Desperately Seeking Deck Hands
May 11, 2013 9:16 AM Subscribe
"For the vast majority of people who have done this work, it has been the hardest job they have ever done, and also the best job they have ever had. but if this work is not for you — if you consider it dull or drudgery or just too hard cuz you would rather watch TV or text someone, then please don't reply because you will have a miserable summer." - A Kennedy Seeks A Deck Hand ....on Cragslist.
....I wonder what it says of me that that sounds actually kinda awesome.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:26 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:26 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
When I graduated high school, my dad kept trying to get me to go work for his cousin, who captained a fishing boat in Alaska. Except he would always end his pitch with the caveat that I would most likely lose at least one finger, and the odds of getting at least one limb horrible maimed were high. I'm not a big fan of seafood.
posted by Brocktoon at 9:29 AM on May 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
posted by Brocktoon at 9:29 AM on May 11, 2013 [3 favorites]
Fortunately, Ted Kennedy won't be driving.
posted by marienbad at 9:32 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by marienbad at 9:32 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
This is a mashup of Downton Abbey and Two Years Before the Mast.
posted by mr vino at 9:35 AM on May 11, 2013 [13 favorites]
posted by mr vino at 9:35 AM on May 11, 2013 [13 favorites]
I like that if you make it the whole summer, he will pay for you to get home ... If not, you're on your own. Hitchhiking home, I guess?
posted by Unified Theory at 9:43 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by Unified Theory at 9:43 AM on May 11, 2013
It would be a great way to spend a summer, certainly would beat a wide variety of minimum wage jobs.
posted by arcticseal at 9:43 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by arcticseal at 9:43 AM on May 11, 2013
A lot of people would love to do it if only so that they can say, for the rest of their lives, that they worked as a "deckhand for a Kennedy" for a summer.
posted by Unified Theory at 9:47 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by Unified Theory at 9:47 AM on May 11, 2013
It could be that he's just trying to set expectations high, trying to think of any possible scenario that could come up. The rewards of being Max Kennedy's deckhand could be pretty cool beyond the obvious connections it could bring. He's been working with Bob Ballard to locate PT-109, for instance.
posted by kingv at 9:48 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by kingv at 9:48 AM on May 11, 2013
Looks like an awesome way to spend a summer. If I was a college student looking for a summer gig I'd be all over this (I'm even qualified!).
posted by atrazine at 10:00 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by atrazine at 10:00 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
When I was in college I spent a summer working in Miami at the Fontainebleau Hotel (as a bellboy). At the end of the summer the crew of the owner's (Ben Novacks) ship, a recommissioned navel vessel about 120 feet long (it was always docked on Indian River across from the hotel), was preparing to move it to New York. They asked me if I wanted to work for a few weeks sailing it north. Like an idiot, I turned it down because I couldn't figure out how to get my 15 year old VW bug back to Michigan. Missed a great opportunity!
posted by HuronBob at 10:07 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by HuronBob at 10:07 AM on May 11, 2013
At that age I was working summers as a deck hand on a schooner in Provincetown and would have jumped at this. The job ends in September but that's when many of their friends' beautiful yachts will need to be delivered to Florida or the Carib and you'd be well qualified and connected to crew those deliveries which is a nice career for a nautically-minded young person.
posted by nicwolff at 10:07 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by nicwolff at 10:07 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
So minimum you are working 80 hours a week, no overtime. Or about 320 hours a month which means an hourly wage of $6.25 based on total hours, though if we consider overtime is 1.5x then its about $4.54/ hour. The minimum wage in Massachusetts is $8.00 hour.
posted by humanfont at 10:18 AM on May 11, 2013 [12 favorites]
posted by humanfont at 10:18 AM on May 11, 2013 [12 favorites]
This seems like a pretty normal listing for a deck hand. Is there anything about it that is out of the ordinary?
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 10:23 AM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 10:23 AM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
its about $4.54/ hour.
Plus room and board. This would actually be a pretty amazing way to spend a summer.
posted by stopgap at 10:24 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Plus room and board. This would actually be a pretty amazing way to spend a summer.
posted by stopgap at 10:24 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
When I graduated high school, my dad kept trying to get me to go work for his cousin, who captained a fishing boat in Alaska. Except he would always end his pitch with the caveat that I would most likely lose at least one finger, and the odds of getting at least one limb horrible maimed were high. I'm not a big fan of seafood.
Yeah, my dad was big on trying to sell me on hard manual labor jobs always ending with the caveat that horrible injury could await, then wrapped up with some kind of challenge to my manhood like "You aren't SCARED, are you?" Of course I am, you lunatic, you just spent 15 minutes telling me all the ways I could get maimed.
posted by Ghostride The Whip at 10:25 AM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
Yeah, my dad was big on trying to sell me on hard manual labor jobs always ending with the caveat that horrible injury could await, then wrapped up with some kind of challenge to my manhood like "You aren't SCARED, are you?" Of course I am, you lunatic, you just spent 15 minutes telling me all the ways I could get maimed.
posted by Ghostride The Whip at 10:25 AM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
This seems like a pretty normal listing for a deck hand. Is there anything about it that is out of the ordinary?
It mentions explicitly what in most other listings is left unsaid - specifically the bit about having to deal with kids and animals which always ends up happening and is never mentioned. It sounds pretty much like the experiences my friends had as deck hands except better paid and working for the Kennedys.
posted by atrazine at 10:27 AM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
It mentions explicitly what in most other listings is left unsaid - specifically the bit about having to deal with kids and animals which always ends up happening and is never mentioned. It sounds pretty much like the experiences my friends had as deck hands except better paid and working for the Kennedys.
posted by atrazine at 10:27 AM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
If I was younger I would've totally gone for this. The accommodations are probably spectacular, the stories and skills you'd get would be great, you'd spend time on a freakin' yacht, I can't imagine there is a downside to being on the good side of the Kennedys, it's FAR better paid than most summer jobs with more independence (you may work less hours at others but it would be at home and still minimum wage so you'd make less total), and I don't see how this job listing is out of the ordinary for this type of work except that the dude is openly honest about what you'll be doing.
posted by Anonymous at 10:32 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by Anonymous at 10:32 AM on May 11, 2013
Did y'all interpret the posting to mean the nine dogs would be on the boat?
posted by Unified Theory at 10:36 AM on May 11, 2013
posted by Unified Theory at 10:36 AM on May 11, 2013
I thought the nine dogs were also deckhands, since the captain obviously doesn't have a lot of money to spend on human help.
posted by orme at 10:42 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by orme at 10:42 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
Is Cragslist anything like Craigslist?
posted by Leisure_Muffin at 11:01 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Leisure_Muffin at 11:01 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
its about $4.54/ hour.
Plus room and board. This would actually be a pretty amazing way to spend a summer.
Contrast this with working as a deckhand on an Oglebay-Norton ship in the summer of 2001: one was paid $11.63/hour for a guaranteed 56 hours/week -- 16 of those at 1.5x pay -- and generally assigned no work on Sundays if outside of port, but paid overtime nonetheless. Every month included a holiday which paid 2x or 2.5x regular pay, and again one was generally paid for doing nothing if outside of port. The food was basically what one would find in a stereotypical diner, with at least several options available at any meal, and steak and london broil served twice a week. Cabins were more than adequate, and each deckhand generally got their own, at least on the 700' boats, as there were by that time only two deckhands per ship rather than the previously traditional three or four.
Having passed an extensive physical, inexperienced deckhands were expected to be willing to work, and that was it.
To my (jaundiced?) eye, on the other hand, it looks as though the Kennedys are looking for a wildly capable sycophant who will consider basking in their glory to be compensation for being paid damn near nothing for doing, as it were, damn near everything.
posted by mr. digits at 11:02 AM on May 11, 2013 [30 favorites]
Plus room and board. This would actually be a pretty amazing way to spend a summer.
Contrast this with working as a deckhand on an Oglebay-Norton ship in the summer of 2001: one was paid $11.63/hour for a guaranteed 56 hours/week -- 16 of those at 1.5x pay -- and generally assigned no work on Sundays if outside of port, but paid overtime nonetheless. Every month included a holiday which paid 2x or 2.5x regular pay, and again one was generally paid for doing nothing if outside of port. The food was basically what one would find in a stereotypical diner, with at least several options available at any meal, and steak and london broil served twice a week. Cabins were more than adequate, and each deckhand generally got their own, at least on the 700' boats, as there were by that time only two deckhands per ship rather than the previously traditional three or four.
Having passed an extensive physical, inexperienced deckhands were expected to be willing to work, and that was it.
To my (jaundiced?) eye, on the other hand, it looks as though the Kennedys are looking for a wildly capable sycophant who will consider basking in their glory to be compensation for being paid damn near nothing for doing, as it were, damn near everything.
posted by mr. digits at 11:02 AM on May 11, 2013 [30 favorites]
my dad kept trying to get me to go work for his cousin, who captained a fishing boat in Alaska. Except he would always end his pitch with the caveat that I would most likely lose at least one finger
My brother captains his fishing boat in Alaska. At the end of each season he reappears after no contact.
I've learned to begin each of those conversations with, "So how did you almost die this time?"
posted by StickyCarpet at 11:15 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
My brother captains his fishing boat in Alaska. At the end of each season he reappears after no contact.
I've learned to begin each of those conversations with, "So how did you almost die this time?"
posted by StickyCarpet at 11:15 AM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
It's said to see how he bends over backwards to appeal an inexperienced, naive, post-collegiate landlubber.
Which begs the question: Why not hire a qualified deckhand--somebody whose been on this gig for awhile and won't fuck up your expensive boat? Why not write "Deckhand wanted" on Craigslist and leave it at that?
If he wanted to give a young person an education in building character, he could do this via a hundred charities and organizations.
If he wanted a legitimate employee, he'd advertise in trade publications or get recommendations from friends.
posted by Gordion Knott at 11:34 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
Which begs the question: Why not hire a qualified deckhand--somebody whose been on this gig for awhile and won't fuck up your expensive boat? Why not write "Deckhand wanted" on Craigslist and leave it at that?
If he wanted to give a young person an education in building character, he could do this via a hundred charities and organizations.
If he wanted a legitimate employee, he'd advertise in trade publications or get recommendations from friends.
posted by Gordion Knott at 11:34 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
From the NY mag comments: It's finally trickling down
posted by photoslob at 11:40 AM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by photoslob at 11:40 AM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
Seymour Zamboni, that is just brilliant. I know your comment was facetious but it wasn't until reading it that I realized how fucking offensive the want ad is, you managed to highlight with your humor exactly how revoltingly privileged and exploitative this fuckwad Max Kennedy is. Seriously, fuck that guy.
posted by Unified Theory at 11:40 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by Unified Theory at 11:40 AM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
The thing is, he's probably going to find some one who is just as privileged, only younger. This strikes me as a job for rich recent college grads looking to do something cool before grad school.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 12:05 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 12:05 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
It was James Gatz who had been loafing along the beach that afternoon in a torn green jersey and a pair of canvas pants, but it was already Jay Gatsby who borrowed a row-boat, pulled out to the Tuolomee and informed Cody that a wind might catch him and break him up in half an hour.
Cody found Gatsby to be smart and ambitious and hired him. Cody fitted him out with a nautical wardrobe, and the Tuolomee set sail for the West Indies and the Barbary Coast with Gatsby aboard. - The Great Gatsby
posted by niccolo at 12:06 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Cody found Gatsby to be smart and ambitious and hired him. Cody fitted him out with a nautical wardrobe, and the Tuolomee set sail for the West Indies and the Barbary Coast with Gatsby aboard. - The Great Gatsby
posted by niccolo at 12:06 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Well, that ad makes my own wednesday night yacht racing seem positively bourgeois by comparison.
posted by tylerkaraszewski at 12:17 PM on May 11, 2013
posted by tylerkaraszewski at 12:17 PM on May 11, 2013
It is always the rich who least understand the true value of money.
posted by Apropos of Something at 1:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
posted by Apropos of Something at 1:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
"I might waken you at 3am after you have gone to bed exhausted, at midnight, and say there is an issue with the boat and you have to go out and work for another three hours, then get up at ten and start working again,"
A member of one of the richest and most privileged clans in the world puts out an ad for a a highly underpaid (5 bucks an hour or so) worker even though they could well afford to pay a decent wage to a skilled worker. No health insurance, no workman's comp if you hurt yourself at 3am while exhausted but presumably you will feel joy at the fact that you are cleaning out the toilets of a Kennedy .
Color me surprised.
posted by Podkayne of Pasadena at 1:28 PM on May 11, 2013 [9 favorites]
A member of one of the richest and most privileged clans in the world puts out an ad for a a highly underpaid (5 bucks an hour or so) worker even though they could well afford to pay a decent wage to a skilled worker. No health insurance, no workman's comp if you hurt yourself at 3am while exhausted but presumably you will feel joy at the fact that you are cleaning out the toilets of a Kennedy .
Color me surprised.
posted by Podkayne of Pasadena at 1:28 PM on May 11, 2013 [9 favorites]
The thing is, he's probably going to find some one who is just as privileged, only younger. This strikes me as a job for rich recent college grads looking to do something cool before grad school.
Man, having observed what happens when "rich recent college grads" take on something as simple as a part-time job at a coffeeshop, I'm pretty sure this gig would literally break in half any one of that set within the first few hours.
posted by invitapriore at 1:45 PM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Man, having observed what happens when "rich recent college grads" take on something as simple as a part-time job at a coffeeshop, I'm pretty sure this gig would literally break in half any one of that set within the first few hours.
posted by invitapriore at 1:45 PM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
The rich people I've known were actually pretty good at dealing with the kind of difficulties that privileged people encounter. Rich people pay to go to sea and work. The prospects of being a unremarkable office worker will make them lose their minds, but a lot of them can handle hard work of this type.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 2:22 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 2:22 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
The prospects of being a unremarkable office worker will make them lose their minds, but a lot of them can handle hard work of this type.
