Taking his shot
May 13, 2020 5:44 AM   Subscribe

Hamilton coming to Disney+ on July 3. That’s it. What a time to be alive. It did not seem right for the news to go unremarked on here.
posted by mwhybark (76 comments total) 15 users marked this as a favorite
 
I was looking forward to seeing it in a theater (admittedly after seeing it twice in a theater) but I'm not going to subscribe to Disney+ for it.

Then again, I put up the same resistance to watching Star Trek Discovery.
posted by emelenjr at 5:58 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


Disney censored Splash for Disney+. Are we expecting them to have any issues with the lyrics to Hamilton?
posted by Mothlight at 6:00 AM on May 13 [10 favorites]


I will 100% temporarily re-subscribe to Disney+ for this. Manipulation, successful.
posted by mosst at 6:04 AM on May 13 [11 favorites]


My fiance is thrilled about this, so I'm glad for anything to look forward to right now. I'm wondering what kinds of things are going to get pulled out of Disney's (and others') vaults to start filling the content holes when they can't shoot new shows / new episodes.

Do they typically do this with other Broadway shows? Does somebody have a closet full of original Broadway productions from the past 10-20 years that could be put on streaming? (Can somebody find a good film of the original Rocky Horror Show and rush that to Netflix?)
posted by jzb at 6:05 AM on May 13


Lin-Manuel Miranda has commented on the possibilty of muting the few expletives in the show.

Kyle Buchanan of the New York Times tweeted his conversation to Miranda about what changes he'll have to make to the show.

"So I asked Lin-Manuel Miranda about it on the Oscars red carpet. 'I think we'll figure it out when we get there,' he said — the film is due out in Oct 2021 — adding, 'but we're not going to cut any sections of the show.' If we have to mute a word here or there to reach the largest audience possible, I'm OK with that, because your kids already have the original language memorized. I don't think we're depriving anyone of anything if we mute an f-bomb here or there to make our rating"


Hopefully this is still the plan now that the show is heading to Disney+ and not theatres. I can't imagine they would actually cut any story content out of Hamilton.
posted by joelhunt at 6:06 AM on May 13 [11 favorites]


Waiting for the Butthole Cut.
posted by delfin at 6:09 AM on May 13 [45 favorites]


I might sign up for D+ for their free trial (do they have a free trial?) for a month to watch this and binge a bunch of other stuff. i don't know that I need the service forever, but doing a massive D+ month could be fun.
posted by hippybear at 6:16 AM on May 13


I'm excited!

idk if they are still doing it but I got a year of free disney plus because i have the verizon unlimited cellphone plan. just fyi for folks that also have that cell plan might be worth looking into
posted by lazaruslong at 6:37 AM on May 13


D+, ha ha ha, oops brand manager team
posted by mwhybark at 6:45 AM on May 13 [21 favorites]


It made me sign up. I've spent more money on worse things. BTW, the free trial is one week.

I saw the touring production of Hamilton in Raleigh (thanks, Pop , for buying me a ticket) and I loved it. There are a lot of movies I can watch again (and again). Who Framed Roger Rabbit never gets old. The only catch is whether or not I can figure out how to get it on my TV. We have 2 remotes and they both piss me off.
posted by corvikate at 6:46 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


Normally I would be torn between not wanting to give money to Disney and really wanting to see Hamilton again (with the original cast as well, having only seen the stage show when it opened in London!), but fortunately my sister has overall fewer qualms than me as a human being and she added me to her Disney+ family sharing when she subscribed at the start of the pandemic. So if I happen to accidentally fall onto my computer in early July and fire up a Disney+ tab entirely by mistake and watch Hamilton and cry, at least I will be able to do so with a semi-clean conscience.
posted by terretu at 6:46 AM on May 13 [9 favorites]


(Also, having seen the show in London in 2018 and then having listened only to the original cast soundtrack ever since, it will be very nice to put faces to voices properly.)
posted by terretu at 6:47 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


Do they typically do this with other Broadway shows? Does somebody have a closet full of original Broadway productions from the past 10-20 years that could be put on streaming?

Allow me to introduce you to BroadwayHD.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 7:17 AM on May 13 [21 favorites]


We had tickets to see Hamilton in New York next week, so this eases my pain a little.
posted by rikschell at 7:45 AM on May 13 [7 favorites]


Do they typically do this with other Broadway shows? Does somebody have a closet full of original Broadway productions from the past 10-20 years that could be put on streaming?

It....depends.

The Actors' Union has a big no-taping thing in most show contracts, so much so that the existence of Broadway HD has surprised me. However, upon looking at that, it's not a comprehensive list; it's got a lot of stuff, yeah, but there are some casts and productions it doesn't have (for instance, it does have a production of A Christmas Carol, but not the specific production that was a one-man show from Patrick Stewart).

However, most shows are nevertheless taped, by the NY Public Library's Performing Arts Wing. That tape usually lives in the NYPL archive, and you can go view these tapes by appointment. Otherwise performances-on-tape take some negotiating with the Actors' Union and the venue wanting to screen them, in terms of where it's screened, for whom, will there be a ticket charge, and how much of that income will the actors/creative staff from the original production get, etc.

But some productions do make those negotiations. LMM clearly did, and so did the staff behind Passing Strange (Spike Lee was a huge fan and made a film of the final performance, which is available for the public). My hunch is that various production companies have made their various agreements with Broadway HD and that's why it exists, but the real motherlode is at New York's Lincoln Center Branch, and if they ever decided to open that up that would be a goldmine.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:00 AM on May 13 [21 favorites]


Can you imagine? It was going to be 2021 and that would be enough. Disney+, my sweet home, I wanna give you a kiss. I was willing to wait for it but the world turned upside down. How lucky we are to be alive right now! This is going to be louder than the crack in the bell. When July 3rd hits they’ll tell the story of tonight. Just you wait.

The Actors' Union has a big no-taping thing in most show contracts, so much so that the existence of Broadway HD has surprised me.

No one really knows how the game is played, the art of the trade, how the sausage gets made.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 8:04 AM on May 13 [30 favorites]


I think it became pretty obvious early on that Hamilton was the kind of crazy once-in-a-generation Broadway breakout where there'd be demand for a mainstream release of a recorded performance, and contracts were renegotiated accordingly.
posted by praemunire at 8:08 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


However, most shows are nevertheless taped, by the NY Public Library's Performing Arts Wing. That tape usually lives in the NYPL archive, and you can go view these tapes by appointment.

BTW, I didn't know this, so thanks!
posted by praemunire at 8:08 AM on May 13


But some productions do make those negotiations.

Now might be a good time for the parties to come to the table. The actors aren't working, the content services are going to be hurting for content...

Thanks for the education on this & Pater Aletheias to BroadwayHD. That's gonna make my fiance a happy person, I bet.
posted by jzb at 8:09 AM on May 13


Here's more information on the NYPL's Theater on Film and Tape Archive and how to visit. May not be possible now, but....

I have been meaning for years to try to head over there to watch very specific performances if they have them. There was a production once of Waiting for Godot with Steve Martin and Robin Williams in the starring roles and I really want to see it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 8:18 AM on May 13 [14 favorites]


Cats is on YouTube for free on Friday, with others to follow.
posted by Segundus at 8:29 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


Got excited there because I thought you meant the movie.

I am a subscriber but as they don't have the original muppet show I had thought about cancelling as i ran out of things I wanted to watch. But it can wait a bit.
posted by lesbiassparrow at 8:39 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


I'm not going to subscribe to Disney+ for it.

They just rolled out Disney+ in the UK and you can get a free week, which was plenty of time to watch everything of interest. Don't forget to cancel your account on day 7.
posted by biffa at 8:42 AM on May 13


I will sign up for a free trial to begin July 1st and end July 7th. Slicing up entertainment into more and more subscription models is just going to drive people back (if they ever left) to torrents and putlocker and the like. I have no doubt someone (many someones) will figure out how to grab this from D+ and make it available by other means. I just hope they use a VPN, since Disney is the worst and will likely go after every single person they can find who even looked up one of their programs and then didn't watch it.

