This television makes me hiss in anger.
February 1, 2017 5:49 AM Subscribe
Some product reviews don't requires data and charts and graphs.
The Sweethome and The Wirecutter, Consumer Reports and Snapsort -- these sites offer lots of objective information for making technology-buying decisions.
Professional tech writers bring experience and perspective to their writing, which is a great service to the rest of us. On the other hand, it's bad to get bound up in "analysis paralysis" -- but it may be worse to select one faulty criteria to guide your shopping (viz., "prettiness").
Once in a while, however, one user's opinion is enough to let you know you've found a dud.
The Sweethome and The Wirecutter, Consumer Reports and Snapsort -- these sites offer lots of objective information for making technology-buying decisions.
Professional tech writers bring experience and perspective to their writing, which is a great service to the rest of us. On the other hand, it's bad to get bound up in "analysis paralysis" -- but it may be worse to select one faulty criteria to guide your shopping (viz., "prettiness").
Once in a while, however, one user's opinion is enough to let you know you've found a dud.
I think 'curved' is as big a non-runner as 3D was. I can get behind 4K and HDR though.
posted by GallonOfAlan at 5:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
posted by GallonOfAlan at 5:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
Don't plug your TV into the internet. That's dumb. Use boxes to get your content on there. My TV has a Chromecast, an Apple TV, a Amazon Fire, a Roku and something I forget. I know I'm forgetting one, because I have 5 HDMI ports and they are all full.
I used to have my TV pugged into the internet, but then one day it rebooted, and it did a software update and I found out my TV was running, "Windows 7 embedded." Not in my house! This update took away functionality. The Blockbuster streaming was gone (it was still a thing at the time), because they'd signed an exclusive deal with someone else or something. And the update took a long time, and I wanted to watch TV, not a progress bar.
And I have no idea what happens if one of their updates bricks my TV. It's out of warranty, so who fixes it? How do I revert? I don't want to worry about these things, I just want to watch *Dawson's Creek.*
Then Vizio decided to brag about how they were spying on me and were going to become the next Nielsen's Ratings. They would tell people everything I did with their TV, even if it was using some other service. I could opt out, but by default they were going to rat out how much of my life I was wasting and on which shows. No thanks.
This all said, when I want to buy anything these days I look to see what Sweethome and Wirecutter recommend, and I just buy that. Life is so much easier. That's how I bought my razor and my tweezers I am happy with them.
And as a tech guy, I can say there are worse criteria to use for purchasing than "pretty." I use this as a factor all the time, I just call it, "build quality."
posted by cjorgensen at 6:12 AM on February 1, 2017 [33 favorites]
I used to have my TV pugged into the internet, but then one day it rebooted, and it did a software update and I found out my TV was running, "Windows 7 embedded." Not in my house! This update took away functionality. The Blockbuster streaming was gone (it was still a thing at the time), because they'd signed an exclusive deal with someone else or something. And the update took a long time, and I wanted to watch TV, not a progress bar.
And I have no idea what happens if one of their updates bricks my TV. It's out of warranty, so who fixes it? How do I revert? I don't want to worry about these things, I just want to watch *Dawson's Creek.*
Then Vizio decided to brag about how they were spying on me and were going to become the next Nielsen's Ratings. They would tell people everything I did with their TV, even if it was using some other service. I could opt out, but by default they were going to rat out how much of my life I was wasting and on which shows. No thanks.
This all said, when I want to buy anything these days I look to see what Sweethome and Wirecutter recommend, and I just buy that. Life is so much easier. That's how I bought my razor and my tweezers I am happy with them.
And as a tech guy, I can say there are worse criteria to use for purchasing than "pretty." I use this as a factor all the time, I just call it, "build quality."
posted by cjorgensen at 6:12 AM on February 1, 2017 [33 favorites]
I was at a Sony product event a few years ago when curved screens were being introduced as premium offerings in their TVs. I asked a product manager about the design, expecting to get the party line on why the curved screen emits more light in the direction of the viewers from both sides of the screen, or provides a better viewing experience in some other way. Instead, he was remarkably candid, responding (paraphrasing), "There is no technical reason for doing it, but we are hoping it will be an effective gimmick that will get people to replace their current TV sets." I haven't been paying attention but it's interesting that they're using it in low-end TVs now, rather than just the high-end ones.
I have a slightly curved Dell ultrawide screen for my desktop PC and think it's great. But that's for just one viewer at about the right distance/angle from the screen for a gentle curve to make slightly easier viewing; I don't think I would want a curved set in the living room, where viewers are often trying to see the screen from fairly extreme angles.
posted by Mothlight at 6:14 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
I have a slightly curved Dell ultrawide screen for my desktop PC and think it's great. But that's for just one viewer at about the right distance/angle from the screen for a gentle curve to make slightly easier viewing; I don't think I would want a curved set in the living room, where viewers are often trying to see the screen from fairly extreme angles.
posted by Mothlight at 6:14 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
My TV has a Chromecast, an Apple TV, a Amazon Fire, a Roku and something I forget. I know I'm forgetting one, because I have 5 HDMI ports and they are all full.
I'm not sure my brain would survive channel surfing on five - FIVE! - media boxes.
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure my brain would survive channel surfing on five - FIVE! - media boxes.
posted by Foci for Analysis at 6:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm not sure my brain would survive channel surfing on five - FIVE! - media boxes.
Not to mention the 6(!) remotes. Yes, you can use voice commands with some of them but not everyone likes shouting at their TV.
posted by tommasz at 6:30 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
Not to mention the 6(!) remotes. Yes, you can use voice commands with some of them but not everyone likes shouting at their TV.
posted by tommasz at 6:30 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
not everyone likes shouting at their TV.
Yeah, I skipped the presidential debates as well.
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 6:35 AM on February 1, 2017 [73 favorites]
Yeah, I skipped the presidential debates as well.
posted by AlonzoMosleyFBI at 6:35 AM on February 1, 2017 [73 favorites]
"There is no technical reason for doing it, but we are hoping it will be an effective gimmick that will get people to replace their current TV sets."
That describes 90 percent of the features on 90 percent of the tech products on the market. I am looking at my Polycom work phone at the moment, a device with 40 mechanical buttons, each of which has multiple software functions, but I could as well be looking at the fucking room light switch that everyone has to play with because it is an on/off/dimmer control for various parts of this stupid little office, or I could be looking at the damned window with built-in open/closed detector that of course is very touchy and gives no feedback to "users" (people opening or closing the damned window) but is sure to complain to the security people downstairs that a window is ajar from the switch's point of view when it is actually closed and locked. Phone. Light switch. Window.
Fuck.
posted by pracowity at 6:46 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
That describes 90 percent of the features on 90 percent of the tech products on the market. I am looking at my Polycom work phone at the moment, a device with 40 mechanical buttons, each of which has multiple software functions, but I could as well be looking at the fucking room light switch that everyone has to play with because it is an on/off/dimmer control for various parts of this stupid little office, or I could be looking at the damned window with built-in open/closed detector that of course is very touchy and gives no feedback to "users" (people opening or closing the damned window) but is sure to complain to the security people downstairs that a window is ajar from the switch's point of view when it is actually closed and locked. Phone. Light switch. Window.