Which is why we see the wealthiest amongst us out there in the construction yards and not in, say boring Board meetings.
I can't imagine there is a downside to being on the good side of the Kennedys
There is a similar line of thinking which allows so many people to believe that they will be rich and powerful as well one day if only they adopt the stated goals and beliefs of the wealthy. You will not be "on the good side of the Kennedy's" . You will be their servant. You will enter and leave by the figurative back doors of the boat. There will be no hobnobbing with the Clintons or Kochs after hours. You will not have your drinks brought to you on deck when the work day is done nor will there be a Christmas card sent to you by Max thanking you for all your great work on the boat last summer. And when you ask for a reference it will not be Max Kennedy who signs it but rather some person working in a personal department.
The downside is that the shit and vomit of the rich and powerful stink just as much as anyone else's and your job will be to clean it up.
posted by Podkayne of Pasadena at 2:52 PM on May 11, 2013 [10 favorites]
Which is why we see the wealthiest amongst us out there in the construction yards and not in, say boring Board meetings.
I can't imagine there is a downside to being on the good side of the Kennedys
There is a similar line of thinking which allows so many people to believe that they will be rich and powerful as well one day if only they adopt the stated goals and beliefs of the wealthy. You will not be "on the good side of the Kennedy's" . You will be their servant. You will enter and leave by the figurative back doors of the boat. There will be no hobnobbing with the Clintons or Kochs after hours. You will not have your drinks brought to you on deck when the work day is done nor will there be a Christmas card sent to you by Max thanking you for all your great work on the boat last summer. And when you ask for a reference it will not be Max Kennedy who signs it but rather some person working in a personal department.
The downside is that the shit and vomit of the rich and powerful stink just as much as anyone else's and your job will be to clean it up.
posted by Podkayne of Pasadena at 2:52 PM on May 11, 2013 [10 favorites]
Cragslist is the place to go, where strapping, sun-battered men with faces like storm-flaked granite go to find underpaid graphic design gigs and declare that aye, they are indeed 420-friendly.
posted by mobunited at 2:59 PM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
posted by mobunited at 2:59 PM on May 11, 2013 [5 favorites]
This is like the second thing in a week that makes me want to smack the shit out of people on the Left.
When the dickheads on the Right start smack talking about "hypocritical liberal elitism" I always chuckle and write it off to projection - I grew up with right wingers with family money and I tell you, those are the ones who genuinely believe they are elite. But nevertheless, they beat the drumbeat of "liberal elites liberal elites liberal elites" until it is tattooed on the public consciousness. And I groan and sigh.
Then some Kennedy dipshit pulls a stunt like this. Last week it was the unhappy City Council woman offended at a children's diversity and learning project - now it's "slave on my yacht".
It's like Game of Thrones. I am sick of the Lannisters, sick of the Starks, sick of the Watch, sick of everyone, and am now going to start rooting for The Others.
posted by Xoebe at 3:11 PM on May 11, 2013 [7 favorites]
When the dickheads on the Right start smack talking about "hypocritical liberal elitism" I always chuckle and write it off to projection - I grew up with right wingers with family money and I tell you, those are the ones who genuinely believe they are elite. But nevertheless, they beat the drumbeat of "liberal elites liberal elites liberal elites" until it is tattooed on the public consciousness. And I groan and sigh.
Then some Kennedy dipshit pulls a stunt like this. Last week it was the unhappy City Council woman offended at a children's diversity and learning project - now it's "slave on my yacht".
It's like Game of Thrones. I am sick of the Lannisters, sick of the Starks, sick of the Watch, sick of everyone, and am now going to start rooting for The Others.
posted by Xoebe at 3:11 PM on May 11, 2013 [7 favorites]
I don't get the idea that this Kennedy is on the left, at least based on how he wants to treat this worker. And when Republicans talk about "liberal elites", they don't mean the Kennedys, they mean a college professor who makes $60,000 a year.
posted by Daily Alice at 3:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [6 favorites]
posted by Daily Alice at 3:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [6 favorites]
I think my point was a little obscured. My point was that it's a mistake to assume that rich=coddled. Rich people can care a lot about putting their kids through testing circumstances, if they think it will make them better suited to roles as important figures. Think about a scion of a rich family who joins the military to advance a future political career. That still happens.
What is hard for the privileged to take is mediocrity not work. Working, even like a dog, for a Kennedy isn't mediocre.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 3:20 PM on May 11, 2013
What is hard for the privileged to take is mediocrity not work. Working, even like a dog, for a Kennedy isn't mediocre.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 3:20 PM on May 11, 2013
Ask not what the Kennedys' can do for you; ask what you can do for the Kennedys'.
