The Wages of Sedition: Speaker Pelosi will impeach Trump a second time
January 11, 2021 8:28 PM   Subscribe

The storming of the U.S. Capitol has resulted in House Speaker Nancy Pelosi setting a hard deadline for moving forward with a 2nd impeachment of Donald Trump. Meanwhile, many of the insurrectionists caught on film are now under arrest. And the GOP has shifted from attacking the election to asking for everyone to move on and embrace unity.
posted by valkane (1774 comments total) 78 users marked this as a favorite
 
Republicans Are Calling For “Unity” After They Voted To Try To Overturn The Election Following The Deadly Capitol Attack -- Buzzfeed
posted by valkane at 8:32 PM on January 11 [32 favorites]


GOP be like: "We lost the House, the Senate, the Presidency, 350,000 American lives, and our integrity, which means it's time for Democrats to stop being partisan and meet us in the middle."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 8:35 PM on January 11 [366 favorites]


This is like how when my little brother was smaller than me I used to give him noogies and whatnot, and then one day he sprouted up and became taller and stronger than me (even though I was four years older), and suddenly I was far too mature for horseplay and he needed to just grow up.
posted by supercrayon at 8:36 PM on January 11 [156 favorites]


I mean, Flash is dead, but I don't think Unity is the answer.
posted by lock robster at 8:36 PM on January 11 [64 favorites]




[From the previous thread]: I suppose we should be grateful that so far MAGA/Qanon/Trumpists (whatever they call themselves) have not manifested 'the stones' of The Weather Underground. So far.

Trump Is ‘Waking Up the Next Tim McVeigh,’ Prominent Former Neo-Nazi Says — Trump’s hysterical rhetoric could ignite another mass-casualty attack, says the man whose life was dramatized in “American History X.”, Daily Beast SpyTalk, Jeff Stein, 1/7/2021:
Frank Meeink [WP bio], the former neo-Nazi whose troubled life inspired the explosive hit movie American History X, says Donald Trump’s incendiary rhetoric is inviting “another Timothy McVeigh” [WP bio] to carry out a mass-casualty bombing of a federal facility or other kind spectacular attack.

“There are Timothy McVeighs everywhere,” ... “Every hour that this madness goes on, we are waking up more and more Timothy McVeighs.”

Meeink says his own years as a white power, neo-Nazi skinhead leader in the early 1990s gives him insight into the thinking of anti-government radicals today. “I would be planning stuff right now,” he told SpyTalk. “I mean, that’s what I did. I kidnapped people, that’s what I did in the movement…”

Meeink, now 45, says he’s not worried about the extremist protesters in Washington so much as the under-the-radar loners nursing their hatreds, building bombs or readying their stocks of automatic weapons to assassinate or kidnap government officials—all in the service of igniting a civil war.

“I know that they’re psyched for this. They’re pumped for this,” he says. The crisis over certifying Joseph Biden’s election victory is “the big game that they’ve been talking about for 30 years in The Turner Diaries”— a civil war....
posted by cenoxo at 8:38 PM on January 11 [34 favorites]


Speaker Pelosi is not the only one impeaching Trump. Give the rest of the House Democratic Caucus, especially freshmen like Jamaal Bowman, Mondaire Jones, Kai Kahele, and Cori Bush who have been pushing tirelessly for this since the 6th, a little credit also, please.
posted by Gadarene at 8:42 PM on January 11 [90 favorites]


Surely this time the Dems will stand firm.

Surely?
posted by Pouteria at 8:42 PM on January 11 [1 favorite]


I assume the GOP is talking about something more like Unity than anything else.

Other than what they usually mean, of course: their complete privilege and insulation from any of the consequences they deserve.
posted by wildblueyonder at 8:43 PM on January 11 [4 favorites]


> "In a tense AM call w Kevin McCarthy, President Trump today privately — and falsely — blamed "Antifa people" for storming the Capitol... McCarthy told him the riot “was MAGA” and he knew because he was in there, per WH official." -- Jonathan Swan

Antifa did this!
posted by homunculus at 8:45 PM on January 11 [15 favorites]


Literally anything Democrats do will be too much and too far for the GOP. The only possible thing that might make the GOP happy would be if Democrats did nothing--and then they'd gloat, even now, and use that to shut down any other criticism. As always.

I realize people are inevitably going to look back at this and say it was too divisive, no matter how it turns out, and yes there will still be bad fallout. We're going to be living with this garbage and these threats for a long time. Doing nothing about it would be even worse.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 8:48 PM on January 11 [47 favorites]



>I assume the GOP is talking about something more like Unity than anything else.

I was thinking Unity. They seem to be all about the hive mind.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 8:51 PM on January 11 [1 favorite]


To quote something I saw on Twitter: “Years of studying South Africa tells me that Reconciliation can only come after Truth and Justice.”
posted by Silvery Fish at 8:52 PM on January 11 [83 favorites]


"In a tense AM call w Kevin McCarthy, President Trump today privately — and falsely — blamed "Antifa people" for storming the Capitol...

It's never a great feeling when you read those reports about him spinning bullshit in private to people he doesn't need to lie to and you start to wonder "oh god, does he really believe this one?"

Like he's a lying liar who constantly lies but he's also built an entire world around his life where other lying liars lie to him all the time so he doesn't throw big baby tantrums (and also to lead him around by the nose for their own agendas), and the version of reality that filters through that and takes hold is terrifying to think about. Does he fully believe whatever someone like Flynn tells him about what's "really" going on? That's nightmare fuel.
posted by jason_steakums at 8:53 PM on January 11 [22 favorites]


I almost posted this in one of the insurrection-related MeTas set up for moral support, but it's just a tad too serious:
“A Socialist Christmas Carol”
Featuring President Ocasio-Cortez, with a streak of gray in her hair, as The Spirit of Protests to Come. From last month's Democratic Left, courtesy your friendly neighborhood DSA.

Also, I just realized I've been thinking this during the entire Trump Administration but never actually said it out loud or written it on the internet: the Pierson's Puppeteers are an alien species from the “Known Space” universe of author (milkshake duck “right-libertarian”, i.e. pro-organ-harvesting-from-undesirables Nazi; a moment of silence for my childhood, please) Larry Niven.

Their defining characteristic is that they are, by the standards of any other species, pathologically afraid of any personal risk whatsoever, which is a major factor that has led in the timeline of the novels to them becoming extremely rich, indecisive, deceptive, owners of layers upon layers of shell companies to obfuscate connections to themselves, and employers of others to do their dirty work.

The supreme ruler of the Pierson's Puppeteers aliens is known as “the Hindmost”, since as the most important individual, he (they all consider themselves male in human languages, Niven apparently thinking it amusing or innovative or something for biological “females” to be the non-sentient of three sexes) has the right to remain the furthest from all dangers.

So: I propose that we add “the Hindmost” to Trump's sobriquets, Trump being the diametric opposite of a leader. (Although that's an insult to fictional aliens as the “male” sexes are portrayed as hyperintelligent and having pleasant speaking voices.)
posted by XMLicious at 8:56 PM on January 11 [15 favorites]


Has anyone started looking into the criminal backgrounds of the rioters? I want to know about the domestic violence charges, specifically, but anything is good.
posted by annsunny at 8:56 PM on January 11 [13 favorites]


"Even the pubs doing great work on this story are using euphemisms and special pleading. The President got desperate pleas from the Capitol to break the siege. He said no." -- Josh Marshall
posted by valkane at 8:56 PM on January 11 [17 favorites]


[From the previous thread]: I suppose we should be grateful that so far MAGA/Qanon/Trumpists (whatever they call themselves) have not manifested 'the stones' of The Weather Underground. So far.

Q-believer did a lot of damage in Nashville, if I recall. Was maybe within the past few weeks, even.
posted by hippybear at 8:58 PM on January 11 [11 favorites]


An armed insurrection demands accountability, of those on the ground, and those who incited them. The rule of law demands it. Anything less — negotiation, concession, accommodation of insurrectionists in any way — takes away from the rule of law. And without the rule of law, there’s no country worth preserving. It really is that simple.
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:05 PM on January 11 [45 favorites]


Via BalloonJuice.com, an article on ArcDigital.media titled "QAnon Woke Up the Real Deep State"

Link

I sincerely hope this is true. It's short and will lift your mood. Forward.
posted by SoberHighland at 9:08 PM on January 11 [51 favorites]


“The people [of a city] should fight for their laws as they would for their city wall.”

— Heraclitus (DK22B44)
posted by Capt. Renault at 9:10 PM on January 11 [28 favorites]


Several Capitol police officers suspended, more than a dozen under investigation over actions related to rally, riot.

Damn! That police department has got to be one toxic work environment right now. Half of them are Nazis helping the rioters that were in the process of beating to death or crushing or chasing the other half. How can such a department even be functional?

Well, "half" is a figure of speech but how would you know who has your back?
posted by JackFlash at 9:25 PM on January 11 [49 favorites]


That police department has got to be one toxic work environment right now.

I would suggest that all police departments are toxic and dysfunctional, and load and stress testing it just shows it clearly.
posted by mikelieman at 9:33 PM on January 11 [43 favorites]


I would guess that most of the cops in that department already have a pretty good idea who does and doesn't have their back, and have probably known it for years.
posted by biogeo at 9:36 PM on January 11 [38 favorites]


"QAnon Woke Up the Real Deep State"

Much in that read made a lot of sense, when I think about how things actually have worked in my lifetime and not how they Hollywood Worked... and so... yeah, that was heartening to read. Thank you.
posted by hippybear at 9:37 PM on January 11 [5 favorites]


I would imagine that there are a few cops out there who might be a little freaked out to realize how many of their fellow officers would support overturning democracy though.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 9:38 PM on January 11 [10 favorites]


The Sift: "An educator's guide to
the week in news literacy"
has a whole issue on the capitol attacks and most of the false claims made online. They especially go over the accusations that AntiFa was to blame. I've only read half of it but it seems pretty thorough.
posted by RuvaBlue at 9:40 PM on January 11 [15 favorites]


https://twitter.com/mkaplantv/status/1348642565650862084

Michael Kaplan @mkaplantv
9:46 AM · Jan 11, 2021·Twitter Web App

NEWS: The US Capitol Police has had to respond to "a couple of incidents" of officers threatening to harm themselves in the wake of the attack on Capitol Hill. This includes a female officer who turned in her own weapon for fear of what might happen.

A source told @CBSNews
the dept. is "demoralized".

"There’s tremendous moral injury, a sense of failure weighing them down. They went home to family and were asked how did this happen. And it’s very easy for those officers to interpret that as ‘how could you let this happen?’”
posted by sebastienbailard at 9:41 PM on January 11 [71 favorites]


The number of reports I've seen about local police precincts having to confront the reports (and photographic evidence) of one of their own being there is, I'm sure, causing a day of reckoning which extended even into unaffected departments who have to consider what other extracurricular activities their co-workers have been engaged in.

How the department and the community of co-workers and the community they work in all respond to this will be a part of the fall-out over the next 3-4 weeks I'm sure. If not longer.
posted by hippybear at 9:43 PM on January 11 [5 favorites]


And it’s very easy for those officers to interpret that as ‘how could you let this happen?’

That’s a not-unreasonable interpretation of a not-unreasonable question.
posted by Ice Cream Socialist at 9:44 PM on January 11 [51 favorites]


[From the previous thread]: I suppose we should be grateful that so far MAGA/Qanon/Trumpists (whatever they call themselves) have not manifested 'the stones' of The Weather Underground. So far.

First and foremost: I don't underestimate the potential for violence & harm in the current moment. I'm scared as shit, in fact. I'm also not trying to venerate The Weather Underground. They were a violent bunch and were willing to cause a lot of real harm. (Aside: Richard Avedon's photos of the principle members of the movement are well worth a look. These were young desperate and pretty much all white people.)

I guess I was just struck in the moment of posting (in the last thread) by the apparent lack of a single galvanizing coherent 'manifesto' or set of 'ten non-negotiable demands' that might give the average person an idea of what these people wanted. But on reflection I see that perhaps I just haven't been looking at a more obvious answer, that it's straight up white nationalism, communicated with dog whistles and 'secret hand shakes' amongst the faithful.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 9:51 PM on January 11 [16 favorites]


But on reflection I see that perhaps I just haven't been looking at a more obvious answer, that it's straight up white nationalism, communicated with dog whistles and 'secret hand shakes' amongst the faithful.

YUP!
posted by hippybear at 9:54 PM on January 11 [15 favorites]


GOP be like: "We lost the House, the Senate, the Presidency, 350,000 American lives, and our integrity, which means it's time for Democrats to stop being partisan and meet us in the middle."

I’m not surprised though, considering the Democratic response to that demand has typically been like: “okay”
posted by EmGeeJay at 9:55 PM on January 11 [88 favorites]


That’s a not-unreasonable interpretation of a not-unreasonable question.
Sure, if you didn't see anything but the stills of the shithead terrorists getting selfies with sympathetic cops. However, if you saw the "heave ho" tape, you'd know that that is a completely unreasonable question because it is blazingly obvious who let this happen, and it was not the cops. Everyone in that building and the police guarding the building were deliberately abandoned to the mob and people who had control and could have stopped it before it happened, or failing that, could have broken it up early before the tsunami of deranged, murderous cultists broke through the doors and windows and beat one person to death and crushed another person to death, everyone with the power to NOT let that happen sat back and watched it happen for hours and did not stop it.
posted by Don Pepino at 9:55 PM on January 11 [127 favorites]


him spinning bullshit in private to people he doesn't need to lie to

He's not trying to persuade them. He's telling them what their story is and modeling the conviction with which they are to tell that story. He's always done that.
posted by ctmf at 9:57 PM on January 11 [83 favorites]




I'd be demoralized too if I found out the hard way how many of my sworn colleagues turned out to be fifth columnists.
posted by tclark at 10:04 PM on January 11 [8 favorites]


President Donald J. Trump Approves District of Columbia Emergency Declaration
Today, President Donald J. Trump declared that an emergency exists in the District of Columbia and ordered Federal assistance to supplement the District’s response efforts due to the emergency conditions resulting from the 59th Presidential Inauguration from January 11 to January 24, 2021.
I have no idea what to think of this.
posted by clawsoon at 10:06 PM on January 11 [12 favorites]


Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal (D-7th WA) Has Tested Positive for Covid
In her statement Monday night, Jayapal’s office took care to highlight that “the duration in the room was multiple hours, and several Republicans not only cruelly refused to wear a mask but mocked colleagues and staff who offered them one,” linking to video showing Delaware Rep. Lisa Blunt Rochester pleading with a group of Republicans to put on the masks she was offering them.
Jayapal's been notably good on the Hill. I'm hoping she pulls through alright, but I'm also sure she won't be the last to be infected by her ostensible colleagues.
posted by CrystalDave at 10:06 PM on January 11 [83 favorites]


I guess I was just struck in the moment of posting (in the last thread) by the apparent lack of a single galvanizing coherent 'manifesto' or set of 'ten non-negotiable demands' that might give the average person an idea of what these people wanted.

Kind of reminds me of what I kept hearing during the Occupy movement, the claim that nobody knew what they wanted. (I thought it was obvious what they wanted—for the rule of law to apply uniformly so the world’s most powerful actors would not be not free to steal and destroy as they please.)
posted by maniabug at 10:16 PM on January 11 [7 favorites]


A veteran in Congress asked the military to make sure troops deploying to Biden's inauguration are not sympathetic to domestic terrorists after Capitol siege
Rep. Jason Crow, a Colorado Democrat and former Army Ranger, asked on a call with Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy Sunday for the military's criminal investigation units to look into "troops deployed for the inauguration to ensure that deployed members are not sympathetic to domestic terrorists."

McCarthy agreed to take additional measures, Crow said in a statement on the call.

As for whether or not the review will take place, a Pentagon spokesperson told Insider that because inaugural support is coming from the National Guard, "the responsibility for such a review would lie with the individual states contributing service members for the support mission."
posted by clawsoon at 10:17 PM on January 11 [23 favorites]


An armed insurrection demands accountability, of those on the ground, and those who incited them. The rule of law demands it.
posted by Capt. Renault


Survival demands it.

----------------

From the article linked above:

If that isn’t what you signed up for, now would be a good time to get out.


More like the last chance.

---------------

I have no idea what to think of this.

In Trump's mind it might just be a ploy to try getting his enemies off guard and gathered together in one open space in broad daylight.

Or he has been told in no uncertain terms to do it or it's 25th time.
posted by Pouteria at 10:19 PM on January 11 [3 favorites]


House Democrats Briefed On 3 Terrifying Plots To Overthrow Government
The first is a demonstration billed as the “largest armed protest ever to take place on American soil.”

Another is a protest in honor of Ashli Babbitt, the woman killed while trying to climb into the Speaker’s Lobby during Wednesday’s pro-Trump siege of the Capitol.

And another demonstration, which three members said was by far the most concerning plot, would involve insurrectionists forming a perimeter around the Capitol, the White House and the Supreme Court, and then blocking Democrats from entering the Capitol ― perhaps even killing them ― so that Republicans could take control of the government.
posted by guiseroom at 10:26 PM on January 11 [26 favorites]


Democrats: Impeach Trump! (1st time)
Republicans: Noooo!!! LeT ThE VoTeRs DeCide!!!

Voters Decide

Republicans: Nooo!!! REVOLUTION!! SEDITION!!! INSURRECTION!!! OTHER METAL BAND NAMES!!!
Democrats: Okay, here's your 2nd helping of impeachment pie!!!!
Republicans: Nooo!!! So DiViSiVe!!!! Let ByGones be ByglyOnes!!! Oh Noes!!! My twitters!!!! ALSO, WE WILL KILL YOU ALL IN 50 STATES PLUS DC!!! DIE!! DIE!! DIE!!!

I am really worried for our nation. We could be headed to a bad, bad, place if these dipshits are even partly successful in their insane goals.
posted by smcameron at 10:26 PM on January 11 [115 favorites]


Republicans in Congress: "I have always believed robust door-closing regimes infringe on the rights of horses, but now that all the horses have escaped, I need to make clear to the American people that I am and always have been on the side of closing the barn door."
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 10:28 PM on January 11 [57 favorites]


I'm genuinely surprised that the title of this thread is not ITMFAgain.
posted by inexorably_forward at 10:31 PM on January 11 [11 favorites]


From previous thread...

during the ramp-up to the 2016 election I was working in an organic grocery store attached to a (dubiously legal but hygienically scrupulous) raw milk dairy in rural Wisconsin & our customers, while all sharing a hippie-ness on some level, absolutely ran the gamut politically in a way I wouldn't have expected if I wasn't there looking at it

Spot on. I began working at farmer's markets in Los Angeles from 2006-2010 selling raw dairy. I came to it having grown up on a farm. The buyers were a cross variety from nursing mom's looking for healthy foods and gourmet buyers ala Alice Waters to the other sovereign extremes (channels, extreme raw foodists, wild-eyed self proclaimed healers, anti-vaxxers, and off the chart nutritionists). In the beginning it was fun playing with all these characters and the farm utilizing every loophole in the state laws to sell the milk in California and across state lines. After awhile I became more and more aware of the cray-cray aspect of it all.

The commonality was a distrust of big food and big pharma. Some a wide gamut of people stopped. Many of the became associated with Weston A. Price groups and Mercola Many moms were initially attracted to the groups until they began to realize the culty aspects surrounding them. The term 'Food Politics" was bandied about alot. I decided to get out when there was a breakout of listeria in NorCal and a customer I knew was saying that raw milk couldn't have done this. It was either the family or the government. I told her that you may be right but that doesn't diminish the fact that 5 kids are still sick.

While I do feel that raw dairy has health benefits, I also know that is my bias based on my farming experience. It may not be that way for everyone.

Almost everyone I know from that period of time has gone off the rails. It's an easy bet to take that a huge amount of alternative providers, especially chiropractors, are on the Trump train.

It's all about purity....
posted by goalyeehah at 10:38 PM on January 11 [36 favorites]


somebody emphatically requested I not post anything Lincoln Project related in any of these threads a while back. Fair enough. But then I come across the following from Steve Schmidt (now a Democrat) and ... sorry, but ...

>>>

"No, Biden's rallies weren't bigger. No, you didn't see many Biden flags on houses or Biden bumper stickers on cars. No, you don't know a single person on your street or at your church who supports Biden. But guess what? We're here.

"Biden's rallies were small because people who live in reality don't want to expose themselves to the virus you continue to downplay or deny. We don't fly Biden flags because we don't want our houses burned down. We don't put Biden bumper stickers on our cars because we want to avoid becoming targets for road rage. We don't trust you. We've decided to minimize our interactions with people who cannot be reasoned with. This is for our own safety.

In private groups where you're not invited - we share our bewilderment of your descent into madness. We all have stories about how we've cut ties with you, our family and former friends, because we don't want your hatred poisoning our social media streams. We can't stand to listen to vomiting the lies of your cult, day after day. You used to be different. We liked you. But now that we know what was inside your heart all along, we've decided you don't deserve to know about our lives.

"We'll skip family reunions, even after we get the vaccine. We'll make up some excuse just to be polite. But in reality, we just don't feel like sitting around eating potato salad and making small talk with people who have such monstrous beliefs.

"To all the brothers and aunts and cousins and dads and neighbors out there who just can't wrap their heads around what this means going forward, know that these scars aren't going away anytime soon. We won't be reaching out, and we won't be mending fences. It's not up to us to apologize for the wounds you have gleefully inflicted upon us and our friends. You poured the gasoline, you lit the match. You burned this to the ground.

"So if we seem different from now on, I guess we are, in a way. We've seen your truth laid bare, and we're horrified.

"I hope Trump was worth it.""
posted by philip-random at 10:47 PM on January 11 [325 favorites]


On ABC World News Tonight a reporter said Trump is so pissed about a self-pardon being risky that he won't pardon anyone else. If he can't have one, nobody can.

This would definitely be in keeping with his style, and I hope SO MUCH this happens. Nothing from from "pals" to "just himself" to "all folks anywhere in federal jurisdiction" would surprise me.


What are the odds that, if he can't do the self-pardon bit and ends up facing charges, that he'll take the folks he's pardoned so far (Stone, etc.) with him (with dirt unrevealed until now) out of pure spite? "If I go down, you're going with me!!!"
posted by gtrwolf at 10:48 PM on January 11 [8 favorites]


I am really worried for our nation.

I am really worried for the whole world. If the USA goes down it is open slather for China and Russia and India, and every wanna be despot the world over, including our own autocratic Trump-humping prosperity-Gospel worshipping Pentecostal Prime Minister here in Australia, who is a very nasty piece of work indeed.

Furthermore, given the Panopticon of techno-surveillance now available to the state, it will be a very very hard road back indeed, and perhaps not even possible.
posted by Pouteria at 10:54 PM on January 11 [35 favorites]


That Schmidt statement is amazing, philip-random, thank you. Do you happen to have a link to the source?
posted by darkstar at 11:00 PM on January 11 [7 favorites]


State capitals face threat of armed protests, FBI warns (WaPo, Jan. 11, 2021; cached) The FBI warned Monday that armed far-right extremist groups are planning to march on state capitals this weekend, triggering a rush to fortify government buildings amid concerns that the violence that erupted at the U.S. Capitol last week could spread throughout the country. [...] In Wisconsin, state workers on Monday began boarding up ground-level windows of the Capitol in Madison in anticipation of the protesters. In Arizona, officials had erected a double-layer chain-link fence around the Capitol complex in Phoenix. In Michigan, a state that has been on edge since the FBI disrupted a plot in October to kidnap Gov. Gretchen Whitmer (D), a state legislative committee voted Thursday to ban residents from openly carrying guns inside the Capitol in Lansing.

Washington Gov. Jay Inslee (D) called up 750 National Guard troops to help protect the Capitol, where the legislature kicked off its annual session Monday. [...] Inslee’s action followed last week’s mob assault on the governor’s mansion, on the same day that a pro-Trump mob stormed the U.S. Capitol, resulting in the deaths of five people including a Capitol Police officer. A video of the disturbance in Olympia, Wash., shows a man with an assault rifle and a large knife standing in front of Inslee’s residence, as other demonstrators stand nearby holding Trump flags.

Gov. Jay Inslee is questioning how nearly 100 people were able to breach fencing and make it as far as the front door of the Governor’s Mansion on the Capitol Campus in Olympia on Wednesday. (Komo News, Jan. 7, 2021) Inslee revealed Thursday he and his wife were inside the residence when the breach occurred. It’s the State Patrol’s job to provide 24/7 security for the governor and the governor's mansion, which is encircled by steel fencing. Video taken during Wednesday showed protesters shaking the pedestrian gate adjacent to the main driveway into the grounds when the gate opens. People began walking unabated onto the grounds. Photos.
posted by Iris Gambol at 11:01 PM on January 11 [26 favorites]


I am seriously worried we might face some sort of redneck Cultural Revolution. Worried enough that a few months ago I bought an AR-15 rifle. Maybe more as camouflage than as a weapon (When the redneck inquisition comes: "Look, I'm no liberal, if I were a liberal, would I have this? Brandishes AR-15).
posted by smcameron at 11:02 PM on January 11 [13 favorites]


clawsoon > President Donald J. Trump Approves District of Columbia Emergency Declaration

Today, President Donald J. Trump declared that an emergency exists in the District of Columbia and ordered Federal assistance to supplement the District’s response efforts due to the emergency conditions resulting from the 59th Presidential Inauguration from January 11 to January 24, 2021.

I have no idea what to think of this.

- - - - - -

It's just wild speculation of course, but Trump fueled his MAGA believers, ignited his symbolic Reichstag Fire and watched it burn, thanked his loyal mob, denied any blame (and shifted it onto imaginary terrorists), accused his enemies, and has declared an emergency about what he created. Expect his enabling act soon to suspend Biden's inauguration, along with a search for the 'real' perpetrators.

This is his standard modus operandi: he does nothing unless he benefits.
posted by cenoxo at 11:05 PM on January 11 [14 favorites]


Ironic that the last Republican presidency, Bush Jr, and its anti-terrorism rules are being applied to terrorists that this Republican presidency produced.

As a Millennial I’m going to associate GOP administrations with terrorism now. With Bush Jr and Trump as the only Republican admins in living memory for young Millennials and Gen Z, it’s gonna be hard for the GOP to make a case for putting them in charge again.

The Republicans are reaping what they sow in more ways than one.
posted by ichomp at 11:07 PM on January 11 [11 favorites]


Do you happen to have a link to the source?

it showed up on a friend's Facebook.

I did a bit of googling and found nothing definitive. Just a pile of re-posts.

if it's a fake, it's a good one
posted by philip-random at 11:07 PM on January 11 [2 favorites]


I'm genuinely surprised that the title of this thread is not ITMFAgain.

ITMF 2: MAGA Boogaloo is just a little too on the nose...
posted by Big Al 8000 at 11:11 PM on January 11 [10 favorites]


I am seriously worried we might face some sort of redneck Cultural Revolution.

It is so funny to me that MAGA shrieks about communism when they share so many traits with Chinese communism than the American “Left” ever has.

-the costumes / red hats
-the devotion to a cult figure
-the rural revolution
-the populism
-the owning of elites
posted by ichomp at 11:12 PM on January 11 [40 favorites]


latest Drudge Report leading links:

200 HOURS LEFT
BANKERS BAIL
FBI WARNS OF 'HUGE UPRISING'
WEDNESDAY: DOUBLE IMPEACHMENT
TWITTER DOOMED?

we are where we are
posted by philip-random at 11:17 PM on January 11 [2 favorites]


-the costumes / red hats

In both cases, made in China.
posted by sebastienbailard at 11:27 PM on January 11 [28 favorites]


Not Schmidt; Katie Schnessel's letter to the Editor: I hope Trump was worth it, The Villages-News, December 27, 2020. The outlet:"Local. Independent. Serving The Villages, Florida." The Villages (Florida's Friendliest Home Town/America's premier Active Adult Retirement Community located in sunny central Florida) in the news before the election.
posted by Iris Gambol at 11:28 PM on January 11 [121 favorites]


The police officers who participated in the Assault on the Capitol provide the strongest argument yet for the Defund the Police movement. Let's just hope we can all get through the next couple weeks without any stronger arguments.
posted by oneswellfoop at 11:40 PM on January 11 [24 favorites]


Sen. Tammy Duckworth, D-Illinois, asked acting Defense Secretary Christopher Miller to allow military criminal investigators to join civilian law enforcement authorities in determining if troops or veterans took part in the insurrection. (USA Today, Jan. 11, 2021) Duckworth, D-Ill., a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee, asked by letter that military criminal investigators determine whether service members or veterans “engaged in insurrection or participated in a seditious conspiracy. [...] Our Nation must demonstrate resolve and resilience in bringing the neo-Nazis, white supremacists and conspiracy theorists who formed this mob to justice. [...] “This includes addressing deeply troubling reports that members of the U.S. Armed Forces” and veterans took part in the mayhem that resulted in five deaths.

“If criminal investigators determine that members of the U.S. Armed Forces, retired members of a regular component of the U.S. Armed Forces and members of the Fleet Reserve/Fleet Marine Corps Reserve servicemembers engaged in criminal conduct related to the January 6, 2021 attack on the United States Capitol, I urge you to take appropriate action to hold individuals accountable under the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Upholding good order and discipline demands that the U.S. Armed Forces root out extremists that infiltrate the military and threaten our national security,” wrote Duckworth, an Iraq War veteran, Purple Heart recipient and former Assistant Secretary of the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs.
Full letter.
posted by Iris Gambol at 12:05 AM on January 12 [71 favorites]


Not Schmidt; Katie Schnessel's letter to the Editor: I hope Trump was worth it,

thanks for that. I had a feeling it might not have been Schmidt when I couldn't find an original post.
posted by philip-random at 12:12 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Fuck him up, Nancy
posted by Going To Maine at 12:16 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


somebody emphatically requested I not post anything Lincoln Project related in any of these threads a while back. Fair enough.

Personally I find the Lincoln Project stuff interesting, and I hope people aren't generally cutting it out of these threads. No, I don't trust the Lincoln Project people beyond our shared goal of destroying Trumpism, but they have an interesting perspective that's worth hearing. People who don't want to hear what they have to say can refrain from watching their videos.
posted by biogeo at 12:52 AM on January 12 [59 favorites]


I don't know anything about Secretaries of Defense to be quite honest, but I feel like Tammy Duckworth would make a pretty good one.
posted by away for regrooving at 12:55 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


[Just noting quickly, there's no site edict against Lincoln Project discussion or links.]
posted by taz (staff) at 12:57 AM on January 12 [42 favorites]


Surely this time the Dems will stand firm.

