Now this is a BUS
August 3, 2016 10:58 AM   Subscribe

China has created a Transit Elevated Bus or "straddle bus" and just unveiled a working prototype in Qinhuangdao, Hebei province. Be sure to scroll down for the video of it in action.
posted by agatha_magatha (58 comments total) 12 users marked this as a favorite
 
This One Weird Bus that Truck Drivers Totally Hate
posted by snuffleupagus at 11:00 AM on August 3, 2016 [11 favorites]


Pretty cool, but it's no Big Bus.
posted by condour75 at 11:12 AM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


Report: 98 Percent Of U.S. Commuters Favor Public Transportation For Others

Honestly this thing is just an admission that they have shit infrastructure planning. It's terrible.

Note: they're by no means alone in having shit infrastructure planning.
posted by GuyZero at 11:14 AM on August 3, 2016 [3 favorites]


Similar to a subway

Worst journalism of the day
posted by chavenet at 11:15 AM on August 3, 2016 [7 favorites]


This is clearly unsafe. How can a responsible commuter expect to be able to use the rampcar in front of them to launch their vehicle over such a tall bus?
posted by gurple at 11:16 AM on August 3, 2016 [9 favorites]


> This One Weird Bus that Truck Drivers Totally Hate

The 11Foot8 bridge just called and wants to remind people in tall vehicles that "trucks can't duck".
posted by mosk at 11:20 AM on August 3, 2016 [7 favorites]


Actually, this thing sounds like it would require dedicated road infrastructure to run on. I mean, it's only good for two-lane highway, first off—no more, no less. Second, the shoulders of the road need to be designed to carry its weight. Also, no low bridges (obviously).

It's hard for me to think of this as a practical transportation solution. Sure is rad, though.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 11:20 AM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


My favorite buses ever are still the Adelaide ones, though. Get on at an express station out in the 'burbs. The bus rolls up onto some concrete rails that run through the park, locks in, and the the driver rockets up to 130kph or so for the blast into the city. Once you're in town, it gets off the rails and becomes a normal bus again. Works great!

Also, they have station-to-doorstep service late at night if you're leaving the clubs in the city and trying to get back to your house, with signs politely asking those who overdid it at the bar to ask the driver to stop if they need to vomit, so that they can go hurl outside rather than doing it all over the inside of the bus.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 11:25 AM on August 3, 2016 [18 favorites]


[elevator music orthogonally intensifies]
posted by hawthorne at 11:25 AM on August 3, 2016 [3 favorites]


The bus needs a second small tunnel on its right side. For the bike lane.
posted by Kabanos at 11:27 AM on August 3, 2016 [15 favorites]


From what I read, it does have a dedicated track that it must follow. Seems to me more like a glorified tram than a bus -- just one that doesn't block cars from using the tram tracks simultaneously.
posted by brambleboy at 11:31 AM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


I wish I could find more information describing how the designers expect this thing to work in real-world infrastructure/traffic environments, or even IF that was a consideration or it's more of a thought experiment/stunt prototype. But I could see situations where it might work (e.g. parallel to expressways) and could provide advantages over the traditional solutions in those situations (light rail, BRT). That said, to my non-traffic engineer eyes, it seems like their should be monorail solutions would address the small footprint problem in a manner similar to this approach while eliminating the problem of how to ensure safe and efficient interaction with regular passenger vehicles.
posted by drlith at 11:33 AM on August 3, 2016


man, China is not about half-measures
posted by indubitable at 11:45 AM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


Meanwhile, in America.
posted by poe at 11:49 AM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


Can it actually turn, or is it constrained to moving along a straight line?
posted by acb at 11:50 AM on August 3, 2016


In the digital mockup at the end of the article, it does turn (and overtakes slower cars while turning!).

This only makes sense in a world where most of the cars are gridlocked in traffic 99% of the time, honestly.
posted by subdee at 11:58 AM on August 3, 2016


Criminals can drive under the bus and break through the ceilingfloor and then ride free. Poor design.
posted by user92371 at 12:03 PM on August 3, 2016 [7 favorites]


Honestly this thing is just an admission that they have shit infrastructure planning. It's terrible.


No, this is a way to get the benefit of a double-decker highway, without building the second deck.

I could see this justify itself in China.
posted by ocschwar at 12:03 PM on August 3, 2016


Wouldn't it just be easier to get rid of the cars?
posted by lowtide at 12:13 PM on August 3, 2016 [6 favorites]


It also only makes sense in places where you want to install a transit system that can only move users along a wide and congested highway, have have room to build stations above said highways, no low bridges that would block the vehicles, and walkable destinations within a few blocks of the highway.

It's a compromise that doesn't make any sense if you think about it for more than a moment. It has most of the disadvantages of a semi-dedicated busway, and none of the advantages.

