I'm the Doctor... and I save people!
July 10, 2015 7:44 AM   Subscribe

 
You know, no matter how problematic or disappointing or middling, NuWho can be, I will never be able to stop the chills down my spine, or the leap in my heart, or the smile on my face when I see a Who trailer or teaser.
posted by Kitteh at 7:47 AM on July 10, 2015 [17 favorites]


Yaaay! A female Master :) I hope she's as campy as the Master was before. Now we just have to wait for a female Doctor!
posted by starlybri at 7:48 AM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


There have been at least two female Doctors. And they were both on Posh Nosh.

Actually, everyone on Posh Nosh was a Doctor.
posted by Yowser at 7:53 AM on July 10, 2015 [5 favorites]


You know, no matter how problematic or disappointing or middling, NuWho can be, I will never be able to stop the chills down my spine, or the leap in my heart, or the smile on my face when I see a Who trailer or teaser.
posted by Kitteh at 10:47 AM on July 10


I'm usually this way, but this left me feeling kind of meh. I'm very much down to my last chance with this show.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 7:57 AM on July 10, 2015 [3 favorites]


It probably wasn't a huge deal to most of the world when last season of Who ratcheted up the dark/scary factor and the appropriate age range for viewers bumped up by around five years. Many people probably even considered it good news. But for my family and my six year-old kid who'd cheerfully clambered onto the couch every Saturday to watch dinosaurs on a spaceship or cat people in New New York, it kind of sucked. Because now it's no longer in his wheelhouse and he's effectively boxed out for a few years.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:04 AM on July 10, 2015 [5 favorites]


I find this brave new world wherein everyone is a Whovian fascinating. When I was younger, as a USAian, Doctor Who was the definition of a "cult show." It was less socially acceptable than being really into Stephen Sondheim musicals. Now it's as universally recognized as Star Wars. How the hell did that happen?

Russell T Davies was a real magician. He took the bones of the classic show and regenerated it into a modern television format. To me, his work felt very much of a piece with the classic show (unlike the misbegotten Paul McGann TV movie). What felt "off" were the big events, usually season-enders that destroyed the universe in an ever biggening fashion. I'm not a fan of those.

But after doing some reading, it seems like those events are what has boosted the popularity of the show into the stratosphere. Steven Moffat has kept to that pattern, only moreso, and seen the same rise in profile worldwide. These producers want the show to last, want to make it impossible for the BBC to cancel. They seem to be succeeding, though at the cost of some of the small-scale sensibilty of the show. I've enjoyed Capaldi's performance a lot, and the bombast meter has come down a tad from the 50th Anniversary/Goodbye Matt Smith year. I'm always excited to see what's next.

If you'd rather watch old 6th Doctor & Peri episodes, you have that option.
posted by rikschell at 8:12 AM on July 10, 2015 [17 favorites]


But for my family and my six year-old kid who'd cheerfully clambered onto the couch every Saturday to watch dinosaurs on a spaceship or cat people in New New York, it kind of sucked.

Perhaps a more traditional location is called for.
posted by Tell Me No Lies at 8:12 AM on July 10, 2015 [13 favorites]


I find this brave new world wherein everyone is a Whovian fascinating. When I was younger, as a USAian, Doctor Who was the definition of a "cult show."

It IS weird. I remember when NuWho started and it would air around 8 pm on the SciFi channel. I would get weird looks from my friends when I wanted to get home on a Friday night to watch it. (Barbelith was still a going concern back then; since the board was mostly populated by Brits, there were threads about each new episode. I even remember one poster mailing me the DVDs for the first half of the 9th Doctor season when I had missed an episode just so I could keep up.)

I am not complaining, mind. But it is astonishing to me that a show that people thought I was lame for loving are now active viewers themselves.
posted by Kitteh at 8:18 AM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


Blink is one of my top ten episodes of NuWho. It's also pretty darn scary (and sadly, the antagonists were overused in the Matt Smith era and rendered less so). I'm all for darker Who.
posted by linux at 8:28 AM on July 10, 2015 [10 favorites]


Proof that Who is mainstream now... Lego: Dimensions. My SO, who grew up in Scotland and had to do some creative watching when Who started up again in 2005, is freaking out a bit over all this.
posted by Huck500 at 8:29 AM on July 10, 2015 [7 favorites]


I think part of Dr. Who's success in hitting the main stream has been part of a general success and increase access to English programming, specifically in the realm of science fiction and fantasy. It used to be that one had to either rely upon the quirky sentiments of a local public access television programmer or rely upon PBS to import the majority of British television. Now, there's BBC America (for all your ST:NG viewing needs), American cable networks in need of programming thats cheaper to license than produce, and the next thing you know, a fair chunk of people can recognize the TARDIS.

