What Every American Should Know about the Middle East
April 1, 2008 1:47 AM Subscribe
This post was deleted for the following reason: really oversimplified uncontenxtualized bloggish primers on hot button topics don't really make for great MeFi threads. -- jessamyn
I hate when someone gets all prescriptivist about what some word means and then acts like everyone else is an idiot for using that word in its widely understood meaning.
Because, yes, the author is correct about the origin of the words semite and semitic, but anti-semitism refers specifically to hostility toward Jews.
posted by birdie birdington at 2:26 AM on April 1, 2008 [1 favorite]
Because, yes, the author is correct about the origin of the words semite and semitic, but anti-semitism refers specifically to hostility toward Jews.
posted by birdie birdington at 2:26 AM on April 1, 2008 [1 favorite]
"Freedom haters! They hate our liberty! Buncha turrists!
Bloody furners!"
This has been brought to you by George W Bush's subconscious.
posted by newfers at 2:28 AM on April 1, 2008
Bloody furners!"
This has been brought to you by George W Bush's subconscious.
posted by newfers at 2:28 AM on April 1, 2008
What Every American Should Be Offended That Yet Another Otherwise Intelligent Person Assumes That They Don't Know About
posted by Jofus at 2:44 AM on April 1, 2008
posted by Jofus at 2:44 AM on April 1, 2008
I was going to come here to complain about the same thing -- the author's statement that is doesn't make sense to call Arabs anti-semitic.
Words are not transparent, you cannot decide what a word means just by looking at it. The word "anti-semitism" means prejudice against Jews, and Arabs can easily be anti-semitic, just like anyone else, and many of them are. The etymology of the word is perhaps unfortunate, but that's how life is sometimes. "French toast" isn't really French, but it's not incorrect to call it French toast.
Otherwise this primer is a good thing if it gets read by the audience that needs to read it. Somehow I don't think metafilter is that audience, though. Too bad.
posted by creasy boy at 3:41 AM on April 1, 2008
Words are not transparent, you cannot decide what a word means just by looking at it. The word "anti-semitism" means prejudice against Jews, and Arabs can easily be anti-semitic, just like anyone else, and many of them are. The etymology of the word is perhaps unfortunate, but that's how life is sometimes. "French toast" isn't really French, but it's not incorrect to call it French toast.
Otherwise this primer is a good thing if it gets read by the audience that needs to read it. Somehow I don't think metafilter is that audience, though. Too bad.
posted by creasy boy at 3:41 AM on April 1, 2008
If we're going to get all semantic about antisemitism, then this list, in talking about the Middle East, should also carry the distinction between Jews, Israelis and Zionists, because frankly, I'm sick of being confused with one of those groups as well as being called antisemitic for having issues with the other.
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 4:04 AM on April 1, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by Cat Pie Hurts at 4:04 AM on April 1, 2008 [2 favorites]
I have some sympathy with the author over 'anti-semitic'. It's true that etymology doesn't determine meaning, but things might be slightly clearer if people used 'anti-jewish' when that's what they mean.
I was more unsettled to find the Bible being cited as the authority on these issues.
posted by Phanx at 4:08 AM on April 1, 2008
I was more unsettled to find the Bible being cited as the authority on these issues.
posted by Phanx at 4:08 AM on April 1, 2008
Good enough in intent, but this particular point put me off:
According to the Bible, Jews and Arabs are related [Genesis 25]. Jews descended from Abraham’s son Isaac, and Arabs descended from Abraham’s son Ishmael. So not only are both groups Semitic, but they’re also family.
He states it as fact. While Arabs and Jews are probably pretty close genetically, to state something (i.e. a Biblical story) that's essentially a story as fact is specious and undermines his credibility.
posted by WalterMitty at 4:19 AM on April 1, 2008
According to the Bible, Jews and Arabs are related [Genesis 25]. Jews descended from Abraham’s son Isaac, and Arabs descended from Abraham’s son Ishmael. So not only are both groups Semitic, but they’re also family.
He states it as fact. While Arabs and Jews are probably pretty close genetically, to state something (i.e. a Biblical story) that's essentially a story as fact is specious and undermines his credibility.
posted by WalterMitty at 4:19 AM on April 1, 2008
The lack of historical understanding about the genesis of "antisemitism" as a hateful term basically amounts to failure.
posted by OmieWise at 4:29 AM on April 1, 2008
posted by OmieWise at 4:29 AM on April 1, 2008
Well, if, as you say, we are going to get semantic about semitism we might as well get generous with out geography and include a few other countries that seem to have been left out. A few political science lecturers I've talked to considered much of north Africa to be a part of the middle east, making the distinction cultural rather than based on the arbitrary locations of oceans.
It's been argued that much of the problems in Iraq (years before the war was even on the table) were caused by the arbitrary establishment of borders by colonial powers with no local knowledge, dividing people and even villages in half and assigning power just as meaninglessly. When studying the middle east I always come back to this idea.
posted by Dillonlikescookies at 4:41 AM on April 1, 2008
It's been argued that much of the problems in Iraq (years before the war was even on the table) were caused by the arbitrary establishment of borders by colonial powers with no local knowledge, dividing people and even villages in half and assigning power just as meaninglessly. When studying the middle east I always come back to this idea.
posted by Dillonlikescookies at 4:41 AM on April 1, 2008
I find fault that he splits Sunni and Shia into seperate groups and then implies that's where it ends. Sunni Muslims make up 90% of Mulslims worldwide and I highly doubt there are no significant subgroups below that.
posted by PenDevil at 4:43 AM on April 1, 2008
posted by PenDevil at 4:43 AM on April 1, 2008
That is an absurdly oversimplified and misleading "primer." Aside from the stupid bit about "anti-Semitism" (which means hatred of Jews, end of story), this is ridiculous:
Shia Muslims are similar to Roman Catholics in Christianity. They have a strong clerical presence via Imams and promote the idea of going through them to practice the religion correctly. Sunni Muslims are more like Protestant Christians. They don’t really focus on Imams and believe in maintaining a more direct line to God than the Shia.
I don't think this guy actually knows what he's talking about, but I do believe he only spent 20 minutes putting the list together. If you want to understand the Middle East, read some books.
posted by languagehat at 5:17 AM on April 1, 2008
Shia Muslims are similar to Roman Catholics in Christianity. They have a strong clerical presence via Imams and promote the idea of going through them to practice the religion correctly. Sunni Muslims are more like Protestant Christians. They don’t really focus on Imams and believe in maintaining a more direct line to God than the Shia.
I don't think this guy actually knows what he's talking about, but I do believe he only spent 20 minutes putting the list together. If you want to understand the Middle East, read some books.
posted by languagehat at 5:17 AM on April 1, 2008
Please note the link to an entry titled "Multiculturalism: Tested And Failed" in the sidebar. Anytime I see the "M-word" mentioned these days it's often as a pejorative used by the kind of people who loved The Fountainhead, use the term "invisible hand" without irony, and think civil rights are the product of racist thought. Anything else from this person's pen is then immediately suspect.
Sure enough.
posted by brownpau at 5:17 AM on April 1, 2008 [3 favorites]
Sure enough.
posted by brownpau at 5:17 AM on April 1, 2008 [3 favorites]
It's interesting to me that he uses so many Wikipedia references but apparently didn't check to see what it has to say about antisemitism.
I agree that the point about Abraham and Ishmael is specious. If you believe that makes Jews and Arabs family, then we're all family since we all descend from Eve and Adam.
I sense that somehow we are expected to learn from these points that Arabs and Jews should really be one big happy family. I am not convinced.
posted by ubiquity at 5:22 AM on April 1, 2008
I agree that the point about Abraham and Ishmael is specious. If you believe that makes Jews and Arabs family, then we're all family since we all descend from Eve and Adam.
I sense that somehow we are expected to learn from these points that Arabs and Jews should really be one big happy family. I am not convinced.
posted by ubiquity at 5:22 AM on April 1, 2008
A few political science lecturers I've talked to considered much of north Africa to be a part of the middle east, making the distinction cultural rather than based on the arbitrary locations of oceans.
Oh no. I haven't got used to having no Near East yet, thank you very much.
"anti-Semitism" (which means hatred of Jews, end of story),
So the people who use it to mean 'against Semites' are objectively wrong about the meaning of the word? It's not just that they're wrong to try to impose their meaning on us - they're actually factually incorrect and should submit to our lexical authority? Just clarifying.
posted by Phanx at 5:53 AM on April 1, 2008 [1 favorite]
Oh no. I haven't got used to having no Near East yet, thank you very much.
"anti-Semitism" (which means hatred of Jews, end of story),
So the people who use it to mean 'against Semites' are objectively wrong about the meaning of the word? It's not just that they're wrong to try to impose their meaning on us - they're actually factually incorrect and should submit to our lexical authority? Just clarifying.
posted by Phanx at 5:53 AM on April 1, 2008 [1 favorite]
I have a good basic understanding in this area, but I'm glad to be reminded of some things I might have forgotten.
Sure, I can quibble with some of the finer points, but I fear most Americans have only the shallowest understanding of Middle-Eastern history.
(So much for an informed populace.)
Thanks for the brush-up, M-Man!
posted by Dizzy at 5:54 AM on April 1, 2008
Sure, I can quibble with some of the finer points, but I fear most Americans have only the shallowest understanding of Middle-Eastern history.
