"I've gone through my whole life trying to avoid this moment"
April 12, 2016 9:11 AM   Subscribe



 
Playdoh that's been warmed up.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:13 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


So he stood there with a limp dick the whole time? Come on, that's hardly the full monty is it?
posted by Emma May Smith at 9:35 AM on April 12, 2016 [4 favorites]


These are really charming and funny. Interesting experiment.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:41 AM on April 12, 2016


The internet is magic.
posted by roger ackroyd at 9:50 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


It's not just you. Christ, that was grotesque.

The lesbians, on the other hand, were pretty decent.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 10:13 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


...is it just me or are a lot of the things being said by the gay men really... just... ugh?

Right!? Especially the guy who literally screamed at her vagina.

As a gay man who has never touched a vagina, I like to think I would be more polite about touching someone's vagina.
posted by selenized at 10:14 AM on April 12, 2016 [16 favorites]


This is the most cis thing I've seen all year.
posted by these are science wands at 10:14 AM on April 12, 2016 [47 favorites]


these are science wands: I (cis, so take this as you will) gave Stevie credit for saying "I'm a woman who happens to have a vagina." The rest though, yep.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 10:15 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is such a rich vein to tap into for viral videos. I look forward to the inevitable evolution of the project:

"Straight men perform fellatio for the first time."
"Gay men perform cunnilingus for the first time."
"Lesbian women have a conversation with a straight dude who ISN'T a douche-bag for the first time."
"Vegans try cannibalism for the first time."
"Shut-ins interact with extroverts for the first time."
"Police Officer gets beaten up by an innocent black man for the first time."
posted by wabbittwax at 10:30 AM on April 12, 2016 [79 favorites]


This was really neat both as intended as a body positive celebration of how humans are beautiful in ways that are independent of sexual attraction, but also as a pretty incisively profound demonstration of sexual orientation as a useful model for explaining human sexuality. I mean, at least very few of us here need to be convinced that gay people exist or that being exclusively oriented towards the same sex is not only possible but as intrinsically ok as being exclusively oriented towards the opposite sex, but an awful lot of people do. These videos, perhaps accidentally, in their innocence and sincerity pretty profoundly challenge a lot of the models, both theological and pseudoscientific, commonly used to deny this in a really cool way and while it may not be directly relevant to the vast majority of Mefites, its still pretty neat.

The account of creation in the opening chapters of Genesis is often cited as the lynch pin holding together arguments against the acceptability of same sex unions. In chapter two it describes how in the beginning God made Adam and Eve, a man and a woman. However, it also does something a lot more profound than a lot of people give it credit for. The first two chapters of Genesis describe how God made the heavens and the earth, plants and animals, us, and everything else each separately and independently, but in this second account God takes particular care to describe everything they make as either good or very good. In the Hebrew the repetition of how good or especially good everything is ends up being repetitive in a way that is said to be poetic and that only serves to highlight the one flaw in creation that God describes as not good, but is sure to fix right away.
[Genesis 2:18] "The Lord God said, It is not good for the man to be alone. I will make a helper suitable for him.”
Indeed, in Genesis the suitable partner that God provided for Adam was Eve, a woman, and for at least most someone of the opposite sex is a suitable partner just like in the account. However, as these videos make pretty abundantly clear, for many someone of the opposite gender simply isn't a suitable partner, and to say that the opposing genders is what is important about this story is a pretty obviously twisted and superficial reading of it. For gay people, obviously the only suitable partner is another gay person of the same gender, and its pretty easy to explain how a gay partner is suitable for a gay person in all of the important ways that a straight partner is for a straight person. Yet, the necessary consequence of homophobic doctrine is the one thing that God declared to be not good about their creation, and even set about fixing, loneliness. If successful, the fruit of this teaching is to deprive gay Christians of the ability to give their love and companionship to someone they love deeply. In this way homophobic doctrine declares to be good the only thing that God declared to be not good, and is thus hard to not see as fundamentally set against the work of God while taking Genesis seriously.

