Zap! Pow! Movies grow up!
February 24, 2016 7:34 AM Subscribe
So, over the next few months, if you pay attention to the trades, you'll see Hollywood misunderstanding the lesson they should be learning with Deadpool. They'll be green lighting films "like Deadpool" - but, by that, they won't mean "good and original" but "a raunchy superhero film" or "it breaks the fourth wall." They'll treat you like you're stupid, which is the one thing Deadpool didn't do. - Guardians of the Galaxy director James Gunn on the success of Deadpool. And indeed the film prompted much speculation as to what R-Rated superhero movies could be made. Warner Bros, about fifteen minutes later: "Here's an R-rated superman movie!"
I predicted this post going up as soon as I saw io9 this morning. Blah blah blah grimdark blah. I'm so tired of people hating on movies that haven't been released.
posted by sevenyearlurk at 7:40 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by sevenyearlurk at 7:40 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
God the obsession with the rating of this movie is just the latest "We need a one sentence explanation!!!" bullshit. Make good, novel films that people will enjoy, you creatively bankrupt monkeys.
posted by selfnoise at 7:44 AM on February 24, 2016 [20 favorites]
posted by selfnoise at 7:44 AM on February 24, 2016 [20 favorites]
When Were Superheroes Grim and Gritty?: The aesthetics and legacy of grim and gritty are perhaps more accurately understood as the other face of camp and irony.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 7:44 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by 1970s Antihero at 7:44 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
Make good, novel films that people will enjoy, you creatively bankrupt monkeys.
That's hard and unpredictable, though. Much better to make a pale knockoff of something good, copying only the bits that don't require any risks be taken.
posted by nonasuch at 7:46 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
That's hard and unpredictable, though. Much better to make a pale knockoff of something good, copying only the bits that don't require any risks be taken.
posted by nonasuch at 7:46 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
I just wanted to say thank you for the title of the post; I don't know how long your experience of that venerable tradition is, but mine goes back to, I think, the end of the 70s.
posted by kimota at 7:46 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by kimota at 7:46 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
The lesson that people should be taking away from Deadpool is that comic book movies should be made by people who actually read and enjoy comic books.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 7:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [72 favorites]
posted by 1970s Antihero at 7:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [72 favorites]
I would like to say that as much as I enjoyed Deadpool, I did give some serious side-eye to the parents who brought their under-sixes to it. (Halfway through, I noticed they did a fade.)
posted by Kitteh at 7:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by Kitteh at 7:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
I'm so tired of people hating on movies that haven't been released.
Yeah, watch before hating...
posted by Alexandra Kitty at 7:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, watch before hating...
posted by Alexandra Kitty at 7:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I predicted this post going up as soon as I saw io9 this morning.
Give me low hanging fruit like this and I'm going to super-punch it in the dick so hard it'll think it's in a Mark Millar comic!!!! *
* possible actual Dawn of Justice EXTREME EDITION dialogue.
posted by Artw at 7:52 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
Give me low hanging fruit like this and I'm going to super-punch it in the dick so hard it'll think it's in a Mark Millar comic!!!! *
* possible actual Dawn of Justice EXTREME EDITION dialogue.
posted by Artw at 7:52 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
For a second there I thought you guys were chiding someone for judging a Zach Snyder movie before watching it and I was going to burst into hysterical laughter. But I see you're talking about Suicide Squad, and yeah I actually thought the trailer was ok and maybe it'll be good fun?
posted by selfnoise at 7:53 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by selfnoise at 7:53 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I couldn't agree more with Gunn's position on this.
But I'll also throw out another speculation on the return of R-rated action films: Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days? Because that demo is what brought us the onslaught of PG-13s in the first place. So, if studios are willing to crank the rating up to R and exclude them, it might mean that they're not buying as many tickets as they did in the late 90s and 2000s. (This is an honest question, I haven't actually looked into the numbers on it.)
posted by tobascodagama at 7:55 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
But I'll also throw out another speculation on the return of R-rated action films: Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days? Because that demo is what brought us the onslaught of PG-13s in the first place. So, if studios are willing to crank the rating up to R and exclude them, it might mean that they're not buying as many tickets as they did in the late 90s and 2000s. (This is an honest question, I haven't actually looked into the numbers on it.)
posted by tobascodagama at 7:55 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
I don't mind R-rated comic book movies as long as the content is good* and not a reason to throw in useless violence/tons o' boobs/swears.
*Deadpool had all of these things but it was done fantastically. I'm thinking more of the idea that if it has these things, then of course it will teh awesum according to movie execs.
posted by Kitteh at 7:59 AM on February 24, 2016
*Deadpool had all of these things but it was done fantastically. I'm thinking more of the idea that if it has these things, then of course it will teh awesum according to movie execs.
posted by Kitteh at 7:59 AM on February 24, 2016
To be ever so slightly fair, it's not just movie execs who think this. I've heard a lot of fanboys express the same idea.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:02 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by tobascodagama at 8:02 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Watchmen's director's cut is rated R and came out in 2009. Maybe Zack Synder imitated Deadpool then, too.
posted by Tanizaki at 8:04 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Tanizaki at 8:04 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
But I'll also throw out another speculation on the return of R-rated action films: Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days?
Honestly, I would be more curious about whether an "R" rating actually has any effect at all on whether teens actually see these movies - it certainly didn't in my day, mostly because the person manning the ticket booth was most likely another teen and didn't really give a shit. I suspect ratings are more "security theater" than anything else, and I doubt that the studios or theater chains have any real detailed info about the actual ages of the people whose butts are actually in the seats.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:04 AM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
Honestly, I would be more curious about whether an "R" rating actually has any effect at all on whether teens actually see these movies - it certainly didn't in my day, mostly because the person manning the ticket booth was most likely another teen and didn't really give a shit. I suspect ratings are more "security theater" than anything else, and I doubt that the studios or theater chains have any real detailed info about the actual ages of the people whose butts are actually in the seats.
posted by soundguy99 at 8:04 AM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
Maybe this means there will be a version of BVSDOJ where Affleck runs around shouting "I'm the god-damn batman".
posted by sleeping bear at 8:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by sleeping bear at 8:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
I suspect ratings are more "security theater" than anything else, and I doubt that the studios or theater chains have any real detailed info about the actual ages of the people whose butts are actually in the seats.
Yeah, I remember some sort of crackdown on this in maybe the late 90s, when I was still a teenager, and it's possible that they happen every now and then still. But I feel like I remember it because it was weird and we were all like "what the fuck are you talking about" when we got ID'd buying tickets.
posted by brennen at 8:07 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I remember some sort of crackdown on this in maybe the late 90s, when I was still a teenager, and it's possible that they happen every now and then still. But I feel like I remember it because it was weird and we were all like "what the fuck are you talking about" when we got ID'd buying tickets.
posted by brennen at 8:07 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
On preview, cjelli beat me to this but I'll post anyway.
Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days?
Don't think the MPAA has released numbers for 2015 yet, but in 2014, the figures [PDF] showed that attendance by all age groups under 40 had been in decline over a five-year period. On a per-capita basis (page 14), the 12-17 age group declined the most. If you look at tickets sold (page 13), 17-and-under account for just 26%. Meanwhile, 18-24 is 16% and 25-39 is 20% so, yeah, it may be becoming more lucrative to target slightly older audiences rather than laser-focusing on the PG-13.
Then again, older moviegoers buy tickets to PG-13 movies, too. I don't know how many of them are more likely to see a movie because it has an R rating. But the R is no longer considered anathema to box office — Warner Bros. had a PG-13 version of Fury Road all boxed up and ready to go, but they let George Miller release his R-rated version simply because it tested better.
posted by Mothlight at 8:11 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days?
Don't think the MPAA has released numbers for 2015 yet, but in 2014, the figures [PDF] showed that attendance by all age groups under 40 had been in decline over a five-year period. On a per-capita basis (page 14), the 12-17 age group declined the most. If you look at tickets sold (page 13), 17-and-under account for just 26%. Meanwhile, 18-24 is 16% and 25-39 is 20% so, yeah, it may be becoming more lucrative to target slightly older audiences rather than laser-focusing on the PG-13.
Then again, older moviegoers buy tickets to PG-13 movies, too. I don't know how many of them are more likely to see a movie because it has an R rating. But the R is no longer considered anathema to box office — Warner Bros. had a PG-13 version of Fury Road all boxed up and ready to go, but they let George Miller release his R-rated version simply because it tested better.
posted by Mothlight at 8:11 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'd actually love to hear from someone who works in the business, regarding whether 'R' ratings keep kids out. It was my impression that in the '90s they typically didn't, but that the whole reason for the rise of the dominance of 'PG-13' was that at some point theaters actually did get very serious about ratings. So, in the '90s you could release an 'R' movie and not actually exclude the teen audience, but in the '00s an 'R' rating would in fact keep the kids out, making studios hesitant to aim movies at that rating.
posted by tocts at 8:13 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by tocts at 8:13 AM on February 24, 2016
These days I mostly only go to cinemas with assigned seating and booze anyway, which basically means a bunch of NPR listeners, though for some kind of movies that feels wrong - The Force Awakens gained much the second time around from seeing it someplace with boisterousness and popcorn.
posted by Artw at 8:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by Artw at 8:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
Then you have movies that should have gone R and they wimped out. *cough couch* Suicide Squad *cough cough*
posted by cjorgensen at 8:18 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by cjorgensen at 8:18 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Quoting that MPAA study:
posted by soundguy99 at 8:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Motion Picture Association of America, Inc. (MPAA) commissioned Opinion Research Corporation (ORC) International to study motion picture cinema attendance in the United States. A survey was conducted among a national probability sample of 4,031 adults comprising 2,010 men and 2,021 women 18 years of age and older, living in private households in the continental United States. Interviewing was conducted beginning January 8, 2015, and ending January 25, 2015 via four waves of CARAVAN®, ORC International’s weekly national telephone omnibus survey.IOW, they're relying on parental units/guardians to report on which movies their 17 & under kids went to, which does not strike me as the most accurate source of info, especially for the 14-17 year olds who are heading out to the flicks without parental supervision.
Also, where the respondent indicated the presence of a child or children in the household ages 2-17, the respondent was asked to provide estimates of the frequency of each child’s motion picture attendance, as well as the child’s age and gender. Following were the questions used, which were repeated for each child in order of oldest to youngest:
• “To better understand the make-up of the movie-going audience, we would also like to know about how frequently children 2 and older attended the movies in 2014, including all times they went with guardians or on their own. Now, thinking of your child at least 2 but under 18, how many times did he or she go to the movies at theaters in 2014?”
• (IF 1 OR MORE): “And, of those [INSERT RESPONSE] movies, how many did that child see in 3D?”
posted by soundguy99 at 8:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Watchmen's director's cut is rated R and came out in 2009. Maybe Zack Synder imitated Deadpool then, too.
I'm sorry, I think you must be confused. Watchmen was never made into a movie, thank god.
posted by dersins at 8:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [36 favorites]
I'm sorry, I think you must be confused. Watchmen was never made into a movie, thank god.
posted by dersins at 8:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [36 favorites]
The cinema I go to completely ignores R ratings. Also I can watch in my underwear, drink beer, and pause it when I need to go pee.
posted by adept256 at 8:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by adept256 at 8:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
PG-13 and R don't really have much impact on whether 15 and 16 year old kids go see the movie with their buddies. It makes a big difference for parents of younger kids about whether you bring them. Although my 10 year old daughter was probably not thrilled that because of Deadpool's "R" rating we went to see "Hail, Caesar" instead...
posted by MattD at 8:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by MattD at 8:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
PG-13 Fury Road???
*FLARGLSPLITH* The very idea has me spitting blood.
And what's wrong with Watchmen? The comic is clearly seminal, but the movie was pretty good in my estimation? You're making it sound like The Phantom Menace
posted by trif at 8:24 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
*FLARGLSPLITH* The very idea has me spitting blood.
And what's wrong with Watchmen? The comic is clearly seminal, but the movie was pretty good in my estimation? You're making it sound like The Phantom Menace
posted by trif at 8:24 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
And what's wrong with Watchmen?
It was terrible?
posted by dersins at 8:26 AM on February 24, 2016 [21 favorites]
It was terrible?
posted by dersins at 8:26 AM on February 24, 2016 [21 favorites]
I would watch the hell—er, heck—out of Batman v. Superman if it had this scene from TKDR in it.
posted by entropicamericana at 8:30 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 8:30 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
I feel bad for the people making Batman Vs. Superman. It's really hard to do something purely imitative when people keep having big successes by doing widely different things. At this point they're obliged to make a team movie like the Avengers, only DARK'N'GRITTYtm like the Nolan Batman movies, only goofy and comic-booky like Guardians, only with cussing like Deadpool. With any luck they'll snap under the pressure of too many contradictory imperatives and completely lose their minds, and we'll get a cussin' Superman, or a movie with Bat-Mite in it. A cussin' Bat-Mite, with 'tude.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 8:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [24 favorites]
posted by Sing Or Swim at 8:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [24 favorites]
R-rated Peter Porker, Spider-Ham
posted by infinitewindow at 8:43 AM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
posted by infinitewindow at 8:43 AM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
So "Black Hole" by Charles Burns is in the pipe? Is that what this means?
posted by From Bklyn at 8:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by From Bklyn at 8:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
a movie with Bat-Mite in it. A cussin' Bat-Mite, with 'tude.
