Good friends we have had, oh good friends we've lost along the way

January 20, 2005 1:26 PM

Bob Marley's works enter the Grammy Hall Of Fame - including No Woman No Cry, Marley's tale of his time in the ghetto of Trench Town, Jamaica (photos)...Marley gave his friend Vincent Tata Ford writing credits, in part, to keep Ford's soup kitchen running...
posted by tpl1212 (16 comments total)

about time
posted by rocket_skates at 1:33 PM on January 20, 2005

Exactly what I was thinking, rocket_skates.

Nicely supported post too, tpl1212.
posted by fenriq at 3:46 PM on January 20, 2005

A million fratboys cheer.

"No Woman, No Cry" is easily the worst most insipid, most vile, and most offensive song ever released. All of that is on purely aesthetic grounds. That song, relentlessy booming from the jeeps and vw cabriolet's of the moronic class, easily cancels out any good music that Marley allegedly created. Its positive and spiritual message, viz. women are evil, never fails to enrage me. Can it really be a coincidence that a)"No Woman, No Cry" was playing on the FBI speakers when the Waco compound burned, and b) that this same song, played by military psyops units in Panama, is what finally forced a broken Manuel Noriega to leave his redoubt in the Vatican embassy?

There are political and moral grounds for Marley's condemnation as well. Bob Marley, like other Rastafarians, believed that white people are the devil. He may be right in that belief, or he may be wrong, but can you imagine what would happen if somebody who believed that Chinese or Muslims were devils was given these awards? Besides being a bigot, he was also a religious fundamentalist (funny how those to things go hand in hand), just like Osama bin Ladin or Pat Robertson. The main difference is that Marley believed that Haile Selasse, the despotic former ruler of Ethiopia who wickedly oppressed his own people, was the messiah. Marley's remains were, if I am not mistaken, recently "returned" to Ethiopia, which he considered to be his spiritual homeland. So, in addition to being a chauvinist of nearly every possible sort, he was obviously a foolish and ignorant man

Let us now turn to the horrible musical crimes (e.g. Sublime, 311, Ziggy Marley, Rita Marley, Curly Marley, The Marley Family Gathering, etc.) that he spawned. I will accept the possibility that before he was on Island Records he may have made some good music (as some of my hipper friends have claimed), but in light of his later crimes and his dire influence on the worst and emptiest form of music ever devised (modern "alterna-ska"), I feel that his entire musical corpus should be locked away in a vault somewhere until it can be objectively reassessed and/or jettisoned into deep space nestled snugly in a lead-lined capsule in or around 4000AD.

All of that said, I do not agree with the CIA's decision to murder him. Nonetheless, I am glad to hear that he helped his friends; I think that everyone should try to do that.
posted by mokujin at 4:39 PM on January 20, 2005

"Bob Marley, like other Rastafarians, believed that white people are the devil"

Incorrect. Bob marley's longtime girlfriend was an ex Miss World named Cindy Breakspeare who is white.

""No Woman, No Cry" is easily the worst most insipid, most vile, and most offensive song ever released."

Obviously you don't listen to much music.

Besides being a bigot, he was also a religious fundamentalist (funny how those to things go hand in hand), just like Osama bin Ladin or Pat Robertson.

This made me laugh out loud. Comparing Bob Marley, who sang about coming together and whose belief in non-violence led him to forgive the attackers who ambushed him in his home, with a fanatic who condones wholesale murder is silly.

Finally if you're going to disagree with a front page post this vehemently its proper form to submit links to back up your accusations. I don't believe you'll be able to back up much of what you said here so please keep this in mind for future posts. Thanks and have a nice night.
posted by keithl at 5:12 PM on January 20, 2005

I can't believe no one has mentioned that Bob apparently got it on with icy Vogue editrix Anna Wintour
posted by mathewi at 6:13 PM on January 20, 2005

I always wondered how to parse "No woman, no cry." Did it mean "No, woman, don't cry", as it seems Marley intended? Or was he actually being cynical and saying that if one doesn't have a woman, one won't cry? Or how about the truly evil third possible meaning, "No, woman, no. Cry!"

Such subtlety, such ambiguity!
posted by A dead Quaker at 6:38 PM on January 20, 2005

Its positive and spiritual message, viz. women are evil, never fails to enrage me.

I am not particularly a fan of his, but I really need to inform you that it's as in "No, woman, no cry,", as in consolation. I don't know anything about your other complaints, but still.
posted by abcde at 10:08 PM on January 20, 2005

"No Woman, No Cry" is easily the worst most insipid, most vile, and most offensive song ever released.

