"Buckle up."
August 17, 2016 8:00 AM   Subscribe

With his campaign chair Paul Manafort mired in scandal and polls showing Arizona and Georgia on the brink of going blue, an increasingly agitated Donald Trump has launched a major shake-up of his political staff. Reportedly infuriated by talk of being "tamed," the Republican nominee has rejected Manafort's moderating sway in favor of Breitbart News CEO Steve* Bannon, an alt-right firebrand who Bloomberg has called "the most dangerous political operative in America." Washington Post reporter Robert Costa foresees a vicious campaign in the making, a prospect further suggested by rumors that disgraced Fox News founder Roger Ailes will be advising Trump ahead of next months' debates with Hillary Clinton (whose odds of a landslide are currently on par with that of any Trump victory). posted by Rhaomi (2445 comments total) 102 users marked this as a favorite
 
Oh god, it only took two weeks for that Onion article to come true. That is amazing.
posted by maryr at 8:04 AM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


Nice thread.

Needs more Hamilton but whatever, it's a good thread I guess.
posted by Tevin at 8:04 AM on August 17, 2016 [24 favorites]


So, il Douche is now getting a fair bit of money into his campaign. But, he isn't spending any of it. $0 in TV ads. At this point he knows he's going to lose; he's campaigning in Connecticut, for God's sake.

He's not going to spend it, is he? He's going to dump it all into a Trump 'charity' post-election. Then he can bleed it dry by charging crazy consulting fees from his for-profit entities.

Dude never stopped grifting.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:04 AM on August 17, 2016 [50 favorites]


not even a full five days! jeebus!
posted by numaner at 8:04 AM on August 17, 2016


I feel for Onion writers at the moment.
posted by peacheater at 8:04 AM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]




You know the discourse is headed downhill when Manafort is considered the moderating voice.

What are the odds on Reince Priebus cutting all GOP funds to Trump's campaign to protect the down ticket now?
posted by PenDevil at 8:06 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]




Bannon hates Paul Ryan, so this is not a move that's going to help relations with the RNC. Forget a pivot; this is Trump doing donuts in the parking lot, holding his upraised middle finger out the window.
posted by EarBucket at 8:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [103 favorites]


I feel for Onion writers at the moment.


It's not surprising that shows like Parks & Rec and Hamilton that are earnest to the core have become so popular as we see the detached irony of the 90s and early 00s draw its last, labored breath all around us.
posted by C'est la D.C. at 8:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [71 favorites]


Imagine trying to write satire
posted by The Whelk at 8:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [39 favorites]


I think it's odd that the role of Fox News and Breitbart in Trump's camp isn't getting bigger play. I mean...it's a new standard for "news" outlets getting involved in campaigns, isn't it? A natural progression, perhaps, that right-wing media ditches its illusion of impartiality and just dives straight into the political process..
posted by touchstone033 at 8:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


When I spoke with him afterward, [the late Andrew Breitbart) described Bannon, with sincere admiration, as the Leni Riefenstahl of the Tea Party movement.

Say what you will about all his very horrible qualities, but Andrew Brietbart knew his Nazis, so this is really saying something.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 8:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [76 favorites]


Green Party's Jill Stein tied with Harambe, losing to Deez Nuts in new poll

For some reason that headline made me flash back to the California Gray Davis gubernatorial recall election, where you had like 135 wackadoo candidates.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:11 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Maybe we could start including references to that other musical about the Founding Fathers?
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:11 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Truly there is no problem that can't be solved with more Steves.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:11 AM on August 17, 2016 [27 favorites]


It's not surprising that shows like Parks & Rec and Hamilton that are earnest to the core have become so popular as we see the irony of the 90s and early 00s draw its last, labored breath all around us.

Oh yeah, we sure are. Irony is totally passé.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:11 AM on August 17, 2016 [28 favorites]


We are all Joel and the Bots now, and we are neck deep into DEEEEEEEEP HUURRRRTTTTIIIINNNNNGGGG!
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 8:12 AM on August 17, 2016 [40 favorites]


NPR reported this morning, in the same story as it reported the Bannon thing, that the Trump campaign seemed to be looking more like a real campaign -- that Trump spoke twice from the teleprompter in the last few days, that the campaign was starting to buy ad time, etc.

So I'm real confused - is Bannon coming in to reverse the trend of the last few days, or is Bannon the cause of the trend? Is Bannon going to move the campaign towards a more traditional "structure" (ad buy) but allow Trump to continue being Trump ("go negative")?

Halp?
posted by devinemissk at 8:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm worried the Trump campaign will destroy American Democracy. Trump's loser talk about how the election is going to be rigged is hugely corrosive and only going to get worse. And it's a sure bet that if the election is close, they're going to sue left and right and muddle the waters for months, maybe years. I'm not sure America can withstand that, particularly if Trump keeps up with the violent rhetoric.

Bush / Gore 2000 was hugely damaging to America's confidence in elections. But the situation was resolved more or less according to the law, with Gore contesting and conceding relatively swiftly. (Election was Nov 7, concession was Dec 12, election certified Jan 6). The country moved on. I don't see any evidence the Trump folks will be as gracious, or that they are concerned about the long lasting damage it would do to our country to go all out.

It's not enough for Clinton to win; she has to win with an uncontestable landslide.
posted by Nelson at 8:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [40 favorites]


Really Trump is staying ahead of the cynical news media by making so many gaffes they can't possible cover them all. It's an unanticipated strategy, and poll shows it's working.
posted by maryr at 8:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


The aforementioned NPR report.
posted by devinemissk at 8:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Not that I dislike a new thread (yay, kinder loading on mobile), but when Rhaomi said they were going to make a new post, I thought it would be about the Aetna/Humana Obamacare merger extortion plot.
posted by tclark at 8:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Around April, I think, I put some work into breaking a story for what would be a fictional novel-length satire of the Trump campaign. There's maybe 15,000 words in that document?

And every single one of them has been out-written by reality.
posted by schadenfrau at 8:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


.$0 in TV ads.

This actually just changed yesterday - the campaign has started buying a little bit of ad time.
posted by Going To Maine at 8:15 AM on August 17, 2016


> Maybe we could start including references to that other musical about the Founding Fathers?

I think "could someone PLEASE open a window?" would be a fine refrain to come back to in these threads.
posted by Tevin at 8:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


maryr: Oh god, it only took two weeks for that Onion article to come true. That is amazing.

Which one? This one -- Mentally Unbalanced Man Still Waiting For The Right Trump Comment To Incite Him (Aug. 12) only took days to come true -- Man’s ‘unusual fixation’ with Lebanese neighbors led to killing, Tulsa police say (Aug. 16)
posted by filthy light thief at 8:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


the campaign has started buying a little bit of ad time.

"I'm Donald Trump, and I approve this message: Fuck you."
posted by Etrigan at 8:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


Thanks for the new thread, Rhaomi!
posted by zarq at 8:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


When Paul fucking Manafort, PR flack to global tyrants and mass murderers, isn't slimy enough to be your campaign manager, something's wrong.
posted by backseatpilot at 8:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [38 favorites]


The Aetna thread is here.
posted by devinemissk at 8:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Every night, Paul Ryan goes to bed thinking "It really can't get any worse, can it?"
Every morning, Paul Ryan wakes up, sees the notifications on his phone, and for a few fleetingly joyful moments imagines life as the top rated Mercedes-Benz salesman in Kenosha County.
posted by splen at 8:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [109 favorites]


tclark: "Not that I dislike a new thread (yay, kinder loading on mobile), but when Rhaomi said they were going to make a new post, I thought it would be about the Aetna/Humana Obamacare merger extortion plot."

zombieflanders has you covered one door down.
posted by Rhaomi at 8:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Heeeeey it's cool people think that this means Trump is done but please consider that if Trump alters course by steering directly into the alt-right white-nationalist fascist camp, and then ends up actually winning by some miracle and/or October Surprise, that is way more terrifying as he will see it as justification for every awful thing he has said/done and a repudiation of any sensible thing he has said/done.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 8:18 AM on August 17, 2016 [35 favorites]


The best part is that Manafort is still involved, but in different ways. Trump just hired more scummy people to augment his campaign. The fact that Roger Ailes will be advising Trump actually scares me.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:18 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I'm worried the Trump campaign will destroy American Democracy. Trump's loser talk about how the election is going to be rigged is hugely corrosive and only going to get worse. And it's a sure bet that if the election is close, they're going to sue left and right and muddle the waters for months, maybe years. I'm not sure America can withstand that, particularly if Trump keeps up with the violent rhetoric.

Yeah, I'm thinking when he loses by massive margins in lots of ostensibly competitive states it takes the wind out of those sails a bit.

Also, I imagine the RNC long knives really come out in earnest for him after the election.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:18 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


zombieflanders has you covered one door down.

What I get when I just follow the link from the previous thread. Cheers!
posted by tclark at 8:18 AM on August 17, 2016


So they're already thinking past the lost election toward a new flashier hatey-er reinvention of Breitbart? I hope they name it "Banner, Ailes, and Trump: Super Heavy Information Team" or BATSHIT for short.
posted by p3t3 at 8:19 AM on August 17, 2016 [88 favorites]


"Vicious campaign in the making" -- sure, but here's my dumb-but-sincere question: Is anyone still listening? Is there a pool of voters who can still turn this around for The Donald?
posted by Capt. Renault at 8:19 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Joel and the bots...

Man, for like two months I have had this fantasy of a Hillary ad in which she and two robots are watching a Trump campaign rally MST-style and wisecracking at the cray cray stuff.

It's the perfect metaphor.
posted by spitbull at 8:20 AM on August 17, 2016 [37 favorites]


Got back from seeing family in North Carolina this weekend, where I kept getting sat at the more racist end of the table, and even they seemed lukewarm on Trump. I don't know who they're voting for, because the constant haranguing about my party identification was too much to bear already, but they freely acknowledged that he was a pretty terrible candidate. I can't imagine them voting for Hillary, but I can hope that they'll stay home out of frustration.
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 8:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]




Is there a pool of voters who can still turn this around for The Donald?

I have my doubts about that. Maybe I simply lack imagination, but I'm having trouble conceiving of what negative things Trump could say about Clinton that (a) he hasn't already said and (b) would appeal to the people not already following him despite his downward spiral.
posted by tocts at 8:23 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


staying ahead of the cynical news media by making so many gaffes they can't possible cover them

The gaffe gallop!
posted by spitbull at 8:24 AM on August 17, 2016 [28 favorites]


Guys, guys - I woke up with a panic attack this morning. I had a flashback to the whole Bush Gore thing, that awful moment when I realized that an incompetent buffoon was going to be our president. It was like a bona fide political PTSD attack, I literally (yes literally) was nauseated for a few hours. I feel so stressed today!

I was working last night but in the background heard Trump's racist speech and it hit me that bad and wooden as it was, some of the theme lines were more coherent Fox tropes taking shape. I'm pretty worried that he might be panicking enough to listen to and follow the counsel of Bannon and Ailes, who are both evil incarnate, but also media geniuses. I'm pretty worried that they or Assange (or Putin) have some horrible shoes to drop in the eleventh hour. I'm pretty discouraged by the intensifying Hillary hate and general misogyny. I'm worried we are all getting too confident, the media is going to want to foment more horse-race drama for their money.

I'm so askeered, hope me!

On the other hand, vacation tomorrow and I am going to try to take a break from news. (I feel the facial tics already) You all need to promise you'll watch things carefully so events don't careen out of control while I take a break!
posted by madamjujujive at 8:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [49 favorites]


roomthreeseventeen: Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

He'll just ask Putin and the Russian hackers to inform him directly.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


Bush / Gore 2000 was hugely damaging to America's confidence in elections. But the situation was resolved more or less according to the law, with Gore contesting and conceding relatively swiftly.

I get what you are saying, but the perfectly clear Constitutional process for deciding a disputed Presidential election was abrogated. The body of legal precedent, iirc, was that States have great latitude in how they conduct their elections, and the legal process within Florida of hashing out recounts and certifying electors seeemd well within that authority. If Gore had won the recount, it seems likely that the Florida Legislature would have refused to certify those electors, and the thing would have been decided in the House of Representatives.
posted by thelonius at 8:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Maybe I simply lack imagination, but I'm having trouble conceiving of what negative things Trump could say about Clinton that (a) he hasn't already said and (b) would appeal to the people not already following him despite his downward spiral.

"She doesn't really like Hamilton that much."
posted by Etrigan at 8:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [18 favorites]


Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

Who needs the CIA when you've got master of disguise James O'Keefe
posted by Existential Dread at 8:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [55 favorites]


I feel for Onion writers at the moment.

The Onion has been killing it lately: I Spend Every Waking Moment Holding This Fragile Facade Of A Person Together, And I’ll Do The Same For America
posted by 1970s Antihero at 8:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [28 favorites]


Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

I just... yep, my Bag of Holding apparently does contain more evens which I may strew behind me as I can't.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [69 favorites]


Adele Stan: Make No Mistake: The Koch Brothers Are Helping Donald Trump
They may not wish to get all of that Trumpy dirt—the calls to violence, the obvious racism and misogyny, the invitation to Russia for cyber­espionage on his own country—on their manicured hands, but they’re keen to turn out the voters needed to maintain Republican control of both houses of Congress. And there’s no way to turn out those voters without helping the quisling from Queens.

People who live in Koch World have a sweet deal. If you’re a politician in the brothers’ orbit, you’re likely dependent on the ground operation of Americans for Prosperity—or other Koch astroturf outfits, such as Libre Initiative or 60 Plus—to get your voters to the polls. If you’re an employee of any of the multitudes of Koch­linked organizations that dot the Republican landscape, you’re dependent on them for your paycheck. And if you’re the Koch brothers, seeking to hold onto your congressional majority, you’re dependent on your people seeing to it that Republican voters are not so turned off by Donald Trump that they fail to show up to vote for your favored candidate for either the House or the Senate.
[...]
But clearly, after the catastrophic week Trump gave himself, this cleanup has not been enough. So this week, a Koch-­founded organization placed before viewers of Fox News Sunday one of its own, presenting herself as an enthusiastic Trump supporter.
posted by zombieflanders at 8:29 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

This reminds me of something I can't stop thinking. On the television show Scandal, there's a super powerful, super secret, pretty evil spy organization called B613 that is basically above the law, answerable to no one, and prides itself on existing to protect the Republic, no matter the moral cost. Basically, it serves to protect democracy from itself.

It's an interesting idea for a fictional organization on a show that's about Power, but it's often, sadly, poorly executed and has made for some Not Good television.

However, the Trump campaign keeps making me wish, even if only a few seconds at a time, that it existed.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 8:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


SIT DOWN, DON
posted by praemunire at 8:32 AM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


I'm going to be disappointed if Lin-Manual Miranda doesn't team up with the Book of Mormon/South Park guys to do "Trump the Musical" after all this. By my read this is just the beginning of Act 2 right?
posted by bitdamaged at 8:32 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


He plays the violence.
posted by DanSachs at 8:34 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Capt. Renault: "Vicious campaign in the making" -- sure, but here's my dumb-but-sincere question: Is anyone still listening? Is there a pool of voters who can still turn this around for The Donald?

The only person who could possibly turn this around is Trump himself. If the campaign were able to put a leash on their candidate to stop him from saying anything but the most innocuous, sane-sounding policy-related soundbites from now until election day, I think many Republicans would change their minds about voting for them. He has over 2 months. Lots of people would probably forgive or forget most of the things he has said and done up until now if he started appearing more Presidential.

He's diving into the mud instead. Which can be a winning strategy, especially with Republican voters. But it hasn't worked particularly well for him since the primaries ended.
posted by zarq at 8:34 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


I Know Trump's New Campaign Chairman, Steve Bannon. Here's What You Need To Know. — Ben Shapiro, The DailyWire. Abstract: He really hates Steve Bannon. Observation: If Andrew Breitbart was Trotsky, then Bannon is Lenin. Or maybe Stalin.

Bonus Game Of Thrones ref: "Bannon knows that in the game of thrones, you win or die. And he certainly doesn’t intend to die. He’ll kill everyone else before he goes."
posted by octobersurprise at 8:35 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]



Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

by contrast I have always had complete faith in them
posted by Postroad at 8:35 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


From the PPP polling article:

Just 19% of Trump voters grant that if Clinton wins the election it will be because she got more votes, while 71% say that it will just be because the election was rigged. More specifically 40% of Trump voters think that ACORN, which hasn't existed in years, will steal the election for Clinton to only 20% who don't think it will, and only 20% who are unsure.

*screeching intensifies*
posted by Mayor West at 8:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [25 favorites]


zombieflanders: Adele Stan: Make No Mistake: The Koch Brothers Are Helping Donald Trump
If this campaign is about Trump, Trump loses. If this becomes about Hillary, her corruption, if it becomes about Supreme Court judges, if it becomes about her dismal record as secretary of state, then I think he has a shot of winning.
Hah, good luck getting Donnie to stay on-topic and keep his messages, stories and tweets from being about Donnie. Oh, and a summary of Hillary's tenure as Secretary of State:
Historians will probably consider Clinton significantly more successful than run-of-the-mill secretaries of state such as James G. Blaine or the long-serving Cordell Hull, but don’t expect to see her on a pedestal with Dean Acheson or John Quincy Adams anytime soon.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


I apologize if this has already been linked, but I couldn't find it.

In 1988, when Dan Rather was grilling George HW about the Iran/Contra scandal, Roger Ailes orchestrated this (6:40 for the smackdown) to shut down Dan Rather and get some points for the VP. Roger Ailes knows what he's doing in crushing an opponent and now with the Breitbart twins bringing their chan tactics over, I'm afraid the debates are going to be painful to watch.
posted by Sophie1 at 8:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


It goes without saying, that Shapiro's picture of Andrew, is, uh, enthusiastic.
posted by octobersurprise at 8:37 AM on August 17, 2016


/me Googles "days until the election" and gets back the answer 82. Cries. Starts wondering if a medically induced coma is possible.
posted by octothorpe at 8:37 AM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]


Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

To be fair, Cheney did the same thing. But it turns out if you set up intelligence services beholden only to you, and stock them with sychophants, they tell you exactly what you want to hear, like "Iraq has WMDs go get 'em".
posted by dis_integration at 8:37 AM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


We rescheduled our annual long vacation to include a family visit in the Carolinas from late October to just after Election Day and god, I am not sure what I want to be back in the US at that time, but too late now! (I'll have already submitted my absentee ballot by then, so whew.)
posted by Kitteh at 8:38 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump soaks the Koch Zero. Sweet. Schadenfreude.
posted by effluvia at 8:39 AM on August 17, 2016


significantly more successful than run-of-the-mill secretaries of state such as James G. Blaine

Blaine? Blaine? James G. Blaine? The continental liar from the State of Maine?
posted by octobersurprise at 8:39 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


Reminder: ACORN, which was founded in 1970, closed shop in 2010. SIX YEARS AGO. Because of bullshit conservative hack propaganda.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:39 AM on August 17, 2016 [32 favorites]


It's interesting that Trump seems to be making an enemy of the three-letter agencies. Could be a dangerous game for him if he or any of his staffers does anything seriously illegal in their dealings with Russia.
posted by Mitrovarr at 8:40 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Octothorpe, statistically that means we have 16.4 more mega-threads at least to go! Stock up on popcorn, people.
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 8:41 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


I hereby predict:

a) GOP congressmen will leak the CLASSIFIED emails they've just been given. No investigation will occur.

b) Trump himself will leak CLASSIFIED information he's about to be given. No investigation will occur.

c) Despite a) and b), we're about to spend another three weeks hearing about email, and "She's just not trustworthy".

Who's in on my bet?
posted by Dashy at 8:45 AM on August 17, 2016 [81 favorites]


Good thread, but uh, I too am getting concerned about the distinct lack of Hamilton-related titles in election threads.
posted by corb at 8:45 AM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


Perhaps the HamilTrash can provide a pool of handy post titles for those not versed in the HamilVerse(s).
posted by filthy light thief at 8:50 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Or I guess you could just read through the Genius annotated lyrics.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:51 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


That election rigging stuff is genuinely frightening when coupled with Trump's no-so-subtle call for violence against Clinton. I wonder if the second Clinton presidency will see a wave of right-wing terrorism like the first one did. It doesn't seem crazy to think we might see another Oklahoma City.
posted by Sangermaine at 8:51 AM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


Starting to actually see the Manafort/Ukraine connection pop up in high visibility news sources.
posted by Twain Device at 8:51 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Finally we polled on Texas secession. Overall 26% of voters would support leaving the United States to 59% who want to stay, and 15% who aren't sure either way. Among Trump voters support for secession goes up to 37%, with only 49% opposed to exiting. If you look at the Presidential race in Texas only among voters who are opposed to seceding from the United State, Clinton leads Trump 54/41. But that's offset by Trump's 72/20 advantage with the secession crowd. If Clinton is elected President this fall, the Trump voters really want out- in that case 61% say they'd support seceding from the United States, to only 29% who would stick around.

I would say, don't let the door hit you in the ass if this weren't so sad and depressing.
posted by stargell at 8:53 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Donald: "No, don't worry, Paul. You still have a place in the campaign. Look! You're still Chairman! Chairman of the Vodka Wolves!"
Paul: "Vodka Wolves what are-"
*Trump kicks Paul Manafort out of the helicopter. He lands in a clearing filled with wolves wearing Russian furry hats. Some have broken vodka bottles clutched in their slavering dogs.*
Donald: *Cannot be heard over the sound of howling and helicopter engines*
posted by robocop is bleeding at 8:56 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


It's not surprising that shows like Parks & Rec and Hamilton that are earnest to the core have become so popular as we see the detached irony of the 90s and early 00s draw its last, labored breath all around us.

Speak for yourself - cynical, detached irony is all that is getting me through this right now.
posted by ryanshepard at 8:56 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Perhaps the HamilTrash can provide a pool of handy post titles for those not versed in the HamilVerse(s)

If we're going into Hamilton I think the John Adams Rap that got cut will provide some post titles. I was going to quote from the lyrics, got as far as:
An open letter to the fat
Arrogant
Anti-charismatic
National embarrassment
Known as President John Adams

The man's irrational. He claims that I'm in league
With Britain in some vast international intrigue?
Bitch, please!
You wouldn't know what I'm doin'
You're always goin' berserk
But ya never show up to work
Give my regards to Abigail
Next time you write about my lack of moral compass
At least I do my job up in this rumpus
Then I realised that if I was going to try and quote the parts that made good thread titles and were relevant to the election I'd quote almost the whole thing. (And for those of you who don't yet know Hamilton, remember that that's one of the numbers that didn't even make the cut).
posted by Francis at 8:57 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


"A Monarchy by a Sidewind. You make him Vindex Injuriarum. The People will not like The Jurors of our Lord the President -- nor the Peace of our Lord the President, nor his Dignity. His Crown will be left out. Do not wish to make the Constitution a more unnatural monstrous Production than it is. -- The British Constitution a three legged Stool. If one legg is longer than another, the Stool will not stand."

-John Adams, Notes, July, 15, 1789.
posted by clavdivs at 8:58 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


How do I join the Vodka Wolves?
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:58 AM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]


It's interesting that Trump seems to be making an enemy of the three-letter agencies. Could be a dangerous game for him if he or any of his staffers does anything seriously illegal in their dealings with Russia.

On the other hand, this should make it easier to make song parodies of this election. Was considering using "We Didn't Start The Fire" or "The Mickey Mouse Club Theme" as bases.
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:59 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Is anyone still listening? Is there a pool of voters who can still turn this around for The Donald?

Do not underestimate the number of people who really really dislike or hate Hillary Clinton. If Trump can somehow convince some of them that he could be a reasonable choice, we are in trouble. We have been very lucky so far that he is fundamentally incapable of not shit-stirring the basest of the Republican base.
posted by maryr at 9:00 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Finally we polled on Texas secession

I don't know why this keeps coming up since secession is unconstitutional.
The Union of the States never was a purely artificial and arbitrary relation. It began among the Colonies, and grew out of common origin, mutual sympathies, kindred principles, similar interests, and geographical relations. It was confirmed and strengthened by the necessities of war, and received definite form and character and sanction from the Articles of Confederation. By these, the Union was solemnly declared to 'be perpetual.' And when these Articles were found to be inadequate to the exigencies of the country, the Constitution was ordained 'to form a more perfect Union.' It is difficult to convey the idea of indissoluble unity more clearly than by these words. What can be indissoluble if a perpetual Union, made more perfect, is not?
...
When, therefore, Texas became one of the United States, she entered into an indissoluble relation. All the obligations of perpetual union, and all the guaranties of republican government in the Union, attached at once to the State. The act which consummated her admission into the Union was something more than a compact; it was the incorporation of a new member into the political body. And it was final. The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration or revocation, except through revolution or through consent of the States.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:03 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


if he or any of his staffers does anything seriously illegal in their dealings with Russia.

Hell, or if any of them have ever used the Internet to mediate their dealings with anything else of a more -- shall we say -- "personal" nature.

/tries not to imagine Trump's browser history
posted by spitbull at 9:03 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I realized that the reason why these threads are addictive is because this election season is like watching a plane heading slowly toward the WTC and realizing, with relief, that it seems like it is going to miss. The brave lady passenger aboard the plane has grabbed hold of the controls and maybe everything will end well and something is right with the country after all.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:04 AM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


And then you realize that 30% of the passengers on the plane were in on the damn plot all along.
posted by spitbull at 9:06 AM on August 17, 2016 [32 favorites]


I don't know why this keeps coming up since secession is unconstitutional.

Since when has that mattered?
posted by rp at 9:06 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


The brave lady passenger aboard the plane has grabbed hold of the controls and maybe everything will end well and something is right with the country after all.

If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct. We will continue on our current course.
posted by ryanshepard at 9:06 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Do not underestimate the number of people who really really dislike or hate Hillary
Exactly, there is not a polling history for the situation. As much as Candidate Trump seems to be alienating significant demographics some are subsets that could have low turnout.

And the debates, two annoying people that I for one can not particularly bear to listen, but one that can have entertaining, if wacky, sound bites. Things could switch around so fast, it could even make Trumps head spind (around a full ten times, you know what that means :-)
posted by sammyo at 9:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Metaphor source?: Airport 1975, starring Charleton Heston and Karen Black
posted by ZeusHumms at 9:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I have some questions about contributing campaigns.

- Does anyone know the optimal amount to donate to HFA at a time?
- Does it cost the campaign more money to process small (< $5) donations?

I have limited funds, so I want to maximize their effectiveness.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:11 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


How do I join the Vodka Wolves?

Like the loup garou of legend, you'll need a belt made of wolfskin, like this one. Then you have to engage in a nighttime ritual where you consume a magic potion beneath the light of the moon. Once you finish the entire potion, you'll think wearing a furry hat is a great idea and boom, you're in!
posted by robocop is bleeding at 9:12 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


/tries not to imagine Trump's browser history

oh you think he looks things up?
posted by psoas at 9:12 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


No, this magic potion....
posted by sammyo at 9:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


/tries not to imagine Trump's browser history

it's just Google searches for "Donald Trump" over and over.
posted by davros42 at 9:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [86 favorites]


If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct.

can u not pls
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 9:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [124 favorites]


Aren't these Intelligence briefings basically the Reader's Digest version of events anyway? I mean, I really hope they are.
posted by RedEmma at 9:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hey kids, how about a Mifi contest, a pool on when the next Trump Campaign Manager is "brought on". I'll pick 9/23.
posted by sammyo at 9:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct. We will continue on our current course.

This is the terrible result of Citizens United! Companies as people! Companies on airplanes! And they've been drinking! Wait a minute, companies can't fly! COMPANIES CAN'T FLY!
posted by filthy light thief at 9:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct. We will continue on our current course.

*grind grind grind*

Sharp enough yet?
posted by dersins at 9:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [61 favorites]


This election is the best TV I've ever watched. Also the most frightening.
posted by codacorolla at 9:18 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Hey kids, how about a Mifi contest, a pool on when the next Trump Campaign Manager is "brought on". I'll pick 9/23.

I'll go with 9/22, because that's the fall equinox, a more auspicious day for summonings.
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:20 AM on August 17, 2016 [49 favorites]


one dollar
posted by griphus at 9:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Imagine trying to write satire

Trump Asks Ailes Why He Can't Just Hire "That Gerbles Guy, You Know, from Germany"

Trump Redirects $80 Million to Funding Mission to Find, Clone Goebbels DNA

Ryan, McConnell Denounce Creation of Zombie Goebbels Clone, Still Endorse Trump
posted by the return of the thin white sock at 9:22 AM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]




The New Yorker: Trump's Blunt-force Foreign Policy

A quarter century before he ran for the Presidency, Donald Trump lobbied to be the chief U.S. negotiator with the Soviet Union on a deal to mutually limit their nuclear arsenals....
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:23 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct. We will continue on our current course.

If the only two options are "continue on current course" and "literally die in twisted, fiery wreckage" I'm perfectly okay with selecting Option A.

Or to put it another way, the current ballot does not read:
[ ] Perfect
[ ] Good

It reads:
[ ] Fine
[ ] Evil
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:24 AM on August 17, 2016 [85 favorites]


RedEmma: Aren't these Intelligence briefings basically the Reader's Digest version of events anyway? I mean, I really hope they are.
...concerning the substance of the information provided, there have been considerable variations in the amount and the type of material made available. All candidates in recent years have valued receiving the President's Daily Brief (PDB), the CIA intelligence summary created exclusively for the President. Some have wanted to receive additional, supplementary intelligence publications during the campaign and the transition period. A few have wanted oral briefings by a number of substantive experts as opposed to hearing from a single Agency briefer each day; others have found multiple briefers confusing or overwhelming.
Excerpt from Getting to Know the President: CIA Briefings of Presidential Candidates, 1952–1992 (PDF, hosted on CIA.gov)
posted by filthy light thief at 9:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Oh man, that Garry Trudeau interview TMOTAT posted upthread:

AMY GOODMAN: I want to go to 1999. You have a cartoon with Donald Trump saying, quote, "A lot of people have been asking what this election is really about. Well, it’s not about the economy, stupid! And it’s not character, stupid! And it’s not authenticity, stupid! It’s not even about the issues, stupid! You want to know what this election is about?" Someone then says, "You, stupid?" Trump replies, "Exactly! People are begging me to run! Begging me!"

GARRY TRUDEAU: Oh, they’re always begging him, and there are always hundreds of calls. And what’s astonishing is these things are obviously made up. But what’s most astonishing about his lack of truth is that he wheels it out for the most banal and trivial of reasons. I was talking to a crew member on CNN who said he was in his office setting up a camera—this was a while back—and he overheard Trump talking to his daughter in the outer office. And he said, "Well, there are five cameras in my office." And he said, "Five? There was one. I was setting up one camera." Why lie to your daughter about how many cameras in your—I mean, the most, you know, insignificant things get lied about, and right up to last night, when he was imagining a video he never saw.

posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [59 favorites]


Got back from seeing family in North Carolina this weekend, where I kept getting sat at the more racist end of the table, and even they seemed lukewarm on Trump. I don't know who they're voting for, because the constant haranguing about my party identification was too much to bear already, but they freely acknowledged that he was a pretty terrible candidate. I can't imagine them voting for Hillary, but I can hope that they'll stay home out of frustration.

My Trump-loving Floridian grandfather, who I mentioned briefly in the previous thread, said he's thinking of writing in Putin on Election Day, just to send the world a message. I told him with outright earnestness that I would love it if he voted Putin in November.
posted by rorgy at 9:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [47 favorites]


Donald Trump Overhauls Campaign, But Lacks Focus

Well, yeah, When you bring in people to layer the guy you brought in to layer the guy who was in charge to begin with, you've kind of lost the plot.

By election day Trump's campaign structure will look like a fucking croissant.
posted by dersins at 9:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


I think I need a Playstation Vue sub to get live CNN and MSNBC for the rest of the election season.
posted by Talez at 9:27 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


The general consensus among the chattering classes (including GOP-leaning columnists) seems to be that Trump is opting to bring the whole GOP down with him in November—the "Samson Option."

Or that Trump has entered the "hospice phase" of his campaign: he's dying, he knows it, and just wants to be surrounded by people he loves.

It's all so bizarre.
posted by My Dad at 9:31 AM on August 17, 2016 [92 favorites]


Or that Trump has entered the "hospice phase" of his campaign: he's dying, he knows it, and just wants to be surrounded by people he loves.

Oh my god
posted by cashman at 9:35 AM on August 17, 2016 [29 favorites]


said he's thinking of writing in Putin on Election Day, just to send the world a message.

I've so wanted to start a hoax that discovers Putin due to a flight emergency out of Vladivostok was actually born on a secret airbase on one of the Aleutian islands and thus was eligible to be an American citizen with the ability to run for President. No less implausible that the silliness about Obama.
posted by sammyo at 9:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Since this entire campaign is like a Simpsons in-joke anyway, I hope that this campaign isn't like that episode where Martin ran for class president against Bart, and Bart was overwhelmingly popular during the campaign, but when voting happened during recess everyone forgot to vote for Bart and went to play, and Martin and his one friend stayed behind and voted Martin and Martin became class president.
posted by zutalors! at 9:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Or that Trump has entered the "hospice phase" of his campaign:

Just like the first dozen primaries.
posted by sammyo at 9:37 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I've so wanted to start a hoax that discovers Putin due to a flight emergency out of Vladivostok was actually born on a secret airbase on one of the Aleutian islands and thus was eligible to be an American citizen with the ability to run for President.

Also he's a secret Targaryen
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:38 AM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


Speaking of diseased campaigns, the very excellent Dr. Jennifer Gunter ("OB/GYN, writer, sexpert, defender of evidence-based medicine") has a look at the letter from Trump's doctor:

I’m A Doctor. Here’s What I Find Most Concerning About Trump’s Medical Letter
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 9:39 AM on August 17, 2016 [18 favorites]


Who isn't a secret Targaryen this point?
posted by asteria at 9:39 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Michael Steele: The GOP Needed Trump's Nomination
“This is all part of the process,” he said. “This has to happen. This confrontation with ourselves.” That confrontation involves the GOP realizing that it has itself to blame for the destructive rise of Trump. “[I]n large measure, we laid down the metrics and pathway for Donald Trump to emerge and to arise the way he did,” Steele said. “He understood the GOP better than the GOP understood itself.” Steele contends that because trust between the party and its base is gone, “[T]his confrontation within the party is something that is long overdue.” [...]
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 9:39 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


If by "brave lady passenger" you mean "Goldman Sachs", you are correct. We will continue on our current course.

Or so they thought...
But they didn't account for one small variable:

Dr. Jill Stein is

Passenger 57

Always bet on Green!

posted by Atom Eyes at 9:40 AM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


And he said, "Five? There was one. I was setting up one camera." Why lie to your daughter about how many cameras in your—I mean, the most, you know, insignificant things get lied about, and right up to last night, when he was imagining a video he never saw.

Most people have met this kind of person, and most of them are harmlessly looking to be a little impressive. Any story a friend of mine tells about his drug use at music festivals needs to be divided by 5 in order to approach reality, where reality is 'he is alive to tell me this story.'

Ivanka is probably very good at mental division.
posted by palindromic at 9:43 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I’m A Doctor. Here’s What I Find Most Concerning About Trump’s Medical Letter

Hah the "only positive results" catch is great. I'm not alone in having been to the doc many times hoping and hoping for the tests to be negative. Turns out Trump tests positive for diarrhea of the mouth.
posted by dis_integration at 9:43 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Michael Steele: The GOP Needed Trump's Nomination

Respectfully, Michael Steele, the rest of us who are not int he GOP really do not need any of this.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:43 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


> “[I]n large measure, we laid down the metrics and pathway for Donald Trump to emerge and to arise the way he did,” Steele said.

Yeah, take a good hard look in the mirror, former chairman of the Republican National Committee.
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:44 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump's loser talk about how the election is going to be rigged is hugely corrosive

The election process has been watched pretty carefully and well vetted. But, would it be cool if this forced states that have registration issues to be looked at closer and have those issues cleaned up a bit?
posted by sammyo at 9:44 AM on August 17, 2016


Dr. Jill Stein is
Passenger 57
Always bet on Green!


FLIGHT ATTENDANT: Dr. Stein, you did it. We're saved!

JILL STEIN: Not yet. There's still one thing I have to do.

[JILL STEIN descends into the cargo hold and disables the chemtrail-spraying device]
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:45 AM on August 17, 2016 [109 favorites]


Trump supporters react to (bogus) outrageous campaign ads, including a project consisting in locking illegal Mexicans in porta potties, loading the potties on flatbed trucks and driving them across the border: "it is something that could be worked with". I hope these people are actually actors, but I'm not sure.
posted by elgilito at 9:46 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Is anyone still listening? Is there a pool of voters who can still turn this around for The Donald?

Do not underestimate the number of people who really really dislike or hate Hillary Clinton. If Trump can somehow convince some of them that he could be a reasonable choice, we are in trouble.


This is precisely what I don't understand, though. He desperately needs the I-hate-Hillary vote. But a large portion of those people are also (increasingly) lukewarm on him. So why the fuck is he doubling-down on the no-holds-barred let-me-be-me, rather than trying his damnedest to be any smidge more temperate and reasoned and measured? I honestly believe it's just the result of being patently incapable of following through with any sort of redirection or change. He has no idea how to not be him.
posted by bologna on wry at 9:46 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I have a relative who is undecided between Trump and Clinton. This is a person who put Palin's book on her Christmas list and is horrified by people who wear American flag print boxers. She claims to be "independent" but I'd bet my savings that she always votes Republican. Yet she thinks Trump is unstable and doesn't know if she can stomach him, but she thinks Clinton is a lying liar who lies so the "Crooked Hillary" rhetoric has gotten to her. I didn't try to convince her; I don't think Wisconsin will go for Trump and frankly I was out of emotional energy that day. All I said was that Trump and Pence (especially Pence) viscerally hate me and want me dead, and hopefully she loves me enough.
posted by AFABulous at 9:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


I hope that this campaign isn't like that episode where Martin ran for class president against Bart, and Bart was overwhelmingly popular during the campaign, but when voting happened during recess everyone forgot to vote for Bart and went to play, and Martin and his one friend stayed behind and voted Martin and Martin became class president.

Bart attempted to rally non-voters with his campaign of willful, gleeful ignorance and over-the-top promises. Martin, though less charismatic, ran a pragmatic, issues-based campaign that turned out reliable voters.

It wouldn't be the worst if this campaign was like that episode.
posted by palindromic at 9:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [32 favorites]


Hey kids, how about a Mifi contest, a pool on when the next Trump Campaign Manager is "brought on". I'll pick 9/23.

I pick 8/31, because it's silly.
posted by ZeusHumms at 9:49 AM on August 17, 2016


Of course this happened while Ivanka was out of the country...on David Geffen's yacht (dun dun dun).
posted by sallybrown at 9:53 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


All candidates in recent years have valued receiving the President's Daily Brief (PDB)

Unfortunately President Bush didn't value PDBs.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:56 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


“This is all part of the process,” he said. “This has to happen.

I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started. It certainly has its roots in the Tea Party movement, but, then again, in the decade following 9/11 the Democrats were cowed and brow-beaten into submission by Bush II's "you're either with us or with the terrorists" bullying.
posted by My Dad at 9:56 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


“This is all part of the process,” he said. “This has to happen. This confrontation with ourselves.”
I see that Michael Steele has reached the fifth stage of grief.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:58 AM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


So why the fuck is he doubling-down on the no-holds-barred let-me-be-me

At his rallies he's playing to the committed (double entendre intended) but wait for the debates, if he comes across as not wacko, more "presidential" and Hil just annoying and reacting embarrassingly poorly to attacks, the silent majority fencesitters could fall to the donald side.
posted by sammyo at 9:59 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hey kids, how about a Mifi contest, a pool on when the next Trump Campaign Manager is "brought on". I'll pick 9/23.

I'll go with 9/22, because that's the fall equinox, a more auspicious day for summonings.


The veil is thinnest on Samhain, so I'm putting all my chips on 10/31 if we're thinking about bringing something out of permanent retirement.
posted by Sophie1 at 9:59 AM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


This is getting to be like one of those NASCAR crashes where the car just keeps spinning and spinning with parts of car flying off every couple of revolutions.
posted by srboisvert at 10:02 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I’m A Doctor. Here’s What I Find Most Concerning About Trump’s Medical Letter

My favorite part is the fact that the MD who wrote the letter had been dead for a few years prior to the release of this evaluation.
posted by Golem XIV at 10:07 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started.

1994
posted by the return of the thin white sock at 10:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


My favorite part is the fact that the MD who wrote the letter had been dead for a few years prior to the release of this evaluation.
I already said this in the last thread, but: The doctor who died is just one of the two names on the letterhead. The doctor who signed it is the other one. It's weird but doesn't prove fraud or anything. It would have been nice if she were more explicit about this; I thought it was a smoking gun too at first.
posted by dfan at 10:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


The next two months are gonna be like Milo Yiannopoulos-meets-'Let Bartlet Be Bartlet'
posted by Itaxpica at 10:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


I’m A Doctor. Here’s What I Find Most Concerning About Trump’s Medical Letter

This is the best thing I've seen all week. Next, can we see a poorly-photocopied reproduction of the note excusing him from 3rd grade gym class, signed "My Parents"?
posted by Mayor West at 10:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


My favorite part is the fact that the MD who wrote the letter had been dead for a few years prior to the release of this evaluation.
I already said this in the last thread, but: The doctor who died is just one of the two names on the letterhead. The doctor who signed it is the other one. It's weird but doesn't prove fraud or anything. It would have been nice if she were more explicit about this; I thought it was a smoking gun too at first.


I blame Meredith.
posted by briank at 10:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


The (surviving) doctor is almost certainly in the same boat as Meredith, a person with whom Trump has some sort of arrangement where he gets to attach their name to whatever self-serving bullshit he needs.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Dr. Jill Stein is
Passenger 57
Always bet on Green!


FLIGHT ATTENDANT: Dr. Stein, quickly! This passenger can't breathe!

JILL STEIN: You can relax. I'm here now ...and I've brought my crystals.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:15 AM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]


Let's please not start getting complacent.

A Monmouth poll just shows Trump up 11 in Indiana. Like it or not, it seems that large parts of this country have swallowed the Trump lines.
posted by peacheater at 10:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


Now we know why Trump took today off. Expect the Trumpbart relaunch tomorrow in downtown Charlotte, following a couple of high-roller fundraisers. That's an interesting location for it. I'd expect people to come in from the boonies (especially SC, which isn't a battleground), but how's it going to play to the white-collar small-c conservatives who are not especially into asshole white grievance politics?
posted by holgate at 10:16 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]




FLIGHT ATTENDANT: Thank goodness, we've defused 99 of the 100 microbombs on board!

JILL STEIN: You fool! You've only made the explosives more powerful!
posted by leotrotsky at 10:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [120 favorites]


Just flashed up on NY Times alert: "Donald Trump's Casinos owed a tax bill of almost $30 million to New Jersey. Then his friend Chris Christie became governer." Link.

I love popcorn.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 10:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started.

1994


I'd say 1964-ish but honestly has it ever not been like this? I certainly don't recall learning about the overwhelming civility of the American political process in history class and nothing I've read since has worked particularly hard to change my mind.
posted by griphus at 10:19 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Let's please not start getting complacent.

Trust me, my feelings of terror are set to the appropriate level.
posted by Artw at 10:19 AM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


Next, can we see a poorly-photocopied reproduction of the note excusing him from 3rd grade gym class, signed "My Parents"?


"Epstein's Mother"
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 10:19 AM on August 17, 2016 [18 favorites]


more like Kuzka's mother am i right folks
posted by griphus at 10:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


From Vanity Fair in 2004: Donald Trump Answers the Proust Questionnaire
Vanity Fair has done a series of Proust Questionnaires over the years.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


They don't ask his favorite curse word.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:22 AM on August 17, 2016


"I despise many living people." -- Donald J. Trump
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:24 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


*Puts on tinfoil hat* So what happens when the shadowy right take Trump out.?
GOP walkover?
posted by adamvasco at 10:24 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]




actually he comes across as, idk, not a monster? in the Vanity Fair thing, but it's funny that he would like to be reincarnated as a building.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:25 AM on August 17, 2016


"I despise many living people." -- Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing
posted by theodolite at 10:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]



Dr. Jill Stein is
Passenger 57
Always bet on Green!


Odds of hitting on Zero or Double Zero: 2.63%
Jill Stein current polling: ~3%

Pretty close, actually.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started.

1994


You can always point out negative, nasty rhetoric going back to the beginning, but I think the qualitative shift in modern times that people are feeling happened in 1988, when Lee Atwater ran Bush I's campaign, as documented in the movie "Boogie Man." Trump probably internalized the Atwater style of politicking around then.
posted by demonic winged headgear at 10:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Shapiro surely means a "Sharknado"; if you're gonna use an outdated pop culture reference, at least do it correctly.

Like I needed another reason to despise him.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 10:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


well, he is a living person
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started.

1994

I'd say 1964-ish but honestly has it ever not been like this? I certainly don't recall learning about the overwhelming civility of the American political process in history class and nothing I've read since has worked particularly hard to change my mind.


I'm inclined to go with 1994 over 1964 because of the rise of Newt Gingrich. He helped usher in a distinct cultural change in Congress away from collegiality and towards combativeness and clannishness.
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:29 AM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


"I despise many living people." -- Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing

I doubt Trump has the attention span for necromancy.

Liches are also healthier looking and have a better skin tone.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


This answer from that Vanity Fair thing is so revealing:

"What is the quality you most like in a man? Integrity and loyalty—although they are almost the same thing, at least to me."
posted by prefpara at 10:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


Shapiro surely means a "Sharknado"; if you're gonna use an outdated pop culture reference, at least do it correctly.

Maybe "Shark tornado" is the off-brand version of Sharknado, like how some stores refer to their generic rip-offs of Dr Pepper as "pepper soda".
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


You can always point out negative, nasty rhetoric going back to the beginning, but I think the qualitative shift in modern times that people are feeling happened in 1988, when Lee Atwater ran Bush I's campaign, as documented in the movie "Boogie Man." Trump probably internalized the Atwater style of politicking around then.

Bush I at least chose raising taxes and losing the election over bankrupting the nation. I don't think you could say the same about Trump and Bush II chose bankrupting the nation QED. 1994 is when the Republicans truly went "fuck all taxes and all the black people they help".
posted by Talez at 10:31 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


PASSENGER: Dr. Stein, we found a vaccine! We can save the co-pilot!

[JILL STEIN turns, dives towards the PASSENGER, and knocks the vaccine syringe out of her hand]

JILL STEIN: That was too close.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:31 AM on August 17, 2016 [24 favorites]


Same question of best quality for a woman: beauty.
posted by thebrokedown at 10:31 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Shapiro surely means a "Sharknado"; if you're gonna use an outdated pop culture reference, at least do it correctly.

Like I needed another reason to despise him.
He said Sharknado; the transcription was in error. My apologies for passing it on without fact-checking it first.
posted by dfan at 10:32 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


Indiana FB contacts are reporting Hillary ads on TV there. It would appear the Hillary campaign is aware of Pence's negatives in-state.
posted by mwhybark at 10:32 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]




Oh god, it only took two weeks for that Onion article to come true. That is amazing.

We now live INSIDE of the onion. There are only tears.
posted by Fizz at 10:35 AM on August 17, 2016 [109 favorites]


It would appear the Hillary campaign is aware of Pence's negatives in-state.

Not like that's tough to learn; just stop a random Hoosier on the street and ask them.

*SPITS*
posted by leotrotsky at 10:37 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


"I despise many living people." -- Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing

The Archlich later distanced himself from the Trump campaign, clarifying that he hates all living things equally and intends to consume their life-energies in a fair and egalitarian manner.
posted by Mitrovarr at 10:38 AM on August 17, 2016 [29 favorites]


@benshapiro calls Trump campaign a “turd tornado”
CNN host: “A what tornado?”
Shapiro: “a turd tornado. Like a shark tornado with poop"


Good lord. Reality has already outpaced Owen Ellicson's twitter feed.
posted by PlusDistance at 10:40 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


The Archlich later distanced himself from the Trump campaign, clarifying that he hates all living things equally and intends to consume their life-energies in a fair and egalitarian manner.

"Roger, I've gone to bat for you plenty of times in the past, but this guy? Are you kidding me? Thoth, what an asshole."
posted by leotrotsky at 10:45 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Privately, the Archlich admitted to close confidants that Manafort gave him the creeps and that Ailes had, on more than one occasion, made inappropriate remarks that made him feel unsafe
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [34 favorites]


PASSENGER: You did it Dr. Stein, the plane is saved!

[CUT TO: flashback of Dr. Stein at that party with Putin. They nod at each other

CUT TO: extreme close-up of Dr. Stein's face]

DR. STEIN (under her breath): Hail Hydra!
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [26 favorites]


I for one could use some [real] and [fake] tags right about now.
posted by palindromic at 10:48 AM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables!—Meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
At least I’m sure it may be so on Meet the Press.

posted by Wallace Shawn at 10:48 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


The Archlich later distanced himself from the Trump campaign, clarifying that he hates all living things equally and intends to consume their life-energies in a fair and egalitarian manner.

No Lives Matter.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:50 AM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


the stuff about the Archlich is [fake], palindromic. as of yet we have no confirmation that Trump is in league with the undead
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:50 AM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


It's not surprising that shows like Parks & Rec and Hamilton that are earnest to the core have become so popular

No shit. I've been rewatching "The West Wing" recently. At the end of S2E3, the gang reflects on what you can say about a country that "goes out of its way to defend even those who want to destroy it," and the consensus is, "God bless America."

In a week when the nominee of a major political party calls for ideological tests for immigrants (among other horrors), this seems less like dewy-eyed sentimentality and more like an urgent reminder.
posted by emilypdx at 10:51 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Frankly I think the undead would have more class than to associate with Trump.
posted by Mitrovarr at 10:52 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


> as of yet we have no confirmation that Trump is in league with the undead

Wait for it, wait for it...
(I want to be in the room when *that* happens.)
posted by RedOrGreen at 10:55 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


FLIGHT ATTENDANT: Thanks for saving us!
DR. JILL STEIN: пожалуйста.
posted by spitbull at 10:57 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


> I for one could use some [real] and [fake] tags right about now.

It's November 9. You have awakened to the news of a landslide Clinton victory leading a Democratic congressional majority and positive trends for Democrat tickets in many battleground states' downticket elections. The sun is shining and it's an unseasonably warm autumn day, and the air is has the rich smell of newly fallen leaves. You hear children playing happily in the park nearby. [fake]
posted by ardgedee at 10:57 AM on August 17, 2016 [24 favorites]


I for one could use some [real] and [fake] tags right about now

Photo of Trump's doctor, Harold Bornstein [real]
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:59 AM on August 17, 2016 [44 favorites]


He's the leading medical light in Margartiaville
posted by The Whelk at 11:00 AM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


the stuff about the Archlich is [fake], palindromic. as of yet we have no confirmation that Trump is in league with the undead

You're a little behind. Roger Ailes is acting as an advisor to the campaign.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:01 AM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


the stuff about the Archlich is [fake], palindromic. as of yet we have no confirmation that Trump is in league with the undead

ok but is 'turd tornado' still a thing an adult human said on the national news
posted by palindromic at 11:01 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


I stopped following the campaign when I could no longer tell the difference between "actual Donald quotes" and "pretend Onion headlines".
posted by which_chick at 11:01 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Photo of Trump's doctor, Harold Bornstein [real]

They misspelled Lawrence Jacoby
posted by Twain Device at 11:01 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


DR. JILL STEIN: Does this plane have wi-fi?
FLIGHT ATTENDANT: oh yes we have GoGo inflight wireless!
DR. JILL STEIN: Ach, we are all dead anyway. No point saving the plane.
posted by spitbull at 11:02 AM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]




I would think he'd be polling even higher. Bayh has a ton of money in campaign funds. He needs to start doing more ad buys.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:05 AM on August 17, 2016


Trump/Bayh ticket splitters are apparently a thing
posted by T.D. Strange at 11:06 AM on August 17, 2016


They misspelled Lawrence Jacoby

It all begins to make sense. Trump isn't looking to win, he's in it for the Garmonbozia.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Accidentally posted in this clip in the old thread, but:

Video evidence of Ben Shapiro calling Trump himself a "turd tornado" on CNN [real]. I had to see this for myself to believe it.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 11:09 AM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


Trump to Receive First Classified Briefing:
Trump is planning to take with him New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie and retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, a former Defense Intelligence Agency director who has become an outspoken supporter of Trump, a senior campaign official said.

Career staffers from the Office of the Director of National Intelligence (DNI), the nation's top intelligence office, will be leading the briefing, which is expected to cover major threats and emerging concerns around the world.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:09 AM on August 17, 2016


Dr. Harold "Gonzo" Bornstein
posted by entropicamericana at 11:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump has brought in a trio new people who are known to be assholes and difficult to work with. I suppose that could work. I am skeptical that it will. Even if they manage to avoid tearing each other apart; the new leadership has only 12 weeks to fix some enormous problems:
1- The campaign appears to be missing a lot of mid level managers and those that are in place are not the best the party has to offer. 12 weeks left in the campaign means they have the staff they are going to the general election with.
2- Staff morale is said to be very low. Bringing in new people to scream at the junior staff for the crap state of affairs isn't likely to improve things.
3- Trump has unprecedented unfavorability ratings because his statements have turned off a lot of Republicans. Those arnt the Breitbart wing, they are military voters, college educated whites, and other more moderate groups. Trump isn't going to win those people back with attack ads and his con artist bullshit.
posted by humanfont at 11:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


This is getting to be like one of those NASCAR crashes where the car just keeps spinning and spinning with parts of car flying off every couple of revolutions.

I like this analogy. At this point, the car is still flipping through the air and we still have to sit through the part where it lands and the leaking oil catches on fire. Even then the driver is still officially scored in the race until they finally drag what's left behind the wall. But at this point, only the driver's diehard fans hold any hope that he's still going to contend for a win.
posted by dances with hamsters at 11:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Frankly I think the undead would have more class than to associate with Trump

I hear Tomb of Horrors now has a big, golden TRUMP sign over the entrance. It really classes up the joint, according to Acererak.
posted by nubs at 11:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


it's spelled "Bornstein," which makes it look like it's pronounced with two syllables ("born-stein"), but actually it's pronounced with three syllables ("spa-che-min").
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:10 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]




I stopped following the campaign when I could no longer tell the difference between "actual Donald quotes" and "pretend Onion headlines".

I wish that I too had stopped paying attention during his first speech.
posted by dances with hamsters at 11:13 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump to Receive First Classified Briefing

The same day he said he said he wouldn't trust US intelligence. Much as I join in the schadenfreude of seeing top intelligence staffers smacked around a bit, I don't think he's likely to be in a mood to learn anything.
posted by zachlipton at 11:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


> I for one could use some [real] and [fake] tags right about now.

It's November 9. You have awakened to the news of a landslide Clinton victory leading a Democratic congressional majority and positive trends for Democrat tickets in many battleground states' downticket elections. The sun is shining and it's an unseasonably warm autumn day, and the air is has the rich smell of newly fallen leaves. You hear children playing happily in the park nearby. [fake]


look
posted by ZeusHumms at 11:14 AM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]


November 2, 2016: Paul Ryan denounces the ibex-horned entity whose face is constantly obscured by swarming black flies currently serving as Trump's campaign manager as "deeply misguided," and says that the entity's plan to "make America great again by first reducing it to nothingness in a monstrous hecatomb of blood and lamentation" is "not the direction we should be heading in as a party or as a country," but stresses that he still supports Trump, telling voters that "the only thing worse than the Great Reaping promised by Mr. [name uncapturable by recording equipment] and the herding of mortal bodies into ash-pits where they may be formed into the very bricks that will build the wall that will seal America off from the eyes of God forever would be allowing Hillary Clinton to nominate the next Supreme Court Justice." [fake]
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [188 favorites]


So… Trump's doctor sometimes goes on vacation I guess? And one time he was at the beach and somebody took an unflattering photo of him? Not exactly a smoking gun, people.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 11:17 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


It's November 9. You have awakened to the news of a landslide Clinton victory leading a Democratic congressional majority and positive trends for Democrat tickets in many battleground states' downticket elections. The sun is shining and it's an unseasonably warm autumn day, and the air is has the rich smell of newly fallen leaves. You hear children playing happily in the park nearby. [fake]

Okay I know this is [fake] but god I just let out this sigh of relief straight from my soul
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 11:18 AM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


November 2, 2016: Paul Ryan denounces the ibex-horned entity whose face is constantly obscured by swarming black flies currently serving as Trump's campaign manager as "deeply misguided," and says that the entity's plan to "make America great again by first reducing it to nothingness in a monstrous hecatomb of blood and lamentation" is "not the direction we should be heading in as a party or as a country," but stresses that he still supports Trump, telling voters that "the only thing worse than the Great Reaping promised by Mr. [name uncapturable by recording equipment] and the herding of mortal bodies into ash-pits where they may be formed into the very bricks that will build the wall that will seal America off from the eyes of God forever would be allowing Hillary Clinton to nominate the next Supreme Court Justice." [fake]

Okay I know this is [fake] but Azathoth I just let out this sigh of relief straight from my soul
posted by Faint of Butt at 11:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [28 favorites]


It's November 9. You have awakened to the news of a landslide Clinton victory leading a Democratic congressional majority and positive trends for Democrat tickets in many battleground states' downticket elections. The sun is shining and it's an unseasonably warm autumn day, and the air is has the rich smell of newly fallen leaves. You hear children playing happily in the park nearby. [fake]

damn you sir/ma'am
posted by sallybrown at 11:21 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


He's the leading medical light in Margartiaville

Maybe he can do something about healthcare, after all.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:22 AM on August 17, 2016


Nice thread.

Be a shame if sumfing 'happened' to it.

Fings burn, you know . . .
 
posted by Herodios at 11:24 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]



Trump is proving himself to be as unaware and gullible as many of his supporters seem to be. Bannon is a horrible human, and in many ways a lot like Trump. Pretty sure he's smarter in number of ways though and knows exactly how to play Trump to get what he wants. Trump is proving himself over and over to be one of the most gullible and un self-aware pols out there right now.

I imagine:
(fake)
Bannon: Trump. You're amazing and great. Nobody understands you. I understand you. You must just be yourself.
Trump: You are correct. You're hired!!
Bannon in his head: *evil cackle* That was as easy as I thought it would be. What a chump.
posted by Jalliah at 11:25 AM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Paul Ryan has basically been ignoring the dumpster fire that is the Trump campaign for the past couple of weeks going all-in on his A Better Way campaign which has been almost universally ignored. With Trump hogging most of the airwaves and Hillary & Co. taking the rest, Ryan has basically been left out in the cold looking through the window at the party going on.

There is no coherency in Republican strategy with Trump looking to drive full nationalism and Paul Ryan trying to engage in some weird as fuck version of nation building which will mostly be implemented as getting rid of benefits to poor people and single mothers.
posted by Talez at 11:26 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


He's the leading medical light in Margartiaville

I'm just a
Trump doctor in paradise
posted by sallybrown at 11:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Does anyone still believe Trump actually wants to be president? He's found a great vehicle for self-promotion and as someone upthread mentioned he'll probably extract a lot of money from the process to boot. He's already sown the seeds that the whole thing is rigged, so in his head he won't really lose. It seems like the worst thing for Trump would be to win.
posted by howling fantods at 11:28 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Special Agent Dale Cooper: Just flashed up on NY Times alert: "Donald Trump's Casinos owed a tax bill of almost $30 million to New Jersey. Then his friend Chris Christie became governor."
The total, with interest, had grown to almost $30 million. The state had doggedly pursued the matter through two of the casinos’ bankruptcy cases and even accused the company led by Mr. Trump of filing false reports with state casino regulators about the amount of taxes it had paid.

But the year after Governor Christie, a Republican, took office, the tone of the litigation shifted. The state entertained settlement offers. And in December 2011, after six years in court, the state agreed to accept just $5 million, roughly 17 cents on the dollar of what auditors said the casinos owed.
...
A deputy New Jersey attorney general wrote in 2007 that Donald J. Trump’s flagship casino, the Taj Mahal, had reported that it paid $2.2 million in alternative minimum assessment tax in 2003, which was not true. It had paid only $500 in income taxes.
Tax cuts for all those who can get away with them!
posted by filthy light thief at 11:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


It would be the worst thing for all of us, howling fantods.
posted by infinitewindow at 11:30 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


It is good to see Trump doing so poorly since it makes those left of center jolly for the first time in many many months.
posted by Postroad at 11:30 AM on August 17, 2016


So… Trump's doctor sometimes goes on vacation I guess? And one time he was at the beach and somebody took an unflattering photo of him? Not exactly a smoking gun, people.

No, it's not, but I get the feeling some smoking might be going on, and he probably wouldn't mind if you checked out those guns
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:32 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


In a FiveThirtyEight chat Nate Silver compares Trump to both Freakazoid and Dennis Rodman.
natesilver: Maybe I think it’s a stupid point!!!!!!!!!!!

Asking “what if Trump were normal” is a nonsensical question.

clare.malone: No, no. It’s asking where he’d be if he hadn’t screwed up too much in the last month to six weeks — i.e., if the pivot to the general election had gone well.

natesilver: But what if the same characteristics that prevented him from pivoting are the same ones that allowed him to win the primary?

It’s a bit like asking, “What if Dennis Rodman had a good midrange jumper?” You have a freakazoid of a player, and it all sort of works, but under relatively narrow conditions. You can’t change that one thing without the whole package being different. If Dennis Rodman had a good midrange jumper, he wouldn’t be Dennis Rodman.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 11:33 AM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


the simplest explanation is that he's not very good at it

gosh yes. I don't know why this is up for debate so much.
posted by zutalors! at 11:34 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Does anyone still believe Trump actually wants to be president?

I'm not sure he has an opinion on the matter, not really being a long term planner. I'm pretty sure he'd hate it if it actually happened, but right nor his focus is on running for president, and what he is going is absolutely his idea of how you win such a race. He lacks any kind of psychological complexity required for the theories that he's secretly throwing it.

On the other hand, if he loses, not really wanting the job will absolutely be one of his excuses.
posted by Artw at 11:34 AM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]


He may not be doing a very good job at running for office, but the simplest explanation is that he's not very good at it, not that he has some double-secret backwards plans to self-promote while actively trying to lose.

Business as typical for Trump? Plan big and showy, fail big after the media has moved on, depend on cronies for the bail-out, and keep the golden parachute for the next failure.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 11:36 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Does anyone still believe Trump actually wants to be president? He's found a great vehicle for self-promotion and as someone upthread mentioned he'll probably extract a lot of money from the process to boot. He's already sown the seeds that the whole thing is rigged, so in his head he won't really lose. It seems like the worst thing for Trump would be to win.

I think he thinks he does but is not capable of doing the analysis needed to figure out why he isn't. His narcissist brain is just not able to deal with the evidence that he as is "I am Donald" is not winning strategy like in the primaries. So he has a whole bunch of people around him trying to get him to understand why he isn't winning and he is only capable of latching onto the ones that give him all the reasons why it's not him. And I expect that they're coaching him on all the ways, like you suggest that he can still 'win'.

He's being played big time by people that really get how he works and are okay with him being horrible because they are just as horrible. Like is attracting like into one big blob of horriblness.
posted by Jalliah at 11:37 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


"jolly" isn't quite the right word. It's more like we're in a game of Russian roulette, we've discovered that we're pretty sure the chamber in the gun against our head is empty, but we also know that the gun will come back around the table to us before the game is over.

No wait that's not quite the right analogy. You know the movie Gravity? The central conceit of the movie is that the main characters are on a space shuttle that's in the path of a swarm of orbiting debris that comes back around to them every 45 minutes or so. Each time they survive it, they know they've bought themselves a little bit of time to catch their breath and make preparations, but also they're a little bit more damaged and a little bit less prepared for the next onslaught.

Every election, the Republicans throw a new type of awfulness at America. And even when the awfulness loses, it still damages new parts of the body politic on its way through.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:40 AM on August 17, 2016 [69 favorites]


the simplest explanation is that he's not very good at it

gosh yes. I don't know why this is up for debate so much.

Dan Drezner in The Washington Post: “The trouble with writing about Donald Trump” (March 28, 2016)
No matter how much one tries to develop an alternative perspective, the inescapable conclusion is that Trump is a narcissistic, ignorant, misogynistic gasbag. Which means that, at this point, the entire commentariat winds up sounding pretty much the same when it comes to him.

He’s basic and bad. There’s really nothing else of substance to say.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2016 [26 favorites]


Trump has totally trashed his brand though. Overall he's been this funny over the top media person all my life, and I didn't even know he delved into politics until the birther stuff, though I might have guessed. I didn't really seek him out much outside the first season of The Apprentice.

Like he might find a new line of business among the Trumpers, but for a lot of sane people they won't want to go anywhere near that brand.
posted by zutalors! at 11:41 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


>It is good to see Trump doing so poorly since it makes those left of center jolly for the first time in many many months.

Ah yes, jollity. Trouble is, I was hanging out hereabouts before Bush got elected, and it seems to me the mood was pretty jolly. Trump seems like The Worst Thing Ever at the moment, but so did Palin, and so did Bush. The bottom line is, if they're gonna keep nominating reality TV stars and professional wrestlers and white supremacists and certifiable loons and whatever else they got, sooner or later the spaghetti is gonna stick to the wall.

On preview: what You Can't Tip A Buick said.
posted by Sing Or Swim at 11:43 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Does anyone have a spare "Surely this..." I can borrow? I ran out weeks ago.
posted by zakur at 11:44 AM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Also, his doctor letter says he has no history using alcohol or tobacco. So how does he know Trump Vodka is the best?!?
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 11:44 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


zutalors!: Like he might find a new line of business among the Trumpers, but for a lot of sane people they won't want to go anywhere near that brand.

Good news for Donnie - there is still a significantly large percentage of the population that supports him, and if they continue to support him, they're more likely to be hardcore supporters going forward. In other words, they're a great base for future marketing.
posted by filthy light thief at 11:44 AM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Like he might find a new line of business among the Trumpers, but for a lot of sane people they won't want to go anywhere near that brand.
posted by zutalors! at 11:41 AM on August 17 [+] [!]


Eh, I dunno. I think he has a built in market now for whatever he wants to sell. Call it 20% of the country. 20% of 350 million people are going to be willing to buy whatever he's selling, because otherwise they'll have to question their entire world.

He will unfortunately be fine.
posted by schadenfrau at 11:44 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]



I'd say 1964-ish but honestly has it ever not been like this? I certainly don't recall learning about the overwhelming civility of the American political process in history class and nothing I've read since has worked particularly hard to change my mind.


In 1864 a U.S. senator beat another U.S. senator nearly to death on the senate floor over the issue of abolitionism. This is not new, and it's been worse.
posted by Ragged Richard at 11:45 AM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


Trump has totally trashed his brand though

Don't think he's capable of figuring out why that has happened either. It sure won't be his fault. I have no doubt that he went into it thinking that yes this will be good for me, he IS his brand. I don't think he's intellectually capable of understanding how much he's ruined it, let alone why.
posted by Jalliah at 11:46 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


under_petticoat_rule: Also, his doctor letter says he has no history using alcohol or tobacco. So how does he know Trump Vodka is the best?!?

Uh, duh. Everything he does is the best. Even when it's collapsing in a fiery ruin, it's the best fiery ruin you'll ever see. (See: his continued support for the short-lived Trump University - 2005-2010, but always #1 in his heart stories.)
posted by filthy light thief at 11:46 AM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


In a FiveThirtyEight chat Nate Silver compares Trump to both Freakazoid and Dennis Rodman.

Of the many characteristics that Trump and Rodman share (attention-getting hair, friendship with tyrants, reality TV and wrestling roles, marriage to and divorce from models, resemblance to characters in dystopian fiction), I didn't think statistical je ne sais quoi would be the one to draw a comparison.
posted by knuckle tattoos at 11:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


It is good to see Trump doing so poorly since it makes those left of center jolly for the first time in many many months.

Hey, pal. This graveyard ain't gonna whistle past itself.
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [25 favorites]


Does anyone have a spare "Surely this..." I can borrow? I ran out weeks ago.

I borrowed a cup of evens from the neighbor the other day.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:47 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


i'm gonna miss the onion's joe biden articles, but i just might be able to cope if we continue to get these in exchange
posted by entropicamericana at 11:48 AM on August 17, 2016 [24 favorites]


Every election, the Republicans throw a new type of awfulness at America. And even when the awfulness loses, it still damages new parts of the body politic on its way through.

To expand on your space shuttle analogy, what I think/hope will happen in November is that NASA get's out the "Okay, we're done fuckin' around now" space shuttle they keep way at the back of the hanger. It takes a lot of energy on the crew's part and everyone at NASA, including the slackers needs to bring their A-game. But if they do, the thing will fly to Mars and back without breaking a sweat and shrugs off space debris like it's not even there.
posted by VTX at 11:51 AM on August 17, 2016




zutalors!: Like he might find a new line of business among the Trumpers, but for a lot of sane people they won't want to go anywhere near that brand.

Good news for Donnie - there is still a significantly large percentage of the population that supports him, and if they continue to support him, they're more likely to be hardcore supporters going forward. In other words, they're a great base for future marketing.


right, but just those hardcore supporters, and that's a diminishing group. I'm not saying that he's going to be like out on the street or anything, but his "famous rich guy" brand is tarnished. Macy's dropped him for example. So he's not going to have that mainstream support again like he had.

I'm not saying he'll have some terrible life but I doubt this benefited his business future, though like others said above, it seems like he doesn't care.
posted by zutalors! at 11:53 AM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


In a FiveThirtyEight chat Nate Silver compares Trump to both Freakazoid and Dennis Rodman.

that fivethirtyeight chat reads like baseball announcers desperately trying to fill airtime in the seventh inning of a shutout.
posted by murphy slaw at 11:53 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


I assume that someone gave him an executive summary of Rick Perlstein's piece on the conservative media direct mail grift, and his takeaway was that he needed to get some of these lists of marks who literally sign up for the con. Huckabee and Carson and the lot have demonstrated that unsuccessful presidential bids are a fine way to tap into that sweet right-wing luchre.
posted by palindromic at 11:53 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I’d say 1964-ish but honestly has it ever not been like this? I certainly don’t recall learning about the overwhelming civility of the American political process in history class and nothing I've read since has worked particularly hard to change my mind.

In 1864 a U.S. senator beat another U.S. senator nearly to death on the senate floor over the issue of abolitionism. This is not new, and it's been worse.


The problem with “not been like this” and “it’s been worse” is that they are inherently subjective measurements. Like, bringing up examples of violence on the Senate floor in advance of the Civil War isn’t a great point of comparison. There have been all kinds of smears leveled throughout U.S. history against candidates, but there have also been a lot of relatively civil US elections. Maybe a better question is whether or not there’s even been a less qualified nominee than Trump, because I sincerely doubt it. Perhaps Harding? And to hear Upton Sinclair tell it, Coolidge was just a pawn of business. But I can’t think of a time when a party just straight-up nominated a huckster.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]



Alternate hypothesis:


ugh I think you should say if you're going to link to Michael Moore.
posted by zutalors! at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]


Alternate hypothesis:

yeah Michael Moore was whining last month that Trump was a lock to win so maybe we take his electoral analysis with a couple salt shakers maybe
posted by mightygodking at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2016 [37 favorites]


Donald Trump may be an outlier political candidate, but god damn it do not mention him in the same breath with Dennis Rodman, and why on on Earth is this the thing that has me angry about this debacle of an election?
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Michael Moore just said the other week that there was no way Clinton will beat Trump. Who gives a fuck what he knows "for a fact"?
posted by defenestration at 11:54 AM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


the simplest explanation is that he's not very good at it

Part of his appeal is that he's not a politician. OK, fine. He's not a professional at this. He's been plucked from the cabin and is flying the plane. But he doesn't know how to fly the plane. And he's waving off all instructions from anyone who does know how to fly a plane. He's going to fly the plane his way, because that's what the people want, and it's the thing he does best. Only...
posted by Capt. Renault at 11:55 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Who's Michael Moore again?
posted by My Dad at 11:55 AM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Alternate hypothesis:

Ah, Michael Moore. Now there’s a name I haven’t heard since the last thread…
posted by Going To Maine at 11:55 AM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


As a political pundit, Michael Moore is a pretty good filmmaker.
posted by tonycpsu at 11:56 AM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


> In 1856 a U.S. senator beat another U.S. senator nearly to death on the senate floor over the issue of abolitionism. This is not new, and it's been worse.

Well yes but also in 1856 we were just a few years away from a massive meat-grinder of a war started by slavers willing to break up the country and then kill millions of people, all in defense of the unlimited expansion of the institution of slavery. so you know maybe not the happiest comparison to make.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:57 AM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


Also, whenever someone says they know Trump doesn't want to win, they're positioning themselves to be one step away from saying he is a Clinton plant.

Because there is no way Clinton can win honestly and fairly, amirite?
posted by defenestration at 11:58 AM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Alternate hypothesis:

yeah Michael Moore was whining last month that Trump was a lock to win so maybe we take his electoral analysis with a couple salt shakers maybe


Agreed, but I have enjoyed Michael Moore's work a lot in the past, so I'm going to cut him some slack. How weird must it be to be a beloved-by-some, boorish political shit-stirrer with an entertainment background for 25 years and then all the sudden find the same type of guy is the fucking Republican presidential nominee.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 11:58 AM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


Frankly I think the undead would have more class than to associate with Trump.

Well, the brain-eating zombies would certainly leave him alone.
posted by Celsius1414 at 12:01 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Like, bringing up examples of violence on the Senate floor in advance of the civil war isn’t a great point of comparison. There have been all kinds of smears leveled throughout U.S. history against candidates, but there have also been a lot of relatively civil US elections.

Fair enough, and I mostly agree. I guess I just wanted to push back against the idea that this is the most toxic political discourse in the U.S. has ever been, since it once got so bad that we had to have an actual war (not as a result of the discourse of course, but hopefully that goes without saying).

As far as least qualified, I think Trump probably wins it in a walk, before him I would say Hoover, but it's hard to know how much of that is hindsight making Hoover look terrible in retrospect.
posted by Ragged Richard at 12:01 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


And one time he was at the beach and somebody took an unflattering photo of him? Not exactly a smoking gun, people.


Yeah, but not exactly Chief of Internal Medicine at Johns Hopkins, either.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 12:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Never actually wanted to be president

Michael Moore is, to me, about as credible as Sean Hannity.
posted by spitbull at 12:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Yeah, but not exactly Chief of Internal Medicine at Johns Hopkins, either.


Not even a member of the gastroenterology department at Lenox Hill.
posted by spitbull at 12:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Unfortunately, Trump may lose the election but win a key battle in the culture war, in the sense of reinforcing radicalized and resentful activists willing to push policies that matter into municipalities and statehouses.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 12:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I'm worried the Trump campaign will destroy American Democracy. Trump's loser talk about how the election is going to be rigged is hugely corrosive and only going to get worse.

Bush / Gore 2000 was hugely damaging to America's confidence in elections. But the situation was resolved more or less according to the law . . . I don't see any evidence the Trump folks will be as gracious . . . It's not enough for Clinton to win; she has to win with an uncontestable landslide.



Election 2000 was, to employ a tired expression, a perfect storm of bad election luck; a electoral vote tie is bad enough, but also a recount hampered by ambiguities quite separate from the partisanship; and in the end, the actual vote count in FLA was very very close. Close enough that you could persuade yourself that maybe somebody would be able to alter or hide enough paper ballots to influence the count -- in FLA.

Right now, most electoral vote maps -- based on various combinations of public polls -- have Clinton leading Trump on the order of 2 to 1. The trend is generally in Clinton's favour.
Think about how many people are watching the numbers very very closely. If the numbers hold, if there's no great discontinuity at the last minute, it's not going to be possible to build a persuasive argument for election fraud.

There will be sore losers, certainly, but not enough to 'destroy American Democracy'.
 
posted by Herodios at 12:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]



Trump says he doesn't trust US intelligence agencies and won't use them if elected

Who needs the CIA when you've got master of disguise James O'Keefe


aka 'The Red Rascal'.
 
posted by Herodios at 12:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


The general consensus among the chattering classes (including GOP-leaning columnists) seems to be that Trump is opting to bring the whole GOP down with him in November—the "Samson Option."

Well . . . it has to be said that he's got the right hair for the job.
 
posted by Herodios at 12:05 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


As far as least qualified, I think Trump probably wins it in a walk, before him I would say Hoover

Before he was President, Hoover first organized food adminstration for the US Army during World War One then organized food distribution for ravaged postwar Europe - the work he oversaw legitimately saved millions of people from starvation. He then went home, became Secretary of Commerce under Harding, and although his politics were conservative he's generally considered to have been extremely effective in that role.

Bill Bryson once pointed out that Hoover is the only person in history for whom becoming President was definitively a bad career move.
posted by mightygodking at 12:05 PM on August 17, 2016 [57 favorites]


Unfortunately, Trump may lose the election but win a key battle in the culture war,

If you take a look at his new campaign team, he basically has a full roster for the launch of Trump TV in November. Fox News turned up to 11.
posted by My Dad at 12:05 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


The campaign appears to be missing a lot of mid level managers and those that are in place are not the best the party has to offer.

As corb noted in the last thread, the ad and comms targeting is shit, the field ops are barely-existent, the schedule still seems driven by Trump's desire to sleep in his own bed (but now also by proximity to fundraisers), and the new hires are media people with zero zilch nada ground-level campaign experience. In the meantime, Clinton and Kaine are opening field offices, signing up names at every organising event, and putting money into registration drives.
posted by holgate at 12:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


> to expand on your space shuttle analogy, what I think/hope will happen in November is that NASA get's out the "Okay, we're done fuckin' around now" space shuttle they keep way at the back of the hanger. It takes a lot of energy on the crew's part and everyone at NASA, including the slackers needs to bring their A-game. But if they do, the thing will fly to Mars and back without breaking a sweat and shrugs off space debris like it's not even there.

This strikes me as an extension of the analogy that privileges large-scale revolutionary change over small-scale incremental reform, and, well, large-scale revolutionary change is not something we're trying this time around.

(not to say that we necessarily should have tried for something big this time: to extend your extension of the analogy, it is possible that the super-sekrit NASA Mars-shuttle doesn't actually exist — maybe the revolution is impossible — and the best we can do is repair what we can and hunker down for the next onslaught.)
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:06 PM on August 17, 2016


Who needs the CIA when you've got master of disguise James O'Keefe

He's not even taking advice from O'Keefe, it's more like random commenters on the Daily Stormer and Stormfront.
posted by T.D. Strange at 12:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Also, if Michael Moore knows it for the fact, why the fuck wouldn't he say why? There's a lot of "I'm not going to say this" going on there, which reeks of bullshit.

In his next documentary, will he just allude to stuff, and follow it up with a voiceover that says: "I'm not going to explain how I know this or why I believe it to be true, but just trust what I'm saying, friends. I know this for a fact."
posted by defenestration at 12:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


I think some of the election fraud messages might work out in favor of the Democrats, actually. If the election is going to be fixed, why bother to vote? And if you do vote but lose in a landslide and that confirms the fraud to you, will you want to vote in the future? Trump supporters might end up feeling totally disenfranchised and staying home from voting indefinitely.
posted by Mitrovarr at 12:07 PM on August 17, 2016


Let's Occam's Razor the fuck out of this shit. The simplest explanation is Trump wanted to run for president, appealed to enough Republican voters to win the primaries but doesn't appeal enough to anyone else to win the election.

If you look at what Republicans tend to win at the state level in primaries, there is no shortage of rabid, frothing at the mouth evil people. It stands to reason that a famous rabid, frothing at the mouth evil person running for president would be the one preferred by that group of voters.

In conclusion, Trump is for real and he is a really awful and incompetent candidate elevated to this position by mostly awful and incompetent people who has chosen to surround himself with more awful and incompetent people. Its anuses all the way down, not connected to a digestive track nor ever reaching a toilet. No new shit is created, no old shit is expelled. Shit just keeps flowing.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [45 favorites]


Michael Moore grew up in Flint, MI as the middle class died with the auto industry. And water.

If he has an excessively pessimistic point-of-view, I'd say he's justified in it. I don't agree, but "Hope For The Best, Expect The Worst" was a song in The 12 Chairs, right?
posted by mikelieman at 12:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Not even a member of the gastroenterology department at Lenox Hill.

why is trump's personal physician a gastroenterologist and not a proctologist
posted by murphy slaw at 12:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Counterpoint: Michael Moore is a millionaire.
posted by spitbull at 12:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


oh god, john yoo just warned against voting for trump

sorry folks i have to vote for the yam now
posted by murphy slaw at 12:11 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Frankly I think the undead would have more class than to associate with Trump.

The brain dead, on the other hand...
posted by y2karl at 12:12 PM on August 17, 2016


People who spout the shit Moore is spouting are basically giving Trump an out after he loses big.

"I'm no loser. Anyone with brains would know I never wanted to be president in the first place. Sad."
posted by defenestration at 12:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


I firmly believe Trump didn't start campaigning to become president; he started to drum up media attention and to be able to add "I ran for president!... And I would've won if it weren't for the horrible liberal media and that snake, [NAME] who got the nomination!" to his list of accomplishments.

It backfired - with a fragmented party unable to step left (or centrist) to appeal to its conservative base that isn't founded in bigotry, Trump found himself ahead - and he can't quit while he's winning. He also can't just agree that it's not working and drop out; that'd make him "a quitter." And walking off this stage is a bit more noticeable than settling lawsuits.

He doesn't want to be president. He has only a vague idea what the president does, and he damn well doesn't want the security hassles and oversight and constant negotiations that he's starting to realize the job includes. He doesn't like being insulted in public, and he maybe thought that "being awesome enough" would keep him from being a target for comedians.

But I don't believe that he's deliberately sabotaging his campaign - rather, he's decided that if he's going to take the job, it'll be on his terms, which is how he's always operated.

Expect more contradictory messages as he oscillates between "I am the awesomest candidate America has ever had" and his growing internal awareness of "this job is a nightmare; why would any sensible person put up with it?" and of course, "why are they all being so mean to me? I'm trying to help them!"
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 12:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


> new line of business among the Trumpers
Gilded assault rifle furniture. Huuuge.
posted by morganw at 12:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Let's Occam's Razor the fuck out of this shit. The simplest explanation is Trump wanted to run for president, appealed to enough Republican voters to win the primaries but doesn't appeal enough to anyone else to win the election.

Also Trump's Razor compliant.
posted by Artw at 12:14 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Trump thinks "winning" the presidency is like being voted Prom King of the USA. He's in it for bragging rights. He's given no thought to the actual details of the job.
posted by Roommate at 12:15 PM on August 17, 2016 [34 favorites]




I think Michael Moore might be a bit of a stopped clock. I find it perfectly plausible that the Trump primary campaign began as something that no one ever intended to actually go all the way (see also: Ben Carson, Herman Caine--it's not like this is an unprecedented accusation). I also find it plausible that for Trump winning is a drug, he has no executive function and no ability to comprehend what winning in this context actually means and that all he knows is that he wants More Of The Winning. The fact that the Presidency lies at the end of that winning is lost on him because he doesn't have the attention span to hold those two thoughts in his head at the same time.

So yeah, he wants to win. But does he want to be President? I'm pretty sure he doesn't even understand what that means.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


No new shit is created, no old shit is expelled. Shit just keeps flowing.

Shitnado
posted by y2karl at 12:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Yeah I don't think "Trump doesn't actually want to be President" is really equivalent to "Trump is a Clinton plant." Trump is a conman with a confidence scheme that worked much, much better than he thought it would, and now he's good and well over his head, with no obvious face-saving way out. And since his wealth is at this point almost entirely based on his media image, loss of face could actually bankrupt him.

Perversely, contra Barnum, Trump has set himself up to go broke by underestimating the stupidity of the American public (or at least by underestimating the tendency of the Republican Party primary voters to fall hard for cheap confidence tricks).
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:18 PM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]


One assumes that Trump is going to stand up the day before the election and say something along the lines of "what the fuck is wrong with you people still supporting me? I've said just about every hateful, bigoted thing I can say and you dumb motherfuckers still want to vote for me? I even tried a speech about tolerance and pluralism to throw you an inkling I might be liberal in conservative's clothing but you still were suckers for that hate. Fuck the lot of you and your identity politics. Hillary is clearly the better choice than literal fascism but you still can't vote someone who doesn't have an R in the party column? Shame on you America. Also, Mexico isn't going to pay for a wall. A wall doesn't stop drugs. We already have a cockamamy wall and it's not stopping drugs."

It's the only thing I can think of that still makes sense.
posted by Talez at 12:18 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Michael Moore? Ah, I remember that guy:

On February 29th (after big wins by Hillary in southern states with substantial African American population):
"Six red states on Super Tuesday irrelevant as they won't vote Democratic in November. Name should be changed to Super Low Turnout Tuesday."

On March 5th (after Bernie wins a couple of white-dominated solidly GOP states):
"Yuge! Sanders wins Kansas 68%-32%. Sanders also wins Nebraska 57%-43%. Clinton wins Louisiana. This is far from over. Don't believe the hype"
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


PPP have mastered the art of trolling by polls. I wonder if this a) gives them useful demographic screening data; b) improves their response rates.

"Polls? Sorry, n--oh, you're PPP! I vote Harambe! I prefer 'dumpster fire' to 'garbage fire'!"
posted by holgate at 12:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


No new shit is created, no old shit is expelled. Shit just keeps flowing.

Shitnado



Full of shit-leopards and vodka wolves.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 12:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


With Trump, I'm reminded of the guy who figured out the patterns on the old "Press Your Luck" game show and then couldn't figure out how to end the game because he'd just built up so many free spins and then they basically paid him to go away...
posted by AJaffe at 12:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


In election podcasting news, I listened to an episode of Radio Free GOP today (look at me, crossing the aisle!) and the content was interesting but the style, dear god. It kind of highlighted for me how the media we choose to consume trains us in what to expect. I now apparently expect podcasts that have been influenced by NPR house style, not conservative talk radio house style. It was jarring and weird.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


In the spirit of Steve Bannon's Government Accountability Institute, which I just learned about thanks to a nice link up-thread, I just spent some time taking a deep dive into the photos of Dr. Harold Bornstein, Trump's esteemed personal physician.

TL;DR: Three photos of Bornstein are known [#1, #2, #3] and all three appear, to my eye, to be genuine.

Dr. Bornstein also appears to be something of a character, but--you be the judge of that.

#1: Dr Bornstein's web site, courtesy of Archive.org: "We pride ourselves in ensuring your comfort and privacy."

Apparently the web site was working until late 2015/early 2016 when the domain name registration seems to have expired. Perhaps the good doctor is retiring and closing his practice?

The credits page lists Dr. Bornstein's professional information and also includes a photo of Bornstein that has circulated widely on various media and social media sites.

#2: The face in Bornstein's photo from his web site matches well with the face in the "Bornstein on the Beach" photo linked upthread, leading me to believe that the "Bornstein on the Beach" photo is genuine. (Though if I may opine, "Trump's Doctor Went to the Beach Once" is w-a-a-a-a-a-a-a-y down near the bottom of the list of unusual and remarkable things about Trump.)

#3: Slightly stranger is that Bornstein appears to have his own twitter account, in Italian no less, that has been described as "a weird parody account". As such, it is somewhat unclear whether it belongs to Bornstein himself or what. It only has a very few tweets, dating from 2013 and 2014, and they are all slightly strange but insubstantial.

However, the hbornst1 twitter account features yet another photo of Harold Bornstein that appears to be genuine. This appears to be a bit older, featuring a slightly younger version of Bornstein. A number of "Jacob Bornstein" credentials and certificates are hanging on the wall in the background, so presumably the photo dates from the time when father & son were sharing a practice.
posted by flug at 12:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


I think Trump and Bornstein share the same mad-genius barber.
posted by dis_integration at 12:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Bornstein On The Beach is my new Philip Glass opera name.
posted by uosuaq at 12:28 PM on August 17, 2016 [27 favorites]


Bornstein on the Beach? What, the Philip Glass opera?

(although as a working title for Trump: The Musical, it has some appeal...)
posted by Devonian at 12:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Very interesting piece from Josh Marshall called Mapping the Trump Hate Bubble. The article examines the relationship between the Republican Presidential campaign, white supremacy, and Russian propaganda outfits on social media.
A few days ago the Trump camp started pushing the idea that Hillary Clinton was "America's Merkel", a reference to longserving German Chancellor Angela Merkel, by many measures one of the more successful European politicians of the post-war era. Trump even personally started pushing the Twitter hashtag "#AmericasMerkel. When I started seeing this my first thought was, "How many Americans do they think have even heard of Angela Merkel, let alone see her as some awful figure in a way that tying her to Clinton would send chills down people's spines?" [...]

Merkel is now a big, big deal (in a bad way) on alt-right and white supremacist websites where she's become the poster-girl for feckless politician's who are betraying the white race. Merkel led the way on pushing an generous refugee policy vis a vis the refugee crisis emerging from Syria. [...]

"Since the start of his campaign," [Fortune] found, "Donald Trump has retweeted at least 75 users who follow at least three of the top 50 #WhiteGenocide influencers. Moreover, a majority of these retweeted accounts are themselves followed by more than 100 #WhiteGenocide influencers."

Is that a big deal? Yes, that's a huge, huge big deal.

How can it possibly make sense to Trump and his top staffers to turn their campaign over to the head of the junk-right gonzo site Breitbart News? Do they think this is going to make winning more likely as opposed to striking a nail into whatever chance they have to turnaround a terrible trend? Who knows? A perfectly plausible answer that Trump is a committed white nationalist who simply wants to run this kind of campaign.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 12:30 PM on August 17, 2016 [56 favorites]


jinx. I really should learn to count to 3 before making a Philip Glass joke. Thirty five times.


(Also, my god, it's still only half-way through August.)
posted by Devonian at 12:31 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


Trump is too skilled a businessman to go this far and be indifferent to losing. After all, a very big loss would do great damage to the Trump brand, and that brand has made him a lot of money. How big is the Trump brand? Not sure. But
Donald Trump's name shows up 3,540 times in Panama Papers
and perhaps that is another reason we are not allowed to see his tax returns.
posted by Postroad at 12:33 PM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


Oh, I was wondering what the fuck that was about, should have guessed "Nazis" as the answer.
posted by Artw at 12:33 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]




I also find it plausible that for Trump winning is a drug, he has no executive function and no ability to comprehend what winning in this context actually means and that all he knows is that he wants More Of The Winning. The fact that the Presidency lies at the end of that winning is lost on him because he doesn't have the attention span to hold those two thoughts in his head at the same time.

So yeah, he wants to win. But does he want to be President? I'm pretty sure he doesn't even understand what that means.


emphasis mine. Seriously, if I could favorite this 1,000 times I would.
posted by bologna on wry at 12:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


How can it possibly make sense to Trump and his top staffers to turn their campaign over to the head of the junk-right gonzo site Breitbart News? Do they think this is going to make winning more likely as opposed to striking a nail into whatever chance they have to turnaround a terrible trend? Who knows? A perfectly plausible answer that Trump is a committed white nationalist who simply wants to run this kind of campaign.

This is a perfectly plausible answer. I also think its a touch of (and I can't recall the name for this) him being surrounded by people who think like him and mistaking "everyone I know thinks this way" for "a majority of humanity thinks this way." If all you're surrounded by are yes men and all you see are large cheering crowds, it probably becomes easy to think "Everyone agrees with me." Especially if you've convinced yourself that all information to the contrary is deliberate lies planted by your enemies.

I'm pretty sure he doesn't even understand what that means.

"You could fill a book - a lot of books - with things Dad doesn't know. And they have."
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


dersins: "By election day Trump's campaign structure will look like a fucking croissant."

"It doesn't do the job... and it makes a fucking MESS."
posted by Rhaomi at 12:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


T.D. Strange: He's not even taking advice from O'Keefe, it's more like random commenters on the Daily Stormer and Stormfront.

That's not "random commenters," it sounds more like a dogwhistle for white supremacists:
[Donnie] fired off two press releases that same day [August 15, 2016] calling Clinton “America’s Merkel,” and took to Twitter to warn of the dangers of #AmericasMerkel.

The line of attack “baffled” political analysts, who wondered why Trump would possibly think referencing a largely-unknown European leader Merkel would help him win votes in the United States. A Pew Study last year found that “Germany is not on the radar of many Americans,” with more than a third reporting “no opinion” of Merkel at all.

But there is at least one group of Americans well familiar with Merkel, her immigration policies, and her connections to Hillary Clinton: white supremacists.

To white nationalist communities that fervently support Trump, Merkel has been a popular villain. Sites like the Daily Stormer, the White Genocide Project, American Renaissance, and The White Resister have posted constantly about her since the Syrian refugee crisis began escalating earlier this year. They have accused her of making a “deliberate attempt to turn Germany from a majority White country into a minority White country.” They have called her a “crazy childless bitch,” “Anti-White Traitor,” and “patron saint of terrorists.” They have asked in articles about her, “Why would you allow a woman to run a country, unless you were doing it as a joke?”
Yup, that's a pivot towards broader electability ... by neo-nazi skinheads and the like. If he's courting the Ayrian people so strongly, why the love of orange skin tone?
posted by filthy light thief at 12:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


Close enough that you could persuade yourself that maybe somebody would be able to alter or hide enough paper ballots to influence the count -- in FLA.

Aww, c'mon, that could only happen if George W. Bush's brother was the governor of Florida and the Florida secretary of state was co-chair of the Bush campaign. That would be sketchy.
posted by kirkaracha at 12:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Bill Bryson once pointed out that Hoover is the only person in history for whom becoming President was definitively a bad career move.

Well, other than Garfield, McKinley, Lincoln, and Kennedy, surely?
posted by entropicamericana at 12:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


If he's courting the Ayrian people so strongly, why the love of orange skin tone?

Because Oompa Loompas are a fictional idealized "noble savage" that happily work (while singing) for a white boss?
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump is too skilled a businessman...

He's a shitty businessman who's severely underperformed the S&P his entire life. He'd actually be as rich as he claims if he'd just put it in a fund. Everything he's done and said has literally cost him money.
posted by chris24 at 12:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [51 favorites]


He may not be doing a very good job at running for office, but the simplest explanation is that he's not very good at it, not that he has some double-secret backwards plans to self-promote while actively trying to lose.