Someone please send this script to Craig Robinson
posted by Fuzzy Monster at 8:51 AM on February 24, 2016
Someone please send this script to Craig Robinson
posted by Fuzzy Monster at 8:51 AM on February 24, 2016
Crow, Punisher, Dredd.
posted by cjorgensen at 8:53 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by cjorgensen at 8:53 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
Everyone forgets about Dredd...
posted by trif at 9:08 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by trif at 9:08 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
I'd say that's because Dredd is not really a super-hero film, originally it's not a super-hero comic book either. I would guess it's a Scifi-action movie in most people's mind. And it didn't really do well commercially.
posted by SageLeVoid at 9:13 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by SageLeVoid at 9:13 AM on February 24, 2016
My one hope is that some film execs in their casting around for comic properties "like Deadpool" lands on Transmetropolitan and then accidentally gives it to a good director with the wherewithal and industry currency to brush off attempted meddling.
posted by 256 at 9:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
posted by 256 at 9:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
The lesson that people should be taking away from Deadpool is that comic book movies should be made by people who actually read and enjoy comic books.
Um... then theres this quote on the screenwriters - "Much to some fans' initial chagrin, though, prior to Reese and Wernick pitching themselves for the project, neither had even heard of Deadpool."
source
posted by bitdamaged at 9:15 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
And then they forget they have the project on the books and just let the team working on it do their own thing for however long they need.
posted by ODiV at 9:16 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by ODiV at 9:16 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Do teens still go see a lot of movies these days? Because that demo is what brought us the onslaught of PG-13s in the first place.
My recollection is that PG-13 was initially created after my entire generation was scarred by seeing Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom at the age of 8 because Raiders of the Lost Ark was lots of fun and nobody anticipated the reach into the guy's chest and pull out his heart thing. (We were at the beach on vacation and a tropical storm hit and it seemed like a fun family movie. epic parenting screaming nightmares fail.)
At least at the time, the idea was to help parents sort out "parental guidance is a good idea" from "not what your 8 year old needs to be seeing even if technically not rated R". That seems to have been forgotten, because yes there were small children in our showing of Deadpool.
posted by hydropsyche at 9:18 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
My recollection is that PG-13 was initially created after my entire generation was scarred by seeing Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom at the age of 8 because Raiders of the Lost Ark was lots of fun and nobody anticipated the reach into the guy's chest and pull out his heart thing. (We were at the beach on vacation and a tropical storm hit and it seemed like a fun family movie. epic parenting screaming nightmares fail.)
At least at the time, the idea was to help parents sort out "parental guidance is a good idea" from "not what your 8 year old needs to be seeing even if technically not rated R". That seems to have been forgotten, because yes there were small children in our showing of Deadpool.
posted by hydropsyche at 9:18 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Tell me, do you bleed?
I keep imaging Bats asking that question of Wonder Woman and she just looks at him weirdly before beating the crap out of him.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
I keep imaging Bats asking that question of Wonder Woman and she just looks at him weirdly before beating the crap out of him.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
I agree with Gunn, that Deadpool's success is going to lead to studios chasing their tails trying to replicate it, without necessarily understanding (or even caring) about what made that success. Studios are businesses which take on huge risks. Movies are expensive products, and a sure thing that follows a trend is preferable to something that's out there and flops.
The GQ article, brief as it was, brings up another good point: TV treatments of superheroes have been doing a great job at bringing in more interesting (and adult) storylines. Jessica Jones is just plain good, without even the qualifier 'for a super hero story'. Daredevil is pretty close. Gotham (an acquired taste) is madcap and insane, and actually gets towards the darkly campy feeling that Suicide Squad appears to be attempting. Maybe that's what mainstream cinema would look like in an alternative timeline where we never had a hard rating system? Either way, those are far more interesting than the next mainline movie that Marvel is going to pump out, ad nauseum.
A few items from my hard R comic adaptation wishlist...
Animal Man - GMo's crazy, genre ripping storyline seems like a good fit, if you could adapt it to critique super hero movies instead of comics. That's one reason that Watchmen was so bad. The comic is a comic about comics, but the movie is just an adaptation instead of an original work. Please keep Zach Snyder far, far, far away from this.
Doom Patrol - Another GMo rework that could make a great movie. Expecially if it was written as a send-up of the Avengers (which, I feel, is what Morrison was doing in the comic, anyway). You have awesome dark, occult elements that could bend it into a partially horror film.
AKIRA (with actual Japanese actors) - This one is touchy, since the anime is already a cut down version of the manga. However, the bones of a really good live action movie are there, if the director would be at all willing to do it justice, instead of casting a 50 year old white man as the lead.
Black Hole - I think James Gunn, David Mitchell, or Jennifer Kent could actually do a pretty good job with this. 70s nostalgia is pretty big right now, and you could most likely adapt this with 95% of the audience never knowing it was a comic.
Bone - Seems like a perfect fit as an animated movie. There's a lot to it, but I feel like there are a number of individual storylines you could compress or rewrite to make it a one-shot. edit: Bone wouldn't be hard R, most likely, I'd just really like to see it!
posted by codacorolla at 9:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
The GQ article, brief as it was, brings up another good point: TV treatments of superheroes have been doing a great job at bringing in more interesting (and adult) storylines. Jessica Jones is just plain good, without even the qualifier 'for a super hero story'. Daredevil is pretty close. Gotham (an acquired taste) is madcap and insane, and actually gets towards the darkly campy feeling that Suicide Squad appears to be attempting. Maybe that's what mainstream cinema would look like in an alternative timeline where we never had a hard rating system? Either way, those are far more interesting than the next mainline movie that Marvel is going to pump out, ad nauseum.
A few items from my hard R comic adaptation wishlist...
Animal Man - GMo's crazy, genre ripping storyline seems like a good fit, if you could adapt it to critique super hero movies instead of comics. That's one reason that Watchmen was so bad. The comic is a comic about comics, but the movie is just an adaptation instead of an original work. Please keep Zach Snyder far, far, far away from this.
Doom Patrol - Another GMo rework that could make a great movie. Expecially if it was written as a send-up of the Avengers (which, I feel, is what Morrison was doing in the comic, anyway). You have awesome dark, occult elements that could bend it into a partially horror film.
AKIRA (with actual Japanese actors) - This one is touchy, since the anime is already a cut down version of the manga. However, the bones of a really good live action movie are there, if the director would be at all willing to do it justice, instead of casting a 50 year old white man as the lead.
Black Hole - I think James Gunn, David Mitchell, or Jennifer Kent could actually do a pretty good job with this. 70s nostalgia is pretty big right now, and you could most likely adapt this with 95% of the audience never knowing it was a comic.
Bone - Seems like a perfect fit as an animated movie. There's a lot to it, but I feel like there are a number of individual storylines you could compress or rewrite to make it a one-shot. edit: Bone wouldn't be hard R, most likely, I'd just really like to see it!
posted by codacorolla at 9:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Crow, Punisher, Dredd.
'Super'. Can't forget Super, it was great. And also James Gunn.
posted by FatherDagon at 9:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
'Super'. Can't forget Super, it was great. And also James Gunn.
posted by FatherDagon at 9:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Growing up in Louisville, Kentucky, the Showcase Cinemas on Bardstown Road enforced the R rating all of once -- I saw Dawn of the Dead there when I was barely in high school, for crying out loud -- and that was for Purple Rain. I suppose the sight of His Royal Badness getting it on with a white chick was beyond my hometown's sensibilities at the time, even if all the high school girls I knew wanted to see the film. So it was a surprise when we got carded, but so what? It being a cineplex, we just bought a ticket to some PG-rated film and then skipped our merry way into the film we came to see after all.
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Gelatin at 9:26 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
For a second there I thought you guys were chiding someone for judging a Zach Snyder movie before watching it and I was going to burst into hysterical laughter.
This is the internet, we'll prejudge the shit out of anything.
But I see you're talking about Suicide Squad, and yeah I actually thought the trailer was ok and maybe it'll be good fun?
It looks fun, sure, much more interesting than BvS. But that second trailer is nothing like the first one, which was better. SS sounds like it should be dark.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:27 AM on February 24, 2016
This is the internet, we'll prejudge the shit out of anything.
But I see you're talking about Suicide Squad, and yeah I actually thought the trailer was ok and maybe it'll be good fun?
It looks fun, sure, much more interesting than BvS. But that second trailer is nothing like the first one, which was better. SS sounds like it should be dark.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:27 AM on February 24, 2016
Kickass seems to get forgotten entirely in discussions of Deadpool - I guess because the sequel flopped.
posted by Artw at 9:27 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Artw at 9:27 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
A few items from my hard R comic adaptation wishlist...
Bone - Seems like a perfect fit as an animated movie. There's a lot to it, but I feel like there are a number of individual storylines you could compress or rewrite to make it a one-shot.
Wait, a hard-R Bone? The original comic is pretty much the definition of "all-ages fun".
posted by Strange Interlude at 9:30 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
Bone - Seems like a perfect fit as an animated movie. There's a lot to it, but I feel like there are a number of individual storylines you could compress or rewrite to make it a one-shot.
Wait, a hard-R Bone? The original comic is pretty much the definition of "all-ages fun".
posted by Strange Interlude at 9:30 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
The really interesting thing about DP was that it only cast $58M to make and at the last minute they had to chop $7M from the budget. Even the creators think that last chop really helped tighten up the movie.
But the $200M for BvS, which is set to clock in at 2 hours and 31 minutes just sounds like a terrible folly. Hopefully the movies being made from under 100M becomes a thing again.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
But the $200M for BvS, which is set to clock in at 2 hours and 31 minutes just sounds like a terrible folly. Hopefully the movies being made from under 100M becomes a thing again.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Maybe the success of Deadpool will finally convince a studio to greenlight Del Toro's Mountains Of Madness movie.
posted by hippybear at 9:33 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 9:33 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Maybe the success of Deadpool will finally convince a studio to greenlight Del Toro's Mountains Of Madness movie.
Not so sure about the new studio demand for wisecracking fourth-wall-breaking shoggoths though.
posted by Drastic at 9:34 AM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
Not so sure about the new studio demand for wisecracking fourth-wall-breaking shoggoths though.
posted by Drastic at 9:34 AM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
I'd actually love to hear from someone who works in the business, regarding whether 'R' ratings keep kids out.
I don't work in exhibition but I see a lot of movies and, anecdotally, the R rating definitely keeps a lot of kids out (but far from all of them).
As far as timeframes, there was a little dust-up in 1999 when the Clinton Administration got worked up about violence in motion pictures following Columbine and stuck its nose into the ratings system. The White House got the theater owners' trade group to agree to step up enforcement of the ratings. I don't know how big the impact was, or how much it has fallen off over time but at the time it certainly felt like there was a real increase in enforcement as theaters took their existing policies more seriously.
I checked out the theater before Deadpool started and didn't see too many kids, except for a group of three 10- or 11-year-olds with some bored-looking parental guardian type in the very back row. One of the kids was just beaming from ear to ear, like he knew this was going to be the greatest night of his life. I hope that kid had a good time.
posted by Mothlight at 9:39 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
I don't work in exhibition but I see a lot of movies and, anecdotally, the R rating definitely keeps a lot of kids out (but far from all of them).
As far as timeframes, there was a little dust-up in 1999 when the Clinton Administration got worked up about violence in motion pictures following Columbine and stuck its nose into the ratings system. The White House got the theater owners' trade group to agree to step up enforcement of the ratings. I don't know how big the impact was, or how much it has fallen off over time but at the time it certainly felt like there was a real increase in enforcement as theaters took their existing policies more seriously.
I checked out the theater before Deadpool started and didn't see too many kids, except for a group of three 10- or 11-year-olds with some bored-looking parental guardian type in the very back row. One of the kids was just beaming from ear to ear, like he knew this was going to be the greatest night of his life. I hope that kid had a good time.
posted by Mothlight at 9:39 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
If they are done correctly, the entire audience will encounter the existential horror that is human existence in a vast uncaring universe as they are addressed directly by the unspeakable.
posted by hippybear at 9:39 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by hippybear at 9:39 AM on February 24, 2016
Wait, a hard-R Bone? The original comic is pretty much the definition of "all-ages fun".
Haha yeah, I got caught up in the moment and just listed None because I want to see it adapted. Edited my post to clarify. I do think None would benefit from outside the box direction, though.
posted by codacorolla at 9:44 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
I worked in a movie theatre in Toronto as a projectionist and we were fairly good at making sure the age recommendations were followed. However, if you really wanted to see a movie you were too young for, there were ways to do that. I think the ratings were really more for parents, in that regard.
posted by dazed_one at 9:46 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by dazed_one at 9:46 AM on February 24, 2016
I look forward to a Lex Luthor dialogue track dubbed with Old Dirty Bastard.
posted by benzenedream at 9:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by benzenedream at 9:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Now I feel even more mystified about the last time I was carded before a movie. It was Cabin in the Woods. In 2012. I was thirty.
posted by Jeanne at 9:57 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Jeanne at 9:57 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Haha yeah, I got caught up in the moment and just listed None because I want to see it adapted. Edited my post to clarify.
Gentle reminder: better to do this sort of thing as a quick followup comment rather than editing the comment itself.
posted by cortex at 9:57 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Gentle reminder: better to do this sort of thing as a quick followup comment rather than editing the comment itself.
posted by cortex at 9:57 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
The Blade series of movies were pretty violent. They were also the first of the Marvel movies to be both popular and lucrative.