And yet the (typically-anti-China) media is all over this for some reason -- and it's going to have a lasting impact by derailing conversations about building real transit systems elsewhere.

[By the way, BRT works great if you build the proper infrastructure for it. While most BRT projects turn into glorified bus routes, TransMilenio and the Guangzhou system are both hugely successful.]
posted by schmod at 12:15 PM on August 3, 2016 [8 favorites]


Oh man, I'd never heard of the Adelaide O-Bahn Busway before, that's amazing!

(Also, previously.)
posted by fragmede at 12:19 PM on August 3, 2016 [9 favorites]


This only makes sense in a world where most of the cars are gridlocked in traffic 99% of the time, honestly.

Yes, I agree that this is exactly what Atlanta needs.
posted by hydropsyche at 12:29 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


Criminals can drive under the bus and break through the ceilingfloor and then ride free. Poor design.

Even worse: They will drill a large hole through the ceilingfloor and then all the passengers' money will pour out, right into their waiting moneybags.
posted by Kabanos at 12:30 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


This only makes sense in a world where most of the cars are gridlocked in traffic 99% of the time, honestly.

Chinese traffic can be atrocious. There are also a number of other considerations that make this useful in a Chinese context and perhaps not so useful in a North American or European context.

Really, this is a option to replace subways at lower cost (it even says so in the article!). In China, where many subway lines are being built currently, it may well make sense. It is cheaper, since you don't need to dig or tunnel. Stations, in particular, would cost many times less. It also has the advantage of requiring less time to access than a subway so is more useful for shorter trips (and Chinese subways in particular often involve long walks within stations). Also, Chinese subways are often very crowded, so this vehicle, carrying 1200 people at once, may make more sense than a bunch of subway cars (or LRT cars).

It also only makes sense in places where you want to install a transit system that can only move users along a wide and congested highway, have have room to build stations above said highways, no low bridges that would block the vehicles, and walkable destinations within a few blocks of the highway.

Many Chinese cities have wide (4, 6, or more lane) boulevards throughout. This could definitely work in those contexts. Not many low bridges either (trains are on very high elevated bridges and highway overpasses are pretty high too) and taking down a few old bridges if required is much less of a big deal in China.
posted by ssg at 12:34 PM on August 3, 2016 [4 favorites]


I wonder how much training it takes for those bus drivers to get over instinctive "OMG I'm about to slam into/run over that car!" reactions. Or maybe it's easier to ignore the lowly earth-goers from that lofty height than I imagine it is.
posted by Greg_Ace at 12:43 PM on August 3, 2016


Aw great, but this ruins one of the greatest automotive vices, riding the shoulder. Now how will jerks pass me on the right when I want to drive the speed limit in less safe conditions?
posted by mccarty.tim at 1:05 PM on August 3, 2016


Wouldn't it just be easier to get rid of the cars?

That would be the practical, realistic, and responsible thing. So, obviously, it's a non-starter.
posted by entropicamericana at 2:25 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


all they need now is a few giant electromagnets mounted to the bottom so they can pick up unsuspecting cars and carry them off

like eagles of the freeways
posted by indubitable at 2:25 PM on August 3, 2016 [17 favorites]


"That would be the practical, realistic, and responsible thing. So, obviously, it's a non-starter."

And replace cars with what?
posted by I-baLL at 2:27 PM on August 3, 2016


And replace cars with what?

Oh, you know, crazy unproven technologies like buses, trains, bicycles, et cetera.
posted by entropicamericana at 2:43 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


Adelaide O-BahnThis is awesome, and the hard (engineering) work has already been done for the Adelaide system. We could totally use these in LA. I wonder why this isn't more common....I guess maybe you can get most of the benefit, if not the same top speeds, by just building a separate busway without the guidewheel tracks.
posted by snuffleupagus at 2:44 PM on August 3, 2016


I like the part in the video where it encountered a large traffic pileup and everyone had to evacuate. I was kind of hoping that giant hydraulic arms would have popped out the front and moved the cars out of the way.
posted by JJ86 at 2:46 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


I guess maybe you can get most of the benefit, if not the same top speeds, by just building a separate busway without the guidewheel tracks.

Not even a middling 70 mph (top speed of O-Bahn cited on Wikipedia)? I realize LA's freeways are shit, but that should still be unimpressive.
posted by indubitable at 2:50 PM on August 3, 2016


I don't think the Orange (BRT) Line goes that fast, despite having a separated transitway. Freeway buses move at freeway speeds, but the nominal speed limit is 65 mph in the city. Or 55. And traffic is often slower.
posted by snuffleupagus at 3:02 PM on August 3, 2016


"Oh, you know, crazy unproven technologies like buses, trains, bicycles, et cetera."