Bravo. That's the most moronic troll I've seen here in years. "Ooh, look at me! I'm a right punk bastard who hates one of the most politically significant musicians of the last half of the 20th century!"

Jesus, what a fucking idiot.
posted by mediareport at 1:07 AM on January 21, 2005

Besides being a bigot, he was also a religious fundamentalist (funny how those to things go hand in hand), just like Osama bin Ladin or Pat Robertson.

What, no mention of Hitler? Jeeze, swing and a miss, Troll-y.
posted by tpl1212 at 5:07 AM on January 21, 2005

mokujin has got sand in his vagina.

Also, marley's father was white.
He did not believe white people are the devil.
posted by mcgraw at 6:58 AM on January 21, 2005

These are all wonderful sentiments. The current government of Ethiopia and myself are in perfect accord in calling Haile Selassie a "despot and tyrant" No word yet on their opinion of Bob Marley's music, however. I never said that Bob Marley and other Rastafarians were wrong in their beliefs (i.e., white people = devils); rather, I want to encourage people to actually look into those beliefs. For that purpose, I suggest you take a look at this page from the University of Virginia on Rastafarian beliefs and history, from which I quote:

"early in the history of the movement Leonard Howell (the founder of the Rastafari movement) gave the Rastafarians six fundamental principles:

1. Hatred for the white race.

2. The complete superiority of the black race.

3. Revenge on whites for their wickedness.

4. The negation, persecution, and humiliation of the government and legal bodies of Jamaica.

5. Preparation to go back to Africa, and

6. Acknowledging Emperor Haile Selassie as the Supreme Being and only ruler of black people."

Another good overview of Rastafari history and beliefs can be found here.

So there are the links to back up what I said about Bob Marley's beliefs. You might also note on the Watchman page that "women's role in the Rastafarian movement is at best a subordinate one". Despite my dislike of most of Bob Marley's lousy music, I find his belief that white people are evil to be a compelling one that is largely in accord with empirical evidence.
posted by mokujin at 7:43 AM on January 21, 2005

Also, I think that, as Keithl pointed out above, it is shameful the way Bob Marley repeated humiliated his wife Rita by "going out on her" and fathering many children with many different women.

This is what Rita Marley has to say about her wonderful times with her semi-devine husband Bob. Some quotes follow:

"In the early days, Rita would wash Bob's only pair of underpants by hand every night in the tank outside their first house in St Ann.
But as Bob Marley and the Wailers earned global fame, Rita could only look on helplessly as the husband she adored succumbed to its trappings. "Every country he'd go to Bob would meet the Miss So-and-so or the local beauty queen. And then at night, she's there, in the bedroom, and then the next morning she's still there."

"And of course I'd be there too because I was a backing singer in his group as well as his wife. So I would see all this going on and it would really hurt, the jealousy."

"Once, asked by a New York newspaper about his wife, Bob replied: "Oh no - Rita's my sister.""

What a lousy human being. As I said above, a chauvinist of every kind, who sold the world on a really nice line of bullshit.
posted by mokujin at 7:56 AM on January 21, 2005

"Despite my dislike of most of Bob Marley's lousy music, I find his belief that white people are evil to be a compelling one that is largely in accord with empirical evidence."

In all of your links Bob Marley is barely mentioned let alone a single example of Bob Marley saying he hated white people or acting that way. Nor is there any of your other "psyop unit" or FBI speaker silliness.

Also, I think that, as Keithl pointed out above, it is shameful the way Bob Marley repeated humiliated his wife Rita by "going out on her" and fathering many children with many different women.

I never pointed out any such thing. Although I may not agree with that kind of behavior its not my practice to make judgement on peoples (even celebrities) personal lives. Their work is what interests me.
posted by keithl at 8:31 AM on January 21, 2005

tpl1212, thanks much for the well-researched post. Good stuff.
posted by madamjujujive at 9:55 PM on January 21, 2005

mokujin, you might be perfectly correct politically, and you have a nice line in vitriol going on, but you have ears of cloth, sir, ears of cloth.

*sticks on Is This Love*
posted by dydecker at 10:27 PM on January 21, 2005

What a lousy human being.

Did you just discover that Marley was human? Good christ. The flaws have been blatantly obvious for years to anyone who's looked at his life even cursorily. But so are the beautifully uplifting moments. Funny how that works in humans.

I've never been one for mindless guru-worship, but that Mirror article is a classic. Be sure to compare the headline against the last few paragraphs. There are all sorts of ways to spin human frailty, but only a few of them stink as bad as mokujin's version.
posted by mediareport at 11:47 PM on January 21, 2005