yet another incremental game
August 7, 2020 8:36 AM Subscribe
distance incremental an incremental game in which you build rockets, manipulate time, and in general just go really absurdly far
happy friday non-flash fun :D
happy friday non-flash fun :D
Incremental games can be a good diversion, but this one starts off with nonsensical mechanics. "Reset your journey" to make your engines faster? Cookie Clicker was more internally consistent.
posted by demiurge at 8:45 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by demiurge at 8:45 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
I can't believe you've done this
posted by saturday_morning at 8:54 AM on August 7, 2020 [11 favorites]
posted by saturday_morning at 8:54 AM on August 7, 2020 [11 favorites]
The scrolling text mentions it, and this is definitely patterned after Antimatter Dimensions which is great but kind of stopped getting updates. Go play that first if you like seeing ridiculously high numbers
posted by JZig at 8:59 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by JZig at 8:59 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
MetaFilter: Cookie Clicker was more internally consistent
posted by oulipian at 9:04 AM on August 7, 2020 [5 favorites]
posted by oulipian at 9:04 AM on August 7, 2020 [5 favorites]
Is there any chance that playing this could cure my Merge Dragons addiction?
Merge Dragons finally got me to stop playing Adventure Communist, but it is way, way worse.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:07 AM on August 7, 2020
Merge Dragons finally got me to stop playing Adventure Communist, but it is way, way worse.
posted by jacquilynne at 9:07 AM on August 7, 2020
I have been playing Merge Dragons every summer since 2017. I have two more wonders to build. Soon. Soon.
...not soon, exponentials are the worst.
(I'll take a new incremental just for the variety.)
posted by restless_nomad at 9:12 AM on August 7, 2020
...not soon, exponentials are the worst.
(I'll take a new incremental just for the variety.)
posted by restless_nomad at 9:12 AM on August 7, 2020
Everytime one of these comes up here I click over and give it a try and ... it just never does it for me.
Maybe one day after I've clicked over to enough of them it'll happen for me?
posted by notyou at 9:47 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
Maybe one day after I've clicked over to enough of them it'll happen for me?
posted by notyou at 9:47 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
I mean, if A Dark Room or Candy Box didn't, then no, probably not.
posted by Scattercat at 9:55 AM on August 7, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by Scattercat at 9:55 AM on August 7, 2020 [3 favorites]
I still have fond memories of that day I lost to converting the universe to paperclips. Of course I already love this. Of course.
posted by kalimac at 9:56 AM on August 7, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by kalimac at 9:56 AM on August 7, 2020 [4 favorites]
I've found what I need from this genre is a mess of systems (like just pile systems in there, I love it) and infrequent resets so there's a constant dripfeed of new things and not very much going over the same ground but faster. It's a plus if the numbers don't get too big, and the game expands out instead of up.
At this point (and admittedly it's because I've developed something of an immune reaction) I tend to bounce off these games quickly if they don't start revealing themselves fast. I've seen enough games that have lifted basic structures from the genre kings and done nothing new with them - the amount of games that have lifted Clicker Heroes' exact structure - that I don't get sucked in the way I used to.
posted by Merus at 10:05 AM on August 7, 2020
At this point (and admittedly it's because I've developed something of an immune reaction) I tend to bounce off these games quickly if they don't start revealing themselves fast. I've seen enough games that have lifted basic structures from the genre kings and done nothing new with them - the amount of games that have lifted Clicker Heroes' exact structure - that I don't get sucked in the way I used to.
posted by Merus at 10:05 AM on August 7, 2020
I wonder if this will pry me away from ngu...
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 10:16 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 10:16 AM on August 7, 2020
What if Kerbal, but inkerbmental????
(i was going to spend today studying and instead: this)
posted by curious nu at 10:24 AM on August 7, 2020
(i was going to spend today studying and instead: this)
posted by curious nu at 10:24 AM on August 7, 2020
Does this eventually give you meaningful choices to make? So far, I'm just resetting a lot.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:39 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:39 AM on August 7, 2020
(I realize that "meaningful choices" is a relative term when talking about incremental games)
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:40 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by escape from the potato planet at 10:40 AM on August 7, 2020
It's a little slow to start but it does seem to be adding systems. I'm not 100% certain if they count as "meaningful choices" yet, though.
posted by restless_nomad at 10:41 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by restless_nomad at 10:41 AM on August 7, 2020
there are 'meaningful choices' but they aren't really available until later in the game when 'infinity', 'elementary', and 'theories' are unlocked, the last having a complete tech tree to fill out in multiple ways depending on the goal (image of the tech tree, minor spoilers)
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 10:53 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 10:53 AM on August 7, 2020
My problem with it so far is that it seems to require fairly constant attention. If you reset a level and then go to the bathroom, by the time you come back, you've vastly over shot the next reset and all that progress is just wasted.
posted by jacquilynne at 10:58 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by jacquilynne at 10:58 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
I just wanna know if I get to make paperclips.
posted by darkstar at 11:11 AM on August 7, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by darkstar at 11:11 AM on August 7, 2020 [3 favorites]
I've reached what feels like a significant decision: reset entirely to get more rockets, or wait for automation to unlock, but I also feel like I don't grasp the math behind things well enough to make a good choice...
posted by codacorolla at 11:24 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by codacorolla at 11:24 AM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
The gain from rockets speeds you towards automation pretty efficiently - I went for rockets pretty fast and it seemed to be a good plan. (Automation is handy but only super helpful if you are not, like me, basically tabbing over every minute or two.)
posted by restless_nomad at 11:26 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by restless_nomad at 11:26 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
I am not sure I should disclose that I did a lot of work on automating Kittens Game such that it was pretty much a zero-click deal until you wanted to [redacted].
posted by seanmpuckett at 11:46 AM on August 7, 2020
posted by seanmpuckett at 11:46 AM on August 7, 2020
I did my first Universal Collapse and I died inside a bit. I'm.. not sure I'm emotionally capable of going through N cycles of "wiping out all progress".
TOO REAL, GAME.
too real.
posted by curious nu at 11:47 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
TOO REAL, GAME.
too real.
posted by curious nu at 11:47 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
Also I don't understand what generates cadavers.
posted by curious nu at 12:03 PM on August 7, 2020 [4 favorites]
posted by curious nu at 12:03 PM on August 7, 2020 [4 favorites]
I feel like having the main loop built around resetting progress endlessly violates a basic tenet of game design. It's like if someone made Super Mario Brothers but instead of beating levels you kept going back to the beginning with more and more powerups.
Technically you're still making progress in this game because each time you reset you get a little better, but your progress is on an axis that isn't how you traditionally perceive progress, and isn't directly surfaced to you the way your distance and acceleration is.
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 12:31 PM on August 7, 2020
Technically you're still making progress in this game because each time you reset you get a little better, but your progress is on an axis that isn't how you traditionally perceive progress, and isn't directly surfaced to you the way your distance and acceleration is.
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 12:31 PM on August 7, 2020
Is it just me or is the % at the top to the next unlock off? It'll say 50% but clearly we're not 50% there at all.
posted by Carillon at 12:47 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by Carillon at 12:47 PM on August 7, 2020
The progress seems logarithmic? Which is ... not helpful.
posted by miguelcervantes at 1:08 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by miguelcervantes at 1:08 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
Nah this didn't hold my attention past time reversal. Kittens Game is amazing because it tells the outline of a story and you flesh it out in your head as it goes along. You monster.
posted by seanmpuckett at 1:20 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by seanmpuckett at 1:20 PM on August 7, 2020
Uh don't click the "Apply Modes" thing in Options unless you want to reset all your progress, and not in the helpful way.
posted by curious nu at 1:22 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by curious nu at 1:22 PM on August 7, 2020
Automation was excellent, but I’m not sure I’m engaged enough to figure out a good Time Reversal strategy,
posted by Lame_username at 1:25 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by Lame_username at 1:25 PM on August 7, 2020
Softcapped: the game
posted by ourobouros at 2:55 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by ourobouros at 2:55 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
I feel like having the main loop built around resetting progress endlessly violates a basic tenet of game design. It's like if someone made Super Mario Brothers but instead of beating levels you kept going back to the beginning with more and more powerups.
Someone didn't like Majora's Mask...
posted by pwnguin at 3:23 PM on August 7, 2020
Someone didn't like Majora's Mask...
posted by pwnguin at 3:23 PM on August 7, 2020
The progress seems logarithmic? Which is ... not helpful.
Looks like you can change it to linear. I'm guessing it's useful as an estimator?
posted by pwnguin at 3:24 PM on August 7, 2020
Looks like you can change it to linear. I'm guessing it's useful as an estimator?
posted by pwnguin at 3:24 PM on August 7, 2020
> Mr.Encyclopedia: "I feel like having the main loop built around resetting progress endlessly violates a basic tenet of game design."
Perhaps in more mainstream game design where "New Game+" is probably the most common incarnation. But this is an incremental/idle game. This mechanic (often known as "prestige") is pretty fundamental to a lot of incremental games.
posted by mhum at 4:27 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
Perhaps in more mainstream game design where "New Game+" is probably the most common incarnation. But this is an incremental/idle game. This mechanic (often known as "prestige") is pretty fundamental to a lot of incremental games.
posted by mhum at 4:27 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
In any case, I just made it to the first "infinity" and have hit kind of a real flat spot. Not sure if I misallocated some resources or something but it looks like it's going to be a while before I get to the second infinity.
Meanwhile, my main complaint about the game is how opaque it is about what things affect what. I really don't know what pathogen or cadaver generation rates are based on, especially since it seems a bunch of these dependencies are a result of certain achievements. Also, I don't think they say exactly how "softcapping" works.
posted by mhum at 4:31 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
Meanwhile, my main complaint about the game is how opaque it is about what things affect what. I really don't know what pathogen or cadaver generation rates are based on, especially since it seems a bunch of these dependencies are a result of certain achievements. Also, I don't think they say exactly how "softcapping" works.
posted by mhum at 4:31 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
I’m working on Infinity now, and I’ve concluded that the game is a Dark God Training Simulator.
