Let's talk about the new Queer Eye
February 26, 2018 11:22 AM   Subscribe

There is a reboot of Queer Eye available on Netflix. The internet has opinions.

Only Queer Eye could make deconstructing toxic masculinity so much fun

The Beauty and Vulnerability of Netflix’s Queer Eye

Why I Couldn’t Stop Watching the New Queer Eye

Queer Eye Returns, Aiming for Acceptance, Not Just Tolerance

None of these were quite the take I was looking for when searching for links, so please add your own.

In one episode, one of the Fab 5 reflects [paraphrased] "I think we showed him what his life could be like if he just cared about it." which resonated with me as kind of the thesis of the show for many of their subjects. What do you think?
posted by Emmy Rae (94 comments total) 12 users marked this as a favorite
 
I haven't seen it yet but on one of the podcasts I listen to, I heard about episode 3 (no spoilers). What a terrifyingly horrible idea to put a black man through as a jest.
posted by Kitteh at 11:26 AM on February 26, 2018 [11 favorites]


There is a New Yorker article which referred to Antoni as "the breakout star of the new group" and therefore I declined to link to it. They also started the article by talking about "half-watching" the show. Ok? Maybe all watch it before writing and publishing an article? Hmph.
posted by Emmy Rae at 11:27 AM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]






It's a real fucking mix. It's overall positive but things like that cop episode and the weird firefighter one are a bit NYTimes Empathy Op-Ed. And some peoples attitudes at the end seem to have gone from "I am broadly homophobic" to "I am broadly homophobic but I will make some approving noises about these guys who I have got a ton of free stuff from".
posted by Artw at 11:31 AM on February 26, 2018 [32 favorites]


The Case for Queer Eye’s Antoni Being A Deep Cover Assassin

this was written by the whelk! which makes me suspect it's really he who is a deep cover assassin within metafilter. :O
posted by Emily's Fist at 11:40 AM on February 26, 2018 [28 favorites]


@TomCBallard:
There should be a sixth #QueerEye guy who comes in at the end of every episode and says "You're unhappy because of capitalism and moisturiser isn't going to fix that. Gurl."

Obviously I notified The Whelk of this but of course they were already aware.
posted by Artw at 11:45 AM on February 26, 2018 [55 favorites]


Antoni reminds me of me in that when I am in a group of gay people I feel slightly bewildered and out of place but they tolerate me for my assorted charms and I'm supposed to have gay friends so here I am wearing a bathing suit that's revealing more than I'd like it to be.
posted by BuddhaInABucket at 11:50 AM on February 26, 2018 [9 favorites]


Wait, I thought we were all deep cover assassins.
posted by ckape at 11:50 AM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


I think it's probably an overall force for good, but anymore this type of early aughts-style, slickly-produced, fast-and-loud reality show gives me the heebie-jeebies. Maybe it's that I've recently been spoiled by gentler, more humane fare like The Great British Bake-Off and Somebody Feed Phil, or maybe it's that this particular production style reminds me too much of The fucking Apprentice and the current national shit-show it begat (an unfair comparison, I know.) Whatever it is, while I wish the show well, I can't personally abide it.
posted by Atom Eyes at 11:50 AM on February 26, 2018 [11 favorites]


The wife and I loved the original show, and were VERY excited about this new version.
Having said that, this one is a bit too formulaic.
You can tell when the Learning Moment is heading your way because here comes the music and low talking, you know that they're going to Thank The Fab Five At The End, and you know that Hearts And Minds Will Come Away Changed.
I want Carson, Ted, Kyan, Jai and Thom back. It would be very interesting to see how they move in this world these days.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 11:54 AM on February 26, 2018 [10 favorites]


There should be a sixth #QueerEye guy who comes in at the end of every episode and says "You're unhappy because of capitalism and moisturiser isn't going to fix that. Gurl."

There should be a seventh who says "You're unhappy because it is the nature of mortals to be unhappy and no amount of moisturizer or revolution is going to fix that. Also I am Death."
posted by octobersurprise at 12:03 PM on February 26, 2018 [114 favorites]


I think that Queer Eye was a measurable benefit to society during its original airing, humanizing and valorizing the talents and expertise of gay men at a time when LGBT media portrayals were systemically negative (or worse, absent).

It was a real benefit at the time ...but that time has passed. Now it seems as dated as Friends' gay panic episodes and the mincing melodrama of Jack on Will and Grace.
posted by leotrotsky at 12:04 PM on February 26, 2018 [20 favorites]


Wait, I thought we were all deep cover assassins.

*slams palms on table* this is the man who was Thursday debacle all over again!
posted by The Whelk at 12:06 PM on February 26, 2018 [34 favorites]


I couldn't get past the middle of the cop episode. The setup recreating the harrowing experience of police harassment, and the feigned open-mindedness. I don't want to see cops get nice things until I see them fully dismantling the militarized police system. I don't want to see toxic men have a moment of acceptance then return to their corrupt job. Who cares if every now and then, on a whim, if the wind is in the right direction, you happen to be kind.
posted by complaina at 12:06 PM on February 26, 2018 [22 favorites]


I can appreciate the critiques, but I unabashedly love the new Queer Eye. It's so refreshing and healing to watch men get to have open conversations about their emotions, and learn about self-care. I don't even care that it's somewhat manufactured. It's a reality show, of course it is! But some of the connections do actually seem genuine, and it's lovely to watch.