D+ can suck it.
posted by tzikeh at 8:57 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


I am super excited! Now if only my partner would activate his free year from Verizon already...
posted by SisterHavana at 9:01 AM on May 13


Cats is on YouTube for free on Friday, with others to follow.

It’s free as in beer, but you do incur a psychic cost to watch it, so be warned.
posted by jmauro at 9:09 AM on May 13 [17 favorites]


D+, ha ha ha, oops brand manager team

I worked directly (now indirectly) on a competing service, have heard/read their service’s name literally 1000+ times in meetings/person/email, and I had never come across “D+” until this post.
posted by sideshow at 9:16 AM on May 13 [4 favorites]


Meanwhile in my corner of things everyone has been calling it D+ since its inception because a) fandom and b) we just hate Disney on principle.
posted by tzikeh at 9:18 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


Cats is on YouTube for free on Friday, with others to follow.

It’s free as in beer, but you do incur a psychic cost to watch it, so be warned.

Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Grizabella R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn MIDNIGHT NOT A SOUND FROM THE PAVEMENT
posted by betweenthebars at 9:22 AM on May 13 [15 favorites]


I will sign up for a free trial to begin July 1st and end July 7th. Slicing up entertainment into more and more subscription models is just going to drive people back (if they ever left) to torrents and putlocker and the like. I have no doubt someone (many someones) will figure out how to grab this from D+ and make it available by other means. I just hope they use a VPN, since Disney is the worst and will likely go after every single person they can find who even looked up one of their programs and then didn't watch it.

As a frequenter of Invite-Only torrent sites because, well, politically, taking back your media after you've already paid for it is really all you can do in the face of content owners who refuse to just let you view the content you've already fucking paid for. Also, since they're invite-only, you don't really need to fuck with a VPN, as the group of people on the site is a known quantity of real people.

For example, I was able to find a 1977 cut of Star Wars that was copied straight from the 35mm film from 1977. George Lucas never wanted me to see that in my life. Tough shit for him, I'm watching it this weekend.

Anyway, I watched all of The Mandalorian without giving that shit company a single fucking dime (take your lucky dime and shove it, Scrooge McDuck!) and I don't feel one ounce of guilt.

When content companies aren't fucking over their customers endlessly, I'll stop pirating.

I'd love to see the House of Mouse fucking burn. They're a shit company, all around, to their customers, to their workers, and in terms of corporate responsibility. They're the main reason our copyright laws are so royally fucked up (copyright laws we are hell bent on exporting to everywhere else, no less). Because they couldn't stomach the idea of Mickey Mouse being public domain.

Also, in respect to the actual post. I'll be pirating this post-haste, as I already pirated a non-approved filming of Hamilton. Honestly, as a poor person, I'd like to think Lin-Manuel Miranda will forgive me. Because I sure as hell will never be able to afford to see it on Broadway.
posted by deadaluspark at 9:23 AM on May 13 [8 favorites]


I used to work for the company that produced this filming, and if I remember correctly, the contract to shoot it was worked out before it even went to Broadway. They also produced this great documentary. Highly recommended. I've never even seen the play or listened to the soundtrack but the doc alone was enough to make me a fan.
posted by greta simone at 9:28 AM on May 13 [7 favorites]


Just so I'm clear, is everyone haw-hawing about D+ as in a bad grade, or as in a freshly buried corpse with a headstone cross?
posted by emelenjr at 9:34 AM on May 13 [7 favorites]


I've seen Hamilton (in Chicago! It was fabulous!) but if I watch it on Disney plus, it will be after my kid has gone to bed. No kids singing the word "whore" in my house, not ever.
posted by 41swans at 9:40 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


Man, movies of more shows would be AWESOME.