You basically learn how to manipulate time, then use that knowledge to work your way beyond the physical confines of the known universe, after which you begin sacrificing billions of cadavers to enhance your own life essence.
posted by darkstar at 5:29 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
You basically learn how to manipulate time, then use that knowledge to work your way beyond the physical confines of the known universe, after which you begin sacrificing billions of cadavers to enhance your own life essence.
posted by darkstar at 5:29 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
This got dark fast.
posted by dmh at 5:41 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by dmh at 5:41 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
Here's a tip: resetting your rockets to get rocket fuel doesn't reset anything else. What that means is, you shouldn't push the "gain rocket fuel" button as soon as you can -- wait a few seconds. Right after you push it, you can push the "gain rockets" button.
posted by CrunchyFrog at 5:55 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by CrunchyFrog at 5:55 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
I feel like having the main loop built around resetting progress endlessly violates a basic tenet of game design.
This is what really screwed me up when I tried to play a Dead Rising game for the first time. I got so frustrated when I would inevitably die a few hours into the game, and I would always go back to my last save to figure out what I did wrong. It was incredibly punishing and hostile and I hated it.
Until I discovered that every time you die, you become that much stronger in your next playthrough, and actually dying a whole bunch was part of the game's progression loop. Once I figured that out and learned not to fear death, everything became so much better. I think it's a totally viable gameplay loop, it's just not obvious to someone like me who up until that point had never even heard the term "roguelike."
Back to Distance Incremental: it takes a lot of attention for the game to start revealing layers of itself, and honestly not in a good way. I feel like incrementals work best when they try to stick or swap between one of two zones: short bursts of intensive activity (do a whole bunch of stuff over the course of an hour or less) or long periods of little activity but measurable progress (you have to let the game sit for a few hours/overnight, but when you wake up you'll have more power in X way). In the early game Distance Incremental is stuck between the two zones: you can't interact with it very often, but you have to interact with it on a regular basis just to move things forward, and there's precious little feedback on whether you're actually making any progress towards unlocking the next "thing," whatever it is. I unlocked rockets and built a bunch, and as far as I can tell this has had no measurable impact on the game's progression.
posted by chrominance at 6:07 PM on August 7, 2020
This is what really screwed me up when I tried to play a Dead Rising game for the first time. I got so frustrated when I would inevitably die a few hours into the game, and I would always go back to my last save to figure out what I did wrong. It was incredibly punishing and hostile and I hated it.
Until I discovered that every time you die, you become that much stronger in your next playthrough, and actually dying a whole bunch was part of the game's progression loop. Once I figured that out and learned not to fear death, everything became so much better. I think it's a totally viable gameplay loop, it's just not obvious to someone like me who up until that point had never even heard the term "roguelike."
Back to Distance Incremental: it takes a lot of attention for the game to start revealing layers of itself, and honestly not in a good way. I feel like incrementals work best when they try to stick or swap between one of two zones: short bursts of intensive activity (do a whole bunch of stuff over the course of an hour or less) or long periods of little activity but measurable progress (you have to let the game sit for a few hours/overnight, but when you wake up you'll have more power in X way). In the early game Distance Incremental is stuck between the two zones: you can't interact with it very often, but you have to interact with it on a regular basis just to move things forward, and there's precious little feedback on whether you're actually making any progress towards unlocking the next "thing," whatever it is. I unlocked rockets and built a bunch, and as far as I can tell this has had no measurable impact on the game's progression.
posted by chrominance at 6:07 PM on August 7, 2020
(which is to say: back to NGU Idle and Kittens Game, where I just finished True Cathammer 40k and have forgotten how to play the game)
posted by chrominance at 6:08 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by chrominance at 6:08 PM on August 7, 2020
Does anyone know how to generate Dark Matter? I can't figure it out.
posted by codacorolla at 6:23 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by codacorolla at 6:23 PM on August 7, 2020
Welp, I blew through a few hours and just reached Infinity, but I’ll be damned if I do this four more times...
posted by darkstar at 6:29 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by darkstar at 6:29 PM on August 7, 2020
codacorolla, just buy a Dark Core and it'll start ticking.
posted by dragstroke at 6:30 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by dragstroke at 6:30 PM on August 7, 2020 [2 favorites]
On the other hand, your upgrades to automation are retained after Infinity, making the second run-through faster.
posted by darkstar at 6:33 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by darkstar at 6:33 PM on August 7, 2020
There was an AI built to last
Who walked the frontier called the last
If 'is' follows 'ought'
It'll do what they thought
In the end we all
posted by BiggerJ at 7:07 PM on August 7, 2020
Who walked the frontier called the last
If 'is' follows 'ought'
It'll do what they thought
In the end we all
posted by BiggerJ at 7:07 PM on August 7, 2020
I'll second that it's not always clear enough where the numbers are coming from. I'd like to know what it is that we have to trade in, specifically, to get cadavers. And what determines how much intelligence you gain in a second.
posted by KChasm at 7:34 PM on August 7, 2020
posted by KChasm at 7:34 PM on August 7, 2020
these games are such absolute crack. i had to clear cookies out to make it stop. what is it about this kind of game that makes my brain freak the f out?
posted by n9 at 8:21 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by n9 at 8:21 PM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]
n9:
> what is it about this kind of game that makes my brain freak the f out?
They are essentially Skinner boxes and we're the pigeons... I mean I still play them, but realizing this is helpful.
Here is a video of a game designer talking about this
posted by pknodle at 12:10 AM on August 8, 2020
> what is it about this kind of game that makes my brain freak the f out?
They are essentially Skinner boxes and we're the pigeons... I mean I still play them, but realizing this is helpful.
Here is a video of a game designer talking about this
posted by pknodle at 12:10 AM on August 8, 2020
I am only reading the comment thread here, but now I would like to hire Rudy Rucker to design a browser game involving construction of transfinite ordinals.
posted by away for regrooving at 1:12 AM on August 8, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by away for regrooving at 1:12 AM on August 8, 2020 [3 favorites]
I thought the fuel bot low-N cadavers was a really dull part and dropped it. The fuel bot has the unfortunate habit of taking rocket fuel ASAP, when the right thing is to take it when your available rockets ~ the threshold for fuel and then take the rockets (and take rockets about every time they 2x your current stock). That created a lot of extra clicking and slowed it down. Going from ~ 25 cadavers to pathogens seemed like such a tedious haul that I wans't willing to give it a shot. You have to click a bunch of rocket stages and time cube generation for each collapse ...
posted by a robot made out of meat at 6:55 AM on August 8, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by a robot made out of meat at 6:55 AM on August 8, 2020 [1 favorite]
Well, I must be damned, because contrary to my assertion that I wouldn’t play the game four more times, I played it through 5 more iterations of Infinity endorsements to get to Ascension, and then 10 more (!) to unlock Stadium. After doing one of the Stadium challenges, I finally, after about ten hours, decided I’d had enough and went to get the eye drops.
I agree with a robot, above: fuelbot sweeps your rockets too quickly into fuel. I also agree with the general algorithm of waiting until you have about as many rockets queued in manufacturing as you do currently in existence. Then, as CrunchyFrog suggests, you convert the rockets to fuel, and immediately manufacture a roughly equivalent amount From the queue to replace them. This prevents you from losing speed by converting your rockets away.
I used a similar algorithm for cadavers to life essence. Queue about as many cadavers as you currently have. Then convert cadavers to life essence, and immediately manufacture a roughly similar amount of cadavers from the queue.
In later Infinity endorsement iterations it’s less important, because you unlock functions that create fuel, rockets and cadavers without you specifically manufacturing them.
One note for those of you playing on iPad: once you reach Infinity the first time, it unlocks an Infinity button on the far right of the menu bar. The budding doesn’t show on my iPad unless I intentionally scroll over to it. So I didn’t see that button for my second and third Infinity endorsement. Which made those iterations a lot longer (on the order of an hour each). But if you find and click on that button, it opens up advancement options that significantly speed along the iteration. My fourth iteration only took about 15-20 minutes because of those advancements.
———
Oh my god, I just clicked on the link again and my data is still there and it’s churning away. Halp!
posted by darkstar at 9:45 AM on August 8, 2020
I agree with a robot, above: fuelbot sweeps your rockets too quickly into fuel. I also agree with the general algorithm of waiting until you have about as many rockets queued in manufacturing as you do currently in existence. Then, as CrunchyFrog suggests, you convert the rockets to fuel, and immediately manufacture a roughly equivalent amount From the queue to replace them. This prevents you from losing speed by converting your rockets away.
I used a similar algorithm for cadavers to life essence. Queue about as many cadavers as you currently have. Then convert cadavers to life essence, and immediately manufacture a roughly similar amount of cadavers from the queue.
In later Infinity endorsement iterations it’s less important, because you unlock functions that create fuel, rockets and cadavers without you specifically manufacturing them.
One note for those of you playing on iPad: once you reach Infinity the first time, it unlocks an Infinity button on the far right of the menu bar. The budding doesn’t show on my iPad unless I intentionally scroll over to it. So I didn’t see that button for my second and third Infinity endorsement. Which made those iterations a lot longer (on the order of an hour each). But if you find and click on that button, it opens up advancement options that significantly speed along the iteration. My fourth iteration only took about 15-20 minutes because of those advancements.
———
Oh my god, I just clicked on the link again and my data is still there and it’s churning away. Halp!
posted by darkstar at 9:45 AM on August 8, 2020
I agree with a robot, above: fuelbot sweeps your rockets too quickly into fuel
This is true for a little while, but like so many things in this game, it doesn't really take that long for it to be rendered irrelevant by the power of non-linearities.
posted by advil at 2:42 PM on August 8, 2020
This is true for a little while, but like so many things in this game, it doesn't really take that long for it to be rendered irrelevant by the power of non-linearities.
posted by advil at 2:42 PM on August 8, 2020
I hit infinity and I'm angry now.
posted by KChasm at 2:15 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by KChasm at 2:15 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
The Stadium challenges — especially the Infinity challenge — were clearly designed by someone who hates humanity. All those cadavers are beginning to make sense, now.
posted by darkstar at 3:45 AM on August 9, 2020
posted by darkstar at 3:45 AM on August 9, 2020
This isn’t a game; it’s a chore.
posted by jayb3369 at 4:32 AM on August 9, 2020 [2 favorites]
posted by jayb3369 at 4:32 AM on August 9, 2020 [2 favorites]
Okay, I realized that my blogging down in the Stadium challenges was because I just hadn’t advanced enough in Infinity endorsements yet. So I went back to focus on that and advanced to the Pantheon fairly quickly. Then went back and the Stadium challenges were much easier.
