something something virtue something
November 14, 2018 9:36 AM Subscribe
Here's 17 minutes of an old steel vice being quietly, painstakingly restored.
I'm surprised he didn't use any heat at all when trying to split it apart initially. Just WD40 and brute force. Also, not even a socket on those great big long jacking bolts - just a huge adjustable. It's almost like he doesn't even want knuckles.
Although I may be biased. I have actually cracked my own rib stubbornly trying to remove a rusted set of air fittings with two big adjustables. Maybe he hasn't had that 'yes it is worth going over there to get the right tools' effort balance lesson.
posted by Brockles at 9:46 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
Although I may be biased. I have actually cracked my own rib stubbornly trying to remove a rusted set of air fittings with two big adjustables. Maybe he hasn't had that 'yes it is worth going over there to get the right tools' effort balance lesson.
posted by Brockles at 9:46 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
Well, he's Swiss (as if that explains everything about choice of tools, stubbornness, diligence, and desire for perfection; but it kind of does).
posted by seanmpuckett at 9:59 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
posted by seanmpuckett at 9:59 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
as someone who does crap like this to relax (and or confuse my children) I wholeheartedly approve of this.
posted by French Fry at 10:09 AM on November 14, 2018
posted by French Fry at 10:09 AM on November 14, 2018
oh but when he comes back in to do the lettering in white I changed my mind about the existence of soulmates ♥
posted by French Fry at 10:13 AM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by French Fry at 10:13 AM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Someone call the vice squad, because we've got some metalwork porn right here.
posted by w0mbat at 10:17 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by w0mbat at 10:17 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
There's a whole world of vintage tool restoration videos on Youtube. I can easily spend a few hours watching other people work hard to restore an semi-obsolete version of a tool I don't even know how to use.
posted by ga$money at 10:23 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by ga$money at 10:23 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
It just occurred to me this must be the mid-life version of kids watching videos of other kids playing video games.
posted by ga$money at 10:28 AM on November 14, 2018 [34 favorites]
posted by ga$money at 10:28 AM on November 14, 2018 [34 favorites]
I found an old vise in a scrap pile a while back, and while looking for information on it discovered the subhobby of vise restoration. There are people who get really into it.
The video is of a European (Gressel) vise; the popular targets for restoration in the US are Wilton and Charles Parker (abbreviated "Chas. Parker" on the castings). You can find both of them at yardsales and flea markets around the northeast and midwest. If you can find one that isn't cracked, they're worth picking up if it's less than $50 or so. Athol and Starret vises are worth more (and at least in my experience rarely need much restoration, because they were expensive enough originally to be kept in better shape... the Chas. Parker ones seem to have been cheap enough for heavy use).
To do a good job of one, you really need access to a blasting cabinet. I don't have one, so for mine I had to send it out. Compared to what most blasting shops do, though, it's a trivial job, and I got an old Chas. Parker blasted (some parts sandblasted, some bead) and powdercoated for under $200. The powdercoating is something of an anachronism on a prewar piece of machinery, which probably makes me a monster in some people's eyes.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:29 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
The video is of a European (Gressel) vise; the popular targets for restoration in the US are Wilton and Charles Parker (abbreviated "Chas. Parker" on the castings). You can find both of them at yardsales and flea markets around the northeast and midwest. If you can find one that isn't cracked, they're worth picking up if it's less than $50 or so. Athol and Starret vises are worth more (and at least in my experience rarely need much restoration, because they were expensive enough originally to be kept in better shape... the Chas. Parker ones seem to have been cheap enough for heavy use).
To do a good job of one, you really need access to a blasting cabinet. I don't have one, so for mine I had to send it out. Compared to what most blasting shops do, though, it's a trivial job, and I got an old Chas. Parker blasted (some parts sandblasted, some bead) and powdercoated for under $200. The powdercoating is something of an anachronism on a prewar piece of machinery, which probably makes me a monster in some people's eyes.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:29 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
This person has way more patience than I do, but that was a fantastic and deeply satisfying job to watch.
posted by Greg_Ace at 10:33 AM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Greg_Ace at 10:33 AM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Also: greasing the bolts themselves was a bit of an odd one. Why not anti-seize, which is the right tool for the job.
posted by Brockles at 10:43 AM on November 14, 2018
posted by Brockles at 10:43 AM on November 14, 2018
And yeah, I'm with Brockles in terms of being surprised/impressed/bemused at the lack of tools he uses during disassembly. The reverse-vise trick with the threaded rods is crafty as heck, but... if I have to turn a bolt more than 360 degrees, and I can get a socket on there... I'm gonna put a socket on it. Crescent wrenches are for holding things while you turn something else into or against them, in my opinion. But hey, can't argue with something that works!