Also, I'm so impressed by the Fan Five's skill in getting the guys to open up. I feel like their nominal areas of expertise are grooming, culture, cooking, etc, but their real skills are stealth therapy skills.

Also watching a show about loving yourself and taking care of yourself is so much better for my mental health than watching procedural shows about murder or the CIA or whatever else. Verdict: this reboot is awesome and I can't wait for more episodes!
posted by aka burlap at 12:07 PM on February 26, 2018 [31 favorites]


Mainly I just can’t get over the bit where the cop pulls them over, because that has to be something staged that the production team thought was a good idea.
posted by Artw at 12:09 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


I was freaked out by the cop episode, but also quite amazed by the ability of Brown to approach it with such openness and dignity...
And I thought his comments were almost radical to have on mainstream entertainment tv. I've not watched much reality tv so maybe I'm wrong, but to see black lives matter come up, and his story about his son? I was very moved by that.

And when they are pulled over, and it's revealed as a "joke", one of the other cast says from the back of the car "you don't do that to a brown person"...

So I'm left touched by Brown's words and approach, and also asking how the hell did that happen? The show was in on this, surely, with film crew at the ready, so ... did they set Brown up?
posted by chapps at 12:09 PM on February 26, 2018 [10 favorites]


Yeah I have many complex opinions about the cop episode. But agreed that the grace and openness Karamo showed was touching and impressive (although he shouldn't have to be so full of grace about it) and it's sadly kind of radical that they even had the conversation they did, as imperfect and disappointingly "we all just need to understand each other"
as it was.
posted by aka burlap at 12:13 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


I want Carson, Ted, Kyan, Jai and Thom back. It would be very interesting to see how they move in this world these days.

There's a bonus episode where the Fab Five (minus Ted) meet with the new cast. It was really short and, overall, disappointing. There'd be so much for them all to talk about in a well-facilitated interview, but it wasn't one.
posted by Miko at 12:20 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


The show was in on this, surely, with film crew at the ready, so ... did they set Brown up?

They absolutely were in on it, and I'm sure the producers were trying to provoke a reaction to trigger the "discussion" later on in the episode.

The cop episode gets deserved criticism. The AJ episode is the apex of feel-good reality TV, it will be studied in media classes.
posted by Think_Long at 12:23 PM on February 26, 2018 [4 favorites]


The AJ episode is the apex of feel-good reality TV, it will be studied in media classes.

I loved this episode so much.
posted by thivaia at 12:30 PM on February 26, 2018 [7 favorites]


I was watching the first episode of the reboot, and my widowed father sat down to watch with me briefly, and the guys were telling the subject of their makeover that he was a valuable person and that all of us spend our lives just wanting to be loved. And my father burst into tears.

And then in the second episode, they told the subject of their makeover that building up walls to protect himself from getting hurt just ends up keeping him separated from real human connections, and my dad looked at me and said “remind you of anybody?” referring to himself.

I dunno, I have mixed feelings for sure, but I feel like they made a real effort in this version to make it much more empathetic and more about being a whole and loving human person rather than finding a hot lady and getting laid. The fact that “culture” this time around is more about “here is how to relate to human people who are not like you” and “here is why toxic masculinity is hurting you” and “here is how to feel your feelings and why it is good even though it is scary” seems really vital to me. The grooming is less about “looking good” and more about self-care, the cooking is more about “try to eat less poison”, even the home decor decisions have been more rooted in “this will help you with your medical condition” or “here’s how to repurpose old materials” than just making the place look cooler.

It was a real benefit at the time ...but that time has passed. Now it seems as dated as Friends' gay panic episodes and the mincing melodrama of Jack on Will and Grace.

Have you seen the new version? It is markedly different from the original, and in the first episode they explicitly say that the aims of the new show are different (that the first was more about tolerance, and this one is about acceptance, for example).

I think you can argue that they haven’t made enough of a departure, but it isn’t the same old formula, from what I’ve seen. I was really heartened by the updates they've incorporated. (Full disclosure, I haven't seen the cop episode yet, so maybe I'll regret all of this in a few days.)
posted by a fiendish thingy at 12:40 PM on February 26, 2018 [32 favorites]


The AJ episode is the apex of feel-good reality TV, it will be studied in media classes.

I loved this episode so much.


Me three.
posted by Major Matt Mason Dixon at 12:41 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


Re: the episode with the cop pulling them over. It appears to have been planned, but nobody in the car knew it was going to happen except for Bobby. From this Buzzfeed overview:

"We had no idea," Karamo Brown told BuzzFeed of the scene. "When we have the driving scene in the morning, we all fight over who’s going to drive. That morning, I was adamant that I wanted to drive. I’m glad that that happened, because then it allowed a conversation to happen that probably wouldn’t have happened if I hadn’t been in the driver’s seat."

