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Last Rites?
September 27, 2010 3:02 PM   Subscribe

Planescape Torment (wikipedia) is widely regarded (1, 2, 3, 4) as one of the best story-driven CRPGS ever crafted, cliche amnesiac-protagonist notwithstanding. Here's a "Vision Statement" design document from when it was known as Last Rites. (2.4MB PDF, Spoilers OBVIOUSLY)
posted by juv3nal (72 comments total) 37 users marked this as a favorite

 
...and if you haven't played it, don't spoil it. GO PLAY IT.

It really is one of the best (and definitely most underrated) games of its genre. Got me hooked on RPG gaming!

While you're at it, go find a copy of Freespace 2 for another best-of-genre game that nobody's ever heard of...
posted by schmod at 3:05 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


No link to the actual game itself? Or is this one of those computer games that I have to buy physical media for?

No snark intended - if I can purchase a computer game without adding cruft to a landfill I will.
posted by muddgirl at 3:13 PM on September 27, 2010


- ''Sheesh. Can this guy write any more text? I'm already bored, and I'm fucking dead."

Good memories, great game but I didn't finish it.
I played table-top Planescapes, the best world TSR ever made.
posted by CitoyenK at 3:14 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


“babes,” as in, “TRUCKLOADS OF.”
Tons of Total Babes: This game will have lots of babes that make the player go “wow.” There will be fiendish babes, human babes, angelic babes, asian babes, and even undead babes. These babes will be present without nipple-age and will all regrettably behave within the TSR Code of Ethics.


well, we knew it was part of gaming design philosophy. I guess it's good that it's explicit.

fwiw, though, I recall no actual babes in the game. neither loaded in trucks, nor walking around. I mean, there were females, yes, but cadaverous ones, or filthy ones. No actual "babes." So I'm glad that things like this don't always reflect the final product.
posted by shmegegge at 3:17 PM on September 27, 2010 [3 favorites]


No link to the actual game itself? Or is this one of those computer games that I have to buy physical media for?

No snark intended - if I can purchase a computer game without adding cruft to a landfill I will.


At one point Gametap had it, but I'm surprised Gametap still even has a website operating. I thought they were toast. One can only hope GoG gets on the case.
posted by juv3nal at 3:17 PM on September 27, 2010


No link to the actual game itself?

it is not, at the moment available for purchase as a download anywhere. it is also crazy buggy in windows vista/7.
posted by shmegegge at 3:18 PM on September 27, 2010


I recall no actual babes in the game.

That Taeflin (or whatever they're called) with the Scots accent and the skimpy outfit is pretty ridiculous, especially in the one cut scene that features her leaning over and giving a good eyeful of cleavage. But other than that most of the women in the game look like normal women and aren't particularly objectified, if memory serves.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 3:22 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


I absolutely love PST, but I'm a little confused about what this document is and why it's dated 8 years after the release of the game...?
posted by ke rose ne at 3:23 PM on September 27, 2010


No link to the actual game itself? Or is this one of those computer games that I have to buy physical media for?

No snark intended - if I can purchase a computer game without adding cruft to a landfill I will.


The game came out in 1999. They haven't made new copies for a decade, the company that made it shut down in 2003, and it's not on places like GOG.com or Steam. If it's that important to you that a copy not go from someone else's closet to yours, I think all the material arguments against piracy have fallen by the wayside.
posted by kafziel at 3:23 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


I have to say, the writing style of the design document does the game itself no favors.
posted by JHarris at 3:23 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


Though it was not how I can across the link to the pdf, here's some context from RockPaperShotgun.
posted by juv3nal at 3:26 PM on September 27, 2010


Oh man, should have looked harder for additional stuff before posting. Here's a motherlode of pitches and design docs including stuff for Bioshock, Fallout 1, & Grim Fandango.
posted by juv3nal at 3:35 PM on September 27, 2010


fiendish babes, human babes, angelic babes, asian babes, and even undead babes.

I like that "Asian" is a category along with "Fiendish" "Undead" and "Human"
posted by delmoi at 3:36 PM on September 27, 2010 [5 favorites]


cough
posted by p3on at 3:37 PM on September 27, 2010


The game came out in 1999. They haven't made new copies for a decade, the company that made it shut down in 2003, and it's not on places like GOG.com or Steam. If it's that important to you that a copy not go from someone else's closet to yours, I think all the material arguments against piracy have fallen by the wayside.