I love live theater, but never go. The absence of good videos of many shows -- coupled with the existence of reallllly crappy boots -- means that if I peek at a show to see if I like it, it looks terrible and I recoil.

Like, I was sorely tempted to watch a boot of Hamilton because of the relentless buzz, but it was so bad (both of them were, in fact), that I still haven't seen more than a few minutes.

When this gets decent cinematography and audio, it's going to be great -- and I would love it to launch a big wave of Original Cast-type events (no, not the crummy ones that the TV networks did two years ago) so that more people can see how good live performance is.

And maybe then we can get a reboot of Gospel at Colonus!
posted by wenestvedt at 9:54 AM on May 13 [2 favorites]


emelenjr: Just so I'm clear, is everyone haw-hawing about D+ as in a bad grade, or as in a freshly buried corpse with a headstone cross?

¿Por qué no los dos?
posted by tzikeh at 10:04 AM on May 13 [2 favorites]


I have been meaning for years to try to head over there to watch very specific performances if they have them. There was a production once of Waiting for Godot with Steve Martin and Robin Williams in the starring roles and I really want to see it.

That's on my list too! Also both Reilly / Hoffman True Wests... I still can't figure out if / how / when they allow non-theater researchers in, though.
posted by Mchelly at 10:04 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


the existence of reallllly crappy boots

Is this what the cool kids are calling bootleg recordings these days? It took me a sec to figure out what shoddy footwear had to do with it.
posted by zamboni at 10:08 AM on May 13 [4 favorites]


The UK's National Theatre has Antony & Cleopatra up on YouTube at the mo if that would interest anyone, with Ralph Fiennes and Sophie Okonedo in the leads. They seem to switch productions weekly, every Thursday so you need to be quick for that one, but there'll be another one.
posted by biffa at 10:14 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


wenestvedt: Like, I was sorely tempted to watch a boot of Hamilton because of the relentless buzz, but it was so bad (both of them were, in fact), that I still haven't seen more than a few minutes.

So, I've heard from people, maybe, who might be collectors of Broadway bootlegs, possibly, who would recommend hanging in there, I guess, because the first 5-10 minutes are always shaky and bad, apparently, because ushers are still seating latecomers, I've been told, so the bootlegger has to hide their phone/camera, so they say, and the bootlegs get more stable and use close-ups and pans and stuff after that.

I mean, as far as I know.
posted by tzikeh at 10:14 AM on May 13 [11 favorites]


Scroll down this page to see what's coming on streaming at the NT.
posted by biffa at 10:15 AM on May 13 [3 favorites]


and I would love it to launch a big wave of Original Cast-type events (no, not the crummy ones that the TV networks did two years ago) so that more people can see how good live performance is.

The only "broadway" musical I ever got to see was when I was 10(?) and my mom dragged me to Seattle to see Hello, Dolly with Carol Channing.

For real, we need films of original casts. Channing was a little old lady by the time I saw her live, but holy crap she was on fire.
posted by deadaluspark at 10:43 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


Dana Hamilton the hammered dulcimer player?
posted by Nanukthedog at 10:58 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


As a frequenter of Invite-Only torrent sites because, well, politically, taking back your media after you've already paid for it is really all you can do in the face of content owners who refuse to just let you view the content you've already fucking paid for. Also, since they're invite-only, you don't really need to fuck with a VPN, as the group of people on the site is a known quantity of real people.

I can literally hear the FBI laughing from here
posted by sideshow at 11:09 AM on May 13 [4 favorites]


No kids singing the word "whore" in my house, not ever.

As Lin said on Twitter, your kids have already memorized all the lyrics anyway.
posted by sideshow at 11:12 AM on May 13 [13 favorites]


Cats is on YouTube for free on Friday, with others to follow.

