The House That Built Cam
February 7, 2016 2:43 PM   Subscribe

This is where Cam Newton comes from: an institution where being African-American and excellent, African-American and respected, African-American and optimistic are normal conditions. A visit to the church Cam grew up in.
posted by The Devil Tesla (38 comments total) 14 users marked this as a favorite
 
This is really good read this the other day. Despite knowing very little about the Panthers I'm obviously rooting for Cam vs all my older family members who suddenly love Peyton Manning.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 3:10 PM on February 7, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm pretty biased (one of my cousins is one of the kids in this photo), but Cam seems like a pretty excellent human being.
posted by leesh at 3:51 PM on February 7, 2016 [1 favorite]


I like Cam, but as a Giants fan I gotta defer to the Manning family connection. Cam will get a ring someday, I can tell.

(also, the halftime show sucks)
posted by jonmc at 5:35 PM on February 7, 2016


I really want Cam to be the next big QB and he's had All the Hype for like 2 years now, but after tonight I seriously have doubts that he has what it takes. Zero risks taken, it was like he had no desire to ascend to the next level. Maybe he assumes that he's accomplished enough, that his legacy had already been earned. I have seen a lot of super stars rise, and Cam Newton looks like no super star.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 7:44 PM on February 7, 2016 [1 favorite]


I really want Cam to be the next big QB and he's had All the Hype for like 2 years now, but after tonight I seriously have doubts that he has what it takes. Zero risks taken, it was like he had no desire to ascend to the next level. Maybe he assumes that he's accomplished enough, that his legacy had already been earned. I have seen a lot of super stars rise, and Cam Newton looks like no super star.


That Broncos defense was tough, though. They just kind of flew under the radar because of the presence of Peyton Manning. They might have even been historically good.

The game kind of reminded me of how Elway was beat up in a couple of his first Super Bowls.
posted by eagles123 at 7:50 PM on February 7, 2016 [5 favorites]


He's what, four years into his career? Give the dude a break, he's got plenty of career left.
posted by Pope Guilty at 8:00 PM on February 7, 2016 [8 favorites]


Speaking of religion and football and race...

I've been a white guy in black churches many times, because of the music, and because of friends who invited me. In Grand Rapids, Michigan, before DeBarge became DeBarge--and most of you don't know who I'm talking about--one of the DeBarge brothers tried to convert me in the basement after the service. (And services at black churches are not like the ones at the white church I went to: in and out in 60 minutes flat.) This church was a block away, and the piano player was my neighbor.

The intersections between sports, religion, and militarism have never been a comfortable space for me. But I have been a Broncos fan for a while, having lived in Denver for close to four decades. I grew up with a football fan dad. That's the way it goes.

I'm happy they won tonight. It's a fortuitously serendipitous moment for Peyton Manning. 200 victories. But I have to say, I might just have to retire as a football fan after the spectacularly inept post-game remark he made after the Bronco's victory. He mentioned Budweiser and "the Man Upstairs" in a 40-second statement.

I think I'm going to retire, too.
posted by kozad at 8:08 PM on February 7, 2016 [5 favorites]


Zero risks taken, it was like he had no desire to ascend to the next level. Maybe he assumes that he's accomplished enough, that his legacy had already been earned. I have seen a lot of super stars rise, and Cam Newton looks like no super star.

The Panthers won 15 regular-season games this season, and posted the best season start by a team since the NFL-AFL merger, which puts them in pretty elite company whatever you may think of Cam Newton's "next level" drive or lack thereof.
posted by blucevalo at 8:24 PM on February 7, 2016 [5 favorites]


Peyton Manning was rebuilt with HGH and other performance enhancing drugs. Once again man triumphs through science over faith.
posted by humanfont at 8:34 PM on February 7, 2016 [4 favorites]


