Panik to Crawford to Belt
November 5, 2014 2:35 AM Subscribe
MLB.com's StatCast dissects the World Series Game Seven double play seen as key to the San Francisco Giants win over the Kansas City Royals.
The play included an initial "safe" call for Eric Hosmer at first base, later reversed to "out" after studying the instant reply under the new rules. It was the first time a reply challenge was used in the World Series.
Eric Hosmer was clearly out. Which reopens the argument about whether sliding into first is a smart move, or not.
Bonus: NY Times interview with Madison Bumgarner's father.
The play included an initial "safe" call for Eric Hosmer at first base, later reversed to "out" after studying the instant reply under the new rules. It was the first time a reply challenge was used in the World Series.
Eric Hosmer was clearly out. Which reopens the argument about whether sliding into first is a smart move, or not.
Bonus: NY Times interview with Madison Bumgarner's father.
Sliding into first is fine, especially if you are Brandon Belt playing defense.
(MAD BUM MAD BUM MAD BUM!!!)
posted by rtha at 5:54 AM on November 5, 2014
(MAD BUM MAD BUM MAD BUM!!!)
posted by rtha at 5:54 AM on November 5, 2014
That play was witchcraft. But Hosmer learned the hard way at the wrong time that you do NOT slide into first base. It's the one base that you have the option of running through safely and conserving your momentum without worrying about a tag out on a force play.
posted by azpenguin at 6:03 AM on November 5, 2014 [2 favorites]
posted by azpenguin at 6:03 AM on November 5, 2014 [2 favorites]
I wonder if the 72mph figure cited for Crawford's throw from second is comparable to the typical way pitch speed is measured? For example, if the 72mph measurement was just the initial velocity when the ball left his hand while a 95mph pitch is at a mid-point or an average over the range.
Anyway, if that 72 is comparable that's damn impressive considering it was all arm.
posted by mullacc at 6:10 AM on November 5, 2014
Anyway, if that 72 is comparable that's damn impressive considering it was all arm.
posted by mullacc at 6:10 AM on November 5, 2014
the other major problem of sliding into 1B is that there is no audible sound for the umpire to compare to the glove pop.
It wasn't that play that killed KC's chances it's that they totally abandoned the small ball play that got them to the WS. They hit a couple of big HRs and all of the sudden they stopped taking chances on the bases. Early in the playoffs I noticed several times the Royals taking off when the catch was still in question, their anemic offense demanded that they be more careless on the bases. This came to a head in the penultimate play of the game when SF was doing everything they could to allow KC to tie the game and yet the 3B coach didn't send Gordon home after not 1 but 2 miscues in the outfield. Sometimes people are just deaf to the good fortune presented to them by the universe.
posted by any major dude at 6:13 AM on November 5, 2014
It wasn't that play that killed KC's chances it's that they totally abandoned the small ball play that got them to the WS. They hit a couple of big HRs and all of the sudden they stopped taking chances on the bases. Early in the playoffs I noticed several times the Royals taking off when the catch was still in question, their anemic offense demanded that they be more careless on the bases. This came to a head in the penultimate play of the game when SF was doing everything they could to allow KC to tie the game and yet the 3B coach didn't send Gordon home after not 1 but 2 miscues in the outfield. Sometimes people are just deaf to the good fortune presented to them by the universe.
posted by any major dude at 6:13 AM on November 5, 2014
Panik's reaction time was recorded at negative-0.03 seconds, exhibiting unrivaled anticipation. ... Giants shortstop Brandon Crawford was also credited for moving to his left with great awareness, preparing for the toss to second base in negative-0.91 seconds
Negative reaction time? Double plays sure are easy to turn when your guys can bend the laws of physics!
posted by exogenous at 6:28 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
Negative reaction time? Double plays sure are easy to turn when your guys can bend the laws of physics!
posted by exogenous at 6:28 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
nope still too fresh to read this
see you in 29 years
posted by dismas at 6:32 AM on November 5, 2014 [7 favorites]
see you in 29 years
posted by dismas at 6:32 AM on November 5, 2014 [7 favorites]
I can't find it right now, but I read a paper about the reaction time of tennis players. Skilled players react much faster than novices when hitting against live opponents - the reaction gap narrows dramatically when hitting against a machine. The best players pull in a bunch of other visual cues to reduce the time it takes them to move to where the ball is going to go. Panik read the pitch and the swing and was moving before the ball left the bat.
posted by IanMorr at 6:47 AM on November 5, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by IanMorr at 6:47 AM on November 5, 2014 [3 favorites]
related game 7 analyses:
Send Alex Gordon!
Don't Send Alex Gordon!
posted by mcstayinskool at 6:58 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
Send Alex Gordon!
Don't Send Alex Gordon!
posted by mcstayinskool at 6:58 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
I've really enjoyed these StatCast videos. This one about McCutchen and Puig is also really good.
posted by DowBits at 7:19 AM on November 5, 2014
posted by DowBits at 7:19 AM on November 5, 2014
You know you've made the wrong choice if you find yourself on the receiving end of a Bill Nye tweet.
posted by goatdog at 7:25 AM on November 5, 2014
posted by goatdog at 7:25 AM on November 5, 2014
any major dude, another factor was that Salvador Perez was all arms at the plate after getting plunked on the leg in the second inning. At least once that I remember he'd've made a difference if he could've hit the ball through the infield.
Also, as soon as the Panik play happened I thought of this. Pure genius instinct.