Special is underappreciated and violent. And ultimatley sad.
If you ignore all the fanboy "criticism" of Watchmen, you end up with a really a good movie.
posted by P.o.B. at 9:58 AM on February 24, 2016
Special is underappreciated and violent. And ultimatley sad.
If you ignore all the fanboy "criticism" of Watchmen, you end up with a really a good movie.
posted by P.o.B. at 9:58 AM on February 24, 2016
“sequences of violence”.
Oh. So that's why it's going to be "R". Not for a Batman/Superman sex scene.
*sigh*
Seriously, "Our brief bitter love affair" makes so much more sense for Berman being pissy, than whatever justification they're going to give in the movie. Plus maybe add in Bats trying to reaffirm his masculinity.
Don't what's with the all the obsession with violence for "R" ratings anyway. I mean c'min Hollywood, the superheroes are already wearing skin-tight outfits...
posted by happyroach at 9:59 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
Oh. So that's why it's going to be "R". Not for a Batman/Superman sex scene.
*sigh*
Seriously, "Our brief bitter love affair" makes so much more sense for Berman being pissy, than whatever justification they're going to give in the movie. Plus maybe add in Bats trying to reaffirm his masculinity.
Don't what's with the all the obsession with violence for "R" ratings anyway. I mean c'min Hollywood, the superheroes are already wearing skin-tight outfits...
posted by happyroach at 9:59 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
I suspect ratings are more "security theater" than anything else, and I doubt that the studios or theater chains have any real detailed info about the actual ages of the people whose butts are actually in the seats.
I was carded buying tickets to Deadpool, and the family in front of me was turned away. (Well, it was a couple of 14 year olds and a 16 year old and the mom was buying tickets for them, and the ticket-seller informed her that he couldn't sell them the tickets unless she was going to be accompanying them to the movie, which she was not.)
My worry with Deadpool imitators is that they are going to ignore the things that made it such a delight, including the relentlessly joyful sex-positivity (teenage female superhero, completely unsexualized! Hero's girlfriend kidnapped, not a shred of rapeyness about it! Enthusiastic ongoing consent to raunchy, kinky sex!) and instead will just make "edgy" crap full of sobbing half-naked women being drooled on by their captors.
posted by KathrynT at 10:00 AM on February 24, 2016 [26 favorites]
I was carded buying tickets to Deadpool, and the family in front of me was turned away. (Well, it was a couple of 14 year olds and a 16 year old and the mom was buying tickets for them, and the ticket-seller informed her that he couldn't sell them the tickets unless she was going to be accompanying them to the movie, which she was not.)
My worry with Deadpool imitators is that they are going to ignore the things that made it such a delight, including the relentlessly joyful sex-positivity (teenage female superhero, completely unsexualized! Hero's girlfriend kidnapped, not a shred of rapeyness about it! Enthusiastic ongoing consent to raunchy, kinky sex!) and instead will just make "edgy" crap full of sobbing half-naked women being drooled on by their captors.
posted by KathrynT at 10:00 AM on February 24, 2016 [26 favorites]
Surely those aren't the only two options.
posted by merelyglib at 10:02 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by merelyglib at 10:02 AM on February 24, 2016
(teenage female superhero, completely unsexualized! Hero's girlfriend kidnapped, not a shred of rapeyness about it! Enthusiastic ongoing consent to raunchy, kinky sex!)
Female villain as unsubtle bruiser instead of vampy seductress in a bikini/evening gown! Then when there is nudity for the character it's pure comic relief instead of titillating.
posted by ODiV at 10:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
Female villain as unsubtle bruiser instead of vampy seductress in a bikini/evening gown! Then when there is nudity for the character it's pure comic relief instead of titillating.
posted by ODiV at 10:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
Make good, novel films that people will enjoy, you creatively bankrupt monkeys.
That's hard and unpredictable, though. Much better to make a pale knockoff of something good, copying only the bits that don't require any risks be taken.
Is it? Is this kind of cargo-cult copying actually more successful than identifying smart, talented creators and giving them space to work? Which studio has a better record of success than Pixar?
posted by straight at 10:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
That's hard and unpredictable, though. Much better to make a pale knockoff of something good, copying only the bits that don't require any risks be taken.
Is it? Is this kind of cargo-cult copying actually more successful than identifying smart, talented creators and giving them space to work? Which studio has a better record of success than Pixar?
posted by straight at 10:05 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
I enjoy the occasional comic book or superhero movie as well but I rarely go to a theater showing because so much of it is just derivative crap. I don't care who wins if Batman and Superman fight and I'm not putting out twenty bucks to find out.
Last night I was watching "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" , an incredible film with wonderful actors and a great storyline. No one had superpowers. I am sad now that we rarely get such movies from Hollywood anymore
posted by AGameOfMoans at 10:09 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
Last night I was watching "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" , an incredible film with wonderful actors and a great storyline. No one had superpowers. I am sad now that we rarely get such movies from Hollywood anymore
posted by AGameOfMoans at 10:09 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
Speaking as a Watchmen fanboy, I loved the movie. Yes, they got rid of the psychic squid and frankly I can totally understand why. But Snyder kept single best line to ever appear in any comic book and/or movie, and generally the whole thing worked well.
I kind of wish they'd managed to include the Black Freighter sequences in the theatrical release, bug again I can understand why they didn't.
And now I wait in terror, for Alan Moore will come murder me for liking the movie.
As for R-rated super hero movies, if they could do one as good as Jessica Jones I'd watch it a billion times. But I fear that Hollywood wouldn't allow anything like Jessica Jones to be a movie.
Mostly I think Gunn is right: Hollywood will take this as a message that what the public really wants are fourth wall breaking cuss fests with lots of bloody murder thrown in. I'm betting on a Joker movie myself.
Ok, no. I'm going to play Cassandra here. I'm betting they turn The Killing Joke into the next R-rated superhero movie, and totally ruin it. There will be a long torture porn segment with Barbara naked, and it'll keep being flashed back to and shown on flatpanel TV's to horrify commissioner Gordon. The Circus Freaks will all be sexy chicks in bondage gear with boob windows. Batman will cuss like Frank Miller only wishes he'd written him cussing. And the Joker will be a bizarre and unworkable combination of over the top campy humor (cuz laughs rite guize!) and grimdark stone cold torturer and murderer.
And in the end Batman will kill the Joker and they'll justify it by citing fans who think that's how the comic ended.
Directed by Michael Bay of course.
That sounds absolutely horrible and completely like something they'd do.
posted by sotonohito at 10:09 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
I kind of wish they'd managed to include the Black Freighter sequences in the theatrical release, bug again I can understand why they didn't.
And now I wait in terror, for Alan Moore will come murder me for liking the movie.
As for R-rated super hero movies, if they could do one as good as Jessica Jones I'd watch it a billion times. But I fear that Hollywood wouldn't allow anything like Jessica Jones to be a movie.
Mostly I think Gunn is right: Hollywood will take this as a message that what the public really wants are fourth wall breaking cuss fests with lots of bloody murder thrown in. I'm betting on a Joker movie myself.
Ok, no. I'm going to play Cassandra here. I'm betting they turn The Killing Joke into the next R-rated superhero movie, and totally ruin it. There will be a long torture porn segment with Barbara naked, and it'll keep being flashed back to and shown on flatpanel TV's to horrify commissioner Gordon. The Circus Freaks will all be sexy chicks in bondage gear with boob windows. Batman will cuss like Frank Miller only wishes he'd written him cussing. And the Joker will be a bizarre and unworkable combination of over the top campy humor (cuz laughs rite guize!) and grimdark stone cold torturer and murderer.
And in the end Batman will kill the Joker and they'll justify it by citing fans who think that's how the comic ended.
Directed by Michael Bay of course.
That sounds absolutely horrible and completely like something they'd do.
posted by sotonohito at 10:09 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
The best line to ever appear in any movie and/or comic book, ROT-13 to avoid the biggest possible Watchmen spoiler:
“Qna, V'z abg n Erchoyvp frevny ivyynva. Qb lbh frevbhfyl guvax V'q rkcynva zl znfgre-fgebxr vs gurer erznvarq gur fyvtugrfg punapr bs lbh nssrpgvat vgf bhgpbzr? V qvq vg guvegl-svir zvahgrf ntb.”
I was literally shouting for joy and punching the air in victory when I read that line the first time.
posted by sotonohito at 10:12 AM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
“Qna, V'z abg n Erchoyvp frevny ivyynva. Qb lbh frevbhfyl guvax V'q rkcynva zl znfgre-fgebxr vs gurer erznvarq gur fyvtugrfg punapr bs lbh nssrpgvat vgf bhgpbzr? V qvq vg guvegl-svir zvahgrf ntb.”
I was literally shouting for joy and punching the air in victory when I read that line the first time.
posted by sotonohito at 10:12 AM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
I'm the god damned Bat-Mite!
posted by ursus_comiter at 10:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
posted by ursus_comiter at 10:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
Again, I can watch snuff flicks (I don't!) on a screen that could comfortably accommodate the Olympic figure skating competition if I lay it flat. In my own home. Who are these people who think an R rating matters? You're on the internet, surely you understand that if people want to see it, it'll be seen. However gross and reprehensible it is.
posted by adept256 at 10:24 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by adept256 at 10:24 AM on February 24, 2016
With any luck they'll snap under the pressure of too many contradictory imperatives and completely lose their minds, and we'll get a cussin' Superman, or a movie with Bat-Mite in it. A cussin' Bat-Mite, with 'tude.
It's obviously too late to save BvS:DoJ (And Wonder Woman Is There Too), but maybe there's still hope for the Justice League movie to revolve around the super-team trying to deal with a Bat-Mite/Mr. Mxyzptlk alliance.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:34 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's obviously too late to save BvS:DoJ (And Wonder Woman Is There Too), but maybe there's still hope for the Justice League movie to revolve around the super-team trying to deal with a Bat-Mite/Mr. Mxyzptlk alliance.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:34 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Speaking as a Watchmen fanboy, I loved the movie. Yes, they got rid of the psychic squid and frankly I can totally understand why.
It wasn't (just) the changing of the ending. It was that Snyder made the same mistake the legion of Watchmen imitators made after it came out: focusing on the violence, missing the underlying point and nuance.
The movie was just garbage, filled with drawn-out slo-mo fight scenes. It once again framed Rorschach as an awesome anti-hero. For fuck's sake, it had Daniel Dreiberg as an ass-kicking figher. Any adaptation of Watchmen that concerns itself with how "badass" and violent it can be instead of focusing on the thoughtfulness and interesting questions the work raises is simply worthless.
posted by Sangermaine at 10:42 AM on February 24, 2016 [15 favorites]
It wasn't (just) the changing of the ending. It was that Snyder made the same mistake the legion of Watchmen imitators made after it came out: focusing on the violence, missing the underlying point and nuance.
The movie was just garbage, filled with drawn-out slo-mo fight scenes. It once again framed Rorschach as an awesome anti-hero. For fuck's sake, it had Daniel Dreiberg as an ass-kicking figher. Any adaptation of Watchmen that concerns itself with how "badass" and violent it can be instead of focusing on the thoughtfulness and interesting questions the work raises is simply worthless.
posted by Sangermaine at 10:42 AM on February 24, 2016 [15 favorites]
So "Black Hole" by Charles Burns is in the pipe? Is that what this means?
David Cronenberg's Dazed and Confused
posted by Sys Rq at 10:43 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
David Cronenberg's Dazed and Confused
posted by Sys Rq at 10:43 AM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
posted by newdaddy at 10:44 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by newdaddy at 10:44 AM on February 24, 2016
I wonder what they're planning for the upcoming (seriously though this time for real no backsies) Sandman movie - the material itself is 100% rated R - even the milder parts of it are PG-13 at best, though maybe you could get away with The Sound of Her Wings.
Really I just want to convince myself that it is still a thing that is happening.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 10:45 AM on February 24, 2016
Really I just want to convince myself that it is still a thing that is happening.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 10:45 AM on February 24, 2016
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
Why not both?
posted by thecjm at 10:46 AM on February 24, 2016
Why not both?
posted by thecjm at 10:46 AM on February 24, 2016
I'm betting they turn The Killing Joke into the next R-rated superhero movie, and totally ruin it.
Unfortunately it came pre-ruined.
posted by MartinWisse at 10:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Unfortunately it came pre-ruined.
posted by MartinWisse at 10:49 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
A lot of the Marvel movies might be okay. I don't recall The Avengers being too gory or scary. The Iron Man movies were all also pretty lighthearted.
posted by Sangermaine at 10:49 AM on February 24, 2016
A lot of the Marvel movies might be okay. I don't recall The Avengers being too gory or scary. The Iron Man movies were all also pretty lighthearted.
posted by Sangermaine at 10:49 AM on February 24, 2016
If you're talking about Snyder's Watchmen, not Moore's, then the voilence, portrayal, and usage of it as a dominating factor is central to the story he tells. He tends to use these same themes in his other movies. Everyone talks about how great the opening credits are in Watchmen but seem to miss the fact that voilence and the medias portrayal of it are blaring obvious throughout that 5 minute sequence.