Yes, but...I think it's just hard for people to believe that he's really this bad at it. I mean, I'm sure I couldn't win an election – running a successful campaign, especially on this scale, is hard. But he's doing a spectacularly awful, self-sabotaging job of it – refusing to take advice from anyone, attacking and offending every group under the sun (including his own party and their allies), saying all sorts of contradictory and nonsensical things that open him up to obvious criticism, not buying ads, campaigning in solidly blue states instead of battlegrounds, etc. If he is, in fact, campaigning, then he isn't just campaigning poorly – he's campaigning pathologically.

And it's not like he screwed up once or twice, and then learned from his mistakes – he doubles, triples, and quadruples down, even as his poll numbers plummet and his media coverage sours. It's not like he hasn't been told how to fix it – the media, and plenty of folks within his own party, have been talking for months about how strange and self-defeating his campaign tactics are, and how he desperately needs to "pivot" if he wants to win.

It's a campaign in the sense that he's been christened as his party's nominee, and will be on the ballot in November – but in every other sense, it's just an incoherent clusterfuck. It's really difficult to reconcile his behavior over the last few months with a sincere desire to win. (Unless his erratic behavior is a symptom of mental illness, Alzheimer's, or drug addiction – all of which are real possibilities, in my mind, although dementia seems the least likely.)

I'm not necessarily saying that Trump is trying to throw the election (although I certainly wonder sometimes). I'm just saying that I understand why people speculate about it.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 12:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


Aww, c'mon, that could only happen if George W. Bush's brother was the governor of Florida and the Florida secretary of state was co-chair of the Bush campaign. That would be sketchy.

But even if that happened, such vote tampering happens in close margin elections. Larger manipulations raise more flags, as you'll find significant differences from exit polls to final voter tallies, and the US isn't so broken as to turn a blind eye to that. Within the margin of error though? That's doable.
posted by filthy light thief at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


he's campaigning pathologically.

He's campaigning as himself. Everything that's so awful has always been there, it just didn't matter in the GOP primary because he appealed to their racism and that's all they cared about.

If you ever doubt the Republican Party is largely a bunch of racists and bigots, just think of this: all they had to do to have a great chance to win the presidency, keep congress and be able to repeal Obamacare, pass tax cuts, defund Planned Parenthood, etc., as well as control the Supreme Court for decades and overturn Roe v. Wade, affirmative action, gay rights, etc., was not nominate a racist, narcissistic, sociopathic buffoon. But they couldn't help but vote for the guy saying the racist, bigoted things most of them think. And now they're going to lose it all, thanks to the very people - black, brown, women, LGBT - they've been trying to keep down.
posted by chris24 at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2016 [80 favorites]


Trump can't stop making insane racist dog whistles even though he nominally wants to win the election.
Your brother-in-law can't stop going to bet on the horses even though he nominally wants to save up for a sweet Pontiac Thunderbird.

They both think they're working toward their goals despite actually moving away from them. Some people are just bad at realizing their goals in the framework of the real world.
posted by 0xFCAF at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


On the bright side, one of the many, many things that Trump has damaged with his run is the idea that under capitalism, wealth and smarts go together. We are, thanks to the orange moron, one step closer to understanding that under capitalism, wealth primarily tracks to access to a big inheritance rather than to any innate merit of the wealth-holder.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:54 PM on August 17, 2016 [32 favorites]


I think it's an example of Dunning-Kruger poisoning.
posted by Deoridhe at 12:55 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


To be fair to Michael Moore, at the time, he was getting his poll results from Nate Silver.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 12:58 PM on August 17, 2016


I think I've been spending too much time reading all these weird stories about the election, 'cause now the dark side of my brain is starting to wonder if Putin's interest in Trump could be more sinister. With Trump playing a useful fool, spouting off about "Crooked Hillary" and stolen elections, there could be some real damage done to the entire system here if anything would happen to him before the election. Given Putin's history, I just can't let go of my suspicion of that sort of thinking being somewhere in the realm of possibility for him. I'm not keen on conspiratorial thinking generally, so I won't expand on the notion, but wrongheaded or not it kinda troubles me.
posted by gusottertrout at 1:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm not necessarily saying that Trump is trying to throw the election (although I certainly wonder sometimes). I'm just saying that I understand why people speculate about it.

All it takes to understand Trump is to remember that hardly anyone in his life has ever been able to tell him "no." He has assumptions about the world, and his place in it and his abilities, that result from being a narcissist who has been completely sheltered from negative consequences his whole life; brainwashed by his own wealth, if you like. And people still tiptoe! Because if they don't he fires them. Who among his staff will last very long if they tell him "that's bad, that hurts you, don't do that"? He has presumed and blustered his way to this place, helped by a media that basically eggs him on and a GOP that has abandoned all pretense of focus or discipline or ethics as "liberal" compromises of their purity.

He's an opportunistic virus of a person, bred in a swampy puddle of wealth and rampaging through the GOP's compromised immune system unopposed.
posted by emjaybee at 1:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [32 favorites]


Everything he's done and said has literally cost him money.

And building on this, even if you could convince him of it, I think he'd say fine. Because being an actual billionaire with money in a fund would not feed his ego like being a indebted millionaire on TV. The billions lost are opportunity cost for a narcissist.
posted by chris24 at 1:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


the dark side of my brain is starting to wonder if Putin's interest in Trump could be more sinister

I don't wonder. I am sure of it. Putin is the enemy of the U.S. and the west in every way. He has plenty of irons in the fire -- dismantling NATO and getting our missiles out of the way of further expansion into Europe, operating puppet dictatorships, creating a strong sphere of influence (including Iran and Turkey and Syria) in the middle East and excluding the U.S., disrupting our political system and trying to install another puppet dictator here, etc. Check out this Slate piece. When it comes to Putin, I think conspiracy theory is quite valid.
posted by bearwife at 1:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


the "Bornstein on the Beach" photo linked upthread

Pretty sure that's Sammy Hagar.
posted by bongo_x at 1:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


How 'Real' Donald Trump And 'Public' Donald Trump Square Up | Morning Joe | MSNBC (includes Radio Free GOP's Mike Murphy)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is a serious proposal (from my acting years).

The person Hillary should get to play Trump in preparation for the debate is Hillary. She could get someone else to be herself.

I think a bit of role reversal will help her learn how to skewer him. And listening to someone else play herself will add some perspective to coming up with the best answer. Besides, I think she'd have a blast.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:11 PM on August 17, 2016 [51 favorites]


I really don't think all the campaign failure can be placed at Donald's feet. Sure he is lousy at it but so are the rest of the Republican party.

They do well at the state level where they have gerrymandered the process into being played on Easy level for them. They step up to the national level where they have no such advantage and suddenly the game is harder. Much much harder. And the people who play on the hard setting all the time have the advantage.

Mitt Romney had an incompetent team and delusional polling despite having and spending tons of money. He had the best team the Republicans could put together and it still wasn't good. The problem is when you are ideologically anti-government you also tend to be pretty bad at organization and management.

They also essentially have a largely mercenary army of staff that are only in it for personal gain (thanks to a couple decades of Randian objectivist anti-socialization) and what counts as personal gain often conflicts with the campaigns goals. A Brietbartian in charge of the campaign? What's better for Brietbart? A Trump presidency or a Clinton presidency? Only one of those generates outrage eyeballs for a drudge clone. PACs and consultants have robbed the right's donors blind for the last few election cycles with crazy shell game contracts that make money go around in tight circles in one small office in D.C. rather than to street level campaign efforts in battleground states.

Donald is an evil clown and all but don't ignore that the entire federal level of the republican party is built on the very worst foundation possible.

If they were remotely competent they would win but if they were remotely competent they probably wouldn't still be the same republican party.
posted by srboisvert at 1:15 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


No, no, not trying to install a fool like Trump, since that could never have seemed all that likely, more like using Trump to spread more calumny about Hillary and our system, then, well, sacrifice his pawn in a way that might seem to implicate our whole system as corrupt to those who've long believed or entertained stories of Vince Foster and so on.
posted by gusottertrout at 1:17 PM on August 17, 2016


If we are very lucky, Trump will not win and the Democrats (or progressives in general) will use that campaign as an innoculation of sorts. Trump represents the worst impulses of American politics, but crippled by an apparent inability to run a decent campaign. If anyone with his political leanings ever turns out to be competent, America is completely fucked unless progressives learn something from this whole mess.
posted by chrominance at 1:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


All it takes to understand Trump is to remember that hardly anyone in his life has ever been able to tell him "no."

If I've understood his history, this is the first job in his life he's actually had to apply for - as in, convince someone to give him the job instead of handing it to someone else. He's had plenty of negotiations, for TV series and probably business mergers and the like, but those weren't "do we go with Person A or Person B?" They were "Do we accept Trump's deal, or decide it wouldn't bring us the money (etc) that we want?"

Even now - he's campaigning more against Obama and "the system" than against Hillary, and what he does aim against Hillary is personal-character attacks, because he can't wrap his head around the idea of people with a pros-and-cons grid that has his and Hillary's names at the top. It's like he doesn't think comparisons exist; it's all "is X good or bad?" (and if X is good, Y must be bad), rather than "in what ways is X better than Y?"

He's had to convince people he's awesome, that his plans are good and will make them money, that he shares their goals, etc. He's never had to convince anyone that he was the better choice.

That's why he thinks it was more impressive to beat 17 candidates than to beat 1.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 1:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Yes, but...I think it's just hard for people to believe that he's really this bad at it.

Couldn't it just be white male privilege? Think about it: he gets practically limitless benefit of the doubt. Even we are sitting around doing our damnedest to find any excuse at all for Trump's miserable failure of campaigning. We look at Trump commit fuck-up after fuck-up after fuck-up, and rather than appeal to the well-established prior belief that "ninety percent of all people are incompetent", we insist that, no, Trump is competent, he's just competently doing something else!

Why do we insist on taking Trump's competence as an axiom? Because he's a white man. If Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama were this far behind in the polls, do you think Republicans would be wringing their hands wondering what their real game is?

tl;dr: Calling Trump incompetent is a radical act.
posted by J.K. Seazer at 1:34 PM on August 17, 2016 [68 favorites]


Couldn't it just be white male privilege?

That's a good notion, and I'm sure it's partly responsible, but we liberals also have a long, established history of perpetual panic and an unmatched skill at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


An alternative explanation to "Trump wants to win" is "Trump is a contrarian ideologue." Similar to how third-party candidates rarely give a damn about electability as long as they get a microphone.

The downside to this is that Trump's actual ideology is incoherence piled onto an alt-right incoherence. He's not even Nader, much less Debs or Roosevelt.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 1:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


and reports are that accounts of his being purportedly "managed" is what led to Paul Manafort's ouster.

In other words, an acknowledgment by those near Trump that Trump has weaknesses is what enraged him, leading to a probable exacerbation of his weaknesses

You fucking incompetent loser, Donald J. Trump. Can we get a tweet storm going at him to that effect?
posted by angrycat at 1:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


"...hardly anyone in his life has ever been able to tell him 'no.'"
"he gets practically limitless benefit of the doubt"
I'm probably going to say this really clumsily, but here goes anyway. Donald Trump seems to be in a position similar to Michael Jackson's toward the end of his life. Too much money or "money" and too much fame and nobody on Earth willing and able to talk sense to them and prevent them from doing and saying whatever occurs to them. I really think what's happened to him is probably inevitable to some degree for a lot of people and maybe even most people who get up this high. People who are constantly indulged and protected from disappointment must all to some degree lose touch with reality. This situation must be essentially similar to its counterpart on the other end of the continuum, namely solitary confinement. Both states of being leave you with no way of checking that your ideas are real. It always seems to end badly: they always suffer in the end. In this case, given that the spoiledcrazy person in question wants to be president and has a relationship with truth and morality like that of a two-year-old child, his suffering when he finally runs full tilt into the wall of real life will be all of ours, too.

He's reading the wrong fable, that snake thing? He should be reading The Fisherman's Wife.
posted by Don Pepino at 1:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Propped Up on Pillows

This is one of the top links on Drudge right now. Comfy!
posted by acidic at 1:52 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


pillowgate will be her undoing
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 1:54 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


A woman a few years younger than my mother (but apparently in better health) needs ergonomic seating. Such a scandal.
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 1:55 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Okay, I am still behind on all the election threads (including this one, which I will read tonight), so I'm sorry if this has already been discussed, but I am getting increasingly worried about a Trump victory. And I have been one of the more relaxed people about this all along - always believing that he can't overcome his deficit in pretty much every demographic except a specific white male demographic and thinking he'd probably put his foot in his mouth anyway (he's been living up to expectations there) and ruin his chances.

But I've seen a few comments on my facebook feed recently that make me think that he still has more support than we give him credit for. I think that (at least in my circles) anyone who supports him knows there's kind of a stigma associated with it now, as the general populace has become more and more appalled by what he's doing and saying. They've kind of started to just keep their support to themselves. It makes me worry that there are a lot of supporters out there who won't say so but will vote for him in November. I mean, he's been outrageous this entire time and I feel like anyone who supported him initially but was open to having their mind changed would have turned away months ago.

I may be totally off base with this - like I said, I'm behind on my election coverage reading - but I've been thinking about it as I've seen some people I know (who seem otherwise reasonable) say nice things about Trump. These are the type of people that I thought would have been turned off with some of the garbage that he's doing and saying, but no, they're still true believers.
posted by triggerfinger at 1:57 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Propped Up on Pillows

DON'T READ THE COMMENTS DON'T READ THE COMMENTS
posted by joyceanmachine at 1:57 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


nobody tell them about fdr okay
posted by entropicamericana at 1:58 PM on August 17, 2016 [24 favorites]


Just more evidence that Shillary is in the clutches of Big Pillow.
posted by Justinian at 1:59 PM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


I bet Crooked Hillary even has pillows under her head when she gets her 7-8 hours of sleep a night. Sad!
posted by asteria at 2:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [38 favorites]


There is a direct coloration between people who unironically use arrows to point to things in pictures and belief in lizard people.
posted by Tevin at 2:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


Have we started a countdown for when Trump leaks the contents of his security briefing?
posted by Dashy at 2:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Crooked Pillowry
posted by kirkaracha at 2:01 PM on August 17, 2016 [26 favorites]


Have we started a countdown for when Trump leaks the contents of his security briefing?

I've actually wondered for a while if Trump would be deliberately fed false information just to test his ability to not leak it.
posted by Faint of Butt at 2:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


Even the pillow sham is a sham! (literally)
posted by a lungful of dragon at 2:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Breaking News: Short person uses pillow to brace back while sitting in chair.
posted by humanfont at 2:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


If it is the case that Trunp supporters become reverse Bradley-effect voters who keep their choice to themselves and lie to pollsters and secretly pull the lever for the racist (which I believe will be the case with at least some of his voters), then he is losing this thing. It's counterintuitive but it means he's continuing to act in the shameful ways that have cost him educated republican voters.

We are at a tipping point in American history that's gone less remarked than it deserves: a presidential campaign cannot count on a majority of voters even being secretly just outright racist as a first principle in all but the former confederate states. And even then, Virginia, N Carolina and Georgia are slipping away.
posted by spitbull at 2:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


What the fuck are the pillows supposed to be evidence of?
posted by defenestration at 2:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


REMEMBER HOW SCALIA DIED.
posted by Artw at 2:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [43 favorites]


I believe they found the egg that held the needle that was his phylactery and broke it, right?
posted by griphus at 2:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


But I've seen a few comments on my facebook feed recently that make me think that he still has more support than we give him credit for.

There’s No Evidence Of The ‘Bradley Effect’ In Trump Polls
posted by chris24 at 2:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


I am getting increasingly worried about a Trump victory.

Hillary Clinton has an 88% chance of winning the presidency. The Real Key in the Electoral College: "Clinton is ahead by at least 10 points in states which are alone enough to win her the presidency."

It makes me worry that there are a lot of supporters out there who won't say so but will vote for him in November.

No, Voters Aren’t Secretly Pining for Donald Trump:
... if Trump’s poll numbers were suffering from voter embarrassment, we probably would have seen it already. But Trump did not reliably outperform the polls in actual voting during the Republican primaries.
posted by kirkaracha at 2:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


REMEMBER HOW SCALIA DIED.

True fact: Pillow mints kill!
posted by a lungful of dragon at 2:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


a query: why do they give the security briefing prior to the election? I guess I'm proud of my country that Trump's turd tornado of a candidacy is historically bad, but hasn't somebody prior to this been like *wait we could have a batshitinsane person one of these days* maybe let's save the super secret info about alien contact or whatever until the person actually has the keys to the car
posted by angrycat at 2:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


What the fuck are the pillows supposed to be evidence of?

Those aren't pillows!
posted by kirkaracha at 2:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


One thing that I suddenly remembered from my annually required compliance training at the bank where I work. Employers can absolutely discriminate on the basis of political affiliation.

It's included as one of the multiple choice options that seems like it might be correct but isn't. The more cynical side of me thinks it might also be a subtle way for my employer to remind me that having political views that directly oppose those of my company can grounds for termination. But it also means that I can fire people for being racist.

But so long as it stay relegated specifically to Trump, it might not be terrible if supporting Trump makes it more difficult for people to get hired. I'm not sure that's a can of worms I want to open, but I'm not sure it's one I want to leave closed either.
posted by VTX at 2:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


a query: why do they give the security briefing prior to the election? I guess I'm proud of my country that Trump's turd tornado of a candidacy is historically bad, but hasn't somebody prior to this been like *wait we could have a batshitinsane person one of these days* maybe let's save the super secret info about alien contact or whatever until the person actually has the keys to the car

Truman started the tradition in 1952 after he suddenly became President and had no awareness of the Manhattan Project, among other important things he suddenly needed to concern himself with:
Priess says by 1952, Truman had made up his mind that his successor should assume the Oval Office better prepared than he had been, so he offered classified briefings to each of the nominees, a tradition that's held ever since. Not everyone accepts the offer. Walter Mondale turned it down in 1984 before losing in a landslide to Ronald Reagan.
posted by zachlipton at 2:15 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


Angrycat: Maddow covered it very thoroughly last night, but tl,dr, Truman was pissed that no one told him about the bomb until 12 days into his presidency.

(Or what zachlipton said)
posted by Sophie1 at 2:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


a query: why do they give the security briefing prior to the election?

It's not like an open book of every dirty secret in US history. It's information about events that have potential to affect national security and that the candidate needs stay up to speed on in the event that there is a national security crisis on inauguration day.

It's important that the Commander-in-Chief be able to hit the ground running as it relates to national security and the briefings are one of the things that enable that.
posted by VTX at 2:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


What the fuck are the pillows supposed to be evidence of?

The implication seems to be that she's lazy or in poor health, or that she's an over-privileged elitist who can't just sit in a chair like NORMAL people - she's gotta have extra-special "make life easy on me" cushions even in the most casual of settings.

Nevermind that none of those settings are actually casual, and that most chairs and couches are designed for the "comfort" of people who are 6' tall. (I am 5'2" tall. Chairs are always too tall and too deep; I would be more comfortable in most toddler-sized chairs if they could take adult weight.)

So, um, yeah, the news here is "Spry grandmother prefers to sit in comfort and has the clout to demand that when she's giving public presentations."
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


And now it's time for President Hillary Clinton's weekly podcast

White House Pillow Talk.

"The State of the Union is .....fluffy!"
posted by srboisvert at 2:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


"I've just heard from top security experts, top security men, that Russia is running a Manchurian Candidate! Obama is allowing that! Crooked Hillary is allowing that!"
posted by Artw at 2:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [54 favorites]


See, I don't think there'd be much of a Bradley effect in a Republican primary context. Even the reverse would seem more likely -- especially among women who tell their male friends they're for Trump but vote otherwise (picture the white office staff of a medium sized lumber business in Alabama).

But I suspect in the general it's gonna be different for the same reasons Trump is sliding in the polls. He doesn't dog whistle, he shrieks ugly and inappropriate racist and misogynist hyena calls. Among educated suburban republicans he is becoming more and more embarrassing and toxic.

But some of those people are racist beneath the surface and I could see them voting Trump in the anonymous privacy of the booth.

These are people who laugh at the joke "what's the first line of any racist joke" - to which the answer is a furtive glance around to see who might be listening first.
posted by spitbull at 2:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


what if you have to have a secret summit with the Final Boss of Terrorism and there are no pillows in the secret meeting place and because you don't have proper lumbar support you are distracted and you accidentally surrender the eastern seaboard to Terrorstan
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


Maddow covered it very thoroughly last night

Isn't everyone doing the homework?

(kidding) [fake, this election has no homework]
posted by zutalors! at 2:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]




The Upshot currently lists Arizona, Florida, Georgia, Iowa, Missouri, Nevada, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, South Carolina as the most competitive states. Some scenarios:

If Clinton only wins Florida and Trump wins the rest, she wins.
If Clinton only wins Ohio, she wins.
If Clinton only wins Pennsylvania, she wins.
If Clinton wins North Carolina and Iowa and Trump wins the rest, she wins.
If Clinton wins North Carolina and Nevada, she wins.
posted by kirkaracha at 2:25 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Seriously though, who among us could resist Big Pillow?
posted by srboisvert at 2:26 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


You know how you start a new job and like the first three months is full of stuff like figuring out where the tissues are when your box runs out, or that this particular group of people always goes to lunch on Thursdays, or what the hell is going on with our relations with North Korea?

Yeah, I don't want a president to start this particular job playing catch-up, even if I'm a little nervous about the idea of Trump getting these briefings. This is not like trying to figure out where the timesheets are on the network drive.
posted by Sequence at 2:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Terrorstan

Terrorstan is the birthplace pillows. [might be fake i am not sure]
posted by srboisvert at 2:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Propped Up on Pillows

I have seen some seriously, deeply stupid shit in my 25 years of internet life and 45 years of life life.

This thing here is a legit contender for the title of stupidest shit I have ever seen.
posted by dersins at 2:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [79 favorites]


> Truman started the tradition in 1952 after he suddenly became President and had no awareness of the Manhattan Project, among other important things he suddenly needed to concern himself with:

I was just reading about this in Six Months in 1945: FDR, Stalin, Churchill, and Truman--from World War to Cold War, which was a pretty good book and really did a great job of showing how much personality and character impact world politics at that high level.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Criticizing the use of throw pillows is how you earn the female vote. [so very false]
posted by srboisvert at 2:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Amazing exchange on CNN.

"You guys are down"
"Says who?"
"... polls? Most of them? All of them?"
posted by Aznable at 2:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [99 favorites]




I think a bit of role reversal will help her learn how to skewer him.

I love imagining the rise she could get out of him by the careful application of gendered insults. "No need to be so shrill, Donald, you have a microphone." "Well, that seemed a bit hysterical, but let me say..."
posted by solotoro at 2:32 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


Pillowgate is just what Trump needs to beat the stuffing out of her! I'll bet she'll be "down" in the polls!
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 2:34 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


That bloomberg article really is scary. The part that really got me:

To this end, Hall peppers his colleagues with slogans so familiar around the office that they’re known by their abbreviations. “ABBN — always be breaking news,” he says. Another slogan is “depth beats speed.” Time-strapped reporters squeezed for copy will gratefully accept original, fact-based research because most of what they’re inundated with is garbage. “The modern economics of the newsroom don’t support big investigative reporting staffs,” says Bannon. “You wouldn’t get a Watergate, a Pentagon Papers today, because nobody can afford to let a reporter spend seven months on a story. We can. We’re working as a support function.”

The reason GAI does this is because it’s the secret to how conservatives can hack the mainstream media. Hall has distilled this, too, into a slogan: “Anchor left, pivot right.” It means that “weaponizing” a story onto the front page of the New York Times (“the Left”) is infinitely more valuable than publishing it on Breitbart.com. “We don’t look at the mainstream media as enemies because we don’t want our work to be trapped in the conservative ecosystem,” says Hall. “We live and die by the media. Every time we’re launching a book, I’ll build a battle map that literally breaks down by category every headline we’re going to place, every op-ed Peter’s going to publish. Some of it is a wish list. But it usually gets done.”

posted by bukvich at 2:34 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]



I love imagining the rise she could get out of him by the careful application of gendered insults. "No need to be so shrill, Donald, you have a microphone." "Well, that seemed a bit hysterical, but let me say..."


I hope she keeps it as wonky as possible.
posted by zutalors! at 2:34 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


What I don't really grok is why the briefings have to start now that there are still two candidates and not, you know, the day after the election. It would still be plenty of time before the Inauguration and seems less risky from a national security perspective.
posted by lydhre at 2:35 PM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


That Michael Cohen ("special counsel to Mister Trump" lol) is almost as Mafioso in mien as Manafort himself.

That was an amazing exchange. You're down. Says who? The polls. Long silence. You're down. Says who? The polls! Which ones? All of them! Silence.

At some point will one of these so-called journalists say "that's it, interview over, you're not coming back on the air until you answer a question by at least entertaining the premise that we live in a shared objective fucking reality."

I mean, anyone?
posted by spitbull at 2:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [46 favorites]


Pillowghazi, surely
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


The pillow thing is them trying to "don't you think she looks tired?" her.
posted by Ragged Richard at 2:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


> Amazing exchange on CNN.

I didn't find that funny at all. Look at how angry that guy was at having his worldview - which is clearly based on erroneous information, or cognitive dissonance, or both - challenged, and at how hard he was biting down on his anger. I would bet you ten bucks he was imagining himself punching that woman in the face during that exchange. And this isn't some dude on the street, it's someone working on Trump's campaign at the highest levels.
posted by The Card Cheat at 2:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Oh it wasn't funny in the slightest. Dude is an outright thug.
posted by spitbull at 2:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


On the subject of silly "Trump is a Clinton cat's paw" conspiracy theories, a friend of mine posted this to his facebook a few days ago:
An imagined Clinton/Trump conspiracy gone awry would be a great screenplay: Clinton hires Trump to run for office, the deal is that he just gets to promote himself and then after he secures the nomination, he acts like a heel until he crosses the line and becomes unelectable. In exchange, they throw a few million dollars his way - he just has to play his part and promise to not divulge his tax returns.

After he successfully gets the nomination, he starts ramping up the crazy but it's not working, people are eating it up. He's panicking, starting to worry that to avoid having a serious shot at becoming president, he'll have to do more damage to his image than the deal could ever be worth. Clinton's realizing that mobilizing the white nationalist right might not have been a great move.

It ends with them turning on each other and wrestling on live television during the last debate; Clinton pulls Trump's hair piece off, stuffs it down his throat, and brutally fights off the secret service as he chokes out. She emerges from the melee with a bloody, victorious smile, slowly realizing on camera that killing her opponent and erstwhile co-conspiratory doesn't win her the election. Jill Stein becomes president, the closing scene is her in the oval office making a late night overseas call, "Agent Zero reporting for orders" in perfect Russian.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


At some point will one of these so-called journalists say "that's it, interview over, you're not coming back on the air until you answer a question by at least entertaining the premise that we live in a shared objective fucking reality."

SEZ HOO!?
posted by leotrotsky at 2:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


I like the image of stoned Gary Johnson fucking up Putin's carefully laid plans and winning by accident amidst the carnage.
posted by spitbull at 2:44 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


What I don't really grok is why the briefings have to start now that there are still two candidates and not, you know, the day after the election. It would still be plenty of time before the Inauguration and seems less risky from a national security perspective.

That's only plenty of time if you are as smart as Scott Adams.
posted by srboisvert at 2:45 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


>> At some point will one of these so-called journalists say "that's it, interview over, you're not coming back on the air until you answer a question by at least entertaining the premise that we live in a shared objective fucking reality."

> SEZ HOO!?


One of the really remarkable things about this election is that it's forcing us to finally admit that epistemology is a political issue.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]


> Amazing exchange on CNN.

I spent a minute wondering how he could have possibly imagined that going, before realizing challenging basic facts was probably basically an autonomic function rather than a considered decision.
posted by aubilenon at 2:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


after-the-credits bonus scene: Mitt Romney and Evan McMullin hanging out in a McDonalds parking lot, eating McMuffins. "Co-presidents of Utah?" Mitt suggests. They fist-bump.
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


SEZ HOO!?

Thomas M. Cooley Law School must be just delighted by the free advertising they are getting.

NO SUCH THING AS BAD PUBLICITY!
posted by srboisvert at 2:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


anyway, these days no one really thinks there's a shared objective fucking reality. The best we can really do is argue that we have a shared intersubjective fucking reality.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:48 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


The pillow thing is them trying to "don't you think she looks tired?" her.

10 could really be a dick, sometimes. "I'm so mad at you for killing the aliens who tried to enslave the earth because 'they were leaving' so I'm going to gaslight you into getting fired."

Where the hell do you think the Sycorax were going 10? On holiday?!
posted by leotrotsky at 2:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Amazing exchange on CNN.

I didn't find that funny at all. Look at how angry that guy was at having his worldview - which is clearly based on erroneous information, or cognitive dissonance, or both - challenged, and at how hard he was biting down on his anger.


I laughed out loud. Humor is subjective, you're explanation for why it wasn't funny is mine for why it is. But really, what I saw was a smackdown delivered, properly.
posted by bongo_x at 2:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


To paraphrase a bit, objective reality believes in us.
posted by spitbull at 2:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Propped Up on Pillows

MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Supported by Floors
MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Holding Up Hair with Her Head
MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Using Special "Moving" Stairs
MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Resting Papers on Special Raised Platform
MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Conveyed by Horseless Carriage
MUST SEE: Photos of Hillary Clinton Using Written Symbols to Communicate Thoughts, Ideas.
posted by PlusDistance at 2:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [79 favorites]


The best we can really do is argue that we have a shared intersubjective fucking reality.

Speak for yourself. I am aiming for shared inter-subjective reality fucking.

It's not even 5pm and I am drunk with pillows.
posted by srboisvert at 2:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm propped on a pillow at this very moment. I didn't realize I was playing "Hillary Clinton: The Home Game," so thanks for making me feel that bit closer to the candidate.
posted by zachlipton at 2:52 PM on August 17, 2016 [47 favorites]


I bet she's got like dozens of stuffed animals on her bed and she makes Bill learn all their names
posted by thelonius at 2:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [29 favorites]


> Speak for yourself. I am aiming for shared inter-subjective reality fucking.

You are R.U. Sirius and I claim my five pounds.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:55 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


Seth Masket at 538: How A Trump Debacle Could Affect The House And State Legislatures:
For one, congressional and state legislative seat shares track each other closely — a finding reported in political scientist Steven Rogers’ research. This is consistent with the idea that voters don’t know much about their state legislative candidates and largely vote the party line — they make a decision about their congressional candidate and then tend to vote accordingly down the ballot.

Another trend we see is that presidential results do not map perfectly onto the shifts in state legislative seats. Yes, when a party wins a presidential race, it tends to win legislative seats. But the president’s coattails aren’t necessarily very long. Presidents Dwight Eisenhower (in 1956), Richard Nixon (1972) and Ronald Reagan (1984) won with substantial re-election margins but weren’t able to bring many congressional or state legislative seats with them. On the other hand, Lyndon Johnson’s 1964 presidential landslide came alongside many Democratic pickups, and the unpopular Jimmy Carter brought many legislators and House members down with him in 1980.
posted by palindromic at 2:56 PM on August 17, 2016


Yeah, I didn't know my need for lumbar support made me presidential, but after I get out of this recliner I'mma go sign some bills into law and maybe deploy the military somewhere. [fake. This comfy chair is not a recliner.]
posted by Cookiebastard at 2:56 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


That pillow article is obviously ridiculous and deserving of scorn. What's not funny is that it showed up in my Google Now list of "Stories to Read" about the election.
posted by zakur at 2:56 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


God. With that Trump satire I mentioned up thread, like the very fucking first thing I wrote down was,

"Like the Producers? Too obvious"

GODDAMMIT.
posted by schadenfrau at 2:56 PM on August 17, 2016


One of the really remarkable things about this election is that it's forcing us to finally admit that epistemology is a political issue.

CLINTON: ...which creates difficulties, as David Hume argues, "That the sun will not rise tomorrow is no less intelligible a proposition, and implies no more contradiction, than the affirmation, that it will rise."

TRUMP: SEZ HOO?

CLINTON: Are you serious? I just ...I just told you that a moment ago.

TRUMP: (Frowning intensifies)
posted by leotrotsky at 2:56 PM on August 17, 2016 [45 favorites]


REMEMBER HOW SCALIA DIED.


Auto-erotic asphyxiation?
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 2:58 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


CLINTON: ...which creates difficulties, as David Hume argues, "That the sun will not rise tomorrow is no less intelligible a proposition, and implies no more contradiction, than the affirmation, that it will rise."

TRUMP: SEZ HOO?

CLINTON: Are you serious? I just ...I just told you that a moment ago.

TRUMP: (Frowning intensifies)
okay I just legit loled.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:58 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


For the sake of MetaFilter unity, I'm not going to just incredulously drop "Polls? Most of them? All of them?" after somebody makes a comment that I can't believe. But it's a very tempting idea.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 2:58 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Ask people flooded out in Lousiana or burned out in California or paying an AC bill in New York if they believe in the objective reality that this July was the hottest month in the global history of temperature records. Because it is busy believing in them.
[real]
posted by spitbull at 3:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


re: Security Briefings and Trump

OK, buckle up again and apologies in advance.

They should give Trump accurate information and not worry about it.

Trump has a reputation of just making shit up. His statements thus far have been 55% false. Indeed, anytime he opens his mouth its impossible to immediately know if anything he says is truth or a lie without fact checking. Sometimes, his statements aren't just misrepresentations but out and out flights of fancy - like stuff that nobody else believes, maybe not even Trump believes it.

He also doesn't seem to have any internal editor so its entirely possible that he'll let slip some vital piece of information without intending to do so.

He's also a self-promoting piece of shit who likes to be important, so its entirely possible that he'll hint at some big important secret he knows (or out and out spills it) just to feel more important.

But, as I said, he's also a huge liar. Its possible that he'll make shit up that is not part of the security briefing and state that so he can feel important, manipulate/scare potential voters or just because in the Wonderful Land up Trump (tm) a magic (vodka) goat told him to share it.

Naturally, we don't want state secrets being blurted out in public, but Trump is very possibly going to blurt. He will blurt long, he will blurt hard. Blurting will happen.

So, if he blurts out a genuine true piece of secret information, just the fact that he said it will call that piece's of information's veracity into doubt. Is it really something he heard? Is it something he invented? Only the folks who gave him his briefing will know for sure and if they take action, they'll immediately be confirming that it is true, which is arguably worse than just letting it float out there as more word poo from Trump's face anus.

Yes, it might also be giving information out to our country's foes, but they also won't know if its true or false. Maybe it causes an international situation, maybe everyone just goes "That's our Trump!" and pretends its not true.

Now, if you give him a false piece of information, the exact same process occurs. The only bonuses are the intelligence community becomes convinced they can't trust him. I imagine they don't need any extra proof to demonstrate this. Furthermore, you risk turning a lie designed to trip up Trump into a genuine situation. Like, let's say you lie to him and say "Canada is planning to invade" and he shares that out. Now you have Canada going "wait, we never said that" and where you didn't have a problem with Canada before, maybe you have one now. Or maybe they just say "That's our Trump!" and move on.

Furthermore, if you lie to him and it gets out that you lied to him, there's more evidence that the intelligence community isn't to be trusted and the world is conspiring against Trump. Why give him more ammunition?

So, long story short, Trump's history of lying might actually mean he's somewhat safer with state secrets than one might expect of a person who can't keep a secret because nobody will believe him.

He's basically the candidate who cries (vodka) wolf. At some point you realize there is never going to be wolf nor vodka at the door.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


What are those pillows stuffed with? Baby seals? Poisoned cotton candy? Miniature Guatemalans? We don't know! The scandals just go on and on.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 3:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Have we started a countdown for when Trump leaks the contents of his security briefing?

My instinctual answer to this was he would leak during his next rally, which is tomorrow. But then, logically, I need to rethink this based on Trump's Razor: what would the stupidest answer be?

1. He'll leak before the end of the day. Probably on Twitter.
2. It will be fake intel provided to him so that he doesn't leak real intel.
3. The fake "intel" he leaks will be, at most, 75% correct. It will come out that Trump got it wrong and wasn't paying attention during the briefing.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 3:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]


I laughed out loud.

My wife, who works in polling, snorted.
posted by waitingtoderail at 3:06 PM on August 17, 2016


Speaking seriously: I'll bet the pillows help her sit comfortably in her bulletproof vest.
posted by maryr at 3:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [29 favorites]


or that she's an over-privileged elitist who can't just sit in a chair like NORMAL people

"Let Van from his coolers of silver drink wine,
And lounge on his cushioned settee,
Our man on a buckeye bench can recline,
Content with hard cider is he."

"The Log Cabin Song," sung by Harrison supporters about Martin Van Buren during the election of 1840. Interestingly, Van Buren a short man, was also mocked as "Little Van." (Tho, "Van Van is a used up man" is my favorite.)

Nothing ever changes.
posted by octobersurprise at 3:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


i get where Truman was coming from
but imagine if Trump succeeded FDR and he learned about the bomb
I mean I kind of don't think we would be around discussing this
posted by angrycat at 3:11 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


If Trump had succeeded FDR, one hopes they wouldn't have told him.
posted by maryr at 3:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Giuliani declares Trump's stump speech on Tuesday ‘the best speech that any Republican has ever given.’ [real]
posted by zakur at 3:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


What are those pillows stuffed with? Baby seals? Poisoned cotton candy? Miniature Guatemalans? We don't know! The scandals just go on and on.

THE ALIEN CYBORG THAT CONTROLS HER THOUGHTS AND MOVEMENTS LIKE SOME KIND OF PUPPET

OH MY GOD IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW
posted by indubitable at 3:18 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


If Trump had succeeded FDR...
"You say we should drop them on Hiroshima and, what's that, Teriyaki? Nah, drop 'em straight on downtown Tokyo, it'll teach 'em a lesson. And one of Berlin too... I know they already surrendered but, dayum they deserve it. And it'll squelch those rumors that my grandfather was German."
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:18 PM on August 17, 2016


Vanity Fair sees PillowArrowGate, counters with MUST SEE: PHOTOS OF DONALD TRUMP RESTING ON LECTERNS.

It's got arrows, you guys.
posted by maryr at 3:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [50 favorites]


"The Log Cabin Song," sung by Harrison supporters about Martin Van Buren during the election of 1840. Interestingly, Van Buren a short man, was also mocked as "Little Van." (Tho, "Van Van is a used up man" is my favorite.)

There were a bunch of really ugly campaign songs about Van Buren. One went "Who rules us with an iron rod? Who moves at Satan's beck and nod? Who heeds not man, who heeds not God? Van Buren." (mp3).

So even the Lucifer stuff is incredibly unoriginal.

Those interested can check out Sing Along With Millard Fillmore: The Life Album of Presidential Campaign Songs, my crappy digital transfer of the 1964 magazine subscription promotional vinyl.
posted by zachlipton at 3:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [26 favorites]


Harrison was certainly a man who went to genuine lengths to prove how tough he was, no argument there.

He should be reading The Fisherman's Wife.

A Grimm fairy tale was not what I thought you were suggesting for a minute there. I've had too much internet.
posted by Countess Elena at 3:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Giuliani declares Trump's stump speech on Tuesday ‘the best speech that any Republican has ever given.’ [real]

I hear the Gettysburg Address was terrible. That or he's come to terms that the Republican Party is no longer the party of Lincoln.
posted by Talez at 3:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


This just in, Guliani has the historical recollection of a goldfish [fake-ish]
posted by mrzarquon at 3:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


"The Log Cabin Song," sung by Harrison supporters

I immediately thought of another Harrison and pondered "I knew John and Paul didn't get along, but I thought George was cool..."
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


HE FORGOT.
posted by maryr at 3:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Rudy is the Dory of campaign 2016.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Also, his doctor letter says he has no history using alcohol or tobacco. So how does he know Trump Vodka is the best?!?
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 11:44 AM on August 17 [4 favorites +] [!]


HIS NAME IS ON IT!!!! [true]
posted by Golem XIV at 3:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Just. Keep. Yelling!
posted by leotrotsky at 3:28 PM on August 17, 2016


He should be reading The Fisherman's Wife.

A Grimm fairy tale was not what I thought you were suggesting for a minute there. I've had too much internet.
posted by Countess Elena at 6:20 PM on August 17 [1 favorite −] [!]


So ... should we be tweeting octopuses at Trump?
posted by McCoy Pauley at 3:28 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump Jr. shitting on Trump's CNN surrogates on Hannity's radio show.

This is the campaign that just keeps giving.
posted by Talez at 3:31 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


Trump Jr. shitting on Trump's CNN surrogates on Hannity's radio show.

Just as I thought I could even again, and now I can't.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Trump Jr. shitting on Trump's CNN surrogates on Hannity's radio show.

[figuratively]
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:37 PM on August 17, 2016 [66 favorites]


For those worried about shy Trumpers not admitting to pollsters their true voting intentions, the Economist (I think) said a couple of weeks ago that there was little evidence for this but the chances were that there could be a significant cadre of shy Hillary supporters among women in deep red country. Which I find much more plausible, given the evidence of some anger issues among some male Trump supporters.

I suppose the chances are less of that being significant over shy Trumpers in swing states, but even in those the distribution of red to blue is not homogeneous.
posted by Devonian at 3:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I certainly don't recall learning about the overwhelming civility of the American political process in history class and nothing I've read since has worked particularly hard to change my mind.

I'm currently rewatching John Adams and it's good to remember our country was founded by people who thought pouring boiling tar over your political opponents was in the range of considerable options.
posted by threeturtles at 3:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


Yeah well, let's be honest. One of those surrogates is Katrina Pierson. I'd say Trump. Jr. was correct in his assessment "and they find like one Trump supporter from the street, who has no real political knowledge, and they just happen to be supporter, and they put that person up against 8 people who do this for a living and try to make it seem like that’s a fair fight.

“I mean, it’s so ridiculous I can’t even watch it anymore.”

Hey, Trump Jr, WE can't watch it anymore either. Signed, America.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:42 PM on August 17, 2016


He should be reading The Fisherman's Wife.

There have been an awful lot of books with titles formatted "The ____'s Wife" recently, many of them too appropriate for today's news. The Ambassador’s Wife, The Artisan’s Wife, The Artist’s Wife, The Aviator’s Wife, The Bad Boy’s Wife, The Bishop’s Wife, The Boss’s Wife, The Bursar’s Wife, The Candidate’s Wife, The Captain’s Wife, The Consul’s Wife, The Dead Man’s Wife, The Diplomat’s Wife, The Doctor’s Wife, The Earl’s Wife, The Emancipator’s Wife, The Fireman’s Wife, The Governor’s Wife (twice!), The Headmaster’s Wife (also twice!), The Killer’s Wife, The Kitchen God’s Wife, The Liar’s Wife, The Lightkeeper’s Wife, The Magician’s Wife, The Pilot’s Wife, The Poets’ Wives (multiple wives in one book; how novel!, The Prisoner’s Wife (twice again!), The Railwayman’s Wife, The Restaurant Critic’s Wife, The Ringmaster’s Wife, The Saddlemaker’s Wife, The Samurai’s Wife, The Sea Captain’s Wife, The Senator’s Wife, The Shoemaker’s Wife, The Shopkeeper’s Wife, The Soldier’s Wife (yep, twice!), The Sniper’s Wife, The Tea Planter’s Wife, The Tiger’s Wife, The Time Traveler’s Wife, The Traitor’s Wife, The Widower’s Wife, The Witch Doctor’s Wife, and The Zookeeper’s Wife.

Which helps explain why Hillary Clinton is the first woman to have a real chance at being elected President after 240 years... she used to be The President's Wife.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


if you're a shy Trumper, try holding your breath
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:45 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


holy hell this election... I cannot remain drunk enough to handle this anymore.
posted by lonefrontranger at 3:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


In the same interview as "Polls. Most of them. All of them," Michael Cohen said he knows about the country's “African American problem”. He later "clarified" he meant "the problem that exists in the African American community."

But really, I think he had it right the first time. Trump's speech last night was about reassuring white voters that Trump can solve all the problems with those pesky African Americans thanks to a law and order approach, and nobody in that room will ever have to consider their privilege or change anything or confront any of the actual problems at stake.
posted by zachlipton at 3:48 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


Maybe it's because the weekly session is tonight, or maybe the lich references above planted the seed in my mind, but I'm thinking that this presidential campaign needs to be turned into a D&D campaign.
posted by The Nutmeg of Consolation at 3:48 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


TPM: GOPer Who Wrote Fiery Benghazi Mom’s RNC Speech: Clinton ‘Only Choice’ In Nov:
The Republican operative who wrote “Benghazi mom” Patricia Smith’s RNC speech, where Smith tearfully blamed Hillary Clinton for her son’s death, said he can never vote for Donald Trump in an op-ed published Wednesday.

Richard Cross, a former Capitol Hill staffer, wrote that he believes he's never voted for a Democrat running for federal office. But now he feels Trump has “betrayed and perverted” the party of Ronald Reagan and Dwight D. Eisenhower.
See also: Hey Mr. President! I campaigned for the other guy, but I voted for you!
posted by palindromic at 3:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


And if you're wondering why Manafort has been pushed aside, it's probably because of things like this: Manafort Allegedly Tried And Failed To Prevent Trump's Infamous Taco Tweet:
The taco bowl incident, trivial though it was, is one example. On Cinco de Mayo, Trump happened to be eating a taco bowl for lunch at his desk in Trump Tower. Manafort was in the office with other aides when a member of the family suggested they tweet a picture of Trump enjoying his “Mexican” lunch.

Manafort politely suggested that this might be seen as condescending and cautioned against it. The tweet went out. Trump himself was delighted by the resulting controversy. “The people who were offended were people we wanted to offend,” he later said.
posted by zachlipton at 3:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [38 favorites]


so did Paul Manafort lose his snake staff or what
posted by theodolite at 3:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


Wasn't it shown that Trump wasn't even in Trump Tower this past May 5th?
posted by maryr at 3:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


See also: Hey Mr. President! I campaigned for the other guy, but I voted for you!

I really appreciate people frinkiac-ing their own comments when it's going to inspire me to do so. Saves time and threadspace!

But what all of the sudden happened for Richard Cross to gain clarity? Did the check not clear?
posted by MCMikeNamara at 4:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Hillary Clinton Appoints Ken Salazar To Lead White House Transition

The Trump trainwreck is fascinating, but don't cut Clinton a blank check. Obama literally asked the public to help him keep his promises... and there were many times that didn't happen. The loyal opposition is important.
posted by zennie at 4:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


For those who missed it, TPM has the CNN Brianna Keilor/Michael Cohen smackdown video up here.
posted by spitbull at 4:14 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


An analysis/interview piece in Vanity Fair concludes Bannon is probably not in much of a position to help Trump win, but may be well placed to create an American nationalist movement off the back of the election.

(warning: contains a para where the writer presents Bannon with Breitbart comments, which are printed.)
posted by Devonian at 4:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


I had to write an email today to a guy named Steve and I started helplessly snickering. I blame all of you.
posted by threeturtles at 4:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [27 favorites]


Michael Cohen said he knows about the country's “African American problem”. He later "clarified" he meant "the problem that exists in the African American community."

I just want to come back to this for a second, because it's sort of a slow "wait, what?" Why the hell is the "correct" version "the problem that exists in the African American community?" Why isn't it the problem that exists in everyone's community? I don't mean that in an "all lives matter" sense; I mean it in the sense that you don't just get to call massive structural racism a black people problem that the rest of us don't have to think about.
posted by zachlipton at 4:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [50 favorites]


I like the image of stoned Gary Johnson fucking up Putin's carefully laid plans and winning by accident amidst the carnage.

Careful. I have Adam Sandler on Line 2 and he's saying he needs to take his family on vacation somewhere educational because his kid is failing Social Studies.
posted by robocop is bleeding at 4:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Also learned this from TPM commenter Eliza614 -- Michael Cohen went to this law school:

Western Michigan University Cooley Law School is an American Bar Association accredited law school. Cooley has four campuses. Its main campus is in Lansing, Michigan and its satellite campuses are in Grand Rapids, Michigan, Auburn Hills, Michigan, and Tampa, Florida.[4] It has an employment score of 22.9%, one of the poorest outcomes of any law school in the United States.[5] It is also notable for having the loosest admission standards of any ABA-accredited law school.

An affiliation between Cooley and Western Michigan University went into effect on August 13, 2014.


Source.

Special counsel to Mister Trump indeed.
posted by spitbull at 4:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]




you don't just get to call massive structural racism a black people problem that the rest of us don't have to think about.

He's not talking about structural racism. I don't think he even grasps the concept of "structural racism" enough to deny that it exists. He's talking about "black-on-black crime".
posted by J.K. Seazer at 4:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Oh and I also learned this about Michael Cohen, Esquire:

"Michael has been instrumental in the development of Trump Tower, Batumi, in the former Soviet Republic of Georgia."

Here is his bio on the website of the Eric Trump
Foundation.
posted by spitbull at 4:25 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


A: Because Donald only speaks English.

Q: Why did Trump launch a Twitter feed in Hebrew?
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]




Wow, I really really read that "pillows" link as satire at first, mostly because the closing line "The pillows provide much needed support" was pretty funny as a satire line, but looking at the rest of the site I guess it isn't? Apparently Heat Street is owned by News Corp. I just gave that site multiple clicks trying to figure out if they were for real or not. At first I was like, "Wow, Metafilter is really getting snowed by this news parody site! Weird!" But it was I who was snowed! For it was not a parody site. It was real.

I AM THROUGH WITH THIS ELECTION, GUYS. Imma vote in November but following this craziness is messing with my irony meter a bit too thoroughly.
posted by the marble index at 4:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [17 favorites]


I LOVE Pillowgate! I have my woman card, and am now eyeing that pillow in HRC's shop. Mr. Trump is an orange fuehrer horror, but he does keep giving me some of the best laughs of my life.
posted by bearwife at 4:45 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]




How long before Alex Jones is brought on board. As maybe a "science advisor." I'm serious.
posted by My Dad at 4:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


> I AM THROUGH WITH THIS ELECTION, GUYS. Imma vote in November but following this craziness is messing with my irony meter a bit too thoroughly.

FOR REALS. I have serious future shock over how 4chan has leaked into the real world and hijacked a major party. I can't deal.

In one of Neal Stephenson's novels there's a scholarly/religious institution whereat disobedient acolytes are punished by being forced to memorize texts designed to thwart memorization in increasingly diabolical ways. Minor punishments involve memorizing poems that almost but don't quite rhyme and arithmetical statements that don't quite add up. The harshest punishments involve memorizing extremely long texts riddled with subtle logical errors designed to drive the pentient literally insane.

Although I'm pretty sure Stephenson included this detail as part of his long-standing and very 20th-century-nerdboy beef with philosophy, critical theory, and humanistic study in general, I think maybe memorizing records of the 2016 election could serve quite effectively as a very high level punishment within this system.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 4:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


NYTimes: Hillary Clinton Twists the Knife in Donald Trump’s Tax Proposals
Hillary Clinton leaned into her plans to raise taxes on the wealthiest Americans on Wednesday, denouncing Donald J. Trump’s tax proposals as a boondoggle for billionaires.

“We’re going to tax the wealthy who have made all of the income gains in the last 15 years,” Mrs. Clinton told a crowd in Cleveland. “The superwealthy, corporations, Wall Street,” she declared emphatically, “they’re going to have to invest in education, in skills training, in infrastructure.”[...]

She said Mr. Trump’s plan to eliminate the estate tax would save his family an estimated $4 billion, which, by Mrs. Clinton’s calculations, would pay for publicly funded prekindergarten classes for 890,000 4-year-olds and provide a year’s worth of health care for 360,000 veterans.

“Donald Trump doesn’t need a tax cut,” she said. She waited for the crowd to quiet down, and then Mrs. Clinton, whose tax returns show that she and former President Bill Clinton earned an adjusted gross income of $10.6 million in 2015, added, “I don’t need a tax cut.”
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [58 favorites]




> @Benioff: This table reflects how @realDonaldTrump sees America : homogeneous.

I had the same reaction to this that I did to the picture of Paul Ryan's staff, which is to say that I leaned into the monitor and squinted to make sure somebody didn't Photoshop the same dude in there five times
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 4:55 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


Trump’s New Campaign Manager Whines: ‘We’ll Never Have the Money’ Clinton Has
This morning, Kellyanne Conway was named the new campaign manager for Trump and she went on Fox News to explain why. While talking about her boss — a man who has claimed to have “unlimited cash” with which to fund his campaign — Conway said, “We’ll never have the money and we’ll have have the man power that Hillary Clinton has in Brooklyn but we don’t need it because quality candidates matter and people want a dynamic, honest messenger in their presidential candidates that they can trust.”
Oh gee, if only they knew a Billionaire who wanted to contribute to their campaign.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:59 PM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


dynamic

honest

lol
posted by defenestration at 5:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


She said Mr. Trump’s plan to eliminate the estate tax would save his family an estimated $4 billion

omg this is pure aikido. if trump wants to deny that he'll benefit from his tax plan, he has to admit that he's grossly exaggerated his net worth!
posted by murphy slaw at 5:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [54 favorites]


because quality candidates matter

the trump campaign is doing that thing where they project their attributes onto clinton, aren't they?
posted by murphy slaw at 5:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I still cannot believe they've brought in Breitbart fucks to run the campaign.

Insane.
posted by defenestration at 5:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


I think even CNN is stopping the swallowing of surrogate bullshit without at least checking if it's the chocolate ice cream said surrogates claim it to be.
posted by Talez at 5:06 PM on August 17, 2016


That is a great speech by HRC. Concrete, hopeful, and INTELLIGENT.
posted by bearwife at 5:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Ed Kilgore, NY Mag: "Trump’s Appeal to Black Voters Was Actually Directed at White Voters."

Spot on dog whistle amplifier.
posted by spitbull at 5:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


> the trump campaign is doing that thing where they project their attributes onto clinton, aren't they?

A Clinton spokesperson quoted in an AP story this morning actually made this point:
"With each passing Trump attack, it becomes clearer that his strategy is just to say about Hillary Clinton what's true of himself. When people started saying he was temperamentally unfit, he called Hillary the same. When his ties to the Kremlin came under scrutiny, he absurdly claimed that Hillary was the one who was too close to Putin. Now he's accusing her of bigoted remarks -- We think the American people will know which candidate is guilty of the charge," [Clinton spokesperson Jennifer Palmieri] said.
Is this the first time somebody in the campaign has said this? I can't remember for sure but I don't think I've seen it anywhere but Metafilter before.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 5:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [55 favorites]


Is this the first time somebody in the campaign has said this? I can't remember for sure but I don't think I've seen it anywhere but Metafilter before.

No but if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and has bad hair like a duck...
posted by Talez at 5:10 PM on August 17, 2016


I think even CNN is stopping the swallowing of surrogate bullshit without at least checking if it's the chocolate ice cream said surrogates claim it to be.

That just leaves "Is it true? Is it false? We 'report,' you decide!" NPR.
posted by leotrotsky at 5:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


> No but if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and has bad hair like a duck...

Ah, well. Once I started following these threads I pretty much stopped finding election news anywhere else, so in my head everything originates on Metafilter.

The echo chamber in action, I guess, but it's pretty much the only thing maintaining my sanity.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 5:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]




bearwife: the "a woman's place is in the shite house" pillow is great. I have one. It's of decent quality, larger than expected and is even fairly tasteful as befits cross stitch. I got one for my mother-in-law and thinking about getting one for my mom too.
posted by R343L at 5:14 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


"Many people are claiming Trump is down, but some people are saying 'says who?'."
posted by defenestration at 5:14 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


R343L... quick, before the edit window closes.... make all the jokes to come incomprehensible
posted by Cold Lurkey at 5:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [35 favorites]


the "a woman's place is in the shite house" pillow is great.

That's a weirdly calibrated autocorrect.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:18 PM on August 17, 2016 [25 favorites]


>"bearwife: the "a woman's place is in the shite house" pillow is great..."posted by R343L at 5:14 PM on August 17 [+] [!]

OMG i don't know whether to cry or laugh at that typo!!
posted by ramix at 5:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


Omg I am going to cry. Why do you hate me iOS?! Normally it actually autocorrects to White House upper case. :(
posted by R343L at 5:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [36 favorites]


Also I'm on a literal tropical vacation and still addicted to these threads. So.
posted by R343L at 5:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


Shite House? Maybe I'm getting old, but I just can't keep up with the electronic music subgenres these days.
posted by box at 5:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [67 favorites]


Dreams in the Shite House
posted by Artw at 5:30 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


Donald Trump made $39 million running failed casino company
In 1995, Donald Trump's first and only initial public offering raised $140 million from public investors under the ticker symbol DJT. A decade later, Trump Hotels & Casino Resorts, filed for bankruptcy.

The casino company posted losses every year it was public -- more than $600 million in total between 1995 and 2004 -- a CNNMoney analysis of 10 years of corporate filings shows.

DJT paid Trump handsomely each year. His salary, bonus and options totaled about $20 million.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:32 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Michael Cohen went to this law school:

That's perfect. Cooley is an abomination bottom feeder that shouldn't exist, it only survives because of the Federal government's bottomless willingness to underwrite any and all student loans. It's the law school equivalent of DeVry or Phoenix. Maybe not even that high, it's the Sullivan cooking school of law schools. There is a federal court decision that basically said, if you signed up to go to this school, you are fucking stupid, and you knew or should've known your "degree" would be utterly worthless.

You know, except if the Trump campaign is hiring legal counsel.
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:32 PM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


From the Eric Trump Foundation bio of Michael Cohen that spitbull's comment linked to,
Michael is a rising star in the business sector and has appeared in various press outlets such as CNBC, Fox, NBC, ABC and the New York Post, as Donald J. Trump's policitical advisor. [sic except emphasis, which is mine]
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:33 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Polictickles, more like.
posted by dis_integration at 5:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


According to a coworker who supported Sanders, then Trump and now Stein, Wikileaks ( and she says this to me smiling and doing a little dance ) is going to release info that will put Hillary in jail. I keep asking why they'd not release it now or hell why not at the primary when Sanders could have picked up the pieces. She just looks at me and shrugs.

This week she did that spiel again and I said after the shrug "You know why they're not releasing it? They have nothing." Oddly she then told me she never supported Trump.

So yeah his supporters are, to say the least fickle and probably not even voters.
posted by 922257033c4a0f3cecdbd819a46d626999d1af4a at 5:37 PM on August 17, 2016 [18 favorites]


Has anybody told Trump how little the President gets paid?
posted by srboisvert at 5:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Oh, he'll find other ways to get paid.
posted by peacheater at 5:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


WaPo: Why a Trump adviser saying Clinton should be shot has resulted in … not much of anything
"The liberal media took what I said and went against the law and the Constitution and ran with it, and they said that I wanted her assassinated, which I never did," Baldasaro told The Republican/MassLive.com. "I said I spoke as a veteran, and she should be shot in a firing squad for treason."

Baldasaro was referring to his original comment in July, when he said on conservative talk radio in Boston that: "Hillary Clinton should be put in the firing line and shot for treason." He's since repeated that sentiment twice. (Though his reasons have shifted from the 2012 terrorist attacks in Benghazi, Libya, to her use of a private email server while secretary of state.)[...]

Trump's spokeswoman issued a statement in July: "We're incredibly grateful for his support, but we don't agree with his comments." It mostly flew under the radar. So did the Secret Service's statement that it's investigating the remarks. Since then, Baldasaro has repeated some version of his comment two more times. The Trump campaign hasn't responded at all. And he's still on board.

And really, why should Trump's campaign have to answer for something controversial his adviser has said, since no one's really focusing on it. That's a product of Trump himself, who is more than capable of making his own controversial statements — some would say even similar statements — that suck up the media's attention. It's a habit of Trump's that drives establishment Republicans like Rep. Paul D. Ryan (Wis.) up a wall.
Salon: Trump’s “alpha-male” paradox: How gender bias makes his behavior seem manly, no matter what
In what is among the most baffling contradictions of the 2016 election, Trump’s behavior on the campaign trail is sometimes a cartoonish execution of these throwback stereotypes that have been unfairly, prejudicially and hatefully associated with women, teenage girls and gay men. Hateful stereotypes of women as thin-skinned and hysterical, and gay men as dramatic gossips, have helped scaffold and maintain centuries of sexist and homophobic harassment, mistreatment and exclusion from institutional authority and leadership positions. Yet Trump enjoys macho hero status with his (largely male) followers, benefiting from a “masculine” (and, thanks to gender bias, a positive) reading of his public persona.

James Hamblin, the usually brilliant health correspondent at the Atlantic, recently wrote an essay chastising Trump as the “climax of America’s masculinity problem.” Hamblin’s evisceration of Trump’s vulgarity, borderline sociopathy and misogyny is accurate and made with ample evidence. But at the same time, the Twitter tough guy’s demeanor bears little resemblance to “masculinity” in its traditional American sense.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


Has anybody told Trump how little the President gets paid?


Sez who?
posted by nubs at 5:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Amusingly the Cohen/Keilar "says who?" interview has gone quite viral already. It's top of the page at Red State right now, and Daily Kos.

Somehow it works as a summarizing image.

And it was live blogged as it happened right here!
posted by spitbull at 5:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Trump's policitical advisor.

Meredith?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


Meredith!
posted by Yowser at 5:45 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


What does Eggo Waffle have to say about this?
posted by Artw at 5:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


Has anybody told Trump how little the President gets paid?

For real, the Clintons left the White House after Bill's term stone cold broke.
posted by 922257033c4a0f3cecdbd819a46d626999d1af4a at 5:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Well to be fair that was because of all the lawsuits against them. Wait.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


They left the White House millions in debt for legal bills incurred fighting right wing witch hunting. They hate it that she is rich now.
posted by spitbull at 6:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


>"With each passing Trump attack, it becomes clearer that his strategy is just to say about Hillary Clinton what's true of himself. When people started saying he was temperamentally unfit, he called Hillary the same. When his ties to the Kremlin came under scrutiny, he absurdly claimed that Hillary was the one who was too close to Putin. Now he's accusing her of bigoted remarks . . . "

Yes, we already have Trump's Razor: "Ascertain the stupidest possible scenario that can be reconciled with the available facts" and that answer is likely correct.

But I think we now have, in addition, Trump's Second Razor: Anything he accuses his opponent of, is something he himself does, has been criticized for, and/or is afraid of being criticized for.

You can call it projection, you can call it pre-school level argumentation ("No, you touched ME first"), or you can just call it Trump's Second Razor.

Whatever you call it, the Trump campaign is very clearly and consciously adopting it as a strategy. Now as a strategy it is so dumb that Trump's Second Razor can only be explained by recourse to Trump's First Razor--but, I digress.

This brings me to a related matter: Over the past few days, apropos of exactly nothing and based on nothing, the chorus of concern over Clinton's supposed health problems has reached a peak.

Which can only make us wonder and suspect--is Trump himself having a serious health crisis? Some kind of a health scare? Why is this topic on the forefront of his mind for such an extended period?

In his speeches and tweets, you can pretty much see what is on Donny's mind. You can see what he is thinking about, what he is worried about. Why is ill health on his mind? Has something happened?

The Clinton camp hasn't raised the issue of Trump's health. (Well, his mental health--but that is another matter.) But pretty clearly, Trump is concerned about an attack on his candidacy on health grounds, and so he is launching a pre-emptive attack on Clinton. Why is he so worried?

Trump's Second Razor suggests an answer . . .
posted by flug at 6:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [49 favorites]


I mean, the only reason Trump's ridiculous doctor's note is getting increased scrutiny now is because of his random accusations about Clinton leaning against pillows and whatnot... (And I do wonder why the MSM was not more interested in the obvious fakeness of that note earlier.)
posted by peacheater at 6:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


the "a woman's place is in the shite house" pillow is great.

That's a weirdly calibrated autocorrect.


Thank you, because I didn't even catch that. I just thought it was a joke I didn't get.
posted by bongo_x at 6:12 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


but may be well placed to create an American nationalist movement off the back of the election. Yeah one of the more haunting things I reme,near a reporter covering the RNC say was. That the most intellgence, clear eyed trump supporters where the Nazis/white nationalists who didn't think he had a chance to win BUT he was a good way to mainstream and popularize thier platform.

And that is fucking scary.
posted by The Whelk at 6:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [30 favorites]


I guess during the primary it was presumed to be just Republicans dumb business, and if they were suckers enough to accept it then so what. But now it's everybodies business, so maybe he'll be pressed on it.
posted by Artw at 6:14 PM on August 17, 2016


So, wait. Is Trump's refusal to remove his suit jacket his projection of Hillary health concerns?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


So...It looks like Trump Youth is now a thing.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:17 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


"‘Trump Youth’ group run by Hitler apologist will teach millennials to root out ‘parasites’"
Parasite = Any millennial who joins a group called "Trump Youth"
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


This seems to be a dude with a YouTube channel.
posted by Going To Maine at 6:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


I keep imagining that if I had a time machine and could convince Fred Trump that Steve is a much better name than Donald, maybe he'd grow up a well-adjusted individual and not need to do all of this other stuff to try to feel good about himself.

and I suppose probably do something about 9/11 as long as I'm mucking with the timeline
posted by ckape at 6:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


This seems to be a dude with a YouTube channel.

So he's on the short list for Trump's next campaign manager?
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:30 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


One of the Pillowpalooza examples says, "Here’s Hillary in a fancy chair, with a pillow that probably cost more than your first car." Pretty rich coming from supporters of a guy who likes gold-rimmed Saddam Hussein-style chairs.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:33 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


Mod note: A few comments removed. Maybe think twice before tossing fucking Horrific Terrorism Chuckles into the conversation.
posted by cortex (staff) at 6:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


The Trump Youth thing fortunately looks like some kook glomming onto the Trump name. Bad, sure, but it doesn't look like anything the campaign is promoting.
posted by R343L at 6:39 PM on August 17, 2016


Yet.
posted by spitbull at 6:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


The Trump Youth thing fortunately looks like some kook glomming onto the Trump name. Bad, sure, but it doesn't look like anything the campaign is promoting.

Well yeah, it's clearly not the campaign BUT people need to put that shit on blast so that the campaign has to denounce and distance itself publicly (and look suuuuper awkward doing it).
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Eh. I kind of feel like this is the kind of thing that is worth ignoring if only not to give them attention. They are nobodies. If the Trump campaign has sense, they'll just send them a quiet cease and desist.
posted by R343L at 6:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Now we know the direction The Onion is taking with Tim Kaine.
posted by Groundhog Week at 6:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [10 favorites]


My theory for a while has been: Nocturnal home hemodialysis

Explains the flying home every night, the late night twitter rampages. Ties in nicely with the diet pill abuse.
posted by joeyh at 6:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


When will the moderator for the September 26th debate be announced? Anybody know?

"First presidential debate (September 26, 2016, Hofstra University, Hempstead, NY)

The debate will be divided into six time segments of approximately 15 minutes each on major topics to be selected by the moderator and announced at least one week before the debate.

The moderator will open each segment with a question, after which each candidate will have two minutes to respond. Candidates will then have an opportunity to respond to each other. The moderator will use the balance of the time in the segment for a deeper discussion of the topic."

Whoever the moderator is, they've got to be on it. Because it seems increasingly clear Trump is just going to spew nonsense in the air. He's going to just spit out conspiracy theories, lies, fabrications, and just every manner of crap.

And a good amount of people will believe him if the moderator doesn't shut that down, or better yet, open the debate by saying the candidates are expected to only use fact-based arguments, not conspiracy theories and lies - and then refers back to that pronouncement every time Trump does it.

Because otherwise, Trump will be taken seriously by too many people, simply because he's on the stage. So many people will think that he can't just be boldly lying about what he's saying, because this is for the presidency, this is a serious event, and the whole setup of the presidential debates gives it an air of formality that will have a lot of people who don't follow politics, running with some seemingly salacious conspiracy theory or falsehood (ala the Cruz/JFK thing). And of course Trump will do it with that "many people are saying...." thing.

But absent the assurance that the moderator will do that, and maybe even if they do, the Clinton campaign has to (and probably is) come up with some kind of way to counteract the rapid-fire as-an-aside lies Trump will try to drop into the discussion.
posted by cashman at 6:44 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


And a good amount of people will believe him if the moderator doesn't shut that down, or better yet, open the debate by saying the candidates are expected to only use fact-based arguments, not conspiracy theories and lies - and then refers back to that pronouncement every time Trump does it.

There's no chance that will happen. Candy Crowley got a lot of pushback for even approaching that kind of thing in the Romney-Obama debate.
posted by Justinian at 6:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


I've been thinking for months that, in the debates, they really ought to enforce microphone time. Meaning: when one candidate is speaking, the other candidate's microphone is cut off. When a candidates time is up, their mic automatically gets cut off.

I mean, I've kinda thought that about political debates in general – but it's extra necessary for these debates.

They won't do it, of course.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 6:57 PM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


She's pretty good at making sure she gets mic time when debating a shouty old dude, I've seen her.
posted by Artw at 6:58 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


When will the moderator for the September 26th debate be announced?

How the fuck are we gonna make it that long
I mean
posted by rp at 6:59 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


That's only about 8 more threads and 30,000 comments.
posted by Justinian at 7:00 PM on August 17, 2016 [20 favorites]


More people should watch Lawrence O'Donnell's show. It is the best.
posted by zutalors! at 7:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Yeah, but Trump is like the shoutiest old dude ever.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 7:05 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


They need to bring back VH1's pop up video format for the debates to do the fact checks for home viewers.

Maybe they can hire whoever is doing the news chyrons.
posted by winna at 7:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


I personally plan to bust out arementalkingtoomuch.com during the debates

spoilers: the answer will unquestionably be yes
posted by The demon that lives in the air at 7:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


The Waste Wing
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:14 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


@benshapiro calls Trump campaign a “turd tornado”
CNN host: “A what tornado?”
Shapiro: “a turd tornado. Like a shark tornado with poop"

Shapiro surely means a "Sharknado"; if you're gonna use an outdated pop culture reference, at least do it correctly.


I think "shartnado" is the optimal term here.
posted by MikeKD at 7:15 PM on August 17, 2016 [36 favorites]


I hope Trump falls below 15% in the polls and thus is not eligible for the debate.
posted by humanfont at 7:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [40 favorites]


I was trying to think of when this corrosive style of American politics started.

I blame Grover Norquist, who helped Oliver North and participated in many other dubious overseas shenanigans, worked with Newt Gingrich in 1994 on the loathsome Contract with America, and then (at Reagan's behest) used that model to get nearly all Republicans in Congress to sign the incredibly destructive Taxpayer Protection Pledge. Oh and he was an early champion of GWB. He's an awful, awful man who is wrong about practically everything.
posted by carmicha at 7:18 PM on August 17, 2016 [33 favorites]




"Uhhhh says who Socrates?"
Socrates: "Shut up Politickles"
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


It seems to me that it isn't the corrosive politics of the last twenty years that is the outlier but rather the relatively restrained (in some ways) politics of the post-war era. Politics was really nasty for much of our history.
posted by Justinian at 7:21 PM on August 17, 2016


Is this the first time somebody in the campaign has said this? I can't remember for sure but I don't think I've seen it anywhere but Metafilter before.

It was Tony Schwartz, ghostwriter of The Art of the Deal:

Something I saw early on w/ Trump: most negative things he says about others are actually describing him. Read his tweets with that in mind
posted by Metroid Baby at 7:22 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


That's only about 8 more threads and 30,000 comments.

This poll doesn't count all of those whose heads already have asploded, nor any of those whose heads will certainly asplode between now and the first debate, should that actually happen, and then the second and third, should they come to pass, let alone those whose crania remain intact through the actual day of the actual election.

Not lookin good, is what I'm sayin.
posted by rp at 7:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


My theory for a while has been: Nocturnal home hemodialysis

Could be, but I doubt it. My partner does home hemo. Most of the time our sessions are at home. But the core unit is around the size of a large office laser printer. I forget what it weighs but it's less than 10 pounds and can be carried with the built in handle. We've traveled with it several times. Need the unit, a few boxes of supplies, and that's about it. If the trip is extended, the dialysis company will ship out supplies overnight. Not entirely painless but traveling with dialysis isn't a huge burden either.

And that's something we can handle with just the two of us. Trump, with a huge entourage which probably includes at least one doctor on site at all times, could easily do a nationwide campaign with dialysis as needed at every stop. Though with his obsessions over cleanliness, he might not trust random hotel suite as being up to his standards for the procedure.

Of course, dialysis could be one of the things impairing his cognition. My partner gets some relatively mild cognitive impairments on the days when she has a session. But her clinic puts her through a series of mental health assessments annually because some patients have far stronger reactions.
posted by honestcoyote at 7:23 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


First the pillow thing, and now rumors are coming out of the Clinton camp that Hillary uses liniment when she has soreness in her joints.


BENGHAYZI


I am so, so sorry.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 7:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [51 favorites]


I like that I can just throw "Says who" into YouTube search and I get the CNN interview with Cohen.
posted by zutalors! at 7:26 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


I don't think there's anything behind his reluctance to stay at a property he doesn't own than just not wanting to be inconvenienced.

(Totally yes to the drugs thing, tho)
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:29 PM on August 17, 2016


Please memail to invest in my new app Says Who it allows you to chat with your friends for free from anywhere in the world because you don't have any friends.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:29 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I'm a masochist I guess because I'm watching the Trump town hall meeting thing on Hannity. It is just too ridiculous but here is the gist:

Hannity: what is extreme vetting? how do you vet what's in someone's heart?
Trump: You get smart people. you use social media. Look at ISIS, recruiting over the internet. We have to end that. But look at ISIS using the internet, and we have people in our country saying we can't do that. Weapons are getting stronger and meaner. I didn't want to go over there.
Hannity: But extreme vetting...
Trump: San Bernadino, what a horror show. If we had looked at social media we would know she was radicalized. They killed the people who gave them a baby - shower? a baby party. A baby party!
Hannity: But extreme vetting...
Trump: The Orlando person was sitting behind Hillary and he looked happy! Let's say the words "racial profiling" - lets get smart. We are letting tens of thousands of people in.
Hannity: okay commercial break.
[real, paraphrased]
posted by gatorae at 7:35 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


A prediction...
The debate is going to be the most horrendous, ghastly bit of television ever. I predict we will see the Trump of the primaries, amped-up to eleven. He's going to play to his slimy base. He's going to ignore the topics, hog the time, and simply call Clinton every name in the book, and the right will go utterly insane with glee.

It will be the moment that either sends the Trumptanic to the briny deep, or makes this real horse race.

I have no idea what Clinton's best strategy can be to handle a stage-hogging maxed-out Trump on a full rampage, but I really hope her team is working on it. This won't be a normal, boring debate, though. That's for sure.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


BENGHAYZI

ಠ__ಠ
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:38 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


"I have no idea what Clinton's best strategy can be"

Mostly just letting him talk probably.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 7:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


That 81 mg of aspirin fascinates me. Aspirin is not a benign substance, particularly when taken regularly. The only reason to prescribe a daily dose is because the alternatives are worse. For example, I have been taking 100 mg per day (originally expressed as "half a tablet", with the typical tablet being 300 mg, but my doctor cheerfully endorsed the 100 mg dose when I found a cheap source of smaller tabs) since a blood clot in 2004. Preventing future clots outweighs the risk of ulcers and bleeding. I'm also on (atorva)statin to control my cholestrol. So what condition is Trump being treated for with Aspirin and a statin?
posted by Autumn Leaf at 7:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


honestcoyote, he could travel with it, but he's trying to keep his condition under wraps..
posted by joeyh at 7:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


but I really hope her team is working on it.

You know they are, dude! Competence is her thing. They're probably role playing it right now.
posted by ftm at 7:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


Chronic Steves Syndrome
posted by Hairy Lobster at 7:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


winna: They need to bring back VH1's pop up video format for the debates to do the fact checks for home viewers.

Ooh, I have a friend who did an awesome Spuffy video in this style, back in the day (er, a dozen years ago). I wonder if she could be persuaded... she has some pretty highfalutin' contacts nowadays.

On it.
posted by Superplin at 7:44 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


I really hope her team is working on it.

I'm sure they are, and letting him sputter, pointing out he can not form sentences, and trusting her security team when he tries to strangle her would be my checklist.
posted by vrakatar at 7:44 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


honestcoyote, he could travel with it, but he's trying to keep his condition under wraps...

Heh...

Dr. Byron Orpheus: [after examining Dr. Venture's latest invention] What the hell is this thing made out of?
Dr. Venture: [suspiciously] Nothing.
Dr. Byron Orpheus: Come on...
Dr. Venture: All right, fine, I might have used a few unorthodox parts.
Dr. Byron Orpheus: Just tell me one.
Dr. Venture: [mumbling] An... orphan.

posted by Artw at 7:45 PM on August 17, 2016 [29 favorites]


So what condition is Trump being treated for with Aspirin and a statin?

He's 70, and has to have hypertension, which can't be helped by hourly rage strokes. Probably cardiac risk.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


The debate is going to be the most horrendous, ghastly bit of television ever. I predict we will see the Trump of the primaries, amped-up to eleven.

i kinda want to see him pop open a pill container right on stage and just toss a bunch in his mouth while he's waiting to respond to something
posted by indubitable at 7:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Wait until the media gets wind of Clinton's obsession with Afro-Cuban percussion.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Maybe do the whole Gary Oldman pill thing from Leon.
posted by Artw at 7:48 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]



More people should watch Lawrence O'Donnell's show. It is the best.


To add to this - he gave his intern a speaking slot tonight. Don't switch after Maddow!
posted by zutalors! at 7:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Bonghozi
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I'm sure they are, and letting him sputter, pointing out he can not form sentences, and trusting her security team when he tries to strangle her would be my checklist.

My dream would be for her to put on her best "mother watching her child throw a tantrum and just waiting for him to run out of steam" stance and, when Trump finally takes a breather, she puts her hands together and says in her best bemused-mommy voice, "Are you done now, Donny?" and just watch his head explode.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:50 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


And she loves that late night horror host from Chicago with all the corn jokes. Sad!

Svengazi.
posted by vrakatar at 7:55 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


I have no idea what Clinton's best strategy can be to handle a stage-hogging maxed-out Trump on a full rampage

Politely smiling and waiting for him to finish, even when that cuts into her allotted time, and then saying politely challenging things designed to enrage him.

"I'm sorry you were ignorant of [fact], Donald, but the best way to deal with this problem is..."
"I can't agree with that approach because I have no vendetta against the poor, who would suffer [result] from that policy..."
"It seems inconsistent that the man who claims to want to end violence in America doesn't want to restrict gun use..."

Needle him with big words; damn with faint praise; condescend with multi-syllable politesse ("While I'm told Mr. Trump's business acumen was sufficient to his company's needs twenty years ago, he lacks any experience with legislative negotiations...") and let him sputter. Play the well-educated society lady to the hilt; let Trump be rude and bombastic in response.

It won't win points among those who think all education is elitism, but those aren't the undecided voters she's trying to sway.

So what condition is Trump being treated for with Aspirin and a statin?

Can't speak for the statin (a cholesterol-lowering drug); 81mg aspirin is baby aspirin, which is prescribed as cardiac preventative medication. (That's my husband's dose.)
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:04 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


I said it in the last thread, but my hope is high for at least one "Oh bless your heart, Donad."
posted by spitbull at 8:06 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


"Before we go on, Mr. Trump, can one of my people bring you a smaller mic? That one seems too big for your hands."
posted by emjaybee at 8:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [16 favorites]


"Remember when my husband and I attended your wedding? Remember what we chatted about? You were such a good host then; what happened?"
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:09 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Not a doctor, but I don't think aspirin and a statin say anything more sinister than that he's old and his cholesterol is a touch high.
posted by EarBucket at 8:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


Hillary arches her eyebrows as Trump goes on and on. She makes a gesture on her podium with a sharpie marker.

Repeat the above as required.

Then at the appropriate time, she shouts "Bingo!" and holds up her card, showing she'd already predicted all of the Donald's moves.
posted by yesster at 8:15 PM on August 17, 2016 [39 favorites]


Nah. The only way to beat Trump is to out-crazy him. He says "We should ban Muslims," she should say "Yeah! And those fucking Episcopalians too!" He says "We gotta build a wall on the Mexican border," she says "And trenches filled with zika-mosquito-bitten sharks around the Wall!" etc. etc. Trump's base supporters will switch sides. Hillary's supporters will be in on the joke. Boom.
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


For an election that will see one of the oldest presidents ever be elected (either way it goes), there's been surprisingly little talk about the age of the candidates so far. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I wonder why? I don't think Trump has the self-awareness to know that calling Clinton an 'Old woman' or something would be dumb, but maybe the Clinton campaign also doesn't want to bring age into this? She's 68, with the benefits of being a lady and seemingly having lived healthily with great healthcare, but maybe? Is there so much more scandalous bullshit in the air, both true and fake, that it'd just be too boring to talk about?

I'm mostly curious because either of them are closest in age to Reagan, and he was not a great example for having a 70+ person as a leader. It's also fairly uncommon in the world to have someone that old as a head of state, especially in the West.

(At least spending most her adult life under fire has probably been good resistance training for the hardest job in the world.)
posted by neonrev at 8:25 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


All they really have to do to induce a Trumpian fit of rage during the debates is to point to a fan at the back of his head during a crucial question. Just enough to muss his hair a little, threaten to expose what's under the comb-over. (Because in Trumpworld impending baldness is a sign of weakness, not normal aging.)
posted by Soliloquy at 8:28 PM on August 17, 2016


Cohen on the "says who" exchange: “I think I unraveled her,” Cohen boasted.

Yea dude, you nailed it.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:32 PM on August 17, 2016 [60 favorites]




For an election that will see one of the oldest presidents ever be elected (either way it goes), there's been surprisingly little talk about the age of the candidates so far.

America's power-elite seem, in general, to be getting older and older and refusing to retire and give up their positions to younger generations. The Senate is super-old (avg. age 63), CEOs are old, Aging profs are taking up the tenured positions long past their used-by date. So maybe it just seems par for the course. Boomers ruin everything!

But also with Trump, Sanders and Clinton all grandparents, there wasn't a lot of political ammo from either side to push the age question.

But women age pretty well, statistically speaking, better than overweight men of Trump's vintage and level of shrieking. I'd be worried about a President getting elected at 80, but 68 is practically a spring shoot. My grandma beat breast cancer at 68 and is still going now at 95.
posted by dis_integration at 8:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [27 favorites]


Honestly I think the best way to anger him during the debates would be to call him on everything. If he makes a claim that's beyond the president's power or is unconstitutional, call him on that. If he lies, call him out. If he talks about doing something obviously infeasible, don't let him go on until he gives a plan on how he's going to accomplish it. If he says it's a secret, say he's bluffing, he doesn't have a plan and can't possibly accomplish it and he's only saying it to appeal to his base. Don't let him get away with any deception at all.

I would guess that between his huge ego, vindictiveness, and being the boss man, he's not used to being questioned at all and will turn hostile really fast.
posted by Mitrovarr at 8:40 PM on August 17, 2016 [14 favorites]


The only way to beat Trump is to out-crazy him.

I'm far more inclined to give him enough nope to hang himself. "Mr. Trump, as a firm believer in Biblical principles, do you support the proposal in Leviticus (which is a book of the Bible, by the way, sir) that gay men should be put to death?" "Well, you know what, we're looking into that, we're looking into that a lot, and you wouldn't believe some of the things we're finding, and I do support the Bible, no one supports it more than me, and I just want to say that day one, when I'm President, we're going to have some very important executive orders that maybe the Second Amendment people can work with, okay? Bigly."
posted by uosuaq at 8:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


For an election that will see one of the oldest presidents ever be elected (either way it goes), there's been surprisingly little talk about the age of the candidates so far. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but I wonder why?

Because 70 is the new 50? (Only half-joking.)

On the one hand, I'm a little sad that after Obama — who's sort of on the Boomer/GenX cusp — we'll be going back to a solid Boomer president. On the other hand, I'm a little weirded out that Marco Rubio was the first credible presidential candidate to be younger than me.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 8:41 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


Honestly, all of this debate fanfiction with people fantasizing about Clinton delivering sick burns to Trump is a little weird.

I mean, also entertaining. But also a little weird.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 8:43 PM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


Marco Rubio was the first credible presidential candidate to be younger than me.


[citation needed]
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 8:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [23 favorites]


We've reached the slashfic part of the thread, see "Egg McMuffin could win Utah and wouldn't that mess up the electoral college?" from the last thread.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


My money is on it being mostly boring/disappointing in some way, and then a spectacular meltdown coming completely out of the blue soon afterwards
posted by Artw at 8:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Out of, or on?
posted by uosuaq at 8:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Marco Rubio was the first credible presidential candidate to be younger than me.

[citation needed]


I meant "credible" in the sense of "actually had a reasonable shot at becoming president," not in the sense of "would actually make a good president."
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 8:49 PM on August 17, 2016


BENGHAYZI

That earns you a two-minute stay in the punalty box.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 8:51 PM on August 17, 2016 [9 favorites]


This is tangential to the general political discussion, but the Song-A-Day guy wrote one about Harry Enten. I haven't been able to purge it from my brain since I heard it, so I'm sharing it with you all so I do not suffer alone.
posted by Anonymous at 8:52 PM on August 17, 2016




Maybe it's because the weekly session is tonight, or maybe the lich references above planted the seed in my mind, but I'm thinking that this presidential campaign needs to be turned into a D&D campaign.

You're in luck! Dungeons and Donalds on Twitter
posted by donatella at 8:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]




not literally, unfortunately.
posted by peeedro at 9:07 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


Honestly, all of this debate fanfiction with people fantasizing about Clinton delivering sick burns to Trump is a little weird.

I mean, also entertaining. But also a little weird.


What worries me is that the debates will be mostly boring and maybe Clinton will even make a mistake or two and then everyone will be tearing their hair out and rending their garments and doomed we're all doomed I tell you
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:08 PM on August 17, 2016 [13 favorites]


Kaine made a stop by the Iowa pork tent — at one point hoisting his pork chop on a stick high into the air [not The Onion]
posted by Yowser at 9:11 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


America's power-elite seem, in general, to be getting older and older and refusing to retire and give up their positions to younger generations.

I think it may be a case of there being so few viable candidates to turn it over to. The people Liberals are excited about are Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren.
posted by bongo_x at 9:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


He made a Star Trek joke! And badgered the press corp to eat! [real] He really IS dad!!!
posted by Deoridhe at 9:13 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


Kaine’s parting advice to the press corps? “Hey, get a pork chop. I mean you can’t come this close and just let us eat and you guys not have anything.”

Aw, c'mon dad!

(I also can not imagine any of the GOP slate noticing that the press wasn't eating, or really that they have personal needs of any kind, and are not solely dedicated to writing about them. Small things.)
posted by neonrev at 9:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


> REMEMBER HOW SCALIA DIED.

Auto-erotic asphyxiation?


Fuuuuck. We're going to be infested with him next year. [fake]
posted by sebastienbailard at 9:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


I want to see the phrase "fielding a mouthful of fried pork" in more political reporting.
posted by bibliowench at 9:19 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


So here's what I've been trying to figure out: if you're a member of the Republican establishment, and are solely concerned with the well-being of the party, isn't there a pretty clear case to be made that a Trump win would do far more damage to the GOP than a Trump loss? I mean, Candidate Trump has already wreaked so much chaos that serious observers are wondering whether the party will survive. President Trump would be an agonizing, four-year commercial for anyone but the GOP.

He's obviously completely unprepared and unfit to fill the role, and is likely to go down in history as the most incompetent American president ever, all under the Republican banner. He's shown zero loyalty to party principles, leaving little reason to believe that he would advance those principles once in power (or indeed that he would advance any principles other than keeping the media spotlight on himself by saying and doing awful things) – even the most ardent of fantasists no longer imagine that he can be tamed. He's likely to cause a recession and do long-term damage to our international alliances. He's alienated minorities of all stripes – who the Republicans desperately need to win over in order to remain viable as a party – for a generation to come. A Trump presidency would in no way improve the GOP's situation.

On the other hand, a Clinton presidency – as awful as that might be in the minds of Republicans – would at least feed the base with a steady diet of outrage and resentment, giving the GOP a solid chance of taking back the White House in 2020 with a halfway sane and competent candidate who will actually advance the party's interests.

I mean, a lot of Republicans have already publicly climbed onto the #NeverTrump wagon. But many more haven't. Probably, there are many closet #NeverTrumpers who daren't say so publicly, for fear of pissing off the voters. And I guess I shouldn't underestimate the irrational fear and loathing of Clinton. But, come on, y'all – President Trump is the last thing you want, if you have any hope of recovering from this thing in the long term.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 9:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [22 favorites]


Dreams in the Shite House

Artw (and the rest of you Lovecraftians), never stop doing this kinda thing.
posted by Existential Dread at 9:20 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think it may be a case of there being so few viable candidates to turn it over to. The people Liberals are excited about are Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren.

Yeah, but who else do we hear anything about? As someone who doesn't have the time/energy to follow politics obsessively, yeah, I'm kind of in a position of waiting for the media to tell me who the next big things are. Maybe I'll pick my favorite of the next big things, but I'm not going to find them until someone points them out. And that's not exactly happening.
posted by Sequence at 9:21 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


So, long story short, Trump's history of lying might actually mean he's somewhat safer with state secrets than one might expect of a person who can't keep a secret because nobody will believe him.

Well, that's all true to a point. It becomes a big game of "and so clearly I can not choose the glass in front of you!" Except for one thing. If you give him real information that is verifiable by the subject, like say, NK missile information, and he blurts... at the very least you lose the use of that source again. You might get someone killed. Or you might provoke retaliation.
posted by ctmf at 9:24 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


Kaine embraces the Butter Cow

Ha ha! That sounds pretty messy. Let me read the actual article!

On a campaign tour, Kaine threw himself fully into the ...

Welp, that looks like a good place to stop.
posted by aubilenon at 9:25 PM on August 17, 2016 [6 favorites]


But, come on, y'all – President Trump is the last thing you want, if you have any hope of recovering from this thing in the long term.

A presidency is a long time. If you believe that Trump isn’t actually an existential threat to the United States, it’s not too hard to argue that, hey, four years of power is plenty of time to put some shine on this turd. It’s also a chance to push an overtly Republican agenda, since you’ll control the house and Senate, and you’ll get a few Supreme Court noms in the mix.

This, of course, also presupposes that you still believe Trump can be elected.
posted by Going To Maine at 9:26 PM on August 17, 2016 [2 favorites]


I want to see the phrase "fielding a mouthful of fried pork" in more political reporting.

David Cameron is on his way out, though


so, not looking good
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:27 PM on August 17, 2016 [12 favorites]


Re: the ageist stuff: Eh, the guy leaving the office is pretty young.
posted by notyou at 9:29 PM on August 17, 2016




Since it's a new thread and all I wanted to point out that Dinild is now taking place on twitter and also tumblr so you can pick your poisonplatform when you want to absolutely horrifyentertain your friends and enemies.

TRIMP
MAKE AGAIN make
posted by komara at 9:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


An Introduction To Field Organizing (by a veteran democratic organizer). Fascinating read... it's really incredible how deep all this goes, and just how thoroughly Trump is shitting the bed on it all.
posted by Itaxpica at 9:48 PM on August 17, 2016 [19 favorites]


Why are many Republicans still loyal

Part of it is Reagan's 11th Commandment: Thou shalt not speak ill of another Republican. Add the strict ideological purity of the Bush / Cheney Administration, in which dissent (within the party) was punished and minimized. Then followed by the frantic, but no less strict, ideological rigidness of the teabaggers, plus the whole very rigid, no compromises, obstructionism. So all that plays a part. It's a long established check on Republicans. (And there were times in the dark days of 2000 and 2004 when I wished Democrats had similar discipline.)

The other part is just old-fashioned political maneuvering. I publicly support Trump because, if he wins, I'll get a seat at the table. If he loses (and I'm sure many of the public endorsers hope so), no one can assail me for being disloyal to the party, and I still get a seat at the table. It's a very cynical win-win.
posted by honestcoyote at 9:49 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]



#sayswho on Twitter is some humorous before bed reading.
posted by Jalliah at 9:51 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Yeah, but who else do we hear anything about?

This is the consequence of the 2010 and 2014 Democratic wipeouts, the bench was completely decimated, and there are no up and coming next generation of Democratic candidates with national exposure. The Congressional leadership is basically stale boomers, and Martin Omalley is about the only credible (former) governor at the state level, because the Dems have lost so many state houses as well. 4-8 years of a Clinton presidency may hopefully help that situation, but at the moment the Democrats are limited to established players of the last generation. Warren is a relative newcomer, but not a spring chicken, because her past life as nationally renowned expert and champion of consumer rights was what gave her progresive credibility in the first place. If Clinton had not been on the scene, I don't want to think about a Democratic free for all between Bernie, sad Biden, and a host of nobodies plus Omalley.
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:57 PM on August 17, 2016 [8 favorites]


An Introduction To Field Organizing (by a veteran democratic organizer). Fascinating read... it's really incredible how deep all this goes, and just how thoroughly Trump is shitting the bed on it all.

I would've omitted the "canvasser pissed himself rather than find a bathroom" anecdote, myself. Ew.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 10:03 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


This is the consequence of the 2010 and 2014 Democratic wipeouts, the bench was completely decimated, and there are no up and coming next generation of Democratic candidates with national exposure.

Tulsi Gabbard, Julian Castro, Eric Garcetti, Kamala Harris, Kristen Gillibrand, Cory Booker, John Hickenlooper... that's off the top of my head.

I don't want to think about a Democratic free for all between Bernie, sad Biden, and a host of nobodies plus Omalley.

Not bad, really. Maybe with Booker sniffing around.
posted by dw at 10:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


>My theory for a while has been: Nocturnal home hemodialysis

Hmm, see the problem here is that we have to apply BOTH Trump's First Razor and Trump's Second Razor to the facts at hand.

Trump's Second Razor says that he either is being attacked on the health issue (projection) or is worried about being attacked (pre-emptive projection).

Trump's First Razor says that we must ascertain the stupidest possible scenario that can be reconciled with the available facts and that answer is likely correct.

So, an actual serious health problem like kidney failure is a serious situation--not stupid at all.

No go. We have to think stupider here.