I like Cam a great deal; followed him at Florida and Auburn. Watched Manning at UTKnox. Been a Panthers fan since '95, through Collins and Delhomme; Broncos previously - young Sara had quite a crush on Elway back in the 80's. Is Cam Montana or Farve? No, but I'd choose him over any QB playing the game right now, and I like that he can be Carolina's franchise QB. By all accounts, he seems to be a good guy and my connections in the Mecklenburg area say he LOVES kids, and he seems to really love the game of football.
I've always gotten a lot of flack for being a Panthers fan, and even more for defending Cam. Granted, when I had to retire my ancient Smith jerker a few seasons ago, I chose 59, but it doesn't mean I respect Cam any less. People talk junk about him for being a showoff and "too self-confident" and a pouter. But I think it's great that he has confidence in his abilities and those of his team and his coaches. He's young; he's won a national championship and a Heisman and set a metric crapton of records. He's still got a lot of years left, and our team is pretty young. I'd hazard a guess that a lot of folks' arguments are based on thinly-veiled racism, and I think that's unfortunate.
I'm not really sure what point I wanted to make, other than the fact that there are some of us who support him and are proud of him and his accomplishments.
posted by sara is disenchanted at 8:40 PM on February 7, 2016 [4 favorites]


Those old white guys on TV sure seemed happy framing this super bowl as the final triumph in the narrative of the oldest, whitest quarterback in the game.

When I was a kid I asked my dad why quarterbacks are so disproportionally white compared to the other positions. Never got an answer for that one.
posted by scose at 8:48 PM on February 7, 2016


@eagles123 - P Manning was historically bad, so your point is proven.
posted by jwest at 9:03 PM on February 7, 2016


I can't stand Eli, and seeing his lack of reaction to the 2-point conversion rankled. Pissant. The Mannings remind me of the Bush family. Archie = Poppy, Peyton = Jeb, Eli = George. As with the Bushes (until tonight), it was the less talented brother who had the better record in the family profession. Oh, and before you ask me, Cooper = Robin, because we never got to know either's potential.
posted by carmicha at 10:21 PM on February 7, 2016


Peyton Manning was rebuilt with HGH and other performance enhancing drugs. Huh? Got some sort of facts to back that up?

He mentioned Budweiser and "the Man Upstairs" in a 40-second statement.

I do not know anything about Peyton's connection to or belief in, the man upstairs, or even to whom he refers when he says "man upstairs" but I do know that he owns several beer distributorships which explains quite well ($$$) that part of the answer.

I like Cam. I drafted him the last two years for my fantasy team. He delivered this year. Last year, not so much. I really liked this article. Cam's father makes the point to the author and I think the author makes the point overall in his article, that do not believe everything you read and hear about someone especially from those paid to sell controversy. Sure, Cam made some mistakes at Florida and maybe even Auburn, but that does not make him a bad person. He learned from his mistakes. I don't know enough about him to have a solid valid opinion about him, but my impression as a fan is that he is an amazing athlete and seems like a genuinely good man who enjoys himself. I love his dab celebration if only because it displays his joy for playing and sort of sticks it to the older more staid parts of the league. I cannot pinpoint it, but there is something about his celebrations that I like even though they are 180 degrees from my style of not doing public displays when I make a good play (or pout when I screw up).

Anyway, he did not have a good game today, but his entire offense didn't either. His receivers in particular, in my opinion, let him down. Too many drops and too many tentative efforts. I guess that should be expected when your team's top receiver is Ted Ginn Jr. If they want to get back to the Super Bowl next year, and of course they do, I think they need to draft, sign or trade for a genuine #1 receiver.
posted by AugustWest at 11:16 PM on February 7, 2016


Every time a great running QB pops up I always think, "This is great! Why don't all teams get one of these?", and then by the end of the season I know why: it takes a while, but opposing defenses eventually reduce the danger to coloring in a 3-year-old's coloring book. He (Cam) is still great, but he needs another running back and receivers with hands.
posted by Chitownfats at 12:09 AM on February 8, 2016


I'd hazard a guess that a lot of folks' arguments are based on thinly-veiled racism, and I think that's unfortunate.

?

He's a showoff when his team is winning and acts like a baby when he gets knocked around and his team is losing. That is why I don't like him.

I'm just glad that Jared Allen won't ever get a super bowl ring.
posted by King Bee at 3:57 AM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


"When I was a kid I asked my dad why quarterbacks are so disproportionally white compared to the other positions. Never got an answer for that one."