The problem people mostly have with his films is that he uses those themes either with already beloved materials thereby staining them, or people feel he uses them haphazardly.
posted by P.o.B. at 10:51 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
The problem people mostly have with his films is that he uses those themes either with already beloved materials thereby staining them, or people feel he uses them haphazardly.
posted by P.o.B. at 10:51 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
It's pretty laughable that this movie is going to be rated R. I mean, christ, it's the frigging Super Friends. What's next? Davy vs. Goliath?
posted by Sys Rq at 10:51 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Sys Rq at 10:51 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
He tends to use these same themes in his other movies.
Snyder movies have themes?
posted by Sangermaine at 10:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Snyder movies have themes?
posted by Sangermaine at 10:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
> The Iron Man movies were all also pretty lighthearted.
I haven't seen the other two, but the first one featured a scene where he shoots a bunch of soldiers in the face in between all the irreverent quips.
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I haven't seen the other two, but the first one featured a scene where he shoots a bunch of soldiers in the face in between all the irreverent quips.
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
"SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS, SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS, SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS," is a sort of a theme.
posted by codacorolla at 10:58 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
posted by codacorolla at 10:58 AM on February 24, 2016 [5 favorites]
>It's obviously too late to save BvS:DoJ (And Wonder Woman Is There Too)
(and Flash and Aquaman apparently)
(if you have taken three or four swings at a Superman movie and can't get it right you should probably lay off Aquaman for the moment, just not taking any lungful-sized hits off the Aquaman pipe is what I am suggesting)
posted by Sing Or Swim at 11:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
(and Flash and Aquaman apparently)
(if you have taken three or four swings at a Superman movie and can't get it right you should probably lay off Aquaman for the moment, just not taking any lungful-sized hits off the Aquaman pipe is what I am suggesting)
posted by Sing Or Swim at 11:13 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Snyder movies have themes?
Depends on how much you love to hate 'em.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:19 AM on February 24, 2016
Depends on how much you love to hate 'em.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:19 AM on February 24, 2016
The only way I'm willing to accept Aquaman now is the Brave and the Bold! version where he sings a bit and pals around with everyone and is generally outrageous and not at all GrimDark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE8C1WWixgc
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 11:19 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yE8C1WWixgc
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 11:19 AM on February 24, 2016 [6 favorites]
PLATELET!
posted by ursus_comiter at 11:20 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by ursus_comiter at 11:20 AM on February 24, 2016
Speaking of Aquaman, why isn't there a movie based on Marvel Hercules, yet? Maybe this dreary Civil War business will eventually lead to the MCU's version of World War Hulk, and then we get to have The Incredible Hercules wandering around the country with Amadeus Cho as a Netflix series or something.
posted by tobascodagama at 11:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 11:20 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS
That is the main premise of Gladiator of which Superman was modeled.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
That is the main premise of Gladiator of which Superman was modeled.
posted by P.o.B. at 11:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
After posting: The only way I'm willing to accept Aquaman now is the Brave and the Bold! version where he sings a bit and pals around with everyone and is generally outrageous and not at all GrimDark.
This was the joke I was obliquely making with the "Speaking of Aquaman" segue. Because B&tB Aquaman was shamelessly just the DC version of Marvel Hercules. (I'm not hating on B&tB at all, mind you, that was the finest DC animated series other than Batman: TAS.)
posted by tobascodagama at 11:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
This was the joke I was obliquely making with the "Speaking of Aquaman" segue. Because B&tB Aquaman was shamelessly just the DC version of Marvel Hercules. (I'm not hating on B&tB at all, mind you, that was the finest DC animated series other than Batman: TAS.)
posted by tobascodagama at 11:22 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Anecdotally, I saw Guardians with my Mom, Dad, bro, sis in law and the tiny baby at his place. Mom is notorious for her complete loathing of sci-fi movies. She gave a diatribe about how much she hated something as low key as District 9.
At the end of the admittedly long Guardians, she stands up and says "Well, that was a pretty good movie." Dad, Bro and I almost have heart attacks. To this date, it's the only sci-fi move she's ever came close to liking. I still think the baby was shocked just due to genealogical inertia.
posted by Sphinx at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
At the end of the admittedly long Guardians, she stands up and says "Well, that was a pretty good movie." Dad, Bro and I almost have heart attacks. To this date, it's the only sci-fi move she's ever came close to liking. I still think the baby was shocked just due to genealogical inertia.
posted by Sphinx at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
"SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS, SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS, SUPERMAN IS LITERALLY JESUS," is a sort of a theme.
It would be interesting if a movie tried to explore this idea more deeply. The early days of Superman's arrival could be likened to the early days of Christianity, and the early Christian community was rife with disagreements on the nature of Jesus. It would be interesting to have a movie approaching the Superman-as-Jesus concept through these lenses, with the various views on the divine/human nature of Jesus/Superman represented in the film as people grapple to come to terms with and understand this unique being who has manifested on our world.
posted by Sangermaine at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
It would be interesting if a movie tried to explore this idea more deeply. The early days of Superman's arrival could be likened to the early days of Christianity, and the early Christian community was rife with disagreements on the nature of Jesus. It would be interesting to have a movie approaching the Superman-as-Jesus concept through these lenses, with the various views on the divine/human nature of Jesus/Superman represented in the film as people grapple to come to terms with and understand this unique being who has manifested on our world.
posted by Sangermaine at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
In my recent experience seeing R-rated movies at the theater, the teens are usually outnumbered by the traumatized preschool kids dragged there by their parents.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Pater Aletheias at 11:23 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
R-Rated superhero movies are fine in theory. Made sense for Deadpool, makes sense for Wolverine, would make sense for Daredevil and the Punisher if they ever graduate to the big screen. Batman and Superman though?
Dumping on an unreleased movie that I have not seen is unbecoming so I'll resist the habit. But it's fair to say I'm pessimistic that the current creative film teams for these characters would make the most of the rating. I have no strong desire to see either of these characters surrounded with lolEPICGOREBRODAMNlol. Doesn't do much for them to just add more violence.
What would be cool though?
Do a Batman movie in black and white, set in the 1940s, in a Gotham City where adult sex lives exist. There's an upper limit to how noir and true crime a story set in Gotham can be without including the element of human sexuality. I'm not saying it should drive the action even, but it should be a real thing. In the true crime and noir tales that Batstories gesture towards, sex is definitely on the menu of motivations. Most Batfilms, you have Bruce vaguely interested in the one woman with her name on some of the posters and that's it. Sex doesn't really exist in the rest of the world around them.
I'm not talking about adapting the juvenile shit you sometimes see in the comics either, like Catwoman sneaking in with the strippers for the millionth time. I'm thinking more about the tone struck in that black and white miniseries and run of backup stories where a lot of times, sex was simply a real presence in the lives of the characters. That's simple and complicated enough. Put a whole 1940s version of the Bat Family onscreen this time around - Dick Grayson, back from the Western Front. Kathy Kane, back from the resistance. Maggie Sawyer, who had to transfer from Metropolis but won't say why. Barbara Gordon, librarian turned rogue vigilante. Tim Drake, junior codebreaker! Stephanie Brown, from the wrong side of town! Selina Kyle, the only one who saw the photographs, the only one who knows who was there.
When they set to work unraveling this latest massive ink black conspiracy of corruption, vice and greed, have sex in the mix. When they go about resolving it through high adventure, violence and bravery, acknowledge that attractive people with amazing abilities who get their heart rates crazy jacked up during intense situations might respond to each other in all kinds of ways. Tell me you don't want to see noir Nightwing and Batgirl have makeouts in an IMAX sized burning zeppelin.
Or, do a straight adaptation of DKR starring Michael Keaton.
posted by EatTheWeek at 11:24 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
Dumping on an unreleased movie that I have not seen is unbecoming so I'll resist the habit. But it's fair to say I'm pessimistic that the current creative film teams for these characters would make the most of the rating. I have no strong desire to see either of these characters surrounded with lolEPICGOREBRODAMNlol. Doesn't do much for them to just add more violence.
What would be cool though?
Do a Batman movie in black and white, set in the 1940s, in a Gotham City where adult sex lives exist. There's an upper limit to how noir and true crime a story set in Gotham can be without including the element of human sexuality. I'm not saying it should drive the action even, but it should be a real thing. In the true crime and noir tales that Batstories gesture towards, sex is definitely on the menu of motivations. Most Batfilms, you have Bruce vaguely interested in the one woman with her name on some of the posters and that's it. Sex doesn't really exist in the rest of the world around them.
I'm not talking about adapting the juvenile shit you sometimes see in the comics either, like Catwoman sneaking in with the strippers for the millionth time. I'm thinking more about the tone struck in that black and white miniseries and run of backup stories where a lot of times, sex was simply a real presence in the lives of the characters. That's simple and complicated enough. Put a whole 1940s version of the Bat Family onscreen this time around - Dick Grayson, back from the Western Front. Kathy Kane, back from the resistance. Maggie Sawyer, who had to transfer from Metropolis but won't say why. Barbara Gordon, librarian turned rogue vigilante. Tim Drake, junior codebreaker! Stephanie Brown, from the wrong side of town! Selina Kyle, the only one who saw the photographs, the only one who knows who was there.
When they set to work unraveling this latest massive ink black conspiracy of corruption, vice and greed, have sex in the mix. When they go about resolving it through high adventure, violence and bravery, acknowledge that attractive people with amazing abilities who get their heart rates crazy jacked up during intense situations might respond to each other in all kinds of ways. Tell me you don't want to see noir Nightwing and Batgirl have makeouts in an IMAX sized burning zeppelin.
Or, do a straight adaptation of DKR starring Michael Keaton.
posted by EatTheWeek at 11:24 AM on February 24, 2016 [13 favorites]
I can't honestly remember the last time I paid attention to the rating of a movie.
Does anyone pay attention other than teenagers worrying about being carded*?
The last one I saw with my kid was apparently PG (I just looked it up), but if you'd asked me in the theater, I would have said G, because Shaun the Sheep.
I choose movies based on their appeal, not an arbitrary rating by a shadowy group of checklist writers.
*When did this become a thing?
posted by madajb at 11:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Does anyone pay attention other than teenagers worrying about being carded*?
The last one I saw with my kid was apparently PG (I just looked it up), but if you'd asked me in the theater, I would have said G, because Shaun the Sheep.
I choose movies based on their appeal, not an arbitrary rating by a shadowy group of checklist writers.
*When did this become a thing?
posted by madajb at 11:31 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
What would be cool though?
Do a Batman movie in black and white, set in the 1940s
You mean the 50s and Greaser Batman.
posted by sukeban at 11:39 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
Do a Batman movie in black and white, set in the 1940s
You mean the 50s and Greaser Batman.
posted by sukeban at 11:39 AM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
Tell me you don't want to see noir Nightwing and Batgirl have makeouts in an IMAX sized burning zeppelin.
Hallelujah!
posted by benzenedream at 11:41 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Hallelujah!
posted by benzenedream at 11:41 AM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
AGameOfMoans: "Last night I was watching "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" , an incredible film with wonderful actors and a great storyline. No one had superpowers. I am sad now that we rarely get such movies from Hollywood anymore"
Lee Marvin had the superpower of being Lee Marvin. No one would take a shot at him for no other reason than he was Lee Marvin and no one shoots at Lee Fucking Marvin.
posted by octothorpe at 11:41 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Lee Marvin had the superpower of being Lee Marvin. No one would take a shot at him for no other reason than he was Lee Marvin and no one shoots at Lee Fucking Marvin.
posted by octothorpe at 11:41 AM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
As I've commented before: I'll watch DC movies again when they regain enough of a sense of fun to make B'wana Beast.
posted by yeolcoatl at 11:44 AM on February 24, 2016
posted by yeolcoatl at 11:44 AM on February 24, 2016
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
To add on to Sangerman's recommendation of The Avengers, it also has some great messages about teamwork and working with people even when you don't necessarily like them. I love watching the Big Ending Battle for all of the hints at how everyone feels about everyone else - the choreography really reinforces personalities and relationships in a way I enjoy watching every time.
posted by Deoridhe at 11:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
To add on to Sangerman's recommendation of The Avengers, it also has some great messages about teamwork and working with people even when you don't necessarily like them. I love watching the Big Ending Battle for all of the hints at how everyone feels about everyone else - the choreography really reinforces personalities and relationships in a way I enjoy watching every time.
posted by Deoridhe at 11:48 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
I can't honestly remember the last time I paid attention to the rating of a movie.
Although you, personally, may not care about ratings, movie studios do. It's why there are a shitload of PG13 horror movies as of late, because the studio is trying to get as wide an audience as possible. Ratings drive content, and can drastically change the freedom that a director has to shoot the script that they want to shoot, as opposed to a studio rewrite that has been pared down to hit the 'shadowy checklist' that you talk about.
Parents also care about ratings, and that determines what they take their kids to see, which determines what toys the kids buy.
So regardless of your own personal relationship to ratings, they do determine what you see.
posted by codacorolla at 11:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Although you, personally, may not care about ratings, movie studios do. It's why there are a shitload of PG13 horror movies as of late, because the studio is trying to get as wide an audience as possible. Ratings drive content, and can drastically change the freedom that a director has to shoot the script that they want to shoot, as opposed to a studio rewrite that has been pared down to hit the 'shadowy checklist' that you talk about.
Parents also care about ratings, and that determines what they take their kids to see, which determines what toys the kids buy.