Yeah, but the comment you responded to was asking "Why build this bus system instead of just getting rid of cars?" which doesn't make sense to me. Also, buses, trains, and bicycles can't replace cars in places with a lot of people and a lot of space since different people need to go to different places at different times.
posted by I-baLL at 3:19 PM on August 3, 2016


I don't understand what you find nonsensical. The straddle bus or whatever they are calling it is unproven technology that doesn't really do anything well except not inconvenience drivers. Taking a lane from automobiles and making it bus only would be cheaper, easier, and more effective.

Buses, trains, and bicycles are all more efficient than automobiles at moving people in places with a lot of people, as the image I posted so clearly indicates.
posted by entropicamericana at 3:30 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


And replace cars with what?

Pickup trucks and SUVs, obviously. That way you can run a very low-to-the-ground public transit system where people lie down on flat trolleys that run underneath and between the wheels of city traffic.
posted by sfenders at 3:37 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think it's pretty cool. In Chicago, when I've spent time there, the elevated tracks serve kind of a similar purpose of allowing mass transit and car traffic to occupy the same space (sort of) but the tracks lead to a feeling of darkness and narrowness on the roads underneath. This wouldn't feel that way. On the other hand, it seems to me that it would be really hard for drivers to get accustomed to a big vehicle swooping down on them and passing overhead, and I'm curious about how the designers plan to deal with the intersections where the straddle bus turns and some car traffic doesn't.

On the other hand, "This might be hard to get used to" is a bad reason to resist innovation. I'll be interested to see how this develops.
posted by not that girl at 3:44 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


Many Chinese cities have wide (4, 6, or more lane) boulevards throughout. This could definitely work in those contexts.

Long, straight sections of track are only one part of necessary rail transit infrastructure. How do you do turnouts with the track literally straddling an active boulevard? What about sidings to get disabled trains out of the way and crossovers to reverse direction (and you will need crossovers because running trains in a continuous circle is a really stupid idea)
posted by RonButNotStupid at 3:52 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


Turnouts, sidings and crossovers would be handled the same way they are now with street integrated LRT. Or for that matter how do street cars handle these issues?

One of the big advantages I can see is stations can be built to access the unit from both sides simultaneously. Passengers can enter on one side and exit the other. Which would reduce loading and unloading time. And would mitigate somewhat people standing in the entryways causing congestion at the doors even when there is open space in the centre of a car.

Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The: "It's hard for me to think of this as a practical transportation solution. Sure is rad, though."

It's niche but then so are subways.

drlith: "That said, to my non-traffic engineer eyes, it seems like their should be monorail solutions would address the small footprint problem in a manner similar to this approach while eliminating the problem of how to ensure safe and efficient interaction with regular passenger vehicles."

Monorail track is going to be more expensive; have more expensive and difficult track maintenance; and impose an unattractive hulking blight on the street they run down.
posted by Mitheral at 3:58 PM on August 3, 2016


Plus you'd get Homer driving it.
posted by Greg_Ace at 4:01 PM on August 3, 2016


It's niche but then so are subways.

Subways are multi-billion-dollar backbones of civic infrastructure.
posted by GuyZero at 4:25 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


Monorail track is going to be more expensive; have more expensive and difficult track maintenance; and impose an unattractive hulking blight on the street they run down.

HEY! Monorails have put Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook on the map, by gum!
posted by entropicamericana at 5:11 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


This only makes sense in a world where most of the cars are gridlocked in traffic 99% of the time, honestly

So, Beijing. And I don't know if you guys have heard of that place but they already have trains, bikes and literal part time car bans. I'm pretty sure the answer to their traffic problems is not some ridiculously obvious and trivial solution off the top of your head.
posted by the agents of KAOS at 5:25 PM on August 3, 2016 [9 favorites]


right, it's obviously being more accommodating to automobiles
posted by entropicamericana at 5:29 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


If you can do this, why not skip to Alternate Reality Zeppelins operating near street level?
posted by mubba at 8:01 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


Cool, can't wait for the first batch of M-rated Liveleak videos that this will bring.
posted by turbid dahlia at 9:07 PM on August 3, 2016


Beijing is the size of Houston with 20 to 30 million people. Car sales are severely restricted in the city (if I recall correctly the most draconian was around 2011 when only 50,000 new registrations were allowed). Cars are completely banned from roadways according to license plate numbers. Large trucks are banned from five AM to eleven PM on most major roads. It has dedicated bicycle lanes on almost every road with more than two lanes. It has one of the largest busing systems in the world with double decker, double length and triple length buses. It has dedicated bus lanes. It has one of the largest subway systems in the world which continues to grow faster than any subway system in the history of the world. It has dedicated pedestrian bridges and tunnels. All of the above are crowded all the time. Pretty much everything that has been suggested here as the "sensible" or practical alternative not only has been tried but is still being expanded, and gridlock continues to get worse. The straddle bus design does have shortcomings that would make it inappropriate for many cities, but for sprawling ringed and gridded Beijing it is the most practical traffic solution I have seen and may actually put a dent in gridlock and hopefully end three hour commutes that at least a million people are going through there daily.
posted by wobumingbai at 9:08 PM on August 3, 2016 [12 favorites]