I don't pirate games. It is available from Amazon or eBay, of course, but I have been burned a few times too many by games that have "mysteriously" lost their activation code.

I guess I didn't realize that it's been more than 10 years since the game was released. It's like the Dark Ages back then.
posted by muddgirl at 3:41 PM on September 27, 2010


What? Everyone knows that "asians" are fictional.
posted by bonehead at 3:43 PM on September 27, 2010


If you manage to get hold of a copy somehow, the fixpack is worth appying.
posted by juv3nal at 3:43 PM on September 27, 2010


Actually, I totally would pirate this game.
posted by muddgirl at 3:47 PM on September 27, 2010


PS:T is, without question, one of the best story-driven games of all time. However, the actual gameplay is fairly dated at this point. So, as an alternative to actually playing the game, I'd recommend reading the novelization. No, not the one that you can find on Amazon or in print form - that was an awful, terrible, no good adaptation. Instead, the novelization i just linked to is the actual story of the game, word-for-word, taken directly from the game files. You'll lose the role-playing aspect of the game, as a novelization can only show you one path out of the many that the game made available to you, but that's the only disadvantage.
posted by gd779 at 3:51 PM on September 27, 2010 [4 favorites]


are you serious?
posted by p3on at 3:54 PM on September 27, 2010


You'll lose the role-playing aspect of the game, as a novelization can only show you one path out of the many that the game made available to you, but that's the only disadvantage.

Verging into SPOILER territory here, but statute of limitations and all that: while I won't argue that the mechanics aren't dated, this is almost entirely missing the point of the game. One of the central questions of the game is "what can change the nature of a man" and one possible answer is that you, the player, can change the nature of a man (the player character) within the game world via the choices you make throughout the game. The story that ends up being told is the culmination of your choices along the way and a large part of what makes Ps:T magical is the degree of reactivity to those choices.
posted by juv3nal at 4:00 PM on September 27, 2010 [5 favorites]


I like that "Asian" is a category along with "Fiendish" "Undead" and "Human"

Yeah, we get classified subtype: Outsider all the time.
posted by yeloson at 4:05 PM on September 27, 2010 [2 favorites]


I seriously bought a used copy of this for like 48 bucks cause Gamptap stopped hosting it.

If people ask me about my influences, I will say Planescape, cause that story is one of the best fantasy stories I've experienced.
posted by The Whelk at 4:05 PM on September 27, 2010


God, I love the Infinity Engine and every single game that sprang from its beautiful loins.
posted by Midnight Rambler at 4:05 PM on September 27, 2010 [5 favorites]


I think the best way to experience this game without actually acquiring it is to read the 'let's play' thread on Somethingawful.com. (Link with just the playthrough without comments by others)
This guy is telling the story of the game by playing it and has been doing so since 2006.. It's a looong story.

I recall no actual babes in the game.

Plenty of them. Annah the tiefling most prominently, but also the later 'call girl' demoness or whatever they are called in the D&D universe, along with her employees. I think there are others as well.
posted by Catfry at 4:05 PM on September 27, 2010


She runs the Intellectual Brothel, where you pay money to exercise your brain via conversation!

Seriously, the Planescape universe always had this tasty Pratchett tang to it where in things could be humorous without being light.

Actually a lot of of the Dark Isle games had that.
posted by The Whelk at 4:08 PM on September 27, 2010 [3 favorites]


So after Good Old Games pretended to close up shop, they relaunched with Baldur's Gate and teased other Atari-Hasbro titles would be forthcoming very soon. Planescape: Torment is rumoured to be amongst the other titles.
posted by chrominance at 4:20 PM on September 27, 2010


One of the elements that made PS:T so unconventional and appealing was that it made some large, wholesale changes to the underlying 2nd-ed-D&D engine. If you've played a lot of 3rd-ed or 4th-ed D&D, or even a lot of CRPGs since about 2002, much of what blew me away mechanically won't seem like a big deal now. But at the time, stat gains by level, free PC reclassing, Wisdom governing exp gain and Int governing conversation options: there was just a whole raft of mechanical stuff that underpinned the notion of formlessness and malleability to which juv3nal is referring. I actually find it easier to go back and play PS:T than Baldur's Gate I or II, because the system does not seem as limiting to my current sensibility.