So regardless of your own personal relationship to ratings, they do determine what you see.
posted by codacorolla at 11:56 AM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
"Last night I was watching "The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance" , an incredible film with wonderful actors and a great storyline. No one had superpowers. I am sad now that we rarely get such movies from Hollywood anymore"
I'd recommend Carol, with Cate Blanchett, it was wonderful.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:03 PM on February 24, 2016
I'd recommend Carol, with Cate Blanchett, it was wonderful.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 12:03 PM on February 24, 2016
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
A lot of the Marvel movies might be okay. I don't recall The Avengers being too gory or scary. The Iron Man movies were all also pretty lighthearted.
Ok, so Yes on Avengers No on Iron man.
As a father of a 7 year old, our then 6 year old learned about The Guardians of the Galaxy first, by waking up, and sitting down with us while we watched it (originally unknowingly). In retrospect, it isn't the best parental decision to necessarily expose him to the violence, or the prison, and there are moments of language which I'm sure have spawned as a result of this, but - in general its a solid mostly kid friendly story. We also used the opportunity to talk about his Grandfather's passing with him in a little bit more of an adult way. But, we also taught him that "The good guys win" which is not a mantra of a movie like The Watchmen. We've stressed what is real and what is a movie.
Then came Captain America which we talked about patriotism, duty to country, standing up for what's right, friendship and really the self sacrifice component. We talked about world war 2, his great grandfather, and a host of other real things in the movie.
that led to the avengers, which he loved, and other than Agent Coulsun "dying" becomes a special effects mind blowing event for him. Then came the Winter Soldier, then Age of Ultron. We had to talk about friendship, the importance of what makes a good friend, and how you rectify issues. Ultron was right on the edge of too much, but - it turned out to be probably one of his favorite movies...
... that was until Ant Man... more on that in a second though
I had too much involvement in the military industrial complex for Iron Man... More importantly, the torture scenes were too much to make the list. It is a realistic scary movie in certain regards, and unfortunately there isn't a real superhero for some of the stuff that's in that movie. I2 and I3 really fall the same way - nope nope nope.
The Hulk I'm on the fence on, once again there's a military complex, but it is not the same manner it is shown in Iron Man. The other side, is that it does have a good conversation about your inner hulk... which I think can be a good thing to talk about...
Thor is way way too dark and scary for him. Also, it bored my wife, so I don't think she can sit through it until we have to.
Then there was Ant Man. He actually cried tears of joy while watching ant man. He likes the idea of a heist movie, he likes the idea of a guy looking for redemption, and he just digs the concept of a little hero (and by that I mean, Ant Man isn't saving the world in Ant Man... its a much smaller battle - unlike the rest of the movies) because he can relate to caring about the people near him and needing the power to do good by them - more than saving the world.
Agents of Shield is a No.
Agent Carter is a No.
X-Men is a No.
Deadpool is a Hell No. (Though we saw it and loved it)
posted by Nanukthedog at 12:09 PM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
A lot of the Marvel movies might be okay. I don't recall The Avengers being too gory or scary. The Iron Man movies were all also pretty lighthearted.
Ok, so Yes on Avengers No on Iron man.
As a father of a 7 year old, our then 6 year old learned about The Guardians of the Galaxy first, by waking up, and sitting down with us while we watched it (originally unknowingly). In retrospect, it isn't the best parental decision to necessarily expose him to the violence, or the prison, and there are moments of language which I'm sure have spawned as a result of this, but - in general its a solid mostly kid friendly story. We also used the opportunity to talk about his Grandfather's passing with him in a little bit more of an adult way. But, we also taught him that "The good guys win" which is not a mantra of a movie like The Watchmen. We've stressed what is real and what is a movie.
Then came Captain America which we talked about patriotism, duty to country, standing up for what's right, friendship and really the self sacrifice component. We talked about world war 2, his great grandfather, and a host of other real things in the movie.
that led to the avengers, which he loved, and other than Agent Coulsun "dying" becomes a special effects mind blowing event for him. Then came the Winter Soldier, then Age of Ultron. We had to talk about friendship, the importance of what makes a good friend, and how you rectify issues. Ultron was right on the edge of too much, but - it turned out to be probably one of his favorite movies...
... that was until Ant Man... more on that in a second though
I had too much involvement in the military industrial complex for Iron Man... More importantly, the torture scenes were too much to make the list. It is a realistic scary movie in certain regards, and unfortunately there isn't a real superhero for some of the stuff that's in that movie. I2 and I3 really fall the same way - nope nope nope.
The Hulk I'm on the fence on, once again there's a military complex, but it is not the same manner it is shown in Iron Man. The other side, is that it does have a good conversation about your inner hulk... which I think can be a good thing to talk about...
Thor is way way too dark and scary for him. Also, it bored my wife, so I don't think she can sit through it until we have to.
Then there was Ant Man. He actually cried tears of joy while watching ant man. He likes the idea of a heist movie, he likes the idea of a guy looking for redemption, and he just digs the concept of a little hero (and by that I mean, Ant Man isn't saving the world in Ant Man... its a much smaller battle - unlike the rest of the movies) because he can relate to caring about the people near him and needing the power to do good by them - more than saving the world.
Agents of Shield is a No.
Agent Carter is a No.
X-Men is a No.
Deadpool is a Hell No. (Though we saw it and loved it)
posted by Nanukthedog at 12:09 PM on February 24, 2016 [9 favorites]
They make tons of movies specifically for kids. If it's superheroes they're after, how about The Powerpuff Girls Movie?
posted by ODiV at 12:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by ODiV at 12:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
I still think most of the MCU films straight-up kill too many people to count as kid-friendly, but whatevs. My dad took me to Under Siege when I was like eight, so I'm not really speaking from a position of strength on this one.
Tell me you don't want to see noir Nightwing and Batgirl have makeouts in an IMAX sized burning zeppelin.
Or, do a straight adaptation of DKR starring Michael Keaton.
Yes to all of this. Keaton is about the right age for DKR Batman, too. (I think we're supposed to believe that Batfleck is more or less DKR Batman, but he's too young IMO.)
posted by tobascodagama at 12:19 PM on February 24, 2016
Tell me you don't want to see noir Nightwing and Batgirl have makeouts in an IMAX sized burning zeppelin.
Or, do a straight adaptation of DKR starring Michael Keaton.
Yes to all of this. Keaton is about the right age for DKR Batman, too. (I think we're supposed to believe that Batfleck is more or less DKR Batman, but he's too young IMO.)
posted by tobascodagama at 12:19 PM on February 24, 2016
codacorolla: So regardless of your own personal relationship to ratings, they do determine what you see.
A fair point.
I suppose I should have said, they don't affect my conscious choice as a consumer, regardless of their impact on the selection I have to choose from.
posted by madajb at 12:22 PM on February 24, 2016
A fair point.
I suppose I should have said, they don't affect my conscious choice as a consumer, regardless of their impact on the selection I have to choose from.
posted by madajb at 12:22 PM on February 24, 2016
A fair point.
I suppose I should have said, they don't affect my conscious choice as a consumer, regardless of their impact on the selection I have to choose from.
I'll tell you what, if they remade a Benji or Lassie movie that was rated R, you better believe I'd be the first in line to see that film as I'd be like holy shit, what happened to Timmy when he fell down the well? Is Carpenter or Del Toro directing this? Am I going to be sick from watching this? I don't dig horror movies, but I'd have to see the movie just to wrap my head around the cognitive dissonance of something like that. Its not like they'd make a Watchmen Babies or anything like it.
posted by Nanukthedog at 12:30 PM on February 24, 2016
I suppose I should have said, they don't affect my conscious choice as a consumer, regardless of their impact on the selection I have to choose from.
I'll tell you what, if they remade a Benji or Lassie movie that was rated R, you better believe I'd be the first in line to see that film as I'd be like holy shit, what happened to Timmy when he fell down the well? Is Carpenter or Del Toro directing this? Am I going to be sick from watching this? I don't dig horror movies, but I'd have to see the movie just to wrap my head around the cognitive dissonance of something like that. Its not like they'd make a Watchmen Babies or anything like it.
posted by Nanukthedog at 12:30 PM on February 24, 2016
How about a superhero film I feel good about letting six-year-old kid watch?
Big Hero Six. Technically a Marvel movie but doesn't hold much if any similarity with its comic book origins.
Marvel tends to break up their properties - the tv cartoons are for kids, the movies and tv are teen and up. They've avoided the PG-13 straight to video animated movies that DC cranks out to varying degrees of quality.
posted by thecjm at 12:49 PM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
Big Hero Six. Technically a Marvel movie but doesn't hold much if any similarity with its comic book origins.
Marvel tends to break up their properties - the tv cartoons are for kids, the movies and tv are teen and up. They've avoided the PG-13 straight to video animated movies that DC cranks out to varying degrees of quality.
posted by thecjm at 12:49 PM on February 24, 2016 [10 favorites]
Could a 6 year old watch Batman: The Animated Series? That's probably too dark...
posted by codacorolla at 12:51 PM on February 24, 2016
posted by codacorolla at 12:51 PM on February 24, 2016
Could a 6 year old watch Batman: The Animated Series? That's probably too dark...
I was watching B:TAS at age 6 and I turned out perfectly norm....on second thought, maybe not :)
But seriously, I can't recall anything off the top of my head. Much of the violence was done off camera or implied/told rather than directly viewed and it ran during after school times on Cartoon Network(I think) when I was a kid (early-mid 90s)
posted by Twain Device at 12:54 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I was watching B:TAS at age 6 and I turned out perfectly norm....on second thought, maybe not :)
But seriously, I can't recall anything off the top of my head. Much of the violence was done off camera or implied/told rather than directly viewed and it ran during after school times on Cartoon Network(I think) when I was a kid (early-mid 90s)
posted by Twain Device at 12:54 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I think we started on Superman:TSA when kiddo was 6, which was a big surprise hit. Also pretty much the best screen Superman available outside of the first two Reeves films.
posted by Artw at 1:00 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 1:00 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
but in the '00s an 'R' rating would in fact keep the kids out
Late to the thread, but I ran into this one time in the late 90s. I was 18 and my sister was 16, and the multiplex carded us for some R-rated movie. I remember this almost 20 years later because of how it went down.
Clerk: "OK, I'll need to check your IDs."
Me: "Here's mine. She's only 16, but it's ok. I'm her legal guardian."
Clerk ponders how to respond to this obvious lie.
Clerk: "Uh, do you have documentation?"
Me: "What, on me? No."
Clerk: "...um, ok. Here's your tickets."
To this day I'm curious if legal guardians carry some kind of ID card listing the children under their care.
posted by ryanrs at 1:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Late to the thread, but I ran into this one time in the late 90s. I was 18 and my sister was 16, and the multiplex carded us for some R-rated movie. I remember this almost 20 years later because of how it went down.
Clerk: "OK, I'll need to check your IDs."
Me: "Here's mine. She's only 16, but it's ok. I'm her legal guardian."
Clerk ponders how to respond to this obvious lie.
Clerk: "Uh, do you have documentation?"
Me: "What, on me? No."
Clerk: "...um, ok. Here's your tickets."
To this day I'm curious if legal guardians carry some kind of ID card listing the children under their care.
posted by ryanrs at 1:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
AKIRA (with actual Japanese actors) - This one is touchy, since the anime is already a cut down version of the manga. However, the bones of a really good live action movie are there, if the director would be at all willing to do it justice, instead of casting a 50 year old white man as the lead.
no seriously, we have this one. black kids on motorbikes in baltimore. we have a director, and actors and everything, he even did a documentary as a test reel for it...
posted by ennui.bz at 1:13 PM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
no seriously, we have this one. black kids on motorbikes in baltimore. we have a director, and actors and everything, he even did a documentary as a test reel for it...
posted by ennui.bz at 1:13 PM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
ryanrs: "To this day I'm curious if legal guardians carry some kind of ID card listing the children under their care."
There are documents for this. Or at least I've had notarized papers allowing my Mother to take my daughter across the Canada-US boarder.
posted by Mitheral at 1:24 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
There are documents for this. Or at least I've had notarized papers allowing my Mother to take my daughter across the Canada-US boarder.
posted by Mitheral at 1:24 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
no seriously, we have this one. black kids on motorbikes in baltimore. we have a director, and actors and everything, he even did a documentary as a test reel for it...
It's interesting, because Akira the movie really focuses on Kaneda's gang and the malaise of no-hope teenagers in a megalopolis, but the manga has a lot more focus on the invasive American military presence, Japanese nationalism after World War II, and Tetsuo's boy empire.
I would contend that Akira the manga is a specifically Japanese story, but the movie could probably be adapted to an American setting through a lens like the Five O'Clock Boys. I don't know that you should call it Akira at that point, though.
Anything but Leonardo Dicaprio, though.
posted by codacorolla at 1:25 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's interesting, because Akira the movie really focuses on Kaneda's gang and the malaise of no-hope teenagers in a megalopolis, but the manga has a lot more focus on the invasive American military presence, Japanese nationalism after World War II, and Tetsuo's boy empire.
I would contend that Akira the manga is a specifically Japanese story, but the movie could probably be adapted to an American setting through a lens like the Five O'Clock Boys. I don't know that you should call it Akira at that point, though.
Anything but Leonardo Dicaprio, though.
posted by codacorolla at 1:25 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I've had notarized papers allowing my Mother to take my daughter across the Canada-US boarder.
Yeah, but do you take those papers with you to the movies?
posted by ryanrs at 1:25 PM on February 24, 2016
Yeah, but do you take those papers with you to the movies?
posted by ryanrs at 1:25 PM on February 24, 2016
Snyder movies have themes?