(So much for an informed populace.)
Thanks for the brush-up, M-Man!
posted by Dizzy at 5:54 AM on April 1, 2008
I'm caught between a rock an a hard place here.
I support the use of "begging the question" in it's vernacular usage. People who want to get technical about the origins of the phrase can keep it to themselves.
But at the same time I'm with the author of this article in regards to "antisemitism", preferring to look to it's roots, despite the popular understanding of it meaning "anti-Jewish".
Damn it!
posted by Jimbob at 6:06 AM on April 1, 2008
I support the use of "begging the question" in it's vernacular usage. People who want to get technical about the origins of the phrase can keep it to themselves.
But at the same time I'm with the author of this article in regards to "antisemitism", preferring to look to it's roots, despite the popular understanding of it meaning "anti-Jewish".
Damn it!
posted by Jimbob at 6:06 AM on April 1, 2008
It's been argued that much of the problems in Iraq (years before the war was even on the table) were caused by the arbitrary establishment of borders by colonial powers with no local knowledge, dividing people and even villages in half and assigning power just as meaninglessly.
Except that this strategy was not meaningless, it was a deliberate feature of colonial policy, intended to invert the ethnic power relations that were in place prior to conquest. Thus, when the occupiers pull out, generations of ethnic strife: the minority populace holds the keys to the economic culture of the wider world.
posted by mwhybark at 6:14 AM on April 1, 2008
Except that this strategy was not meaningless, it was a deliberate feature of colonial policy, intended to invert the ethnic power relations that were in place prior to conquest. Thus, when the occupiers pull out, generations of ethnic strife: the minority populace holds the keys to the economic culture of the wider world.
posted by mwhybark at 6:14 AM on April 1, 2008
Oh, and pardon me: the strategy was deployed literally everywhere, from the Americas to Asia. So the problem of arbitrary postcolonial borders and a legacy of internal ethnic strife deriving in part from these borders is far from uniquely Arab.
posted by mwhybark at 6:16 AM on April 1, 2008
posted by mwhybark at 6:16 AM on April 1, 2008
Shia Muslims are similar to Roman Catholics in Christianity.
Yeah that slew me too. Finding common ground is one thing, but using Christian theological concepts to describe Islamic ones is more trouble than it's worth half the time from all the baggage they bring with them. The worst is the constant refrain about Islam needing a 'Reformation' or an 'Enlightenment' or what have you. Please stop using events from your past to define our future, thanks in advance.
posted by BinGregory at 6:26 AM on April 1, 2008
Yeah that slew me too. Finding common ground is one thing, but using Christian theological concepts to describe Islamic ones is more trouble than it's worth half the time from all the baggage they bring with them. The worst is the constant refrain about Islam needing a 'Reformation' or an 'Enlightenment' or what have you. Please stop using events from your past to define our future, thanks in advance.
posted by BinGregory at 6:26 AM on April 1, 2008
That primer, AS a primer, was good; the hair-splitting and kvetching here in MeFiLand is as bad as in the primer's comments. Disappointing.
I hate when someone gets all prescriptivist about what some word means and then acts like everyone else is an idiot for using that word in its widely understood meaning.
Because, yes, the author is correct about the origin of the words semite and semitic, but anti-semitism refers specifically to hostility toward Jews.
Well, ignorance and prejudice remain as widely distributed phenomena too, yet most of us agree that they should be eradicated where possible.
Words can frame or mask the issue they are intended to portray. "Anti-semitism" is a charged term, invoking pograms and Nazis and Holocaust, yet some will throw it about easily, such as against someone who expresses disapproval for some Israeli action. As many point out it has 19th century European roots; if it's also semantically flawed, then maybe it should be retired...?
In the meantime, relax... yes we all still know what the term means when someone uses it, including the author of the linked article.
posted by Artful Codger at 6:29 AM on April 1, 2008
I hate when someone gets all prescriptivist about what some word means and then acts like everyone else is an idiot for using that word in its widely understood meaning.
Because, yes, the author is correct about the origin of the words semite and semitic, but anti-semitism refers specifically to hostility toward Jews.
Well, ignorance and prejudice remain as widely distributed phenomena too, yet most of us agree that they should be eradicated where possible.
Words can frame or mask the issue they are intended to portray. "Anti-semitism" is a charged term, invoking pograms and Nazis and Holocaust, yet some will throw it about easily, such as against someone who expresses disapproval for some Israeli action. As many point out it has 19th century European roots; if it's also semantically flawed, then maybe it should be retired...?
In the meantime, relax... yes we all still know what the term means when someone uses it, including the author of the linked article.
posted by Artful Codger at 6:29 AM on April 1, 2008
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posted by pompomtom at 2:12 AM on April 1, 2008