(Were I of age, I would totally apply, actually, if only for the stories I could tell after.)
posted by octobersurprise at 3:56 PM on May 11, 2013
(Were I of age, I would totally apply, actually, if only for the stories I could tell after.)
posted by octobersurprise at 3:56 PM on May 11, 2013
Which is why we see the wealthiest amongst us out there in the construction yards and not in, say boring Board meetings.
You will see them climbing mountains, doing transatlantic yacht races, and that sort of thing. It's easier to enjoy making no money doing gruelling work when you don't need the money and you know that at 22, it's the only time you'll ever have to do that sort of work. If there was some kind of accident at our local amateur triathlon we'd have a pressing shortage of barristers thereafter.
There is a similar line of thinking which allows so many people to believe that they will be rich and powerful as well one day if only they adopt the stated goals and beliefs of the wealthy. You will not be "on the good side of the Kennedy's" . You will be their servant. You will enter and leave by the figurative back doors of the boat.
Yes of course you're there as an employee but the class implications of a 20 year old working on a yacht for the summer before they head back to Dartmouth are not the same as working as a housekeeper when you're 45. That's always the case with jobs that are associated with 'elite' sports - one reason it's hard to make your living as a ski instructor is that upper middle class and rich kids do it for fun for a few seasons so you're competing with people who don't need the money.
A friend of mine spent four months working as a deckhand/SCUBA instructor/etc. for a wealthy Swedish family while he was on a sabbatical year from working at a management consultancy and is marrying into that family in July. No-one in the family has a problem with it and I assure you that had he been the gardener (who earns considerably more - this being Sweden after all) there would have been a very different reaction.
And when you ask for a reference it will not be Max Kennedy who signs it but rather some person working in a personal department.
I doubt that because this job ad (on craigslist!) was obviously not written by an HR professional. For someone that's on the fringes of the American elite (parents are dentists or something like that, currently attending an Ivy), I'd bet that there are doors that a phone call from 'ol Max would open. Especially in fields that you're qualified for but that are highly competitive and dominated by the children of the elite.
Anyway, old-money [not that a bunch of Catholic rum-runners are real old money, but oh well] loves telling the kind of story about the smart college kid who was a real hard worker and who they helped out with an introduction. It helps them look magnanimous without doing anything grubby like helping out an actual working class person.
posted by atrazine at 4:58 PM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
You will see them climbing mountains, doing transatlantic yacht races, and that sort of thing. It's easier to enjoy making no money doing gruelling work when you don't need the money and you know that at 22, it's the only time you'll ever have to do that sort of work. If there was some kind of accident at our local amateur triathlon we'd have a pressing shortage of barristers thereafter.
There is a similar line of thinking which allows so many people to believe that they will be rich and powerful as well one day if only they adopt the stated goals and beliefs of the wealthy. You will not be "on the good side of the Kennedy's" . You will be their servant. You will enter and leave by the figurative back doors of the boat.
Yes of course you're there as an employee but the class implications of a 20 year old working on a yacht for the summer before they head back to Dartmouth are not the same as working as a housekeeper when you're 45. That's always the case with jobs that are associated with 'elite' sports - one reason it's hard to make your living as a ski instructor is that upper middle class and rich kids do it for fun for a few seasons so you're competing with people who don't need the money.
A friend of mine spent four months working as a deckhand/SCUBA instructor/etc. for a wealthy Swedish family while he was on a sabbatical year from working at a management consultancy and is marrying into that family in July. No-one in the family has a problem with it and I assure you that had he been the gardener (who earns considerably more - this being Sweden after all) there would have been a very different reaction.
And when you ask for a reference it will not be Max Kennedy who signs it but rather some person working in a personal department.
I doubt that because this job ad (on craigslist!) was obviously not written by an HR professional. For someone that's on the fringes of the American elite (parents are dentists or something like that, currently attending an Ivy), I'd bet that there are doors that a phone call from 'ol Max would open. Especially in fields that you're qualified for but that are highly competitive and dominated by the children of the elite.
Anyway, old-money [not that a bunch of Catholic rum-runners are real old money, but oh well] loves telling the kind of story about the smart college kid who was a real hard worker and who they helped out with an introduction. It helps them look magnanimous without doing anything grubby like helping out an actual working class person.
posted by atrazine at 4:58 PM on May 11, 2013 [2 favorites]
Anyway, old-money [not that a bunch of Catholic rum-runners are real old money, but oh well] . . .
Exactly. It's no surprise to me that nobody who worked for the Kennedys in a manual job has a kind word for them. Certain people with new money are keenly aware that the only difference between them and the help is that money, and they are bound and determined to lord it over the help as hard as possible in order to increase their advantage. This is also, to me, the secret behind bad tipping from well-off people at restaurants.
