Why doesn't suing the police work? One reason is...

June 28, 2019 5:12 AM

We're allowed to sue the police, for money, for violating (some of our) constitutional rights. Why doesn't this change police behavior? One reason is that police have "qualified immunity." "Qualified immunity permits law enforcement and other government officials to violate peoples’ constitutional rights with virtual impunity. "[Explainer in the Appeal]

For optional further law review* reading:

mefi's own Prof. William Baude argues that qualified immunity is unlawful in an influential law review article cited by Justices Thomas and Sotomayor.

Prof. Joanna Schwarz argues that qualified immunity doesn't even accomplish the policy goals it is supposed to accomplish (and that it "renders the constitution hollow")


*"Law reviews" are the professional scholarly publications in legal academia

posted by internet fraud detective squad, station number 9 (16 comments total)

When people cannot get legal redress and the offense against them is great enough, they might consider other than legal remedies. The law, properly and fairly applied guarantees the peace. When you have bad laws which protect bad people, you have oppression. When you have enough oppression people eventually refuse to accept it.
posted by Katjusa Roquette at 6:31 AM on June 28, 2019 [11 favorites]

I have heard police officers dismiss lawsuits as “the city is just settling for political/financial reasons. We didn’t do anything wrong and don’t need to change.”
posted by Big Al 8000 at 6:33 AM on June 28, 2019 [5 favorites]

anyway direct action
posted by poffin boffin at 6:37 AM on June 28, 2019 [6 favorites]

This is so interesting! I had always wondered why lawsuits didn't work to curb this. I just read this article which has the phrase "Where there is a right, there must be a remedy." Which really made me think -- if you can't sue to protect a right, do you actually have that right?
posted by selfmedicating at 7:46 AM on June 28, 2019 [4 favorites]

ACAB
posted by pompomtom at 7:50 AM on June 28, 2019 [10 favorites]

ACAF tbqh
posted by Holy Zarquon's Singing Fish at 7:51 AM on June 28, 2019 [4 favorites]

Does anyone know how this compares internationally?
posted by lokta at 8:15 AM on June 28, 2019

After the cops shot me when I was 25, I sued them and (eight years later, I) won. I have no illusions about it changing behavior because the cops aren't the ones making the payout, the city is. I tend to think that the cops and the city see it as the cost of doing business, where for me this was (and is) devastating and deeply personal. The police department in question never even bothered figuring out which one of them shot me, or even narrowing it down to a list of who used rubber bullets that day - I don't think they even bothered with that much paperwork. They didn't care what they did to me, or anyone else they hurt that day. They tried to send me to prison purely to weaken my case against them. They don't care, and don't see any reason why they should because to them, anyone they have a problem with is automatically put in the "criminal" category. Cops are every abusive asshole who thinks they're in the right and can get away with it, and until cops start paying personally, start losing their jobs, start going to prison for their crimes, nothing is going to change.

ACAB.
posted by bile and syntax at 8:41 AM on June 28, 2019 [47 favorites]

The cruelty is the point.
posted by Reyturner at 9:21 AM on June 28, 2019 [5 favorites]

Before retirement I was involved on the plaintiff side in a number of civil rights cases involving police misdeeds. The fact is that, unlike the title of this post implies, you cannot sue the police. You can sue the city that employs the police. When the plaintiff wins, it is the city that has to fork over the money out of the general fund. The taxpayer pays the fine, the police don't suffer at all. I have seen police chortling over this - go ahead and sue, they really don't give a shit. I say, take the money out of the police budget and you might see some changes.
posted by charlesminus at 10:39 AM on June 28, 2019 [9 favorites]

The amount of money the city of Chicago has paid out in police misconduct settlements in the past 11 years (about half a billion dollars) is roughly the amount of money that wasn't paid into the city's pension funds when it should have been. Bad policing is undermining the financial futures of the cities they are supposed to protect. We are robbing Peter Public to pay for Officer Paul's misconduct.
posted by srboisvert at 10:58 AM on June 28, 2019 [6 favorites]

Yeah, money is key. The podcast Planet Money had an episode recently (#901, Bad Cops Are Expensive) about how insurance companies are applying pressure. Basically small municipalities pool together to buy insurance and if one municipality's police force has a lot of judgements against it then the others don't want them in the pool because they raise rates for everybody.
posted by selfmedicating at 11:13 AM on June 28, 2019 [2 favorites]

That's a really great explainer. Thank you for this post!
posted by mixedmetaphors at 3:07 PM on June 28, 2019

A simple but unpassable law. If an officer is responsible for a case that the city loses they are automatically fired. Due process was the civil trial and the Police Union/Guild can even provide legal aid to the municipality defending itself. If liability is found the officer is out.
posted by Ignorantsavage at 9:07 PM on June 28, 2019

Yeah but most cities settle.
posted by Big Al 8000 at 7:40 PM on June 30, 2019

They settle because with a settlement they can tack on NDA's and a "non-admission of guilt" that can prevent them having to actually address any underlying issues or culpability that led to the problem that necessitated the settlement. In essence they are paying a politically motivated "go away" bribe to victims and couching it as fiscally responsible risk management.

The reform I'd most like to see is that settlements are not allowed without an admission of responsibility and no NDA's ever. There should be zero ability to write off police misconduct settlements as a "cost of doing business".
posted by srboisvert at 7:00 AM on July 2, 2019