That said, it's a bit of an exaggeration to equate Who to Star Wars, at least the original trilogy. I'd wager that 90% of the population can recognize the Millennium Falcon, but maybe less than that percentage can recognize the TARDIS (it doesn't help that the hero of the show is played by a different face/actor every so many years). In the realm of Sci-Fi/Fantasy fans, I would definitely raise that percentage quite a bit, tho'.

It looks like Season 9 will weigh heavily on alien or future cities. How about some time travel into the past that isn't the same setting for Charles Dickens or Sherlock Holmes?
posted by Atreides at 8:38 AM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


Blink is one of my top ten episodes of NuWho. It's also pretty darn scary

Something to look forward to, then: Hettie MacDonald, who directed "Blink," finally returned after eight years to direct the first couple episodes of this series.
posted by Iridic at 8:45 AM on July 10, 2015 [5 favorites]


I'd wager that 90% of the population can recognize the Millennium Falcon, but maybe less than that percentage can recognize the TARDIS...

... or recognize a Dalek.
posted by bentley at 8:46 AM on July 10, 2015 [4 favorites]


I was excited for Lego Doctor in Lego Dimensions, until I saw that the starter game is $100 and each level pack (including Doctor Who) is another $30. I know Legos are pricy, but cripes.
posted by frogstar42 at 8:46 AM on July 10, 2015 [3 favorites]


How about some time travel into the past that isn't the same setting for Charles Dickens or Sherlock Holmes?

The episodes Maisie Williams will be guest starring in will be set in Viking era and the late Middle Ages England. On the other hand, it is rumored that the episode Mark Gatiss is writing for this season will feature Jane Austen. That episode hasn't yet been filmed.
posted by plastic_animals at 8:47 AM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


Okay, Star Wars may be a slight exaggeration, but as a guy who works in a shop that sells Doctor Who Magazine and has a knitted Tardis and sock monkeys of the Doctor, it's amazing to see how recognizable it is, and multigenerational, too. And that the people who recognize it are REALLY excited.
posted by rikschell at 8:47 AM on July 10, 2015


And last year we had Robin Hood. I wish they'd get off Earth more, but Moffat does not like cheesy effects in the way RTD did, so they have to travel less to hide the budget limitations.
posted by rikschell at 8:50 AM on July 10, 2015


I really want Craig Ferguson to come back and guest on whatever episode has Capaldi wailing on a guitar.

Also Gomez is a DELIGHT as the Master and she can have the role forever.
posted by fifteen schnitzengruben is my limit at 9:07 AM on July 10, 2015 [7 favorites]


As an old-skool Whovian (PBS brought me Tom Baker and a stint living in England introduced me to Peter Davison and regeneration), I find the best way for me to enjoy the show without disappointment now is to ignore the hype and all the teaser trailers and things. Having said that, I did relax my rule for this trailer and enjoyed it a lot.

(Thing from it I'm already over: guessing which Time Lord/Lady Maisie Williams is supposed to be. If they're really bringing back Susan, they're not showing a clip of it yet.)
posted by immlass at 9:25 AM on July 10, 2015


Is it just me, or is Capaldi's hair longer, and he looks like Hartnell and Pertwee? This seems purposeful, somehow.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:28 AM on July 10, 2015 [3 favorites]


Michelle Gomez is a delight full stop. Proof.
posted by Paul Slade at 9:35 AM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


Can we stop saying 'Whovian' please?

the correct term is 'Whoover'.
posted by pipeski at 9:39 AM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


It's better than "Whovee."
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:50 AM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


>the correct term is 'Whoover'.

