How was Roman column formed?
March 18, 2015 11:52 AM Subscribe
This short, stop-motion film shows how Trajan's Column might have been constructed. The behind-the-scenes of the stop motion is also pretty neat.
The Roman emperor's victory over the Dacians in A.D. 106 is carved in a spiraling frieze up the column.
The Roman emperor's victory over the Dacians in A.D. 106 is carved in a spiraling frieze up the column.
I don't know, Davey... I don't think Father will be happy that we used a time machine to travel to an ancient pagan society... </goliath>
posted by not_on_display at 11:58 AM on March 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
posted by not_on_display at 11:58 AM on March 18, 2015 [7 favorites]
Praeces meae cum snut mater
posted by boo_radley at 11:59 AM on March 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
posted by boo_radley at 11:59 AM on March 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
The Roman emperor's victory over the Dacians in A.D. 106 is carved in a spiraling frieze up the column.
I hadn't known there was a spiral staircase carved into the interior of the multi-ton blocks of solid marble that comprise the column. Nifty, as was the video.
posted by Gelatin at 12:00 PM on March 18, 2015 [8 favorites]
I hadn't known there was a spiral staircase carved into the interior of the multi-ton blocks of solid marble that comprise the column. Nifty, as was the video.
posted by Gelatin at 12:00 PM on March 18, 2015 [8 favorites]
I studied art history in college, and I totally don't remember being told that there was a staircase built into Trajan's Column. That's just amazing.
posted by xingcat at 12:03 PM on March 18, 2015
posted by xingcat at 12:03 PM on March 18, 2015
I know - the thought of the staircase being carved out of the center of each block, and then everything being fitted together! Wow.
posted by rtha at 12:09 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by rtha at 12:09 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
Ancient Rome, y'all. They weren't idiots.
PBS had a similar show set in the Colosseum once, where they tried to recreate the trap door system that Romans could have used to present their stadium shows - and a team of modern engineers figured out how to use a manpowered pulley-and-platform system to lift a caged wolf up from the underground "backstage" area at the Colosseum to a trap door which it would use to enter the Colosseum floor.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:10 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
PBS had a similar show set in the Colosseum once, where they tried to recreate the trap door system that Romans could have used to present their stadium shows - and a team of modern engineers figured out how to use a manpowered pulley-and-platform system to lift a caged wolf up from the underground "backstage" area at the Colosseum to a trap door which it would use to enter the Colosseum floor.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:10 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
"Well, each century would draw straws to see who had the honor of going first, and they would be preceded by their standard-bearers and trumpeters, who would set the pace. Along with his armor, each soldier would carry two javelins with him, as well as...oh...you mean the other kind..."
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 12:11 PM on March 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 12:11 PM on March 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
How did Selfie Guy get back from ancient Rome? The TARDIS/Photo-booth was unplugged when he landed!
Great video, great little morsel of learning. How fun must it have been to build the model for filming - such detail!
posted by jazon at 12:18 PM on March 18, 2015
Great video, great little morsel of learning. How fun must it have been to build the model for filming - such detail!
posted by jazon at 12:18 PM on March 18, 2015
Wow, that is super neat, and I actually did assume they meant a column of infantry until I saw the more inside.
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 12:18 PM on March 18, 2015
posted by Steely-eyed Missile Man at 12:18 PM on March 18, 2015
I hadn't known there was a spiral staircase carved into the interior...
That was a total surprise to me, too. As was Trajan's tomb being in the base.
posted by Thorzdad at 12:28 PM on March 18, 2015
That was a total surprise to me, too. As was Trajan's tomb being in the base.
posted by Thorzdad at 12:28 PM on March 18, 2015
Imagine calculating all the engineering requirements using Roman numerals.
posted by QuietDesperation at 12:31 PM on March 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
posted by QuietDesperation at 12:31 PM on March 18, 2015 [6 favorites]
Huh, I just made a joke pretty much for languagehat alone.
And yeah, Roman Engineers Did Not Fuck Around. They developed a type of concrete that was similar to our current cement ca 1st century CE. In some cases, roman materials are more durable than what we produce today. Let that sink in: 2,000 years of progress, and they still manage to one up us every now and again.
posted by boo_radley at 12:32 PM on March 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
And yeah, Roman Engineers Did Not Fuck Around. They developed a type of concrete that was similar to our current cement ca 1st century CE. In some cases, roman materials are more durable than what we produce today. Let that sink in: 2,000 years of progress, and they still manage to one up us every now and again.
posted by boo_radley at 12:32 PM on March 18, 2015 [3 favorites]
Let that sink in: 2,000 years of progress, and they still manage to one up us every now and again.
If memory serves me correctly, there are places in Europe where Roman roads are still used, at least as the base of a modern road.
