"Wearing it now is kind of my comeback."
February 12, 2016 9:25 AM   Subscribe

 
That's a really interesting article. I know that in the Hispanic community I was a part of, there were also a lot of "you can only wear shades that complement your skin tone" and a bitter battle between girls/ladies who used lightening makeup and those who thought it was a betrayal. The lightening one is a hard question - I go back and forth on that myself.
posted by corb at 9:30 AM on February 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


FTA: Make-up is for the wearer.

Yes. It is perfectly okay for someone to give advice about make-up when asked, but there's no need to shame any woman for wearing (or not wearing) whatever makeup they want to.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 9:43 AM on February 12, 2016 [8 favorites]


This is not an area I know anything about, but I don't know how anyone could look at those women wearing red lipstick and not think they look FABULOUS. Because they do. Look FABULOUS.
posted by fiercecupcake at 9:54 AM on February 12, 2016 [7 favorites]



If anything, I think people object to the demystification of make-up rather than to the make-up, because of course people wore make-up before, but it was supposed to be a secret, and being really good at it was hard. It's now, when you can see how powerful everyday make-up techniques can be, that everyone kicks - precisely because that power is much more accessible to more people, thanks to the internet.

I'd say, actually, that this is much healthier than the discourse around make-up when I was growing up.

That Lisaalamode video where she has half her face made up in the intro and turns and winks - that's so adorable.
posted by Frowner at 9:59 AM on February 12, 2016 [14 favorites]


I'm pretty torn about how to feel about this, because on the one hand this should speak to me as a black lady, but on the other hand I'm pretty makeup agnostic at best so I have a hard time feeling sorry to folks who a.) choose to do something to affect their appearance, and then b.) get judged for their choices. But on the other hand, it's sad that we live in a world where some women are made so aware of their "flaws" that they feel like they need to hide them.

So, I don't really get the rage about the "take her swimming" meme. I mean, why would you want to waste time going out with a guy who wasn't attracted to you without your makeup on?

But at the same time, the whole: "women wear makeup to deceive men" meme is stupid, because guess what dude, she's not wearing it for you.
posted by sparklemotion at 10:35 AM on February 12, 2016 [8 favorites]


Like anyone has naturally bright red lips. I don't understand people sometimes.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:44 AM on February 12, 2016 [3 favorites]


Really though it's like people have never heard of waterproof makeup, which is invincible.
posted by BuddhaInABucket at 10:45 AM on February 12, 2016 [4 favorites]


Why Are Black Women Makeup-Shamed So Heavily?
posted by a halcyon day at 10:56 AM on February 12, 2016 [20 favorites]


Really though it's like people have never heard of waterproof makeup, which is invincible.

There's not just waterproof makeup, there is specific makeup designed to be worn underwater, for high fashion photoshoots, water ballets, and performing mermaids. In fact you could go to a mall Sephora and buy everything you need to be your own Esther Williams.
posted by Hypatia at 10:59 AM on February 12, 2016 [11 favorites]


Anyone care to comment on what's behind the no red lipstick for dark skinned people critique? I was curious about that, but the article doesn't really get into the why.
posted by Diablevert at 11:03 AM on February 12, 2016


So, I don't really get the rage about the "take her swimming" meme. I mean, why would you want to waste time going out with a guy who wasn't attracted to you without your makeup on?

I think there's a difference between "this guy is attracted to you without makeup" and "this guy's dates are not allowed to look their best, or present themselves in ways that they make them feel confident or comfortable; in fact he should remove from them anything that might enhance their appearance."
posted by Hypatia at 11:03 AM on February 12, 2016 [3 favorites]


Anyone care to comment on what's behind the no red lipstick for dark skinned people critique? I was curious about that, but the article doesn't really get into the why.

I've been noticing the black women-shaming memes a lot the past couple years.

I agree with almost the whole article, but that one shot of the woman in bright red lipstick (lower right hand corner) really did jump out at me as a poor fashion choice.
posted by kanewai at 11:19 AM on February 12, 2016


Anyone care to comment on what's behind the no red lipstick for dark skinned people critique? I was curious about that, but the article doesn't really get into the why.

Harkens to the minstrelsy.
posted by pwnguin at 11:27 AM on February 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


Harkens to the minstrelsy.

That's a particularly weird stick to hit actual black women with.

Not shooting the messenger here, to be clear
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:40 AM on February 12, 2016 [10 favorites]


but that one shot of the woman in bright red lipstick (lower right hand corner) really did jump out at me as a poor fashion choice.

then i suggest you don't wear that shade of lipstick.