And then the characters. I still quote Dak'kon at people all the time, and discovering each aspect of the Unbreakable Circle of Zerthimon was one of the best gaming experiences I've ever had.

I like the novelization, I think it's a pretty good job, but the joy of PS:T is in finding your own way through that weird, shifting landscape. For an RPG nerd, I have a hard time thinking of a better CRPG than this one.
posted by Errant at 4:31 PM on September 27, 2010 [6 favorites]


Also, muddgirl, I'm pretty sure that the game just had a CD-check, no activation codes needed, so if you get ahold of a copy you should be fine.
posted by Errant at 4:41 PM on September 27, 2010


shmegegge: fwiw, though, I recall no actual babes in the game. neither loaded in trucks, nor walking around. I mean, there were females, yes, but cadaverous ones, or filthy ones. No actual "babes." So I'm glad that things like this don't always reflect the final product.

Squirreled away in one of the menus was a complete list of all the creatures you'd encountered so far, descriptive text explaining what exactly they were supposed to be, and a primitive CG image portraying them. What I most remember about this list was how embarrassed I was by almost every female entry in the list, because they were all ridiculously proportioned and improbably clothed. I was appalled because I was young and pretentious and this was the best game I'd yet found to demonstrate gaming's legitimacy as an art-form, and the existence of this gallery of images made it very hard for me to recommend the game to the gatekeepers of culture in my art appreciation class (or whatever).

These days the whole thing just makes me laugh.

If you want to see the images in question, it looks like they're online here:
http://www.gamebanshee.com/planescapetorment/creatures.php
posted by jsnlxndrlv at 4:42 PM on September 27, 2010


I play it from CD images, ripped from my originals. Much easier than using the actual discs. No-CD patches are easy to find *cough*gamecopyworld*cough*.
posted by bonehead at 4:58 PM on September 27, 2010


I think PS:T was the first videogame that made me exhale loudly, push my chair back, stand, pace, and tug my hair while I wrestled with The Big Decision the game was forcing me to make.
posted by BitterOldPunk at 5:13 PM on September 27, 2010 [2 favorites]


I downloaded the game recently, having never played before. I found it incredibly frustrating to play, its ugly, and the writing is awful. I don't think I can recommend it.
posted by empath at 5:14 PM on September 27, 2010


Planescape: Torment is still probably my favorite CRPG of all time, although it's had stiff competition since. Really couldn't get into why without spoilers.

But oh, man, the Practical Incarnation...

*shakes head*
posted by mordax at 5:27 PM on September 27, 2010


In the 90s I picked up a copy of Planescape; I recall it may have been in some kind of cheap multi-game offering with other, more forgettable RPGs.

A few years later I found it in my pile of junk and decided to play it. After many hours of enjoyable gameplay, at what I figured was the entrance to the final area, the game simply *crashed*. Any savegame I loaded to replay *crashed* at the same point. I gave up. I've never seen the end of Planescape.

I'd be tempted to dig out the discs and try it again, maybe with the patches mentioned by juv3nal, but I'd hate to put time into it and get screwed out of an ending yet again.
posted by jepler at 6:04 PM on September 27, 2010


I think I'm one of like 5 people who actually bought the game when it first came out, and played it on a borrowed laptop more than I studied for my year 12 finals (I passed everything though, so that's okay).

I think a better introduction to the game and list of why it's so great are the things it doesn't have. It's an RPG that has

NO armour
NO elves
NO dwarves
NO swords*
NO teenagers
NO grass
NO trees
NO penalty for death (for plot related reasons you die a few times and get massive bonuses)
The most important stat is wisdom
The least important stat is strength
They intentionally made the weapons ones you typically never use, so fighters use axes, hammers and daggers

*Okay, there's two swords, but only one you can use and I've never had a character able.