Only Bobby Berk, the design expert, knew what was going to happen right before they drove off. "I’m kind of momma in the group," Berk said, "so right as we went to pull away, production whispered in my ear. Just in case, I could be like, 'Guys, OK, this isn’t real, chill out.' But [the rest] of them had no idea, they thought it was totally real."

posted by redsparkler at 12:45 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


New Queer Eye on FanFare
posted by mbrubeck at 12:48 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


I plan to watch this one. My recollection of the original (which I enjoyed very much) was that it lost its lustre when it became popular and as a result they were able to get lots of sponsored gifts and materials, and didn't have to improvise as much.
posted by idb at 12:57 PM on February 26, 2018


Re: the episode with the cop pulling them over. It appears to have been planned, but nobody in the car knew it was going to happen except for Bobby.

Bobby is a cop.
posted by Artw at 12:57 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


There should be a seventh who says "You're unhappy because it is the nature of mortals to be unhappy and no amount of moisturizer or revolution is going to fix that. Also I am Death."

would watch Apocalypse Eye for the Mortal Guy or Sauron's Eye for Mortal Man Doomed to Die or All-Seeing Eye for the Conspiracy Guy or A.I. for the Made of Meat Guy or Precog Eye for the Hasn't Done Anything Yet Guy
posted by lefty lucky cat at 12:58 PM on February 26, 2018 [16 favorites]


The seventh guy is with us always.
posted by Artw at 12:59 PM on February 26, 2018 [4 favorites]


I think only the last link of the OP mentions the Jonathan Van Ness recap show Gay of Thrones.
posted by larrybob at 1:08 PM on February 26, 2018 [4 favorites]


I only remember two things from the original series:

1. They were always telling the guy getting a "makeover" to shave with the beard grain, not against (and they were always dismayed when the guy didn't follow that advice). But in my personal experience, unless I do an against-the-grain pass after the with-the-grain pass, I remain stubbly. I still don't know whether that bit was just added for extra tension or was real...or whether I have some strange sort of beard hair that requires an extra pass.

2. My girlfriend at the time coveted a particular shower curtain that we saw on one show, and managed to track it down and buy it. I have to admit it looked pretty cool and went perfectly with the tile color in our bathroom. Unfortunately, when we split up she got custody of the shower curtain.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:12 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


Wait, I thought we were all deep cover assassins.

Well, not anymore.
posted by Greg_Ace at 1:13 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


The seventh guy is with us always.

As the Queer Three-Lobed Burning Eye?
posted by GenjiandProust at 1:22 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


Re: the episode with the cop pulling them over. It appears to have been planned, but nobody in the car knew it was going to happen except for Bobby.

Wow. That's some serious exploitative treatment of their staff, and unforgivable in the treatment of the black member of their team.

Surely this could be considered racial harassment??
posted by chapps at 1:24 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


I mean I know it's harassment, but could there be a claim made under employment law?
posted by chapps at 1:25 PM on February 26, 2018


I love this show and ugly-cried through most of the episodes I've seen so far.

My biggest 'omg' moments were of course, them getting pulled over by the cop as a prank (WHAT) followed by the orchestrated 'discussion' and how I felt for Kamaro just the whole way through. What he is forced to do to be a part of that team. And the one where the dad of six worked two jobs on 90 minutes of sleep per night. I was just appalled at his circumstances and thinking that... well I'm glad he's getting this nice makeover and house redo bc he's going to be dead inside a year. And the look that passes over his face when they tell him he has to look nice to keep his wife, I just, oh no :(

I will never recover from watching the AJ episode.
posted by everydayanewday at 1:29 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


The Case for Queer Eye’s Antoni Being A Deep Cover Assassin

But why male models?
posted by bonehead at 1:31 PM on February 26, 2018 [20 favorites]


Only Bobby Berk, the design expert, knew what was going to happen right before they drove off. "I’m kind of momma in the group," Berk said, "so right as we went to pull away, production whispered in my ear. Just in case, I could be like, 'Guys, OK, this isn’t real, chill out.' But [the rest] of them had no idea, they thought it was totally real."

And that makes it worse. Ugh.
posted by Kitteh at 1:33 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


I adore Jonathan Van Ness and will watch anything he is in. That being said, I do find myself fast-forwarding some every episode... but overall I am ok with it so far (5 eps in).
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 1:36 PM on February 26, 2018


I think there is something important in this show. In part, it demonstrates an unavoidable element of privilege -- that men, especially straight white men, can let themselves just slide into an unhappy day-to-day sameness, a thoughtlessness about their lives, and get away with it forever.

But this is also often the symptom of a profound unhappiness, or deep-rooted insecurities, or some sort of crisis, and the men themselves don't feel especially good about it but are also terrified to address it. So I suppose the show is a dramatization of the fact that privilege can hurt even the privileged.

And not everybody this past season was equally privileged. There were men who were people of color, one of them gay, and all had stalled in some way, and that stalling showed itself in so much of their lives.