The reason why there are so many bigoted preachers who are so desperate to see being gay as a choice is that they necessarily have to in order to retain a worldview that wouldn't doom gay people to an unaccountable loophole in creation. If orientation were a valid model then they would have to explain why God would throw gay people under the bus like this, so they pretend that gay people are really as straight as anyone else but only acting gay for some nefarious purpose. What I've seen change the hearts and minds of bigoted Christians is just experience with healthy happy gay couples challenging the idea that gayness is intrinsically disordered with lived truth, but I will remember these videos the next time I come across someone whose homophobia requires there to be no truly gay people.
posted by Blasdelb at 10:32 AM on April 12, 2016 [39 favorites]


As a gay man who has never touched a vagina, I like to think I would be more polite about touching someone's vagina.

I nominate this for sentence of the day. Also, I realize that my experience isn't everyones, but most people I know have had experiences of all kinds, even if just on the early-teen "you show me yours" level. YMMV.
posted by jonmc at 10:38 AM on April 12, 2016 [5 favorites]


The straight dudes, though. uh. Straight dudes are so weird, yo. It's just another dude's body.

Are you talking about the straight men touch another penis for the first time video? Because if so I'm puzzled by your reaction.

"I think a lot of my friends when they see this video will think it's a joke, right? But the reason I did this is to prove that it's not a big deal."

"It's not actually a big deal."

"I hope everyone will just be open to the fact that, outside of it being a sexual organ, it's just another body part, which is human. We have it."

"That's the purpose of this, to get people thinking outside of the box." (*snicker*)

"Just go with your instincts and do what you want to do."

I mean, all three basically have little monologues at the end that articulate a laid-back, mature take on the "experiment."

Am I missing something? Was it the sound effects you found appalling? Straight dudes love sound effects. I'm making some right now.
posted by echocollate at 10:40 AM on April 12, 2016 [5 favorites]


"Straight men perform fellatio for the first time."

Usually, when it comes to "fist time" videos it's wise to mentally append "today" to the description.

"Ben tries anal for the first time!" is better read as "Ben tries anal for the first time today!"

Also, gay for pay is it's own genre.

The problem I have with these videos is they shouldn't even exist.

If we (and by "we" I mean the US) weren't a bunch of prudes, normal sexual exploration would have resolved this for the vast majority of people. Now, I am not suggesting that some didn't have a bright idea of where they would end up regarding sex and gender, but for many, I'm pretty sure the lines were a bit blurry during the formative years.

Take away the sexual element, and just from a clinical standpoint, or a nurturing standpoint, making it to adulthood without touching the genitals of both sexes seems weird to me, but then perhaps I had a stranger upbringing than most.
posted by cjorgensen at 10:48 AM on April 12, 2016


Also, gay for pay is it's own genre.

In my experience the vast majority of guys in gay-for-pay videos are actually just gay, or bi. A lot of porn is made in Montreal, and a fair bit used to be made in Toronto. I've seen a lot of guys in the Broke Straight Boys vein who I'd seen the week before dancing shirtless with their hands in the air.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 10:51 AM on April 12, 2016 [7 favorites]


"Usually, when it comes to "fist time" videos it's wise to mentally append "today" to the description."

Best typo I've seen today.
posted by the webmistress at 10:53 AM on April 12, 2016 [33 favorites]


There's a gay for pay porn studio in my unassuming little Northern California hometown! It got the same kind of cheery write-up in the local paper you'd see for the grand opening of a new bakery or pet store or something.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:55 AM on April 12, 2016 [20 favorites]


the webmistress: ""fist time""

Maybe the app will be included in the next iOS update.
posted by chavenet at 10:57 AM on April 12, 2016 [10 favorites]


fist time waits for no one
posted by wabbittwax at 10:58 AM on April 12, 2016 [3 favorites]


At the end of it I think they realized that it wasn't a big deal, sure. But the beginning was just, "Dudes, get over yourselves." Which they did.

The sounds effects were cool though. Pew pew.
posted by echocollate at 11:01 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


The clit is in the hood.

~mic drop
posted by Thorzdad at 11:12 AM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


I've seen a lot of guys in the Broke Straight Boys vein who I'd seen the week before dancing shirtless with their hands in the air.

As if they just didn't care? Scandalous.
posted by the uncomplicated soups of my childhood at 11:29 AM on April 12, 2016 [11 favorites]


Indeed, in Genesis the suitable partner that God provided for Adam was Eve, a woman, and for at least most someone of the opposite sex is a suitable partner just like in the account. However, as these videos make pretty abundantly clear, for many someone of the opposite gender simply isn't a suitable partner, and to say that the opposing genders is what is important about this story is a pretty obviously twisted and superficial reading of it.