A good sign that they will is that we've had several attempts at doing the usual waffling from some of the usual suspects this past week and they've all been ruthlessly quashed by the House Democrats.

Funny thing about how having been seconds from being lynched can really concentrate the mind.
posted by MartinWisse at 12:59 AM on January 12 [30 favorites]


WaPo opinion on "a better way" than impeachment:
Section 3 of the 14th Amendment, passed in the aftermath of the Civil War, bars Trump from holding another federal office if he is found to have “engaged in insurrection or rebellion against” the Constitution of the United States.

The finding could be accomplished by a simple majority vote of both houses, in contrast to the requirement in impeachment proceedings that the Senate vote to convict by a two-thirds majority. Congress would simply need to declare that Trump engaged in an act of “insurrection or rebellion” by encouraging the attack on the Capitol. Under the 14th Amendment, Trump could run for the White House again only if he were able to persuade a future Congress to, “by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.
Here's what I think: why not both?

Keep the impeachment pressure on Republicans. Find out which minority of them might be brought into repudiation of Trumpism. It will be a minority because movement conservatism is disease, and honestly I don't think there's enough Romneys in the party to convict, but the pressure might be revealing and useful anyway.

If they don't cooperate by the time the House and Senate D majorities are in place, make the declaration part of impeachment proceedings, in which it'd have to come out anyway.

Every single last damn law that can be brought against Trump needs to be. The words "moral hazard" don't even begin the problem of letting him get away with this. And sure, the kind of people that choose *him* of all people over actual functioning society are going to do more stupid things just like they did on the 6th. They're going to do that anyway. No point in buying crazy down, let's make the rule of law work.
posted by wildblueyonder at 1:00 AM on January 12 [70 favorites]


Those congressional representatives violating protocol by refusing to wear masks (especially in confined spaces for extended periods of time) need to be severely censured. Does Pelosi have any available options to send them packing? Their flagrant violations put their colleagues at risk.
posted by St. Oops at 1:20 AM on January 12 [63 favorites]


I don't know anything about Secretaries of Defense to be quite honest, but I feel like Tammy Duckworth would make a pretty good one.

This is not the right direction to go.

If anything, the United States needs a stronger legislative branch than ever. We need to start reducing the powers of the President, which have been growing to the point where a dictatorship is inevitable. We need a president who's not allowed to:

- wage war indefinitely (the War Powers Act seems pretty powerless)
- pardon criminal co-conspirators
- fire cabinet members who are also supposedly judges of their character (25th Amendment)
- influence the security of other elected officials (Washington DC jurisdiction)
- make up laws (Executive Orders)

If Biden ends his term with less power than when he started, that would be a step in the right direction.
posted by meowzilla at 2:00 AM on January 12 [90 favorites]


There should be unity. Unity makes a country stronger. A house divided against itself cannot stand. That's why Republicans should join in unity with the Democrats working to protect democracy and the constitution. That's why they should disavow the months* of disunity they sowed following the election. Unity means standing united against a president who treats elections as something that exists for show.

Republicans have made a lot of hay by claiming terms like Freedom and Patriotism for their own, and ingraining their own cynical definitions of them in the culture at large. It would be nice if Democrats (and we) pushed back on this more often.


(Well, years of disunity, and the election of almost every Democrat, but who's counting.)
posted by trig at 2:17 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Goddamn, the news about Pramila Jayapal is really upsetting. She’s my representative and has been knocking it out of the park throughout the pandemic with constant updates and information. I’m so proud of her being our rep. I really hope it’s one of those mild cases or no symptoms ones. There’s so much to be furious about but those fuckers refusing masks makes me rage blind.
posted by kitten kaboodle at 2:20 AM on January 12 [49 favorites]


Someone needs to take Joe aside, put both hands on his shoulders and look him directly in the eyes and say 'JOE, they would have killed you. They were chanting HANG MIKE PENCE. What do you think they would have done to you?'
posted by adept256 at 2:26 AM on January 12 [43 favorites]


> I'm also not trying to venerate The Weather Underground. They were a violent bunch and were willing to cause a lot of real harm. (Aside: Richard Avedon's photos of the principle members of the movement are well worth a look. These were young desperate and pretty much all white people.)...

The most tangible distinctions between The Weather Underground and contemporary domestic terrorist cells is that the cops opposed The Weather Underground.

That's the difference between a police officer wanting to kill you on sight and wanting to help you sneak past security. It's the difference between having to live pseudonymously with no fixed address for a decade and being able to advertise and recruit openly from their privately owned home. Otherwise they're similar in many ways, including how they represent an extremely small group committed to violent activities in the name of goals that a much broader population may openly support but are (regardless of what they claim) unwilling to make any meaningful efforts toward.
posted by at by at 2:43 AM on January 12 [17 favorites]


Jayapal is my rep too, and she’s also a local of my particular slice of town. I’m proud to have voted for her and if she has long lasting symptoms from this I will be heartbroken in a way I thought I had become numb to.
posted by Mizu at 2:43 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Antifa did this!

If Antifa did this there would have been medics, a first aid tent, a soup kitchen and an lgbtq squad with water bottles rinsing people's eyes.
posted by adept256 at 2:56 AM on January 12 [211 favorites]


Amen.

The other difference between the Weather Underground and the Trumpist insurrectionists is that the Weather Underground had an idea of how to run a revolution. They may have been middle class white kids but they knew who their enemies were and what the cost of fighting them would be. Sure, some elements of the Trump mob had concrete goals and plans to achieve them but most of them seemed to believe that they could just show up at the capital, march in, and magic big daddy would make it 1950 again. QAnon doesn't tell it adherents that there will generations of class warfare, blood, toil, and in the end the revolution will be won. It tells them that they just have to be spectators, fans really, until the day Trump fixes all the evil in the world. The white nationalists and the militia members hiding in the Trump crowd are very dangerous because they have plans, maybe not viable plans but plans nevertheless.
posted by rdr at 3:20 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


The reps who refused to wear a mask should face criminal charges for their reckless endangerment of their fellow humans.
posted by interogative mood at 3:39 AM on January 12 [57 favorites]


Well, "half" is a figure of speech but how would you know who has your back?

The National Fraternal Order of Police endorsed Trump. The majority of local Fraternal Orders also did. The cops are incredibly pro-Trump.
posted by srboisvert at 3:58 AM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Those congressional representatives violating protocol by refusing to wear masks (especially in confined spaces for extended periods of time) need to be severely censured. Does Pelosi have any available options to send them packing? Their flagrant violations put their colleagues at risk.

Personally, I think we are the point of the pandemic where this kind of behavior can reasonably be called bioterrorism.
posted by srboisvert at 4:02 AM on January 12 [39 favorites]


Worth pointing out that Jessica Mitford may have come to her political beliefs as a kid but she spent her life as a dedicated and serious socialist writer and activist.

Yes. Jessica was very much the good Mitford, as this recent BBC radio profile of her demonstrates.
posted by Paul Slade at 4:14 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Senator Duckworth using words like "insurrection" and "seditious conspiracy" warms my heart. They're rightly rightously pissed off at Donald Trump's assassination attempt, and this isn't going away.

Bring back the HUAC. "Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Republican party?"
posted by mikelieman at 4:22 AM on January 12 [25 favorites]


It looks as if the road to the Inauguration will be bumpy.
BBC: There are reports of armed groups planning to gather at all 50 state capitols and in Washington DC in the run-up to his 20 January inauguration.
An internal FBI note obtained by ABC News shows warnings of "a huge uprising".
These also all have the potential to be super-spreader events as the MAGA's deny the virus .
posted by adamvasco at 4:29 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


I don’t know why no one seems to be saying it, but anyone calling for unity needs as the BARE MINIMUM to admit that the election wasn’t stolen. That the vote was fair, and Biden won the election. Not “whatever happened, he’s President now.” If you can’t say that he won, which was affirmed by every voting authority including Republican ones, you don’t want unity - you want to keep living in a country that is okay with two versions of reality. That there’s no such thing as the truth. You can’t have unity until people actually unite.

Frankly I think we should put pressure on Schumer and Pelosi that that’s a litmus test for serving in government. People are welcome to think whatever they want to think privately, but if you want to serve in an elected position, you better damn well make it clear to your constituents that you believe in fair elections.
posted by Mchelly at 4:34 AM on January 12 [93 favorites]


Here in Texas, home of treasonous cockroach Ted Cruz and several other slithering Republicans, I wonder if we have much to worry about at our Capitol. Of course I want to be sure our remaining Dems are protected, but in general I'm not sure they're going to see any uprising. Sadly, assholes pretty much get what they want from our gerrymandered to hell state lege.
posted by emjaybee at 4:37 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Skimming, it looks like she was just another contrarian troll, fueled by the desire for attention and contempt for human suffering:

Perhaps skim beyond the first section? Midford was certainly not "just another contrarian troll": "Pryce Jones reports that "She [Mitford] saw him, it seemed, more than a hundred times, no other English person could have anything like that access to Hitler"
posted by dmh at 4:39 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


And as a follow-up to that: The American Abyss from the NYT Magazine is worth a read. Fascism starts with a Big Lie. For the US right now, the Big Lie is that Democrats - and particularly Democrats of color - can’t be trusted to vote fairly.
posted by Mchelly at 4:39 AM on January 12 [25 favorites]


Anyone calling for "unity" right now is either willfully naive or a villain.
posted by The Card Cheat at 4:40 AM on January 12 [21 favorites]


In their Strange Days interview yesterday, Sarah Kendzior and Ruth Ben-Ghiat are both pretty blunt about the situation being unsafe to hold an inauguration as it usually would have been.
posted by progosk at 4:45 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


[Deleted extended derail about Unity Mitford. Feel free to make a post about her if you'd like.]
posted by taz (staff) at 4:57 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Bring back the HUAC. "Are you now, or have you ever been, a member of the Republican party?"

I want to see Bernie Sanders brandishing a list of names on the Senate floor. "I have here, in my hand..."
posted by Faint of Butt at 4:59 AM on January 12 [15 favorites]


[deleted my own Mitford sister ranking comment]
posted by atrazine at 4:59 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Today, President Donald J. Trump declared that an emergency exists in the District of Columbia and ordered Federal assistance to supplement the District’s response efforts due to the emergency conditions resulting from the 59th Presidential Inauguration from January 11 to January 24, 2021.

I have no idea what to think of this.


Ivanka Trump is rumored to be attending the Inauguration.
She has political ambitions of her own.
posted by Chitownfats at 5:00 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


If the Ctrl-Z brigade are calling for unity then, after the reports of faeces-smearing in the federal capitol, people must require at least basic potty-training and continence from the losers.
posted by scruss at 5:01 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


The only reason I can see for letting Ivanka attend is to help ward off attacks, and that grosses me out for multiple reasons. Otherwise she has no business being anywhere near it.
posted by emjaybee at 5:04 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


I'm worried that with all that needs to get done, Congressional Review Act action is going to slip through the cracks, especially since its ability to undo executive rulemaking (and bar future administrations from performing similar rulemaking without explicit legislative approval) only reaches back "60 legislative days," a time frame that will keep on narrowing every day after the 20th.

When Trump took over, the republicans in congress used it to undo a slate of Obama's actions stretching back to, I believe, mid-summer. I'm not sure how to find out how far back 60 legislative days stretches this time.

It only requires 50 votes in the Senate.

Maybe those contacting their representatives about inauguration security or impeachment plans should add this to their requests?
posted by nobody at 5:06 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


"Citing his role in a "violent insurrectionist attack on the U.S. Capitol," the chairman of the New York State Senate's judiciary committee has made a formal request to begin the process of stripping Rudy Giuliani of his law license." -- Kyle Griffin
posted by valkane at 5:11 AM on January 12 [80 favorites]


Senate Armed Services has a hearing in a couple of hours abt civilian control of the military. C-SPAN link for later.
posted by fluttering hellfire at 5:16 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Sheldon Adelson just died. So, there's that.
posted by bcd at 5:19 AM on January 12 [48 favorites]


Rep. Jason Crow...asked...for the military's criminal investigation units to look into "troops deployed for the inauguration to ensure that deployed members are not sympathetic to domestic terrorists."

The government can't trust itself right now. That's terrifying.
posted by PlusDistance at 5:23 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


The only reason I can see for letting Ivanka attend is to help ward off attacks

And that is in anyways bad? Pence will be there, probably.
posted by Chitownfats at 5:28 AM on January 12


Sheldon Adelson just died

Maybe everyone but me knows who he was without having to look him up, but if anyone doesn’t, he was a rich casino owner who was the largest Trump donor. If this isn’t relevant beyond having anything at all to do with Trump, I didn’t read far enough to find the connection.
posted by aubilenon at 5:29 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


If this isn’t relevant beyond having anything at all to do with Trump, I didn’t read far enough to find the connection.

Adelson repeatedly dumped reality-warpingly large sums of money into our political discourse. In 2012 he singlehandedly kept Newt Gingrich's failing campaign alive by pumping 20 million into various PACs before begrudgingly moving on to support establishment candidates.

It can definitely be argued that Trump would have had a much more difficult time getting elected if not for people like Adelson.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 5:43 AM on January 12 [37 favorites]


Der Füzz PR machine> And it’s very easy for those officers to interpret that as ‘how could you let this happen?’

> That’s a not-unreasonable interpretation of a not-unreasonable question.

Sympathy for the victims of propaganda, sympathy for the victims of all fascist and capitalist predation, but keepin' it 💯^—there really will be no reasonable excuse, in less emotional moments, for any rational person who has been conscious for the last five years, much less the last twenty, to spend a little while thinking about or researching the events which led up to this yet still ask, “Dear God Almighty, what could possibly have gone wrong for us to deserve this? My burden is that of Job!^</not an actual quote from anyone>

I mean forget all of the stuff about the publicly self-identified white nationalist (←previous megathread) Nazi president of the United States leading a violent autocoup to overthrow the goverments of the same, the state governments for having sung his tune in the wrong key, after literally openly declining to accept a peaceful transfer of power... national capital disaster preparedness wise, all of the same stuff happened—indeed worse happened—on 9/11 (←previous megathread) less than two decades ago. No future historian is going to let any of us get off with “I am just shocked, completely blindsided, that twelve years of the deft helmsmanship of George W. Bush and Trump, and eight years of Obama also carrying out all POTUS duties backwards, in high heels, during the Neo-Confederate Antipatriot Birtherism onslaught and also trying to wind down the two simultaneous land wars in Asia his predecessor started, while juggling flaming bowling pins and keeping dinner plates gyroscopically spinning atop poles, did not result in an ‘A’ on our report cards for all problems and loose ends related to 9/11 like our bazillion-dollar investments in securing our capitol.” </not an actual quote>

Just to be clear, I am not merely trying to say ACAB and that there haven't, in the past week, been hero cops and others who went above and beyond the call of duty and risked the last full measure for those in their charge (or gave it, in at least that one case).

We let the “well oiled machine” guy with the nuclear codes go about his shenanigans and capers and we pretended, along with the police executives some cops feel betrayed by, that he was actually captain of some parts of an actual well oiled machine, in which honest non-Nazi Officer Friendly would need to exert herself at peak performance and with all the de-escalation training but also the non-lethal crowd control and active shooter scenarios and observation of rules for allowing free speech protests, etc., gears turning in her head, but still fulfill her duties within the tolerances of reasonable job expectations for a cog in a multi-trillion-dollar machine with uncountable levels of redundancy architected by the heretofore wealthiest and most sophisticated entity in the history of the human race. No, instead we let honest non-Nazi Officer Friendly down in regards to any reasonable expectations relative to her job description, and forced her into a position where she faced potentially having to silently say goodbye to her kids and throw herself on a grenade.

It's kind of like the opposite of systemic racism in principle... no systemic sympathy for the cops, systemically indeed they're all bastards, but individually there is indeed the needle in the haystack like Officer Eugene Goodman (←previous megathread links), and we should sympathize with the difficulties the hypothetical principled, moral cop will face while being the boot stomping on the human neck forever. If only for Buddhist compassion purposes like you'd have for a public louse who did not choose to be a public louse, on top of the tactical utility of an ability to speak to those on the other side and/or think like Nazi LEOs infiltrators and Russian GRU/GU^ personnel tasked with active measures and trying to shake loose something in particular.

But overall, as others have pointed out, let's keep it foremost in our mind that American citizens of color in a future hectic protest doing anything that even superficially resembled the actions of the January 6 Putsch will result in (←previous megathread) something similar to 1960 South Africa's Sharpeville massacre. And, lets be frank, quite possibly anyone else at this point; indeed it may accidentally happen to Nazis at some point (producing Horst Wessel martyrs for Nazi propaganda grist, undoubtedly deaths that will be attributed to Antifa assassins despite police-caliber bullet holes in their bodies, oops all the cameras were switched off) since we're into Hunger Games territory... btw thank you, thank you, thank you, Young Adult Fiction industry and related media industries for having your editorial head screwed on fairly straight during this century and green-lighting adult themes of dystopia on so many occasions (because real adults can handle dystopia maturely! not.), as far as the greedy capitalist IP sector goes.

Horst Ludwig Georg Erich Wessel, Berlin Sturmführer Nazi party officer supposedly killed by communists in 1930; he was the lyricist responsible for the now-outlawed official Nazi German Anthem Horst-Wessel-Lied. After Hitler came to power, there were continuous show trials and other executions of communists, socialists, and other leftists. So TO BE PERFECTLY FUCKING CRYSTAL CLEAR FOR ANYONE WHO STILL HAS NOT PICKED UP ON IT this is why the Putschisten, Trump, the Republicans, and Fox News are trying to claim that it was Antifa who breached the Capitol of the Republic and did every bad thing these last few years: because after they finally crush their enemies, there will be an all-they-can-eat/murder orgy in which they label whoever they want as “Antifa” and execute them, just as during the last hundred-plus years our broader society has pointed at whoever we want *cough* brown people *cough*, called them terrorists, and executed or bombed them and their families to death.

Michael Corleone, in a tuxedo, sitting on the steps of the opera house, cradling his daughter's body in his arms, screaming; she was killed by a failed assassin's bullet that passed through his body and into hers. Nearly the last scene of the trilogy, after the characters thought it was all over, thought that they were still tough guys but out of the business. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Help the cops, and other Americans, who suddenly at any point become able to see the blood soaking our hands and reel in horror; just don't let your guard down or assume that some coping mechanism will not subsequently assert itself and snap into place and allow us to again look away, again press the “deploy drones” button that has a “less-than-lethal munitions” label clumsily pasted over the real one and yawn and go get some lunch, or even return to the killing fields personally.
posted by XMLicious at 5:57 AM on January 12 [22 favorites]


It can definitely be argued that Trump would have had a much more difficult time getting elected if not for people like Adelson.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 9:43 PM on January 12 [+] [!]


Adelson is also largely, at some points primarily, responsible for bringing us everyone's least favorite Mitch.
posted by saysthis at 5:59 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]




Wouldn't they cancel each other out? Or would there be an enormous explosion, like with matter and anti-matter?
posted by Grangousier at 6:02 AM on January 12 [16 favorites]


It's like an ouroboros of wrong-headedness.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:02 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Madison Cawthorn spoke at rally before violent mob attacked Capitol. Now he’s facing backlash. -- The Charlotte Observer

“Make no mistake: There is blood on his hands. He played a role in encouraging the violence and attack on our democracy (Wednesday), going to get his picture taken and trying to get on the right-wing news by whipping up the crowd that attacked our democracy and our constitutional process. It was disgusting.”

Democratic Party officials from the 11th District sent a letter to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi requesting that the House conduct an ethics investigation into whether Cawthorn’s statements constitute “acts of sedition” and calling for his expulsion or censure."
posted by valkane at 6:03 AM on January 12 [48 favorites]


interogative mood: The reps who refused to wear a mask should face criminal charges for their reckless endangerment of their fellow humans.

The fact that they didn’t put the anti-mask stance aside even when under siege speaks volumes. They must have assumed that any gunman that breached their location would target hoax virus believing demonrat mask-wearers, not Real Patriots like themselves.
posted by dr_dank at 6:08 AM on January 12 [15 favorites]


The only reason I can see for letting Ivanka attend is to help ward off attacks, and that grosses me out for multiple reasons. Otherwise she has no business being anywhere near it.
posted by emjaybee


What are the odds she makes a grab for the mike, starts speechifying, and has to be dragged away?
posted by Pouteria at 6:08 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


For second time in a year, Fort Bragg officer's political protest under scrutiny, Gilbert Baez, WRAL Fayetteville, 1/11/2021 [brackets added, I’ve posted this long quote for context]:
FORT BRAGG, N.C. — The Army is investigating a psychological operations officer who led a group of people from North Carolina to the rally in Washington that led up to the deadly riot in the U.S. Capitol by supporters of President Donald Trump. Commanders at Fort Bragg are reviewing Capt. Emily Rainey’s involvement in last week's events in the nation's capital.

It marks the second time in just months that Rainey has been in hot water for her political activity. In May she posted a video [WRAL story with video] of herself taking down yellow tape around swings and slides at a playground in Southern Pines so her children could play. Southern Pines police charged her with injury to personal property, and told WRAL News that they let her off with warnings twice before after she tore down the tape closing off the playground.Fort Bragg says it took what it calls "appropriate disciplinary action" against her for that protest, and in October, she resigned her commission as an officer in the United States Army.

Now, just months before she was scheduled to leave the Army, Fort Bragg leaders are trying to determine if Rainey broke any military laws by leading 100 members of Moore County Citizens for Freedom [Facebook] to the Washington, D.C. rally that turned into a deadly riot. Rainey’s group describes itself online as a nonpartisan network promoting conservative values.

Joe Buccino, a public affairs officer with Fort Bragg, said the command would "look at the breath, totality of that soldier’s service, the circumstances at hand and then render a judgment." He also said the command was working to determine if any other soldiers from post participated. "It's important for us to keep in mind that soldiers are allowed to participate in political rallies, provided they do so in civilian clothes, provided that they adhere to all laws," Buccino said.

...The Department of Defense directive prohibits active-duty servicemembers from sponsoring partisan organizations. It is unclear if Rainey’s participation with her group on Wednesday went against DOD policy. Rainey said she attended the Trump rally while on leave, didn’t advertise that she was an Army officer and told her bosses ahead of time that she'd be going. "We are confident justice will prevail proving our innocence” ...she didn’t know of anyone who entered the Capitol and that her group was headed back to their buses hours before an emergency curfew took effect. “I was a private citizen and doing everything right and within my rights”.

Rainey, 30, is assigned to the 4th Psychological Operations Group at Fort Bragg, according to Maj. Daniel Lessard, a spokesman for 1st Special Forces Command. Known as PSYOPS, the group uses information and misinformation to shape the emotions, decision-making and actions of American adversaries. In June, Rainey wrote an article [direct link, cached] for the [unofficial] online military publication SOFREP about navigating the regulations around political activity. “The more you know about the rules, the freer you become,” she wrote.
posted by cenoxo at 6:08 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Imagine being Mike Pence and doing everything you can to keep the guy who tried to get you murdered in power so that you don't become President of the United States.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:10 AM on January 12 [82 favorites]


Today, President Donald J. Trump declared that an emergency exists in the District of Columbia and ordered Federal assistance to supplement the District’s response efforts due to the emergency conditions resulting from the 59th Presidential Inauguration from January 11 to January 24, 2021.

I have no idea what to think of this.


The Mayor of DC (and the governors of Virginia and Maryland) requested this because with the order in place she can call up the Mayor can deploy the National Guard and get assistance from Maryland and Virginia without going through the additional steps and veto points that delayed things on the 6th. It also allows the Capitol and Supreme Court to be more throughly secured prior to inauguration, as before the order the 19th and 20th were the only dates covered. It also releases additional funds to secure those facilities and the city.

It’s pretty standard, requested by Trump’s political opponents, and not really something Trump can use for nefarious purposes. To be honest I’m 100% shocked Trump even ordered it.
posted by jmauro at 6:10 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Democrats should respond to every Republican call for "national unity" that they can have it when they admit, publicly, in word and deed, that Democratic governmenance is as legitimate as their own, instead of spending every waking hour pushing the idea that it isn't.
posted by Gelatin at 6:14 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


What are the odds she makes a grab for the mike, starts speechifying, and has to be dragged away?

I realize you're mostly kidding, but come to think of it, I don't think I have ever seen her speak extemporaneously at any point... only in video statements, strategic social media posts, teleprompter speeches, and the like. She's a "curated" presence, an "influencer." She doesn't do off the cuff.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:14 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Here’s the impeachment resolution, H.Res. 24. (There were 4 introduced yesterday, but this looks like the one they will go with, and it’s cosponsored by most of those representatives.)
posted by Huffy Puffy at 6:15 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Another is a protest in honor of Ashli Babbitt, the woman killed while trying to climb into the Speaker’s Lobby during Wednesday’s pro-Trump siege of the Capitol.

The movement seems to have found its Horst Wessel.
posted by acb at 6:22 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Metafilter: I didn’t read far enough to find the connection.
posted by bl1nk at 6:28 AM on January 12 [20 favorites]


There are so many examples of the irrational craziness that is driving so many of these insurrectionists, but for some reason this one seems emblematic to me: a doctor who was one of the invaders of the US capital last week, who despite all evidence to the contrary is an ardent advocate for hydroxychloroquine as a COVID treatment. And of course,
Gold said she was worried that photos of her inside the Capitol would distract from her advocacy work with America’s Frontline Doctors.
“I do regret being there,” Gold
posted by PhineasGage at 6:29 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]


If Biden ends his term with less power than when he started, that would be a step in the right direction.

Let's not stop there. Ideally, strip the Presidency of all executive roles, spreading those across the legislature, and reducing the President to a ceremonial figurehead, a sort of elected constitutional monarch whose duties are cutting ribbons, existing as a symbol of continuity (for which the Presidential term should perhaps be longer than 4 years, and elections should not coincide with Congressional ones), reading the occasional government-prepared speech in an official capacity, and most importantly, officially having no opinions on day-to-day political matters.
posted by acb at 6:31 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Once we get through this it will be time to address the rot that has set into our military and our police forces. The way to do that is not just by explaining, shaming, and exposing. It requires punishment. Firings, stripping of pensions, incarceration.

The Overton window can move in either direction. But to move it back you’ll need a hammer. Grab them by the balls and their hearts and minds will follow.
posted by mono blanco at 6:31 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Adelson repeatedly dumped reality-warpingly large sums of money into our political discourse. In 2012 he singlehandedly kept Newt Gingrich's failing campaign alive by pumping 20 million into various PACs before begrudgingly moving on to support establishment candidates.

Didn't he also buy out a bunch of independent newspapers doing investigative reporting on local issues, sack their journalists overnight and turn them into propaganda sheets?

If there were a Hell, he'd have a prime spot reserved.
posted by acb at 6:34 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Yes, he did, and yes, with any luck, he does.
posted by Ghidorah at 6:41 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


On the one hand, we see police departments everywhere doing their very best to prove that ACAB, and that police abolition is not just a nifty slogan. On the other hand, if there's no vehicle to enforce the rules, who arrests and prosecutes the insurrectionists (not to mention the purposeful superspreaders). It's a paradox I can't see my way out of. "Reform" just isn't going to cut it.

There's a lot of heat focused on Pelosi, and rightfully so. But honestly, I don't know what she's supposed to do. She doesn't have the votes to expel the House members who are actual insurrectionists, and the 14th Amendment doesn't seem to have enough teeth and detail to not get shredded by a Trumpist SCOTUS. She's stuck with a hundred or more literal traitors.

If ever there was a time to not play by the rules, this would be it. But once you admit that not everyone is constrained by the same rules, you pretty much have to rebuild everything from scratch. You've done your own coup. I desperately don't want to be represented by literal Hitler-worshiper Madison Cawthorn, but he won the fucking election. So what recourse is there until (and unless) he is prosecuted for his role in the insurrection?

Democrats have had their heads in the sand for so long that the Republicans are just the opposition party and not a real and dangerous force for evil that now we are boxed into mostly letting most of their leadership off the hook for this (because I don't foresee Pelosi signing up for the necessary purge and revolutionary restart that the other choice demands).

We dodged a bullet with this election (and the Georgia runoff), but I have no idea what we're going to do about the sniper that's still up there with plenty of ammo.
posted by rikschell at 6:43 AM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Madison Cawthorn spoke at rally before violent mob attacked Capitol. Now he’s facing backlash.

I'm never going to be convinced that he wasn't made in some mad scientist's lab to be the perfect Republican. His name sounds like a WASPy plantation owner, he looks and talks like a robot they store in Kevin McCarthy's office closet to charge at night.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:45 AM on January 12 [19 favorites]


acb: " reducing the President to a ceremonial figurehead, a sort of elected constitutional monarch whose duties are cutting ribbons, existing as a symbol of continuity (for which the Presidential term should perhaps be longer than 4 years, and elections should not coincide with Congressional ones), reading the occasional government-prepared speech in an official capacity, and most importantly, officially having no opinions on day-to-day political matters."

Not so far from Trump, if you throw in a few rounds of golf and subtract the fascism.
posted by chavenet at 6:49 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


The problem is that President Donkey Kong still has a supply of flaming barrels to hurl, and can cause a lot of harm with executive orders, withdrawals from treaties and such, even when wielding those clumsily as a blunt instrument. A ceremonial figurehead president would have no barrels, flaming or otherwise.
posted by acb at 6:52 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


"For the 1st time in the last 10 transitions, the GOP Senate is not confirming Biden cabinet prior to inauguration. That’s right: Biden won't have DHS, AG, State, or HHS heads when he takes office in the wake of a domestic terror attack & during a pandemic" -- Tim Miller
posted by valkane at 6:52 AM on January 12 [52 favorites]




(I think it's worth amending "giving Israel carte blanche to do what it wanted" to "giving the hard-right wing in Israel carte blanche to do whatever it wanted.")
posted by nobody at 6:59 AM on January 12 [37 favorites]


Trump had almost 80% support among Israelis as of the 2020 election, so either the vast majority of the country is hard-right wing or it's not just that wing that's the problem.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 7:02 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


"Trump apparently not planning to aggressively fight impeachment because he's not on speaking terms with his White House Counsel" -- Josh Marshall
posted by valkane at 7:03 AM on January 12 [32 favorites]


That’s right: Biden won't have DHS, AG, State, or HHS heads when he takes office in the wake of a domestic terror attack & during a pandemic

Isn't this precisely why other nations have shadow ministers who spend their party's years in opposition still being briefed about the various goings on of departments so that when a transfer of power happens they're ready to go on day one?
posted by RonButNotStupid at 7:04 AM on January 12 [19 favorites]


I dislike being cynical and negative. It doesn't do any good really. However, a friend the other day opined that this divide goes back to Reagan. I said one could make a case for our country's fractured state having its roots in what we did to indigenous native Americans ('1491' is a good book) and importing slaves to this country.
posted by DJZouke at 7:12 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]



QAnon Woke Up the Real Deep State
The Deep State is real, but it’s not what you think. The Deep State you worry about is mostly made up; a fiction, a lie, a product of active imaginations, grifter manipulations, and the internet. I’m telling you this now because storming the Capitol building has drawn the attention of the real Deep State — the national security bureaucracy — and it’s important you understand what that means.