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:04 AM on November 5, 2014
Also, as soon as the Panik play happened I thought of this. Pure genius instinct.
posted by Lyme Drop at 8:04 AM on November 5, 2014
I can't find it right now, but I read a paper about the reaction time of tennis players. Skilled players react much faster than novices when hitting against live opponents - the reaction gap narrows dramatically when hitting against a machine. The best players pull in a bunch of other visual cues to reduce the time it takes them to move to where the ball is going to go. Panik read the pitch and the swing and was moving before the ball left the bat.
Yes, I have read this as well. I think it was in Blink by Malcolm Gladwell.
The middle infielders will often also watch the catcher's signals to anticipate the pitch. In this case, the pitch was a fastball, which often results in opposite field hits because the bat makes contact earlier in the swinging motion. For a lefty such as Hosmer, this means the ball will tend to go towards the left half of the field, which is to Panik's right.
posted by ILuvMath at 8:24 AM on November 5, 2014
Yes, I have read this as well. I think it was in Blink by Malcolm Gladwell.
The middle infielders will often also watch the catcher's signals to anticipate the pitch. In this case, the pitch was a fastball, which often results in opposite field hits because the bat makes contact earlier in the swinging motion. For a lefty such as Hosmer, this means the ball will tend to go towards the left half of the field, which is to Panik's right.
posted by ILuvMath at 8:24 AM on November 5, 2014
re reading the pitch, yes, its been shown that baseball players are reading cues from the pitcher's body language, its not that they have unusually quick visual processing.
One reason why there was a high school softball pitcher called Jenny Finch in CA who has struck out MLB hitters because they don't have the right cues to read as the pitch is delivered.
This was a GREAT year in baseball playoffs, from the wildcards through Game 7, though. Great defense, outfields, great strategy, and alas, KC, MadBum
posted by C.A.S. at 9:07 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
One reason why there was a high school softball pitcher called Jenny Finch in CA who has struck out MLB hitters because they don't have the right cues to read as the pitch is delivered.
This was a GREAT year in baseball playoffs, from the wildcards through Game 7, though. Great defense, outfields, great strategy, and alas, KC, MadBum
posted by C.A.S. at 9:07 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
But Hosmer learned the hard way at the wrong time that you do NOT slide into first base. It's the one base that you have the option of running through safely and conserving your momentum without worrying about a tag out on a force play.
How does someone make it all the way to the MLB and then to the World Series and not have this drilled into their heads so that it's automatic? It's one of the first things you learn about base running in Little League. I guess when you're in the heat of a moment like that it might be pretty easy to slip up, so I shouldn't judge.
posted by ChuckRamone at 10:32 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
How does someone make it all the way to the MLB and then to the World Series and not have this drilled into their heads so that it's automatic? It's one of the first things you learn about base running in Little League. I guess when you're in the heat of a moment like that it might be pretty easy to slip up, so I shouldn't judge.
posted by ChuckRamone at 10:32 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
> This was a GREAT year in baseball playoffs, from the wildcards through Game 7, though. Great defense, outfields, great strategy, and alas, KC, MadBum
Indeed, and I find it strange this is the only MeFi post about the postseason. How many posts did we have about the World Cup? I know, I know, once every four years and world vs US, but still. Thanks for this post, and congratulations Giants! (Note to Royals fans: as a Mets fan, I know what it's like not to have won a Series in several decades. Hang in there.)
posted by languagehat at 10:53 AM on November 5, 2014 [2 favorites]
Indeed, and I find it strange this is the only MeFi post about the postseason. How many posts did we have about the World Cup? I know, I know, once every four years and world vs US, but still. Thanks for this post, and congratulations Giants! (Note to Royals fans: as a Mets fan, I know what it's like not to have won a Series in several decades. Hang in there.)
posted by languagehat at 10:53 AM on November 5, 2014 [2 favorites]
Also, as soon as the Panik play happened I thought of this. Pure genius instinct.
Actually I remember Jeter being interviewed about the play after the game mentioning Spencer's penchant for missing the cutoff man being his main motivation for backing up the throw. Sometimes genius instinct can be weeks in the making.
posted by any major dude at 11:47 AM on November 5, 2014 [1 favorite]
Note to Royals fans: as a Mets fan, I know what it's like not to have won a Series in several decades. Hang in there
Boo hoo. As a life-long Cubs fan, I really feel your pain. :)
When you have to go back to 1908, get in touch.
You'll always have 69, though. At the Cubs expense. Just before my time, I only now appreciate how good that Cubs team was, and how epic the August collapse.
posted by C.A.S. at 1:11 PM on November 5, 2014
Boo hoo. As a life-long Cubs fan, I really feel your pain. :)
When you have to go back to 1908, get in touch.
You'll always have 69, though. At the Cubs expense. Just before my time, I only now appreciate how good that Cubs team was, and how epic the August collapse.
posted by C.A.S. at 1:11 PM on November 5, 2014
> Boo hoo. As a life-long Cubs fan, I really feel your pain. :)
When you have to go back to 1908, get in touch.
Hey, I would never dream of trying to console a Cubs fan; I simply doff my cap in respect.
posted by languagehat at 1:37 PM on November 5, 2014
When you have to go back to 1908, get in touch.
Hey, I would never dream of trying to console a Cubs fan; I simply doff my cap in respect.
posted by languagehat at 1:37 PM on November 5, 2014
Eric Byrnes headfirst dove into first base for the final out of the 2007 NLCS… and then stayed there motionless, face-down in the dirt as the Rockies celebrated.
posted by El Mariachi at 1:43 PM on November 5, 2014
posted by El Mariachi at 1:43 PM on November 5, 2014
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