Really, all the Fab Five did was to give their motor a little kick, and most of the men, the ones who needed the most help, just fell apart with the realization of where they were, how much they hurt, how much they wanted help and how meaningful it was to get it. The AJ episode is truly a standout, but there were genuine, heartfelt moment in all of them.

I don't want every show to be about swooping in to help people with more or less privilege when there are people who are not unhappy dudes who likewise need help and have not ever gotten their own emergency squad to rush out and give them free stuff, but occasionally it is nice to see a show that demonstrates how toxic toxic masculinity is for everyone.
posted by maxsparber at 1:39 PM on February 26, 2018 [19 favorites]


> ckape:
"Wait, I thought we were all deep cover assassins."

Christ what an assassin
posted by chavenet at 1:40 PM on February 26, 2018 [7 favorites]


So we are doing hot takes? I have some!

Christian-dad-of-6 is the worst episode, unless someone can show me evidence that he and the church he attends are ACTUALLY supporting and accepting of gay people and not just 'love the sinner hate the sin' accepting, which I strongly suspect is the case.

I ugly-cried so hard right along with AJ and his stepmom. God. I'm crying now thinking about it.

Anyone remember Karamo from The Real World Philadelphia? I do! He was kind of a jerk then, but looking back on it I think he was probably edited to be the Angry Young Black Man and if so I feel dumb for falling for it.

Some people at work were talking about the show and one guy asked me 'so which of the queers is your favourite?' and I just goggled at him for a moment and then sputtered unintelligibly for a bit and then came out with something like 'it's the name of the show but.... just... don't call them queers? Unless I suppose every single one of them goes on record of saying that its OK but probably not even then? Anyway I love Jonathan and I'm going to go over here now byee.'

And yes Jonathan is 100% the best one, and it's my new quick measuring tool to see who the best people are. If Jonathan is your favourite you're one of the best people. Also he and Antoni and Tan Pants (which is my incredibly clever nickname for Tan France) have adorable banter with each other on social media, not that I'm obsessed or anything.
posted by cilantro at 1:40 PM on February 26, 2018 [13 favorites]


I love how Jonathan can charm anyone, even people you wouldn't expect to feel comfortable around him. I especially love when he walks into the hair salon with each guy and it seems like he's been working there for 8 years and is besties with everyone.
posted by Emmy Rae at 1:45 PM on February 26, 2018 [8 favorites]


There is something about Antoni's facial movements, mouth movements, or stare that makes me think he's... acting? Or expecting something and waiting.
posted by FirstMateKate at 1:46 PM on February 26, 2018




I enjoyed The Pop Culture Happy Hour take on the reboot.
posted by Wretch729 at 1:49 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


Jonathan is the best if we're polling
posted by FirstMateKate at 1:57 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


I'm just on other side of 60 and I've been an out gay man for over 40 years. When I'm around gay men like the cast of Queer Eye, I feel like I've woken up in a foreign country, perhaps some European nation I somehow never learned about, and I'm clearly not with my tribe. It's always been like that and always will be.
posted by A. Davey at 1:58 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


I really like the new show. I have watched the first 3 episodes and used the second and third ones as a reward because I love them so much they are motivating. I know that because it is a reality show, most of it is bound to be scripted BS but it is still a zillion times better than so many other things. I think many humans need advice and reminders about loving ourselves, and it is a nice reminder for me when I watch the show.
posted by Bella Donna at 2:03 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


There is something about Antoni's facial movements, mouth movements, or stare that makes me think he's... acting? Or expecting something and waiting.

As we said, he’s awaiting commands from Control.
posted by The Whelk at 2:05 PM on February 26, 2018 [8 favorites]


As we said, he’s awaiting commands from Control.
posted by The Whelk at 5:05 PM on February 26 [1 favorite −] Favorite added! [!]


I just wanted to thank you personally for that medium article
posted by FirstMateKate at 2:20 PM on February 26, 2018


Christian-dad-of-6 is the worst episode, unless someone can show me evidence that he and the church he attends are ACTUALLY supporting and accepting of gay people and not just 'love the sinner hate the sin' accepting, which I strongly suspect is the case.

Yes, this exactly. My wife was watching and this was the first one that I sat down and watched, instead of just overhearing. I recognized so much of this guy's coded "Being gay isn't ok but I think you guys, individually, are alright" speech from growing up in the south. (The wife liked it because she didn't get that subtext.) I felt so bad for any child of his who might come out as LGBT in the future. He didn't go from homophobic to ally over the course of the episode; he seems to have gone from "all gay people are evil sinners" to "these five gay people are lovable sinners". IMO there's no way he wouldn't make the same face at "my husband" today as he did (fairly early IIRC) in the episode.

I think I called it "violently centrist" afterwards. I'm just glad I didn't see the cop episode.
posted by supercres at 2:21 PM on February 26, 2018 [11 favorites]


The internet has opinions.