When I took apart my Chas. Parker, I discovered a huge semi-recessed "king bolt" holding the vise to the swivel base. (The vise in the video doesn't have this, it's meant to be mounted perpendicular to a workbench and doesn't move, for heavier work. But from what I have seen, the swivel vises were more popular at least in the US and there are more of them around.) I have no idea how the thing was assembled originally or was intended to be taken apart; most people in the 1930s probably didn't have a set of giant sockets sitting around.
But, conveniently, modern cars typically have great big axle nuts, which necessitate big honking sockets, available cheap from your local auto parts store. And a 35mm socket is just a hair bigger than a 1-3/8", close enough that it fits particularly if the bolt is a bit rusty. And and even more conveniently, even the cheap axle nut sockets are impact sockets. So you toss one of those onto a 1000 lb-ft impact driver, soak the thing in Liquid Wrench, and away you go.
I'm still not sure how the Dead Men (to borrow Dan Holohan's term) intended for it to be done, but I hope they'd be impressed at the progress we've made in shop tools.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:48 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
When I took apart my Chas. Parker, I discovered a huge semi-recessed "king bolt" holding the vise to the swivel base. (The vise in the video doesn't have this, it's meant to be mounted perpendicular to a workbench and doesn't move, for heavier work. But from what I have seen, the swivel vises were more popular at least in the US and there are more of them around.) I have no idea how the thing was assembled originally or was intended to be taken apart; most people in the 1930s probably didn't have a set of giant sockets sitting around.
But, conveniently, modern cars typically have great big axle nuts, which necessitate big honking sockets, available cheap from your local auto parts store. And a 35mm socket is just a hair bigger than a 1-3/8", close enough that it fits particularly if the bolt is a bit rusty. And and even more conveniently, even the cheap axle nut sockets are impact sockets. So you toss one of those onto a 1000 lb-ft impact driver, soak the thing in Liquid Wrench, and away you go.
I'm still not sure how the Dead Men (to borrow Dan Holohan's term) intended for it to be done, but I hope they'd be impressed at the progress we've made in shop tools.
posted by Kadin2048 at 10:48 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
Previous post with more videos by the same guy, and other similar videos in the comments. I love watching these old tools be brought back to life. I've come across a few old tools that are still in good shape over the years and they are almost always better made and often better designed than their modern counterparts. Practically indestructible, unless really abused/neglected. I have a friend who used to do a variety of construction work, and one time while remodeling some old barracks at the nearby army post he tore out a wall and found and old Estwing framing hammer that had presumably been dropped in there accidentally and sealed up some time around 1950. It was in great shape and quickly became one of his favorite tools.
I wonder how he chooses what color to paint the restored tools. For this drill the finished color doesn't seem to match what was left of the original finish, and for many of the tools there seems to be nothing but rust, although I imagine old catalogs and such would show you the correct color.
posted by TedW at 10:49 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
I wonder how he chooses what color to paint the restored tools. For this drill the finished color doesn't seem to match what was left of the original finish, and for many of the tools there seems to be nothing but rust, although I imagine old catalogs and such would show you the correct color.
posted by TedW at 10:49 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
If you like this sort of thing check out Hand Tool Rescue. Occasionally Jimmy Diresta will take an old tool and make it new again, or more often into an entirely different tool.
There was another recent MeFi post about this sort of thing and it inspired me to dig up a few rusty tools and restore them. It's a very, very satisfying process and even better when you end up with a tool that you use regularly.
posted by bondcliff at 10:50 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
There was another recent MeFi post about this sort of thing and it inspired me to dig up a few rusty tools and restore them. It's a very, very satisfying process and even better when you end up with a tool that you use regularly.
posted by bondcliff at 10:50 AM on November 14, 2018 [4 favorites]
I like watching stuff like this now and then partly because I have almost no knowledge of the domain and processes, and can sort of just quietly go along for the ride, nodding and saying "sure, yes, the oil stick, that seems like as good an idea as any"; I like seeing stuff like this posted on MetaFilter partly because I enjoy people with actual domain knowledge start to go "...hey but why on earth would—I mean, a flange grobber would be a better—" as the job progresses.
Basically I'm getting the whole package today and I appreciate that.
posted by cortex at 10:54 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
Basically I'm getting the whole package today and I appreciate that.
posted by cortex at 10:54 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
Jimmy Diresta will take an old tool
The single best part of that video is at the 10:30 or so mark. You'll know it when you see it. Second best is 10:50.
posted by Brockles at 11:06 AM on November 14, 2018
The single best part of that video is at the 10:30 or so mark. You'll know it when you see it. Second best is 10:50.
posted by Brockles at 11:06 AM on November 14, 2018
This is nice. It would have been easier to go back in time and buy a new one, but it probably wouldn't have been as much fun.
posted by pracowity at 11:06 AM on November 14, 2018
posted by pracowity at 11:06 AM on November 14, 2018
You'll know it when you see it. Second best is 10:50.