Got to Derivatives shortly afterward, and then the scary Elementary, which asked if I reeeeeally wanted to do it. But the boost it gives you makes starting over relatively painless. After the Elenentary reset, the first Infinity came in about 60 seconds.
So yeah, I’m pretty much sucked in here and I blame all of you.
posted by darkstar at 5:39 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
Got to Derivatives shortly afterward, and then the scary Elementary, which asked if I reeeeeally wanted to do it. But the boost it gives you makes starting over relatively painless. After the Elenentary reset, the first Infinity came in about 60 seconds.
So yeah, I’m pretty much sucked in here and I blame all of you.
posted by darkstar at 5:39 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
Interesting article here on the math of these incremental games, and trying to balance a game with incredibly large numbers.
posted by darkstar at 6:14 AM on August 9, 2020
posted by darkstar at 6:14 AM on August 9, 2020
I must be daft. How do you export and save your game so that you don't lose everything when you close the browser? I click on the Export button and just get a blue notification that the save was exported, but I don't know where it is so I can later Import it.
posted by CancerMan at 10:08 AM on August 9, 2020
posted by CancerMan at 10:08 AM on August 9, 2020
I click on the Export button and just get a blue notification that the save was exported, but I don't know where it is so I can later Import it.
It copies it to your clipboard, you can paste to a text editor. (This is standard for these types of games so that's how I figured this out, but it never actually indicates that this is what it's done!)
posted by advil at 10:14 AM on August 9, 2020
It copies it to your clipboard, you can paste to a text editor. (This is standard for these types of games so that's how I figured this out, but it never actually indicates that this is what it's done!)
posted by advil at 10:14 AM on August 9, 2020
“You have 1.8812e6.0582e+4 cadavers“
Has anyone broken through the plateau around 41 endorsements? Right now I'm just accumulating a lot of elemental particles, but I'm wondering if there's a trick that I've missed, because at basically no other point in this game has this kind of waiting been the optimal thing to do. (Although, let's be honest, my clicking hand needs the break...)
posted by advil at 10:56 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
Has anyone broken through the plateau around 41 endorsements? Right now I'm just accumulating a lot of elemental particles, but I'm wondering if there's a trick that I've missed, because at basically no other point in this game has this kind of waiting been the optimal thing to do. (Although, let's be honest, my clicking hand needs the break...)
posted by advil at 10:56 AM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
I’m kind of in the same boat and you’re right, this plateau is beginning to seem odd.
I’m repeatedly bogging down at 38 infinity endorsements. I’ve gotten here six times, realized how long the exponential progress would take, and like you did an Elementary reset for the particles. I have about 100 Fermions and 100 Bosons.
I’m letting it churn unattended so the Boson count will unlock a new row of Infinity upgrades, hoping that will help me advance. Needs to churn for ten more minutes, then I’ll reset again and see if that helps.
Speaking of which, I have no grasp on which is the better Quark to have active. I’ve left it on Rockets, which is intuitively helpful. I get a nagging sense that I should try to optimize things by switching it to a different type. But I’ve lost a clear picture of how or whether one is better than the other, particularly with softcapping in play.
Similarly unsure about best use of Leptons, but I have them boosting Quarks (which are boosting Rockets).
(Mercifully not having to micromanage Infinity, Ascension, or Stadium any more.)
posted by darkstar at 12:25 PM on August 9, 2020
I’m repeatedly bogging down at 38 infinity endorsements. I’ve gotten here six times, realized how long the exponential progress would take, and like you did an Elementary reset for the particles. I have about 100 Fermions and 100 Bosons.
I’m letting it churn unattended so the Boson count will unlock a new row of Infinity upgrades, hoping that will help me advance. Needs to churn for ten more minutes, then I’ll reset again and see if that helps.
Speaking of which, I have no grasp on which is the better Quark to have active. I’ve left it on Rockets, which is intuitively helpful. I get a nagging sense that I should try to optimize things by switching it to a different type. But I’ve lost a clear picture of how or whether one is better than the other, particularly with softcapping in play.
Similarly unsure about best use of Leptons, but I have them boosting Quarks (which are boosting Rockets).
(Mercifully not having to micromanage Infinity, Ascension, or Stadium any more.)
posted by darkstar at 12:25 PM on August 9, 2020
I’m letting it churn unattended so the Boson count will unlock a new row of Infinity upgrades, hoping that will help me advance. Needs to churn for ten more minutes, then I’ll reset again and see if that helps.
I was able to sort of power through this and do all the higgs boson upgrades, where eventually you get something that manages elementary resets for you, this got me from around 38 to 40 in the first few seconds. Then from 40-42 I was able to do some active management of quarks to get up to 42, with a max of ~200 EPs per reset. But it's a slog to get to this and I'm extremely plateaued there. Right now I'm struggling for enough photons for level 1 of the double EP gain. Around 10k fermions and bosons each.
Speaking of which, I have no grasp on which is the better Quark to have active. I’ve left it on Rockets, which is intuitively helpful. I get a nagging sense that I should try to optimize things by switching it to a different type. But I’ve lost a clear picture of how or whether one is better than the other, particularly with softcapping in play.
I'm not really sure either but I *think* the two knowledge boosts are the best combo I've found for grinding EPs. Once you max out knowledge and ascension upgrades are out of sight, I can't really tell the difference between them though. I kind of suspect this could be where there's something non-obvious.
posted by advil at 12:46 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
I was able to sort of power through this and do all the higgs boson upgrades, where eventually you get something that manages elementary resets for you, this got me from around 38 to 40 in the first few seconds. Then from 40-42 I was able to do some active management of quarks to get up to 42, with a max of ~200 EPs per reset. But it's a slog to get to this and I'm extremely plateaued there. Right now I'm struggling for enough photons for level 1 of the double EP gain. Around 10k fermions and bosons each.
Speaking of which, I have no grasp on which is the better Quark to have active. I’ve left it on Rockets, which is intuitively helpful. I get a nagging sense that I should try to optimize things by switching it to a different type. But I’ve lost a clear picture of how or whether one is better than the other, particularly with softcapping in play.
I'm not really sure either but I *think* the two knowledge boosts are the best combo I've found for grinding EPs. Once you max out knowledge and ascension upgrades are out of sight, I can't really tell the difference between them though. I kind of suspect this could be where there's something non-obvious.
posted by advil at 12:46 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
Ah, no, that latest Boson upgrade didn’t help. The upgrades in that extra row require Knowledge ten orders of magnitude higher than I currently have, which isn’t happening at current rates.
There’s another Boson upgrade that boosts Ascension and Knowledge, so I’ll wait another 10 minutes to see if that helps.
On preview: I’ll follow your lead and go back to Elementary Resets after this next Boson upgrade, just to grind more particles. I’ll also tweak Quarks/Leptons to see if I can boost Knowledge.
posted by darkstar at 12:46 PM on August 9, 2020
There’s another Boson upgrade that boosts Ascension and Knowledge, so I’ll wait another 10 minutes to see if that helps.
On preview: I’ll follow your lead and go back to Elementary Resets after this next Boson upgrade, just to grind more particles. I’ll also tweak Quarks/Leptons to see if I can boost Knowledge.
posted by darkstar at 12:46 PM on August 9, 2020
The upgrades in that extra row require Knowledge ten orders of magnitude higher than I currently have, which isn’t happening at current rates.
I think that if you pick the charm quark and the tau lepton you should be able to start making a dent in these; it took me a long while (comparatively speaking) to be able to get all of them though.
posted by advil at 12:55 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
I think that if you pick the charm quark and the tau lepton you should be able to start making a dent in these; it took me a long while (comparatively speaking) to be able to get all of them though.
posted by advil at 12:55 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
That other Boson upgrade did it. It boosted Knowledge fairly quickly ten orders of magnitude, allowing a rapid cascade of unlocking that new row of Infinity upgrades. Made it to 40 endorsements fairly quickly.
Then tweaked the Quarks to Charmed to boost Knowledge. Currently 1.48% toward unlocking Theory...
posted by darkstar at 1:00 PM on August 9, 2020
Then tweaked the Quarks to Charmed to boost Knowledge. Currently 1.48% toward unlocking Theory...
posted by darkstar at 1:00 PM on August 9, 2020
Now just waiting until it gets up to 40 Endorsements and then clicking on Elementary reset to get about 71 particles. Half to Fermions and half to Bosons.
This Elementary cycle goes fast, within about a minute. When I hit 40 endorsements, just before I reset, I register about 4.3% towards Theory.
I think I’m at that plateau you were talking about a couple of hours ago. Just grinding particles now...
posted by darkstar at 1:27 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
This Elementary cycle goes fast, within about a minute. When I hit 40 endorsements, just before I reset, I register about 4.3% towards Theory.
I think I’m at that plateau you were talking about a couple of hours ago. Just grinding particles now...
posted by darkstar at 1:27 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
I think I’m at that plateau you were talking about a couple of hours ago.
Well, I think you were at the beginning of the same plateau, it all felt pretty continuous. Overall it does seem like around the elementary upgrade, the pace shifts to slightly more of an idle game.
At this point, I think that it'll be pretty doable to get to 1000 EP in a run just by getting to level 3 of the photon upgrade that doubles EP gain (so that around 42 endorsements will be over 1000 EP); the numbers remain tractable as you upgrade that one, and from where I'm at it should be possible to get there just by walking away for a bit. Not sure about the distance requirement for theory though, I'm still quite a bit short. One other thing I noticed is that ascension power contributes to gauge bosons, for longer runs where I'm trying to grind out these upgrades I've been targeting ascension power with quarks.
posted by advil at 1:51 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
Well, I think you were at the beginning of the same plateau, it all felt pretty continuous. Overall it does seem like around the elementary upgrade, the pace shifts to slightly more of an idle game.