Fuck.
posted by pracowity at 6:46 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
Yeah, my wife and I made the same mistake before Christmas. We picked up a Vizio 50" UHD (E50-E3, I think?) display from Best Buy for an unbelievable price. Apparently the reason the price was unbelievable was because the screen lost color fidelity more than maybe 10 degrees off center. Sitting on the couch maybe 30-40 degrees off center meant everything had atrocious color banding. People's faces were monotone pink, shadows were HUGE BANDS of gray, it was completely unwatchable. But I know people with Vizio screens! People who aren't blind! Thankfully Best Buy's return policy was pretty much "anything broken? no? here's your money back."
We ended up replacing it with a mid-low (x700) line Bravia for ~2x the price. But that display is beautiful aside from some quirks with local brightness control and blacks that could be blacker but I'm not made of money. I did like how Vizio's approach was that it's just a display, all the smarts come from your devices, that was nice. AndroidTV makes me want to shiv someone, I never thought I'd need to reboot a TV before and yet here we are.
(The old TV was 10 years old and had significant color vignetting in the corners and the bulb present / blast shield door interlock switches were getting to the point where they needed a shim to recognize the hardware. It was time.)
posted by Kyol at 6:49 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
We ended up replacing it with a mid-low (x700) line Bravia for ~2x the price. But that display is beautiful aside from some quirks with local brightness control and blacks that could be blacker but I'm not made of money. I did like how Vizio's approach was that it's just a display, all the smarts come from your devices, that was nice. AndroidTV makes me want to shiv someone, I never thought I'd need to reboot a TV before and yet here we are.
(The old TV was 10 years old and had significant color vignetting in the corners and the bulb present / blast shield door interlock switches were getting to the point where they needed a shim to recognize the hardware. It was time.)
posted by Kyol at 6:49 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I got myself a nice new TV for the holidays, because the prices seemed stupidly low for what I was getting. (The new set is not only about as big as I can fit in the space that I had for the old one, but about as big as I could fit in my car for the trip home, so I'll probably be hanging onto it for some time. One of the first things that I watched on it was the Avatar Blu-ray, and I got a somewhat uneasy sense of recognition when I saw, in the extended version, Jake Sully's apartment on Earth, which was pretty small and ratty except for the TV which covered one entire wall.) The curved TVs on display at Costco seemed to be very much of the 3D/who-really-asked-for-this type of thing.
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:50 AM on February 1, 2017
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:50 AM on February 1, 2017
Not to mention the 6(!) remotes. Yes, you can use voice commands with some of them but not everyone likes shouting at their TV.
Oh, that's easy enough, you just hook it to an Alexa or a Google Home, and let them curate the experience for you. Hell, why not hook them both up and let them fight for your love? Then you'll need some sort of externally-addressable hypervisor so you can control your various media devices from your phone when you're not in the living room, because physical proximity is for PEASANTS.
There. The living room of the future. All internet-connected, so a firmware update on any of them can potentially brick your entire setup. Oh, and also they're probably running an unpatched Linux distro from 2008, so an attacker can make your house his own miniature botnet. It's like living in The Jetsons!
posted by Mayor West at 6:51 AM on February 1, 2017 [12 favorites]
Oh, that's easy enough, you just hook it to an Alexa or a Google Home, and let them curate the experience for you. Hell, why not hook them both up and let them fight for your love? Then you'll need some sort of externally-addressable hypervisor so you can control your various media devices from your phone when you're not in the living room, because physical proximity is for PEASANTS.
There. The living room of the future. All internet-connected, so a firmware update on any of them can potentially brick your entire setup. Oh, and also they're probably running an unpatched Linux distro from 2008, so an attacker can make your house his own miniature botnet. It's like living in The Jetsons!
posted by Mayor West at 6:51 AM on February 1, 2017 [12 favorites]
Also has anyone considered that the screens are curved, and have 5 degrees of viewing angle, because the manufacturer wants you to be exactly centered in front of the parabolic array containing unknown light-emitting technology? That's what's going to replace Nielson boxes to figure out how effective their targeted advertisements are. WAKE UP, SHEEPLE.
posted by Mayor West at 6:54 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by Mayor West at 6:54 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
The blipverts are 50% less effective when the target is even slightly off axis.
posted by Kyol at 6:56 AM on February 1, 2017 [14 favorites]
posted by Kyol at 6:56 AM on February 1, 2017 [14 favorites]
Glossy screens seem to be a requirement of high pixel densities, as the anti-reflection film they use to make matte screens also tends to blur the image. With the trend for 4k and higher screens, glossy seems to be the way thinks are going...
posted by Eleven at 6:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Eleven at 6:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
Are we airing grievances?
Because my Vizio installed an update a month or two ago (before I changed my wifi setup) and now I don't have volume control for 10 seconds or so on boot up. Because I totally need to HEAR THIS INFOMERCIAL when I turn on the TV in the morning.
I guess I could hook it back up to wifi and see if they've fixed it. It could either get better, or it could get worse.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:03 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
Because my Vizio installed an update a month or two ago (before I changed my wifi setup) and now I don't have volume control for 10 seconds or so on boot up. Because I totally need to HEAR THIS INFOMERCIAL when I turn on the TV in the morning.
I guess I could hook it back up to wifi and see if they've fixed it. It could either get better, or it could get worse.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:03 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
That review was weirdly counter-productive, in that it kind of made me want to go out and buy that TV just to share the experience of basking in its shitty, shitty glory. Thankfully, I'm far too hip and with-it to be influenced by customer reviews, and so my three-ton CRT will live to fight another day.
posted by Zeinab Badawi's Twenty Hotels at 7:03 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Zeinab Badawi's Twenty Hotels at 7:03 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
Smart TVs with curved screens are double-proof that no one in the tech sector gives one single damn what the average consumer actually wants or needs. It's all about fulfilling engineers' (and marketing's) wet dreams.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by Thorzdad at 7:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
"I never thought I'd need to reboot a TV before and yet here we are."
I had to physically unplug my TV the other day because the Netflix app crashed (started with a black screen, nothing else) and I couldn't figure out any other way to "reboot" it or quit the misbehaving app.
Progress!
posted by howling fantods at 7:15 AM on February 1, 2017
I had to physically unplug my TV the other day because the Netflix app crashed (started with a black screen, nothing else) and I couldn't figure out any other way to "reboot" it or quit the misbehaving app.
Progress!
posted by howling fantods at 7:15 AM on February 1, 2017
You know what bothers me about TVs these days? They cost a fortune and the speakers are completely terrible. Audio is 50% of their job! Do the speakers suck -- and face backwards, ffs -- because that's all that'll fit in the skinny-ass screen, or is it just so they can charge you the other arm and leg for external speakers?
TBH, I'm mostly waiting for the return of televisual furniture that sits down on the floor. The thin screens were neat at first, but the novelty has completely worn off. Give me something I can set my drink on.
posted by Sys Rq at 7:21 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
TBH, I'm mostly waiting for the return of televisual furniture that sits down on the floor. The thin screens were neat at first, but the novelty has completely worn off. Give me something I can set my drink on.
posted by Sys Rq at 7:21 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
Fiery rants about trifling things do the same for me as kitten videos do for other people. I love this.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [26 favorites]
posted by DirtyOldTown at 7:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [26 favorites]
You know what bothers me about TVs these days? They cost a fortune and the speakers are completely terrible.