...and it turns out their construction is detailed on, yes, Trajan's Column.
posted by Gelatin at 12:37 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
If memory serves me correctly, there are places in Europe where Roman roads are still used, at least as the base of a modern road.
...and it turns out their construction is detailed on, yes, Trajan's Column.
posted by Gelatin at 12:37 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Those poor Dacians, crushed into subservience, their state fragmented, and the directly-annexed part essentially used as ablative armor for the empire's Danube frontier for the better part of the following two centuries.
That's what you got for having gold mines and working on your own state consolidation too close to Rome, however...
posted by Earthtopus at 12:39 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
That's what you got for having gold mines and working on your own state consolidation too close to Rome, however...
posted by Earthtopus at 12:39 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
How did Selfie Guy get back from ancient Rome? The TARDIS/Photo-booth was unplugged when he landed!
I'm pretty sure that Elon Musk lent him some of those new Tesla batteries.
posted by TDavis at 1:01 PM on March 18, 2015
I'm pretty sure that Elon Musk lent him some of those new Tesla batteries.
posted by TDavis at 1:01 PM on March 18, 2015
Prof. Lynn Lancaster (who gets a cite in the credits) knows all about this stuff. She has uploaded her piece on Building Trajan's Column to her academia.edu site, for which action I, for one, thank her. (She also has things to say about Roman concrete.)
Huh, I just made a joke pretty much for languagehat alone.
So it would seem! Well, I assume the reference is to preces meae non sunt dignae, but I can't quite figure if that's a deliberate misspelling of sunt (and if so, to what purpose; even if slurred into English it doesn't quite make it for me), or what mother has to do with it.
Maybe you had to be there?
posted by BWA at 1:10 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Huh, I just made a joke pretty much for languagehat alone.
So it would seem! Well, I assume the reference is to preces meae non sunt dignae, but I can't quite figure if that's a deliberate misspelling of sunt (and if so, to what purpose; even if slurred into English it doesn't quite make it for me), or what mother has to do with it.
Maybe you had to be there?
posted by BWA at 1:10 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
BWA: "I assume the reference is to preces meae non sunt dignae, but I can't quite figure if that's a deliberate misspelling of sunt, or what mother has to do with it. "
Totally deliberate (and Praeces, too) and a callback to the the source of this thread's title:my pary are with the father. Inexplicably I replaced pater with mater. I'm not sure how you'd say "christ, what a fuckup" in latin, but that's what I did there.
posted by boo_radley at 1:21 PM on March 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
Totally deliberate (and Praeces, too) and a callback to the the source of this thread's title:my pary are with the father. Inexplicably I replaced pater with mater. I'm not sure how you'd say "christ, what a fuckup" in latin, but that's what I did there.
posted by boo_radley at 1:21 PM on March 18, 2015 [4 favorites]
How did Selfie Guy get back from ancient Rome? The TARDIS/Photo-booth was unplugged when he landed!
Well... it is a nice little video, but one of the rules of narrative is that you only get a happy ending by knowing when to stop the story.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:27 PM on March 18, 2015
Well... it is a nice little video, but one of the rules of narrative is that you only get a happy ending by knowing when to stop the story.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:27 PM on March 18, 2015
At about 3:15 in the video: "Within each drum [section of the column] was carved windows and a staircase to allow access to the top."
The staircase is mentioned in the Wikipedia entry, too.
posted by Gelatin at 1:34 PM on March 18, 2015
The staircase is mentioned in the Wikipedia entry, too.
posted by Gelatin at 1:34 PM on March 18, 2015
I wonder what it looked like painted... (argh the weird interface confused me and I missed the REALLY OBVIOUS PAINTED REPRESENTATION IN THE ARTICLE)
posted by flaterik at 1:37 PM on March 18, 2015
posted by flaterik at 1:37 PM on March 18, 2015
Ha, eat it, you loser Dacians!
posted by Chrysostom at 2:02 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Chrysostom at 2:02 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
you can just say "Dacians".
posted by boo_radley at 2:05 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
posted by boo_radley at 2:05 PM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]
The visibility problem is a curious one - from Wikipedia, "the structure would have been generally invisible and surrounded by the two libraries in Trajan's Forum, and because of the difficulty involved in following the frieze from end to end, it could be said to have had much less propaganda value."
I have a pet theory that Trajan's Column was surrounded by a polished metal sheath, so you could only view the column's exterior by climbing the interior staircase, looking out the little windows, and seeing the reflection of the column's surface. Almost certainly nonsense, but at least it's entertaining nonsense.
posted by Paragon at 2:21 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
I have a pet theory that Trajan's Column was surrounded by a polished metal sheath, so you could only view the column's exterior by climbing the interior staircase, looking out the little windows, and seeing the reflection of the column's surface. Almost certainly nonsense, but at least it's entertaining nonsense.
posted by Paragon at 2:21 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
How did Selfie Guy get back from ancient Rome? The TARDIS/Photo-booth was unplugged when he landed!