You attacked America. Maybe you think it was justified — as a response to a stolen election, or a cabal of child-trafficking pedophiles, or whatever — but it was still a violent attack on the United States. No matter how you describe it, that’s how the real Deep State is going to treat it.

The impact of that will make everything else feel like a LARP.
TL;DR: In the calculus of FAAFO, the time for FA is done; the time for FO has begun.
posted by jquinby at 7:12 AM on January 12 [25 favorites]


Fascism starts with a Big Lie.

I think this has a lot to do with why Trump favored Twitter. He didn't have to answer to the press. He would tweet and they would print it; no reporters' questions like there's would be in a press conference. The media really needs to learn from this dynamic.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:17 AM on January 12 [66 favorites]


Biden won't have DHS, AG, State, or HHS heads when he takes office in the wake of a domestic terror attack & during a pandemic

Given the quality of the individuals involved I think this is for the best.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 7:19 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


And the mob threats just keep on coming:

"Trump makes first public appearance and comments since last week, tells pool on South Lawn that impeachment is a "continuation of...the witch hunt."

"I think it’s causing tremendous anger," he said." -- Eli Stokols, LA Times
posted by valkane at 7:19 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


I remember way back in 2016 a friend pointed me to a post on Facebook, calling out the co-owner of a restaurant we frequented as a Trump supporter. I was pretty bothered, but another friend expressed disdain, and actually referred to it as a 'witch hunt.' We stopped going, but I didn't ever go further than that.

I can't help but think such a witch hunt in 2016 might have prevented some of this bullshit.
posted by aspersioncast at 7:22 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


"Without taking questions, Trump says, "We want no violence, never violence...On impeachment...it's ridiculous...This impeachment is causing tremendous anger. For Pelosi & Schumer to continue...I think it's causing tremendous danger to this country...I want no violence." -- Kaitlan Collins
posted by valkane at 7:35 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Given the quality of the individuals involved I think this is for the best.

Yep, here are the good things about Merrick Garland as Attorney General:

1) He opens up a DC Circuit seat
2) ...

I hope very much that he'll be aggressive in investigating and prosecuting Trump administration criminality, which should be one of the core priorities of this DOJ, but I'm not holding my breath. He's also lukewarm on criminal justice issues as far as I know.

But they got to own the conservatives by elevating the old centrist white guy who the Republicans blocked when Obama tried it, and he's not going to upset any big donor apple carts, so there you go.
posted by Gadarene at 7:37 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]




Trump leaving for Alamo, Texas on Air Force One as we speak.
No one has told has told Alamo about this.
posted by neroli at 7:41 AM on January 12 [42 favorites]


I suppose there’s a certain symbolism in going to the Alamo to make your last stand. Anybody tell him how that worked out for the folks at the Alamo last time?
posted by notoriety public at 7:48 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


a long, disciplined line of men in body armor moves as a unit up the Capitol Building steps.

I keep thinking about how wonderful it is that their green camouflage made them stand out like a sore thumb against all the red hats and blue flags, it would have been so easy to blend in but nope.
posted by Lanark at 7:49 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


That's the funny bit; he's going to Alamo. Not The Alamo, which is in San Antonio. Guessing a photo-op by the wall or something.
posted by jquinby at 7:49 AM on January 12 [26 favorites]


I know it was mentioned in a prior thread, but I seriously wonder if they thought they were scheduling something at THE Alamo, rather than Alamo, Texas? Can McAllen's airport handle AF1, or are they going to have to fly to San Antonio anyway?
posted by LionIndex at 7:50 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


For the first time in more than four years I went and looked up the emails I exchanged with my dad in July 2016 after he told me on a phone call he was planning to vote for Trump.

Excerpt from one of my emails:
Anyway, no, it's not [Trump's economic proposals] what worries me. It's that he's inciting such racial, ethnic, and religious vitriol and violence among some of the most hateful and vocal groups of people in this country, and instead of denouncing it, he's relishing it, encouraging it, and making it part of his platform. This nonsense with building a wall and "rounding up Muslims" is so horrid and gross, and whether or not it could actually ever *happen* were he to get elected is beside the point. He has never turned down the opportunity to say something horrible thing about women. He's openly mocked disabled people. In the last few weeks he's been talking about forcing US troops to commit war crimes (he has actually said he would make them do it) and he's advocated torture on numerous occasions. He's saying these things, loudly and with pride, and he now has access to the biggest stage in the world. It's an embarrassment. I'm embarrassed for our country. The Republican party has cannibalized itself so much over the last few years, trying desperately to appeal to it's rapidly radicalizing base, that this disgrace of a man is a major party Presidential nominee. Economic issues aside, think for a moment how it would feel to have someone who bloviates with such blatant disregard for even the most basic of rules of human decorum as the leader of our country. What example would that set? He would be the mouthpiece of the United States, a person children are supposed to be able to look up to and a person who needs to be respected by the leaders of other countries.
Excerpt from my dad's response:
For decades, everyone wanted to be Trump’s friend and business associate and share in the rewards of the Trump Brand. Now, his brand is damaged so the rats have come out to chew on his carcass. You will find nowhere in the media anything from the past 40 years that can label Trump as anything other than probably being a sexist. Trump and the Clintons are billionaires. Trump got there by building things and employing tens of thousands of people all around the country. Clinton’s got there by selling political favors. [...] Trump is a problem for everyone because he listens to no one and cannot be bought at any price. Hillary Clinton is a problem for me because she has demonstrated over and over and over that she is an inherently dishonest person.
Coda.

posted by phunniemee at 7:50 AM on January 12 [31 favorites]


It's actually at Alamo Total Landscaping.
posted by stevis23 at 7:51 AM on January 12 [52 favorites]


Four Seasons Alamo.
posted by PhineasGage at 7:51 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Of course a couple days ago (when this Alamo trip was initially announced) Twitter was wondering which Alamo Car Rental branch they would be using.
posted by soundguy99 at 7:52 AM on January 12 [25 favorites]


~ Trump leaving for Alamo, Texas on Air Force One as we speak.
~ No one has told has told Alamo about this.


Maybe he thinks he's going to The Alamo? That would make more sense vis-a-vis his delusions.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:52 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


*sigh* I work in a state capital capitol building and I really don't want to go to work next week.
posted by JanetLand at 7:52 AM on January 12 [57 favorites]


He may be able to visit the two Alamos – the day is still young-ish over there.
posted by Namlit at 7:56 AM on January 12


here are the good things about Merrick Garland as Attorney General

3. Maybe a minor point, but his appointment to AG means he doesn't need to be considered for Supreme court nomination if Justice Breyer resigns / another vacancy opens. Allows a new more progressive nominee for any vacancy, cutting off the "well if Garland was so great last time and you fought for him, why isn't he your nominee now?" distraction.
posted by inflatablekiwi at 7:56 AM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Maybe he just mumbled something about “a limo” and things spiralled out of control
posted by oulipian at 7:58 AM on January 12 [16 favorites]


I'm eagerly waiting for the Trump rally at Alamo Car Rental.
posted by xedrik at 7:59 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Here’s the impeachment resolution, H.Res. 24. (There were 4 introduced yesterday, but this looks like the one they will go with, and it’s cosponsored by most of those representatives.)

Has anyone seen an explainer (or something like that) on HR 24, 32 (Rep Omar's), and the other ones? I'm curious as to how they differ.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 7:59 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


What is the confusion? I read clearly stated this morning he is visiting his precious (unfinished) border wall.
posted by tiny frying pan at 8:00 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Maybe he just mumbled something about “a limo” and things spiralled out of control

Wouldn't be the first time such a thing had happened.

Legend says that once upon a time, J. Edgar Hoover scribbled "Watch the borders" on a memo, which immediately caused several car-loads of FBI agents to be dispatched towards the US-Canadian border, when the old man had actually been complaining about the margins on the document.
posted by jquinby at 8:01 AM on January 12 [29 favorites]


Isn't this precisely why other nations have shadow ministers who spend their party's years in opposition still being briefed about the various goings on of departments so that when a transfer of power happens they're ready to go on day one?

In most parliamentary systems, at least those without stupid fixed election laws, government can be dissolved and reformed in a matter of weeks so yes all parties with aspirations to control run shadow cabinets so they have people ready to run departments on day one when ever day one happens to occur.

Given the quality of the individuals involved I think this is for the best.

Too be clear it's Biden's people who aren't approved not the Trump lackeys. Normally the Senate approves all the incoming President's nominations before the inauguration.
posted by Mitheral at 8:03 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


> He's not trying to persuade them. He's telling them what their story is and modeling the conviction with which they are to tell that story. He's always done that.


That's a great insight. Abusers groom victims, successful* abusers groom allies. And Trump grooms reality itself through obsequious consensus. It's sickening and horrifying.

* Successful at not being caught, to hell with all abusers
posted by Godspeed.You!Black.Emperor.Penguin at 8:04 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


I think a number of corporations are ditching the Republicans right now because of adage, "I hate reality but it's the only place to get a good steak."
If the Republicans succeed in breaking the U.S., meal tickets are going to suffer.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:04 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]


he is visiting his precious (unfinished) border wall.

Maybe he misunderstood the meaning of being first against the wall when the revolution comes.
posted by Riki tiki at 8:10 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]


It looks like Jake Angeli will be getting his organic meals while he's incarcerated.

This angers me to a degree that surprises even me.

Not because I want to see him suffer, but because:

1) There are reliable reports of American jails and prisons doing things like giving pork to Muslims and denying or slow-walking vegetarian/vegan meals to those who request to them. Angeli gets fast tracked, similar to Dylan Roof being treated to Burger King by empathetic cops.

2) The privilege people like Angeli and his fellow white right-wing terrorists have is enormous and they won't. shut. up. about how they are the real victims when you think about it . They're like dragons sleeping on a pile of treasure. They can't or won't use it, but they fly into flaming fits of rage whenever anyone else -- especially those they consider lesser beings -- gets even a tiny bit.

To paraphrase both Nina Simone and Reverend Jeremiah Wright, America goddamn.
posted by lord_wolf at 8:12 AM on January 12 [132 favorites]


3. Maybe a minor point, but his appointment to AG means he doesn't need to be considered for Supreme court nomination if Justice Breyer resigns / another vacancy opens. Allows a new more progressive nominee for any vacancy, cutting off the "well if Garland was so great last time and you fought for him, why isn't he your nominee now?" distraction.

Don't put it past them to do it anyway, but this is a valid point, thank you.
posted by Gadarene at 8:15 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


The closest airport to the city of Alamo, Texas is McAllen Miller International Airport [map] about 6 miles west of Allen (which Trump’s evidently not visiting on his way to the border wall).
posted by cenoxo at 8:16 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Ugh, yeah I saw that bit about the organic meals. Is the normal protocol for hunger-striking prisoners to cave to their demands? After a few days surely it would justify a psych eval and maybe IV nutrition? Like, for food allergies, obviously accommodate that, but this is toddler-refusing-vegetables territory, surely.

Not to mention, he could be safely at home eating whatever the hell he wants if he hadn't decided to storm his nation's capitol to overturn a legitimate election, committing many crimes in the process.
posted by Godspeed.You!Black.Emperor.Penguin at 8:19 AM on January 12 [28 favorites]


Fascism starts with a Big Lie.

The Big Lie isn’t everything of the Trump administration; it’s the lie about Covid being real and serious.

These people are living through the largest daily mass casualty event in US history, propagated by their leader, and are STILL running around maskless, fighting with managers who ask them to wear a mask and asking Nurses how they could possible have Covid if it “isn’t real” as they go on a ventilator to die.

Covid is the big lie. We’re seeing fascism rise from that.
posted by glaucon at 8:21 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Yep, here are the good things about Merrick Garland as Attorney General:

1) He opens up a DC Circuit seat
2) ...

I hope very much that he'll be aggressive in investigating and prosecuting Trump administration criminality, which should be one of the core priorities of this DOJ, but I'm not holding my breath. He's also lukewarm on criminal justice issues as far as I know.

But they got to own the conservatives by elevating the old centrist white guy who the Republicans blocked when Obama tried it, and he's not going to upset any big donor apple carts, so there you go.


The speculation I read is that this opens Garland's current seat in his circuit for another judge, Ketanji Brown Jackson, a Black woman. That circuit is a feeder for the Supreme Court and would set her up to allow Breyer to retire and her to take his place.

The donor apple carts statement also seems off base - as a circuit court judge, isn't Garland much less entrenched in the donor economy than Doug Moore or Sally Yates, the other candidates for the job?
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 8:24 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


"Without taking questions, Trump says, "We want no violence, never violence...On impeachment...it's ridiculous...This impeachment is causing tremendous anger. For Pelosi & Schumer to continue...I think it's causing tremendous danger to this country...I want no violence."

Translation: Please don’t indict me
posted by leotrotsky at 8:27 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


I do find it interesting that before the Supreme Court thing, Garland was best known for his investigation into and prosecution of the Oklahoma City bombers. He basically made his name going after domestic terrorism.
posted by everybody had matching towels at 8:28 AM on January 12 [81 favorites]


Cruz' communications director resigns over his refusal to certify the election and the failed insurrection.
posted by deeker at 8:28 AM on January 12 [64 favorites]


Garland has deep ties to the DoJ. He's been put in there to try and rebuild a working Justice Department after Trump's goons trashed the place. He's also unbelievably well-respected by the judiciary, so that's some huge points right there- Judges have spend the last four years becoming progressively less trusting of the DoJ not to flat-out lie to them.

He also ran the entire investigation of the Oklahoma City bombing, so he knows more than a little about the threat of homegrown terror.

There's plenty of reasons why people don't like him- I'm not saying that he was the right choice. But those are some of the reasons why he was picked. Biden did not pick him to own the cons.
posted by BungaDunga at 8:29 AM on January 12 [56 favorites]


I'd say the Big Lie we've been fed for some time is more hydra-like.. more environmental and immersive.. than "fake-news COVID" (I take your point that it's others who are embracing the Big Lie, not "us", and I challenge this as I challenge anyone who seems to think dealing with Trump is even substantively a response to the past several years).

Trump and the senseless violence, the willful ignorance, these are products of generations of deficit. It's not that I am hopeless, I just don't see people and systems that are equal to turning this ship. I'm not American and what is happening in the US is happening around me, too, just a slightly different tenor to the situation.
posted by elkevelvet at 8:29 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


>> If Biden ends his term with less power than when he started, that would be a step in the right direction.

> Let's not stop there. Ideally, strip the Presidency of all executive roles, spreading those across the legislature, and reducing the President to a ceremonial figurehead, a sort of elected constitutional monarch whose duties are cutting ribbons, existing as a symbol of continuity (for which the Presidential term should perhaps be longer than 4 years, and elections should not coincide with Congressional ones), reading the occasional government-prepared speech in an official capacity, and most importantly, officially having no opinions on day-to-day political matters.

Huzzah. Iceland's Birgitta Jónsdóttir interviewed on Democracy Now! in 2016 (at about 32:45, alt link, .torrent, transcript) after the initial victories of the Pirate Party:
...the parliaments in this world are so weak. They are governed and ruled by the executive branch. And that is a big problem with how we run our societies.
...the winter after the Panama Papers came out; IIRC one of the ways the story had been broken to the public by the allied journalist organizations was by the Icelandic vanguard springing uncovered personal financial details on corrupt then-Icelandic-Prime-Minister Sigmundur Davíð Gunnlaugsson in the middle of an interview, in response to which he blinked, stood up, walked out of the room, and resigned.

...aaaand Wikipedia says that last year Gunnlaugsson claimed that Black Lives Matter is racist and is the equivalent to Mao's Cultural Revolution. (Citation in Icelandic, so I can't verify.)

Couldn't it just be financial turpitude? So much for the warm glow of my rosy fictional imagined version of Iceland synthesized from Jónsdóttir and Eurovision Song Contest: The Story of Fire Saga.
posted by XMLicious at 8:36 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I am incalculably sad at the state of the country (also mad).
posted by bluesky43 at 8:39 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


I was listening to a podcast yesterday about Trump (Dollop #300 in 2018), and they read extracts from the advert he placed against The Central Park Five.

It's thirty years later, but I think the time may have come for some of the points he made to be considered relevant, at least when it comes to one man who we know has lived by this sword. To paraphrase slightly:
What has happened to the respect for authority, the fear of retribution by the courts, society and the police for those who break the law, who wantonly trespass on the rights of of others? What has happened is the complete breakdown of life as we knew it.

Many New York families - White, Black, Hispanic and Asian - have had to give up [their pleasures] - given them up as hostages to a world ruled by the law of the streets, as roving bands of wild criminals roam our neighbourhoods, dispensing their own vicious brand of twisted hatred on whomever they encounter. At what point did we cross the line from the fine and noble pursuit of of genuine civil liberties to the reckless and dangerously permissive atmosphere which allows criminals to [incite sedition] and then laugh at [the] anguish? They laugh because they know that soon, very soon, they will be returned to the streets to [incite violence] once again - and yet face no great personal risk to themselves. [...]

They should be forced to suffer, [...]. They must serve as examples so that others will think long and hard before committing a crime or an act of violence. [...] If the punishment is strong, the attacks on innocent people will stop.

posted by MattWPBS at 8:40 AM on January 12 [16 favorites]


In first public appearance since the Capitol siege, Trump expresses no contrition for inciting the mob. (nyt)

“People thought what I said was totally appropriate,” Mr. Trump told reporters at Joint Base Andrews, en route to Alamo, Texas, where he was set to visit the border wall. Instead, Mr. Trump claimed that racial justice protests over the summer were “the real problem.”

“If you look at what other people have said, politicians at a high level about the riots during the summer, the horrible riots in Portland and Seattle and various other places, that was a real problem,” he said.
posted by bluesky43 at 8:43 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


I decided to check what George Will was saying about this. He has not been a Trump fan, sometimes I felt that was more because Trump is a vulgarian than because he is a fascist.

So on, January 5th, Will wrote: ". . . on Wednesday, the members of the Hawley-Cruz cohort will violate the oath of office in which they swore to defend the Constitution from enemies “foreign and domestic.” They are its most dangerous domestic enemies." Pretty good stuff.

On January 6th he wrote, "The three repulsive architects [elsewhere identified as Cruz, Hawley, and Trump] of Wednesday’s heartbreaking spectacle — mobs desecrating the Republic’s noblest building and preventing the completion of a constitutional process — must be named, and forevermore shunned." Shunning? Even Hester Prynne is face-palming.

He hasn't tweeted since January 6th.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:43 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Article on Deutsche Bank and others cutting ties with Trump at The Guardian.
posted by history_denier at 8:43 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Wish there was a way his bankers could call in his loans now.
posted by suelac at 8:45 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


(nyt) On Tuesday, Representative Brad Schneider, Democrat of Illinois, said that he had received a positive virus test, following similar statements from two other Democrats, Representatives Bonnie Watson Coleman of New Jersey and Pramila Jayapal of Washington.

All three Democratic lawmakers have pointed at Republican counterparts who refused to wear masks while members of Congress were sheltering in place.
posted by bluesky43 at 8:49 AM on January 12 [18 favorites]


Trump leaving for Alamo, Texas on Air Force One as we speak.

This is a man in despair who still cannot believe how everything crumbled around him. He is mentally trying to go back to that first glorious day when he rode down the golden escalator and announced he would build a wall and Mexico would pay for it. He's regressing to the past because the future is too despairing. Nobody cares about the wall anymore except Donald.
posted by JackFlash at 8:53 AM on January 12 [20 favorites]


Jesus. From the Washington Post article.
McCarthy did eventually reach Trump, but later told allies that he found the president distracted. So McCarthy repeatedly appeared on television to describe the mayhem, an adviser said, in an effort to explain just how dire the situation was.
The middle of a crisis, and the House Minority Leader has to try to get the gravity across via television.
posted by MattWPBS at 8:55 AM on January 12 [59 favorites]


reps jayapal, schneider and coleman need to name the unmasked colleagues sheltering with them. unmask the unmasked!
posted by 20 year lurk at 9:01 AM on January 12 [37 favorites]


> Nobody cares about the wall anymore except Donald.

So it's finished, right? Every foot of the border between the U.S., completely walled off and impregnable, and paid for by Mexico to boot? You can't blame Trump for wanting to bask in such a triumphant achievement for one afternoon.

/ sarcasm
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:04 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Have there been any intimations from big corporations that, as with those who opposed Electoral College certification, they'll withhold contributions to any member of Congress who votes to acquit Trump?
posted by Epixonti at 9:06 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


“If you look at what other people have said, politicians at a high level about the riots during the summer, the horrible riots in Portland and Seattle and various other places, that was a real problem,” he said.

First of all, fuck this guy. JFC.

Now, it's beginning to make sense why he hid in his bunker and called upon Barr's goons when BLM protests came to the White House. He hid in his bunker because in his mind the protesters would murder him if they could. That's why he thinks his actually murderous mob is no worse. Since that's as he understands it, he knew damn well what he was really commanding them to do when he sent them down the road.
posted by adept256 at 9:07 AM on January 12 [30 favorites]


"Sen. Lindsey Graham, who last week said he and President Trump had a "hell of a journey" but it was time to "count me out" because "enough was enough," is flying to Texas on Air Force One today, per the pool." -- Kaitlan Collins, CNN
posted by valkane at 9:10 AM on January 12 [48 favorites]


In first public appearance since the Capitol siege, Trump expresses no contrition for inciting the mob. (nyt)

“People thought what I said was totally appropriate,” Mr. Trump told reporters at Joint Base Andrews, en route to Alamo, Texas, where he was set to visit the border wall. Instead, Mr. Trump claimed that racial justice protests over the summer were “the real problem.”

“If you look at what other people have said, politicians at a high level about the riots during the summer, the horrible riots in Portland and Seattle and various other places, that was a real problem,” he said.


Thank you Maine voters.
posted by leotrotsky at 9:13 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


"Sen. Lindsey Graham, who last week said he and President Trump had a "hell of a journey" but it was time to "count me out" because "enough was enough," is flying to Texas on Air Force One today, per the pool." -- Kaitlan Collins, CNN

The Onion was once again prophetic: ‘This Apology Is Bullshit And I Am Lying To You,’ Says GOP Senator To Widespread Media Praise.
posted by jedicus at 9:15 AM on January 12 [95 favorites]


Have there been any intimations from big corporations that, as with those who opposed Electoral College certification, they'll withhold contributions to any member of Congress who votes to acquit Trump?

From Heather Cox Richardson:
Suddenly corporations are announcing they will no longer make political donations… at least to Republicans. Judd Legum and Tesnim Zekeria at Popular Information yesterday broke the story that Marriott, BlueCross BlueShield, and Commerce Bank would not contribute to the 147 Republicans who objected to the counting of the electoral votes in Congress. That’s more than half the Republicans in Congress. Verizon, AT&T, and Amazon have now joined that boycott. Citigroup, 3M, Facebook, Microsoft, Google, and JPMorgan Chase have all halted political giving for several months, and a number of other companies say they are reevaluating their giving.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 9:18 AM on January 12 [23 favorites]


As for Mitch's feet of clay, I've never seen a turtle move so fucking fast as when RBG died.
posted by adept256 at 9:19 AM on January 12 [52 favorites]


history_denier: "Article on Deutsche Bank and others cutting ties with Trump at The Guardian."

Bank had propped up Trump Organization for years despite being sued by president but acted after Capitol attack


Such bravery.
posted by chavenet at 9:19 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


In first public appearance since the Capitol siege, Trump expresses no contrition for inciting the mob. (nyt)

“People thought what I said was totally appropriate,” Mr. Trump told reporters at Joint Base Andrews, en route to Alamo, Texas, where he was set to visit the border wall. Instead, Mr. Trump claimed that racial justice protests over the summer were “the real problem.”

“If you look at what other people have said, politicians at a high level about the riots during the summer, the horrible riots in Portland and Seattle and various other places, that was a real problem,” he said.


Ah yes, the Trumpoborous abides.
posted by lazaruslong at 9:20 AM on January 12


I can't wait until the Senate reconvenes so they can all have another chance to chuckle at Lindsay Graham's funny jokes together.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:21 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Ideally, strip the Presidency of all executive roles, spreading those across the legislature

It's not like that has done much to keep Orban or Modi in check. It's cool to want to completely overhaul the government structure so it moves to a parliamentary system but it's not a way out of our problems.
posted by mark k at 9:25 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.
Throughout American history, political violence has often been guided, initiated, and perpetrated by respectable people from educated middle- and upper-class backgrounds. The belief that only impoverished people engage in political violence—particularly right-wing political violence—is a misconception often cultivated by the very elites who benefit from that violence.
posted by suelac at 9:26 AM on January 12 [61 favorites]




Did not see this in the last thread or this one but Snopes is saying that the people getting dragged off of airplanes are mostly anti-maskers and not people on no fly lists.
posted by jessamyn at 9:37 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


> Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.
So when they said "those people do not represent america", they were actually correct, albeit their reason was almost exactly opposite to the reason why it was correct.
posted by runcifex at 9:39 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


mostly anti-maskers and not people on no fly lists

That Venn diagram is nearly a circle.
posted by Fleebnork at 9:39 AM on January 12 [29 favorites]


Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.
So true. And yet we have had to suffer through miles and miles of reports about the White Working Class.
posted by mumimor at 9:40 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


So often we hear "if only we had a different form of democracy everything would be different." Musings about whether the U.S. needs a parliamentary system are not new, and wherever there's a shitty parliamentary government there are advocates for a directly elected executive and/or legislative districts.

But in the American example right now, after years of an egregiously gerrymandered House of Representatives and Mitch McConnell's iron rule of the Senate, I'm surprised anyone here wants Congress to have more power.
posted by PhineasGage at 9:42 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


It looks like Jake Angeli will be getting his organic meals while he's incarcerated.

With say vegan or vegetarian meals i can see how one could say 'hey this isn't what I requested!' but how does one get handed a glass of milk and know it's not organic???
posted by 922257033c4a0f3cecdbd819a46d626999d1af4a at 9:45 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.

It's upsetting just how few comfortable centrists/liberals, most of them white, don't want to hear this. Heavily upgraded rifles and pickup trucks are expensive. I guess it's more comforting to assume the problem is with poor white people who live far away and not one's own coworkers and neighbors.

These people don't want to pay taxes and to a lesser degree, they are terrified of being displaced from the top of the American dream (even though that won't actually happen). That's all it takes for them to warp patriotism into an attempted armed insurrection.
posted by Ouverture at 9:45 AM on January 12 [25 favorites]


I mean parliamentary democracy is working great for Britain what could be the downside? /s
posted by Huffy Puffy at 9:45 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


The belief that only impoverished people engage in political violence—particularly right-wing political violence—is a misconception

on the evening of the putsch, in a newsroom-style segment on washingtonpost, james hohmann, as part of his explanation for violence directed against members of the press, offered "these people" and then he lowered his voice a bit like one might while self-consciously uttering a cuss amid other speech at normal volume, "many of them didn't graduate from college..." and so don't understand the president's anti-press statements as empty demagoguery.

i tweeted (selftwitterlink) at him and the post about the offensive stupidity of such a statement to no response or avail. it was exceptionally disappointing -- and terribly discrediting -- to hear from a journalist, even during that distressing day, such misdirected proxy classism. of course, since then, many college-graduates and others of the bourgeois have been identified among the putschists.
posted by 20 year lurk at 9:46 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


That Venn diagram is nearly a circle.

The same type of people, sure, but I think it's important to know that people aren't being disallowed to fly out of DC (or elsewhere) because of activities at the Capitol, it's just because they are anti-maskers. That's an important distinction. No-fly lists are either the main one maintained by the FBI (which were notorious for being racist and for profiling people and which do not seem to include these new terrorists) or individual ones maintained by airlines, which can be for any number of things (usually being "disorderly" in some ways) but so far it doesn't appear that either of these tools are what is being used against the people in the widely-circulated videos. Which is a good news/bad news situation at some level.
posted by jessamyn at 9:46 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


"Without taking questions, Trump says, "We want no violence, never violence...On impeachment...it's ridiculous...This impeachment is causing tremendous anger. For Pelosi & Schumer to continue...I think it's causing tremendous danger to this country...I want no violence."

Translation: Please don’t indict me


One of the tells that Trump has been briefed to be sure to emphasize a point ("Be sure to mention that you don't want violence!") is that he repeats it over and over and over and...
posted by Gelatin at 9:47 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


The organic meals thing sounds like the Van Halen no-brown-M&Ms tour rider: as a test and/or demonstration of how much deference one commands.
posted by acb at 9:47 AM on January 12 [21 favorites]


Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.

Yes, similar conclusions have been drawn about members of Al-Qaeda and other violent groups that use terrorism tactics, that they are middle or upper-middle class movements. A pretty good overview here: "A Matter of Pride," Democracy Journal, 2007
posted by sk932 at 9:48 AM on January 12 [7 favorites]


These people don't want to pay taxes and to a lesser degree, they are terrified of being displaced from the top of the American dream (even though that won't actually happen).

Proving that nothing much changes; those are the reasons behind the USA's historical middle-class political violence (Revolution/War of Independence: "we don't like paying taxes"; Southern "redemptionists" c. 1876: "we must forcefully establish white supremacy").
posted by Pseudonymous Cognomen at 9:48 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


I dislike being cynical and negative. It doesn't do any good really. However, a friend the other day opined that this divide goes back to Reagan. I said one could make a case for our country's fractured state having its roots in what we did to indigenous native Americans ('1491' is a good book) and importing slaves to this country.