I saw bootleg Cats last month. A friend pointed a webcam at his TV for Discord narrowcast. Distorted video and very poor quality audio. It's not the best way to see Cats, but it might be the most appropriate way to see Cats.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 11:14 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


Look. I'm not going to say that the 2016 election (and the naming convention of all those political threads) has given me a Hamilton PTSD-dread that will haunt me to the end of my days, but I'm also not not saying that. I honestly can't listen to anyone sing "never gonna be president now."
posted by grandiloquiet at 11:15 AM on May 13 [13 favorites]


I've seen Hamilton (in Chicago! It was fabulous!) but if I watch it on Disney plus, it will be after my kid has gone to bed. No kids singing the word "whore" in my house, not ever.

For a lot of families that ship has already sailed. The number of kids who have listened and memorized this musical is shocking.

Also there is an above average chance that D+ will censor the musical in some way. The production team has been mum about if that's the case here, but they haven't denied it in any way and indicated that they're open to it.
posted by jmauro at 11:19 AM on May 13 [1 favorite]


I appreciate all the suggestions about how to say no to Dis.

(Sorry.)
posted by mersen at 11:27 AM on May 13 [9 favorites]


mersen: I appreciate all the suggestions about how to say no to Dis.

... can someone tell me how to "yay" and "boo" at the same time? Asking for me.
posted by tzikeh at 11:50 AM on May 13 [5 favorites]


- Hercules Mulligan, you knock me down I get the fork back up again!

- Southern Monkey-Fighting Democratic Republicans!
posted by Flannery Culp at 12:02 PM on May 13 [6 favorites]


I hadn’t thought about language.

Ugh.

Can’t they just PG it or something? I mean, bastard orphan son of a whore is a main motif.

I sat next to a mom and her 14 year old daughter and the daughter knew every breath of the entire musical and could have performed the entire thing solo, I think.
posted by affectionateborg at 12:10 PM on May 13 [3 favorites]


I was looking forward to seeing it in a theater (admittedly after seeing it twice in a theater) but I'm not going to subscribe to Disney+ for it.

Yeah, pretty much. I am not getting around to doing all my Netflix and Hulu as is, I don't want to subscribe to a third thing I have to pay for every month but don't get around to viewing every 2 out of 3 months...but Hamilton....sigh,I dunno.
I tried to talk someone into buying me Disney + for my birthday but she said she couldn't technologically do it. Sigh.

Re: the language, can't they just for once make it Not Safe For Children and put a warning up at the start? Also, who doesn't know it has cuss words in in now? Trust me, all the kids know 'em by heart by now.
posted by jenfullmoon at 12:13 PM on May 13


I honestly can't listen to anyone sing "never gonna be president now."

Ooof, I remember when LMM was the guest host of Saturday Night Live in 2016, and the Hollywood Extra "Grab them by the...." tape had just been released. The premise of the song was how stoked LMM was to be hosting the show, as he danced through NBC hallways featuring portraits of past hosts, only to stop immediately in front of a photo of Trump guest-hosting (which he did twice, in 2004 and 2015) and sing that line.

I wonder if that line makes it into Hulu's streaming version of the episode.
posted by The Pluto Gangsta at 12:20 PM on May 13 [8 favorites]


For a lot of families that ship has already sailed. The number of kids who have listened and memorized this musical is shocking.

As a counterpoint to the concern over the language: when we saw Hamilton, we were walking by the merch table on the way out and a kid who couldn't have been older than 12 or so was tugging on her mother's shirt, and saying, "Mommm. Can we get the Chernow biography?"

Watching a kid badger their parent to buy them a doorstop of a biography was very encouraging.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 12:49 PM on May 13 [13 favorites]


not to go too far on the "where else is there filmed Broadway" derail but I also want to mention the Great Performances series on PBS, which you can stream to your TV via their app (and does require a continuing donation to your local PBS affiliate). GP's range includes classical music concerts and opera, but their musical theater is pretty small but decent, including Ken Watanabe's run of The King and I and An American in Paris
posted by bl1nk at 12:57 PM on May 13 [4 favorites]