I am your evil twin and if they have to include speakers at all I want them to be the cheapest things imaginable, because I hook everything up through a receiver and proper speakers. Because I am not a brute animal.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:39 AM on February 1, 2017 [28 favorites]
I am your evil twin and if they have to include speakers at all I want them to be the cheapest things imaginable, because I hook everything up through a receiver and proper speakers. Because I am not a brute animal.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:39 AM on February 1, 2017 [28 favorites]
How about if they had an app you could use as the remote control? And it was basically great because it looked and behaved exactly like the actual remote control that came with it. Awesome! Then they pulled that app and replaced it with one that had maybe a 1/3 of the functionality, didn't look at all like the actual remote, but had the great new feature that it could push ads at you all the time?
posted by lagomorphius at 7:52 AM on February 1, 2017
posted by lagomorphius at 7:52 AM on February 1, 2017
Matte versus Gloss finish
Honda did this to my Accord. Every surface, including center console and buttons(!?) is glossy.
Why the hell would you put a glossy finish on something designed to be touched by fingers?!? I have to keep a microfiber cloth in the car to keep it from looking like crap all the time.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
Honda did this to my Accord. Every surface, including center console and buttons(!?) is glossy.
Why the hell would you put a glossy finish on something designed to be touched by fingers?!? I have to keep a microfiber cloth in the car to keep it from looking like crap all the time.
posted by leotrotsky at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
I got a curved OLED last year because the price was incredible - not that I desired a curved screen. The upside to it being curved is when took to the big once-a-year tailgate the glare on the screen was significantly reduced compared to previous years. Thankfully the dimensions of my living room make the curve a non-issue.
posted by 6ATR at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017
posted by 6ATR at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017
Ever since I became subject to the tablet ecosystem, the idea of watching a TV as a box in a place just seems bizarre. "Hey, I'm going to go to that room where the entertainment is!" feels like I think of my house as a castle with rooms that only serve one function. It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping. So odd.
Of course, if I want to watch a proper movie, I pull down the big screen, fire up the projector, power up the huge speakers, and tuck my boyfriend under an arm to indoctrinate him into Barbarella. Old fashioned TV just feels so...interim.
posted by sonascope at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017 [11 favorites]
Of course, if I want to watch a proper movie, I pull down the big screen, fire up the projector, power up the huge speakers, and tuck my boyfriend under an arm to indoctrinate him into Barbarella. Old fashioned TV just feels so...interim.
posted by sonascope at 7:53 AM on February 1, 2017 [11 favorites]
And don't get me wrong - I (generally) like SmartTV capabilities. It makes cutting the cord so much easier to have the apps right there, and not have the whole janky "cast/airplay from your phone to the TV" step in the middle. Plex on my TV/AppleTV is a much nicer experience directly on a TV, Playstation Vue works great with actual shuttle controls, having an actual Amazon Prime streaming app is a godsend, I don't miss my traditional television provider at all.
But AndroidTV feels like the lowest possible bar to hit that. It doesn't feel like a top down design (let's feed inputs to the screen, android is just an internal input, but upscaling and video controls and all that is traditional), it feels like they just whacked an android device on the back of a 55" display and everything runs through Android, for better or worse.
And yeah, I'm sorta torn on the whole speakers thing - decent soundbars can be had for reasonable prices and they can (theoretically) survive multiple televisions? And it turns out it's kind of nice having a speaker system in the living room without having a whole audiophile enthusiast deal going on. But lord all mighty the stock speakers in modern televisions are _awful_ now.
posted by Kyol at 7:55 AM on February 1, 2017
But AndroidTV feels like the lowest possible bar to hit that. It doesn't feel like a top down design (let's feed inputs to the screen, android is just an internal input, but upscaling and video controls and all that is traditional), it feels like they just whacked an android device on the back of a 55" display and everything runs through Android, for better or worse.
And yeah, I'm sorta torn on the whole speakers thing - decent soundbars can be had for reasonable prices and they can (theoretically) survive multiple televisions? And it turns out it's kind of nice having a speaker system in the living room without having a whole audiophile enthusiast deal going on. But lord all mighty the stock speakers in modern televisions are _awful_ now.
posted by Kyol at 7:55 AM on February 1, 2017
It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping. So odd.
discreet humble-brag that.
gift-wrapping in multiple rooms!
posted by leotrotsky at 7:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [15 favorites]
discreet humble-brag that.
gift-wrapping in multiple rooms!
posted by leotrotsky at 7:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [15 favorites]
Gotta agree with the author about curved screens adding nothing (good) to consumer displays. But sympathy for her husband as it's really easy to go to a big box electronics store and choose a bad TV. I find it absolutely impossible to judge image quality in any of those stores with their rows and rows of screens packed together, bright lights, and horrible source material. Might those environments actually be designed to confuse the consumer?
posted by Dean358 at 7:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by Dean358 at 7:57 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
TVs. Can't live with them, can't live without them. I choose to look at my TV as a one time cost of entertainment. I purchased my TV for the holidays in 2015. I had a Super Bowl party two months later. 25 people over. Buying nice filet of beef, enough to feed 25, the shrimp, the scallops and bacon, the chips, dip, wings and Tums cost me more than the TV. Heck, the food is only usable once. And, I shit out half the value of the TV the next day. The tequila, beer, bourbon and wine cost more than the TV. That was peed out in hours. Once I came to the realization that I was not tied down to this purchase, that I was free to get rid of it at any time, I began to actually not care about its flaws. When you are mentally prepared to toss the thing in the recycling center at any moment, you are free of its constraints.
posted by AugustWest at 8:00 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by AugustWest at 8:00 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
"I never thought I'd need to reboot a TV before and yet here we are."
My last job had a water cooler with a computer controller that would occasionally freak out and have to be rebooted before it would dispense water.
posted by octothorpe at 8:13 AM on February 1, 2017 [21 favorites]
My last job had a water cooler with a computer controller that would occasionally freak out and have to be rebooted before it would dispense water.
posted by octothorpe at 8:13 AM on February 1, 2017 [21 favorites]
Why didn't they just return it?
posted by cmoj at 8:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
posted by cmoj at 8:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
My kids broke my remote, can I return them?
posted by Nanukthedog at 8:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by Nanukthedog at 8:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
Stop putting computers in things.
posted by brennen at 8:39 AM on February 1, 2017 [18 favorites]
posted by brennen at 8:39 AM on February 1, 2017 [18 favorites]
Gotta agree with the author about curved screens adding nothing (good) to consumer displays. But sympathy for her husband as it's really easy to go to a big box electronics store and choose a bad TV.
True, but the author's husband is the Editor-in-chief of a technology review site.
posted by mmascolino at 8:41 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
True, but the author's husband is the Editor-in-chief of a technology review site.
posted by mmascolino at 8:41 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
I think I'm married to Becky. My missus won't let me live down the $800 laser disk player that's gathering dust downstairs.
Funny review!
posted by sixpack at 8:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
Funny review!
posted by sixpack at 8:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I use this as a factor all the time, I just call it, "build quality."
This is how I wound up being a Mac person for almost a decade, until Mac decided that "so thin you can sharpen the edge and shave with it" s the new "build quality". Pretty is one thing, but it also needs to fit in my giant bear hands.
I have a slightly curved Dell ultrawide screen for my desktop PC and think it's great.