The article touched on this, but even ten years ago it was normal and accepted for well-respected coaches, writers, and analysts to just flat-out say that quarterback was "too intellectual" a position for black players. Before that, it was "white linemen won't block for a black quarterback, white receivers won't take playcalls from him." Talented black football players got counseled out of the QB position in high school, because if they wanted to play in college, it wouldn't be as a QB. (This also partially accounts for black players being overrepresented as top-tier running backs and wide receivers. You're a super-athletic, tall, fast, natural football player with a talent for reading the field and forbidden from being a QB? Running back and wide receiver are natural places to take those skills.)

Black QBs still receive a lot more scrutiny than white ones and - as King Bee just illustrated so neatly - are considered "arrogant" or "show-offs" for winning. You'd think Cam Newton is the only guy celebrating touchdowns the way the media goes on about it, but white players celebrate just as often ... and get virtually no media or fan attention for the same behavior. Newton's no more emotional on the field than half a dozen white quarterbacks in the League, but he's called out as a showboat when he's happy and a spoiled baby when he's frustrated.

The people complaining about Cam Newton's attitude are the same ones who, ten years ago, were insisting black QBs weren't smart enough to play at the NFL level. They're mostly just pissed that he's proving them so egregiously wrong. Since they can't attack his playing, they're going to go after his personality in a way white QBs are never gone after or we'd be talking about Brett Farve, king of the drama queens and kind of a dickhead, or Ben Rothelisburger, who's so emotional and dramatic and self-centered that even his coaches and teammates talk in the press about what a pain-in-the-ass drama queen he is.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 4:16 AM on February 8, 2016 [16 favorites]


If there's a particular incident that has people going on about Cam not trying hard enough it's this right? Not a great moment but mostly - and I don't really know from football I will warn you - it seemed like the defense just killed him, tactically and physically. Which I suspect is more likely to determine games than "does he want it badly enough?"
posted by atoxyl at 5:10 AM on February 8, 2016


I'm pretty sure this is not going to be the end of Cam Newton being a star player.
posted by atoxyl at 5:16 AM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


If there's a particular incident that has people going on about Cam not trying hard enough it's this right?

Yes. That's an example of losing the thread -- the fundamental thing drilled into every single football player is ALWAYS JUMP ON THE BALL.

But that's not why he lost. He lost because Denver's defense constantly got into the backfield and hit him. I don't care how good you are, when your line is giving you zero protection, you're going to have a bad game.

Remember two years ago? You know, when the QB who *just won the Super Bowl* was completely incapable of making a pass? Why? Because Seattle punched through Denver's offensive line, covered all the receivers, and never let Manning make a throw. Yesterday, it was Denver's defense doing that to Carolina. Worse, Carolina never could get the run game going -- Carolina's best rusher was Cam Newton, and even for a guy who runs like he does, it's never a good sign when the QB is the leading rusher, and it's even worse when he's the leading rusher with 45 yards on 6 carries.

In fact, Carolina far outgained Denver in offensive yardage -- 315 to 194, the latter being the least yards gained by a winning team in the history of the Super Bowl. But Denver's 7 sacks tied the Chicago Bears in Super Bowl XX -- the team that set the standard for defensive greatness. Carolina lost 68 yards in sacks.

The other thing that killed Carolina. 4 fumbles, three lost. Plus one interception. You turn the ball over four times, you lose 95 out of 100 games. Something else that didn't help was the stupid penalties. Both sides had them -- the reason Carolina scored was a stupid penalty on an third down that gave them another series -- but 12 penalties for 102 yards? That's bad too. Between sacks and penalties, 170 yards lost.

So? Was it Cam's fault? Somewhat. He was throwing too hard, got picked once and almost picked twice more by throwing the ball through a guy, also had problems getting the ball on target. He didn't jump on that fumble, which is a "Thou shalt not...." level screwup in the game. You gotta jump on the ball.

But his offensive line is who really lost that game for Carolina. They couldn't set for the run, they couldn't protect Cam Newton. You can have all the talent in the world (and he does.) You can have the best game plan in the world. None of that means a thing if you don't get time to run the play, and the way that both Von Miller and DeMarcus Ware kept getting free runs at Newton meant that he was doomed. (Von Miller won MVP because he got that stripped ball in the 4th, otherwise, I think DeMarcus Ware gets it, and one of Ware's sacks was rather meaningless (last play 2nd quarter.))