Shakespeare's Globe Theater also has short pieces to watch, and is posting half a dozen full plays (on YouTube) this spring: https://www.shakespearesglobe.com/watch
posted by wenestvedt at 1:10 PM on May 13 [2 favorites]


First thing I thought of when I saw the announcement was later expressed much better in this tweet:

Bob Iger goes into his office, breaks the “in case of emergency” glass, and slams the big red button that just says “drop Hamilton”
posted by martin q blank at 1:56 PM on May 13 [10 favorites]


Regarding overdue shot stage performance releases, The Met, Fathom, and Great Performances appear to be sitting on the December 2019 Akhnaten, much to my irritation. I heard it awakening on Saturday morning in December and the experience and the performance has haunted me since. Totally missed the boat on the early April Great Performances airing.
posted by mwhybark at 4:23 PM on May 13 [1 favorite]


Oh wow, GP is going to do Bernstein's Mass, starting on Friday? I know this piece well from the original cast album but have never seen it performed.
posted by hippybear at 6:09 PM on May 13 [1 favorite]


I'm here to admit that I don't really know anything about Hamilton other than that people here seem to like it a lot.

I'm going to get my Metafilter membership revoked, aren't I?
posted by medusa at 8:27 PM on May 13


Look. I'm not going to say that the 2016 election (and the naming convention of all those political threads) has given me a Hamilton PTSD-dread that will haunt me to the end of my days, but I'm also not not saying that. I honestly can't listen to anyone sing "never gonna be president now."

Ah, I see I'm not alone. I had been listening to Hamilton incessantly shortly before that election and took particular glee in humming that to myself whenever "surely this" news came out and after election night I just... couldn't listen to Hamilton at all for a whole year. Between that song and then general sense of optimism about what the country could be, it just upset me. It's only in the last six months or so that I'm finally able to really enjoy it again. It's weird, how these things happen.
posted by gloriouslyincandescent at 8:29 PM on May 13 [4 favorites]


Off-topic a bit farther, but if anyone has any idea how I can get a good-quality copy of this (American Playhouse but I think also on Great Performances) production of Charley's Aunt, I would be thrilled. I've been trying to track it down for years.

(It is so so good)
posted by Mchelly at 9:26 PM on May 13


I'm here to admit that I don't really know anything about Hamilton other than that people here seem to like it a lot.

Hamilton takes the story of one of America's founding fathers (Alexander Hamilton) and recasts the entire US/Britain thing in the light of race relations both from then and from now. It's a rap musical basically sung/rapped through that comes at you with dense information but it's entirely catchy and it's very creative in its use of musical styles to depict various groups within the conflict.

It's probably one of those generational shift musicals, like West Side Story or the Godspell/Jesus Christ Superstar duopoly... I have the original cast album but I don't have it memorized -- I need to give it a real listen with the lyrics in front of me like old-school vinyl listening days.

I don't know if it would appeal to you, but it seems to serve well both Broadway and inner-city school kid crowds.
posted by hippybear at 9:28 PM on May 13 [1 favorite]


When content companies aren't fucking over their customers endlessly, I'll stop pirating.
I really doubt you will, or that they'll ever meet your bar for "not fucking over their customers".

There is a consumer-centric view of art underpinning all the rest which strikes me as entitled. "I have to pay again for content I've paid for"? Yes, and you have to pay multiple times to enter the same gallery to view the same art. And each time you go to the cinema you have to pay, even if you watch the same film. This isn't a new concept.

Disney aren't a great company to try and defend at the best of times, and especially not right now as they slough off staff while keeping well-paid execs well-paid – but I don't think the principle of them asking people to pay to see things they've made is egregious.

George Lucas never wanted me to see that in my life. Tough shit for him, I'm watching it this weekend..
I mean, I get it. I don't like a lot of his later choices around the films either. But they're his choices, and (to an extent), it's his art. You're not a hero for subverting an artist's wishes, even if you end up not really liking the artist's later work.