I just recently read Matthew Vines' God and the Gay Christian, which is a really outstanding book from someone who is conservative about their approach to the Bible--very evangelical in theology--but does a very good job pointing out that when you take the context and language seriously, the Bible doesn't say at all what many Christians were taught it says about homosexuality. In addition to what you point out, Vines notes that what makes Eve a suitable partner for Adam is clearly how much she is like him. It is their similarities as humans that matters, not their differences because of gender.

The man said,

“This is now bone of my bones
and flesh of my flesh;
she shall be called ‘woman,’
for she was taken out of man.”


It's one of those things that is obvious once you see it. For the story to work, Eve had to be female so that the human race could continue. But she didn't have to be female to be a suitable companion for Adam. She just had to be human--flesh of his flesh, bone of his bone.

Anyway, give Vines' book to your conservative Christian friends who are willing to think about this issue, because he will give them a lot to chew on.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 12:00 PM on April 12, 2016 [19 favorites]


I'm kind of excited now. Not aroused, just...like I would like to meet other people's body parts, too!
posted by Omnomnom at 12:26 PM on April 12, 2016


"Anyway, give Vines' book to your conservative Christian friends who are willing to think about this issue, because he will give them a lot to chew on."
Matthew Vines is great! For people who are interested in what he has to say, but don't want to order and read a whole book, this really engaging lecture just about covers it. I borrowed the argument from the same source he did, Gagnon's book, which is older and less engaging but a bit more technical in a way I suspect you might appreciate.
posted by Blasdelb at 12:34 PM on April 12, 2016 [2 favorites]


...is it just me or are a lot of the things being said by the gay men really... just... ugh?

Is it totally terrible that i winced really hard the first time i clicked on that video because i knew exactly what was coming, and exactly what kind of guys they'd put in there/that they'd say awful shit?

I mean we've already had a "gay dudes being misogynistic in a very specific to gay dudes way" thread get nuked, but it's absolutely A Thing.

I feel like the entire premise of the video is sort of playing off that semi-stereotypical OMG SARLACC PIT reaction too? Like that the viewer would approach it assuming it was coming with the intention to laugh at it?

It felt more like a bad joke video than a wow-thats-interesting video to me in premise, i guess. Especially since i had cold opened that one from a link without the context of a post like this when i first saw it, and it was being shared as such.
posted by emptythought at 1:02 PM on April 12, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm bi, and now I feel like I just go around touching everything.
posted by kyrademon at 1:07 PM on April 12, 2016 [9 favorites]


I'm bi, and things like this have never made any damn sense to me and for years and years I figured everyone must be lying to themselves at least a little? But nope. Oh well. Time to make a video where bisexual people don't touch anything and it's just awkward the whole time.
posted by Mizu at 1:32 PM on April 12, 2016 [31 favorites]


but it's absolutely A Thing

I saw that video back when it first got posted, and yeah, I had to stop watching because I feel like I know some of those people and how it would go and the the punchlines many people would walk away with would be "vaginas are gross" and "gay men are screeching queens."
posted by Candleman at 1:33 PM on April 12, 2016 [1 favorite]


...is it just me or are a lot of the things being said by the gay men really... just... ugh?

A little more empathy and politeness might have gone a long way (and I don't doubt the existence of gay misogyny), but I think that works the other way here too.

One of the opportunities sexuality offers is the way you get drawn closely into the fundamental aspects of other people -- all of them certainly different from you in some ways -- including the details of their bodies. If you're gay, the opportunity to explore the broad differences usually presented by sex is not quite as naturally presented to you, only the differences presented within your sex.

And when I think about it, anyway, bodies are a little weird. Often beautiful in the way that life is often beautiful (and humans are beautiful!) but also sometimes just kindof gross in the way that life can be gross, too. I'm used to my gender's typical characteristics because I grew up with a typical body of that gender to explore. I'm now used to typical bodies of the opposite gender at a general level, but I can remember when they could seem foreign and strange even while compelling. I can even remember times when my own body has seemed foreign and strange.

So seeing people find bodies they're less familiar with foreign and strange... that seems pretty human to me.