Are "Orange" and "Teal" themes?
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:34 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Are "Orange" and "Teal" themes?
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:34 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
The theme is "Hey, look at this badass thing. Isn't this thing badass? I think it's pretty badass."
posted by entropicamericana at 1:38 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by entropicamericana at 1:38 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
I don't think Deadpool says much about where comic book movies should go, but as far as action movies in general I hope it lets people realize you can make something like a Die Hard sequel without watering it down to PG-13.
Please don't take this as advice to make another Die Hard sequel.
posted by Drinky Die at 1:44 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Please don't take this as advice to make another Die Hard sequel.
posted by Drinky Die at 1:44 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
Sucker Punch had a theme. You can totally argue it was handled shittily and was a shitty movie but it definitely had a theme.
posted by Justinian at 1:50 PM on February 24, 2016
posted by Justinian at 1:50 PM on February 24, 2016
The lesson that people should be taking away from Deadpool is that comic book movies should be made by people who actually read and enjoy comic books.
Exactly.
That's why I'm pitching a Legion of Super-Heroes movie that mostly takes place in a pastel-colored surrealist 1970s Métal hurlant desert universe.
Also, a Wonder Woman movie where Diana and her punk girlfriend mostly hang out drinking beer and going to hardcore shows in early-'80s East L.A.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:53 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Exactly.
That's why I'm pitching a Legion of Super-Heroes movie that mostly takes place in a pastel-colored surrealist 1970s Métal hurlant desert universe.
Also, a Wonder Woman movie where Diana and her punk girlfriend mostly hang out drinking beer and going to hardcore shows in early-'80s East L.A.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 1:53 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Superburbia?
posted by dersins at 2:08 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by dersins at 2:08 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Man-Thing, if it had been written by Junji Ito, directed by Takashi Miike.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 2:20 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 2:20 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
What's next? Davy vs. Goliath?
BHWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAmmmm....
"Uh gee, I dunno, Davy...."
BHWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAmmmm....
Yeah, I can totally see it.
posted by happyroach at 2:33 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
BHWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAmmmm....
"Uh gee, I dunno, Davy...."
BHWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAmmmm....
Yeah, I can totally see it.
posted by happyroach at 2:33 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
It's interesting, because Akira the movie really focuses on Kaneda's gang and the malaise of no-hope teenagers in a megalopolis, but the manga has a lot more focus on the invasive American military presence, Japanese nationalism after World War II, and Tetsuo's boy empire.
I would contend that Akira the manga is a specifically Japanese story, but the movie could probably be adapted to an American setting through a lens like the Five O'Clock Boys. I don't know that you should call it Akira at that point, though.
But the manga is, in part, inspired by the movie "Godspeed You! Black Emperor" about Japanese biker gangs inspired by American biker gangs ala Easy Rider.
Akira is universal.
posted by ennui.bz at 2:44 PM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
I would contend that Akira the manga is a specifically Japanese story, but the movie could probably be adapted to an American setting through a lens like the Five O'Clock Boys. I don't know that you should call it Akira at that point, though.
But the manga is, in part, inspired by the movie "Godspeed You! Black Emperor" about Japanese biker gangs inspired by American biker gangs ala Easy Rider.
Akira is universal.
posted by ennui.bz at 2:44 PM on February 24, 2016 [4 favorites]
My dad took me to Under Siege when I was like eight
I was seven, my dad's completely incorrect age-appropriate viewing choice for me was:
Apocalypse Now
In IMAX...
"the horror... the horror..."
posted by jkaczor at 2:45 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
I was seven, my dad's completely incorrect age-appropriate viewing choice for me was:
Apocalypse Now
In IMAX...
"the horror... the horror..."
posted by jkaczor at 2:45 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
Hero's girlfriend kidnapped, not a shred of rapeyness about it!
I remember no jokes or threats about raping women, but rather a lot of joke/threats about raping men. Not actually good, but different enough to be better? Am mixed.
posted by clew at 2:46 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
I remember no jokes or threats about raping women, but rather a lot of joke/threats about raping men. Not actually good, but different enough to be better? Am mixed.
posted by clew at 2:46 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
a Legion of Super-Heroes movie that mostly takes place in a pastel-colored surrealist 1970s Métal hurlant desert universe.
Also, a Wonder Woman movie where Diana and her punk girlfriend mostly hang out drinking beer and going to hardcore shows in early-'80s East L.A.
If you combine the two of these, then it's already been done, sort of.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 2:47 PM on February 24, 2016
Also, a Wonder Woman movie where Diana and her punk girlfriend mostly hang out drinking beer and going to hardcore shows in early-'80s East L.A.
If you combine the two of these, then it's already been done, sort of.
posted by 1970s Antihero at 2:47 PM on February 24, 2016
There is exactly zero chance that a second Akira movie would be better than the existing one. Chances that it would be execrable, however, are pretty fair. Remaking Akira is like sinking a full-court shot behind your back and then asking for a redo. The whole remake thing is a mental virus, like in Pontypool.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 3:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Sing Or Swim at 3:11 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
The problem with SUPERJESUS isn't that there is no precedent for it, or even that it can't be interesting. It's that I have exactly no faith at all that Snyder is able to portray it in a way that will go beyond HE'S LIKE JESUS, SEE! because I have seen all of his movies (except Suckerpunch) and fervently gesticulating at a theme is as far as he ever gets.
posted by Tevin at 3:41 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Tevin at 3:41 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
CTRL +F LOBO
No results? Wow. Lobo is the first thing I thought of after reading this post, because he was created to be the same kind of character as Deadpool, albeit about nine years earlier. Deadpool even made fun of him once or twice. Both of them were intended to be ridiculously over the top exaggerations of what was considered to be "cool" in comics at the time, that somehow took off and became incredibly popular. The major difference is that Deadpool lives in (and makes fun of) the regular Marvel universe, while Lobo has his own domain in outer space filled with silly action tropes and dolphin cults. A Lobo movie would be a harder sell than Deadpool, because you couldn't necessarily bring in an established audience like X Men fans, but would instead need to convince people to take a chance on something that sounds ludicrous.
posted by Kevin Street at 3:43 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
No results? Wow. Lobo is the first thing I thought of after reading this post, because he was created to be the same kind of character as Deadpool, albeit about nine years earlier. Deadpool even made fun of him once or twice. Both of them were intended to be ridiculously over the top exaggerations of what was considered to be "cool" in comics at the time, that somehow took off and became incredibly popular. The major difference is that Deadpool lives in (and makes fun of) the regular Marvel universe, while Lobo has his own domain in outer space filled with silly action tropes and dolphin cults. A Lobo movie would be a harder sell than Deadpool, because you couldn't necessarily bring in an established audience like X Men fans, but would instead need to convince people to take a chance on something that sounds ludicrous.
posted by Kevin Street at 3:43 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
The problem with SUPERJESUS isn't that there is no precedent for it, or even that it can't be interesting. It's that I have exactly no faith at all that Snyder is able to portray it in a way that will go beyond HE'S LIKE JESUS, SEE! because I have seen all of his movies (except Suckerpunch) and fervently gesticulating at a theme is as far as he ever gets.
FWIW, the original Christopher Reeve movie absolutely pushed that theme: His spaceship was a crib that resembled a manger, he finally gains his powers 30 years after he arrives on earth, as a 3yo, Jesus was 33 when he died & was resurrected/went back to being God, his father is shown to be like a god, with all the knowledge of the universe available to him, etc. etc. They were certainly pushing the Superman is Jesus thing in that film.
posted by nushustu at 3:43 PM on February 24, 2016
FWIW, the original Christopher Reeve movie absolutely pushed that theme: His spaceship was a crib that resembled a manger, he finally gains his powers 30 years after he arrives on earth, as a 3yo, Jesus was 33 when he died & was resurrected/went back to being God, his father is shown to be like a god, with all the knowledge of the universe available to him, etc. etc. They were certainly pushing the Superman is Jesus thing in that film.
posted by nushustu at 3:43 PM on February 24, 2016
Superman should symbolically crucify himself by flying into a falling atomic bomb. *
Also be a robot.
Will also accept super and trial by fire against a planet sized pterodactyl.
posted by Artw at 3:47 PM on February 24, 2016
Also be a robot.
Will also accept super and trial by fire against a planet sized pterodactyl.
posted by Artw at 3:47 PM on February 24, 2016
Metafilter: The theme is "Hey, look at this badass thing. Isn't this thing badass? I think it's pretty badass."
posted by mr. digits at 3:51 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by mr. digits at 3:51 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
They were certainly pushing the Superman is Jesus thing in that film.
But for both Snyder and the Reeves movies, it doesn't mean anything. It's not just that they aren't saying something interesting, they aren't saying anything, about Superman or Jesus, by comparing the two.
It's like the worst kind of comedy that makes a reference but no joke about it, expecting you to just laugh with recognition that you got the reference.
posted by straight at 3:57 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
But for both Snyder and the Reeves movies, it doesn't mean anything. It's not just that they aren't saying something interesting, they aren't saying anything, about Superman or Jesus, by comparing the two.
It's like the worst kind of comedy that makes a reference but no joke about it, expecting you to just laugh with recognition that you got the reference.
posted by straight at 3:57 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
"It's like the worst kind of comedy that makes a reference but no joke about it, expecting you to just laugh with recognition that you got the reference."
The Friedberg and Seltzer of superheroes.
posted by Tevin at 3:59 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
The Friedberg and Seltzer of superheroes.
posted by Tevin at 3:59 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
An R-rated Transmetropolitain movie would be pretty sweet. An R-rated Sandman movie might work too, but it really should be an HBO series. Preacher also.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:04 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:04 PM on February 24, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm really scared for that Preacher series at AMC. I hope it works, but the odds are so high against it being a faithful adaptation. Preacher is incredibly dark and bilious, the product of two disturbed young minds - an Irishman and an Englishman trying to do a modern American western that savagely tore into religion, government, pop culture and pretty much everything else they could think of. It wasn't the concept that made Preacher work, but rather the people who created it.
Transmetropolitan and Sandman are two long running series that became hits by building up their own rich, detailed alternate worlds. You could make great movies out of them, but it's a little like dipping into a stream and panning for gold. You've got to pick the right story out of all the stories they did, and build those lush alternate worlds for the audience to get lost in. I would really, really love to see a great Sandman movie, but it would need a great director who understands what made the series work.
posted by Kevin Street at 4:18 PM on February 24, 2016
Transmetropolitan and Sandman are two long running series that became hits by building up their own rich, detailed alternate worlds. You could make great movies out of them, but it's a little like dipping into a stream and panning for gold. You've got to pick the right story out of all the stories they did, and build those lush alternate worlds for the audience to get lost in. I would really, really love to see a great Sandman movie, but it would need a great director who understands what made the series work.
posted by Kevin Street at 4:18 PM on February 24, 2016
I'm really scared for that Preacher series at AMC. I hope it works, but the odds are so high against it being a faithful adaptation.
Can't remember where I read it, but it's guaranteed not be a faithful adaptation. Which isn't surprising, as it's on AMC and It's doubtful they'd be down for the show only being 66 episodes. The characters are there, but the direction they take won't be same. Just make peace with that.
Tell me, do you bleed? I keep imaging Bats asking that question of Wonder Woman and she just looks at him weirdly before beating the crap out of him
I wrote this comment earlier, but just want to emphasize that this imagined scene fills me with glee.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:28 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Can't remember where I read it, but it's guaranteed not be a faithful adaptation. Which isn't surprising, as it's on AMC and It's doubtful they'd be down for the show only being 66 episodes. The characters are there, but the direction they take won't be same. Just make peace with that.
Tell me, do you bleed? I keep imaging Bats asking that question of Wonder Woman and she just looks at him weirdly before beating the crap out of him
I wrote this comment earlier, but just want to emphasize that this imagined scene fills me with glee.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:28 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Ah, here's the article: AMC's Preacher is very different from the comics
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:36 PM on February 24, 2016
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:36 PM on February 24, 2016
I saw a video where Henry Cavill talks to kids about superheroes and I finally got why people are mad about Snyder's Man of Steel and obviously very dark BvS. SUPERHEROES ARE FOR KIDS. I would much rather suffer through my kid watching Christopher Reeves ham it up than explain why Supes broke Zod's neck.
That being said I very much prefer Man of Steel and Nolan's Batmans over the old goofy stuff and for the most part even over The Avengers films.
But man, those kids talking about Superman and Batman with such joy and me knowing that none of them should be allowed into BvS really left a bad taste in my mouth. I guess I have finally found the thing that makes me say "won't somebody think of the children?"
That being said I somehow watched an entire episode of Teen Titans Go and thought I would hate it but really it was very well done. So there's still something out there that's not all superhero doom and gloom. It also had a Bea Arthur joke which sort of blew my mind.
posted by M Edward at 4:40 PM on February 24, 2016
That being said I very much prefer Man of Steel and Nolan's Batmans over the old goofy stuff and for the most part even over The Avengers films.
But man, those kids talking about Superman and Batman with such joy and me knowing that none of them should be allowed into BvS really left a bad taste in my mouth. I guess I have finally found the thing that makes me say "won't somebody think of the children?"