I'm going with:
  • Health scare - routine medical test comes back positive, leaving you to stew about all the horrible possibilities before further testing reveals nothing really serious; stress and/or lack-of-sleep symptoms that look like they might, instead, be something cardiovascular until further testing rules it out--that type of thing
  • Ordinary run-of-the-mill health issues that any 70 year old might face and that are actually no big deal, but that threaten Donnie's masculinity and self-esteem or whatever
Take something like that, add a heavy dose of catastrophizing by Donnie and his inner circle, and there you go.

The main point, though, is (as pointed out up-thread): "Most negative things he says about others are actually describing him. Read his tweets with that in mind."

When he starts talking about Clinton's health, don't start thinking about what's up with Clinton's health--start thinking about what's up with Trump's health. Then think as stupid as possible. Good--now you're getting close!
posted by flug at 10:25 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


A long read from Timothy Shenk in The Guardian: “The dark history of Donald Trump's rightwing revolt”
posted by Going To Maine at 10:35 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


When he starts talking about Clinton's health, don't start thinking about what's up with Clinton's health--start thinking about what's up with Trump's health. Then think as stupid as possible. Good--now you're getting close!

He's having problems with chronic constipation?

It makes me kinda grumpy and bitter...
posted by Jalliah at 10:36 PM on August 17, 2016 [1 favorite]


Since it's a new thread and all I wanted to point out that Dinild is now taking place on twitter and also tumblr so you can pick your poisonplatform when you want to absolutely horrifyentertain your friends and enemies.

two observations:
1) the human body is an endless landscape of moist, shaggy horrors that rolls ever onward toward the horizon

2) the best part of this is that all of the photos are tagged as having trump in them, and are presumably showing up in media searches for His Orangeness
posted by murphy slaw at 10:39 PM on August 17, 2016 [11 favorites]


IBS

Irritable Brains Syndrome

Or maybe just a bad case of the twitters.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 10:44 PM on August 17, 2016 [3 favorites]


I hope the moderator is Rick Deckard.

"You're not helping. Why is that, Donald?"

"I like tortoises that weren't flipped over, okay? Probably a murdering rapist anyway."
[fake]
posted by ckape at 10:46 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


Seen in the internets:
Knock Knock
Who's there?
Says
Says who?
The Polls All Of Them
posted by humanfont at 10:53 PM on August 17, 2016 [21 favorites]


TRIMP
MAKE AGAIN make


Late-stage democracy.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:02 PM on August 17, 2016 [5 favorites]


On the other hand, a Clinton presidency – as awful as that might be in the minds of Republicans – would at least feed the base with a steady diet of outrage and resentment, giving the GOP a solid chance of taking back the White House in 2020

I've been thinking that the metaphor I want to use is, "Clinton may drive the country in the wrong direction for four straight years - but she won't be driving it off a cliff."

There is also the detail that neither party has viable candidates lined up for 2024. (Clinton would, presumably, run again in 2020.) The Confetti Candidates on the Republican side aren't going to coalesce into 3-5 in the next four years, and the Democrats are all going to look like right-wing reactionaries after this season. And as mentioned, the current batch of candidates is all seriously not-young.

In 2020 or 2024, we may be seeing a pack of 35- to 40-year old candidates, born in the early 80's with almost no conscious memory of a pre-internet world, drastically changing the way political campaigns are done. Look for a pack of YouTube vloggers running their pre-formal-announcement campaigns without acknowledging that TV media exists.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:10 PM on August 17, 2016 [4 favorites]


Late-stage Stage IV democracy.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:16 PM on August 17, 2016 [7 favorites]


the Democrats are all going to look like right-wing reactionaries after this season.

This needs a citation, or at least a clarification. The Democratic party sure as heck isn’t going anywhere, and if there’s something to be learned from Clinton v. Sanders it’s the reminder that the politician who can form the best coalition will win. “The left” as such right now is a broad collection of issues that aren’t necessarily that philosophically unified beyond “government isn’t inherently awful, and maybe let’s not destroy the social safety net.” (For instance, both Clinton and Sanders are just fine with drone warfare, an issue that ticks off many harder lefites.) Meanwhile, a bunch of Rs/“independents” just might be up for grabs if the party can figure out how to do the right outreach, and presumably that outreach will be to the right. After all, it’s Johnson, not Stein, who is primarily picking up the third-party vote right now.

Indeed, to assume that Orenstein & Mann have been onto something with their analysis of the ills of our system, the real issue right now is less left v. right and more gridlock v. not gridlock. If the up-and-comers in the Democratic party keep pulling so hard to the left that all the blue dogs vanish, it’s hard to imagine that gets much better. (Though, granted, the gridlock problem is perhaps less due to positions on the issue and complete moral collapse - but moral collapse, ironically, can be cured by throwing out the current crop of bums and replacing them with better ones. The Rs don’t have to drift left, they just have to drift away from obstruction.)

Besides that, the next eight years are going to bring about a whole new raft of complicated social issues. Self-driving cars will be around, CRISPR will perhaps be getting used on babies, drones will be omnipresent... it’ll be craaazy. The problem with the Ds having decisively won on a number of social issues is that those issues suddenly stop mattering. In eight years, no one’s going to care where you stood on gay marriage because the issue will be dead and everyone will care where you stand on Gattaca. (Well, okay, not everyone, but the vast majority until the next big Trumpian earthquake.)

So I dunno. But imagining a big leftward shift in the next generation seems premature.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:47 PM on August 17, 2016 [15 favorites]


look I already told you guys Weird Facebook is going to win in 2024. it's a historical inevitability.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:09 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


He casts no shadow! o_O
posted by Autumn Leaf at 12:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


He casts no shadow! o_O

From that picture of Trump’s office, I’d assume that Don Jr. is about to be sent out in a robot powered by Ivana…
posted by Going To Maine at 12:37 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Just a friendly reminder that Michael "Says Who" Cohen said this last year in response to Ivana's (later recanted) allegation of sexual assault:
"And, of course, understand that by the very definition, you can’t rape your spouse.”
In reaction to this comment, the Daily Beast discussed why it took until 1984 before New York recognized marital rape as a crime.

This reminder is brought to you by the Republican Rape Advisory Chart, which tracks all sorts of stupid and horrible things said by Republicans on the subject (trigger warning for Republicans saying stupid and horrible things about sexual assault).
posted by zachlipton at 12:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


Just a thought, but wouldn't Trump's Second Razor be more aptly named Trump's Mirror? Anything Trump says about an opponent is a reflection of himself?

(Which assumes he has a reflection, or is capable of reflection, but I'm comfortable with multiple layers of horror and irony at this stage in the game.)
posted by Devonian at 12:53 AM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


Trump's Shaving Kit

Trump's Razor - when attempting to explain Trump's behavior, the dumbest explanation is usually correct.

Trump's Mirror - If Trump says something about an opponent, he's actually talking about himself.

Trump's Shaving Cream - Always assume Trump is full of shaving cream... be nice and clean.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:18 AM on August 18, 2016 [80 favorites]


Yes, yes not that kind of razor. Homina homina homonym.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:21 AM on August 18, 2016


Trump's Shaving Cream
posted by oneswellfoop at 1:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Homonym, Houyhnhnm, who's counting? (Apart from Mister Ed, of course.)
posted by Devonian at 2:12 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


The Breitbart guys are going to want to make their mark soon. I therefore predict shenanigans for today.
posted by thelonius at 3:57 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Bah, let's not wait until 2020 or 2024.

Where do Hillary and Trump stand on Skynet? Are they for or against 100% of the federal budget going to fund strong AI research? Inquiring basilisks want to know!
posted by fragmede at 4:03 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I tell you what, though — these campaign megathreads have broken my usual web routine. Like, I generally start my day with several cups of black coffee and a leisurely trawl through the New York Times, the Guardian and BBC, the front page of MetaFilter, whatever links from friends on Facebook pique my interest and a few lefty sites.

I haven't done that since the conventions, y'all. It's always straight into the current reigning leviathan, to the little blue box that reads 476 new comments, show. And yeah, we're all kind of noting the velocity and volume of comments here, and trying not to narcissistically make too much of the fact that certain tropes that surface here seem to show up in the mainstream media later on.

It'd be tempting to frame this as some emerging form of real-time, non-Twitter, participatory news and analysis medium, but I think deep down we all suspect (or at least, I certain suspect) that it's all driven by that particularly unhinged oh-no-he-dint/whatever-will-he-think-to-do-next quality of the Republican candidate. Tell me we'd have biweekly 5,000-comment threads if the nominee had been, like, George Pataki.
posted by adamgreenfield at 4:11 AM on August 18, 2016 [63 favorites]


Michael "Sez Who" Cohen is claiming that they have many secret black friends, and that's why the polls are wrong. Funny how Trump's secret black friends don't show up at the rallies or have their picture taken with him or write press releases about why they support him.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:35 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


Does his uncle work at Nintendo as well?
posted by PenDevil at 4:39 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


Ahh, the old Canadian Girlfriend gambit.
posted by adamgreenfield at 4:40 AM on August 18, 2016 [38 favorites]


"Sez" is one of those literary conventions for expressing oral style or uneducated diction that makes no sense. There is no alternative (American English) dialectal way to say "says." A Harvard professor "sez" educated things. A stevedore "says" stevedore things. Potato, pota(h)to it ain't.

"Sez" is a thus a strictly visual writerly convention. It says (sez) "this guy speaks with bad spelling."

I guess it saves writing one letter.

/favors IPA spelling for all writing
posted by spitbull at 4:41 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


(PS that might be the single most MetaFiltery comment I've ever written. Says who? Say what?)
posted by spitbull at 4:48 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Hopefully the issues we're seeing the edges of, given the popularity of these politics mega-threads demonstrates why Mefi style moderation won't scale to larger, more active sites like Twitter or Reddit, and that it's not strictly an issue with resource allocation.
posted by fragmede at 4:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


I was just thinking yesterday that I have been running to these threads to get my "latest Trumpster fire" fix and I kind of felt bad that I'm not sure where to get my Hillary updates? There are a few updates about the Hillary campaign in these threads, but it's definitely outnumbered by the Trump soap opera.

This is understandable because we are all naturally geared toward hearing about drama and the Trump campaign is not capable of avoiding drama for more than 24 hours.

It seems like no matter where I look people are talking about Trump, whether positively or negatively. Isn't this exactly what he wants? Isn't this exactly why he thinks he doesn't have to buy ads because he's getting the attention for free?

Not sure what the answer is. We cannot idly stand by while he lies and insults everyone but he's also feeding off the attention.
posted by like_neon at 4:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


> "Michael 'Sez Who' Cohen is claiming that they have many secret black friends, and that's why the polls are wrong."

They live in the secret states.
posted by kyrademon at 4:53 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Secret strategy: implement the secret plan. In the secret states.
posted by box at 4:56 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]




Funny how Trump's secret black friends don't show up at the rallies or have their picture taken with him or write press releases about why they support him.

Well, then they wouldn't be a secret, duh.
posted by C'est la D.C. at 5:01 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Here's Obama giving the game away about the secret states. There are eight of them, apparently.
posted by Devonian at 5:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


They live in the secret states.

That was my reaction, too. Trump is full of secrets. His taxes are secret, his plans are secret, his states are secret...ad. in.

I went with "sez" because it conveys a certain belligerence that "says" does not. Wise guys and tough guys use "sez." Michael Cohen was definitely trying to be a tough guy.

Now that I'm at my desk I can cut and paste from the article that T. D. Strange linked.
Cohen went on to say the over 100 African-Americans he has worked with during the campaign are all convinced Clinton would “pander” to their community with “no ability or intent to follow through.”

“These same individuals have all met with Mr. Trump and have engaged in significant dialogue about issues that effect their specific communities. Unanimously, these African-American Evangelical preachers all acknowledge that Donald Trump is colorblind when it comes to race and is only interested in ensuring that all Americans have the opportunity to thrive and achieve the American dream,” said Cohen.

Cohen also pointed to the crowds at Trump’s rallies as a sign polls may be off.

“I think Mr. Trump and Secretary Clinton are substantially closer than the polls indicate,” Cohen explained. “The proof is the massive 20-, 25- and 30,000-person rallies that he is attending on a multiple-time-per-week basis. In all honesty, Hilary Clinton can’t fill a Starbucks even if they offered free ventis.”
So not only does he have secret black friends but he draws 30,000 people to his rallies several times a week. I guess these are some secret rallies because again there is no photographic proof of that. What I am seeing is his largest rallies are maybe a few thousand. The RNC is probably the last time that tens of thousands of people showed up in person to hear Trump speak-- and many of those people were there for other reasons.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:16 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 5:22 AM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


So here's what I've been trying to figure out: if you're a member of the Republican establishment, and are solely concerned with the well-being of the party, isn't there a pretty clear case to be made that a Trump win would do far more damage to the GOP than a Trump loss? I mean, Candidate Trump has already wreaked so much chaos that serious observers are wondering whether the party will survive. President Trump would be an agonizing, four-year commercial for anyone but the GOP.

Expecting republicans to act for the collective good of their party is to misunderstand what a republican is.
posted by srboisvert at 5:23 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


And let's not forget Kaine's Razor: "iPod iPhone icant TAKE It anymore! I'll stick with the Motorola."
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:24 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


>@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

Soon they will be calling you "presidential loser" and later "The guy who ran the worst campaign in modern history" but MR BREXIT is what you're going with?

OK.

OK.

OOOOOOK.
posted by Tevin at 5:24 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


What does MR BREXIT even mean??? What are we going to secede from? Reality??
posted by C'est la D.C. at 5:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [19 favorites]


@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

Most Americans:Mr Whatsit?
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


He means he'll shock the world by winning and then everyone will be regretful and the Economy will crash. Interesting strat.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 5:27 AM on August 18, 2016 [38 favorites]


Whereas Egg McMuffin is MR BREFIX.
posted by valkane at 5:29 AM on August 18, 2016 [61 favorites]


Trump brags about his rally crowds but how many of them are there to support him and how many are there to see a show. It's tempting to see the crazy close up and personal, so I bet there's a lot of lookey loos.

And how many of his people who 'never voted before' all the folks he claims to be bringing in are registered to vote? This is where the GOP voter suppression is going to bite ol' Donnie in the ass. Those people better be getting busy making sure their Drivers License or State ID with the picture says the correct address. And that they have registered and get to the proper place to vote at the proper time.
posted by readery at 5:29 AM on August 18, 2016


Time for Clinton's crew to start stressing how much a Trump victory will cost many voters.

Ok, they want some BREXIT magic? Start talking about how f'ed up the UK economy already is from that insane choice. It's costing thousands of jobs and billions of Euros already and it has t even started.

Seems to me that reminding people that a Trump win would sink the retirement savings of tens of millions of Americans (generally educated ones especially) would be worthwhile. Start saying what investors already are discussing: the high likelihood of chaos in stock markets if Trump were to win and enact his proposed trade policies, just for a start.

For the poorer folks, stess the immediate impact on the prices of food, transportation, and basic consumer goods of a radically protectionist and anti-immigration government. Make it dark. Let people secretly calculate what they have to lose personally.
posted by spitbull at 5:32 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

I was certain that must be the @RealDenaldTrump parody account but it's... not?

Did he wake and bake and get, like, super fucking high this morning? What is he even trying to say?
posted by dersins at 5:33 AM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


Also too remember when Trump seemed not to know what BREXIT even was?
posted by spitbull at 5:35 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'll repeat this every time it comes up -- the polls weren't off in Brexit.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 5:41 AM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


Brexit was an upset election in which a xenophobic, radically protectionist policy plan unexpectedly won over the flawed-but-workable status quo that everybody thought would prevail. Trump is just trying to rub some of that magic juju on himself. It's just word association.

That's what a lot of his campaign rhetoric is: it's just a mishmash of words, concepts, and catch-phrases that resonate with his supporters, strung together haphazardly and set to a familiar, insistent, rhythmic cadence.

It's a different kind of rhetoric than we like here on MeFi, but its power should not be discounted. Many people use language that way. It's very common. It's also frequently linked with mental illness, but as we all know only the poor are crazy—the rich are merely eccentric.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


"Michael 'Sez Who' Cohen is claiming that they have many secret black friends, and that's why the polls are wrong."

"Our black friends support us in secret
They all think Trump's great don’t you know.
You liberals just don’t understand them
But soon you will bow down to us so!"
posted by octobersurprise at 5:46 AM on August 18, 2016


I'm pretty sure we could convince his target demo that Brexit is a brand of tasteless fiber breakfast biscuits.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


20-, 25- and 30,000-person rallies

I say this sincerely: I want to see the receipts. Because last I heard he was yelling at fire marshals because the venues he'd booked were a long way from being that large. Is he seriously, still, routinely getting 25,000 people at his rallies?
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Brexit is Breitbart-approved (WashPo):
Bannon is close to Nigel Farage, the former head of the right-wing U.K. Independence Party, who offered “massive thanks” to Breitbart News for supporting the party’s successful campaign on behalf of Britain’s departure from the European Union. “Your UKIP team is just incredible,” Bannon told Farage during an interview after the June Brexit vote.
posted by peeedro at 5:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Did he wake and bake and get, like, super fucking high this morning? What is he even trying to say?

I'll repeat this every time it comes up -- the polls weren't off in Brexit.

I think that's the only interpretation of the MR BREXIT tweet that makes sense. The Donald woke up, turned on his massive array of televisions (1989 magnavoxes) to the talking heads, saw that everyone was doing "SAYS WHO" knock knock jokes, then reminded himself that most of the polls for Brexit had a decent lead for remain up until the last week when they narrowed to a dead heat.
posted by dis_integration at 5:54 AM on August 18, 2016


Our black friends support us in secret

The mother of all reverse Bradley effects, just you wait.
posted by spitbull at 5:55 AM on August 18, 2016


Was the BREXIT tweet from an iPhone or an Android phone?
posted by ardgedee at 5:58 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


He fell asleep to Bannon talking Brexit, maybe as kind of a cheerleading speech "the world is changing, the people as rising up against the status quo and only YOU Mr Trump can lead them!!!"

He woke, blinked his piggy little eyes, reached for his phone and typed 'They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.'
posted by readery at 6:00 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Er, I'm sorry, not a dead heat, but a shift to a sure lead for brexit in the last weeks. But the pundits definitely said it still wouldn't happen, showing how people often can ignore the polls right in front of them.
posted by dis_integration at 6:00 AM on August 18, 2016


Michael "Sez Who" Cohen is claiming that they have many secret black friends, and that's why the polls are wrong. Funny how Trump's secret black friends don't show up at the rallies or have their picture taken with him or write press releases about why they support him.

"The lurkers support us in email."
posted by dersins at 6:01 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Yeah, both Brexit and the Trump primary victory were ultimately vindications of polling data. In both cases the actual result was pretty close to the poll prediction. Pundits weren't saying these things would never happen because of data, they were saying they would never happen because they're completely stupid. Unfortunately, being completely stupid is not a guarantee of failure, whereas being down in polls still seems to be.
posted by jackbishop at 6:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]



@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.


2016's remake of "In the Heat of the Night" had some odd casting and script choices.
posted by splen at 6:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]



He's obviously completely unprepared and unfit to fill the role, and is likely to go down in history as the most incompetent American president ever, all under the Republican banner. He's shown zero loyalty to party principles, leaving little reason to believe that he would advance those principles once in power (or indeed that he would advance any principles other than keeping the media spotlight on himself by saying and doing awful things)


#neverzaphod
posted by solotoro at 6:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


(I went there, too, splen. Sidney Poitier Our Man From Queens is not.)
posted by adamgreenfield at 6:10 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

Won't that cause brand confusion? Will they have to change the signs on all the buildings? MR. BREXIT Steaks?

I mean, I understand the impulse to move away from a brand that has been tarnished/tainted, but he really needs to think through his strategy here.
posted by nubs at 6:18 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


If the Presidency were a figurehead position, and if Trump were a hoopy frood rather than a frothing hatemonger, I might feel a lot better about this whole election thing.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 6:18 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


What does MR BREXIT even mean???

Maybe it's like Mr. October
posted by thelonius at 6:21 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Mr Brexit, huh?

Well, UKIP - Farage's party and the party of Brexit - has fallen apart, collapsed in the polls and is currently in the middle of a massive squabble over who's going to inherit the ashes.

So, yeah, that works for me.
posted by Devonian at 6:25 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


(although, to be fair, that's also true of Labour. The process of Brexit itself is proving to be like passing a puffer fish that's inflated itself in the lower digestive tract - if you don't shit it out, you'll probably die of internal wounds and the neurotoxins; if you do, you'll die through the massive bleeding and trauma. But so far, the critter's not moving - really, we still have no idea now what's going to happen- because NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MINDS STICKS A LIVE PUFFER FISH UP THEIR ARSE.

Yes, still angry Could you tell?)
posted by Devonian at 6:33 AM on August 18, 2016 [80 favorites]


For the new thread, update on the yard sign commentary from the previous thread: I did see the first house in my new neighborhood (within Rockville, MD; I bought a house and moved in this past January) to be festooned with yard signs. I'm not talking one, I'm talking three or four. And they seemed to understand both the "display to traffic" and "make a point to neighbors opposite" approaches, as the signs were placed both parallel and perpendicular to the curb. [real]

And they were for Trump. [real]

I was very upset at seeing that, and I still am. Just bummed.[real]

I was surprised at exactly how upset. [fake]


I'm just going to go hug the 538 forecast page for MD, which shows two flat lines for Clinton at 99.9% and Trump at <0.1%.
posted by seyirci at 6:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MINDS STICKS A LIVE PUFFER FISH UP THEIR ARSE.

I can get behind that.
posted by kingless at 6:47 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Oh, huh, you found Montgomery County's Trump voter.
posted by jackbishop at 6:48 AM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

Coming out of my cage
And I've been doing just fine
Those polls are getting me down
Because I want it all
I stir some shit with a tweet
Gonna win, winning's sweet
Just keep letting me tweet, just keep letting me tweet.
posted by Superplin at 6:50 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


Oh, huh, you found Montgomery County's Trump voter.

I found Pittsburgh's Ben Carson fan! It was when I was househunting in the spring and one of the cars in the driveway of the house we were looking at had a Carson bumper sticker and I was like, 'Oh, bless your heart." (The house itself had scripture passages painted on to the walls, and little crosses painted above every window. So, yeah.)

Also, Pittsburgh's Ted Cruz fan lives up the block. Bumper sticker still firmly affixed to car.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Oh, huh, you found Montgomery County's Trump voter.

Probably an Eastern Shore transplant
posted by phearlez at 6:54 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


The leadership of the Tories and of the GOP didn't believe that ethnic nationalism is a problem within the white community anymore. That's why they assumed the polls were skewed.

I have some sympathy for the ordinary Brexit and Trump voters. There are reasons - not good reasons mind you, but understandable and sometimes even legitimate reasons - for voting as they did.

But I have nothing but scorn for the political leaders whose selfishness, wilful blindness and utter indifference to the danger of their rhetoric created these conditions.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:59 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Because last I heard he was yelling at fire marshals because the venues he'd booked were a long way from being that large. Is he seriously, still, routinely getting 25,000 people at his rallies?

I think Trump/Coren is calculating what the numbers would be if #incompetentfiremarshals let everyone in.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:00 AM on August 18, 2016




> What does MR BREXIT even mean???

Within days of the Brexiteers' unexpected success, most of them had quit or scurried away, terrified.

Devonian, Farage's quitting preceded UKIP's collapse, as you say - his personality held it aloft - but the money behind UKIP has hinted darkly at a new populist/far-right party to replace it. Still early days; I've no idea how well it'd poll.

But I assume Trump wants the association with a perceived upset against "the establishment", and ignorance triumphing over experts.

Watching these threads from the UK, all I can (repeatedly) say/plead to Hillary supporters is: don't be complacent (as we were).
posted by Quagkapi at 7:11 AM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


his personality held it aloft
"personality"
posted by adamgreenfield at 7:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Not complacent at all here. Did another evening of phone banking in MA. Got to make some conversions to volunteers. People do seem to require an incredible amount of hand holding though.
posted by peacheater at 7:15 AM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Yeah in my few weeks of phone banking I have not talked to a single person on the phone or volunteer in the call center who has said "Yeah, I support Hilary but she's got this thing sewn up, I'm not worried."

It's all "You betcha I'm going to vote, we can't let this guy get elected!" Obviously that's a self-selecting group (you're a volunteer, or interested enough to be on a call list) but I'm heartened to discover that nearly everyone I interact with (so far as they say!) is taking this very seriously.
posted by Tevin at 7:19 AM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Re: the ageist stuff: Eh, the guy leaving the office is pretty young.

Re the ageist stuff: obsessing on the age of the candidates in general is not so cool. We can discuss their health and fitness and qualifications without harping on particular calendar ages, or pigeonholing them with some generational label we have a personal prejudice against.
posted by aught at 7:23 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


> Did another evening of phone banking in MA. Got to make some conversions to volunteers. People do seem to require an incredible amount of hand holding though.

I'd like to hear more about what you mean by the 'incredible amount of hand holding' (having just read and thoroughly enjoyed Itaxpica's link to 'THIS ELECTION IS FREAKING ME OUT, WHAT CAN I DO!? (An Introduction to Field Organizing).)
posted by moody cow at 7:35 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I like how Mister Brexit scans.
MIS-ter BREX-it

Kind of like
DOC-tor EV-il
posted by angrycat at 7:35 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Re the ageist stuff: obsessing on the age of the candidates in general is not so cool.

Both Trump and Clinton are only about 70 years old. I don't think either of them has enough life experience to be qualified for this office. We need someone with more maturity.
posted by Faint of Butt at 7:36 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]



I think Trump/Coren is calculating what the numbers would be if #incompetentfiremarshals let everyone in.

Riiiight I know that was meant to be tongue-in-cheek but seriously the rally where he first complained about the Fire Marshals being in the pay of Big Hillary there were 1000 people inside the room and 1000 in the overflow room. Maybe they had a thousand or even two outside-- so even if the Fire Marshals kowtowed to MR BREXIT we are still talking less than 5000.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:38 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Both Trump and Clinton are only about 70 years old. I don't think either of them has enough life experience to be qualified for this office. We need someone with more maturity.

Wait do you want us to vote Chtulhu or Smaug?
posted by Zalzidrax at 7:38 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


We need someone with more maturity.

May we see your ID?
posted by y2karl at 7:39 AM on August 18, 2016


Come on, Cthulhu waits dreaming in drowned R'lyeh - he probably has pillows!

No, the malignant deity for us this election year is Nyarlathotep.
posted by winna at 7:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


MIS-ter BREX-it

Clap. Clap. Clapclapclap.
posted by box at 7:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


I'd like to hear more about what you mean by the 'incredible amount of hand holding' (having just read and thoroughly enjoyed Itaxpica's link to 'THIS ELECTION IS FREAKING ME OUT, WHAT CAN I DO!? (An Introduction to Field Organizing).)

I really enjoyed that link as well!

By hand-holding I meant that even when people are enthusiastic about volunteering, they're having a lot of trouble figuring out how to volunteer. One issue is that a lot of the volunteering is hidden inside hillaryclinton.com/events, which people don't think to look at since they think of volunteering as distinct from events, maybe?

Second, once people find that link, they can enter their zip code and get a list of volunteer events near them. Unfortunately the volunteer events seem to be organized haphazardly and not in chronological order. For example, what the potential volunteer really needs to know is that there is phonebanking at 11 Beacon St. in Boston, MA every weekday from morning till night. Instead there are a bunch of distinct events, with titles like Phonebanking, Sept 20th, Phonebanking, Aug 19th, Phonebanking Aug 18th and the order in which things appear seems rather random? This makes things needlessly confusing and causes volunteers to think there are fewer volunteering opportunities than they are. Still, I was able to personally wade through that stuff and see that basically there were volunteering opportunities every day to phone bank or canvass in NH. Most potential volunteers need this to be spelled out for them.

A lot of people don't want to just get that information on the phone though - they're at work and can't talk now and would like an email with the info. Which is fine, and understandable, but the volunteering opportunities are not super complicated and would only really take a couple minutes to tell them on the phone. Instead of which I send them an email (I have one drafted and ready to go - but I think this is another thing the campaign should try to draft beforehand), to whatever emails they have provided and cc the campaign head organizer etc. All of which takes time I could be using to make more phone calls. Then I get follow up emails with more questions.

I am providing all this feedback to the supervisors by the way, and I think their systems are improving.
posted by peacheater at 7:47 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


MIS-ter BREX-it

MAY-or DEW-ey
MAY-or DEW-ey
MAY-or DEW-ey
posted by Strange Interlude at 7:53 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Is he seriously, still, routinely getting 25,000 people at his rallies?

No. I've watched a lot of his events (livebloged some last thread)and don't recall a venue larger than 9,000. You could double that and not get the numbers they're throwing around.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:53 AM on August 18, 2016


Unfortunately the volunteer events seem to be organized haphazardly and not in chronological order.

YES! CAN CONFIRM! It's super confusing. I can't tell if they're arranged in proximity to my zip code (which, like, I live in a city, there are 10 zipcodes within 2 miles of my house, I do not need to know which events are 10 blocks closer, just any in the city limits is cool) or what but they are definitely not chronological. And if you live somewhere with a big campaign presence, the events page is OVERWHELMING. Like, there are people going every weekend to a certain farmer's market to register voters. Cool. That means that "Registering Voters at XXX Market" is on the events page like 10 times. Multiply that by every single farmer's market, every single neighborhood with a major commercial district, every single weekly phone bank, and it adds up to dozens and dozens of events in non-chronological order. I love that the campaign is doing such a huge GOTV operation here but it's hard to navigate.

I'll admit to being a whiny whinypants on the volunteering and I haven't done any yet. And I keep hearing about "volunteer orientations" but... there don't seem to be any of those on my local Events page? Are they just baked into the events themselves?

Soooo yeah. I am probably one of these people that requires hand-holding. I'm working on it.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:56 AM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


They will soon be calling me MR BOOMBASTIC.
posted by PlusDistance at 7:57 AM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


spitbull: I like the image of stoned Gary Johnson fucking up Putin's carefully laid plans and winning by accident amidst the carnage.

January, 2017: Putin calls the White House

Johnson: Hey, what's up?
Putin: Uh, hallo, let me speak to the President.
Johnson: That's me!
Putin: No, the president, some Gary Johnson. This is Vladimir Putin, President of the Russian Federation.
Johnson: Yeah, and you got me! Wanna go rock climbing?
Putin: What? No, we need to talk about your term.
Johnson: Can we do it while mountain biking? Or maybe horse riding?
Putin: OK, this is enough. Give me the president.
Johnson: That's me! Gary Johnson! Google me! Google Gary Johnson. Oh wait, there are a lot of Gary Johnsons. Google President Gary Johnson. And turn on "Safe Search," people put weird photos on the internet these days.


palindromic: TPM: GOPer Who Wrote Fiery Benghazi Mom’s RNC Speech: Clinton ‘Only Choice’ In Nov:

I used to work with a guy who ran a successful GOP Governor's campaign, and he said that he didn't really support the Governor's policies, and was more of a Libertarian himself, but he was "Really good at running those campaigns." After all, the Governor won. He was way higher in the company structure than I was, so I wasn't going to shout at him "THEN WHY NOT WORK FOR THE CANDIDATE YOU ACTUALLY SUPPORTED (MORE)?!?!?!"
posted by filthy light thief at 7:57 AM on August 18, 2016 [19 favorites]


Upthread: #sayswho on Twitter is some humorous before bed reading.

Taking a look:

SNL doesn't have to change a thing. #SaysWho?

"My hands are normal size." #SaysWho

"Worth $9 billion" #SaysWho

#SaysWho is now my response to everything.

We were gifted both #SaysWho and #TurdTornado in a single day. What a time to be alive.


Heh. (Indeed.)
posted by RedOrGreen at 8:00 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


There's a limited amount of venues that can even hold 25-30k people. Tomorrow for example, Trump is at a sports complex place in Michigan. Saturday they're having community league hockey games. It might hold 6-7000 people if you stuffed them in. He's not selling out Ford Field, or even the Breslin Center.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:00 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Regarding the writer of the Benghazi Mom speech, a quote from the mentioned op-ed:

As a political speechwriter, that was something of a home run moment for me. The New Yorker called the speech "the weaponization of grief."

I ... don't think this guy understands the point that The New Yorker was trying to make.
posted by tocts at 8:00 AM on August 18, 2016 [32 favorites]


>No, the malignant deity for us this election year is Nyarlathotep

Everyone makes fun of the Tzeentch or Tzbust people, but I for one believe the insane chaos prophets who forsee that the Changer of Ways still has a secret and very, very complicated plan to win it all.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


Is the Trimp stuff safe for the squeamish? I don't have any brain-bleach on me.
posted by pxe2000 at 8:05 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


#SaysWho
#ManyPeopleAreSaying
posted by C'est la D.C. at 8:07 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


pxe2000:

It's disturbing, vaguely-Trump-shaped flesh lumps, often with tiny mouths. Kind if like a Chris Cunningham video. So probably not.
posted by argybarg at 8:08 AM on August 18, 2016


I'm Mr Brexit
Get schwifty

is what I hear
posted by Sauce Trough at 8:09 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


Another thing about the events page is that there are surely folks like me who would like to volunteer our time and skills but not at anything considered an 'event', at least as that seems to be shown around here. The events for my area are all voter registration and phone banking, and those things are great and awesome and necessary, but I know very well that I am not capable of doing them. (At least, not with so much Ativan under my belt that you probably no longer WANT me doing them, at that point.)

If my local campaign office could use someone to do some non-public-facing dirty work, I would be there. Can I stuff envelopes? Can I do data entry? Can I set up or tear down for events? I would be there, except I can't figure out how to get there, as my emails have gone unanswered and the same social anxiety stuff that makes it hard for me to phone bank also makes it hard for me to make cold phone calls. If I could get someone to shoot me an email and say 'Hey, show up at X day/time, we'll put you to good use sorting t-shirts" or any other boring little thing, I would be there in a heartbeat.

(I don't actually mind any of this, it's more important that the campaign get the people that it needs to do the things it needs, than that it hand-hold me through my anxiety and reach out to me in exactly the way I need so I can feel useful. But it's an interesting observation and I wonder if there might be other silent armies of would-be quiet people out there, ready to do the scut work, if we could only figure out how to reach out in the right way within our limitations.)
posted by Stacey at 8:10 AM on August 18, 2016 [19 favorites]


In the New England states, if you see one TRUMP sign on a lawn, there will be at least three TRUMP signs on the lawn. My wife and I love going "Trump, Trump, Trump!" to each other as we pass these bastions of belligerency.
posted by yhbc at 8:10 AM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Tomorrow for example, Trump is at a sports complex place in Michigan.

Which mentions him not at all on their site, instead choosing to prominently feature info for women's flat track roller derby division 2 championships, which is amazing.

So obviously their business folks figured out that DIVISION 2 WOMEN'S ROLLER DERBY > TRUMP
posted by palindromic at 8:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


Today is the 96th anniversary of the ratification of the 19th Amendment. It occurs to me that if Clinton wins, then she would preside over its centennial, which would be awesome.
posted by jedicus at 8:15 AM on August 18, 2016 [49 favorites]


That is why it's my goal to make it to the 2020 DNC with my daughter, who will be 6 by then.
posted by palindromic at 8:16 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


I would be there, except I can't figure out how to get there,

Yeah, this too. Everything on my local events page is either a phone bank or voter reg. And there are tonnnnns of those, which is awesome, but those are the only two options on the menu.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:16 AM on August 18, 2016


LET'S go RED sox!
posted by spitbull at 8:19 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Just from personal experience, I don't think many hyper-local offices (where a lot of the back end work is done) are up and running yet. I know my Organizer's office is opening next week.

Also, if you sign up for an event, eventual an Organizer (or volunteer) WILL call you. From there you can let them know that you would like to do something that is not forward facing and then figure out what you can do.

From what I can tell, if you can talk to your area Organizer they will keep a profile of what kind of work you can/want to do and be in touch accordingly. But don't feel like signing up for an event is set in stone - it's a good way to get their attention.
posted by Tevin at 8:21 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]




@RealDonaldTrump They will soon be calling me MR BREXIT.

so a raging dumpster fire enabled by a discouraged and bewildered electorate?

sounds about right
posted by murphy slaw at 8:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Liberals Have the Wrong Fears About Hillary’s #NeverTrump Outreach:
...the term of art for what Clinton is doing is building a “permission structure” for Republican officeholders and Republican voters to overcome their partisan inhibitions and vote for her.

If Clinton, or any Democrat for that matter, says Trump is unfit for the presidency, it does nothing to convince Republicans, and may even make Republicans more inclined to support Trump. But if former Reagan and Bush advisers validate Clinton’s claims, other Republicans might take them seriously.
...
The danger of being too solicitous of conservatives is that it’ll bump progressives out of the opposite end of a huge, unwieldy coalition. That’s why I argued recently that the right thing for Clinton to offer her new surrogates in exchange for their support is nothing. Abandoning Trump is its own reward and there’s no reason to disrupt the liberal coalition by offering permanent policy concessions for the sake of what will likely be a one-time alliance of necessity.

And so far, that’s exactly what Clinton has offered them: squat. Republicans can support her, and in return they can preserve their dignity. Her economic policy hasn’t swung back to the center since winning the primary, and though most progressives have never been huge fans of her foreign policy, nothing suggests she’s become more hawkish or open to inviting neocons back into the government than she was before the endorsements started rolling in.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:28 AM on August 18, 2016 [49 favorites]




Shortly I'm going to be eating lunch on the sofa while watching last night's Daily Show. I will be using a pillow behind my back and I'm eating a Taco salad in a Bowl. I'm so confused. I don't know who to vote for.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:30 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


My wife and I love going "Trump, Trump, Trump!" to each other as we pass these bastions of belligerency.

GOP Elephant picked the Trump
and blew the fucking election
off they went with a Trumpity Trump
Trump Trump Trump

GOP Elephant picked the Trump
and trundled off to the alt-right
off they went with a Trumpity Trump
Truuuuump
Truuuuuuump
Truuuuuuuuuump
posted by murphy slaw at 8:30 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Donald Trump aide on awkward exchange with CNN anchor: ‘I think I unraveled her’.

Cohen told Yahoo News he was stunned by Keilar’s conduct during the interview. “I was shocked at the length of the silence as she stumbled to think of an answer,” Cohen said. “And when she did come up with an answer, it was so generic it could have applied to anything.”

CNN interview as Rashomon.

(Look out for the bit where he cites "more than 100 African-American Evangelical preachers" as evidence that African-Americans will vote for Trump.)
posted by rory at 8:31 AM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


MIS-ter BREX-it

*clap clap clap-clap-clap*

[NOT YANKEES-IST]
posted by dersins at 8:32 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Today is the 96th anniversary of the ratification of the 19th Amendment.

And I think we're going to see a real 19th Amendment solution to Donald Trump.
posted by Sophie1 at 8:33 AM on August 18, 2016 [48 favorites]


MEET HILLARY CLINTON'S INNER CIRCLE, THE QUEENMAKERS WHO WON'T REST UNTIL SHE'S PRESIDENT
They came for Bill but left with Hillary.
San Francisco philanthropist Susie Tompkins Buell says the first time she was in the same room with Hillary Clinton was at a Bay Area fundraiser for Bill Clinton, in the early 1990s. Hillary was there to deliver the introduction for her husband, and Buell was instantly smitten—but not by the candidate. “I remember thinking, She is going to run for president someday—it should be her,” Buell, the founder of Esprit clothing, recalls. “It wasn’t that I was turned off by him, I was just so attracted to her. I could feel her dedication.”
posted by the man of twists and turns at 8:34 AM on August 18, 2016 [13 favorites]


Donald Trump aide on awkward exchange with CNN anchor: ‘I think I unraveled her’.

All these men understand is dominance. I swear this entire campaign is just a referendum on PUA tactics and how well they work on the general populace.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:35 AM on August 18, 2016 [67 favorites]


soren_lorenson, I believe we're working off the same events page for the same city. Maybe we should show up together at the East Liberty office and stage a very quiet unassuming sit-in until they give us some envelopes to stuff very quietly.
posted by Stacey at 8:37 AM on August 18, 2016 [23 favorites]


Slightly dated news from New Mexico: Pence aims to put New Mexico in play
In a campaign foray into what’s been a reliably Democratic state in recent presidential election years, Republican vice presidential candidate Mike Pence told New Mexicans on Tuesday to ignore polls that show Donald Trump trailing in this year’s race.
...
“We’re going to put New Mexico on the board to make Donald Trump the president of the United States of America,” Pence told a crowd of roughly 600 cheering supporters in a Sandia Resort and Casino ballroom.
New Mexico is not likely to turn Red for Donnie. But there's more! Pence faces boos at rally over Trump rival (NM Gov.) Martinez
Gov. Mike Pence faced a chorus of boos from the crowd at a rally here on Tuesday after he defended Gov. Susana Martinez, a fellow Republican who has declined to endorse Donald Trump in his presidential bid.

“Let me say Susana Martinez is a dear, dear friend of mine,” Pence said in a response to a question about why Martinez and other Republicans have not endorsed Trump.

“She’s a great governor, she’s done a great job for New Mexico,” Pence said Tuesday, drawing boos from the crowd. Pence had spoken with Martinez just a few hours earlier at the Republican Governors Association summer meeting in Aspen, Colorado.

Trump and Martinez do not have a warm relationship, with the GOP nominee saying in May that the New Mexico governor “has got to do a better job.”
The first article notes "The turnout for Tuesday’s town hall meeting at Sandia Resort was far smaller than for Trump’s rally in May, which drew an estimated 8,000 people."
posted by filthy light thief at 8:38 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Re Hillary events, there's naught all way out in teahadist country where we live, but there is a Pride parade in Dallas in Sept, where my 13 year old and I will be joining the Pride for Hillary contingent. We're headed to the craft store this afternoon to pick up sign making materials.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 8:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


All these men understand is dominance. I swear this entire campaign is just a referendum on PUA tactics and how well they work on the general populace.

Gotta love how a 'wtf you stupid man' incredulous reaction gets translated into 'Ha. You see? She didn't know what to say. I gots her , hardy har."

What is kinda awesome though is that I checked out his twitter and that tweet is full of 'says who' responses and people laughing at him. Haven't checked this morning but the laughing response was the majority.
posted by Jalliah at 8:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


Trump lingered last in line for brains
The one he got was sorta rotten and insane
Small hands so sad, flips birds can't land
Is Trump fast asleep a-while-he breaks his own brands

He's Trump
He's Trump
He's Trump

What's on his head?
posted by Groundhog Week at 8:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [23 favorites]


Because of all of you* I've just made my first ever financial contributions to political campaigns: one to Hillary and one to Katie McGinty (running for Senate in PA).

It seems especially wonderful that this is on the 96th anniversary of women getting the vote. (And also just days before my grandmother's 96th birthday!)

So thank you for convincing me to get off of the sidelines. (But I'm still not getting anywhere near a phone bank. Nuh uh. Never. Nope. No way.)

*with a hat tip to Trump, who reminds me much too much of my narcissist mother

posted by mcduff at 8:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


I signed up to do phone banking on Saturday. I'm terrified, and will definitely be hitting the Klonopin beforehand, but our generally kickass mayor will be present and I've met him before so that's giving me some comfort space (although, I mean, it's not like we're chatting buddies or he'll even remember me; this is all in my brain). Once I'm there, I plan to ask about opportunities for data entry and other non-public-facing tasks, if any are available, but I am steeling myself even to go out and canvass (ack!) if that's what they need. I'm determined to do my part in this.

What was frustrating for me was to see how few events were available. I realize it's early days yet and they're still setting up their offices, and although Arizona is a surprisingly swingish state this go-round, it's not a huge campaign priority. Still, we have an important senate race where we might actually get rid of that numpty McCain, and I just imagined that in this big metro area there would be more going on.
(It's also annoying because it's keeping me low on the leaderboard on the surprisingly enjoyable Hillary app, since I can't rack up the big points by committing to/checking in at/inviting friends to events. I mean politics are important and all but what about my game stats.)
posted by Superplin at 8:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


Who can forget the 50,000 people that rallied for McGovern 5 days before his 49 state landslide*.


* loss
posted by chris24 at 8:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


I think this is all just n-dimensional chess.

And n = 0.
posted by srboisvert at 8:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [18 favorites]


The events for my area are all voter registration and phone banking, and those things are great and awesome and necessary, but I know very well that I am not capable of doing them.

This. I've checked for nearby volunteer opportunities a few times, but it's 80% phone banks, and the rest is canvassing, voter registration, etc. I am some combination of: introverted; undiagnosed social anxiety; just plain misanthropic / antisocial. So that's not gonna happen.

If someone could, like, drop off a box of envelopes at my apartment for me to lick, I'd be all about it. But it seems like the vast majority of the work that needs to be done is social. My state is already going so hard for Clinton it's not even funny, so I guess it's no huge loss anyway.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 8:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


> MEET HILLARY CLINTON'S INNER CIRCLE, THE QUEENMAKERS WHO WON'T REST UNTIL SHE'S PRESIDENT

Yeah, that's an interesting article. My favourite bit:
Philanthropist Swanee Hunt, who spends much of the money she inherited from her Texas oilfield magnate father, a conservative, on progressive causes and candidates, has a similar memory. In October 1992, she organized a fundraiser in Denver called “Serious Women, Serious Issues and Serious Money,” aiming to raise a million dollars for Bill Clinton’s presidential campaign. Hillary was one of the key speakers. “I sat there in the audience listening to Hillary talking about the economy, and I thought, Holy Toledo, how can someone stand up there with no notes and sound like the head of the World Bank or Federal Reserve?” Later, Hillary called to thank Hunt for her contribution, Hunt recalls. “I said, ‘Oh, actually it isn’t for him, it’s for you.’”?
posted by moody cow at 8:47 AM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


I think this is all just n-dimensional chess.

And n = 0.


11-dimensional tiddlywinks
posted by murphy slaw at 8:48 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


so just think about how many women in this guy's life have looked on in silent stunned revulsion
and each time he thought *winning*
posted by angrycat at 8:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [48 favorites]




I actually would rather door-knock than phone-bank. I do better in-person and I'm not even remotely tempted to argue with people, I just want to collect their data and move on. I wouldn't even mind phone-banking, but am hesitant to do the at-home version of that because I don't have a landline and sometimes my cell reception is not great. I spend all day doing tech support over the phone, so talking on the phone isn't exactly my favorite thing, but I can do it. It just needs to be on a weekend because I work and then I have a kid to pick up from daycare and feed dinner, etc....

I'll get on this this week, though. I promise.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


So is Mr Brexit supposed to be Donald, or his father?

On the last day of the campaign we learn that Mr Brexit was the name of Fred Trump's business when Donny was a child
posted by GameDesignerBen at 8:54 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Justice Department says it will end use of private prisons
The Justice Department plans to end its use of private prisons after officials concluded the facilities are both less safe and less effective at providing correctional services than those run by the government.
Outsourcing doesn't work for services where there should be no justification or incentive for economic gain? You don't say ....
posted by filthy light thief at 8:58 AM on August 18, 2016 [25 favorites]


Private prisons is like the one economic thing my libertarian dad and I can agree on. WHY would you create a profit-motive for depriving people of many of their rights? I'm really happy to hear about the feds doing a big homerinthebushes.gif with them. It's been a long time coming.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:03 AM on August 18, 2016 [24 favorites]


Justice Department says it will end use of private prisons

This is a great start. Does the federal government have any authority to tell state penal systems to do the same thing?
posted by murphy slaw at 9:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Coming out of my cage
And I've been doing just fine
Those polls are getting me down
Because I want it all
I stir some shit with a tweet
Gonna win, winning's sweet
Just keep letting me tweet, just keep letting me tweet.


Now I'm falling asleep.
Florida's in the bag.
And I'm smoking the polls,
and her speech is a drag.
And I'm going to bed,
but my message is slick.
Sure, it's all in my head,

but I've got a war chest, now.
My team is the best now.
Mex... i... co...
And she's just a crook—
it's killing me.
Let's take back control.
posted by rorgy at 9:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


I also needed some handholding re volunteering, mostly thanks to navigating that confusing events page on Hillary's website while doing the mental math on which events would be worth attending given traffic/commute constraints, but I'm headed to a phone banking event tonight. While I can do the phone thing (I did almost four years of call center fundraising for my university as my on-campus job/work study), I too am hopeful for some non-phonebanking volunteering options. Thanks to everybody who's reported back on their experiences! It helped me get over my anxiety about it.
posted by yasaman at 9:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


soren_lorensen: homerinthebushes.gif

Eh? Oh, right.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Didn't see this mentioned yet:
WIRED has never made a practice of endorsing candidates for president of the United States. Through five election cycles we’ve written about politics and politicians and held them up against our ideals. But we’ve avoided telling you, our readers, who WIRED viewed as the best choice.

Today we will. WIRED sees only one person running for president who can do the job: Hillary Clinton.
WIRED endorses Optimism
posted by asteria at 9:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [44 favorites]


(Source: seen here with more context)
posted by filthy light thief at 9:09 AM on August 18, 2016


I know it's not high on the list of most people's causes, but I am concerned about what might happen with the USPS under conservative leadership. It seems pretty clear to me that conservatives would like nothing better than privatizing the Post Office, which is exasperating to me. It's my hobby horse, I know, but I view the PO as one of our most democratic institutions. Almost everyone can get their mail right at their own house, and despite the grumbling, the mail is CHEAP. My nightmare is the mail being privatized, which would impact the most rural and poor among us--people least likely to use things like email, least likely to be able to travel to get mail regularly.
posted by thebrokedown at 9:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [80 favorites]






From the WIRED endorsement [real]:
Trump’s campaign started out like something from The Onion. Now it has moved into George Orwell–as–interpreted–by–Paul Verhoeven territory.
posted by ZeusHumms at 9:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


He wants you to call him "Mr. Brexit" because "Mr. Terrible Wealth-Destroying Idea That Has No Place In America And Is Fueled By Resentment Fear And Racism" is too long to fit in a tweet
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:14 AM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


Trump as Eric Cartman has real memic possibilities.
posted by spitbull at 9:18 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


I would say it's more like Mussolini-as-interpreted-by-Uwe-Boll territory.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:20 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


INFLATED INTESTINAL PUFFER FISH / CANDIRU 2016!
posted by thatwhichfalls at 9:21 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


The good news is that, between “George Orwell–as–interpreted–by–Paul–Verhoeven” and “Mussolini–as–interpreted–by–Uwe–Boll,” we officially have Both Sides so that NPR can give a balanced story.
posted by nicepersonality at 9:23 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


An idea for people who are shy and can't bring themselves to phonebank or canvas: When I volunteered in Richmond, VA in 2008 for Obama, I was really impressed by the constant stream of food coming into the Obama field offices. The main office we worked out of had an entire room filled with food: whole turkeys, trays of mac and cheese, etc. As far as I could tell, people were just driving up to the office and walking in with plates full of food.

Don't underestimate the motivating power of a plate of cookies.
posted by maggiemaggie at 9:27 AM on August 18, 2016 [36 favorites]


BREAKING NEWS: Turdnado picks Jumpthesharknado as running mate.
posted by y2karl at 9:34 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I signed up to do phone banking on Saturday. I'm terrified, and will definitely be hitting the Klonopin beforehand

It's nerve wracking at first, but doing it in person and having support helps. I hope it's great. :)

Justice Department says it will end use of private prisons

This is a great start. Does the federal government have any authority to tell state penal systems to do the same thing?
posted by murphy slaw at 9:04 AM on August 18 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]


Oh please please please please please. Please. I have been good. I have been so good this year. What I wouldn't give to see those private prison fuckers face actual charges. For literally anything, at this point.

And that's like...half the Federal government's whole deal, post reconstruction, right? Protecting citizen's rights from the state(s)?

Please please please please please. I am feeling so optimistic and hopeful that this actually seems possible.

PLEASE, CTHULU.
posted by schadenfrau at 9:37 AM on August 18, 2016 [12 favorites]


rorgy:
Now I'm falling asleep.
Florida's in the bag.
And I'm smoking the polls,
and her speech is a drag.
And I'm going to bed,
but my message is slick.
Sure, it's all in my head,


Oh, good! I was hoping someone would pick up the next bit.

But surely it should be "she's going to bed"? Because Hillary is the one who gets the unfair sleep, on her fancy pillow.
posted by Superplin at 9:39 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Don't underestimate the motivating power of a plate of cookies.

Oh my god, does our field office need brownies? Find out for me, soren_lorenson! I make such good brownies. If the power of chocolate can win this thing for Hillary then by god, that is a thing that I can provide.
posted by Stacey at 9:41 AM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


I want to buy a plate of chicken wings for the genius who cooked up /r/DonaldandHobbes
posted by cmfletcher at 9:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


How long do we think it takes for Trump to defend Ryan Lochte? If only because he's getting the shakes and needs another headline?
posted by schadenfrau at 9:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh my goodness I still haven't stopped thinking about this truly unbelievable, fresh-baked, breadcrumby buttery creamy mac and cheese that some saint would bring to the Long Island City phone banks in 2012. Daily. Whoever you are, if you're out there, all of us who were there 12+ hours a day still talk about you. Also I'm sorry to the person whose serving bowl I "borrowed" to bring some of the leftover food home. I still use it, if that's any consolation...This year, I resolve to be that hero. Protip: pizza and brownies are certainly fantastic but sometimes some complex carbs or fresh fruits/veggies were particularly appreciated.

Also needed, even from those who don't want to place calls or canvass themselves: suitable large and small phone bank locations (we did regular phone banks out of sympathetic coffee shops/homes and big GOTV phone banks out of donated clubhouse-type spaces; I'm sure places of worship would work great too. Still useful in deep blue or deep red areas!). Events where volunteers can run volunteer signup and voter registration efforts. Anything else that would help volunteer recruitment/voter registration gain visibility in your community.
posted by R a c h e l at 9:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


Donald Trump aide on awkward exchange with CNN anchor: ‘I think I unraveled her’

You know, I've always hated the term "punchable face" for its mix of needless bellicosity, thoughtless lookism, and empty rhetorical flailing. But after watching this guy in action...

OK, I still hate the phrase. And would never deign to use it.

But I kind of understand it.
posted by Atom Eyes at 9:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


I just got an invitation from the Sanders campaign to attend a kickoff event on August 24th, where "I and others will lay out some of the next steps we can take as a movement to empower a wave of progressive candidates this November and win the major upcoming fights for the values we share. We'll also talk about how you can be a key movement builder in your community for Our Revolution." (He will be addressing these meetings through remote simulcast, I take it.)

If it weren't at some guy's house I'd actually think about attending. I don't think I can do public phone banking and attend a political event at a stranger's house (with a nonzero chance of hearing Hillary bashing from attendees) in the same week. Still, I'm interested in seeing what shakes out and how it affects local races, of which we have a number of important ones coming up.
posted by Superplin at 9:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


And human fecal stain (and utter disgrace to the medical profession) Dr. Drew Pinsky weighs in on his "grave concerns" about Hillary's health care. That's just great!
posted by infinitywaltz at 9:50 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Also, if you live in area where there will be canvassing, they will need local staging areas on weekends ( like a garage or living room ) where volunteers can pick up and drop off their lists for walking around the neighborhood.
posted by maggiemaggie at 9:52 AM on August 18, 2016




> Nude statue of Donald Trump mysteriously appears in NYC

Warning - if you click through to the images, there will never be enough brain bleach in the world to un-see that rendering.
posted by RedOrGreen at 9:57 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Yeah, hard pass on that statue.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:01 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Nude statue of Donald Trump mysteriously appears in NYC

Mr. Burns: Thank you for not making fun of the size of my genitalia.
Marge: [aside] I thought I did.
posted by Atom Eyes at 10:01 AM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]




The Hank Hill like butt on the statue is great.
posted by pseudodionysus at 10:05 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Trimp was more disturbing. "Punchable face" doesn't work when there's no discernable face, just orifices and teeth.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:07 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


And human fecal stain (and utter disgrace to the medical profession) Dr. Drew Pinsky weighs in on his "grave concerns" about Hillary's health care. That's just great!

Christ, what an asshole.

Two or three or eighteen threads ago we were ruminating on who would be The Left's version of Donald Trump, the celebrity candidate so terrible you could never vote for them. This fucker could be running on a platform of my progressive dream wishlist and I'd have a real hard time not pulling the R lever. If it was between Dr. Drew and Donald Trump, I'd vote for Jill Stein. Arrgghh my day is worse now just for Dr. Drew having touched it in this small, inconsequential way. Dr. Drew is so terrible. Dr. Drew is the literal worst. I need to go take a walk or something.
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:10 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


For all those who are confused by the events page or don't really want to do phone banking or canvassing but are wondering if there are other ways you can contribute: just show up at an organized event. There will definitely be a supervisor around who can figure out if there is something you can do and at least keep you in the loop. Data entry is probably definitely a need as a lot of people were working off of sheets of phone numbers rather than computers. Food is also appreciated - I saw that people were bringing in candy/nuts/cookies/trail mix etc. Some of the older volunteers were confused by the computer systems, so I was able to quickly help them out by explaining how to enter information or get to the next phone number.
posted by peacheater at 10:11 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Only tangentially related but Gawker.com to End Operations Next Week

Thanks Obama Peter Theil.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


So, question: I do not actually have a working phone at the moment. When I read "phone banking" I guess I imagined some kind of old-school call center equipped with a bunch of phone lines, but it's dawning on me that this is unlikely.

Can I still participate if I can't use my own phone? (It's why I haven't done any of the calling from the web site, either.)
posted by Superplin at 10:14 AM on August 18, 2016


My state is already going so hard for Clinton it's not even funny, so I guess it's no huge loss anyway.

You could make calls to swing states or find competitive Congressional races and donate to them.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:15 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Superplin they had old school phones for us to use in an old school conference room. I think in off years volunteers are usually older, too, right? So they shouldn't have an expectation that people will provide their own phones. I would actually side eye the campaign pretty hard if they expected people to use their own phones, but with the caveat that I am just a person on the internet, not a...campaign person. (In my head I said that like "bird person.")
posted by schadenfrau at 10:21 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Omg, I am loving the nudestatues popping up, as it were, all over the country in one fell swoop of artivism. That's fantastic.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 10:21 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Re: Michael Moore & candidacy reasons;
it's all the Illuminati's fault.

(sorry for being late to the party but wow, very thread, such posts)
posted by farlukar at 10:22 AM on August 18, 2016


Can I still participate if I can't use my own phone? (It's why I haven't done any of the calling from the web site, either.)

Sure, they will have cell phones at the phone banking events. Just make sure to get there a bit early to ensure they don't run out.
posted by peacheater at 10:24 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


You Can't Tip a Buick: nude trumps across america.

OK, I appreciate the mocking statues, but "The emperor has no balls" was not what I was expecting. To me, that implies a reduced level of machismo not found in the rendering of his tiny penis. It's like calling him a wimp, which is weird to me.

Also, why the Freemason Square and Compass + "G" ring? Again, there are implications I wasn't expecting, and don't really buy into.

But hey, it's public art to evoke response, so bully for the artist!
posted by filthy light thief at 10:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Only tangentially related but Gawker.com to End Operations Next Week

From the comments: "Gizmodo, Kotaku, Jezebel, Deadspin, etc.. are all staying around. It’s just Gawker.com that will be terminated."
posted by kirkaracha at 10:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump supporters flood Canada's Trump Sandwich artist with bad reviews.

Two slices of white bread, full of baloney, with a side of Russian dressing and a tiny pickle, all surrounded by "a wall of Mexican chips."
posted by GhostintheMachine at 10:26 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


MR BREXIT

Yeah, best damn kosher butcher in town!



Oh -- "Brexit".

I thought you were all talking about  Mister  Brisket.
 
posted by Herodios at 10:27 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Can I still participate if I can't use my own phone?

My friends who spent a week doing a volunteer vacation in Harrisburg, PA were in an office that had a pile of burner phones for that use. The impression one of my friends gave me, when I said something about using their own phones, was that the office manager was -discouraging- use of your own phone. Though that could have been an inaccurate impression on her part or my part.

Additionally, with regards to people above not getting good feedback from places to volunteer - they had decided to do this and booked plane tickets and weren't hearing much back from the person supposedly in charge of this new office. When they asked someone higher on the food chain that person told them to just show up. Which they did because they figured they already had their non-refundable plane tickets anyway, but it turned out fine.

Now, one of them who really didn't want to do phone work never the less found herself doing phone work. But she could have declined; she just felt like fuck it, she'd gone this far why would she say no to something that needed to be done? But that was something she was uncomfortable with, not something she felt really freaked out by. She said they never pushed her to do something she indicated she really didn't feel good about.
posted by phearlez at 10:29 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Clinton camp rips 'terribly weak' Trump on health records:
Trump knows that there is no issue with Clinton's health, [chief strategist Joel] Benenson told MSNBC's Andrea Mitchell, remarking that it "must be driving his ego crazy that she's outworking him, out-thinking him, connecting better with the American voters about the issues that matter in their life."
...
"They're ludicrous, they’re ridiculous, they’re trumped-up allegations because they’ve got a desperate candidate who since his convention has had his net favorable rating decline by 15 points. The man is 32 points underwater," Benenson said.

Mitchell later asked Benenson why he thought that Trump, 70, would be going after someone who is actually younger than he is by more than a year.

"Because I think he's terribly weak right now, I think his ego is probably battered because he's getting battered in the polls which he used to love to cite. I think because he's a man who’s feeling kind of – you know, a little at a loss right now," Benenson said. "He's been unraveling for weeks since the convention, going after the family of a fallen war hero, a man who gave his life to safe his troops for this country."
"Weak." "Trumped-up." Sweet.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:31 AM on August 18, 2016 [30 favorites]


And that's like...half the Federal government's whole deal, post reconstruction, right? Protecting citizen's rights from the state(s)?

Um, no: Reconstruction ended when the federal government decided they weren't really going to enforce all those pesky equal protection things TOO much.

The terrorists/insurgents won, basically.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:32 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Making fun of peoples' bodies is shitty, thanks.
posted by Pope Guilty at 10:33 AM on August 18, 2016 [19 favorites]


I did my first volunteer shift at the Boston office! It was a little chaotic because a Girl Scout troop was also volunteering, but I was able to do some data entry. I know some MeFites are volunteers there--do you want to do a MeFi volunteer shift?
posted by pxe2000 at 10:34 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Even if making fun of people's bodies weren't shitty, I'm not clear what the statues are supposed to accomplish. Is the idea to get people to subconsciously associate Trump with revulsion and disgust?
posted by Spathe Cadet at 10:36 AM on August 18, 2016


Sure, pxe2000! I work near there so let me know what day works for you.
posted by peacheater at 10:36 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


My favorite quote from the NYC nude statue article is its last sentence. "Multiple NYPD officers had no comment on its origin."
posted by merriment at 10:36 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm not clear what the statues are supposed to accomplish.

It's a public service announcement. The more you know, the less you see.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:39 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


What's the over/under on an angry tweet about the statues? 1 hour?
posted by cmfletcher at 10:41 AM on August 18, 2016


There needs to be a like, "Introverts for Hillary" organization or something that has a bunch of us "I wanna help but I'm no good talking to people" on standby to swoop in and do a bunch of the non-facing stuff.

Data entry, driving people around, stuffing envelopes, running for food, etc. Those are things I would LOVE to be able to do to enable the people who ARE good at and enjoy talking to people to make more calls or knock on more doors than they would have otherwise.

I'd get started on this idea myself but I'm...not very good with people.
posted by VTX at 10:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [41 favorites]


The plaque on the statue reads 'the emperor has no balls." So a take on the emperor has no clothes which works quite well for Trump as far as I am concerned.
posted by Jalliah at 10:42 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I thought you were all talking about Mister Brisket.

Christian Slater's really good on that.
posted by Lentrohamsanin at 10:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


"punchable face"

I'd gin up a satirical version of Ani DiFranco's untouchable face song but that's probably less accessible than Lump.
posted by phearlez at 10:45 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Maybe the statues are meant to provoke a reaction from the man himself. Like maybe he'll get his doctor to write a letter about how astonishingly excellent and not-small his junk is.

[Somewhere in Key West, a phone rings. The ringtone is a Jimmy Buffett deep cut. Without any particular urgency, the phone's owner puts down his Corona and answers it...]
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [13 favorites]


What’s this about nude statues? All I see are mannequins wearing beautiful suits, absolutely beautiful, just tremendous suits, featuring all American-made Trump jackets, Trump shirts, Trump ties, such lifelike hair, absolutely the best, believe me.
posted by nicepersonality at 10:46 AM on August 18, 2016 [33 favorites]




I imagine the gross naked Trump statues will win over as many voters to Hillary as gross naked Hillary statues would to Trump.

The way this election's been going, we'll probably find out in three . . . two . . . one . . .
posted by Spathe Cadet at 10:47 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


You know... I don't like the naked Trumps. I mean, besides the obvious eyesore that each is, all I can think is how upset I would be if this were Hillary.
posted by maryr at 10:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [36 favorites]


Wait do you want us to vote Chtulhu or Smaug?

Treebeard. And at the inauguration, they have to use his full name so the ceremony takes like a day and a half.
posted by Celsius1414 at 10:49 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Donald Trump’s Crucial Pillar of Support, White Men, Shows Weakness

Yep, that crucial white pillar.

/cough
posted by Celsius1414 at 10:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


There needs to be a like, “Introverts for Hillary” organization or something that has a bunch of us "I wanna help but I'm no good talking to people" on standby to swoop in and do a bunch of the non-facing stuff.

Can you convert your unused volunteer time to cash?
posted by Going To Maine at 10:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Yep, that crucial white pillar.

is this some sort of Freemason code
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:51 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Donald Trump’s Crucial Pillar of Support, White Men, Shows Weakness

Yep, that crucial white pillar.

/cough


You were supposed to turn your head, first.
 
posted by Herodios at 10:52 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


[Somewhere in Key West, a phone rings. The ringtone is a Jimmy Buffett deep cut. Without any particular urgency, the phone's owner puts down his Corona and answers it...]

Why would Trump be calling Joe Biden?
posted by Etrigan at 10:54 AM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


My one and only embrace of the statues is of the belief that it is designed to provoke a reaction from the man.

I mean, a naked statue of Mitt Romney? Jeb Bush? There's no humor in that, you'd want to just give them a hug.

But this fucking guy? Poke him where it fucking hurts.
posted by angrycat at 10:55 AM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Poke him where it fucking hurts.

right in the net worth!
posted by prize bull octorok at 10:57 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


My one and only embrace of the statues is of the belief that it is designed to provoke a reaction from the man.

My immediate thought was of the Simpsons epsiode, Brush with Greatness:

MR. BURNS: Marge, a word please.
You know, I'm no art critic, but I know what I hate.
I don't hate this.
Your painting is bold but beautiful.
And incidentally, thanks for not making fun of my genitalia.

MARGE: I thought I did.

But I'm worried about this one; not the reaction from He, Trump, but the reaction from his supporters and the form it will take. We're at a dangerous nexus of misogyny and violence. Then again, we always are.
posted by nubs at 11:00 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


If Trump ignores the naked statues, they'll be a three-day gigglefest and drop into history after Trump's next public gaffe.

If he attempts to sue the creators for "defamation," or makes a big noise about this "horrible" slander, he'll manage to (1) bring it to the awareness of people who don't pay attention to "freak news" from NY and SF, and (2) inspire a series of gifsets and other spinoffs, showing the statues with his quotes next to them.

The sensible approach would be, of course, to make a mild statement about "I think it's very insulting and I wish people would focus on serious issues, here's my talking point of the day that I'd rather we discussed." Any votes on whether Trump's going to do that?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:02 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


The artist who painted that nude portrait of Trump with a micropenis got assaulted by Trump supporters, IIRC.

So the statues are...yeah. Poking a bull that will almost certainly not charge at the people who erected the statues, but will likely charge.

OTOH, I'm not really sure that anything is going to stop that aging, raging bull from fucking up everything within sight, so, you know. Sure.
posted by schadenfrau at 11:02 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Poke him where it fucking hurts.

right in the net worth!

Relatedly, (though perhaps already linked?) E. Alex-Jung at Vulture has the list of jokes Donald Trump allowed and banned at his Comedy Central roast. So yes, the net worth is indeed where it hurts.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Instead of naked statues that perpetuate a culture of body shaming, how about an enormous poster that says DONALD TRUMP WANTS TO MURDER THE INNOCENT RELATIVES OF TERRORISTS. I mean, he does, or at least did, and we're not talking about it enough. We've talked about the size of his junk too much already.

The moral high ground is not the place that says "It's okay to make fun of people's bodies if they really deserve it". Fuck that noise. Trump deserves to lose this election even if he had the body of an Olympic gymnast, because he's a dangerous disinformed maniac. I don't want caricature statues of Clinton showing up in response, even if the people who make those statues think that Clinton really deserves it because BENGHAZI or whatever.
posted by 0xFCAF at 11:04 AM on August 18, 2016 [31 favorites]


so here's what I hope. Here is my hopeful fantasy for the future.

I hope that year after year people keep putting up nude Trump statues. I hope that people are putting up nude Trump statues long after this wretched election is over. I hope people keep putting up nude Trump statues long after Trump's political career is over. I hope that people keep putting up nude Trump statues long after Trump is dead.

I hope that 100 years from now people will still be putting up small-penised statues of a naked tubby blond man, without having any clear idea of who the small-penised naked tubby blond man really was, not out of any conscious political motivation but just because they think he's a funny figure and it's a funny tradition. I hope that Trump's ultimate impact on America is to serve as the inspiration for something roughly equivalent to the shitting figurines in Spanish nativity scenes.

I hope that some day that Trump will mean gentle mockery and weird fun and a sort of charming acknowledgement of the frailty of human bodies and the futility of human ego, rather than representing stupidity propped up by blind force, that his body will be a little joke, rather than patriarchy and white supremacy and capitalist-worship and wealth-worship made brutally material.

I hope that there's a Singularity, and that after this Singularity, some tiny shard of the vast shared machine-and-human hive mind that will gradually subsume all material on Earth and then all material in the solar system and then all material in the galaxy into its unimaginably enormous omnicalculating self will every so often think of a statue of a small-penised naked tubby blond man and quietly chuckle to itself, without quite understanding why it finds this idea funny.

This is what optimism looks like, here at the end of the world.

if I had made this statue, the plaque would have just read "ye Mighty."
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [41 favorites]


I have to say after a year of hearing this racist fuck say Americans don't win anymore it's pretty great to see African-American women crushing it at the Olympics.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:06 AM on August 18, 2016 [50 favorites]


my prediction is he won't comment on the statues. It doesn't provide him a high profile target, unless he wants to blame DiBlasio or Cuomo somehow.
posted by zutalors! at 11:07 AM on August 18, 2016


There's no humor in that, you'd want to just give them a hug.

I have yet to encounter a naked statue that invoked that particular emotion in me. Neither Mitt nor Jeb would be the first.
posted by maryr at 11:07 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


if I had made this statue, the plaque would have just read 'ye Mighty.'
Look on my junk, ye Mighty, and despair!

posted by kirkaracha at 11:09 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


So this is where y'all have been hanging out.
posted by drezdn at 11:10 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


So this is where y'all have been hanging out.

I stopped paying attention for like I swear a DAY and had to go hunting.
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:12 AM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


a naked statue?

But this fucking guy? Poke him where it fucking hurts.
If you want to be president
You gotta have your health and fitness
The American public has a right to know
If you know what I mean

So we're takin' you to down to Walter Reed
It's such an intimate setting
You've been talkin' real big for all these months
So now you know what your getting

You have to take a physical, physical
You have to take a physica-a-a-al
You gotta turn your head and cough,
Your head and cough
Let me see you turn your head and cough

You have to take a physical, physical
You have to take a physica-a-a-al . . .
Apologies to Olivia Newton-John, and a tip o' the topper to the late Dow Thomas
posted by Herodios at 11:13 AM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


SOMEWHERE IN FORT MEADE, A WEEK AGO:

Agent Heskins: "He might still win"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskings: "We'll be toast"
Agent Carlton. "Yeah"
Agent Heskins: "Activate Operation Orangemandias?"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskins. "Do it"

FORT MEADE: TODAY

Agent Heskins: "Seen Twitter?"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskins: "The Village did a good job"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskins: "Got the candidate briefing there?"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskins: (reads) ""The Agency has put maximum resource into tracing the originators of the statue outrage." Think he'll take us seriously now?"
Agent Carlton: "Yeah"
Agent Heskins: "Yeah"
posted by Devonian at 11:15 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


>> So this is where y'all have been hanging out.

> I stopped paying attention for like I swear a DAY and had to go hunting.


I love that the chief concern of so many of the people participating under inscrutable pseudonyms in a long-running heated political discussion that's hidden deep in non-front-page threads on an old-fashioned website from the 1990s is how to help a political campaign without actually talking to anyone.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:16 AM on August 18, 2016 [87 favorites]


Also, as a public work of art, installed in multiple public spaces, with no obvious renumeration or profit-seeking motive attached — any passerby can experience it for free — it is a repudiation of a standard bearer for the excesses of private wealth on that level, as well.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:17 AM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Seriously, Green Party?
posted by tonycpsu at 11:18 AM on August 18, 2016 [13 favorites]


Only tangentially related but Gawker.com to End Operations Next Week

i hope univision turns it into an all trump hate all the time site filled with righteous chancla rage
posted by poffin boffin at 11:22 AM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


also w/r/t anxious pseudonyms on hidden threads participating in politics, it strikes me that metafilter is maybe the most cyberpunk place in the world. we're basically a minor plot point in a William Gibson novel come to life.

But like not one of the early novels where he was trying to seem cool and hip and cutting edge, instead one of the recent-ish ones where you can tell he's gotten older and doesn't care about seeming cutting-edge and just wants to talk about clothes and vintage word processors instead.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:23 AM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


Which mentions him not at all on their site, instead choosing to prominently feature info for women's flat track roller derby division 2 championships, which is amazing.

So obviously their business folks figured out that DIVISION 2 WOMEN'S ROLLER DERBY >
TRUMP


This reminds me of something.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 11:24 AM on August 18, 2016



Seriously, Green Party?
[Jill Stein's running mate, Ajamu Baraka] has a distinguished record as a human rights activist and a teacher. What he does not have, however, is any political experience whatsoever. Consequently, he lacks the sort of verbal filter that political pros develop early in their careers. On matters of race and racism, his words tend to recall the militant rhetoric of Malcolm X. He has, for example, called Barack Obama an "Uncle Tom" and—though he supported Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) in the primaries—has said that the Vermonter is committed to "Eurocentrism and normalized white supremacy." A little fringy, but not too far out of the mainstream.

On other matters, however, Baraka's history raises a few more eyebrows. He's been in the habit of associating with 9/11 truthers, for example, as well as Holocaust deniers. He himself has embraced various conspiracy theories, such as the notion that MH17 was not downed by pro-Russian insurgents in Ukraine, but instead by anti-Putin Zionists. So, in other words, the Jews are behind everything.

It is hard to know exactly what constituency Stein felt she would be courting when she chose Baraka. However, the Veep should theoretically be someone who is capable of "sitting at the desk," as President Obama puts it. Nothing in Baraka's past suggests that he has that capacity. So, the conclusion here is the same one we reached with Jill Stein yesterday: The Green Party is failing to seize the day, with choices all-but-guaranteed to preserve their fringe, 0.36% of the vote status. The sad thing for the Greens is that Bernie Sanders showed there is support for a Democratic Socialist in America, but Stein and Baraka are the wrong messengers.
-- Zenger (Christopher Bates), Electoral-Vote.com
posted by Herodios at 11:24 AM on August 18, 2016 [29 favorites]


Instead of naked statues that perpetuate a culture of body shaming, how about an enormous poster that says DONALD TRUMP WANTS TO MURDER THE INNOCENT RELATIVES OF TERRORISTS.

Most people I know who are considering voting for him would consider that a selling point, not a negative.

It's really really difficult to combat such evil, hatred and insult without sinking to its level, as people who would be convinced by a high-minded argument probably would have been already. Not that it isn't worth the effort, just that I am slightly more willing to forgive assaults on his person because I don't think arguments are going to work anymore, all we have is antagonism to demonstrate how combative and irrational he is.

I will say, however, that it's a kinda lazy piece of art, and a lazy joke. I will also say that hearing Trump declare "I do too have balls! The biggest balls, the best balls, you'll all see, these balls are AMAZING!." would be pretty fun for me. I'm accepting a lot of shittiness this election cycle, this is a minor example. Insults directed at pudgy white dudes, focusing on their gentialia are pretty damned low on my priority list right now.
posted by neonrev at 11:24 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Ugh, I'm so not a fan of the statues. It makes our side look shallow and petty. Making fun of people for their appearance is the kind of thing Trump does. It's a gross thing to introduce into politics, and a gross thing to do in general. I really hope the statues are quickly forgotten.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 11:28 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


chancla?

I'm still waiting for someone to ask Jill Stein if she was paid to attend that Russia Today banquet in Moscow with Putin and Trump's military adviser, Michael Flynn. (Flynn has admitted being paid for it.)

In the meantime: CNN: Anti-science claims dog Green Party's Jill Stein
"We should not be subjecting kids' brains especially to that [wireless internet including wifi] ... Scientists don't know for sure if these technologies are safe for children, and as a doctor, I'd rather take precautions until the research is more conclusive."
posted by msalt at 11:29 AM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


(i am probably guilty of making jokes about his hair, though)

(i contain multitudes)
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 11:29 AM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Oh, huh, you found Montgomery County's Trump voter.

Finally, someone I can blame for the inexplicable Confederate soldier statue by the old courthouse, which is now covered in a wooden box because somebody painted "Black Lives Matter" on it. I'll bet he's real torn up about that.
posted by hyperbolic at 11:31 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Who started the whole penis size thing during the primaries?
posted by Artw at 11:31 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I hope that Trump's ultimate impact on America is to serve as the inspiration for something roughly equivalent to the shitting figurines in Spanish nativity scenes.

first of all how dare you profane the glorious caganer tradition in this vile way
posted by poffin boffin at 11:31 AM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


Yeah I wanna say Trump's hair, virility, and dick size are fair game to the extent that he's made them part of his campaign (OH GOD WHAT DID I JUST EVEN TYPE WHY), but like...mocking him for not having those things sort of buys into the assumption that they matter at all?

Otoh, as someone else said upthread, fuck that guy.
posted by schadenfrau at 11:34 AM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


> I will say, however, that it's a kinda lazy piece of art, and a lazy joke. I will also say that hearing Trump declare "I do too have balls! The biggest balls, the best balls, you'll all see, these balls are AMAZING!." would be pretty fun for me. I'm accepting a lot of shittiness this election cycle, this is a minor example. Insults directed at pudgy white dudes, focusing on their gentialia are pretty damned low on my priority list right now.

I disagree. I think this is a pretty smart piece of art, aside from the lame slogan on the plaque which really should just read "ye Mighty" instead.

Because bodies are hilarious. These things we're in, they're absurd, they're ridiculous, they're all lumpy and sweaty, they're fragile, they stink on a regular basis, they fart sometimes, they're always falling apart even in the best of situations... and Donald Trump haaaaaates being in a body. Recall that Marla Maples allegedly never saw him naked — that he'd only disrobe in total darkness — and recall that he apparently hasn't been seen in public without a suit-jacket on in years. Recall the heroic measures he takes to put up a shallow patina of virility — the expensive malfunctioning hair implants, the artificial tan, the surreal defensiveness about hand-size jokes — even though he's not fooling anyone, not even himself.

A big chunk of Trump's painfully-visible-on-the-surface insecurity can absolutely be derived from the fact that he's 70 now, 70 goddamned years old, and no one as shallow as him will ever love his body, ever, no matter how much power he gathers up for himself.

Trump's not running for President. He's running from his own naked body. He's running from the mortality his naked body signifies. And now his naked body is on display across America.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:37 AM on August 18, 2016 [53 favorites]




Making fun of people for their appearance is . . . a gross thing to do in general.

i am probably guilty of making jokes about his hair, though


There is no shame in being human -- either physically or verbally. Just maintain a sense of proportion* about things and a sense humour / humility about oneself.


------------------------------------------------------------------
* So to speak.
posted by Herodios at 11:38 AM on August 18, 2016


That Baraka article is weirdly phrased: the “Uncle Tom” statement is fine but out of the mainstream, but also he hangs out with 9/11 Truthers and Holocaust deniers, and that’s the real problem.

I agree that the latter is worse than the former, but I think it’s also possible that people who tend towards extreme language in politics also tend towards extremes in their other beliefs.
posted by Going To Maine at 11:38 AM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I wouldn't really call his hair part of his body anyway. It's clearly a weave. (The classiest, most luxurious weave.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:38 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


The GOP’s Chances of Holding the Senate Are Following Trump Downhill:
Donald Trump’s post-conventions polling slump seems to be having an effect on the Republican Party’s U.S. Senate candidates. We thought this might happen: There’s been an increasingly strong relationship between how a state votes for president and how it votes for Senate over the past few election cycles. And, indeed, Trump’s tumble has coincided with worsening GOP numbers in key states. It may cost the party the Senate.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:43 AM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


> Anti-science claims dog Green Party's Jill Stein

This headline broke my brain a little, cause I thought for a second they were calling Green Party's Jill Stein an anti-science claims dog. and I'm like, "what's a claims dog?"
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:47 AM on August 18, 2016 [55 favorites]


> what's a claims dog?

Violinist linked to JAL crash blossoms
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 11:48 AM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


Sorry to loop back up to this, but...on the Dr. Drew article, my read is that he was saying that Hillary Clinton's health was probably reasonably fine all things considered but her medical care, based on drugs prescribed and treatment regimens, was outdated and substandard. I've never quite been on board with all the Drew hate around these parts, but really, is that not a reasonable criticism for a medical doctor to make about a publically released set of medical records?
posted by R a c h e l at 11:48 AM on August 18, 2016




Andrew Kaczynski: Sen. Sessions: Central Park Five Ad Shows Trump Has Always Believed In Law And Order
“He bought an ad—people say he wasn’t a conservative—but he bought an ad 20 years ago in the New York Times calling for the death penalty. How many people in New York, that liberal bastion, were willing to do something like that?”

“So he believes in law and order and he has the strength and will to make this country safer,” Sessions added. “The biggest benefits from that really are poor people in the neighborhoods that are most dangerous where most of the crime is occurring. And I think people can come to understand that if the message continues to pound away.”

Trump spent more than $85,000 to publish controversial full-page newspaper ads calling to “BRING THE DEATH PENALTY BACK!” The five men who were sentenced the rape were later exonerated, but only after they had served their full sentences. The men convicted were all black and Latino and in their mid-teens.

Their wrongful conviction settlement, which ran into the millions of dollars, was sharply criticized by Trump. He wrote an op-ed in the New York Daily News in 2014 calling the settlement a disgrace. He later tweeted in response to criticism, “Tell me, what were they doing in the Park, playing checkers?” One of the exonerated men later blamed Trump for helping turn public opinion against them.
BTW, for those who don't know about Jefferson Beauregard "Jeff" Sessions III--yes, he's proudly named after two slave-owners, one of whom was a traitor--he's the guy who thought the KKK was totes cool until he found out that some of them smoked pot, accused civil rights organizations of being un-American and/or communists, and in general seems to have a hate on for civil rights for anyone that isn't a straight Christian white dude.
posted by zombieflanders at 11:52 AM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


MSNBC - First Read: The One Way Trump's Shake-Up Makes Sense
... But there is one strategic way it makes sense: Team Trump views the 2016 presidential contest as a race to 40%. Under that scenario, you somehow assume that Libertarian Gary Johnson will get more than 15% of the popular vote, and that the Green Party's Jill Stein will get more than 5%.

And then you make a play for the base to carry you across the finish line. It's essentially the game plan that helped elect -- and then re-elect -- controversial Maine Gov. Paul LePage in 2010 and 2014. Of course, there's a problem with this base play: If the 2016 presidential race is a contest to 40%, well, Hillary Clinton probably gets there first, especially with Trump's percentage currently sitting in the 30s in many key states. And it's doubtful that Johnson and Stein will get a combined 20%-plus of the vote; it will likely be half of that -- if not less.

Down in the polls and outflanked for now in the battleground map, Trump had two ways to go: One, try to broaden his appeal by changing his message and approach. Or two, double down on everything that's gotten him this far. Trump has chosen Door No. 2, which is something 95%-99% of political professionals wouldn't advise.
[factish]
posted by ZeusHumms at 11:52 AM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


"I'm like, "what's a claims dog?""

Not much, what's up with you?
posted by komara at 11:52 AM on August 18, 2016 [34 favorites]


I kinda feel like "Uncle Tom" is one of those things it's not cool for non-black folks to use. Especially non-black folks who are white. But ymmv.

(Also, the best way to keep up with the threads that I've found is just going to tags/election2016.)
posted by asteria at 11:52 AM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Wait, no, what I meant to say is that Trump's hairpiece is not a hairpiece at all - it's actually a henway.
posted by komara at 11:53 AM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


TIME SAVING IDEA FOR SELF:
  1. write script to locate current metafilter election thread.
  2. write script to post "the horror.... the horror...." to current metafilter election thread every six hours or so.
  3. leave script running until election.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 11:53 AM on August 18, 2016 [18 favorites]


> Donald Trump’s Crucial Pillar of Support, White Men, Shows Weakness

“I liked Trump until he opened his mouth,” said Phil Kinney, a retired middle school administrator and a Republican from Bethlehem, Pa.


"I liked Trump until he went from being the signified to the signifier."
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:54 AM on August 18, 2016 [19 favorites]


You Can't Tip A Buick - I think if you write your script to search for "most recent Hamilton lyric as post Headline," you should effectively be able to always find the most recent election thread.

That's why we're quoting Hamilton, people. Its search code.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Wait, no, what I meant to say is that Trump's hairpiece is not a hairpiece at all - it's actually a henway.

I presume he keeps his hair tonic in a Grecian urn.
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I kinda feel like "Uncle Tom" is one of those things it's not cool for non-black folks to use. Especially non-black folks who are white. But ymmv.

I'm far from an expert, but Ajamu Baraka -- the person cited above as calling Obama an Uncle Tom -- looks pretty non-non-black to me.

The Uncle Tom business is wide of the mark anyway. As we all know, Obama's mother was 'white' and his father was Kenyan. If Americans have to be either black or non-black, he's black, but he's no more a descendant of American slavery than is African-American Theresa Heinz (Kerry).
 
posted by Herodios at 12:01 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm far from an expert, but Ajamu Baraka -- the person cited above as calling Obama an Uncle Tom -- looks pretty non-non-black to me.

Yeah, and as pointed out upthread, Baraka has far worse stuff to answer for.
posted by zombieflanders at 12:05 PM on August 18, 2016


“I liked Trump until he opened his mouth,” said Phil Kinney, a retired middle school administrator and a Republican from Bethlehem, Pa.

Or, as my coworker said with no trace of irony whatsoever: "If he would just be quiet, we would be able to hear his good ideas!"
posted by Jeanne at 12:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [36 favorites]


I'm far from an expert, but Ajamu Baraka -- the person cited above as calling Obama an Uncle Tom -- looks pretty non-non-black to me.

Sorry, I misread and thought Stein was the one saying it.
posted by asteria at 12:07 PM on August 18, 2016


I've never quite been on board with all the Drew hate around these parts, but really, is that not a reasonable criticism for a medical doctor to make about a publically released set of medical records?

Well, aside from the fact that the Washington Times is a notoriously untrustworthy right wing rag, there's the actual words spoken by Drew during the interview:
Another issue that "gravely concerned" the doctors is that Mrs. Clinton had to wear prism glasses after she fell and hit her head, suffering from a concussion in 2012.

"That is brain damage, and it's affecting her balance," Dr. Drew said. "Now clearly, it hasn't affected her cognition, but tell us a little more about that. That's profound. And then number two, when they screened her for heart disease, again, they did an old-fashioned screen. It just seems like she's getting care from somebody that she met in Arkansas when she was a kid, and you've got to wonder. You've got to wonder."
This is a textbook example of the "I'm just asking questions" type of concern trolling.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [29 favorites]


I'm Mr Brexit
Get schwifty


Very astute. Alas, as a nuke-obsessed and belligerent mango-a-stick, Mr. Trump, by definition, can never, ever get schwifty.

And if we are not vigilant, this specific failing of his may one day damn us all.

Though on the positive side, it also means that we may yet be spared the moment when, having exhausted all other options, he has no choice but to SHOW US WHAT HE'S GOT.

Because no one on this good, green earth deserves to have to see that shit.

Plus, we can't afford to get our pride caught up in his shame.
posted by palmcorder_yajna at 12:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]




Anyone who listened to Loveline in the 90's knows that's nothing new for Dr. Drew. On that show his big thing was "predicting" women who were sexual abuse survivors by how high or girlish their voice was. [Real]
posted by asteria at 12:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


I, for one, look forward to the changing of the names on all those buildings from "TRUMP" to "BREXIT". (It may be the best way to recover lost business in the BREXIT TOWER)

Luring firms fleeing London? Crafty.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:12 PM on August 18, 2016


ok but is 'turd tornado' still a thing an adult human said on the national news

Apologies if this has been noted already, I'm not caught up with the thread yet, but saying "turd tornado" on CNN during a "let's interview a pundit" segment is not the same thing as someone saying it during an actual news broadcast.

Sadly, we barely have "news broadcasts" as such any more. Which matters only because TV personalities are often confused with reporters and/or journalists, and they are neither. Sigh.
posted by Bella Donna at 12:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I've never quite been on board with all the Drew hate around these parts, but really, is that not a reasonable criticism for a medical doctor to make about a publically released set of medical records?

Perhaps reasonable but as someone who is married to a person professionaly deeply interested in the reproducibility crisis in science perhaps not valid.

I'd rather have older well known and understood drugs than the new hotness myself unless I would be facing significant difficulties with an outdated drug regimen.
posted by srboisvert at 12:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Another issue that "gravely concerned" the doctors is that Mrs. Clinton had to wear prism glasses after she fell and hit her head, suffering from a concussion in 2012.

"That is brain damage, and it's affecting her balance," Dr. Drew said. "Now clearly, it hasn't affected her cognition, but tell us a little more about that. That's profound


I make lenses for glasses for a living. I've made many sets with prism. That is a criminally inaccurate description of the multiple reasons one might need prism set into their lenses, the vast majority of which are physiological issues with no mental effect whatsoever.
posted by neonrev at 12:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [43 favorites]




Or, as my coworker said with no trace of irony whatsoever: "If he would just be quiet, we would be able to hear his good ideas!"

There is some truth to this though. A typical election the surrogates make the borderline racist and bigoted claims. Then the candidate disavows them if they step over the line. Trump doesn't need to shut up. He needs to stay on message loudly. Wall off the Mexicans, tax cuts for all, law and order for everyone, treat everyone equally*, and run America like his successful** businesses. Litter those talking points with half-truths if you want. It'll still keep a decent amount of the "intellectual" Republicans who still think it's about low taxes and small governments and they just need a licence to hold their nose while they vote for hatred and bigotry.

* Your expectation of equality may be different than that of the vision of Donald J. Trump for President.
** In the loosest sense of the word. Shit may hit the fan but Trump always gets paid!


Let the surrogates fight his dirty battles. Let Katrina batshit insane fight with the Khans. Let some pissant house member from the racist part of Alabama fight his Mexican judges. That's what they're there for. It's unbelievable how he won't just shut his mouth, have that smug scowl on his face and look down the camera saying "You're fired Obama!". If straight after becoming the presumptive nominee he had done that he would have had the election wrapped up by now. Instead he personally drags himself into one Kobayashi Maru shitfight after another.
posted by Talez at 12:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I've never quite been on board with all the Drew hate around these parts

Me, I've always felt that the worst mistake Adam Carolla ever made was not pushing him into the street.
posted by octobersurprise at 12:19 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Another issue that "gravely concerned" the doctors is that Mrs. Clinton had to wear prism glasses after she fell and hit her head, suffering from a concussion in 2012.

"That is brain damage, and it's affecting her balance," Dr. Drew said. "Now clearly, it hasn't affected her cognition, but tell us a little more about that. That's profound. And then number two, when they screened her for heart disease, again, they did an old-fashioned screen. It just seems like she's getting care from somebody that she met in Arkansas when she was a kid, and you've got to wonder. You've got to wonder."


Hear ye, hear ye: I bring good tidings. For today we bring to an end our long national quest to find the Greatest Armchair Physician in All the Land.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'm gravely concerned that Dr. Drew isn't qualified to diagnose an armchair either.
posted by griphus at 12:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [63 favorites]


"A white supremacist in Olympia, Washington stabbed an interracial couple this week, and then told police that he planned to attack Black Lives Matter protesters at a nearby Trump rally."

The victims will probably be all right. The Trump supporter managed to cold-cock himself by running into a car, so he never got to the Trump rally, and this story won't stick to Trump as it should.
posted by Countess Elena at 12:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


More charitable non-giving! This episode brought to you by The Apprentice.

The Washington Post tracked all the “personal” gifts that Trump promised on the show — during 82 episodes and seven seasons — but could not confirm a single case in which Trump actually sent a gift from his own pocket.
posted by Dashy at 12:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Okay, I performed a bit of research into Roger Stone which I posted on my blog. (Most of the content on my blog is not political.) I became interested while looking over Amazon Reviews of his books and noticing how skewed they were. For example, 66 out of 75 reviews in the first week of the release of The Clintons' War on Women were five stars.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 12:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Heh, I wore prism glasses for a few years. I'll concede that I do have a terrible sense of humor as well, but I'm afraid I can't blame brain damage for either affliction.
posted by the marble index at 12:28 PM on August 18, 2016


WaPo Trump promised personal gifts on ‘Celebrity Apprentice.’ Here’s who really paid.
In all, the Post found 21 separate instances where Trump had pledged money to a celebrity’s causes. Together, those pledges totalled $464,000. The Post then contacted the individual charities to find out who paid off Trump’s promises.

In one case, the answer was: nobody at all.

In 2012, Trump had promised $10,000 to the Latino Commission on AIDS, the charity of former Miss Universe Dayana Mendoza. The charity said it never received the money.

In two other cases, it was not possible to determine what happened. One charity said that somebody had paid off Trump’s promise, but declined to say who. Leaders of another charity — baseball slugger Darryl Strawberry’s foundation, to which Trump had promised $25,000 — did not respond to multiple calls or emails from The Post.