At this point, I think that it'll be pretty doable to get to 1000 EP in a run just by getting to level 3 of the photon upgrade that doubles EP gain (so that around 42 endorsements will be over 1000 EP); the numbers remain tractable as you upgrade that one, and from where I'm at it should be possible to get there just by walking away for a bit. Not sure about the distance requirement for theory though, I'm still quite a bit short. One other thing I noticed is that ascension power contributes to gauge bosons, for longer runs where I'm trying to grind out these upgrades I've been targeting ascension power with quarks.
posted by advil at 1:51 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
hahaha well here's one thing that explains why quarks and leptons are so confusing:
https://github.com/Jacorb90/DistInc.github.io/issues/23 "Lepton buffs have a negative increase instead of positive"
I noticed this for perks and went looking, and the report says perks, pathogen, and derivative boosts. It definitely seems to me like this bug does *not* apply to all of them, I'm pretty sure knowledge works right as does quark gain. Not sure about the cadaver one.
posted by advil at 2:43 PM on August 9, 2020 [2 favorites]
https://github.com/Jacorb90/DistInc.github.io/issues/23 "Lepton buffs have a negative increase instead of positive"
I noticed this for perks and went looking, and the report says perks, pathogen, and derivative boosts. It definitely seems to me like this bug does *not* apply to all of them, I'm pretty sure knowledge works right as does quark gain. Not sure about the cadaver one.
posted by advil at 2:43 PM on August 9, 2020 [2 favorites]
I got my first fermion last night, and can't seem to get to 2nd infinity now. Maybe I need to read the Pathogen upgrades instead of just hitting Max All every time.
posted by Marticus at 5:33 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Marticus at 5:33 PM on August 9, 2020 [1 favorite]
As I recall, for the first few EP resets, there were a few fiddly things you have to do about that point, though I don’t recall specifically which ones they were. But I recall having to make sure the various bots and automation were turned on.
I did eventually hit Max All on Pathogens, but don’t recall at what point it became the thing to do. At some point, though, it’ll be obvious, because the second you tap on one Pathogen upgrade, another will open up.
posted by darkstar at 7:32 PM on August 9, 2020
I did eventually hit Max All on Pathogens, but don’t recall at what point it became the thing to do. At some point, though, it’ll be obvious, because the second you tap on one Pathogen upgrade, another will open up.
posted by darkstar at 7:32 PM on August 9, 2020
So I just had a breakthrough and now at 42 Endorsements.
I basically followed your suggestion, advil, and started focusing on Photons. After grinding EP for an hour or so, I just let it sit for a while. Eventually, I accumulated enough Photons to go to Level 1 on Double Photon and Gluon again. Then I let it keep going for a while longer, accumulating enough Photons to go to level 3 on the Boost Knowledge Gain by 50%.
Together, that the Knowledge gain sufficiently upgraded to gain several more Infinity Upgrades, leading to enough Higgs Bosons to make the last two upgrades. Those swiftly leveled me to 42 Endorsements.
And I was just able to level up the Double EP gain to Level 1, so it’s sitting at 359 EP in the queue, with 6.16% toward Theory.
I’m at another plateau here, but I think this is what it’s going to take: just let it spin up resources for a while, make a small tweak, and repeat. But it definitely feels like a different game dynamic at this stage, compared with those first 40 Endorsements.
posted by darkstar at 9:11 PM on August 9, 2020
I basically followed your suggestion, advil, and started focusing on Photons. After grinding EP for an hour or so, I just let it sit for a while. Eventually, I accumulated enough Photons to go to Level 1 on Double Photon and Gluon again. Then I let it keep going for a while longer, accumulating enough Photons to go to level 3 on the Boost Knowledge Gain by 50%.
Together, that the Knowledge gain sufficiently upgraded to gain several more Infinity Upgrades, leading to enough Higgs Bosons to make the last two upgrades. Those swiftly leveled me to 42 Endorsements.
And I was just able to level up the Double EP gain to Level 1, so it’s sitting at 359 EP in the queue, with 6.16% toward Theory.
I’m at another plateau here, but I think this is what it’s going to take: just let it spin up resources for a while, make a small tweak, and repeat. But it definitely feels like a different game dynamic at this stage, compared with those first 40 Endorsements.
posted by darkstar at 9:11 PM on August 9, 2020
Whoa! I just noticed something.
The distance (uni) requirement to reach in order to gain the next Endorsement is suddenly a changing value. And it’s decreasing!
posted by darkstar at 10:04 PM on August 9, 2020
The distance (uni) requirement to reach in order to gain the next Endorsement is suddenly a changing value. And it’s decreasing!
posted by darkstar at 10:04 PM on August 9, 2020
Aaaand now the requirement for being endorsed is increasing. Like, by a lot. How can you level up when the level-up requirement is rapidly increasing?
I’m not even sure what is going on at this point. Is the game still bugged?
Meanwhile, I’m just grinding Elementaries. About 740 per cycle. Just before I reset each time, I’m about 55% toward Theory. But I don’t see how I can level past 42 with the increasing level-up bar.
posted by darkstar at 5:04 AM on August 10, 2020
I’m not even sure what is going on at this point. Is the game still bugged?
Meanwhile, I’m just grinding Elementaries. About 740 per cycle. Just before I reset each time, I’m about 55% toward Theory. But I don’t see how I can level past 42 with the increasing level-up bar.
posted by darkstar at 5:04 AM on August 10, 2020
Update: I grinded (ground?) fermions and bosons to about 20,000 of each, then just let it sit for an hour.
Surprisingly, the EP queue is up to 2100 particles, and I’m at 97.2% of Theory.
So I think I’ll just let it sit for a few more hours and see how this goes.
posted by darkstar at 5:59 AM on August 10, 2020
Surprisingly, the EP queue is up to 2100 particles, and I’m at 97.2% of Theory.
So I think I’ll just let it sit for a few more hours and see how this goes.
posted by darkstar at 5:59 AM on August 10, 2020
How long have you been playing? I've had this spinning since Saturday afternoon and the 15 most recent posts above read like complete gibberish.
posted by ardgedee at 6:44 AM on August 10, 2020 [3 favorites]
posted by ardgedee at 6:44 AM on August 10, 2020 [3 favorites]
Update: I grinded (ground?) fermions and bosons to about 20,000 of each, then just let it sit for an hour.
Surprisingly, the EP queue is up to 2100 particles, and I’m at 97.2% of Theory.
I meant to leave it overnight and my computer went to sleep. So I'm still stuck in roughly the same place, where I get to around 90% of theory with 42 endorsements; sounds like you broke one step past where I'm at currently. I suspect I need to get some of my photon upgrades that are the closest up one more step.
Aaaand now the requirement for being endorsed is increasing.
I haven't seen this happening -- at 42 endorsements it is very slowly decreasing. So maybe a bug?
posted by advil at 6:57 AM on August 10, 2020
Surprisingly, the EP queue is up to 2100 particles, and I’m at 97.2% of Theory.
I meant to leave it overnight and my computer went to sleep. So I'm still stuck in roughly the same place, where I get to around 90% of theory with 42 endorsements; sounds like you broke one step past where I'm at currently. I suspect I need to get some of my photon upgrades that are the closest up one more step.
Aaaand now the requirement for being endorsed is increasing.
I haven't seen this happening -- at 42 endorsements it is very slowly decreasing. So maybe a bug?
posted by advil at 6:57 AM on August 10, 2020
Well, I just unlocked theory sort of accidentally -- the trick wasn't at all what I was expecting, but I noticed that scaled derivative boost 8 was in reach with knowledge boosts, and it happened basically instantly once I got this one.
posted by advil at 7:51 AM on August 10, 2020
posted by advil at 7:51 AM on August 10, 2020
ardgedee: there’s a new menu button and area that unlocks somewhere around your 35th (?) Infinity Endorsement, called Elementary.
In Elementary, you can do an Elementary Reset that will manufacture Elementary Particles. You then can choose whether to make those EPs either Fermions or Bosons, and their various particle subtypes (e.g., quarks, leptons, photons, etc.). Those particles give you buffs.
Once you have unlocked the Elementary area, it tells you how close you are to unlocking the next area, which is called Theory. I’m plateauing at about 92% progress toward Theory, but advil just broke through.
Congrats advil! I’ll have to try working on that Scaled Derivative Boost 8.
posted by darkstar at 10:04 AM on August 10, 2020
In Elementary, you can do an Elementary Reset that will manufacture Elementary Particles. You then can choose whether to make those EPs either Fermions or Bosons, and their various particle subtypes (e.g., quarks, leptons, photons, etc.). Those particles give you buffs.
Once you have unlocked the Elementary area, it tells you how close you are to unlocking the next area, which is called Theory. I’m plateauing at about 92% progress toward Theory, but advil just broke through.
Congrats advil! I’ll have to try working on that Scaled Derivative Boost 8.
posted by darkstar at 10:04 AM on August 10, 2020
Ok, I think I might have messed something up. I finally got to Theory (mainly by grinding Elementary Particles, I think) but then I exited my first Theoriverse run with only one Theory Point and now I can't see how to make any progress. When I enter the Theoriverse at depth 2, whatever nerfing happens in these Theory runs is keeping me from getting past 36 endorsements and inf9;9 upgrades. I tried grinding more EPs (~9e5 Fermions, ~3e6 Bosons, level 5 pathogen gain and knowledge gain) but it doesn't seem to be helping.
I'd probably be relieved if I somehow accidentally got myself into a no-win state in this game so I could finally be free from this curse.... buuuut... if anyone has a clue or hint on how to progress, I wouldn't turn it down.
posted by mhum at 10:14 AM on August 10, 2020
I'd probably be relieved if I somehow accidentally got myself into a no-win state in this game so I could finally be free from this curse.... buuuut... if anyone has a clue or hint on how to progress, I wouldn't turn it down.
posted by mhum at 10:14 AM on August 10, 2020
advil, I just checked and my Scaled Derivative Boost is on level 6. I’m so far away from level 7, I don’t see how 8 could ever be possible without doing something significantly different from what I’m doing.
Like mhum, I may just have to go back to grinding Elementaries. >:-/
mhum, I wish I could be of help, but I can’t even see you from where I am, anymore. *sigh*
posted by darkstar at 10:21 AM on August 10, 2020
Like mhum, I may just have to go back to grinding Elementaries. >:-/
mhum, I wish I could be of help, but I can’t even see you from where I am, anymore. *sigh*
posted by darkstar at 10:21 AM on August 10, 2020
Like mhum, I may just have to go back to grinding Elementaries. >:-/
I had about 2e5 of each at that point, so if you aren't around there you might just need more EPs? I'm not actually sure what all I did to get to this point because it wasn't something I was aiming for and when I had previously checked, it also seemed completely out of the realm of possibility for me.
I'd probably be relieved if I somehow accidentally got myself into a no-win state in this game so I could finally be free from this curse.... buuuut... if anyone has a clue or hint on how to progress, I wouldn't turn it down.