As far as the improbably clothed women in the game, it is a little embarrassingly juvenile, and it's one of the only things I wish they'd really changed in the original design. Just about any class of character (eg. male citizen, female citizen) will have the female in skimpy clothing. However, it is funny that the only succubus you meet in the game is not only chaste but wears the least revealing clothing.
posted by Silentgoldfish at 6:21 PM on September 27, 2010


Here is a REALLY great guide to installing the game with many of the modern features we gamers enjoy, plus lots of helpful tweaks and a lot of missing and unfinished stuff added back into it. Incredibly useful, no matter how you go about acquiring the game.
posted by deafmute at 6:28 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


This remains perhaps my favorite CRPG of all time. It is Black Isle at their finest moment, which means great writing and, compared to their later forays, relatively few bugs. The art was dark and, if not edgy, pointy. But different from more Tolkien-esque settings.

Once caveat: be prepared for a lot of reading. The text for a playthrough easily comprises a novel's worth of material. It really is a novel (or two) executed and unfolded through the exploration of some beautifully hand painted levels.
posted by Verdant at 6:30 PM on September 27, 2010


but also the later 'call girl' demoness or whatever

That was "Fall-From-Grace", the succubus who "fell" up, and became good-aligned.

What an amazing game this was. Loved it, and I also DMed some tabletop planescape games. I still have most of the (now out of print) boxed sets - (Planes of law, planes of chaos, planes of conflict, hellbound, the main boxed set, the planewalker's handbook, faction war, dead gods) on a shelf upstairs. DiTerlizzi's artwork is an incredible treat, woven nicely with the material on each page.

What was I saying? Oh right, I should dig around and see if I still have the PS:T discs, though I imagine it would be quite frustrating to play nowadays, especially if you're used to something like, say, Dragon Age.

Still though, nostalgia. It still feels to me like the spiritual forefather to every game that has your decisions affecting the plot.
posted by mrgoat at 6:36 PM on September 27, 2010


My favourite games are the ones that take the conventions of games and fold them into the game itself. One of the reasons that Torment worked so well is that it took a couple of conventions of RPGs (the 'reload a save game after death' and the 'learning new skills at a suspiciously fast rate') and made them an integral part of the game - and incorporated them into the plot and play. It's like they took these practical abstractions that all computer games need in order to operate, and they actually gave a consistent and logical explanation for why they would exist according to the world of the game.

(This is something that Assassin's Creed does really well - not only do they rationalise the save game, there are also in-game rationales for the HUD and the 'time skips' between scenes.)
posted by Paragon at 6:55 PM on September 27, 2010


I love this game! I treasure the copy I found in the bargain bin at The Bay of all places. It was so engrossing and I loved all the text. In some games I find there's too much fighting and it gets in the way of the story - I particularly noticed this in both Icewind Dale games. I really wish there was a sequel...and yes, as someone else said, I hope GOG brings it back to life. Man, I feel like an old codger...I really do love and miss Black Isle.
posted by Calzephyr at 7:33 PM on September 27, 2010


It really is one of the best (and definitely most underrated)

I think it's a stretch to say PST is underrated since it is almost universally considered the best story driver cRPG of all time by players and critics alike.

Intellectual Brothel

The Brothel For Slaking Intellectual Lusts, if you please. The romance with Grace is still after all this time by far the finest, most moving, most believable romance in a computer game. And as far as I recall you never so much as touch.

DONT TRUST THE SKULL.
posted by Justinian at 8:12 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


I recall no actual babes in the game.

If you look at the character art in the bestiary for generic female NPCs like "townswoman" or "noblewoman" they are generally wearing outfits that would make a hooker blush. You can see screenshots here (scroll down a bit). And then of course there are the actual hookers. But it's entirely possible to play the whole game without ever looking at the bestiary, so you might not have seen it.
posted by phoenixy at 8:13 PM on September 27, 2010 [1 favorite]


To be fair, the male protagonist doesn't wear anything but some ragged shorts. Talk about beefcake.
posted by Justinian at 8:17 PM on September 27, 2010


Ravel is still one of the best non-villains in any game. And you know what I really liked? The detail put into the town of Sigil. It's bad and lowly and poor and miserable but rich and deep and complicated ...like a real slum. So many things that would have been a big side plot (Like say The Lady) are just alluded to and brushed up again, so you really feel like you're lost in this big alien world.