If the KLF want to delete their back catalogue and exclude it from streaming, turning the existing copies in the world into a new kind of artefact – one that must be sought out to experience – that's their moral rights as the artists. (And is a nice co-opting of copyright itself to achieve artistic ends)

I'm hardly going to condemn people who pirate the original editions, or make copies of The White Room but I'm not wholly going to applaud it either. Art+commerce has always been an uneasy balance, and the answers aren't as clear as that comment suggests.
posted by bonaldi at 4:57 AM on May 14 [11 favorites]


Yes, and you have to pay multiple times to enter the same gallery to view the same art. And each time you go to the cinema you have to pay, even if you watch the same film. This isn't a new concept.

It's also not a new concept that art I've bought isn't in a gallery, just as movies I've bought aren't at the cinema. Why should the gallery or the cinema set up a ticket booth at my front door?
posted by Earthtopus at 6:25 AM on May 14 [1 favorite]


It's also not a new concept that art I've bought isn't in a gallery, just as movies I've bought aren't at the cinema

In terms of this analogy, that's more like buying a print from the gallery. The Mandalorian isn't for sale on those terms – you can't buy it on physical media – so it's only available to watch in the cinema, as it were.
posted by bonaldi at 6:30 AM on May 14


I'm here to admit that I don't really know anything about Hamilton other than that people here seem to like it a lot.

Adding to hippybear's comment above - if you want a taste, this bit from that year's TONY awards ceremony will work well. Each of the "Best Play" nominees at the TONYS does a number and Hamilton went with their take on the Battle of Yorktown. (Note that they preface the performance with two introductions - one from the Obamas and one from Common - so the performance proper doesn't start until a couple minutes in.)

I showed that clip to a dude from Paris on my cell phone and he flipped his shit, raving up and down that it was one of the best things he'd ever seen despite not knowing that much about American history (he knew who George Washington and the Marquis de Lafayette were and that's about it).
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:07 AM on May 14 [2 favorites]


I was just about to tell my sister that I was going to get D+ for a month to do the Mandelorian but really the final season of Clone Wars (the best part of Star Wars ever) but now I'm gonna have to wait so I can catch Hamilton. I'm seriously starting to see the compartmentilization of services as a form of month-to-month sign-up, binge watch, unsubscribe cycle.
posted by zengargoyle at 7:48 AM on May 14


Oh wow, GP is going to do Bernstein's Mass, starting on Friday? I know this piece well from the original cast album but have never seen it performed.

Cool. Saw it performed once in college, long, long ago. It seemed to involve the entire School of Music.
posted by ZeusHumms at 8:20 AM on May 14


Oh wow. I've only started listening to it again recently too -- like so many others, I hear the songs and am immediately back in the summer of 2016, the sweltering heat of Philadelphia and every emotion running high and, yeah. I couldn't revisit that for awhile.
I watched the link EmpressCallipygos posted and anyway, guess who just freaked the cat out with chair-dancing! I can't wait to watch the whole thing, now. (And I guess it'll get me off my duff to finally watch Frozen 2 and re-watch Moana for the nth time and anyway, traditionally we've had that week off work so, uh, extra-good timing there.)
posted by kalimac at 8:48 AM on May 14


I'm very much looking forward to this. I saw the tour in Baltimore last year, and one of the things that is rarely discussed is what an inventive piece of theater it is. There's plenty of talk about how innovative the music is, and there is room for disagreement on that subject. But watching it live tickled the soul of this theater geek. The production is remarkably low tech (other than the revolving stage trick that has been around since Les Miz 30 years ago), and they evoke an amazing number of settings with just a few chairs, black boxes, and choreography. From a directorial standpoint, the production beautifully demonstrates that less is more.

After too many Broadway shows (even good ones) focused on spectacle and gimmickry, the sparse nature of the Hamilton production is a major artistic selling point for me.
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 9:02 AM on May 14


One interesting footnote about the Tony's performance that EmpressCallipygos posted, which I had forgotten until I watched it again.