In the other 18 cases, the answer was the same — on air, Trump promising a gift of his own money, off-air, that gift coming from someone else.
Ah the on-going saga of con artist and blowhard Donald J. Trump. What a figure of ridicule he is and I hope that this run for the highest office in the land becomes the greatest regret of his life. You can fool all of the people some of the time and some of the people all of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time. [Somebody, but probably not Lincoln]

AAAH Shakes fist at Dashy!
Pipped at the post again. Well I'll just leave this for the quote.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:29 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


I'm gravely concerned that Dr. Drew isn't qualified to diagnose an armchair either.

Does the armchair have a pillow on it?
posted by zachlipton at 12:30 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


I'd rather have older well known and understood drugs than the new hotness myself unless I would be facing significant difficulties with an outdated drug regimen.

This. Coumadin and synthroid are bog-standard drugs.
posted by Dashy at 12:30 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Does the armchair have a pillow on it?

goddamn it again zach

I'm just going to wait until you're sleeping to try to make comments

wait i've looked at the overnight parts of the thread

you never sleep

who are you
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:32 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


Dashy: Coumadin and synthroid are bog-standard drugs.

Hey, I take Synthroid, too! I share a prescription with our next president. #WINNING
posted by Superplin at 12:34 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Is Donald Trump’s Hair a $60,000 Weave? A Gawker Investigation [Updated]
This is why it is tragic/scandalous to be losing Gawker before the current electoral sh!tstorm is over. (And we have to worry whether its archive will survive - and where) But then, it's only the brand and its domain that are shutting down. The rest of the soon-to-be-renamed-Gawker-network-of-sites will live on, with some-or-most of Gawker's gawkish staff 'reassigned', most likely to the equally snarky but proudly feminist Jezebel, which will inevitably become a valuable resource during the Hillary Clinton Administration. The now-formerly-Nick-Denton network of sites has retired names before (Valleywag, where the ultimately-fatal digs at Peter Theil originated - Sploid, which was my entry point to that tangled web - and sold-off names Wonkette and Consumerist, the latter now responsibly run by Consumer Reports).
[/digression]
posted by oneswellfoop at 12:36 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


(To clarify, having prism lenses basically means that the images from each eye do not line up correctly, usually resulting in double vision, and is often caused by a variety of issues that I'll describe as 'cross-eyed', even though it's way more complicated than that, some of which are injury-induced. Prism lenses displace the image to correct this, which sometimes helps with balance issues caused by not seeing properly, the same as any other prescription can help headaches, eye strain, squinting and just plain not seeing well. Sometimes the 'cross-eyed' issue can be associated with a mental illnesses, but it's not a sign of anything of that sort to say the least.)
posted by neonrev at 12:37 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hey, I take Synthroid, too! I share a prescription with our next president.

That's why Drew's slam was so strategically stupid -- far more people are going to have this reaction, than will say "oh, she's a goner".
posted by Dashy at 12:40 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Coumadin and synthroid are bog-standard drugs.

Isn't Armor Thyroid different from synthroid? Armor is desiccated pig thyroid, not the synthetic stuff, or am I mistaken?
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 12:41 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


ARMCHAIR FOUND DEAD AFTER STAY IN DR. DREW'S CELEBRITY FURNITURE REHAB HOUSE
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:44 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


(That's not to endorse any criticism of Hillary for her health. I don't think there's any evidence that she's not healthy enough to be president and also would vote for "Hillary incapacitated in a back room while the country is run by the White House intern corps" over Trump.)
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 12:45 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I both wear prism glasses and take thyroid medication!

Does that make me the most or least qualified person to be President?
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:45 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh, prism glasses are actually not uncommon for people on thyroid hormone replacement. That's why I wore them, too. If I remember correctly, it can cause a bit of swelling of the optic nerve, which can give you double vision, which the prism corrects.
posted by the marble index at 12:49 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


> goddamn it again zach

I'm just going to wait until you're sleeping to try to make comments

wait i've looked at the overnight parts of the thread

you never sleep

who are you


Although as late as 2007 most metafilter commenters were human, at this point almost all comments are auto-generated by a set of old Perl scripts developed in 2004 by several CS PhD candidates putting off working on their dissertations.

I don't have time to go into all of the natural language processing techniques used to generate seemingly intelligent (or, well, intelligish) dialogues, though I can say that the vast majority of these systems were trained off of Pynchon novels mixed with 1970s critical theory and the scripts of several Kids in the Hall episodes.

For whatever it's worth this comment marks the twelfth time in metafilter history that a script responded to a script posting incredulously about how a third script seems to never sleep by explaining that we're all scripts here.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [44 favorites]


Does that make me the most or least qualified person to be President?

That depends, do you use pillows?
posted by NMcCoy at 12:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


I both wear prism glasses and take thyroid medication!
Does that make me the most or least qualified person to be President?


That depends. What are your thoughts on pillows?
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Holy shit, NMcCoy.
posted by Atom Eyes at 12:53 PM on August 18, 2016 [26 favorites]


Atom Eyes and NMcCoy for co-presidents!

(I sleep with a full body pillow, which is probably the most pillowy pillow-usage that ever used pillows.)
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:55 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Case in point. We're all scripts here.
posted by the marble index at 12:55 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


MR BREXIT

So has this been decoded? The only thing I can imagine it means is that he will announce that he intends to leave NAFTA
posted by thelonius at 12:55 PM on August 18, 2016


Yes, that's right Bulgaroktonos. One problem with being an animal-derived source it is harder to control the amount of thyroid hormone because it varies from animal to animal. Some people swear by it, though, and claim that Synthroid has too many side effects or conversely that Synthroid does not work at all on their system. I've seen many discussions about this over the years.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:56 PM on August 18, 2016


So has this been decoded? The only thing I can imagine it means is that he will announce that he intends to leave NAFTA

It's almost certainly a reference to a comeback from terrible polls.

Or maybe he plans to leave NATO?
posted by dis_integration at 12:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


> Yes, that's right Bulgaroktonos. One problem with being an animal-derived source it is harder to control the amount of thyroid hormone because it varies from animal to animal.

The problem of animal-derived products varying unpredictably from animal to animal is, incidentally, also the reason that metafilter switched from human-derived to machine-derived commenting.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


MR BREXIT

So has this been decoded? The only thing I can imagine it means is that he will announce that he intends to leave NAFTA


NAFTA, NATO, basically any (international) group that would dare to tell America that it has to or can't or even shouldn't do something.
posted by Etrigan at 12:59 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]




This Is Just To Say

I have posted
your joke comment
21 seconds
before you did

and you
probably
thought it was
pretty original

Forgive me
it was funny
and we're running
on the same scripts
posted by Spathe Cadet at 1:01 PM on August 18, 2016 [69 favorites]


Evan McMullin: Donald Trump’s Intel Briefing Threat To National Security | MSNBC

You tell 'em, McMuffin! You, most of all, know the risks of having a clown at the helm of a major operation!

(But seriously, telling Donald Trump sensitive information totally *is* a threat to national security, and I hope they stuck to things it wouldn't matter if he said on Twitter. Because he will.)
posted by mordax at 1:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


This Is Just To Say

I have posted
your joke comment
21 seconds
goddammit.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [54 favorites]


21 seconds, SAIT!

I need debugging
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [27 favorites]


Allegations of anti-Semitism have surfaced against one of Donald Trump’s foreign policy advisers, raising further questions about the guidance the Republican presidential nominee is receiving... “In his final days, he allegedly lectured Mr. Crane on the details of concentration camps and how the ovens were too small to kill 6 million Jews,” wrote Meyer, whose complaint is before the Merit Systems Protection Board (MSPB).
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 1:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Sounds like a #WhiteGenocide dude.
posted by asteria at 1:07 PM on August 18, 2016


GOOD MORNING MR BREXIT
posted by the marble index at 1:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


“I do not recall ever even hearing of any ‘allegations of anti-Semitism against [me],’ which would be preposterously false and defamatory because, among other reason(s), I am quite proud of the Jewish heritage of my wife of 38 years,” he wrote in an email.

What do you mean, anti-Semitic? Some of my best wives are Jewish!
posted by tonycpsu at 1:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


MR BREXIT

So has this been decoded? The only thing I can imagine it means is that he will announce that he intends to leave NAFTA


For at least a month, pundits and bloggers and podcasters have been trying to warn terrify us by saying "Trump could still win this thing even though his polling is terrible-- look at Brexit." Meaning that just before the referendum most people, including the Prime Minister, assumed that the people of GB would vote to stay in the EU. Final polls showed the truth so they weren't completely taken off-guard. I believe that Trump has been told by Bannon, who was involved with thee referendum via UKIP, has been assuring Trump that bad polls are nothing, he can still turn this around and win defying all expectations.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


More fact-checking of Trump's About page:

'The Apprentice'...quickly became the number one show on television

Nope. Seasonal rankings ranged from a high of 7 in Season 1 and got lower every season, to a low of 113.

'The Celebrity Apprentice' has met with great success as well, being one of the highest rated shows on television.

Also nope. Seasonal rankings ranged from a high of 46 to a low of 84. Donald Trump Says 'Celebrity Apprentice' Is the No. 1 Show on TV:
Confusion over how Trump reached the conclusion that his show was the highest-rated on television — it is not — prompted several more questions about the ratings. After conceding that it is just the highest-rated show on Mondays — it is not — Trump was informed that CBS sitcom Mike & Molly has topped Mondays for the last two weeks. "That's just what I had heard," he said with a shrug.
'You’re fired!' is listed as the third greatest television catchphrase of all time.

Says who? Not here. Here either. Whatchu Talkin' 'Bout Donald? D'oh! Nopeity-nope. I pity the fool.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:10 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


thelonius: So has this been decoded? The only thing I can imagine it means is that he will announce that he intends to leave NAFTA

See also: Donny sez NATO is ‘Obsolete,’ UN is ‘Political Game’ -- a return to American Isolationism aka US non-interventionism.
posted by filthy light thief at 1:10 PM on August 18, 2016


Dear Republicans: The Call from the Crazies is Coming from Inside the House
Wait -- what? Roger Ailes is now seen as having been an anti-establishment threat to the GOP mainstream? Didn't the GOP rely on Ailes to be its communications director for twenty years? Sure, that Tea Party thing got a wee bit out of control, but there was never the slightest indication that the Republican Party was upset at Fox News, or wanted to stop using Fox to disseminate its talking points. Why this revisionist thinking?

The truth is, Fox News has always made its audience angrier, more radical, and more conspiratorial than was good for the party in the long run. And, of course, Fox allowed Donald Trump to establish himself as a political pundit on its airwaves. But until 2016, the only negative consequence for the GOP was that its presidential nominees in 2008 and 2012 had to appease the Fox-maddened crazies, and thus ran campaigns that were too right-wing to succeed. In this cycle, though, it all came crashing down with Trump. Ailes, a guy who was extremely useful to the GOP, helped to turn it into what it is now.

But there hasn't been a clear line between establishment Republicanism and the fringe for years. Consider the rich donors who now have significantly increased influence in Trump World [...]

[...]

So Mercer cash bankrolled the campaigns of some rising stars who are very much in the GOP mainstream (Cotton) or who've been welcomed into the mainstream despite fringe beliefs (Ernst, Gardner).

The Mercers aren't barbarians who stormed the GOP barricades -- they were invited guests. For that matter, so was Trump, who gave a lot of money to within-the-pale Republicans, and whose endorsement Mitt Romney actively sought even after Trump went birther. Republicans, nobody forced you to take money from wealthy enablers of crackpots and racists. This is a crisis of your own making.
posted by tonycpsu at 1:10 PM on August 18, 2016 [23 favorites]


Is this next election going to held as a 51% majority-take-all referendum??? Tell me the [truth]!
posted by Golem XIV at 1:10 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


mordax: But seriously, telling Donald Trump sensitive information totally *is* a threat to national security

You're not the first to say this - Aki Peritz, a former CIA analyst, is one of several intelligence officials sounding alarm bells about the prospect of sharing the nation's secrets with Donald Trump (NPR, May 9, 2016)
posted by filthy light thief at 1:14 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


they can enter their zip code and get a list of volunteer events near them. Unfortunately the volunteer events seem to be organized haphazardly and not in chronological order.

I see what you mean peacheater. I put in my zipcode and got a huge number of events, but they are all pretty far away, up to 4 hours away in Dallas. What I really wanted to know is if there is anything local. Looks like there isn't, unless I want to go to Austin or Houston. I'm glad to know there are a lot of events in the big cities, though.
posted by threeturtles at 1:18 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


> I don't think I can do public phone banking and attend a political event at a stranger's house (with a nonzero chance of hearing Hillary bashing from attendees) in the same week. Still, I'm interested in seeing what shakes out and how it affects local races, of which we have a number of important ones coming up.

I've never run into Hillary-bashing at a Bernie volunteer event, and I've been to a bunch. Not saying it won't happen, but it's very unlikely, in my experience. Internet warriors don't like volunteering for actual work, apparently. (There doesn't seem to be much overlap between Hillary-bashers and people who actually support progressive causes and were willing to work to get Bernie nominated. At least, they never show up to things like this.)

If you live in an urban area, there'll probably be events scheduled at more public venues. An event in somebody's livingroom will probably fill up really quickly. Maybe check back in few days? The presentation itself will almost certainly be posted on YouTube the next day, but you'll miss the chance to meet and coordinate with other volunteers if you don't go.
posted by nangar at 1:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Anybody seen any Donald Trump ads yet? I'm curious as to what angle he is going to take.

Also I've been wondering about poor Paul Ryan. He must dread getting up in the morning. After all the shit that Trump piled onto his desk, now Trump hires Bannon who hates Paul Ryan.

Quartz Donald Trump’s merger with the Republican party has failed
The merger has failed. The convention was a disaster, eroding Trump’s poll numbers and failing to convince conservatives he was one of them. And while Manafort’s connections to corruption investigations in the Ukraine and now in the United States have been an ongoing distraction, he simply hasn’t been able to rein Trump in.

Now, Trump, apparently angry at efforts to point him toward the median voter, is casting off the reins. His new campaign chief executive, Stephen Bannon, a former Goldman Sachs banker turned conservative activist, has backed populist Republicans like Sarah Palin and purveyed conspiracy theories at Breitbart, launching harsh criticisms of Republican leaders deemed insufficiently committed to the cause.
Right Wisconsin Breitbart's Worst Paul Ryan Smears
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I just now realized that peacheater eats peaches instead of cheating peas.

I now return you to your regularly high signal-to-noise ratio.
posted by dfan at 1:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [93 favorites]


How do you know that that person doesn't cheat peas?
posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 1:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]




I just now realized that peacheater eats peaches instead of cheating peas.


omg can't unsee
posted by zutalors! at 1:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [23 favorites]


the signal is coming from inside the noise
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:29 PM on August 18, 2016 [25 favorites]


Trump's about to drop $5m in ten days of TV ads in NC, Ohio, Florida and PA. Which is under ten percent of what HRC's spent already, but it's a start.

What they'll be like, though...
posted by Devonian at 1:31 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Thanks, nangar, that's useful information.
posted by Superplin at 1:31 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I just now realized that peacheater eats peaches instead of cheating peas.

Just like Nicolas Cage's line from Face/Off: "Ah could cheat a pea for hourrrs..."
posted by Strange Interlude at 1:32 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


> last I heard he was yelling at fire marshals because the venues he'd booked were a long way from being that large.

I don't know if it played nationally, but Colorado laughed at Trump because the fire marshal he lambasted was from the same fire department who, hours earlier, rescued Trump after Donny and his entourage accidentally locked themselves in an elevator.

$10 says Trump was embarrassed that he had to be rescued so he scapegoated the fire marshal.
posted by Monochrome at 1:32 PM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


My two favorite headlines from thehill.com today: Ex-GM CEO: I've always voted Republican until now and Trump advisor accused of anti-Semitism.

And I am enjoying that even Newt Gingrich can't get behind this nonsense about Clinton's health.
posted by bearwife at 1:33 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


The next ten days is after the Olympics and before Labor Day. At a time when no one is paying attention they are going to run some ads.
posted by humanfont at 1:33 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I can't wait to see the name of the contracted ad agency on the FEC report.
posted by schadenfrau at 1:35 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


"I just now realized that peacheater eats peaches instead of cheating peas."

There's a user on another site I frequent named poorusher who might be Poor Usher but as far as I'm concerned he just doesn't take his time on the toilet.
posted by komara at 1:36 PM on August 18, 2016 [36 favorites]


> Trump's about to drop $5m in ten days of TV ads in NC, Ohio, Florida and PA. Which is under ten percent of what HRC's spent already, but it's a start.

What they'll be like, though...


Probably the most effective thing they could do is run an ad that's just a slow Ken Burns effect pan over an picture of this shirt.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:37 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]




The billionaire only makes the cheapest ad buys. He got pressure from the party about spending money on something useful besides paying his kids and hangers on and renting his own plane, so SEE HE'S DOING IT NOW. HAPPY?
posted by readery at 1:38 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


It's wrong to characterize Trump's foreign policy as non-interventionist. He wants to intervene like crazy, by bombing ISIS and stealing their oil, and by joining the civil war in Syria. And he wants to do all this without traditional U.S. allies. What he proposes is the U.S. as a rogue state.
posted by chrchr at 1:39 PM on August 18, 2016 [18 favorites]


And I am enjoying that even Newt Gingrich can't get behind this nonsense about Clinton's health.

This might be the craziest twist yet.
posted by Going To Maine at 1:39 PM on August 18, 2016


> a Trump win would do far more damage to the GOP than a Trump loss?

Republican ad campaign: Vote for the crook, not the racist.
posted by Monochrome at 1:41 PM on August 18, 2016


Maybe we could not link and repost Trump's ads endlessly when they come out.

Just a thought.
posted by kyrademon at 1:43 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


So, National Review is hosting a post election cruise.

One, given this is after the election, how much alcohol is going to be on board?
Two, hey, a convicted felon is on the headliner list!
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:44 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


> Trump's about to drop $5m in ten days of TV ads in NC, Ohio, Florida and PA. Which is under ten percent of what HRC's spent already, but it's a start.

Oh god, I've seen that face before.

That is the face of someone who doesn't know if he should be reading the thing in front of him, doodling, or put on his reading glasses because he can't actually read the document. And trying to figure out which default facial expression to use when he thinks it is important.
posted by mrzarquon at 1:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]




now that's shade to live for
posted by angrycat at 1:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


That is the face of someone who doesn't know if he should be reading the thing in front of him, doodling, or put on his reading glasses because he can't actually read the document. And trying to figure out which default facial expression to use when he thinks it is important.

Rick Perry?
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Shade for daaaaays. That's amazing.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:49 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Well, wouldn't the NYC Parks Department be experts in shade?
posted by NoxAeternum at 1:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [46 favorites]


WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Obama administration said Thursday that a $400 million cash payment to Iran seven months ago was contingent on the release of a group of American prisoners.
Dammit. Welcome to the new right-wing talking point.
posted by Mister Fabulous at 1:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Probably the most effective thing they could do is run an ad that's just a slow Ken Burns effect pan over an picture of this shirt.

I saw somebody wearing that shirt this weekend, and I desperately wanted to ask whether or not it was ironic.
posted by Faint of Butt at 1:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


What they'll be like, though...

Oh I've got an idea
posted by PenDevil at 1:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


upon further investigation into the trump tank muscle tee, I have discovered the one image that could make me feel good about the Bush years. slash, the most apt possible visual metaphor for the Bush administration's foreign policy.

the attention to detail on these things is incredible. note that the shark is wearing a cowbell. note that there's a shoe in the lower left corner, presumably having been thrown at Bush.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:53 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Have you seen Hillary's 'Never Trump' campaign buttons?
posted by zennie at 1:53 PM on August 18, 2016


> I saw somebody wearing that shirt this weekend, and I desperately wanted to ask whether or not it was ironic.

we're in a post-irony world now. that question is invalid.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:54 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I saw somebody wearing that shirt this weekend, and I desperately wanted to ask whether or not it was ironic.

we're in a post-irony world now. that question is invalid.


You're right. The question we ask today is: was the shirt sarcastic?
posted by dis_integration at 1:55 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


They tried the Iran thing already before the Olympics. It was wrong then (it was money we owed Iran for the sale of some jets going back to before the Revolution) and it's still wrong.
posted by asteria at 1:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


NYC Parks Department won today's internets, let's all try harder tomorrow.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I just now realized that peacheater eats peaches instead of cheating peas.

I always assumed they did HVAC work for these guys.
posted by dersins at 1:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


> They tried the Iran thing already before the Olympics. It was wrong then

Yeah, but now the White House has issued a new statement that is going to seem, to them, to confirm their accusations.

Of course, "the payment [of the money we already owed them] was contingent on the release of the prisoners" is totally different from "the release of the prisoners was contingent on the payment."

You know that, I know that, but the talk radio circuit ain't gonna understand or care.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 1:58 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


"You pay us our $400 million and we'll give you your hostages."

"No, YOU release our hostages and we'll give you your $400 million."

[awkward silence]

This has been Great Moments in Diplomacy
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:59 PM on August 18, 2016 [41 favorites]


Diplomacy more often than not resembles a larger scale version of a drug deal going down behind the local Denny's.
posted by NoxAeternum at 2:01 PM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


That kind of diplomatic problem is precisely why the Swiss exist [and, you know, for cheese and stuff].
posted by zachlipton at 2:02 PM on August 18, 2016


hah

Yeah, I suppose it's the fact that the US already owed the money to them that's really the important distinction here, rather than who's twisting whose arm.

If somebody like Trump had negotiated the deal, though, he'd definitely try to spin it as tough, decisive diplomacy. And it would probably work with his base.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 2:03 PM on August 18, 2016


The problem with the Iran story is that the White House has been changing the spin. First, the two things ere unconnected, then they happened at the same time because this was the first batch of intergovernmental negotiations possible after the nuke deal and these were some of the most pressing outstanding matters, now it's that the money was only going to be returned when the prisoners came back.

Which is still not a ransom, and probably a sensible and prudent provision to make, but by sliding into the story reluctantly Obama is now open to being asked 'so, what's the next spin cycle going to say?' when he could have put the whole thing out at the beginning with a very positive line and had it shut down by now.

It probably doesn't matter, but it could have been handled better.
posted by Devonian at 2:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


The Obama administration said Thursday that a $400 million cash payment to Iran seven months ago was contingent on the release of a group of American prisoners.

What's the big deal? It's not like they traded arms for hostages or something.
posted by octobersurprise at 2:05 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Hi, I just wanted to draw attention to a truly offensive thing that was posted in this very thread.

> Very astute. Alas, as a nuke-obsessed and belligerent mango-a-stick, Mr. Trump, by definition, can never, ever get schwifty.

How dare you insult the noble mango, king of tropical fruits? How very dare you, sir and/or madam.
posted by a power-tie-wearing she-capitalist at 2:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


just wait til the guava comes ashore with her bloodriders
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


just wait til the guava comes ashore with her bloodriders

Surely you meant her blood orange riders?
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 2:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


More of a circus peanut, really.
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


And I am enjoying that even Newt Gingrich can't get behind this nonsense about Clinton's health.


If I know anything about Newt Gingrich, it's that he loves the moon & dinosaurs and hates anything to do with sick women.
posted by MCMikeNamara at 2:09 PM on August 18, 2016 [50 favorites]


Also that he's a fucking dickbag.
posted by dersins at 2:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


hates anything to do with sick women

Second best burn of the day
posted by cmfletcher at 2:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


I always interpreted the name by considering that "pe" is the 17th letter of the Hebrew alphabet, "ache" is pain, and "ter" is an abbreviation for terrace.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 2:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Yeah thats not going to play well at all.

In other news, SpaceX managed to land a rocket again for reuse, and there's speculation that a nearby planet in the goldilocks zone will be announced soon. [real]

The star it is thought to be orbiting is mere decades away, if humanity would just stop bickering and put its minds to it.
posted by fragmede at 2:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


The other Manafort shoe drops: Adam Weinstein and Ken Silverstein at Fusion: “Trump aide Manafort implicated in pro-Russian protests against US troops”
In the Ukrainian government memo written last year and leaked to the Times of London this week, a senior prosecutor alleges that Manafort, in fact, “orchestrated” the Sea Breeze protests and other anti-NATO demonstrations, forcing cancellation of the exercise. “While I was in the Crimea I constantly saw evidence suggesting that Paul Manafort considered autonomy [from Ukraine] as a tool to enhance the reputation of Yanukovych and win over the local electorate,” the prosecutor wrote. Charges were ultimately not sought against Manafort sooner, he says, because vital evidence was lost after Yanukovych fled Ukraine and Russia annexed Crimea.
Sounds like a spicy charge but one lacking a smoking gun. Just my read, though.
posted by Going To Maine at 2:17 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Just like Nicolas Cage's line from Face/Off: "Ah could cheat a pea for hourrrs..."

How dare you. That's a line from Cape Fear.
posted by phearlez at 2:17 PM on August 18, 2016


> The star it is thought to be orbiting is mere decades away, if humanity would just stop bickering and put its minds to it.

i vote we exile trump there
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 2:18 PM on August 18, 2016


No Man's Sky TRUMP SKY
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:20 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Case in point. We're all scripts here.

wait... am I a script too?
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:20 PM on August 18, 2016


Don't inflict him on poor innocent aliens
posted by yasaman at 2:21 PM on August 18, 2016


do any scripts read the posts down here?
posted by zachlipton at 2:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


Usually I don't like calling people names and plays on someone's name really irk me. Doesn't matter how much I don't like them or what side they're on. I've found an exception to this and Trump. Playing on his actual name (Trumpy, Trimp, Drump etc) bug me but for some reason I have no problem with all the food names that people call him.

Every time someone used a food name I spend time pondering why these food names don't cause any reaction and at times actually make me giggle. Yam, cheeto Jesus, mango, pineapple hair etc etc.

Maybe because food is just super neutral? I dunno. This election is such a mystery at times.
posted by Jalliah at 2:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


as a former New Yorker, I want to believe that the Parks Dep't response was in part brought about by Trump going berserkers on a NYC agency and they wouldn't have insulted his genitals but he was just such a fucking pain in the ass about getting a statement out about the fucking statues and in short, that's what Trump diplomacy gets you.
posted by angrycat at 2:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


I hope that year after year people keep putting up nude Trump statues. I hope that people are putting up nude Trump statues long after this wretched election is over. I hope people keep putting up nude Trump statues long after Trump's political career is over. I hope that people keep putting up nude Trump statues long after Trump is dead.

Artistic visualization
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Finally, someone I can blame for the inexplicable Confederate soldier statue by the old courthouse, which is now covered in a wooden box because somebody painted "Black Lives Matter" on it. I'll bet he's real torn up about that.

They've been trying to move that statue, but they can't find anyone willing to take it. The county voted to move it to a Rockville city park, but Rockville rejected it.

Also, hi, neighbors!
posted by amarynth at 2:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


> do any scripts read the posts down here?

we try when we can but we're sort of busy right now wedging our cats into scanners.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:31 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Don't inflict him on poor innocent aliens

ALIENS: So, are you a typical human.

TRUMP: I am the best, the ultimate best of what humanity has to offer.

ALIENS: *Destroys Earth*

TRUMP: ...

TRUMP: Sad.
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:33 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


Getting annoyed by Facebook statuses again.

"The only thing more terrifying than voting for Hillary Clinton is not voting for Hillary Clinton."

Has the right-wing propaganda machine really worked so well? People find voting for Clinton terrifying? Honestly, I just don't understand and perhaps never will.
posted by peacheater at 2:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Also, hi, neighbors!

hi!

I've seen Trump signs closer to Frederick, which I've been told gets offended when you call them "Fredneck" because many of them are Montgomery County expats who wanted cheaper houses and don't want to be associated with the term [anecdotally real] (also actual rural folks who don't take kindly to being mocked [real]). The farms around Barnesville / Poolsville are surprisingly sign-free, but you'll see plenty of Obama '08 and Gore '00 (and even Kerry '04) bumper stickers.

I did see the first house in my new neighborhood (within Rockville, MD; I bought a house and moved in this past January) to be festooned with yard signs.

I parked at White Flint this morning (due to current Metro Safetrack crippling Shady Grove to Twinbrook), I'm so tempted to cruise around Rockville to find this house after work today.
posted by numaner at 2:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


People find voting for Clinton terrifying?

Fine, whatever, as long as their hand isn't shaking so bad that they can't punch the ballot.
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:01 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Trump losing another demographic [humorous]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


:'( that's a shameful way to honor piano cat
posted by numaner at 3:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Keyboard cat! Not piano cat!
posted by Justinian at 3:13 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]



"The only thing more terrifying than voting for Hillary Clinton is not voting for Hillary Clinton."


I think this is a direct quote from the guy who wrote the Benghazi mom's speech at the RNC, for what that's worth. He's voting for Clinton.
posted by zutalors! at 3:13 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


"The only thing more terrifying than voting for Hillary Clinton is not voting for Hillary Clinton."

Its like worst Oscar Wilde paraphrase ever.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:17 PM on August 18, 2016


Keyboard cat! Not piano cat!

it's been so long I've forgotten! noooo all my internet pointssss noooooooo
posted by numaner at 3:18 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


haha, all your base are ours now!
posted by prize bull octorok at 3:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


oh shit i forgot to put the [real] tag on all my comments from this thread.

[fake]
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 3:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think this is a direct quote from the guy who wrote the Benghazi mom's speech at the RNC, for what that's worth. He's voting for Clinton.

Ah, I feel better now. I thought the guy who posted it was a Clinton supporter, so I was surprised to see him put that up. But maybe he's doing some kind of stealth thing to push undecideds over the line.
posted by peacheater at 3:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


David Daley was on Politically Re-Active to talk about Gerrymandering and how it was leveraged in 2010 to bring us where it is. I knew it was bad - it's always been bad - but the points about how it's led to this particular bad is depressing/interesting. It also explains why the democratic party is so focused on voter drives - they are literally the only way to counter these carefully gerrymandered districts.
posted by Deoridhe at 3:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


haha, all your base are ours now!

belong to us, not ours now!
posted by yellowbinder at 3:29 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


belong to us, not ours now!

That's what you say, Princess Leia. Give me my sweater back or I'll play the guitar.
posted by stolyarova at 3:32 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


A plague on all your base.
posted by Itaxpica at 3:33 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


> So, National Review is hosting a post election cruise.

Interested parties might want to confirm they're planning on coming back. Remember this, after Romney's loss? So much sad.
posted by The Card Cheat at 3:37 PM on August 18, 2016


Dana Perino (Fox News): "I will not lie to you about the state of this race"

(Does not address what she will lie to us about, but polls are apparently not one of those things)
posted by thefoxgod at 3:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


So, National Review is hosting a post election cruise.

something something bay of pigs
posted by murphy slaw at 3:55 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Black Republicans Growing Even More Frustrated With Trump Effort

Featuring the time the the chairman of the Black Republican Caucus of Florida was escorted out of a Trump rally (for unknown reasons) and the time Trump's chief strategist in Florida said they didn't need black votes to be elected.
posted by zachlipton at 3:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


> literally the only way to counter these carefully gerrymandered districts.

Oh are we using literally figuratively again? Shaw v. Reno would say that's not literally true although I would agree that GOTV efforts are very very important.
posted by fragmede at 3:58 PM on August 18, 2016


I'm going to go out on a limb and predict we're back to a 2-3 point race by the first debate. I realize that to us that sounds ridiculous but I think it will happen.
posted by Justinian at 4:03 PM on August 18, 2016


Literally was used colloquially for hyperbole at least as early as 1769, I am so so tired of this dumb "controversy" or maybe of this dumb election

OED:

"1769 F. Brooke Hist. Emily Montague IV. ccxvii. 83 He is a fortunate man to be introduced to such a party of fine women at his arrival; it is literally to feed among the lilies."

posted by sandettie light vessel automatic at 4:05 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Intensifiers gonna intensify.

Objective reality may or may not concur.
posted by narwhal at 4:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]




predict we're back to a 2-3 point race by the first debate. I realize that to us that sounds ridiculous

I don't think any of us think that sounds ridiculous at all. At least I don't. If you look at the nationwide poll over time, you see the pattern. And I have no doubt Trimp will con himself into more followers and with the horse race stuff going on in the media, they'll amplify any bad news for Hillary, and there we'll be.
posted by cashman at 4:21 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


"Sometimes we get so distracted by the nastiness & nefariousness of Breitbart that we forget it's staffed by morons."

It's real poetic justice that one of the tweeters disputing Barro chose the name "Sir Wankalot."
posted by octobersurprise at 4:26 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


We're literally doing the "omg literally?!" thing again? please, no.
posted by dis_integration at 4:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Make "Literally" Great Again!

No, wait, don't. Let's just drop it and discuss the election.
posted by Nerd of the North at 4:29 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]




Holocaust deniers on the team
posted by My Dad at 4:35 PM on August 18, 2016


Trump is on time. I think that's a first.

Talks about Louisiana. No mention of CA.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:37 PM on August 18, 2016


Trump mentions his earlier TelePrompTer speeches. Calls the race one the law & order one. Expounds on law & order.

Now talks about leaving no Americans behind. Talks about African American children. 4 in 10 in poverty. Jobs, fair and equal representation . Mentions Hispanics.

We need to break from the failures of the past. Talks about great company, created jobs, helped neighborhoods.

Mentions how he has chosen the wrong words and said the wrong things. Says he regrets it.

Look for the pod...
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:41 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Who is this man? What has he done with Donald Trump?

Oh God. This is the pivot. THIS IS THE PIVOT.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 4:42 PM on August 18, 2016 [20 favorites]


Mentions how he has chosen the wrong words and said the wrong things. Says he regrets it.

That doesn't sound like the Trump we've come to know and loathe. No way that's his words.
posted by yesster at 4:43 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh. Nevermind. (chanting of "Build The Wall!"; Trump responds "we will build that wall.")
posted by Spathe Cadet at 4:43 PM on August 18, 2016


This is your pivot:

"I've never wanted to learn the language of the insiders, and I've never been politically correct. It takes far too much time. [cheering] Truthfully, it takes far too much time and can make it more difficult to achieve total victory. Sometimes, in the heat of debate and speaking on a multitude of issues you don't choose the right words or you say the wrong thing. I have done that. [laughter and cheers] And believe it or not, I regret it. And I do regret it. Particularly where it may have caused personal pain. Too much is at stake for us to be consumed with these issues, but one thing I can promise you this: I will always tell you the truth. I speak the truth for all of you and for everyone in this country who doesn't have a voice of which there are many."
posted by zachlipton at 4:44 PM on August 18, 2016


DJT: I will always tell you the truth. I will speak for those who don't have a voice. For those who don't have a job. For the veteran who has been denied the medical care they need.

DJT: I speak the truth on behalf of the family living near the border who deserves to be safe, but has no security or protection at all.

(Build that wall chanting)

DJT: We will build the wall. Our campaign is about representing the great majority of Americans who read the paper/TV and don't hear anyone speaking for them. Insiders fighting for insiders. The poverty, unemployment , failing schools, I'm fighting for these Americans.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:45 PM on August 18, 2016


I believe that is as close to an apology he as he is possibly capable of.
posted by zachlipton at 4:45 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


@JYSexton: Guy just said he thought Trump would lock up dishonest press after election. "You got to do something" his friend says.

So everything is the fault of the press because I guess they should not be reporting on what DJTrump actually does and says.

And Chill, guys, even if Trump pivots perfectly he still has no ground game and he still has a steaming pile of crap on record.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


This sounds like it was plagiarized from Hillary Clinton. Someone should check.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 4:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Maybe Ivanka is back from vacation?
posted by acidic at 4:47 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


DJT: Every day I think about how much is at stake in the election. This is our fight to save this country. I refuse to let another generation of American children be excluded from the American Dream. Let our children be Dreamers too.

DJT: Our country loses every time a child failed to graduate, be admitted to the work force, falls to drugs. I know it can be fixed very quickly if we know what we're doing. Where I come from if something isn't working you fix it. I'm running to end decades of failure and offer the American people a future of opportunity. America First.

(Chanting)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:48 PM on August 18, 2016


Plus he is really good at delivering empty promises-- I will be your savior. I will sacrifice everything for you. I will love you and lead you to the promised land. [fake, fake, fake] Where is the plan? Why should anyone trust him? Where are the ideas and the policies? Cutting taxes on the richest still seems to be his main policy plus building a useless and expensive wall.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:50 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Let our children be Dreamers too.

but not DREAMers, right?
posted by acidic at 4:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Too bad he has never done anything in his life to fix those things and has gone out of his way to attack people who are of color, disabled, immigrants, of a different religion, and African American.

Because this is just nonsense from a guy with NO credibility.
posted by bearwife at 4:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


DJT: Aren't you tired of arrogant leaders who look down on you instead of serving and protecting you? That's about to change. How about November eighth?

DJT: We're going to put the American people first again. I will never lie to you. I will never put someone else's interest ahead of yours. I'm funding my campaign. My only interest is the American people. I'm giving back.

DJT: Sometimes I can be too honest. Hillary is the opposite. One lie after another and getting worse each passing day

(Lock her up chants)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Sorry, not sorry. @SopanDeb: Trump: "So while sometimes I can be too honest..." So he believes the stuff he's said? What does he regret?

He's too honest, guise! Like when you go for a job interview and they ask, "What is your greatest weakness?" and you say, "Sometimes I am too much of a perfectionist."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:54 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


DJT: Hillary has never apologized. For 33000 emails, for pay for play, for Benghazi, for Iran on a path for nuclear weapons, for Iraq, for Libya, for Syria, for unleashing ISIS. Has Hillary apologized for the decisions that resulted in death, destruction, and terrorism.

DJT: Obama lied about the $400 million in cash. He denied it was for the hostages. Openly and Blatently just like he lied about ObamaCare. You can have your doctor, you can have your plan. Now putting Americans overseas at greater risk of being kidnapped.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:54 PM on August 18, 2016


So Trump just brought up the State dept news. He said the president lied about that, "just like he lied about Obamacare", then said it puts americans abroad, including soldiers, at greater risk of being kidnapped.

He talked about it for about 2 minutes tops, and transitioned on.
posted by cashman at 4:55 PM on August 18, 2016


"I will never lie to you... but, I mean, just for old time sake, here's a few more lies."
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Trump adviser accused of making anti-Semitic remarks

The headline really diminishes the accusations, which are that in his previous employment as Defense Department inspector general he regularly made antisemitic remarks, engaged in Holocaust denial, and boasted about having Jewish employees forced out.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


The entire cadence and construction of those sentences is new, not just the (astonishing) sentiment. Seriously, this is as close to penitence as you will ever get from this man. Terrifying, because it could be effective. It is just coherent enough to give wavering supporters plausible deniability, cover.
posted by adamgreenfield at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


Oh, god, my heart is literally pounding. I really hope with all my heart that the American public doesn't buy what this man is selling.
posted by peacheater at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


DJT: Let's talk about the economy. Nafta. NC lost half its jobs. China. Hillary was a disaster, totally unfit. Hillary owes the state of NC an apology. You'll get it when you see the emails. Never.

DJT: Our open border has allowed drug, crime, and gangs in. I've spent the time with families whose loved ones were killed. Violence spilling across our borders (reads names of some people.)

DJT: My opponent supports sanctuary cities. Where was the sanctuary for Kate, and Laura and Sabine and ???. These moms and dads don't get apologies. They won't get the time of day from Hillary. They'll always come first for me. We will deliver justice for these great families.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh also, Trimp said "Hillary owns Obama's Iran policy" (trying to link in Hillary Clinton to this news)
posted by cashman at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016


More on Joseph Schmitz, Trump's foreign policy advisor accused of antisemitism. His father happens to be Rep. John G. Schmitz, who "had the rare and almost comical distinction of being expelled from the John Birch Society for being too extreme, racist and anti-semitic. Yes, you read that right." His father was also drafted to take George Wallace's place in 1972.

It seems the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
posted by zachlipton at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]




Bill Clinton submits cookie recipe, following tradition that started in 1992 to cries about Hillary Clinton working outside the home.

As did Melania Trump, but the Clinton angle is far more interesting than the Trump one, for once
posted by fragmede at 5:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


> "I've never been politically correct. It takes far too much time."

Who among us hasn't been in such a hurry that we inadvertently called for the assassination of our opponents, insulted the religion of a grieving mother, questioned the impartiality of a judge based on his ancestry, called for a religious test for entry into a country, or stated that immigrants from a neighboring country were thieves and rapists?

Just imagine how much time NOT DOING ANY OF THAT would have taken.
posted by kyrademon at 5:01 PM on August 18, 2016 [80 favorites]


As did Melania Trump, but the Clinton angle is far more interesting than the Trump one, for once

It's a little less awesome given that he submitted the same recipe. I like that he participated (given that its almost the opposite message of the original 1992 contest, where it was basically Hillary having to appear more traditional), but the fact that he didn't have "his own" recipe to submit dampens that a bit.
posted by thefoxgod at 5:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


> Clinton has to apologize for Iraq?

Well, as a Senator she did vote to invade Iraq.

This is one of the issues she's taken heat on from the left. Personally, I'm willing to overlook it given that the Bush administration falsified intelligence. But it's not prima facie absurd that she should apologize for Iraq --

but in fact she has already apologized.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 5:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


It's a little less awesome given that he submitted the same recipe.

And one that he, a vegan, cannot enjoy...
posted by acidic at 5:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


DJT: Just think if the media investigated poverty of the inner cities, the border, our schools, or the dark secrets hidden in the emails that Hillary illegally deleted.

(Lock her up)

DJT: Instead every story is told from the perspective of the insider. Never the people it's been rigged against. No outrage from the media class. It's not about me, it's about all the people who never had a voice. I am running to be your voice. I am running to be the voice for every forgotten part of this country. I'm glad I make the powerful a little uncomfortable. Including the powerful in my own party. I'm fighting for real change. There's a reason the Hedge Fund managers are throwing money all over Hillary .

DJT: On terrorism we're going to focus on destroying ISIS. We'll use cyber, financial warfare. We'll work with anyone who shares our goal. We will win and win soon. On immigration, we'll temporary suspend immigration from anywhere where screening can't be adequately performed. Extreme vetting.

(USA)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


And one that he, a vegan, cannot enjoy...

Oh gosh, I forgot about that. Yeah, it would have been much much more awesome if he had submitted a vegan recipe. There are plenty of delicious vegan cookie recipes. What a missed opportunity. :(
posted by thefoxgod at 5:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Holy shit -- I never thought he'd actually pivot. This is bad.
posted by tzikeh at 5:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


Holy shit -- I never thought he'd actually pivot. This is bad.

Just wait, no chance it lasts.
posted by waitingtoderail at 5:10 PM on August 18, 2016 [14 favorites]


I never thought he'd actually pivot

This is not a pivot. It is just dressing up the same old lies and attacks with nice platitudes.

I cannot imagine anyone not already in the Trump camp who will be taken in. It does not help that his vileness has been videoed.
posted by bearwife at 5:10 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Holy shit -- I never thought he'd actually pivot. This is bad.
I am so, so curious as to how the alt-right jackass from Breitbart and Madame Republican Pollster got him to pivot when no one else could. What were the magic words? Perhaps something like, "Trump, just act like a President so we can get in office. You can go back to being a racist, misogynistic, xenophobic, clueless asshole the moment we're in there picking out the new couch and deciding which Presidential desk we're gonna use." [fake, obvs]
posted by xyzzy at 5:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Its one speech. I'm doubtful he can restrain himself enough to avoid starting a new insane controversy in the next 81 days. I mean, he made some more restrained speeches before and then went back to insanity (I remember his first teleprompter speech where everyone was like "Is this the new Donald Trump" and the answer was No).
posted by thefoxgod at 5:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh are we using literally figuratively again? Shaw v. Reno would say that's not literally true although I would agree that GOTV efforts are very very important.

According to Daley, while there are a few cases making their way to the Supreme Court and a few possible legislative fixes as well, the Legislative work has to make it through the districts to begin with to be in place in 2020 and the Supreme Court makeup is also dependent on the next few elections and quite slow to enact. Apparently there's also talk of doing something at the National Level, but again that is dependent on getting control of the House and the Senate, both of which have been carefully gerrymandered in key places (the Senate less than the House for reasons of district size).

He goes over it in detail on the podcast; it was interesting if depressing. I literally was using "literally" literally, based on his information; if you believe his assessment is incorrect, I'd be interested to hear it.
posted by Deoridhe at 5:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I don't think its bad. The substance is the same. He's just using some of his convention "I am your voice" speech now. Keep steadily working on getting out the vote and don't panic.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


DJT: Anyone who thinks Sharia law supplants American law will not get a visa. Anyone who thinks suppressing women, gays won't get in.

DJT: My opponent wants a 550% increase in Syrian refugees. What are we doing? Hillary Clinton is running to be america's Angela Merkel. We've seen how much crime.

DJT: On crime, we're going to add more police, prosecutors. Will pursue strong enforcement of federal laws. The gangs, cartels will be stripped apart one by one. Very fast.

DJT: On trade, we're going to renegotiate NAFTA. If they don't agree, we'll withdraw. And TPP, another disaster. Stand up to China. Protect every American job. Hillary has supported all the trade deals that stripped our jobs and wealth.

DJT: On taxes, get rid of regulations that send jobs overseas, and make it easier for American s to get credit for small businesses. On education we're going to get choice and charter schools. My opponent wants to deny students choice in order to get money form the education beuracracsy. We'll work with African American community. What a big difference that will make. One of the things I most look forward to doing. Top priority.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Eh. One speech does not a pivot make. He's read from a teleprompter before, only to fly off the rails again the next day on Twitter.
posted by monospace at 5:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


There's a reason the Hedge Fund managers are throwing money all over Hillary .

uh dude you know your new campaign manager made his bones on wall street right
posted by murphy slaw at 5:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think it only counts as a pivot if he manages to keep going in a coherent/positive direction. Right now, it's more like he briefly stumbled in the "right" direction. Everything is fresh and happy with the new handlers, they gave him some good lines, he's energized, he's feeling it, he's using their lines and listening. How long does this last? Recent history says not very, but we'll see.
posted by feloniousmonk at 5:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


I really hope with all my heart that the American public doesn't buy what this man is selling.

They swallowed whole the dreck talk-radio pushed out. They bought onto the Fox News train. They embraced the Tea Party. And, in the end, they gave the right both chambers of Congress, and the majority of state legislatures and governorships.

No reason to think they won't swallow Trump's codswallop.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:13 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


however coherent he sounds, this is not reaching out beyond his existing base. he's repeating himself off the teleprompter. if it didn't work during the convention with all eyes on him, what makes you think it will work now?
posted by murphy slaw at 5:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


DJT: On healthcare repeal and replace obamacare. Aetna is pulling out, including NC. You'll have better healthcare at a lower cost.

DJT: On political corruption, restore honor. Enforce all laws on protection of classified info. Prevent senior officials from accepting speaking fees from lobbyists/governments for five years after they serve.

DJT: Bring our country together by emphasizing what we have together. Hillary is bigoted. Sees communities of color only as votes. She's been there forever and look where you are. If African Americans give me their vote the results will be amazing. Look how things are going under decades of Democrats. Time for a change. What do you have to lose by trying something new? I will fix it. The inner cities are so bad.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Just nervously donated another $100. Great speech Donald!!!
posted by acidic at 5:19 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


DJT: I will works as hard as I can to bring opportunity. Hillary has take African American votes for granted. They haven't produced. Time to break with the failures of the past. In my administration every American will be treated, protected, honored equally. We will reject bigotry. This is the change I am promising you, an honest government and a just society. But we can never fix our problems by relying on the politicians who caused it. 72% say the country is on the wrong track. I am the change candidate. It's time to vote for a new American future.

DJT: Together we will make America strong, proud, safe again. We will make America great again. Got bless you.

(Exheunt)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:19 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


> Look how things are going under decades of Democrats.

???

How many years out of the last 30 have Democrats controlled both the White House and Congress, giving them free reign to pursue their policy goals? By my count only 10, and they're not consecutive.

We have not had "decades of Democrats."
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 5:20 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


That's the Big Lie.
posted by adamgreenfield at 5:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


No, I'm dumb. Not ten years. Four.
posted by a mirror and an encyclopedia at 5:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Time to break with the failures of the past.

this is referring to his bankruptcies right
posted by murphy slaw at 5:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


We have not had "decades of Democrats."

While true, it doesn't matter. So long as there is one marginally liberal person left in government, they will always run with the liberals/democrats are ruining the country meme. It works time and time again.
posted by Thorzdad at 5:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


@JYSexton: "Everyone says this is about letting Trump be Trump, but this is everything he wasn't. This is a puppet dancing for a new puppet master."
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 5:24 PM on August 18, 2016 [21 favorites]


this is referring to his bankruptcies right

I think it's referring to the last 13 months of his campaign.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:24 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


How many years out of the last 30 have Democrats controlled both the White House and Congress, giving them free reign to pursue their policy goals? By my count only 10, and they're not consecutive.

We have not had "decades of Democrats."


He's talking about in cities, like Baltimore, Chicago. It's a common expression in some conservative circles, and popped up again after the acquittal for the police involved in Freddie Gray's murder.
posted by the man of twists and turns at 5:24 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


He's talking about in cities, like Baltimore, Chicago.

then maybe his ass should be running for mayor
posted by murphy slaw at 5:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Crucially, he is still not offering any concrete plans or vision beyond "I will fix it for you." That's not going to convince very many people beyond the rabid 27%. Plus, it's not going to magically erase the past 12 months of increasingly alarming what-the-fuckery.
posted by monospace at 5:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


This speech is scary. This speech is truly scary.

It sounds so reasonable. It's fucking terrifying.
posted by Talez at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


I just hope the media doesn't run with the "OMG HE APOLOGIZED WOW SO PRESIDENTIAL" and call him out for the emptiness of all the platitudes.
posted by Tevin at 5:30 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


It sounds so reasonable. It's fucking terrifying.

Until you look at the content. He's putting lipstick on the pig, but the pig is still a dead pig. Perhaps a pig head stuck on a stick attracting flies on an island filled with feral boys.

He's still Trump. We still need to GOTV no matter what. Guys, we got this.

Disclaimer - I know that it is our job as progressives to believe we're somehow going to throw the whole election but this year, we just keep working hard and we've got this. Really, work hard and we got this.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:33 PM on August 18, 2016 [22 favorites]


Please someone show him a picture of the nekkidTrump statue so that he loses his tiny little mind and shows us his real self again...
posted by uosuaq at 5:34 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


He's talking about in cities, like Baltimore, Chicago.

Ah. One of the many difficulties in trying to give running summary of what he's saying is he says some things that make you think you misheard him. Glad that one was about right.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:35 PM on August 18, 2016


Joey Michaels, I can still remember the months when I'd stare at this every morning for a few minutes.
posted by uosuaq at 5:36 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Damn, I step out to mow the lawn for a bit and Trump gets himself an honest to gosh speech-writer? Fascinating.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:37 PM on August 18, 2016


It sounds so reasonable.

It only sounds reasonable compared to all the shit he's been flinging up until now. He has a very, very low bar to clear. I'm not worried yet.
posted by monospace at 5:38 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


DJT: Let's talk about the economy. Nafta. NC lost half its jobs

Governor Pat McCrory (R) would like to have a little word with you, Donald. According to him NC is adding jobs faster than the national average and that bathroom bill didn't hurt us a whit, no sirree bob.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:43 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


REKT! Donald Trump posts Throwback Thursday video attacking Hillary Clinton

Rather partisan for an ABC affiliate (granted, AZ)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:43 PM on August 18, 2016


Bill's cookie recipe is fine. He's not stealing any spotlight, and he's reminding people that Hillary has been fighting bullshit sexist expectations for decades. I like a vegan cookie as much as the next guy, but I'm already in the tank. The BoB's and Stein types that such a recipe might appeal to are a far smaller group than the women and men who will be like, 'yeah, that was some shit. Hey, maybe I'll make some cookies.'
posted by box at 5:43 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Hillary Clinton is running to be america's Angela Merkel.

Aside from the fact that a solid fraction of the electorate doesn't know who Angela Merkel is and a larger fraction doesn't care, that's not "reasonable" that's nonsense. And managing, after a year of campaigning, to deliver a more or less coherent speech isn't "reasonable," either, it's barely adequate.
posted by octobersurprise at 5:43 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Hillary Clinton is running to be america's Angela Merkel

Also, its an alt-right/white supremacist dog whistle.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:45 PM on August 18, 2016 [30 favorites]


numaner: Try the triangular bit of Twinbrook between 355 and Veirs Mill.

(Also hi, neighbors!)
posted by seyirci at 5:47 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Remember that Merkel is hated by Putin and the alt right (race traitor browning Germany.) Seems on-message.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Also, its an alt-right/white supremacist dog whistle.

Yep. It's nonsensical in any other context but in the context of neo-nazis and the alt-right it's absolutely code for, "Trump's new masters know wassuuup, fellow white supremacists! Never you fear."
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


The Jared Yates Sexton twitter feed is pretty scary. He is reporting on the crowd's reactions to the media including, "Everyone at CNN should be arrested." "The media is full of perverts and retards." and one guy telling another, "Reporters need lobotomies," and his friend replied, "Maybe that is what Trump will do after elected."

It is not like anything I've seen before. He has whipped up so much frenzy over the press that I fear for them more than I fear for Clinton-- she at least has the Secret Service to watch her back.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:52 PM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


He has whipped up so much frenzy over the press that I fear for them more than I fear for Clinton-- she at least has the Secret Service to watch her back.

Apparently his USSS detail is keeping an eye out for the press, walking at least one reporter that he called by name to her (natch) car. Obviously, that's not their assigned task.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]




I'm not a very optimistic person, but if this is the big pivot then I don't think we need to be overly worried. It's the same shit he always says without a horrifying "gaffe" somewhere in the middle, basically like his RNC speech. He can't keep this up. You can put a lid on him for a few days but eventually the pressure builds up and he has to release it in some idiotic word vomit on Twitter, an interview, an off-the-cuff remark in an interview, or all of the above.
posted by gatorae at 6:02 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Sopan Deb tweets: This is incredible. For the 1st time - in prepared remarks, Trump expressing regret for some of his campaign conduct

Trump camp blasts out email using a tweet from me, headlining with saying I called Trump's speech "incredible"

The funny thing is how the email has taken one word from a bunch of different tweets to string together the sentence: "Killer Trump speech containing empathy, regret, strength, & cutting change contrast with Hillary.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:02 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Yay I made it to the end of the thread! Now my machine can cool off for a minute before it has to get the script up and whirring again.
posted by aka burlap at 6:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


walking at least one reporter that he called by name to her (natch) car.

Katy Tur.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Bill's cookie recipe is fine.

He should've submitted the one off the back of the package of chocolate chips. It was a bullshit weapon to use against Hilary in 1992, and it'd be fitting for that crap to end with Bill. If she wins he should submit the same one 4 (or hopefully 8) years in a row until they stop asking him.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


well, maybe if Trump stays on target for long enough to make TPP an issue again, Clinton will have to ultimately legitimately oppose it.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 6:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I want to know why it's so easy for some people to pivot from absolute scorn to absolute terror.
posted by My Dad at 6:09 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Make Republicans Fucking Choke on Donald Trump

Some are
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I believe the answer to the scorn-to-terror flip-flop is that the underling terror is constant. it's like how Bruce Banner learned to semi-control his transformations by just going ahead and being furious all the time.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 6:11 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Politico has the speech if you feel the need to read it.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


My Dad: it's what the left does. Somehow our collective anxiety complex doesn't allow us to feel successful at anything.

I just looked up my local district. GOTV people. I mean I make a fuss in city council meetings on the regular but this is more important.

c'mon guys, stop hand wringing and GO DO SOMETHING even if it's just going outside. We got this.
posted by lonefrontranger at 6:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


Make Republicans Fucking Choke on Donald Trump

"If I were Clinton, I'd demand that each of these assholes scrambling to get away from Trump join the Democratic Party."
Yeah, that's totally what she should do: in the middle of a campaign against Donald Trump, she should devote her time and energy to starting a second fight with the Republicans who've voiced their support for her for not being Democrats.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:14 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Hey, everyone remember back when Donald Trump was saying crazy shit and not giving a fuck who he offended?




Well congratulations, you're more qualified to be a journalist than I suspect any current journalists will be as they write their "pivot" stories.
posted by tonycpsu at 6:14 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]



Politico has the speech if you feel the need to read it.


Pshaw. Sure, if you just want it handed to you.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


If that's an apology, it's the pretty lamest. But it's probably enough for his supporters to feel like he's apologized for whatever statement gives them the most doubt.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 6:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Politico has the speech if you feel the need to read it.

Not I. I prefer the ChurchHatesTucker abridged version.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


> a Trump win would do far more damage to the GOP than a Trump loss?

Republican ad campaign: Vote for the crook, not the racist.
posted by Monochrome at 2:41 PM on August 18 [+] [!]


Maybe we could not link and repost Trump's ads endlessly when they come out.

Just a thought.
posted by kyrademon at 2:43 PM on August 18 [4 favorites +] [!]


This ("Vote for the crook") is not a Trump ad. It's a blog post from Fred Clark pointing out that Republicans have in the past sabotaged their own candidate when he was loathsome enough for them to care.
posted by Monochrome at 6:18 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


So far all of the news articles that I'm reading (L.A. Times, NPR, Newsweek, CNN) are saying the same thing, he said he had regrets but wouldn't say for what and said we should leave the past behind. Then, for example, the L.A. Times goes on to list some of the shittier, more recent things he has said. So I don't think the media is just going to pretend this is a brand new day and all slates are wiped clean.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:18 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


What's funny is that if Clinton did demand that he Republican supporters become Democrats, the I'd be reading pieces angrily asking why Clinton was inviting Republicans into the party.
posted by octobersurprise at 6:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [16 favorites]


This was announced last hour by MSNBC: Joint Candidate Event to Highlight National Security, Military and Veterans Issues, Live in Primetime on NBC and MSNBC on Wednesday, September 7, 2016

"The candidates will appear back to back during the one-hour event. They will take questions on national security, military affairs and veterans issues from NBC News and an audience comprised mainly of military veterans and active service members."
posted by cashman at 6:24 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]



If that's an apology, it's the pretty lamest. But it's probably enough for his supporters

Do I need to point out that he needs more than his supporters? He can't win with just those guys, he needs to win over new people in order to have any kind of a chance. Unfortunately for him (fortunately for us) he has burnt those boats. You think the Hispanics and Latinos are just going to forget about the Wall and Judge Curiel and the "rapists" remarks? You think the people who have insurance because of ObamaCare are going to be fine with his plan to abolish it? You think women are going to shrug off all his nasty, sexist remarks? You think the disabled and their families are going to forget his mocking gestures? Think of how many groups (Fire Marshals!!) he has alienated. He certainly has gone out of his way to emphasize that Black Lives Matter less than support for the police.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:27 PM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


Between Arizona, North Carolina, and Virgina, the judicial branch is (slowly) working on "unratf**king" the damage that was done (with a lot of work), so there's clearly some ability to redistrict other than a massive spend to GOTV followed by doing your own self-interested redistricting. Still, Daley is far more concerned with realistic options rather than theoretical possibilities though, as we should be, rather than quibble over semantic choices.

Still, I'm happy to discuss the substantive districting procedural aspect of redistricting and am glad to see I didn't manage to bait everyone with the all important hot-button topic of diction.
posted by fragmede at 6:31 PM on August 18, 2016


Politico has the speech if you feel the need to read it.

Where in the hell did this come from?
posted by Going To Maine at 6:32 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


You think the Hispanics and Latinos are just going to forget about the Wall and Judge Curiel and the "rapists" remarks?

I think there's a certain segment of the electorate that wants to not vote for Hillary but also wants to sleep at night thinking they picked the lesser of two evils. Trump acting like a reasonable human being, no matter the content, gives that part of the electorate the license they're looking for to vote for Trump. Trump already has the 27% crazy part of the Latino electorate.
posted by Talez at 6:35 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Ahhh, he deviated from the prepared remarks during the actual speech. Politico, fix your transcript.
posted by Going To Maine at 6:35 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I don't think the members of the media are going to forget that Trump made them a target. I doubt they'll fall for it. The mask slipped of; we all saw it.
posted by schadenfrau at 6:39 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I've never been politically correct. It takes far too much time.

Dude, don't be mean and refer to people the way they like to be referred to. I learned that shit in kindergarten, brah.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Pretty sure this is the mask tonight.
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


https://twitter.com/JYSexton/status/766447431483531264

Jared Yates Sexton
‏@JYSexton
Trump wasn't Trump tonight. He was a megaphone spouting off Breitbart copy. It was organized and structured. Nuanced. That's terrible news.
posted by rbf1138 at 6:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [8 favorites]


Joint Candidate Event to Highlight National Security, Military and Veterans Issues, Live in Primetime on NBC and MSNBC on Wednesday, September 7, 2016

"America’s next Commander-in-Chief"

American does not have a commander-in-chief. According to the job description:
The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States...
I know this the audience at this event will be "comprised mainly of military veterans and active service members," but I'm really tired of the president being called the commander-in-chief outside of the context of the armed forces.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:53 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I think if the Les Moonves types see it as profitable, the journalists will have to take this "pivot" seriously.
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 6:54 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm really tired of the president being called the commander-in-chief outside of the context of the armed forces.

I know, it's like police talking about "civilians".
posted by Joe in Australia at 6:56 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


The big question is... if the candidates do a half-hour each back-to-back, who goes first?
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:57 PM on August 18, 2016


The big question is... if the candidates do a half-hour each back-to-back, who goes first?

It won't matter. Either way Trump will claim Hillary demanded to go either first or last and that it put him at a disadvantage and it was unfair.
posted by Talez at 7:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Debate tactic idea for Clinton: she should come out in a Trump wig. A perfect, strand-for-strand replica of Trump's "hair." Anyone says anything she should just be like "I don't know what you're talking about. Can we please get off the topic of my hair." Just totally play it cool.

Then at the end of the debate she should take it off and throw it at him.
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


If Trump had given this as his acceptance speech and stayed on target and out of trouble, I'd be worried. But he didn't and he's self-destructive, so pfft.
posted by argybarg at 7:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Feeling worried about this pivot speech, but we'll have to see if Trump can stay consistently faux-reasonable. And, based on the excerpts I read, he wasn't specific about anything he "regrets" saying, etc.

He needs to be made to answer what, exactly, he regrets, and what he's changing his tune on. If he cannot make that clear, and stick with it, the pivot is a lot less believable.

We shall see. I honestly wasn't sure he'd even try...
posted by defenestration at 7:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


American does not have a commander-in-chief.

Of course it does. This is shorthand, like talking about appointing Justices. Yeah, it's not all the Prez does, but the Prez does it.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:19 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]




So, I wonder what hot take we'll get from Michael Moore next week.
posted by defenestration at 7:20 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I'm not saying that the world can stop paying attention or anything, but let's not catastrophize based on one speech. Reacting to the one time in the last few months he was able to do the bare minimum that a candidate is supposed to do as if this is an amazing turning point is just playing into the media's horse race narrative.
posted by tocts at 7:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [17 favorites]


So now we get to test this quote from back in mid-June.

"Trump’s campaign manager has insisted that they “let Trump be Trump” and the wisdom of the strategy is undeniable. As long as he continues to say crazy shit, he will continue to dominate the news and will continue to attract crowds. The moment he ceases to entertain – to say crazy shit – he will evaporate. "
posted by cashman at 7:22 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'm a little tired of "hot take" as "opinion I don't like." But it's not exactly worth a MetaTalk post.
posted by uosuaq at 7:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


So, I wonder what hot take we'll get from Michael Moore next week.

I don't know, but I'll bet it involves him treating the people who work for him like shit.
posted by dersins at 7:24 PM on August 18, 2016


let's not catastrophize based on one speech

Really we oughta just tune out until the debates but dammit I'm hooked on these mefi politickles.
posted by dis_integration at 7:25 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Regretful Trump pivots 107 days late:
Three and a half months after sealing the Republican nomination, Donald Trump pivoted to contest the general election on Thursday night, expressing regret for his past failures to “choose the right words” and delivering one of the most comprehensive, on-message rationales for his candidacy to date.

Speaking from prepared remarks on the heels of another staffing shakeup, Trump positioned himself as the champion of voiceless Americans against a corrupt and incompetent elite and the leader of an inclusive movement who repeatedly condemned “bigotry.”
posted by kirkaracha at 7:26 PM on August 18, 2016


A scorpion asks a frog to carry it across a river. The frog hesitates, afraid of being stung, but the scorpion argues that if it did so, they would both drown. Considering this, the frog agrees, but midway across the river the scorpion does indeed sting the frog, dooming them both. When the frog asks the scorpion why, the scorpion replies that it was in its nature to do so.
posted by kirkaracha at 7:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


I think there's a certain segment of the electorate that wants to not vote for Hillary but also wants to sleep at night thinking they picked the lesser of two evils

Given how vocal Trump supporters have been and how vocal Clinton critics have been, is there any evidence of a significant number of voters who are sort of "secret" Trump voters as you suggest? Wouldn't you think that a voter who doesn't want to vote for Clinton but who doesn't want to vote for Trump, either, is more likely to vote third party? Or simply not vote at all? The assumption behind your theory seems to be that since a significant number of people really want to vote for Trump but are too scared to, all he needs to do to get these voters is to be a little less scary. That's possible, of course, but is there evidence to suggest that it's true?
posted by octobersurprise at 7:28 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


I used hot take, sarcastically, because Moore has had two contradictory, in-the-moment, unsupported by any sort of evidence opinion pieces in the last month or so. Or at least evidence he was willing to share.

I apologize. I should have said shitty take.
posted by defenestration at 7:29 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


Not trying to defend Moore...I think he's produced some good work (which tends to be better the more he stays behind the camera) and I think he has a certain gift for making abstract issues tangible. But he's not my hero or anything.
posted by uosuaq at 7:31 PM on August 18, 2016


I'm curious, and a little but not too concerned, about how Breitbart is going to handle Trump. I don't think they're idiots—I think they probably understand how to fuck over a media that's trying to be balanced better than anybody. I bet they have plenty of ideas of ways to make Trump seem reasonable in the eyes of CNN.

I'm also curious if their privately–commissioned poll was commissioned in part to convince Trump to go along with their master plan. The timing there seems apropos. Could "look at you losing in the polls, like a loser" be how they made him give this speech?
posted by rorgy at 7:34 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


All good. Generally speaking, I get irked by trendy turns of phrases that sorta pop up and you see them everywhere, instantly being overused. Specifically, I've felt that was about the phrase "hot take" itself.

It just felt really a propos. You calling it out gave me a chance to explain what I meant.
posted by defenestration at 7:36 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


(What did Michael Moore do that's infuriated so many people? Other than being snotty and a little hot–headed? I haven't followed him in the news for ages, but I read his books when I was younger and they were full of then–interesting ideas, albeit presented a bit more sloppily than I generally prefer. Guy's no Al Franken but I didn't know he was this apparently despised.)
posted by rorgy at 7:37 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Yeah, it's a shame that everything he's said before now is on record, he's got a bunch of rabid followers who might not play along, he's pissed off everyone else, he won't be able to square the Reasonable Trump with the 'No tax returns from me' Trump, he's months behind on organisation, he's got two Clintons, one Obama, one Kaine and one Biden against him, and all he's managed to prove so far is that he can read a teleprompter.

And he has to go 80+ days without a meltdown, he has to regain (actually, just gain) the trust of god knows how many GOPers, navigate a by now hostile press, debates and a country which clearly does not like him, without the aid of words written down by a Breitbart hack.

Should be interesting.
posted by Devonian at 7:37 PM on August 18, 2016 [10 favorites]


I don't know, having looked at the transcript a little more closely, it's basically the same word soup he always brings to the table, it's just more competently prepared and with fresher ingredients. When you get down to it, the difference this time around is that instead of taking the most vicious possible rhetorical line on every point, he's taken the second-most vicious rhetorical line. Otherwise, it's like some sort of Breitbart Talking Points Greatest Hits medley number that labors to tick all of the right boxes. Literally no development would surprise me at this point, but it really seems like it's just a matter of time until something gives and we're right back into "can you believe what he said this time?" mode. Saying the same things in a slightly better way just doesn't indicate actual substantial change to me.
posted by feloniousmonk at 7:38 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Literally no development would surprise me at this point, but it really seems like it's just a matter of time until something gives and we're right back into "can you believe what he said this time?" mode. Saying the same things in a slightly better way just doesn't indicate actual substantial change to me.

While I'm concerned about Bannon's competency, this is the main reason I'm not especially freaking out right now. Breitbart believes all the stupid conspiratorial bullshit that Trump believes in. Their major successes have mostly involved faked-up videos, and not actually reporting batshit right-wingery in a way that makes the mainstream give a shit. I mean, I follow all the news, all of it, and Breitbart makes Fox Nation and the Drudge Report seem actually fair and balanced.

If anything, I bet they try to use their "Clinton Cash" documentary as the main scandal, and wind up using Trump as a tool to promote their in–house video productions. That seems like the sort of cocked–up idea that they either believe would work, or don't care about the effectiveness of so long as it lets them point at themselves and go "Look! We made history!"
posted by rorgy at 7:42 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


rorgy:
I think it's mostly down to a couple Chicken-Little-sky-is-falling-type pieces, re both Romney and Trump. Which people either interpret as: "gimme a fuckin break" or "maybe the is some sort of reverse psychology? I dunno, but I do know it ain't workin as intended."

It's funny how little it takes for people to write people/things/ideas off, isn't it?
posted by rp at 7:44 PM on August 18, 2016




Another thing to factor in is that the Breitbart crew are writers but they aren't speechwriters. This is probably their A game that they've been working on since they started seriously considering the job. Can they keep it up? Their website can afford to miss on most of its articles because nobody really cares and a big success will make up for it but Trump can't really afford to keep spinning his wheels as they cycle deeper into the conspiracist's card catalog trying to find new themes that stick as Trump bores of/exhausts/ruins the existing ones.
posted by feloniousmonk at 7:47 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm not referring to Moore as a person, or any of his larger work. I'm referring to his commentary on this presidential election. Also, the last, as he's falling into similar narratives.

If I had written him off completely, I wouldn't be reading anything he writes, period.
posted by defenestration at 7:48 PM on August 18, 2016


Didn't Moore make that 9/11 truther movie?

"Hot take" refers to very stale opinions which the opiner thinks are new, daring, or sophisticated but are actually well-covered ground.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 7:54 PM on August 18, 2016


No, a "hot take" is an opinion given instantly without deep thought or research.
posted by modernnomad at 7:57 PM on August 18, 2016 [27 favorites]


I regret saying the wrong thing.
posted by defenestration at 8:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [6 favorites]


Didn't Moore make that 9/11 truther movie?

It exposed and pilloried the total incompetece of the Bush administration in handling 9/11, which is a kind of truth, so yes. But in the commonly accepted "wacky conspiracy theorist" sense? No.

Honestly, I don't understand the "HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER!!!" vibe I'm picking up in general in this thread re: Moore. He did some solid work in the Bush years.
posted by indubitable at 8:00 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


Keep Your Nerve, everyone. Trump can't coast to victory on the backs of his speechwriters. If he ends up looking more competitive then that can only end up underscoring the legitimacy of Clinton's victory.
posted by um at 8:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


Honestly, I don't understand the "HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER!!!" vibe I'm picking up in general in this thread re: Moore. He did some solid work in the Bush years.

His 'Trump will win' piece had a pretty unmistakable Bernie Or Bust vibe to it, weeks after the convention. That's pretty unforgivable from someone who markets himself as a scion of the left. He's poisoned the well as far as commentary on this election goes, and needs to just go away and make a movie or something. Real time analysis has never been what he's done well.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:03 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


I think of a hot take as an intentionally inflammatory or contrarian opinion of the type that Slate excels at (Why Foxes Are The Best Henhouse Guards types of essays).
posted by Bookhouse at 8:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


In conclusion, hot takes are a land of contrasts.




(In 2004 my history teacher seriously made us watch a serious 9/11 conspiracy theory movie which I probably got mixed up with Fahrenheit 9/11)
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:05 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


more seriously I think all of those connotations are accurate
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 8:06 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Friend of mine posted some pictures and commentary on what he saw outside the Trump rally in Charlotte, NC.
posted by marxchivist at 8:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [15 favorites]


I feel like I started the "hot take" derail, and wish I could end it.
posted by uosuaq at 8:07 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


In the Simpsons a common joke set-up is that Lisa gets straight As, is a genius, and behaves impeccably. Bart is, well, Bart, but bringing home a C- instead of an F will causes him to get lavished with attention. In the same sense, I think that trump's mediocre ability to read a slightly sanitized version of his same old Sturm und Drang from a teleprompter will get outsized attention in the press, and likely translate to a poll bump. I think this is because outlets like CNN need this to be a horse race, and you can't have three months of just shitting (even deservedly) on a single candidate. Overall though, I simply don't see how he has a path to the presidency. His campaign cleaning up might have the undesirable tack-on effect of not allowing the Dems to recapture the senate, but I think that he's still in the 5% path to victory reality, even if he does go up by ten points or so in the next month.
posted by codacorolla at 8:08 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


But in the commonly accepted "wacky conspiracy theorist" sense? No.
I'm afraid I must beg to differ on that account. Moore spent a lot of time on the Bush family's connection to the Bin Ladens and the approval of the Saudi flights out of the US when everything else was still grounded. While not literally stating that 9/11 was a false flag op cooked up by Bush and Buddies to wade back into the Middle East, Moore's documentary still has a truther flavor to it that's like sand in your swim trunks.
posted by xyzzy at 8:09 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Honestly, I don't understand the "HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER!!!" vibe I'm picking up in general in this thread re: Moore.

He is far from "HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER," but, on the other hand, literally not one single person in this thread is claiming that he is.

On the other, other hand, he writes pointlessly hysterical bullshit opinion pieces in which he makes putatively authoritative claims that not only have no basis in actual fact, but are blatantly self-contradictory.

On the other, other, other hand, he purports to be a man of the people and a champion of the "workin' man" while treating the people who work for him with in an utterly contemptuous and exploitative manner.

So, not "HISTORY'S GREATEST MONSTER," but, also, fuck that guy in the face.
posted by dersins at 8:09 PM on August 18, 2016 [11 favorites]


If Trump starts to look more reasonable, that'll convert to Dems working even harder to GOTV. I was actually starting to worry a little about our side turning complacent.
posted by rifflesby at 8:13 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


People are freaking out because he apologized? His only strength was the appearance of strength and now he doesn't even have that. Sweep the leg baby
posted by Potomac Avenue at 8:16 PM on August 18, 2016 [7 favorites]


Potomac Avenue: People are freaking out because he apologized?

For some people, getting an honest apology without a following "... but [you're still wrong/ you shouldn't have said that thing you did]" is a marked improvement and elicits surprise and praise.

And he stayed on message, deviating from the prepared script only slightly. There was positive response when he read from a teleprompter before, this is definitely something journalists will make into a mountain.

Then again, he might get another Donald Trump Gives Low-Energy Teleprompter Speech And Nobody Cares. Sad!
posted by filthy light thief at 8:21 PM on August 18, 2016


"I really regret that" is his new "Believe me". They just changed his tell.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]


Trump can't really afford to keep spinning his wheels as they cycle deeper into the conspiracist's card catalog trying to find new themes that stick

I don't know why they would do that. All he's got to do is give the same speech about a hundred more times in 80 days without crackinga and he gains a lot of the groundb he lost through unforced error.

a) unlikely
b) not all the ground.
posted by ctmf at 8:24 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


And anyway, this has been the "new" Donnie of the past few days:
campaign and the candidate, in the last couple of days at least, have been doing things that seem very much in line with a shift. The campaign is, on a daily basis, trying to drive a message. And the candidate, two days in a row at least, has spoken from a teleprompter. Last night, he held a rally here. The vibe was very much that sort of raw energy of a rally. There were chants in the crowd of lock her up and things that are typically at a Trump rally. The only thing that was different was Donald Trump himself. He stuck largely to the teleprompter.
NPR, August 17, 2016.

But now it looks like he also has a bigger staff who bring more dirt to dig up, so he has that going for his campaign.

And we still have the debates, where Donny has to talk with people who won't just cheer along at the right times, and he won't have a teleprompter to prop him up. He has plenty of chances to go back to the garbage fire we know and despise.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:25 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


So, Trump found an editor?
posted by valkane at 8:29 PM on August 18, 2016


While eating man's face, Florida 'cannibal killer' wore Trump 'Make America Great Again' hat [real]

I am literally out of both evens and hot takes. Good night, everyone.
posted by stolyarova at 8:31 PM on August 18, 2016 [67 favorites]


False flag. Everyone knows cannibal killers support Gary Johnson.
posted by Joey Michaels at 8:47 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


While eating man's face, Florida 'cannibal killer' wore Trump 'Make America Great Again' hat [real]

They're not even trying to make this latest season plausible :(
posted by Mitrovarr at 8:48 PM on August 18, 2016 [28 favorites]


That is definitely the worst Florida Man yet.
posted by gatorae at 8:51 PM on August 18, 2016 [9 favorites]


I don't know why they would do that.

I basically expect the unforced errors to keep happening. You can give Trump better source material to go into a situation with, but you can't change who he is or how he reacts in the heat of a high pressure moment, so I think he'll keep ad libbing around the edges of his major points in ways that will continue to pile up lingering questions that are best avoided by moving onto the next thing.
posted by feloniousmonk at 8:58 PM on August 18, 2016 [2 favorites]


A candidate who thinks political correctness takes too much time undoubtedly also thinks that due process takes too much time.
posted by puddledork at 9:04 PM on August 18, 2016 [18 favorites]


Trump's about to drop $5m in ten days of TV ads in NC, Ohio, Florida and PA. Which is under ten percent of what HRC's spent already, but it's a start.

What they'll be like, though...


I smell goldfish snuff films!!!

posted by Kid Charlemagne at 9:19 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


While not literally stating that 9/11 was a false flag op cooked up by Bush and Buddies to wade back into the Middle East, Moore's documentary still has a truther flavor to it that's like sand in your swim trunks.

Prince and the '28 pages': Indirect 9/11 link to Saudi royal revealed:
Now, 14 years after Zubaydah was apprehended, newly declassified information from a 2002 congressional report on the 9/11 attacks, dubbed the "28 pages," reveals an indirect link previously hidden from the American public between the alleged al Qaeda operative and a company associated with a key member of the Saudi royal family, former Saudi Ambassador to the United States Prince Bandar bin Sultan.
Saudi Arabia's 9/11 connection:
At the heart of the close relationship between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia on 9/11 was one man: Prince Bandar. A grandson of the Gulf state's founding king, Bandar was the Saudi ambassador to the U.S. from 1983 to 2005, and went on to run his country's intelligence agency. He was so close to the Bushes he was often called "Bandar Bush," and he was instrumental in persuading his government to assist the U.S. in the first Gulf War.
...
During 2000 and 2001, al-Bayoumi received about $3,000 a month — through several intermediaries — from Prince Bandar's wife. Many suspect some of this cash was passed on to the hijackers.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:12 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Emails obtained by the AP appear to show that Paul Manefort and another Trump advisor broke laws lobbying for Ukrainian dictator.
posted by humanfont at 10:15 PM on August 18, 2016 [5 favorites]


Emails obtained by the AP appear to show that Paul Manefort and another Trump advisor broke laws lobbying for Ukrainian dictator.

That's a hot potato, since the Democrat-aligned Podesta Group is all tangled up in it as well, as per the AP report. I wonder how far the reporting of it will go since it makes everyone look bad.
posted by dis_integration at 10:23 PM on August 18, 2016 [1 favorite]


Right now, MSNBC is quoting some Bannon writing about how he celebrated with wine when Zimmerman was acquitted and how "mongrel" races want to kill superior whites out of jealousy. Has this been gish-galloped into normalcy already, or is this another 72 hour campaign reboot? Fuck I'm sick of waiting to find out if the better angels of our national character will prevail or not.

Also, I'm bummed that Gamechange 2: Great Again can't star Phillip Seymour Hoffman as Trump. That's the fantasy casting I see in my head and you guys? He nails it.
posted by EatTheWeek at 10:30 PM on August 18, 2016 [45 favorites]


If you look at the Huffington Post's composite polls going back to June 2015, Trump's ceiling is 43.9% (January) and Clinton's floor is 44.3% (mid-July). The closest it's been is Clinton 44.8% to Trump's 42.2% on July 23, just before the Democratic National Convention. I believe Trump's done too much permanent damage to his chances to be able to overtake her.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:47 PM on August 18, 2016 [4 favorites]


Also, I'm bummed that Gamechange 2: Great Again can't star Phillip Seymour Hoffman as Trump. That's the fantasy casting I see in my head and you guys? He nails it.

that "AUGH" noise you all heard just now was me having feelings. sorry. i'll clean it up.

hey, so, one fun thing i've learned courtesy of this election: if you dismantle the boxed wine and just drink directly from the bag, it's like suckling on a wine teat. very comforting in a fucked up, freudian sort of way.
posted by palomar at 11:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [24 favorites]


I don't trust Donald Trump.
posted by mazola at 11:46 PM on August 18, 2016 [3 favorites]






Okay, so I just saw the video of the speech. When he says "We are going to work closely with African-American parents and students in the inner cities – and what a big difference that will make. This means a lot to me, and it is going to be a top priority in a Trump Administration.", did anyone else feel a little ominous? And maybe threatened?
posted by Weeping_angel at 12:17 AM on August 19, 2016


I mean, the text looks fine, but something about how he says "work closely"...
posted by Weeping_angel at 12:18 AM on August 19, 2016


If he doesn't get a poll boost out of this speech I expect kindler-gentler-Trump will be drop kicked out the window.
posted by PenDevil at 12:29 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Regrets
He's had a few
But then again
Too few to mention
posted by kyrademon at 1:52 AM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


The NY Times sounds skeptical:

Donald Trump Steps Out of Character to Voice Unexplained Regrets
posted by monospace at 1:56 AM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


Yes, he clearly REGRETS not leading in the polls.
posted by threeturtles at 2:01 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


"I didn't mean that 2nd Amendment People should _kill_ Hillary after election but before she nominates Supreme Court Justices. Just wing her." [fake]
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:05 AM on August 19, 2016


Regrets
He's had a few
But then again
Too few to mention


I've long thought "Bizarro Sinatra" would make a good Trump nickname.
posted by PlusDistance at 2:24 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


needs to just go away and make a movie or something.

Is this the new "shut up and sing?"
posted by waitingtoderail at 3:51 AM on August 19, 2016


The thread about the Death of Gawker reminded me of its proud predecessor in "tabloid journalism" (and in getting sued but yet not sued out of existence), The National Enquirer. The Enquirer's publisher is a proud friend and supporter of Donald Trump, which is why its front page has been all-Hillary-Clinton-'scandals' for several months and will continue to be until the election. So why spend money on advertising when you have attacks on your opponent prominently displayed at every supermarket checkstand in America?
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:09 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump's first ad is out [Real]
posted by sporkwort at 4:24 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


"...the system stays rigged against real Americans...." voiceover, "Vote here" sign visual.

Reeeeeal subtle
posted by PenDevil at 4:42 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


so let me get this straight
for months the GOP has been to Trump, *don't be crazy*
and then Trump hires some batshit insane people
and they say *don't be crazy*
and he says okay?

And he says nothing about the naked statues?

This seems like a mistake of reality
posted by angrycat at 4:45 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


The entire ad is made up of little soundbites, like it was written in bullet points. It's very Trumpian, for short-attention span voters. Clinton's ads have a much different feel.
posted by zarq at 4:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I will repeat, then I will drop the subject, that I really, really don't think we should boost signal on his ads. He is spending relatively little money on them and I suspect he is counting on internet chatter to get the word out. I'd rather not play into that.
posted by kyrademon at 4:58 AM on August 19, 2016 [23 favorites]




Does anybody who is potentially receptive to Trump's message read the posts down here?
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:06 AM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


Ok, so I just caught up with the threads after a solid month full of "what" and even if Trump tries to pivot, it would give the media time to catch up with all the outlandish things he's said. Besides, someone with his temperament won't be able to practice self-restraint for long.
posted by ersatz at 5:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I believe that kyrademon is concerned about link juice. The more widely an article (or video, or whatever - any URL, basically) is posted / shared / linked, the more highly it ranks on Google. And being linked from highly trafficked sources (such as MeFi) provides more link juice.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 5:19 AM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


Besides, someone with his temperament won't be able to practice self-restraint for long.

What? He has the best temperament!
posted by dersins at 5:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Metafilter's Google link credibility is going to be relevant to smaller sites that don't get a lot of attention. This is part of why it's considered bad form to link directly to some controversial extremist sites here, and people will instead use a cache like archive.org or Google cache: it provides access to the source without conferring findability.

For a TV commercial for the Republican Presidential candidate, Mefi is too small to matter. The video is linked everywhere by every major news organization in the world by now.
posted by ardgedee at 5:30 AM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


Agreed with ardgedee. We're not talking about some random thread on Stormfront; these are commercials from a major-party Presidential candidate. They're already going to be amplified by, like, much of the global media industry. Unfortunately I don't think MeFi has much influence over their ranking one way or the other.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 5:39 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


About Trump's 'the election will be rigged' claims - he's talking about a major conspiracy to commit a very serious crime indeed. Has anyone asked him:

* what proof he has?
* whether he has raised these concerns with authorities?
* if not, why not?
* are these claims he now regrets or wishes to claim as sarcasm?

All reasonable questions that Reasonable Trump (RT, not to be confused with Russia Today) will doubtless be keen to address.
posted by Devonian at 5:50 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


and then Trump hires some batshit insane people
and they say *don't be crazy*
and he says okay?


My theory: He finally found people that speak his same language. All the people who were telling him to not be crazy before were asking him in the wrong way because they were talking to him like he's not a malignant narcissist and actually a serious politician. Now he's found people who have his exact same white supremacist agenda and his exact same personality disorders and they are able to communicate to him in a way that he gets. Also, it's finally sunk in that he really is losing very badly. I'm positive that the Breitbart "unskewed" poll that also showed Hillary +5 was commissioned with this exact endgame in mind: to get Breitbart staff onto the campaign.

Trump is now being used by those assholes in the same way that Putin uses him. He's easily manipulable by people who know what he responds to. Let him think he's actually the one in charge and you can get him to do anything you want.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:51 AM on August 19, 2016 [42 favorites]


Let him think he's actually the one in charge and you can get him to do anything you want.
I heard that Mark Burnett Productions handled him the same way for "The Apprentice" TV show... of course, they're all under NDAs now.
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:54 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


The NY Times sounds skeptical
“If African-American voters give Donald Trump a chance by giving me their vote, the result for them will be amazing,” he said.

The crowd, which was almost entirely white, cheered and applauded.
Good amazing or bad amazing?
posted by kirkaracha at 6:08 AM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Clinton Camp Calls Trump Apology ‘Teleprompter Regret’:
“Donald Trump literally started his campaign by insulting people. He has continued to do so through each of the 428 days from then until now, without shame or regret," Clinton deputy communications director Christina Reynolds said in a statement.
...
"We learned tonight that his speechwriter and teleprompter knows he has much for which he should apologize," Reynolds said in the statement. "But that apology tonight is simply a well-written phrase until he tells us which of his many offensive, bullying and divisive comments he regrets — and changes his tune altogether."
posted by kirkaracha at 6:15 AM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


Trump's first ad is out [Real]

Very reminiscent of the Brexit Campaign "Breaking Point" Poster with the visual of a vast stream of people crossing the border. Tag line "We must break free of the EU and take back control of our borders."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:17 AM on August 19, 2016


* what proof he has? the best proof. Yuuuge amounts of proof.

* whether he has raised these concerns with authorities? Lots of authorities. The authorities are coming to me asking how they can help. Authorities are the best.

* are these claims he now regrets or wishes to claim as sarcasm? I. REGRET. NOTHING!!! (bites the head off a bald eagle as the crowd roars in approval)
posted by splen at 6:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


if the breitbart crew are serious about schmearing some respectability onto this campaign, i wonder if we'll see less katrina pierson on the cable news circuit. i guess one sign of the durability of this pivot will be how much confabulated history and armchair neurological diagnosis continues to spew forth from trump talking heads.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:18 AM on August 19, 2016


I'm just flabbergasted that anyone is even for one second thinking that anything he said about minorities and "bigotry" in that speech was anything except a little pat on the head for his bigoted white supporters to let them know that they're not really racists, they're just super concerned about black-on-black violence you guys!

I mean, have you ever actually met anyone who admits they're a racist? Other than lefties who understand that you can't grow up in a racist culture without being racist yourself? My first job in high school was working at a public library and one of my co-workers was an actual Odinist white separatist. Like, he made no bones whatsoever about it, he was totally open with his beliefs. And even he would never actually say he was a racist or a bigot. No no no, you don't understand, he loves black people and he totally has black friends! He just thinks that they'd be so much better off living amongst their own kind. Just like white people are really just so much happier only living with other white people. It's just natural! It has nothing to do with racial hatred or othering! He only has the best interests of black people at heart!

So, yeah, every time Donald Trump starts to finger-wag about bigotry? I just hear that guy all over again.
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:19 AM on August 19, 2016 [46 favorites]


Trump has a new toy basically so he's focused on it. One the novelty wears off, the polls don't immediately jump up, some tweet gets under his skin, he's asked a tough question, or hell, he's asked what specifically he has regrets for or is sorry for and he says like he did before that he's sorry for nothing, it'll be Trump being true Trump again. It was one speech. If he's shown anything, it's that he can't maintain even an appearance of normality.
posted by chris24 at 6:19 AM on August 19, 2016


Trump surrogate defends Breitbart hire.

Surrogate unsurprisingly fails to defend the indefensible. Interviewer rubs guy's nose in Breitbart stench, refuses to take no answer for an answer. Journalism not yet dead.

An excerpt from a longer excerpt on DailyKos:
Joy Reid: Hold on Steve, let me get my question back in there again, because you didn’t answer my initial question. Because my question to you is who is this designed to resonate with, who is not already a Donald Trump supporter? In the primary he was running for Republican support. This was not a general election.

Steve Cortes: Right.

Joy Reid: I want to read you headlines from Breitbart.com, which you’ve tried to paint as sort of a take on all-comers website: “Phony fascist tears: Obama cries during gun control speech”, “Birth control makes women unattractive and crazy”, “Trannies whine about hilarious Bruce Jenner Billboard”, and “Bill Kristol: Republican spoiler renegade Jew”.

I want to now give you another new set of information. This is the Southern Poverty Law Center which tracks hate groups. They track White supremacist movements, and they track the Alt-Right, which is sort of the dressed-up-in-suits version of the Neo-Nazis and White supremacist movements in the U.S.—Headline, is Breitbart.com becoming a media arm for the Alt-Right? The outlet has undergone a noticeable shift toward embracing ideas on the extremist fringe of the conservative Right; racist ideas, anti-Muslim and anti-immigrant ideas—all key tenets making up an emerging racist ideology known as the Alt-Right. So I’m going to ask you that question again.

Steve Cortes: O.K.

Joy Reid: Having a guy who runs that website that’s got headlines about Trannies, renegade Jew—quote unquote Bill Kristol—birth control makes women unattractive and crazy and which is now an arm of the Alt-Right—and you and I just discussed what the Alt-Right is. How is embracing the guy who runs that—who is that designed to add to Donald Trump’s support base?
Give it all the linkjuice ya got.
posted by valetta at 6:19 AM on August 19, 2016 [76 favorites]


The President is making some missteps here. And not even complex ones, they're dumb. Now you've got Trimp landing in Louisiana and about to surely make some bs 'heartfelt' statement about the flooding. Meanwhile, Republicans bankrupted the state. And Bush's lack of response to Katrina, (and the country's response in general) was one of the times I felt the worst about America.

The good thing is that none of this is on Hillary. Flint was a disaster as well, and if Trimp said anything or did anything about that, it was likely insignificant, I don't remember it. (For the record, I'm going to call him Trimp from time to time, because that look is emblematic of what it would look like if his appearance matched his grotesque statements)

But the last thing I need right now is him trying to act like he cares about Louisiana, while trying to negatively portray the president.
posted by cashman at 6:22 AM on August 19, 2016


and they track the Alt-Right, which is a sort of the dressed-up-in-suits version of the Neo-Nazis and White supremacist movements in the U.S.

damn, son. nailed it.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:23 AM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


dude, the governor of Louisiana told Obama not to come because his security needs would pull away essential first responders. i'm sure he's pleased as punch that fuckface mcclownstick is parachuting into the middle of an ongoing disaster to score some cheap points
posted by murphy slaw at 6:27 AM on August 19, 2016 [49 favorites]


LA's gov has been pretty vocal that he doesn't want to have to deal with the logistics of a Presidential visit right now.
posted by saturday_morning at 6:27 AM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


I'm waiting for Trump to go to LA and say "Barack Obama doesn't care about black people" [fake -- SO FAR]. That's the vibe I'm getting from The Usual Suspects On Facebook.

It's really too bad that Trump is hitting his floor among minorities (i.e. zero). But it'll be interesting to see after the election how the GOP spins the fact that 95% or more of their voters are white.
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:35 AM on August 19, 2016


Yeah, Louisiana's governor doesn't seem too thrilled about Trump's visit:
"Donald Trump hasn’t called the governor to inform him of his visit," a spokesman for Edwards' office said in a statement Thursday evening. "We welcome him to LA but not for a photo-op. Instead we hope he’ll consider volunteering or making a sizable donation to the LA Flood Relief Fund to help the victims of the storm."
[source]
posted by marshmallow peep at 6:39 AM on August 19, 2016 [39 favorites]


From before the primaries, but makes a relevant point. Turns out primary debates matter way more than the generals
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:39 AM on August 19, 2016


"Instead we hope he’ll consider volunteering or making a sizable donation to the LA Flood Relief Fund to help the victims of the storm."

Or saying he'll make one and then getting someone else to pony it up. Or claiming that the raised visibility of Louisiana because of his visit counts as a donation.
posted by Etrigan at 6:44 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Instead we hope he’ll consider volunteering or making a sizable donation to the LA Flood Relief Fund to help the victims of the storm.

Trump will of course go to LA, claim he did either or both, then by the time the press catches up to the lies he'll be on to the next shitshow.