He told a story about that on his podcast. The first stump he hit with the ax had a wasp's nest in it and he was stung several times. Unfortunately, I don't think he got video of it.
posted by bondcliff at 11:14 AM on November 14, 2018
He told a story about that on his podcast. The first stump he hit with the ax had a wasp's nest in it and he was stung several times. Unfortunately, I don't think he got video of it.
posted by bondcliff at 11:14 AM on November 14, 2018
Several commenters criticize him (while taking pains to couch it in effusive praise) for using WD-40 because it's not a penetrating oil, and he acknowledges that saying he 'knows that now', but I'd swear that used to be the main focus of its marketing. Maybe when it became "non-toxic", which is definitely not an original feature I remember, it was necessary to remove the penetrating components.
It surprised me a little bit to see that anvil-like flat spot behind the jaws. Was that actually to be used for pounding on things? And do contemporary versions have that? Seems like you'd be inviting damage to the sliding surfaces by doing much pounding there. And I didn't see evidence of a hardened plate braised onto it of the sort you might see on an anvil. Maybe older vice steels were harder than what we use now.
posted by jamjam at 11:16 AM on November 14, 2018
It surprised me a little bit to see that anvil-like flat spot behind the jaws. Was that actually to be used for pounding on things? And do contemporary versions have that? Seems like you'd be inviting damage to the sliding surfaces by doing much pounding there. And I didn't see evidence of a hardened plate braised onto it of the sort you might see on an anvil. Maybe older vice steels were harder than what we use now.
posted by jamjam at 11:16 AM on November 14, 2018
It surprised me a little bit to see that anvil-like flat spot behind the jaws.
That's a very common bit of vices - the better, industrial ones. And I am not sure of intended use but I have personally battered the shit out of lots of things on that surface. It stops (I think) people wanting to do it on the top of the jaws and screwing up the mechanism.
posted by Brockles at 11:22 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
That's a very common bit of vices - the better, industrial ones. And I am not sure of intended use but I have personally battered the shit out of lots of things on that surface. It stops (I think) people wanting to do it on the top of the jaws and screwing up the mechanism.
posted by Brockles at 11:22 AM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
Metafilter: I'm Painting it With a Toothpick
posted by dismas at 11:35 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by dismas at 11:35 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
bemused at the lack of tools he uses during disassembly.
It is kind of weird that dude's got access to a sandblaster, welder, a mill and a lathe but doesn't seem to know what a socket set is.
WD-40 because it's not a penetrating oil
I feel like this gets repeated over and over again on the Internet, and it certainly is true, but anyone who has ever used WD-40 to unstuck a stuck thing knows that it works most of the time for that purpose. I've taken to using oil for most things but every now and then the can of WD-40 is close by and that's what I use, and it works.
The vice he ends up with is a thing of beauty and it would be a shame to actually use it on a dirty chunk of metal.
God I could watch these damn videos all day.
posted by bondcliff at 11:45 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
It is kind of weird that dude's got access to a sandblaster, welder, a mill and a lathe but doesn't seem to know what a socket set is.
WD-40 because it's not a penetrating oil
I feel like this gets repeated over and over again on the Internet, and it certainly is true, but anyone who has ever used WD-40 to unstuck a stuck thing knows that it works most of the time for that purpose. I've taken to using oil for most things but every now and then the can of WD-40 is close by and that's what I use, and it works.
The vice he ends up with is a thing of beauty and it would be a shame to actually use it on a dirty chunk of metal.
God I could watch these damn videos all day.
posted by bondcliff at 11:45 AM on November 14, 2018 [2 favorites]
I know nothing about this stuff, really, but I was kind of surprised at how much of the process he seems to go through with bare hands, including touching/rubbing freshly milled (or whatever the term is) metal parts. Seems like a good way to get a nasty cut?
posted by kenko at 12:36 PM on November 14, 2018
posted by kenko at 12:36 PM on November 14, 2018
I love this kind of stuff. No talking, processes I am not familiar with but are immensely satisfying to watch, incremental progress. Lovely.
If I could offer this person two bits of feedback, they would be to 1) shift all of the text to annotations (optional) in order to maximize zen-viewing and 2) put in some nature sounds in back. Primitive Technology does these (well, the nature sounds come...naturally) and are just the pinnacle of zen viewing for me. Thanks for this post!
posted by lazaruslong at 12:38 PM on November 14, 2018
If I could offer this person two bits of feedback, they would be to 1) shift all of the text to annotations (optional) in order to maximize zen-viewing and 2) put in some nature sounds in back. Primitive Technology does these (well, the nature sounds come...naturally) and are just the pinnacle of zen viewing for me. Thanks for this post!
posted by lazaruslong at 12:38 PM on November 14, 2018
I enjoyed how, after he'd manufactured several replacement parts and even parts for temporary use, he went "eh, I'll just call up the company and order some new jaws." In a plastic package with the same company logo as on the old vice.
posted by alexei at 1:03 PM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by alexei at 1:03 PM on November 14, 2018 [3 favorites]
I was thinking it might be amusing for us if on videos like this the poster would make a note of how many views and favorites/unfavorites it had at the time of posting, so that on videos which had been around for a while and didn't have too many views, we could get a sense of the Metafilter effect, so I went back to it intending to gauge how well it met my criteria: not well, since it has more than a million views, and I couldn't immediately see how long it's been up.