Yeah, ultrawide PC monitors seem like the only place where curved screens make sense. The farther back you are from a screen, even a really big one, the less distortion you get from the screen having a flat surface. Ultrawide monitors are in an anti-sweet spot where the ratio of screen width to viewing distance is large enough to justify throwing in a gentle curve.
As for glossy vs matte... Well, my office has a south-facing window, and I have both a glossy-screen Macbook Pro and a matte-screen Dell monitor. The glare on the Dell monitor is about a thousand times worse. Don't ask me how that works, maybe the MBP just has a better backlight (highly probable, actually), I agree that in theory the glossy finish should be worse for glare, but that's my experience. The glossy screen is only really a problem when there's a light source directly behind me. I can see that being the case in some folks' living rooms, but it's not the case in either my living room or my office.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:55 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
This is how I wound up being a Mac person for almost a decade, until Mac decided that "so thin you can sharpen the edge and shave with it" s the new "build quality". Pretty is one thing, but it also needs to fit in my giant bear hands.
I have a slightly curved Dell ultrawide screen for my desktop PC and think it's great.
Yeah, ultrawide PC monitors seem like the only place where curved screens make sense. The farther back you are from a screen, even a really big one, the less distortion you get from the screen having a flat surface. Ultrawide monitors are in an anti-sweet spot where the ratio of screen width to viewing distance is large enough to justify throwing in a gentle curve.
As for glossy vs matte... Well, my office has a south-facing window, and I have both a glossy-screen Macbook Pro and a matte-screen Dell monitor. The glare on the Dell monitor is about a thousand times worse. Don't ask me how that works, maybe the MBP just has a better backlight (highly probable, actually), I agree that in theory the glossy finish should be worse for glare, but that's my experience. The glossy screen is only really a problem when there's a light source directly behind me. I can see that being the case in some folks' living rooms, but it's not the case in either my living room or my office.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:55 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I am your evil twin and if they have to include speakers at all I want them to be the cheapest things imaginable, because I hook everything up through a receiver and proper speakers. Because I am not a brute animal.
Congratulations on all your money. We brute animals are all very impressed.
What you want, though, is not a television, but a monitor. A projector, even. If TV makers' expectation is that the end consumer will have to plug external speakers into their televisions (which we do, because the onboard speakers are complete garbage), why do they bother including speakers at all? They're a total waste of energy, labour, and natural resources, and must add to the cost -- though, if those P's.O.S. add more than a dollar and a half, they're overpaying for their components.
Televisions have speakers. If they had "proper speakers," you wouldn't need to buy them. That is the point I am making.
posted by Sys Rq at 9:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
Congratulations on all your money. We brute animals are all very impressed.
What you want, though, is not a television, but a monitor. A projector, even. If TV makers' expectation is that the end consumer will have to plug external speakers into their televisions (which we do, because the onboard speakers are complete garbage), why do they bother including speakers at all? They're a total waste of energy, labour, and natural resources, and must add to the cost -- though, if those P's.O.S. add more than a dollar and a half, they're overpaying for their components.
Televisions have speakers. If they had "proper speakers," you wouldn't need to buy them. That is the point I am making.
posted by Sys Rq at 9:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
My missus won't let me live down the $800 laser disk player
Joke's on her — those things have pretty sweet laser diodes in them. And the really old (1980s) ones actually have visible-light HeNe gas lasers!
posted by Kadin2048 at 9:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
Joke's on her — those things have pretty sweet laser diodes in them. And the really old (1980s) ones actually have visible-light HeNe gas lasers!
posted by Kadin2048 at 9:11 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
True, but the author's husband is the Editor-in-chief of a technology review site.
Yes, that's exactly my point, mmascolino. Intentional or not, the design of these stores makes the images on all the TV sets look alike! A few examples:
1. Contrast Ratio (#1 criteria for a display): this is about how black the darkest black can be vs. the brightest white. The key being how dark the blackest black is. But all the TVs are turned up to max brightness and they all reflect on each other, so the difference in black levels is obliterated.
2. Colorimetery: this requires looking at subtleties. But as images get brighter the eye perceives them as more colorful. With the blinding light coming from 100s of TVs all cranked up everything looks super colorful and again, the differences between displays become impossible to see.
3. Off Axis Viewing. The light from all the adjacent TVs -- remember the have the same images on them -- tends to hide the falloff from off-axis viewing.
4. Quantizing and banding: the source material is specifically designed to hide these errors. Notice there is very rarely a soft ramp from black to white and/or monochrome to color being displayed?
5. Motion artifacts: same thing, source material designed to camouflage.
I could go on (and on :-) but you get the point. So the editor in chief of a tech magazine goes to buy a tv there, and since he can't see the difference in image quality between displays he buys "the nicest looking" which probably means the shape of the bezel. What hope to regular consumers have?
posted by Dean358 at 9:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
Yes, that's exactly my point, mmascolino. Intentional or not, the design of these stores makes the images on all the TV sets look alike! A few examples:
1. Contrast Ratio (#1 criteria for a display): this is about how black the darkest black can be vs. the brightest white. The key being how dark the blackest black is. But all the TVs are turned up to max brightness and they all reflect on each other, so the difference in black levels is obliterated.
2. Colorimetery: this requires looking at subtleties. But as images get brighter the eye perceives them as more colorful. With the blinding light coming from 100s of TVs all cranked up everything looks super colorful and again, the differences between displays become impossible to see.
3. Off Axis Viewing. The light from all the adjacent TVs -- remember the have the same images on them -- tends to hide the falloff from off-axis viewing.
4. Quantizing and banding: the source material is specifically designed to hide these errors. Notice there is very rarely a soft ramp from black to white and/or monochrome to color being displayed?
5. Motion artifacts: same thing, source material designed to camouflage.
I could go on (and on :-) but you get the point. So the editor in chief of a tech magazine goes to buy a tv there, and since he can't see the difference in image quality between displays he buys "the nicest looking" which probably means the shape of the bezel. What hope to regular consumers have?
posted by Dean358 at 9:17 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
Ever since I became subject to the tablet ecosystem, the idea of watching a TV as a box in a place just seems bizarre.
The problem I have with watching television on a tablet or other mobile device is a) I cannot do anything else as I have to hold this tablet now b) it's too close for me to watch comfortably, other than in bed. The way I watch television (well, Plex chrome casted to my television to watch my Chinese cartoons) is to put it on, put something interesting on, then go do something else while it is playing, e.g. fart about on MeFi.
posted by MartinWisse at 9:19 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
The problem I have with watching television on a tablet or other mobile device is a) I cannot do anything else as I have to hold this tablet now b) it's too close for me to watch comfortably, other than in bed. The way I watch television (well, Plex chrome casted to my television to watch my Chinese cartoons) is to put it on, put something interesting on, then go do something else while it is playing, e.g. fart about on MeFi.
posted by MartinWisse at 9:19 AM on February 1, 2017 [6 favorites]
I used to be the guy who had to have super surround sound and all that, but as I've aged and turned into my parents I've become the guy who "JUST WANTS TO HEAR WHAT THEY'RE SAYING!"
And surprise, the little cheesy built-in speakers that come with the TVs are great for that.
posted by lagomorphius at 9:38 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
And surprise, the little cheesy built-in speakers that come with the TVs are great for that.
posted by lagomorphius at 9:38 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
"There is no technical reason for doing it, but we are hoping it will be an effective gimmick that will get people to replace their current TV sets."