I have to say, I worry that Trump's new team will be able to play Trump's game at full bore without shame. We'll look back on the post-convention clown show with laughter but what is to come may be really terrifying -- and effective.
posted by argybarg at 6:47 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


WaPo [opinion]: Donald Trump (maybe) finally pivots! It (probably) won’t work.
One speech coming hard on a(nother) campaign shake-up then can't be — or shouldn't be — considered a pivot. It's like losing 10 pounds on the first five days of a diet. It's not about the initial weight loss. It's about sticking to the diet plan, which usually requires an extended commitment to changing your lifestyle. That's how success is judged.

Then there's the fact that Trump is not only badly behind in most key swing state polling but also has an image problem that makes Clinton's issues seem like small potatoes.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:49 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


If Bannon manages to get Trump in line when no one else could then he's terrifying; the Bloomberg piece described him as a smarter version of Trump, and I can already see why. From what I know of Breitbart, if he is handed any semblance of power he'd tear our country apart at the seems -perhaps even more so than the candidate he's campaigning for.

Hoping this speech was a one-off.
posted by CottonCandyCapers at 6:54 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I wish some reporter would ask Katrina Pierson to define "dysphasia."

Also she said "Maneurism" for "mannerism" and no one noticed.
posted by spitbull at 6:57 AM on August 19, 2016


MinnPost [fact]: Trump's Minneapolis fundraiser: long on security, short on Republican politicians
Security for the GOP presidential candidate is of such high concern that it forced the Trump campaign to cancel a public rally and to relocate the fundraiser from the Minneapolis Club to the convention center.
Convention center has more exit points, less likely to be literally besieged by protestors.
posted by ZeusHumms at 6:58 AM on August 19, 2016


After Trump attempted to seem normal last night, I feel like when he speaks these next few days he will resemble the 'The Bug' character from Men in Black. Barely holding it together, looking and feeling odd and strange, and clearly appearing uncomfortable. All of his disgustingness bursting at the seams of his suits. From time to time he will unwittingly let some diseased statements crawl out from as he lurches from place to place across the country trying to complete his mission.

Closer to the election, his campaign, surrogates and staff will probably drop any pretense and emerge as a towering pile of hate, intent on ruining everything we have in the world. If the film is any indication he will be close to succeeding but at a pivotal moment will be unable to resist getting baited into defending some gross statement he made, and that's when he'll get destroyed.
posted by cashman at 6:59 AM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]




Well that explains the campaign shakeup. Sounds like he's going to be dealing with the cops and/or lawyers pretty soon.
posted by zombieflanders at 7:01 AM on August 19, 2016


Also she said "Maneurism" for "mannerism" and no one noticed.

That is too perfect. I'm going to use that one the next time some guy freaks the hell out about some issue that he swears threatens his masculinity. Like people who freak out and won't let their sons touch anything pink.
posted by cashman at 7:01 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Robert Costa reports that Manafort has resigned.

The timing is fantastic.
posted by cashman at 7:02 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Robert Costa reports that Manafort has resigned.

Damn, son.

Provided we don't all starve in a nuclear winter, the books resulting from all this are going to be fascinating in about 3 years.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:03 AM on August 19, 2016 [22 favorites]


Trump only hires the best people.
posted by PenDevil at 7:05 AM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


SCOOP: A close friend of Manafort tells me he has resigned.

"Just keep my name out of it." -- Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing
posted by leotrotsky at 7:05 AM on August 19, 2016 [39 favorites]


As @lyndynn put it, "I believe it's customary to tender formal resignation before fleeing the country."
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:07 AM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


>"Just keep my name out of it." -- Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing

Obviously, since the Archlich cannot be truly "named" as we understand the convention.
posted by Tevin at 7:08 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


So the press' ridiculous fawning about Trump's pivot is going to be run over by stories and questions about the sudden resignation of his Russia-connected campaign manager. The Keystone Kampaign can really ruin even the biggest, best gift.
posted by chris24 at 7:08 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


The scoop isn't that he resigned, it's that he has a friend.
posted by um at 7:09 AM on August 19, 2016 [53 favorites]


Vox [opinion]: Donald Trump’s latest pivot is a reminder that he’s a media celebrity, not a businessman
[The pivot] comes as a reminder of a fundamental truth of this campaign: Trump isn’t really a businessman in the conventional sense anymore, and hasn’t been for some time. He’s a television star.

...

Trump really was a businessman for a while, a real estate developer and then a casino mogul, but he was bad at it. He inherited a real estate empire from his father and drove it into bankruptcy. He walked away from the experience with fame. Fame that he was able to leverage, over time, into more fame that he leveraged into more money. It was clever, but it was ultimately savvy media work more than savvy business dealings.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:14 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump, showing an athleticism his staff had never seen, races down the steps of Trump tower, four, five, six steps at a time, shoving staff out of the way, sending papers flying. Outside Manafort is about to get into his taxi, finally realizing that dealing with the Russians and Ukraine is far more desirable than the human Cheeto.

Trump finally catches up to the car as Manafort rolls down the window.

"Don, I told you, I resign."
"You can't resign," Trump says, giving it a beat for dramatic effect, "You're FIRED!"

Trump looks around, waiting for the teeming masses to start applauding. [fake]
posted by splen at 7:15 AM on August 19, 2016 [27 favorites]


Joy Reid: Having a guy who runs that website that’s got headlines about Trannies, renegade Jew—quote unquote Bill Kristol—birth control makes women unattractive and crazy and which is now an arm of the Alt-Right—and you and I just discussed what the Alt-Right is. How is embracing the guy who runs that—who is that designed to add to Donald Trump’s support base?

I think I've said this before, but really, Joy Reid needs to replace Chris Matthews. For all of the "hardball" he thinks he plays, he just basically does loud stream-of-consciousness blathering. She, on the other hand, actually plays hardball.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [41 favorites]


Trump wasn't Trump tonight. He was a megaphone spouting off Breitbart copy. It was organized and structured. Nuanced. That's terrible news.

Eh, give him a couple days to get distracted.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:19 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Manafort has resigned.

AHAHAHAH I can't even think of a popcorn joke to make that has not already been made. Need to move on to the harder stuff.

Bring me my Jujubes! A 200-ounce vat of Diet Coke, also, please.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


The Manafart has been expelled, but the stench remains hanging in the air...
posted by Devonian at 7:23 AM on August 19, 2016


Manafort resigning has just been confirmed

And I agree. Give Trump a little time to get bored of this and he'll be back to his old self.
posted by Francis at 7:23 AM on August 19, 2016


Would this be the appropriate venue to talk about the time yesterday where my four-year-old turned to me and announced "Mommy, you're fired."

The look on my face was quite literally ಠ___ಠ

I even mute the radio in the car when there's a Trump soundbite on, so he doesn't hear it (also so I don't have to hear it). I have no idea where he got that.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:24 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


SCOOP: A close friend of Manafort tells me he has resigned.

It's official. Donald J. Trump Statement
This morning Paul Manafort offered, and I accepted, his resignation from the campaign. I am very appreciative for his great work in helping to get us where we are today, and in particular his work guiding us through the delegate and convention process. Paul is a– Donald J. Trump
Link goes to Boston Globe
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 7:25 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


marshmallow peep: Instead we hope he’ll consider volunteering or making a sizable donation to the LA Flood Relief Fund to help the victims of the storm

And if he says he'll donate, make sure the check clears before you agree on any press coverage for the "act of generosity."


> Trump wasn't Trump tonight. He was a megaphone spouting off Breitbart copy. It was organized and structured. Nuanced. That's terrible news.

> Eh, give him a couple days to get distracted.

Or just give him his phone back, and "accidentally" give it to him with a photo of someone looking uncomfortable by one of those new statues.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:25 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Gah, listening to Diane rhemes show, and the media personalities are all "baton rouge is Obama's Katrina for not showing up on the ground", despite the fact that the Gov has asked him not to come right now. There also talking about how great the brietbart additions to the Papayas staff are. NPR, it's like I don't even know you anymore.

Edit to add, now they're going off on the Hillary email thing about how it shows she can't be trusted.
posted by SecretAgentSockpuppet at 7:26 AM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


Would this be the appropriate venue to talk about the time yesterday where my four-year-old turned to me and announced "Mommy, you're fired."

The look on my face was quite literally ಠ___ಠ

I even mute the radio in the car when there's a Trump soundbite on, so he doesn't hear it (also so I don't have to hear it). I have no idea where he got that.


Kids, like real sponges, absorb things both wonderful and toxic.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:26 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


The New Yorker : What Are Donald Trump, Roger Ailes, and Steve Bannon Really Up To?

Speculates on the probability of a TBN (Trump Breitbart News) network to rival and out-Fox Fox.
posted by valetta at 7:27 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


SecretAgentSockpuppet: NPR, it's like I don't even know you anymore.

Whenever I get pissed off at NPR's coverage of politics, I take solace in their more diverse coverage of the rest of the world, which is completely missing from other US-based news feeds.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:28 AM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


Anyone else remember when getting Manafort on board was supposed to be this massive coup for the Trump campaign?
posted by kyrademon at 7:30 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Gah, listening to Diane rhemes show, and the media personalities are all "baton rouge is Obama's Katrina for not showing up on the ground", despite the fact that the Gov has asked him not to come right now.

The coverage I'm hearing today on NPR's Morning Edition is less blamey and less emotionally manipulative than the comments from the DR show, BUT I have not yet heard them mention that the governor asked the president not to show up and pull away first responder resources. I only heard that here.
posted by puddledork at 7:31 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


valetta: Speculates on the probability of a TBN (Trump Breitbart News) network to rival and out-Fox Fox.

I wonder what would happen if they flank Fox and go farther/ alt'r right - would Fox try to pull that way, or pitch itself as the "centered" conservative network? And if Fox pulls harder right, would it tug the rest that way? Which way will the Overton window shift?
posted by filthy light thief at 7:31 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Remember when Manafort was the most craven member of his staff? These folks make Lee Atwater look like Aldai Stevenson (shout out to 2 straight weeks of pbs docs)
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:33 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Nate Silver on Twitter: Not surprising given the recent news: you might even say it was MANAFORT'S DESTINY.
posted by waitingtoderail at 7:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [56 favorites]


Which way will the Overton window shift?

At this point I think it's safe to say that the Overton window is fully broken and is lying in a million pieces in the Overton front yard.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [43 favorites]


Weeping_angel: "When he says "We are going to work closely with African-American parents and students in the inner cities – and what a big difference that will make. This means a lot to me, and it is going to be a top priority in a Trump Administration.", did anyone else feel a little ominous? And maybe threatened?"

It's funny, when so much of Trump's message about education is that the federal government should be hands-off. Hands-off for white people, I guess.
posted by roll truck roll at 7:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Which way will the Overton window shift?

Trick question. The Overton window will transform into a different architectural feature entirely, like the Overton gable, or maybe the Overton crawlspace.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:35 AM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


Kinda terrified after reading Jared Yates Sexton's tweets from the rally last night. A major presidential campaign that fosters and thrives on pure hate at its core while simultaneously trying to humanize it for a wider audience just wigs me the hell out.

But I choose to stay positive. Hillary is disciplined and used to playing the game at a harder difficulty setting. She has an organized and capable campaign that has a lead on the ground. Trump handing the reigns to a white supremacist dirtbag is only going to make them work harder.

I don't care how many emails I get asking for money between now and November, I'll give what I can. Raise those dollars, knock those doors, get people to the polls. Let's get a win that unequivocally removes appeal-to-fascism from the playbook for future candidates.

In the mean time I just hope that no one gets hurt by the white hot hate ball of hate that the RNC has shackled itself to out of desperation.
posted by strange chain at 7:35 AM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


Nate Silver needs a vacation he's like a nba beat writer during the finals right now.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:37 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


would Fox try to pull that way

That depends on the size and demographic of the audience Fox is looking for, and whether it thinks it's worth competing with (what one would assume is) the alt-right heavy putative (or Putin-ative) TBN and splitting that sizeable and not impoverished but diminishing population would be better than going for a broader yet less rabid church.

What may make a difference is if outside funding sources subsidise operations, in other words whether either or both are seen as worth supporting by special interest groups with big pockets.

(Personally, I'd expect a period of competition for that audience followed by a merger/takeover, but where Murdoch will be on that is unknowable at the moment.)
posted by Devonian at 7:39 AM on August 19, 2016


would Fox try to pull that way, or pitch itself as the "centered" conservative network?

Towards the end of that New Yorker article Bannon is quoted complaining about the Murdoch sons, implying Fox is going soft under their management. So maybe.
posted by valetta at 7:39 AM on August 19, 2016


At this point I think it's safe to say that the Overton window is fully broken and is lying in a million pieces in the Overton front yard.

The Overton family is standing dead eyed around the house each staring out a different portal. The dog is crying black blood. Baby Overton is floating up the attic stairs, babbling in an unknown tongue.
posted by Potomac Avenue at 7:40 AM on August 19, 2016 [48 favorites]


Joy Reid needs to replace Chris Matthews

She makes him look like the addled punter he has always been, just one step over to the respectable side of an apologist for white supremacy and patriarchy (which he disguises as his fake familiarity with white working-class shop floor culuture, like he has ever held a manual labor job in his life).

Reid is amazing. Truly showing her colleagues how journalism gets done and working insane hours doing it (likewise I think for Katy Tur, who has risen in my estimation by the day in recent weeks -- she and Robert Costa are the only TV people following Trump with any sense of duty).

But of course Reid will remain a token diversity face until they dump her after the election with a single weekend show at an unwatched hour, prime time MSNBC will remain all white and mostly male, and Mathews will continue his nightly exercises in bloviating, overtalking, mansplaining bullshit from a 1970s point of view.

Frankly I think Reid also cruises right past Rachel Maddow, Chris Hayes, and Lawrence O'Donnell too in talent and journalistic smarts and camera charisma alike. Those folks are alright, but gee, what is it they all have in common that Joy Reid disrupts? Because she would run circles around all of them as an anchor in prime time.

Oh right. Her hair. That must be it.
posted by spitbull at 7:41 AM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


In the mean time I just hope that no one gets hurt by the white hot hate ball of hate that the RNC has shackled itself to out of desperation.

It's too late to hope for that, people have already been hurt and even killed. At this point we just have to hope that the body count from peri-election violence stays in single digits.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:41 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Resigned? Breitbart's cuckoos pushed him out of the nest, more like.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 7:42 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


NYT headlines this: Embattled Chief Leaves Trump Campaign Days After Shake-Up.

Follows with: G.O.P. Worries Falling Trump Tide Will Lower All Boats.

Well, I never thought I'd stoop to this, but it sure sounds like good news for John McCain.
posted by RedOrGreen at 7:43 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


At this point I think it's safe to say that the Overton window is fully broken and is lying in a million pieces in the Overton front yard.

Overton crime rates go up.
posted by ZeusHumms at 7:44 AM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


It's like the story of the scorpion and the frog, if there were an infinite number of scorpions, and scorpions always turned into frogs.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:45 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


At this point I think it's safe to say that the Overton window is fully broken and is lying in a million pieces in the Overton front yard.

That would indicate the window was broken from inside the house.

Which may well be true; I am actually getting into the weeds with this particular metaphor.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 7:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


In looking for a timeline to chart when Donnie's campaign hired and fired various key members, I haven't found one handy link, but a ton of different stories from the past months: Has there ever been such a tumultuous presidential campaign in terms of top staff turn-overs?
posted by filthy light thief at 7:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


I am actually getting into the weeds with this particular metaphor.

Watch out for the broken glass.
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:52 AM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


Trump looks around, waiting for the teeming masses to start applauding. [fake]

"IT'S STILL REAL TO ME DAMMIT!".jpg
posted by Celsius1414 at 7:52 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Frankly I think Reid also cruises right past Rachel Maddow, Chris Hayes, and Lawrence O'Donnell too in talent and journalistic smarts and camera charisma alike.

I agree. Rachel Maddow is doing a different job than Joy Reid. Maddow's changed up traditional journalism and takes current events and dives deep, but she's never confrontational and that is a shame. Chris Hayes has great guests, but he's not clapping back either. Honestly, I've never watched Lawrence O'Donnell.
posted by Sophie1 at 7:53 AM on August 19, 2016


REHM her name is DIANE REHM
posted by tivalasvegas at 7:53 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


the Overton window is fully broken

see, this is why we need more police
posted by thelonius at 7:53 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think you mean Rehm.

Oh right, that's what you wrote. Huh.
posted by filthy light thief at 7:55 AM on August 19, 2016


Has there ever been such a tumultuous presidential campaign in terms of top staff turn-overs?

It seems like what he's doing is hiring people who want to help him do nefarious things. But when they express a clear opinion that conflicts with his on how to effectively accomplish those nefarious things, they get fired for disagreeing with the boss.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:01 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I follow and enjoy John Gruber's writing at Daring Fireball. He rarely offers non-tech commentary, but he's offered up this longer piece today: Is Donald Trump Actually Trying to Win?

Same arguments that have been hashed out in great detail on this very thread (and -100 points for re-linking that Michael Moore piece - seriously?) but his bottom line is that Trump is many things - "reprehensible, bigoted, reckless, obnoxious, selfish, incurious" - but not stupid. So:

"What if Trump’s goal, now that he’s the Republican nominee, remains the same as it was a year ago when he announced his candidacy? Not to become president, but to be on TV and make a lot of money doing it. ... The idea that there is sufficient demand for a media outlet to the right of Fox News is extraordinary, but Trump’s sizable minority of supporters suggests that there might be."

It's ... not a bad piece. And while the implications for the election are good, the implications for the future of the country are frankly terrifying.
posted by RedOrGreen at 8:02 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Paul is a– Donald J. Trump

This must be Trimp's highest compliment. Let Paul Manafort be remembered as that guy who was a real Donald J. Trump.
posted by Excommunicated Cardinal at 8:04 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Counterpoint to the Gruber piece and other 'Trump wants to lose' articles; Donald Trump Is a Terrible Politician

"But to this day, as Trump is losing to Hillary Clinton in every poll, it is still commonly suggested that Trump has mysterious political powers. No matter what he says, his supporters love it! If he’s losing, it might be because he’s “deliberately trying to avoid winning.”

I would like to propose an alternate hypothesis: Donald Trump is bad at politics. He won the Republican primary because he is a bad politician, he is losing today because he is a bad politician, and part of what makes him a bad politician is only doing the kinds of things his supporters love, which can appear to be good politics to incurious journalists, but is actually not."
posted by chris24 at 8:06 AM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


> "Has there ever been such a tumultuous presidential campaign in terms of top staff turn-overs?"

I'm just spitballing here, but could it be possible that someone whose catchphrase is "You're Fired!" is not actually the best person to put in charge of other people?
posted by kyrademon at 8:07 AM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]






Oh dear, if only Obama had gone to Baton Rouge Hillary could win Louisiana?

Lol. At least the democratic governor seems competent, for a change in Louisiana politics.
posted by spitbull at 8:12 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Cracking down on Deez Nutz

I see what you did there!

Someone had to say it.
posted by spitbull at 8:14 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Bannon won't last past October. The emotional labor necessary to wrangle Trump is beyond any mortal ego.
posted by klarck at 8:15 AM on August 19, 2016


Well we have always known that the biggest problem is that Donald Trump has been running as a racist sexist who doesn't take money from the rich and powerful but in order to get elected he has to appeal to other races and women, and take money from the rich and powerful. So you can go by the premise that he never wanted to win (otherwise he would not have run with such a narrow viewpoint) or he is a bad politician (he doesn't know how to appeal to a broader electorate.) Take your pick.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:15 AM on August 19, 2016


Honestly, I've never watched Lawrence O'Donnell.

Stay up past Maddow and give him a chance. O'Donnell is very much in the no bullshit camp and has a background both as a high level political aide and a writer/producer on the West Wing.
posted by nathan_teske at 8:16 AM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


Federal Election Commission is cracking down on Deez Nuts.

That's about all they're capable of doing. Meanwhile Trump is still soliciting illegal foreign contributions daily.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Rachel Maddow is doing a different job than Joy Reid.

Yes, unfortunately they seem to have put her in charge of the department of redundancy and repetition department.

Does it drive anyone else crazy that it takes her 20 minutes to make a simple point every single night?
posted by spitbull at 8:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


Ukrainians saw Paul Manafort's political impact up close – and it wasn't pretty

Also, Larry King got $225,000 to interview Viktor Yanukovych's PM, says Ukraine politician
posted by Mister Bijou at 8:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Yeah, O'Donnell is a better watch than Maddow at this point.
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 8:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


“The Commission has authorized staff to send verification letters to filers listing fictional characters, obscene language, sexual references, celebrities (where this is no indication that the named celebrity submitted the filing), animals, or similarly implausible entities as the name or contact information of the candidate or committee,” the agency said in a statement Thursday.

There's only one thing to do - someone's going to have to get a legal name change to "Deez Nuts." He or she will be remembered as a true patriot many years hence.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:19 AM on August 19, 2016


Larry King story lede buried: On Russia Today!
posted by spitbull at 8:19 AM on August 19, 2016


Federal Election Commission is cracking down on Deez Nuts.

From the Hill
The Federal Election Commission (FEC) says it will no longer tolerate “unlawfully false or fictitious” political candidates like 'Deez Nuts.'

“The Commission has authorized staff to send verification letters to filers listing fictional characters, obscene language, sexual references, celebrities (where this is no indication that the named celebrity submitted the filing), animals, or similarly implausible entities as the name or contact information of the candidate or committee,” the agency said in a statement Thursday.
Awww. They want to make politics more boring.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:19 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Federal Election Commission is cracking down on Deez Nuts.

Before we can get a handle on out of control campaign financing, we've first got to take care of Deez Nuts.
posted by dis_integration at 8:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Awww. They want to make politics more boring.

As badly overplayed as the joke is, Deez Nuts ARE boring.

...

DAMNIT!
posted by Celsius1414 at 8:22 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Before we can get a handle on out of control campaign financing, we've first got to take care of Deez Nuts.

Or at least cup them.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 8:22 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]



Rachel Maddow is doing a different job than Joy Reid.

Yes, unfortunately they seem to have put her in charge of the department of redundancy and repetition department.

Does it drive anyone else crazy that it takes her 20 minutes to make a simple point every single night?


That is exactly why I stopped watching. She repeats things over and over with pauses in between and it drives me crazy. I was a huge fan but I've stopped watching because of that and because I hardly ever learn anything new.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 8:22 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


How big could a potential Trump/Breitbart TV channel be? It's not going to match the success of Fox News -- that medium has sailed, and its audience won't be around much longer. Younger conservatives are already getting their news online. So that leaves a somewhat larger, better funded version of breitbart.com. It'll be more visible, which is bad news, but it won't be the juggernaut that Fox was able to become when it first launched.
posted by PlusDistance at 8:24 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


How big could a potential Trump/Breitbart TV channel be?

To be fair, Trump isn't known for running successful businesses.
posted by Roommate at 8:28 AM on August 19, 2016 [40 favorites]


The Commission has authorized staff to send verification letters to filers listing fictional characters

Gentlemen -- Enclosed please find our completed verification forms for the "Deez Nuts for America Committee" ballot entry. I think the attached photocopies will fill in the remaining details your looking for

Yours, etc.
posted by PlusDistance at 8:30 AM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


The Federal Election Commission (FEC) says it will no longer tolerate “unlawfully false or fictitious” political candidates like 'Deez Nuts.'

When I lived in NJ, there was a guy who kept running for governor under the name NJWEEDMAN. In Jersey, you get a mailer with statements from all gubernatorial candidates. His basically boiled down to the idea that his rights were being violated because they weren't letting him run as "NJWEEDMAN.COM"

He still would've been better than Christie.
posted by Ragged Richard at 8:32 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


How big could a potential Trump/Breitbart TV channel be?

It wouldn't just be a TV channel, though: the Master Of Twitter must remain, and *also* branch out to other venues: a Racist Uncle Instagram account here, maybe a Smash The Unions LiveJournal there, and of course a YouTube channel full of rubbish for his superfans to comment upon.
posted by wenestvedt at 8:32 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


but his bottom line is that Trump is many things - "reprehensible, bigoted, reckless, obnoxious, selfish, incurious" - but not stupid.
[emphasis mine]

I... would like to see much much more evidence of this assertion.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:33 AM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Seen elsewhere: only Team Trump could manage to screw up a Friday afternoon news dump in August.
posted by spitbull at 8:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


My guess is the person responsible for the Trump "pivot" (really just one craptacular but less-than-insane speech) isn't Bannon, but Kellyanne Conway. If you rise far enough in the corporate world as a woman, you learn how to work with/around egotistical childish men who need every decision to feel like it was their idea and every outcome to feel like they just won the Super Bowl. The fact that she made it so high in the campaign suggests she has the rare ability to work successfully with Trump. Who's the sole remaining high-up campaign figure who's been on the Trump Train since Day 1 and is not related to Donald? Hope Hicks, another woman with this skill.
posted by sallybrown at 8:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [42 favorites]


p.s. The NYT article on Manafort's departure suggests Jared Kushner pushed him out because of the Russia revelations.
posted by sallybrown at 8:35 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Jared Kushner seems like he's the entirety of the Trump Campaign HR department.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:39 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I suspect there must be some cognitive dissonance (or worse) on the anti-Semitic alt right over the central role of the Kushners in the Trump campaign. Hmm.
posted by spitbull at 8:39 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Is Trump stupid? Intelligent? Don't know, don't care because it's irrelevant. Trump is one thing only: Shameless. He operates without limits, without the constraints of civil society, without the self-limitations that plague most people. To many people his expressions of infantile ego are exciting to watch, and some who are excited are also in favor.

There is no other salient characteristics of Donald Trump. Even his racism and sexism are secondary expressions of his massive fleshy boundless acquisitive drive. Guessing about anything else is a waste of time.
posted by argybarg at 8:46 AM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


I'm pretty sure Jared is the one guy desperately trying to bail water out of the SS Trump and meanwhile the captain is drilling holes into the hull of the ship.

At what point in time do Jared and Ivanka realize that they need to cut bait in regards to Donald or else the failure of the Trump brand could undermine the creation of a Ivanka brand?
posted by vuron at 8:46 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


San Francisco is fighting to keep the statue. I'm looking for a clip of the interview with the rep from Lefty O'Doul's, which said something like "so, there's this pathetic naked guy stuck in the Castro, obviously lost and alone... of course we would welcome him! Everyone is welcome here!" (paraphrase)
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 8:47 AM on August 19, 2016 [30 favorites]


I suspect there must be some cognitive dissonance (or worse) on the anti-Semitic alt right over the central role of the Kushners in the Trump campaign.

"Well, he's one of the good ones."
posted by Etrigan at 8:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


It's pretty weird that Manafort leaving is being positioned (in various articles I've seen) as happening because of his role being reduced in the latest Trump re-org. That feels at best backwards; I feel pretty safe saying that his becoming an increasing liability (due to the revelations about his actions with respects to Russia and Ukraine) is what led to the re-org, and his reduced role, and now his "resignation".
posted by tocts at 8:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Federal Election Commission is cracking down on Deez Nuts.

If 2016 has taught us anything, it's that we're not living in Orwell or Huxley's dystopian future. We're living in Robert Anton Wilson's.
posted by Mayor West at 8:49 AM on August 19, 2016 [36 favorites]


From politico.com: GOP Insiders: Trump's Overhaul Won't Succeed.
posted by bearwife at 8:50 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Donald Trump’s first general election ad is a good Republican primary ad:
The focus is unsubtle: Immigrants, including ones from Syria, are coming into the United States and putting Americans at risk. It's a through-line for Trump's campaign, looping in his campaign-launch comments about Mexican immigrants and his December announcement about barring Muslims from coming to the U.S. The descriptor is itself very Trumpian. The "system" is "rigged against Americans."

But to whom is this meant to appeal?

Trump launched his general election campaign at the Republican convention by declaring himself the "law and order" candidate. He focused on the themes above -- immigrants, crime, terror -- as reasons that he should be allowed to move to Washington.

Those themes mostly appeal to Republicans.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:52 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Likewise some cognitive dissonance for Jared Kushner, whose Jewish faith seems deeply important and cherished to him. That New Yorker piece this week made me think he's only committed to this because it's so important to Ivanka (although there were light shades of a bro-esque "the PC police are out of control lately"). The way he was described was as someone who cares most about his faith and his family - an obedient husband who lives his faith every day. Thus why he only felt compelled to speak publicly when his employee called him out as supporting anti-Semitism. I don't think Ivanka will ever crack, but if she did, Jared would follow. The problem is, Ivanka's central motivation seems to be a devotion to her father and a constant seeking of his approval (familiar to anyone with a distant, mercurial, narcissist parent).
posted by sallybrown at 8:53 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


No, Romney’s Campaign Is Not Doomed [real, Sept. 2012]
posted by Horace Rumpole at 8:53 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


If 2016 has taught us anything, it's that we're not living in Orwell or Huxley's dystopian future. We're living in Robert Anton Wilson's.

TRUMP 2016: MAKE THE ESCHATON GREAT AGAIN
posted by Celsius1414 at 8:54 AM on August 19, 2016 [16 favorites]


TRUMP 2016: IMMANENTIZE IT
posted by Mayor West at 8:56 AM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


And similar to Kirkaracha's link: Donald Trump’s first ad shows there is no pivot and never will be

"It’s a pretty simple proposition — Hillary Clinton will let foreigners kill you and Donald Trump won’t."
posted by chris24 at 8:57 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


At what point in time do Jared and Ivanka realize that they need to cut bait in regards to Donald or else the failure of the Trump brand could undermine the creation of a Ivanka brand?

I suspect the campaign is already tanking Ivanka Trump's brand value. Her businesses are Trump-branded also, and she's been able to free ride on widespread consumer awareness of the Trump name. (I had a pair of really cute Ivanka Trump shoes a few years back.) Her fortunes are tied to what her last name evokes in consumers.
posted by sallybrown at 8:58 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


REHM her name is DIANE REHM

...and she's terrible. I'm not just talking about the antisemitism thing with Bernie. For someone striving to host a 'serious' discussion, she is just clueless (and humorless) most of the time. She's neither particularly thoughtful or perceptive, and squanders what could be an intelligent take on contemporary events.

I mean, Terri Gross will spend 15 minutes rooting around with rusty spoon in your childhood trauma for her own perverse fascination when you're just trying to pitch an album, but at least she elucidates something interesting.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:58 AM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


ErisLordFreedom: San Francisco is fighting to keep the statue.

From that article:
An American activist collective called Indecline took responsibility for the statue, which is similar to others that went up today in Seattle, Los Angeles, New York and Cleveland.

Indecline released a statement saying the project started in April and was completed Aug. 10 in an undisclosed location on the West Coast by a Cleveland artist and sculptor known as Ginger. Ginger works exclusively in the horror genre.
Emphasis mine.
posted by filthy light thief at 8:59 AM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


TRUMP 2016: MAKE THE ESCHATON GREAT AGAIN

TRUMP 2016: IMMANENTIZE IT


Like anyone in the Trump campaign could spell either of those words.
posted by leotrotsky at 8:59 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


From politico.com: GOP Insiders: Trump's Overhaul Won't Succeed.

That article had a state-focused ad for NM Together, which lays out how our Governor failed to bring jobs and threw money at out-of-state companies, and identifies the Democratic candidates in the upcoming election. Very well done.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:01 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


sallybrown -- I really took the opposite impression from that piece, oddly. The faith and family schtick came across to me as a cover story for a man who comes from a deeply poltical family dynasty with really serious faith in being able to work corrupt levers of power to get rich and become aristocracy. The ethnic politics of this are interesting and complex and the dynastic alliance with Trump seems to me to be strategic on both sides. I don't believe Ivanka and Jared's relationship is just the sweet love story we have been fed, any more than anything else in Trumplandia is ever what it is presented to be.

Real estate profiteering is not respectable until it is harnessed to poltical power and a morally specious cover story about development as progress. Christie being neck deep in this same history is telling too.
posted by spitbull at 9:01 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


I suspect the campaign is already tanking Ivanka Trump's brand value. Her businesses are Trump-branded also, and she's been able to free ride on widespread consumer awareness of the Trump name. (I had a pair of really cute Ivanka Trump shoes a few years back.) Her fortunes are tied to what her last name evokes in consumers.
Oh absolutely. I've been extremely close to buying her shoes several times, ultimately deciding to go with a different pair. But I think I'm squarely in the middle of her intended market, women who need "professional", mid-priced shots for work and I'm definitely going to look for other options now.
posted by peacheater at 9:02 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Indeed, I have come to wonder if Trump's *primary* interest in being president is converting the family brand to "dynastic" aristocratic status.

Joe Kennedy was a mobster. Never forget.
posted by spitbull at 9:03 AM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


GUYS
on a philly bus there was a giant ad that reads
"Our next president will not be elected" #abc #survivor
WHY
ABC DO YOU REALIZE YOU ARE PARROTING THE TALKING POINT OF AN EXISTENTIAL THREAT TO HUMANITY
posted by angrycat at 9:04 AM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]


No one gets truly rich selling shoes and jewelry. Ivanka's brand is a plaything. A magician's trick to hide the card of real estate money.

Also the inheritance tax issue is inside the Trojan horse of Trump's populism. If he's worth what he says he can make a cool 4 billion for his kids with that move.

Ivanka's shoes will never be worth 4 billion.
posted by spitbull at 9:07 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


angrycat...

That is unbelievably fucked.
posted by defenestration at 9:09 AM on August 19, 2016


This isn't Trump related but w/e
Illinois Comptroller Leslie Geissler Munger likes to suggest her Democratic challenger, Chicago City Clerk Susana Mendoza, can't do math.

But when it comes to middle school multiplication, it's Republican Munger who might need some practice.

Chicago Inc. quizzed both candidates for the comptroller's office, charged with paying the state's bills, on their multiplication tables at the State Fair this week after Munger gave two stump speeches in which she got laughs by suggesting that as a former state representative, Mendoza shares blame for the state's terrible financial situation. "What's her deal?" Munger asked of her rival for the role of the state's chief fiscal officer. "Maybe she's not so good at math!"

The final scores in our off-the-cuff oral exam, though, told a different story: Munger, 33 percent; Mendoza, 100 percent.

Munger's impromptu exam, given to her on camera moments after she stepped off stage at Gov. Bruce Rauner's rally Wednesday, started confidently, with her boasting "my math is good — I have a master's in business" and pointing to her experience managing an $800 million company.

Then the math started, and things started going wrong.

Asked what eight times seven was, Munger shot back "Eight sevens is 72," before correcting herself, "no, 56."

Things got worse when the comptroller was asked what nine threes are: "53," she answered. "No. Nine threes? Why are you doing this to me?"
posted by DynamiteToast at 9:11 AM on August 19, 2016 [42 favorites]


"Our next president will not be elected" #abc #survivor

This is a tin-eared teaser for a new Keifer Sutherland vehicle for the '24' political-eschaton-fantasist crowd.

ABC’s ‘Designated Survivor’: Rejoice! It’s Kiefer!
Buyers adore the former '24' star and think this drama will succeed

Plot summary
During every State of the Union address or presidential inauguration, one member of the Cabinet is chosen to stay at an undisclosed location far from the hoopla. Should something happen to the president, vice president and rest of the line of succession, this “designated survivor” will become president.

Tom Kirkman (Kiefer Sutherland) is the Secretary of Housing and Urban Development, whose life turns upside down when he becomes the designated survivor following a terrorist attack.

He has doubts about his ability to lead – in fact, it turns out he may have been fired right before the attack occurred. And many in his new staff have doubts, too.

But it turns out he has no choice, since the terrorist attack may just be the start of an assault on the nation.

posted by snuffleupagus at 9:11 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


filthy light thief: From politico.com: GOP Insiders: Trump's Overhaul Won't Succeed. That article had a state-focused ad for NM Together, which lays out how our Governor failed to bring jobs and threw money at out-of-state companies, and identifies the Democratic candidates in the upcoming election. Very well done.

For me it's full of "Aspire to Greatness" ads exhorting me to join the Trump team. Which is pretty hilarious, in context.

I've mentioned before, in another mammoth thread, that my favorite black patent leather pumps are Ivanka Trump branded. I'm hoping for selective amnesia so I can continue wearing them this F/W season.
posted by Superplin at 9:12 AM on August 19, 2016


There was a picture of the flag and everything. I annoyed the bus driver because I forgot I needed to get on the bus I was so gobsmacked
posted by angrycat at 9:12 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hell yeah that's brilliant. Math and vocabulary and geography tests for everyone running for office. Screw debates and press conferences!
posted by spitbull at 9:13 AM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Hitler Finds Out Trump is Losing Every Poll

Indeed, I have come to wonder if Trump's *primary* interest in being president is converting the family brand to "dynastic" aristocratic status.

“that we’ll be like one of those old-money California families where no one remembers where the fortune came from.”
posted by the man of twists and turns at 9:13 AM on August 19, 2016


538's take: Trump is doubling down on a losing strategy.
posted by bearwife at 9:16 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


The worst part is 53 is prime
posted by DynamiteToast at 9:16 AM on August 19, 2016 [45 favorites]


I don't believe Ivanka and Jared's relationship is just the sweet love story we have been fed, any more than anything else in Trumplandia is ever what it is presented to be.

I see no reason to doubt that. They broke up over religious differences, and she ultimately converted. That doesn't strike me as a cynical cover.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:16 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


No one gets truly rich selling shoes and jewelry.

If you start with strong brand awareness and license right, you can make billions in the retail sector.

Ivanka's retail brand includes shoes, jewelry, clothing, accessories, and handbags, some of which is specifically geared to working women.
posted by sallybrown at 9:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


my favorite black patent leather pumps are Ivanka Trump

I have TWO pairs. They are comfy, elegant looking shoes. I'm fine buying her shoes. I'm only boycotting the orange fuehrer (anyone else notice he seems to have a new more blond/gray mop as of yesterday?) and his business enterprises.
posted by bearwife at 9:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


So just to recap, Trump, who built his brand on publicly firing people on his TV show for making small mistakes while doing tasks they aren't good at, has yet to fire anybody on his actual campaign staff for making gigantic mistakes like being an unregistered Russian agent or plagiarizing a speech, instead allowing them to resign or even just stay in place?
posted by zachlipton at 9:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


A pollster with (as far as I can tell) no history before this month is being touted by right-wing Twitter for a poll that shows Trump up six. I'm going to guess based on the very little information available that this is not simply a bad pollster but a straight-up disinformation campaign from Trump or his allies.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 9:20 AM on August 19, 2016


They broke up over religious differences, and she ultimately converted. I did not know this. Are you telling me that their relationship is a Sex and the City plotline?
posted by like_neon at 9:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


The worst part of 53 is the proctology exam.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 9:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Trump refused Meredith's resignation, but accepted Manafort's!
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:21 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


538's take: Trump is doubling down on a losing strategy.

-- Trump is helped by the fact that Hillary Clinton might be the second-most-unpopular nominee ever, after Trump

Emphasis via link, theirs - it made me think of our experience shopping for engagement rings. The jeweler tried to warn us away from sapphires because they're not the hardest stone. "What's harder than sapphires?" we asked, knowing the answer. "Uh, diamonds."
posted by filthy light thief at 9:22 AM on August 19, 2016


making gigantic mistakes like ... plagiarizing a speech, instead allowing them to resign or even just stay in place?

Meredith knows where all the bodies are buried. She stays.
posted by yhbc at 9:22 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


she ultimately converted.

Meh, I'm sure Eleanor of Aquitaine worked hard on her Old English too.
posted by spitbull at 9:23 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


I did not know this. Are you telling me that their relationship is a Sex and the City plotline?

Without the used teabags, I hope.

And of course, no one will ever be as cute as Harry Goldenblatt, inside and out.
posted by sallybrown at 9:25 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


their relationship is a Sex and the City plot line

Exactly. These people are nothing if not derivative.
posted by spitbull at 9:27 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]




Meredith knows where all the bodies are buried. She stays.

*ring ring*

MEREDITH: Hel--

TRUMP: Meredith I need you drop whatever you're doing and go down to Duane Reade and pick up some rubber gloves and bleach

MEREDITH: OH MR. TRUMP NOT AGAIN NO
posted by prize bull octorok at 9:30 AM on August 19, 2016 [37 favorites]




ABC’s ‘Designated Survivor’: Rejoice! It’s Kiefer!
Buyers adore the former '24' star and think this drama will succeed


Please tell me the first episodes are a massive shitfight between our hero and the evil house member who was the opposing party's designated survivor fighting over the presidential line of succession in the Supreme Court with an 8 person court delivering a 4-4 decision on who is president.
posted by Talez at 9:31 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


The jeweler tried to warn us away from sapphires because they're not the hardest stone. "What's harder than sapphires?" we asked, knowing the answer. "Uh, diamonds."

The honest jeweller says "created moissanite".
posted by Talez at 9:35 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm going to guess based on the very little information available that this is not simply a bad pollster but a straight-up disinformation campaign from Trump or his allies.

I won't be surprised to see a lot of this sort of thing in the next few months. Partly to drive a narrative that Trump can win, partly to keep their own morale up, and partly to try to dispirit Clinton voters.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:36 AM on August 19, 2016


My brother actually told me the plot of the new 24, except when he told me that Jack was head of HUD I thought it was one of my brother's weird jokes
posted by angrycat at 9:37 AM on August 19, 2016




WSJ: meanwhile, Putin is building forces on Ukraine's border.

Ominous. If he's not going to get an invasion rubberstamped by a puppet resident that means he can move the timeline.
posted by Artw at 9:37 AM on August 19, 2016


If anyone wanted to make a meetup on IRL at the HRC hq in Boston for later this month I bet we could all take an afternoon off and call people and someone would bring us cookies. Just sayin
posted by Potomac Avenue at 9:38 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


San Francisco is fighting to keep the statue. I'm looking for a clip of the interview with the rep from Lefty O'Doul's, which said something like "so, there's this pathetic naked guy stuck in the Castro, obviously lost and alone...

Just one?
posted by phearlez at 9:39 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]



Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over


I'm fucking exhausted already.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:40 AM on August 19, 2016 [63 favorites]


WSJ: meanwhile, Putin is building forces on Ukraine's border.

Almost certainly a response to this. Russia won't flinch. God shit is getting too real.
posted by dis_integration at 9:41 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


I'm going to guess based on the very little information available that this is not simply a bad pollster but a straight-up disinformation campaign from Trump or his allies.

It's so the next time someone says "The polls? Most of them? All of them?" they can respond "NOT ALL OF THE POLLS YOU LIBERAL HACK"
posted by J.K. Seazer at 9:41 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Totally up for a MeFi Boston volunteer meetup!
posted by Sublimity at 9:41 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I expect the polls to tighten over the week ahead. Nicely phrased nationalism pulls big numbers in the United States and I'll bet the apology headpats in Trump's latest speeches to be enough to convince some portion of the electorate that backing Trump won't really make them racists, now that he's making some vague gestures towards contrition. 80-plus days is a damn long time. Given the difference in media saturation between 2012 and now, I consider that span "longer" than I would have last cycle due to the increase in density. I know I'm not the only one who perceives recent days as longer due to the wall to wall constant ugliness of this campaign (and my own panicked inability to look away from it).

Having a hard time finding any comfort in that Won't Work politico article or that Losing Double Down one from 538. Friendly Bigotry has a proven track record of appeal in the United States. Enough to win a presidential election in 2016? I'm legit not sure. I know the Trump strategy has always been to engage those resentful, backwards citizens who have stopped voting in blue states because they've long felt it pointless to push back against "PC tyranny." This is what that Nazi party prick meant by this being a huge opportunity for his group and other traitors to American pluralism. I'm realizing too late that to a lot of low information white voters, the "melting pot" means that everyone in this country ought to do their damndest to become white. Up until now, the conservative dog whistle has been tuned in such a way as to never disturb that vein of American thought with any sort of cognitive dissonance. Trump has been losing thus far because he could not learn to say the quiet parts quiet. If this weird, media mogul heavy new campaign team has at last taught him to dog whistle in tune, this race will become much more competetive.

I'd like to have more faith in my country than this, but I've also lived in this country my whole life.
posted by EatTheWeek at 9:43 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over

Wait, don't we have to elect Clinton and cancel Full Frontal first?
posted by Etrigan at 9:45 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


soren_lorensen: Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over

See also: Discrimination and harassment will be legal ethics violations under American Bar Association (ABA) model rule - sexist dudes don't realize they've been sexist dudes for decades.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]




Or the headline should be re-written: "Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Don't Realize They've Been Saying and Doing Sexist Things for Their Entire Lives"
posted by filthy light thief at 9:50 AM on August 19, 2016 [35 favorites]


Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over

[Sexism is over, if you want it! Sexism is over, if you want it!]

So, this is an election
A woman candidate has won
They say she'll have periods
Even though they're long done.
posted by Talez at 9:51 AM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over

I'm fucking exhausted already.


They also think Obama getting elected meant the end of racism.

Then they voted against him twice and passed laws all across the south to keep black folks from the polls.
posted by leotrotsky at 10:05 AM on August 19, 2016 [16 favorites]


from dis_integration's link:
Stoltenberg also added that the defense ministers had agreed to recognize cyber attacks like any other attack on the physical battlefield, noting that the change would encourage other countries in the alliance to bolster their virtual defenses.

“This is important to all possible conflicts we can foresee,” Stoltenberg said, adding that almost all modern conflicts involve a cyber component. Stoltenberg did not single out any one country as a specific cyber threat.

Russia has made cyber warfare a key component of its current operations, namely in eastern Ukraine. Russian-backed separatists there have used electronic, cyber and disinformation campaigns to wage what is called “hybrid warfare,” an atypical approach to conflict that uses domestic unrest to help achieve tactical gains on the battlefield.
posted by notyou at 10:08 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


From Ivanka: an article on unpaid work complete with black woman emoji.
How to make it work as an unpaid intern: https://t.co/pwMIYWh4kw #nomoneynoproblems #interntips #internships pic.twitter.com/BRoWuO6bq7— Ivanka Trump (@IvankaTrump) August 18, 2016

posted by Sophie1 at 10:18 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


I think the polls will tighten over the next few weeks, too. (I mean, how could this not be an improvement after the last few weeks?) He'll shore up his support in some of those red states that have turned pink or improbably light blue. His followers will get a morale boost. But he won't be able to reach the demographics he's already alienated. It won't be enough to win. ** spits to ward off the evil eye **
posted by PlusDistance at 10:20 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Hillary Clinton Campaign: Donald Trump 'Peddles Lies' | MSNBC

Well said, Jennifer Granholm!
posted by bearwife at 10:21 AM on August 19, 2016


First Trump General Election Ad: Economic Anxiety? What Economic Anxiety?
So here's Donald Trump's first TV ad of the general election campaign. Where's the economy? [...]

Economic anger? Nope. The entire ad is about fear of the Other -- including, we can safely infer, that opening shot of a polling place entrance and the words "system rigged," which, to Trump's base, is a dog whistle meaning "Democratic machine bosses in big cities with large non-white populations are going to manipulate the vote in Clinton's favor."

The rest is about Muslims and Mexicans, then about manly symbols of American strength (helicopters, Border Patrol vehicles, an aircraft carrier) keeping citizens safe in Trump's America. [...]

You can keep telling yourself that the Trump phenomenon is all about jobs and declining incomes. It isn't.
posted by tonycpsu at 10:23 AM on August 19, 2016 [30 favorites]


I mean, how could this not be an improvement

If anyone can find a way it's Donald Trump.
posted by spitbull at 10:25 AM on August 19, 2016


Russian-backed separatists there have used electronic, cyber and disinformation campaigns to wage what is called “hybrid warfare,” an atypical approach to conflict that uses domestic unrest to help achieve tactical gains on the battlefield.
WaPo did an opinion piece on Russian disinfo campaigns and why they work in European nations with free press and open internet.
Fifteen years ago, the idea that foreign disinformation might be a problem for European countries seemed ludicrous. Free media looked as triumphant as free markets; Western television and newspapers had comfortable funding and big audiences. But the business model that once supported media across the continent, indeed all across the West, no longer works. Much Western journalism is poorly resourced, and the proliferation of information has made it harder for people to judge the accuracy of what they see and read.
The article doesn't explicitly say that the US is a disinformation target, but it would be naive to think that Americans aren't vulnerable and haven't already been targeted. I think that the polarization of America and the resulting mass media and online echo chambers indicate that Americans may actually be particularly vulnerable. See: this election.
posted by xyzzy at 10:28 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Poll: Majority of Men and Republicans Think Sexism Is Over

CUT TO: President Trump, resplendent in a gender-neutral futuristic jumpsuit, standing on the flight deck of the u.s.s. bell hooks, as a banner unfurls reading MISSION ACCOMPLISHED.
posted by Strange Interlude at 10:28 AM on August 19, 2016 [62 favorites]


You can keep telling yourself that the Trump phenomenon is all about jobs and declining incomes. It isn't.

Pooling all their efforts into a Willie Horton strategy requires an actual Willie Horton figure to make it work, and the part of the country that votes is probably a bit too diverse these days to get away with that.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 10:34 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


The revolving door of Trump's campaign leadership, apparently deeply influenced by Jared Kushner, reminds me an awful lot of the revolving door of the NY Observer's editor-in-chief position, which was held by six people in the first seven years of Kushner's ownership.
posted by acidic at 10:35 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


u.s.s. bell hooks
ded.
posted by adamgreenfield at 10:36 AM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


Much Western journalism is poorly resourced, and the proliferation of information has made it harder for people to judge the accuracy of what they see and read.


Also people have kind of a Wikipedia-derived idea that a link to anything whatsoever on the web is a "citation" that's as good as gold. So people see a story and it has links to some echo chamber support and, hey, citations.
posted by thelonius at 10:38 AM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Also people have kind of a Wikipedia-derived idea that a link to anything whatsoever on the web is a "citation" that's as good as gold. So people see a story and it has links to some echo chamber support and, hey, citations.

Ann Coulter was doing this in dead tree books a decade ago.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:48 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


So there's this fake internal PPP memo floating around which in addition to having Trump beating Clinton 74-9 in Florida includes some other gems.
posted by ckape at 10:50 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Ann Coulter was doing this in dead tree books a decade ago.

Al Frankin knocked her and others for that - list end notes instead of foot notes, so people are even less likely to follow the links, so to speak.
posted by filthy light thief at 10:50 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Manafort's ouster is not derailing Trump's "pivot." The "pivot" is there to cover Manafort's departure.

Re: Gamechange 2: Great Again, in the absence of Philip Seymour Hoffman I nominate for your consideration Vincent D'Onofrio and Kristian Bruun (Donnie from Orphan Black).

I'd be wary of any Trump ad encouraging me to join the Trump Team. Seems like you'd be forced out before long.

I'm not sure who would advertise on a Trumpbart network. I know Trump wants to be king of all media and there's a lot they could do on the Internet, but people that rooted in TV can never let go of TV.
posted by under_petticoat_rule at 10:51 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


New Analysis: Even South Carolina and Kansas Aren't Sure Bets for Trump:
A new Electoral College analysis by the University of Virginia's Center for Politics reveals that the map is only growing for Hillary Clinton and even South Carolina and Kansas have moved from "safe Republican" to "likely Republican."
...
"We certainly don’t expect either Kansas or South Carolina to vote Democratic. Still, we have noticed that many deep red states may be preparing to produce lower-than-usual pluralities for Trump. It won’t matter in the Electoral College, of course, but it will be reflected in the national popular vote total," they wrote.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:54 AM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Does any state really want to be the last holdout for Trump? Idaho, I'm talking to you.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 11:02 AM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


ChurchHatesTucker: Hillary Clinton Campaign: Donald Trump 'Peddles Lies' | MSNBC
The problem is, and I know you have to cover both sides of this, but when you know that it is utterly false, why are we spending any time on that? It's the same as the other garbage that they're putting out. Why are we even giving breath to something that we know is totally false? The only reason to even talk about it is to point out the character of the man who is putting that out. It's not just that he's an embarrassment, it's not just the reason other Republicans are running from him [laughter in the background !!!] because there are decent Republicans and Independents who see what he is about and they know America is better than that."
The newscaster points out "But Hillary's campaign responded to it! Moving forward, how should the campaign respond to conspiracy theories coming forward in the future?" Answer: point out that it's garbage, and the person uttering this is a garbage person for knowingly putting out utter lies.

And that's the problem with who he has on board - they put winning ahead of everything else. This is not good for America.

(And then the newscaster goes on to ask "is having a transition team this early a sign of over-confidence?" Good thing Former Governor Jennifer Granholm remembered that Donnie signed Christie on back in MAY to lead his transition team, and cited the Pre-Election Presidential Transition Act of 2010.)
posted by filthy light thief at 11:04 AM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


Trump's "apology" is the classic non-apology. "I regret that my telling the truth has caused some people to take offense."
posted by JackFlash at 11:06 AM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]






Sudden thought: The Donald would make a great character for the board game Clue.

His name? Mr. Orange, of course!
posted by CottonCandyCapers at 11:14 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Re: Gamechange 2: Great Again, in the absence of Philip Seymour Hoffman I nominate for your consideration Vincent D'Onofrio and Kristian Bruun (Donnie from Orphan Black).

Not familiar with Bruun but hell yeah D'Onofrio can reach the appropriate levels of unhinged inner turmoil. I'll have my people call his people.

I'm not sure who would advertise on a Trumpbart network
.

The ad slots not immediately filled by Trump Ties / steaks / shirts / board games / vodka / magazine / various golf courses and resorts / Ivanka line products will be a natural home for all those "learn the gold / medical / real estate secrets that 'they' don't want you to know" prosperity magic / paranoia pitches that constitute so much of the alt-right media bubble. Number one with Angry Uncles everywhere!
posted by EatTheWeek at 11:15 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Spotted in the background of that MSNBC clip.

This is the danger of letting kids go on Trumpspringa
posted by prize bull octorok at 11:17 AM on August 19, 2016 [54 favorites]


I'm not sure who would advertise on a Trumpbart network.

There's an entire industry that preys on paranoid, racist conservative preppers who are stockpiling MREs for the coming rapture/race war/FEMA trailers. If you don't frequent those sorts of media outlets and don't have your name on the right direct marketing lists, you probably would never know about it, but it's there and it's a huge industry. It's the right-wing equivalent of magic woo water that cures cancer.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:21 AM on August 19, 2016 [29 favorites]



So, wait. Is Trump's refusal to remove his suit jacket his projection of Hillary health concerns?

Recall that [Trump] apparently hasn't been seen in public without a suit-jacket on in years.


Health concerns or no, it actually turns out not to be all that hard to find recent photos of Trump without a suit jacket.

Just google "trump golf", and . . .
1 |  2 |  3 |  4

Also: Separated at birth? Golfer John Daly endorses Trump for president -- and seemingly, his tonsorial style -- if the slide show here is any indication.
 
posted by Herodios at 11:22 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


"The world will end soon! Buy gold, which we are entirely willing to exchange for shortly-to-be-valueless American dollars!"

Right-wing media, from a certain perspective, basically exists to connect scam artists and grifters with a hand-selected population of gullible, frightened marks without critical thinking skills.
posted by Pope Guilty at 11:23 AM on August 19, 2016 [43 favorites]


Sudden thought: The Donald would make a great character for the board game Clue.

His name? Mr. Orange, of course!


Get Tim Roth on the phone!
posted by Strange Interlude at 11:24 AM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Mister Orange: Why can't we pick our own colors?
Joe: No way, no way. Tried it once, doesn't work. You got four guys all fighting over who's gonna be Mister Black, but they don't know each other, so nobody wants to back down. No way. I pick. You're Mister Orange. Be thankful you're not Mister Yellow.
Mister Orange: How 'bout if I'm Mister Purple? That sounds good to me. I'll be Mister Purple.
Joe: You're not Mister Purple. Some guy on some other job is Mister Purple. You're Mister Orange.
Mister White: Who cares what your name is?
Mister Orange: Yeah, that's easy for your to say, you're Mister White. You have a cool-sounding name. Alright look, if it's no big deal to be Mister Orange, you wanna trade?
Joe: Hey! NOBODY'S trading with ANYBODY. This ain't a goddamn fucking city council meeting, you know. Now listen up, Mister Orange. There's two ways you can go on this job: my way or the highway. Now what's it gonna be, Mister Orange?
Mister Orange: Jesus Christ, Joe, fucking forget about it. It's beneath me. I'm Mister Orange. Let's move on.

posted by kirkaracha at 11:25 AM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Right-wing media : Nigerian Prince :: prepper product peddlers' (say that five times fast) : money transfer scam.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:26 AM on August 19, 2016


I know but it's funnier this way.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:26 AM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Outdoors without a hat? No way is that recent.
posted by Artw at 11:46 AM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Just google "trump golf", and . . .

You get a lot of photos from c. 2012. Many of which were used to illustrate more recent articles.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:58 AM on August 19, 2016


Federal Election Commission is cracking down on Deez Nuts.

DN: I'd like to register as a candidate for president my name is Bofa.

FEC: Bofa?!?!?

DN: BOFA DEEZ NUTS!!
posted by msalt at 12:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


DN: I'd like to register as a candidate for president my name is Bofa.

It was only a matter of time before Bank of America ran in its own right.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:04 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


I swear, at this point in the election, I would not be shocked to have Trump suddenly be swapped out with someone who looks somewhat like him in a wig while the Republican establishment goes on all the news shows to adamantly insist that "of course it's Trump, he's just finally pivoted, how could you be so insensitive to talk about his appearance like that."
posted by C'est la D.C. at 12:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


An 18-year-old Charlotte college student who was ejected from Thursday’s Donald Trump rally says he went from avid backer to disillusioned opponent after Trump’s security accused him of being a known protester.

Jake Anantha, who registered as a Republican and planned to cast his first presidential vote for Trump, was wearing a Trump shirt when police removed him from the Charlotte Convention Center before the rally began. He and his father, Ramesh Anantha, say they believe he was profiled because of his dark skin.

“It’s unbelievably ironic,” said Ramesh Anantha, whose parents immigrated from India. He says his son, as a young person of color appearing at a rally where the Republican presidential nominee touted his support for people of color, “should have been looked at as a perfect Trump supporter. He should have been somebody they’re putting up on stage.”


Teen Trump fan, ejected from Charlotte rally, says he was profiled (Charlotte News & Observer)
posted by salix at 12:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [34 favorites]


I wonder if he started wearing a bulletproof vest earlier in the campaign, at which point he stopped taking off his suit jacket.
posted by aubilenon at 12:11 PM on August 19, 2016


Jake Anantha says he thinks he’ll vote for Libertarian Gary Johnson.

well, kinda stupid is better than holy shit stupid, I guess
posted by mightygodking at 12:11 PM on August 19, 2016 [29 favorites]


"It was a very rude introduction into the world of politics,” said Ramesh Anantha, who works in financial services. “We realize Donald Trump himself had nothing to do with this problem, but it’s the type of campaign he’s running." [...] Jake Anantha says he thinks he’ll vote for Libertarian Gary Johnson.

Ha ha ha ha.
(On preview, what mightygodking said above.)
posted by RedOrGreen at 12:13 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I wonder if he started wearing a bulletproof vest earlier in the campaign, at which point he stopped taking off his suit jacket.

Possible (Hillary's jackets have also raised some snark) but he doesn't take it off even on his own plane.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:16 PM on August 19, 2016


@NateSilver: Unsurprising, given the recent news. You might even say it was MANAFORT’S DESTINTY. (AP Tweet)
posted by Going To Maine at 12:17 PM on August 19, 2016


he doesn't take it off even on his own plane.

given where he sources his campaign staffers, can't hurt to err on the side of caution!
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:18 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


but he doesn't take it off even on his own plane.

I mean, I hate to malign dogs like this but has anyone considered the possibility that he's actually just 4 or 5 of these guys zipped up in a Trump suit?
posted by phunniemee at 12:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


There's a picture of him in a golf shirt from a year or two ago and he does not look healthy. A suit coat hides a lot of figure flaws.
posted by readery at 12:22 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


I mean, I hate to malign dogs like this but has anyone considered the possibility that he's actually just 4 or 5 of these guys zipped up in a Trump suit?

I think it's more like this.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:25 PM on August 19, 2016


There's a picture of him in a golf shirt from a year or two ago and he does not look healthy.

Well think again because Donald Trump is the healthiest person ever to run for president his doctor said so in a totally nonforged letter with no spelling errors whatsoever
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


Trump when asked today by Tom Llamas at ABC if his speech last night was an apology:

"They have to take it as they see it."
posted by chris24 at 12:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I swear, at this point in the election, I would not be shocked to have Trump suddenly be swapped out with someone who looks somewhat like him in a wig while the Republican establishment goes on all the news shows to adamantly insist that "of course it's Trump, he's just finally pivoted, how could you be so insensitive to talk about his appearance like that."

"Whoa has Trump always been black"
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]



I mean, I hate to malign dogs like this but has anyone considered the possibility that he's actually just 4 or 5 of these guys zipped up in a Trump suit?


phunniemee remember when we were wrapping our pets in blankets and calling it a furrito? TRUMP WAS WATCHING EVERY MOMENT
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:29 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Sometimes I wear a suit when I go into the office because I get cold and don't want to wear a sweater. My arms can get cold while my core doesn't.

It's also a good way to dress up without adding a tie (I hate wearing a tie) and Mrs. VTX really likes the way it looks on me.
posted by VTX at 12:29 PM on August 19, 2016


There's a picture of him in a golf shirt from a year or two ago and he does not look healthy. A suit coat hides a lot of figure flaws.

Or it's just an identity thing for him. People wearing clothing even when it's inappropriate or wildly uncomfortable isn't exactly unusual. A woman in heels way too high for a bar crawl. Dudes who don't take off their riding leathers even though it's crazy hot. I see wool hats on punks and hipsters waiting for the bus in 95 degree weather in the summer. Trump finds lots of ways to be extraordinarily dumb and show poor judgement. This is a pretty pedestrian way.
posted by phearlez at 12:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


@NateSilver: Unsurprising, given the recent news. You might even say it was MANAFORT’S DESTINTY. (AP Tweet)

Dammit Tim stop feeding Nate your Dad Jokes
posted by Existential Dread at 12:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [18 favorites]


I mean, I hate to malign dogs like this but has anyone considered the possibility that he's actually just 4 or 5 of these guys zipped up in a Trump suit?

Vincent, a Trump man
posted by Going To Maine at 12:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


I think it's more like this.

Or like this
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Jake Anantha, who registered as a Republican and planned to cast his first presidential vote for Trump, was wearing a Trump shirt when police removed him from the Charlotte Convention Center before the rally began. He and his father, Ramesh Anantha, say they believe he was profiled because of his dark skin.

“It’s unbelievably ironic,” said Ramesh Anantha, whose parents immigrated from India. He says his son, as a young person of color appearing at a rally where the Republican presidential nominee touted his support for people of color, “should have been looked at as a perfect Trump supporter. He should have been somebody they’re putting up on stage.”


uh yeah guess what dumbass the trumpists DGAF what shade of brown we are.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [16 favorites]


Trump when asked today by Tom Llamas at ABC if his speech last night was an apology:

"They have to take it as they see it."


...okay, sure. No problem.
posted by seyirci at 12:35 PM on August 19, 2016


Trump has nothing on Vincent Adultman
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:37 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


has anyone considered the possibility that he's actually just 4 or 5 of these guys zipped up in a Trump suit?

"Imagine a giant cockroach, with unlimited strength, a massive inferiority complex, and a real short temper, is tear-assing around Manhattan island in a brand new Edgar Trump suit. That sound like fun?"
posted by octobersurprise at 12:44 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


Maybe he's 1000 Mice in a Human Suit.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:46 PM on August 19, 2016


"They have to take it as they see it."

Belligerent apology, I like it. It means he is not sorry. at. all. Which means he will be doing more of the same.

Eric Trump gave a statement to FOX about Manafort's "resignation" He packs more "you know"s into 4 sentences than I ever thought possible.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:47 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Latest Reuters/Ipsos national poll:

Clinton - 42%
Trump - 34%

"Since late July, support for the former secretary of state has ranged between 41 percent and 44 percent of likely voters, while Trump's support has varied between 33 percent and 39 percent."
posted by chris24 at 12:49 PM on August 19, 2016


We're getting into The Worm That Walks territory.
posted by McCoy Pauley at 12:49 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I just finished reading this whole damn thread. It is hard when there are 200 new comments when you are just partway down. A really fun experience. I am glad I am not Steve.

Is there any chance at all that MeFi is an echo chamber, and that all of us are going to be shocked and surprised by the election outcome? I sure hope not.

The first Clinton and Trump debate has got to have of the biggest number of eyeballs of all time. The buildup will have us expecting utter personal destruction and actual flames.
posted by Midnight Skulker at 12:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Given what we know about Trump and projection, him being a dog dressed like a human would at least explain the whole 'fired like a dog' thing.
posted by sporkwort at 12:55 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]




Is there any chance at all that MeFi is an echo chamber, and that all of us are going to be shocked and surprised by the election outcome? I sure hope not.

We are an echo chamber, but we're also long trained pessimists who firmly believe that the Democrats can manage to lose this badly. Thus, while everything looks good now and I think as long as we (as I've said) work hard to GOTV, there's always a chance that all of the positive data can be wrong. I mean, an 88% of winning is not a 100% chance of winning. Ergo, GOTV.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


I am glad I am not Steve.

When the stars are right and the Grand Enstevening takes place all will be Steve and Steve will be all
posted by prize bull octorok at 12:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


Is there any chance at all that MeFi is an echo chamber, and that all of us are going to be shocked and surprised by the election outcome? I sure hope not.

Don't go by MeFi, go by the many, many scientifically-conducted (for varying definitions of that) polls. They all at this point are indicating that there 30-40% of likely voters who currently intend to vote for this omnishambles of a candidate, but that is not enough to win an election.
posted by soren_lorensen at 12:59 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Is there any chance at all that MeFi is an echo chamber, and that all of us are going to be shocked and surprised by the election outcome? I sure hope not.

We're an echo chamber, sure. But we're not an echo chamber that's talking about "unskewing the polls", so we're not unmoored from reality like echo chambers on the other side!
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 1:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Is there any chance at all that MeFi is an echo chamber, and that all of us are going to be shocked and surprised by the election outcome? I sure hope not.

The comfort I draw is that all the polls (including the Republican-leaning ones) are reflecting Trump's massive unpopularity and show him losing in November, without much change over time. Also, establishment Rs like Lindsey Graham and the ol' turtle man Mitch McConnell are bracing themselves for a potential massive defeat.
posted by Existential Dread at 1:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


You guys, I spent 2 hours this morning arguing with my uncle on Facebook about estate tax [I normally have a Do Not Engage policy, but he literally tagged me in it and asked what I thought] and I am so in need of the warm, sweet embrace of Metafilter election threads.
posted by misskaz at 1:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


Everyone here agrees that MeFi is *not* an echo chamber.
posted by uosuaq at 1:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [75 favorites]


The buildup will have us expecting utter personal destruction and actual flames.

A thing that actually occurred to me: will the debaters shake hands this time? It's traditional, and frequently in the past the candidates have had healthy respect for each other. This time, there's so much rancor that I could imagine that step being quietly dropped.
posted by Countess Elena at 1:02 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Everyone here agrees that MeFi is *not* an echo chamber.
posted by Cookiebastard at 1:03 PM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]


Not an echo chamber. ber. ber. ber
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:04 PM on August 19, 2016 [20 favorites]


chamber

chamber
posted by uosuaq at 1:05 PM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


A thing that actually occurred to me: will the debaters shake hands this time?

Trump will insist on it to show how huge his hands are in comparison to Clinton's tiny lady hands.

Note: This may well backfire on him. I have no idea how big Clinton's hands are.
posted by Etrigan at 1:05 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


> I am so in need of the warm, sweet embrace of Metafilter election threads.

Misskas have you heard the perilous news about our lord and destroyer the Archlich? When [unknowable]'s arrival is nigh you will feel nothing but the warm embrace of oblivion.

Enjoy!
posted by Tevin at 1:05 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Not an echo chamber. We have always been at war with Steve.
posted by yellowbinder at 1:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


*hugs misskaz* Your Facebook Uncle Is Terrible is probably on a cross-stitch pillow somewhere.
posted by maryr at 1:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


An Agency Created a Trump Chatbot on Facebook to Revisit His Many Controversial Comments
"BFF Trump" is a Facebook Messenger bot that provides users with the best and/or worst of Donald Trump. It makes for an amusing way to pass a few minutes' time ... unless you happen to be a yuuuuge fan of The Donald.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:10 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


I just... he kept shifting the goalposts and posting links to things that didn't prove what he claimed they did and... I'm so exhausted. At least he's voting for Gary Johnson, not Trump?
posted by misskaz at 1:16 PM on August 19, 2016


What's most amazing about Facebook is that they invented a device to deliver traumatic family experiences to everyone and made billions with it.
posted by octobersurprise at 1:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [29 favorites]


At least he's voting for Gary Johnson, not Trump?

I think the most fruitful family psyop this election season is to convince potential Trumpists that actually Gary Johnson is the real anti-establishment conservative candidate. He's so outside the mainstream, he's not even in the party at all! Google Gary Johnson, grandpa! You'll be super impressed! We can talk all about it at Thanksgiving!
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


it's even more amazing when you've been arguing with your racist Facebook uncle for hours and it slowly dawns on you that your parents were only children
posted by prize bull octorok at 1:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [57 favorites]


People without racist uncles get assigned them by Facebook when you create your account.
posted by soren_lorensen at 1:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [80 favorites]


Aulani Kaaihue, our local evil GOP politician running against Rep. Tulsi Gabbard, recently released her latest cry for help. She sent a press release out offering to leave the race if the governor helps her settle a lawsuit and... well, read it yourself because its one of the more bizarre and prejudiced screeds you'll read from a politician this year. My favorite part is the response of the local Republican chair:
“I don’t understand what her point is, and so I’m mystified as to what it is she’s trying to accomplish,” Rohlfing said. “I haven’t had any prior discussions about these topics with her, so I’m at a loss.”
For some added context, the candidate, Angela Aulani Kaaihue, is from Texas and her birth name was Angela Stenger. She is not of Hawaiian descent. Kaaihue is her ex-husband's name and Aulani is a name she selected. If you don't mind wading into a bit of a cesspool, there's a Reddit discussion about her, too.

She only received about 7,500 votes and will be blown out in the election, but I'd like to propose that, short of Trump, she's the worst and most openly bigoted candidate running for a national office in the U.S. this year.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:28 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


Call it an echo chamber but I find Facebook a lot more tolerable since I started unfriending or unfollowing people who post noxious shit. I can get all of that I want any time I want elsewhere.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:29 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Kaaihue is her ex-husband's name and Aulani is a name she selected.

omg did she name herself after the disney resort
posted by murphy slaw at 1:31 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


What's most amazing about Facebook is that they invented a device to deliver traumatic family experiences to everyone and made billions with it.

They old internet people call it Eternal Thanksgiving.
posted by cortex at 1:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [57 favorites]




People without racist uncles get assigned them by Facebook when you create your account.

I feel like this has happened to me. Some of my relatives - well, I never had thought they were likely to be big Jon Stewart fans or anything, but I'm appalled at what they've said. Still, I don't need to be in any more of a liberal bubble than I am. I use an app to strip out common election terms from my feed, so the nonsense stays down to a dull roar.
posted by Countess Elena at 1:39 PM on August 19, 2016


An old joke in Native America... When you meet someone who claims to be indigenous and has a name like Rainfall Desert Redsky you know it's fake because real Indians are always named "Leonard."
posted by spitbull at 1:39 PM on August 19, 2016 [41 favorites]


So you're telling me Adolf Hungry Wolf is not totally genuine
posted by Countess Elena at 1:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


It's Hungry Lika Wolf.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion that Hillary is corrupt? I'm finding it really hard to counter this, I don't like Trump, but I feel she's just "dirty" stuff :(
posted by peacheater at 1:44 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


> The old internet people call it Eternal Thanksgiving.

oh god you're killing me. cortex's joke has crashed my script.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:44 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Everyone here agrees that MeFi is *not* an echo chamber.

I dare anyone to disagree.
posted by bongo_x at 1:46 PM on August 19, 2016


Everyone always talks about the right-wing echo chamber, and justifiably so, but my favourite example of someone living in an information bubble was a Harpers op-ed written by Lewis Lapham during the run-up to GWB's re-election in which he claimed to have never met nor talked to a Bush supporter during the campaign (you don't say!) and then expressed amazement that he was anywhere near Kerry in the polls.
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:47 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion that Hillary is corrupt? I'm finding it really hard to counter this, I don't like Trump, but I feel she's just "dirty" stuff :(

Well, I'd ask:
1. Is the standard by which she's deemed corrupt the same standard by which any other (male) politician would be deemed corrupt?

2. What specific allegations are you hearing, and is the evidence for those allegations real and strong?

You really need to consider the evidence as it exists for those claims.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 1:48 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


LIVE Stream: Donald Trump Rally in Dimondale

Thank you for your continued service, ChurchHatesTucker. If only I had some of Superplin's guacamole, I might be able to watch some of these things myself.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:48 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


... real Indians are always named "Leonard."
Umm. Some are named Steve.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:48 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


The Republicans have been trying to pin something on Hillary for a quarter-century. If she was dirty, there'd be more than just a vague sense that she's corrupt, there'd be actual prosecutions and convictions, not just innuendo and accusations that never pan out.
posted by Pope Guilty at 1:49 PM on August 19, 2016 [31 favorites]


Based on my attempt to fact-check someone out of their beliefs about estate tax just now, I'd say don't even bother, peacheater. I'm a little frustrated and disheartened, can you tell?
posted by misskaz at 1:50 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


To expand further: you bring up fact X, they move the goal posts to condition Y. You ask for backup and they send a link. You examine link and pull conclusion A, B, and C out of the info they provided, which does not support their claim. They say "well that's because that link doesn't include factor Z!" while accusing you of straying off topic. You ask for data that includes factor Z and they link dump census data. (Which also probably doesn't support their claim but at this point you've been at your desk for 2 hours and haven't gotten any work done.)

It's just not worth it. :/
posted by misskaz at 1:53 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


Rising Stock Markets Are Another Sign Trump Is Losing:
Earlier this month, Donald Trump said he’d pulled his money out of the stock market, warning of “very scary scenarios” ahead for investors. Those scenarios, according to many market watchers, include the possibility that Donald Trump could be elected president.

And that’s a slim possibility, judging by the behavior of the markets. Investors seem to have all but written off the likelihood of a Trump presidency, pushing stocks to record highs as Trump takes his cash off the table.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


Yeah the joke only works by invoking reductio ad absurdam (although a lot of NA guys of a certain age are named Leonard, which is why it's funny).
posted by spitbull at 1:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


C'est la D.C.: I swear, at this point in the election, I would not be shocked to have Trump suddenly be swapped out with someone who looks somewhat like him in a wig while the Republican establishment goes on all the news shows to adamantly insist that "of course it's Trump, he's just finally pivoted, how could you be so insensitive to talk about his appearance like that."

This is known as an old-fashioned person swap - draw someone's focus on an item in front of them, and they ignore the person next to them.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion that Hillary is corrupt?

Yeah, um, it's hard to prove a negative, especially such a vague one. I mean, Hillary Clinton, to the best of my knowledge, has never been formally charged with so much as a traffic violation. Certainly never tried or convicted. She's been accused of a bunch of stuff, but entirely by political enemies.

Like, I doubt anyone has any articles to counter the notion that cortex does terrible things to kittens. People sure are talking about it a lot. Just seems like there might be something there.
posted by Cookiebastard at 2:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


This is known as an old-fashioned person swap

Or maybe the classic Freedonian mirror deception.

(It just occurred to me that Donald Trump might be the Rufus T. Firefly of Earth-Prime.)
posted by Strange Interlude at 2:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Ennnh. While it's impossible to say if the market will go up 10% from here or down, I gotta say I'm not a fan of "the stock market is hitting record highs!!". The S&P's trailing PE ratio is like 25 right now. That's... quite high. I'd think it has to give some of that back at some point. Of course as they say the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent so I'm not betting on it going down any time soon.
posted by Justinian at 2:08 PM on August 19, 2016


We really need to put this cortex/kitten thing to rest. Please, if anyone has proof that cortex doesn't do terrible things to kittens...I beg you, come forward now!
posted by uosuaq at 2:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


Since Trump is slamming Obama for not visiting Louisiana, let's just refresh our collective memories about the governor's wishes.
posted by vverse23 at 2:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


It begins

DJT: Nov. 8th we're going to win big. Going to be a victory for the people, wage earner, factory worker. Big victory for the factory, those whose voices have not been heard for many years. It's going to be your victory. These are hard times for many in this country. I just got back from a tour of the suffering in Louisiana. The spirit of the people is incredible. Obama ought to get off the golf course and get down there. We morn for the lives lost and pledge our help, comfort and support. To the people of LA we are with you. Their spirit will overcome. We have a lot to overcome in our country, especially our jobs being taken away to other lands, especially here in MI.

DJT: In this new future, millions of workers on the sidelines will be returned to the workforce. If I'm not elected that will never happen. Businesses and plants have been ripped out of your hands. Crumbling roads, bridges, airports will be replaced. Families in welfare will be provided jobs. Children stuck in failing schools will be able to attend school of their choice. Govt. will become lean. Border will be protected, children will be safe, we'll build the wall.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:10 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


[A few comments deleted. This thread is not the place for dozens of posts that retread the same tired rumors, so please stop posting them out of respect for cortex's countless kitten victims.]
posted by Cookiebastard at 2:12 PM on August 19, 2016 [38 favorites]


Careful. Paphnuty was the last of us to recognize the Moderator/Kitten connection, and, well...
posted by yhbc at 2:12 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


Earlier this month, Donald Trump said he’d pulled his money out of the stock market, warning of “very scary scenarios” ahead for investors. Those scenarios, according to many market watchers, include the possibility that Donald Trump could be elected president.

I'm kind of seeing a sequel to The Big Short here. Man leverages himself up to his eyebrows, shorts everything, runs for President in such a crazy way that he spooks the markets, and profits. It's obviously not working for Trump, nor is he smart enough to pull something like that off, but a real genius could make a killing. And I'd like to see the SEC make a case for market manipulation based on being a buffoon of a Presidential candidate.
posted by zachlipton at 2:13 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Is that last DJT quote real?
posted by andruwjones26 at 2:14 PM on August 19, 2016


"Corrupt Hillary" is a standard Right Wing tactic. The most notable version for the left-ish is "rumor" that Glenn Beck raped and murdered a girl in 1990 (Know Your Meme). Except instead of being over the top slander in the style of Glenn Beck, it's more like the pervasive whisper of some wrong-doing that's hard to completely dismiss.

You can keep countering the claims, but at some point it becomes a meme unto itself, much like how 40% of Trump voters think that ACORN, which hasn't existed [for six] years, will steal the election for Clinton.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:14 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


(Build the wall)

DJT: Law and order will be restored. We must reject the same insiders telling us the same lies over again. No group in america has been more harmed by Hillary's policies than african american communities. Tonight I'm asking for the vote of every single african american citizen who wants a better future. The inner cities of our country have been run by the democratic party for sixty years. It's time to hold them accountable. At what point do we say enough? It's time to hold failed leaders accountable for their results, not empty promises. Look what they did to Detroit. 40% live in poverty. Half do not work and cannot work. Tops the list in violent crime. This is the legacy of Democratic politicians who run this city. This is the work of Hillary.

(Lock her up)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:14 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Like, I doubt anyone has any articles to counter the notion that cortex does terrible things to kittens. People sure are talking about it a lot. Just seems like there might be something there.

I want to take this opportunity on behalf of The Cabal all right-thinking members of this community to categorically deny any allegations that cortex has engaged in any nefarious behavior with kittens. Despite repeated investigations, no single Mefite* has been willing to go on record to publicly acknowledge the many and numerous accounts of kitten malfeasance by cortex, and I think it's disgraceful that you bring it up in a public forum like this.

*since the disappearance of Paphnuty
posted by leotrotsky at 2:15 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


ChurchHatesTucker: It begins

By "it" you mean the teleprompted fluff, it looks. Lots of promises, no content.

Classic Donnie. You keep doing you, and we'll keep getting out the vote.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:16 PM on August 19, 2016


DJT: 33000 emails gone. The only way to change results is to change leadership. Can't rely on politicians who created it. Look how much African American communities are suffering. What do you have to lose by trying something new like Trump.

(Trump chant)

DJT: You're living in poverty, your schools are no good, you have no jobs, your youth is unemployed. At the end of four years I'll get 90% of the AA vote. I will produce for the AA community. The Democrats will not. If you keep voting for the same people you'll get the same result. My administration will go to work for you as none has ever done before. By contrast, every item in Hillary's agenda takes jobs away from AA, all workers. Your companies are leaving, going to Mexico, everywhere but here.

DJT: Hillary supports open borders, which means
[feed glitches]
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:18 PM on August 19, 2016


I just don't get why Trump keeps calling him Kitten Killin' Cortex, then. You wouldn't make a thing like that up.
posted by uosuaq at 2:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


I can't wait to hear what anti-political-correctness crusader Donald Trump thinks about this new more politically correct version of the GOP Presidential nominee.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:22 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


[feed resumes. blood is pouring from DJT's eyes, mouth, nose and ears. Nothing but a muffled high pitch whistle can be heard, like after a large explosion in close proximity. The audience gapes in stunned horror at the portal to hell opening behind the podium]


[fake]
posted by onehalfjunco at 2:23 PM on August 19, 2016 [20 favorites]


ChurchHatesTucker: [Donny sez] In this new future, millions of workers on the sidelines will be returned to the workforce.

Bringing Back Manufacturing Jobs Would Be Harder Than It Sounds (NPR - August 18, 2016)

See also:
- Why Trump and Clinton vows to bring back manufacturing jobs are a pipe dream (Market Watch opinion piece - July 20, 2016)
- Why it would be tough for Trump to bring jobs back from China (CNN Money - February 12, 2016)
- Economists Fact-Check Donald Trump’s Plan to Bring Back Millions of American Jobs From China (The Blaze, Aug. 5, 2015)

In other words, CHT I think you can save yourself some time and sanity and simply write "see prior empty promises about [topic]" every 5 minutes.

In fact, I think that's a perfect job for a script.
posted by filthy light thief at 2:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


DJT: I'm cutting taxes for business and middle class. America must reject the bigotry of Hillary who sees only votes. Would rather provide a job to refugees from overseas than AAs, who have become refugees in their own country. We have to get AAs the jobs they deserve. Hillary would bring in refugees in her first term. Hillary wants to be American's Angela Merkel. For the price of supporting one refugee in the US we could support 12 in a safe zone, or say Syria. Extreme vetting. We will invest a portion of the money saved for inner city youth. AAs gave so much, sacrificed so much, yet 4 in 10 AA children live in poverty. Can't find jobs. We must do better. Our future will be great for everyone.

DJT: In a Trump American all workers will get priority for jobs in their own country. Workers making less than 18 years ago, working harder. We're going to create great jobs and get the wages up. Hillary is a throwback to when politicians preyed on our weakest citizens. With Trump that's not going to happen. Only a change in leadership will produce a change in outcome. American first. This will include a revitalization of the MI manufacturing sector. It's a disaster.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


SCP 1401: DONALD TRIMP CUT UP WHILE TALKING
posted by Countess Elena at 2:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Did he really use the phrase 'A Trump America?'
posted by Joey Michaels at 2:28 PM on August 19, 2016


DJT: Many of you who think you have jobs, you're going to find out your company is leaving. With Trump those days are over. We will bring jobs back. There will be a price to pay for companies that want to leave. It won't happen. MI lost 1 in 4 of its manufacturing jobs since NAFTA. Maybe the worst trade bill ever. Emptied out MI, New England, NY state. We end up with nothing. Signed by Bill Clinton, supported by Hillary Clinton. You lost one in 7 manufacturing jobs since Bill did something with China. Hillary will go back on TPP. Detroit lost 1 in 3 manufacturing jobs since NAFTA. No industry has been more hit than the auto industry. Lost jobs. Look at the plants in Mexico.

DJT: In 2015 GM planned to double Mexico investments by 2018. Mexico will become the car capital of the world very quickly, unless you elect Trump president. Chrysler announced layoffs, we will turn it around. When we tell them there will be a substantial tax on cars made in Mexico, they won't move, but if they do our country is going to make a heck of a lot of money. We have to win Nov 8th. TPP will be almost as bad as NAFTA. Hillary plans to ram it through. Would be a disaster for MI, for the car industry. I won't let it happen.

(cheers)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:31 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Does anyone other than the alt-right consider Merkel a failed leader? My impression from the outside was she is highly successful; didn't she steer Germany around the global recession?
posted by sallybrown at 2:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


You're doing the Lord's work, ChurchHatesTucker.
posted by vverse23 at 2:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]


Rather than build cars in Mexico, let's have Mexicans come into the US to build cars.
posted by Midnight Skulker at 2:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


So he's decided he's going to spend a few weeks pretending to be Huey Long?
posted by octobersurprise at 2:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


DJT: Emptied out MI, New England, NY state.

*looks around* Oh, is that where everybody went?
posted by maryr at 2:36 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


DJT: According to Economic Industry ... biggest loses will be in auto industry with TPP. We will withdraw before it can ever happen. I previously laid out a 7 point plan. Strong protection against currency manipulation, tariffs for those that cheat. Total renegotiation of NAFTA so jobs can come back. If we can't make a better deal we will walk. I'm not an isolationist, but we have to make great deals for our country. We're losing. Who makes these deals? We want trade deals that work for America, the American worker. We want to sharing our 800 billion trade deficit. We have hacks, politicians as our negotiators. Lobbiests won't let Hillary do what's right.

DJT: Another major issue is foreign policy. Hillary made one bad decision after another. Iraq war, hillary supported, I opposed it. Her tenure as SoS one of the worst ever. Unleashed ISIS onto the world. Has she ever apologized for destruction?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:36 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm sure the 1% of African American voters currently supporting Trump will love being told they are refugees in their own country.
posted by sallybrown at 2:37 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Oh, nope, it's after 5pm, they all went home because we have non-manufacturing jobs here in New England as well.
posted by maryr at 2:37 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Thanks for the suggestions everyone. I tried to show her the email explanation but she said she didn't really care about that. Instead she dredged up an article from the 80s claiming that Clinton was corrupt at her law firm, which seems like weak sauce to me. Anyone know anything about that? She also didn't seem to have any knowledge of the way in which the media portrayed her as First Lady (she hadn't even heard about Cookiegate). I did get her to agree that the way the media has been attacking her for so long is sexist, and ultimately she said she would wait and see what a Clinton presidency would be like, though she was not "optimistic". Partly she seems to have been extremely influenced by her husband who though a Bernie supporter grew up with right wing parents who are now voting for Trump. I can't help wondering what anti Clinton propaganda he must have swallowed growing up.
posted by peacheater at 2:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Does anyone other than the alt-right consider Merkel a failed leader? My impression from the outside was she is highly successful; didn't she steer Germany around the global recession?

The people Trump is speaking to don't know anything about Merkel and whether she's a good leader. Trump can say anything he wants about her and make his own reality. And if anyone asks, he can say she doesn't control the borders, and his people will eat that up.
posted by zachlipton at 2:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


(Lists middle easter countries as being stable before HRC was appointed, in chaos now)

DJT: Iran was given 400 million in cash. Obama caught in a lie, just like Obamacare. It will be repealed, replaced. Hillary has a legacy of death and terrorism. America deserves better. I am the change agent. I am your messenger. Strong defense, common sense, take care of the vets, great education, save our second amendment. Hillary is the defender of our status quo. Our country was losing, but she was cashing in. Bill was paid $50 million in speaking fees while she was Secretary. All the money funneled to the Clinton Foundation. It was pay for play. Hillary is indifferent to the suffering she caused. No apologies for ISIS, open borders, emails or Benghazi. The only way to learn the depth of her corruption is to read the 33000 emails she deleted. The only way to get justice in this rigged election is to show up to vote. Are you ready to vote?

(cheer)

DJT: I'm funding my campaign, spending tremendous money, raising money for the RNC. I think they're doing a good job, but we'll see Nov 8th. I'll work for you, I'll never lie to you, I'll never put any interest before you, I'll never stop fighting for you.

(cheer)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Anyone know anything about that?

I believe this is what "Whitewater" was about - that may help track down info.
posted by sallybrown at 2:44 PM on August 19, 2016


Breaking: Ryan Lochte to join Trump campaign as surrogate. Campaign manager Kellianne Whatsherface praises swimmer's "outstanding ability to tell bald faced lies about the stupidest shit and also his excellent record of courage under fire and avoidance of responsibility." Campaign special counsel, Michael "8-Ball" Cohen, when asked if Lochte's conduct in Rio might be a liability , replied "what conduct in Rio, he won 15 gold medals!?" When told of Lochte's invention of an armed robbery by police to avoid publicity for an act of drunken vandalism, Cohen only responded "says who?"

[fake]
posted by spitbull at 2:44 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


We need a Pop-Up Video version of these speeches where they're fact checked in real time. Like when Trump said he was self-funding it can pop up saying "Donald J Trump For President has actually accepted millions in donations from people".
posted by Talez at 2:45 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


DJT: We're going to have adequate screening. We'll join with any nation to defeat ISIS. At home taxes will go down, especially for middle income earners. Put millions of new jobs in poorest neighborhoods. Voters will be in charge. We have a divided country, totally devided. We'll have one country. Everyone will work together. We'll emphasize what we have in common. Every American will be protected, honored equally. Our common culture values as one American people. Honest government, low taxes, just society. Time to vote for a new American future. We will make American wealthy, united, great again.

(Exeunt.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


This is known as an old-fashioned person swap - draw someone's focus on an item in front of them, and they ignore the person next to them.

Isn't this the plot to Dave with Kevin "Otto" Kline?
posted by a lungful of dragon at 2:49 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion that Hillary is corrupt?


After the years and years, and millions and millions the Republicans have spent investigating her, either there's really nothing there or she's Keyser Soze. And if she's Keyser Soze, isn't that the kind of get-it-done genius you want working for you?
posted by chris24 at 2:50 PM on August 19, 2016 [53 favorites]


I mean, have you ever actually met anyone who admits they're a racist?

Yeah us white folks are REALLY good at the "but I'm not a racist" dance. I always think of my father, who, after I scolded him for telling a joke containing the n-word, got all huffy and wide-eyed about how he COULDN'T be a racist. In fact, he explained, he'd had a black friend when he was in the army THIRTY YEARS BEFORE.

Like, my dad didn't just pull "I have a black friend." He pulled "I had a black friend ONCE IN MY LIFE THREE DECADES AGO and therefore I'm allowed to use the n-word."
posted by threeturtles at 2:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Video of Trump and Pence handing out boxes from the back of a truck in Baton Rouge. "The awkwardness. The yacht club blazer. The hat. It's all there."
posted by kirkaracha at 2:56 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


I am the change agent.

I am the change agent. Through me all things will become new. We will be reborn in fire and blood, we will dance in the viscera of our crucified enemies. Ḭ̩ä̛͉̩͙̝̻!҉̥̖ ̢̼͈̫̺ͅͅI͉͇̜̠͞ä͏͙͓!̵͍̣̠͖͈̭͇ ̪͇͝S̲̗h́u̸͖̼̮͍b̮͘-͢N̖͓̗͉͎̳ig҉g̣ụ̥̺̭̗̯͠r͜á͈̺̻̟t҉͚̤̬h̥!͉ ̰̩͔


[real]
posted by Existential Dread at 2:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [28 favorites]


And Sanders manages to run out the clock:

Now that Sanders’ second extension has expired, spokesman Michael Briggs confirmed to the Center for Public Integrity that the senator won’t file a presidential campaign personal financial disclosure after all.

“We were told that since the senator no longer is a candidate there was no requirement to file,” Briggs said.

FEC spokesman Christian Hilland verified that Sanders has not filed a personal financial disclosure. He likewise confirmed that Sanders, who technically ceased to be a presidential candidate when Hillary Clinton secured the Democratic nomination on July 26, is no longer required to file one


Wonder what Jon Chait has to say, given his recent lexical vomitus.
posted by NoxAeternum at 2:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


why in the ever-loving fuck are they handing out Play-Doh
posted by prize bull octorok at 2:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Breaking: Donald Trump tells all-white audience he supports full reparations to descendants of African slaves, drawing gasps. However, he immediately clarified that this would bankrupt the United States and reduce the cost to "pennies on the dollar, 40 square inches and a hamster, if you know what I mean," emphasizing that governing was really just about making good deals. However, he asserted, the hamsters would be "absolutely the best first class hamsters."

He added that this same strategy would work to rebuild the military without incurring long term debt.

[fake]
posted by spitbull at 2:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


It seems every election, the newcomer to the game proves their foreign policy chops by visiting several countries on a "listening" tour.

Where is Trump going to go? Who will show up to see him?

Or will he forgo that too?
posted by yesster at 2:59 PM on August 19, 2016


PUTTING DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTERS THROUGH AN IDEOLOGY TEST.

And there it is.gif
posted by Talez at 3:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


Video of Trump and Pence handing out boxes from the back of a truck in Baton Rouge.

Why did Trump hand the man a box and then slap him? That looked like a person who does not know the meaning of the word affection trying to be affectionate.
posted by zachlipton at 3:00 PM on August 19, 2016


According to this piece on 538, more than a quarter of voters aged 18-29 tell pollsters they're voting for Johnson or Stein.

Goddamnit millenials!
posted by chrchr at 3:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [16 favorites]


Now that Sanders’ second extension has expired, spokesman Michael Briggs confirmed to the Center for Public Integrity that the senator won’t file a presidential campaign personal financial disclosure after all.

Since I'm asking questions, what kind of dumbass election law scheme do we have that allows candidates to put off their financial disclosure until after the conventions?
posted by zachlipton at 3:02 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


According to this piece on 538, more than a quarter of voters aged 18-29 tell pollsters they're voting for Johnson or Stein.

Incremental change over generations? But I want my social democracy nowwwwwwwwwwwwwww.
posted by Talez at 3:03 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


"What do you have to lose? You’re living in poverty, your schools are no good. You have no jobs, 58 percent of your youth is unemployed, what the hell do you have to lose?"

You know, I'm not sure this language is aimed at winning over African-American voters.
posted by box at 3:04 PM on August 19, 2016 [32 favorites]


I feel she's just "dirty" stuff :(

Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion?