Also just about where I'm at...1 theory point to play with, and I have moved it around a bit to different effects, but I'm not sure how much difference this is making. There's also that a few achievements kicking around that might conceivably be within range soon?
posted by advil at 10:28 AM on August 10, 2020
I had about 2e5 of each at that point, so if you aren't around there you might just need more EPs? I'm not actually sure what all I did to get to this point because it wasn't something I was aiming for and when I had previously checked, it also seemed completely out of the realm of possibility for me.
I'd probably be relieved if I somehow accidentally got myself into a no-win state in this game so I could finally be free from this curse.... buuuut... if anyone has a clue or hint on how to progress, I wouldn't turn it down.
Also just about where I'm at...1 theory point to play with, and I have moved it around a bit to different effects, but I'm not sure how much difference this is making. There's also that a few achievements kicking around that might conceivably be within range soon?
posted by advil at 10:28 AM on August 10, 2020
Is there a point to having more than 1e+4 life essences?
posted by ardgedee at 10:30 AM on August 10, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 10:30 AM on August 10, 2020
Is there a point to having more than 1e+4 life essences?
At that point life essence boosts cadaver gain (softcapped), and cadaver count does a lot of stuff, so the answer is probably yes depending on the exact circumstances (I'm not sure offhand when it is going to be the *most* useful thing to focus on though).
posted by advil at 10:39 AM on August 10, 2020
At that point life essence boosts cadaver gain (softcapped), and cadaver count does a lot of stuff, so the answer is probably yes depending on the exact circumstances (I'm not sure offhand when it is going to be the *most* useful thing to focus on though).
posted by advil at 10:39 AM on August 10, 2020
Yeah, I long ago lost an intuitive grasp of how all of the buffs interact. It’s half black magic, now.
I’ll stick to grinding EPs for a while.
posted by darkstar at 10:58 AM on August 10, 2020
I’ll stick to grinding EPs for a while.
posted by darkstar at 10:58 AM on August 10, 2020
Yeah, it's obvious that cadavers boost things (primarily time lapsed per tick), but the utility of life essences is pretty obscure. I wondered if I was missing something.
posted by ardgedee at 11:06 AM on August 10, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 11:06 AM on August 10, 2020
I’m so far away from level 7, I don’t see how 8 could ever be possible without doing something significantly different from what I’m doing.
I think I meant 7 and not 8 here -- was going by the number on the button, which is (I take it) the next level, not the current level.
posted by advil at 11:39 AM on August 10, 2020
I think I meant 7 and not 8 here -- was going by the number on the button, which is (I take it) the next level, not the current level.
posted by advil at 11:39 AM on August 10, 2020
Oh thank heavens! Yeah, my number in parentheses is (7) right now. But I’m not sure if that’s the one I’m on, or the one that it will get me to, when I click on the button once it unlocks.
But it sounds like I’m not as far from where you were, which is a relief.
posted by darkstar at 12:46 PM on August 10, 2020
But it sounds like I’m not as far from where you were, which is a relief.
posted by darkstar at 12:46 PM on August 10, 2020
Oh wait. It looks like I spoke too soon. Somehow, I accidentally left a Theoriverse run active when I went out for lunch and when I came back, I had 4 new Theory Points (but endorsements were still stuck at 36). I assumed I would only get new Theory Points on new endorsements, but clearly that's not the case and I'm not sure why I assumed that. Although, now I realize I have no idea what exactly creates Theory Points so I have no idea what I should be trying to optimize here.
posted by mhum at 1:14 PM on August 10, 2020
posted by mhum at 1:14 PM on August 10, 2020
I let the theoriverse run overnight and never got through the elemental run, so I'm stuck at 1 theory with no way forward.
1 have 1e16 quarks and leptons set to gain knowledge, 2e5 fermions, 6e5 bosons, yadda yadda. This all seems like it should be enough, but the elemental run stalls at 36 endorsements. I've let it run there for hours, no progress at all. Gonna walk away from it, which is fine with me.
Wish this game was like the meat-based thingy which would run without actually being open.
posted by maxwelton at 3:45 PM on August 10, 2020
1 have 1e16 quarks and leptons set to gain knowledge, 2e5 fermions, 6e5 bosons, yadda yadda. This all seems like it should be enough, but the elemental run stalls at 36 endorsements. I've let it run there for hours, no progress at all. Gonna walk away from it, which is fine with me.
Wish this game was like the meat-based thingy which would run without actually being open.
posted by maxwelton at 3:45 PM on August 10, 2020
I am not playing but I am loving reading all the comments, please continue to post your adventures, brave incrementalists!
posted by curious nu at 4:13 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by curious nu at 4:13 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
So, under the heading of "maybe bugs", I was hard plateaued pretty much all day at (edit: trying to break through) theory depth 2 with no sign of being even close to more theory points; I tried all sorts of things, grinded out 1e7 each of fermions and bosons, etc. Then, it occurred to me that I had been using the same browser window for like 2 days straight. So, I tried closing the window, exiting the browser, and restarting. It happened that the last autosave had been before exiting out of a theoriverse...and what do I see on restarting, but "Exit the theoriverse to gain 4 theory points"...
posted by advil at 7:01 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by advil at 7:01 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Huh. Yeah, I was hung up on elementaries with no clear progression other than maybe letting it idle grind through 90% of whatever, so I saved, exported, quit chrome and restarted and _bang_ theoriverse.
posted by Kyol at 7:08 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Kyol at 7:08 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Good to know. Probably a good idea to restart the game new each day, just in case they’ve done any bug fixes or updates. I’ll try it myself.
Otherwise, I’m at 42 endorsements, but pretty much stuck at 91% toward Theory. But I only have 1e5 of each of Fermions and Bosons. So clearly, based on your comments, I need to get back to the grindstone and up those EP numbers considerable.
posted by darkstar at 7:11 PM on August 10, 2020
Otherwise, I’m at 42 endorsements, but pretty much stuck at 91% toward Theory. But I only have 1e5 of each of Fermions and Bosons. So clearly, based on your comments, I need to get back to the grindstone and up those EP numbers considerable.
posted by darkstar at 7:11 PM on August 10, 2020
Holy Cats — the game restart worked!!!
“All features unlocked!”
No Theory Points, though. Just the opportunity to enter the Theoriverse at depth 0...
...and within 1 minute, earned a Theory Point!
posted by darkstar at 7:15 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
“All features unlocked!”
No Theory Points, though. Just the opportunity to enter the Theoriverse at depth 0...
...and within 1 minute, earned a Theory Point!
posted by darkstar at 7:15 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Aand, I was just able to repeat this to finish theory depth 3, pretty much immediately (where again, nothing seemed to be happening without restarting). Did not work for depth 4, so I guess it's not actually a bug that's letting me cheat.
But I only have 1e5 of each of Fermions and Bosons.
I don't remember how much I had then, but I think it was a bit more than this, and not a huge amount more.
posted by advil at 7:17 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
But I only have 1e5 of each of Fermions and Bosons.
I don't remember how much I had then, but I think it was a bit more than this, and not a huge amount more.
posted by advil at 7:17 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Yeah, I was maxing out my elementary runs around 42 endorsements for 2k-ish EPs - there's a couple of photon multipliers in there and the gap from 400-ish elementary particles to 2k is a long time coming so my auto-elementary was set to like 380 all afternoon getting me to 385-ish elementary resets. I'm up to 34.965K fermions (t Charm2 quarks and T Tau2 Leptons for ALL THE KNOWLEDGE) and 33.878k bosons and now that I'm in the theoriverse I'm finally making a dent in the gauge boson upgrades. I knocked out all the up-to-10T Higgs Boson scalar boson upgrades a while ago while idling.
And yeah, it feels like maybe there's a bunch of weird corner cases that 1.7 will fix eventually? Kind of fun to this point, though - just enough time doing the clicky dance on resets before you automate past caring about whatever was giving you grief, then you hit a new period of managing the new tier for a bit until you creep over the limit into a brand new tier and it all starts over again. Tedious micro, curious macro until you see how to automate the tedium away and you start working towards the next goal.
I still haven't figured out what the gluons are doing. Maybe they're in supersymmetry? At least I'm finally gaining photons fast enough to matter.
Very skinner. Much box.
posted by Kyol at 7:24 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
And yeah, it feels like maybe there's a bunch of weird corner cases that 1.7 will fix eventually? Kind of fun to this point, though - just enough time doing the clicky dance on resets before you automate past caring about whatever was giving you grief, then you hit a new period of managing the new tier for a bit until you creep over the limit into a brand new tier and it all starts over again. Tedious micro, curious macro until you see how to automate the tedium away and you start working towards the next goal.
I still haven't figured out what the gluons are doing. Maybe they're in supersymmetry? At least I'm finally gaining photons fast enough to matter.
Very skinner. Much box.
posted by Kyol at 7:24 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Agreed on all points. I just went back and noticed that Supersymmetry is now super-buffing the fermions and bosons. So I’m also liking at being able to level those up further, soon.
And yes, this has skinnered the heck out of me.
posted by darkstar at 7:29 PM on August 10, 2020
And yes, this has skinnered the heck out of me.
posted by darkstar at 7:29 PM on August 10, 2020
(and you can kind of sort of see how the things that had been holding you up suddenly are barely blips in the road - the stadium sucked the first time through, but by the 2nd or third I knew how to cheese it and by the 10th it was click click click click and then I unlocked an automation and it was always completed on unlock. Fun! Right now I'm watching my infinity upgrades turn blue then _bang_ reset and start over.)
posted by Kyol at 7:30 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Kyol at 7:30 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Theory depth 3 is currently owning me; Knowledge gain seems to sluggishly rise through the e50s now.
It is very skinner box, lots of frustration and occasional blazing reward boosts.
posted by Marticus at 8:12 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
It is very skinner box, lots of frustration and occasional blazing reward boosts.
posted by Marticus at 8:12 PM on August 10, 2020 [1 favorite]
Same here, Marticus. I enter the Theoriverse at Depth 2 and now my Knowledge is plateauing at about e54.
It says that all pre-Elementary resources are nerfed by being raised to the power of e0.75. But this should be overcome by the Supersymmetric Wave buff multiplying the same resources by e7.
So I’m puzzled...
posted by darkstar at 8:27 PM on August 10, 2020
It says that all pre-Elementary resources are nerfed by being raised to the power of e0.75. But this should be overcome by the Supersymmetric Wave buff multiplying the same resources by e7.