I don't think it is cynical nor negative to acknowledge that everything we have seen happen in the last few years has roots in slavery, indigenous genocide, post-WW2 neoconservatism, and most recently, bipartisan neoliberalism.

To think that there are no macroscopic or historical factors at play here is to think that Trump was the root problem all along.
posted by Ouverture at 9:49 AM on January 12 [24 favorites]


brown M&Ms derail: That's not why Van Halen had that in their tour rider. It has more to do with "What other instructions did you fail to read?" and less to do with deference.
posted by emelenjr at 9:56 AM on January 12 [73 favorites]


Adam Serwer (the guy who coined "The cruelty is the point") points out that the Trump base is the respectable white middle class.

It's upsetting just how few comfortable centrists/liberals, most of them white, don't want to hear this.


Worth noting that Serwer's article largely seems to be a response to another Atlantic writer portraying the coup as being made up of rednecks and "slow students" (her actual words). It should not be surprising that the author of that article is yet another Harper's signatory who feels like this is really ultimately the fault of (or a valid response to) "wokeness". It's turning into a pattern with these folks.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 9:58 AM on January 12 [17 favorites]


Madison Cawthorn spoke at rally before violent mob attacked Capitol. Now he’s facing backlash.

I'm never going to be convinced that he wasn't made in some mad scientist's lab to be the perfect Republican. His name sounds like a WASPy plantation owner, he looks and talks like a robot they store in Kevin McCarthy's office closet to charge at night.


And he is a college dropout who quit after pulling straight D's in his first year. So he seems like the logical choice for the Republican's next presidential candidate.
posted by srboisvert at 10:00 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


It should not be surprising that the author of that article is yet another Harper's signatory who feels like this is really ultimately the fault of (or a valid response to) "wokeness". It's turning into a pattern with these folks.

When all these people have is an irrational grievance, the entire world looks like a tragedy to be framed through said grievance.
posted by Ouverture at 10:00 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


These people don't want to pay taxes and to a lesser degree, they are terrified of being displaced from the top of the American dream (even though that won't actually happen). That's all it takes for them to warp patriotism into an attempted armed insurrection.

My working theory is that underlying a lot of the MAGA stuff is the tendency that the more comfortable you are the more trivial shit you focus your frustrations on, so now we get a whole middle class conservative subculture whipped up into a frenzy about things that don't even really affect their comfort.
posted by jason_steakums at 10:01 AM on January 12 [45 favorites]


The same type of people, sure, but I think it's important to know that people aren't being disallowed to fly out of DC (or elsewhere) because of activities at the Capitol, it's just because they are anti-maskers.

But they will be put on a no-fly list maintained by that airline. I don't know if airlines share their internal lists.
posted by JackFlash at 10:02 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


So since I can't call my elected Representative about this, I'm calling the other 434. That's a lot of phone calls, even though they only take about a minute apiece. Did you know that 434 is evenly divisible by 62? It's very interesting to take this cross-country journey and visit with heroes like Cori Bush and villains like Mo Brooks. I've left a lot of messages, talked to some very nice people (including a couple of Republican staffers who voiced their agreement!) as well as a couple of dicks. Here's my script:

My name is Rik Schell, and I'm calling you from Asheville North Carolina, because I can’t call my own House Representative. (I am calling all the other 434 members.) Madison Cawthorn is an insurrectionist, a serial liar, an abuser, and a literal fascist. I would rather have no representation in the House than have him represent me. As a citizen of the 11th District of North Carolina, I humbly beg you to expel him from the legislature. He did win his election, but he doesn’t believe in democracy and encouraged the violent overthrow of our legitimately elected leaders. HE DIRECTED THE MOB AT YOU. He should have no place in government, and if you agree with him, neither should you.

(Did I mention it's a lot of calls?)
posted by rikschell at 10:05 AM on January 12 [136 favorites]


So there are well-off people in Trump riots, well-off people in ISIS, and I'm pretty sure there are well-off people in BLM protests, too. I've heard there were well-off people involved in the French Revolution and in the violent suppression of the Chartists. I guess we shouldn't be surprised when well-off people take to the streets to push for political changes.
posted by clawsoon at 10:05 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I'm officially taking off from work on Inauguration Day, my boss okayed it. I just don't think I can even pretend to care about work drama while wondering if the capital is going to be blown up and/or waiting for it to blow up, whether literally or figuratively. I really just want them to move the ceremony to an "undisclosed location" already under the circumstances.
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:09 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


“People thought what I said was totally appropriate,” Mr. Trump told reporters

OK, everyone needs to stop letting him get away with this--especially the media. He refers to "people" a lot. Which people? Who? Who qualifies them? Do they look at the whole country, or just his supporters? What did they say? Was it a survey?

I can talk about how "people" feel I need a raise, or that "people" feel I'm the greatest Metafilterer of all time. The undescribed "people" attempts to suggest some credential that isn't there.

STOP LETTING HIM GET AWAY WITH IT!!!! "When you say 'people said it was totally appropriate,' which 'people' are those?"

"This impeachment is causing tremendous anger. For Pelosi & Schumer to continue...I think it's causing tremendous danger to this country...I want no violence."

The lack of impeachment is causing tremendous anger. But that's not what I want to say. This sounds like the situation where a killer has a gun to the head of a hostage: "take one more step and I kill her. That will be your fault." This could easily be read as "if there is an impeachment, my supporters should do violence."
posted by MrGuilt at 10:09 AM on January 12 [41 favorites]


20 year lurk: reps jayapal, schneider and coleman need to name the unmasked colleagues sheltering with them. unmask the unmasked!

Republican members of Congress refuse to wear masks during Capitol insurrection, CNN:
Six House Republicans were captured on video refusing masks offered by a colleague during the US Capitol insurrection on Wednesday.

Rep. Lisa Blunt Rochester, a Delaware Democrat, was shown approaching the group of colleagues and offering blue surgical masks. The video, shot from inside a safe room where the lawmakers gathered during the chaos, was published on Twitter by Punchbowl News.

Georgia Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene, Oklahoma Rep. Markwayne Mullin, Arizona Rep. Andy Biggs, Pennsylvania Rep. Scott Perry, Texas Rep. Michael Cloud and California Rep. Doug LaMalfa were captured unmasked and gathered closely together. They all refused the masks.
posted by kristi at 10:11 AM on January 12 [51 favorites]


[ One comment delete for violating the Content Policy. Cursing is fine, cursing at someone else is not.]
posted by loup (staff) at 10:11 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


From Nov. The Atlantic
''That’s a nice transition, ISIS to us'', Rhodes said when I first called him, in February, and told him what had led me to the Oath Keepers.
posted by adamvasco at 10:12 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


After 4 years and literally tens of thousands of lies, what does "don't let him get away with" saying baseless things even mean? He didn't take questions. The only ones who can "not let him get away with it" are Congress.
posted by PhineasGage at 10:13 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Six House Republicans were captured on video refusing masks offered by a colleague during the US Capitol insurrection on Wednesday.

Why should we even be civil about this, at this point? Especially when you're trapped in close quarters with somebody?

"Here's a mask."
"Oh, no thanks."
"We're not asking. Put the fucking mask on."
posted by Two unicycles and some duct tape at 10:13 AM on January 12 [63 favorites]


Washington Post: FBI report warned of ‘war’ at Capitol, contradicting claims there was no sign of looming violence.
“[...]specific calls for violence [included] stating ‘Be ready to fight. Congress needs to hear glass breaking, doors being kicked in, and blood from their BLM and Pantifa slave soldiers being spilled. Get violent. Stop calling this a march, or rally, or a protest. Go there ready for war. We get our President or we die. NOTHING else will achieve this goal.”
(I'm afraid to look up what "Pantifa" is supposed to mean exactly. Panty fascists? Pantry fascists?)
posted by nobody at 10:14 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]


From the WaPo article:
But as senators and House members trapped inside the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday begged for immediate help during the siege, they struggled to get through to the president, who — safely ensconced in the West Wing — was too busy watching fiery TV images of the crisis unfolding around them to act or even bother to hear their pleas.

“He was hard to reach, and you know why? Because it was live TV,” said one close Trump adviser. “If it’s TiVo, he just hits pause and takes the calls. If it’s live TV, he watches it, and he was just watching it all unfold.”

Even as he did so, Trump did not move to act. And the message from those around him — that he needed to call off the angry mob he had egged on just hours earlier, or lives could be lost — was one to which he was not initially receptive.

“It took him awhile to appreciate the gravity of the situation,” Graham said in an interview. “The president saw these people as allies in his journey and sympathetic to the idea that the election was stolen.”

Trump ultimately — and begrudgingly — urged his supporters to “go home in peace.” But the six hours between when the Capitol was breached shortly before 2 p.m. Wednesday afternoon and when it was finally declared secure around 8 p.m. that evening reveal a president paralyzed — more passive viewer than resolute leader, repeatedly failing to perform even the basic duties of his job.
I think we need to call out this kind of narrative as bullshit. The facts are true but the narrative is being shaped into Trump is a compulsive live TV watcher he just couldn't pull himself away from the screen to take action. While for a normal administration this would be damning enough -- a president who is such a couch potato he's willing to watch TV rather than save lives -- it does not go far enough.

Trump was not watching TV because he's addicted to it. He was waiting to see if the coup succeeded, Pence or Pelosi was killed, and the voting disrupted. This was a coup attempted through deliberate military and leadership inaction. He was a fire chief who threw lit matches, and now is watching his ex-wife's house burn down, while multiple firemen are asking him for permission to do something about the fire. It may not be murder but it sure is sedition and manslaughter.
posted by benzenedream at 10:14 AM on January 12 [84 favorites]


The Onion was once again prophetic: ‘This Apology Is Bullshit And I Am Lying To You,’ Says GOP Senator To Widespread Media Praise

I was pleased to discover that The Onion has consistently been referring to the putschists as "Trump rioters".
posted by J.K. Seazer at 10:15 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I'm afraid to look up what "Pantifa" is supposed to mean exactly.

Looks like "Antifa" with an extra dose of misogyny and lol-underwear. And I say this as someone who is typically a big fan of lol-underwear comedy.
posted by Faint of Butt at 10:17 AM on January 12 [14 favorites]


The great thing about being a disease carrier is you have full deniability as long as you're not tested for it.
posted by at by at 10:17 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Freshman Republican Rep. Peter Meijer wrote a piece calling for other Republicans to take responsibility for the insurrection. It included this:
after the Capitol was cleared of insurrectionists, with windows shattered and the smell of tear gas lingering, the consequences of his dangerous lies became clear. As we moved to accept Arizona’s electors, a fellow freshman lingered near a voting terminal, voting card in hand.

My colleague told me that efforts to overturn the election were wrong, and that voting to certify was a constitutional duty. But my colleague feared for family members, and the danger the vote would put them in. Profoundly shaken, my colleague voted to overturn.

An angry mob succeeded in threatening at least one member of Congress from performing what that member understood was a constitutional responsibility.
ALL threats against public officials need to be reported and prosecuted. It needs to become the highest law enforcement priority.
posted by kristi at 10:17 AM on January 12 [55 favorites]


If you don't want to watch Trump's two speeches so far today, here's the transcript.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 10:17 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


But my colleague feared for family members, and the danger the vote would put them in. Profoundly shaken, my colleague voted to overturn.

That coward should resign, public service is not for them.
posted by Groundhog Week at 10:20 AM on January 12 [67 favorites]


The facts are true but the narrative is being shaped into Trump is a compulsive live TV watcher he just couldn't pull himself away from the screen to take action

It's absolutely bullshit, obviously, but if we take it to be true then it's a powerful argument for the cabinet to remove him. If he can't look away from a live television feed in order to take literally any action, then he's incapable of performing his duties. Sure, it's not like he was interested in taking any helpful actions, but if he couldn't turn his attention away from the television then we are deep into some form of fairly severe inability.

Either he was unwilling, in which case he should obviously be impeached, or he really is incapable, in which case he has to be removed for inability.
posted by BungaDunga at 10:22 AM on January 12 [11 favorites]


My earlier post was (properly) deleted for swearing at someone.

Right now Schumer is being heckled while trying to brief the press on why he's calling for domestic terrorists to be placed on the no fly list. The talking heads are wondering aloud whether it's possible to have a safe and public inauguration ceremony. Trump and the RNC are willing to push the country to the brink of war, never mind handing out plenty of intelligence to anyone who wants to disrupt our elections in the future.

I try to avoid vulgarity for it's own sake. I try to come up with rational arguments that might change someone's mind.

But at this point in history, if you still support the RNC: bless your heart.
posted by nicoffeine at 10:22 AM on January 12 [31 favorites]


How do you force someone to put a mask on? Get up close and personal with their head and breathing trying to drag it onto their head?
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:22 AM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I'm afraid to look up what "Pantifa" is supposed to mean exactly.
You... really don't want to go down the rabbithole of political 'forced feminization' that's popular in those circles. Just know it's out there and it's got a lot of baggage with it. (If it's your thing it's your thing, but the political layer is an extra issue, imho)
posted by CrystalDave at 10:23 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


After 4 years and literally tens of thousands of lies, what does "don't let him get away with" saying baseless things even mean? He didn't take questions.

I'd be rich if I had a dollar for every time NPR reported on something completely ludicrous, self-contradictory, or just plan made up that Trump said by bringing in one of his surrogates or even another NPR staffer to answer the question "what did the president mean to say?".

The news media routinely criticizes elected officials and candidates for being too wonkish or unapproachable, yet the past four years they've been going to extreme lengths to not point out just how obviously incompetent, irresponsible, and utterly incomprehensible Trump is.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 10:25 AM on January 12 [40 favorites]


I think we need to call out this kind of narrative as bullshit. The facts are true but the narrative is being shaped into Trump is a compulsive live TV watcher he just couldn't pull himself away from the screen to take action.

Yeah. This would mean either that POTUS is not immediately aware and responding in the chain of command when the VP is under siege and hidden away by Secret Service, or it means that he doesn't care / that it was intentional. Either are grounds for removal.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 10:27 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Nobody cares about the wall anymore except Donald.

There are many good reasons to care about the wall.

Trump's Border Wall Has Destroyed Indigenous Sacred Sites for Good
As President Donald Trump’s attempts to reverse the results of the U.S. election continue to make headlines, construction of his signature undertaking—the border wall with Mexico—is ramping up in the final weeks of his presidency.

Along the way, contractors and border patrol agents are bulldozing and dynamiting ancestral and sacred lands, causing irreparable damage along the Texas and Arizona borders with Mexico, which will only worsen until President-elect Joe Biden’s inauguration on January 20, Indigenous leaders say.
How the Trump border wall sapped a desert oasis dry: Ancient springs might not survive unchecked construction during the pandemic.
Amidst the towering saguaro and pronged organ pipe cacti of southern Arizona’s Sonoran Desert, a 30-foot-tall fence snakes through the vegetation, shadowed by a barren strip of land that’s been carved into the mountainsides. Despite the COVID-19 pandemic, there’s been a flurry of activity in these borderlands, particularly in the area’s Organ Pipe Cactus National Monument. In the last months of the Trump administration, a Customs and Border Protection (CBP) construction crew has been dynamiting and drilling their way through nature refuges and cultural relics to make room for the new border wall. A 30-mile-long spine of steel poles filled with concrete now chokes the monument’s southern edge. Mixing the raw materials for this structure requires a lot of water—some 84,000 gallons a day, by CBP’s own estimates—a dwindling resource that’s being siphoned from the already arid landscape.
posted by Lexica at 10:28 AM on January 12 [38 favorites]


PA election fuckery interlude, news from Marc Elias:
NEW: A Pennsylvania federal judge appointed by Trump issued a decision today in a case involving the state legislature that squarely rejects the GOP lie that the PA Supreme Court "changed the rules" in the election.

I assume this means the State leg will immediately swear in the Dem senator, Jim Brewster, they refused to last week? (she asks, rhetorically).
posted by Dashy at 10:34 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


I'd be rich if I had a dollar for every time NPR reported on something completely ludicrous, self-contradictory, or just plan made up that Trump said by bringing in one of his surrogates or even another NPR staffer to answer the question "what did the president mean to say?".

I've been complaining to NPR about their coverage of Trump since Day 1. Back before the 2016 election, they routinely invited on Jerry Falwell Jr. and other detestable surrogates to tee off on softball questions about Trump and his campaign.

The ombudsperson literally responded to one of my complaints with, "We have stations in Trump country too, you know!"
posted by mikeand1 at 10:34 AM on January 12 [20 favorites]


I care. Mr. Biden, tear down that wall.
posted by Dashy at 10:35 AM on January 12 [17 favorites]


How do you force someone to put a mask on? Get up close and personal with their head and breathing trying to drag it onto their head?

I got you, fam. Mask gun.
posted by loquacious at 10:37 AM on January 12 [21 favorites]


Aaron Mostofsky's arrest documents have been posted on the link someone added in an earlier megathread installment to Lawfare Blog. He was identified (among other methods) after they subpoena'd his instagram account and someone DM'd him a meme of one of his in-Capitol photos.

It would be hilarious if any of this were funny.

First indictment has also been posted (Mark Leffingwell) and there are more charges than originally arrested on.
posted by pixiecrinkle at 10:40 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


I do find it interesting that before the Supreme Court thing, Garland was best known for his investigation into and prosecution of the Oklahoma City bombers. He basically made his name going after domestic terrorism.

I'm looking for more on this, but I read somewhere (can't remember where now) that the prosecution of McVeigh was a huge disappointment to anyone who had been tracking the white power movement because of how narrow it was. McVeigh wasn't a lone wolf; he was part of an extended network of white power criminals and terrorists who trained and equipped him, and those people weren't prosecuted.

I don't know enough to be able to evaluate that claim, and I don't know enough to evaluate whether the scope of the prosecution would have been Merrick Garland's call or if that politically sensitive decision would have been made somewhere over his head.

But if we don't cast a wide net now, we are fucked.
posted by schadenfrau at 10:46 AM on January 12 [38 favorites]


"First indictment has also been posted (Mark Leffingwell) and there are more charges than originally arrested on."

Until they get charged with felony rioting, just like the J20 protestors...

who gives a shit?

The charges they are hitting them with are pathetic in comparison.

They added one charge for Leffingwell. Civil Disorder.
posted by deadaluspark at 10:46 AM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Also a second count of assaulting a federal officer. Not that I disagree with you (or that that specific charge isn't telling.)
posted by pixiecrinkle at 10:50 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I am holding out for sedition and felony murder. If there's anything more they can be charged with, do it. Maximal charges. For Trump, too. Godfuckingdammit.
posted by schadenfrau at 10:52 AM on January 12 [10 favorites]




Regarding cabinet appointments and confirmation hearing delays. McConnell basically said back in December that they were going to be slow with Biden’s nominees because Democrats held up some of Trump’s nominees. It is also not true that the entire cabinet has been approved prior to a President taking office;most of them are often in place but usually one or two is often held up, Two examples that spring to mind are Zoë Baird under Clinton, John Tower under Bush Sr were both nominated and the President their term without an AG (Baird) or Sec Defense (Tower) in those instances.

Also because Senate control wasn’t clear until after the Georgia runoff there was a waiting game by Democrats and Republicans on holding hearings since Democrats didn’t want someone voted down who they might be able to get through after the election and Republicans might be able to cut some deals if they kept control.
posted by interogative mood at 10:55 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


I am holding out for sedition and felony murder.

I am too but I also don't think the Trump DOJ in its remaining time is going to go there and in fact may have been ordered not to go there. I'm trying to not let myself get frustrated about charges until Biden's Attorney General is in place.
posted by jason_steakums at 10:59 AM on January 12 [9 favorites]




“It took him awhile to appreciate the gravity of the situation,” Graham said in an interview. “The president saw these people as allies in his journey

Which is enough, in and of itself, to justify Trump's impeachment and Graham's expulsion, among others.

The President of the United States watched an angry mob attempt to bully its way into the US Capitol Building to physically harass and threaten the Congresspersons inside, beating on and spraying chemicals at Capitol police, and he saw these people as allies.

And lickspittles like Graham still see TRUMP as an ally.

Clear that entire side of the room and start over.
posted by delfin at 11:14 AM on January 12 [16 favorites]


from Reuters, via John Harwood of CNN:

“Secretary of State Mike Pompeo cancelled his Europe trip at the last minute on Tuesday after Luxembourg's foreign minister and top European Union officials declined to meet him, European diplomats and other people familiar with the matter said”
posted by valkane at 11:16 AM on January 12 [55 favorites]


Three lawmakers who sheltered during Capitol attack test positive for Covid

The previously mentioned Bonnie Watson Coleman, Pramila Jayapal (D-WA), and Brad Schneider (D-IL)

That brown m&m retcon doesn't hold water. What does the green room have to do with the stage?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 11:17 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Hey cortex, can you post that ha ha gif again?
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:17 AM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I listened to NPR on my drive home yesterday and they interviewed a Republican talking head (sorry I don't remember who) who complained that the president was being silenced by Twitter, and the host said that the president could hold a press conference or do an interview at any time if he wanted to get a message out, and I practically cheered that they had pushed back on their nonsense for once, and then the guy said something about BLM's violent riots (or words to that effect) and the host didn't challenge that at all and I went back to hating them.

Their news reporting when they weren't interviewing anybody was straightforwardly referring to this as an attempted coup and used the term "insurrection," so at least there's that.
posted by joannemerriam at 11:18 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


the charges may not be sufficiently severe (yet?), but reading those complaints and supporting affidavits is gratifying.
posted by 20 year lurk at 11:21 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]




I'll admit that this gave me a slight chuckle. (See relevant content in the "bonus material" about 1:07 in with the dipshit scaling the Capitol wall. Also, you just know that this isn't the first anti-masker that guard has dealt with in the first segment).
posted by gtrwolf at 11:30 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


“What does the green room have to do with the stage?“

Brown m&ms won’t kill you. Badly secured overhead lighting or stage panels will, and that’s what the clause was designed to uncover.
posted by _Mona_ at 11:31 AM on January 12 [41 favorites]


Pramila Jayapal needs to immediately get an injection of "bam bam" or Bamlanivimab. It must be given right now as it will be useless once she gets in the inflammatory phase of the disease where there is pretty much no more active virus replication. Same for any chemical antiviral too.
posted by RuvaBlue at 11:33 AM on January 12 [3 favorites]


The only mention I see of this is from McConnell himself, so I presume it is a willful misreading to his own party's benefit but:

Unless 100 senators agree, impeachment will not be entertained in Senate before inauguration.

Of course I support the grounds for impeachment, and the value of such a conviction and prevention from holding future office seems sound, but what's the actual use of the current tactic if the senate won't unanimously agree to entertain business during the pro forma sessions? Can they choose to change their rules to do so?
posted by abulafa at 11:34 AM on January 12


Through 1/20/21 the Senate is controlled by Mitch McConnell. NOTHING will happen in the Senate before the Biden-Harris Inauguration, no matter how much fan fiction we write.
posted by PhineasGage at 11:37 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Schumer is rumoured to be working on some parliamentary arcana to try for an earlier vote. But it's unlikely to work.
posted by saturday_morning at 11:42 AM on January 12 [1 favorite]


What does the green room have to do with the stage?

To reiterate what others have said: If the band walked into the green room and saw that the brown M&Ms were missing, that means the promoter and venue read the rider in detail and followed it to the letter. If they came in and it was just regular M&Ms, or there were no M&Ms at all, the band knew they should assume everyone involved had a real shit sense of attention to detail, at the very least.

The major of any artist's/band's rider is requirements about lighting, electrical, safety, and the like. These are things the band and their people need to trust with their lives (seriously), so an extreme attention to detail is required. If they won't even pick out the "wrong" M&Ms, they probably aren't making your electrical system requirements are met.
posted by sideshow at 11:44 AM on January 12 [28 favorites]


Through 1/20/21 the Senate is controlled by Mitch McConnell. NOTHING will happen in the Senate before the Biden-Harris Inauguration, no matter how much fan fiction we write.

Absolutely true. But in a year or so, Democrats running for senate will be able to point to the Republicans' unwillingness to take responsibility during a national crisis. And if we are lucky they will even be able to run those ads on the background of a succesful ending of the corona pandemic and a beginning economic recovery.
posted by mumimor at 11:50 AM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Reps. Dingell, Brown want to fine members $1,000 a day for not wearing masks in Capitol

At this point, it may be simpler for DC Mayor Bowser to remove the gov't employee exemption from July's mask order.
posted by Iris Gambol at 11:51 AM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Correction — The closest airport to the city of Alamo, Texas is McAllen Miller International Airport [map] about 6 miles west of Allen Alamo (which Trump’s evidently not visiting on his way to the border wall).
posted by cenoxo at 11:51 AM on January 12


a friend the other day opined that this divide goes back to Reagan

A friend of mine runs the Galactic Journey blog, scifi news/etc. of 55 years ago. He tracks it back to Goldwater. He's said you can see those politics metastasize as the Voting Rights Act and Civil Rights Act started to actually make a difference in people's lives.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 11:52 AM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Last I checked, Congress is part of the federal government. No order from the DC Mayor can force Congress members to wear masks in the Capitol.
posted by PhineasGage at 11:53 AM on January 12


Unfortunately for the fascist-in-chief McAllen's longest runway is 7,120', which is not long enough.
posted by phliar at 11:54 AM on January 12


Schumer is rumoured to be working on some parliamentary arcana to try for an earlier vote. But it's unlikely to work.

Apparently there's a rule that allows the majority and minority leader to call an emergency session, but you need both of them. So McConnell can just choose not to concur with Schumer's maneuver and it will go nowhere:
The resolution, which passed the Senate unanimously in February 2004, allows the chamber’s majority and minority leaders to reconvene at a time when, “in their opinion, such action is warranted by intervening circumstances,” according to a legislative summary.
posted by BungaDunga at 11:55 AM on January 12 [6 favorites]


I mean, so Air Force One will be landing somewhere farther away....
posted by phliar at 11:56 AM on January 12




A couple of great links from the previous thread, arguing that it all started when America became a full democracy 55 years ago. It's a young, recently decolonialized democracy, going through all the racial growing pains that so many other slightly older democracies have gone through. Many Americans are still uncomfortable with all the changes that full democracy has brought.
posted by clawsoon at 11:59 AM on January 12 [19 favorites]


and more details on that rule:
When the Senate is out of session, the majority and minority leaders, or their designees, may, acting jointly... modify any order for the time or place of the convening of the Senate when, in their opinion, such action is warranted by intervening circumstances.
So, McConnell is just talking out of his ass w/r/t needing unanimous consent. If he wanted to reconvene the Senate, he absolutely could, unanimous consent or not.
posted by BungaDunga at 12:00 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


how does one get handed a glass of milk and know it's not organic???

Prisoners aren't handed a 'glass' of anything. If it's milk they're getting, it'll be in the little carton, with all the usual nutrition labels.


From the previous thread, concerning the armed 'protesters' coming to each state capital:

A "protest" that wanted to get good optics would focus on the biggest cities in each state.

Yeah, but where, exactly? Dunno the layout in New York, but I've always found big protests in LA kinda lame since their usual focus is that Federal office building in Westwood, which isn't at all military or strategic and has none of the 'optics' of a demonstration with a capitol dome in the background.
posted by Rash at 12:02 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


WATCH LIVE: President Trump Speaks About Border Security in Alamo, Texas.
By Space Coast Daily // January 12, 2021
TRUMP IS EXPECTED TO SPEAK AT 3 P.M. ET
posted by cenoxo at 12:04 PM on January 12


Many Americans are still uncomfortable with all the changes that full democracy has brought.

...and many are willing to try the politics of racial violence that has characterized so many other young democracies with racial divides.
posted by clawsoon at 12:05 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


TRUMP IS EXPECTED TO SPEAK AT 3 P.M. ET

Acting US attorney and FBI to provide an update on the Capitol attack investigation in just about a minute (3pm ET).


Which one to watch hmmmmm
posted by saturday_morning at 12:06 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Politico: Anti-Trump group pledges $50 million effort to defend Republican impeachment supporters
The effort is led by Defending Democracy Together, an umbrella organization that includes Republicans for the Rule of Law and Republican Voters Against Trump, groups that campaigned against the president during his unsuccessful reelection bid.

“We want to say to any Republican who votes to impeach or remove Donald Trump: You will not be left alone,” said Bill Kristol, a leading conservative critic of Trump’s, in a release. “We will help you against primary challenges. And before the challenges emerge, we will help explain your vote to your constituents.”
This is pretty solid and may help change some votes. The sad reality is that it might be even more effective to be offering to pay for bodyguards.
posted by jedicus at 12:06 PM on January 12 [30 favorites]


Oh I'm sure it's a coincidence that this urgent speech on border security that he flew to Texas to deliver happens to conflict with an update on the Capitol attack.
posted by Riki tiki at 12:07 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


My house "representative" published this op-ed [nyt]. TL;DR blah blah unity, blah blah damage democracy. While I'm not at all surprised, nonetheless I am incandescent.
posted by wordless reply at 12:07 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I hope very much that he'll be aggressive in investigating and prosecuting Trump administration criminality, which should be one of the core priorities of this DOJ, but I'm not holding my breath. He's also lukewarm on criminal justice issues as far as I know.

I suspect the appointment of AOC and other Squad members/sympathists to the House Oversight Committee is expressly a choice to let them be the attack dogs for the Democrats for the next two years and to dig up the evidence necessary for other government agencies, like DoJ, to prosecute Trumpists.
posted by mightygodking at 12:11 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Yeah, but where, exactly? Dunno the layout in New York, but I've always found big protests in LA kinda lame since their usual focus is that Federal office building in Westwood, which isn't at all military or strategic and has none of the 'optics' of a demonstration with a capitol dome in the background.

New York City has a big, imposing Federal courthouse on Foley square, which is a great spot for a protest. It's across the street from a big Federal building.
posted by BungaDunga at 12:11 PM on January 12


I don't know why I'm watching but Trump is headlong into inciting violence again.

Okay, I'm done, I can't watch him do this anymore. Just had to make sure that he was pathetically trying to cling to any win he can, and he didn't disappoint on that front.
posted by deadaluspark at 12:13 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Oh I'm sure it's a coincidence that this urgent speech on border security that he flew to Texas to deliver happens to conflict with an update on the Capitol attack.