Smart TVs with curved screens are double-proof that no one in the tech sector gives one single damn what the average consumer actually wants or needs. It's all about fulfilling engineers' (and marketing's) wet dreams.
Once upon a time this was known as "planned obsolescence," a term that now sounds as quaint as "antimacassar" and "If it ain't broke, why fix it?"
posted by scratch at 9:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
Smart TVs with curved screens are double-proof that no one in the tech sector gives one single damn what the average consumer actually wants or needs. It's all about fulfilling engineers' (and marketing's) wet dreams.
Once upon a time this was known as "planned obsolescence," a term that now sounds as quaint as "antimacassar" and "If it ain't broke, why fix it?"
posted by scratch at 9:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping. So odd.
discreet humble-brag that.
gift-wrapping in multiple rooms!
But of course! So I can wrap gifts for you in my gift-wrapping room, while you wrap gifts for me in the gift-wrapping parlor.
your husband can wrap gifts for both of us in the gift-wrapping salon.
posted by sexyrobot at 9:45 AM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
discreet humble-brag that.
gift-wrapping in multiple rooms!
But of course! So I can wrap gifts for you in my gift-wrapping room, while you wrap gifts for me in the gift-wrapping parlor.
your husband can wrap gifts for both of us in the gift-wrapping salon.
posted by sexyrobot at 9:45 AM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century. Used to think that I really should upgrade to the latest and greatest. A bit more hesitant now.
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:07 AM on February 1, 2017
posted by ZeusHumms at 10:07 AM on February 1, 2017
It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping. So odd.
I believe they are called walk in closets.
posted by srboisvert at 10:14 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I believe they are called walk in closets.
posted by srboisvert at 10:14 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century. Used to think that I really should upgrade to the latest and greatest. A bit more hesitant now.
Don't get the very-latest-and-greatest. Get the surviving latest-and-greatest from last year and you'll be fine.
posted by Etrigan at 10:15 AM on February 1, 2017 [7 favorites]
Don't get the very-latest-and-greatest. Get the surviving latest-and-greatest from last year and you'll be fine.
posted by Etrigan at 10:15 AM on February 1, 2017 [7 favorites]
I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century.
I'm still rocking my flat-screen-tube Trinitron from...oh...the early 90's? Late 80's? I forget. Every time I look at a new flatscreen model, I get very underwhelmed. Nothing but bells and whistles and a mediocre viewing experience. Lot's of hat but no cattle.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I'm still rocking my flat-screen-tube Trinitron from...oh...the early 90's? Late 80's? I forget. Every time I look at a new flatscreen model, I get very underwhelmed. Nothing but bells and whistles and a mediocre viewing experience. Lot's of hat but no cattle.
posted by Thorzdad at 10:42 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century. Used to think that I really should upgrade to the latest and greatest. A bit more hesitant now.
Not sure if you're being facetious, but since I also had a turn-of-the-century tube TV until a month ago I guess it's plausible there are two of us.
Honestly, coming from a tube TV, I think even the shittiest LCD TV would have looked awesome to me. Getting last year's latest-and-greatest is good advice.
posted by howling fantods at 10:45 AM on February 1, 2017
Not sure if you're being facetious, but since I also had a turn-of-the-century tube TV until a month ago I guess it's plausible there are two of us.
Honestly, coming from a tube TV, I think even the shittiest LCD TV would have looked awesome to me. Getting last year's latest-and-greatest is good advice.
posted by howling fantods at 10:45 AM on February 1, 2017
I wish I had a partner just so I could use gift-wrapping as a euphemism for sex.
Anyway, I have a Sanyo whatever that my ex picked up on sale in 2011 just before a Packers playoff game because we didn't own a TV. It doesn't connect to the internet and I don't have cable TV. 99% of the time I'm either using it as an external monitor for my laptop or playing something through the Roku. It's great and I hope it never ever dies.
posted by AFABulous at 10:50 AM on February 1, 2017
Anyway, I have a Sanyo whatever that my ex picked up on sale in 2011 just before a Packers playoff game because we didn't own a TV. It doesn't connect to the internet and I don't have cable TV. 99% of the time I'm either using it as an external monitor for my laptop or playing something through the Roku. It's great and I hope it never ever dies.
posted by AFABulous at 10:50 AM on February 1, 2017
Consumer electronics companies got really spoiled in the early Aughts when you had the convergence of HDTV rollout, flatscreen TVs, and DVDs, which meant just about everyone who could replaced their entire home theater setup at least once. They've spent the entire time since trying to recreate those times, but none of the stuff they've come up with since has had the impact of even one of those things.
posted by ckape at 10:50 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
posted by ckape at 10:50 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]
Some product reviews don't requires data and charts and graphs.
Typo above the fold is more annoying than a curved TV.
posted by w0mbat at 10:58 AM on February 1, 2017
Typo above the fold is more annoying than a curved TV.
posted by w0mbat at 10:58 AM on February 1, 2017
You seem to have aged and turned into your parents when they were barely-out-of-the-crib whippersnappers. I and my parent watch stuff on the TV all the time and we have to have the subtitles on because she's deaf as a post. She comments constantly about stuff being inaudible. "I do not hear the train in the distance or the birdsong cited in the subtitles; prithee, what species of bird is't that singeth?" and I am always answering, "Verily, sainted parent, I cannot hear the train either, nor yet the warbler in Q. for lo, the speakers on this gorgeous thing are composed of petrified bullshit whipped into a froth." I love the TV--it's a Bravia from forever ago, pushing ten years, I think, and the picture is still so beautiful it makes me weep, but the speakers seriously suck and I can't hear a thing anybody says. Fortunately my mom's hard of hearing (...too?), so I tell people that's why the subtitles are on all the time.
posted by Don Pepino at 10:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
posted by Don Pepino at 10:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
"There is no technical reason for doing it, but we are hoping it will be an effective gimmick that will get people to replace their current TV sets."
The Onion has this covered.
posted by tommasz at 11:15 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
The Onion has this covered.
posted by tommasz at 11:15 AM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm still rocking my flat-screen-tube Trinitron from...
I still have that as my setup as my main TV. It dates from 2001 and weighs just under 200 pounds. After getting married and moving into a house, my spouse wanted to replace the ugly utilitarian tv stand. By this point it was difficult to find functional furniture that would accommodate the weight of this beast.
The picture is still gorgeous and shows wonderful amounts of contrast and true blacks. While it does support 1080P it it is old enough that it doesn't have HDMI inputs so that is a total pain. Oh and the fact that the tv has an aspect ratio of 4:3 means I am never using all of my screen these days.
When it does go bad, I will hate all of the difficult to compare models that shopping for a TV means these days.
posted by mmascolino at 11:22 AM on February 1, 2017
I still have that as my setup as my main TV. It dates from 2001 and weighs just under 200 pounds. After getting married and moving into a house, my spouse wanted to replace the ugly utilitarian tv stand. By this point it was difficult to find functional furniture that would accommodate the weight of this beast.
The picture is still gorgeous and shows wonderful amounts of contrast and true blacks. While it does support 1080P it it is old enough that it doesn't have HDMI inputs so that is a total pain. Oh and the fact that the tv has an aspect ratio of 4:3 means I am never using all of my screen these days.