*eye roll* There have been many accusations, many smear campaigns, almost without exception ginned up each time she has run for office. None has ever been based on anything more than animus. The evidence, which is apparent to anyone that takes the time to read what she writes, listen to her talk, and look at her record, is that she is an exceptionally hard working, intelligent, compassionate woman who has devoted her life to public service and to reaching out to help other people.

It is time for the people with the "feelings" to realize they are based on nothing, and those who have notions to defend their claims

I find it really ironic that this is the narrative when the RNC candidate (besides being openly sexist and racist) has a long and well documented history of stiffing suppliers, looting businesses, promising charitable donations he never delivered, defrauding investors and struggling students, and apparently violating campaign finance laws as well as closely linking himself to people deeply implicated in furthering corrupt activities by Vladimir Putin. Not to mention there are serious questions to be asked about his own apparent desire to become one of Putin's puppets in office.
posted by bearwife at 3:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [40 favorites]


more than a quarter of voters aged 18-29 tell pollsters they're voting for Johnson or Stein.


My God, that's over 500 voters...
posted by Cookiebastard at 3:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [36 favorites]


According to this piece on 538, more than a quarter of voters aged 18-29 tell pollsters they're voting for Johnson or Stein.

Incremental change over generations? But I want my social democracy nowwwwwwwwwwwwwww.


And I'm more cynical and think it's almost entirely about appearances. The fist bump factor.
posted by bongo_x at 3:11 PM on August 19, 2016


Does anyone have any articles to counter the notion that Hillary is corrupt?

I don’t know that it’s a “counter”, exactly, but I liked Michael Baraboro’s attempt to investigate the issue on the August 15 episode of The Run-Up podcast. (“Why She’s Distrusted”) No link, though, since the NYT seems to be confining its podcast coverage to its RSS feed.
posted by Going To Maine at 3:12 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


According to this piece on 538, more than a quarter of voters aged 18-29 tell pollsters they're voting for Johnson or Stein.

Goddamnit millenials!


I remember my first beer too, kids. Go on, sow your wild oats, get that tattoo of dat boi on your neck, cast your first vote for an unqualified third party candidate, go roadie for a crab-core band at Knotfest
posted by Existential Dread at 3:14 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]




I find it really ironic that this is the narrative when the RNC candidate (besides being openly sexist and racist) has a long and well documented history of stiffing suppliers, looting businesses, promising charitable donations he never delivered, defrauding investors and struggling students, and apparently violating campaign finance laws as well as closely linking himself to people deeply implicated in furthering corrupt activities by Vladimir Putin. Not to mention there are serious questions to be asked about his own apparent desire to become one of Putin's puppets in office.

I agree, but it's hard to counter when the person you're arguing with agrees that Trump would be a disaster and would vote for Clinton (if they could vote) - and they also live in New York where their hypothetical vote wouldn't matter much anyway. So why do I bother trying to counter this? I guess I'm just tired of seeing all the Clinton hate out there. We should be celebrating the first major party woman nominee, and instead there are all these smears. I haven't even dared to wear a Clinton button in public, which is really sad.
posted by peacheater at 3:19 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Clinton leads by enough overall right now that underperforming a bit with young voters isn’t a big deal. If the election becomes closer, however, Clinton may need help appealing to this group.

A lot could happen between now and November, but maybe the Hillary people think their odds are so overwhelmingly good they can be complacent, and just plowing ahead and going after fence-sitting Republicans who are reluctant about Trump is what they think is the best way to go.

Numbers are interesting, but it would be great if 538 could get some insight from actual Clinton staff on what they think about young people who vote, about how their current outlook impacts the Democratic Party's chances in down-ticket races, as well as future presidential campaigns. Looking into what young people really think their real future life prospects are under a Clinton or Trump presidency, and why that motivates their preferences, would be a lot more insightful than the numbers themselves, maybe.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 3:19 PM on August 19, 2016


You ask for data that includes factor Z and they link dump census data. (Which also probably doesn't support their claim but at this point you've been at your desk for 2 hours and haven't gotten any work done.)

I call this "asymmetrical warfact."
posted by MonkeyToes at 3:19 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


45% of white people are supporting Donald Trump to 33% for Clinton (Johnson 11%, Stein 4%). (source)

But sure, let's pile on those snake people who, for the most part, do not want a fascist to win the presidency.
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:23 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


It is time for the people with the "feelings" to realize they are based on nothing, and those who have notions to defend their claims

They aren’t exactly based on nothing - they’re based on a public figure acting in contradictory ways, one who fails to speak in sound bites. It’s been a cycle of distrust that has fed itself. However, I would love more coverage that assumes the distrust was born of hatred and not substance. The NPR politics podcast this week, for instance, continued the weird tack of acknowledging that candidates have been releasing their tax returns for years but hey, Clinton releasing her returns must have been done primarily as an opportunity to attack Trump and not, you know, because there are supposed to be rules. (Although, writing this, I can’t help but think that the running critique of Clinton is that she puts herself above the rules while, so often, Trump putting himself above the rules is just creating a radical new normal.)
posted by Going To Maine at 3:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Donald Trump Drops in for Louisiana Flood Photo Op After Governor Asks Him Not To, Because He Cares:
Donald Trump wins the thousand-meter Empty Show Of Compassion event today as he and running mate Mike Pence dropped in on Baton Rouge, Louisiana, to nod and look concerned about all the flooding. And also to sign some Make America Great Again hats, despite Gov. John Bel Edwards’s request that he not visit the state for political purposes.
posted by kirkaracha at 3:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


I liked Michael Baraboro’s attempt to investigate the issue on the August 15 episode of The Run-Up podcast. (“Why She’s Distrusted”) No link, though, since the NYT seems to be confining its podcast coverage to its RSS feed.

Is it this one? (Posted the 16th)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


"Don't bother the snakes."
posted by kirkaracha at 3:26 PM on August 19, 2016


"At the end of four years, I guarantee you I will get over 95 percent of the African-American vote. I promise you," Trump said during a rally today in Dimondale, Mich., a town where in 2010 just 9 of the town's 1,234 residents were black, according to census data.

Yes, not a speech aimed at African Americans, that's clear.

It is beyond laughable that he'll ever get much more than 1% of that bloc, for reasons well explained here.

Plus, I am pretty sure the Rs will do all they can to blot out the memory of the DJT name. So he'll have trouble being a nominee for any party, much less getting 95% of the vote from any group.

What a bold liar he continues to be.
posted by bearwife at 3:28 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Is it this one? (Posted the 16th)

Your search skills are better than mine! I don’t know that it’s great, necessarily -probably everyone will get mad at some portion of it- but I liked the attempt.
posted by Going To Maine at 3:30 PM on August 19, 2016


It's been said above and before but his "outreach to black voters " has **nothing at all** to do with black votes. It is an appeal to educated white suburban republicans to show that he is Not (crudely) Racist. And a wink at white supremacists since his "outreach"'consists of patronizing stereotypes.
posted by spitbull at 3:36 PM on August 19, 2016 [34 favorites]


Breaking: FBI investigating Manafort.

[real]
posted by spitbull at 3:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [22 favorites]


DJT: We're going to have adequate screaming.

[fake]
posted by salix at 3:45 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


despite Gov. John Bel Edwards’s request that he not visit the state for political purposes.

Which Hillary and Obama have respected, btw.
posted by leotrotsky at 3:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


I think a winning move for Clinton in the debates is, as soon as Trump says something horrible, to say:

"See, that's one of the many reasons Donald Trump is losing this race. The American people don't want a president who [whatever horrible thing Trump said]."

"The American people don't want a president who insults the families of our troops."
"The American people don't believe you when you say you can get Mexico to pay for a ridiculous wall between our countries."
"The American people aren't buying the snake oil you're trying to sell them."

She just needs to point out that he's losing. He'll burst into flames.
posted by straight at 3:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [35 favorites]


PUTTING DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTERS THROUGH AN IDEOLOGY TEST.

That is some quality old school Daily Show work there. Thanks, Talez.
posted by maryr at 3:48 PM on August 19, 2016


despite Gov. John Bel Edwards’s request that he not visit the state for political purposes.

Which Hillary and Obama have respected, btw.


HRC is raising money with her campaign mailing list for Louisiana relief. I just contributed via a link from her campaign's email.

I have not researched this but will bet DJT has neither contributed nor raised funds.
posted by bearwife at 3:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


I have not researched this but will bet DJT has neither contributed nor raised funds.

But he passed out Play-doh! Come on! That's as good as, right?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:59 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


But he unloaded a few boxes!
posted by maryr at 3:59 PM on August 19, 2016


But he passed out Play-doh! Come on! That's as good as, right?

God, the fucking Play-doh. Speaking as someone who was in the midst of terrible floods in Chennai, India last year, fuck Play-doh. Clean drinking water, non-perishable food supplies, generators - those were things we could have done with. Not Play-doh.
posted by peacheater at 4:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Wait - Play-doh isn't just the word used to describe what cans of relief food look like? Was he handing out actual play-doh?
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:04 PM on August 19, 2016


Was he handing out actual play-doh?

Yup. TBF I can see it being useful for keeping little ones' minds occupied.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


No it was literal-I-really-mean-literal-look-at-the-picture-not-like-chris-traeger "emergency play-doh" [real]
posted by zachlipton at 4:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Ah, add a little filé and play doh is fine.
posted by spitbull at 4:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


those were things we could have done with. Not Play-doh.

Yeah, that goes without saying. So we have two choices. Either a.) someone on Trump's team was told to go to WalMart and $500 worth of stuff for kids or b.) there was already a truck full of kid stuff sitting around somewhere and someone said, "Hey. Why don't we unload that stuff. It will make a great photo op."

I didn't see any food or flashlights or bottled water or anything useful-- just what looked like garishly bright boxes of toys.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Yeah I'm not opposed to some stuff that's good for kids who are putting up with a lot of awfulness, and it does sort of look like there was other stuff on the truck, but since the whole thing was a photo-op, his campaign had the bad sense to have him photographed wit play-doh instead of water or food or something life-sustaining.
posted by zachlipton at 4:08 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


It looked like the Play-Doh was packaged in boxes made to look like school buses, so yeah what do you want to bet some Trump Org back-to-school donation stuff just got abruptly repurposed
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:10 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Hey, Play-Doh is non-toxic, which basically means it's food, right?
posted by aubilenon at 4:12 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


DJT: [snip] Hillary is the defender of our status quo. Our country was losing, but she was cashing in. Bill was paid $50 million in speaking fees while she was Secretary. All the money funneled to the Clinton Foundation. It was pay for play.

Trump has stuck with this idea to ban spouses of government officials from accepting speaking fees. I know it's just a bludgeon to call Hillary crooked, but he needs to give that concept a catchy name like "extreme vetting" to give it legs. I suggest we call it The Ginni Thomas Rule.
posted by peeedro at 4:13 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


That implies Trump does back-to-school donations, and it's starting to look like he steadfastly avoids actually donating things that he owns. More likely there was a preschool that couldn't make rent so the real estate mogul evicted them and confiscated the Play-Doh.
posted by fragmede at 4:14 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


you gotta love how he bucket brigaded the Play-Doh with Pence to get it to where it was most urgently needed as swiftly as possible tho
posted by prize bull octorok at 4:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


No it was literal-I-really-mean-literal-look-at-the-picture-not-like-chris-traeger "emergency play-doh" [real]

But that's... I mean... THAT DOESN'T MAKE ANY FUCKING SENSE. No, no, that's a completely illogical action. That's a short-circuit Mudd's robots act of illogic. People have lost their homes. They only have essentials with them. How does this help? Now they need to find a place to put the fucking Play-doh. "Mommy, when can we go home?" "Someday, meanwhile, here's some Play-doh from Mr. Trump." "Mommy, when can we eat again?" "Someday, meanwhile, here's some Play-doh from Mr. Trump." I mean unless he's not giving it to people effected by the flood but instead giving it to all the people who have been inconvenienced by having people effected by the flood come into their neighborhoods for help. "Oh, man, I've been having to look at flood refugees all day... oh, wait! Look, Play-doh from Mr. Trump! My day is better now." This is an act so dumb that it strains the very limits of Trump's Razor. Play-doh is not needed here. Distributing Play-doh here is stupid. The choice to distribute it is stupid. Their presence there is stupid. Taking a photo of them doing this is marginally less stupid because it illustrates the stupidity but the stupid by this point has become so dense that a perfect black hole of dumb has formed. I am so fucking angry about this and this is such a minor thing but its so stupid and so emblematic of the stupid that is this giant orange play-doh golem of a candidate. Maybe he is actually Play-doh and he's distributing it because these are his spawns who will replace the humans he gives it to. I don't know. I can't believe how furious this makes me.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [51 favorites]


DJT: Many of you who think you have jobs, you're going to find out your company is leaving.

I thought this was a very interesting moment. He does like to use scare tactics as we saw at the RNC. Strike fear into their hearts and surely they will vote for the alpha-male authoritarian figure and not the old lady who needs pillows.

I really found the description of the African-American community to be appalling. To tell a crowd of white folk that the black kids are refuges? That black people have no jobs, their schools are no good and they are living in poverty. That's a mighty wide brush he is using to paint an entire race of people.

Then there was the strange, "the automobile industry, we call it the car industry." OK. Does he think that anyone in that crowd does not know the meaning of the word "automobile"? Is there another way to parse this? Who is "we" I guess is what I should be asking.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:19 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


Trump did insult Obama and sign hats. That beats donating as requested by a mile, no?
posted by bearwife at 4:20 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


The NPR politics podcast this week, for instance, continued the weird tack of acknowledging that candidates have been releasing their tax returns for years but hey, Clinton releasing her returns must have been done primarily as an opportunity to attack Trump and not, you know, because there are supposed to be rules.

This sort of shit has gotten really offensive to me, especially in light of the Sanders campaign running out the clock on having to disclose, as reported by the Center for Public Integrity - because the narrative is going to be that the candidate who actively prevented their tax returns from being made public will be the one with the reputation for transparency and the candidate who made sure that her returns were available will have the reputation for secretiveness.
posted by NoxAeternum at 4:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [35 favorites]


Say, is that a Play-Doh Fun FactoryTM I espy?

Job creator!
posted by Atom Eyes at 4:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


This is all so unbearably on the nose -- Trump is both corrupt and cheap. Of course he's trying to bribe the voters with play dough.

That and he seems to be low on the real stuff.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:23 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Maybe that's his friend's plant he keeps talking about.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


A colleague is heading to Louisiana from Florida for a conference, and her car is loaded up with crossword-puzzle books, board games, toys, etc. Displaced kids who have lost all their toys need stuff to play with. The Play-Doh thing is, like, fine. Geez. I'm sure Trump showed up somewhere and posed to look like he was helping unload whatever was being unloaded, which reasonably would have included Play-Doh. I seriously doubt he, or his campaign, donated the Play-Doh. But if they did, good for them. And that is the most I will ever stick up for Donald Trump, even if he rescues a kitten from cortex.
posted by Cookiebastard at 4:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


Trump-Doh only comes in classic angry orange. Always store Trump-Doh in a cool, dry place. Prolonged exposure to moisture and heat may result in strange fuzzy hairlike outgrowths.
posted by Hairy Lobster at 4:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Then there was the strange, "the automobile industry, we call it the car industry." OK. Does he think that anyone in that crowd does not know the meaning of the word "automobile"?

Trump did say he loves the "poorly educated." He's just adjusting his vocabulary to match.
posted by zachlipton at 4:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


LOL yeah the whole Bernie Sanders being the secretive candidate who won't disclose his financial statements thing is super hilarious to me. I guess he just hopes nobody cares? Eh, he's probably right actually.
posted by (Arsenio) Hall and (Warren) Oates at 4:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Guys, guys, Trump is playing 11 dimensional chess. Play doh was originally invented to clean wallpaper!!

[real]
posted by spitbull at 4:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Then there was the strange, "the automobile industry, we call it the car industry." OK. Does he think that anyone in that crowd does not know the meaning of the word "automobile"?

Trump did say he loves the "poorly educated." He's just adjusting his vocabulary to match.


Except literally everyone calls it the 'auto industry.' Especially auto workers.
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Then there was the strange, "the automobile industry, we call it the car industry." OK. Does he think that anyone in that crowd does not know the meaning of the word "automobile"? Is there another way to parse this?

Car = What normal regular working people call the thing they drive to work in.

Automobile = Term used by liberal technocrats and CFOs. You know...the ones profiting from shipping your jobs away.
posted by Thorzdad at 4:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


you gotta love how he bucket brigaded the Play-Doh with Pence to get it to where it was most urgently needed as swiftly as possible tho

Great chemistry between those two! Are they running mates or two random strangers in a bucket brigade?
posted by kirkaracha at 4:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Because all cars are automobiles, but not all automobiles are cars!
posted by spitbull at 4:30 PM on August 19, 2016


I don't know much about it, but I'm pretty sure everyone I've ever heard refer to the making of vehicles called it the 'Automotive Industry'. I've certainly never heard anyone say the 'car industry'.
posted by neonrev at 4:31 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Real play-doh. Diapers. Didn't see any canned goods.
posted by murphy slaw at 4:32 PM on August 19, 2016


I don't know if it makes a better story that someone else donated the stuff and Trump and Pence were just there to unload and have their pictures taken but that is one theory. I get that people do enjoy donating toys because they imagine that these poor children in shelters need something to keep them occupied but honestly if you and your family were displaced by flood waters would you want to have toys for the kids handed to you or food, water, first aid stuff, clothes, and shoes? Maybe some vouchers. Maybe a flashlight. Bug spray. Grooming items.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump had to give play-doh because we gave all of our SUITCASES FULL OF MONEY to IRAN.
posted by acidic at 4:36 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


The last time I really got into it with my dad re: his unshakeable belief in Hillary Clinton's strangely unprovable but somehow incredibly obvious 'corruption,' I eventually threw up my hands and said "you know what? no matter how many times she gets investigated, they all end up the same way" and concluded with this gif. and I think that gif is going to be my only response, from here on out.
posted by nonasuch at 4:36 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


Play-Doh smells delicious
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Watch CNN's Brianna Keilar Explain To A Trump Advisor That Speaking To White Voters Is Not Black Outreach
KEILAR: I have to stop you because you said he's going there. He's not, he's in Diamondale, which is 93 percent white. When he was in Milwaukee the other day, it was part of Milwaukee that wasn't dealing -- I mean he, it's --

KINGSTON: Well yeah, but Brianna he went --

KEILAR: It's almost completely white.

KINGSTON: I mean, maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car, but the reality is --

KEILAR: No no no no no, I'm not talking about a burning car. I'm talking about meeting with black voters.

KINGSTON: Well, he met with David Clarke, who as you know is the African-American Sheriff of Milwaukee, and he's engaged with him.
Guys! Trump talked to that one black guy-- you know, the one who stands for all the African-Americans in the US.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [40 favorites]


if you and your family were displaced by flood waters would you want to have toys for the kids handed to you or food, water, first aid stuff...

Yes. Toys. My colleague (see above) brought all that stuff by request from her friends and their neighbors who were displaced. It's not either-or. People are donating food, water, first-aid stuff too. I love to rag on Trump as much as anyone, but yes, little kids need toys to play with when their life is turned upside down.
posted by Cookiebastard at 4:43 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Joey Michaels: Thank you for your continued service, ChurchHatesTucker. If only I had some of Superplin's guacamole, I might be able to watch some of these things myself.

I love that my guacamole has become the official comfort food for election-induced emotional eating for 2016. I'm very proud!
(I do make pretty great guacamole, if I do say so myself.)
posted by Superplin at 4:44 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


I am not what you'd call proud of this, but but the only way I could work through my Play-doh anger was through creating a hastily made meme.

Also, I made a donation to the Red Cross because food and medicine > Play-doh.
posted by Joey Michaels at 4:45 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car

TRUMP CAMPAIGN BLACK OUTREACH STRATEGY REVEALED; AUTO INSURERS ISSUE PROTEST [fake]
posted by snuffleupagus at 4:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


KINGSTON: I mean, maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car, but the reality is --


Wow, that just there speaks volumes. Trump's advisor is asked why he's not speaking to black voters, and immediately jumps to burning cars.

These people just have the worst ideas about huge segments of Americans don't they?

Hillary's campaign is going after him for it:
Hillary Clinton's account: This is so ignorant it's staggering.

Trump questions the citizenship of the first black president, courts white supremacists, and has been sued for housing discrimination.

posted by peacheater at 4:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [56 favorites]


Rob Ford also practiced this form of "your schools suck, most of you are unemployed, your children would be dead or in jail without me and nobody supports the black youth more than I do" style of black outreach. Ford's efforts were more successful than Trump's thus far.
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:47 PM on August 19, 2016


Kingston assumes that all black neighborhoods have burning cars in view no matter which way you point the camera.
posted by EarBucket at 4:48 PM on August 19, 2016 [16 favorites]


Slate: Trump to Black Voters: You’re Poor, So Why the Hell Don’t You Vote for Me
Never mind that Trump—who recently polled at 1 percent among black voters in a nationwide survey—was treating black people as a monolithic group of poor, unemployed people. His ad-libbed “what the hell do you have to lose” line sounded very much like Trump thinks he knows what’s better for black voters than they know for themselves.
I almost feel like Trump is actually baffled why he can't get the black vote-- they are such losers so why wouldn't they want to win? [fake but a paraphrase]
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:49 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


pretty neat trick to be incredibly racist in the middle of someone explaining to you how your african-american outreach sucks
posted by murphy slaw at 4:50 PM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


Donald Trump's first ad buy of 2016 general election will air in NC
According to political website The Hill, the ad buy is $4 million, including $838,000 in NC. The ad will run from Friday, August 19 through Monday, August 29.

People in Asheville had mixed reactions to the ad.

"Scares the hell out of me," Robin Stevens said, referring to Trump himself, not the ad. Stevens lives in West Asheville. He moved to the area in 2006 from his native England. "I am scared of Donald Trump. He just seems unstable to me. He's using fear to get people to vote for him. I just picture his two fingers on the nuclear button, and I definitely want Hillary's finger on it. I don't want his."

"He's a fearmonger," Linda Ayers, a visitor to Asheville from her home in Charlotte, said.
No doubt I'll catch a glimpse of this at the gym. That's the only place I ever see live TV.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 4:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


> pretty neat trick to be incredibly racist in the middle of someone explaining to you how your african-american outreach sucks

Every time something like this happens (outside party explains to a Trump team member that their approach is counterproductive, idiotic, or offensive), I'm torn between relief that someone is pointing out the obvious huge wrong thing, on the one hand, and anxiety that someone is offering them suggestions about how to reach people more effectively, on the other.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 4:56 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Don't people realize that Trump's promises are meaningless? He promises whatever the audience wants to hear. If in one breath he promises he will win 95% of black voters votes in 4 years (which is absurd) and in another breath he promises to protect your job, how do people not put 2 and 2 together and realize that he is exactly as likely to do the second as the first? How do they not see that every promise he makes is bullshit? It's meaningless circus barker patter.
posted by Justinian at 4:56 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


KINGSTON: She didn't go to the Fraternal Order of Police. She won't say three words: Blue Lives Matter.

Why the fuck would she do those things to reach out to black voters?
Also, she won't say the magic phrase! Like she won't say radical Islamic terrorism!
posted by kirkaracha at 4:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Trumps African American voter outreach strategy can be summed up in one word: negging.

At least, that's how it appears to me.
posted by nubs at 4:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


Again, Trump has zero interest In "the black vote." He isnt trying to get it. Mocking him for failing to do so misses his entire point. The burning car image invoked by Kingston is strategically targeted to white suburban republicans. Period.

Don't play into his con game.
posted by spitbull at 5:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


Trumps African American voter outreach strategy can be summed up in one word: negging.

FTFY
posted by fragmede at 5:02 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]




I just picture his two fingers on the nuclear button, and I definitely want Hillary's finger on it.

'Cause it would take two of his tiny fingers to press it, while Hillary just needs one.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:03 PM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]


KINGSTON: I mean, maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car, but the reality is --

Goddamn these people, seriously. This is so fucking depressing.
posted by sallybrown at 5:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [28 favorites]


Trump: I'll get 95 percent support from black voters in 2020

Ummm, you forgot the [real] tag.

Here's another beauty:

Trump pitches black voters: 'What the hell do you have to lose?' [REAL!]
posted by zakur at 5:08 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


From CNN, Bakari Sellers and Trump apologist Kayleigh McEnany:
“I guarantee you if you go into the inner cities and ask the people who live there, ‘Are you better off today than you were eight years ago?’ the answer is absolutely not,” McEnany stated, causing Sellers to jump in.

“I’m going to throw this out there. I’m going to be pretty blunt” he began. “I’m African-American, we did know that? And so I live in these communities, I am part of this community. And what Donald Trump said today, his plea was that ‘You know what, what else do you have to lose?’ It was very naive, it was very insulting, because the fact of the matter is that Donald Trump has no comprehension of intersectionality. The fact is, you don’t have a comprehension of intersectionality.”

Sellers attempted to tick off the systemic problems facing black in the U.S. only to have McEnany jump in saying, “You’re making my point!”

“No, I’m actually not making your point,” Sellers shot back.

“Because of the simple fact that Donald Trump can’t comprehend that,” he then continued. “You cannot say that of someone who got sued twice by the Department of Justice for failure to rent to African-Americans. You can’t say that of someone who took out a pro-death penalty piece for the Central Park five. You can’t simply say that somebody who started the birther movement all of the sudden cares about intersectionality and African-Americans!” (source)
posted by erisfree at 5:10 PM on August 19, 2016 [74 favorites]


After the years and years, and millions and millions the Republicans have spent investigating her, either there's really nothing there or she's Keyser Soze. And if she's Keyser Soze, isn't that the kind of get-it-done genius you want working for you?

Eh, I view the argument "Republicans say this is bad, therefore it's good" as an almost indirect ad hominem. Just because the Republicans view something as wrong doesn't mean they're viewing it as wrong, it's possible just as with a multitude of issues, they view it wrong in all of the incorrect and wrong ways, and bark up all of the wrong trees in their pursuit of finding it wrong in a way compatible to their worldviews.

Regarding Keyser Soze, Clinton's probably closer to him than Obama was, given her experience. She's probably more politically experienced than Bill was back when he first ran. And definitely more experienced than Carter. She'll either be a new LBJ or a Democratic equivalent to Nixon, which isn't really a moral judgment so much as an assessment on her experience and abilities.
posted by Apocryphon at 5:11 PM on August 19, 2016


I think she'll be Hillary Clinton and I remain excited.
posted by meinvt at 5:14 PM on August 19, 2016 [67 favorites]


After he has attacked and promised to make terrible things happen to every OTHER 'minority' group, his advisors thought "how do we get 'tolerance' and 'minority support' props? How about making supportive noises to the Blacks? I mean 'African Americans'... is that hyphenated?" [hypothetical]

As for Trump "rebuilding cities", oh, like he Rebuilt Atlantic City? (insert pic of torn-down casino)
posted by oneswellfoop at 5:18 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump has stuck with this idea to ban spouses of government officials from accepting speaking fees.

I suspect this runs smack into freedom of speech etc issues, under the same logic that California bans most non-compete clauses in its employment contracts.

Even if the definition of "government official" were limited to "those who are banned by law from accepting speaking fees" (like congresspeople; I couldn't find documentation on whether the president can get paid for external work - I'd assume not, but googling turns up a swarm of junk about Michelle's income and Bill's more recent speaking fees), there's no legal background for saying, "if your job is X, your spouse's job cannot be Y."

There's plenty for, "if your job is X, you must comply with certain security protocols," which may involve your spouse not being permitted to speak in some settings - but that's not the same as "your spouse can't do a book tour and get paid for it."

(Of course, he wasn't talking about book tours... but there's no legal difference between "paid $150k to speak at a university" and "paid $500 + lunch to speak at a bookshop.")

Plenty of spouses of gov't officials have careers of their own, and would be paid as speakers for reasons not connected to their marriage... but Trump can't even imagine that; he can't wrap his head around a marriage that doesn't have one person in charge and the other as an adjunct.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:19 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Is this some sort of meme I'm unaware of?

Donald J. Trump ‏@realDonaldTrump 4m4 minutes ago
#WheresHillary? Sleeping!!!!!
posted by waitangi at 5:22 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Really can't wait for the genderswapped House of Cards parodies. Or maybe House of Cards crossed with Parks and Rec mashups.
posted by Apocryphon at 5:24 PM on August 19, 2016


We'll have one country. Everyone will work together. We'll emphasize what we have in common. Every American will be protected, honored equally. Our common culture values as one American people.

Ein Reich, ein volk...
posted by Sauce Trough at 5:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


I couldn't find documentation on whether the president can get paid for external work

I don't know specifically for the President, but most (maybe all) federal employees cannot be paid for external work that relates to their federal job. When you're the President, I imagine it's hard to find something that doesn't relate.
posted by sallybrown at 5:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


They kiiiiind of want the Presidency to be your only job.
posted by Pope Guilty at 5:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


Is this some sort of meme I'm unaware of?

There's apparently a whole thing about how Clinton is tired/ill/etc. Don't think too hard about it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:29 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Just donated to both the Baton Rouge Area Foundation and HFA again because fuck that guy and his blatant paternalistic racism with side order of white supremacist dog-whistling and fuck his disaster tourism.

This bullshit is bullshit not because it's inept but because it's not meant to woo black voters in any way, shape or form. It's 1000% to make racists feel like they're Not Really Capital-R Racist (spoiler alert: they are). And towards that goal it may be somewhat effective because the thing that every racist wants to believe about themselves is that they're not a racist. It's more telling people what they want to hear.
posted by soren_lorensen at 5:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [25 favorites]


Trump signed hats and shook hands, but turned down a plate of jambalaya.

He missed a trick there.
posted by Autumn Leaf at 5:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Really can't wait for the genderswapped House of Cards parodies. Or maybe House of Cards crossed with Parks and Rec mashups.

Or the unexpected sequel to Primary Colors.
posted by ZeusHumms at 5:33 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Again, Trump has zero interest In "the black vote." He isnt trying to get it. Mocking him for failing to do so misses his entire point. The burning car image invoked by Kingston is strategically targeted to white suburban republicans.

Yeah- I think the "Mr. Brexit" tweet is starting to make sense after seeing his speech locations and the first official TV ad.

They're trying to recreate a victory by pulling enough older rural and suburban racists and xenophobes out of the woodwork to magically upset the poll numbers. Probably much harder in the US with the electoral college system (granted I know nothing about the UK voting system), but they're undoubtedly more than happy to just lose and go back to peddling racist news to racists anyways.

I really hope their campaign at least pretends to address some other issues though. It's hard to stomach all the law and order racist fear mongering.
posted by p3t3 at 5:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


So why do I bother trying to counter this? I guess I'm just tired of seeing all the Clinton hate out there.

I've tended to respond with my enthusiasm, personally. My glee over the DNC being so diverse and so focused on access along multiple axes. The focus on getting voters to the polls no matter what. Clinton helping that gentleman in New York when she was a Senator and he was put into collections after a major health scare while trying to recover. Her cool, supportive relationships with other Democratic Women. The number of diverse people in her team. The way she included a bunch of artists in making her swag. Sometimes I add in being pissed - like the cookie nonsense, or how everyone calls her suits "pants suits" because the attacks on her started when women were expected to wear skirts in a work environment.

It's worked pretty well for me with Bernie enthusiasts.
posted by Deoridhe at 5:35 PM on August 19, 2016 [28 favorites]


Given the ubiquity of video on phones, instead of a still photo op, isn't there anyone who could show us precisely how many seconds Trump and Pence spent grimly loading a truck, from start to finish? Instead of click, I've got it, okay were done here.

Reminds me of 2012 when Paul Ryan stopped into a restaurant, put on an apron, and washed one pot that was already clean.
posted by JackFlash at 5:35 PM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


It's a self-link of sorts, but I put together a blog post about my DNC and Hillary enthusiasm that might help people wanting to bolster their enthusiasm with examples.
posted by Deoridhe at 5:37 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Don't people realize that Trump's promises are meaningless? He promises whatever the audience wants to hear.

But that's what people want. They want some kind of gesture, even if it's an empty one, to say "I'm going to bring you a better life." It's like when someone says "oh, you look so great!" It's a polite white lie, and one that Trump has been shockingly unable to do. Just say a positive thing you're going to do, say that you have good wishes for all people. Trump's failure to do even this basic function has probably been incredibly frustrating to Republican pols.

Now that he's doing so, nominally at least and in speeches, we're going to see more of a race. At least while he maintains his focus.

And Hillary has to come up with a juicier offer.
posted by argybarg at 5:40 PM on August 19, 2016


Or the unexpected sequel to Primary Colors.

I feel like reading about this election is going to be my lifelong addiction, the way some people (ahem my mother) buy every book or magazine (especially "commemorative issues") relating to the Kennedys. I can't wait for Barron's tell-all. (And the special edition 20th anniversary Metafilter election thread 2016 coffee table book.)
posted by sallybrown at 5:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


Heard just now on MSNBC: he spent 49 seconds unloading the truck.
posted by spitbull at 5:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [30 favorites]


Well, that's twice as long as I would have guessed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 5:43 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Oh good, Trump got his phone back. (Seems to be accusing Hillary of consorting with the enemy.*)

*pillows
posted by sallybrown at 5:43 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]




the special edition 20th anniversary Metafilter election thread 2016 coffee table book

Which is a book that doubles as a coffee table.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:47 PM on August 19, 2016 [56 favorites]


most (maybe all) federal employees cannot be paid for external work that relates to their federal job. When you're the President, I imagine it's hard to find something that doesn't relate.

Congressfolk have specific limits on external income:
A Member may not receive compensation for affiliating with or being employed by a firm, partnership, association, corporation, or other entity providing professional services involving a fiduciary relationship; allowing his/her name to be used by such a firm, partnership, association, corporation, or other entity; practicing a profession involving a fiduciary relationship; serving as a member or officer of the board of an association, corporation, or other entity; and teaching without prior notification to and approval of [appropriate committee].
Emphasis added - I want to know if similar/same rules apply to the president, because that seems like it'd be very problematic for Trump.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 5:47 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Given the ubiquity of video on phones, instead of a still photo op, isn't there anyone who could show us precisely how many seconds Trump and Pence spent grimly loading a truck, from start to finish? Instead of click, I've got it, okay were done here.

Joy Reid had the tape on tonight's All In -- 47 seconds. Trump and Pence unloaded play-doh for 47 seconds.

(Joy Reid needs to be bumped up to a regular prime time slot.)
posted by nathan_teske at 5:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [23 favorites]


I've always gone under the assumption that PUAs use negging not because it is so much more effective than witty banter, compliments, and good listening skills, but because they enjoy the process more. It allows them to keep their disgust for the people that they want to have sex with and when someone does fall for that-- it is that much sweeter to bed someone you have torn down.

That is how I feel about Trump. I don't think he likes his voters. He has called them losers, uneducated, and he retains so much power over them he can "stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters." [all real] I honestly think he isn't courting the black vote-- otherwise he would talk to black groups, but I sense that he thinks their vote is beneath him and not worth trying to get.

he spent 49 seconds unloading the truck.

Hey 49 seconds is a long time when you are an unfit, 70 year old man in a jacket toiling away under the Louisiana sun in August.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


- I want to know if similar/same rules apply to the president, because that seems like it'd be very problematic for Trump.

Come on down to President Trump's President's Day Sale at Hot Carl's Used Cars and Leather Emporium!
posted by Existential Dread at 5:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Who's going to enforce those rules? The GOP Congress? The US Attorney, Chris Christie?
posted by T.D. Strange at 5:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


By the way, the answer to Where is Hillary? Sleeping!!!!! is: Hillary and Bill Clinton are having dinner on Martha's Vineyard to celebrate his 70th birthday, per an aide.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:53 PM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]




President Trump Presents Mesopotamian Mess II: This Time It's Syria(ous)

I'm deeply sorry
posted by Existential Dread at 5:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


> Just say a positive thing you're going to do, say that you have good wishes for all people. Trump's failure to do even this basic function has probably been incredibly frustrating to Republican pols.

Now that he's doing so, nominally at least and in speeches, we're going to see more of a race. At least while he maintains his focus.

And Hillary has to come up with a juicier offer.


This is not a dig at you, because I think you're probably right, but...damn, what an amazing example of sexism and male privilege. All Trump has to do is go a day an hour ten minutes without saying or doing anything outrageously sexist and/or racist and that's enough to potentially* level the electoral playing field with a former Secretary Of State who happens to be a woman.

* I mean, I think that's their strategy, or one of them anyway. Who can tell, really?
posted by The Card Cheat at 5:58 PM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


With Paul Manafort Gone, Who's Left to Run Donald Trump's Campaign?
With the resignation of campaign chairman Paul Manafort, the Trump campaign is now without a single senior figure who has ever run a campaign.

Donald Trump's team has always been a lean operation fueled by the candidate himself rather than the organization around him, but from the very beginning the Trump campaign included people who had at least some experience running political campaigns.

But now the top ranks of the team include family members, conservative media executive Stephen Bannon and Republican pollster Kellyanne Conway, the new campaign manager.

None of them have experience managing a campaign. And aside from Conway, who is widely respected in Republican circles and spokesman Jason Miller who formerly served as Ted Cruz’s spokesman, the Trump campaign inner circle is now without anybody with significant ties to the what was once known as the leadership of the Republican party.
Expect to see many more handing-out-play-doh-to-flood-victims type photo ops. The trump train is running full steam ahead but there is no one at the controls.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


got back from a trump protest in minneapolis. it was a little subdued due to the weather but we got to shout and shame a few supporters/$1000-$100,000 per platers as they entered the private event to give money to the vulgar talking yam who is so rich he doesn't need their money, but he'll take their money.

had one interaction with a trump supporter former bernie supporter and although it was completely maddening, like trying to argue with a cloud, it gave me a bit of insight into this alter-reality overtaking a large portion of this country.

all in all the whole thing just made me incredibly sad.
posted by localhuman at 6:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [15 favorites]


According to the Guardian, Trump was touring flooded Louisiana in an 18 wheeler full of supplies including water and diapers.
Wherever he went, he created his own television-ready crowds. In St Amant, one of the hardest-hit areas between Baton Rouge and New Orleans, Trump’s convoy set up in a parking lot, and droves of people turned out to watch him hand out water bottles and diapers.

“It was really something,” said national guardsman Chris Ealy, who shook Trump’s hand. The 25-year-old seemed dazzled by his encounter with national political machinery. “I could tell they were in a hurry.”

Trump stayed about 15 minutes before the motorcade of black SUVs and motorcycles moved on. Within a few minutes the crowd had melted away.

The brevity of the spectacle didn’t matter. Trump’s target audience was watching him on television; local people will vote for him regardless.

“This is his stomping grounds,” said Greg Patterson, who was cleaning muck from his store called the Pit Stop. The idea that a billionaire from Manhattan could describe the working-class corner of Louisiana as “his stomping grounds” did not strike Patterson as contradictory.
I don't even know what they mean by "this is his stomping grounds."

I don't think this got him any new voters:
As Trump left the area, police closed down Interstate 10, which connects Baton Rouge and New Orleans. As his motorcade passed by, drivers in the oncoming lane slammed on their brakes, unsure whether to pull to the side of the road. Some veered off into the grass and mud.
This is exactly why the President did not go to Louisiana. Trump had to have a police motorcade which was probably not the best use of their time.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:09 PM on August 19, 2016 [21 favorites]


Reminds me of 2012 when Paul Ryan stopped into a restaurant, put on an apron, and washed one pot that was already clean.

If it is the same photo-op, I remember that too, but it was worse. It was at a homeless shelter and they were not amused.
posted by lampshade at 6:10 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]




Trump bashes — and exploits — the news media
it was not at all surprising where he defined journalists’ status in the universe in his Erie rally. “These people are the lowest form of life, I’m telling you,” he said. “They are the lowest form of humanity.”

For Trump, the news media are like the polls: wonderful when they accommodate his craving for self-aggrandizement, tools of a rigged system when they dare to expose something other than the reality he is trying to create.

Note the sharp reduction in Trump mentions of the polls. In one 30-day stretch over the primary season, he shot out more than 100 tweets about his poll numbers, and bragged about them at almost every rally. Today, to the extent he mentions polls, it is to question their methodology and to suggest that they are missing the waves of support for his candidacy. “They will soon be calling me Mr. Brexit!” he tweeted Thursday.
Hilarious! Giuliani on Trump's La. Visit: 'More Presidential Than the President'

Yeah because riding around in an 18 wheeler with a police escort, handing out stuff to random people at random stops is so much more presidential than immediately sending FEMA in and staying away as requested by the Governor.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Well, the anti-NAFTA, all your factories will come home, we're gonna beat ISIS real quick stuff is going to be persuasive to some people. I think what will happen under President Trump is a return to old style protectionist trade wars will crash the economy, and he's going to find that all the easy common sense ideas to fight ISIS are already being done, so he instead will start another futile war, probably in Syria. But the idea that there are simple solutions, and the only reason they haven't been implemented is the feckless and corrupt insider government of elitists, will always have some legs.
posted by thelonius at 6:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Egg Mcmuffin anecdata: I grew up in Utah and am Facebook friends with a number of Mormon Utahns and have been seeing a lot of pro Evan McMullin articles posted and receiving many likes.
posted by Waiting for Pierce Inverarity at 6:22 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


yes, thelonius. I linked to an article yesterday that showed that Trump's 14 point plan to rescue the VA was mostly stuff that had been tried before and failed. That's what happens when you get someone who thinks he knows all the answers but has never actually governed before.

Quick side note: Federal judge refers Sheriff Joe Arpaio for criminal contempt

That's good because I certainly do find him contemptible.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:23 PM on August 19, 2016 [20 favorites]


Well, the anti-NAFTA, all your factories will come home, we're gonna beat ISIS real quick stuff is going to beHAS BEEN persuasive to some people.
That's his <40% polling base. His only hope for catching up to Hillary is an all-out attack campaign aided by Russian hackers 'leaking' carefully chosen/altered embarrassing content against her. And he may have less of a connection to them now with Manafort leaving the campaign.
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:24 PM on August 19, 2016


"At the end of four years, I guarantee you I will get over 95 percent of the African-American vote. I promise you," Trump said during a rally today in Dimondale, Mich., a town where in 2010 just 9 of the town's 1,234 residents were black, according to census data.

Functionally, Dimondale is South Lansing. It's not like a small town in the middle of nowhere. I live in a different Lansing adjunct community, and if you'd asked me to describe where Trump was speaking, I'd have called it Lansing. There are roughly 30,000 black people in Lansing, and they are definitely bearing the brunt of shitty schools, rising crime, city budget cuts, job loss, falling home values, and drug incursions.

I watched part of the speech. I was darkly amused that Trump was promising to keep automotive jobs in Michigan, because that horse left the barn a long time ago. There are big chunks of Lansing that are wastelands where auto plants used to be.
posted by not that girl at 6:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


If I find out where the Clintons had din din I'll leave a clue. We drove past the armored SUV yesterday, as it was positioning right in front of the straunt. Journalists, spooks everywhere.
posted by vrakatar at 6:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


my favorite part of trump's plans is where he promises to put a moratorium on regulations to get the government out of the way of business and then with his next breath he says his administration won't let businesses take jobs out of the country. presumably through some non-regulatory mechanism? like maybe using the army i guess? anyway it's gonna be great.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:29 PM on August 19, 2016 [22 favorites]


@realDonaldTrump #WheresHillary? Sleeping!!!!!
Hillary and Bill Clinton are having dinner on Martha's Vineyard to celebrate his 70th birthday, per an aide.

So Sleeping!!!!! With Bill!!!!!
posted by oneswellfoop at 6:29 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


if you'd asked me to describe where Trump was speaking, I'd have called it Lansing. There are roughly 30,000 black people in Lansing

Not a lot of them hanging around the ice rink on a typical day, much less an ice rink that's hosting a Trump rally.
posted by Etrigan at 6:31 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


A lot could happen between now and November, but maybe the Hillary people think their odds are so overwhelmingly good they can be complacent, and just plowing ahead and going after fence-sitting Republicans who are reluctant about Trump is what they think is the best way to go.

What Clinton has already offered liberal millennials: almost everything they said they liked about Sanders. Except not being Hillary Clinton.

What Clinton has offered fence-sitting Republicans: not a goddam thing except not being Trump.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [73 favorites]


There are big chunks of Lansing that are wastelands yt where auto plants used to be.

Is there much in Lansing these days except MSU and the state government?
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:38 PM on August 19, 2016


What Clinton has already offered liberal millennials: almost everything they said they liked about Sanders. Except not being Hillary Clinton.

Well, there you go. If she was serious about courting the remaining disaffected Busters, she'd just stop being Hillary Clinton.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:39 PM on August 19, 2016 [24 favorites]


Well, there you go. If she was serious about courting the remaining disaffected Busters, she'd just stop being Hillary Clinton.

I would totally vote for Chillary Hinton.
posted by Pope Guilty at 6:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


> “It was really something,” said national guardsman Chris Ealy, who shook Trump’s hand. The 25-year-old seemed dazzled by his encounter with national political machinery. “I could tell they were in a hurry.”

Oh, I bet Trump was in a hurry, but not for the reasons you think. Every personal interaction he has with the public is probably followed by something like the end of this scene.

Don't sleep on Michael Caine as a potential filmic Trump. His part here was basically the closest thing we'll ever get to a live-action version of Mr. Burns.
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


What Clinton has already offered liberal millennials: almost everything they said they liked about Sanders. Except not being Hillary Clinton.

Well, there you go. If she was serious about courting the remaining disaffected Busters, she'd just stop being Hillary Clinton

All she needs are groucho glasses.
posted by Going To Maine at 6:43 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'm heading out tomorrow to do canvassing for the first time! Any advice/tips/links would be much appreciated.
posted by ilicet at 6:45 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


If we are indeed actually living in a computer simulation we may have reached the point where its creator has gone all Breaking Madden on us.

The Card Cheat, I cannot favorite this enough (maybe we need superfavorites!), I have made that parallel in my head so many times. The last few weeks have felt like time is broken. Hence my poor contributions to these threads, which end up as more metacommentary and not adding substance to any discussion outside the oh god how fucked up ribbons that seem to connect all of it. It's been my own personal Vs the Arrow of Time.
posted by rp at 6:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Wow this campaign shakeup with tradin out Boris Yellsome with The Bright Bart is producing quite the neck-and-neck race we televsion veiwers have come to expect from a professional pres-ee-dential type campaign. With the photo-ops and the fact-based talkin like.
posted by petebest at 6:57 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Watch CNN's Brianna Keilar Explain To A Trump Advisor That Speaking To White Voters Is Not Black Outreach

Brianna Keilar has been on fire lately. First Shapiro, then Kingston. Who's the next idiot surrogate to let her point out them putting their feet square in their mouth?
posted by Talez at 7:07 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Every time I read Bannon my mind's internal voice changes to Seinfeld saying, "Bania!"
posted by maggieb at 7:13 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


I mean, maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car, but the reality is --

I know we've moved on, but omg I can't even...
posted by maggiemaggie at 7:13 PM on August 19, 2016 [20 favorites]


“These people are the lowest form of life, I’m telling you,” he said. “They are the lowest form of humanity.”

Maybe this could be an election of speaking up for reporters, too. It's not a job people do for the money. It's incredibly important, sometimes heroic. And if you want to come for anyone else, reporters are the ones you come for first.

Amid all the other horrible stuff, let's not forget just how wrong this is.
posted by john hadron collider at 7:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [33 favorites]


Other people have picked up on the burning car bit.
posted by peacheater at 7:22 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


He unloaded Play-Doh for 47 seconds "for flood victims". The floor of my expectations has been shattered yet again. That's like nine times so far this campaign. What's next? Are we gonna find out that Trump pocketed $10,000 from Hasbro for handing out the Play-Doh?
posted by Mister Fabulous at 7:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


I think the former Georgia congressman was actually implying that black people are big 80s synthpop fans and may have preferred a backdrop of John Foxx's Burning Car video.
posted by p3t3 at 7:35 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Here's the good news: even if Trump stays totally on message for the rest of the campaign (and he won't), and everyone forgets about everything he said before (and they won't), and everyone doesn't bother to notice that he has no actual policies that make any sense (and I hope they won't), the orbit of idiots around him will continue to say awful things like suggesting that outreach to black voters involves a backdrop of burning cars or that you can't rape your spouse or just batshit stupid things like the exchange that prompted "polls, most of them, all of them."

Trump's motley crew of advisors can generate enough negative press for the campaign even if the guy never opens his mouth or tweets again.
posted by zachlipton at 7:35 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Not to mention that if Trump moderates his message or tries to appeal to a wider audience, he'll drive off some of his more extreme supporters, or at least make them lose some enthusiasm.

That's the problem with starting out so extreme - if you don't back down you never appeal to the center, and if you do back down you not only lose the fringe, you can't really get the center either because your opponent can always just keep bringing back up the things you said before.
posted by Mitrovarr at 7:39 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Don't sleep on Michael Caine as a potential filmic Trump. His part here was basically the closest thing we'll ever get to a live-action version of Mr. Burns.

I saw a tweet earlier that I can't find that said only Divine could play Trump.
posted by Uncle at 7:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [10 favorites]


Michele Bachmann is apparently advising Trump on foreign policy.
posted by peacheater at 7:42 PM on August 19, 2016 [18 favorites]


Hannity just lauded Trump for having "the best week since the convention." Aim high!

Immediately followed by Michael Cohen saying that Donald Trump is the "best dealmaker ... in the history of the world."
posted by gatorae at 7:43 PM on August 19, 2016


>Every time I read Bannon my mind's internal voice changes to Seinfeld saying, "Bania!"

Every time I see the name "Bannon" I start to hum the theme to a 70's detective show.

(Waka-chika waka-chika)
posted by octobersurprise at 7:45 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


He unloaded Play-Doh for 47 seconds "for flood victims". The floor of my expectations has been shattered yet again. That's like nine times so far this campaign. What's next? Are we gonna find out that Trump pocketed $10,000 from Hasbro for handing out the Play-Doh?

The corollary to Trump's Razor- ie the stupidest thing possible is always the truth, is that "the stupidest thing possible" is a moving target with no known lower bound.
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


Michele Bachmann is apparently advising Trump on foreign policy.

Oh my gawd.

All the Republican crazy are being called home to their arch-loon.

I feel... not bad, necessarily, for non-crazy Republicans (because seriously where have you been the past couple decades as the party was allowing this to happen) but this must be pretty cringe-inducing to watch if once upon a time you actually thought this was a party of sane grown-ups.
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:46 PM on August 19, 2016 [19 favorites]


Clinton only 85% to win on 538 now! Doom! Doom!

(I am going to feel happier next time he is called out on some obviously awful thing)
posted by Artw at 7:51 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Every time I see the name "Bannon" I start to hum the theme to a 70's detective show.

A Quinn Martin Production.
posted by bongo_x at 7:53 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


Trump pitches black voters: 'What the hell do you have to lose?'

From the Slate article:
"At the end of four years, I guarantee you that I will get 95 percent of the African-American vote,” he said.
Is there any way to logically parse this quotation (based on the available evidence of Trump's attitudes and policies) that doesn't sound like he's threatening genocide?
posted by Strange Interlude at 7:54 PM on August 19, 2016 [11 favorites]


See, I just go right to the Jonny Quest place. There's a joke there somewhere, but I think Racist Bannon is too on the nose.
posted by nonasuch at 7:55 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Is there any way to logically parse this quotation (based on the available evidence of Trump's attitudes and policies) that doesn't sound like he's threatening genocide?

Let's not lose our heads. He could merely be promising mass disenfranchisement.
posted by gerryblog at 7:56 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


Michele Bachmann is apparently advising Trump on foreign policy.

With these crazy eyes
One look at you
And you can't disguise
those crazy eyes
I feel the magic between you and I
posted by octobersurprise at 7:56 PM on August 19, 2016


It's actually probably not ridiculous to donate children's toys to people who have been forced from their homes. Also, you can eat Play-Doh if you get too hungry; it's non-toxic. Says so right on the tin.
posted by thelonius at 8:02 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Let's not lose our heads. He could merely be promising mass disenfranchisement.

Nah. He's just saying that, under a Trump administration, all minorities will be absolutely free to vote. As their owners dictate.
posted by Thorzdad at 8:03 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


kirkaracha: [Play-doh Fun Factory] Maybe that's his friend's plant he keeps talking about.

I would love if Trump met a kid in Mexico once, when he was doing some weird "pass out someone else's donations" photo shoot, and he happened to hand that kid a Play-doh Fun Factory.

Because I would love if that kid would be Donnie's emissary to the maquiladoras, especially with the idea that he's talked with his factory friend in Mexico about moving work back into the US.

"Joey, have you talked to your people about my proposal to build the wall and move jobs back into the US?"
"Tienes mas Play-doh, Señor Trump?"
"What did he say?"
*Assistant translates*
"Oh right, here you go."
"Gracias!"

Trump Press Release: "I have huge support with my friends in Mexico, and they support my proposals to build a wall that they'll pay for, and they understand that their days of taking our jobs are over."
posted by filthy light thief at 8:04 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Well to be fair, he only needs 95% of 3/5 of the current black vote.
posted by spitbull at 8:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Is there any way to logically parse this quotation (based on the available evidence of Trump's attitudes and policies) that doesn't sound like he's threatening genocide?

Well, I kind of assumed he was talking about instituting sham elections.
posted by Mitrovarr at 8:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


The idea of giving toys makes a lot of sense. But I think it supports the idea that Trump didn't really take care of his kids when they were young. I can't imagine most parents with no fixed place to live want a toy that requires cleanup and really needs a clean flat surface to play with. (I am a parent though never one in an emergency situation.)
posted by R343L at 8:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


What does Trump have to lose? With virtually no black voters supporting him, why not openly show contempt for them?
posted by aubilenon at 8:16 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Play doh and toys can be perfectly reasonable items to hand out to flood victims and still not be a point in favor of Trump. They could have been handing out food and clean water and it still does not need to be a point in favor of Trump. Either way, it was a stunt that lasted less than a minute and shows only as much regard for their suffering as can be encapsulated in a photo that suggests Trump cares.
posted by neonrev at 8:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


If Donald Trump himself had to put one moment of thought into what was in that truck his campaign is doing it all wrong. I think it's a long stretch to read a psychological motive into handing out toys.

And yes he is purposely insulting black voters, but he's doing it in a patronizing, fake solicitous way that collapses "black" and "poor" and "inner city" and "unemployed" and "burning cars" into a tableau that resonates with the "concerned" condescending racism of the suburban republican white voter. This is deniable bigotry. Racism 2.0. It does not matter at all if both African Americans and overt white supremacists can read the code easily. Indeed it's a feature and not a bug.

And he invokes a cartoon level knowledge of history.

He's basically concern trolling.
posted by spitbull at 8:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [17 favorites]


> What does Trump have to lose? With virtually no black voters supporting him, why not openly show contempt for them?

It's been covered above, but: public performance of superficial concern for Black people is not intended for Black people, but instead to salve the consciences of and provide a cover story for moderate white racists, of the sort who bear no particular animus to any particular Black person who they may know, but who deep in their hearts don't particularly care whether Black people in general live or die.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 8:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [29 favorites]


The exact ingredients of Play-Doh compound are proprietary, so we cannot share them with you. We can tell you that it is primarily a mixture of water, salt and flour. It does NOT contain peanuts, peanut oil, or any milk byproducts. It DOES contain wheat.
posted by porpoise at 8:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Trump cites notorious racist's group in new campaign ad

"Rachel Maddow reviews the history of some elitist, racist movements in the U.S. and the role of eugenicist John Tanton in those movements, and notes that his Center for Immigration Studies is cited Donald Trump's new campaign ad."
posted by cashman at 8:27 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


"Hillary Clinton sees black people as people who might vote for her [paraphrased]. But I go out of my way to make sure that could never happen to me [fake]"
posted by aubilenon at 8:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hey, remember when some of us kind of freaked out that Trump was staying on topic and doing so well reading from the teleprompters? We only had to wait a day for Donny himself inserting "what the hell do you have to lose" to court black voters (at a rally full of white people, in a town of white people), Donny and crew doing a drive-through "good will" publicity tour through flooded lands against the wishes of the Governor and eating up police resources in a time of real and true need, and then one of his advisers saying that a "burning car backdrop for a press conference or rally" would be a better sign of "engaging with black voters" than a rally with 99% white folks in a very white town.

Yeah, we'll be OK.


localhuman: like trying to argue with a cloud

MetaFilter: like trying to argue with a cloud
posted by filthy light thief at 8:34 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


MetaFilter: like trying to argue with a cloud

Man, this is the future!
posted by aubilenon at 8:38 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


Especially if you have the cloud-to-butt extension installed!
posted by spitbull at 8:39 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


Play-Doh unfortunately does not taste as good as it smells
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 8:41 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


“I mean that’s a bunch of government-owned housing,” Patterson said. “Nobody here is looking for handouts or waiting on the government. These are Trump’s people.”
It was a bombastic statement, and maybe emotionally satisfying, but it was also untrue: more than 60,000 local people have applied for relief from the Federal Emergency Management Agency (Fema).

(from the Guardian piece linked above.)
This is a very telling statement for the Trump people I know.
Some of them are on disability, but this is not a handout like it is FOR THEM, it's a just compensation for their inability to work, not THEM just sitting on their asses because their back hurts and expecting pay.
Some of them are on SS, but this is a reward for their long years of work, not the government paying THEM for being old and lazy, and certainly not like THEM scamming money out of the pockets of hard workers by getting paid to have never worked.
Most of them work in either the ag industry or related areas, but the subsidies that keep them afloat isn't relying on the gov't for support, it's that their work is important enough to be supported in defense of the market, not like THEM with their NPR and artworks.
Every single last one of them under the age of 31 (I only know Trump voters from my hometown) was educated in a brand-new, very nice high school that was largely paid for with federal money, but that's not looking for a handout like THEM, it's just that they deserved it is all.

For all the talk about realities becoming so different, a lot of these people have only ever lived in a world where, to them, only they and the people they like have ever truly worked or deserved help of any sort, and everyone else is a lazy shitball deserving nothing.
posted by neonrev at 9:00 PM on August 19, 2016 [62 favorites]


Especially if you have the cloud-to-butt extension installed!

OLD MAN YELLS AT BUTT
posted by Going To Maine at 9:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [14 favorites]


Not to mention that if Trump moderates his message or tries to appeal to a wider audience, he'll drive off some of his more extreme supporters, or at least make them lose some enthusiasm

No, he carefully always does it with a wink to the alt-righters. It's only cover for the people who know damn well he's full of shit, but now they have something to point to as justification that he's not so bad.
posted by ctmf at 9:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


Play-Doh unfortunately does not taste as good as it smells
My vast culinary experience with eating lots of play doh as a pica-afflicted child begs to differ. My mouth still waters when I smell play doh. A brief experiment has informed me that the texture has changed over the years, however. Homemade play dough is of course the best of all options.
posted by neonrev at 9:06 PM on August 19, 2016 [6 favorites]


"You are All Fired." [potentially true]
posted by porpoise at 9:16 PM on August 19, 2016


I doubt Trump chose Play-Doh purposefully. He just grabbed whatever toys were at hand when he raided the orphanage.
posted by chrchr at 9:39 PM on August 19, 2016 [20 favorites]


Sweet jesus on a cookie, I just now finally caught up.

Very fun to see the pivot and then the immediate cars-on-fire/play-doh frazzle within half an hour of reading.

Carry on!
posted by mochapickle at 9:55 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


Also, ChurchHatesTucker, you are doing fine work with all that painful but helpful transcribing. Much appreciated!
posted by mochapickle at 9:59 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


mochapickle: "Sweet jesus on a cookie, I just now finally caught up. "

Pshaw.

I've seen the joking references to tehhund and his Sisyphean struggle to read through all the election megathreads, but today I noticed for the first time him favoriting a string of my comments in a row.

They're all live reactions to Obama's DNC speech. From halfway through the DNC Day 3 thread. From more than three weeks ago.

By my reckoning, he's still got:

- the back half of that thread (~1,500 comments)
- the DNC Day 4 thread (3,595)
- the 100 days thread (3,427)
- the Mighty Woman thread (3,057)
- the Evan McMuffin thread (3,634)
- the Clinton podcast thread (2,655)
- and the current Bannon thread (nearly 1,800 and counting)

...for a grand total of almost 20,000 comments, just to catch up to Right Now -- and there will doubtlessly be thousands more at that point. Figure each comment has an average of five sentences (balancing one-liners vs. essays), and that's 100,000 sentences, or roughly the King James Bible x3.

Godspeed, dude.
posted by Rhaomi at 10:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [88 favorites]


Favorited to the max.
posted by rp at 10:02 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


After the years and years, and millions and millions the Republicans have spent investigating her, either there's really nothing there or she's Keyser Soze. And if she's Keyser Soze, isn't that the kind of get-it-done genius you want working for you?

Redolent of RuPaul:
So, what do I think of Hillary? I think she's fucking awesome. Is she in bed with Wall Street? Goddammit, I should hope so! You've got to dance with the devil. So which of the horrible people do you want? That's more of the question. Do you want a pompous braggart who doesn't know anything about diplomacy? Or do you want a badass bitch who knows how to get shit done? That's really the question.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:04 PM on August 19, 2016 [12 favorites]


I've seen the joking references to tehhund and his Sisyphean struggle to read through all the election megathreads,

It appears there are a couple others making the journey. You guys be careful, you should stick together.
posted by bongo_x at 10:15 PM on August 19, 2016 [9 favorites]


Anybody want to provide cliffnotes for the past two days? After following most of these threads, I really don't feel like diving back in, but I understand if no one wants to relive it.
posted by R.F.Simpson at 10:20 PM on August 19, 2016


Mefite Recliner of Rage appears to be in be in both this thread and back on DNC Day 1 at the same time. If you've become unstuck in time, just say Egg McMuffin three times and we'll come rescue you.

(p.s. does that recliner have any pillows on it?)
posted by zachlipton at 10:21 PM on August 19, 2016 [7 favorites]


I don't understand why a conservative watchdog group has the authority to get a judge to require Clinton to be textually deposed regarding her e-mail server under oath. Does anyone know what the substance of this case is?
posted by xyzzy at 10:24 PM on August 19, 2016 [3 favorites]


when you are an unfit, 70 year old man in a jacket toiling away under the Louisiana sun in August, your fingers cramping as the muscles of your hands and wrists strain to maintain your tenuous purchase on the heavy, slippery carton...
posted by Rat Spatula at 10:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Does anyone know what the substance of this case is?

I believe it has to do with FOIA requests for government-related emails, as her private server wasn't necessarily searched when groups previously requested State Department emails (though emails other State employees wrote to Clinton would have been searched).
posted by zachlipton at 10:32 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Thanks, zachlipton.
posted by xyzzy at 10:40 PM on August 19, 2016


It seems to me that people who say "what do you have to lose?" often have no idea, nor do they care, what the people they're taking to have to lose.

It's like they just arrived here from a parallel universe where The Doobie Brothers "Takin' it to the Streets" hasn't been around long enough to become elevator music.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 10:40 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


I can't imagine most parents with no fixed place to live want a toy that requires cleanup and really needs a clean flat surface to play with.

As a parent who's dealt with very low-income living (although not emergency-with-children living) and long-distance car travel, play-doh sounds like an excellent toy. It's quiet; can be played with on laps or a tiny flat surface like a book or CD case, is non-toxic, and if half of it gets destroyed or left behind, there's still a usable toy. If it all gets destroyed, it's easily replaceable. It even works for older kids, or adults who want something to fidget with. Yay.

Whoever decided on play-doh deserves a thumbs-up for that; I'm willing to bet that Trump was not that who. Trump gets no points for spending less than a minute pulling boxes out of a truck and shoving them into someone's hands, and using up security resources that are needed elsewhere.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 10:40 PM on August 19, 2016 [35 favorites]


The New York Times maintains a pretty good Cliffs Notes of the past few days of election news.
posted by mbrubeck at 11:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [1 favorite]


Heh. I guess it varies by parent. I find playdoh very stressful as a toy in any situation where I care about mess or cleanup. But then mine isn't even 3 yet.
posted by R343L at 11:01 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


He really is going to set up rallies in every white-flight suburb of every big city and talk about African-Americans to a room full of white people, isn't he?
posted by holgate at 11:11 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


Play-doh's recommended age is 2 and up, so it makes sense that it's iffy for kids under three... it's not actively dangerous to them, but it's not really designed with them in mind. What, you don't like washing dried orange crumbs out of the hems of jeans and finding green smears mashed into the couch cushions? Don't want USB patch cords to be filled with purple goop that maybe you can remove with a toothpick and maybe not? ... Yeah, play-doh is definitely better for kids who have stopped trying to shove all their toys into whatever orifices they can find.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:17 PM on August 19, 2016 [4 favorites]


Are we overthinking a Play of Doh?
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:23 PM on August 19, 2016 [27 favorites]


Overthinking playdoh is our own version of playing a lyre while Rome burns. Wait. Uh. *coughs*
posted by R343L at 11:25 PM on August 19, 2016 [5 favorites]


I know it's like three thousand comments ago but: don't bring facts to a feelings fight. Exactly 87.283% of people don't see politics as a question of true or false, it's something like a team sport slash religion slash purity/unity demonstration.

This is why so much political speech doesn't really add up logically, it's more about saying 'good' words alongside your candidate and 'bad' words alongside theirs. Trump just takes this to the logical extreme and omits all the traditional pretense of structuring it as if it were a logical argument. He doesn't bother putting any filler between "Hillary" and "Crooked", he just goes for it! Such economy!

Anyway, the only successful tactic I've found with this whole amateur boxing genre of 'debate' is to use judo instead. Just remember the magic words: "What would convince you of X?"

It's respectful and polite, it's easy to remember, it puts the focus on the person you're talking to instead of the side they're supporting, and best of all it only has three possible outcomes:
  1. An actual answer. This never happens but if it somehow does it means you're talking about something concrete that the other person came up with. Either it's something reasonable that you can demonstrate (and enjoy the acrobatics as they're now arguing with themselves) or something that can't be demonstrated (in which case you can talk about why their burden of proof is so high).
  2. "Nothing will convince me." Well, ok. Why are we talking about this then? If you've already made up your mind let's not waste everyone's time.
  3. Literally Any Other Response. Resist the urge to gloat because your opponent has given you a big stick with which to beat them. Either they give something like an answer in which case GOTO 10, they demonstrate that they're not arguing in good faith by refusing to meet your extremely reasonable request in which case you have a polite way out of the conversation or they just ghost on you in which case you got the last word.
As an aside, it's instructive to turn this on your own beliefs.
posted by Skorgu at 11:26 PM on August 19, 2016 [86 favorites]


Hi, I'm on metafilter, and I could overthink a truck full of play doh.
posted by neonrev at 11:35 PM on August 19, 2016 [8 favorites]


This may be daring of me but I tentatively think it's ok to be pro play doh and against Trump.
posted by sebastienbailard at 11:50 PM on August 19, 2016 [13 favorites]


this kid named Steve was on a show I just watched and the name was completely distracting from the plot for me
posted by angrycat at 11:53 PM on August 19, 2016 [2 favorites]


> ...for a grand total of almost 20,000 comments, just to catch up to Right Now -- and there will doubtlessly be thousands more at that point. Figure each comment has an average of five sentences (balancing one-liners vs. essays), and that's 100,000 sentences, or roughly the King James Bible x3.

Godspeed, dude.


Oh.

that's where my time went.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 12:09 AM on August 20, 2016 [51 favorites]


Think about what could have been accomplished if we'd devoted this collective effort to literally anything else
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 12:34 AM on August 20, 2016 [41 favorites]


and that's 100,000 sentences, or roughly the King James Bible x3

My reaction to that was more, 'at least we have the courtesy to include [real] and [fake] tags for future generations.'
posted by mordax at 12:39 AM on August 20, 2016 [40 favorites]


you'd think so, but after the election we'll probably start using them ironically
posted by ryanrs at 12:44 AM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


Think about what could have been accomplished if we'd devoted this collective effort to literally anything else

hey man we're winning this election

yes, US
posted by litleozy at 12:52 AM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


come on be realistic the most metafilter can hope for is getting picked as Weird Facebook's running mate in 2024.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:18 AM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


I keep forgetting that this thread is so busy. The rest of the site seems quieter than usual. Other threads sort of feel like being at the grocery store at 2 AM - you know there's a lot more people passing through than you'd imagine, but the store's so big and empty that you only ever see one or two other people at a time.

On the other hand, it is actually 1:30 AM Friday night here, so maybe that's contributing to this feeling too. Either way, man, it takes me back to shopping at the Ralph's in Westwood after midnight, just me and some random frat guys with nothing but a bunch of GoGurt in their cart.
posted by teponaztli at 1:35 AM on August 20, 2016 [27 favorites]


alternate analogy:

so the first national parliament ever was the Icelandic Alþingi ("Allthing"), started in like 900 CE. During the Allthing like practically everyone would come to a central-ish location (the þingvellir, or thing-field) to listen to the law and argue the law and also just sort of generally trade and socialize.

(the þingvellir, incidentally, is at the rift between the North American and European continental plates. The raised ridge at the meeting of the plates had really good acoustics for the reading of the law by the Lawspeaker.)

maybe the election thread is metafilter's Allthing, is what I'm getting at.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:49 AM on August 20, 2016 [40 favorites]


My reaction to that was more, 'at least we have the courtesy to include [real] and [fake] tags for future generations.'
you'd think so, but after the election we'll probably start using them ironically
but not that ironically..
posted by Nerd of the North at 2:00 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


I like to imagine that while everyone was at the Alþingi, there was someone wandering around a village being like "huh, sure is quiet today" and quietly stocking up on GoGurt.
posted by teponaztli at 2:05 AM on August 20, 2016 [38 favorites]


GoSkyr, but yes.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 2:07 AM on August 20, 2016 [20 favorites]


Think about what could have been accomplished if we'd devoted this collective effort to literally anything else

Like that nihilism thread!
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:46 AM on August 20, 2016 [10 favorites]


The Sisyphean references upthread (not far (as a percentage)) reminded me of a couple of my favorite Rhymes With Orange cartoons, one with a dog and another with a cat.
posted by kingless at 3:03 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Either way, man, it takes me back to shopping at the Ralph's in Westwood after midnight,
[writes a check for 69 cents.]
posted by adamgreenfield at 3:17 AM on August 20, 2016 [14 favorites]


The bad thing about GoGurt is that in order to get the good flavor you have to get the bad flavor, too
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 4:00 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Metafilter: roughly the King James Bible x3.
posted by Autumn Leaf at 4:11 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]





[writes a check for 69 cents]


nice
posted by Potomac Avenue at 4:20 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


The Overton family is standing dead eyed around the house each staring out a different portal. The dog is crying black blood. Baby Overton is floating up the attic stairs, babbling in an unknown tongue.

This Overton thing, I have rellies whose last name is very similar. Whenever it's mentioned I see them when they were kids in pigtails and shorts, staring out of a broken window. The youngest's nickname is actually/literally/in fact and to this day, "Baby". Thanks to Potomac Avenue my mental Overton scene now has better art direction.
posted by valetta at 4:28 AM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


A linguist on why Trumps speeches are so effective.

Also, Donald Trump’s strange speaking style, as explained by linguists which cites this article and covers a few of his other habits.
posted by peeedro at 4:28 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


My reaction to that was more, 'at least we have the courtesy to include [real] and [fake] tags for future generations.'

you'd think so, but after the election we'll probably start using them ironically


But what about sarcastically?
posted by sallybrown at 5:30 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


We'll have sarcasm. The best sarcasm. We'll have so much sarcasm you'll get tired of sarcasm.

[fake, but not very]
posted by Autumn Leaf at 5:34 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


So after luxuriating in just Hillary and Patrick Murphy commercials for the last 6 weeks or so, I got back to back Marco Rubio and Trump commercials during the news this morning. I was surprised at how boring and unoriginal they were. Rubio's commercials are weird, one with 3-4 veterans who talk about one bill that Rubio co wrote. The other one is a mother of a woman that wanted the FDA to push through approval for a drug for her daughter's cancer treatment, so she called Rubio and a week later the drug was approved. The Trump/Pence one was the standard bullet points listed on the screen of his (empty) promises ending with "make America great again". Just standard typical candidate commercials with zero creativity.

On the other hand, Hillary's commercials are powerful and draw you in, Patrick Murphy's are proud and defiant in how he almost flaunts his Obama endorsement and uses the terms "woman's right to choose" and "NRA lobby" and "real progressive". It's like he's, I dunno, proud of being on the Dem ticket? That's rare around here.

Either way, the Rubio/Trump/Pence commercials just ramped up my normal morning nausea, so thanks for that, assholes.
posted by hollygoheavy at 5:51 AM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm in Louisiana salvaging a family home after the flood and I can say Trump's play doh escapade is really working. The media people tune into down here isn't portraying the "47 seconds" aspect of it.

Of course, most of the people hyped up about it were Trump supporters anyway who are happy to have evidence of him doing something non-embarrassing.
posted by tofu_crouton at 5:56 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


The other one is a mother of a woman that wanted the FDA to push through approval for a drug for her daughter's cancer treatment, so she called Rubio and a week later the drug was approved.

So is Rubio corruptly putting political pressure on regulators to bypass the medication approval process, or is the Senator merely taking credit for a felicitous coincidence of timing?

just asking questions
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:01 AM on August 20, 2016 [21 favorites]


One thing that really pisses me off about Donald Trump's assertion that Democrats have failed black cities is that the whole reason black cities are in this strife is that tax bases of inner cities have been absolutely fucking wrecked in the white flight of the past fifty years. Detroit in particular. The riots of '67 and bam, the whites got the fuck out of there and moved to Oakland County taking the tax dollars with them. They halved the population of Detroit leaving it with the expenses and obligations of a city but now with half the revenue. What's a black mayor to do? There's literally no fucking money to do anything with!

It's basically the same with every inner urban core. Baltimore? Out to the suburbs! Chicago? Out to the suburbs! Leave the city cores with nothing but debt and obligations.
posted by Talez at 6:03 AM on August 20, 2016 [50 favorites]


I saw my first TRUMP TRAIN!!!1! sign in the city limits today. It was huge and honestly did not look like an "official" sign but one that someone had made at a sign-maker. I have a sneaking suspicion that the building it's on is actually a rental (the area is heavily rentals) and the landlord put it there. I will report back ;)
posted by soren_lorensen at 6:03 AM on August 20, 2016


From the unfair Washington Post: Jerry Falwell Jr.: Trump is the Churchillian leader we need

[not fake]

Is this willfull stupidity or just a product of an inadequate education (which the Christian right would love to foist upon others)?
posted by readery at 6:26 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


It's basically the same with every inner urban core. Baltimore? Out to the suburbs! Chicago? Out to the suburbs! Leave the city cores with nothing but debt and obligations.

Huh, so that's where "distressed" private capital funds like Cerberus got their playbook...

[fake but analogous]
posted by strange chain at 6:27 AM on August 20, 2016




Eavesdropping on a couple guys talking about the election: They first agree that the choices this year aren't that exciting, but one of the guys goes on to explain that people gotta remember Hillary's a crook. She was born that way. People don't pay much attention to politics and I gotta remind them about her being crooked, and they say that's right. People don't remember Watergate, Hillary gets away with too much.

Trump says some stupid stuff, but the thing is he isn't a politician, they just look out for themselves. He's telling things as they are.

The other guy mostly agreed, but had some reservations about Trump. His big concern was that politicians get too much in retirement benefits. Full health care for life and 100% of their salaries.

He's a registered republican, but says he isn't one of those people who always, he just registered to be able to vote since his home is in Republican territory.

The first guy agreed that people don't realize you need to register like the people around you in order to vote.

(That's a mix of quotes and paraphrase since I couldn't get it all word for word. It made no more sense hearing it than it does in the recap.)
posted by gusottertrout at 6:36 AM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Odd little political story: GOP: Gilbert physically fit enough to run for Congress

The events were:
1.) Melissa Sue Gilbert (of Little House on the Prairie Fame) ran for and won the Democratic primary to represent the 8th District in Michigan.

2.) In May she pulled out of the race siting health reasons. She was in a car accident in 2014 and her neurosurgeon wrote a letter that she is about to undergo spinal surgery and that she is medically disabled. The doctor's letter and her medical insurance records were submitted to State Director of Elections who approved her replacement.

3.) The Democratic Party recruited Suzanna Shkreli who faces U.S. Rep. Mike Bishop (R) in the general election.

4.) The GOP submitted a letter saying that there is not enough proof that Gilbert would be too unfit to serve in Congress and that replacing her name on the ballot disenfranchises the 27,000 voters who voted for Gilbert.
The Republican Party’s attorneys argued in an Aug. 11 letter to the Secretary of State’s Office that Gilbert is physically fit enough to remain on the ballot.

“Members of Congress often have illnesses or injuries that require hospitalization or time away from their official duties,” wrote Jason Hanselman and Gary Gordon of the Dykema Gossett law firm. “Such illnesses or injuries do not necessarily render a Member of Congress physically unfit to serve.

The lawyers cited the examples of U.S. Sen. Mark Kirk, R-Ill., continuing to serve after having a massive stroke and often being wheelchair-bound; quadriplegic U.S. Rep. James Langevin, D-Rhode Island; and three others serving while battling cancer. By contrast, they wrote, one of the few instances when the state’s unfit law was used in a 1950s case “of mental illness so severe that the nominee for county treasurer was placed in an insane asylum in a different county....”

In arguing for the state canvassers’s review, the Republican Party said Gilbert’s medical issues need to be aired publicly to ensure they meet a strict standard of physical unfitness.
This really seems mean spirited.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:49 AM on August 20, 2016 [31 favorites]


Think about what could have been accomplished if we'd devoted this collective effort to literally anything else

The election makes up a major part media coverage every four years (kidding, more like two and a half) and I like to think that a more in-depth perspective on media is worth it. Of course, if every third comment was a chapter of The man without qualities, all of us would have been making great literary progress.
posted by ersatz at 7:02 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


For all the talk about realities becoming so different, a lot of these people have only ever lived in a world where, to them, only they and the people they like have ever truly worked or deserved help of any sort, and everyone else is a lazy shitball deserving nothing.

This dates back at least as far as the early-80s "welfare queen" talking point. We got a lovely recap of it back in '09 with Craig Nelson's delightful anti-government-aid rant: "I've been on food stamps and welfare. Anybody help me out? No." To a lot of people, "government aid" is the clearly fraudulent largesse given (apparently vanishingly rarely) to black people, not the subsistence support the government actually gives to the dangerously impoverished.

"What do you have to lose?"

Ooh, I bet John Lewis has a really good answer to that question. So would the ghost of Frederick Douglass, if we can hunt down a good necromancer.
posted by jackbishop at 7:06 AM on August 20, 2016 [10 favorites]


To a lot of people, "government aid" is the clearly fraudulent largesse given (apparently vanishingly rarely) to black people, not the subsistence support the government actually gives to the dangerously impoverished.

Yep. Which is also why social democracy tends to work better the more homogenous the population is. People see "us" getting the welfare, not "them."
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:09 AM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


It’s hard to imagine a much worse pitch Donald Trump could have made for the black vote (WaPo)

My favorite line from that article:

Some black people, research shows, live in places beside the "inner city."
posted by tocts at 7:32 AM on August 20, 2016 [17 favorites]


So would the ghost of Frederick Douglass, if we can hunt down a good necromancer.

I mean, I've got one in mind, but even for Archlich Xonolotep the Unseeing that would be crossing a line. If anyone in history deserves to not get dragged in to this shit circus, it's Frederick Douglass. Let the man rest.
posted by Itaxpica at 7:43 AM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


this kid named Steve was on a show I just watched and the name was completely distracting from the plot for me


✊Steve Holt! ✊
posted by Existential Dread at 7:44 AM on August 20, 2016 [28 favorites]


The long promised NYTimes investigative piece on the Trump financial mess:
In Maze of Trump’s Empire, Unknown Ties and $650 Million in Debt

He laid the groundwork very well for what he had to assume was coming. His followers will believe nothing that's been reported by the Times or WP.
posted by readery at 7:44 AM on August 20, 2016 [22 favorites]


I'm heading out tomorrow to do canvassing for the first time! Any advice/tips/links would be much appreciated.
Logistics:
Comfy, sensible shoes. Sounds obvious but I've seen people canvass in shoes that have left them blistered and in pain.

Hydrate! Seriously! Also sounds obvious.

Hats! Sunblock!

Strategics:
Don't spend more than a couple of minutes per door. You can't argue an opponent into being a supporter. And supporters, while fun to small-talk and chit-chat with, will understand your need to go preach to potential converts.

DO be polite and take the high road, even if you meet someone you disagree with. (AND make that interaction super-short, and move on!

DO remember - you are doing the absolute most important work that there is. This stuff wins elections and Makes HISTORY! YEEEAAAHHHHHH!
posted by Cookiebastard at 7:44 AM on August 20, 2016 [29 favorites]


Josh Marshall on the Keilar/Kingston exchange: "They Can't Stay in Character."

In the two segments in this single video we see the same dynamic which has played out all over the Trump campaign over the last few days. Put simply, they're so wrapped up in racial antagonism that they can't keep track of whether they're trying to execute the standard faux outreach act or just angry trolling. It's all so close to the surface they can't help blurting out lines that sound more like something you might say shooting the shit with David Duke. Trump's 'appeal' amounts to a diatribe against African-American life which bristles with contempt.
posted by spitbull at 7:51 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


via Mark Halperin, the Trump ABCs - his go to idioms and fillers
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:03 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


The first guy agreed that people don't realize you need to register like the people around you in order to vote.

[real]

Lots of places have closed partisan primaries for down-ballot races with candidates in one party's race and no one running in the other party.

If you aren't registered in the majority party, you might not get to vote for sheriff, clerk of courts, etc.
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:07 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Well done video from the Clinton camp:

Donald Trump: No regrets
posted by defenestration at 8:09 AM on August 20, 2016 [22 favorites]


He laid the groundwork very well for what he had to assume was coming. His followers will believe nothing that's been reported by the Times or WP.

That's not Trump's doing. Ignoring the NYT has pretty-much been a mainstay on the right since, roughly, the Reagan administration.
posted by Thorzdad at 8:09 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


@realDonaldTrump: President Obama has absolutely no control (or respect) over the African American community-they have fared so poorly under his presidency.
"Control"?
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 8:10 AM on August 20, 2016 [78 favorites]


If you aren't registered in the majority party, you might not get to vote for sheriff, clerk of courts, etc.

This is a big reason why I'm a registered Democrat. Most local races here are decided in the Democratic primary, and our primaries are closed.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:10 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Jerry Falwell Jr.: Trump is the Churchillian leader we need

Aw, sorry Jerry. Right war but wrong guess. Would you like to go for Double Jeopardy where the scores can really change? I'll even take two answers as correct. /Die Hard
posted by chris24 at 8:12 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


President Obama has absolutely no control … over the African American community

christ i hope not, we fought a war over it
posted by murphy slaw at 8:13 AM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]


The first guy agreed that people don't realize you need to register like the people around you in order to vote.

[real]

Lots of places have closed partisan primaries for down-ballot races with candidates in one party's race and no one running in the other party.


Yeah this is my interpretation of it. In Albany county, if you're registered as a Republican there's basically nothing at the County level worth voting for. Even though Republicans run for local seats, they usually don't stand a chance, so the real battle for the local gov't is in the Democratic primary. For example, if you're not a registered dem you might as well not vote for county executive.
posted by dis_integration at 8:14 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


President Obama has absolutely no control (or respect) over the African American community-they have fared so poorly under his presidency.

Didn't you know? People of color are all robots controlled by the Supreme POC Intelligence.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:14 AM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


People don't remember Watergate, Hillary gets away with too much.

"In 1974 she was a member of the impeachment inquiry staff in Washington, D.C., advising the House Committee on the Judiciary during the Watergate scandal."
posted by kirkaracha at 8:17 AM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


Is there much in Lansing these days except MSU and the state government?

There is a large GM plant across 496 from downtown, and another in Delta township, on the way to Dimondale, coincidentally.

I worked at the Engineering facility that used to be part of the downtown plant (which was originally Oldsmobile) for 19 years before they moved us to Milford, Pontiac and Warren.
posted by rfs at 8:18 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Didn't you know? People of color are all robots controlled by the Supreme POC Intelligence.

Jesse Jackson?
posted by Talez at 8:20 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


By mistake, I was listening to Any Answers on Radio 4 this afternoon. It's a phone-in response programme to Any Questions, a current events panel show on earlier, and I never listen to either because vox populi est vox moroni and I can't afford to replace my radio once a week, let alone the glazing bills.

However, I'd dozed off during the news and woke to Mr Angry (ret'd) from Mittelengland - and he was saying "They never show the pictures of the babies Mrs Merkel has drowned. She drowns babies. By enfouraging people to be refugees, she drowns babies."

So, apparently this demonisation of Mrs Merkel is quite widespread. It doesn't matter that you're not German and thus not affected in any way by German immigration policy.

And before I could turn the damn thing off, Mrs Splutter (ret'd) came on to say that everyone should stay in their own countries where they belong and stop this nonsense. Especially the fit young men.

Today, therefore, I am hating everyone over the age of 65, with really quite some venom.
posted by Devonian at 8:21 AM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


I think everyone is misreading Trump's "What do you have to Lose?" question. He's test marketing it on a limited demographic. Sometime next week he's going to start using it as his campaign's main theme. No more make America great again. Instead it'll be America, what do you have to lose.
posted by rdr at 8:21 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Are the Trumpites going to try to swarm polls dressed in red? (Link to meme on random crazy lady Twitter) Or will that come to nothing like any number of urban legends?
posted by Countess Elena at 8:21 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


@realDonaldTrump: President Obama has absolutely no control (or respect) over the African American community-they have fared so poorly under his presidency.

FWIW -- and because I looked for it in his Twitter feed and didn't immediately find it -- this is [real] but from 2014.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 8:24 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Michele Bachmann is apparently advising Trump on foreign policy.

Yes! Dream Team! Democracy's so rad.
posted by petebest at 8:38 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


[I heard two people say stuff on the radio], therefore, I am hating everyone over the age of 65, with really quite some venom.

My neighbour's son was murdered by a black man. Therefore, he hates all black people [real].
 
posted by Herodios at 8:39 AM on August 20, 2016


It is hard to imagine a more thoroughly rich racist white guy sentiment than laying the blame for the problems in African-American communities at the feet of the first black guy to hold the presidency, as opposed to the 43 white guys who preceded him.
posted by tocts at 8:41 AM on August 20, 2016 [53 favorites]




But tomorrow, I shall not hate everyone over the age of 65, because today's hate is self-indulgent and indefensible. Just having a wallow.
posted by Devonian at 8:45 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I really wish people would stop using "alt-right." It makes that movement sound way too fucking respectable.
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:47 AM on August 20, 2016 [29 favorites]


Just having a wallow.

Please wallow in private.

Thanks,

signed A. Senior.
 
posted by Herodios at 8:48 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I really wish people would stop using "alt-right."

Is there a Chrome extension to change "alt-right" to "white supremacist neofascists" yet?
posted by Mister Fabulous at 8:50 AM on August 20, 2016 [15 favorites]



Steve Bannon and the alt-right: a primer

Yeah, this is really good, wish there was more.

Ditto John Tanton, though this page from the SPLC is the background for Rachel Maddow's reporting mentioned upthread. Worth becoming familiar with, given recent developments in Trumpland.
 
posted by Herodios at 8:51 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


If not, someone needs to get on that. Looking forward to the day i can read about snake people white supremacist neofascists"
posted by soren_lorensen at 8:51 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Jerry Falwell: "And this country will have as its president a person who jeopardized our national security by negligently sending and receiving classified emails on a private server."

Except we know that use of private servers was and still is approved by the rules and was standard practice before Clinton took office. We know that Clinton did not send classified mail, but she did receive three that were improperly marked. Its "jeopardizing national security" subject was about when to schedule a phone call to Kofi Annan.

This is how Republican memes become hardened into "facts" that even Democrats buy into.

Even today, almost two decades later, most Democrats still believe that Al Gore is a big fat fibber that said that he invented the internet. You can still see it flung out there on the pages of the New York Times and on CNN on occasions -- Al Gore, ha ha, invented the internet.

The big lie about the emails is going to be out there forever, so get used to it and be ready to push back. Don't let the bastards wear you down.
posted by JackFlash at 8:52 AM on August 20, 2016 [76 favorites]


I really wish people would stop using "alt-right."

It brings up a very bizarre 'easter egg' on my keyboard.
 
posted by Herodios at 8:52 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Well I turned 65 last week. I blame my parents.
posted by valetta at 8:54 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Eavesdropping on a couple guys talking about the election:

See, this...this is the kind of thing that makes me want to throw up my hands and go find a cave to crawl into. These MeFi threads make me feel like a politically unsophisticated rube. But then, stories like this (and my own similar encounters, and the things I see online) remind me that there are legions of grown-ass adults who don't know any goddamn thing about their own country's government, politics, electoral system, or anything else. Politics, for them, boils down to simple tribalism, rationalized and given a cheap veneer of sophistication with lazy handwaving.

To the extent that I can believe that fellow Americans are generally curious and motivated by an honest desire to follow Truth wherever it may lead, that some of them are simply misinformed or confused on particular issues...I can see reason for hope. Ignorance is a curable condition.

But when I'm reminded how many people are habitually and constitutionally incurious, indifferent to (or even proud of) their own ignorance, who see no reason to upset their existing intellectual balance with a bunch of new facts or ideas when their existing framework is already giving them simple, comfortable answers without all of that distasteful thinking - like, that's when I want to give up on democracy. Bring on the benevolent dictator, because the people are too dumb to rule themselves.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 8:56 AM on August 20, 2016 [25 favorites]


"I really wish people would stop using "alt-right." It makes that movement sound way too fucking respectable."

You said it - they should instead be labeled "alt-wrong!"

...I'll see myself out.
posted by CottonCandyCapers at 8:57 AM on August 20, 2016 [15 favorites]


Did you mean: alt reich
posted by kirkaracha at 9:01 AM on August 20, 2016 [50 favorites]


I just got back from a two week vacation with my brother. While we agree on a lot of issues (and compared to the rest of the family we're the crazy liberals), his political leanings seem much more based on hatred of the state of the world, disgust with society, and extreme pessimism about any chance for improvement in the future. He's a Jill Stein guy I think despite himself ranting against pseudo-science health claims and homeopathy. All coupled with a huge ego which prevents him from seeing any other perspective than his own, so good luck having a respectful conversation about anything because if he disagrees you're wrong and you're stupid in his eyes. He's even becoming a prepper. So fun times.

After two weeks of this, I don't know what to think anymore. I feel exhausted. I can't even discuss politics with people who nominally lean the same way because it always takes a weird turn. I'm so tired of discussing politics with people who don't actually follow politics but have a lot of opinions. Maybe MeFi has spoiled me? I hate realizing the allies are also kooks.
posted by downtohisturtles at 9:03 AM on August 20, 2016 [20 favorites]


That SPLC page says Tanton's practice was in Petosky, Michigan. That's too bad, because when I think Petosky, I would rather think Petosky stone.

The fact that Claude Shannon was originally from Petosky makes up for it.
 
posted by Herodios at 9:06 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Where I work, I hear a lot of conversations about this election, some between people who know each other and some, like the one I quoted above, where the two men were strangers.

The way the conversations are carried out is interesting in itself, as you can see different notions of etiquette, confidence, and feelings of power being expressed. In the conversation above, the man talking about Hillary being crooked styled himself as something of a political expert, knowledgeable about the past and the real problems in Washington. His big pitch later on was Trump was the best guy to clean up Washington, he had the men to do it and speaks the truth. You could almost hear the sound bites he was thinking of for most of the points he brought up, and as the conversation went on, his confidence and volume increased.

His speaking style was much like that of Trump, fragmented, incomplete sentences, digressions and nonsequitors. It was apparent that he didn't see himself as an intellectual type, just someone who knew what was going on and had to say it. He focused a lot of his attention on how other people perceived things and how they didn't know some element or another. Even his agreements with the other fellow, were modified with how others wouldn't understand.

Despite his confidence in his narrative of Trump as truth teller and fixer, where he would speak over the other man's attempt to say anything, he would also retreat into a defensive stance quickly when even nudged in the direction of a more factual reference.

The man he was talking with was much more concerned about etiquette, hesitant to fully open up, allowing the other man to direct the conversation, even though you could hear him try to nudge it along different lines. When he was talking about being a registered Republican, but now always, the inference I took was that he was testing out ways to suggest he wasn't very enthusiastic about voting for Trump, but didn't want to try and counter the the narrative of the first man. It also seemed fairly evident that he didn't accept a number of things the first man said in anywhere near the same sense of meaning.

His talk of being a registered Republican acted as a way for him to bridge to talking about Democrats a little, equating their tribalism, with that of Republicans, but then saying he wasn't one of those people, he'll vote for who he thinks best. Who that might be in this election wasn't stated, but the implication seemed to be not Donald. The first man quickly agreed on vote for the best person, in a way that made it seem defensive, but didn't appear to connect that idea to his own testimony about Trump since he resumed it shortly thereafter.

The reason I've bothered to mention all of this is because these dynamics are not at all uncommon to see among the people talking about Trump and the election where I work. The people who are drawn to Trump are often lower information voters with either a couple concerns, guns and immigrants mostly, or some vision of Washington being corrupt or just not connected to their more real world. They have an active suspicion of discursive coherence as it seems to them to be indistinguishable from bullshit, presumably since they and those they hang out with do not speak like that. Yet they also will, in certain company, retreat from any abstract claims in a way that suggests their own uncertainty and willingness to back down from people they recognize or at least suspect as authorities.

The people who seem less interested in Trump are far less likely to push a positive agenda, or much of any agenda at all, and instead spend more time trying to edge conversations from areas of seeming disagreement or to areas where there might be some common ground. They rely on allusion and more subtle conversational hints rather than direct statements, and show greater interest in factual information rather than generalized abstractions or personality driven claims. They often shy away from anything but the mildest direct contradiction of the person they're speaking to, even when it seems quite likely they know the other person is wrong, and prefer to change subjects to another area where they might have better luck instead of risking conflict.