(I understand that it does not necessarily speak well of me to have opinions of the difference between "old money" and "new money." Privilege is all ugly stuff. At least the Kennedys probably don't have somebody to put toothpaste on their brushes like Prince Charles.)
posted by Countess Elena at 5:13 PM on May 11, 2013
Exactly. It's no surprise to me that nobody who worked for the Kennedys in a manual job has a kind word for them. Certain people with new money are keenly aware that the only difference between them and the help is that money, and they are bound and determined to lord it over the help as hard as possible in order to increase their advantage. This is also, to me, the secret behind bad tipping from well-off people at restaurants.
(I understand that it does not necessarily speak well of me to have opinions of the difference between "old money" and "new money." Privilege is all ugly stuff. At least the Kennedys probably don't have somebody to put toothpaste on their brushes like Prince Charles.)
posted by Countess Elena at 5:13 PM on May 11, 2013
> This is like the second thing in a week that makes me want to smack the shit out of people on the Left.
It genuinely boggles my mind that you think the Kennedys are "on the Left." You need to read some history.
posted by languagehat at 5:18 PM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
It genuinely boggles my mind that you think the Kennedys are "on the Left." You need to read some history.
posted by languagehat at 5:18 PM on May 11, 2013 [4 favorites]
Also, what Podkayne of Pasadena said. Plus a little added anarchist venom.
posted by languagehat at 5:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by languagehat at 5:19 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
There is a similar line of thinking which allows so many people to believe that they will be rich and powerful as well one day if only they adopt the stated goals and beliefs of the wealthy.
Yep. It's like:
"Even through right now you're a roofer with just a GED, one day you might somehow get an Ivy league degree and become friends with a bunch of East Coast financiers. . ."
posted by mlis at 6:29 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Yep. It's like:
"Even through right now you're a roofer with just a GED, one day you might somehow get an Ivy league degree and become friends with a bunch of East Coast financiers. . ."
posted by mlis at 6:29 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Joe Kennedy Sr. didn't make his money in bootlegging. He made his fortune in finance / investment banking and was instrumental in arranging financing for a number of Holywood studios. He was made the first Chairman of the SEC because he knew all the tricks and was extremely effective for a time at reigning in his old associates.
posted by humanfont at 6:44 PM on May 11, 2013
posted by humanfont at 6:44 PM on May 11, 2013
Yeah, in with the fishing boat commenters. Same shit (you've really got to be able to work every job on the boat), much more dangerous, often working for a share of catch rather than a wage. And that's after costs - so a bad trip can either kill you or leave you broke.
posted by Ahab at 8:08 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
posted by Ahab at 8:08 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
There will be no hobnobbing with the Clintons or Kochs after hours. You will not have your drinks brought to you on deck when the work day is done nor will there be a Christmas card sent to you by Max thanking you for all your great work on the boat last summer. And when you ask for a reference it will not be Max Kennedy who signs it but rather some person working in a personal department.
Given Max put out an ad on Craigslist I dunno if an HR person is handling this particular position. I'm not thinking this would make anyone rich and elite. I'm thinking if you're just graduating college, or will be soon, and you're looking at getting a post-college job or go to grad school Max could be a helpful contact. It's pretty clear from the posting that while they expect this person to work and do manual labor, they also aren't looking for a poor kid from the Bronx who just got their GED and has no experience in any social setting outside the Bronx. They clearly want someone middle-class or above, maybe lower middle-class.
posted by Anonymous at 8:32 PM on May 11, 2013
Given Max put out an ad on Craigslist I dunno if an HR person is handling this particular position. I'm not thinking this would make anyone rich and elite. I'm thinking if you're just graduating college, or will be soon, and you're looking at getting a post-college job or go to grad school Max could be a helpful contact. It's pretty clear from the posting that while they expect this person to work and do manual labor, they also aren't looking for a poor kid from the Bronx who just got their GED and has no experience in any social setting outside the Bronx. They clearly want someone middle-class or above, maybe lower middle-class.
posted by Anonymous at 8:32 PM on May 11, 2013
To my (jaundiced?) eye, on the other hand, it looks as though the Kennedys are looking for a wildly capable sycophant who will consider basking in their glory to be compensation for being paid damn near nothing for doing, as it were, damn near everything.
So basically every job on Craigslist, these days.
posted by Sara C. at 11:25 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
So basically every job on Craigslist, these days.
posted by Sara C. at 11:25 PM on May 11, 2013 [1 favorite]
Did y'all interpret the posting to mean the nine dogs would be on the boat?
And apparently trees and grass as well: making BBQ, climbing trees, cutting grass, catching fish on lines and in nets.