That Tony Awards Ceremony occurred the day after the Pulse nightclub shooting in Orlando in 2016. In response, the Hamilton cast adapted their choreography at the last minute so that no cast member would be carrying a gun during the performance. (It's a battle sequence, so usually they all have one.)
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 9:17 AM on May 14 [5 favorites]


I mean, I get it. I don't like a lot of his later choices around the films either. But they're his choices, and (to an extent), it's his art.

The artists collective of Negativland would happily disagree with you here. Sadly, the interview with Marl Hosler where he goes into depth about his views on art and society has disappeared from the internet for whatever reason. He discusses how, once you put a piece of art into the public realm, it's not really yours anymore, it becomes a cultural artifact, collectively owned, shaped, and changed by the culture it belongs to. As a "meme," it changes and shifts as it moves from person to person.

Anyway, his final point was "If you want 100% full control of your art under all circumstances, keep it in your home, don't share it with anyone, and you'll have full control. By putting it into the public eye, you've already ceded control of it by making something that can be copied." Since you can't physically prevent copies, it's a moot point, you don't actually have ownership. (I'm speaking philosophically, not legally.)

Frankly, I'm with them on this. If it can be copied and it's not under your physical control, you have no control over it, even if you're charging money for it (just ask all the small-time artists online who have had their work stolen and put on t-shirts). So no, George Lucas can go fuck himself with the "they're his movies" shit. Nah, they were our movies the second they became part of the public consciousness.

Also: Negativland on Disney.
posted by deadaluspark at 10:30 AM on May 14 [1 favorite]


Frankly, I'm with them on this. If it can be copied and it's not under your physical control, you have no control over it, even if you're charging money for it

I haven't seen the Hosler interview, but is he really saying that might is right? Just because you can't physically prevent something happening does not mean that thing is OK – philosophically or legally.

Consider the consequences of that view: if says that revenge porn is OK (you shared it with someone, you ceded control of it), or creepshots (you put your body into the public eye), or, like you say, the theft of artwork by big brands. But those things are not OK, and are generally accepted not to be.

There's a reason protection of the moral rights of your artistic productions is in the UN Declaration of Human Rights.
posted by bonaldi at 2:52 PM on May 14


The problem with Disney's model isn't so much that they charge you to watch the movie, but that in order to watch the movie you have to buy an open-ended season ticket to watch all the movies, most of which are things you actually don't want to watch. There seems to be no other alternative.

It really is a different relationship, a less casual relationship, demanding a general buy-in in a way that a cinema release (or single rentals) or even the smorgasbord model like Netflix doesn't.

I don't really have a high moral position on Corporations Fucking Over The People, other than that when an organisation operates with such cynicism, the undeniable karmic hit that getting their stuff using alternative means engenders isn't really that great. The Mandalorian is a nice little TV series, but it's just a TV series. It's not the crown fucking jewels. It will be interesting to see what happens when such powerful cultural touchstones as the Marvel movies are gathered together in the Disney walled garden.

This isn't new, by the way - in the 90s (I think) Sky (a Murdoch offshoot) bought up the rights to major sporting events in the UK. It would need someone interested in sports to describe, but I think it fundamentally changed the relationship between football and cricket and the general public that First Division matches and Test Matches were no longer things that just turned up on your TV as a matter of course. For someone like me, who had only a passing interest in them, but would occasionally watch them because there was no internet, and the only TV channel that wasn't on the test card was showing the test match, that meant that those sporting fixtures effectively ceased to exist. Whether the changes that came were for the better for the sports in general, I really couldn't say. But putting things in a walled garden does mean that things that were common cultural touchstones become... not common, I suppose.

I'm mostly just interested to see what happens. But while I'm waiting, a judicious use of BitTorrent will keep me modestly entertained along with my Netflix and Prime subscriptions.
posted by Grangousier at 12:49 AM on May 15 [3 favorites]


Also: Negativland on Disney.

That whole Dead Dog Records album is great and I've been trying to find it in full to post here for a while, but I imagine it's not around due to copyright issues.
posted by hippybear at 11:49 AM on May 19


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