When it does go bad, I will hate all of the difficult to compare models that shopping for a TV means these days.
posted by mmascolino at 11:22 AM on February 1, 2017
cjorgensen: "Don't plug your TV into the internet. That's dumb. Use boxes to get your content on there."
Case in point: LG TV Infected by Randomware.
posted by wcfields at 11:25 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
Case in point: LG TV Infected by Randomware.
posted by wcfields at 11:25 AM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century. Used to think that I really should upgrade to the latest and greatest. A bit more hesitant now.
The thing about flat-panel tvs is that more or less by definition the geometry is *perfect*. Even "flat" tube tvs aren't really (unless, maybe, you have a production monitor).
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:26 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
The thing about flat-panel tvs is that more or less by definition the geometry is *perfect*. Even "flat" tube tvs aren't really (unless, maybe, you have a production monitor).
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 11:26 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
For-real question re:smart TVs...Do you have to connect them to the web at any time to get them to work? I mean, let's say I have a new "smart" TV for which I have no need of the built-in apps. Given that, do I ever have to give it access to the web in order to get the thing to work? Or, does it have to go online at least once (first startup?) to begin working?
I ask this because I have no damned interest in a smart TV, but there doesn't appear to be a non-smart TV available at any of my local retailers.
posted by Thorzdad at 11:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
I ask this because I have no damned interest in a smart TV, but there doesn't appear to be a non-smart TV available at any of my local retailers.
posted by Thorzdad at 11:32 AM on February 1, 2017 [1 favorite]
Maybe I'll just get a new fridge instead and use the browser on that for streaming.
posted by ZeusHumms at 11:41 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
posted by ZeusHumms at 11:41 AM on February 1, 2017 [9 favorites]
> I'm not sure my brain would survive channel surfing on five - FIVE! - media boxes.
I don't surf on them.
The Apple TV is for Netflix, anything I buy or rent on iTunes, HBO Go, app streaming (app streaming is how I watch Lucifer, Rosewood, Blacklist, and Blindspot), and the NHL app. The Chromecast is for casting CBS shows (they don't let you use the Apple TV app without paying, but you can stream same content for free from an iOS device). The Amazon Fire TV is for Amazon Prime shows and streaming music. The Roku is a backup to the Apple TV in case the NHL app isn't working on there (has happened twice?). I also sometimes like digging through the "blackmarket" channels (the ones not in their directory). I also had plans doing my own channel someday, but never got around to it.
All my TV is time shifted to when I can watch it. If I can't stream it, then it doesn't exist. There's plenty of content out there that I get the highest quality shows without commercials for fairly cheap, mostly because I am willing to wait. I end up getting to spend less time consuming, and get to consume more. I also pay a lot less.
I read somewhere that most people put more toward their cable bill than they do toward retirement. I decided not to be one of these people. I think I have a higher quality viewing experience, and it's not costing me tons. I also get to do things like, watch all five seasons of Breaking Bad all at once, or all three seasons of LOST. Sure, sometimes there's a show I don't get to see, or I have to buy it outright if I am impatient, but if you spin services up and down as needed, it's actual cost effective and I wouldn't do it any other way at this point.
When I travel, I literally will not travel without an Apple TV and an Airport Express in my bag.
posted by cjorgensen at 11:42 AM on February 1, 2017
I don't surf on them.
The Apple TV is for Netflix, anything I buy or rent on iTunes, HBO Go, app streaming (app streaming is how I watch Lucifer, Rosewood, Blacklist, and Blindspot), and the NHL app. The Chromecast is for casting CBS shows (they don't let you use the Apple TV app without paying, but you can stream same content for free from an iOS device). The Amazon Fire TV is for Amazon Prime shows and streaming music. The Roku is a backup to the Apple TV in case the NHL app isn't working on there (has happened twice?). I also sometimes like digging through the "blackmarket" channels (the ones not in their directory). I also had plans doing my own channel someday, but never got around to it.
All my TV is time shifted to when I can watch it. If I can't stream it, then it doesn't exist. There's plenty of content out there that I get the highest quality shows without commercials for fairly cheap, mostly because I am willing to wait. I end up getting to spend less time consuming, and get to consume more. I also pay a lot less.
I read somewhere that most people put more toward their cable bill than they do toward retirement. I decided not to be one of these people. I think I have a higher quality viewing experience, and it's not costing me tons. I also get to do things like, watch all five seasons of Breaking Bad all at once, or all three seasons of LOST. Sure, sometimes there's a show I don't get to see, or I have to buy it outright if I am impatient, but if you spin services up and down as needed, it's actual cost effective and I wouldn't do it any other way at this point.
When I travel, I literally will not travel without an Apple TV and an Airport Express in my bag.
posted by cjorgensen at 11:42 AM on February 1, 2017
I think you're still fine if you never activate any of the "smart" functionality or connect it to the internet. At least the Samsung I bought last year is fine playing dumb.
posted by ckape at 11:43 AM on February 1, 2017
posted by ckape at 11:43 AM on February 1, 2017
It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping.
Why not both?
posted by zippy at 11:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
Why not both?
posted by zippy at 11:59 AM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
but the speakers seriously suck
Any speakers packed into a flat screen will suck.
So - the father-in-law- came for a visit this Christmas - he is so deaf that his only possible volume to listen to the TV is approximately a minimum level of "70+". Normally, the family hovers between "20-23"...
We have a soundbar - but that does nothing for dialogue IMO, typically we only use it when music-heavy shows are playing (*cough* "TheVoice" *cough* *cough*), or for music.
This situation lasted for all of about 2-hours, before the inevitable trip to the store to prevent the entire family from going deaf or doing something even more drastic...
Got a pair of rechargeable wireless headphones, and hooked that up to the audio out from the TV. The worst part was having to get an optical signal splitter (to continue to support the aforementioned soundbar) and a RCA convertor.
If you live with someone hard-of-hearing, a setup like this will improve everyone's quality of life dramatically...
Um... turns out, now that he is gone home, apparently they are nice for me... (he already had a similar setup at home, or I would have sent them along)
...Seems he is not the only one with a hearing problem... (I no longer have to ask "what did that person say", or pump the volume to 28 (which is apparently way too loud)... and hey, now I can watch late at night without waking everyone up...)
posted by jkaczor at 12:19 PM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
Any speakers packed into a flat screen will suck.
So - the father-in-law- came for a visit this Christmas - he is so deaf that his only possible volume to listen to the TV is approximately a minimum level of "70+". Normally, the family hovers between "20-23"...
We have a soundbar - but that does nothing for dialogue IMO, typically we only use it when music-heavy shows are playing (*cough* "TheVoice" *cough* *cough*), or for music.
This situation lasted for all of about 2-hours, before the inevitable trip to the store to prevent the entire family from going deaf or doing something even more drastic...
Got a pair of rechargeable wireless headphones, and hooked that up to the audio out from the TV. The worst part was having to get an optical signal splitter (to continue to support the aforementioned soundbar) and a RCA convertor.
If you live with someone hard-of-hearing, a setup like this will improve everyone's quality of life dramatically...