"Whosoever"?
posted by PandaMomentum at 9:55 AM on July 10, 2015 [3 favorites]


Capaldi just not doing it for me. I want Doctor Who, not Doctor House. Further, the characterization is spotty and inconsistent even for Doctor Who. He's such an unsympathetic asshole, so cavalier with the lives of others, that (absent Clara) I find myself thinking those 8 deadly words,"I don't care what happens to these people."
posted by leotrotsky at 10:03 AM on July 10, 2015 [7 favorites]


Also, Danny Pink was fucking robbed. Bring back Danny!
posted by leotrotsky at 10:04 AM on July 10, 2015 [8 favorites]


'Whoover'? We are not talking vacuum cleaners here. Maybe 'Whoevers' (as in Who Forever), or 'Whoosters', but anything with "Who" is going to get confused with Roger Daltrey or Dr. Seuss fans, so I'd rather go with something TARDIS-y, like 'Tardists' (but NEVER 'Re-TARDIS').

I've mentioned before the joy of being in L.A. circa 1980 when UHF station Channel 52 was desperately trying to get a foothold against the 4 VHF non-network stations and ingeniously counterprogrammed Channel 13's successful Star Trek reruns with a Monday-Friday strip of the 3rd and 4th Doctors before PBS got a hold of it and started doing Saturday Afternoon blocks of entire 4-episode story arcs (NOT the way to enjoy the Old Who, IMO).

And I will never consider "The Curse of the Fatal Death" as NOT canon, so Joanna Lumley will always be the First Woman Doctor.
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:57 AM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


leotrotsky:
" He's such an unsympathetic asshole, so cavalier with the lives of others, that (absent Clara) I find myself thinking those 8 deadly words,"I don't care what happens to these people.""
Funnily, when I introduced my wife to the first Doctor she referred to him as "Dr.Douche" after watching him intentionally strand them on Skaros, try and run away and leave his companions behind and say, "Better them than us!" I know its the difference between cowardice and just plain dickishness, but still.
posted by charred husk at 10:58 AM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


And last year we had Robin Hood. I wish they'd get off Earth more, but Moffat does not like cheesy effects in the way RTD did, so they have to travel less to hide the budget limitations.

I forgot about that. I think. Intentionally.

And now someone had to go and mention Danny Pink. My mood for Season 9 has shifted from excited and anxious to skeptical and gruff. In Doctor terms, I think that means I just went from the 10th/11th Doctor to Capaldi.
posted by Atreides at 11:53 AM on July 10, 2015


He's such an unsympathetic asshole

I enjoy the bit of emotional distance Capaldi has brought to the role. And from past WhoPosts I know I'm not the only one who found the choice of a Doctor who is not a dreamboat fantasy boyfriend who saves the universe with the power of love, to be refreshing. Capaldi's Doctor really seems cognizant of being a 1000 year old extraterrestrial demigod in a way that makes the previous characterizations seem odd in that they didn't (although Smith did pull this off neatly from time to time). I never really get the sense that #12 doesn't care of people, just that he acknowledges that he cannot pretend to be one of them.
posted by Panjandrum at 12:16 PM on July 10, 2015 [12 favorites]


If you'd rather watch old 6th Doctor & Peri episodes, you have that option.

You monster.
posted by davros42 at 12:34 PM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


So are they going to stop mumbling the dialog this season? I swear that I could only understand about 2/3 of what was said last season.
posted by octothorpe at 12:39 PM on July 10, 2015 [3 favorites]


I wish I could get excited about this still. There was a period of time I was REALLY into NuWho. I loved Eccleston and Tennant so much. I enjoyed Amy and Rory, once they came along.

I just don't feel Capaldi. And absolutely loathe Clara as a character. Add onto that I found myself more and more often watching episodes and realizing 3/4 of the way through the plot made ZERO sense, so I just stopped.
posted by Windigo at 12:43 PM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


"Because now it's no longer in his wheelhouse and he's effectively boxed out for a few years."

Try him out on Classic Who. Pertwee and Tom Baker in particular.
posted by Billiken at 12:51 PM on July 10, 2015


Try him out on Classic Who. Pertwee and Tom Baker in particular.

My kid likes Patrick Troughton.
posted by davros42 at 12:54 PM on July 10, 2015


"I'm very much down to my last chance with this show."

...because Peter Capaldi is such a disappointing actor, right?!

"Capaldi just not doing it for me. I want Doctor Who, not Doctor House."

You want Doctor Who, you said? The real one?!

You cannot handle The Doctor
.
Do you both realize the enormous risks?!
Very well... Go already.
posted by markkraft at 1:35 PM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


I nearly said something about watching the Tom Baker episodes when I was 6 and how the scare was part of the fun, so for the kid to go ahead and watch the new ones but thought better of it. Are these suggestions for Baker as a substitute serious? Have they just aged so they are not scary to kids now? Talons of Weng Chiang* was really scary back in 1977!