A fig leaf so Fox can edit the video from the FBI presser to more easily conform the "news" to the RNC's current talking points. I, too, am incandescent.
posted by nicoffeine at 12:13 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Trump's comments on the insurrection: "I want to address what happened"...briefly referred to it as a "mob", expresses that he wants "peace", and then after literally three sentences, moves directly into the "witch hunt" impeachment, then over to vaccines, then back to the border wall.
posted by Room 101 at 12:16 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


My house "representative" published this op-ed [nyt]. TL;DR blah blah unity, blah blah damage democracy. While I'm not at all surprised, nonetheless I am incandescent.

My old district in upstate NY. Reed is a mealy mouthed liar and I wish there had been a strong candidate running against him.
posted by bluesky43 at 12:17 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]




FBI briefer guy sure is braying a lot about how great the FBI is at preventing violence, while completely neglecting to address their failure here.
posted by lazaruslong at 12:20 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


I “love” the dystopian reality of working from home during a pandemic raging totally out of control, while the President is STILL the guy who invited a group of followers less than a week ago to storm our legislative body in order to somehow change the results of a democratic election, is doing it AGAIN with support of what, at least 40% of the country?

He must have the absolute most disgusting Kompromat on the GOP. We know they were hacked and nothing leaked out. We can assume they’ve accepted foreign money, too. But there must be something incredibly sinister he knows that gives him this untouchable ability to do everything he does.

I’m tired of pretending this country is anything other than what it is.
posted by glaucon at 12:20 PM on January 12 [20 favorites]


FBI briefing - over 170 cases so far over the 'destruction and violence' at the Capitol, FBI has a long memory and a broad reach, and will find you if you were involved. Appeal for more digital evidence. Expect cases to grow exponentially into the hundreds. Citing charges coming including felony murder.

Does not sound like they are planning to go soft on this, or are prepared to minimise it at all.



Brown M&Ms - Van Halen were the first band to bring this scale of tour to a lot places, to the point of the stage sinking into the floor.
posted by MattWPBS at 12:23 PM on January 12 [37 favorites]


FBI briefing listed the types of cases they're investigating. Missing from the list: Anything like sedition or interference with vote.
posted by joeyh at 12:24 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


I’m full of rage at the democrats calling for unity and healing and all this bullshit, but I also pity them tbh. They really seem unable to grasp that things have changed, and that many of their colleagues are fucking pod people from planet MAGA. They are not reasonable, they are not just playing politics, they are dangerous violent zealots. There’s no going back to the way things were.

I wanted to touch briefly on the George W Bush derail. I wanted to remind people that he laid the blueprint for what’s happening now. He was incompetent. He stole an election. It was during his tenure that we started really ramping up the whole “patriotism” and “if you’re not with us you’re not an American” dialogue. He let people die and it was likely highly racially motivated (Hurricane Katrina). He also tried to dismantle the government and install cronies (heckuva job Brownie anyone?). He looted the treasury and gave billions away to the ultra rich and then left a giant mess that hamstrung the next administration. I haven’t even touched Iraq or Afghanistan yet.

Remember this?:

“The aide said that guys like me [Suskind] were "in what we call the reality-based community," which he defined as people who "believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality." I nodded and murmured something about enlightenment principles and empiricism. He cut me off. "That's not the way the world really works anymore," he continued. "We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors ... and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.”

And now the right just lives in their own warped reality, delusional and divorced from logic and reason. And we’re just studying what they do.

So not to be rude but please miss me with any defense of that jackass. He and his enablers are just as responsible for today in their way as Trump. They laid the groundwork for this. Trump is worse. If we don’t stop this now what comes after Trump will be worse again.
posted by supercrayon at 12:24 PM on January 12 [67 favorites]


FBI briefer guy sure is braying a lot about how great the FBI is at preventing violence, while completely neglecting to address their failure here.

The FBI is incredibly good at setting up the mentally ill with the tools to commit terrorist acts, egging them into it, and then swooping in at the last second to say "We stopped terrorism" so they can go to Congress for further anti-terrorism funding.

They are not actually very good at really stopping real terrorists.
posted by deadaluspark at 12:25 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


"sedition and conspiracy"
posted by little onion at 12:26 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Sedition and conspiracy strike force set up.
posted by MattWPBS at 12:26 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Looks like this briefing is entirely focused on what the FBI plans to do with regards to arresting and charging the rioters. Not so much a post-mortem on what went "wrong" that allowed the rioters to waltz into the Capitol. I wonder when / if we will get that.
posted by lazaruslong at 12:26 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Ok, a bit later on the FBI does say they're investigating sedition and conspiracy.
posted by joeyh at 12:26 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Acting US Attorney just used the words "sedition and conspiracy" in terms of upcoming charges they are working on.
posted by pixiecrinkle at 12:26 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


"If you planted a pipe bomb or if you just trespassed on the Capitol, you will be found and you will be charged."

Strike force going after people who assaulted the media.
posted by MattWPBS at 12:28 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Specific prosecutors are dedicated to working on assaults on the media.
posted by pixiecrinkle at 12:28 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


glaucon: "He must have the absolute most disgusting Kompromat on the GOP."

This is the myth we have to come to terms with now. He doesn't have dirt on the GOP, he is the GOP. He's only saying the things the politicians can't say out loud. He's not an aberration, he's the soul of the party.
posted by team lowkey at 12:30 PM on January 12 [66 favorites]


Sounds to me like the FBI is dumping responsibility for the colossal security failure on...anyone else. Basically saying yeah, we got a ton of intel prior to the riot that this stuff might happen, and we shared with all of our law enforcement partners on the joint terrorism task force which includes capitol police, park police et al.
posted by lazaruslong at 12:30 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


From that briefing they are going to be going after everyone who was involved in any way hard.

Michael Sherwin (Acting US Attorney) sounded furious.
posted by MattWPBS at 12:31 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Michael Sherwin (Acting US Attorney) sounded furious.

I've seen plenty and heard plenty of people who looked and sounded serious. Their furrowed brows and dark tones rarely actually lead to real justice.

Like with Mueller, I'll wait until the results are in before I start expecting the FBI to be my savior in this scenario. (Just in case everyone forgot how miserably the FBI has already failed us in regard to Trump)

Sounds to me like the FBI is dumping responsibility for the colossal security failure on...anyone else.

Sounds like the general modus operandi for law enforcement in the US.
posted by deadaluspark at 12:34 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Lazurus, the responsilibility isn't with the FBI. They did their part, then the Capitol Police was supposed to get their own backup in place.
posted by frecklefaerie at 12:34 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


"SHERWIN says people will be "shocked" by some of the non-public details of things that happened inside the Capitol." -- Kyle Cheney, Politico
posted by valkane at 12:35 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


The Texas speech just ended. I missed the beginning, but I caught the middle and end:

Free speech is under attack. The 25th Amendment is of no danger to him, but might be of danger to Joe Biden. 'Sir, a vaccine will take seven years, five years, ten years, maybe.' Texas and Florida are doing great with vaccine rollout. Time for respect for law enforcement, it's the foundation of the MAGA agenda.

Trump: 'Do you feel like a hero?'
LEO guy: 'I do.'
Trump: Because you do, and you are.'

Thanks various LEO people. 'We took on the cartels, the coyotes, and the special interests.' Claims that someone wanted to build a wall ten years ago. '450 miles, nobody realizes how big that is.' The wall is finished, except for the pieces that are in construction, or in pre-construction, and the places where you don't need a wall after all.

Goes on about illegal aliens for a while. Used coronavirus to justify removing migrants more quickly. Talks about the 24 names for coronavirus, including China virus, China plague, and invisible enemy. 'We empowered our wonderful ICE.' Many people crossing the US-Mexico border are from the Middle East. Describes groups of thousands of people forming south of the border. 'Change the name from the caravans, which I think we came up with, to the gravy train, because that's what they're looking for.' 'Smugglers and coyotes are preparing to surge the border.'

Hispanic people understand the border--I won Texas, including the border towns. The governor of Texas, Greg, great guy, called and said you've had numbers nobody has had since Reconstruction. ICE, CBP, etc., you have no idea how much our nation loves and respects you. God bless America.

Trump walks offstage, cue 'YMCA,' Trump walks directly to the limo.

In the words of George W. Bush, that was some weird shit.
posted by box at 12:35 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


I've always found big protests in LA kinda lame since their usual focus is that Federal office building in Westwood, which isn't at all military or strategic and has none of the 'optics' of a demonstration with a capitol dome in the background.

I'm talking "optics" in the sense of "they're in a city that people are more likely to have heard of".

Also -

Hey cortex, can you post that ha ha gif again?

Er, was this in response to the news that three Congress reps now have Covid from sheltering in place? If so, I think at least 2 of them were people who WERE wearing masks....
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 12:36 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Lazurus, the responsilibility isn't with the FBI.

FBI>What We Investigate>Terrorism

"Protecting the United States from terrorist attacks is the FBI’s number one priority."

I don't know, sounds like stopping terrorism is exactly what they describe as their top priority.

edit: Jinx
posted by deadaluspark at 12:36 PM on January 12


Lazurus, the responsilibility isn't with the FBI. They did their part, then the Capitol Police was supposed to get their own backup in place.

I'm not sure I buy that. From the FBI's mission page:
Combat significant violent crime
Protect the U.S. from terrorist attack
Protect civil rights
posted by lazaruslong at 12:37 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


"Trump delivered a low energy speech, then bizarrely was serenaded off the stage by the thumping beat of "YMCA" (he didn't dance this time though)." -- Aaron Rupar, Vox
posted by valkane at 12:38 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


The Texas speech just ended. I missed the beginning, but I caught the middle and end:

Thank you for your service, box.
posted by Faint of Butt at 12:40 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Trump's comments on the insurrection: "I want to address what happened"...briefly referred to it as a "mob", expresses that he wants "peace", and then after literally three sentences, moves directly into the "witch hunt" impeachment, then over to vaccines, then back to the border wall.

OK, I can already hear a Trumper acquaintance or two say "he has to say that, he doesn't mean it" and it reminds me of something I'm just noticing: how often "they have to say that, they don't mean it" comes up among some of the shittiest conservatives I've known.

For a long time I thought it was just a convenient argument for them, and I'm still sure that plays a role, that there is some part of the conservative psychology that is extra DGAF about whether an argument actually describes reality, just whether it's plausible enough to function, give even belief-of-the-gaps possibility... or even just *sound* like an argument.

But now I think it's also something else: these people are telling us something about how they've operated their entire lives. Sure, everyone sometimes goes along to get along, but it's a way of life. They all have things they know they have to say all the time, they resent it but they care about their status waaaay more than frank self-expression so as much as they resent the sheer unfair persecution of not being able to have their views (and where possible, their identity) expressed unfiltered if not outright privileged, they say what they have to say and have gotten used to it. Then comes Donald Trump who "says what people are thinking" and they recognize a kindred spirit, just someone who's climbed far enough up some ladder that a lot of the time, he doesn't have to say that.

You'd think watching him say something he clearly doesn't want to would take him down a peg, but then again that's actually the enemy of understanding for this kind of psychology. You can't take Trump down a peg. That's an attack on the fundamental narcissism of the worldview (and why Trump's narcissism appeals so heavily inside it). There has to be another explanation. He's being clever. He's temporarily playing the game. Or he's setting a trap and mass arrests are coming, just you wait, Pelosi is already in custody and Clinton will be locked up and WE can be the ones putting liberals in the concentration camps of our most fervent fantasies instead of being scared that our opposition is going to carry out our most fervent fantasies, all thanks to the cleverness of Trump.

Who has to say that. Of course. He doesn't want any violence. *wink*
posted by wildblueyonder at 12:42 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


"FBI and Justice Dept were NOT asked whether investigation is underway into President Trump or White House into "incitement" of insurrection. (They cut off questions before a bunch of reporters were set to ask)." -- Scott MacFarlane, NBC
posted by valkane at 12:42 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Like with Mueller, I'll wait until the results are in before I start expecting the FBI to be my savior in this scenario.

I wouldn't suggest that you expect them to be your saviour, but there was some nervousness that they were only looking for low level charges in these threads, and weren't going to go after people for sedition and similar serious offences. That definitely doesn't seem to be the case.
posted by MattWPBS at 12:44 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


All of 4 questions or so during that FBI news conference? I've been in dozens of government calls that are moderated like that, and aside from when a snowstorm struck, I've never heard that few questions, granted it wasn't by media members. I don't know how much more the FBI spokespersons would have said today, but it just seems like there's no way there should be 4 whole questioners.

I was pleased with what they said when they did talk, and I do feel like there is a robust reaction going on and a lot of action on the side of how America in the real world should be reacting, but I still could have used more information.

But I'll be satisfied if they just prevent whatever is coming in these 9 days, from happening. I've finally managed to compose myself since being rattled by everything that has happened, but I'm still on edge each time I see things like that Correa video, or the Jim Jordan video. Stay safe yall.
posted by cashman at 12:44 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


That Space Coast live feed for Trump’s Texas broke off. I switched to The Independent’s live You Tube feed but it’s apparently over.
posted by cenoxo at 12:44 PM on January 12


They cut off questions before a bunch of reporters were set to ask).

Well that answers that. Great. That's just great.
posted by cashman at 12:44 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I wouldn't suggest that you expect them to be your saviour, but there was some nervousness that they were only looking for low level charges in these threads, and weren't going to go after people for sedition and similar serious offences. That definitely doesn't seem to be the case.

Yeah, I would take the FBI response so far as "necessary, though not yet sufficient." Much more must be done, but so far they haven't dropped the ball or collaborated with the insurrectionists.
posted by jedicus at 12:45 PM on January 12


Fox did in fact carry the FBI briefing. Aftewards, Gowdy on saying if you are in the party of law and order, share information about anyone you know with law enforcement. Some other dude riffs for a minute on how it's "interesting" that there are charges of sedition, though he is taking everything pretty seriously.

A few minutes later, a cut to commercial before Rove discusses Trump's impeachment.

I remain incandescent.
posted by nicoffeine at 12:48 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


"Whether or not they intended it, the absence of acting AG Rosen and FBI director Wray from that law enforcement press conference risks sending the signal that the Trump administration is NOT taking this terrorist attack on the US with the utmost seriousness." -- Jake Tapper, CNN
posted by valkane at 12:48 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Once again: why YMCA? Does he still not know what that's referring to?
posted by jenfullmoon at 12:49 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


"Risks" sending?
posted by The Card Cheat at 12:50 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


"Trump delivered a low energy speech, then bizarrely was serenaded off the stage by the thumping beat of "YMCA"

What? So this wasn't just a speech. It was a campaign rally -- in the wake of an insurrection attempt.
posted by JackFlash at 12:52 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Once again: why YMCA? Does he still not know what that's referring to?

With the caveat that there may be some hidden nazi meaning, I think the reason they play it at Trump rallies is the same reason they play it at sporting events - it's fun and it get the listeners/participants all moving in the same way together. To wit, it is (ugh) unifying, which is useful when you're trying to create a mob.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:53 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Trump news - live: President blames MAGA mob on Covid in rambling speech after autographing border wall, The Independent, Jon Sharman, & Justin Vallejo, 1/12/2021.

But did he really blame “MAGA”?
posted by cenoxo at 12:53 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Reps. Dingell, Brown want to fine members $1,000 a day for not wearing masks in Capitol (See segment at 12:15 p.m.)

Yeah, no, that's not gonna work with these people. They'll turn their fines into badges of honor and crowdfund them in a day.

Fucking expel them. Or charge them with something. Jesus fucking Christ, this is not a goddamn game.
posted by schadenfrau at 12:57 PM on January 12 [36 favorites]


Trump's favorite rally songs are "YMCA," "Macho Man," "We Are the Champions," and "Tiny Dancer," and I'm convinced that he has some kind of weird but relatively harmless prejudice about gays making the best music.
posted by theodolite at 12:57 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


450 miles, nobody realizes how big that is

It's about 23% of the 1,954-mile-long (3,145 km) border between the United States and Mexico.
¡Pobre México! ¡Tan lejos de Dios y tan cerca de los Estados Unidos!

The 40 miles or so of new wall IMPOTUSx2 built is about 2% of the border. (Estimates range between 12 and 80 miles so I split the difference.)
posted by kirkaracha at 12:58 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Once again: why YMCA? Does he still not know what that's referring to?

I've been wondering the same damn thing. I thought it was possible that they're just scraping the bottom of the barrel since so many musicians have complained about Trump's use of their music at his events, but apparently it's not even clear WHAT the Village People think about this, based on Rob Sheffield's essay for Rolling Stone. I swear, I feel like it's just laziness at this point all round.

Aside: When the pre-rally video surfaced a couple days ago one of my first thoughts was sorrow that Laura Branigan was dead and couldn't complain about the use of "Gloria." I was tickled to learn that her estate/representative did, in fact, complain.
posted by dlugoczaj at 1:00 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


I'm personally not prepared to give Trump the benefit of the doubt that anything about his psyche can be described as "weird but relatively harmless."
posted by Spathe Cadet at 1:00 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Happened 12 hours / seven centuries ago, but Trump Lawyer Lin Wood had his privilege to argue a case in Delaware revoked by a judge because of his "toxic stew of mendacity, prevarication, and surprising incompetence."
posted by nicoffeine at 1:01 PM on January 12 [60 favorites]


Trump probably just likes that music because it reminds of him of when he was young, kicking up his heels with Jeff Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell.
posted by valkane at 1:01 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]


They cut off questions before a bunch of reporters were set to ask).

Well that answers that. Great. That's just great.


If there is (hypothetically) an investigation into incitement to sedition against Trump, the White House or speakers at the rally, would you want that to be headline news before the 20th?
posted by MattWPBS at 1:03 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Trump probably just likes that music

45 doesn't like any music. It's a well-known signifier of his complete lack of (a) soul. Somebody else makes these selections. His kids?
posted by Rash at 1:03 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Derail but why are any members of Congress relying on 5-cent surgical masks ("I protect you and you protect me") when they are stuck in a building with people who clearly don't want to protect anyone else? Michigan is shipping all their residents KN95 respirators which work to both capture people's germs and protect themselves from others' germs. I can buy legit US-made N95 respirators and plenty of KN95s and KF94s for not more than a few dollars each from a variety of reputable sources. Are we stuck on some excuse of "optics" for people who are still in the June 2020 mindset?
posted by meowzilla at 1:05 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Jordan Klepper Sees It All at The Capitol Insurrection

He's done a lot of these Trump rally segments for The Daily Show, but this is the first one I've seen that had an air of real menace alongside the buffoonery (still plenty of that too, though).
posted by Rhaomi at 1:08 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Have his rallies ever played the song long enough to get to the "No man does it all by himself/I said, young man, put your pride on the shelf" part? Or do they just record scratch over that so they can get back to "you can do whatever you feel"?
posted by Riki tiki at 1:09 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


45 doesn't like any music. It's a well-known signifier of his total lack of soul.

As is his being the first president since James K. Polk, the Napoleon of the Stump, to not have a pet.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:09 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


I actually feel a little better seeing that our dipshit President ran off to the border wall for a boring replay of his greatest hits including golden oldies like "caravan panic" which I haven't heard since 2018, it makes it seem like he doesn't think he has a lot of other moves available to him and he's scrambling.
posted by jason_steakums at 1:11 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Both the New York Times and the Washington Post have published thoughtful articles about the courage of Maryland Rep. Jamie Raskin, who lost a son to suicide on December 31, endured a violent insurrection in his workplace on January 6 with family members in tow, yet still has taken on a leading role in crafting the articles of impeachment. I couldn't be more pleased that a man with this level of bravery, intelligence, and courage represents some of my fellow Marylanders. He stands in sharp contrast to his fellow Maryland Representative Andy Harris and the other cowardly Republicans who've aided and abetted sedition.
posted by cheapskatebay at 1:11 PM on January 12 [81 favorites]


I am in some distant way related to James K. Polk. This never fails to make me sort of sad and ashamed whenever I remember it. I guess on the bright side there are now far worse presidents one could be related to...
posted by Alterscape at 1:11 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


"My guess is the FBI and DOJ sent no-name officials to do this press briefing so Trump wouldn't get any ideas about firing anyone over it. If they'd sent a recognizable face out there like Chris Wray, he could have been fired by the end of the day." -- Palmer Report

Could also be why they scheduled at the same time as Trump's wall speech, so he couldn't watch it live.
posted by valkane at 1:11 PM on January 12 [30 favorites]


Michigan is shipping all their residents KN95 respirators which work to both capture people's germs and protect themselves from others' germs.

link?
posted by LionIndex at 1:15 PM on January 12


As is his being the first president since James K. Polk, the Napoleon of the Stump, to not have a pet.

well, he has Lindsey Graham

(I stole that from somewhere, not sure where)
posted by schadenfrau at 1:15 PM on January 12 [20 favorites]


I just wish they'd stop calling them "Trump supporters" and start calling them "Republicans." That's how they vote and that's who they are. Make the party own the fact that a large faction are domestic terrorists.
posted by valkane at 1:20 PM on January 12 [65 favorites]


Michigan is shipping all their residents KN95 respirators which work to both capture people's germs and protect themselves from others' germs.

link?


MaskUpMichigan

But worth stating that the state is not shipping us all masks to our homes, you still have to go to one of several local distribution centers to pick one up.
posted by Preserver at 1:24 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Gov. Whitmer announces MI Mask Aid: 4 million free masks to protect vulnerable populations from COVID-19

Bleh, I read the news too optimistically. It looks like there are only 4 million available for a population of 10 million, and you have to get them yourself which a lot of people are unlikely to do.
posted by meowzilla at 1:25 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


If anyone missed it, Sky News (YouTube) has Trump’s entire Texas border wall speech, about 30 (boring) minutes long.
posted by cenoxo at 1:26 PM on January 12


I am in some distant way related to James K. Polk. This never fails to make me sort of sad and ashamed whenever I remember it. I guess on the bright side there are now far worse presidents one could be related to...
Being distantly related to Richard Nixon, I share your feelings.
posted by inexorably_forward at 1:33 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Trump does say that the 25th amendment is no threat to him, which I would interpret to mean it's absolutely a threat to him.
posted by Riki tiki at 1:34 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]




"Breaking NYT: Mitch McConnell has told associates he believes Trump committed impeachable offenses and that he is pleased that Democrats are moving to impeach him, believing that it will make it easier to purge him from the GOP." -- Kyle Griffin

Holy shit.
posted by valkane at 1:38 PM on January 12 [75 favorites]


There is clear video of that judge's son, breaking the capitol window out with the clear riot shield he somehow got hold of. You know, there was an officer murdered you might ask, did he get the shield off the dead officer, and was he involved in the murder?
posted by Oyéah at 1:38 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Something I missed on the first listen through the FBI/DoJ press briefing. Sherwin said that the sedition and conspiracy strike force consists of "very senior national security prosecutors and public corruption prosecutors".

Involvement of public corruption prosecutors significant, or would people say that's standard?
posted by MattWPBS at 1:40 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I believe exactly no words out of McConnell’s mouth.
posted by kerf at 1:40 PM on January 12 [78 favorites]


"Breaking NYT: Mitch McConnell has told associates he believes Trump committed impeachable offenses and that he is pleased that Democrats are moving to impeach him, believing that it will make it easier to purge him from the GOP." -- Kyle Griffin


...surely this?
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 1:41 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


So, you could split up the Senate days to do impeachment in the afternoon and legislation in the evening. Or you could have a couple of 2/3 test votes to skip to a verdict, right at the start and again after opening arguments.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:42 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Yeah I just heard the McConnell news on MSNBC and jumped on this thread to see what the latest intel is. If true, huge. Still has to make it to a vote, but wow.
posted by andruwjones26 at 1:42 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Derail but why are any members of Congress relying on 5-cent surgical masks.

They were told to take off their masks and put on the gas masks when they were attacked according to The Cut's interview Rep. Jayapal. My guess is that many had better quality masks before that (though some probably didn't because even people who are trying are often inscrutably weird in this pandemic). The cheap masks were what they were given afterwards.
posted by srboisvert at 1:43 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Until McConnell says, publicly, that he wants Trump removed I am uninterested in his attempts to salvage the GOP from the wreckage.
posted by Riki tiki at 1:43 PM on January 12 [34 favorites]


...believing that it will make it easier to purge him from the GOP.

Trump's usefulness to Mitch McConnell has officially ended.
posted by charred husk at 1:43 PM on January 12 [41 favorites]


They have to purge him or it will be internal GOP civil war until Trump dies. Unfortunately for them, it can be a bit hard to break a cult... their dear leader will never shut up though I guess now he can't tweet.
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 1:43 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


"Biden called McConnell yesterday and asked if Senate could dual track impeachment trial and cabinet confirmations.

Far from telling Biden he would not discuss the impeachment, McConnell said he would check with the parliamentarian and get back to Biden." -- Jonathan Martin, NYT
posted by valkane at 1:45 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


If nothing else, the NYT report about Mitch will send Trump into a rage, and he has no Twitter with which to vent.
posted by martin q blank at 1:47 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Unfortunately for the fascist-in-chief McAllen's longest runway is 7,120', which is not long enough.

An air dropped crate would suffice. Parachute optional.
posted by y2karl at 1:48 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I lied. I am very interested in McConnell's attempts to salvage the GOP from the wreckage. I'm just pushing back on selective leaks that might be part of that effort. Hi, Ms. Haberman!
posted by Riki tiki at 1:49 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Trump's usefulness to Mitch McConnell has officially ended.

my feeling is that happened when Amy Coney Barrett was confirmed to the Supreme Court (end of September). Everything McConnell has done since then has been masters level dis-entanglement. How to cut this clown loose without losing any votes ...
posted by philip-random at 1:51 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Unfortunately for the fascist-in-chief McAllen's longest runway is 7,120', which is not long enough.

An air dropped crate would suffice. Parachute optional.


Operation Dumbass Drop
posted by jason_steakums at 1:52 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]




but apparently it's not even clear WHAT the Village People think about this,

Victor Willis told him before the election to stop playing it.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 1:56 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Per Erica Werner at WaPo:

Dem staffers briefed today by Biden team ahead of covid plan roll-out Thurs -- per sources Biden does *not* want to use reconciliation, hopes for bipartisan deal instead

At a certain point this obsession with bipartisanship becomes unhealthy, and that point was two years ago.
posted by mightygodking at 1:58 PM on January 12 [16 favorites]


At a certain point this obsession with bipartisanship becomes unhealthy, and that point was two years ago.

That point was when Biden screwed us on the fiscal cliff by going behind Reid's back to broker an awful deal, but yes.
posted by Gadarene at 2:01 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


At the risk of sounding Q-ish on the opposite extreme, I've got to feel like a lot of this Twitter/Facebook/Google/Amazon sudden epiphany has a lot less to do with awakening morals and "crossing a line" than it does with someone going hard in the background with not-fucking-around threats. I think the Biden administration has already been quietly "new sheriff in town and you WILL get with the program" in key pressure points. Police departments investigating officers? Police union officials being forced out? Yeah, no. Any few of those I could believe, all together is too much coincidence. We'll see I guess.

Upthread: "Here's a mask."
"Oh, no thanks."
"We're not asking. Put the fucking mask on."

I agree 100% with the sentiment, but play it out.
"No."

What then, a fistfight? Make yourself the spectacle, get yourself sanctioned and possibly arrested? There's nothing you can do if nobody will make anti-masking a crime and enforce it.
posted by ctmf at 2:01 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


"Biden called McConnell yesterday and asked if Senate could dual track impeachment trial and cabinet confirmations. Far from telling Biden he would not discuss the impeachment, McConnell said he would check with the parliamentarian and get back to Biden."

I'll give credence to speculation about McConnell ever doing the right thing after it has actually happened and verified and too late to undo with the Infinity Gauntlet. My first instinct is McConnell already knows the parliamentarian's answer is no. But even McConnell just not using every procedural tool to be a jerk for the hell of it would be a shift.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:04 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Military Joint Chiefs condemn "sedition and insurrection" at US Capitol.
posted by adamvasco at 2:04 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]



If nothing else, the NYT report about Mitch will send Trump into a rage, and he has no Twitter with which to vent.


There is a part of me that wishes he could have Twitter while being banned from Twitter, just for the popcorn of the meltdown.
posted by MattWPBS at 2:05 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Omfg can people stop saying "surely this."
posted by JenMarie at 2:06 PM on January 12 [32 favorites]


I'm trying to figure out what McConnell's angle is because prior to today, he would bring the impeachment charge to the Senate for trial on the 19th. So what gives? The NYT article doesn't do a deep enough dive on this. Is Mitch just mad about Georgia?

Mr. McConnell, Republican of Kentucky, has indicated that he wants to see the specific article of impeachment that the House is set to approve on Wednesday, which is expected to draw support from as many as a dozen Republicans, potentially including Representative Liz Cheney of Wyoming, the party’s No. 3 in the House. But he has made clear in private discussions that he believes now is the moment to move on from the weakened lame duck, whom he blames for causing Republicans to lose the Senate.
posted by bluesky43 at 2:07 PM on January 12


I've got to feel like a lot of this Twitter/Facebook/Google/Amazon sudden epiphany has a lot less to do with awakening morals and "crossing a line" than it does with someone going hard in the background with not-fucking-around threats.

Possible, but I think they've simply decided that open civil war would be bad for their profitability.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 2:09 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


When sentiment is moving against you, hurrying up and getting it decided is the best chance you're ever going to get.
posted by ctmf at 2:10 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Sorry to harp back on the point of the FBI's involvement, but they did their duty by reporting the threat to the other authorities. It was then up to the others to act on that information. FBI enforcers can't just go on federal grounds as agents, just like how the National Guard couldn't go in without approval. There was one strike team enabled to go in, and they did, and no one else was authorized. Can't find the links now.
posted by frecklefaerie at 2:10 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


‘It was not to make friends but to save our lives up in there’ — Rep. Lisa Blunt Rochester spoke out after video circulated of two GOP reps appearing to mock her for passing out masks during lockdown
posted by bluesky43 at 2:11 PM on January 12 [23 favorites]


Military Joint Chiefs condemn "sedition and insurrection" at US Capitol.