This job really sounds like a combo of au pair, handyman, gardener, deckhand, and chef.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:10 AM on May 12, 2013
And apparently trees and grass as well: making BBQ, climbing trees, cutting grass, catching fish on lines and in nets.
This job really sounds like a combo of au pair, handyman, gardener, deckhand, and chef.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:10 AM on May 12, 2013
And that's after costs - so a bad trip can either kill you or leave you broke.
posted by Ahab at 20:08 on May 11
In your own case, the answer is somewhat obvious.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 6:16 AM on May 12, 2013 [6 favorites]
posted by Ahab at 20:08 on May 11
In your own case, the answer is somewhat obvious.
posted by Pyrogenesis at 6:16 AM on May 12, 2013 [6 favorites]
Sounds like an incredible opportunity to prove to a family with vast connections that you're not afraid of hard work and long hours. I spent my college summers mowing lawns for $13 an hour. I didn't meet anyone, I didn't learn anything, and the lawn mowing company didn't pay my room and board. I'd have jumped at this opportunity.
posted by Kwine at 9:33 AM on May 12, 2013
posted by Kwine at 9:33 AM on May 12, 2013
Sounds like an incredible opportunity to prove to a family with vast connections that you're not afraid of hard work and long hours.
This is probably why I'm a gutter-dwelling nobody, but I've lived my life with the attitude that if I ever feel I need some famous family's vast connections, I'm Doing It (i.e. Life) Wrong.
posted by Unified Theory at 9:50 AM on May 12, 2013
This is probably why I'm a gutter-dwelling nobody, but I've lived my life with the attitude that if I ever feel I need some famous family's vast connections, I'm Doing It (i.e. Life) Wrong.
posted by Unified Theory at 9:50 AM on May 12, 2013
an incredible opportunity
I think this phrase gets at the heart of what I find unsavory about this job posting.
It's not an "incredible opportunity". It's a job. We can debate till the cows come home whether it's a good job, or a job worth doing, or whether the pay is fair, or whether it would confer future advantages on the person who did it or not.
But it's a job. For money. An economic relationship.
When we start down the road where a job, even an interesting job, becomes "an incredible opportunity", we start getting perilously close to serfdom. It's as if the labor itself is worth nothing, and the worker should feel privileged simply for having the chance to work at all.
Oh, thank you, Mr. Kennedy, for allowing me to swab the decks on your boat! How can I ever repay this amazing opportunity?
posted by Sara C. at 10:14 AM on May 12, 2013 [7 favorites]
I think this phrase gets at the heart of what I find unsavory about this job posting.
It's not an "incredible opportunity". It's a job. We can debate till the cows come home whether it's a good job, or a job worth doing, or whether the pay is fair, or whether it would confer future advantages on the person who did it or not.
But it's a job. For money. An economic relationship.
When we start down the road where a job, even an interesting job, becomes "an incredible opportunity", we start getting perilously close to serfdom. It's as if the labor itself is worth nothing, and the worker should feel privileged simply for having the chance to work at all.
Oh, thank you, Mr. Kennedy, for allowing me to swab the decks on your boat! How can I ever repay this amazing opportunity?
posted by Sara C. at 10:14 AM on May 12, 2013 [7 favorites]
I thought I vaguely recalled Max Kennedy being the one whose attempted roll-out of his political career in the early 2000's was an unmitigated disaster.
I was right. This NYT article gives a pretty in-depth portrait of The Captain. Funny stuff. A taste:
Being a young Kennedy in America, even a fairly anonymous one, confers special status, and Max has always thrived in what his friend, the former Clinton speechwriter Ted Widmer, calls ''a state of pleasant anarchy.'' He rarely plans ahead or suffers the small inconveniences of everyday life. He almost never carries cash, confident that someone will cover him. He shows up at the toniest restaurants without a reservation, wearing a Hawaiian shirt and sneakers. Rather than leave his yogi-to-the-stars behind when he moved back to Cambridge from Los Angeles (his wife, Vicki, had landed a teaching fellowship at Harvard), he bankrolled a yoga studio in nearby Somerville and simply imported him.
If you go to work for him I guess you better carry cash.
posted by Unified Theory at 10:28 AM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
I was right. This NYT article gives a pretty in-depth portrait of The Captain. Funny stuff. A taste:
Being a young Kennedy in America, even a fairly anonymous one, confers special status, and Max has always thrived in what his friend, the former Clinton speechwriter Ted Widmer, calls ''a state of pleasant anarchy.'' He rarely plans ahead or suffers the small inconveniences of everyday life. He almost never carries cash, confident that someone will cover him. He shows up at the toniest restaurants without a reservation, wearing a Hawaiian shirt and sneakers. Rather than leave his yogi-to-the-stars behind when he moved back to Cambridge from Los Angeles (his wife, Vicki, had landed a teaching fellowship at Harvard), he bankrolled a yoga studio in nearby Somerville and simply imported him.