Anyone care to comment on what's behind the no red lipstick for dark skinned people critique?

i think it's one of those things were dark skinned women are policed harder on just about everything and the idea that their makeup shouldn't make them "stand out" too much (which, fuck that). spend any amount of time reading "what top 10 fashion trends men HATE" lists and you'll see red lipstick (especially with causal looks) for any woman come up over and over and over again.
posted by nadawi at 11:43 AM on February 12, 2016 [25 favorites]


Those in the beauty community have always known of its existence, but Nikkie was the first to really put the idea of makeup-shaming on the map.

Is the "beauty community" people who bond over their use of makeup? I haven't encountered the term before.
posted by layceepee at 12:29 PM on February 12, 2016


Like anyone has naturally bright red lips.

True. But I think colours in the reddish/peach/pink/mauve/rose families have often been worn in the slightly deceptive "my lips but better" sort of way, by people with the colouring for that to "work", which it does, when it does, because it's been mixed for them. (I.e., white people. And not even all white people. Like, I'm white, and almost all the drugstore colours available when I was a teen were clearly designed for some other shade of pale, for people on the pink or peaches-and-cream side. Even now, there are maybe three shades of red that make sense on my face. And almost one pink. [I had a great one by Lancome with *just enough* blue in it to not make it look like I have jaundice, unlike 99% pinks, but it's been discontinued.])

I wonder if the reaction from some corners is about that. There are palettes and lines now that are explicitly designed for WoC, for that MLBB look. (Not enough, no question.) Maybe some are wondering why - if someone seems to be going for that particular look, vs. the fearlessly dramatic (e.g. with electric blues or violets) - they're using colours from the (traditionally) peaches-and-cream repertoire. (Which I think is bullshit as well, because if makeup preference [or knowledge] is an indicator of whatever kind of awareness, that's a sorry state of affairs.)
posted by cotton dress sock at 12:56 PM on February 12, 2016


I haven't encountered the term before.

The beauty community that I am aware of are YouTubers and bloggers who put up how-tos, product reviews, and the like.
posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 12:56 PM on February 12, 2016 [2 favorites]


(Even though red is a strong colour, not really MLBB, I think it gets read as within the "natural" range, on certain complexions.)
posted by cotton dress sock at 1:04 PM on February 12, 2016


There was an episode of Lockup where Hispanic women were making their own makeup -- like, Vaseline and crushed pencil lead for eyeliner. They talked about how it made them feel normal.

On the one hand, hey, whatever helps you pass the time in the joint. On the other hand, what is it about a culture that not only drives women toward make-up, but drives them to the point where it feels normal, driving you to doing chemical engineering with your cellmate, only you're not making Pruno.

This is more than "Feel beautiful in your own skin, ladies!" This is like, "You're an addict."
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:21 PM on February 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is more than "Feel beautiful in your own skin, ladies!" This is like, "You're an addict."

People have been adorning themselves since we became Homo Sapiens. The ability to care for oneself and to differentiate one's appearance, especially in oppressive and monotonous settings like prison, is a natural human impulse.

What do I know though, my addiction to cosmetics has ruined my life and broken the hearts of my entire family.
posted by Hypatia at 1:29 PM on February 12, 2016 [40 favorites]


This is more than "Feel beautiful in your own skin, ladies!" This is like, "You're an addict."

Or it's like, "women are shamed for their appearances so frequently and so intensely that many of them only feel like they're normal-looking people when they're wearing makeup and other beauty products that help obscure aspects of themselves that they've been told are inadequate."
posted by MeghanC at 2:04 PM on February 12, 2016 [11 favorites]


spend any amount of time reading "what top 10 fashion trends men HATE" lists and you'll see red lipstick (especially with causal looks) for any woman come up over and over and over again.

I gave it a shot. I don't even know what half the things they list are (bandeau bikinis, peplums, mullet dresses - do any guys actually know the names for these?).

Back to the red lipstick question. The discussion and comments on the OP is really interesting. It's another rare case of: read the comments.
posted by kanewai at 2:07 PM on February 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is more than "Feel beautiful in your own skin, ladies!" This is like, "You're an addict."

what about "I really like how this looks on me"? or would you call an artist an addict if she needs to paint everyday to feel normal?
posted by 5_13_23_42_69_666 at 2:09 PM on February 12, 2016 [12 favorites]


The ability to care for oneself and to differentiate one's appearance, especially in oppressive and monotonous settings...