Given all the fears we have about servicemen and women infiltrated into the Republican terrorist movement, this is very good news. Insurrection within the military will be dealt with very harshly.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 2:12 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Has there been any talk of why the Park Police were letting protesters bring items they aren't normally allowed? This seems like more than "oh white people, don't have to worry about them and their flag spears!" given everything else.
posted by sepviva at 2:13 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


About McConnell and some other Republicans:
first of all, it is human for them to take some time to truly understand what happened, because it is so insane.
McConnell is not so much human, but he is very attached to money. And if you look at how the donors are reacting, that might have some influence, not least now when Adelson is dead.
posted by mumimor at 2:13 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


I've got to feel like a lot of this Twitter/Facebook/Google/Amazon sudden epiphany has a lot less to do with awakening morals and "crossing a line" than it does with someone going hard in the background with not-fucking-around threats.

Possible, but I think they've simply decided that open civil war would be bad for their profitability.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 2:09 PM on January 12


Nope. They're facing a Democratic government and they don't want to be regulated by the government, a move much more likely in a Democratic government. It's purely self interest and I find it among the most cynical moves I've seen by these companies (even though I agree with their actions).
posted by bluesky43 at 2:13 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Realizing that the house and the senate are both democrat controlled and will be VERY interested to hear about how social media spread sedition may have had something to do with it. It's not necessary to construct a complicated answer when a very simple one is before us.
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 2:14 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


FBI: ‘In 6 days, we have opened more than 160 case files and that’s just the tip of the iceberg … Even if you’ve left D.C., agents from our local field offices will be knocking on your door if we find out that you were part of the criminal activity at the Capitol’
posted by bluesky43 at 2:18 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


Out of curiousity, I know that the FBI is often called in for crimes that involve crossing state lines. Since most of these people weren't DC locals, did the fact that they would have traveled to commit these crimes play into the role of the FBI being involved or did the simple facts of the location and target(s) of the crime automatically mean that this was FBI jurisdiction? I'm just curious if crossing state lines has any weight whatsoever.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 2:21 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Jim Acosta was just reporting that McConnell is angry that he had to take shelter during the coup attempt and “hates Trump now.”

Something something “I have use the face eating leopard carefully to create a chaotic landscape of fear and uncertainty that has allowed me to get exactly what I want for the last four years. However, recently, the leopard ate my face, and I am very unhappy about that.”
posted by Ghidorah at 2:24 PM on January 12 [76 favorites]


It's not necessary to construct a complicated answer

I've considered that, I'm not all the way down the "trust the plan" rabbit hole. But it seems more complicated to me that they all came to this pretty big, weighty strategic decision that must have taken a lot of consideration, all on the same day. (To exaggerate a little bit). Rather than someone making the rounds saying "there WILL be consequences" and making the decision much easier.
posted by ctmf at 2:24 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Remember this?: “The aide said that guys like me [Suskind] were "in what we call the reality-based community," which he defined as people who "believe that solutions emerge from your judicious study of discernible reality."

The aide was Karl Rove, GWB's deputy chief of staff; Rove was on Fox News less than an hour ago w/ "Pelosi bid for Trump impeachment not in Americans' interest."

posted by Iris Gambol at 2:25 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


I know that Fox isn't the best place to link to, but watching new Republican rep Nancy Mace steamroll over the host as the host tries to politely cut off her explanation of why she's no longer supporting Trump, and why what Trump did and said is in fact bad and did in fact promote violence, is nice.
posted by clawsoon at 2:27 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


It’s a small fraternity of senior tech leadership, and their employees are largely educated leftist. But yeah, no one wanted to go first, and they likely hoped someone in government would do something in the last four years.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 2:27 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


What then, a fistfight? Make yourself the spectacle, get yourself sanctioned and possibly arrested? There's nothing you can do if nobody will make anti-masking a crime and enforce it.

I’m honestly shocked that the house and senate have not mandated mask use on the floor, with a clause about the sergeant at arms removing any member who refuses to wear one. In the heightened circumstances of being locked in close quarters together, to me, the proper response is wear the mask or try your luck out in the hallways.
posted by Ghidorah at 2:27 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


Rove is one of the Reichministers, like Hannity and Limbaugh, who all need to be shamed (if that’s possible) into inconsequence.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 2:28 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


I mean, something pretty big did happen that all the tech companies could see. This wasn't a babbling State of the Union, it was a terrorist attack and a coup attempt. It's not hard to picture all the tech companies responding similarly to that huge external stimulus.
posted by stevis23 at 2:29 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


I mean parliamentary democracy is working great for Britain what could be the downside? /s
posted by Huffy Puffy


Not working too well here in Australia either, with our special sauce preferential voting system that is supposed to negate (or at least limit) the problems caused by first past the post systems like those in the US and UK. We have massive and rapidly expanding corruption, abuse of power, and straight thuggery under the current hard right government, led by a Prime Minister who clearly wants to install a fascist feudalist theocracy.

The clear lesson from all this seems that it is impossible to fully codify robust protections against such behaviour. All forms of democratic government rely on goodwill and norms, and they are too easy to circumvent, exploit, and shit all over by bad faith actors.

Don't look to us for any answers to the problem.
posted by Pouteria at 2:29 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


I know that Fox isn't the best place to link to, but watching new Republican rep Nancy Mace steamroll over the host as the host tries to politely cut off her explanation of why she's no longer supporting Trump, and why what Trump did and said is in fact bad and did in fact promote violence, is nice.

Mace was on CNN yesterday arguing that impeachment was a step too far and that the House should settle for a censure resolution, so let's not jump to celebrate her.
posted by mightygodking at 2:30 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


But it seems more complicated to me that they all came to this pretty big, weighty strategic decision that must have taken a lot of consideration, all on the same day.

Eh. It was the day after a terrorist attack on the Capitol building. The execs of these companies have surely had innumerable meetings about how to handle Trump, and exactly what line-crossing would result in a ban.

On preview, what stevis23 said.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 2:31 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


impeachment was a step too far and that the House should settle for a censure resolution

Heated debate over a thing that will have no effect vs. a thing that will probably have no effect. 2021
posted by ctmf at 2:33 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I'm now picturing all the major tech CEOs on a conference call. Entire conversation: "Surely this?" "Surely this?" "Surely this?" "Surely this?" "Surely this." "Surely this." "Surely this?" "Surely this." "Surely this." "Surely this."
posted by clawsoon at 2:33 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Josh Dawsey (waPo)
@jdawsey1
Confirming NYT: McConnell has told others that Trump probably committed impeachable offenses but wants to hear case before making a final decision, per person who has spoken with him. Would not whip votes for or against impeachment. Hasn't talked to Trump since Dec. 14.
5:27 PM · Jan 12, 2021
posted by bluesky43 at 2:34 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


It's not necessary to construct a complicated answer

I've considered that, I'm not all the way down the "trust the plan" rabbit hole. But it seems more complicated to me that they all came to this pretty big, weighty strategic decision that must have taken a lot of consideration, all on the same day. (To exaggerate a little bit). Rather than someone making the rounds saying "there WILL be consequences" and making the decision much easier.


I think it's more than a little exaggerated to say 'all on the same day'. Twitter, Google and Facebook were umming and aahing for a few days about suspending Trump's account, locking it for 24 hours, etc, etc. Before that I think we had weeks or even months with discussions about how he'd probably lose his special interest protections after leaving office.

Then we had the storming of the Capitol.

They've all been slowly edging closer to the line of action, and as soon as that meant one jumped it was easier for another to follow. Once you've got a few big movers, then the momentum makes doing nothing the harder option for the smaller players.
posted by MattWPBS at 2:36 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


but wants to hear case before making a final decision

Well that's a nice change
posted by clawsoon at 2:36 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


Maybe we should start numbering some of the overused (by me, among others!) MeFi Drollery Greatest Hits, so we could use them in shorthand:
"surely this" = 32
"leopard ate my face" = 33
posted by PhineasGage at 2:36 PM on January 12 [31 favorites]


> I know that Fox isn't the best place to link to, but watching new Republican rep Nancy Mace steamroll over the host as the host tries to politely cut off her explanation of why she's no longer supporting Trump, and why what Trump did and said is in fact bad and did in fact promote violence, is nice.

I noped out of this after the part where she said she wanted both Democrats and Republicans to take responsibility for "the violence leading up to this". If that's the GOP's idea of meeting in the middle, I'm thinking some more cycles of truth and reconciliation are in order.
posted by tonycpsu at 2:37 PM on January 12 [38 favorites]


>Has there been any talk of why the Park Police were letting protesters bring items they aren't normally allowed? This seems like more than "oh white people, don't have to worry about them and their flag spears!" given everything else.

I don't have an answer to this, but it's the one thing I keep coming back to again and again. Especially since I learned that the officer who died took a blow to the head from a fire extinguisher -- except it was probably not a fire extinguisher but a canister of bear repellent that a protester brought. (Though I have no solid confirmation of that and I feel like I'll explode if I look into it further.)

Jordan Klepper has an interview with a guy who brought a for-real pitchfork. How was this allowed at all?
posted by Catblack at 2:38 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Joint Chiefs call riot a "direct assault" on the constitutional process, affirm Biden as next commander in chief (waPo)

The Joint Chiefs of Staff, the group of the most senior uniformed leaders at the Pentagon, issued a force-wide statement Tuesday condemning the riot at the Capitol as a “direct assault” on Congress and the constitutional process and affirming President-elect Joe Biden will become the nation’s 46th commander in chief on Jan 20.
The memo represented a rare step for a U.S. military leadership that has sought to keep the American armed forces out of the nation’s rancorous partisan politics in recent years.
posted by bluesky43 at 2:38 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]


Maybe we should start numbering some of the overused

Metafilter: Maybe we should start numbering...
posted by ctmf at 2:39 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


And if you look at how the donors are reacting, that might have some influence, not least now when Adelson is dead.
posted by mumimor


Society progresses one death at a time.
posted by Pouteria at 2:40 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Katy Tur has the full statement
Liz Cheney, number 3 Republican in House, is a YES on impeachment.
posted by Brainy at 2:45 PM on January 12 [51 favorites]


mightygodking: "per sources Biden does *not* want to use reconciliation, hopes for bipartisan deal instead"

Reconciliation is a budgetary maneuver that (per wikipedia) can only be used up to three times per year: one each for issues related to spending, revenue, and the federal debt limit. It took a lot of acrobatics to use it for the ACA, which was better than not passing the ACA but weakened the bill and made it more vulnerable to legal challenges.

I can absolutely understand Biden not wanting this to require those same distortions or have that same fragility, or to blow one of his limited opportunities to use this method. This is boring process stuff, but it matters.
posted by Riki tiki at 2:46 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


Not working too well here in Australia either, with our special sauce preferential voting system that is supposed to negate (or at least limit) the problems caused by first past the post systems like those in the US and UK.

Funny that you should mention that, as some of Australia's governing conservatives are talking about moving part of the way back towards first-past-the-post, by making second and further preferences optional.

And so, the Murdosphere converges towards a common set of values.
posted by acb at 2:47 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Metafilter: Maybe we should start numbering...

So instead of Gödel numbers we'd have Mathowie numbers?
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 2:47 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY): Donald Trump Jr. is now under criminal investigation in the District of Columbia.

Sweet.
posted by Dashy at 2:48 PM on January 12 [74 favorites]


But it seems more complicated to me that they all came to this pretty big, weighty strategic decision that must have taken a lot of consideration, all on the same day.

Tipping point, domino effect, snowball effect, cluster effect. Pretty common human patterns of behavior.

Judd Apatow gets a hit movie, suddenly there's R-rated manchild comedies everywhere. The White Stripes break big, now all the labels are signing garage rock bands and the price of crappy 60's department store guitars are shooting through the roof.

Hell, the damn tech companies all look to each other (to put it politely) for cues and ideas anyway - how many of them have tried to add or boost a social media video element after TikTok captured the kids?

Complicated seems unnecessary.
posted by soundguy99 at 2:48 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


So instead of Gödel numbers we'd have Mathowie numbers?

You already have one, 65212.
posted by hippybear at 2:49 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Losing both the military and the industrial wings of the military-industrial complex, along with professional fucking golf, is a pretty staggering profile in failure to be even a marginally competent Republican:

Northrop Grumman on Monday became the first major defense contractor to pause political donations to members of Congress, as a wave of corporate entities react after the Jan. 6 riot on Capitol Hill. But it does not seem to be the last.

“We are pausing political action committee giving and evaluating the way forward,” Northrop spokesman Tim Paynter told Defense News Monday evening.

On Tuesday morning, Leidos — the 23rd largest defense firm in the world, according to the annual Defense News Top 100 — followed suit. In a statement, Leidos chairman and CEO Roger Krone said “Violence, lawlessness, and anarchy have no place in our nation. We believe in civil political discourse and the fundamental right to peacefully protest, but strongly condemn violence or intimidation. In light of these events, Leidos’ Political Action Committee (PAC) has decided to temporarily pause all political donations.”

Then Tuesday afternoon, Raytheon Technologies had joined in as well, with spokesman Chris Johnson saying “We have paused all political action committee contributions to reflect on the current environment and determine appropriate next steps.”


And by that, I mean losing their support for all the wrong reasons.
posted by mandolin conspiracy at 2:50 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


"Hakeem Jeffries (D-NY): Donald Trump Jr. is now under criminal investigation in the District of Columbia."

Genuine question: is it in relation to the riot or to other criminal activity?
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 2:51 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


por que no los dos?

Sure hope discovery is productive.
posted by Dashy at 2:53 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Rep. John Katko becomes first House Republican to back Trump impeachment (Rep from upstate NY, Syracuse area)

Katko, R-Camillus, is the first House Republican to acknowledge that he will join at least 218 House Democrats who signed onto an impeachment resolution. A vote is expected Wednesday, a week before President-elect Joe Biden will be sworn into office.

Katko said he felt compelled to uphold his oath of office and defend the Constitution by impeaching Trump.

“To allow the president of the United States to incite this attack without consequence is a direct threat to the future of our democracy,” Katko said in a statement. “For that reason, I cannot sit by without taking action. I will vote to impeach this president.”
posted by bluesky43 at 2:54 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


Oyeah - There is clear video of that judge's son, breaking the capitol window out with the clear riot shield he somehow got hold of. You know, there was an officer murdered you might ask, did he get the shield off the dead officer, and was he involved in the murder

There may be many reasons for his mode of speach, but Aaron Mostofsky doesn't come across as a violent person, he comes across as a vulnerable person. He says he found the sheild on the floor and doesn't know whose it is because it doesn't have a name on it. During the 2m interview he complains that his backpack is heavy. To me, he seems the type of vulnerable adult that needs protecting from the likes of Trump. Mostofsky seems to me to be a great argument for deplatforming toxic people.

He has been arrested in Brooklyn, so he managed to get back home successfully.

The people who need to be identified aren't the jesters in fur outfits, they aren't the idiots complaining that they got 'maced' for entering the Capitol building, these are not the instigators of violence.

Has anyone seen any interview with any of the seditionists that shows them comprehending the implications of the action they are taking part in? Anyone who shows any understanding of democracy, how law is a pillar of society, what white privilege is? Anyone...Bueller

Here's a fellow who seems to grok the palpable lack of justifiable motivation for the insurrection.
posted by asok at 2:56 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


(McConnell) Would not whip votes for or against impeachment.

I wonder if this means that he knows the votes are there.
posted by Ruki at 2:58 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


McConnell has told others that Trump probably committed impeachable offenses but wants to hear case before making a final decision, per person who has spoken with him.

Nancy Pelosi should tell him to put his money where his mouth is by publicly describing what charges he'd vote to convict on so they can be included in the articles of impeachment.
posted by The Tensor at 2:58 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Maggie Haberman
@maggieNYT
The White House is expecting roughly two dozen defections among Republicans who will vote to support impeachment, a senior administration official said
posted by bluesky43 at 2:58 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


And so, the Murdosphere converges towards a common set of values.
posted by acb


Murdoch has an awful lot to answer for. He is one of the most destructive humans in history, IMHO, and he has faced precisely zero serious consequences for it.

I am not holding my breath he ever will.
posted by Pouteria at 2:59 PM on January 12 [23 favorites]


"Now that we're going to be in the minority and have to negotiate for every scrap of political benefit to our donors beloved constituents, let's remind everyone of the integrity and strong moral principles we don't have. We stand firmly against any violence that might endanger The Agents of Democracy, which is to say, us personally."
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:59 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Catblack

Apparently none of the usual security was present, here is a report from a citizen observer, historian Terry Bouton. Normally anything that can be used as a weapon (sometimes including water bottles) is confiscated at the security barrier. There was no security barrier on 6th January.

'There is no doubt the Capitol was left purposefully understaffed as far as law enforcement and there was no federal effort to provide support even as things turned very dark. This contrasts sharply with all of other major protests we have attended. A lot has been made of the contrast to the overwhelming police presence at Black Lives Matters protests in the fall, and this is certainly true. But there was also A LOT more federal law enforcement presence at every single previous protest we have attended in DC. '
posted by asok at 3:03 PM on January 12 [40 favorites]


McConnell is the Vicar of Bray once again.

And this be law, that I'll maintain until my dying day, sir
That whatsoever king may reign, Still I'll be the Vicar of Bray, sir.
posted by ocschwar at 3:03 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]



‘It was not to make friends but to save our lives up in there’ — Rep. Lisa Blunt Rochester spoke out after video circulated of two GOP reps appearing to mock her for passing out masks during lockdown

GOP reps: Oh, isn't that cute, the Democrats think they're going to live through this.
posted by jointhedance at 3:05 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Seth Abramson @SethAbramson
CNN is reporting that Mitch McConnell has no intention whatsoever of speaking to Trump again at any time in the foreseeable future, and *also* that he is in touch with president-elect Joe Biden about how to structure the coming impeachment trial.

/also Mitch McConnell can go to hell.
posted by bluesky43 at 3:06 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


>There may be many reasons for his mode of speach, but Aaron Mostofsky doesn't come across as a violent person...

So that's why he carried a stick, helped break a window, put on an officer's vest, carried around a riot shield. Screw him and his brother.
posted by Catblack at 3:07 PM on January 12 [32 favorites]


So that's why he carried a stick, helped break a window, put on an officer's vest, carried around a riot shield. Screw him and his brother.

Are you saying don't judge a book by its cover story?
posted by clawsoon at 3:10 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


Those congressional representatives violating protocol by refusing to wear masks (especially in confined spaces for extended periods of time) need to be severely censured. Does Pelosi have any available options to send them packing? Their flagrant violations put their colleagues at risk.
Personally, I think we are the point of the pandemic where this kind of behavior can reasonably be called bioterrorism.


If I even joked about doing this with another brown person, we would be disappeared faster than you can say "extraordinary rendition". I don't understand how anyone can watch this level of cruelty and think bipartisanship is something worth even trying.
posted by Ouverture at 3:10 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


McConnell has told others that Trump probably committed impeachable offenses

Impeach him now so they can start the "Trump wasn't really a Republican and I certainly never really supported him" train.
posted by kirkaracha at 3:13 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Liz Cheney from deepest red Wyoming just came out in favor to impeachment. She’s the number 2 Republican in the House.
posted by interogative mood at 3:15 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


To me, he seems the type of vulnerable adult that needs protecting from the likes of Trump. Mostofsky seems to me to be a great argument for deplatforming toxic people.

When Mostofsky appeared in court, he seemed cognizant of what he had done but at no point did he say or do anything approaching something like genuine remorse or shame for his actions. He's out on bail, somehow allowed to be remanded to the custody of a man whose Twitter account is currently vacillating between the coup being a patriotic duty or the work of antifa false flag operatives. He's not the victim here.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 3:16 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Re: McConnell and impeachment, Michael Steele (former chair of RNC) is on MSNBC saying this is probably due to some big news on the horizon and McConnell is trying to stay a head of it. Rats, sinking ships, etc. But I don't care as long as impeachment happens.
posted by nicoffeine at 3:17 PM on January 12 [20 favorites]


“We are pausing political action committee giving and evaluating the way forward,” Northrop spokesman Tim Paynter told Defense News Monday evening.

Leidos’ Political Action Committee (PAC) has decided to temporarily pause all political donations.”

Raytheon Technologies...Chris Johnson saying “We have paused all political action committee contributions to reflect on the current environment and determine appropriate next steps.”


Note that they are all pulling money from all PACs. Not Republican PACs. All PACs. Corporate both-siderism. If they were actually concerned, they’d pull the trough away from the Republican PACs only, and drive home the message that if they want the green, they need to cut out the bullshit. This is just marketing.
posted by Thorzdad at 3:17 PM on January 12 [49 favorites]


One of my friends put it pretty concisely: "Megacorps have really similar drivers. If a customer does something to burn through the patience of one megacorp, nobody else is gonna be ok with it either."
posted by tavella at 3:22 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Re: McConnell and impeachment, Michael Steele (former chair of RNC) is on MSNBC saying this is probably due to some big news on the horizon and McConnell is trying to stay a head of it. Rats, sinking ships, etc.

I have $20 on evidence of overt collusion between the White House and/or other Republicans and insurrectionists
posted by schadenfrau at 3:25 PM on January 12 [54 favorites]


Cheney's actions could be better explained by Chevron "reviewing their contributions"
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 3:25 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]




I have $20 on evidence of overt collusion between the White House and/or other Republicans and insurrectionists

Jim Acosta reported the day of the riot that someone at the White House was in direct contact with some of the rioters. I don't understand why this hasn't gotten more attention.
posted by suelac at 3:30 PM on January 12 [30 favorites]


Unfortunately for the fascist-in-chief McAllen's longest runway is 7,120', which is not long enough.

Good point, I took a quick guess. Trump actually flew in & out of Valley International Airport in Harlingen, Texas (Wikipedia, map). Their longest runway is 8,301 feet.
posted by cenoxo at 3:30 PM on January 12


CNN is reporting that Mitch McConnell has no intention whatsoever of speaking to Trump again at any time in the foreseeable future

Someone on one of my facebook pages just called this The Tortoise vs. The Hair.
posted by Mchelly at 3:30 PM on January 12 [102 favorites]


re YMCA, i have long derided the magahat crowd as being bad at both dancing and spelling, but on inspection, i'm pretty sure they're taking advantage of the well-known dance (?) to misspell those four particular letters on purpose, YMCA isn't spelled MAGA!

the seventies playlist spin-up music at the putschist rally was ... deuced odd. i suspect it is calculated to appeal to the attending demographic while offering the veneer of broadly-accepted americana.
posted by 20 year lurk at 3:32 PM on January 12


conviction only requires 2/3 of members present.

Ugh, I would definitely take removing Trump for a couple extra days even if it means the Democrats take almost all the heat for it, but if that's the only way for it to happen then bless those Republican cowardly cowards' hearts forever and ever amen.
posted by Riki tiki at 3:32 PM on January 12


Jim Acosta reported the day of the riot that someone at the White House was in direct contact with some of the rioters. I don't understand why this hasn't gotten more attention.

my totally uneducated guess is that this is one of those things that law enforcement and possibly high level elected officials would ask to keep under wraps while they're actively investigating it

and / or the kind of thing where you really need to nail your reporting
posted by schadenfrau at 3:34 PM on January 12 [23 favorites]


Jim Acosta reported the day of the riot that someone at the White House was in direct contact with some of the rioters. I don't understand why this hasn't gotten more attention.

(a) same, and (b) my money's on that someone being Stephen Miller.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 3:35 PM on January 12 [45 favorites]


"Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) becomes the third Republican to vote for impeachment, following Reps. Cheney (R-WY) and Katko (R-NY)." -- Brian Tyler Cohen
posted by valkane at 3:36 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


That little Ratfuck has been very very quiet, hasn't he?
posted by schadenfrau at 3:36 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


a friend the other day opined that this divide goes back to Reagan

A friend of mine [tracks] it back to Goldwater.


Yes. I'm reading Ted White's The Making of the President 1964, and the discussion of the Republican party "primitive" branch reminds me of today.
posted by jgirl at 3:36 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


There is a part of me that wishes he could have Twitter while being banned from Twitter, just for the popcorn of the meltdown.

I like to imagine that they shadow-banned him, and he is still furiously tweeting into the void!
posted by Lanark at 3:37 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


"The House Judiciary Committee just released a 76-page impeachment report. Here's how it ends:

"President Trump remains a clear and present danger to the Constitution and our democracy." -- Adam Klasfeld

It's like a Tom Clancy novel. Only written by a lefty. (in my head it's William Gibson)
posted by valkane at 3:39 PM on January 12 [27 favorites]


I know everyone here is aware of the cynicism of republican turns today, but the image rehab machine is already churning
posted by fluttering hellfire at 3:40 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


The recent Behind the Bastards episodes on the John Birch Society (1, 2) dig into the Goldwater thing and the Phyllis Schlafly episodes (1, 2) offer related context. They're all great listens.
posted by Riki tiki at 3:41 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Hey Donnie, be careful who you step on on the way up the ladder. It’s a long fall.

Except of course for Ted Cruz, that coward will be throwing the palantir to the hobbits any moment now.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 3:42 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Interesting update Glegrinof the Pig-Man. Is it his brother Neil that you are referring to? I am not saying Aaron is a victim, but I am saying that he is as far from a ring leader as it is possible to get. If his brother is anything to go by, he is not getting high quality information on what is going on in the world.

Aaron Mostofsky is looking at a maximum sentence of 10 years for theft of government property, along with three other charges. He said in an Instagram conversation “But it was like I’m here now how did I get there.”

Catblack, did you watch the interview I linked before you posted? I understand that you are angry, but I suggest that this particular person is unlikely to be a worthy target of your ire, given the plethora of others available. He is an easy target, less nasty than Jacob Angeli, more clueless than Elizabeth from Tenessee. These people have all been arrested, but they are not the people who made this happen.

Nachman Mostofsky does sound like a nasty piece of work, but he is also defending his brother from possible incarceration, so he is likely to say anything he thinks will help. It is possible that he is delusional enough to believe what he is saying, which would mean he is another conduit for toxicity.

These people are navigating the same world that we are navigating, but they are choosing different information sources and trusting different people. As Baron Cohen said, we need to get back to a place where we have a shared reality.
posted by asok at 3:42 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


"Mitch McConnell has no intention whatsoever of speaking to Trump again at any time in the foreseeable future"

Probably the most relatable thing McConnell has ever expressed.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 3:44 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Jim Acosta reported the day of the riot that someone at the White House was in direct contact with some of the rioters.

Hakeem Jeffries: "Donald Trump Jr. is now under criminal investigation in the District of Columbia.

Keep the pressure on every single person who incited the violent attack on the Capitol."


Please feel free to imagine me connecting these two possibly unconnected things with some red string on the cork board of theorizing that is this thread.
posted by yasaman at 3:46 PM on January 12 [51 favorites]


As Baron Cohen said, we need to get back to a place where we have a shared reality.

Nah, not buying it. I'm sitting here, trying to make decisions from discernible reality. I'm not into the spellcasting that the MAGA crowd dabbles in, trying to make reality by force of will and repetition. They're welcome back anytime, so long as they come in honest repentance that's as loud and long lasting as their evildoing.
posted by tclark at 3:47 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


asok, maybe there's some sympathy to be had for gullible people who were excited about some mayhem, but let's put them down the list way past children separated from their parents and put in cages, after Portland protesters abducted in unmarked vans by federal law enforcement, and then also past all the people who didn't literally break into the Capitol at the direction of their orange god.
posted by Riki tiki at 3:47 PM on January 12 [71 favorites]


Republican house and senate leaders are looking to their future - "how can we get votes from the middle to get house and senate majorities?" - they're doing the calculus and realising that that's getting harder and harder as Trump polarises things more and more - my guess is that they want him gone from any future elections, 2/4 years from now they don't want to be running Trumpist slates of terrorist redneck yahoos they'll lose seats, they probably understand that there's a chance that it might be a generation before the GOP finds its way back from the weeds
posted by mbo at 3:48 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


My guess is despite whatever McConnell and other GOP say about how they've suddenly seen the light, and there is now evidence of X, Y, or Z, they are actually doing this for 2 reasons (assuming he does follow through): first, the corporate donor class turning on Trump will soon spread to the rest of them, and second, Trump's Twitter army has been disbanded. If the stories are true about what all the GOP say behind closed doors being the opposite of what they say in public, then this is probably their one chance to dump Trump with minimal blowback while right wing social media is still in temporary blackout/brownout.
posted by p3t3 at 3:48 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


re: corporate campaign contributions and "Note that they are all pulling money from all PACs. Not Republican PACs. All PACs. Corporate both-siderism. If they were actually concerned, they’d pull the trough away from the Republican PACs only ... "

Some corporations are stopping contributions to specifically the 147 Republicans who betrayed their Constitutional duty by opposing certification of Electoral College votes. (Other corps are, indeed, "reviewing all contributions," and I totally agree that that is appalling both-sides-ism.)

Corporate America halts donations to Republicans who voted to overturn the election, CNN, lists these companies as ONLY cutting off the 147 Republicans:

AirBnB, Amazon, American Express, AT&T, BlueCross BlueShield, Comcast, Commerce Bank, Dow, Marriott, Mastercard, Verizon, and Walmart.

Then there are others suspending all PAC donations, including 3M, Bank of America, Citigroup, Coca-Cola, Facebook, and others.

And this Bloomberg article, Fund Managers Donated $1 Million to GOP Election Deniers , lists specific donation totals from fund managers to those 147 Republicans.
posted by kristi at 3:49 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


General request: to anyone posting news, please please scroll up and see if it's already posted. These threads get long fast.
posted by Dashy at 3:51 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


What then, a fistfight? Make yourself the spectacle, get yourself sanctioned and possibly arrested?

Way upthread, but yes. I would happily believe in something again to see Congresswoman Jayapal punching Josh Hawley in the dick.
posted by aspersioncast at 3:52 PM on January 12 [31 favorites]


The do seem to get mega long, mega fast.
posted by vrakatar at 3:54 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I would happily believe in something again to see Congresswoman Jayapal punching Josh Hawley in the dick.
There's your fanfiction right there.
posted by Horkus at 3:54 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Given how much speculation and other chaff gets posted in these threads, to be honest I appreciate when important news is linked more than once. I suppose it depends on whether you're following the thread in real time or trying to catch up periodically.
posted by DingoMutt at 3:54 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


General request: to anyone posting news, please please scroll up and see if it's already posted. These threads get long fast.

Also, double check MF on a separate tab to make sure said newsitem hadn't already been posted while you were typing up your post.

Trust me as someone who learned this the hard way.
posted by gtrwolf at 3:55 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


It seems like Democrats should be "divisive" more often!