And lately that’s about all it has.
posted by Celsius1414 at 2:24 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


My little kid loves it, especially because Kamaro has kids and the men talk about their husbands and families. That's something that's often missing on tv, just grown up adult queer lives, past the drama of falling in love and coming out, the ever after ordinary stuff. It's different to her that it's not a story but real-real somehow, and I get that. I got my son to watch an episode in hopes of inspiring his wardrobe and Netflix reports more episodes were watched after I went to bed....
posted by dorothyisunderwood at 2:35 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


The Pop Culture Happy Hour take on the reboot.

The best line in that podcast ep is "Tan's personality is basically 'brunch.'"
posted by dnash at 2:47 PM on February 26, 2018 [17 favorites]


Tan is best because he's from Doncaster.
posted by Artw at 3:06 PM on February 26, 2018 [4 favorites]


I'll be the contrarian and say Tan and Kamaro were my clear faves, with Jonathan somewhere in the middle of the pack. I think I would have a different opinion if I spaced out the episodes more, but in a binge his exuberance (while charming) became a bit grating. But also I don't even moisturize daily so what do I know?

Highlights: AJ, date at the car show
Lowlights: Cop scene/conversation, recommending "Japanese breadcrumbs" as an ingredient for a lazy bachelor

I thought the firefighter handled the experience in a really savvy way by focusing on the firehouse instead of having to delve into his personal life. Certainly not all his decision, but I respect whoever made that happen.
posted by matrixclown at 3:09 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


I binge-watched them all (really unusual for me; I don't much like TV). I agree that the cop episode was kind of squidgy -- I somewhat intentionally did the dishes while they were pulling them over so I could mostly ignore it. I'm largely unimpressed with the Christian guy, but I think it was worth it just to get the damn kids to help out. My God, that was depressing. To be honest, though, my least favorite was the comedian -- I don't know if he was just Bad At TV or really did have the personality of a small piece of paper, but I found his episode unforgivably boring. At least with the others I could feel an emotion.

It took me a little while, but Jonathan's charm worked, and I would now follow him to the ends of the earth.

I was lary when the remake was announced, but this feels overall good and new -- they're very aware that the world has changed, in a lot of ways. It's not the most progressive show ever, but I think in its own way, it's changing things -- not even 'hey, have you tried not hating gays', but more 'hey, toxic masculinity is fucking you over'. I think that came over strongest in the first episode. (I adored Tom. I can't help it.)
posted by kalimac at 3:12 PM on February 26, 2018 [5 favorites]


I mean I know it's harassment, but could there be a claim made under employment law?

As compared to reality tv in general?

I mean, half of all network programming is shock and exploitation wrapped in a shiny package these days.
posted by rokusan at 3:38 PM on February 26, 2018


My late husband and I used to watch the original. It was something he loved to download for us to watch together, along with Degrassi TNG and South Park.
I was wary of this new version when I saw it pop up on Netflix, but I was in love 10 minutes in!
But yeah, the cop episode... I cringed several times.
I just finished the AJ episode, and maybe I'll watch another one after getting some homework done while my Sweetie is in class tonight. :)
posted by luckynerd at 4:47 PM on February 26, 2018


Would second the general impression of the Christian guy.

Also i get what they are doing basing themselves in Georgia, but there is some gross shit going on there right now.
posted by Artw at 4:55 PM on February 26, 2018


I haven't seen it yet but on one of the podcasts I listen to, I heard about episode 3 (no spoilers). What a terrifyingly horrible idea to put a black man through as a jest.

Yeah, that was bad - and I think the fact that they didn't at all examine the fact that the cop thought it was OK made it worse. When Karamo said "I'm very aware of this kind of cop", totally closed down, totally straight-faced, it made the subsequent return to shouting and hugging feel artificial - and I think this series lives or dies on whether you can buy into its sense of sincerity.
posted by running order squabble fest at 4:58 PM on February 26, 2018 [4 favorites]


Jonathan is fine for me in small doses. I just don't quite get how the grooming guy has demonstrably the worst hair of the five of them. And this is coming from a guy who likes long hair on men - well, good long hair, on the right guy at least. Jonathan's looks really dry and kinda split ends or something and just doesn't suit his face well at all.
posted by dnash at 5:09 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


Oh, I think Jonathan's hair makes him look like happy, shiny, well-conditioned Jesus. Tan's hair is is some of kind structural marvel, but I love Jonathan's.

The big moment of AJ's show actually made me turn away. His emotion was so raw and felt so authentic that I felt like I was invading his privacy. Absurdly wonderful that the episode showing his swing and leather harness also features the most moving moment of the entire series.

To be honest, though, my least favorite was the comedian -- I don't know if he was just Bad At TV or really did have the personality of a small piece of paper, but I found his episode unforgivably boring.

The comedian's episode was forgettable except for the Five's reaction to him finally asking out a woman that he never told any of them about. Their mixture of scandalized pride at his stealth was so sweet.

Having this on Netflix without any commercials and without any of the manufactured BS that so many home improvement/makeover shows do kept me watching. It cuts the stupid repetition and none of that "what? we're over budget! the plumbing!" nonsense.
posted by gladly at 5:26 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


I like this show way more than I thought I would. I watched the first series, but I love how this one concentrates on the guys' inner lives--their fears, lack of confidence, closing themselves off--and self-care. Some things were just painful to watch, like Neal's terror of being touched, the comedian's inability to make eye contact, and AJ, of course, talking to his stepmom. I've cried at pretty much every episode.
posted by ceejaytee at 5:37 PM on February 26, 2018 [2 favorites]


The comedian episode has not a bit of Antoni talking to Joe about food, which is immediately suspicious. Also, Joe hand waves away his massive weight lossas having gone to the gym a lot, despite no apparent interest in fitness and zero muscle tone. And, in fact, neither the Fab Five's makeover of his home nor the makeover of his look does anything to acknowledge this supposed fixation on fitness.

Skipping ahead in my argument to the end: I had bariatric surgery last year and I bet you dollars to donuts Joe did, too. He looks like a bariatric surgery person.

This is unfair to speculate on and not my business. But I'm just saying.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:02 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


my least favorite was the comedian -- I don't know if he was just Bad At TV or really did have the personality of a small piece of paper, but I found his episode unforgivably boring

The reason I found that episode disappointing was that, unlike with most of the other subjects, they never actually dug into what his problems were. It was sort of like "he's shy and lacks confidence!" but it seemed obvious there was more going on. I thought he had some sort of unhealthy fixation on his brother - following in his footsteps as a comedian, when his brother really didn't seem to have a lot going on in his own life. I was a little concerned about the father's apparent emotional distance from the whole thing. all in all it seemed like a bad family situation that the bedroom makeover wasn't going to fix.

And the girl at the end - I felt like that was really set up. Of course the production team had that all in hand. It's tough to have a show that wants so badly to be taken sincerely and wants to show authenticity that still drinks soooo deeply of the reality show manipulation of reality. It's just dissonant.
posted by Miko at 6:50 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]




Apparently AJ sold his gorgeous condo about three seconds after the production team drove away and moved in with his boyfriend/fiance.

I am sad that there were only 8 episodes and hope they'll rush more into production. I love that they didn't limit themselves to straight men and I hope they'll broaden their subjects even more if there's another season. I thought the firefighter episode was the worst -- they seemed very distracted by the other "hot" firefighters while the ostensible subject of their attentions sort of faded into the woodwork.
posted by sevenyearlurk at 7:09 PM on February 26, 2018


I mostly got a bad vibe from the original series. Some of that has to do with the fact that it was airing shortly after my dad came out; I’ll own that the stuff I was going through to work out the new family dynamic colored my view of a lot of things at the time. But it also so reinforced so many stereotypes - maybe stereotype isn’t the word I mean, but it seemed to underscore the idea that “gay men are like this” and there’s only one way to be gay. Which I found pretty troubling at a time when someone I loved was trying to figure out how to be gay. There are definitely echoes of that in the small amount (1.5 episodes) of the reboot I’ve watched, but less.

I also always really hated the whole “go into someone’s house and make shitty judgy comments about their stuff and throw large amounts of it away even the things they actually care about” side of the show. There was a lot of “the way you’re living is wrong” instead of “we can help you with this aspect of life that’s creating problems for you”. Not always, but some of them - Carson especially - had a manner about them that I’ve always hated in real life. That attitude that “I know you asked me not to violate this important personal boundary but I’m going to do so anyway and call attention to the fact I’m doing it, all in the name of getting you out of your comfort zone.” There seems to be quite a bit less of that in the reboot, at least so far

Still can’t say I’m a fan.
posted by nickmark at 7:45 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


Can Queer Eye’s food expert Antoni actually cook?

From following him on Instagram, where he posts video clips in his "story," yes he can cook.
posted by dnash at 8:03 PM on February 26, 2018


Well, the guacamole was simple, but that’s something that Tom can do - not just remember how to make it, but remember to have the ingredients on hand and have the energy to carry through. (Although not in a molcajete, I expect.) That’s one thing I definitely appreciate about this version; they meet the guys where they are at.

I liked Christian Dad, but then I’m a Southerner and I’m used to panning for the good in people. The couple seemed sincere. Mostly I was horrified by the poor man’s insane work schedule. (I also felt for the teenage daughter, probably because of projection.)
posted by Countess Elena at 8:23 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


occasionally it is nice to see a show that demonstrates how toxic toxic masculinity is for everyone.

Sure, but the thing that this show fails to address--and my main problem with it (despite watching some of it!) is that it doesn't really emphasize, at all, that it is a glorification of marginalized people doing the work for the privileged, of offloading the emotional labor that is being an adult human onto other people. Having gay men act as "stealth therapists" without having that labor openly acknowledged in the show--and instead of glorifying the other kinds of labor they are doing--it's not excellent.

I have mixed feelings, but ultimately I think "Queer eye for queer guys" or something similar is something I'd prefer. Why should the privileged continue to profit off of the marginalized? I'm pretty over that, as far as it goes.
posted by sockermom at 8:31 PM on February 26, 2018 [6 favorites]


Also i get what they are doing basing themselves in Georgia, but there is some gross shit going on there right now.

There is some shitty legislative shit going on right now, but I'm not sure what you mean "I get what they are doing". Atlanta is a pretty gay city.
posted by bongo_x at 8:51 PM on February 26, 2018 [3 favorites]


I have mixed feelings, but ultimately I think "Queer eye for queer guys" or something similar is something I'd prefer.

Why not "Queer Eye for lonely unappreciated spinsters and other people."

We need new curtains and for someone to hug us and tell us we matter too.
posted by bunderful at 9:03 PM on February 26, 2018 [19 favorites]


Atlanta is a pretty gay city.

True story; I'm living in Decatur temporarily for an internship & one of the first things I saw once I got off the train was a flyer for an all-lesbian Dungeons & Dragons group. Then it just kept getting queerer from there...
posted by taquito sunrise at 9:26 PM on February 26, 2018 [8 favorites]


I'm on Team Antoni. He just seems like such a sweetheart. He's really good with the moms, too.
posted by eviemath at 9:46 PM on February 26, 2018 [1 favorite]


Husband and I just started watching this last night! We've only seen the first two and I teared up within the first 30 seconds of the first episode.

I was absolutely delighted in the first episode when they went mattress shopping and they were being SO SILLY with the pillow (no spoilers, you know what scene I'm talking about) and the subject Tom was giggling away and having so much fun with them.

So far I am most impressed with their ability to endear themselves to the subject of the show and also the ability of the producers to pull off the home makeovers in less than a week. Damn, can I get the number of their general contractors pls?

I guess I'll have to brace myself for the cop episode and dad to six everyone is alluding to. They can't all be winners I guess. And I'm ok with that, it's how the world works sometimes and it sounds like the guys always handle things with grace and class.
posted by like_neon at 2:56 AM on February 27, 2018


Why not "Queer Eye for lonely unappreciated spinsters and other people."

We need new curtains and for someone to hug us and tell us we matter too.


To be fair, I think the title in the opening credits only call the show "Queer Eye", I noted that it never said "for the straight guy" anywhere. So maybe this opens a window for Season Two to expand their remit.
posted by like_neon at 2:58 AM on February 27, 2018 [2 favorites]


I watched through the coming out episode last night because of this thread.

The cop episode seems to get lost in the #BlackLivesMatter discussion, but there is one other massively important revelation in it that I think bares fruit worth discussing: They advise the cop to dress up not just for him, but for his wife because it shows that he's putting time and effort into his relationship for his partner. I'm going to show this tread to my wife later tonight, because here's the thing: that message was read loud and clear. My wife is worthy of being shown how much I love her by taking better care of myself not only for myself, but to look good for her. I'm sorry I forgot that part about a relationship. I love you.
posted by Nanukthedog at 6:29 AM on February 27, 2018 [10 favorites]


Having said that, this one is a bit too formulaic.

I'm only four episodes in, but I'm finding this version slightly less formulaic than the original. Not that I think "formulaic" is inherently bad. Not everything has to be mind-blowing prestige TV. Sometimes I just want the TV equivalent of comfort food, and "formulaic" shows can be great for that.
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 6:57 AM on February 27, 2018


Queer Eye's Needlessly Woke Makeover
But now when I hear queer, I think about drag queens in Bushwick and Radical Faeries and the vast array of gender identities—not a bunch of composed dudes in neutral colors, button-downs, and conservatively fitted pants that are trying to get other dudes to wear the uniform. The show doesn’t really reckon with that, nor does it much bother to detail exactly what makes these guys authorities in their assigned fields—that extends the supposition that their gifted insight is the result of their magical gayness.
Do We Need Queer Eye in 2018?
“Dega Don’t” sticks in the mind, more than some of the better installments. Faced with a man depicted solidly pro-Trump on the show, the series doesn’t quite cross over from provocative to confrontational. It finds a problem it can’t solve with love and good vibes, and ignores it. But does the show really have a political responsibility? Is it fair to put that burden on what is effectively a makeover show, just because it features gay men? If that is unfair, then why does Queer Eye amp up its own mission by calling it a battle for acceptance?

All of these questions suggest a broader one: What is the purpose of Queer Eye in 2018?
posted by runt at 9:32 AM on February 27, 2018 [2 favorites]


The thing that really bothers me about this show is that it seems like the only permanent queer eye solutions to someone's problems requires a minimum of $10,000. Everything else is just a temporary fix, and the queer-eyed folks are going to fall back into their normal routines and habits that gave them filthy apartments and so on in the first place. I dunno. The AJ episode was more permanent because of the coming-out feelgoodness, but otherwise it seems like the Fab 5 come in, buy you a new wardrobe and rearrange your house then leave you alone so you can go back to being a dirty guy with piss all over your bathroom floor or whatever.
posted by dis_integration at 10:55 AM on February 27, 2018


Thanks to Runt’s Muse link I found out about Jonathan’s podcast Getting Curious.
posted by larrybob at 4:20 PM on February 27, 2018


Queer, I: Fifteen years on from the original, Netflix’s new Queer Eye series brings a more nuanced take on queerness and masculinity to a world more willing to embrace it – particularly those who were afraid to the first time around”.
posted by harriet vane at 6:38 AM on February 28, 2018


I loved the original Fab 5 and I love these new guys too. I do like that they seem to be spending a bit more time digging into the "why" of their projects and also including more of their families/friends in the whole life makeover (other than the fireman's family) with their talking privately to the people who nominated them in order to get to know the person better.

I guess I'm the odd one out that really did like the comedian episode. He reminded me in a lot of ways of one of my sons (but he has his own apartment and a good job), he's shy and doesn't notice opportunities to interact with new people, he doesn't care how he looks or dresses as long as he's had a shower, his apartment is done up in First Dorm Room style and as his mom-there's not much I can say or do to help him see where he might be a little bit happier with some changes.

That dad of 6 will have that house trashed inside of a week.
posted by hollygoheavy at 11:14 AM on February 28, 2018


R. Eric Thomas on the new Queer Eye, Queer Eye Is, More Than Anything, a Docu-series About Queer Emotional Labor. His essay is just what I wanted to read on this.
posted by gladly at 10:28 AM on March 2, 2018 [5 favorites]


gladly, thanks for that article. After reading it I think I realized what is so refreshing to me about the show - it is all about emotional labor but women don't have to do any of it. Unfortunately, that means a different population of people who are overly taxed with emotional labor are doing it. At least in this case, they are getting paid.
posted by Emmy Rae at 12:23 PM on March 2, 2018 [4 favorites]


Why not "Queer Eye for lonely unappreciated spinsters and other people."

We need new curtains and for someone to hug us and tell us we matter too.


Ooo, this could be a metafilter thing! It wouldn't have to be televised. It could be like a sort of counterpart to Secret Quonsar, maybe in June at the opposite side of the calendar year or slightly earlier in the spring like a spring cleaning and renewal thing? "Meta Eye for the Crone Island Person"? :D
posted by eviemath at 1:37 PM on March 2, 2018 [2 favorites]


YES, this is exactly what I was talking about above - it's marginalized people doing emotional labor for men who can't be bothered to do it for themselves. Nope, big nopetopus on that. I see that all day, every day, I do not need to see it happening on television, too, but somehow also twice-subverted so that it turns into an incredibly gross enterprise in Extreme Capitalism!

I just... I don't need someone who is marginalized to "tell me I matter too," and I also don't need anyone to hang my curtains for me. Why do people think it's fine to just... make other people who are objectively much more taxed than they are *do their work for them*? It makes less than no sense to me. It is ridiculous. I am not interested in seeing queer magic worked on straight pain. Full stop.
posted by sockermom at 1:49 PM on March 2, 2018 [2 favorites]


I was reading some articles on the show today, and one noted that Kamaro is trained as a social worker, so helping people with emotional problems is literally his thing (and the cast calls him "KamOprah"). Another noted that Antoni actually teaches several dishes, but generally they just show one (and generally it's one they make for the last gathering/event thing), but that his focus is very much on incremental improvements based on the guys' actual lives. Like with the dads, he spends more time on healthy things they can make for or with their kids. With Neil (the Indian tech entrepreneur who used to cook a lot but got really depressed), they did some more advanced recipes mostly focused on entertaining. With the older guy with unhealthy habits (Abby was his 3rd ex wife, I forget his name), they worked with him on more healthy food he could easily prepare with his limited kitchen talents, so that he could eat takeout less and prepare healthier food at home more, but without making it so complicated he'd never do it. (Similarly, Jonathan is about finding out how long they usually spend on grooming and trying to improve that without adding more than a minute or two to their routine, since he knows it won't stick.)

And Bobby gets a one-sheet about the guy (and his family, if applicable) because he has to order furniture in advance, but they really do come in and do the whole reno in one week. (I think that article was in architectural digest?) He said they were really lucky because Extreme Makeover: Home Edition had been in Atlanta several times so there were local contractors already familiar with TV renovations and working in that high-speed environment (and it's actually a lot less intense than Extreme Makeover).

The cast do stay in touch with the guys they made over, by text message and social media, and there have been some ups and some downs.

Also Jonathon is the best one because he's from downstate Illinois, obvs.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 2:11 PM on March 2, 2018 [5 favorites]


I saw a post on Reddit earlier today from someone claiming to have been the subject of the firefighter episode. He said their episode was actually the 15th filmed, but was shown out of order. So if that's true, they have another short season ready to go.
posted by sevenyearlurk at 7:58 PM on March 2, 2018 [2 favorites]


After reading it I think I realized what is so refreshing to me about the show - it is all about emotional labor but women don't have to do any of it.

Agreed, and the promise at the end of each show is that the Fab Five have shown their subject that performing emotional labor makes them healthier, happier people and improves the lives of the people they love. The makeover is that these men will keep doing the work, and even though that's probably the most "reality show" constructed part, I am totally seduced by it.
posted by gladly at 8:12 AM on March 3, 2018 [3 favorites]


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