Very universal, even on the milder end of the spectrum: My friends who went to the neighboring Catholic Middle School spent a lot of time and energy pushing the limits of the uniform/dress code. It wasn't about being beautiful or appealing to the opposite sex (yet), it was really more about finding ways of taking control over their appearance and/or expressing their individuality.

Like Rinny from the article It’s a sense of creative expression. And if you impose restrictions, people will just find a way to work around it.
posted by ghost phoneme at 2:09 PM on February 12, 2016 [4 favorites]


The take-your-date-swimming meme makes me angry, and here's why. It communicates the idea that it's okay to belittle a certain kind of woman.

She's a straw woman, and she changes shape. Sometimes, she's the "high-maintenance" girl he dated in his early twenties. She spent money and time on herself. She had strong opinions. She expected things of him. He didn't always get from her what he felt he was entitled to get--especially considering whatever investments he made in his relationship with her (his time, his money, the opportunity cost of being with her instead of "playing the field"). Other times, she's the Crazy Ex Girlfriend--the woman with flaws--real or imagined, physical or emotional--which weren't disclosed to him up front. He read the packaging. He went into the transaction thinking he'd found someone worth the time, money, and opportunity cost. In the end, she was flawed, and she hid it from him because she was duplicitous and terrible. Sometimes, she's the woman who's always eyeing the field, looking for someone better. And that's why she wears so much makeup, dresses the way she does, carries herself like that. Because she's putting herself on display for other men. And sometimes, it's any woman who makes choices that don't have anything to do with what he wants.

It's treating people as if they're things, and relationships as if they're point-of-sale transactions. And it needs to stop.
posted by Flipping_Hades_Terwilliger at 2:13 PM on February 12, 2016 [32 favorites]


Exactly; imagine if a man went on a first date and his date said "You would look so much better without that tie, why are you wearing it?". Or even: "Take off that jacket, no one naturally wears a jacket and I bet it has shoulder pads in anyway. You're deceiving me."
posted by Hypatia at 2:22 PM on February 12, 2016 [7 favorites]


I gave it a shot. I don't even know what half the things they list are (bandeau bikinis, peplums, mullet dresses - do any guys actually know the names for these?).

Tim Gunn. Tom and Lorenzo.

To be fair, peplums are pretty awful. It's like a lampshade for your ass.
posted by asockpuppet at 2:50 PM on February 12, 2016 [8 favorites]


"i think it's one of those things were dark skinned women are policed harder on just about everything and the idea that their makeup shouldn't make them "stand out" too much (which, fuck that). spend any amount of time reading "what top 10 fashion trends men HATE" lists and you'll see red lipstick (especially with causal looks) for any woman come up over and over and over again."

The one I saw from black (dude) friends on Facebook was really all about the minstrel show blackface thing. It did seem like there was more going on there than the regular dumb complaints about red lipstick = painted Jezebel stuff that crops up for white ladies.
posted by klangklangston at 2:52 PM on February 12, 2016



This is more than "Feel beautiful in your own skin, ladies!" This is like, "You're an addict."

Uh, it makes them feel "normal" as in "not in prison". Would you be so judgey if some dude in prison said that wearing their favorite baseball cap made them feel normal? What about fuzzy bunny slippers? A nice massage? A cup of tea? What desire for a kind of regular, everyday event that happens on the outside of prison but not the inside would you consider not to be a sign of illness?

For fuck's sake.
posted by oneirodynia at 3:24 PM on February 12, 2016 [37 favorites]


I'm part of a QPOC make-up lovers group on Facebook & seeing the incredible looks dark skinned women turn out makes my heart soar and my wallet desire a little lightening via luminizer and eyebrow powder.
posted by Juliet Banana at 8:49 PM on February 12, 2016 [4 favorites]


The red lipstick looks fine (even very good), and people way overestimate how much "shades for your skintone" is 100% of the essence. Absolutely people deserve shades formulated to their family of skintones, but if you wear the right complementary makeup you can pull off most shades. All those women look fine; the day I let a man judge whether my lipstick is a "poor fashion choice" is the day I am a husk of a woman.
posted by stoneandstar at 12:32 PM on February 16, 2016 [6 favorites]


I think it is crazy hold judgemental people get with others decision on how the do or do not present themselves. The amount of concern the world shows towards someone over something ridiculous has became so bad. To each his (her) own.
posted by Meli1029 at 5:40 AM on February 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


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