I'm pretty sure this is not going to be the end of Cam Newton being a star player.

No. What Cam Newton knows now is the incredible stress of being in the Super Bowl. If he makes it again (and god, I hope they fix that offensive line!) then he'll be better able to deal with it. He is probably the most physically talented QB in the game, and has a great grasp on the mental side of the game -- not to Peyton Manning's level, but I don't think *anybody* who's ever played the game has that. Maybe Roger Staubach or Sid Luckman, but Staubach and Luckman played a very different game than Manning did, so comparing them is really meaningless.

So: He was heartbroken last night. After being crushed, he made a big mistake on the biggest stage in the game. Unless he lets that eat away at him, he will be back -- and history shows us that Cam Newton is not likely to let that mistake destroy him.

I fully expect Carolina to be a power in the NFC next year. 15-1 and a Super Bowl appearance is a great year, and that team isn't going to lose many people this offseason.

Cam will be back.



Aside: People keep getting this wrong. Gary Kubiak is not the first coach to win a SB for the team he played for. Oakland Raider coach Tom Flores (SB XV/XVII) and Chicago Bears coach Mike Ditka (Super Bowl XX) both did it before him. Kubiak is the first coach to play on a team *in the Super Bowl* and then go on to coach that team to a win in the Super Bowl -- he was on the roster of Denver's Super Bowl XXI/XXII/XXIV teams as Elway's backup.
posted by eriko at 6:37 AM on February 8, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm a born and raised Kansas City Chiefs fan who has lived in North Carolina for over a decade. I tried for many years to make myself a Panthers fan but not until Cam Newton did it take. The man is irresistibly fun to watch and so charismatic and talented and I have been long confused by people who dismiss his attitude as showboating. He's having a great fucking time out there! Why is that not okay? We should all be so lucky to love our jobs and be as good at them as he is at his.

Yeah, he wasn't great last night and he handled the press conference poorly, but he's 26 years old and was playing against an incredible, unexpectedly dominant defense after almost an entire season of utterly smooth sailing. He was shocked and sad and it's hard to to envision anyone not being irritated at having to sit there and answer some variation of the "why did you lose" question over and over and over after such a demoralizing night. I feel like it's okay to cut him (and anyone in that situation) some slack.
posted by something something at 6:44 AM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


Someone on another board posts a good point. The last QB to get flamed as hard as Cam Newton for "checking out" of a game was the current Chicago Bear's QB, Jay Cutler, who pulled out of the NFC Championship game. Turns out that he had a torn MCL and couldn't stand, but nobody knew that and to this day people will cite that against Cutler.

So, in some ways, it's not just race. Screw up on the big stage and everybody remembers. That's not to say race isn't a big part of this -- I'm certain it is (and if they use the word "boy" in reference to Newton, it *definitely* is) -- but all QBs get it if they're perceived as giving up.

Ooh, fun stat I didn't realize: BOTH QBs had QB ratings under 60. That means, really, they both sucked.
posted by eriko at 6:46 AM on February 8, 2016


Yeah, both offenses were horrific. The Panthers would probably have had the lead into the second half if the officials had overturned that challenged incomplete pass in the first quarter. It was an unpleasant game to watch all around.
posted by something something at 6:49 AM on February 8, 2016


The Panthers won 15 regular-season games this season, and posted the best season start by a team since the NFL-AFL merger

Umm, by what measure? The 2007 Patriots went 19-1, losing only to the Giants in the Super Bowl. It's hard to get a better start than that. The 1972 Miami Dolphins famously went 17-0, but that was when the season was 14 games, not 16.

The Panthers would probably have had the lead into the second half if the officials had overturned that challenged incomplete pass in the first quarter.

I'd argue that they got it right, because the ball was moving after he was down and the one thing we've seen about catches is the ball can't be doing that. But proving what is and is not a catch in the NFL right now is probably a good doctoral thesis topic, so arguing if it was or was not a catch is pretty much moot. The only answer we can give is "the officials said it wasn't, the replay didn't see enough to overturn."