If you go to work for him I guess you better carry cash.
posted by Unified Theory at 10:28 AM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
If you go to work for him I guess you better carry cash.
A friend of mine spent some time as the personal assistant to a Bollywood actress who had come to the US to work on a film.
There were multiple occasions where they would go out somewhere and my friend would somehow get stuck with the (unbelievably gigantic) tab.
Said friend was a recent film school grad making like $400 a week if she was lucky. I think the movie ultimately "took care of it", but it still sucks to be a broke 22 year old out with your millionaire boss, expected to front a week's pay on a night of drinking.
posted by Sara C. at 10:58 AM on May 12, 2013
A friend of mine spent some time as the personal assistant to a Bollywood actress who had come to the US to work on a film.
There were multiple occasions where they would go out somewhere and my friend would somehow get stuck with the (unbelievably gigantic) tab.
Said friend was a recent film school grad making like $400 a week if she was lucky. I think the movie ultimately "took care of it", but it still sucks to be a broke 22 year old out with your millionaire boss, expected to front a week's pay on a night of drinking.
posted by Sara C. at 10:58 AM on May 12, 2013
... given a second go-round as an adolescent (only this time as a confident and more mature adolescent), hell I'd take the gig in a heartbeat. I expect I'm not (or wouldn't have been) Abercrombie & Fitch - looking enough to get it, though.
I'm going through my boat phase now. I've chased and gotten some marine trade certifications, and I've taken some leave from my high-paying programmer gig to basically be some marine electrician's bitch, in order to get some hours and experience.
Because... boats! Also, it's kind of cool to still be able to pick up something new in my 50s.
posted by Artful Codger at 1:45 PM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
I'm going through my boat phase now. I've chased and gotten some marine trade certifications, and I've taken some leave from my high-paying programmer gig to basically be some marine electrician's bitch, in order to get some hours and experience.
Because... boats! Also, it's kind of cool to still be able to pick up something new in my 50s.
posted by Artful Codger at 1:45 PM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Another part of the ad I call bullshit on ... the part where he says
if you are more than 22 years old you're probably way too old to do this job, so seriously this is a young person's job.
I really do not think there are any jobs where the physical demands render anyone over 22 unqualified. I mean, seriously.
The no-older-than-22 thing really seems like it's about the aesthetics (who wants some pot-bellied 30-year-old loser of a deckhand on a Kennedy boat when they could get a young recent Harvard grad?) and the requisite deference.
posted by Unified Theory at 3:34 PM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
if you are more than 22 years old you're probably way too old to do this job, so seriously this is a young person's job.
I really do not think there are any jobs where the physical demands render anyone over 22 unqualified. I mean, seriously.
The no-older-than-22 thing really seems like it's about the aesthetics (who wants some pot-bellied 30-year-old loser of a deckhand on a Kennedy boat when they could get a young recent Harvard grad?) and the requisite deference.
posted by Unified Theory at 3:34 PM on May 12, 2013 [1 favorite]
Eh, working in the film industry, there are age cutoffs to an extent. Just because working 16 and 20 hour days gets old really fast at a certain point.
Also, people in their mid 20's and beyond start having life demands that make jobs like these difficult. I mean, who wants to be a deckhand on a yacht for half minimum wage when they still have to pay rent on an apartment back on the mainland?
Also, a 22 year old has most likely never held a real job before and has no life experience about what is or is not reasonable to expect from such an arrangement. I could probably physically DO the job listed here, but when this asshole tried to wake me up at three AM to tie knots or some shit I would just tell him to fuck off.
"seriously this is a young person's job" is code for "I want someone who is completely flexible, and who also lacks the experience and coping skills to call me out on my bullshit."
posted by Sara C. at 3:39 PM on May 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
Also, people in their mid 20's and beyond start having life demands that make jobs like these difficult. I mean, who wants to be a deckhand on a yacht for half minimum wage when they still have to pay rent on an apartment back on the mainland?
Also, a 22 year old has most likely never held a real job before and has no life experience about what is or is not reasonable to expect from such an arrangement. I could probably physically DO the job listed here, but when this asshole tried to wake me up at three AM to tie knots or some shit I would just tell him to fuck off.
"seriously this is a young person's job" is code for "I want someone who is completely flexible, and who also lacks the experience and coping skills to call me out on my bullshit."
posted by Sara C. at 3:39 PM on May 12, 2013 [3 favorites]
« Older Not fade away | Lots of sax; no violins Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 9:24 AM on May 11, 2013 [17 favorites]