But now it has two ads in the middle of it (for me) which weren't there before! Though that could easily be an effect of multiple views by the same person, I guess.
posted by jamjam at 1:06 PM on November 14, 2018
But now it has two ads in the middle of it (for me) which weren't there before! Though that could easily be an effect of multiple views by the same person, I guess.
posted by jamjam at 1:06 PM on November 14, 2018
Alternatively, my method for rusty old tool restoration:
1) Soak tool in tub of vinegar for two days.
2) Forget it's in there.
3) Remember, but at that point it's rained three times.
4) Dump out skanky rain/water/rust slurry.
5) Soak in tub of vinegar for two days in the shed this time.
6) Scrub with wire brush for ten minutes until it's not terrible.
7) Spraypaint it with whatever leftover quarter-of-a-can spraypaint you find in the shed.
8) Don't make a video.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 1:12 PM on November 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
1) Soak tool in tub of vinegar for two days.
2) Forget it's in there.
3) Remember, but at that point it's rained three times.
4) Dump out skanky rain/water/rust slurry.
5) Soak in tub of vinegar for two days in the shed this time.
6) Scrub with wire brush for ten minutes until it's not terrible.
7) Spraypaint it with whatever leftover quarter-of-a-can spraypaint you find in the shed.
8) Don't make a video.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 1:12 PM on November 14, 2018 [7 favorites]
>8) Don't make a video.<
Yea, if I DID (but I won't) it would all have to be silent film (or rated at least a hard R)
posted by twidget at 1:27 PM on November 14, 2018
Yea, if I DID (but I won't) it would all have to be silent film (or rated at least a hard R)
posted by twidget at 1:27 PM on November 14, 2018
Satisfying on soooo many levels.
When it was done, I wanted to touch it. I bet the screw action would be silky-smooth.
posted by kinnakeet at 2:29 PM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
When it was done, I wanted to touch it. I bet the screw action would be silky-smooth.
posted by kinnakeet at 2:29 PM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
I guess you can't buy Kroil in Switzerland, but 50/50 acetone and ATF would have worked.
And an impact driver.
posted by a halcyon day at 4:41 PM on November 14, 2018
And an impact driver.
posted by a halcyon day at 4:41 PM on November 14, 2018
My YouTube history:
Cookie-decorating
Hard candy making
Toffee-pulling machines
Tool restoration
I guess I have a type.
posted by arcticwoman at 5:27 PM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
Cookie-decorating
Hard candy making
Toffee-pulling machines
Tool restoration
I guess I have a type.
posted by arcticwoman at 5:27 PM on November 14, 2018 [1 favorite]
I enjoyed how, after he'd manufactured several replacement parts and even parts for temporary use, he went "eh, I'll just call up the company and order some new jaws."
Ooh! I might actually know the answer to this one. In a different vice restoration video I watched, dude went ahead and milled out a completely new set of jaws in brass, and NONE of the planes were parallel. I don't think the jaws on this one are nearly as convoluted, but it looks like everything else he's making himself is pretty straightforward lathe/milling work with radial symmetry (well, until he cuts it in half).
Might well just be the sort of work that isn't as much "fun."
posted by ivan ivanych samovar at 1:54 PM on November 15, 2018
Ooh! I might actually know the answer to this one. In a different vice restoration video I watched, dude went ahead and milled out a completely new set of jaws in brass, and NONE of the planes were parallel. I don't think the jaws on this one are nearly as convoluted, but it looks like everything else he's making himself is pretty straightforward lathe/milling work with radial symmetry (well, until he cuts it in half).
Might well just be the sort of work that isn't as much "fun."
posted by ivan ivanych samovar at 1:54 PM on November 15, 2018
I have big plans to do something like this soon, only with an entire house. There will be lots and lots of pictures, possibly a blog. There's just something so satisfying about taking an object that was made with great care and skill by some bygone craftsman (if we're talking about bygone days it was almost certainly a man—it is what it is) and lovingly restoring it to new or better-than-new condition. There's no reason that vise can't continue being a vise for another hundred years. Stuff didn't used to be made with the assumption that it would soon break and be replaced.
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:16 PM on November 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by Anticipation Of A New Lover's Arrival, The at 5:16 PM on November 15, 2018 [2 favorites]
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