Um... turns out, now that he is gone home, apparently they are nice for me... (he already had a similar setup at home, or I would have sent them along)
...Seems he is not the only one with a hearing problem... (I no longer have to ask "what did that person say", or pump the volume to 28 (which is apparently way too loud)... and hey, now I can watch late at night without waking everyone up...)
posted by jkaczor at 12:19 PM on February 1, 2017 [4 favorites]
Closed captioning has become my friend as I wade deeper into my 30s.
posted by gyc at 12:28 PM on February 1, 2017 [7 favorites]
posted by gyc at 12:28 PM on February 1, 2017 [7 favorites]
Seriously, CC is the best. Even if only for the way it lets you avoid the LOUD ACTION SCENE - quiet talking scene thing by setting the volume to a comfortable medium and relying on the captions.
posted by tobascodagama at 1:13 PM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 1:13 PM on February 1, 2017 [3 favorites]
I work with televisions and peripherals.
My work desk is surrounded by screens, chromecasts, apple tvs, amazon fires, game consoles, media players, set top boxes. Curved, flat, ultra thin, 3d, 4k, from 18" to >70", advertised contrast ratios that require scientific notation to fit on the box.
There is a locked room, larger than many houses i've lived in, with a specimen of every line of TVs that sold more than a few tens of thousands of units in the US between 2012 to 2016.
Inside that room is a double locked room with dev kits and production prototypes of TVs, game consoles and media players that will not make it to market for another year.
I have tested all the devices, I have debugged the firmware and fought the APIs. I've even seen the source code on occasion.
I have strong opinions, and I would love to write some honest reviews and give advice, but I also have signed multiple NDAs.
I can only talk about things that have already been in the media:
Some of the worlds stupidest security failures where anyone within range can get your home wifi password from the TV along with your complete viewing habits, and get control of the device (from the same company that makes remotely operated and fully autonomous machine gun sentry turrets).
Or the very explicit planned obsolescence, with firmware updates that will degrade the performance of your device after 18 or 24 months. (Can be fixed by visiting the right forums and doing a USB firmware update).
Or the perceptual tricks used when demoing a TV. (Shiny screens make the contrast and color look better at a properly set up store display, same with sound post-processing tricks, but will suck in a room used by real humans).
The only advice I can give is:
Buy the dumbest TV you can find where you like the size, resolution and picture quality.
Plug the Ethernet port with hot glue and NEVER give it your WiFi password.
Buy a chromecast / roku / appleTV and use that.
posted by Dr. Curare at 1:22 PM on February 1, 2017 [36 favorites]
My work desk is surrounded by screens, chromecasts, apple tvs, amazon fires, game consoles, media players, set top boxes. Curved, flat, ultra thin, 3d, 4k, from 18" to >70", advertised contrast ratios that require scientific notation to fit on the box.
There is a locked room, larger than many houses i've lived in, with a specimen of every line of TVs that sold more than a few tens of thousands of units in the US between 2012 to 2016.
Inside that room is a double locked room with dev kits and production prototypes of TVs, game consoles and media players that will not make it to market for another year.
I have tested all the devices, I have debugged the firmware and fought the APIs. I've even seen the source code on occasion.
I have strong opinions, and I would love to write some honest reviews and give advice, but I also have signed multiple NDAs.
I can only talk about things that have already been in the media:
Some of the worlds stupidest security failures where anyone within range can get your home wifi password from the TV along with your complete viewing habits, and get control of the device (from the same company that makes remotely operated and fully autonomous machine gun sentry turrets).
Or the very explicit planned obsolescence, with firmware updates that will degrade the performance of your device after 18 or 24 months. (Can be fixed by visiting the right forums and doing a USB firmware update).
Or the perceptual tricks used when demoing a TV. (Shiny screens make the contrast and color look better at a properly set up store display, same with sound post-processing tricks, but will suck in a room used by real humans).
The only advice I can give is:
Buy the dumbest TV you can find where you like the size, resolution and picture quality.
Plug the Ethernet port with hot glue and NEVER give it your WiFi password.
Buy a chromecast / roku / appleTV and use that.
posted by Dr. Curare at 1:22 PM on February 1, 2017 [36 favorites]
ZeusHumms: "I still have the tube TV I got back at the turn of the century. Used to think that I really should upgrade to the latest and greatest. A bit more hesitant now."
If you can justify it, widescreen 1080i CRT TVs look great and cheap as heck. I got one for $40 off of eBay and picked up locally.
posted by wcfields at 1:44 PM on February 1, 2017
If you can justify it, widescreen 1080i CRT TVs look great and cheap as heck. I got one for $40 off of eBay and picked up locally.
posted by wcfields at 1:44 PM on February 1, 2017
Got a four-year old Panasonic plasma smart TV and it works like a charm. Blacks are really black. I hope it works for at least another four.
But damn, rural cable provider means we have no CC unless we're streaming Netflix or Amazon. My wife has a terrible time with accents and she's always missing things. And then rewinds on the DVR. And then rewinds again. And then again. Kill.Me.Now.
posted by Ber at 2:52 PM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
But damn, rural cable provider means we have no CC unless we're streaming Netflix or Amazon. My wife has a terrible time with accents and she's always missing things. And then rewinds on the DVR. And then rewinds again. And then again. Kill.Me.Now.
posted by Ber at 2:52 PM on February 1, 2017 [2 favorites]
"I had to physically unplug my TV the other day because the Netflix app crashed (started with a black screen, nothing else) and I couldn't figure out any other way to "reboot" it or quit the misbehaving app. Progress!"
I have trained my children to do this for me.
Just like my parents trained me to change the channels for them, before remotes.
TRADITION!
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:25 PM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
I have trained my children to do this for me.
Just like my parents trained me to change the channels for them, before remotes.
TRADITION!
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:25 PM on February 1, 2017 [10 favorites]
TBH, I'm mostly waiting for the return of televisual furniture that sits down on the floor. The thin screens were neat at first, but the novelty has completely worn off.
We bought a new TV because my kid accidentally caught something on a cable, knocked our old flatscreen off the the table and it shattered. Wouldn't have happened with a console!
posted by emjaybee at 7:12 AM on February 2, 2017
We bought a new TV because my kid accidentally caught something on a cable, knocked our old flatscreen off the the table and it shattered. Wouldn't have happened with a console!
posted by emjaybee at 7:12 AM on February 2, 2017
Or the very explicit planned obsolescence, with firmware updates that will degrade the performance of your device after 18 or 24 months.
For real? The manufacturer purposely degrades product performance after a couple of years?
posted by pracowity at 9:54 AM on February 2, 2017
For real? The manufacturer purposely degrades product performance after a couple of years?
posted by pracowity at 9:54 AM on February 2, 2017
Does anybody remember the very early remote controls that caused a solenoid to physically turn the channel knob one click forward or back?
posted by lagomorphius at 10:20 AM on February 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
posted by lagomorphius at 10:20 AM on February 2, 2017 [2 favorites]
Got a four-year old Panasonic plasma smart TV and it works like a charm.
It is a real shame that panasonic couldn't stay in the tv market. Their plasmas are still the best tv you could have bought in the mid price points. And they're sufficiently stupid smart tv's that I don't feel at all guilty ignoring their remote and slaving the tv to the sound system. I don't know what we will do when the plasmas reach their ends of life.
posted by bonehead at 11:16 AM on February 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
It is a real shame that panasonic couldn't stay in the tv market. Their plasmas are still the best tv you could have bought in the mid price points. And they're sufficiently stupid smart tv's that I don't feel at all guilty ignoring their remote and slaving the tv to the sound system. I don't know what we will do when the plasmas reach their ends of life.
posted by bonehead at 11:16 AM on February 2, 2017 [1 favorite]
For real? The manufacturer purposely degrades product performance after a couple of years?