That being said I somehow watched an entire episode of Teen Titans Go and thought I would hate it but really it was very well done. So there's still something out there that's not all superhero doom and gloom. It also had a Bea Arthur joke which sort of blew my mind.
posted by M Edward at 4:40 PM on February 24, 2016
From Brandon Blatcher's link: "We want the show to be fun for regular people without sick sensibilities."
Guess that's it, then.
posted by Kevin Street at 4:42 PM on February 24, 2016
Guess that's it, then.
posted by Kevin Street at 4:42 PM on February 24, 2016
Clerk: "OK, I'll need to check your IDs."
Me: "Here's mine. She's only 16, but it's ok. I'm her legal guardian."
Clerk ponders how to respond to this obvious lie.
Clerk: "Uh, do you have documentation?"
Me: "What, on me? No."
Clerk: "...um, ok. Here's your tickets."
To this day I'm curious if legal guardians carry some kind of ID card listing the children under their care.
You don't need to be their legal guardian. You just have to be over 18. Like, you could have taken your sister and a bus full of other kids. As long as they're accompanied by an adult -- any adult -- it's cool.
posted by Sys Rq at 4:51 PM on February 24, 2016
Me: "Here's mine. She's only 16, but it's ok. I'm her legal guardian."
Clerk ponders how to respond to this obvious lie.
Clerk: "Uh, do you have documentation?"
Me: "What, on me? No."
Clerk: "...um, ok. Here's your tickets."
To this day I'm curious if legal guardians carry some kind of ID card listing the children under their care.
You don't need to be their legal guardian. You just have to be over 18. Like, you could have taken your sister and a bus full of other kids. As long as they're accompanied by an adult -- any adult -- it's cool.
posted by Sys Rq at 4:51 PM on February 24, 2016
I have skipped a majority of this thread just to say that I want an Unbeatable Squirrel Girl movie for myself, my children, and all of humanity.
posted by mfu at 4:59 PM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
posted by mfu at 4:59 PM on February 24, 2016 [11 favorites]
As to codacorolla's suggestion of a Grant Morrison Doom Patrol movie... Morrison is himself a screenwriter, and might be the only one qualified to adapt it. Not sure how much of an audience there'd be for that kind of surrealism, tho.
posted by Kevin Street at 5:17 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Kevin Street at 5:17 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
But for both Snyder and the Reeves movies, it doesn't mean anything. It's not just that they aren't saying something interesting, they aren't saying anything, about Superman or Jesus, by comparing the two.
Yes, like the Jesus pose that Charlton Heston strikes at the end of Omega Man, after being pierced by a spear no less. Although, in that one he brought salvation to humanity through his blood, so it was at least a superficially appropriate image, even if the movie didn't really earn the right to use it.
SUPERHEROES ARE FOR KIDS. I would much rather suffer through my kid watching Christopher Reeves ham it up than explain why Supes broke Zod's neck.
I mean, that sort of gets at it, but I don't accept the premise as stated.
The thing about Superman is that, as Chris Sims often points out, he has to be the shining beacon of hope, the symbol of truth and justice, the Boy Scout, because a dude with those powers who isn't those things is fucking terrifying. Grimdark Superman is a horror villain, not a superhero.
Alan Moore understood this, and this idea is kind of the whole deal with Watchmen, particularly Dr. Manhattan. But not just Dr. Manhattan, because you also get a look at how fucked up it would be for other superhero archetypes to operate with ordinary human flaws within an imperfect human society like our own. The movie failed to convey any of this, despite rewriting the ending in a way that Dr. Manhattan is directly portrayed to the world as a horror monster, which is why it sucked.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:21 PM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
Yes, like the Jesus pose that Charlton Heston strikes at the end of Omega Man, after being pierced by a spear no less. Although, in that one he brought salvation to humanity through his blood, so it was at least a superficially appropriate image, even if the movie didn't really earn the right to use it.
SUPERHEROES ARE FOR KIDS. I would much rather suffer through my kid watching Christopher Reeves ham it up than explain why Supes broke Zod's neck.
I mean, that sort of gets at it, but I don't accept the premise as stated.
The thing about Superman is that, as Chris Sims often points out, he has to be the shining beacon of hope, the symbol of truth and justice, the Boy Scout, because a dude with those powers who isn't those things is fucking terrifying. Grimdark Superman is a horror villain, not a superhero.
Alan Moore understood this, and this idea is kind of the whole deal with Watchmen, particularly Dr. Manhattan. But not just Dr. Manhattan, because you also get a look at how fucked up it would be for other superhero archetypes to operate with ordinary human flaws within an imperfect human society like our own. The movie failed to convey any of this, despite rewriting the ending in a way that Dr. Manhattan is directly portrayed to the world as a horror monster, which is why it sucked.
posted by tobascodagama at 5:21 PM on February 24, 2016 [8 favorites]
and fervently gesticulating at a theme is as far as he ever gets.
Either you really don't care to see the pretty obvious thematic elements in his films, or you haven't watched them. That statement is ridiculous either way. The guy isn't shooting for Citzen Kane, but he does put together well made films.
posted by P.o.B. at 5:35 PM on February 24, 2016
Either you really don't care to see the pretty obvious thematic elements in his films, or you haven't watched them. That statement is ridiculous either way. The guy isn't shooting for Citzen Kane, but he does put together well made films.
posted by P.o.B. at 5:35 PM on February 24, 2016
The only comment on one of those articles is really all that needs to be said:
"NICE FINALLY GET TO SEE SOME PENISES"
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 5:41 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
"NICE FINALLY GET TO SEE SOME PENISES"
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 5:41 PM on February 24, 2016 [2 favorites]
The guy isn't shooting for Citzen Kane, but he does put together well made films.
Not really. The only one of his I really enjoyed was 300 (didn't see SuckerPunch). He's got the bid budget look down, with lots of cgi destruction, busy backgrounds and things exploding. But it's usually thrown together in a haphazard fashion that doesn't feel particularly real.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:43 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
Not really. The only one of his I really enjoyed was 300 (didn't see SuckerPunch). He's got the bid budget look down, with lots of cgi destruction, busy backgrounds and things exploding. But it's usually thrown together in a haphazard fashion that doesn't feel particularly real.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 6:43 PM on February 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
An R-rated Transmetropolitain movie would be pretty sweet.
Too late. This Presidential election is us living in Spider's world.
posted by Sangermaine at 7:14 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
Too late. This Presidential election is us living in Spider's world.
posted by Sangermaine at 7:14 PM on February 24, 2016 [7 favorites]
I said well made, not good. With the exception of Watchmen which is a good film, and probably his best. He likes to pick low hanging fruit but it looks like it's working and he puts butts in seats. I was bored seeing Superman's origin story again. I don't really want to see Doomsday, Zod, or even Luthor anytime soon.
I think Max Landis has some pretty great ideas as far as what would make great Superman films
posted by P.o.B. at 7:51 PM on February 24, 2016
I think Max Landis has some pretty great ideas as far as what would make great Superman films
posted by P.o.B. at 7:51 PM on February 24, 2016
madajb: "Does anyone pay attention other than teenagers worrying about being carded*?"
Yes. Ratings aren't the end-all, by any means. If I've seen a movie already I can use my personal experience to judge whether or not to show the movie to my elementary-school aged sons. But if I haven't seen a movie, and am unfamiliar with the source material (if there is source material), ratings help me decide if its a watch-with-the-kids thing. Ratings are what led me to decide to wait till after the kids went to be to watch Kick Ass, which my wife rented based on commercials that made it look like a fun goofy superhero movie, instead of watching it together. It's wonderful that you don't use them and all, but I don't use tampons, left-handed scissors, or hair relaxer; that doesn't mean those things are without value.
madajb: "*When did this become a thing?"
I can't say exactly, but I remember being carded when I went to see Total Recall, so at least 26 years ago.
Kevin Street: "CTRL +F LOBO"
I would watch the absolute fuck out of a properly done movie version of Lobo's Paramilitary Christmas Special (that's Santa Claus that Lobo's fighting).
posted by Bugbread at 6:06 AM on February 25, 2016
Yes. Ratings aren't the end-all, by any means. If I've seen a movie already I can use my personal experience to judge whether or not to show the movie to my elementary-school aged sons. But if I haven't seen a movie, and am unfamiliar with the source material (if there is source material), ratings help me decide if its a watch-with-the-kids thing. Ratings are what led me to decide to wait till after the kids went to be to watch Kick Ass, which my wife rented based on commercials that made it look like a fun goofy superhero movie, instead of watching it together. It's wonderful that you don't use them and all, but I don't use tampons, left-handed scissors, or hair relaxer; that doesn't mean those things are without value.
madajb: "*When did this become a thing?"
I can't say exactly, but I remember being carded when I went to see Total Recall, so at least 26 years ago.
Kevin Street: "CTRL +F LOBO"
I would watch the absolute fuck out of a properly done movie version of Lobo's Paramilitary Christmas Special (that's Santa Claus that Lobo's fighting).
posted by Bugbread at 6:06 AM on February 25, 2016
R-Rated Superhero Stories Are Inherently Revisionist - Why the R-rated BATMAN V SUPERMAN is so weird.
posted by Artw at 6:12 AM on February 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Artw at 6:12 AM on February 25, 2016 [3 favorites]
Drastic: "Maybe the success of Deadpool will finally convince a studio to greenlight Del Toro's Mountains Of Madness movie.
Not so sure about the new studio demand for wisecracking fourth-wall-breaking shoggoths though."
Maybe if they make the shoggoth sassy, gay, and black?
posted by Samizdata at 9:15 AM on February 25, 2016
Not so sure about the new studio demand for wisecracking fourth-wall-breaking shoggoths though."
Maybe if they make the shoggoth sassy, gay, and black?
posted by Samizdata at 9:15 AM on February 25, 2016
ryanrs: "I've had notarized papers allowing my Mother to take my daughter across the Canada-US boarder.
Yeah, but do you take those papers with you to the movies?"
Well, for a while, back when I was married, since my underaged sister in law and I used to spend a lot of time together, my mother in law would periodically give me signed papers acknowledging me as a valid person in case of medical emergencies that I kept on hand in my wallet.
posted by Samizdata at 9:36 AM on February 25, 2016
Yeah, but do you take those papers with you to the movies?"
Well, for a while, back when I was married, since my underaged sister in law and I used to spend a lot of time together, my mother in law would periodically give me signed papers acknowledging me as a valid person in case of medical emergencies that I kept on hand in my wallet.
posted by Samizdata at 9:36 AM on February 25, 2016
TheWhiteSkull: "Man-Thing, if it had been written by Junji Ito, directed by Takashi Miike."
Ahhhhhhhh geez.
(I would watch it, then enjoy the nightmares afterward, I suppose.)
posted by Samizdata at 9:37 AM on February 25, 2016
Ahhhhhhhh geez.
(I would watch it, then enjoy the nightmares afterward, I suppose.)
posted by Samizdata at 9:37 AM on February 25, 2016
Tevin: "The problem with SUPERJESUS isn't that there is no precedent for it, or even that it can't be interesting. It's that I have exactly no faith at all that Snyder is able to portray it in a way that will go beyond HE'S LIKE JESUS, SEE! because I have seen all of his movies (except Suckerpunch) and fervently gesticulating at a theme is as far as he ever gets."
I used to be willing to cut Snyder impressive amounts of fanboy slack. We're talking tectonic plate sized amounts.
Then he had Superman kill Zod.
Nano-amounts now, possibly pico-amounts.
(I am sorry, but in my headcanon, the main attribute of Superman is that HE. DOES. NOT. KILL. EVER.)
posted by Samizdata at 9:41 AM on February 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
I used to be willing to cut Snyder impressive amounts of fanboy slack. We're talking tectonic plate sized amounts.
Then he had Superman kill Zod.
Nano-amounts now, possibly pico-amounts.
(I am sorry, but in my headcanon, the main attribute of Superman is that HE. DOES. NOT. KILL. EVER.)
posted by Samizdata at 9:41 AM on February 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Brandon Blatcher: "Ah, here's the article: AMC's Preacher is very different from the comics"
Then don't call it Preacher. Find something else. That's like saying "We're shooting a movie called Aquaman. See it's about this guy running a milkshake stand in Death Valley...." or "We're working on a treatment called The Life of Nikola Tesla. It's about the trials and tribulations of a medic during World War II who's part of a wacky group of special commandos behind enemy lines..."
posted by Samizdata at 9:47 AM on February 25, 2016
Then don't call it Preacher. Find something else. That's like saying "We're shooting a movie called Aquaman. See it's about this guy running a milkshake stand in Death Valley...." or "We're working on a treatment called The Life of Nikola Tesla. It's about the trials and tribulations of a medic during World War II who's part of a wacky group of special commandos behind enemy lines..."
posted by Samizdata at 9:47 AM on February 25, 2016
"Oh, and Nikola is also sassy, black and gay!"
posted by Samizdata at 9:47 AM on February 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Samizdata at 9:47 AM on February 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
tobascodagama: "I mean, that sort of gets at it, but I don't accept the premise as stated.
The thing about Superman is that, as Chris Sims often points out, he has to be the shining beacon of hope, the symbol of truth and justice, the Boy Scout, because a dude with those powers who isn't those things is fucking terrifying. Grimdark Superman is a horror villain, not a superhero."
See Miracleman.
posted by Samizdata at 9:49 AM on February 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The thing about Superman is that, as Chris Sims often points out, he has to be the shining beacon of hope, the symbol of truth and justice, the Boy Scout, because a dude with those powers who isn't those things is fucking terrifying. Grimdark Superman is a horror villain, not a superhero."
See Miracleman.
posted by Samizdata at 9:49 AM on February 25, 2016 [2 favorites]
The thing about Superman is that for some people he's a known character, a particular person, and for a lot of people he's just a concept. For them, a Superman story is just, "What do I think a guy might do with Superman's powers," rather than "What do I think Clark Kent / Kal El would do in this situation." There's a reason Watchmen worked so much better with original characters than it would have as a revisionist take on Blue Beetle, Captain Atom, and The Question.
But this is Hollywood, who gave us a RDJ Victorian Batman movie and called it "Sherlock Holmes," so I shouldn't expect any better, except that watching Chris Evans bring Steve Rodgers to life tricks me into thinking maybe it could be better.
posted by straight at 11:21 AM on February 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
But this is Hollywood, who gave us a RDJ Victorian Batman movie and called it "Sherlock Holmes," so I shouldn't expect any better, except that watching Chris Evans bring Steve Rodgers to life tricks me into thinking maybe it could be better.
posted by straight at 11:21 AM on February 25, 2016 [1 favorite]
"Oh, and Nikola is also sassy, black and gay!"
Sweet Jesus, please tell me that Tidus' character arc in Kimmy Schmidt season 2 is him successfully writing, directing, and starring in a breakout Nikola Tesla musical that re-imagines him as a WWII medic.
posted by codacorolla at 11:47 AM on February 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
Sweet Jesus, please tell me that Tidus' character arc in Kimmy Schmidt season 2 is him successfully writing, directing, and starring in a breakout Nikola Tesla musical that re-imagines him as a WWII medic.
posted by codacorolla at 11:47 AM on February 25, 2016 [5 favorites]
No results? Wow. Lobo is the first thing I thought of after reading this post, because he was created to be the same kind of character as Deadpool, albeit about nine years earlier.
Is Lobo still mega popular? Or just one of those things from the '90s people fondly remember? (Pre-Nu52 Lobo, not metrosexual Lobo?).
Incidentally Bleeding Cool makes a good argument that if DC/WB wants an R-rated, mid-budget film then Hitman works really well.
posted by Mezentian at 12:33 AM on February 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Is Lobo still mega popular? Or just one of those things from the '90s people fondly remember? (Pre-Nu52 Lobo, not metrosexual Lobo?).
Incidentally Bleeding Cool makes a good argument that if DC/WB wants an R-rated, mid-budget film then Hitman works really well.
posted by Mezentian at 12:33 AM on February 26, 2016 [1 favorite]
Mezentian: "Is Lobo still mega popular? Or just one of those things from the '90s people fondly remember? (Pre-Nu52 Lobo, not metrosexual Lobo?)."
The only Lobo I'm familiar with is the early 90s Bisley Lobo.
Wikipedia:
posted by Bugbread at 3:25 AM on February 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
The only Lobo I'm familiar with is the early 90s Bisley Lobo.
Wikipedia:
In September 2009, Warner Bros. announced that Guy Ritchie would direct a live-action adaptation featuring the comic book character. Variety described the premise: "Lobo is a seven-foot tall, blue-skinned, indestructible and heavily muscled anti-hero who drives a pimped out motorcycle, and lands on Earth in search of four fugitives who are bent on wreaking havoc. Lobo teams with a small town teenage girl to stop the creatures."... The studio was aiming for a PG-13 rating from the Motion Picture Association of America.[20]Wait what no. No no no. Lobo is contracted by the Easter Bunny to kill Santa Claus. After punching Santa's eye out in a knife-fight, he then beheads Santa Claus. He does not "team up with a small town teenage girl in a PG-13 movie".
posted by Bugbread at 3:25 AM on February 26, 2016 [2 favorites]
Pre-Nu52 Lobo is the only way to go. But yeah, he's not as popular as Deadpool these days.
posted by Kevin Street at 3:29 AM on February 26, 2016
posted by Kevin Street at 3:29 AM on February 26, 2016
Kinda makes you long for the days when every junk food popcorn movie was 90 minutes so theatres could have more showings. I love the LOTR films, but I can't help but feel it's their fault that we're suffering through all these interminable slogs.
posted by tobascodagama at 12:35 PM on February 27, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 12:35 PM on February 27, 2016
Batman V. Superman to be long, so very long
I just can't imagine seeing this film, unless glowing reviews come out. It sounds like watching it will be a huge chore.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:11 PM on February 27, 2016 [4 favorites]
I just can't imagine seeing this film, unless glowing reviews come out. It sounds like watching it will be a huge chore.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 3:11 PM on February 27, 2016 [4 favorites]
That's actually shorter than I was expecting.
Of course, it will feel so much longer if it sucks.
posted by Mezentian at 1:56 AM on February 28, 2016 [1 favorite]
Of course, it will feel so much longer if it sucks.
posted by Mezentian at 1:56 AM on February 28, 2016 [1 favorite]
Artw: "Batman V. Superman to be long, so very long"
Look, man, you knew it was a Snyder film when you took the mission. I am sorry you dozed off during the briefing, but that ISN'T MY FAULT, SOLDIER! BUCK UP AND FACE THOSE MINUTES LIKE A SOLJUH!
(seriously, it's Zack Snyder. What the blistering green fuck did you expect?)
posted by Samizdata at 1:40 PM on February 28, 2016
Look, man, you knew it was a Snyder film when you took the mission. I am sorry you dozed off during the briefing, but that ISN'T MY FAULT, SOLDIER! BUCK UP AND FACE THOSE MINUTES LIKE A SOLJUH!
(seriously, it's Zack Snyder. What the blistering green fuck did you expect?)
posted by Samizdata at 1:40 PM on February 28, 2016
The only Lobo I'm familiar with is the early 90s Bisley Lobo.
Which had five pretty stl, considering it's a rip-off or "tribute" of Matt Howarth's Ronald Post.
Those Annoying Pay Brothers btw, is one if those comic books I consider unfilmable. Not just for the artwork, but because it would pretty much have to be rated X.
posted by happyroach at 6:59 AM on February 29, 2016
Which had five pretty stl, considering it's a rip-off or "tribute" of Matt Howarth's Ronald Post.
Those Annoying Pay Brothers btw, is one if those comic books I consider unfilmable. Not just for the artwork, but because it would pretty much have to be rated X.
posted by happyroach at 6:59 AM on February 29, 2016
(seriously, it's Zack Snyder. What the blistering green fuck did you expect?)
Expect is a strong word. I definitely hoped, but you're right, it's Snyder and he does have his particular ways (as all director's do).
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:23 AM on March 2, 2016
Expect is a strong word. I definitely hoped, but you're right, it's Snyder and he does have his particular ways (as all director's do).
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 7:23 AM on March 2, 2016
I love the LOTR films, but I can't help but feel it's their fault that we're suffering through all these interminable slogs.
You should probably direct your glare at Cameron; Aliens (even the theatrical version) and Abyss were both really long for actiony-scifi movies, and Titanic is just comically long.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:34 PM on March 17, 2016
You should probably direct your glare at Cameron; Aliens (even the theatrical version) and Abyss were both really long for actiony-scifi movies, and Titanic is just comically long.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 8:34 PM on March 17, 2016
Eh. They were exceptions at the time. I still maintain that PJ normalised the idea of really friggin' long blockbuster films by dominating holiday box offices with them for three years in a row.
posted by tobascodagama at 10:09 AM on March 18, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 10:09 AM on March 18, 2016
Wow, can't say I've ever noticed just how long Aliens is, despite viewing it double digits times. That thing is a masterpeice of pacing.
posted by Artw at 10:14 AM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Artw at 10:14 AM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
I watch a lot of pre-1950s films and I love how economical they are. It's a rare one that lasts as long as two hours and most manage to tell their whole story in 90 minutes. Jackson's King Kong is twice as long as the 1933 version but adds nothing to the original.
posted by octothorpe at 10:56 AM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by octothorpe at 10:56 AM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
Citizen Kane is just under the two hours mark, so if you're going over that you probably want to ask yourself if your movie is Citizen Kane or if you are Orson Welles.
posted by Artw at 11:01 AM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 11:01 AM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
The mention of King Kong reminds me that its problems are exactly the same problems that his Hobbit movies had. Namely, the injection of a bunch of really pointless set pieces to a story that already had precisely as many set pieces as it needed.
posted by tobascodagama at 11:02 AM on March 18, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 11:02 AM on March 18, 2016
I'll watch the PJ Hobbit the day someone releases a 90 minute cut of it.
posted by Artw at 11:05 AM on March 18, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by Artw at 11:05 AM on March 18, 2016 [3 favorites]
(In subjective time I've watched several weeks of it, but I think it was just the first 30 minutes. They never left Bag End.)
posted by Artw at 11:06 AM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
posted by Artw at 11:06 AM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
I can only hope that if Snyder does make Fountainhead movie it'll bomb as much as the Atlas Shrugged movies did.
posted by sotonohito at 11:55 AM on March 18, 2016
posted by sotonohito at 11:55 AM on March 18, 2016
(In subjective time I've watched several weeks of it, but I think it was just the first 30 minutes. They never left Bag End.)
It's fine, you've seen the best part.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:24 PM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
It's fine, you've seen the best part.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:24 PM on March 18, 2016 [2 favorites]
I'd assume that his film will have production values higher than the Sharknado level of the Atlas Shrugged films.
posted by octothorpe at 1:24 PM on March 18, 2016
posted by octothorpe at 1:24 PM on March 18, 2016
Citizen Kane is just under the two hours mark, so if you're going over that you probably want to ask yourself if your movie is Citizen Kane or if you are Orson Welles.
Surely it's much more difficult to be concise and economical? Shouldn't we say, "If you think you can tell your story in under two hours, who do you think you are, Orson Welles?"
posted by straight at 1:25 PM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
Surely it's much more difficult to be concise and economical? Shouldn't we say, "If you think you can tell your story in under two hours, who do you think you are, Orson Welles?"
posted by straight at 1:25 PM on March 18, 2016 [1 favorite]
Maybe it's WWOWD? - though Welles often didn't have a choice there, for instance there isn't a cut of A TOuch of Evil that's over 2 hours but I am pretty sure he would have pushed it out longer.
posted by Artw at 1:31 PM on March 18, 2016
posted by Artw at 1:31 PM on March 18, 2016
At least we have the "Is Snyder attracted to fascistic themes?" argument settled.
posted by Artw at 1:32 PM on March 18, 2016 [4 favorites]
posted by Artw at 1:32 PM on March 18, 2016 [4 favorites]
Kinda like when Brad Bird did Tomorrowland and it turned out to be: What if... Galt's Gulch?
posted by tobascodagama at 2:03 PM on March 18, 2016
posted by tobascodagama at 2:03 PM on March 18, 2016
I'll bet twenty bucks this 15-second Instagram video of Henry Cavill hanging out in Times Square in a Superman T-shirt has more footage of Superman happily grinning than all six hours of Batman v. Superman.
posted by straight at 6:02 PM on March 18, 2016 [3 favorites]
posted by straight at 6:02 PM on March 18, 2016 [3 favorites]
So, it's sitting between London Has Fallen and The Brothers Grimmsby, buy waaaaaay above Fantastic Four.
Harsh.
Possibly fair. I'll only be able to judge.... When will my local video store have a copy in?
And yet 98% of people want to see it. Which, let's be fair, are the real people, who will bootstrap themselves to the cinema to see it.
posted by Mezentian at 2:54 AM on March 23, 2016
Harsh.
Possibly fair. I'll only be able to judge.... When will my local video store have a copy in?
And yet 98% of people want to see it. Which, let's be fair, are the real people, who will bootstrap themselves to the cinema to see it.
posted by Mezentian at 2:54 AM on March 23, 2016
It clawed its way up to 40% since I posted that link, but thars still low enough to say it's a critical bomb. Popcorn may be required for trainwreck.
posted by Artw at 7:01 AM on March 23, 2016
posted by Artw at 7:01 AM on March 23, 2016
If it doesn't make $200 million US this weekend, I think we sensible people who understand how movies work can crow.
If it does meet projections: Aquaman Vs Fountainhead!
posted by Mezentian at 7:09 AM on March 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
If it does meet projections: Aquaman Vs Fountainhead!
posted by Mezentian at 7:09 AM on March 23, 2016 [3 favorites]
I'm guessing 180 opening, with a mediocre 4-week stretch. Probably capping at around 275 to 300.
posted by codacorolla at 8:13 AM on March 23, 2016
posted by codacorolla at 8:13 AM on March 23, 2016
I'm not going to lie:
I want this to do well so Hollywood throws obscene amounts of money at Zack so he can make the 300-style George Washington film he wants to make.
Because I'll see the trailer for that.
posted by Mezentian at 2:58 AM on March 24, 2016
I want this to do well so Hollywood throws obscene amounts of money at Zack so he can make the 300-style George Washington film he wants to make.
Because I'll see the trailer for that.
posted by Mezentian at 2:58 AM on March 24, 2016
Heh. Actual headline found in the wild: Pow! This isn't Batman v Superman. Whack! It's Wonder Woman v Supersexism
posted by Artw at 6:48 AM on March 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
posted by Artw at 6:48 AM on March 24, 2016 [1 favorite]
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posted by Itaxpica at 7:39 AM on February 24, 2016 [15 favorites]