Actually my favorite bit in Planescape was thier take on Exp. That if you weren't a total asshole berserker you could get a shit-ton by PAYING for it, or by being polite. Because if you had a Universe where where Exp Was A Thing, surely by now people would have tried to monetize it? Planescape keeps punishing people who try to play it like a hack-n-slash, and I really, really enjoy that.
posted by The Whelk at 8:21 PM on September 27, 2010


Ever try playing through Torment with very low intelligence? The only dialogue choices you get are like grunts and such. It's hilarious. This does limit your options in terms of solving quests for obvious reasons. You aren't exactly going to be talking anyone out of anything if all you can do are monosyllabic growls.
posted by Justinian at 8:24 PM on September 27, 2010


DONT TRUST THE SKULL

Reminds me: @brainygamer/Michael Abbott weighed in on Ps:T in 1, 2, 3 parts.
posted by juv3nal at 8:26 PM on September 27, 2010


I downloaded the game recently, having never played before. I found it incredibly frustrating to play, its ugly, and the writing is awful. I don't think I can recommend it.

Persever! It's worth it. The beginning of the game is particularly ugly (the mortuary, ugh) and has a lot of repetitious boring writing (yes, PLEASE explain to me how planes work for 4000 words again, I'd LOVE that) and annoying search quests (see: the mortuary); I gave up on my first few playthroughs because of it. It gets a lot better. The writing never becomes particularly good from a stylistic perspective or anything but the plot and characterization as they develop are extremely strong.
posted by phoenixy at 8:50 PM on September 27, 2010


Yeah, I got the point where i had to go upstairs to get something or other that wasn't clear explained to me, and all the workers kept attacking me and killed me for reasons I'm not clear on, and about the third time I had to look at gamefaqs for something that wasn't sign posted particularly well I just said, fuck it, this isn't fun and played more minecraft instead.
posted by empath at 9:20 PM on September 27, 2010


What's that, Cube Hero? Mort's a stupid skull? Why yes, he is!
posted by The otter lady at 9:27 PM on September 27, 2010


Wonderful. I'd forgotten the Cube Hero interaction, otter lady.
posted by Justinian at 10:41 PM on September 27, 2010


I knew little about the guy until this post. Great video (eventually..) played the track again via Spotify a couple of times now. Will explore "I'm new here" further.

The joy of MetaFilter.
posted by marvin at 11:00 PM on September 27, 2010


I downloaded the game recently, having never played before. I found it incredibly frustrating to play, its ugly, and the writing is awful. I don't think I can recommend it.

A+++ WOULD TROLL AGAIN
posted by FatherDagon at 11:13 PM on September 27, 2010


At some point I need to go into the boxes I have here from my move and find my copy of PS:T, the unopened and still-sealed copy, and see what I can get for it on eBay.

...assuming it didn't get lost in the move. A couple things seem to have.

(I had a second copy I bought, before learning I'd won a contest and got the one I put on a shelf for years. It really is an amazing game.)
posted by mephron at 1:21 AM on September 28, 2010


I loved (still love) this game. It's like a grim Fantasy version of Momento. I played it through once as quite a thicky, and felt a bit baffled and hard done by when I reached the ending and still didn't really understand what was going on. Playing through again with high Wis and Int changed everything. Cracking stuff.
posted by RokkitNite at 2:30 AM on September 28, 2010


juv3nal, thank you for the link. I love all things PS:T, and this is FREAKING AWESOME.

Verdant, I recall reading somewhere that it actually has something like 250,000 words to it, so--two hefty novels.

With changing OSes and such, I don't recommend this game like I used to, but this was the first video game to convince me of the video-game-as-art argument. The character development, the themes... FANTASTIC. Maybe most of all, I loved the consistency of the design: the art and the music always seemed to complement each other. Occasionally I'll still hear the music in my head at random moments, or a scrap of dialogue will come to mind. I have played this game more than is healthy at this point, and I've read (to the best of my knowledge) every word of dialogue or exposition in the game itself on one of my many runs through it, including the small pack of "extras" out there in mod-land.