I'm sure if you tried to put a class-action together and subpoenaed company emails, you'd never find a smoking gun that uses the terms "planned obsolescence" or "performance degradation". But, you know, over time you have to start pulling out code that you licensed from some third party, maybe you replace it with something else or maybe you don't. And it's not the latest and greatest product anymore, so you start pulling people off maintenance and onto other projects until there's maybe just one guy who even knows the code base and he's splitting his time between support for three or four other products...
posted by tobascodagama at 11:27 AM on February 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'm sure if you tried to put a class-action together and subpoenaed company emails, you'd never find a smoking gun that uses the terms "planned obsolescence" or "performance degradation". But, you know, over time you have to start pulling out code that you licensed from some third party, maybe you replace it with something else or maybe you don't. And it's not the latest and greatest product anymore, so you start pulling people off maintenance and onto other projects until there's maybe just one guy who even knows the code base and he's splitting his time between support for three or four other products...
posted by tobascodagama at 11:27 AM on February 2, 2017 [3 favorites]
I'd just be happy if people would actually learn that aspect ratio matters and not expect me to watch movies at the wrong ratio, so that circles are ovals and faces are either overskinny or all goofywide, and to act like I'm the crazy one for pointing out that the Death Star was not fucking egg-shaped.
posted by sonascope at 1:30 PM on February 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
posted by sonascope at 1:30 PM on February 3, 2017 [6 favorites]
It's like having a single room for sex or gift-wrapping. So odd.
No need to be judgmental -- if a couple's tastes happen to include colorful print paper, scotch tape, ribbons, and bows, as well as handcuffs, fur, lace, and rubber appliances, it makes good sense to combine these items in one convenient location. And what consenting adults do in the privacy of their room with these items is none of our business.
posted by BlueHorse at 9:36 PM on February 3, 2017
No need to be judgmental -- if a couple's tastes happen to include colorful print paper, scotch tape, ribbons, and bows, as well as handcuffs, fur, lace, and rubber appliances, it makes good sense to combine these items in one convenient location. And what consenting adults do in the privacy of their room with these items is none of our business.
posted by BlueHorse at 9:36 PM on February 3, 2017
Does anybody remember the very early remote controls that caused a solenoid to physically turn the channel knob one click forward or back?
My family still calls the remote control "the clicker", and it never occurred to me how odd this was until a younger relative questioned it.
I miss some of the unintentional UI elements that came out of the design of older analog devices. You knew that the remote and TV were both working because of the telltale "click" when you tried to change the channel (and going from VHF to UHF was more of a "clunk"). You could tell that an older computer was swapping hard, and not just CPU hung, because you'd hear the hard disk activity. On an old answering machine you'd know if someone left you a crazy spoken-wall-of-text message based on how long the tape took to rewind, vs. the number of messages. None of these were intentional UI elements but they were useful, in that they communicated something about the internal state of the machine to the user.
Lots of modern devices have eliminated this unintentional state leakage but haven't replaced it with an intentional UI element or feature. As a result, the device becomes more and more mysterious. If I press a button on my TV's remote and nothing happens, there's no immediate way of knowing if it's the remote, the TV (which now can freeze! glorious), or the video source equipment. Or the user.
posted by Kadin2048 at 9:08 AM on February 6, 2017 [2 favorites]
My family still calls the remote control "the clicker", and it never occurred to me how odd this was until a younger relative questioned it.
I miss some of the unintentional UI elements that came out of the design of older analog devices. You knew that the remote and TV were both working because of the telltale "click" when you tried to change the channel (and going from VHF to UHF was more of a "clunk"). You could tell that an older computer was swapping hard, and not just CPU hung, because you'd hear the hard disk activity. On an old answering machine you'd know if someone left you a crazy spoken-wall-of-text message based on how long the tape took to rewind, vs. the number of messages. None of these were intentional UI elements but they were useful, in that they communicated something about the internal state of the machine to the user.
Lots of modern devices have eliminated this unintentional state leakage but haven't replaced it with an intentional UI element or feature. As a result, the device becomes more and more mysterious. If I press a button on my TV's remote and nothing happens, there's no immediate way of knowing if it's the remote, the TV (which now can freeze! glorious), or the video source equipment. Or the user.
posted by Kadin2048 at 9:08 AM on February 6, 2017 [2 favorites]
The only advice I can give is:I'm not in the industry, but I am the go-to nerd for lots of people.
Buy the dumbest TV you can find where you like the size, resolution and picture quality.
Plug the Ethernet port with hot glue and NEVER give it your WiFi password.
Buy a chromecast / roku / appleTV and use that.
This is exactly the same advice I give people when they ask me.
posted by uberchet at 2:58 PM on February 6, 2017
VIZIO to Pay $2.2 Million to FTC, State of New Jersey to Settle Charges It Collected Viewing Histories on 11 Million Smart Televisions without Users’ Consent
posted by cjorgensen at 4:12 PM on February 8, 2017
posted by cjorgensen at 4:12 PM on February 8, 2017
So as long as complete viewing histories could be sold for more than 20 cents, it's still entirely profitable?
posted by tavella at 4:18 PM on February 8, 2017
posted by tavella at 4:18 PM on February 8, 2017
For real? The manufacturer purposely degrades product performance after a couple of years?
On second thought, 'purposely' is too strong a word.
I'm sure if you tried to put a class-action together and subpoenaed company emails, you'd never find a smoking gun that uses the terms "planned obsolescence" or "performance degradation".
tobascodegama has the right idea, although I have not seen any of the specific examples they mention.
One example I have seen is a 2013 model with limited memory and a very lightweight firmware. It worked great. The 2014 model comes out with twice the memory and firmware with afew more features, it runs even better. 2015 model comes out, with 4 times the RAM, it runs like a dream with full featured firmware.
Critical security update is applied to 2015 firmware, 2013 and 2014 firmware does not get security update, instead 2013 and 2014 TVs upgrade to the 2015 firmware. Suddenly 2013 and 2014 TVs are secure but unusable.
posted by Dr. Curare at 3:31 PM on February 17, 2017 [1 favorite]
On second thought, 'purposely' is too strong a word.
I'm sure if you tried to put a class-action together and subpoenaed company emails, you'd never find a smoking gun that uses the terms "planned obsolescence" or "performance degradation".
tobascodegama has the right idea, although I have not seen any of the specific examples they mention.
One example I have seen is a 2013 model with limited memory and a very lightweight firmware. It worked great. The 2014 model comes out with twice the memory and firmware with afew more features, it runs even better. 2015 model comes out, with 4 times the RAM, it runs like a dream with full featured firmware.
Critical security update is applied to 2015 firmware, 2013 and 2014 firmware does not get security update, instead 2013 and 2014 TVs upgrade to the 2015 firmware. Suddenly 2013 and 2014 TVs are secure but unusable.
posted by Dr. Curare at 3:31 PM on February 17, 2017 [1 favorite]
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Really, as the article says... "Do they design these thing in caves?".
posted by jkaczor at 5:58 AM on February 1, 2017 [5 favorites]