To me, given how often I see these kinds of interactions, there seems to be some suggestive elements that repeat themselves with regularity that are worth thinking about when conducting one's own conversations on the subject.
posted by gusottertrout at 9:12 AM on August 20, 2016 [26 favorites]


I can't even discuss politics with people who nominally lean the same way because it always takes a weird turn.

Yeeeeeah. When politics comes up at work, I start daydreaming about the DMV adding an "elementary school civics" section to the drivers test or something. There are a lot of bizarre misapprehensions about government/politics/elections/etc. You get people talking, and you find out that maybe the timecube guy wasn't so far outside the norm...
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 9:13 AM on August 20, 2016 [14 favorites]


I'm reminded how many people are habitually and constitutionally incurious, indifferent to (or even proud of) their own ignorance

Willful ignorance is what bothers me the most. And yes, I see people taking pride in it all the time. There should be a word for it. Just like Schadenfreude means taking pleasure in another's misfortune, there should be a word for taking pride in one's own ignorance.
posted by Surely This at 9:14 AM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


My liberal academic bubble is very very comfy and cozy and I regret nothing, honestly.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:17 AM on August 20, 2016 [22 favorites]


before the heat wore me out I was full of volunteer fever at the DNC. And remember, this was the week after the historically ridiculous and awful and WTF of the RNC, so politics was taking up most of my forebrain.

One of those days I came into the pharmacy and saw my neighborly pharmacist and was like OH BOY THE ELECTION EEEEEE

And my pharmacist, a very nice man and loving father and non-Trump supporter said very mildly, oh, I don't follow politics.

And I kind of felt like saying *Okay dude hey you know in case Trump wins hang on to the oxys because that's going to have more value than cash*

But I didn't. I did have a sad though.
posted by angrycat at 9:34 AM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


>> Think about what could have been accomplished if we'd devoted this collective effort to literally anything else

> Like that nihilism thread!
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:46 AM on August 20 [6 favorites −] [!]


Strive to be the nihilism thread you want to see in the world.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:35 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I actually found academia in the same city as soren_lorensen to be largely hard right-wing and militaristic but that may be a function of it being a software engineering department.
posted by octothorpe at 9:37 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


And my pharmacist, a very nice man and loving father and non-Trump supporter said very mildly, oh, I don't follow politics.

That can mean what it says, but it can also mean "I'm too professional to talk about my politics with a customer/associate/coworker".

When I taught college, it was my stock response if politics came up in conversation with a student.
posted by Mitrovarr at 9:40 AM on August 20, 2016 [40 favorites]


a software engineering department

lol sometimes stereotypes exist for a reason.

My day-to-day interactions are mostly with my colleagues (we're all staff, not faculty) and one my colleagues was an OFA field organizer and there's a lot of teh gays here too, and basically Trump has been a punchline in the department since he entered the race. (Two of the folks I work with are former military, too, but, like, they're not insane?)

I just... don't get how you can exist in your day-to-day life working in Oakland and look around and be like, "Yep, I am deeply suspicious of 50% of the people I see around me at any given moment." That must be a pretty miserable way to live.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:45 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I remember a lot of the foreign students being amazed that multiple professors cancelled classes on the first day of deer season but that's life in Pennsylvania.

I just looked up my grad school adviser on Facebook and see that he's wearing a "I'm a gun own and I vote t-shirt" and an NRA hat so things evidently haven't changed there.
posted by octothorpe at 9:54 AM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


there should be a word for taking pride in one's own ignorance

"dunningkruger"
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 9:55 AM on August 20, 2016 [15 favorites]


When I worked in the Psych department at CMU, we had lab field trips to Obama rallies during the work day.

In PA, deer hunting is bipartisan, though. And good thing too because we're being overrun by those fuckers.
posted by soren_lorensen at 9:57 AM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Sadly I've also encountered many conservatives in my professional tech career too. The #politics channel at my last job was just a horrible den of ditto heads.
posted by octothorpe at 10:03 AM on August 20, 2016


Just got back from registering voters. We were registering people in front of a grocery store and the attached strip mall in a very depressed area. Probably 85% black, 10% Hispanic and the remainder white. The black people were ALL polite and cheerful and everyone of them said they were registered but thanked me for asking. They smiled and seemed happy at the idea of voting. Some of them even thanked me for coming out in the heat and told me to take care of myself.

The white people were ALL surly and negative. "There is no one to vote for." "Hell no!" and "Who cares." One guy just went on and on about how "We are all doomed. This country owes 18 trillion dollars. Everything I own comes from China." When I suggested he might like to vote he told me it didn't matter. "Doesn't matter who is in office, this country is going to have a major crash in five years."

Another white man told me he didn't care for any of the choices. When I suggested that he might like to vote for Governor or state representative, he replied "Not this year. There isn't anybody to vote for."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:07 AM on August 20, 2016 [45 favorites]


White people are having an extinction burst.

It's really just all too familiar from my life with a four-year-old. "I don't want the vegetable that's on my plate, so I'm going to throw my whole dinner on the ground!"
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:12 AM on August 20, 2016 [50 favorites]


>My favorite line from that article:

Some black people, research shows, live in places beside the "inner city."


One of my favorite scenes from The Office (US) is when Michael asked middle class, middle-aged Stanley if he learned it on the streets.

Stanley: Sometimes women say more in their pauses than they say in their words.
Michael: Really?
Stanley: Oh, yes. Let's listen to it again. And this time, really listen to the pauses.
Michael: God, Stanley, that's frickin' brilliant. How do you know that? Did you learn that on the streets? Sorry.
Stanley: Oh, no, that's ok. I did learn it on the streets. On the ghetto, in fact.

It is one of our family in-jokes "I learned it on the ghetto."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:14 AM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


Michele Bachmann is apparently advising Trump on foreign policy.

Sigh. On behalf of all Minnesotans, I would like to once again apologize for loosing Michele Bachmann on the world. We're mostly pretty nice and reasonable.

VTX to Mrs. VTX: "Trump has added a woman as one of his foreign policy advisers."

Mrs. VTX: "Oh?"

VTX: "Michele Bachmann."

Mrs. VTX (I'm paraphrasing here): "HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA...AAAHHH HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!! TEEEEEHEEEEE HO HO HAH HAH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!..."
posted by VTX at 10:17 AM on August 20, 2016 [25 favorites]


> The white people were ALL surly and negative. "There is no one to vote for." "Hell no!" and "Who cares." One guy just went on and on about how "We are all doomed. This country owes 18 trillion dollars. Everything I own comes from China." When I suggested he might like to vote he told me it didn't matter. "Doesn't matter who is in office, this country is going to have a major crash in five years."

Another white man told me he didn't care for any of the choices. When I suggested that he might like to vote for Governor or state representative, he replied "Not this year. There isn't anybody to vote for."


oh no please don't politically marginalize yourselves ignorant white people that would be awful just awful no one wants that
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 10:19 AM on August 20, 2016 [49 favorites]


In PA, deer hunting is bipartisan, though. And good thing too because we're being overrun by those fuckers.

We should really be asking where each campaign stands on the reintroduction of Cougars to the northeast. This election needs more (big) cats!
posted by strange chain at 10:23 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Wow I'm reading the New York Times article linked above. Lots to talk about. So far the most interesting are:
For example, an office building on Avenue of the Americas in Manhattan, of which Mr. Trump is part owner, carries a $950 million loan. Among the lenders: the Bank of China, one of the largest banks in a country that Mr. Trump has railed against as an economic foe of the United States, and Goldman Sachs, a financial institution he has said controls Hillary Clinton, the Democratic nominee, after it paid her $675,000 in speaking fees.
and
Beyond finding that companies owned by Mr. Trump had debts of at least $650 million, The Times discovered that a substantial portion of his wealth is tied up in three passive partnerships that owe an additional $2 billion to a string of lenders, including those that hold the loan on the Avenue of the Americas building. If those loans were to go into default, Mr. Trump might not be held personally liable, but the value of his investments would sink.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:23 AM on August 20, 2016 [23 favorites]


In PA, deer hunting is bipartisan, though. And good thing too because we're being overrun by those fuckers.

Those bipartisans sure are vicious, too. I hope they don't come here.

#echochamberdefenseleague
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:23 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Off to run errands. I want at least 45 comments to read by the time I get back.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 10:24 AM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]



oh no please don't politically marginalize yourselves ignorant white people that would be awful just awful no one wants that


Well except you know that even if they don't vote, they'll still whine about every goddamn thing.
posted by soren_lorensen at 10:25 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I would like to once again apologize for loosing Michele Bachmann on the world.

Oh my god, I don't think I've ever seen a correct use of the verb 'to loose' in the wild. Well played.

Off to run errands. I want at least 45 comments to read by the time I get back.

Challenge accepted.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:26 AM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


Even in my state I haven't a lot of Trump stickers. Did see one yesterday: it was on Toyota RAV next to a Dave Matthews Band sticker. I looked hard for the Dead sticker but didn't see one.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:32 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


The linguist articles are fascinating, in how he manipulates speech. One thing I would add, is that as a salesman he knows that any customer he deals with is already at least half inclined to say yes- they're already halfway there. So his speeches are designed to reinforce the belief systems of people already inclined to believe him.

I have no idea how well that's going to work in the debates, with a neutral, questioning audience.
posted by happyroach at 10:32 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


(I don't know if they were buckled-up.)
posted by octobersurprise at 10:33 AM on August 20, 2016


Wow I'm reading the New York Times article linked above. Lots to talk about.

Oooooh, Mr. Trump isn't going to like this. If I were Meredith I would quick take the rest of the afternoon off before he gets around to reading it.
posted by tivalasvegas at 10:34 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Haven't seen a single Trump sticker or sign yet here in conservative Colorado Springs. Haven't seen any Hillary stickers or signs, either, come to think of it.

Before the primaries, we had some Carson and Fiorina. And then quite a few Bernies here in the blue part of town -- my neighbor still has her Bernie sign up and last I heard she is thinking of sitting out the vote altogether.
posted by mochapickle at 10:38 AM on August 20, 2016


The all-American Donald Trump: why Trump's rise could only happen here -"In the United States, however, there is no place for the sizable minority of racist and ethno-nationalist voters to go except within a major party. And there is also no place for elites of that party to go. If this were Europe, Reince Priebus, Paul Ryan, and Mitch McConnell might accept some tactical support from an interloping right-wing party but vigorously distance themselves from that party’s more noxious views and its leading politicians. Here, they can’t renounce Trump without renouncing the muscle and bones of their own political organization and its nominating convention."

Clinton Karma - "Having mercilessly derided the Clintons for decades, I am now counting on one of them to rescue America. While many of Clinton’s prosecutors have ended their careers in disgrace, Hillary Clinton is on her way to the highest office in the land. If she can defend us as doggedly and capably as she defended her husband and herself, we will all be in very good capable hands."

Why Republicans Are Suckers for Trumpism
posted by the man of twists and turns at 10:44 AM on August 20, 2016 [22 favorites]


That's too bad, because when I think Petosky, I would rather think Petosky stone.

When I think of Petosky I think of Ernest Hemingway. And when I think of Hemingway right now I think of the letter he wrote to Joe McCarthy telling him that one of his sons needed ass-kicking practice and inviting him down to be the pigeon.
posted by octobersurprise at 10:47 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


The CBS article on alt right was not bad. They said Bannon was best known for a Palin documentary. I never heard of Bannon before this week. Every other article I read led with he got stinking rich owning a piece of Seinfeld's syndication revenue.
posted by bukvich at 10:53 AM on August 20, 2016


Oh my god, I don't think I've ever seen a correct use of the verb 'to loose' in the wild. Well played.

I had the same thought! You are my people, and I love you all.
posted by Weeping_angel at 10:54 AM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


Haven't seen a single Trump sticker or sign yet here...

My best guess is the campaign's merch department is doing a shitty job and we can't assume that a lack of signs means that there aren't any people that would be happy (yikes) to have Trump signs.
posted by puddledork at 10:55 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Yes, the House is in play. (8/10/16)
Retaking the House remains a difficult task. If any significant reversal of fortune emerges for the Trump campaign, the likelihood of a 12 to 15 seat pickup will return. With less than 100 days until Election Day, the possibility of a Democratic wave is growing.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:02 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


That GOPLifer post is pretty fantastic and a great thing to bookmark for when you've got anti-Clinton Republican folks you're trying to reason with.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:04 AM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


> I think everyone is misreading Trump's "What do you have to Lose?" question. He's test marketing it on a limited demographic. Sometime next week he's going to start using it as his campaign's main theme. No more make America great again. Instead it'll be America, what do you have to lose.

If he does go with that it'll sound like something Anton Chigurh would use as a campaign slogan.

CHIGURH 2016: WHAT'S THE MOST YOU EVER LOST ON AN ELECTION?
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:05 AM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Voters Want Change. Candidates Disappoint. Repeat.
Voters rally to get a candidate elected, then call on the politician to stop technological change from tanking the local economy, to give them much more generous health care at half the cost of whatever they've currently got, to cut their taxes without touching Social Security or Medicare because they earned those benefits, to provide large new entitlements paid for entirely by taxing hedge fund managers, to reform the education system so that all the students will be above average, to defuse conflict in the Middle East and maybe leap some tall buildings in a single bound. You know, the usual.

...

Unfortunately, this is not a very good description of the real world. And when all the caring and the willing fails, people start talking crazy. Faced with the unhappy reality that their desired outcomes are simply not achievable in the current political landscape, they embrace extreme, destructive measures that have no chance of succeeding. The only thing that can be said for many of these ideas is that they haven't been tried yet. The same can be said for picking up this fork I happen to have sitting next to me and jamming it into my brain stem.
posted by soren_lorensen at 11:14 AM on August 20, 2016 [10 favorites]


I can't even discuss politics with people who nominally lean the same way because it always takes a weird turn.

I've been feeling this lately, myself, and I think it boils down to the crushing realization that for any given political topic, you'll first need to spend a wildly disproportionate amount of time simply accurately setting the stage before you can have a substantial conversation about it. Most people discuss politics on the same intellectual level as sports or whatever other competitive pursuit they follow. You can't even talk about the candidates without having to first draw a custom map through all of the propaganda. Of course, this large pre-talk discussion is riddled with potential derails and points of contention. You can't even set out to talk about A and end up talking about it, because if you want to have a factual conversation, you have to start by defining the concept of a fact and then building everything up from there. It's like every time you do math, you have to write a proof of the associative property from scratch.
posted by feloniousmonk at 11:18 AM on August 20, 2016 [28 favorites]


Voters rally to get a candidate elected, then call on the politician to stop technological change from tanking the local economy, to give them much more generous health care at half the cost of whatever they've currently got, to cut their taxes without touching Social Security or Medicare because they earned those benefits, to provide large new entitlements paid for entirely by taxing hedge fund managers, to reform the education system so that all the students will be above average, to defuse conflict in the Middle East and maybe leap some tall buildings in a single bound. You know, the usual.
I see McArdle is back to grinding her political axes in the absence of evidence, reality, or a good faith effort to understand what people want or what progressive reforms are actually capable of doing.
posted by dis_integration at 11:20 AM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


That GOPLifer post is pretty fantastic

Just coming in to second this.
posted by wallabear at 11:24 AM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


So from the NYT it seems that not even Deutsche Bank is willing to loan money anymore and now he has to borrow from China.
posted by PenDevil at 11:25 AM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


So when Trump says "We owe China all this money" [fake/paraphrase] he means "me and my companies". Seems plausible.
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:30 AM on August 20, 2016 [29 favorites]


Yep. Which is also why social democracy tends to work better the more homogenous the population is. People see "us" getting the welfare, not "them."

Which is in turn why social democracy can't stay homogenous. When some get something others aren't, human nature is to look for a pattern. They become "them" and whatever the distinguishing trait is gets amplified and demonized.
posted by ctmf at 11:33 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Has this collection of disgusting headlines from Breitbart been posted yet?
posted by peacheater at 11:38 AM on August 20, 2016


Donald Trump Embraces Radical Right With New Hire | Rachel Maddow | MSNBC

Explains a lot of Trump's stranger moves.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:39 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Donald Trump Embraces Radical Right With New Hire | Rachel Maddow

Man, Rachel Maddow really had me fooled.
posted by Horace Rumpole at 11:43 AM on August 20, 2016 [24 favorites]


You know, I kind of wish SPLC would make trading cards.

"I'll trade you two David Dukes for a Bundy"
posted by mrzarquon at 11:45 AM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Which Bundy?
posted by spitbull at 11:47 AM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Voters Want Change. Candidates Disappoint. Repeat.

By Megan 'Sincerely held policy position that is accidentally appealing to racists' McArdle
posted by the man of twists and turns at 11:48 AM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


> Yep. Which is also why social democracy tends to work better the more homogenous the population is. People see "us" getting the welfare, not "them."

Which is in turn why social democracy can't stay homogenous. When some get something others aren't, human nature is to look for a pattern. They become "them" and whatever the distinguishing trait is gets amplified and demonized.


OK, I'm not super mad about this or anything, but I see/hear people saying this a lot (usually in the key of "this is why we can't have nice things") and while it does bear a certain plausibilityishness, it also smells a bit like bullshit to me.

Sure, your Textbook Social Democracies like Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Iceland, etc. are small, ethnically homogeneous nations with consensus-based stable democratic politics.

But there are also examples like Belgium (bilingual to the extent that the two ethnic groups have their own self-segregated political and social institutions), Germany (big country, a colorful political history, Spain (fractious regional-national relationships, also very colorful political history), Canada (arguably not super social democratic, but bi-cultural with lots of immigrants), Singapore, Hong Kong, etc., etc.

Plus, from the other side, there are plenty of smallish relatively homogenous nations that aren't particularly social-democratic.

My point is, I don't think we have to choose between social democracy and pluralism. But there are definitely some powerful interests that benefit from driving a wedge between the two concepts.

I don't know really how to search for this, but I'd be interested to read [publicly available] analysis of this....
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:50 AM on August 20, 2016 [31 favorites]


Cards against Hannity?
posted by Devonian at 11:52 AM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Are you equating Hannity with Human?
posted by Thorzdad at 11:54 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


That's why in needs to be a separate and distinct product.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 11:57 AM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


It's 8pm here, I have started on the posh gin (Silent Pool, an experimental tipple, which is... OK, but not quite my style) and I have recovered my compassion and respect for all life, yea even those over 65. And even Hannity, who may be a loathsome blowhard twerp but still contains the divine spark, damn his eyes.

You have to love your enemies, even if you despise everything they say and do.
posted by Devonian at 12:01 PM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


"to give them much more generous health care at half the cost of whatever they've currently got"

aka the cost the rest of the OECD pays for their health care.
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 12:09 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Devonian, I imagine your posts in David Tennant's voice, although this American can't really distinguish a Scots from a Briton from a Canadian word choice.
posted by angrycat at 12:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I see McArdle is back to grinding her political axes in the absence of evidence, reality, or a good faith effort to understand what people want or what progressive reforms are actually capable of doing.

At some point, Megan McArdle might want to address the perplexing institutional reasons why Megan McArdle remains in work.
posted by holgate at 12:18 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Devonian, I imagine your posts in David Tennant's voice, although this American can't really distinguish a Scots from a Briton from a Canadian word choice.

It would be fascinating to have all the commenters in one of the Political Threads record their comments aloud and then to string them together into a (probably eight hour long) podcast.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:21 PM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Oh gods. Tell me I don't sound like Trump.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:32 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


This is the 39th comment since Secret Life of Gravy went on their errands.
posted by Reverend John at 12:35 PM on August 20, 2016 [26 favorites]


Just got back from canvassing! Apparently, my new state (NH) only allows town clerks to register people to vote, so we can't do that. Today was just information gathering, and I gotta say, it's a bit nice knowing that whatever answer people give you is good information. You're a strong Trump supporter? Great! We'll cross you off our list and not spend any more resources on you. On to the next house.
posted by damayanti at 12:39 PM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


BTW, Trump is speaking in VA at 6:00 EDT. I don't think I'll be able to live blog this one.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:39 PM on August 20, 2016


This is the 39th comment since Secret Life of Gravy went on their errands.

I too have been counting... dear jesus what have we become
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:39 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


No David Tennant I. If I were to be a Doctor Who character voice, think excitable round-spectacled round-faced boffin.
posted by Devonian at 12:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


My point is, I don't think we have to choose between social democracy and pluralism. But there are definitely some powerful interests that benefit from driving a wedge between the two concepts.

Thanks for your whole post, tivalasvegas. This truism has always bothered me as well. My own theory is that who we identify with can be fluid. I don't expect my neighbors to look like me or have my exact background - certainly not to the extent of denying them a social safety net.

And things change. 100 years ago Jews, Italians and Irish were part of the scary other in the US and that seems laughable today.

(Also I have a friend from Belgium who still goes to her family dentist because her checkup is something like $3 and she gets to see her parents).
posted by maggiemaggie at 12:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


I like to imagine Devonian sounds like this.
posted by Bloxworth Snout at 12:49 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Thanks for your whole post, tivalasvegas. This truism has always bothered me as well. My own theory is that who we identify with can be fluid. I don't expect my neighbors to look like me or have my exact background - certainly not to the extent of denying them a social safety net.

I think it's the last stop on the Reagan Democrat-to-Social Democrat train, at least I hope so (my mum is currently there, hopefully there's not a long dwell time....)
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:50 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Willful ignorance is what bothers me the most. And yes, I see people taking pride in it all the time. There should be a word for it. Just like Schadenfreude means taking pleasure in another's misfortune, there should be a word for taking pride in one's own ignorance.
posted by Surely This at 12:14 PM on August 20



How about "Republican"?
posted by AsYouKnow Bob at 12:52 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


think excitable round-spectacled round-faced boffin.

Now I really like tivalasvegas' idea of recording a giant podcast of all of our comments. This one would be priceless.
posted by Surely This at 12:54 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


In reality the main distinguishing feature of my voice is that I talk very, very quietly unless I concentrate hard on being audible. But if you'd like to think of me as sounding like Pinky from Pinky and the Brain, I wouldn't object exactly.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 1:04 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


I just saw this column pop up on twitter and it's really putting the pieces together... even the pillow thing!
posted by prefpara at 1:08 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Wow.
[Trump] is tied with Hillary (within statistical margin of error) in every major credible national poll out in the past few days. Pick your poll: Zogby, Rasmussen, LA Times/USC, Bloomberg, they all say he’s down 1 or 2 points with likely voters- which is tied. In the latest LA times/USC poll he’s down less than one point.

And we all know 5% to 10% of voters won't admit they support Trump. Why would they after the three weeks of disaster I just described?

So that means he's actually AHEAD by 3 to 5 points.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:13 PM on August 20, 2016


I'm hoping that political ad watchers this week are able to link all the refugee/immigrant fear mongering with the picture of Omran Daqneesh sitting in a Syrian ambulance with his eye swollen shut and a face full of blood.

In other news, it has been reported to me through a third party that someone I know posted a picture of their paper target from the gun range, riddled with bullet holes, on their Facebook feed. The caption reads, "Suck it, Hillary." Good times. Glad I'm not on Facebook anymore. I might have a stroke.
posted by xyzzy at 1:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


[Trump] is tied with Hillary (within statistical margin of error) in every major credible national poll out in the past few days.

Where is that from?
posted by Surely This at 1:23 PM on August 20, 2016


The previous comment.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:24 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Ah, thanks.

It’s remarkable how biased the mainstream media is against Donald Trump.

*snort*
posted by Surely This at 1:27 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Huffington's rolling summary currently shows Clinton up 8 points. Townhall is just making shit up.
posted by octothorpe at 1:29 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Not to be dismissive, but that might just be the grass being greener. My experience of Stockholm is that it feels more diverse than the time I spent in Boston, and the 2012 Swedish census reported 15% of the population were born outside the country. More to the point, people living in rural parts still blame the government for taking all their tax dollars, but for going to pay for the (wonderous) public transportation system, instead of on welfare recipients.

In 2014, the right wing racist party (by the name of Sweden Democrats) recieved 20% of the vote and were able to prevent a budget from being passed. This almost forced a reelection, which has only happened once before (well, since 1974 when the current form of government was established).

Lately, the Social Democrats (center-left in Sweden, though still further left than the Democrats in the US) have proposed a law to ban begging, rather pointedly illegitimizing a rather specific group of immigrants, the Romanisæl. Strangely, the law was originally proposed by the Christian Democrats (Christian right-wing party) a few months earlier and were roundly shot down for being a bunch of racists.

The Green party (center-left, but they prefer not to be defined by such labels, they're a legitimate political party in Sweden with a significant minority of the votes, unlike in the US) have denounced the proposed law as a populist move by the Social Democrats.

The Green party has threatened to leave the current coalition government in the next election (in 2018), which may (unfortunately) end up forcing the center to listen to the racists to be effectual, which no one wants but Trump want supposed to even make it into the Primaries.

This brief detour into a Sweden-specific version of "this is why we can't have nice things" brought to you by the only thing necessary for evil to triumph.
posted by fragmede at 1:30 PM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


From the Chicago Sun-Times reporter Lynn Sweet re Trumps Chicago losing venture.

'Trump complains about media bias. So I want to underscore that the admissions about why the Trump Tower retail space is not rented come from a legal brief filed with the Cook County Assessor by the law firm Trump’s own organization hired to seek a property tax break.

Trump’s own brief states the devastating shortcomings of the tower’s commercial and retail space.

In May, the Sun-Times’ Chris Fusco and Tim Novak reported on how Trump and his investors were able to cut millions of dollars from their Cook County property tax bills, hiring Klafter & Burke, the law firm run by clout king Ald. Ed Burke (14th), for a series of successful appeals.'

I used to work across the river and as I said in an earlier thread many floors of the building remained empty for years. It came on line in 2008 to an over-saturated commercial market in Chicago and the recession/depression. it's amazing the ground floors still remain unleased. Note that across the river the Chicago Riverwalk is packed with people seven days a week. I was there on a recent Saturday afternoon for an architecture cruise it was so crowded on a weekend afternoon in the loop it was difficult to get thru the crowds.It's hard to believe they couldn't attract something, but maybe they need the easy visual of ground floor unleased space to cover for the scammy tax deal with Cook County insiders.

There is a draw for folks to stand across the river in front of the Trump sign and give it the finger. I've seen people waiting in the best spot for their turn at the photo op.

posted by readery at 1:34 PM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


Wow, Townhall is the best example of Poe's Law I've ever seen.
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 1:34 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


from that townhall article:
If Hillary isn't ahead by 15 to 20 points right now...at this absolute low point of Trump's campaign...the deep, deep valley…Hillary is the one in deep trouble.
has there ever been a presidential candidate with a lead that commanding in the polls in august? or ever?
posted by murphy slaw at 1:34 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


[Trump] is tied with Hillary (within statistical margin of error) in every major credible national poll out in the past few days. Pick your poll: Zogby, Rasmussen, LA Times/USC, Bloomberg, they all say he’s down 1 or 2 points with likely voters- which is tied. In the latest LA times/USC poll he’s down less than one point.

Really now? Presumably that Town Hall writer can count on his locked-in readership not bothering to check on the actual polls - particularly the other reputable ones that don't agree with his thesis. But that's what epistemic closure gets you.

Incidentally, the latest LA times/US poll has Clinton ahead of Trump 44.6% to 43.4%. Presumably he couldn't be bothered to check for an update before filing his breathless copy. (That's way, way too close for comfort, mind.)
posted by Doktor Zed at 1:37 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Says who?
Says who?
What polls?

I just wanted to drop that here because I think it is the best absolute best omni-non-response possible. This way maybe the thread doesn't have to be visited by a Trump staffer.
posted by Golem XIV at 1:41 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


There is a draw for folks to stand across the river in front of the Trump sign and give it the finger. I've seen people waiting in the best spot for their turn at the photo op.

The best spot is just under the bridge so it spells "RUMP"
posted by srboisvert at 1:49 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


From that crazy townhall.com column:
Hillary is like a NFL team ahead by 14 in the 3rd quarter...
According to the Pro Football Reference win probability calculator, an NFL team with a 14 point lead at the beginning of the 3rd quarter wins the game over 92% of the time.
posted by chrchr at 1:50 PM on August 20, 2016 [44 favorites]


hiring Klafter & Burke, the law firm run by clout king Ald. Ed Burke (14th)

My surprised face, let me show you it. Burke is living proof that corrupt & racist assholery is a bipartisan endeavor.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:50 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Incidentally, the latest LA times/US poll has Clinton ahead of Trump 44.6% to 43.4%

you read that wrong, it's Trump over Clinton, with Trump at 44.2 to Clinton at 43.6. 538 adjusts this to +3 for Clinton so that poll must have a bad track record of leaning R.

Still it's disturbing that the polls are narrowing again so quickly. Who are these people whose minds change so rapidly and are so easily swayed?
posted by dis_integration at 1:56 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


mochapickle: Before the primaries, we had some Carson and Fiorina.

During the primaries, I saw this modified gem: I'm with Ben Ted! (in New Mexico, where Ted stepped aside, to give John Kasich a chance against Trump)
posted by filthy light thief at 1:57 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


>> "I'll trade you two David Dukes for a Bundy"
> Which Bundy?

Ted or Cliven are pretty useless, but Al should be worth a lot more than two David Dukes.
posted by farlukar at 1:57 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


That LA Times poll is terrifying.
posted by maggiemaggie at 2:07 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


soren_lorensen: In PA, deer hunting is bipartisan, though. And good thing too because we're being overrun by those fuckers.

strange chain: We should really be asking where each campaign stands on the reintroduction of Cougars to the northeast. This election needs more (big) cats!

Do you know Gary Johnson's nickname in highshool? Jaguar (f**kin') Johnson. Just sayin'.

Google Gary Johnson. That's what I'm sayin'. (More specifically, google Gary Johnson on Samantha Bee's show.)
posted by filthy light thief at 2:12 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Answering my own question:

Why the USC/L.A. Times tracking poll differs from other surveys
posted by maggiemaggie at 2:12 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


That LA Times poll is terrifying.
I try not to get too worked up by national polls. Regan got like 438 EC votes with just 50.1% of the popular vote.
posted by xyzzy at 2:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


that poll must have a bad track record of leaning R.

It's a tracking poll, and it has a very different methodology from other tracking polls and the "high grade" polls. The Upshot discussed it last week: they've basically committed to a weighting based on self-reported past voting throughout the campaign season that might be off by quite a way. If so, it may well be consistently off. Most poll-watchers are focusing on its shifts, not the absolute numbers.
posted by holgate at 2:17 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


you read that wrong, it's Trump over Clinton

Well, crap. Call it confirmation bias from this political position as well.

Who are these people whose minds change so rapidly and are so easily swayed?

Republican-leaning independents, presumably.
posted by Doktor Zed at 2:19 PM on August 20, 2016


Hillary is like a NFL team ahead by 14 in the 3rd quarter...

According to the Pro Football Reference win probability calculator, an NFL team with a 14 point lead at the beginning of the 3rd quarter wins the game over 92% of the time.


For a group that brands themselves as manly, salt of the earth, pure blooded American types, football metaphors are something the republicans are really, really bad at.

.@SpeakerRyan "When you advance to a national championship don't you root for a Longhorn if you're an Aggie? Start thinking that way."
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 2:22 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Republican-leaning independents, presumably.

I think that's probably true. There is a sizable group of people who have visceral dislike of Hillary Clinton (without much of a factual basis to back it up) but are put off by overt displays of racism and bigotry. They are, however, looking for a way to vote against Clinton and if Trump can go a week without using a racial slur or accidentally wearing a pointy white hood they will come home to him because Hillary Clinton just feels bad to them.

Note it's only overt displays of racism that put them off. Covert dog whistling actually appeals to them. That's why the campaign "shakeup" from Trump is much more dangerous than it seems to those on the left. We see the same old racism... maybe even more of it... but it's got a shiny new polish on it, and a lot of people will vote for it as long as there is the smallest figleaf covering it.
posted by Justinian at 2:32 PM on August 20, 2016 [10 favorites]


I gotta say it was a nice two weeks without existential dread of a Trump presidency. We are, however, moving back to the "this can't be happening, can it?" phase I think. I need to see some new good state polling out of PA and VA, stat.
posted by Justinian at 2:33 PM on August 20, 2016 [20 favorites]


I was quite taken with this tour, advertised in Private Eye, which promised nearly a week in America over the election with all sorts of access - but then I discovered it was £3650 for four days in Florida and two in Washington DC.

Which.. well, I'd be OK with a day in Florida, but it's hardly representative of the bits of the US in play.
posted by Devonian at 2:37 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Guys, 538s polls-only has her at an 85% chance of winning still. Breathe.
posted by waitingtoderail at 2:37 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]




From the Steve Bannon and the alt-right: a primer linked above,

What is there left to say about the alt-right? Let’s just start with the basics.

Their numbers are hard to quantify, but they have a large social media presence, particularly on Twitter, which they use to harass journalists and conservatives, particularly Jewish ones. They’re fond of internet memes, have their own little shibboleths (such as their tactic of putting parenthesis around the names of Jewish users​), and


Wait. I - I'm sorry, WHAT. Um, can we just take care of this right now? I mean the link itself to CBS News is a start but seriously the Sez Who guys need to take it in the nards every interview until this is fixed if this is in fact a thing. The POTUS election is as SuperBowly as it gets and the Gee Dub years are not forgotten (Looking at you, NPR).

FFS fourth estate, quit eating ice cream and get in there!
posted by petebest at 2:40 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


The cops give zero fucks about harassment in general and even less if it's done using the internet. Meanwhile social media gives no fucks about harassment that regular media doesn't write articles decrying.

That's why.
posted by Pope Guilty at 2:42 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


I gotta say it was a nice two weeks without existential dread of a Trump presidency. We are, however, moving back to the "this can't be happening, can it?" phase I think. I need to see some new good state polling out of PA and VA, stat.

Justinian, do I need to activate that Remote Ativan Release Module, remember about how we implanted it in your arm the last time the polls tightened?
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:45 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


prefpara: I just saw this column pop up on twitter and it's really putting the pieces together... even the pillow thing!

Wow. Yet another quote illustrating the level of mass meme delusion:
Because Wikileaks clearly has her 32,000 deleted emails. Secret emails that detail her crimes against the American people.

No wonder Hillary’s sick...no wonder she has “health issues”...no wonder she has trouble standing up behind a podium...or sitting on a couch without being propped up by large pillows...or walking up stairs...stress will kill you!

Hillary knows what's coming...and it's destroying her mental and physical health.
In other news, I just got back a little while ago from my first phone banking experience, and it was great. The place was PACKED: all the table seats were taken, so around 20 people crowded along the back wall of the room to hear the mayor's remarks and the brief training, before wandering off to find some available office space to work in. The enthusiasm was palpable, and there was a heartening mix of genders, ages, races and ethnicities represented. I was far from the only person at her first rodeo, but everyone was unfailingly nice and informative.

As someone with phone anxiety, the fact that I placed 50 calls makes me feel a bit like a superhero. I was definitely done for the day, though, and declined another sheaf of numbers. I may be back later today or in any case during the week for data entry, canvassing, and even some more phone banking. I had a lot of no-answers, but the conversations I did have were unfailingly pleasant: even the people who were busy were unfailingly polite, and everyone expressed strong sentiments in favor of Clinton and other Democratic candidates. The thought that Arizona might actually go blue this time around was exciting to everyone I spoke to.

tl;dr Had a great time phone banking, despite my phone issues, and will definitely be back to help make sure our next president of the United States is Hillary Clinton.
posted by Superplin at 2:45 PM on August 20, 2016 [62 favorites]


The cops give zero fucks about harassment in general and even less if it's done using the internet. Meanwhile social media gives no fucks about harassment that regular media doesn't write articles decrying.

Yep. Cops are apparently technologically impotent until they're the ones that are affected then they know exactly who the fuck to call.
posted by Talez at 2:47 PM on August 20, 2016 [14 favorites]


I won't be liveblogging this one.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:40 PM on August 20 [+] [!]


Anyone up for giving us the highlights / lowlights? I just can't even stomach his speeches, so I've counted on the summaries here...
posted by Surely This at 2:52 PM on August 20, 2016


FFS fourth estate, quit eating ice cream and get in there!
I have noticed a few more journalists being pushy over the last couple of days. Tara Reid did an interview with a Trump placard yesterday where she repeatedly demanded that he actually answer the question she asked rather than proceed with his predetermined talking points. She got quite snarky, saying stuff like, "OK, so you won't answer that question. Let me try another." I'm paraphrasing but that was the gist of the entire interview.

I also watched Anderson's panel show with glee yesterday--the black members of the panel just destroyed Kayleigh McEnany's attempts to talk positively about Trump's characterization of African Americans as a whole as uneducated criminals who are poverty-stricken as a result of 50 years of Democratic leadership. (Kayleigh is the same woman who proclaimed that Democrats were trying to raise women above men and deny her white infant son opportunities.)
posted by xyzzy at 2:52 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


The articles about how Trump's speaking style is really not the ramblings of a borderline illiterate addled moron as it appears, but actually super genius in disguise, would be much more convincing if he were winning voters and not losing them every time he opens his mouth.
posted by bongo_x at 2:53 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


In the like 10 minutes I had NPR on I'm the car today I was treated to a serious soft-peddling of who Bannon and the alt-right are. No they aren't just populists and the right wing if the republican party. They are actually neofascists and violent misogynist to boot.
posted by soren_lorensen at 2:54 PM on August 20, 2016 [15 favorites]




Tuned into the Trump rally... ugh. Anyone have a bat with nails in it so I can bash my brains in?
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2016


89 since your most recent comment *claps*

The enthusiasm was palpable, and there was a heartening mix of genders, ages, races and ethnicities represented.


My experience with phone banking has been very different. The two co-coordinators are young women but all of the volunteers are women over 50. And while we are enthusiastic there aren't that many of us, sad to say, because I live in NC and it is going to be a very important state for Clinton
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Actually Paul Ryan's question is an important one. I have never understood how New York baseball fans living in New York who love the Yankees would root for the Cardinals to beat the Mets. My favorite team is the Oakland A's but my second favorite team is the San Francisco Giants and the third place team doesn't even hardly register.

How common are these Yankee fans who hate the Mets or the other way and what is up with them?
posted by bukvich at 3:00 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Again claiming he has no donors.

Apparently trying out "the forgotten man, the forgotten woman" whose voice he will be.

Heh. Promised not to let us down. Someone's going to make a Rickroll before too long (also, iOS auto capitalizes Rickroll)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump seems to be offering privatization of Veteran medical care now.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:03 PM on August 20, 2016


In fairness, while the lede on that CBSNews piece is a bit of a mess, the meat of the piece taps into the "fascism for the lulz but also for all the standard goals of fascism" aspect of it:
This was the alt-right, a collection of racists, pick-up artists, men’s rights activists, and other noxious trolls of the internet.
but, y'know, tl;dr
posted by holgate at 3:05 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Wants us to get the military back to Cold War levels.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:05 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Again claiming he has no donors.

Every rally over the past week or so has been tied to a fundraiser. That's why he'll be in Mississippi next week.
posted by holgate at 3:08 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


The non-interventionist military?
posted by Artw at 3:08 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Again, Hillary created ISIS, but has never apologized. Mentions she has no stamina. Invokes pay for play. Predictable chanting.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:09 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Who are these people whose minds change so rapidly and are so easily swayed?

This is what I meant when I said above that this was the pivot - the speech where he "apologized." It doesn't matter that we all know he's saying the same things as before; what matters are the people who are now hearing a different person.

...yup, I'm freaking out.
posted by tzikeh at 3:12 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'll admit, I'm having some fun trolling the chat in that YouTube feed.
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:12 PM on August 20, 2016


Talking energy now. Immediately goes to coal miners. Hillary wants them out of a job. Quotes her verbatim. We have the largest coal reserves. Clean coal, that's going to make our energy bills cheaper. Talks about decline in coal jobs since 1990.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:13 PM on August 20, 2016


You can't quit him, ChurchHatesTucker, and I love you for that.
posted by Joey Michaels at 3:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [23 favorites]


Looking at the transcript of Trump's last speech he concludes
And We Will Make America Great Again.

Thank you, and God Bless.
Has he always ended his speeches with God bless? I don't remember that from previous speeches I've listened to. Also over on his Facebook page is this
Thank you, Mr. Jeff Nolan, and all of the people in Louisiana, for your courage, your resolve and your spirit. It was an honor spending time with many of you today, and my prayers are with you and all of the families who have lost so, so much. We are one nation, and when you hurt, we all hurt. Know that the entire country is praying for you -- and stands beside you.
Now that sounds perfectly normal if it came from Mike Pence, but Trump? He has only ever asked for prayers one other time that I know of-- that was when he asked the Evangelical leaders to pray for him at the anti-LGBT rally in Orlando last week
Whatever you can do, I would appreciate. I say pray for me, I pray for you,” Trump said during a meeting with evangelical pastors.

“I figure it’s probably, may be, the only way I’m going to get to heaven,”
He has certainly gotten very religious all of the sudden.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:15 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm beginning to wonder whether the critical commentary itself has not galvanized the rump candidate in recent weeks (polls aside). I imagine DT has a deep and sustaining grudge against the media and political establishment of this country, and that because of his business trials and embracement of the lowbrow he is (or has the potential to become)an empathetic figure for many.
He has to have been seeing the things we have all been saying about him. That he doesn't have what it takes. That he is mentally ill.
I think it may be entirely possible that his recent pidgeon ass kicking may have flipped a switch in his head...if that is true let's hope he is truly and fundamentally incapable of controlling himself for two months.
posted by bird internet at 3:15 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


How common are these Yankee fans who hate the Mets or the other way and what is up with them?

Predominant, I would say. Dates back to the Brooklyn Dodgers - Yankees crosstown rivalry. See also white sox - cubs, angels - dodgers. in part it is expressive of class identity, one team seen as identified with the working class and the other with big piles of money, however much these constructions are fictional and driven by marketing. i actually do see the same class identification in the Bay Area between the teams, even if your experience is not inclusive of that sense of rivalry.
posted by mwhybark at 3:16 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


I got banned from their chat. awwwww
posted by JakeEXTREME at 3:17 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


This is what I meant when I said above that this was the pivot - the speech where he "apologized." It doesn't matter that we all know he's saying the same things as before; what matters are the people who are now hearing a different person.

...yup, I'm freaking out.


This is all Donnie talking by himself, in front of a crowd who already supports him, reading from his scripts. Just wait for the debates. Blowhard who can't take the heat vs a woman who has survived decades of harsh treatment from all sides.
posted by filthy light thief at 3:18 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


JakeEXTREME: I got banned from their chat. awwwww

Three letters: VPN
posted by filthy light thief at 3:19 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Donald Trump meets with Latino leaders
Donald Trump sat down Saturday with Latino leaders from nearly a dozen states in his latest effort to appeal to minority voters who have largely spurned his struggling campaign. [...]

In a round table discussion with his campaign's Hispanic advisory council at Trump Tower in New York, the real estate mogul talked about creating jobs and his plans to limit immigration, according to attendees.

Colorado State Rep. Clarice Navarro, a member of the council who attended the meeting, said Trump heard the group's concerns.

"It's about jobs, jobs, jobs, and he really listened," said Navarro, a Republican. "I've always felt he does care about the Latino community and now it's on us to get him elected."
Wow Bannon is going to put some effort into getting Trump elected. I think it is far too late fortunately. This should have been happening last February or March.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 3:21 PM on August 20, 2016


You can't quit him, ChurchHatesTucker, and I love you for that.

Eeesh. I'm listening as long as I can. Just don't want to live blog if I'm not certain I can finish.

Feed glitched. Talking economics now. Hillary's tax hikes will hit family farms. Pushing the death tax, naturally. Wow, pivots to the killing the EPA, waters of America. Death tax again. it's killing family farms. Cut Corp tax to 15%. Clean coal again. Trade deals are going to be "fair and balanced". No more one sided deals.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:22 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Clean Coal is my favorite science fiction story.
posted by Pope Guilty at 3:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [33 favorites]


He has to have been seeing the things we have all been saying about him. That he doesn't have what it takes. That he is mentally ill.

Nah, he doesn't read! He relies on aides to verbally tell him things. One has a hard time imagining that any one who is working for or with him is anxious to relay that particular set of perceptions in a manner intended to give him pause or to create an atmosphere of self-examination.
posted by mwhybark at 3:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


...yup, I'm freaking out.

Reuters/Ipsos Poll came out yesterday with data through the 18th and Clinton was up 8%. To paraphrase Churchill, Keep Calm and Read Poll Averages. Which - thanks to the Reuters and pretty much every poll other than the LAT - have Clinton up 5 - 8%.
posted by chris24 at 3:27 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


He is constantly absorbing media. This whole metaphenomena is fueled by his media participation and engagement.
posted by bird internet at 3:29 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Now Law and Order. Claims support of nearly all law enforcement. VA governor going to get criminals to vote. They shouldn't be allowed to vote.

Now Hillary going to allow cities and states to ban guns. On to appointing Justices, briefly.

Failed Gov Tim Kaine raised taxes first week, saw tremendous increase in immigration. Back to tax increases. Kaine wasn't popular. Taxes. Immigration has tripled. Build a wall. Chanting. Mexico will pay for it. Easy.

This is a movement, and movements don't joke. Thousands of recent border crossers are being moved to VA. Hurts low income Hispanics and AAs. Criminals are right here.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:30 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Personally asking for AA vote. Party of Lincoln. Wants it to be home of AA again. We reject the bigotry of Hillary Inner cities controlled by Dems. Hillary wants to raise taxes on AA biz. We'll provide education and jobs. Put American workers at the head of the line. Amnesty program will do something bad. Shell import thousands of Syrian refugees, take jobs from AA youth.

Touches on everything again. Get out there November. Well win VA.

Fin
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:36 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I read a comment from that TownHall right wing nutjob site linked earlier that has stuck in my mind all afternoon.

Through out the Bible, God has been seen to have chosen those considered unfit to carry his message [sic].

That's a reach, but I bet it gets a few people to take license to support a racist asshole.
posted by readery at 3:38 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Are videos like this (Trump "Regrets") playing as ads on TV? I'm really curious what people are seeing.

Clinton's "The Briefing" videos are pretty pointed, but I'm not seeing them being posted around.
posted by zennie at 3:39 PM on August 20, 2016


So Milo Yiannopolous, who got banned from Twitter for harassing Leslie Jones, (for the malfeasance of acting in a ghostbusters remake while 1. black and 2. a woman) is Breitbart's tech editor.

I'm sure this happens in all the news publications, not just the alt-right ones.
posted by sebastienbailard at 3:42 PM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


The God thing is pretty new. Sometime this past week, IIRC.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:42 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


fwiw........probably not necessary to post this as folks are really plugged in here, but every Trump speech makes me want to do so.

This is my standard Trump-rebuttal post on other sites. Complaining about what he says at this point is moot. The best solution is to be prepared to vote.

How to Vote in Every State (YouTube Channel | URL links on right side of page)
U.S. Election Assistance Commission: Resources for Voters (eac.gov)
Can I Vote? National Association of Secretaries of State (canivote.org)
Student Voting Guide - Brennan Center for Justice (brennancenter.org)
Campus Vote Project (campusvoteproject.org)
Voting and Elections - Find answers to common questions about voting in the US (usa.gov)
Early Voting Calendar (vote.org)
Absentee and Early Voting - National Conference of State Legislatures (ncsl.org)
posted by lampshade at 3:44 PM on August 20, 2016 [25 favorites]


If somebody thinks those voter registration sites aren't 'fun' enough, there's votegif.
posted by oneswellfoop at 3:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm really curious what people are seeing.

I've seen the "Our children are watching" spot on TV in NC a few times
posted by thelonius at 3:48 PM on August 20, 2016


They did a national buy for the Olympics, so everyone is seeing those (at least on TV, we have the app)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 3:53 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


I just saw this column pop up on twitter and it's really putting the pieces together... even the pillow thing!

Good lord, that is some horrible writing. It's like an online newspaper comment rant in pure form, including excessive ellipses, random commas, and mixed metaphors. All it's missing is ALL CAPS for emphasis.
posted by krinklyfig at 3:57 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


I mean, right here:

Her peak is actually the valley. Her fans and the mainstream media just don't understand that yet. This is the high water mark of her campaign. It will never get better than this. And she's tied, hanging on by her fingernails.

Three different metaphors in the same paragraph. She's at the peak which is actually in the valley, at the high water mark, hanging on by her fingernails. She's drowning and hanging on and way down in the valley.
posted by krinklyfig at 4:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [18 favorites]


Did you mean: alt reich
posted by kirkaracha at 2:01 on 8/21
[38 favorites +] [!]


That's a dogwhistle. Can we not do this?

Wikipedia:

Possible negative connotations in modern use

A number of previously neutral words used by the Nazis have later taken on negative connotations in German (e.g. Führer or Heil); while in many contexts Reich is not one of them (Frankreich, France; Römisches Reich, Roman Empire), it can imply German imperialism or strong nationalism if it is used to describe a political or governmental entity.


The alt-right is not cohesive enough to be considered an entity and we can hope it never holds government.
posted by Autumn Leaf at 4:06 PM on August 20, 2016


Fucking John Denver.
posted by Artw at 4:06 PM on August 20, 2016


Three different metaphors in the same paragraph.

In conclusion, Hillary Clinton is a land of contrasts!
posted by Surely This at 4:07 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]



I was quite taken with this tour, advertised in Private Eye, which promised nearly a week in America over the election with all sorts of access - but then I discovered it was £3650 for four days in Florida and two in Washington DC.

Which.. well, I'd be OK with a day in Florida, but it's hardly representative of the bits of the US in play.


UM OKAY so if NATIONAL FUCKING REVIEW can pull off a post election cruise extravaganza surely metafilter can right? All proceeds to benefit the mods in the form of alcoholic beverages / whatever else they need.
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:16 PM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Autumn Leaf, I don't think that's a dog whistle so much as a direct and pejorative allusion.
posted by adamgreenfield at 4:17 PM on August 20, 2016 [25 favorites]


UM OKAY so if NATIONAL FUCKING REVIEW can pull off a post election cruise extravaganza surely metafilter can right?

Well, at the very least there should be celebratory (?) meetups.
posted by Surely This at 4:21 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


UM OKAY so if NATIONAL FUCKING REVIEW can pull off a post election cruise extravaganza surely metafilter can right? All proceeds to benefit the mods in the form of alcoholic beverages / whatever else they need.

Yeah, but Tehhund would get to the ship weeks after the cruise ended and we'd feel bad.
posted by zachlipton at 4:21 PM on August 20, 2016 [57 favorites]


I am hiking the Pacific Crest Trail from Mexico to Canada this spring and summer, and it has been a real joy to load these megathreads whenever I catch some internet and then slowly read them in my tent over the next few days and feel like I am in somewhat in tune with what is happening in the election. Thanks to all who participate.
posted by Kwine at 4:21 PM on August 20, 2016 [60 favorites]


Yeah, I don't feel bad about comparing the alt-right to fascists, because that is precisely how they describe themselves.
posted by krinklyfig at 4:23 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Yes, but not all Fascists are Nazis, and once "Nazi" started being appended to "Grammar" and "Soup", it really degraded the concept.
posted by oneswellfoop at 4:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Pretty much the same turds as Gamergate with pretty much the same coherence of wold-view.
posted by Artw at 4:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


To me, given how often I see these kinds of interactions, there seems to be some suggestive elements that repeat themselves with regularity that are worth thinking about when conducting one's own conversations on the subject.

Yeah in my workplace back around the 2008 election cycle and for a while afterwards there was a man who's style was very similar to what you describe. His favorite pastime was to stand over coworkers (who were mostly trying to actually work) and rant about whatever Fox News was indignant about at the time (mostly how evil Obama was, natch.) He would get all worked up, increasing in volume as he went, while whoever he was ranting to made polite noises, sometimes agreeing with him to a limited extent, but more often just making the kinds of noises most people would interpret as "I'm not really interesting in discussing this."

What made it so enraging to me was he was literally the only white man in the office. Almost everyone else were women, mostly WOC. So he was lecturing WOC about how evil the Black President was and they were too well socialized to tell him to shut the hell up.

Finally I sent him an email asking him to please stop discussing politics in the office during working hours (I wasn't his boss, we had totally separate supervisor positions), reminding him that members of the public could hear him (since I could hear every word in my office with the freaking door closed) and that people have diverse opinions. I also mildly implied that it might trigger or agitate one of my mentally ill clients, hoping he'd get the fucking message. He did, apologized, and shut the hell up. One of the best things I ever did.

It also reminds me of a conversation I overheard in my doctor's office this primary season. Two white people were lecturing their black coworker about how she needed to vote for Trump. Her tactful response was "I'll have to pray on it." At which point the white woman started lecturing her on HOW to pray. "Well, just remember you have to LISTEN too." I admired that nurse's restraint when she didn't smack the crap out of her coworker.
posted by threeturtles at 4:26 PM on August 20, 2016 [40 favorites]


Yeah, but Tehhund would get to the ship weeks after the cruise ended and we'd feel bad.

Trump won't be needing his helicopter anymore, I'll go ahead and arrange for Tehhund et al. to be flown out to the ship when they get to the departing port.
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:27 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think it's more like the Germans are offended that they are the go-to comparison for awful shit. "Why can't we be more like the British," I imagine them thinking, "and just quietly bury this?"
posted by indubitable at 4:27 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Also people, if you don't have any ativan at hand you can just go ahead and listen to this.
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:33 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


There is going to be an event for Clinton campaign volunteers on Monday in Boston with Bill Clinton, Elizabeth Warren, Ed Markey and Marty Walsh. Doors open at 2 pm, the event starts at 3 pm and goes until 5 pm. If anyone is interested in going let me know and I can share the RSVP link via MeMail.
posted by peacheater at 4:35 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Which is not to say it's only open to people who have volunteered already, I'm sure they'd welcome anyone who's interested.
posted by peacheater at 4:36 PM on August 20, 2016


I'd love to be in the US with MeFites on election night, but as that's unlikely to happen I can certainly offer a place for any who happen to be in Edinburgh and fancy raucosity with a big screen, decent connectivity and serious drinking.
posted by Devonian at 4:37 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


I have been plenty embarrassed recently by the significant Steve-American involvement in Trump’s campaign, so when the Clinton campaign sent me this solicitation, you better believe I donated again.
posted by nicepersonality at 4:38 PM on August 20, 2016 [37 favorites]


It would be fascinating to have all the commenters in one of the Political Threads record their comments aloud and then to string them together into a (probably eight hour long) podcast.

I hate to tell you all this, but in my head you all sound exactly like me. Which is probably why these threads can be so comforting. I like hearing myself sound all intelligent and rational.
posted by threeturtles at 4:40 PM on August 20, 2016 [28 favorites]


I have been plenty embarrassed recently by the significant Steve-American involvement in Trump’s campaign, so when the Clinton campaign sent me this solicitation, you better believe I donated again.

Ha! I got one of those too, but I have a really unusual name, even globally, so my email said that 1 other person with my name was a Hillary supporter. Now I'm really curious about this other person.
posted by peacheater at 4:41 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


I don't think that's a dog whistle so much as a direct and pejorative allusion.

That's how I meant it, anyways.
posted by kirkaracha at 4:43 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Failed Gov Tim Kaine raised taxes first week, saw tremendous increase in immigration. Back to tax increases. Kaine wasn't popular.

Tim Kaine was so unpopular as mayor of Richmond he was elected Lt. Governor in 2001 (in Virginia the Governor and Lt Governor are elected separately, not a joint ticket like President & VP). He was so unpopular as Lt Governor he was elected Governor in 2005. He was so unpopular as Governor he was elected to the Senate in 2012. Sad? Nope.

And Tim Kaine didn't raise taxes in Virginia. One of the planks that got him elected Governor was a promise to fix the fucking roads and do something about the awful traffic in Northern Virginia and in the Hampton Roads area. When he got into office, he had the gall to say that roads cost money and Virginia is required to have a balanced budget, so here's a plan to fix some roads and here's how we will pay for it by increasing revenues (yes, taxes). But the gerrymandered Virginia General Assembly was (and still is) controlled by the other guys who refused to budge.

So Tim Kaine is smeared by Republicans as a big tax increase guy, merely because he had to acknowledge the reality that infrastructure costs money and he proposed to make $4 billion of transportation improvements happen. All for nothing, nobody got better roads. In fact, he was in office during the 2008-9 economic implosion and oversaw $4.6 billion in budget cuts. Calling out Big Daddy Kaine as a big taxin' guy is just ignorant.
posted by peeedro at 4:45 PM on August 20, 2016 [39 favorites]


In other news: Trump canceled his Portland, Oregon fundraiser, due to 'schedule conflict'.

Too bad it was too close to Burning Man, because I could really see some Art Car protest performance if it did happen.
posted by mrzarquon at 4:47 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


He would get all worked up, increasing in volume as he went, while whoever he was ranting to made polite noises, sometimes agreeing with him to a limited extent, but more often just making the kinds of noises most people would interpret as "I'm not really interesting in discussing this."

I had a similar thing happen to me recently at the grocery store. I had just got there and was browsing through the produce section when I heard a voice say "Did you see the car chase!?". After first paying it no mind assuming he was talking to another person, I looked up and saw the expectant face of a man probably early-40s looking to me for confirmation. I sort of smiled, said "No, I didn't hear about that" and he proceeded to fill me in on a car chase that had apparently happened nearby. I thanked him for letting me know and then went back to choosing my fruits.

Later on I'm in the dairy section looking over the yogurt options when the same voice starts up again. I look to my side and the guy starts talking about how the news never covers that sort of thing and how awful the news was (which is ridiculous. This is LA. We have car chases all the time. And the news always covers it). I said something like "Yeah, they care more about their advertisers than anything else" which is not wrong and I was just trying to give the obviously lonely guy a human acknowledgment of his concerns. But I really wasn't looking to continue this.

Then he starts ranting more and more about how the media is terrible and journalists should be prosecuted. Which set off my in-brain warning signal and I started backing away. I, being a polite person, didn't go back too much but let him know that prosecution seemed a little extreme to me. He seemed to realize I wasn't biting and he looked around for the next person to engage with. I hope they got out quicker than I did. But the whole thing left me pretty uncomfortable.

Moral of the story? It's probably best not to engage that sort of person in the first place. Their opening lines are just the start of a deep well of crazy.
posted by downtohisturtles at 4:48 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


Through out the Bible, God has been seen to have chosen those considered unfit to carry his message [sic].

That's a reach, but I bet it gets a few people to take license to support a racist asshole.


When a whale pukes Trump out on main street USA he's totally got my vote. But not a moment before.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 4:48 PM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]


And in a semi-related stupid, Obama is subsidizing lesbian hillbilly carpetbaggers to break up Republican voting districts. (Not FPP worthy.)
posted by CBrachyrhynchos at 4:51 PM on August 20, 2016


I hate to tell you all this, but in my head you all sound exactly like me. Which is probably why these threads can be so comforting. I like hearing myself sound all intelligent and rational.

But are you someone who grew up in Michigan as the child of a Minnesota-born woman, and who then lived as an adult in Ontario and Chicago?

Oh and who also is hearing-impaired and has never been able reliably to emit such crucial sounds as initial and intervocalic /r/, etc.?

oh god i've said too much
posted by tivalasvegas at 4:53 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Hey, hiya, Kwine! *waves*
posted by wallabear at 4:58 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I have been plenty embarrassed recently by the significant Steve-American involvement in Trump’s campaign, so when the Clinton campaign sent me this solicitation, you better believe I donated again.

Oh, ha! I just got one, too. But my name pluralized is also the name for everyone's favorite strepsirrhine primate. LORIS FOR HILLARY!

The big-eyed animal faction is with her!
posted by mochapickle at 5:05 PM on August 20, 2016 [23 favorites]


Every day, I walk my dogs by this creek that leads to a pond. Almost every day, there's a cranky blue-grey heron in the water who will fly off when we approach and make a circle overhead. Yelling and cackling at us the entire time. When in flight, the bird looks very much like a pterodactyl. I've started calling this bird "Mrs. Pterodactyl" When I see posts by Mrs. Pterodactyl, I'll imagine her sitting smugly in front of the screen thinking "On the internet, no one knows you're a heron."

Not trying to single you out Mrs. Pterodactyl. Just my random thought in imagining what mefites sound or look like. Sometimes I imagine everyone as a large parliament of different animals. The mice routinely vote down ongoing motions from the cats on the subject of "What shall we have for dinner?" And I get shushed occasionally because there's no place in Robert's Rules of Order for random howls and yips.
posted by honestcoyote at 5:12 PM on August 20, 2016 [41 favorites]


From an 8/18 rally: Reporter’s Tweets from Within Crowd at Trump Rally Are Raw, Powerful and Shocking

Scary stuff. Comments should be avoided.
posted by ZeusHumms at 5:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


> Sometimes I imagine everyone as a large parliament of different animals.

*cough*

Some of us are plants.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:17 PM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]


plants that cough.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 5:19 PM on August 20, 2016 [20 favorites]


A criminal vegetable.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:24 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]




Republicans prep ‘break glass’ emergency plan as Trump tumbles:
Republicans, worried about preserving their House and Senate majorities in the face of fierce headwinds, are accelerating their plans to distance themselves from Donald Trump – and may soon concede, if only implicitly, his defeat.

Party strategists are mapping out blueprints for down-ballot candidates, in TV ads and on the campaign trail, to present themselves as checks on a Hillary Clinton presidency. It’s an approach that would essentially admit a Trump loss. In interviews, nearly one dozen Republican operatives said they had begun poll-testing the idea – which one labeled a “break glass in case of emergency” strategy - to gauge how the public would react to it.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:36 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]




From last year, essentially the bullet point version (half the length) of the interview I posted above : David Cay Johnston: 21 Questions for Trump on Kickbacks, Busting Unions, the Mob & Corporate Welfare
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:39 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Pat me on the goddamned shoulder when it is time for the next thread. I finally joined this thing because I spend half my life lurking here, but it takes a quarter of that to get this damned page to load.
posted by a gentleman and a scholar at 5:42 PM on August 20, 2016 [23 favorites]


"The Making of Donald Trump": David Cay Johnston on Trump's Ties to the Mob & Drug Traffickers (Democracy Now!)
Link to Transcript
posted by ZeusHumms at 5:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


An old pal just phoned me, he worked the Clinton funder earlier tonight, reports the candidate was in good spirits and ready to hurry off to her next event. GET READY BOSTON!
posted by vrakatar at 5:51 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


David Cay Johnston: 21 Questions for Trump on Kickbacks, Busting Unions, the Mob & Corporate Welfare
Transcript, Original Article.
posted by ZeusHumms at 5:53 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Pat me on the goddamned shoulder when it is time for the next thread. I finally joined this thing because I spend half my life lurking here, but it takes a quarter of that to get this damned page to load.

Highly recommend you try the classic theme. Things remain pretty stable up to 4,000 comments on my mac with the classic theme.
posted by zachlipton at 6:01 PM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


Seconded. Reading election threads in the classic theme is like watching political events on C-SPAN.
posted by box at 6:06 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


I have a dinky macbook and with classic theme I have never had a problem loading a metafilter page fast.
posted by bukvich at 6:08 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


I didn't even realize I was USING classic theme until people started talking about it working better for these threads, then I realized why I hadn't had problems. I've even used it on my phone without much trouble at the bottom of long threads.
posted by threeturtles at 6:09 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


Highly recommend you try the classic theme.

I'm also a long time lurker, but just recently signed up*. Does the "Classic Theme" do the dynamic "show new comments" thing? I find that to be useful.

* Hi, a gentleman and a scholar.
posted by Surely This at 6:10 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Welcome! Yep, the classic theme does the same dynamic new comments thing. And it comes with an unprofessional blue background.
posted by zachlipton at 6:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Does the "Classic Theme" do the dynamic "show new comments" thing?

It does do that.

(Also that is an impressive favorites given to comments made ratio in less than a month signed up. /Oprahvoice)
posted by T.D. Strange at 6:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Interesting tweetstorm about today's immigration pivot (and then pivot back to the beginning):
‏@JuddLegum
1. Lots of conflicting reports about what Trump said to a group of Hispanics this afternoon about his immigration policy
2. For what I can tell, it seems Trump suggested to this group that he would modify his proposals and legalize some undocumented immigrants
3. His campaign, however, appears to be telling a lot of reporters that Trump isn't changing his position at all
4. The official campaign statement tries to have it both ways. Effectively argues that Trump always said he would be "humane"
5. So the Trump view is that any change to his immigration position that is "humane" isn't actually a change
6. Needless to say, none of this makes any sense. Trump's signature issue is immigration, any softening would be a big switch
7. My guess is Trump was telling these folks what he thought they'd want to hear, didn't realize implications. Now campaign is cleaning up
posted by acidic at 6:14 PM on August 20, 2016 [21 favorites]


Yes, Classic does the new comments thing. One of the best recent-ish coding additions to the site in my mind. I've never found newweb design intuitive or particularly beneficial, so Metafilter keeping the classic theme around has been a godsend. If it were an all or nothing change I'd have never kept up with these threads.

I'm old, aren't I?
posted by downtohisturtles at 6:15 PM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]


I nopped out of the new theme immediately, so I keep forgetting that is a thing. Classic works pretty well with older iOS devices too. And yeah, show new coments is an old feature.

More David Cay Johnson: David Cay Johnston: There is "Incredibly Strong Evidence" Donald Trump Has Committed Tax Fraud

Transcript, Article (h/t ZeusHumms)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:17 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


Thanks for all of the responses. I know it's kind of "META", but it matters to a lot of us on older hardware / slower connections. I've been traveling a lot lately, and my habit has been to load "The Thread" right before cabin doors close so I can catch up in flight (Hi TehHund!)

My phone isn't THAT old, but the size of the threads has caused the scrolling ballistics to have paroxysms of agony. "Classic" it is...
posted by Surely This at 6:22 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I also use classic exclusively. Old school.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:22 PM on August 20, 2016 [15 favorites]


I'm signed up for my first day of door-to-door canvassing tomorrow, in VA. Wish me luck!
posted by nonasuch at 6:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [37 favorites]


I'm signed up for my first day of door-to-door canvassing tomorrow, in VA.

NoVa, I hope. Good luck either way!
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:29 PM on August 20, 2016


Trump canceled his Portland, Oregon fundraiser, due to 'schedule conflict'.


Hmm. I expect Bannon won't let him throw rallies in Maine anymore, either.
posted by murphy slaw at 6:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


NoVa, I hope.

Yep, Arlington, and Woodbridge next week. Though really, the way the polls are going I'd be fine almost anywhere.
posted by nonasuch at 6:32 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


I live in far western Maryland, which is apparently a lot different than where a lot of you folks live. Here, Trump is winning, bigtime. Here, to admit one is for Clinton is to admit that one is a moron. It is a given that the Clintons are crooks determined to pillage our coffers and leave us all to be raped and killed by terrorists. We're 98+% white and relatively poor and overwhelmingly Christian, we don't even have a synagogue within an hour's drive and only a couple of Catholic churches honestly, and we probably only know other "Christians" and "whites". The terrorists, if they came, would almost certainly not bother with us, we are too rural and don't even matter. We have next to no violent crime. But Trump will win here in a landslide. I have a lot of ideas and knowledge aboutwhy that is. I also don't think it matters much. My county has about 30,000 people. We don't matter. It is a shame. It would be nice if we did matter, or that the majority of folks here knew that Trump won't be what does make us matter. I get the anger. It is frustrating to me that the ones who "took our jobs" through automation and outsourcing and antiunion behavior, are the same ones who wave flags and blow dogwhistles at us to get us to vote against our own interests. But the thing is, there aren't many of "us" left, there aren't many outposts like where I am from left. We had to move or starve. We have to come up with a new way to live, but so do they have to come up with a new constituency. They have just about killed off their old reliable voters. The white nationalism ticket seems scary, but most of us who it speaks to are already calling bullshit, and I don't think there's enough left to amount to much. That's just my opinion on north central appalachia, and we certainly do have a lot of racists and homophobes here, a lot a lot...per capita. But it feels like last gasps, not a revolution.
posted by a gentleman and a scholar at 6:35 PM on August 20, 2016 [65 favorites]


I read a comment from that TownHall right wing nutjob site linked earlier that has stuck in my mind all afternoon.

Through out the Bible, God has been seen to have chosen those considered unfit to carry his message [sic].

That's a reach, but I bet it gets a few people to take license to support a racist asshole.


I've seen this specific argument put forward on facebook multiple times already. (Because -- God is putting him into office, so we should do our part to put him into office? It's not clear why God can use Trump but not Clinton in these posts.) Also, this C.S. Lewis quote, on a picture of Clinton/Trump:

I feel a strong desire to tell you–and I expect you feel a strong desire to tell me–which of these two errors is the worse. That is the devil getting at us. He always sends errors into the world in pairs–pairs of opposites. And he always encourages us to spend a lot of time thinking which is the worse. You see why, of course? He relies on your extra dislike of the one error to draw you gradually into the opposite one. But do not let us be fooled. We have to keep our eyes on the goal and go straight between both errors. We have no other concern than that with either of them.

Trump's polling numbers with white evangelicals are great for him, but the ones that I know personally all seem to be doing a lot of soul-searching about their vote.
posted by gerstle at 6:36 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump's next pivot: he fakes being born again.
posted by spitbull at 6:40 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


I also don't think it matters much. My county has about 30,000 people. We don't matter. It is a shame.

My city has 600,000. We don't matter either. MD is weird.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:40 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump's polling numbers with white evangelicals are great for him, but the ones that I know personally all seem to be doing a lot of soul-searching about their vote.

Most of my extended family is in Texas and Oklahoma, and they're mostly Evangelical and strongly Republican. They've pretty much fallen silent about politics, which speaks volumes...
posted by Surely This at 6:42 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Trump's polling numbers with white evangelicals are great for him, but the ones that I know personally all seem to be doing a lot of soul-searching about their vote.

I've talked about this before and I'm not one of them so I can only speak so much, but most of my family are white evangelicals and most of them distrust the faker claim-God when it's convenient "Christians" about as much as they distrust non-Christians. Trump can say anything he wants but there are a lot of people who actually believe the stuff he's pretending to care about. And they don't really like the pretenders.
posted by downtohisturtles at 6:44 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


We don't matter either.

I know my specialty lately has been shorthand and snark, but if I can speak to this...

I'm in Hawaii and by the time we start voting, the presidential election is usually already decided. Our 2 electoral votes never matter in the sense that we haven't even started to vote by the time is all decided.

What does matter, however, and why GOTV is so essential is our state and local races. I suspect the same is true in MD. The more people we get out to vote progressive locally, the more we can adopt policies that benefit people locally. The national stuff is important, but the big changes happen when they start at a local level. I think the next big change in the USA will be Marijuana legalization. If states start following Colorado and Washington, it's just a matter of time until it happens nationally.

What in saying is, we're spending a lot of time fetishizing the presidential race but the down ballot stuff is where we matter the most. In conclusion, gotv.
posted by Joey Michaels at 6:54 PM on August 20, 2016 [46 favorites]


Our 2 electoral votes

4, if that helps.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 6:57 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Paul Dean, August 16th Mass Transit: Election 2016 — Which Outcomes Should Transit Fans Cheer For?

I'm new to this publication so I don't know Paul Dean's history aside from looking at a couple other pieces he wrote. He seems to be pretty even in his writing. Just trying to give people some things to read outside of the typical things we've seen as of late.
posted by cashman at 6:59 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


In conclusion, gotv.

True, but MD has been subject to suburb fixation the past few cycles. The Gov is elected off year, so GOTV is especially important. That's why a mostly blue state is reliable for Prez. It's gerrymandered to hell, so blue for Congress. But the Gov is in flux because it comes down to the off year voters so it's fairly even (and the Dem was a moron last go.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]



Pat me on the goddamned shoulder when it is time for the next thread. I finally joined this thing because I spend half my life lurking here, but it takes a quarter of that to get this damned page to load.

Highly recommend you try the classic theme. Things remain pretty stable up to 4,000 comments on my mac with the classic theme.


I'm quite illiterate, but I read a lot of this on my not so smart old Android phone. Belive me, we're already in the weeds here on classic theme. E.g, this took me (what felt like) an hour to find your message and preview and post response. It took at least four reloads and aw snaps anyway.

I do appreciate the welcome and the tip. As a very recent lurker though, my option until now seemed only to be to reload. I never saw show new comments until I joined. And like I say even having joined, my old Wal-Mart LG straight talkphone is still having a time of it with this thread.
posted by a gentleman and a scholar at 7:13 PM on August 20, 2016


From the Democracy Now! interview posted above, the story of cutting off the baby's healthcare:

So, Freddy Trump Jr. died of alcoholism early. And when Old Man Trump died, he had a new grandson—a great-grandson, who was born a few days later—very sickly child, nearly died several times, huge medical bills. Everyone in the Trump family gets medical insurance from the Trump Organization. Donald is a big believer in healthcare. It’s one of the positive things you can say about him. And the line of Freddy Trump Jr., when they realized they’d been effectively cut out of the will, filed a lawsuit. "Hey, you know, you guys are dividing the money up four ways instead of five." Donald immediately cut off the healthcare for this sickly child.

AMY GOODMAN: This is his grandnephew.

DAVID CAY JOHNSTON: His grandnephew. And he’s asked about this. And he says, "Well, I don’t like people who sue my father." And he was told, "Well, don’t you think this will look cold-hearted? You’re putting the life of this child in jeopardy." "Well, what else am I to do?" And that’s an essential element to understanding Donald Trump. You don’t exist, Amy, I don’t exist, as a person. That’s why he talks about women the way he does, in these degrading terms. Donald doesn’t see other people as people. He sees them as things to be used. And put the life of a child in jeopardy for more money? Donald thinks nothing is wrong with that. That’s—of course you would do that, if you’re Donald. If you wouldn’t do it, what’s wrong with you? That would be Donald’s attitude.
[emphasis added]

If true, his older brother dying "from alcoholism" seems like an important point, at least as it may relate to daddy issues. Which, c'mon.
posted by petebest at 7:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [13 favorites]


Trump's next pivot: he fakes being born again.

That sort of already happened.
posted by OnceUponATime at 7:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


But merely "letting Christ into your heart" is not being "born again." He has to come under conviction.

At least he's got the speaking in tongues part down.
posted by spitbull at 7:19 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


4, if that helps.

If there is ever a day that the rest of you have to wait for our for electoral votes before we can declare who has won the presidential election, I will feel awful for all of you. We're three hours off of the PST on election day and we count our ballots slowly.

I'll feel pretty good for us, though, because we're as blue a state as exists.
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Trump's Empire: A Maze of Debts and Opaque Ties

Trump is way more leveraged than anyone realized.
posted by Miko at 7:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


And his dad's middle name is "Christ". [real]
posted by petebest at 7:38 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hillary will be in Reno, Nevada on Thursday. Ahead of that, Al Franken was in NV today, campaigning for Hillary and firing up volunteers.
posted by cashman at 7:43 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Classic is definitely the best format for these mega-threads. That said, this thread makes my iPad cry. The delay as I type this is horrible, and there's a very, very long pause as it processes and posts. Time for a new thread, please!
posted by Thorzdad at 7:59 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Really? The plain theme is working so much better for me than the classic one. I can scroll up, down, and comment without any lag.
posted by Joe in Australia at 8:02 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Mefite Recliner of Rage appears to be in be in both this thread and back on DNC Day 1 at the same time. If you've become unstuck in time, just say Egg McMuffin three times and we'll come rescue you.


I almost don't want to be rescued since I'm digging the DNC thread too much, but what the hell: Egg McMuffin! Egg McMuffin! EggMcMuffin!

(I wonder if tehhund is doing what I am - DNC thread on phone, current thread on laptop, dropping my jaw at the "burning car" reference...)
posted by Recliner of Rage at 8:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [28 favorites]


In Donald Trump's socioeconomic orbit they have two stupid cliches:

1. If you owe the bank a million dollars you have a problem, but if you owe the bank two hundred million dollars they actually have as big a problem as you do.

2. The most important feature of your net worth is the absolute value of it (i.e. 100 million under water is actually much better than a half million above.)

(These are the jolly good fellows who crashed the economy for the rest of us in 2007-2008)
posted by bukvich at 8:11 PM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


Donald Trump’s Campaign Manager Rose Quickly By Playing to His Ego:
There’s a secret to newly appointed campaign manager Kellyanne Conway’s success with Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump: she knows how to play to his ego.

The notoriously thin-skinned businessman promoted Conway over fellow campaign pollster Tony Fabrizio, in part, because he didn’t like it when Fabrizio told him about his poor poll numbers and how he needed to do better, a source close to the campaign told The Huffington Post.

Conway is better at massaging the truth ― she tells him that there are hidden Trump voters lurking in swing states, the source said ― and her words.

“Kelly’s telling Trump what he wants to hear,” the source said.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:21 PM on August 20, 2016 [14 favorites]


Conway tells Trump what he wants to hear; Trump tells voters what they want to hear. Who's telling Conway what she wants to hear?
posted by Spathe Cadet at 8:23 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


Wow, I was so exhausted from phone banking that I basically fell into a coma afterward, and then woke up to discover that apparently the only adverb I had room for in my brain when I wrote my last post was "unfailingly." I promise I normally have a slightly larger vocabulary. #BrainFryIsReal
posted by Superplin at 8:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


Who's telling Conway what she wants to hear?

Her accountant?
posted by Thorzdad at 8:25 PM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


The notoriously thin-skinned businessman promoted Conway over fellow campaign pollster Tony Fabrizio, in part, because he didn’t like it when Fabrizio told him about his poor poll numbers and how he needed to do better, a source close to the campaign told The Huffington Post.

Is Trump actually Mr. Burns? Because at this point the comparisons are getting ridiculous.
posted by downtohisturtles at 8:26 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Conway tells Trump what he wants to hear; Trump tells voters what they want to hear. Who's telling Conway what she wants to hear?

The voices of crazy inside her own head.
posted by JackFlash at 8:26 PM on August 20, 2016 [4 favorites]


Conway is better at massaging the truth ― she tells him that there are hidden Trump voters lurking in swing states, the source said ― and her words.

Well, crap. The Trump campaign now has someone who is smart and savvy that Trump likes. That's dangerous.
posted by dw at 8:26 PM on August 20, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh hey guys I was just watching a rerun of the Daily Show from the other night and they were doing the whole Evan McMullen...Who? thing, and I was all like THEY STOLE OUR BIT! And then they never called him Egg McMuffin, so whatever.
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:27 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Who's telling Conway what she wants to hear?

Her accountant?


I swear to God I almost posted this, and then I thought, does she have enough juice to get paid upfront?
posted by schadenfrau at 8:27 PM on August 20, 2016


Clean Coal is my favorite science fiction story.

That's not science fiction. It's fantasy.
posted by tclark at 8:28 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


Enjoyed the DNC? Relive all the best moments with Bad Lip Reading.
posted by zachlipton at 8:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


You guys if I get a few weeks off that happen to coincide with...idk a productive fugue state where I can write a Trump campaign satire, I'm totally writing it about Meredith

And the other women who vie for control of the easily manipulated hair piece

(Is this better or worse? Worse right? Goddammit)
posted by schadenfrau at 8:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


1. If you owe the bank a million dollars you have a problem, but if you owe the bank two hundred million dollars they actually have as big a problem as you do.

I've heard this a number of times, and Trump seems to have exploited it at least once before (he was deeply leveraged when he bought the Eastern Airlines shuttle and at least one casino). But the axiom seems less true when your lender is state-owned and has $2.4T in assets like Bank of China does.

Who knows exactly how all of the LLCs and partnerships that have all of this debt are structured, but it's troubling to think about a president that could be on the hook for $100M+ that's owed to BOC.
posted by strange chain at 8:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


Less than 30 minutes till the deadline and Trump has not yet filed his July FEC report...hmmmmmmmmmmm
posted by sallybrown at 8:37 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


Was just about to post that, sallybrown! Watch party! I'm not very well-versed in this stuff, but have been following @LPDonovan in particular.

edit: literally just as i was posting, it's here!
posted by acidic at 8:41 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Is it just me or is this filing a bit anemic?
posted by Yowser at 8:44 PM on August 20, 2016


Some speculation here about where the $80M went; basically that a lot of it was from joint fundraising efforts and was never really Trump's in the first place.
posted by zachlipton at 8:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


it's troubling to think about a president that could be on the hook for $100M+ that's owed to BOC.

I still believe his first motivation for wanting the job is the potential to enrich himself because of the position; and the day he's inaugurated, he'll tell "whoever's in charge in China" (that's exactly how he'll address the message) that if they want him to hold off on his promised 35% tariffs, "first, write of that $100million debt".
posted by oneswellfoop at 8:48 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


He did bring in 36mil in July, that's actually on par with Romney's 33mil in July.
posted by T.D. Strange at 8:50 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Except the convention in 2012 was in August.

Still, Trump beat Romney in July and Hillary came up short of Obama's July 2012 ($49M to $44M).
posted by dw at 8:56 PM on August 20, 2016


Well forgive me if I'm late to the news, but I think it's awesome that Hillary Clinton had her campaign set up twitter accounts for almost each and every state, in early 2015. RI still needs one. And the Hillary Logo with what appears to be some picturesque element of the state in it, is the icon for most.

Hillary for: Alabama Alaska Arizona Arkansas California Colorado Connecticut Delaware Florida Georgia Hawaii Idaho Illinois Indiana Iowa Kansas Kentucky Louisiana Maine Maryland Massachusetts Michigan Minnesota Mississippi Missouri Montana Nebraska Nevada New Hampshire New Jersey New Mexico New York North Carolina North Dakota Ohio Oklahoma Oregon Pennsylvania South Carolina South Dakota Tennessee Texas Utah Vermont Virginia Washington West Virginia Wisconsin Wyoming.

Puerto Rico too.
posted by cashman at 9:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [14 favorites]


Holy shit Trump is getting creamed in fundraising.

DJTFP:
7. Total Receipts This Period 36682127.29

HFA:
7. Total Receipts This Period 52288296.69

That explains why they only dropped $18m on advertising. That was literally half their cash and Trump is already $20m down on Clinton after this month.
posted by Talez at 9:03 PM on August 20, 2016 [5 favorites]


Oops. $52M. My bad. I was reading the wrong report.
posted by dw at 9:07 PM on August 20, 2016


Greetings to you all! Like several others, these threads have done me in because I am addicted to them, but the scrolling is driving me nuts on a tablet. In a good way, of course :) The obvious solution, after so many years of lurking I've lost track of when I started reading, is to finally join.

I owe so much to all of you for the awesome commentary and the links to so many exceptional articles. I give you all a group shout out because I can't begin to name you all, but I have mentally thanked you on the way as I read the posts, linked articles and comments. Especially relevant now are those of you in the election threads. I read every comment and have learned so much, so thank you all!

I must single out Soren_Lorenson for her additions to my vocabulary. I have informed the family that "guanopsychotic (TM)" is my new favorite word, and have copyrighted it to her. It speaks volumes very succinctly this season.

I have to thank ChurchHatesTucker for doing something I cannot, which is to coherently watch and report on a Trump performance. You go above and beyond and I'm grateful. I can't even watch the Trump surrogates any longer since so few call them on their idiocy, so a Trump speech is out of the question.

I'm looking forward to spending the remainder of this season camped out here blessedly not scrolling :) And thank you all again.
posted by Silverstone at 9:10 PM on August 20, 2016 [71 favorites]


I love that these threads have drawn out so many lurkers (myself included!)

But I have bad news for you about the scrolling
posted by schadenfrau at 9:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


it's awesome that Hillary Clinton had her campaign set up twitter accounts for almost each and every state,

Hey, neat! And last time I checked, there was nothing happening in Alaska, but now there's a bunch of stuff (linked from the Alaska for Hillary twitter account, which would be awesome if I used Twitter). Maybe I'll do something, then.

And I made it to the end of the thread before it moved on! Woo hoo!
posted by leahwrenn at 9:15 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


And the Hillary Logo with what appears to be some picturesque element of the state in it, is the icon for most.

Of course, of course the picturesque element for SD is motherfucking Mt. Rushmore, a symbol of white America's gigantic middle finger towards native people, and a boring shitty blown up mountain at best.
At some point we're all going to realize that Rushmore is actually a really embarrassing mistake made by racists and imperialists and stop using it as a symbol for anything good, right?
The Corn Palace is also a uniquely South Dakotan landmark, and it also doesn't represent genocide.
posted by neonrev at 9:23 PM on August 20, 2016 [16 favorites]


And I'm sure someone's pointed this out in the last 30,000 comments, but it's awfully nice that hillaryclinton.com has a prominent "Español" toggle at the top of the page, and what looked like a reasonable version of her website---it didn't switch back to English for me until I was actually at the list of the two local campaign events.

Needless to say, donaldjtrump.com appeared to have no such option.
posted by leahwrenn at 9:23 PM on August 20, 2016 [7 favorites]


To schadenfrau, I'm already seeing benefits, but I can see that some scrolling will be involved :) But tonight, sooooo much less. And that gives me a happy :)
posted by Silverstone at 9:28 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


The HillaryforCA Twitter account is very pretty, except that the picture is of Cattle Point Lighthouse in the San Juan Islands of Washington.

There isn't a lighthouse in California that looks like that one, and I happen to have visited Cattle Point on Tuesday...
posted by suelac at 9:33 PM on August 20, 2016 [8 favorites]


I think it's awesome that Hillary Clinton had her campaign set up twitter accounts for almost each and every state

Okay, sure, but let's pour one out for Hillary Forfl and Hillary F. Orpa and all the other Hillarieses who have to make do with less mnemonic twitter handles now.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 9:46 PM on August 20, 2016 [10 favorites]


Jeff Goldblum phone banked for Hillary earlier this month.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:47 PM on August 20, 2016 [19 favorites]


As to the scrolling, I remember reloading the 2008 Palin thread and then having to spend the better part of a minute scrolling scrolling scrolling on my first-gen iPod Touch--it was like obsessively petting a tiny kitten.
(this was before the "skip [to the bottom of the page]" link was added)
posted by blueberry at 9:48 PM on August 20, 2016 [9 favorites]


fine, Jeff Goldblum, I'll go out with you
posted by palomar at 9:55 PM on August 20, 2016 [12 favorites]


I make sure to click on a time stamp regularly, so that when the iPhone randomly decides it wants to reload the page (or it's been a while since I checked in) I go back to where I was.
posted by leahwrenn at 9:56 PM on August 20, 2016 [46 favorites]


Ah, neat trick leahwrenn, gonna have to remember that one. I don't like teasing people by using favs as a bookmark.
posted by neonrev at 10:00 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


I think Hillary is going to benefit from a reverse Bradley effect where evangelicals and other republican voters are going to pull the lever for her or just not show up to vote, even though they are answering pollsters and friends as likely Trump voters.
posted by humanfont at 10:12 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]




Trump’s biggest expense last month was $8.4m in digital consulting and online ads, going to San Antonio-based firm Giles-Parscale

Of the $18m Trump spent last month, $1.4m was on shirts, mugs and stickers. And then $423k on hats. So more than 10% just on merchandise.
posted by T.D. Strange at 10:13 PM on August 20, 2016 [2 favorites]


Eyeing the pile of avocados on my kitchen table and wondering whether I should take some guacamole on my next visit to the Democratic HQ, to make friends and influence people among the staff and volunteers.

You guys, this could mark the beginning of my political career.
posted by Superplin at 10:20 PM on August 20, 2016 [24 favorites]


I don't like teasing people by using favs as a bookmark.

You could find a comment nearby you like, then fave and leave it.

I do think it would be handy if the thread could be RSS-ified for reading in feedly. It seems like it would rarely be worth it, but for these monster threads, the read/unread tracking and not having to reload the whole page would really be handy.
posted by ctmf at 10:25 PM on August 20, 2016


It is -- hit the "subscribe" link at the top of the page.
posted by gingerbeer at 10:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [6 favorites]


Unless I'm misunderstanding what you're looking for, in which case, apologies.
posted by gingerbeer at 10:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


How have I not seen that in all this time? Thanks, gingerbeer. I knew I could do that for the front page of each subsite, but not for the threads.
posted by ctmf at 10:44 PM on August 20, 2016


cashman: […] it's awesome that Hillary Clinton had her campaign set up twitter accounts for almost each and every state, in early 2015. RI still needs one.

It looks like the accounts were mainly being set up in alphabetical order in Feb. and March 2015, and the @HillaryForRI account was created on a date that fits with that. That makes it seem less likely that someone else scooped up just @HillaryForRI the same day the Clinton campaign was going to. Maybe they just forgot the password?

It doesn't follow the same naming schema as the rest of the accounts, but there is a (fairly recent) official account @HRCforRI with the same sort of setup as all the @HillaryForWherever accounts.
posted by JiBB at 11:31 PM on August 20, 2016 [1 favorite]


Trump is way more leveraged than anyone realized.

I'm probably not anyone, then, because the best way for me to parse Trump is through the filter of Robert Maxwell -- as veteran British journo Raymond Snoddy said this week -- except without the pension fund to pilfer and without the yacht. One big lender calls in a loan and the whole charade and façade comes crashing down.

Perhaps the way to say it is this: Trump is more leveraged than you think, even if you think that Trump is more leveraged than anyone else thinks.
posted by holgate at 11:34 PM on August 20, 2016 [11 favorites]


Oh, hey, checking out the state Twitter account linked above, there is a photo of the phone banking event I did this morning. I'm actually sitting in the direct line of sight of the camera... but entirely blocked out by a dude at the next table. Heh.
posted by Superplin at 12:01 AM on August 21, 2016 [19 favorites]


Secret Life of Gravy: "KINGSTON: I mean, maybe it would have been nice if he went and had a backdrop with a burning car, but the reality is --

KEILAR: No no no no no, I'm not talking about a burning car. I'm talking about meeting with black voters.
"

Remember when Obama was first elected in 2008 and people said racism was dead in America? Boy, were they wrong!
posted by double block and bleed at 1:05 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


Clinton's November win probability on Princeton Election Consortion has just jumped up to 95% Bayesian, 92% Random Drift.

I'm not taking anything for granted this year and it's significantly lower on some other prediction sites (fivethirtyeight has her at 75.2% in their polls-plus model right now), but it's comforting to see.
posted by kyrademon at 2:03 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


(All the way from Australia) I'm loving people checking in with their stories of volunteering for Hillary.

I can't remember if that used to happen in the 2008 and 2012 election threads. Maybe because it seems even more important now?
posted by moody cow at 3:49 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Checking in from the Netherlands here. I never felt like I should have a right to vote for an American president but with the chance of the US going full fascist and the threat of getting nuked in the process I feel weirdly left out of any chance of a say in the matter.

As moody cow above I love hearing about mefites volunteering for HRC. Please please please all US mefites, do anything you can to help avoid the orange disaster from happening.
posted by Kosmob0t at 4:06 AM on August 21, 2016 [20 favorites]


It definitely happened in both those years' election threads.
posted by cashman at 4:06 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


> I'm signed up for my first day of door-to-door canvassing tomorrow, in VA.

Go get 'em, tiger!

I'm volunteering today at a voter registration event in the Northern Virginia 'burbs that I found on the Clinton campaign website. This is a first for me, doing something more than snarking from the sidelines. Really what got me to this point was my ignorant, Tea Party, Guns & Ammo brother. It only took two minutes of being reasonable to move him from "lock her up" to "I really don't know who to vote for" which I consider a win.
posted by peeedro at 4:25 AM on August 21, 2016 [39 favorites]


My county has about 30,000 people. We don't matter. It is a shame. It would be nice if we did matter, or that the majority of folks here knew that Trump won't be what does make us matter. I get the anger. It is frustrating to me that the ones who "took our jobs" through automation and outsourcing and antiunion behavior, are the same ones who wave flags and blow dogwhistles at us to get us to vote against our own interests.

Take away almost everything else (or appear to), and pride and identity become the only remaining interests people believe they can advance.
posted by kewb at 4:34 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


I think Hillary is going to benefit from a reverse Bradley effect

God, I hope so. The less respectable he gets the more I worry about a Bradley effect sort of situation.
posted by gerstle at 5:42 AM on August 21, 2016



When in flight, the bird looks very much like a pterodactyl. . . . "On the internet, no one knows you're a heron."

How true, how true . . .
 
posted by Herodios at 5:45 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


In related news, poop truck explosion in Russia showers cars in shit.

I have found our metaphor.
posted by spitbull at 5:54 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


Sometimes I imagine everyone as a large parliament of different animals. The mice routinely vote down ongoing motions from the cats on the subject of "What shall we have for dinner?" And I get shushed occasionally because there's no place in Robert's Rules of Order for random howls and yips.
posted by honestcoyote at 8:12 PM on 8/20
[7 favorites −] Favorite added! [!]


Eponysterical on two levels.
posted by rabbitrabbit at 5:58 AM on August 21, 2016 [14 favorites]


Eponysterical on two levels.
posted by rabbitrabbit


Meta-eponysterical on four.
posted by spitbull at 6:12 AM on August 21, 2016 [43 favorites]


indubitable: I think it's more like the Germans are offended that they are the go-to comparison for awful shit.

Nope, that's fine, go ahead. If the shoe fits... It's only the Sun-style "The Panzers Are Rolling Again!" stuff for completely unrelated sports events (reciprocated by the worst German tabloids) that is shitty.

Kosmob0t: As moody cow above I love hearing about mefites volunteering for HRC. Please please please all US mefites, do anything you can to help avoid the orange disaster from happening.

Seconded. Thanks to everyone who volunteers, there are a lot of people out there who feel that they have a stake in this election but have no options for actually affecting the outcome. However, if someone could convince Trump to hold an Obama'08-style rally in Berlin... The protests would be HUGE!
posted by ltl at 6:20 AM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


I'd like to welcome Silverstone, a scholar and a gentleman, schadenfrau of course, and any other new members who've joined recently because of this massive mess of an election. New voices are always appreciated :) If you're still lurking, step in, the mods need $5 for beer.

I just realized there are now more MeFites who've joined after me than before me. I've only been a member for 5-1/2 years!