I haven't encountered as enthralling a game since.
posted by cupcakeninja at 3:53 AM on September 28, 2010


Good news! As of today, Planescape: Torment is available on Good Old Games.
posted by danb at 6:09 AM on September 28, 2010 [7 favorites]


It's like a grim Fantasy version of M[e]mento

Memento came out about a year after the game, and I had played the game, so when I saw Memento I thought "WTF? They ripped off Planescape!" Sometimes I still wonder whether it's just a coincidence that both things came out around the same time with the idea "Who am I, and why am I covered in all these tattoos?"

I would love to know.
posted by freecellwizard at 6:38 AM on September 28, 2010 [1 favorite]


I wish someone would license some old Black Isle engines and put out a some cRPG goodness with a great story for $20. I know there's a market for it and nowadays with an already existent engine it must be feasible.
posted by haveanicesummer at 6:50 AM on September 28, 2010


Dammit danb! I already have two copies of this game and now I'm going to have to go in for a third. You just had to dangle the soundtrack in front of me, didn't you?

For those of you that want to play this game in something like a reasonable resolution with a few modest bugfixes, you can download patches here or for walkthroughs and more infos you can go here.
posted by BYiro at 7:15 AM on September 28, 2010 [2 favorites]


I just came over to post that you could buy this over on GOG, but danb beat me to it.

Busting out the credit card now. Wicked cool. This is one of the best games ever done. It starts kinda slow and weird, and there's too many FedEx quests in the beginning, but it just gets so goddamn good later on.

I am deeply ashamed to admit that I didn't buy it when it first came out, purely because of the ugly blue guy on the cover. I didn't really have much contact with other gamers at the time, so there was nobody to whack me upside the head. I didn't buy it for like two years.

I am, in other words, part of the reason it didn't do very well, and part of the reason there were never any more. :(
posted by Malor at 7:56 AM on September 28, 2010


Good news! As of today, Planescape: Torment is available on Good Old Games.

Oh man: my discs are in terrible shape and that's very tempting for 10 bucks (especially with the soundtrack thrown in). I'm a little worried though that GOG's version won't be compatible with all those interesting mods and fixes from deafmute's comment.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 8:10 AM on September 28, 2010


Sweet, thanks danb!
posted by Calzephyr at 8:11 AM on September 28, 2010


A+++ WOULD TROLL AGAIN

What the hell? I agree completely with that guy. I couldn't get past the first ten minutes because the constant repetition of all the little phrases that occurs every damn time you click on something made me want to scream. It might be a great game but I've never been able to make it to the good part. People who disagree with you are not trolls.
posted by Dormant Gorilla at 8:38 AM on September 28, 2010 [1 favorite]


I just FIAMO, but yeah.
posted by muddgirl at 8:41 AM on September 28, 2010


I hope it's the hit on the GOG servers that keeps crashing my download, and not a problem on my end, because I'm really looking forward to having a copy of this to play.
posted by rollick at 9:43 AM on September 28, 2010


Yeah, if I were trolling, I'd keep going in a back and forth and try to convince everyone that their opinion is wrong. I'm sure there's good stuff in the game. It's just not for me, and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone but hardcore old-school gamers.
posted by empath at 9:51 AM on September 28, 2010


I swear I am not a GoG shill. Honest. (GoG: where's my paycheck guys?)
posted by juv3nal at 11:06 AM on September 28, 2010


I'm a little worried though that GOG's version won't be compatible with all those interesting mods and fixes from deafmute's comment.

There's a thread about this on the GOG forums. It looks like some tweaks are included, and the others are compatible (with the possible side effect of a benign crash-on-quit in 64-bit Windows 7).
posted by danb at 5:32 PM on September 28, 2010 [1 favorite]


What I loved about PS:T is how it took the most kitchen-sink setting of D&D and told a story in it in a way that overcame the weaknesses of both the system and the setting. I appreciated not having to optimise yet another character for combat.
posted by ersatz at 12:09 PM on September 29, 2010


Darn; picked up the GoG Planescape Torment and it's not running in Crossover 9.1.

Have been wanting to play this and had hoped I could do so on my Mac.
posted by caphector at 4:51 PM on September 29, 2010


I'm a little worried though that GOG's version won't be compatible with all those interesting mods and fixes from deafmute's comment.


I just bought this from GOG and modded the daylights out of it in about 15 minutes, following the forum directions, and am now running it at 1920x1080 resolution. It's amazing.
posted by SpacemanStix at 9:23 PM on October 2, 2010


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