And, right or wrong, a team either gets over bad calls or they lose. I don't think the call affected Carolina much, certainly not compared to the Bronco's running right through the Panther's offensive line.
posted by eriko at 6:55 AM on February 8, 2016


"The last QB to get flamed as hard as Cam Newton for "checking out" of a game was the current Chicago Bear's QB, Jay Cutler, who pulled out of the NFC Championship game."

I ALMOST used Cutler as an example of an overemotional white QB because nobody can sideline sulk like Cutler, but I always feel bad picking on him because he does get waaaaaaay too much crap over this.

Oh well. As Euripides said, Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make Bears quarterbacks, so it's not like he didn't know what he was getting into.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:01 AM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


I ALMOST used Cutler as an example of an overemotional white QB because nobody can sideline sulk like Cutler, but I always feel bad picking on him because he does get waaaaaaay too much crap over this.

Remember: When Cutler yells at a teammate, he's a bad leader. When Brady yells at a teammate, he's a great motivator.

And, when you've had 5 OC's in 6 years, each with a different scheme, and you're going to get another one next year,* I don't think you can blame the inconsistency completely on the QB.



* But this time, at least, it's because the OC got a head coaching gig, rather than being fired.
posted by eriko at 7:06 AM on February 8, 2016


Showboating isn't tolerated as much in a QB as it is in receivers and running backs, it's not a new thing. Yes they can be drama queens and sure there's a racial "respectability" component to it along with the fact that they're supposed to be showing leadership to the whole team and not doing things that can rack up fines, but I don't think a moderator should be insinuating a previous commenter was racist for pointing out an attribute that is uncommon in most quarterbacks. That "the same people who say X are these other bad people from the past" construction is not always appropriate or accurate IMO, you're talking to your community. More accurately I think people don't like showboats when they're not representing their team (i.e. rivalry hate) or when they consistently get into trouble for it. The more you showboat, the more shit you're going to get when you act out and be "dramatic" because human nature is to skewer the overconfident at every turn. Schadenfreude. Race comes into it for sure but there's plenty of "fuck that guy for rubbing it in when he's good and being a baby when he's not" to go around. Plenty of gendered testosterone laden impulse in addition to racial respectability politics. I dunno.

Tebow rubbed people the wrong way for similar reasons. Super sanctimonious any time he scored a touchdown especially when he ran them in himself (ooh, nice legs but can you throw bro).
posted by aydeejones at 8:20 AM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


Denver fans think Brady is a huge baby BTW and I didn't hear a lot of grumbling here about Cam, I picked up on more genuine fear and respect IMO
posted by aydeejones at 8:24 AM on February 8, 2016


Showboating isn't tolerated as much in a QB as it is in receivers and running backs, it's not a new thing.

Aaron Rodgers has turned his touchdown celebration into a series of commercials. If he were Ay-ay-ron Rodgers, he'd get the same shit that Cam Newton gets.
posted by Etrigan at 8:46 AM on February 8, 2016 [2 favorites]


The people complaining about Cam Newton's attitude are the same ones who, ten years ago, were insisting black QBs weren't smart enough to play at the NFL level.

That's quite the generalization.

I am a NY Giants fan. We have the opposite complaint about our QB and it seems like Eli almost broke the internet with his EliFace. We all complain that Eli is emotionless and needs to get stirred up to lead. Phil Simms was and is a fiery leader. Aw shucks Eli, not so much, but Eli gets results and that is why he ultimately gets a pass.

Cam is a very good QB. He seems to be a good man too. He likes to display his emotion. His post game behavior, to me, is ok because it is consistent with him being an emotional person. When he wins, he celebrates. When he loses, he does the opposite. So what? Should he suck up and compliment the Broncos and say we'll get them next year just to be like whatever the model is for QBs? To me, his job is to play QB ON THE FIELD. He had an amazing season.
posted by AugustWest at 8:52 AM on February 8, 2016 [2 favorites]


Since they can't attack his playing, they're going to go after his personality in a way white QBs are never gone after

I can talk about all the white QBs I hate for various reasons (you mentioned two of the biggest punks), but this was a thread about Cam Newton.

You'd think Cam Newton is the only guy celebrating touchdowns the way the media goes on about it, but white players celebrate just as often ... and get virtually no media or fan attention for the same behavior.