Love to see it. And also love the pressure everyone is putting on.
posted by ichomp at 3:57 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Unity through impeachment!
posted by Huffy Puffy at 3:58 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


Donny Deutsch on MSNBC: "When you think about the logo of Trump's business going forward, it's people storming the Capitol. No brand in any way shape or form will be associated with him. His brand is castrated. It's over."
posted by valkane at 3:59 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


Since the corporate PAC’s tend to give more to Republicans than Democrats I don’t care about their both sides nonsense. Also it’s a long time till the next election they don’t need to have their PACs doing anything right now.
posted by interogative mood at 4:02 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


If there is (hypothetically) an investigation into incitement to sedition against Trump, the White House or speakers at the rally, would you want that to be headline news before the 20th?

FBI director Robert Mueller, 2 days after 9/11, answered the same amount of questions. Not a single arrest had been made at that point, so anything could have been planned, but he gave a lot of specificity.

But it's cool, as long as at the end of the day law enforcement and our justice system prevents any further violence of this nature, arrests and charges and convicts the perpetrators and helps stabilize the country, I'm fine with them being strategic. I don't believe that's the case, but at the end of the day, get the job done and keep people safe and maybe they can explain what needs to be explained.
posted by cashman at 4:03 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


"Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) becomes the third Republican to vote for impeachment, following Reps. Cheney (R-WY) and Katko (R-NY)." -- Brian Tyler Cohen
posted by valkane at 3:36 PM on January 12 [5 favorites +] [!]


Wait. Are they voting today? There is just so much going on, oh my.
posted by Snowishberlin at 4:04 PM on January 12


The corporate money is more important than usual as the Trump fan club is going to continue to donate money to Trump and his associated grifters. It's not going to be switched to the normal Republican coffers after a Republican president leaves office.
posted by meowzilla at 4:05 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Wait. Are they voting today? There is just so much going on, oh my.

I think the vote itself is tomorrow. I think these are just people publicly saying how they will vote.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 4:07 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Republicans speaking on the house floor are wearing masks. What is this bizarro world?
posted by joeyh at 4:07 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


McConnell has told others that Trump probably committed impeachable offenses but wants to hear case before making a final decision, per person who has spoken with him.

Conducting a trial and hearing evidence is literally the Senate's role in impeachments.
posted by mikelieman at 4:07 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


"Several GOP sources say tonight that if McConnell supports conviction, Trump almost certainly will be convicted by 67 senators in impeachment trial.

"If Mitch is a yes, he's done," said one Senate Republican who asked (not) to be named. Many Rs are staying mum." -- Manu Raju, CNN
posted by valkane at 4:08 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


my guess is that they want him gone from any future elections, 2/4 years from now they don't want to be running Trumpist slates of terrorist redneck yahoos they'll lose seats, they probably understand that there's a chance that it might be a generation before the GOP finds its way back from the weeds

And yet they probably can't get anybody but MAGA candidates past primaries - here's hoping for some more Akin vs McCaskill reruns in general elections coming up.
posted by jason_steakums at 4:12 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


"Conducting a trial and hearing evidence is literally the Senate's role in impeachments."

Too bad the Senate Republicans refused to do their jobs and hear witnesses the last time Trump was impeached.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 4:13 PM on January 12 [33 favorites]


And yet they probably can't get anybody but MAGA candidates past primaries

Eh, they can just cheat, the Democrats know how and would be willing to help. /s
posted by ctmf at 4:14 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Mitch is thinking "Should I have impeached him then? Naw, then I wouldn't have got that last Supreme!"
posted by valkane at 4:15 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


And yet they probably can't get anybody but MAGA candidates past primaries - here's hoping for some more Akin vs McCaskill reruns in general elections coming up.

This same gambit got us Hawley vs. McCaskill, which is to say: it got us Hawley.
posted by Chef Flamboyardee at 4:16 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Note that they are all pulling money from all PACs. Not Republican PACs. All PACs. Corporate both-siderism. If they were actually concerned, they’d pull the trough away from the Republican PACs only ...

The neutrality stuff is bullshit, yes. It's cowardly, and it's also real hard to imagine this will last. But in general, and specifically in the case of defense industry types like Northrop-Grumman and Raytheon as mentioned, I'd be super happy if their money got out of the system entirely and stayed out.

Never gonna happen, but it would be an absolute good thing.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 4:17 PM on January 12 [20 favorites]


Has anyone seen any interview with any of the seditionists that shows them comprehending the implications of the action they are taking part in?

You know, I see where you're coming from with this entire comment, but it doesn't matter much. Intentionality doesn't matter. Actions matter. People's deeply-held personal beliefs are inconsequential when they are beating you with a flag.
posted by aspersioncast at 4:20 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


Do you think it is a coincidence that these Republicans have suddenly shown "courage" the day after Trump's Twitter account is blocked? It seems that they have been cowering for four years in fear that Trump might make a mean tweet about them. Oh, the humanity.
posted by JackFlash at 4:21 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


If Mitch is a yes, he's done.

I'm almost certain that Trump has been as abusive toi McConnell as he is to everyone, so now that Mitch really has nothing left to lose, he can take a measure of revenge.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 4:23 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Do you think it is a coincidence that these Republicans have suddenly shown "courage" the day after Trump's Twitter account is blocked?
It's not Twitter. Hint: follow the money.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 4:24 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


This same gambit got us Hawley vs. McCaskill, which is to say: it got us Hawley.

You don't always win with the "hope the other party nominates an extremist" gambit, but it's always the right play to take. McCaskill had a much better shot to win against Hawley than a moderate replacement-level Republican, and that's the right trade-off to make every time.

The only thing that matters is the political stance of the median Senator. Electing anyone to the left of Joe Manchin, which is nearly any living human willing to put a (D) next to their name, makes them the deciding vote in the Senate and expands the window of possibilities leftward.

Conversely, it doesn't matter at all if it's Hawley or Rob Portman sitting in that seat, because only Murkowski and Collins are remotely likely to tip the scales.

Focus on the median, not the average. Don't take your eye off the ball.
posted by 0xFCAF at 4:24 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?
posted by jenfullmoon at 4:27 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


"The second I realized our "safe room" from the violent white supremacist mob included treasonous, white supremacist, anti masker Members of Congress who incited the mob in the first place, I exited. Furious that more of my colleagues by the day are testing positive." -- Rep. Ayanna Pressley
posted by valkane at 4:27 PM on January 12 [91 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

My guess, there are no term limits in congress.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 4:29 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

His kink is getting re-elected and fundraising massive amounts of money. More so than any other politician. He'e obsessed.
posted by ichomp at 4:32 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I exited

uh...to where?
posted by schadenfrau at 4:33 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I'm almost certain that Trump has been as abusive to McConnell as he is to everyone, so now that Mitch really has nothing left to lose, he can take a measure of revenge.

I was gonna say, if there is ANY truth to the reporting about McConnell being willing to convict, something else has to be going on. I don't feel like the political calculus has changed--there's no downside to his waiting until the 20th, and there's no downside to his playing wait-and-see until Biden takes office. Trump must have said something pretty egregious to him. It's not like he suddenly grew a conscience.
posted by Room 101 at 4:33 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


It might not have been Trump himself but the PACs withdrawing money that turned McConnell.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 4:35 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

To quote Lex Luthor, "Do you know how much power I’d have to give up to be president?"
posted by jason_steakums at 4:38 PM on January 12 [72 favorites]


Josh Marshall @joshtpm: "The DC US attorney said today that people will be shocked when they learn what happened in the Capitol. Keep in mind, top congressional leaders have quite likely been briefed what they've found."

I'm imagining that this might have something to do with the about-face from Mitch and Co. When whatever this is becomes public knowledge (and therefore public outrage), the R's will want to be able to be in a position to condemn it.
posted by metaxa at 4:40 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


> why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

He's very good at his job (from the POV of his side of things) and Senate Majority Leader is one of the most powerful roles in national government, without many of the downsides that come with being President.

It also requires a different set of skills than being President does, and is also a more stable job (6 year terms, no formal limits).
posted by at by at 4:40 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


If it turns out that this was pre-planned on a more professional level this is even worse than what we saw with our own eyes. And we have already heard/read reports that some Capitol Police seemed to collaborate with the rioters, and of course there is the conspicuous lack of police, compared to other demonstrations. McConnell and several other Republicans were targets.
posted by mumimor at 4:42 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Yeah, and that also explains why he has daggers out for Trump; Trump just lost him Senate Majority Leader status.
posted by valkane at 4:42 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


I think we owe that outcome to the voters of Georgia.
posted by Rash at 4:45 PM on January 12 [52 favorites]


"Lauren Boebert is refusing to comply with the metal detector or allow a bag search. Now standing in the House doorway. Security is refusing to allow her to enter. Appears to be a standstill." -- Marc Rod

This is too much.
posted by valkane at 4:45 PM on January 12 [53 favorites]


I know we need the Republicans to follow through on conviction but I'm already so tired of the argument Mitch and Lindsay will be making in a month about how their one too-little too-late act of bipartisanship out of desperate self preservation means Democrats are the real extremists and that's why they're filibustering everything
posted by jason_steakums at 4:46 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


There doesn't seem to be a lot of long-term US Congressmen recently becoming President. Biden is an outlier. You have to go back 57 years to LBJ to find anyone who comes close.

*Biden - 36 years Senate
Trump - zero political experience
Obama - half a US Senate term
GW - TX Gov
Clinton - AR Gov
HW - US House term, various committees
Reagan - CA Gov
Carter - GA Gov
*Ford - never elected but was in House for 20 years
*Nixon - one term in House, half term in Senate
*LBJ - ten years Senate, 11 years House
*JFK - 7 years Senate, 7 years House

McConnell - 35 years Senate
(all years very poorly rounded)
posted by meowzilla at 4:47 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


I imagine the Dems met McConnell's asking price (which probably involves not pursuing McConnell himself, Elaine Chao, and/or Todd Inman for some evil[s] done during Trump's term).
posted by Iris Gambol at 4:47 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


> "Mitch is thinking 'Should I have impeached him then? Naw, then I wouldn't have got that last Supreme!'"

I mean, he would have. It's not like Mike Pence wouldn't have nominated the exact same person or someone just like her.

But you're not wrong that not convicting Trump for his crimes the last one was a completely calculated political maneuver having nothing to do with actual justice. It was just a different calculation.
posted by kyrademon at 4:48 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


"RIGHT NOW-> Congresswoman Lauren Boebert, who has bragged about her desire to carry a weapon on Capital Hill is currently in a standoff with Capitol Police at the newly installed Metal Detectors outside the chamber doors." -- Ryan Nobles, CNN
posted by valkane at 4:49 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


If it turns out that this was pre-planned on a more professional level

I don't know about "professional" level, but it's looking more and more that it being planned on a wider, coordinated, premeditated level is not just hyperbolic speculation. Inside job at Capitol Police, strategic holding back of mutual aid, premeditated foot-dragging with the National Guard, coordinating of communications between the WH, inciters on the front line, and key members in the crowd, Lauren Boebert literally live-tweeting Pelosi's location in the capitol building (seriously wtf, criminal assistance), all of it. It may not be military-level effective-professional, but a lot of work went into planning and executing it. This was not just Parler cranks egging each other on.

Or I'll eat a cake
posted by ctmf at 4:49 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


Via dKos: Biden makes inspired pick in career diplomat William Burns to head CIA
posted by darkstar at 4:49 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Heather Caygle on Twitter

NEW: Speaker Pelosi implementing FINES for members who don't wear a mask on the House floor

$500 fine for first offense.

$2,500 for second office.

Fines will be deducted from Member pay (no use of campaign funds or MRA for fines).


Brown m&ms: The story is a retcon. Crew and hospitality are normally different, often unrelated, groups. Testing one is a nonsensical way to evaluate the other.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 4:49 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]


Rep. Boebert did pledge to carry a Glock handgun to work just last week. (Prior to the insurrection.)
posted by Iris Gambol at 4:50 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


She also kept tweeting Nancy Pelosi's physical location during the insurrection.
posted by valkane at 4:51 PM on January 12 [34 favorites]


That explains the masks they were wearing earlier. $500 is all it takes, good to know
posted by joeyh at 4:51 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Or I'll eat a cake

Something something threatening with a good time.
posted by Kadin2048 at 4:52 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Heh, this is the freeze-frame image from the FBI press conference when I got back to my laptop. Seems about right.
posted by Riki tiki at 4:53 PM on January 12 [20 favorites]


"In a new letter, Pence tells Pelosi he won’t invoke the 25th Amendment. While the move was seen as incredibly unlikely, he had not put out a definitive statement until now." -- Kaitlan Collins, CNN
posted by valkane at 4:53 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Josh Marshall again:
Facebook rep told Michigan AG "I'm worried" about Michigan, based on right wing chatter on Facebook. Michigan AG just said this on CNN. #TrumpersDeterminedToStrikeinUS
posted by schadenfrau at 4:56 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


"Boebert has now been let into the chamber it was unclear from my vantage point if the Capitol Police searched her bag before she went in." -- Ryan Nobles
posted by valkane at 4:56 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Nixon was also Vice President for 8 years under Eisenhower. LBJ wasn’t just in the Senate, he was the Senate.
posted by interogative mood at 5:01 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


"Boebert has now been let into the chamber it was unclear from my vantage point if the Capitol Police searched her bag before she went in." -- Ryan Nobles

Well, that's the most nerve-wracking statement I've read in quite some time. I really hope they disarmed Boebert.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 5:02 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]








maybe there's some sympathy to be had for gullible people who were excited about some mayhem

If they actually exist, I'd have sympathy for people who got swept into the Capitol by the rest of the mob and then left of their own accord without confronting police or damaging property as soon as they were able. Or someone who actively attempted to stop the batteries by pulling the victims to safety or attempting to calm or redirect the mob, but not by exhorting the officers to abandon their posts. Otherwise, they made their bed and now they can lie in the goddamn thing like the rest of us

As far as Republicans wearing masks in the House chamber goes, it's required by rule and they can be ejected for refusing to do so. An amendment was filed tonight to allow fines to be levied as well.
posted by wierdo at 5:05 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


one thing I haven't seen mentioned in various deplatforming discussions is that Twitter and Facebook have all the DMs

They're likely in a way better sigint position than the alphabet agencies.
posted by Sauce Trough at 5:05 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


My Rep (D-Huffman) just finished a town hall wherein he said, "Also those who just stood down, looked the other way, none of that is acceptable, they let down their country & fellow Capitol Police . . . . Gotta tell you the Sgt at Arms [who resigned after the insurrection] is not somebody I've ever had confidence in. 2 years I've been working on him to do something about firearms [in the Capitol] & privately he told me he was concerned, but he was more concerned about the optics. Not surprising that he declined National Guard assistance on the day [of the insurrection] because of "optics" instead of doing his job to keep Capitol safe. I'm glad he's gone." [quick & dirty transcript from me]
posted by cybercoitus interruptus at 5:07 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


So we are counting three Republicans who are possibly carrying guns? This is growing terribly scary.
posted by mumimor at 5:08 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


That explains the masks they were wearing earlier. $500 is all it takes, good to know

I am reminded of an anecdote variously attributed to George Bernard Shaw and Winston Churchill whose upshot was they had established what the other party was, and now were just haggling over price.
posted by Gelatin at 5:09 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


This thread lays out some of the online interaction between Ali Alexander and Gosar leading up to January 6th.
posted by LostInUbe at 5:10 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]




500$ same as in Senate.
posted by clavdivs at 5:14 PM on January 12 [16 favorites]


This just made me laugh and I needed it.
posted by vrakatar at 5:14 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


>> That Venn diagram is nearly a circle.

> The same type of people, sure, but I think it's important to know that people aren't being disallowed to fly out of DC (or elsewhere) because of activities at the Capitol, it's just because they are anti-maskers. That's an important distinction.

Security theater in the age of COVID: the security theater will be televised.^

On another note, the comments above indicating that the phrase “witch hunt” is still in vogue now that even an open Nazi insurrection has occurred prompted me to realize that the response to this should be, “So was Simon Wiesenthal hunting witches? Y'know, the Austrian Jewish Holocaust survivor?”

Though on second thought, offering Nazis and the Nazi-curious the opportunity to freestyle a response mixing Judaism, witchcraft, and the Holocaust may not be the best idea...
posted by XMLicious at 5:15 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


So we are counting three Republicans who are possibly carrying guns? This is growing terribly scary.

No, it's over a dozen and counting:

Just watched about 10 Republicans walk around the magnetometer.
posted by meowzilla at 5:17 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


"The fact that Republican members of Congress think that they are too important to go through metal detectors tells you everything you need to know about them." -- Marc E. Elias
posted by valkane at 5:19 PM on January 12 [76 favorites]


is that Twitter and Facebook have all the DMs
They're likely in a way better sigint position than the alphabet agencies.


At some point when you have intel like that you call the alphabet agencies yourself and volunteer it. Twitter and Facebook are pretty big and untouchable, but I would not be the manager who sat on something like that. It would have to come all the way from Zuck and Jack themselves.

More likely, nobody DMs on Twitter and Facebook. They're mass communications tools, not internal ones. That's what Signal, etc. are for.
posted by ctmf at 5:19 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


I hate these people so fucking much.
posted by schadenfrau at 5:19 PM on January 12 [56 favorites]


What I hate is that nobody with the authority to do so seems to have the balls to hold them accountable.

That they are enabled steams me far more.
posted by deadaluspark at 5:20 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]




Those who refused the metal detectors should be banned from business today.
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 5:21 PM on January 12 [42 favorites]


Those who refused the metal detectors should be banned from business today.
posted by deadaluspark at 5:21 PM on January 12 [43 favorites]


Just watched about 10 Republicans walk around the magnetometer.

These are people who argue with a straight face that the solution to school shootings is to arm teachers. I am certain that they feel that bringing a gun into the chambers isn't just their Constitutionally-protected right, it's them being smart and self-protective.

I also think it's pretty chicken shit. If you're going to bring a gun in, admit it and argue your case. Bypassing the metal detectors just to be coy about whether or not you have one is pathetic.
posted by Mchelly at 5:22 PM on January 12 [34 favorites]


They'd need to stop everything and sweep the building for firearms.
posted by Marticus at 5:22 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Just watched about 10 Republicans walk around the magnetometer.

I bet half of them went to sleep imaging themselves the good-guys-with-a-gun who heroically (and single-handedly) fend off another attack on the Capitol before deciding to carry today.

And the other half went to sleep imagining themselves... well...
posted by clawsoon at 5:23 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


The metal detectors are going to be useless if they’re just going to let the members who don’t want to go through the magnetometer sidestep it.

Fine them $500. We know it works!
posted by saturday_morning at 5:24 PM on January 12 [16 favorites]


And set up barriers so you can't just walk around them.
posted by Marticus at 5:25 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


More likely, nobody DMs on Twitter and Facebook. They're mass communications tools, not internal ones. That's what Signal, etc. are for.

Counterpoint - some of these people live streamed themselves storming the Capitol. We may not be talking about good security practices.
posted by MattWPBS at 5:25 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


I guess the real question is whose side will they be shooting at if there's another invasion of the Capitol.
posted by kokaku at 5:25 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


I am certain that they feel that bringing a gun into the chambers isn't just their Constitutionally-protected right, it's them being smart and self-protective.

Doubt it.

2/3 chance: it's a stunt. They know they're on their back foot and would loooove to either be the Tough Guys who carried in congress or aggrieved victims who were FORCED by the GUBMINT to momentarily give up the totem of their one true gun-god.

1/3 chance: they intend to off some fellow members of congress and start The BoogaKrakeStorm or something.
posted by wildblueyonder at 5:27 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


It’s really causing tension between police and members

Police, most of whom battled to keep rioters from overrunning the chamber a short time ago. As well as escorting members to safety. You know, the little people.
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:27 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]


One of the people carrying a gun was the same one keeping rioters up to date on where Pelosi was being kept. She wants the Speaker of the House killed and cannot be trusted.
posted by at by at 5:27 PM on January 12 [67 favorites]


Whenever Republicans act like this I am reminded of this Tim and Eric segment.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 5:28 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I guess the real question is whose side will they be shooting at if there's another invasion of the Capitol.

Arguably they are the next invasion of the Capitol.
posted by notoriety public at 5:30 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Meanwhile, on Tucker Carlson, Glenn Beck is talking about shoes and internment camps. Do you think we ought to let them know there's an impeachment vote tomorrow? (I know appearance is out of bounds, but I seriously did not recognize Glenn Beck. Guys changed. A Lot.
posted by valkane at 5:31 PM on January 12


Gotta tell you the Sgt at Arms [who resigned after the insurrection] is not somebody I've ever had confidence in. 2 years I've been working on him to do something about firearms [in the Capitol] & privately he told me he was concerned, but he was more concerned about the optics.
It concerns me that the 15-year veteran of Capitol Police Force who died by suicide over the weekend was the son of former Senate Sergeant at Arms (serving from 1981-1983). After 1983, the dad, a lawyer, became a prominent lobbyist and chief of staff for Senator Fred Thompson (R-Tennessee) (they were friends at Vanderbilt law school, and they'd partnered in a law firm) and, after Thompson's retirement, for Sen. Bill Frist (R-Tennessee). A month after his own retirement, the dad died of a heart attack at age 62.
posted by Iris Gambol at 5:31 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Oh man, I always love a good Fred Thompson ref. Even if it is somber.
posted by valkane at 5:34 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


There are no confirmed guns in the House, people. Just assholes who refused to go through the metal detector. Let's not be crazier than we have to be, everything is already completely ....I don't even know what to call it. 2020 on bath salts?
posted by schadenfrau at 5:34 PM on January 12 [19 favorites]


I am very confused. Why are the R members suddenly bringing weapons into the Capitol? Is this just some last-ditch 2nd amendment dog whistling, I.e. symbolically 'going out fighting' in the final days of Trump or are they genuinely expecting violence? If so who are they defending themselves against - the rioters want Republican rule so what the hell are the members worried about?
posted by freya_lamb at 5:34 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


They probably didn't do it "suddenly," is my guess.
posted by tiny frying pan at 5:35 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


The detectors are new, the guns may have been there all along. So be reassured by that.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 5:36 PM on January 12


These fuckers are the same ones that cheered on suspension of civil liberties with the Patriot Act, warrantless surveillance, etc.

They aren't pro-freedom, they're white supremacists.
posted by mcstayinskool at 5:37 PM on January 12 [43 favorites]


Per this article, I'm not sure that the detectors are actually new - it sounds like they've been permitted to walk around them all along.
posted by sagc at 5:39 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


'Bathsalt Revolution' sounds like biker band.
posted by clavdivs at 5:39 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Refusing a test =/= to packing heat, and while it's worrisome and I sure as fuck want some repercussions for this, the mere act of refusing to comply is entirely within their chosen optics, all the more so if they can spin it multiple ways to the 'armed teachers are safe teachers' and 'Qanon hopefuls' and people with 'last honest republican going down blazing defending a bastion of Democracy!' crowds, which all exist to varying levels.

Mostly it's the same shit as them not wanting to wear masks, and I'm sure some of them try and maybe win this game at TSA checkpoints and shit, idk. Refusing a test, any test, is admirable if it thumbs the nose at government that cares about stuff.
posted by neonrev at 5:42 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Ignore the metal detector tantrum. It’s all they have left.
posted by interogative mood at 5:44 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


It's not the grumpy old senators, but the fresh Qanon house members that are the worry here.
posted by Marticus at 5:45 PM on January 12 [39 favorites]


There are no confirmed guns in the House, people.

How can anybody be sure, if the metal detectors can be so easily bypassed?
posted by Rash at 5:45 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Senators refusing to go through a metal detector aren't showing much inclination to compromise for 'unity'.

I think the poo flinging of the rioters should be featured in every press mention. People should be reminded that the insurrectionists were shitty. That's the kind of detail that upsets the otherwise impervious middle class conservatives.

On the subject of white supremacy, some observations from Ajay Parasram.

'If you were to ask those rioters if they were doing something wrong, they’d probably tell you no. They feel entitled to that space, their president called upon them to take that space and to “never surrender” as if they were extras in a Chuck Norris flick. The police response shows that white people are not seen as “threats” in the same way that BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, People of Colour) are. White activism is seen as safe, and the police response is maybe to scold and otherwise excuse the behavior and send people home. BIPOC activism terrifies the white settler state because it almost always exposes the fact that deep structural changes are needed, not a few more diverse looking politicians.

To understand the difference between police response to Floyd and the response to the MAGA rioters you have to put aside the extreme fringes and focus on the “normal” folks who think and are led to think that society is built for them. Society isn’t built for BIPOC, and that’s why the police can choke the life out George Floyd in broad daylight but they cannot stop white people from laying siege to the epicentre of American political institutions.'
posted by asok at 5:48 PM on January 12 [31 favorites]


confirmed
posted by saturday_morning at 5:49 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Totally, asok, I was not trying to imply that Gohmert was any less of a humanoid festering anal fistula.
posted by Marticus at 5:49 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


we have declined in our propriety and civil manners - can't any of these members get a cane?
posted by pyramid termite at 5:50 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


“There’s terrorism and there’s crime,” ....“You never know when either one is going to happen. You can rely on terrorists and criminals not to hurt you, or you can prepare yourself so they don’t hurt you. I trust myself more than the terrorist.”

-Rep.Mo Brooks.

some desert
"The purpose of the Second Amendment was to ensure that the citizenry could protect itself from a dictatorial and out-of-control government,” Brooks told TheDCNF."

“It has long been a primary goal of kings, dictators, communists, fascists and the like to disarm the citizenry so that there is minimal risk of opposition to centralized government, dictating to the citizenry that is unarmed and defenseless, and unable to assert their rights,” he said.

posted by clavdivs at 5:50 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


For quite a while, I've been thinking, and commenting about the fact that Trump is probably desperate and has been for a while, at least since when the second corona-wave arrived and he realized that his presidency might be ending. Trump outside the White House is a very vulnerable man, even if one disregards the possibility that the Russian Mafia wants their money back etc. He has indictments coming up, he has debts coming up, he has lots of properties running with a loss.
Now, he has brought his followers into the same desparate mindset. Hundreds, and maybe even thousands are going to jail, maybe ranging from mentally unstable MAGA hats to high-level officials. Many of them have already lost their jobs, just from the association with the events on the 6th. And with their jobs goes their healthcare, and perhaps other things, like their houses, their families. So they are desperate like Trump. And that makes them dangerous, not least because he inspires their choices in that situation. He mirrors their fear and their anger.
I don't think millions of Trumpists are desperate. But you don't need millions for it to be dangerous.
posted by mumimor at 5:52 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


can't any of these members get a cane?

riposte!
posted by clavdivs at 5:52 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


If you were to ask those rioters if they were doing something wrong, they’d probably tell you no. They feel entitled to that space, their president called upon them to take that space and to “never surrender” as if they were extras in a Chuck Norris flick. The police response shows that white people are not seen as “threats” in the same way that BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, People of Colour) are.

And the disabled. Even white ones, IIRC.
posted by Pouteria at 5:53 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


valkane, in 1973, when Thompson became minority counsel to the Senate Watergate Committee, he rang up his old friend to come help out. Friend wound up co-authoring the Baker report. (When Sen. Baker became majority leader, he became sgt. at arms.)
posted by Iris Gambol at 5:54 PM on January 12


Just out of curiosity, does anyone know whether gun rights whackjobs generally think duelling should be allowed? That's the first thing that came to mind in the context of weapons in Congress.
posted by XMLicious at 5:54 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


When the republicans are losing, they perform these little charades. I'm getting definite whiffs here of them wanting to argue about metal detectors as opposed to arguing about the other republicans who stormed the capitol.
posted by valkane at 5:55 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


I'm getting definite whiffs here of them wanting to argue about metal detectors as opposed to arguing about the other republicans who stormed the capitol.

Send them home and they can argue with themselves.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 5:57 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


"I have one message to members of Congress who amplified lies to undermine our democracy, encouraged an attack on our Capitol, and tried to overturn our election:

Resign.

If your lust for power exceeds your dedication to democracy, there is simply no place for you in Congress." -- Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez
posted by valkane at 5:59 PM on January 12 [109 favorites]


It's frustrating to have to say this in light of the divide that was on full display last Wednesday, but the metric for understanding what Rep Boebert is doing and the reaction (or lack thereof) from law enforcement/security has got to be "How would this situation have played out if the person in question were black?"

I have a lot of trouble believing the Capitol Police would have behaved the same if a newly elected black woman with professed attachments to Farrakhan's Nation of Islam, a stated intent to carry a Glock while in Congress, and who had been live-tweeting the location of Sen McConnell during the terrorist attack had attempted to bypass the metal detectors.

I've had clerks at stores lose their shit if I enter with a bag or backpack and don't immediately make a beeline for the counter to check it. So...yeah.
posted by lord_wolf at 6:01 PM on January 12 [79 favorites]


Gun toting liberal here.

Duels?

Fuck no.

But I gotta say after the complete conspiratorial failure of all their security, I think the Democrats should be carrying too.
posted by butterstick at 6:04 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


Yes, Pouteria, you do remember correctly.

'Contrast with 2017 when 140 were arrested in the Capitol building for peacefully protesting cuts to Medicaid. They were mostly disabled so yeah they were peaceful protests.'
posted by asok at 6:05 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


And the disabled. Even white ones, IIRC.

There was an essay linked in a recent thread about ableism being at the core of all oppressions, because it's the justification used for other oppressions. That the core idea of hierarchies is manifest in the very idea that people have worth based on their ability. So you get the familiar eugenicist arguments, you get claims of female intellectual or moral inferiority, etc etc.

I would like to read more on this, but what I kept thinking about as I read was that the disabled were the first to be exterminated in Nazi Germany, and my impression, as I learned about that years ago, was that it was because everyone kind of agreed that that made sense. And at the time that felt shocking and revelatory to me, that utilitarianism as applied to human worth was necessarily bound up in genocidal mania.

It doesn't really feel shocking anymore.
posted by schadenfrau at 6:09 PM on January 12 [43 favorites]


Pelosi should just instruct the Sergeant at Arms to throw these chuds in the Congressional clink for shits and giggles. Let them call Mitch to bail 'em out. Rake them over the coals via the Ethics committee for months after their warm glow has faded.