*(Also pretty racist so not a good starting point.)
posted by biffa at 1:36 PM on July 10, 2015


I try not to get carried away with the series, though it's one of the few things I watch on live TV. I quite liked the way that the last season veered into mythic and picture book stories. It was certainly different. I like the fact that Capaldi's Doctor is unlovely, difficult, irascible and vulnerable. In a couple of years it will be completely different, I hope.
posted by Grangousier at 1:45 PM on July 10, 2015


Tom Baker's doctor was famously dismissive of his companions; I don't think you can say the 12th Doctor's coldness is outside the realm of who the Doctor is. But word trickling in is that he won't be playing the antihero this season. Moffat has changed gears considerably from Matt Smith, but I don't think he's found a comfortable groove yet for Capaldi; in fact, he seems not to WANT to get comfortable. When Doctor Who gets too formulaic it will lose more viewer than when it tries to stretch (seems to be his philosophy).

I was glad Season 8 was lower on continuity, but neither did it feel like a sequence of "monster of the week." I will gladly quibble on a lot of Moffat's choices (keeping the Ponds around too long, the Impossible Girl arc deferring character development for Clara, too many self-sustaining paradox loops), but I think it would be hard to argue that he's not keeping up good stewardship of the show.
posted by rikschell at 1:56 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


I will never be able to stop the chills down my spine, or the leap in my heart

Hah! With what they've done to that majestic theme song Delia fashioned? Suits .... gaaaar.
posted by Twang at 2:12 PM on July 10, 2015


Did you all see the Sherlock Special preview?
posted by biffa at 2:12 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


> "Tom Baker's doctor was famously dismissive of his companions; I don't think you can say the 12th Doctor's coldness is outside the realm of who the Doctor is."

SARAH: That's horrible! He was so concerned about his brother.
DOCTOR: I told him not to be. I told him it was too late.
SARAH: Oh! Sometimes you don't seem ...
DOCTOR: Human?
posted by kyrademon at 2:44 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


I want to see an entire series of Peter Capaldi's doctor slumming it in London playing with in a band with some old punks. I'd even accept him slumming it in Cardiff.
posted by lownote at 2:46 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


"Did you all see the Sherlock Special preview?"

I am *sooo* glad that it didn't include Vastra, Jenny, and Strax. The Paternoster Gang must die!!!
posted by markkraft at 2:54 PM on July 10, 2015


"I want to see an entire series of Peter Capaldi's doctor slumming it in London playing with in a band with some old punks. I'd even accept him slumming it in Cardiff."

After Clara Oswald leaves The Doctor, he should go to a quiet beach in Scotland and spend a few dozen years watching the aurora borealis, drinking brandy with a beachcomber, making out with a supposedly human female with webbed toes, converting a local phone box to a tardis, and counting all the grains of sand in a large bucket.
posted by markkraft at 3:05 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


Capaldi just not doing it for me. I want Doctor Who, not Doctor House.
Lol. Well, I'm on the other side. I hoped Capaldi's incarnation of the Doctor would be *more* like Malcolm Tucker. Who better to read invading aliens the Riot Act?

Capaldi's Doctor got off to a good start: a slightly deranged, wickedly intelligent, fast-talking character with a short fuse who also had a cold, serious, and unpredictable side, e.g. the showdown with the robot - we don't know if he killed him or talked him into suicide. Either way - wow.

Unfortunately, the emotional range of Capaldi's Doctor flattened as the season wore on. I actually wanted an angrier and darker Doctor. But the character needs more comedic quirks, borderline-deranged eccentricities, or *something* to balance things out. Right now, the character is... I dunno... a bit too flat, callous, and unlikable? Something's off, anyway.

Capaldi certainly has the talent to become one of the great Doctors. I was thrilled when he was announced. He has an impressive acting range, considerable comedic talent, and can breath verbal fire second to none. Unfortunately, his tenure is off to an unsteady start. It's not clear whether this is poor writing, bad direction, or Capaldi's own choices in developing the character. Whatever the case, I hope things turn around next season, and quickly.

A new companion would also help. There is close to zero chemistry between Capaldi and Coleman.
posted by Davenhill at 3:59 PM on July 10, 2015 [5 favorites]


I am *sooo* glad that it didn't include Vastra, Jenny, and Strax. The Paternoster Gang must die!!!