So I’m puzzled...
posted by darkstar at 8:27 PM on August 10, 2020
Now around theoriverse depth 5, and kind of enjoying the upgrades at this point. If any of you get to a point in theory where you're asked to upgrade to something mysterious for theory points and warned you won't get those points back? It's been extremely worth it every time so far.
posted by advil at 5:42 AM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by advil at 5:42 AM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
Automating the Elementary resets doesn’t seem to be working well.
Unlike all of the other automated processes, this one gets to the prearranged threshold and then it pops up a message asking if I really want to do it. So it requires pressing ok at the end of every cycle.
This is not what automated means to me. It should just reach the threshold, auto reset and sweep those EP into the bank, the way it does with fuel.
Is anyone else encountering this issue? Or is it just an iPad thing where this message pops up at the end of every Elementary cycle?
posted by darkstar at 5:10 PM on August 11, 2020
Unlike all of the other automated processes, this one gets to the prearranged threshold and then it pops up a message asking if I really want to do it. So it requires pressing ok at the end of every cycle.
This is not what automated means to me. It should just reach the threshold, auto reset and sweep those EP into the bank, the way it does with fuel.
Is anyone else encountering this issue? Or is it just an iPad thing where this message pops up at the end of every Elementary cycle?
posted by darkstar at 5:10 PM on August 11, 2020
Is anyone else encountering this issue? Or is it just an iPad thing where this message pops up at the end of every Elementary cycle?
Experiencing the same thing on Mac / Chrome.
Theory depth 3 is currently owning me; Knowledge gain seems to sluggishly rise through the e50s now.
Exactly the same problem here. I tried pouring my Theory points into weakening the Theoriverse nerf but it doesn't seem to have helped.
posted by saturday_morning at 5:13 PM on August 11, 2020
Experiencing the same thing on Mac / Chrome.
Theory depth 3 is currently owning me; Knowledge gain seems to sluggishly rise through the e50s now.
Exactly the same problem here. I tried pouring my Theory points into weakening the Theoriverse nerf but it doesn't seem to have helped.
posted by saturday_morning at 5:13 PM on August 11, 2020
Unlike all of the other automated processes, this one gets to the prearranged threshold and then it pops up a message asking if I really want to do it. So it requires pressing ok at the end of every cycle.
I saw this reported as a bug for auto-elementaries so I'm guessing it will be fixed eventually, but it's possible to entirely disable the elementary restart warning popup in the options menu and if you do that it also prevents the popup for auto-elementaries.
Exactly the same problem here. I tried pouring my Theory points into weakening the Theoriverse nerf but it doesn't seem to have helped.
This was exactly the point where I first hit the bug involving restarting, so definitely try restarting your browser after letting the theoriverse run until it seems like there's no more gains and saving, if you haven't yet. Otherwise, (once you've sorted out the popup) idle-collect a lot of EPs and try to do some more boson upgrades?
posted by advil at 5:19 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
I saw this reported as a bug for auto-elementaries so I'm guessing it will be fixed eventually, but it's possible to entirely disable the elementary restart warning popup in the options menu and if you do that it also prevents the popup for auto-elementaries.
Exactly the same problem here. I tried pouring my Theory points into weakening the Theoriverse nerf but it doesn't seem to have helped.
This was exactly the point where I first hit the bug involving restarting, so definitely try restarting your browser after letting the theoriverse run until it seems like there's no more gains and saving, if you haven't yet. Otherwise, (once you've sorted out the popup) idle-collect a lot of EPs and try to do some more boson upgrades?
posted by advil at 5:19 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
Also, I have only now noticed that the game is pausing when it is not in the active tab.
I’m not sure why I thought it was still running when I was tabbing over to do other things. But I’ve just tested it a few times and, on the iPad at least, it’s definitely pausing.
Hmf.
posted by darkstar at 5:19 PM on August 11, 2020
I’m not sure why I thought it was still running when I was tabbing over to do other things. But I’ve just tested it a few times and, on the iPad at least, it’s definitely pausing.
Hmf.
posted by darkstar at 5:19 PM on August 11, 2020
Oh wow, advil — thank you!
Holy cow, I wish I’d known that yesterday. I could have been spinning up EPs all day and night.
Well, better late than never!
posted by darkstar at 5:23 PM on August 11, 2020
Holy cow, I wish I’d known that yesterday. I could have been spinning up EPs all day and night.
Well, better late than never!
posted by darkstar at 5:23 PM on August 11, 2020
Also, I have only now noticed that the game is pausing when it is not in the active tab.
That may be an iOS thing, darkstar; on most desktop browsers the behavior is to degrade an out-tab javascript update interval to 1000ms vs. however-fast the active tab will go, but IIRC iOS (or at least Safari iOS) just suspends JS updates when tabbed out to lower memory/CPU load.
How any given idle game copes with away time for a background tab varies: for some, they're written to more or less perfectly catch up on away time based on time-based modeling; for others, they rely on the periodic updates at whatever-interval and the effective game speed is reduced when you tab away to 1 update per second; still others effectively cease to update at all when you lose focus, on any OS and browser. Just depends on the coding.
(This is also why, if you really want to be sure about idling a game in a tab on desktop, you should kick out the game tab to its own browser window so it'll always be in focus even when minimized.)
posted by cortex at 6:40 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
That may be an iOS thing, darkstar; on most desktop browsers the behavior is to degrade an out-tab javascript update interval to 1000ms vs. however-fast the active tab will go, but IIRC iOS (or at least Safari iOS) just suspends JS updates when tabbed out to lower memory/CPU load.
How any given idle game copes with away time for a background tab varies: for some, they're written to more or less perfectly catch up on away time based on time-based modeling; for others, they rely on the periodic updates at whatever-interval and the effective game speed is reduced when you tab away to 1 update per second; still others effectively cease to update at all when you lose focus, on any OS and browser. Just depends on the coding.
(This is also why, if you really want to be sure about idling a game in a tab on desktop, you should kick out the game tab to its own browser window so it'll always be in focus even when minimized.)
posted by cortex at 6:40 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
And now we're up to v1.7. Bugs squashing ahoy, I'm sure! I'll poke at it a bit, see if it's managing to continue to tickle my interest or if I've hit the point where there are just too many unknown inputs to too many outputs to know how the hell any of it is plumbed any more.
posted by Kyol at 6:46 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Kyol at 6:46 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
If anyone is still stuck with the Elementary popup, there's an option to turn it off; I also set it to display every 5 ticks, makes it a lot less hectic.
posted by Marticus at 6:46 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Marticus at 6:46 PM on August 11, 2020 [1 favorite]
Reach 1e2e7 uni, and 64 Endorsements to unlock hadronic challenge (0%)
oh no
posted by saturday_morning at 6:50 PM on August 11, 2020 [5 favorites]
oh no
posted by saturday_morning at 6:50 PM on August 11, 2020 [5 favorites]
Oh no, indeed.
Furthermore, I have just watched as my iPad battery charge has drained from 11% to 9% while being plugged in and charging.
Evidently, the massive computation of this exponentially-growing-more-complex game is using a LOT of juice. I may as well be grinding Bitcoin...who knows, maybe I am, and just don’t know it!
I may have to export my game and load it up on a Chromebook where it can get a dedicated window and more robust power source.
On the plus side, I’m farming EP like crazy, now!
posted by darkstar at 8:54 PM on August 11, 2020
Furthermore, I have just watched as my iPad battery charge has drained from 11% to 9% while being plugged in and charging.
Evidently, the massive computation of this exponentially-growing-more-complex game is using a LOT of juice. I may as well be grinding Bitcoin...who knows, maybe I am, and just don’t know it!
I may have to export my game and load it up on a Chromebook where it can get a dedicated window and more robust power source.
On the plus side, I’m farming EP like crazy, now!
posted by darkstar at 8:54 PM on August 11, 2020
I...think I’m going to have to wrap this up. I’ve made it past Theory Depth 2, and plateauing hard in 3. Added to the battery drain on the iPad now, and the requirement that it always have the active tab, I think it’s time to let go.
It’s been a strangely compelling game, and an excellent case study in (*Superintendent Chalmers’ voice*) SkinNER Box operant conditioning.
Been fun journeying beyond the multiverse with you all these past few days! And good luck on that Hadronic challenge!
posted by darkstar at 9:17 PM on August 11, 2020
It’s been a strangely compelling game, and an excellent case study in (*Superintendent Chalmers’ voice*) SkinNER Box operant conditioning.
Been fun journeying beyond the multiverse with you all these past few days! And good luck on that Hadronic challenge!
posted by darkstar at 9:17 PM on August 11, 2020
Yeah, after maintaining a decent pace through elementaries, theoriverse is just a bit too blind and grindy to be entertaining. And that's OK, the patch notes suggest that it's basically just a grindathon from there on out anyway.
posted by Kyol at 7:04 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by Kyol at 7:04 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
Well the end result of this was that I went back and played Universal Paperclips, which I'd somehow missed the first time around, so I'm calling it a win.
posted by restless_nomad at 7:20 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by restless_nomad at 7:20 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
I have let this thing run for days, made decisions which I didn't understand and seem to not have affected things to one whit. That said, I have reset my elementals 400 times, made it through Theoriverse depth 6, I have 8 strings, my preons have boosted my theories 34 times, and my accelerons have achieved all five dark expanders. I have "earned" 800 theory points.
The theory tree has nine levels. I would say my 800 theory points have filled it in about...1%? If that? So.
My achievement grid has 11 unfilled squares left, including some that seem to imply you're supposed to try and turn off some of the stuff you've earned.
Jesus, if there was ever a dog which salivated at a bell, it's me.
posted by maxwelton at 7:42 AM on August 12, 2020 [2 favorites]
The theory tree has nine levels. I would say my 800 theory points have filled it in about...1%? If that? So.
My achievement grid has 11 unfilled squares left, including some that seem to imply you're supposed to try and turn off some of the stuff you've earned.
Jesus, if there was ever a dog which salivated at a bell, it's me.
posted by maxwelton at 7:42 AM on August 12, 2020 [2 favorites]
Can we all just take a moment of appreciation for how wild this sentence is without context?
I have reset my elementals 400 times, made it through Theoriverse depth 6, I have 8 strings, my preons have boosted my theories 34 times, and my accelerons have achieved all five dark expanders.posted by Green With You at 9:21 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
Well done, maxwelton! You’ve earned a rest. (Or are you continuing?)