Well, assuming the time-travel mechanisms were fairly advanced, and that his smartphone might've been recent enough to allow near-field communication - LOOK, IT'S A CARTOON, ALRIGHT?
posted by Smart Dalek at 2:35 PM on March 18, 2015
Well, assuming the time-travel mechanisms were fairly advanced, and that his smartphone might've been recent enough to allow near-field communication - LOOK, IT'S A CARTOON, ALRIGHT?
posted by Smart Dalek at 2:35 PM on March 18, 2015
> Praeces meae cum snut mater
Tu boner fack benigne!
posted by languagehat at 2:46 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Tu boner fack benigne!
posted by languagehat at 2:46 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Those little removable dovetail lifters are genius. In about two seconds I went from "Wait, that's not gonna..." to "OH WOW".
posted by echo target at 3:04 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by echo target at 3:04 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
languagehat: "Tu boner fack benigne!"
I also would have accepted "Tu Cloaca".
posted by boo_radley at 3:15 PM on March 18, 2015
I also would have accepted "Tu Cloaca".
posted by boo_radley at 3:15 PM on March 18, 2015
Fails the Bechdel test.
posted by Dreidl at 5:33 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by Dreidl at 5:33 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
And yeah, Roman Engineers Did Not Fuck Around. They developed a type of concrete that was similar to our current cement ca 1st century CE.
Did you see the video that autoplayed right after, about concrete fabric construction?
The column and scaffolding animations immediately reminded me of a couple of posts at the always fascinating Ptak Science Books:
The Beauty of Repair—Moving Heavy Stuff and Fixing the Impossible
Definitions of Columns and Shapes
posted by charlie don't surf at 7:31 PM on March 18, 2015
Did you see the video that autoplayed right after, about concrete fabric construction?
The column and scaffolding animations immediately reminded me of a couple of posts at the always fascinating Ptak Science Books:
The Beauty of Repair—Moving Heavy Stuff and Fixing the Impossible
Definitions of Columns and Shapes
posted by charlie don't surf at 7:31 PM on March 18, 2015
Getting to climb the staircase inside of Trajan's Column and watch Rome sprawl out all around at the top was the best field trip ever. The windows were the biggest surprise-- they're so subtle and so easily lost in the overall design, but those little slits are really essential on the trip up and down. If you're interested in seeing the Column up close, there are still a couple of really excellent casts left: at the Museo della Civilta Romana if you're in Rome when it reopens, the V & A if you want the vertical edition.
posted by jetlagaddict at 10:11 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
posted by jetlagaddict at 10:11 PM on March 18, 2015 [1 favorite]
Cool video, I was also amazed by the staircase carved into each block.
Here's a public service announcement for anyone wanting to make stop motion animation, though: Deflicker filters are cheap and abundantly available. Use them.
posted by Joakim Ziegler at 1:12 AM on March 19, 2015
Here's a public service announcement for anyone wanting to make stop motion animation, though: Deflicker filters are cheap and abundantly available. Use them.
posted by Joakim Ziegler at 1:12 AM on March 19, 2015
What a fun video! The whimsical elements reminded me of David Macaulay's illustrations.
posted by smammy at 6:23 AM on March 19, 2015
posted by smammy at 6:23 AM on March 19, 2015
Lovely stop motion work! And fun humor: Roman laborer wearing Addidas at 2:19, and another using iPhone at 4:18.
posted by metacurious at 2:40 PM on March 19, 2015
posted by metacurious at 2:40 PM on March 19, 2015
Earthtopus: "Those poor Dacians, crushed into subservience, their state fragmented, and the directly-annexed part essentially used as ablative armor for the empire's Danube frontier for the better part of the following two centuries.
That's what you got for having gold mines and working on your own state consolidation too close to Rome, however..."
The spouse and I were watching a Terry Jones historical piece (Barbarians, maybe) and found ourselves in a call-and-response pattern before long:
That's what you got for having gold mines and working on your own state consolidation too close to Rome, however..."
The spouse and I were watching a Terry Jones historical piece (Barbarians, maybe) and found ourselves in a call-and-response pattern before long:
Jones: Now why would the Romans decide to invade [whichever people are currently under discussion], when they'd had a productive trading relationship until then?posted by Lexica at 1:53 PM on March 22, 2015 [1 favorite]
Spouse and me, in chorus: Was there GOLD?
Jones: It turns out, the [people] were sitting on top of large gold deposits, at [location].
Us: Called it.
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posted by phearlez at 11:54 AM on March 18, 2015 [2 favorites]