I really wonder how much football you watch and how much you pay attention to sports media.
posted by King Bee at 9:48 AM on February 8, 2016


Just look at how Aaron Rodgers's "championship belt" celebration is framed and packaged by ESPN: https://youtu.be/mcwa2EvQ61Y?t=30s

But no, there's no double standard at play here at all right?
posted by AceRock at 12:19 PM on February 8, 2016


Then there's the universally admired and respected Greg Popovich, famous for giving one-word press conferences. I will eat my shoe if you can find one instance of him ever being called a thug.
posted by AceRock at 12:26 PM on February 8, 2016


Does Greg Popovich celebrate every time Tony Parker makes a shot? Does Aaron Rodgers even do the belt thing anymore during games?

For the record, I like Cam's Superman TD celebration. I do not like that he taunts other teams when blowing them out but can't keep it together on the field when his team is falling apart. It's all I've seen for years from him. If you thought that falling down on the sideline when Gano missed a field goal is an example of poise, I don't know what to tell you.

But anyway, apparently I have two options:
1. Have an undying love for Cam Newton
2. Be a cold, unforgiving racist who hates all black quarterbacks and thinks none of them are "smart enough" to play quarterback

I'll show myself out of the thread.
posted by King Bee at 1:13 PM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


I was rooting hard for Cam and the Panthers largely because Luke Kuechly was my student at BC. I love watching this new generation of highly mobile QB's...it is a more exciting style of play IMO. And as far as Peyton Manning is concerned, he was awful last night--I think one of the worst QB performances in Super Bowl history. And as somebody on Reddit said: "Denver would have won last night with any one of the following people playing QB for the Broncos: Stephen Hawking, Helen Keller, or Mark Sanchez." Ouch.
posted by Seymour Zamboni at 1:45 PM on February 8, 2016


Not enjoying Cam's antics is to me a perfectly acceptable point of view. There has been a much reduction on both sides of the argument. He does carry on a bit too much at times, but so do a lot of players. He's a fallible person, not the emotional Vitruvian Man. Moreover he's the leader of his team, and perhaps the reason he's does what he does is because his TEAM responds to it, and if you watch the games, they do, rather emphatically.

There is a racial dog-whistle component to a lot of the internet commentariat vitriol, but it think it's as much as piling on a hater bandwagon as much as it is truly racist, not that either is a healthy way to spend your time. People say that Brady is a crybaby, and he can be, but there's also nothing that you can say about him that would be on they same level as calling Cam Newton a (fill in your racial slur of choice here).

It's the same in baseball when people get on to Yasiel Puig or Jose Bautista (or Bryce Harper) for not "playing the right way," which is the most tiresome part of watching baseball or trying to talk about baseball these days. I don't give a fuck about whether some thin-skinned millionaire got his feels hurt on the ballfield. They can cry into a stack of money in the locker room after the game. I want to see human drama unfold, and that can be messy and fraught, but ultimately it's why we watch sports.
posted by dudemanlives at 1:55 PM on February 8, 2016


So much going here. What the hell, I'll drop some opinions.

1. As previously mentioned no quarterback gets more negativity thrown at them than Smokin' Jay Cutler.
1a. Except perhaps Johnny Football who is an absolute fucking trainwreck.

2. Who even watches post-game press conferences?

3. I like Cam Newton, he's talented, charismatic and everytime he scores he gives the ball to a little kid in the stands (Awww...). He had a bad day yesterday but overall a great year. He'll be fine.

4. A certain amount of celebration is to be expected in the NFL. The only celebrations that bug me are when they're done at the end of an inconsequential play. You made a hard tackle on a running back after he gained three yards on second down at the start of the first quarter? Big fucking deal. Got a first down on second and two? Whatever. I guess everyone can't be Barry Sanders.
posted by MikeMc at 1:56 PM on February 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


It's not that there isn't a discussion to be had there about sports and winning and losing and emotionalism and what we expect from grown men who get played millions of dollars to play a game, it's just that the discussion cannot be had in good faith if we pretend that race isn't part of people's perceptions. And I am growing mighty weary of people who say "Just because my opinions conform exactly to well-established racist narratives that have been omnipresent in American culture since before I was born doesn't mean that my thoughts are in any way motivated by race."
posted by KathrynT at 1:53 PM on February 9, 2016


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