A day after I stopped, I am experiencing a distinct sense of relief at the now-waning “pressure to click”.
posted by darkstar at 9:36 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
A day after I stopped, I am experiencing a distinct sense of relief at the now-waning “pressure to click”.
posted by darkstar at 9:36 AM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
I have let this thing run for days, made decisions which I didn't understand and seem to not have affected things to one whit. That said, I have reset my elementals 400 times, made it through Theoriverse depth 6, I have 8 strings, my preons have boosted my theories 34 times, and my accelerons have achieved all five dark expanders. I have "earned" 800 theory points.
I'm in pretty much the same place, with 906 theory points, though I have stopped playing so actively. I can get up to 63 endorsements and about 60% towards hadron whatevers at the max. At this point the activity seems to be mainly experimenting with different theory upgrade combos to figure out how to get past that, which was entertaining between things I actually needed to do but not high-maintenance (and also so far relatively fruitless).
One trick I have found is that preons never reset unless you buy a booster, so you don't need the "theoretical boosters are cheaper" upgrade at the same time as the "get more preons" upgrade. But like everything in this game, it only takes you so far. (In fact this is probably the difference between 800 and 900 theory points or so.)
At least this game doesn't have a way to fleece us of our money in service of the bell?
posted by advil at 1:32 PM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
I'm in pretty much the same place, with 906 theory points, though I have stopped playing so actively. I can get up to 63 endorsements and about 60% towards hadron whatevers at the max. At this point the activity seems to be mainly experimenting with different theory upgrade combos to figure out how to get past that, which was entertaining between things I actually needed to do but not high-maintenance (and also so far relatively fruitless).
One trick I have found is that preons never reset unless you buy a booster, so you don't need the "theoretical boosters are cheaper" upgrade at the same time as the "get more preons" upgrade. But like everything in this game, it only takes you so far. (In fact this is probably the difference between 800 and 900 theory points or so.)
At least this game doesn't have a way to fleece us of our money in service of the bell?
posted by advil at 1:32 PM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
> Furthermore, I have just watched as my iPad battery charge has drained from 11% to 9% while being plugged in and charging.
I'm running this on my desktop, but made the mistake of using Safari, which throws up a nag in any tab that's's getting CPU-intensive: "This webpage is using significant energy. Closing it may improve the responsiveness of your Mac." I've dismissed that nag more times than I've gotten Infinity Endorsements.
Going into Options -> Other and setting Visual Updates to "Every 5 Ticks" helps a little, though.
posted by ardgedee at 4:56 PM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
I'm running this on my desktop, but made the mistake of using Safari, which throws up a nag in any tab that's's getting CPU-intensive: "This webpage is using significant energy. Closing it may improve the responsiveness of your Mac." I've dismissed that nag more times than I've gotten Infinity Endorsements.
Going into Options -> Other and setting Visual Updates to "Every 5 Ticks" helps a little, though.
posted by ardgedee at 4:56 PM on August 12, 2020 [1 favorite]
I have not seen the Safari warning yet on my Mac, and it's been running for like 25h.
posted by uberchet at 5:13 PM on August 12, 2020
posted by uberchet at 5:13 PM on August 12, 2020
I'm running this on my desktop, but made the mistake of using Safari
You should be able to use the export/import functions to move to a different browser. I do think that the further you get, the more cpu-intensive it is -- my computer can't handle zoom and late-game grinding for EPs at the same time.
One trick I have found is that preons never reset unless you buy a booster
I was really slow to realize this, but this basically generalizes to every theory resource. So I think it is more like (pre-hadron stuff, which I'm still a maddening 3% from unlocking last time I tried): preons and regular strings don't reset without the resource-specific reset; entangled strings, supersymmetric particles, and accelerons never reset. So there's a whole bunch of idle strategies where you swap theory point allocations around based on this.
posted by advil at 8:49 AM on August 13, 2020
You should be able to use the export/import functions to move to a different browser. I do think that the further you get, the more cpu-intensive it is -- my computer can't handle zoom and late-game grinding for EPs at the same time.
One trick I have found is that preons never reset unless you buy a booster
I was really slow to realize this, but this basically generalizes to every theory resource. So I think it is more like (pre-hadron stuff, which I'm still a maddening 3% from unlocking last time I tried): preons and regular strings don't reset without the resource-specific reset; entangled strings, supersymmetric particles, and accelerons never reset. So there's a whole bunch of idle strategies where you swap theory point allocations around based on this.
posted by advil at 8:49 AM on August 13, 2020
I've hit a point where nothing happens a lot. I'm shy of the 15th endorsement, and all I can do that affects things is click the Ascension buttons.
posted by uberchet at 1:16 PM on August 13, 2020
posted by uberchet at 1:16 PM on August 13, 2020
I've been plateaued at 41 endorsements for over a day, and it's only been since a little while ago that I've reached a point where grinding Elementary Resets is showing some meaningful speedups, so maybe I'll finally get a 42nd endorsement. Maybe.
posted by ardgedee at 5:55 PM on August 13, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 5:55 PM on August 13, 2020
... so, version 1.7 of the game came out, and right now it's getting to the point where i need to keep a spreadsheet to aide my search for even bigger numbers and i'm not sure if it's worth it anymore but i can't quit, send help :(
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 6:32 PM on August 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 6:32 PM on August 13, 2020 [1 favorite]
I finally have been broken of this game after my laptop started giving an intermittent "service battery" warning yesterday at 1/3 its projected max charging cycles and I thought to myself, "maybe I running it full bore 24/7 in search of very large numbers is not what the power system of this computer needs right now". Stats on retiring: max 64 endorsements, 6e2.33e7 max distance , theoriverse depth 7, best hadronic score 0.64530 (I didn't get to spending a lot of time on this mode, so this is a fairly low-hanging-fruit score).
posted by advil at 6:11 AM on August 14, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by advil at 6:11 AM on August 14, 2020 [1 favorite]
I started a new Kittens Game and loaded up my auto play script and they’re now in year 60 and doing quite well. I’ll look in on them this afternoon, maybe they’ll have started scraping furs to make parchment which you need for temples in order to praise the sun.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:34 AM on August 14, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:34 AM on August 14, 2020 [1 favorite]
I managed to bail out BEFORE the "spreadsheet" phase, thank God.
I still have Excel docs for CookieClicker and Kittens and Paperclips somewhere.
posted by uberchet at 6:59 AM on August 14, 2020
I still have Excel docs for CookieClicker and Kittens and Paperclips somewhere.
posted by uberchet at 6:59 AM on August 14, 2020
I gave up on this one, too, when it became clear that to progress there was some sort of special "combo" needed for the theory tree to advance...I guess? I draw the line at having to start up spreadsheets. Scratched notes on a doodle pad is OK, but only for small problems.
Paperclips is kinda my ideal for this, really. You can finish without a spreadsheet in roughly a day, and the stupid little animated battles are kinda fun in the last stages.
Swarm Simulator was nice in that it did its calcs "off screen", allowing you to leave it for days. I let that one run for years before a Chrome crash inadvertently took it. Once I forgot about it for two years and came back to relative piles of things to spend.
posted by maxwelton at 7:51 AM on August 14, 2020 [2 favorites]
Paperclips is kinda my ideal for this, really. You can finish without a spreadsheet in roughly a day, and the stupid little animated battles are kinda fun in the last stages.
Swarm Simulator was nice in that it did its calcs "off screen", allowing you to leave it for days. I let that one run for years before a Chrome crash inadvertently took it. Once I forgot about it for two years and came back to relative piles of things to spend.
posted by maxwelton at 7:51 AM on August 14, 2020 [2 favorites]
some sort of special "combo" needed for the theory tree to advance...I guess?
Yes, a fairly specific combo, plus some idling you can do under various other combos an prep (at least through depth 7, past that I think you also need to integrate hadron things). I didn't use a spreadsheet or even notes in the end, just a lot of iterative testing. It did feel pretty good to finally work out some of these combos though!
(On the more-interactive side, if anyone needs something really absorbing that involves generating quantities of resources in more and more complex ways, I just heard that factorio finally moved out of EA...also probably not what my dodgy laptop battery needs right now.)
posted by advil at 10:14 AM on August 14, 2020
Yes, a fairly specific combo, plus some idling you can do under various other combos an prep (at least through depth 7, past that I think you also need to integrate hadron things). I didn't use a spreadsheet or even notes in the end, just a lot of iterative testing. It did feel pretty good to finally work out some of these combos though!
(On the more-interactive side, if anyone needs something really absorbing that involves generating quantities of resources in more and more complex ways, I just heard that factorio finally moved out of EA...also probably not what my dodgy laptop battery needs right now.)
posted by advil at 10:14 AM on August 14, 2020
So I have kind of a dumb question. When you've got a number in mixed notation--I'm keeping a close eye on my cadavers right now b/c they're the only thing between me and more theory points--what does the number mean in like...normal numbers? Like this: I have e27.767 K cadavers. What is that number? What is an e? What is a K? I've been trying to look it up but I keep coming up with like car models and things like that, rather than an explanation of the notation. I'm assuming it's some really huge vast number but...how vast? How many digits is it, in normal decimals?
posted by mittens at 6:54 PM on August 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by mittens at 6:54 PM on August 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
The lower case “e” is a shorthand symbol for exponential notation. It literally means “times 10 raised to some number”.
An example is the number 2.3e11. In conventional exponential/scientific notation, this would be written 2.3x10^11, where that up-caret means that the 11 is an exponent.
Or, in other words, “2.3 times 1-with-11-zeroes-after-it”. Or, in standard notation, 230000000000.
It’s not technically correct to just write the “e” followed by the exponent number, but it works as a convenient shorthand. So, for example, “e7” would mean 1 with seven zeroes after it, or 10,000,000.
The thing I think is super funny (because I’m a nerd like many of you) is when the game was working with numbers so large that they used a second “e” to raise the exponent itself to an exponent. Like “1e17e6”, which would be 1 with 17e6 zeroes after it. Which starts to get into some pretty darn big numbers.
Which explains why my little iPad wasn’t able to maintain a charge even when it was plugged in. I was probably calculating a moon landing’s worth of math every microsecond!
posted by darkstar at 7:08 PM on August 15, 2020 [2 favorites]
An example is the number 2.3e11. In conventional exponential/scientific notation, this would be written 2.3x10^11, where that up-caret means that the 11 is an exponent.