One approach to traffic congestion could be for employees to live in the same building in which they work oh wait
posted by turbid dahlia at 9:11 PM on August 3, 2016


interaction with regular passenger vehicles
You mean "cars". Check your assumptions. In Beijing there used to be more bicycles (up to 9 million of those, versus 5.6 million cars now), motor cycles and scooters than cars. Cars take up an absurd amount of space on the road considering most are carrying just one person.
posted by Autumn Leaf at 9:16 PM on August 3, 2016 [2 favorites]


It's late and I'm already cranky (two transit threads on a day when I'm this busy?) but I think professional transit planner Jarrett Walker has a good take on this ridiculous gadgetbahn:

As I said before, I think that especially in wealthy countries, this thing is mostly useful as a parable, whose message is: Look how much money people will spend on infrastructure whose sole purpose is to avoid taking any space from motorists.


(Read the whole blog post; it's excellent and provides half a dozen reasons why this is ridiculous.)
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 9:35 PM on August 3, 2016 [4 favorites]


Regardless of whether your assumption is correct or not, Autumn Leaf, how does replacing cars with bicycles/motorbikes change the fact that a faster-moving mass transit vehicle sharing the roadway with slower-moving independent private vehicles must some how overcome the inevitable right-of-way conflict when the bus wants to go straight and a private vehicle wants to cross the tracks to turn or exit the roadway, or conversely when the bus goes around a corner at an intersection and part of the private vehicle traffic is continuing straight? In some ways, I think replacing cars with bicycles would make the potential for conflict all the more greater. That's what I'm asking about. This is a problem with many tram systems, and the more they share the roadway with other vehicles (OF ANY KIND) the greater a problem it is, and the slower their average speed it. Tramways involve a tradeoff between reduced speed and reduced infrastructure costs, and there's are a lot of people who argue that tramways are really not a viable future development for mass transit. Aside from the increased passenger capacity, how is this not a glorified tram type system?
posted by drlith at 9:49 PM on August 3, 2016


Seems like they're wasting a lot of effort to avoid inventing hoverbuses.
posted by blue_beetle at 9:51 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


drlith: "the inevitable right-of-way conflict when the bus wants to go straight and a private vehicle wants to cross the tracks to turn or exit the roadway, or conversely when the bus goes around a corner at an intersection and part of the private vehicle traffic is continuing straight?"

With traffic control devices like signal lights and gates. Seriously this is something that happens every day in for example Calgary. It's not like the elevated buses are going to be whipping along completely oblivious to the regular traffic.

And the same conflict is also handled where bike lanes continue straight and motorists want to turn. Admittedly less well, motorists tend to cut bikes off because they aren't as visible. Can't see that being a problem with these huge vehicles.
posted by Mitheral at 10:17 PM on August 3, 2016 [1 favorite]


the inevitable right-of-way conflict when the bus wants to go straight and a private vehicle wants to cross the tracks to turn or exit the roadway, or conversely when the bus goes around a corner at an intersection and part of the private vehicle traffic is continuing straight?

If only there were a system of lights that we could use to regulate traffic.
posted by ActingTheGoat at 11:31 PM on August 3, 2016


It really looks like a boondogle, one that will end up with a couple of prototypes, maybe a demonstration system somewhere, but no copycats and no export market. Most likely the first few vehicles will break down or get into accidents, fail to be repaired, and the whole thing quietly shut down and unpersoned to avoid loss of face by its proponents.
posted by Blackanvil at 8:56 AM on August 4, 2016


> like eagles of the freeways

That has been (half) baked. The BosWash Landliner proposal eats conventional buses and deposits them at their destination.

Hat tip to Jalopnik
posted by Monochrome at 12:54 PM on August 4, 2016


China’s Transit Elevated Bus is a Money-making Scam designed to Fleece Investors


A number of Chinese state media outlets claim the entire TEB project is a scam. They noted the TEB project is being funded by peer-to-peer lending and not by bank loans. In this form of funding, an online company matches potential investors with borrowers, promising high interest rates for investors.

Media noted other peer-to-peer investing platforms in China have proven to be scams. They cited Ezubao, a peer-to-peer lending scheme based in Anhui, that was shut down this year after the government arrested 21 of its officers.

posted by GuyZero at 3:40 PM on August 8, 2016 [1 favorite]


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