And it's human to have to learn to see other people's humanity even when presented with foreign/strange. While I may not love all of the reactions I see here, I think one can see them as occurring as part of that process.
posted by wildblueyonder at 2:12 PM on April 12, 2016 [2 favorites]


So seeing people find bodies they're less familiar with foreign and strange... that seems pretty human to me.

Nah. This really is just garden variety gay cis male misogyny. I'm a gay dude, literally nothing those guys said in that video was surprising, shocking, or out of the ordinary.
posted by feckless fecal fear mongering at 2:36 PM on April 12, 2016 [9 favorites]


I'm not sure what I was expecting, but that was better than I thought it would be. I nearly noped out cause I imagined it was gonna be sort of poking fun of people in a "you're not really gay if you can touch this" kind of way.
posted by WalkerWestridge at 3:39 PM on April 12, 2016


Oh, I bet Aleks is going to have some explaining to do.

– "Where were you?"
"Oh, just at a video shoot."
– "A video shoot? And were there women there?"
"Yeah, sure ... maybe ..."
– "And did these women ... touch you?"
"What? No! Well yes, a bit. But it wasn't like that honey, I swear. It just happened so fast!"
– "Oh, Aleks. It's the lying I can't stand."
posted by Joe in Australia at 8:24 PM on April 12, 2016


I have to say Aleks and Stevie being basically chill about this whole thing really made the videos worth watching. You really get the reactions of the people involved which is what you're sort of looking for.
posted by jessamyn at 8:43 PM on April 12, 2016 [5 favorites]


I don't know, his facial expressions are half the fun.

My favorite bit was at 1:05 when she's explaining how she used "to stuff the turkey necks with corn on the cob" and is making these hand motions.
posted by Joe in Australia at 8:55 PM on April 12, 2016


I have to say Aleks and Stevie being basically chill about this whole thing really made the videos worth watching. You really get the reactions of the people involved which is what you're sort of looking for.

I ended up finding the host's reactions more interesting than the people who were doing the touching, actually. They were really chill and seemed like they would be interesting in person (with clothes on, obviously).
posted by Dip Flash at 4:13 AM on April 13, 2016


Yeah, Stevie and Aleks seem like really cool people.

I watched all the videos and found it interesting that in the straight guy touching penis one, one of the guys is blurred out so it wouldn't threaten his employment. I wonder how much of that was known ahead of time. Like did he participate and then after the fact get concerned about his job? Or did he say he would participate, but couldn't be recognizable and they decided to go with it because of what it says about the society we're in? (This is probably covered somewhere, I should go look.)

Was anyone else caught off guard by the boob grab in the straight women touching vagina one? My first thought was, "You're in here to touch one part of her, that doesn't give you full license," but I'm probably the least equipped to judge how appropriate it was.

Are we just giving up on the whole vulva thing? I've been using that word with my two girls, but is it just a lost cause at this point?

So he stood there with a limp dick the whole time? Come on, that's hardly the full monty is it?

I feel like this maybe would have crossed a line? At least one in my head? Like, it's a sexual organ, but this isn't meant to be a sexual experience, you know.
posted by ODiV at 8:45 AM on April 13, 2016


Are we just giving up on the whole vulva thing?

That was my question too, but I didn't want to be in internet nitpicker about it. At one point Stevie says "You can touch anything you want, just don't go inside me" (which sounds sensible) and I was like "But then that's just touching a vulva right?"

I think this is going to be one of those "language evolves" things where vagina is going to come to mean not just the internal bits but the entire inside/outside space down there. Like how a bannister is both a balustrade and a bannister nowadays? I mean that's a larger thing in the world of sex-and-genitals generally, that you can touch a penis (or see a penis) without there necessarily being a sexual context but if you're touching/seeing a vagina (in the "it's the inside part" definition) and not a doctor/yourself, that's almost sex by definition. So, language evolves and one of the things I liked about these videos is you could sort of talk about those topics without feeling like the videos were trying to push you in a specfic way besides "hey people and bodies, neat huh?"

And yeah I felt a little odd about the boob grab but I assumed those folks were friends and knew each other.
posted by jessamyn at 11:16 AM on April 13, 2016


« Older Bringing Gender Equality to the Apocalypse   |   individualistic and subjective, tailored to... Newer »


This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments