The biggest Black Lives Matter page on Facebook is fake
April 9, 2018 5:19 PM Subscribe
"For at least a year, the biggest page on Facebook purporting to be part of the Black Lives Matter movement was a scam with ties to a middle-aged white man in Australia, a review of the page and associated accounts and websites conducted by CNN shows." (by Donie O'Sullivan)
Indeed, Facebook was told of concerns about the page some time ago. Patrisse Cullors, a co-founder of the Black Lives Matter movement, told CNN that Black Lives Matter had, suspecting the page was a scam, contacted Facebook about removing it a few months ago.
"Congressman, I am unaware of any systemic racism at Facebook. We connect people."
posted by benzenedream at 6:27 PM on April 9, 2018 [12 favorites]
"Congressman, I am unaware of any systemic racism at Facebook. We connect people."
posted by benzenedream at 6:27 PM on April 9, 2018 [12 favorites]
Capitalist? Say so if it makes you feel better, but...
"The page consistently linked to websites tied to Ian Mackay, a National Union of Workers official in Australia. The union represents thousands of workers across various industries.
The union did not respond to CNN's request for comment."
posted by homerica at 6:38 PM on April 9, 2018 [4 favorites]
"The page consistently linked to websites tied to Ian Mackay, a National Union of Workers official in Australia. The union represents thousands of workers across various industries.
The union did not respond to CNN's request for comment."
posted by homerica at 6:38 PM on April 9, 2018 [4 favorites]
On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog grifter
posted by OverlappingElvis at 6:44 PM on April 9, 2018 [8 favorites]
posted by OverlappingElvis at 6:44 PM on April 9, 2018 [8 favorites]
Ian Mackay, a National Union of Workers official in Australia.
They don't do themselves any favours do they? Another nail in the coffin. Libs will have a field day.
posted by unliteral at 6:48 PM on April 9, 2018 [6 favorites]
They don't do themselves any favours do they? Another nail in the coffin. Libs will have a field day.
posted by unliteral at 6:48 PM on April 9, 2018 [6 favorites]
That union has about ten seconds to fire that dude before all kinds of shit rains down on them. Goddammit unions, we all need you to not be stupid. Argh.
posted by aramaic at 7:21 PM on April 9, 2018 [15 favorites]
posted by aramaic at 7:21 PM on April 9, 2018 [15 favorites]
there's a splinter group of Black Lives Matter here in Atlanta that's like this. it's led by a cishet dude who was kicked out of BLM-Atlanta for for threatening fellow organizers with a knife. turns out, he was pissed because the BLM group here wouldn't let him be in charge of the social media accounts, particularly because he was a transphobic, emotionally immature punk. he then formed a group called 'Black Lives Matter - Greater Atlanta' that's just a Paypal account to himself. he also shows up to marches that other folks have organized so he can post on his Facebook / Instagram but his group usually trails along a few hundred feet behind the main crowd (which is super fucking annoying to marshal for) because nobody wants him there
BLM national disavowed him but the donation page is still up and, I found this fucking thing out yesterday, his org is the only one that pops up when you search 'Black Lives Matter' when you select charities on Amazon and Humble Bundle and other places
to wit, even when you try to do a little bit of good via the tiny bit of control corporations allow you to have over your own capital, it's superficial bullshit that sucks
posted by runt at 7:33 PM on April 9, 2018 [25 favorites]
BLM national disavowed him but the donation page is still up and, I found this fucking thing out yesterday, his org is the only one that pops up when you search 'Black Lives Matter' when you select charities on Amazon and Humble Bundle and other places
to wit, even when you try to do a little bit of good via the tiny bit of control corporations allow you to have over your own capital, it's superficial bullshit that sucks
posted by runt at 7:33 PM on April 9, 2018 [25 favorites]
It didn't occur to me that BLM being decentralized carries this sort of risk. It probably didn't occur to a lot of other people, either.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 8:15 PM on April 9, 2018 [15 favorites]
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 8:15 PM on April 9, 2018 [15 favorites]
This frickin' timeline.
This happened with Occupy Wall Street as well on multiple levels, including both gov and freelance provocateurs, shit stirrers and scummy fuckers running off with or randomly collecting donations.
We had one known problem with some street kid that absconded with about 1k in cash in a jar who was later found rolling on MDMA in his tent w/ his underage runaway, ugh, goddamnit, victim-not-girlfriend.
Ironically he was found by the cops because they were actively clearing the plaza and at that moment finally banning tents from being set up, and they were refusing to come out, likely for multiple reasons, most of them stupid.
posted by loquacious at 9:22 PM on April 9, 2018 [8 favorites]
This happened with Occupy Wall Street as well on multiple levels, including both gov and freelance provocateurs, shit stirrers and scummy fuckers running off with or randomly collecting donations.
We had one known problem with some street kid that absconded with about 1k in cash in a jar who was later found rolling on MDMA in his tent w/ his underage runaway, ugh, goddamnit, victim-not-girlfriend.
Ironically he was found by the cops because they were actively clearing the plaza and at that moment finally banning tents from being set up, and they were refusing to come out, likely for multiple reasons, most of them stupid.
posted by loquacious at 9:22 PM on April 9, 2018 [8 favorites]
"Congressman, I am unaware of any systemic racism at Facebook. We connect people."
It's not a policy per se. But, their board of directors does consist of nine white folks, only one of which is a woman, and their CxO's consist of four white men and one white woman. Those CxO's went to Stanford, Harvard and Georgetown. So, certainly not any sort of diversity in their executive ranks.
I just wish this sort of problem was the biggest issue facing the company. I was about to derail with a long list of serious shit that has global impact that they are in the center of... But that list would be too long, it would end up a derail. I guess I'll just say I'm glad there isn't a bodycount associated with this issue. But, and it's a big but, folks can and should certainly critique FB on many fronts - they've earned it.
posted by el io at 11:59 PM on April 9, 2018 [2 favorites]
It's not a policy per se. But, their board of directors does consist of nine white folks, only one of which is a woman, and their CxO's consist of four white men and one white woman. Those CxO's went to Stanford, Harvard and Georgetown. So, certainly not any sort of diversity in their executive ranks.
I just wish this sort of problem was the biggest issue facing the company. I was about to derail with a long list of serious shit that has global impact that they are in the center of... But that list would be too long, it would end up a derail. I guess I'll just say I'm glad there isn't a bodycount associated with this issue. But, and it's a big but, folks can and should certainly critique FB on many fronts - they've earned it.
posted by el io at 11:59 PM on April 9, 2018 [2 favorites]
Capitalist? Say so if it makes you feel better, but...
"The page consistently linked to websites tied to Ian Mackay, a National Union of Workers official in Australia.
Yes, capitalist. The NUW is part of the Labor Right, which calls itself “Third Way” or as Blair called it “new capitalism”.
posted by the agents of KAOS at 12:32 AM on April 10, 2018 [13 favorites]
"The page consistently linked to websites tied to Ian Mackay, a National Union of Workers official in Australia.
Yes, capitalist. The NUW is part of the Labor Right, which calls itself “Third Way” or as Blair called it “new capitalism”.
posted by the agents of KAOS at 12:32 AM on April 10, 2018 [13 favorites]
That union has about ten seconds to fire that dude before all kinds of shit rains down on them. Goddammit unions, we all need you to not be stupid. Argh.
I don't know if the article's been updated, but immediately after that it does say:
posted by Luddite at 1:48 AM on April 10, 2018 [5 favorites]
I don't know if the article's been updated, but immediately after that it does say:
A spokesperson for the National Union of Workers said Tuesday that it has suspended Mackay and one other official while it investigates the situation.
The union "is not involved in and has not authorized any activities with reference to claims made in CNN's story," National Secretary Tim Kennedy said in a statement.
posted by Luddite at 1:48 AM on April 10, 2018 [5 favorites]
Here's the ABC article, in case anyone is interested.
posted by AnhydrousLove at 2:32 AM on April 10, 2018
posted by AnhydrousLove at 2:32 AM on April 10, 2018
I wonder if he's running any other misleading pages. It's not like he needed to trade on any actual connection with BLM; he could easily have set up pages for all sorts of causes.
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:27 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by Joe in Australia at 4:27 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
Or all sorts of domain names, according to Brad Esposito at Buzzfeed.
“A list of domains that were at one point registered using his Union email address shows dozens of domains referencing things including Donald Trump, Black Lives Matter, references to Australian online banking corporations, and sexual acts.”
posted by harriet vane at 4:43 AM on April 10, 2018 [5 favorites]
“A list of domains that were at one point registered using his Union email address shows dozens of domains referencing things including Donald Trump, Black Lives Matter, references to Australian online banking corporations, and sexual acts.”
posted by harriet vane at 4:43 AM on April 10, 2018 [5 favorites]
If you report anything which is likely to be fake on Facebook, very little is done about it. Dead obvious troll accounts which exist only to harass people are really hard to get rid of.
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 4:52 AM on April 10, 2018 [7 favorites]
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 4:52 AM on April 10, 2018 [7 favorites]
I bet the Fugazi Ian MacKay is pissed.
posted by rikschell at 5:02 AM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by rikschell at 5:02 AM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
Don't even ask about Minor Threat's Ian Mackay. Super pissed, that one.
posted by dozo at 6:31 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by dozo at 6:31 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
If you report anything which is likely to be fake on Facebook, very little is done about it.
Report a trans person for using a name that doesn't match the one on their drivers' license, on the other hand...
I wonder if he's running any other misleading pages.
It's all but guaranteed that he is. We just don't know about the other ones yet.
This is a big problem that basically negates all of the supposed advantages of Facebook, Twitter, et al. for social justice organising. Supposedly, the benefit of these corporate platforms is that they allow the folks doing the work on the ground to reach out to all the slacktivists and clue them in. But, in reality, mostly what's happening is that the slacktivists are engaging with groups run by IRA and independent assholes like Mackay and the aforementioned "BLM Greater Atlanta" guy.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:40 AM on April 10, 2018 [6 favorites]
Report a trans person for using a name that doesn't match the one on their drivers' license, on the other hand...
I wonder if he's running any other misleading pages.
It's all but guaranteed that he is. We just don't know about the other ones yet.
This is a big problem that basically negates all of the supposed advantages of Facebook, Twitter, et al. for social justice organising. Supposedly, the benefit of these corporate platforms is that they allow the folks doing the work on the ground to reach out to all the slacktivists and clue them in. But, in reality, mostly what's happening is that the slacktivists are engaging with groups run by IRA and independent assholes like Mackay and the aforementioned "BLM Greater Atlanta" guy.
posted by tobascodagama at 7:40 AM on April 10, 2018 [6 favorites]
I have a hard time trying to come up with a solution that isn't worse than the problem. Asking facebook to verify grass-roots protest movement web pages doesn't seem likely to make the world a better place. I'm glad this jerk was exposed, and I trust that others will be in the future.
posted by eotvos at 8:31 AM on April 10, 2018
posted by eotvos at 8:31 AM on April 10, 2018
Does Facebook verify legit 501c nonprofits?
posted by benzenedream at 8:41 AM on April 10, 2018
posted by benzenedream at 8:41 AM on April 10, 2018
Solution: trust corporate-owned social media no more than you'd trust corporate-owned mass media.
posted by tobascodagama at 8:43 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by tobascodagama at 8:43 AM on April 10, 2018 [2 favorites]
First, I have to point out that administrated is a loathsome bastardization of administered. Second, I'll chill out and go finish the F article.
posted by theora55 at 9:31 AM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by theora55 at 9:31 AM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
Just wanted to give a shoutout to this blog post from Jeremy Massler's blog "Manic News". In December 2017 he broke this story about the fraud based on the pattern of referral traffic looking weird. The CNN story we're talking about here does link that post, credits Massler, and did a bunch of significant reporting on its own. I just like the scoop came from some random blogger, someone like you or me.
posted by Nelson at 10:03 AM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by Nelson at 10:03 AM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
It didn't occur to me that BLM being decentralized carries this sort of risk. It probably didn't occur to a lot of other people, either.
If only there were some organizational framework with a proven track record of success, that could centralize the work of progressive/revolutionary organizations while preserving a truly democratic base of power. A sort of "democratic centralism" if you will...
posted by Krawczak at 11:20 AM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
If only there were some organizational framework with a proven track record of success, that could centralize the work of progressive/revolutionary organizations while preserving a truly democratic base of power. A sort of "democratic centralism" if you will...
posted by Krawczak at 11:20 AM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
Report a trans person for using a name that doesn't match the one on their drivers' license, on the other hand...
Or a Catholic monk. It's an equal opportunity offensive policy.
posted by Jahaza at 1:16 PM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
Or a Catholic monk. It's an equal opportunity offensive policy.
posted by Jahaza at 1:16 PM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
Indeed, Facebook was told of concerns about the page some time ago. Patrisse Cullors, a co-founder of the Black Lives Matter movement, told CNN that Black Lives Matter had, suspecting the page was a scam, contacted Facebook about removing it a few months ago.
The question becomes, how does Facebook (or anybody else) verify (1) that the person/group calling for a shutdown is part of the "real" BLM (2) and the person/group at risk of shutdown is a "fake" BLM? If every investigation requires serious investigative reporting, it isn't something that the company is going to be terribly excited to. But leaving this to be self-policed and/or community regulated has its problems as well.
And what's to prevent infighting activist groups from reporting each other as "fakes"? (That already seems to happen quite a bit, with online activists reporting content from opposing groups and/or persons in order to get them suspended or banned.)
posted by theorique at 1:51 PM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
The question becomes, how does Facebook (or anybody else) verify (1) that the person/group calling for a shutdown is part of the "real" BLM (2) and the person/group at risk of shutdown is a "fake" BLM? If every investigation requires serious investigative reporting, it isn't something that the company is going to be terribly excited to. But leaving this to be self-policed and/or community regulated has its problems as well.
And what's to prevent infighting activist groups from reporting each other as "fakes"? (That already seems to happen quite a bit, with online activists reporting content from opposing groups and/or persons in order to get them suspended or banned.)
posted by theorique at 1:51 PM on April 10, 2018 [1 favorite]
how does Facebook (or anybody else) verify (1) that the person/group calling for a shutdown is part of the "real" BLM (2) and the person/group at risk of shutdown is a "fake" BLM
they can read the news every once in a while or, to fit more with Facebook's spirit of outsourcing labor onto their users, they can mandate a protocol for complaints that requires sources and then make a judgement call based on that
posted by runt at 2:16 PM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
they can read the news every once in a while or, to fit more with Facebook's spirit of outsourcing labor onto their users, they can mandate a protocol for complaints that requires sources and then make a judgement call based on that
posted by runt at 2:16 PM on April 10, 2018 [4 favorites]
The question becomes, how does Facebook (or anybody else) verify (1) that the person/group calling for a shutdown is part of the "real" BLM (2) and the person/group at risk of shutdown is a "fake" BLM?
How indeed could Facebook or -- for that matter -- anybody else with $41,711,000,000 in cash and short term investments as of the end of fiscal 2017 ever resolve such a quandry? If only they had something that they could apply to this problem...
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 10:02 PM on April 10, 2018 [7 favorites]
How indeed could Facebook or -- for that matter -- anybody else with $41,711,000,000 in cash and short term investments as of the end of fiscal 2017 ever resolve such a quandry? If only they had something that they could apply to this problem...
posted by Homeboy Trouble at 10:02 PM on April 10, 2018 [7 favorites]
they can read the news every once in a while
How would that even work? What do you mean by that? Trying to see if people quoted by the media are the same people administering an account? Trying to see if the narratives agree?
I second theorique's question. Verified individual pages make sense, since individuals can prove identity. Same for registered nonprofits, corporations, whatever. For non-registered entities...well, I certainly wouldn't want to be in the position of making those judgment calls.
posted by mosst at 8:12 AM on April 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
How would that even work? What do you mean by that? Trying to see if people quoted by the media are the same people administering an account? Trying to see if the narratives agree?
I second theorique's question. Verified individual pages make sense, since individuals can prove identity. Same for registered nonprofits, corporations, whatever. For non-registered entities...well, I certainly wouldn't want to be in the position of making those judgment calls.
posted by mosst at 8:12 AM on April 11, 2018 [1 favorite]
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And if its not political parties trying to score points with the populace with fake populist movements...
And if its not corporations trying to shut down any negative discussions about their products...
Then, if it's not all those skeevy fucking shitbags, then it's just regular fucking fuckshit capitalists who have decided to make money off of a real movement by creating a fake page for that movement and siphoning money off for themselves.
This problem is way bigger than fucking Facebook, and any asshat who thought these kind of shenanigans only happened after the internet was invented, well, they are naive as living hell, because this is what con-men do and trying to fucking act like it's Facebook's fault for not policing it instead of maybe the fault of people who hand their fucking money out to organizations without checking where the money is going or how it is being spent is a little absurd.
I can't believe I'm defending Facebook, but this problem isn't going to go away just because they hire a bunch of people to monitor it all.
Funny how Twitters cryptocurrency scams, which are basically the same fucking kind of shit, have not gotten anywhere near as much press, and that's just because they aren't currently in a nosedive.
I don't even have a Facebook account and I've been ranting about privacy issues with respect to Facebook for years, but this is a human problem, not a Facebook problem.
Although it's arguable the companies response is tone-deaf. But what fucking companies ISN'T these days? I could hand down a fucking load of stories of the fucking number of times Google has personally pulled serious tone-deaf bullshit with me, but nobody gives a fuck for whatever reason. The problem is the corporatism has gotten to the point that it doesn't matter how tone-deaf their response is, if they've got the money, they'll weather it and be fine.
Just look at British Petroleum. Their stock has recovered quite nicely, they're almost right back to where they were before the disaster. They still keep pumping oil. The gulf continues to be a fucking wreck.
The CEO literally complained about people hassling him over the fucking disaster. He just wanted it to be over. The most tone deaf motherfucker alive and now in charge of Glencore PLC. So looks like tone-deafness just gets you shuffled over to a different shitty company.
I fully except basically fuck-nothing to come from this Facebook nonsense.
CNN just wants to distract from what a fucking shitty news network they are.
posted by deadaluspark at 6:23 PM on April 9, 2018 [20 favorites]