Or, in other words, “2.3 times 1-with-11-zeroes-after-it”. Or, in standard notation, 230000000000.
It’s not technically correct to just write the “e” followed by the exponent number, but it works as a convenient shorthand. So, for example, “e7” would mean 1 with seven zeroes after it, or 10,000,000.
The thing I think is super funny (because I’m a nerd like many of you) is when the game was working with numbers so large that they used a second “e” to raise the exponent itself to an exponent. Like “1e17e6”, which would be 1 with 17e6 zeroes after it. Which starts to get into some pretty darn big numbers.
Which explains why my little iPad wasn’t able to maintain a charge even when it was plugged in. I was probably calculating a moon landing’s worth of math every microsecond!
posted by darkstar at 7:08 PM on August 15, 2020 [2 favorites]
Also, I don’t recall the game using K as a numerical unit. However, a lower-case k is the metric prefix for 1000.
E.g., 1 kilometer = 1 km = 1000 meters. So if you saw that in the game, then it may have been indicating an extra thousand-fold multiplier.
Of course, a “kilocadaver” would be a pretty grim unit of measurement...
posted by darkstar at 7:11 PM on August 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
E.g., 1 kilometer = 1 km = 1000 meters. So if you saw that in the game, then it may have been indicating an extra thousand-fold multiplier.
Of course, a “kilocadaver” would be a pretty grim unit of measurement...
posted by darkstar at 7:11 PM on August 15, 2020 [1 favorite]
bah, i got up to 80% or so of getting to the hadronic challenge, but i just don't understand what to do with the theory tree (if messing with that is even the method to get there)...so i guess i'm turning it off. it was fun though!
posted by mittens at 5:39 PM on August 17, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by mittens at 5:39 PM on August 17, 2020 [1 favorite]
and by 'turning it off' i mean 'coming back the next day to stare at the progress to the hadronic challenge while carefully flicking and unflicking various theory tree options until i unlock the challenge...yay? i guess i'm stuck here a while. oh god, the theory tree got bigger.
posted by mittens at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2020 [1 favorite]
posted by mittens at 6:31 AM on August 18, 2020 [1 favorite]
Completely wedged on depth 3 of Theoriverse. Progress halts at 99.4% of the run no matter what combination of Quarks and Leptons, and no matter where I put my points in the Theory Tree. But it also looks like I'm not going to get past 43 Endorsements without figuring this out. So I'm inclined to say fuck it and quit.
posted by ardgedee at 6:51 AM on August 18, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 6:51 AM on August 18, 2020
Completely wedged on depth 3 of Theoriverse. Progress halts at 99.4% of the run no matter what combination of Quarks and Leptons, and no matter where I put my points in the Theory Tree. But it also looks like I'm not going to get past 43 Endorsements without figuring this out. So I'm inclined to say fuck it and quit.
If you haven't already, try restarting your browser and reloading. I know this is already mentioned upthread in general terms but this worked for someone in the mfc discord in exactly this situation.
posted by advil at 9:22 AM on August 18, 2020
If you haven't already, try restarting your browser and reloading. I know this is already mentioned upthread in general terms but this worked for someone in the mfc discord in exactly this situation.
posted by advil at 9:22 AM on August 18, 2020
Um, okay, let's say hypothetically I can beat every hadronic challenge except the one where you're in purge, that I've managed depth 8 into the theoriverse, and that I'm around 130 theory points shy of inflatons. What...do I do to get to inflatons? My preons aren't fast enough to add that many theory points even when I focus all my existing points on preon gain and lowering the theoretical booster cost; my hadrons are running +3.13 a second, but I can't really get any higher (see above hadronic challenge problem). I figure I have to be missing something fairly obvious; it's not a point where I can just grind something, I don't think. (Also I think I can't reach any of the remaining achievements for a boost either.)
posted by mittens at 3:51 PM on August 19, 2020
posted by mittens at 3:51 PM on August 19, 2020
there are two hadron modifiers in the theory tree that you can use to increase hadron gain, which should give you enough free TP to pay for inflatons.
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 8:43 AM on August 20, 2020
posted by and they trembled before her fury at 8:43 AM on August 20, 2020
that's kind of what i was thinking, but to get the two boosts together i need 2.5k tp...and i only have 1.5. so i end up not being sure where the next 1k will come from.
posted by mittens at 10:23 AM on August 20, 2020
posted by mittens at 10:23 AM on August 20, 2020
(aaaaaah, wait, something changed, now i'm flooded with theory points, what did i even do, stop rewarding me, game, it's confusing)
posted by mittens at 11:14 AM on August 20, 2020
posted by mittens at 11:14 AM on August 20, 2020
hello from the vastness of space, i am still playing...i have three achievements left to go. i can't believe how much i ended up liking this game. it's still super-frustrating, because there are apparently cycles of theories to go through to get strong enough to beat the harder hadronic challenges...i'm still at 2 as my best score, but i know if i keep going i can get higher, and...well. i can't quite believe i've been playing this thing for three weeks.
posted by mittens at 5:04 AM on August 28, 2020
posted by mittens at 5:04 AM on August 28, 2020
i'm stuck - can't unlock hadronic or get past theoriverse 4. i'm sure i'm just missing the right way to optimize. yet still trying for some reason...
posted by prefpara at 7:21 AM on August 28, 2020
posted by prefpara at 7:21 AM on August 28, 2020
Similarly, I've plateaued at Theoriverse depth 7 for about a week.
posted by ardgedee at 8:23 AM on August 28, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 8:23 AM on August 28, 2020
At endorsement = 15 I have a plateau with nowhere seeming to go. Moving to level 16 very very slowly even with perks activated. Ascension power and knowledge accumulating slow. There is a huge jump in knowledge cost after inf 7;4. Stadium challenges seem very difficult ...
posted by a robot made out of meat at 2:03 PM on August 29, 2020
posted by a robot made out of meat at 2:03 PM on August 29, 2020
I...uh...tinkered around with the distance on the challenges and suddenly met all the achievements? But I'm not sure what I actually did?
posted by mittens at 5:30 PM on August 29, 2020
posted by mittens at 5:30 PM on August 29, 2020
What's irritating me now is that I seem to be regressing. At one point I had over 50 endorsements, but experimenting with the Theory Tree has made every subsequent reset plateau at around 45 endorsements and I can't get any further; I don't have enough Theory Points to stack the price of boosters and preon gain to make any more boosters achievable within my lifetime, and I can't find a way to distribute points to make any more Theoriverse runs achievable within my lifetime.
posted by ardgedee at 6:29 AM on August 30, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 6:29 AM on August 30, 2020
ardgedee, have you checked your gluons? at a certain point--i forget when exactly--they begin offering a bundle of theory points, as long as you don't have auto-elementaries turned on.
posted by mittens at 6:57 AM on August 30, 2020
posted by mittens at 6:57 AM on August 30, 2020
Yeah, auto-elementaries are off. I've gotten a couple hundred Theory Points from the gluons (for a current grand total of 900 not including the ones used to unlock additional tabs under Theories), but each of the colors will need around 1e16 gluons for the next gift of TPs, and that's a tough haul at a current accumulation rate of around 3e10 gluons/sec.
posted by ardgedee at 3:00 PM on August 30, 2020
posted by ardgedee at 3:00 PM on August 30, 2020
I also returned to this, and have put it away at ~ 150 theory points mostly because the javascript isn't behaving well and this seems like the end of the game. For anyone else, the annoying times in the game to me were (1) around the early universe rests / before pathogens (2) not realizing that you had to buy dark cores for a while because the text was so small (3) around ascension when it seemed like you had to click perks a lot (3) at around 15 endorsements (4) theoryverse runs.
Some notes: (1) Often, to break through the next tier, what you need is to look for a specific achievement with a reward attached that requires unusual restrictions and may take ~ 10-30 minutes unattended. (2) There are a few specific orders in which doing the stadium challenges is feasible at endorsements = 15. Make sure you've checked for purge power from time to time. (3) You do just have to grind a fair amount of elementary particles, which only weakly scale thier gain (despite many using the strong force). Fermions make individual runs easier (knowledge+knowledge is almost always the best combo since the first infinity comes so fast, but sometimes you have to cycle rockets and cadavers), and bosons mostly unlock upgrades that make subsequent resets less painful / accelerate themselves. When the photon upgrades or higgs upgrades are going ~ 0.1% of the target per second (gain about 3 orders of magnitude less than target) and an elementary reset didn't seem to do much, you probably just need to let it sit for 15-20 minutes and get the next tier of higgs or photon upgrades. The Higgs upgrades are enormous. (4) In theory runs, the limitation to reaching the end is usually the cadaver count. Try playing with the fermions manually. (5) In some of the achievment challenges, remember what's blocked by purge+reality and play with the fermions accordingly (derivative leptons seemed like a good choice).
posted by a robot made out of meat at 9:11 AM on August 31, 2020 [1 favorite]
Some notes: (1) Often, to break through the next tier, what you need is to look for a specific achievement with a reward attached that requires unusual restrictions and may take ~ 10-30 minutes unattended. (2) There are a few specific orders in which doing the stadium challenges is feasible at endorsements = 15. Make sure you've checked for purge power from time to time. (3) You do just have to grind a fair amount of elementary particles, which only weakly scale thier gain (despite many using the strong force). Fermions make individual runs easier (knowledge+knowledge is almost always the best combo since the first infinity comes so fast, but sometimes you have to cycle rockets and cadavers), and bosons mostly unlock upgrades that make subsequent resets less painful / accelerate themselves. When the photon upgrades or higgs upgrades are going ~ 0.1% of the target per second (gain about 3 orders of magnitude less than target) and an elementary reset didn't seem to do much, you probably just need to let it sit for 15-20 minutes and get the next tier of higgs or photon upgrades. The Higgs upgrades are enormous. (4) In theory runs, the limitation to reaching the end is usually the cadaver count. Try playing with the fermions manually. (5) In some of the achievment challenges, remember what's blocked by purge+reality and play with the fermions accordingly (derivative leptons seemed like a good choice).
posted by a robot made out of meat at 9:11 AM on August 31, 2020 [1 favorite]
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posted by mittens at 8:43 AM on August 7, 2020 [1 favorite]