Agreed but I want a web spinoff that's just Strax and his awkward Sontaran belligerence.
posted by nathan_teske at 4:55 PM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


I am probably going to reserve judgement (and viewing) on this season until people I trust have seen it. However, my undying loyalty can absolutely be bought if they bring back Romana.
posted by nonasuch at 5:34 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


To be honest, I wasn't really feeling last season. But giving The Doctor Jon Pertwee's hair and introducing Maisie Williams (as Romana? as Jenny? as Susan?) is enough to reel me in.
posted by kittens for breakfast at 6:09 PM on July 10, 2015 [1 favorite]


The Paternoster Gang must die!!

I love The Paternoster Gang but I feel like they're not being developed as characters.

I'm going to use Strax as the example here, but the problem isn't limited to him. He's of a a clone race that rarely lives to be more than 8 or 9 years old. At this point, he might be one of the oldest Sontarans ever. He's certainly had a largely variety of experiences. What if he was effected by those experiences? What if he started to have realizations about himself and about his people that no other Sontaran has ever had the chance to have (because they don't have the chance to mature beyond a certain point before they die in battle?). What if he starts making a real effort to blend in with the customs and expectations of his new way of life?

This wouldn't preclude him being stupid (or naive in that uniquely Sontaran way) but it opens up a bunch of possible stories that could make the character fascinating.

Madame Vastra and Jenny Flint are largely in the same situation. They're sort of locked into certain ways of behaving and are denied any sort of development. I mean, even Micky got some character development (the realization that he didn't want to be the robot dog, for example).

The trio was a delight when we first met them but they've been one note ever since. It doesn't have to be that way. The unkind side of me would argue that this is further evidence that NuWho doesn't wouldn't know how to develop a female character unless there was a male personality in her body.
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:23 PM on July 10, 2015 [2 favorites]


Because now it's no longer in his wheelhouse and he's effectively boxed out for a few years.

The idea that Doctor Who was mostly a kids' show felt weird to me back when we were only talking about the original series. Sure, kids could watch it, but the Tom Baker years (which is what we mostly got in the US) didn't feel notably less grown-up than American sci-fi shows that weren't for kids, cheesy effects aside. The new series has had all kinds of horrifying deaths and oral sex jokes and bitchy transsexual trampoline ladies and flirty pansexual space con-men and lesbian human/lizard lady romance. (I'm not saying any of that stuff is bad, just that it's stuff I sure wouldn't expect to see on kids TV.)

I wouldn't say this last season has been any less appropriate for kids, in terms of scariness, sex or violence. But maybe Peter Capaldi's prickly take on the Doctor makes the show seem less kid-friendly? Matt Smith was such a big lovable goof; he was a natural sharing custard and fish fingers with little Amy Pond, while it's not unlikely Capaldi's Doctor would have said something impatient and kind of nasty to the kid and stomped off to his next adventure without looking back. (To be clear, I love both guys in the role.)
posted by Ursula Hitler at 8:26 PM on July 10, 2015


I think parents should worry less about their tender little lumplings being traumatized by Doctor Who, and instead realize that many of the most beloved stories for children are, in fact, pretty terrifying, oftentimes featuring content which isn't the least bit "appropriate" for young children. (Secret: That's part of what makes them a classic.)

I would worry more about how they're likely to largely be raised and influenced not by you or even by other adults, but by their own peers. most of whom are probably more messed up than they are.
posted by markkraft at 12:15 AM on July 11, 2015


I hope the people watching have a good time, but after last season's finale and "Permission to squee" I'm done. It was fun for a while, but it's not for me anymore.
posted by Legomancer at 5:28 AM on July 11, 2015


introducing Maisie Williams (as Romana? as Jenny? as Susan?)

Given her blade skills, surely she will be Leela?
posted by biffa at 8:37 AM on July 11, 2015 [2 favorites]


Blade skills = The Corsair mayhaps?

Yeah, not got hugely excited by the trailer, except more Zygons which I recall hearing before, the Dalek(?) city and Pertwee-ish looking Doctor.

Definitely looking forward to the series though.
posted by comealongpole at 11:08 AM on July 11, 2015


Sherlock Comic Con Panel
posted by fearfulsymmetry at 2:55 PM on July 12, 2015


I was burning out on the show by the end of last season, but now I'm really looking forward to finding out who Maisie Williams is playing.
posted by homunculus at 8:20 PM on July 12, 2015


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