Your humble servant & resident idiot, #122599
posted by wallabear at 6:25 AM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


The FEC filings for August are bizarre. trump raised a paltry sum in comparison to Clinton, but also to Romney and Obama in 2012. But apart from that he only spent 18 Million dollars. Around half of what Clinton spent. And his receipts show that 0 dollars of that was on advertising.
posted by codacorolla at 6:31 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


So has anyone read Jared Yates Sexton's Twitter account of a Trump rally? I'm not sure how much of it was pasted through to that article on the clickbait website posted earlier, but it starts at that link and is pretty troubling. There seems to be a lot of hatred for the press right now, and Bannon may have been a significant upgrade in terms of getting Trump to stay on message.
posted by indubitable at 6:31 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


(Apologies for having to swipe through Tweets or however it is that you're supposed to navigate Twitter; their interface seems to be [*flips through current metaphors*] an exploding septic tank truck)
posted by indubitable at 6:35 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Your humble servant & resident idiot, #122599

Anyone else read that in Javert's singing voice?
posted by Mchelly at 6:43 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


Superplin: Oh, hey, checking out the state Twitter account linked above, there is a photo of the phone banking event I did this morning. I'm actually sitting in the direct line of sight of the camera... but entirely blocked out by a dude at the next table. Heh.

I can't believe it ... I was on TV! Did you see me, I'm a natural!

Good luck in these first days of your political career :)
posted by filthy light thief at 6:44 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I really wish major media outlets would at least threaten to withdraw live coverage of Trump rallies and speeches, and stop interviewing his surrogates as "balance" on every panel, over the threats and outright stonewalling and lying on display. You can feel the actual on the ground journalists and some of the Tv hosts starting to lose their shit. I wonder what it would take to push that button, and I fear it's injury to a member of the press or one of the surrogates actually losing their shit and using the "b" or "c" or "n" words on camera. (For someone getting close, see Michael Cohen's rage face at Brianna Keillar by the end of the "says who?" segment. You know that guy has a rage switch that was close to getting flipped by his humiliation there by a woman.)

Among other juicy bits we learn from last night's Trump FEC filing, Corey Lewandowski's firm is STILL GETTING PAID BY TRUMP despite his working for CNN.

Jesus, mainstream broadcast media. So do *any* of you have any pride left?

Washington Post has gone in an admirable direction on this stuff. But the TV networks really need to find some shred of professional pride soon. I mean, come on, the guy is directly threatening to go after the remains of our free press as president.
posted by spitbull at 6:50 AM on August 21, 2016 [19 favorites]


> So has anyone read Jared Yates Sexton's Twitter account of a Trump rally?

So here's the Storify of Sexton's Trump's pivot tweets which I think someone linked to earlier in this thread but I can't find it. Anyway, all because I wanted to say that aside from the press hatred which I found quite chilling, this made me laugh despite myself:
@JYSexton
There are a couple of grandmothers over here talking about their grandkids and executing Clinton in the same breath.

@JYSexton
And now they're talking about Clinton's brain damage.
"She's basically a vegetable."
"A criminal vegetable."
posted by moody cow at 6:54 AM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


A killer tomato?
posted by spitbull at 6:56 AM on August 21, 2016 [13 favorites]


ZeusHumms linked it here.
posted by wallabear at 6:56 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


I like how ready people are to describe the effects of a concussion as brain damage when it comes to Clinton. I'm going to start asking them if they think football should be banned because players get repeated concussions and are therefore obviously mentally incompetent babies. I'm sure that they will see the obvious similarities and not find some way in which a woman getting a concussion is somehow more significant than a man.
posted by neonrev at 6:59 AM on August 21, 2016 [11 favorites]


Also did Larry Wilmore have Wolf Blitzer's fucking number or what at that correspondents' dinner gig? He was shamed for being mean but damn.
posted by spitbull at 6:59 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


And of course, Surely This, how could I have missed that? :)
posted by wallabear at 7:03 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I'd like to welcome Silverstone, a scholar and a gentleman, schadenfrau of course, and any other new members who've joined recently because of this massive mess of an election. New voices are always appreciated :) If you're still lurking, step in, the mods need $5 for beer.

I've lurked here for about sixteen years (!) but just recently signed up for an account. These election threads truly are a treasure.

Don't forget to add your story to MetaFilter Memories.
posted by Surely This at 7:04 AM on August 21, 2016 [28 favorites]


Meanwhile, in a back office in Trump Tower, a psychologist is up late at night, writing up the shocking results of her in vivo experiments on crowd behavior, persuasion and executive function.

I mean, that is what's going on here, right? A series of experiments testing the limits of various social psychology theories, right?
posted by soren_lorensen at 7:05 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


My conservative uncle that baited me into a Facebook argument that I mentioned upthread? Deleted the entire post/conversation. Friends say that's like winning the internet argument super bowl, but I'm just disappointed I did all this research about estate tax and didn't get to post it. But hey, I learned a lot so if anyone needs some ammo arguing with someone going apeshit over "death tax", hmu.
posted by misskaz at 7:06 AM on August 21, 2016 [20 favorites]


Joy Reid is living up to her first name on MSNBC right now. She just pwned a Latino Trump surrogate by responding to his ugly comments on "illegal" as a term of discourse with "That was simply disingenuous and wrong."
posted by spitbull at 7:09 AM on August 21, 2016 [17 favorites]


Ah, I'm also going to start asking people harping on her concussion if they have ever played a contact sport or been in an accident, and then suggest that if they had they probably shouldn't be allowed to vote, as how can we trust someone who's brain damaged to make intelligent decisions and vote for the right people?

Truly, the Trump supporters are ushering in a new era of using past injury to determine who is and who isn't capable of having certain jobs. Played football in high school? Better limit you to basic labor jobs so your brain damage doesn't endanger anyone. After all, how can we trust a cop, a doctor, a judge or an engineer if they've been brain damaged? We'll all be much safer now.

Hell, what do I know, I had a concussion as a kid, I'm probably basically insane and have been for a couple decades now.
posted by neonrev at 7:09 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


My conservative uncle that baited me into a Facebook argument that I mentioned upthread? Deleted the entire post/conversation. Friends say that's like winning the internet argument super bowl, but I'm just disappointed I did all this research about estate tax and didn't get to post it. But hey, I learned a lot so if anyone needs some ammo arguing with someone going apeshit over "death tax", hmu.

Nah, getting someone to delete the thread is more like winning a regular season game, getting someone to delete the thread AND delete you as a friend is the Super Bowl.

You get extra points if you start complaining about them 'censoring' you and taking away your first amendment rights. That one starts the heads a-spinnin'.
posted by neonrev at 7:12 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'm seeing murmurs on Twitter that Alan Dershowitz is going to play Trump for Clinton's debate prep.
posted by stolyarova at 7:15 AM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


It's more like being far enough behind the shit truck that the explosion doesn't reach your windshield.
posted by spitbull at 7:15 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Truly, the Trump supporters are ushering in a new era of using past injury to determine who is and who isn't capable of having certain jobs.

Good thing for them that their guy has never worked a real job or taken any real physical risks a single day in his life.
posted by EatTheWeek at 7:23 AM on August 21, 2016 [7 favorites]


I'm down for a test of stamina between Clinton and Trump done reality TV style. I'm thinking something like "Hands on a Hardbody" -- a 90s documentary about a car dealer in Texas that holds a competition for a new Nissan (ergo "Hardbody") pickup in which the winner is the person who can stand with their hand on the truck for the longest time. The premise is more entertaining than you'd think given the cast of characters involved.

Only I want Clinton and Trump to stand for as many hours as they can with their hand on a simulated nuclear launch code button on live TV while undergoing a moderated debate on the finer points of international policy.

Moderated by Alex Trebek.

They can phone a friend once. Each can have 3 hints per hour. Their only option for leaving the stage other than hourly bathroom breaks is to hit the button and end the debate.

People want reality TV. Give it to them.
posted by spitbull at 7:36 AM on August 21, 2016 [19 favorites]


while undergoing a moderated debate on the finer points of international policy.

Save that for double jeopardy. In the opening round they should just answer questions from the US citizenship exam.
posted by peeedro at 7:44 AM on August 21, 2016 [9 favorites]


People want reality TV. Give it to them.
posted by spitbull at 7:36 AM on August 21 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]


Oh my God, I want that.
posted by schadenfrau at 7:44 AM on August 21, 2016


A really good read in Politico: Erick Trickey -- "Charlie Sykes' Air War."
posted by spitbull at 7:51 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


I'll take What The Fuck for $1000, Alex.

I agree with spitbull's idea of media's withdrawing coverage of Trump. People are being threatened that are in their employ. That must be unnerving, at best, I know I wouldn't want to be caught up in that environment. Is OSHA OK with these working conditions? And a blackout of Trump's rallies would send a HUGE message. The BEST message.
posted by wallabear at 7:52 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


::Trump presses the button::

Trebek: Ohhhh... Boo Hiss....
posted by downtohisturtles at 7:53 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


The Princeton Election Consortium has updated their prediction methodology with the result that Hillary Clinton is very strongly favored to win.
posted by procrastination at 7:55 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


YouGov just released showing Clinton up 46-40 in Ohio. Tied at 40 in Iowa.
posted by spitbull at 7:58 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Is OSHA OK with these working conditions?

Journalists accept a certain amount of risk as part of their work, generally. Being on the campaign trail already has its risks - you're in target-rich environments with famous people and schedules and appearance information is easy to find. I don't think they should withdraw coverage out of fear of risk, but I do think it'd be understandable to reduce effort because the campaign has so little availability to the press.
posted by Miko at 8:07 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


They should report from his rallies in combat body armor. Make the same point.
posted by spitbull at 8:11 AM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Also that YouGov shows Ohio undecideds down to 6%, she's winning 90% of democrats, she's cut his lead with independents from 19% last month to 6% now, and she's winning with black voters 91-3.

Makes his current strategy obvious: it has nothing to do with black voters and everything to do with white independents.
posted by spitbull at 8:15 AM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


MSNBC's Joy-Ann Reid is not to be played with. Holy crap. Steve Cortes (Trump surrogate) just walked into a buzzsaw.
posted by cashman at 8:19 AM on August 21, 2016 [15 favorites]


To elaborate, this Trump Steve was on her show trying to defend Trump's courting of black voters, while he's running a racist campaign, and he said something about how it's completely fine how Trump is behaving, and Joy brought up a retweet from Trump himself, where Trump retweeted a white nationalist posting bs 'stats' about black & white crime. He looked stupid after that trying to make a case for Trump.

Props to her staff, because while I'm sure they have clips on deck, there are times where she brings up something and wants something shown on screen in a key moment, and they bring it up on screen.
posted by cashman at 8:23 AM on August 21, 2016 [26 favorites]


Makes his current strategy obvious: it has nothing to do with black voters and everything to do with white independents.

Yep. The current messaging is a fig leaf of responsibility that makes the holding of the nose more appealing.
posted by codacorolla at 8:23 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Yes that was the guy I was talking about above -- Steve (!) Cortes. Joy dismantled him completely.
posted by spitbull at 8:24 AM on August 21, 2016


Yes, Miko, of course. It just really torques me that assholes think they get to gather and threaten anyone for simply being present as press, at a press event. A blackout seems appropriate, but hey, that's news, and thus.
posted by wallabear at 8:27 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Clinton's November win probability on Princeton Election Consortion has just jumped up to 95% Bayesian, 92% Random Drift.

I think that's due to a recalibration of the model's underlying assumptions about the volatility of the race, not to any substantive polling changes.

Basically they looked at the relatively stable poll numbers to date and decided that this is likely to continue.
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:36 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


OK the Trump July FEC filing reports $356.01 paid to Meredith McIver!

Got their money's worth too.
posted by spitbull at 8:37 AM on August 21, 2016 [26 favorites]




Gotta had it to Hillary - orchestrating Benghazi, setting up private email servers, murdering Vince Foster and countless others, all while so weak and frail that she needs to be constantly propped up on pillows: impressive!
posted by Cookiebastard at 8:51 AM on August 21, 2016 [53 favorites]


First of a 7-part series - Millions more to face new voting restrictions in 2016
Updated: August 21, 2016 — 1:08 AM EDT

Excerpts:
Since the last presidential election in 2012, politicians in 20 states have passed 37 different voting requirements that they said were needed to prevent voter fraud, a News21 analysis found. More than a third of those changes require voters to show specified government-issued photo IDs at the polls or reduce the number of acceptable IDs required by preexisting laws.
...
By contrast, some Democratic-controlled states, mostly in the West and New England, have passed laws that gave voters the option to register every time they walk into a motor vehicles office or at the polls on election day, made it easier to vote early, or have converted their elections to entirely vote-by-mail.
And this disturbing part:
Some states put new voting requirements in place only after the 2013 U.S. Supreme Court decision in the Shelby County v. Holder case negated the provision in the 1965 Voting Rights Act that required them to clear such changes in advance with the Justice Department. For example, Texas enacted one of the strictest photo ID laws in the country in 2011, only to have its implementation blocked by the federal government. But on the same day in 2013 on which the Shelby County decision was handed down, state officials announced that the ID law would finally be enforced. While it has been ruled to be discriminatory four times by federal courts, it was kept in place while the state appealed those decisions.

"We think it's perfectly reasonable when you need to show a photo to pick up your kids from school, sometimes to pick up your pet from the kennel, that it's OK to show a photo to prove that you are the person who is voting," Republican Texas Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, a coauthor of the voter ID law, said.

The plaintiffs in the Texas court case argued that the law amounts to a modern poll tax because many voters without photo ID are low-income people who, without driver's licenses, faced trips of 90 minutes or more via public transportation to government offices to pay for and obtain the required forms of ID.

The Shelby County decision also undermined the Justice Department program that had monitored elections in states and localities previously covered under the Voting Rights Act. Now, Justice can send observers only to where they are ordered by a federal court. Otherwise they must get local permission to enter polling places. There are just seven counties or cities in five states that will fall under court-ordered observation for the November election, according to a Justice spokesman, compared with the 11 states where observers formerly had authority.

Steven H. Wright, a federal observer coordinator for the Department of Justice from 2007 until 2012, said this will leave a "gaping hole" in the government's ability to investigate and sue over unjust election practices.

"If you call a polling place and you ask, 'Are you complying with federal law?' they're going to say, 'Yes,' because no one is going to admit they're violating federal law. The only way [to make sure] is to have people in the polls."
Which gives more encouragement to act now, increase the lead now. It's a good thing to get people against a racist hatemonger anyway, but the closer things are to a blowout on election day, the less likely there is going to be a mess on election day with people trying to cause chaos and prevent people from voting.
posted by cashman at 8:59 AM on August 21, 2016 [28 favorites]


People are being threatened that are in their employ. That must be unnerving, at best, I know I wouldn't want to be caught up in that environment. Is OSHA OK with these working conditions?

Also from that series of tweets from a Trump rally:
Jared Yates Sexton ‏@JYSexton Aug 18

Talked to multiple journalists, all of them agreed it's getting worse. One said he wished he was undercover like me.
posted by indubitable at 9:10 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


> Checking in from the Netherlands here... As moody cow above I love hearing about mefites volunteering for HRC. Please please please all US mefites, do anything you can to help avoid the orange disaster from happening.

It's a real pity that America had to produce an actual orange disaster, since I think "Orange Disaster" would be a pretty good name for a punk band from the Netherlands.
posted by You Can't Tip a Buick at 9:19 AM on August 21, 2016 [13 favorites]


Republicans Set to Lose Senate Control:
According to The Huffington Post’s Senate model, which relies on the polls aggregated in HuffPost Pollster charts, there’s a 55 percent chance that the Senate will swing completely over ― and a 23 percent chance that it’s tied at 50 seats for each party. That means there’s a 78 percent chance that the Democratic Party could get 50 or more seats.
posted by kirkaracha at 9:27 AM on August 21, 2016 [19 favorites]


Ventured out of my urban bubble today and regretted it instantly. I drove over to a supermarket that's attached to a dead mall that's being torn down and was looking at the demolition when an elderly man gets out of a twenty year old Subaru and instead of going directly into store, comes over to me and starts telling me how this is all Obama's fault. Never mind that the mall had been dying for decades but he wanted me to know that everything got worse eight years ago and did you know that one out of five households have no job holder? And that food stamps and medicaid rates are going through the roof and a few other right-wing rants that he kept yelling at me as I walked away and into the store.
posted by octothorpe at 9:34 AM on August 21, 2016 [18 favorites]


Trump paid dearly to boost fundraising

The campaign increased its spending in July, but not on building a staff or field organization.
The money the Trump campaign raised also didn't come cheap. The campaign more than doubled its spending from the previous month to $18.5 million in July, far more than in any other period of the campaign. Most of that money went toward expanding the campaign's online fundraising operation.

A full 45 percent, or $8.4 million, went to Giles-Parscale, the San Antonio-based digital marketing firm that has done Trump's online advertising. (The company had never worked for a campaign before 2016.) The campaign also paid $100,000 to the Prosper Group for fundraising consulting.

Meanwhile, spending on the 84-person staff and field organizing barely increased from the previous month, to just $392,000 and $432,000, respectively. The campaign dropped much more — $1.8 million — on hats and other merchandise.

By comparison, the Hillary Clinton campaign in July spent $2.9 million on its 703-person payroll and $25.8 million on media.
Very strange. Donald Trump is not managing his campaign at all. For a so-called great businessman he seems to be unable to run his campaign like a well run, efficient business.

What I was thinking about this morning while cooking brunch is the very different approaches each campaign has made to raising funds. Donald conflates his fundraising numbers with money going to PACs and the RNC so he can tout impressive figures while telling his supporters that his campaign is all self-funded. On the other hand Hillary sends me Halp! Oh Noes! emails several times a a day telling me if I don't send her a dollar right this second Donald will win! yet she raised more money than even Barack Obama did in July 2012.

Here is another interesting pull from the Politico breakdown:
The filing did list a $1,713.40 "contribution refund" to Manafort, who did not take a salary for his work on Trump's behalf.

That is such an odd sum, I have to wonder what is was for. A plane ticket? A week's worth of meals? Or is it that Manafort made a mistake and accidentally contributed too much money to Trump.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:35 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


...chance that it’s tied at 50 seats for each party...

Anyone know any good "Dad Jokes" about the constitutional duties of the Vice President?
posted by Cookiebastard at 9:39 AM on August 21, 2016 [7 favorites]


I personally would want them to include throwing double middle fingers at the Rs every time he got to cast that vote, but I guess Tim Kaine's a nicer guy than I am.
posted by rifflesby at 9:44 AM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


So I'm doing a google search for the last 24 hours for headlines on "Donald Trump FEC" and most of the stories are about Trump owing more in corporate debt than he reported-- that's the big takeaway from the NYTimes financial report. Second most popular is the $20,000 salary to Cory Lewandowski.

I think there is a lot of outrage that CNN hired someone who was--and may still be--on Trump's payroll. I've seen some attempts to explain it away, that possibly that paycheck was his salary for the previous month, but that still leaves the fact that CNN hired someone with close ties to one of the campaigns to be a commentator. It could not be more obvious that CNN is more interested in viewership than ethical journalism.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 9:47 AM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]




Anyone know any good "Dad Jokes" about the constitutional duties of the Vice President?

*Tim Kaine shows up to the Senate with a ripped tie*

Senate Majority Leader: "Uhhh... Mr Vice President?"
VP Kaine: "They told me I was supposed to be a tie breaker!"
posted by Talez at 9:53 AM on August 21, 2016 [38 favorites]


Oh I have one: "Justice Garland." (Knock knock...)
posted by spitbull at 9:58 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


NC GOP Seeks to Limit Early Voting | MSNBC

Thanksgiving is going to be rough at the Woodhouse's.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 10:00 AM on August 21, 2016


I caught this article this morning which brings up one of my greatest fears about Trump holding any public office in the U.S. The NYT began to peel the layers of his financial onion with their article yesterday linked above, but I'm not sure it's possible in this country to legally discover off-the-books loans or business bribery costs without a criminal investigation to discover it. His business dealings with oligarchs concern me on both counts.

Where Trump is not required by law to place his assets in a blind trust if elected, nor is he required to liquidate any of them to remove potential conflicts of interest, we're expected to take him at his word that his children will manage them and all will be well.

What if, however, like his loan from the Bank of China, he owes money to banks or oligarchs and he's elected? What if he's paid bribes to attempt to do business in Russia? Business bribery is very specific in terms of what is allowed. If he's elected, what if these entities, real or imagined, were to call in the loan(s) or threaten to reveal illegal bribery? I don't think he has the necessary wherewithal to tell them to go fly a kite and take the consequences. I don't really care with whom he chooses to do business, right up to the point where it influences this country and how it is governed.

I'm really hoping that the MSM starts thinking about why he's so friendly with Russia, why Paul Manafort might have been brought into the campaign, and why General (ret.) Flynn is still in the campaign and getting security briefings. As well, is Manafort truly gone, or is he still informally "advising" Trump?

As I say, I'm not sure if any of the financial matters can be legally investigated by the MSM, but I would appreciate it if someone reputable investigated and informed me that I should look into a new tin foil hat, perhaps a nice beret this time.
posted by Silverstone at 10:00 AM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


Or a good one going around:

Knock knock
Who's there?
The polls.
The polls -- who?
All of them!
posted by spitbull at 10:01 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


Or a good one going around:

Knock knock
Who's there?
The polls.
The polls -- who?
All of them!
It's actually:

Knock Knock?
Who's there?
Says.
Says Who?
The polls. All of them.

posted by Talez at 10:05 AM on August 21, 2016 [50 favorites]


Lol yeah that's better. Ah, memory.
posted by spitbull at 10:08 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


What if, however, like his loan from the Bank of China, he owes money to banks or oligarchs and he's elected? What if he's paid bribes to attempt to do business in Russia? Business bribery is very specific in terms of what is allowed. If he's elected, what if these entities, real or imagined, were to call in the loan(s) or threaten to reveal illegal bribery? I don't think he has the necessary wherewithal to tell them to go fly a kite and take the consequences. I don't really care with whom he chooses to do business, right up to the point where it influences this country and how it is governed.

I would expect that the intelligence agencies have probably been taking a good look at what he's been doing, and will torpedo him with any information they have if he represents an actual threat. This would require him to have actually done something to threaten national security, and I think they'd only do it if they thought there was a realistic chance of him winning the election. It could severely damage their public image a lot if they were seen to influence the election.
posted by Mitrovarr at 10:14 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Where Trump is not required by law to place his assets in a blind trust if elected, nor is he required to liquidate any of them to remove potential conflicts of interest, we're expected to take him at his word that his children will manage them and all will be well.

Isn't it crazy that people are barely talking about this, while the media is going crazy about potential conflicts of interest with the Clinton Foundation?
posted by acidic at 10:14 AM on August 21, 2016 [36 favorites]


To be fair, those details only came out last night, but yes it will be interesting to see if the story is picked up more widely.
posted by Miko at 10:17 AM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Isn't it crazy that people are barely talking about this, while the media is going crazy about potential conflicts of interest with the Clinton Foundation?

The right is still kind of pissed that "Soros letting Clinton know about civil unrest and asking her to stop a potential government killing protestors scenario before it starts" story didn't gain any traction.
posted by Talez at 10:21 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Miko, I'm not referring to the debt details which came out last night, I'm referring to the general concept of Trump owning a huge company while being President, which has been known ever since he became a candidate.
posted by acidic at 10:23 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


If he's elected, what if these entities, real or imagined, were to call in the loan(s) or threaten to reveal illegal bribery? I don't think he has the necessary wherewithal to tell them to go fly a kite and take the consequences. I don't really care with whom he chooses to do business, right up to the point where it influences this country and how it is governed.

1. Impeachment.
2. "I, Michael Pence, do solemnly swear..."
posted by Thorzdad at 10:30 AM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


Thanks, Mitrovarr. I try to console myself with this very reasoning, but there are too many variables hanging fire out there to be entirely comfortable with it. I'm still trying and looking at nice tin foil hats for every occasion to help me feel better. I'm one who wishes this election were sooner rather than later.

Acidic, this bothers me, too. The Republicans claim the MSM is so biased against them, but doesn't begin to consider this huge discrepancy in their favor. Almost all of the negative Trump coverage involves using his own words and statements; those do paint a negative picture of him. I would call that harvesting the low hanging fruit rather than deep journalism, and I'm hoping that more pieces like the NYT financial piece come out once the media has had the necessary time to research and write them.
posted by Silverstone at 10:32 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


tied at 50 seats for each party.
Dad jokes aside, Kaine looks like an even smarter choice if this is in play - he not only knows from experience how the Senate runs, but by most accounts is respected by both sides on a personal level. Wonder if Clinton's campaign factored this in, or if it's just a nice bonus.
posted by une_heure_pleine at 10:52 AM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


Thorzdad, If he is elected and has these issues in his background, I hope this is the outcome. That depends on some things happening which are not guaranteed, though. It depends upon the intelligence services finding data which indicates a crime or crimes have been committed. It also depends on the currently Republican-controlled House and Senate being willing to do their jobs as a matter of conscience rather than along party lines.

If Trump has hidden misbehaviors or informal loans well enough, evidence might not emerge until grave damage has been done. Even if he were to be impeached and tried, he would still be President during the lengthy process.

I don't mean to sound like I'm losing sleep over this issue, but I am concerned. As with so many other issues I have with a potential Trump presidency, when taken all together, they tell me that not only he must be defeated soundly, the Democrats need to retake the House and Senate.

Not that I would be happy with a Pence presidency, either, but that's a whole other plate of beans.
posted by Silverstone at 10:55 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Guardian: 'If you fight fire with fire, everyone burns': how to catch a troll like Trump

Trolling works for Trump because it is fundamentally a manipulation of our emotions. “Trolling is crafted by people who believe it is their job to figure out exactly what people’s buttons are, then press those buttons,” says [MeFi's own] Jessamyn West, a veteran community manager who now works at the Internet Open Archives Library.

Trump’s trolling is a high-impact, low-output strategy. A single tweet or comment can generate days worth of free publicity, and keep him the central character in the race. Like all skilled trolls, Trump has proven masterful at inspiring his followers to do the bulk of his dirty work. According to West, the best trolls enter a conversation, make a comment or two, set off a fight, and step back as other trolls emerge to sling punches. Trolls aren’t warriors, they’re instigators. They know how to imply something racist, hateful or misogynistic, blowing rhetorical dog whistles that bring out more blatantly offensive supporters while allowing themselves deniability. “There’s an art to this,” West says. “It’s like a flaming bag of dog shit on someone’s doorstep.” Even if you know who likely put it there, it’s not like you can dust it for prints.

posted by Johnny Wallflower at 10:55 AM on August 21, 2016 [54 favorites]


Welcome, former lurkers! Here's what I do to deal with the crazy long threads: on my phone, whenever I close the browser I make sure to click on the last time stamp I read. I just leave one window on the current thread and use a different one for any other internetting so I don't use my place. (Huh... Autocorrect accepts internetting as a word...). Whenever I want to switch to a computer, I check the last timestamp and Control-F to find it. Switching back to thread on my phone after I've been on a computer all day is the only time I ever have to scroll. If I have something useful or pertinent to comment right before I leave the computer, I do, because then I can just click on "your last comment" in Recent Activity and then I don't even have to scroll then.
posted by Weeping_angel at 10:58 AM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


I think a Trump win would land us right into not a "constitutional crisis" but an administrative crisis. Trump shows several factors (foreign influence, financial) that could be disqualifying (or at least suspension/refusal to grant during investigation) for a national security clearance. What if the boss of the clearance adjudication works for the subject? What if a supposed non-partisan agency knows something disqualifying? If the voters know he's not qualified but vote him in anyway, does that override the rules?
posted by ctmf at 11:13 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Jessamyn is a "trolling expert!"
posted by spitbull at 11:19 AM on August 21, 2016 [20 favorites]


O yeah the administrative crisis would start immediately at noon on 1/20/2017 (earlier if Trump decided not to engage in any transition planning); the constitutional crisis would not occur until hours or possibly days later
posted by tivalasvegas at 11:21 AM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


That Guardian article is hella good. Here's another choice quote:
According to Chuck Dueck, a senior vice-president at icuc.social, a company that manages the online presence for hundreds of companies and organizations, trolls fall into four different categories: those who deliberately practice harassment, those who enjoy being outrageous and causing havoc, those who love to argue, and those too stupid to know they are trolls. Dueck believes Trump is most like the second and third types.
posted by spitbull at 11:22 AM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Trump shows several factors (foreign influence, financial) that could be disqualifying (or at least suspension/refusal to grant during investigation) for a national security clearance.

All power of adjudication of documents is derived from the office of the President. The President has no security clearance and there is no document that can be hidden from the President for national security reasons.

There are documents the president can't see for privacy reasons (i.e. individual census results and tax returns) and there are specific things that the president can know but can't share because of specific reasons set out in law (i.e. if the President in the course of an investigation learns from your medical record you have herpes they cannot tell your partner) but the Joint Chiefs can't legally withhold information from the President and the President can tell whoever the hell they want almost anything they want.
posted by Talez at 11:24 AM on August 21, 2016 [11 favorites]


The problem from this situation being that Trump will have access to stuff that he can legally feed back to his Russian buddies and Congress can't do shit about it because President Trump™ (god forbid) can order any documents he want be declassified then sent straight on over to Moscow.
posted by Talez at 11:31 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Oh except for nukes and CIA spooks. Nukes and spooks are statutory secrets under the Atomic Energy Act and Intelligence Identities Protection Act respectively.
posted by Talez at 11:34 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


And that it destroys the whole system from the top down. Already we've got a guy trying the "but hillary's eeeemaillls" defense.
posted by ctmf at 11:35 AM on August 21, 2016


Jessamyn is a "trolling expert!"

Wait, that's "our" Jessamyn? Cool!
posted by Surely This at 11:45 AM on August 21, 2016


It could not be more obvious that CNN is more interested in viewership than ethical journalism.

Yyyyyeah, I think we're ready to call that one.

This "Joy Reid" of which you speak, however . . . do go on.

Joy Reid shames pastor for Trump lies: ‘Even a pastor cannot make things up on this show'

But he went a step too far when he denied Trump had anything to do with encouraging the birther movement over President Barack Obama’s citizenship.

“Don’t tell me you agree with the birtherism, sir,” Reid said as she cut him off. “Don’t tell me you agree with that.”

“The birtherism issue came out of Hillary Clinton’s campaign in 2008,” Scott replied.

“No it didn’t,” Reid shot back, with Scott replying, “Yes it did.”

“That’s wrong,” Reid said as she stopped him once again.

“Even a pastor cannot make things up on this show,” she cautioned.

Shutting down the conversation as he continued to protest, she told him, “I respect you as a pastor, but you’re not going to come on and make things up.”


ON SCREEN!
posted by petebest at 11:50 AM on August 21, 2016 [70 favorites]


Wait, that's "our" Jessamyn?

You can tell by her reference to flaming bags of dog shit.
posted by spitbull at 11:50 AM on August 21, 2016 [27 favorites]


I'd love to see reporters start asking Trump - maybe it could be a debate point - who'll be managing his business assets if he's elected. I want him to say that of course there'll be no conflict of interest and he won't be making presidential decisions based on how they'd help his businesses.

Not that I'd believe him - but the exact phrasing of the lie would give the us plenty of hooks for both more stories and more specific questions to share with his fans - like, he keeps talking about tariffs on non-US businesses; will he tax his own companies 35%?
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:51 AM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


"Mr. Trump, if elected, are you seriously going to let the Bank of China take 100 million dollars of your personal money from you like a chump?"
posted by petebest at 11:54 AM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


So we two main sources of news these days have been Metafilter and Gawker with occasional visits to Daily Kos. This must change. Where do you all go regularly for your election coverage?
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:57 AM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


are you seriously going to let the Bank of China take 100 million dollars of your personal money from you like a chump dog?"
posted by Spathe Cadet at 12:00 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Joey Michaels: "So we two main sources of news these days have been Metafilter and Gawker with occasional visits to Daily Kos. This must change. Where do you all go regularly for your election coverage?"

I try to hit RedState and Breitbart up once a day to see what the other side is saying. Breitbart is a sewer.
posted by double block and bleed at 12:02 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


According to Chuck Dueck, a senior vice-president at icuc.social, a company that manages the online presence for hundreds of companies and organizations

Chuck Duck at I cuck?

u.trollin.rite?
posted by srboisvert at 12:02 PM on August 21, 2016 [17 favorites]


Kellyanne Conway went on CNN and ABC This Week this morning. No transcript but Josh Rogan has a few tweets covering the content of the interviews.
Trump's campaign manager stands by comment about how Hillary didn't stand up to Bill's cheating so can't stand up to North Korea.

Trump campaign manager @KellyannePolls says Hillary has the most "joyless" campaign in recent history. @ThisWeekABC

.@KellyannePolls on Trump's outreach to African Americans: "I'm white, I was very moved by his comments." #WHAT? @ThisWeekABC
She may not be as ignorant as Katrina Pierson but she sure is equal in her capability as professional spokeswoman.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:06 PM on August 21, 2016 [7 favorites]


...I think it's awesome that Hillary Clinton had her campaign set up twitter accounts for almost each and every state, in early 2015...

And the Florida one has several tweets in Spanish. Which shows she's not just rolling a state-by-state campaign. She's doing this by county.

I mean, God forbid Trump wins, obviously, but I just don't see it happening. I'm definitely not saying we should get complacent. I'mma keep phone-banking and canvassing 'til we get it done. I just hate seeing this super-competent, state-of-the-art campaign being practically wasted on running against a gross ratfart of a campaign that even the mainstream media has referred to as Dumpster Fire.
posted by Cookiebastard at 12:09 PM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


Where do you all go regularly for your election coverage?

Links from the current Thread mainly. I also have RSS feed groups for local (Chicago) news, national and international news. Talking Points Memo (Josh Marshall) is a crucial read both for independent reporting and for an insightful, even-keeled step back from the frenzy. I also have feeds for the NYT (pulse of mainstream US establishment media), Toronto Star (used to live there + it's a good in-but-not-of perspective on US politics), BBC News (global news from Western perspective) and al-Jazeera (non-Western perspective). On my commute I typically listen to the podcast version of Maddow plus Trumpcast, NPR Politics, Slate Gabfest, The Gist with Mike Pestka and (sometimes) 538 podcasts. I also have the PollTracker app from TPM and keep an eye on 538.com and the Princeton Election Consortium for polling info.
posted by tivalasvegas at 12:22 PM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


I try to hit RedState and Breitbart up once a day to see what the other side is saying. Breitbart is a sewer.

They are both in my news feed (along with a few others like BizPacReview and Daily Caller) and I usually just read the headlines, but sometimes I click on the articles. For example, I was curious about BPR's headline: Only in America...Team Hillary employs illegal 'army' to help register voters - Dems laugh as they defend it. Which was about Mi Sueno, Tu Voto (My Dream, your vote) which uses Dreamers to register people. I find it helpful to see what the new talking points are going to be so I am prepared to counter them with facts.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:34 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


stolyarova: I'm seeing murmurs on Twitter that Alan Dershowitz is going to play Trump for Clinton's debate prep.

Dershowitz: Happy to help Clinton with debate prep But, he says, no one has asked him yet. “I have no idea what they’re internally thinking,” Alan Dershowitz said.
(on Politico, by Annie Karni / posted 08/21/16 11:47 AM EDT / updated 08/21/16 12:46 PM EDT)
posted by filthy light thief at 12:39 PM on August 21, 2016


Talking Points Memo has had excellent coverage this year. I don't can't think of anyone doing it better more reliably. Other than that I mostly find myself relying on Twitter and on these threads.

For poll analysis, I like Sam Wang at the Princeton Election Consortium better than 538.

For the view from the right, National Review's The Corner has been a fascinating read for months ever since they collectively rejected Trump. Instapundit is still the place I go when I want to understand what my father will suddenly be convinced he's always believed the next time I talk to him (and is about as Trump-loyalist as I can stand). I know he's a long-standing MetaFilter punching bag but Scott Adams is actually a fascinating upside-down read right now for much the same reason.
posted by gerryblog at 12:39 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


I have never been a big fan of twitter but for this campaign it has been invaluable. Especially from those people like Daniel Dale @ddale8, Washington Correspondent for the Toronto Star, who covers the trump rallies in person.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:43 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


I'm seeing murmurs on Twitter that Alan Dershowitz is going to play Trump for Clinton's debate prep.

I said this on Twitter but they should really get a quick-witted improv impressionist like Anthony Atamanuik for at least a couple go-rounds. Trump's schtick is about instant self-gratification; he has no genuine philosophical commitments beyond that. I think Atamanuik would be much better at teaching her to respond to someone who is not playing by the rules of the debate and not even trying to win by traditional standards far better than someone who is trying to model Trump as a thinker with some ostensibly consistent set of beliefs and positions.
posted by gerryblog at 12:43 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


I have never been a big fan of twitter but for this campaign it has been invaluable. Especially from those people like Daniel Dale @ddale8, Washington Correspondent for the Toronto Star, who covers the trump rallies in person.

@KatyTurNBC has been fascinating reading too, especially in her much-linked piece in Marie Claire.
posted by gerryblog at 12:45 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


"it's like a picture of a man fucking a chicken; you may know who put it in a metatalk post but you're really surprised that the person posted it"
posted by angrycat at 12:47 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


Talking Points Memo has had excellent coverage this year.

I also want to add that in my view The Washington Post has done an outstanding job of covering Trump which started when he banned their reporters from his rallies and news conferences. They have spent all their time on research instead and it has paid off. Plus, oddly enough the banned reporters were allowed to interview him for a book that will be coming out shortly. Go figure.

@KatyTurNBC has been fascinating reading too

Right. And @SopanDeb for CBS. Both Katy Tur and Sopan Deb cover Trump exclusively so I do tend to read a lot more about Trump than I do about Clinton.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 12:50 PM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


C-SPAN radio is useful, especially on Sundays when they rebroadcast the Sunday chat shows. They actually broadcast in the DC area, but there are a variety of options to listen online.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


@SopanDeb is covering Trump as an embed for CBS News and often posts transcripts of speeches and TV spots on Twitter. A recent example (click through for the transcript, which is an image, followed by another image as a fact-check):

Conway to ABC: "Well, but [Trump] doesn't hurl personal insults."

posted by salix at 12:57 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Seconding Katy Tur's Twitter feed. It's well ahead of the curve at least when Trump is on the road. And it's funny.

I love TPM for what they do, and Josh Marshall was **way** in front of the Russia story. But his reporters don't have deep access and seem very young so they end up doing a lot of secondary reporting of other people's scoops. Also being a boutique shop they produce very little content as news is actually breaking evenings and weekends, so they tend to be late to stories that then shift underneath them in this crazy and volatile year -- like the Manafort resignation. They show the limits of a small operation, no matter how serious.

Politico has been surprisingly good in my opinion this season, while always cynical they feel a bit less nakedly republican than under prior management. That Dickey piece on Charlie Sykes I posted above is serious work, for example, and I learned a ton about Wisconsin politics from it.

Ed Kilgore in NY Mag and Charles Pierce in Esquire and Heather (Digby) Parton at her own blog and Salon (which otherwise yuck) and Olivia Nuzzi at the Daily Beast are almost always worth reading.
posted by spitbull at 1:00 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


gerryblog: Trump's schtick is about instant self-gratification; he has no genuine philosophical commitments beyond that.

I've said it before, but Trump is in a position to surprise everyone if he's able to recite some facts and sound mature for a change. That all depends on how serious he is on winning the election, which seems debatable. But our expectations for him are so low that we're practically expecting him to... well, live up to everything else he's done. But I won't be surprised if he tries to sound like he has a handle on the issues. He may not be smart or clever enough to pull it off, but don't expect him to just flail around, either.

Anyway, I could be wrong about all this and he could be aiming to continue with his "real talk outsider" shtick. Either way, I'm not sure what Clinton should do besides play it straight and show off her experience and knowledge.
posted by teponaztli at 1:02 PM on August 21, 2016


North Carolina a snapshot of Trump's shrinking trade appeal
In the state that may be the most pivotal to Trump's White House bid, the audience for the Republican's chief economic pitch is shrinking by the day. Textile and furniture manufacturing no longer dominates the state's economy as it did a generation ago. Banking, technology and others industries have driven North Carolina's economic output to grow faster than any state in the past three years.

Voters are flowing into the state at a firehose rate — young, educated and many to take high-paying jobs when they arrive. They're coming from everywhere and quickly diluting North Carolina's conservative political underpinnings.

"Clinton is winning," said North Carolina Republican pollster Michael Luethy. "Particularly because folks who have moved to the state in the last five years are very different voters. They're persuaded by a different issue set than those have been here a while."

Suburban voters in three key states just say No to Trump
These three states [Virginia, Pennsylvania, Colorado] have been considered crucial for Trump — among the half-dozen or so states he has to switch from the Democratic column to win. The growing suburbs in these states seem to be making that impossible. If he loses Colorado, Pennsylvania and Virginia, a pathway to victory is hard to see.

Trump is especially unpopular in these venues, which include a lot of college-educated residents, rising diversity and voters who are more tolerant on social issues. But this only is accelerating a political trend in suburbs outside the deep South, which have been trending Democratic for almost a quarter-century. As recently as 1988, they were Republican bastions.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 1:03 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Actually it's kind of cool how the various folks covering Trump for different networks interact on Twitter.

And yes for me too on the Washington Post. It's been exemplary and It's become indispensable.
posted by spitbull at 1:06 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Meanwhile, spending on the 84-person staff and field organizing barely increased from the previous month, to just $392,000 and $432,000, respectively. The campaign dropped much more — $1.8 million — on hats and other merchandise.

Trump's MAGA-merch budget was ~4.5x his budget for field? That is...not super likely to translate to actual, y'know, electoral success.

I mean, unless hats suddenly start voting, which, well, I guess anything's possible?
posted by dersins at 1:09 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh the new thing is wonderful. Apparently, led by Rush Limbaugh, the far right is freaking out over a conspiracy theory that Obama wants to promote LGBTQ migration to rural areas to dilute republican voting power.

Choice quote:

The all-day summit will teach lesbian and transgender hillbillies how to get subsidies from the government like rural housing loans and ‘community facility grants.’ Bullying will also be discussed,” said the [Washington Free] Beacon.
posted by spitbull at 1:13 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Why is Trump considerably overperforming his national numbers in Iowa? Yeah it's overwhelmingly a white state but so are a bunch of other states where he is doing terribly. Is it because of all the old people?
posted by Justinian at 1:16 PM on August 21, 2016


From the FEC filing, $64k went for Alabama field operations to Chess Bedsole, who has a name that is simultaneously improbable and yet exactly what an Alabama GOP Trumper would be called.
posted by holgate at 1:16 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


...the far right is freaking out that Obama wants to promote LGBTQ migration to rural areas to dilute republican voting power.

Sometimes, I think it must be fun as hell to work for whatever firm it is where you sit around making-up crazy-ass shit for conservatives to freak-out over. I mean, there just doesn't seem to be a limit to just how nutty and implausible these things can be. They just get swallowed whole and believed.
posted by Thorzdad at 1:17 PM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


Obama wants to promote LGBTQ migration to rural areas to dilute republican voting power.

Dear President Obama,

Trans Soldier #562981-E reporting in for duty, sir.

Please tell me where to relocate, sir. My preferences would be for someplace in the West Coast, but I will go anywhere to dilute Republican power.

For America,
Dwayne
posted by spinifex23 at 1:19 PM on August 21, 2016 [52 favorites]


Justinian - The aforementioned Ed Kilgore, who is from Iowa, just posted an interesting piece on Iowa and Trump yesterday in NY Mag, although his conclusion is Trump won't win it.
posted by spitbull at 1:20 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Media Blackout: Trump Surges Past Clinton in Major Poll, Press Cites Older Polls

Russian state propoganda channels are unskewing the polls now. They're all excited about the LA Times poll today showing Trump +2. National average is still Clinton +5.3, not even looking at the state map.
posted by T.D. Strange at 1:21 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


There are a lot of Bedsoles in Alabama. it's a thing.
posted by spitbull at 1:25 PM on August 21, 2016


My spouse and I moved to rural southern Oregon a couple years ago, so we had an excited "They're talking about us!!!" high five over the lesbian/trans carpetbagger nonsense.

I don't know how much we're diluting Republican power, but there are a lot more trans folks coming to the small town library I work for. I'm really pleased and proud that we can provide a safe space in a very conservative part of an assumed-blue state.
posted by The demon that lives in the air at 1:36 PM on August 21, 2016 [21 favorites]


Chess Bedsole, who has a name that is simultaneously improbable and yet exactly what an Alabama GOP Trumper would be called

Chess Bedsole is right up there with Capacitors P. Renewer and Bergson G. Plumpness when it comes to names that are totally not spam e-mail senders, really and truly.
posted by Servo5678 at 1:37 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


> I mean, there just doesn't seem to be a limit to just how nutty and implausible these things can be. They just get swallowed whole and believed.

There's probably some sort of connection between this sort of thing and the reason Republicans are usually keen on slashing education budgets, but I can't quite put my finger on what it might be.
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:38 PM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


I also want to add that in my view The Washington Post has done an outstanding job of covering Trump which started when he banned their reporters from his rallies and news conferences.

You might be surprised at what you can get away with as long as you don't personally offend the press.
posted by indubitable at 1:41 PM on August 21, 2016 [9 favorites]


Russian state propoganda channels are unskewing the polls now. They're all excited about the LA Times poll today showing Trump +2. National average is still Clinton +5.3, not even looking at the state map.

The LA Times poll is also a tracking poll, meaning it samples from a small preselected group that never changes. It has been trending R compared to other polls the entire time.
posted by showbiz_liz at 1:41 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Republicans are also strongly against the Fairness Doctrine being reinstated, but again like you say it's just hard to see a connection there
posted by Countess Elena at 1:41 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


I've been wondering that as well, Justinian. My theory:

Iowa has a relatively small urban population (64% urban, 11th lowest) which magnifies rural concerns particularly on the right. It also has a quickly-growing Latino population - primarily in rural areas as agricultural workers, I believe, in contrast to the more industrialized areas of the Midwest and the Northeast where Latinos tend to live in big cities.

I suspect that enough white rural Iowans are feeling enough racial panic to make up for the nationwide headwinds against Trump when compared to the Romney coalition. The same logic may explain Indiana, a similarly rural-dominated Midwestern state. I imagine that southern Illinois has similar demographics, but of course Illinois isn't in play at all, thanks to Chicagoland.
posted by tivalasvegas at 1:42 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


The latest in the adventures of Hawaii republican candidate Kaaihue, who is running against Tulsa Gabbard:
Hawaii Republican Party Chair Fritz Rohlfing said in a statement Friday Kaaihue's comments "do not represent the views, values, or the sentiments of our Party and its members."

"Her vulgar, racially-bigoted, and religiously-intolerant descriptions of Democratic Party candidates are offensive, shameful, and unacceptable in public discourse. I unconditionally denounce her despicable statements. I strongly urge all Hawaii Republicans to join me in disavowing her candidacy."
I'm not likely to vote republican this lifetime, but Rohlfing's disavowal of Kaaihue is exactly how you should do it. This is why I genuinely respect many local Republicans even when I fight with them on 75 different fronts.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [45 favorites]


Because of course someone does, someone (namely J.D. BEDSOLE, ASME, BSBA, BSVE, MSEA, PhD) keeps a detailed history of the Bedsole family of Alabama from 1600 to 2006 online. This fellow devoted 56 years of international research to chronicling the Bedsoles.
posted by spitbull at 1:57 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Obama wants to promote LGBTQ migration to rural areas to dilute republican voting power.


I want to say fairymandering, but that makes me a bad man.
posted by Devonian at 1:57 PM on August 21, 2016 [79 favorites]


When Politicians Tell the Truth on Voting Restrictions (From the 10th, but if it was posted I missed it)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 1:58 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


(me, previously): I suspect that enough white rural Iowans are feeling enough racial panic to make up for the nationwide headwinds against Trump

This thesis also is congruent with my other theory that areas that were first colonized by Americans through the Cumberland Gap (roughly the central and southern portions of the Ohio Valley, or the areas where people speak the Midlands dialect - northern pink area on this map) have more cultural and political affinity with the Southern highlands / Greater Appalachia than with the Upper Midwest, the areas north that were primarily settled by New Englanders and by Germanic immigrants.

More affinity, at least, along the particular racial and cultural fault lines to which American politics seem to be aligning. In other ways they are very much Midwestern.
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:02 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I want to say fairymandering, but that makes me a bad man.

You have my blessing. Our people respect punnery as long as it is sufficiently self-aware, and as a Brit you have an automatic licence to wield irony so, you know, go nuts.
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:05 PM on August 21, 2016 [15 favorites]


'Racialists’ are cheered by Trump’s latest strategy

When Trump made Breitbart News CEO Steve Bannon his campaign’s chief executive last week, Taylor found reasons to celebrate. It was the latest sign for white nationalists, once dismissed as fringe, that their worldview was gaining popularity and that the old Republican Party was coming to an end.

. . . At Trump’s rally in Charlotte, one of the first of the Bannon era, the message was sinking in. Frances Johnson, 68, said that the polls were not reflecting Trump’s real level of support and that she sometimes emailed the campaign with ideas on how to change that. The pitch to black voters, she said, was smart.

“I really don’t think that African Americans want to be stuck where they are,” Johnson said. “They’re basically glorified slaves — they get free this, free that, free this, free that, and they can’t get a good job and depend on the government. What else do you call it?”
[emphasis added]

YEAH, WHAT ELSE DO YOU CALL IT, WASHINGTON POST?!
"Well Nazis sure seem to be happy, let's run that with no thoughtful challenge whatever." You're doing it again, MSM. You're shitting in our bed. AGAIN. Golly those WMD's sure were tricky to understand! Who could have foreseen W's massive catastrophe unfolding slowly?! (Besides Janeane Garofolo, obvs. It was kind of eerie how she knew it was all bullshit?)

Robert Costa, Jenna Johnson and Frances Sellers contributed to this story.

Well, you did a shitty job. DO. BETTER.
posted by petebest at 2:11 PM on August 21, 2016 [11 favorites]


Enjoyed the DNC? Relive all the best moments with Bad Lip Reading.

Fixed the link to the accidental perfect soundtrack to the Sanders concession speech
posted by Apocryphon at 2:13 PM on August 21, 2016


You're doing it again, MSM.

What? Reporting the racist language of Trump supporters?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 2:24 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Yeah, I didn't think that quote needed any extra comment to explain how horrific it was.
posted by maggiemaggie at 2:27 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I don't get it petebest, did you want a giant neon highlighted paragraph saying RACISTS after the quotes or something?
posted by Justinian at 2:28 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


As multiple comments above attest, few "MSM" institutions *are* "doing it better" than WaPo, which has taken a strong editorial stance against Trump's bigotry.

I don't like "MSM" as a term personally. It always seems to exclude the perfectly "mainstream" sources relied upon by whoever is using it to dismiss all other media they don't like.
posted by spitbull at 2:33 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Obama wants to promote LGBTQ migration to rural areas

Who better to handle bulls? And bears?
posted by Johnny Wallflower at 2:34 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Hey everybody, kindly disregard my earlier musings on Iowa's surprisingly strong Trump showing to date.

After a long journey down in the wiki mines, I have discovered the true reason.
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:37 PM on August 21, 2016 [14 favorites]


Iowa is controlled by the Meredithstream Media?
posted by zachlipton at 2:38 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I don't get it petebest, did you want a giant neon highlighted paragraph saying RACISTS after the quotes or something?

Not speaking for petebest here, but I for one, would be ok with the media simply using the word "racists" to describe racists.
posted by Cookiebastard at 2:38 PM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


controlled by the Meredithstream Media

yes
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:39 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


A poll from "USC/LATimes"??? The Breitbart Poll is more reliable. Growing up in L.A., I knew USC as the rotten rich kids school masquerading as a "University of California" that put most of its money toward its football team before it was fashionable and graduated most of Nixon's Watergate co-conspirators. And I gave up on the Los Angeles Times as an impartial news source when they fired political cartoonist Ted Rall* at the personal request of the L.A. Chief of Police. Rall has sued, less about the job loss but for defamation over their dishonest editorials 'explaining' their decision, and they responded with "Anti-SLAPP" actions that forced him to put up a $75,000 non-reduceable bond to let the case go forward. Very Trump-like use of the legal system ("You can sue me, but it'll cost you more than you can afford") by the LATimes.

*disclaimer: I am not part of the small percentage of readers who LIKE his political cartoons. He hates EVERYBODY (currently making Clinton/Trump equivalency 'points') and can't draw well enough to make any famous person recognizable.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:45 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


as a Brit you have an automatic licence

Props for giving the Brits a licence and not a license.
posted by dis_integration at 2:46 PM on August 21, 2016 [15 favorites]


It was the latest sign for white nationalists, once dismissed as fringe, that their worldview was gaining popularity and that the old Republican Party was coming to an end.

That reminds me, has anybody heard from Paul Ryan or Mitch McConnel lately? Are they okay?
posted by monospace at 2:46 PM on August 21, 2016 [23 favorites]




> After a long journey down in the wiki mines, I have discovered the true reason.

>>The Meredith Corporation is an American media conglomerate based in Des Moines, Iowa, USA. The company has two divisions, National Media and Local Media.

No doubt each division is headed by a man named Steve? [fake, but who the hell knows any more]

Meredith Magazines include: American Baby ... Better Homes and Gardens ... Country Life ... Successful Farming ... Traditional Home ... Wood

Need some Wood?
posted by RedOrGreen at 2:47 PM on August 21, 2016


Would've been nice if they had spelled it correctly in the headline, ie,

Racialists

instead of repeating a neoprettyifiedicalism for yellow rain.
posted by Dashy at 2:47 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


Adrain Carrasquillo at Buzzfeed: “In Reversal, Trump Indicates To Hispanic Leaders Openness To Legalization For Immigrants”
Eduardo Suárez at Univision: “Trump now says he plans to legalize some undocumented immigrants”


Pravda* says no. Exclusive – RNC Official at Trump’s Hispanic Meeting Debunks False BuzzFeed, Univision Reports that Donald Succumbed to Amnesty Activists

* Breitbart
posted by chris24 at 2:49 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Props for giving the Brits a licence and not a license.

I went to university in Ontario, it's where I learned how to do textual codeswitching

my workplace has separate buckets for 'holiday' and 'vacation' time, which always fucks with my head when I try to figure out if I have enough PTO for whatever.
posted by tivalasvegas at 2:52 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Univision needs to have some of the former Gawker writers brought into their offices to unscrew that screwed-up report.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:53 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


oneswellfoop, you can't dismiss the USC/la times poll because you think USC students are rich assholes.

USC has serious graduate academic programs, especially in the sciences. Although this is somewhat irrelevant too this poll, which uses a specific and well-described methodology as a tracking poll. Its sample might be screwy but no one knows who will actually vote so all samples are educated guesses and income assumptions.
posted by spitbull at 2:57 PM on August 21, 2016 [9 favorites]


Chess Bedsole, who has a name that is simultaneously improbable and yet exactly what an Alabama GOP Trumper would be called

Let us now praise famous Bedsoles.
posted by octobersurprise at 3:03 PM on August 21, 2016


I really appreciated the guest "ranter", Ana Marie Cox, MTV's lead political correspondent, on this week's Savage Lovecast.
At the top of the show, she shares her experience at recent Trump rally and underlines how reading about the rallies in the news didn't prepare her for the terror of experiencing it first hand. Seriously worth a listen.
posted by Waiting for Pierce Inverarity at 3:06 PM on August 21, 2016 [12 favorites]


oneswellfoop, you can't dismiss the USC/la times poll because you think USC students are rich assholes.

This is true. Instead, you can dismiss it because it's had a very strong R-ward slant this entire election, and literally every other poll (...all of them?) is going very differently.
posted by Itaxpica at 3:13 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Other Trump related Tweeters I follow and haven't seen mentioned yet: Kyle Griffin, Brad Jaffy, Ali Vitali, Maggie Haberman, and -of course- Cher*. (In addition to Katy Tur, Sopan Deb, Olivia Nuzzi, and Robert Costa.)

My dream is that Olivia Nuzzi writes a Primary Colors style "novel" about the exploits both professional and personal of the reporters following the Trump campaign.

*i have also preemptively followed Rosie O'Donnell in the hopes that she has some super hot fire tweets coming my way on Election Night. I want the best outcome of this election for all of us, but especially for her.
posted by sallybrown at 3:14 PM on August 21, 2016


Ugh I meant "involve assumptions," not "income."

Here's a good recent WaPo article about why colleges and universities get into the polling business. Short answer: branding.
posted by spitbull at 3:15 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


she shares her experience at recent Trump rally and underlines how reading about the rallies in the news didn't prepare her for the terror of experiencing it first hand. Seriously worth a listen.

Yes it was.
posted by cashman at 3:18 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


I wouldn't "dismiss" any poll conducted with transparent and reasonable methodology. These are not partisan statements. They aren't trying to influence the election. They can't be proven wrong or right until the election happens, and some (like the USC one) don't have track records. It makes assumptions you can challenge, and Nate Silver has pointed out how it tends to move in the same direction as more Clinton-positive polls. It captures *something* about a universe in which its assumptions hold.

There is zero reason to think it's rigged to favor republicans for nefarious reasons. Nor is there any reason to panic about its outlier results. It's just data.
posted by spitbull at 3:20 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


Well, you did a shitty job. DO. BETTER.

If you’re mad about how much this article about how white nationalists like Trump is somehow insufficiently explicit, let me suggest that you are missing about a million dog whistles to the left of the spectrum. Kudos to the Post.
posted by Going To Maine at 3:21 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


sallybrown, one of those fantastic reporters you mention was making an excellent point with a link on Twitter, and one of her responses was simply: "You have a double chin." Upon argument to the point at hand, he doubled down on that allegation.

I've seen reporters on Twitter taking all kinds of abuse and threats for their positions. There was something about that response of his that made me long for a complete cultural rethinking of how, why and when we raise children, so that none of them grow up to be such a creature as that.
posted by Countess Elena at 3:24 PM on August 21, 2016 [9 favorites]


Also *all* the tracking style polls show a closer race than non-tracking polls. So while LAT/USC is odd in showing Trump having a lead within the MoE, it's not opposed to "all" the national polls at all in showing a tighter national race than other polls show. Luckily of course, it's not a national race.
posted by spitbull at 3:25 PM on August 21, 2016


The LA Times itself has repeatedly, clearly explained *why* its poll is an outlier. It's not necessary to disparage USC and/or the LA Times in order to think critically about the poll. Off the top of my head:

1. It's a tracking poll-- it polls the same people every day. Great for noticing shifts, bad if the respondents are not representative. Also bad if the experience of being polled daily somehow skews them to make them less representative of the electorate.
2. It's not an either/or poll-- the respondents are asked to rank their likelihood of voting for each candidate from 0 to 100. Therefore, a strong Trump supporter becoming a *diehard* supporter will affect the poll, where it wouldn't affect others.
3. Its pool of respondents skews GOP because they did not take into account that many Romney voters self-report as Obama voters (not wanting to appear on the losing team). The polling community has developed tools to counteract this. It's not necessary or wise to discard the data just because it's skewed.
posted by acidic at 3:29 PM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


There was something about that response of his that made me long for a complete cultural rethinking of how, why and when we raise children, so that none of them grow up to be such a creature as that.

See also: some of the repulsive comments Sopan Deb gets also. These press folks get abuse heaped on them not only in person at the rallies, but also online, 24/7.
posted by sallybrown at 3:29 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Couple other people I follow on Twitter: Jeet Heer and Dan Drezner.
posted by chris24 at 3:35 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


As "skewed" has come to mean "corrupt" in recent elections, I'd say we don't know which assumptions best characterize the 2016 electorate, especially given the many unusual dimensions of this year's election. A tracking poll by its nature assumes a stable or incrementally different electorate over time. It simply would not capture shifts in motivation or alliance that drove or inhibited changes in the makeup of the electorate. Some polls assume many more Latinos will be highly motivated this year and 13 + million will turn out. Others don't see that in various models they are using.

The trick is not to let any one poll ever stand in for the state of the race. It's so tempting to be happy when we get a good one or worried when we see a bad one.

No one knows how the election will turn out. Everyone is guessing based on measurements connected to assumptions and subject to major disruptions due to unforeseen events.
posted by spitbull at 3:37 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


You might be surprised at what you can get away with as long as you don't personally offend the press

Seems fairly obvious to me that Trump desires to run against the non-alt-right press. They are happy to oblige.
posted by save alive nothing that breatheth at 3:46 PM on August 21, 2016


I know this might not be relevant to the thread, but someone important just left Martha's Vineyard- 3 ospreys and two "Marine One" style choppers just flew over my house, Cape Cod bound. GO GET EM DEMS!
posted by vrakatar at 3:50 PM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think that following a lot of Twitter feeds isn't very helpful in terms of forming an understanding about what is happening, how today's or this week's events and positions and so on fit into the bigger story of what is happening in this election cycle and what is happening on a historical level. I think that outside of a few points where genuinely important events with highly indeterminate outcomes are happening in real time, Twitter tends to obscure with minutiae rather than inform with a nuanced realtime perspective.

This could be a function of my own personality and perspective, of course.
posted by tivalasvegas at 3:52 PM on August 21, 2016 [11 favorites]


They can't be proven wrong or right until the election happens

"If the election were held today" can't be proved wrong or right even then, since, you know, it wasn't
posted by thelonius at 4:08 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Good point thelonius. I meant to say their *assumptions* about the composition of the electorate can be proven right or wrong , not the outcome on any given date before the election.

Polls both model and influence a dynamic and complex and meaningful reality. Social science ain't physics.

There is a lot of smart writing about the LA Times poll out there.

Go Trojans.
posted by spitbull at 4:19 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


The depth of discourse on Twitter may be quite shallow indeed, but the Republican Party's candidate is running on the strength of hosting how many episodes of The Apprentice? I'd love a place which better does nuance but even here, we're (collectively) terrible at it. Corb presented their perspective up thread and was barraged with a handful of long-winded comments "proving" their perspective was wrong, rather than addressing the actual point they raised.

FWIW, USC is a private university with no official affiliation with the public University of California system, of which UCLA, UC Santa Cruz, and UC Berkeley are a part of.
posted by fragmede at 4:20 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Mod note: Couple comments removed. oneswellfoop, you're not unique in having shown poor judgement about quippiness in these election threads but it's getting to be a pretty conspicuous pattern from you and I'd really appreciate it if you would start making more of an effort at this point to just close the tab and do something else when the urge arises.
posted by cortex (staff) at 4:25 PM on August 21, 2016 [7 favorites]


For what it's worth USC Dornsife political science/international relations ranks as a top 20 PHD program in the most recent NRC study (or so they claim on their website).

A lot of issues with NRC PHD program rankings (this is my business) but that ain't chopped liver.
posted by spitbull at 4:25 PM on August 21, 2016


538 just posted: "Election Update: National Polls Show The Race Tightening — But State Polls Don’t."
posted by spitbull at 4:37 PM on August 21, 2016


Fox News posts WAKE UP SHEEPLE on alt-right's HRC health concern trolling.
posted by Talez at 5:14 PM on August 21, 2016




From the FOX link posted by Talez:
Before you purchase a house you inspect it for termites, before you purchase a car you look under the hood. Is it too much to ask for a health examination and report of all presidential candidates?
OK I'll bite. How about we get a REAL physician's report on Trump and...oh...I don't know... what about some tax returns?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:18 PM on August 21, 2016 [20 favorites]


New Donald Trump theme song.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:21 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Donald Trump: No regrets | The Briefing

That's really good. It's a string of soundbites to establish a narrative, of course, and it does that well. It'll play to the undecided/marginal voters.

And it has the added advantage of being accurate.
posted by tivalasvegas at 5:26 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


This one seems targeted to your Reagan Republican uncle.

Why do Trump and Putin sound so much alike? | The Briefing

(The Briefing is a Hillary Campaign channel, BTW)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:28 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


(The Briefing is a Hillary Campaign channel, BTW)

I don't know about elsewhere in the country (given the political demographics, I'm guessing she's not too worried about taking DC, so we may not be getting all the ads), but so far every Hillary ad I've seen on TV has been purely soundbites from either Trump or from (anti-Trump) Republicans, and I think it's brilliant.
posted by solotoro at 5:34 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


What's this? The New York Post is a POS; has anyone put an iodine tablet in this story and seen what's really there?
posted by Countess Elena at 5:37 PM on August 21, 2016


Fox News posts WAKE UP SHEEPLE on alt-right's HRC health concern trolling.
I got a call this week from a well-known physician who believes Hillary's falls and her history of head trauma could represent a serious medical condition known as normal pressure hydrocephalus (NPH).

Of course, no physician can make a diagnosis such as NPH without an exam, an MRI, and a spinal tap but this surgeon feels Hillary's history of head trauma and continued balance problems are worth looking into.
This is... satire? Please say yes.
posted by Panjandrum at 5:46 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Re NY Post article: looks like typical guilt-by-association stuff; the articles quoted are simply ones published by the Journal of Muslim Minority Affairs while Abedin was assistant editor (one by her mother, one by some guy who wrote an open letter that the journal republished).
posted by shenderson at 5:46 PM on August 21, 2016


Hillary hasn't posted a new podcast episode since the launch on 8/12; I was hoping for weekly episodes :(
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 5:51 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I mean, I sort of feel like if Huma Abedin didn't believe that women and mothers should be working, she wouldn't have taken a decades-long series of difficult and time-intensive jobs where her boss was one of the most prominent working women in the world. Is this not a case where her behavior speaks far louder than words she didn't write?
posted by zachlipton at 5:53 PM on August 21, 2016 [18 favorites]


Who knew when Trump said "my African-American" there might literally be just the one.

Trump polls 1-2% among blacks. In '64 Goldwater got 6% after voting no on the Civil Rights Act. In '68 segregationist George Wallace won 3%.

* Ok, not literally literally, but really really close.
posted by chris24 at 5:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [10 favorites]


The fringe right has been spreading baloney about Huma Abedin for years, from her being a plant for the Muslim brotherhood, to being Hillary's secret lesbian lover. Now they're trying to turn a scholarly journal into 'radical Muslim journal'. It's just more desperate nonsense.
posted by airish at 5:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


Longform Podcast #207: McKay Coppins
posted by My Dad at 6:00 PM on August 21, 2016


Josh Marshall: "Trumpism is a Politics of Loss and Revenge."
posted by spitbull at 6:00 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


so far every Hillary ad I've seen on TV has been purely soundbites from either Trump or from (anti-Trump) Republicans, and I think it's brilliant.

Or ordinary people and/or reporters, like this one (Hi again, David Cay Johnston). I haven't seen a Briefing yet that featured Hillary in any way, which is one way of navigating around her own negatives.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:00 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


has anyone put an iodine tablet in this story and seen what's really there?

Her mother is more conservative than she is.

DUN-dun-dunnnnnn!

And even there, gods help me if I am judged by my nineties self.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:06 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


For those interested, here is the site for the journal that Huma Abedin worked at: Journal of Muslim Minority Affairs.

How they describe themselves:
Journal of Muslim Minority Affairs is the only scholarly journal studying Muslim communities in non-Muslim societies. It provides a wealth of information about these communities that cannot be found anywhere else in documented form. The journal has opened up a new area of specialisation in minority studies with original articles addressing the minority condition from the historical, demographic, social and economic perspective. Our research interests extend to include non-Muslim minorities living in Muslim societies, interfaith dialogue to promote understanding and the study of Muslim minority women, the minorities’ minority. The journal has indeed pioneered the way in examining theoretical and conceptual issues that define and explain the minority experience.

'Radical Muslim journal'? What a joke, these bigots are singing to their own disgusting choir.
posted by airish at 6:17 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


This recent Vogue profile of Huma was great (and discusses Huma's mother, whose story sounds even more interesting than Huma's).
posted by sallybrown at 6:27 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


The Huma Abedin article appears to be a coordinated attack between Breitbart, Daily Mail and NY Post - all seem to have published the article at the same time (they came up when I did a google search for Journal of Muslim Minorities)
posted by maggiemaggie at 6:29 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


If you have time to kill, gaze into the abyss (tl:dw, online polls are not scientific. Also, ABC should be sued for malpractice.)
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:30 PM on August 21, 2016


Yeah, not surprised that they're going after Huma again, not surprised that they're doing the health rumors again. These are two of their standard plays, y'all.
posted by palomar at 6:31 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I did my first stint of volunteering and spent an afternoon at a street fair signing people up to vote. Most people were already registered, so we. Most of those who weren't were convinced that there were no choices worth voting for, but we were urged to push voting for more local races like school board. We were across from a Catholic gift shop run by nuns and they were irritated enough at our booth that they put a hand lettered "Trump for Life" sign in their window. Otherwise, people were generally positive and supportive.

I also am doing some campaign messaging data scientist work. I made geospatial data report builder with my cofounder and we're modifying it to work for local races here in PA to help with targeting. It should work nationwide, so memail me if you are connected to down-ticket races that could benefit from extra data.
posted by Alison at 7:06 PM on August 21, 2016 [22 favorites]


No doubt each division is headed by a man named Steve? [fake, but who the hell knows any more]

You did click through and look at who the CEO of Meredith Corporation is, right?
posted by carsonb at 7:20 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


You did click through and look at who the CEO of Meredith Corporation is, right?

It's Steves all the way down.
posted by dis_integration at 7:23 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


Fwiw, I think the Washington Post has done some very good reporting thus far, and I went there to see what was new. What I got was "'Racialists' are Tickled Pink for Trump". The first of the 5000 comments (pick up the pace here, people) that followed noted that the definition of racialist was racist. why not say that? Why, pray, would they cram some extra letters in that giant front page headline?

Maybe I'm not hep to the dogwhistle jive, but I think a 20 point headline front page article with no other context but "other racists agree" isn't a dogwhistle but a flat-out normalization of white supremacist garbage. Overton window moved, units shifted, clicks recorded, now thats just good journalism.

Except for the "Gentlemen:To evil!" part. Is 'enhanced interrogation' torture? Then say it! Are Trump's racist base excited about Bannon? Then Say It!

"Racialism, once considered fringe . . ." STILL, actually, considered fringe on account of the spitting in the face of American idealism. So, put "still" in there, okay? It's not "once considered". Its a lazy undermining of not allowing racist crowds to be okay as Trump's base or at all.
posted by petebest at 7:24 PM on August 21, 2016 [23 favorites]


The first of the 5000 comments (pick up the pace here, people) that followed noted that the definition of racialist was racist. why not say that?

There's a very important (according to them) distinction in that racialists only believe that everyone is equal but should be separated. Racists just hate everyone that isn't them. So they harbor no ill will, but just want to be with their own kind.

Which is all just stupid bullshit. Either way it's not conducive to a free and open society.
posted by Talez at 7:34 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


TBF, part of the criticism of Trump's campaign is precisely that he's normalizing racism. So reporting on it as if it's normalized doesn't seem radical.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:35 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


“Racialism, once considered fringe . . .” STILL, actually, considered fringe on account of the spitting in the face of American idealism. So, put “still” in there, okay? It's not “once considered”. Its a lazy undermining of not allowing racist crowds to be okay as Trump's base or at all.

I’m assuming that we’re talking about this passage here:

When Trump made Breitbart News CEO Steve Bannon his campaign’s chief executive last week, Taylor found reasons to celebrate. It was the latest sign for white nationalists, once dismissed as fringe, that their worldview was gaining popularity and that the old Republican Party was coming to an end.

There’s a key difference between fringe and accepted as good or accepted as bad. Fringe connotes niche and non-mainstream. I’d argue that, with Bannon being the head of Trump’s campaign now, it’s reasonable to say that the alt-right has suddenly become scarily much-less-fringe and much more part of the America. In the same way, perhaps, that Gamergate made a lot of people acknowledge that abuse on Twitter is a thing that occurs and not just one or two irked folks. Right now, The candidate of a major political has essentially let part of the alt-right into his situation room. It’s a cause for worry; I’m less irked at the Post for reporting something that has happened than I am at Trump and “mainstream” Republicans for both coopting the Republican party and allowing themselves to be coopted.

There’s nothing in that article that approves of racism, and if it isn’s possible to read the words “white nationalism” without immediately thinking of Nazis, I’m not sure what to say.

Are Trump's racist base excited about Bannon? Then Say It!

This is fundamentally what the article -indeed, the above sentence- does say. White nationalists believe that Bannon’s appointment shows that their views are becoming mainstream. It’s a scary sentence.
posted by Going To Maine at 7:39 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


I think a 20 point headline front page article with no other context but "other racists agree" isn't a dogwhistle but a flat-out normalization of white supremacist garbage

"Racist" is a word with a known political context, Democrats say Republicans are racist. If they make up a new word, they're excused from "liberal bias", and can force it into the only story they know how to write, "both sides do it too". Hence, "racialists".
posted by T.D. Strange at 7:40 PM on August 21, 2016


dis_integration: "You did click through and look at who the CEO of Meredith Corporation is, right?

It's Steves all the way down.
"

We took a vote at the recent Gathering of the Steves and decided to kick these guys out of the Steve Brotherhood.
posted by double block and bleed at 7:40 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


Hence, “racialist”.

Racialists is also a word with a history. (I have some British plays from the 1980s that use the term instead of “racist”, and I was quite confused.) In this case, the article uses “racialist” (in quotes) because the white nationalist identifies as a racialist.
posted by Going To Maine at 7:44 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Racialists is also a word with a history.

Quite. It's Enoch Powell and Alf Garnett and the occasional Telegraph columnist in his 70s, and you could see a regurgitated version of it from the UKIP Brexit crowd.

Peter Brimelow was born in Britain, grew up during the Powell years, and brought his Powellite politics to North America undiluted. (And thus never actually lived in the US during the Jim Crow and Civil Rights years, unlike Boomer Americans born in the US.) A few other white-nationalists have very similar immigrant backgrounds.
posted by holgate at 8:03 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]




"Racialist" is always used, in my experience, by a racist who thinks they can put a veneer of intellectualism over their beliefs. It's one of those terms that marks someone as a nutter as soon as they use it.
posted by Joe in Australia at 8:25 PM on August 21, 2016 [35 favorites]


Next chapter in the email saga that won't die -
"Her people have been trying to pin it on me," Powell, 79, told PEOPLE Saturday night at the Apollo in the Hamptons 2016 Night of Legends fête in East Hampton, New York.

"The truth is, she was using [the private email server] for a year before I sent her a memo telling her what I did," Powell added.

Why does the former diplomat believe this to be the case?

"Why do you think?" he said. "It doesn't bother me. But it's okay; I'm free."
Sigh.
posted by sallybrown at 8:26 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


Hannity has a long record of claiming to be both a journalist and not a journalist.
posted by zachlipton at 8:27 PM on August 21, 2016 [5 favorites]


(I have some British plays from the 1980s that use the term instead of “racist”, and I was quite confused.

I'm pretty much only aware of it as a mocking semi-comedic term, FWIW.
posted by Artw at 8:34 PM on August 21, 2016


The main reason the post used "racialist" is because the subjects of the article used the term on themselves. Even racists know it's bad to be called racists, and then you have squabbles. "Self-described" is a powerful phrase.
posted by msalt at 8:39 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


I can't imagine someone saying "I'm not a racist, I'm a racialist" and the other person being like "oh, OK, I was worried for a minute." But then, I would never have imagined plenty of things that happened this year, so what do I know?
posted by teponaztli at 8:42 PM on August 21, 2016 [16 favorites]


Yeah, it's just a way for racists to feel ok saying "I'm racist" in public. Which, ok, I guess I can support it on the basis of radical transparency.
posted by ryanrs at 8:44 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


"Racialist" is always used, in my experience, by a racist who thinks they can put a veneer of intellectualism over their beliefs.

Yep. That's why Andrew Sullivan's championing of The Bell Curve in 1994 as editor of The New Republic was much appreciated by the type of people who make bullshitty deterministic arguments that just happen to line up with thinking white people are superior. (And of course, fitting the pattern, Sullivan is an immigrant: not that I consider him part of that crowd, but I do think he has a blind spot about America's racial history.)
posted by holgate at 8:45 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


Trump discussed doing The Apprentice from the White House.

Going out on a limb here, but I don't think Hillary will let him do this.
posted by strange chain at 8:48 PM on August 21, 2016 [84 favorites]


ENSEMBLE: The Olympics are now over.

TRUMP: Can we get back to politics?

PENCE: Please?

Trump: Yo
posted by dw at 8:49 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


He tells it like it is.
posted by Talez at 8:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [19 favorites]


I don't think Hillary will let him do this.

She should offer, just to rub it in.
posted by ryanrs at 8:55 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


David Duke Show Celebrates Trump’s Breitbart Hire: We’ve ‘Taken Over the Republican Party!’
Don Advo: So, something extonishing has happened. We appear to have taken over the Republican Party.

David Duke: Well, rank and file, but a lot of those boll weevils are still in those cotton balls, and, uh, the Republican Party may be a European-American populated party, but like a ball of cotton, you can have boll weevils in there that are going to rot it out from the inside.
Jesus tap dancing Christ.
posted by Talez at 9:01 PM on August 21, 2016 [29 favorites]


I want to say fairymandering, but that makes me a bad man.

QUILTBAGgers?
posted by C'est la D.C. at 9:01 PM on August 21, 2016 [9 favorites]


He tells it like it is.

What do they have to lose?
posted by T.D. Strange at 9:02 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


I know the surface meaning of boll weevil, but I'm not following the metaphorical meaning. Is he referring to somebody specific?
posted by Spathe Cadet at 9:04 PM on August 21, 2016


Armed white-supremacists surround Texas NAACP with ‘white lives matter’ signs and Confederate flags
One protester was holding the sign 14 Words, which is a white supremacist slogan meaning, “We must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children.” It comes from the late white supremacist David Lane, who was a member of pro-white terrorist group called The Order.
WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON? Seriously? They're emboldened so much they'll stand outside the NAACP (armed) with a sign that literally says "14 words". I'm utterly gobsmacked. Utterly fucking gobsmacked to see this particular white supremacist shibboleth in daylight.
posted by Talez at 9:05 PM on August 21, 2016 [68 favorites]


I know the surface meaning of boll weevil, but I'm not following the metaphorical meaning. Is he referring to somebody specific?

Well, cotton is white, so
posted by salix at 9:12 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


I know the surface meaning of boll weevil, but I'm not following the metaphorical meaning. Is he referring to somebody specific?

Just equating all the people of color remaining in the republican party with something nasty, I'd guess.
posted by sebastienbailard at 9:13 PM on August 21, 2016


The Clinton ad campaign should buy time in moderate to light red states: have a 10 second ad and just run a brief history of David Duke in text, and then that clip about having "taken over the republican party," and then ask viewers if he's right. Force moderate Rs to reckon with that reality, force trump to disavow it, force Bannon to respond, force Duke to double down and defend it.
posted by codacorolla at 9:16 PM on August 21, 2016 [58 favorites]


Spathe Cadet: "I know the surface meaning of boll weevil, but I'm not following the metaphorical meaning. Is he referring to somebody specific?"

They're using cotton as a metaphor for 'white america". Boll weevils ruin cotton by eating it from the inside out. So an allusion to either black republicans, white republicans who aren't neo-nazis, or probably both.
posted by double block and bleed at 9:17 PM on August 21, 2016 [6 favorites]


Talez: WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON? Seriously?

I think those dog whistles are becoming more like calls to battle.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:24 PM on August 21, 2016 [11 favorites]


And does anyone know if those "extreme citizen tests" Donnie is touting include anything about freedom of the press? Just wondering.
posted by filthy light thief at 9:26 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Hannity has a long record of claiming to be both a journalist and not a journalist.

He's a journalialist!
posted by Joe in Australia at 9:44 PM on August 21, 2016 [23 favorites]


"Her people have been trying to pin it on me," Powell, 79, told PEOPLE Saturday night at the Apollo in the Hamptons 2016 Night of Legends fête in East Hampton, New York.


How are they pinning it on him by mentioning the fact that he used a private server? It was an open fact so I'm sure they knew about it before asking for advice.

If she wanted to pin something on Powell, she could mention the time he got up in front of the world and lied about WMDs in Iraq and blame him for her vote. She wouldn't but y'know.
posted by asteria at 10:02 PM on August 21, 2016 [22 favorites]


I've seen a couple of comments mention this and so I did a little cursory digging and I can't seem to find any official comment from RNC officials or from GOP Congressional leadership on Trump's new campaign staff. Are they actually silent or am I just not finding this commentary? If they're silent, that's really interesting.
posted by feloniousmonk at 10:10 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


How are they pinning it on him by mentioning the fact that he used a private server? It was an open fact so I'm sure they knew about it before asking for advice.

None of this is true so I'm not really sure where you're going with this. Colin Powell did NOT use a private server; he used an AOL account for non-classified emails.
posted by acidic at 10:13 PM on August 21, 2016 [1 favorite]


If I'm understanding this correctly, a racialist is somebody who is comfortable being a racist but not comfortable being called a racist.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:14 PM on August 21, 2016 [52 favorites]


Colin Powell did NOT use a private server; he used an AOL account for non-classified emails.

I gave him too much credit then.

He still lied about the WMDs, right?
posted by asteria at 10:26 PM on August 21, 2016 [2 favorites]


Colin Powell did NOT use a private server; he used an AOL account for non-classified emails.

That actually sounds fairly safe. I mean, what self respecting hacker would have wasted their time at AOL?
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:29 PM on August 21, 2016 [8 favorites]


A private server is much more secure than an AOL account. Clinton also used her account for non-classified communications. Three times individuals sent her emails that contained classified info, but that material was not properly marked as classified. We also know that the emails were about her availability for phone calls with the President of Mali and Kofi Anan. The question of the Secretary of State's availability to take a call at let's assume some Tuesday afternoon isn't exactly the kind of state secrets which could have destroyed the Republic.
posted by humanfont at 10:48 PM on August 21, 2016 [27 favorites]


I've got a stomach bug and I'm standing guard over my toddler who also has said stomach bug. It's 2 am and I need to stay awake. I just ran out of thread.

Send help.
posted by lydhre at 11:03 PM on August 21, 2016 [21 favorites]


He still lied about the WMDs, right?

Maybe, but no one is going in front of a committee to answer for that crime.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:08 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


They're emboldened so much they'll stand outside the NAACP (armed) with a sign that literally says "14 words".

In a HEAVILY Black neighborhood, too. Although it's of note that the NAACP office was not actually OPEN, because it's Sunday. And "surrounded" sounds like a bigger deal than it was. No one seems to be reporting how many were there, but it doesn't look like more than a dozen. So a few people stood in front of an empty building no one was trying to actually get to.

It's disgusting, but chickenshit.
posted by threeturtles at 11:19 PM on August 21, 2016 [22 favorites]


I'm not likely to vote republican this lifetime, but Rohlfing's disavowal of Kaaihue is exactly how you should do it. This is why I genuinely respect many local Republicans even when I fight with them on 75 different fronts.

When Kaaihue and other Republicans do the horrible things that they do, when these repudiations come out, are there any consequences, like the loss of financial contacts and support? If Republicans were really serious about this, why not cut off funding and logistical support, at least? The GOP is not powerless.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:21 PM on August 21, 2016 [4 favorites]


I'm not sure Kaaihue is getting logistical or significant party resources. She changed what district she was running in but still had the other day (after the primary!) a Facebook image up near the top of her page with the wrong district given. So if she's getting support it doesn't seem very useful. Really she's probably not be best example of a bigoted, unacceptable candidate that the party can disavow themselves of, if only because her campaign doesn't seem very serious and probably only got any attention because she's so outside the norm.
posted by R343L at 11:31 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


> A private server is much more secure than an AOL account.

Sorry, but, no. A server, whomever set it up, is only as secure as the sysadmin running it. AOL employs sysadmins to run its email, same as Google does for Gmail, and same as Colin Powell did for his private email, and so did Hillary Clinton. The email thing has ultimately proven to be weak-ass manufactured scandal with no legs, not deserving of a -gate name, but a private server is not inherently secure despite the word "private" in the name. Even the NSA has issues securing servers, as we've seen very recently.
posted by fragmede at 11:40 PM on August 21, 2016 [7 favorites]


Mod note: Folks, I appreciate the urge to help out lydhre in their hour of need, but in a huge thread that people are having trouble loading already, let's not have an extended off-topic riff. Thanks. (Also, if someone has ideas about making a new State of the Thing election post, that's fine from our end).
posted by taz (staff) at 11:45 PM on August 21, 2016 [3 favorites]


Sorry mods, didn't mean to steer this ship further off course. Enjoy the quiet night!
posted by lydhre at 11:49 PM on August 21, 2016


I'm getting pretty angry that the best case scenario for a Trump presidency is JUST some enabled crazy racists are going to do something awful with a gun.
posted by angrycat at 12:33 AM on August 22, 2016 [5 favorites]


When Kaaihue and other Republicans do the horrible things that they do, when these repudiations come out, are there any consequences, like the loss of financial contacts and support?

My understanding from my Republican friends (and they could be wrong) is that Kaaihue is not getting any support from the local Republican party (other than from the 7,000-odd Republicans who voted for her). She is completely toxic and they want nothing to do with her. Furthermore, there's lots of anecdotes of buyer's remorse from those 7,000 voters - the most common one being that they didn't know anything about her expect that she had a Hawaiian name.

I predict in the general vs Gabbard she will receive fewer votes than she received in the primaries.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:51 AM on August 22, 2016 [2 favorites]


(also, the Hawaii Republican Party is an unusual beast in that they are something of a permanent minority party out here. Even when Linda Lingle was the governor, the house and senate were overwhelmingly Democrat. Many politicians who would be Republicans in other states are the conservative wing of our Democratic Party. Which is to say they couldn't survive backing a nasty piece of work like Kaaihue)
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:53 AM on August 22, 2016 [2 favorites]


I can't sleep. Somehow the campaign knows this and hits me up for yet another $19. I read all the way to the bottom of the email. Even the disclaimer. Hoping it will cure insomnia. At the very bottom is a link titled "yee haw".
posted by honestcoyote at 2:37 AM on August 22, 2016 [9 favorites]


If the real Dolly Parton endorses Hillary, then she can't lose.
posted by oneswellfoop at 2:44 AM on August 22, 2016


Dolly has weighed in, only to later clarify that it was not meant to be an endorsement of Hillary:
How do you feel about a female presidential nominee?

Well, I think that that would be wonderful. Hillary might make as good a president as anybody ever has. I think no matter if it’s Hillary or Donald Trump, we’re gonna be plagued with PMS either way — presidential mood swings! But I personally think a woman would do a great job. I think Hillary’s very qualified. So if she gets it, I’ll certainly be behind her.
posted by peeedro at 2:53 AM on August 22, 2016 [2 favorites]


How are they pinning it on him by mentioning the fact that he used a private server? It was an open fact so I'm sure they knew about it before asking for advice.

Clinton told the FBI* in her interview that Colin Powell suggested she use private email (not sure whether the story is that he specified a private server or just private email). When that came out, Powell said he did not recall having that conversation, but he did send Clinton a memo about how he used his own email address. He then later gave the comments above about the Clinton camp trying to pin this on him.

It's odd in a number of ways (People Magazine? Powell being so blunt? Why correct the story twice?) but my guess is he is annoyed that his name keeps coming up in this.

*The fact that this became public knowledge this week means someone must have leaked it, correct?
posted by sallybrown at 4:08 AM on August 22, 2016




Meet the voters jumping off the Donald Trump train by MeFi fav Daniel Dale, lots of great quotes in here: “For a while I thought he was very metaphorical — his ‘wall’ was really just a metaphor for him wanting to secure the borders,” said Lucasti, now undecided. “After months of watching him, though, I now know for sure that this guy honestly wants to build a concrete wall hundreds of miles long. Just ridiculous.”
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 5:41 AM on August 22, 2016 [13 favorites]


Remember when Trump's new campaign manager said just yesterday that Donald doesn't do personal insults? Well, guess who has his phone back and was watching MSNBC this morning?

Some day, when things calm down, I'll tell the real story of @JoeNBC and his very insecure long-time girlfriend, @morningmika. Two clowns!

and

Tried watching low-rated @Morning_Joe this morning, unwatchable! @morningmika is off the wall, a neurotic and not very bright mess!

If you're wondering, Trump reserves 'neurotic' for women, having only called Mika and Debbie Wasserman Schultz it.
posted by chris24 at 6:02 AM on August 22, 2016 [15 favorites]


Heyyy guys I made a new thread over here.
posted by sallybrown at 6:07 AM on August 22, 2016 [28 favorites]


Chris24, I was just getting ready to post about that. It is amazing that Donald Trump did not tweet once about the Olympics-- an event where American athletes covered themselves with glory and won more medals by far than any other country-- yet could devote several tweets to Morning Joe's anchors and the rumor of an affair.

Jill Stein tweeted about the Olympics, so did Gary Johnson, Hillary Clinton and President Obama. Hey Donald, do you have no love of the games or are you just down on all things American?
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:08 AM on August 22, 2016 [7 favorites]


The NRA is raffling off guns that Hillary Clinton wants to 'ban'
In a new push, the National Rifle Association is raffling off a dozen weapons that it says will be "banned" if Clinton wins the White House in November.

"Hillary Clinton is the first presidential candidate in American history to openly and publicly affirm her all-out intent to destroy the Second Amendment," the NRA warns breathlessly in the latest issue of its membership magazine "America's First Freedom," which hit mailboxes this month. "But you can help the NRA fight back - and win - by entering our banned guns raffle today."[...]

In a statement, Clinton's campaign branded the NRA's claims "lies."

"The fact is, too many families in America have suffered—and continue to suffer—from gun violence and the vast majority of the American people – including the vast majority of gun owners – believe we can and must do better," the statement reads. "That's why Hillary Clinton supports common sense measures like comprehensive background checks that will help decrease the number of gun deaths our nation suffers every day."
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:13 AM on August 22, 2016


It is amazing that Donald Trump did not tweet once about the Olympics

It doesn't fit his narrative about how shitty and uncompetitive we are. Plus, women won most of the U.S.'s medals, so those don't count to him.
posted by Etrigan at 6:18 AM on August 22, 2016 [21 favorites]


the latest issue of its membership magazine "America's First Freedom,"

So first it's enshrined in the Second Amendment!
posted by Gelatin at 6:19 AM on August 22, 2016 [21 favorites]


The Daily Beast (I know) points out that Donald Trump has said virtually nothing about the US Constitution or the Founding Fathers, and has said very little about previous Presidents (not even to praise Saint Ronnie) other than to excoriate Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. In other words Donald Trump seems to think U.S. History began with his own birth.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 6:22 AM on August 22, 2016 [5 favorites]


It is amazing that Donald Trump did not tweet once about the Olympics

Well, there's this, a picture of himself.
posted by peeedro at 6:25 AM on August 22, 2016 [1 favorite]


So, something extonishing has happened.

what is that word
posted by tivalasvegas at 6:27 AM on August 22, 2016 [7 favorites]


"Extonishing" should be that thing when you break up and then your ex all the sudden does the thing you always urged him to do but he never would
posted by sallybrown at 6:33 AM on August 22, 2016 [45 favorites]


I know the surface meaning of boll weevil, but I'm not following the metaphorical meaning. Is he referring to somebody specific?

It's the undesirable, even damaging, part of the cotton/party.

The historical meaning was southern, conservative Democrats. So, it's a bit of a funhouse mirror to use it on (relatively) liberal Republicans.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:34 AM on August 22, 2016 [4 favorites]


I knew that "17 new comments" was too good to be true...
posted by zachlipton at 7:50 AM on August 22, 2016 [9 favorites]


MetaFilter: It's disgusting, but chickenshit.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:00 AM on August 22, 2016


One of Trump's agricultural advisors? Sam Brownback.

Again, my response.
posted by Talez at 8:02 AM on August 22, 2016




"Extonishing" should be that thing when you break up and then your ex all the sudden does the thing you always urged him to do but he never would

heh, true story: my ex is becoming a Franciscan monk, take from that what you will
posted by tivalasvegas at 8:44 AM on August 22, 2016 [11 favorites]


I mean, I was extonishing when my last ex-gf broke up with me. But that's because I figured out that while she wasn't worth doing those things for, I was.
posted by Imperfect at 9:13 AM on August 22, 2016 [2 favorites]


I learned what a boll weevil was from, amazingly, Ambush Bug comics when I was about 10 years old; I don't remember the outer context, but the punchline is some sort of panic where Ambush Bug screams "IT'S A DEMOCRAT PRETENDING TO BE A REPUBLICAN!" and everyone screams and runs.

I was pre-politics and Canadian and for some reason the whole thing was just so weird that it stuck in my head to this day. Thank you, Irwin Schwab, for your myriad educational virtues!
posted by Shepherd at 9:16 AM on August 22, 2016 [2 favorites]


For the time period in question we know that AOL was hacked numerous times, including an incident where the private email of CIA Director John Brennan was hacked. We also know that the official Stare Department email, the her critics suggest Hillary should have used was hacked.

The FBI found no evidence Clinton's email was hacked. Making the claim that her server was less secure ought to be supported by evidence it was compromised. Otherwise you are demanding proof of a negative which is impossible.

This claim that Colin Powell was somehow more secure is absurd given the actual facts we have about the state of AOL account security. There are hundreds, if not thousands of people who can reset a password. These people routinely fall victim to various social engineering scams and give access to people who shouldn't have it. AOL's terms of service are written to eliminate their liability for these failures.
posted by humanfont at 11:37 AM on August 22, 2016 [11 favorites]


The question of the Secretary of State's availability to take a call at let's assume some Tuesday afternoon isn't exactly the kind of state secrets which could have destroyed the Republic.

If it's classified, then it's by definition one of the following:
Confidential shall be applied to information the unauthorized disclosure of which reasonably could be expected to cause damage to the national security that the OCA is able to identify or describe.

Secret shall be applied to information the unauthorized disclosure of which reasonably could be expected to cause serious damage to the national security that the OCA is able to identify or describe.

Top Secret shall be applied to information the unauthorized disclosure of which reasonably could be expected to cause exceptionally grave damage to the national security that the OCA is able to identify or describe.
So at least "damage to the national security." I guess it could have been *gasp* overmarked? (DoD people understand the extreme sarcasm there.) But then, since it wasn't marked at all, would that make it erroneously un-overmarked?
posted by ctmf at 6:53 PM on August 22, 2016 [1 favorite]


Play-Doh unfortunately does not taste as good as it smells

Dow goo dell bee.
posted by quinndexter at 10:21 PM on August 22, 2016 [3 favorites]


Oh man, national security briefings for Trump? I wouldn't even tell that guy where the bathroom was if his bladder had backed up and piss was trickling out of his ears.
posted by turbid dahlia at 7:38 PM on August 23, 2016


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