It will play at least as well nationally as their bullshit plays at home.
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:09 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


House member Katie Porter talks about her experience during the siege on a radio interview on KQED's Forum (51 min. audio)
posted by JDC8 at 6:12 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


If your lust for power exceeds your dedication to democracy, there is simply no place for you in Congress

The point that needs to be hammered over and over again. We have chosen to have a (flawed pretense of) democracy. You do not get to claim to represent any populace in it while actively, vocally working to destroy it.
posted by aspersioncast at 6:13 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


A long time ago I did a very stupid thing. I was old enough to be charged as an adult, I got cuffed and stuffed. No one was hurt, it was a stupid situation that got way out of control and I was a fool.

I spent the night in jail, appeared before the judge, and was released. Got a court date for a couple of months later. Thing is, one of the charges I was charged with carried a maximum of five years in jail.

Five years in jail.

And for those couple of months as I waited for my day in court, and kept all this secret from my folks (whole other story) the pressure, dread, and shame I felt, well it was gigantic, ever present, and painful.

That is what president shitstain is feeling now. On steroids. Delivered by Dracula and Godzilla.

My case got continued without a finding and I started getting better. I'm much better now.
posted by vrakatar at 6:13 PM on January 12 [58 favorites]


Oh gods, I thought the talk of poo-flinging was metaphorical.

Pro-Trump rioters smeared poop in U.S. Capitol hallways during belligerent attack

Some of the unhinged pro-Trump rioters who stormed the U.S. Capitol on Wednesday defecated inside the historic building and “tracked” their feces in several hallways, the Daily News has learned.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:17 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Their little metal detector stunt just reminded me that while donors are dumping them, amazing human being and NY AG Letitia James is still working to make damn sure that the NRA isn't gonna be of much help going forward. I can't believe I forgot about that in all the craziness of the last few months. I can't even imagine the dynamics of a post-Trump GOP without the NRA.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:19 PM on January 12 [31 favorites]


Okay, Pence didn't take Pelosi's call about invoking the 25th; there's a letter. (Full text via The Hill). In part: "Last week, I did not yield to pressure to exert power beyond my constitutional authority to determine the outcome of the election, and I will not now yield to efforts in the House of Representatives to play political games at a time so serious in the life of our Nation." It's several lines of similar obnoxiousness, with a religious crackle-glaze featuring a dollop of Ecclesiastes 3 (or, if you prefer, The Byrds' Turn! Turn! Turn!). I'm starting to come around to the idea that his life was never truly in danger last Wednesday.

Also, Pence has the signature of a serial killer.
posted by Iris Gambol at 6:22 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


That is the shit, ChurchHatesTucker! It's not metaphorical, it's just regular poop.

Word to MF, schadenfrau.
posted by asok at 6:23 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


"Today, I am an inquisitor. I shall not sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction of the Constitution."

-Barbara Jordan, 1974.
posted by clavdivs at 6:24 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Maddow just showed video of a congresswoman who disclosed a litany of injuries suffered by the Capital Police. It was a lot more violent than i had previously seen discribed.
posted by bluesky43 at 6:25 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


I disagree with Pence, but I also think it is a valid stance to say "he's not impaired or has an inability to do his job." The right time for the 25th Amendment was 10pm on the 6th, and after a couple days, the argument got weak fast.

I would contend that not being able to command the confidence of your executive agencies is indication of inability, but I also think that after about 24 hours, there was no point in waiting on a 25th Amendment action.
posted by tclark at 6:25 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Pence isn't necessarily wrong in his thoughts about the limits of the 25th in that letter, but jesus christ the condescension dripping off of that guy when he gets a chance to talk down to a woman.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:26 PM on January 12 [27 favorites]


The biggest problem is that both sides point to the Constitution, but only one side has actually read it.
posted by valkane at 6:26 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Maddow just showed video of a congresswoman who disclosed a litany of injuries suffered by the Capital Police.

Rep. Scanlon (D-PA) described one officer nearly being shot with his own gun.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:29 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Speaker Pelosi (in the discussion about the 25th amendment resolution) being really clear that Trump incited "treasonous activity", and "who knows what he might do next". Well done.
posted by Riki tiki at 6:29 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I half suspect Pence's opposition to the 25th has mostly to do with not wanting to be President rather than wanting Trump to continue being President.
posted by at by at 6:29 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Fine them $500. We know it works!

Make it $600. For the symmetry.
posted by srboisvert at 6:30 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


Pelosi: Tonight, I have the solemn privilege of naming the Managers of the impeachment trial of Donald Trump.

@RepRaskin
@RepDianaDeGette
@RepCicilline
@JoaquinCastrotx
@RepSwalwell
@StaceyPlaskett
@RepDean
@RepJoeNeguse
posted by bluesky43 at 6:31 PM on January 12 [21 favorites]


Sorry, I thought the Capitol urine and feces rampage was common knowledge? The outgoing president’s rioters smeared “their extremist excrement around the building,” said sources in Senator Chuck Schumer’s office. According to Rep. Hakeem Jeffries on WNYC public radio, the stench of urine from at least one protester still emanated inside the building (variety of pics at link). Seeing a glove-less Rep. Andy Kim, cleaning up at 1am on Thursday morning, was worrisome.

Other corners of the internet hellscape are urging authorities to run DNA tests on the excrement, the way analysis is run on dog turds littering certain neighborhoods.
posted by Iris Gambol at 6:31 PM on January 12 [43 favorites]


I would favorite that, Iris Gambol, but I don't want to touch it.
posted by valkane at 6:32 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


It has been cited in several of these threads, but any time we're talking about swinging canes or packing heat in the halls of Congress, I recommend the definitive book on how this ended badly last time, Yale historian Joanne Freeman's The Field of Blood: Violence in Congress and the Road to Civil War .
posted by PhineasGage at 6:33 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


"What is "Sedition, Alex""
posted by Windopaene at 6:33 PM on January 12


I agree with you tclark — there's a very fair argument that the 25th isn't the right way to do this. Course, it's hard to respect Pence when he doesn't follow that up with support for impeachment or any other way to deal with the situation.
posted by saturday_morning at 6:33 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


the way analysis is run on dog turds littering certain neighborhoods.

We as a society definitely have too much money.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:34 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Lindsay Wise @lindsaywise (WSJ)
Michigan Republican @RepFredUpton will vote to impeach President Trump, his office confirms. Statement coming.
9:17 PM · Jan 12, 2021
posted by bluesky43 at 6:37 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]


Oh man, I always love a good Fred Thompson ref.
Russians don't take a dump, son, without a plan.

posted by kirkaracha at 6:38 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Pence, probably: "I talked with Trump. He's as sane as he's been for the past four years."

Everybody else: "That's the problem."
posted by clawsoon at 6:39 PM on January 12 [28 favorites]


I half suspect Pence's opposition to the 25th has mostly to do with not wanting to be President rather than wanting Trump to continue being President.

Nah. Pence thinks Trump is God's Champion and doesn't want to interfere with His plan.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 6:40 PM on January 12


"Devin Nunes: Look, the President makes a lot of mistakes. All presidents make mistakes..."

"Uh-huh. A mistake. "Insurrection? Whoops!" -- Bob Cesca, Salon
posted by valkane at 6:41 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Must be rough when God's Champion calls you a pussy for refusing to go along with his plan.
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:42 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Pence's late in the game mea culpa doesn't mean diddly squat to me. It's just one more cynical act by a cynical politician looking out for himself.
posted by bluesky43 at 6:42 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Who among us hasn't accidentally waged violent sedition on a bad hair day?
posted by Pouteria at 6:42 PM on January 12 [32 favorites]


Frankly, I've been of the opinion that Impeachment, from a political, historical, and "send a message" perspective, was a better option than the 25th (the ideal would be a 1-2 punch of the 25th (to "take away the keys") followed by impeachment). Then 25th could be spun as a coup, or a power grab. Since impeachment will take votes from Republicans, though there will be some dead-end MAGAites, it would give removal more legitimacy.

Perhaps Pence agrees and/or doesn't want to have the cross-hairs solely on him (can't say I blame him). If he has a signal from McConnell that he'll get removed and ASAP, Pence may feel he can stand down.

Or Trump pulled out photos yesterday, and threatened to show mother. It really could go either way. Who said 2021 was going to be dull?
posted by MrGuilt at 6:43 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Devin Nunes: Look, the President makes a lot of mistakes. All presidents make mistakes... (sound off because it's Fox and he's disgusting)
posted by bluesky43 at 6:47 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


"Devin Nunes: Look, the President makes a lot of mistakes. All presidents make mistakes..."

Considering Nunes' history of being Trump's pet Congressional lackey, I can't imagine he wasn't directly involved in all of this.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:47 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

Being able to win 51% of the active voter pool in Kentucky is much, much easier than winning 51% of the active voter pool in 270 electoral votes' worth of states. And Sen Maj Speaker, as we've noted, has political power comparable to the President.

Currently, Mitch gets his power and influence without having to convince voters in swing states that he's their guy.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 6:49 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


Yeah, the cows are definitely coming home to roost for Devin.
posted by valkane at 6:49 PM on January 12 [43 favorites]


"Pence looked for legal advice on whether he could upset the election, and John Yoo, Mike Luttig, and Pence's counsel Greg Jacob agreed he had no such power. Only John Eastman disagreed (although was he acting as Trump's lawyer when he made that arg?)" -- Orin Kerr

Torture Lawyer: You can't.
Other two lawyers: Torture lawyer is right!
Torture Lawyer: You can waterboard him, but you can't make him President again.
posted by valkane at 7:01 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


Don't read the Pence letter to Pelosi unless you want to pull your hair out.

Accuses Pelosi of politcal games.
Says congress must not divide and inflame passions of the insurrectionists.
Calls for unity.
Some Bible shit.
posted by JackFlash at 7:02 PM on January 12 [14 favorites]


Says congress must not divide and inflame passions of the insurrectionists.

So, appeasement then?
posted by Slothrup at 7:05 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Trump told him they were going to spare him all along. Credulous toady he is, and hearty helping of wanting to believe he wasn't betrayed, he said, "whew, that's a relief! What do you want me to do next?"
posted by ctmf at 7:06 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Pence looked for legal advice on whether he could upset the election

That's too damn far before he even got to the advice of the torture lawyer.
posted by jason_steakums at 7:08 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


I wish they'd spray people who won't go through metal detectors with that dye they use to tag bank robbers. Then everyone would know which asshole to keep an eye on.
posted by emjaybee at 7:11 PM on January 12 [35 favorites]


That's too damn far before he even got to the advice of the torture lawyer.

Or Eastman, who is such a craven limp noodle without discernible motivation other than naked partisanship that he'd tell Pence he can overturn the election but would say Gore couldn't have done the exact same thing.
posted by tclark at 7:11 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


The New Yorker on Twitter

Good News! He'll be gone in a week!

Remember Jeffery Toobin jokes?
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 7:24 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Sorry, I thought the Capitol urine and feces rampage was common knowledge? The outgoing president’s rioters smeared “their extremist excrement around the building,” said sources in Senator Chuck Schumer’s office.

"where we go one, we go all."
posted by weston at 7:25 PM on January 12 [50 favorites]



Sorry, I thought the Capitol urine and feces rampage was common knowledge? The outgoing president’s rioters smeared “their extremist excrement around the building,” said sources in Senator Chuck Schumer’s office.

"where we go one, we go all."


Did the rioters keep their shit in their pants?

Depends.
posted by lalochezia at 7:29 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


congress must not divide and inflame passions of the insurrectionists.

I know this is paraphrasing to some degree, and I can't be arsed to read Pence's letter to determine the degree, but this sure sounds like a shitty abusive threat.
posted by nickmark at 7:42 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


Army Will Not Screen All National Guardsmen Deploying to DC for Extremist Sympathies, Military.com, Matthew Cox, 12 Jan 2021:
The U.S. Army will not grant a Democratic lawmaker's request to have the service's Criminal Investigation Command (CID) screen thousands of National Guard troops deploying to Washington, D.C., to find possible supporters of extremists planning to disrupt Inauguration Day.

In the aftermath of a violent breach of the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, Rep. Jason Crow, D-Colo., made the request to Army Secretary Ryan McCarthy on Sunday "to ensure that deployed members are not sympathetic to domestic terrorists," according to a readout of the call.

McCarthy agreed to take "additional measures," but they do not include the massive CID effort needed to investigate the 10,000 Guard members expected to arrive in the District of Columbia this weekend, a force that could grow to 15,000 before President-elect Joe Biden's Jan. 20 inauguration....
Related: Lawmaker to Army Secretary: Investigate Troops Deploying to Inauguration for Domestic Terror Sympathies
posted by cenoxo at 7:43 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Accuses Pelosi of politcal games.
Says congress must not divide and inflame passions of the insurrectionists.
Calls for unity.
Some Bible shit.


They want us to turn the other cheek because they're not done abusing us.
posted by deadaluspark at 7:43 PM on January 12 [24 favorites]


In fairness: investigating and rooting out white nationalists in the armed forces isn't going to be a quick or easy job. It's going to take years. It really isn't realistic to try to investigate an entire division or more in less than a week.

Also, if extremists compose more than half of that division, the USA is fucked no matter what, so there's that.
posted by mightygodking at 7:47 PM on January 12 [25 favorites]


Mike Pence has always been a coward, and he's not bright, and when he fucks up, he only has one move: Set up a photo op with a bunch of religious leaders standing behind him, and refuse to take press questions during the photo op.

This is the letter equivalent of that. Complete with grossly self-serving eisegetical Biblical quotes.

(Wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross, as they say.)
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 7:47 PM on January 12 [23 favorites]


Accuses Pelosi of politcal games.
Says congress must not divide and inflame passions of the insurrectionists.
Calls for unity.
Some Bible shit.


They want us to turn the other cheek because they're not done abusing us.

@MattGlassman: This Pence letter is reasonable. I agree that the 25th amendment isn’t designed for the current situation. I disagree that letting Trump finish his term is the best course. But it’s nice to see the VP working to strengthen the system, especially as POTUS is trying to destroy it.

@SusanHennesey: This is a defensible view from Pence. He says he does not believe that Trump is currently incapacitated within the meaning of the 25th Amendment. Members of Congress and even some White House staff might not agree, but Pence seems to have reached his conclusion in good faith.

My hot take is that the President isn’t a crazy person or mentally debilitated, just a sociopath and an extreme narcissist, so the 25th amendment is the wrong tool and we shouldn’t have wasted time with it, but that’s me.
posted by Going To Maine at 7:49 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


Through 1/20/21 the Senate is controlled by Mitch McConnell. NOTHING will happen in the Senate before the Biden-Harris Inauguration, no matter how much fan fiction we write.

Unless there's a sudden SCOTUS vacancy, then we'll see how fast Mitch can go.
posted by adept256 at 7:50 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Eisegesis is when a reader imposes their interpretation of the text. Thus exegesis tends to be objective; and eisegesis, highly subjective. The plural of eisegesis is eisegeses (/ˌaɪsɪˈdʒiːsiːz/). Someone who practices eisegesis is known as an eisegete (/ˌaɪsɪˈdʒiːt/); this is also the verb form.
posted by valkane at 7:51 PM on January 12 [22 favorites]




My hot take is that the President isn’t a crazy person or mentally debilitated, just a sociopath and an extreme narcissist, so the 25th amendment is the wrong tool and we shouldn’t have wasted time with it, but that’s me.

Why in the fresh living hell is the argument "he's not crazy, he's only just as much of a monster as you think he is" in any way a sound argument for not getting this motherfucker in restraints fucking last week.

Because guess what, if he's not looney tunes off his rocker, that makes him a fucking murderous, fascist monster, which is frankly a lot more scary to have in charge than a crazy pants on head idiot.

I don't want to live on this planet anymore.
posted by deadaluspark at 7:54 PM on January 12 [16 favorites]


"A loyal friend, hounded without mercy by Democrats intent on destroying him from Day 1. Then he lost the election. It made him crazy or revealed a dysfunction I had refused to see. He then unleashed a mob to make war on their own government. 5 to their doom. @LizCheney is right" -- Geraldo Rivera

"Fuck you." -- Frank Coniff
posted by valkane at 7:55 PM on January 12 [46 favorites]


"Rep. Mikie Sherrill says that some members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege on the government's legislative branch." -- Kyle Griffin
posted by valkane at 7:57 PM on January 12 [62 favorites]


Why in the fresh living hell is the argument "he's not crazy, he's just as much of a monster as you think he is" in any way a sound argument for not getting this motherfucker in restraints fucking last week.

Agree but if SCOTUS rejects the use of 25th in a month as the original intent was medical incapacitation, not Impeachment Lite, then the uprising from the MAGA crowd would be massive, violent and completely to Trump’s advantage. In our fucked up Looney Tunes world with civil awareness being the cesspool it is for the general American public.
posted by glaucon at 7:58 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


MetaFilter: Surely this.
posted by New Frontier at 7:58 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege

wait just a god damn minute
posted by vrakatar at 8:00 PM on January 12 [52 favorites]


Unless there's a sudden SCOTUS vacancy, then we'll see how fast Mitch can go.

Bite your dang tongue. I think that may be the only way this can get significantly worse.
posted by MrGuilt at 8:04 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege

what
posted by medusa at 8:05 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


the President isn’t a crazy person or mentally debilitated, just a sociopath and an extreme narcissist, so the 25th amendment is the wrong tool

He's a domestic enemy of the Constitution and therefore incapable of performing his duties. It's the right tool, and has been since he was elected. (Although it likely needs further modification to account for craven VPs .)

I'm not saying people aren't following the m&m myth now that it's been established. I'm saying VH were just being dicks with their rider and someone came up with a cover story that doesn't really make sense. Check your equipment, not the green room.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 8:08 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Will be nteresting if those tours (already closed before Jan. 6th, for COVID reasons?) were members of Congress escorting constituents, donors, lobbyists, military... the security camera video will tell.

Gold medalist Olympic swimmer recognized amid Capitol mob (The Hill, Jan. 11, 2020) Klete Keller, a swimmer and two-time Olympic gold medal winner for the United States, was recognized by former teammates and coaches as one of the participants in the deadly pro-Trumb mob that overtook the Capitol last week. In the clip, the man recognized as the 6-foot-6 Keller is seen wearing a U.S. Olympic team jacket with “USA” printed on the back and down the sleeves as he stands over a crowd that was pushing and shoving police officers attempting to clear the Capitol Rotunda. [...]

Keller, 38, was on three U.S. Olympic teams, winning golds at the Athens Games in 2004 and at the Beijing Games in 2008 as a member of the 4 x 200-meter relay team. He also won silver in the event at the 2000 Sydney Games.
posted by Iris Gambol at 8:11 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


"Rep. Mikie Sherrill says that some members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege on the government's legislative branch."

This may explain how they found Jim Clyburn's unmarked office.
posted by cape at 8:16 PM on January 12 [40 favorites]


He’s a domestic enemy of the Constitution and therefore incapable of performing his duties. It's the right tool, and has been since he was elected. (Although it likely needs further modification to account for craven VPs .)

I dunno, I’m not a lawyer, I’m just a dude who is trying to keep up with how people talk about it and the historians whose views I read on the Twitter seem more miffed that Congress is wasting time with it. The notion that it would be appropriate for a conniving VP to ride the ticket onto election day and then conspire with cabinet members to boot a bad president on day 1 of their term seems also kind of sub-par.
posted by Going To Maine at 8:22 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


Someone needs to get their Olympic medals stripped.
posted by darkstar at 8:22 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


Yeah they probably were there to kill people. The big crowd of yokels doing stupid shit like live-streaming themselves and literally shitting on things gave cover to the small group of scary ex/current-military and ex/current-law enforcement fuckers with tactical gear and zip ties. And some current members of congress probably colluded with them. Wonder if that’s all about to come out? Maybe why Mitch is acting like a human being suddenly.

Hail hydra 🙃.
posted by supercrayon at 8:23 PM on January 12 [38 favorites]


members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege

I have expressed this in other places: something big, huge, and scary caused Google, Apple, Amazon, Shopify, etc to set aside every concern about lawsuits and loss of marketshare to shut pro-Trump media down, all within hours of each other after 1/6.

McConnell is rumored to be trying to stay a head of yet-broken story by supporting impeachment.

This could be a shadow of that thing.
posted by nicoffeine at 8:25 PM on January 12 [42 favorites]


Retired Lieutenant Colonel Is Unlikely to Face Court-Martial in Capitol Riot, Experts Say, Military.com, Oriana Pawlyk, 11 Jan 2021:
It's unlikely an Air Force veteran who entered the Senate Chamber during the Jan. 6 assault on the U.S. Capitol in Washington, D.C., will face a military court-martial, according to legal experts.

Larry Rendall Brock Jr., seen brandishing zip-tie handcuffs during the pro-Trump siege, was arrested Sunday in Texas and charged with knowingly entering a restricted building without lawful authority, along with one count of "violent entry and disorderly conduct," according to the Justice Department.

Brock retired from the Air Force Reserve in 2014 as a lieutenant colonel, according to the service. While he faces civilian charges, he is unlikely to be recalled to go through the military justice system, experts say.

Zachary Spilman, the lead contributor for the military justice blog CAAFlog [*], explained Monday that Brock is not subject to a court-martial, despite his past military service....
Details follow in the article.

*CAAFlog (About) has a PDF of the signed Joint Chiefs of Staff "Memorandum for the Joint Force" about the riot in Washington, D.C..
posted by cenoxo at 8:25 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


From that The Hill article: Swimming news website SwimSwam on Monday was the first to report on Keller’s apparent presence at the riot, noting that at least a dozen people in the swimming community had identified him in video footage posted on social media by a reporter from a conservative outlet, Townhall.

Linus's law - Wikipedia

In software development, Linus's law is the assertion that "given enough eyeballs, all bugs are shallow".
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 8:26 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


Watching the 25th amendment hearings, John Kasich blathers on about cancel culture and how Republicans might be getting cancelled but know that 'cancel culture will come for you Democrats as well' (I paraphrase).

Jamie Raskin's turn to speak, "the cancel culture of violent white supremacy tried to cancel all our lives last Wednesday."

*Snaps fingers* I see you, Jamie Raskin, not mincing words.

Resolution 21 at least passed vote muster this evening.
posted by erattacorrige at 8:27 PM on January 12 [65 favorites]


I had never heard of Raskin before 1/6 but he's definitely someone I'm going to pay attention to going forward!
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 8:35 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


Bwahaha youtube has suspended Trumps channel for seven days

Twitter

CNN
posted by supercrayon at 8:36 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


youtube has suspended Trumps channel for seven days

It's a start, I guess.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 8:39 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


Political correctness = Civilized behavior

Locker-room talk = Sexism

Platform = Privately-owned media outlet

Election integrity = Only Republican votes count

Thug = Person of color

Cancel culture = Indictment

It's really pretty easy when you've got the code key.
posted by valkane at 8:40 PM on January 12 [62 favorites]


"NEW: Republican Rep. Jaime Herrera Beutler will vote to impeach Trump. She is now the fifth House Republican." -- Kyle Griffin
posted by valkane at 8:42 PM on January 12 [17 favorites]


To be clear, the US house votes to APPROVE the 25th amendment resolution just a few minutes ago. Final vote count: 223:205 with 1 republican voting in favor and no Democrats voting against.
posted by erattacorrige at 8:43 PM on January 12 [10 favorites]


It's really pretty easy when you've got the code key.

You forgot:

Patriot = White GOP supporter
Very Fine People = Racist
Pro Life = Christian Zealot
Religious Freedom = Ability to disregard laws in order to force my belief on you
posted by MrGuilt at 8:44 PM on January 12 [23 favorites]


Sorry, I thought the Capitol urine and feces rampage was common knowledge?
Owning the libs by, uh, shitting into your own hands in public, I guess.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 8:51 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


States' Rights = [Nothing. That has no meaning whatsoever]
posted by ctmf at 8:51 PM on January 12 [11 favorites]


John Kasich blathers on about cancel culture and how Republicans might be getting cancelled but know that 'cancel culture will come for you Democrats as well'

john kasich is the governor of ohio.
that pustulent asshole paraphrasing justice kavanaugh's "reap the whirlwind" bullshit is representative for ohio's 4th district, jim jordan.

in the unlikely event you need to see it, find it at 2:46:15 - 2:48:38 here.
but, really, don't expose yourself to jordan if you can help it.
posted by 20 year lurk at 8:52 PM on January 12 [8 favorites]


"The purpose of the Second Amendment was to ensure that the citizenry could protect itself from a dictatorial and out-of-control government,” Brooks told TheDCNF."

“It has long been a primary goal of kings, dictators, communists, fascists and the like to disarm the citizenry so that there is minimal risk of opposition to centralized government, dictating to the citizenry that is unarmed and defenseless, and unable to assert their rights,” he said


Even accepting this framework as true, the point of bearing arms against a tyrannical government was not to allow insurrectionists to take government property by force, it was to defend oneself when they came for you in your home. The argument has been twisted from one of actual defense into some kind of veto over the democratic process. It's sick.

Of course, if one looks to history it's quite clear that the Second Amendment was never meant to be a protection against the government, it was meant to avoid having a standing Army. The Whiskey Rebellion happened while George Washington was still President and nobody said the Second Amendment gave those insurrectionists the right to shoot at lawful authorities.
posted by wierdo at 8:52 PM on January 12 [33 favorites]


Right, the idea that a bunch of dudes with ARs and F250s is going to inconvenience the Army is ludicrous. The guns are just for being intimidating and threatening to your neighbors.
posted by ctmf at 8:55 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


"During her live stream, Ocasio-Cortez spoke at length about the attempted coup, asking what the end game of political nihilism is. "What claim will you have? That you rule over a destroyed society? That the ashes belong to you?"" -- Kyle Griffin
posted by valkane at 9:00 PM on January 12 [76 favorites]


The Whiskey Rebellion happened while George Washington was still President and nobody said the Second Amendment gave those insurrectionists the right to shoot at lawful authorities.

N.B., VOA: Trump Has Power to Pardon Mob That Attacked US Capitol

America’s first president pardoned two men sentenced to die in connection with an insurrection that came to be known as the Whiskey Rebellion. The men were part of an uprising of distillers protesting a costly tax on spirits.

“And so, in that case it worked the way they had hoped it would,” Kalt says.

posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:01 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


The problem is that the Army couldn’t control Iraq, which is about the size of Ohio, Virginia, and North Carolina. They can do a lot of damage, as insurrectionist sized cells. You know, like the KKK did for about 100 years.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 9:06 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


I just couldn't help myself, I had to look up Kevin McCarthy. This guy hasn't had a real job his entire life.
posted by valkane at 9:11 PM on January 12 [6 favorites]


the President isn’t a crazy person or mentally debilitated, just a sociopath and an extreme narcissist, so the 25th amendment is the wrong tool.

Being a sociopath or an extreme narcissist *is* a mental disability. It is exactly what you might call "crazy" or "mentally debilitated" though it might be impolite to say "crazy". Being a narcissist screws up a person's thinking, same as any other mental illness, and that is precisely why the 25th was always appropriate, even though it was never invoked, and it will continue to be appropriate until Trump is no longer president.
posted by surlyben at 9:29 PM on January 12 [33 favorites]


Josh Gerstein on Twitter:
BREAKING: Acting Attorney General Jeff Rosen takes to YouTube just as president is removed from it. In 1st on camera appearance since Capitol riot, Rosen vows 'no tolerance whatsoever' for violence and other criminality at Biden inauguration.
posted by non canadian guy at 9:34 PM on January 12 [5 favorites]


There may be many reasons for his mode of speach, but Aaron Mostofsky yt doesn't come across as a violent person, he comes across as a vulnerable person. He says he found the sheild on the floor and doesn't know whose it is because it doesn't have a name on it.

I don't think it's a good idea to try to infer intent or vulnerability from the way Mostofsky talks in a video, and outside of that, he might not be as vulnerable as you think. Mostofsky just made $100k bail. At his hearing he smartly responded in one-word answers and let his lawyer do the rest. Meanwhile, his father is a Brooklyn judge, which means dad is incredibly well connected. Our local judicial system is trash; judges are theoretically elected, but because they generally run unopposed they're effectively and undemocratically appointed by the local Democratic party. So judgeships are usually plum positions handed to party loyalists.

Which is not to mention that "I picked it up and didn't know what to do with it" doesn't sound all that different to me than the folks who've been saying, "I didn't mean to break in to that office I was smugly lounging around in, I was pushed in."

If he's vulnerable for some reason that will come up at and can be addressed at trial. Until then, he's already gotten better treatment and had more privileges than thousands of NYC protesters who weren't involved in an attempt to overthrow the US government. The answer is to treat everyone better, but in the meantime, I don't think he particularly needs to be singled out for sympathy.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 9:36 PM on January 12 [35 favorites]


MetaFilter: Surely this.

I think you mean 32
posted by Ray Walston, Luck Dragon at 9:40 PM on January 12 [26 favorites]


BREAKING: Acting Attorney General Jeff Rosen takes to YouTube just as president is removed

Just want to point out that this is where the line break happened to fall on my screen and my heart almost skipped a beat before reaching the rest of the sentence.
posted by nobody at 10:17 PM on January 12 [9 favorites]


Profiles of some of the profiles of the insurrection attendees are wild - Fort Bragg captain questioned over attendance at rally - "The Army is investigating Rainey, a psychological operations officer, who led a group of people from North Carolina to the rally in Washington".

Imagine being a psyops specialist and not knowing you've been played?!
posted by phigmov at 10:18 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


Imagine being a psyops specialist and not knowing you've been played?!

For that reason alone I can't see her next performance review being too favourable.

I can hear distant but unmistakable howls of laughter from the direction of Russia.
posted by Pouteria at 10:21 PM on January 12 [12 favorites]


From Ayanna Pressley's CoS: when she hid from the howling mob, she discovered that “every panic button in my office had been torn out.”
posted by tavella at 10:24 PM on January 12 [58 favorites]


john kasich is the governor of ohio.

WAS the governor of Ohio, please. (Although our current R Gov, DeWine, is cut from the same cloth, albeit slightly less cranky.)

Kasich is currently a private citizen, what the fuck would he be doing in a House discussion/debate/vote on the resolution to ask Pence to use the 25th?

Unless the OP means that Kasich was a commentator on CNN or somewhere - which makes more sense, and if he's popping his head up again that means he smells Trump blood in the water, and thinks it's a good time to stake out his "reasonable Republican" territory.

representative for ohio's 4th district, jim jordan.

Jordan is the single best argument for "what's wrong with gerrymandering?" His district looks like a fucking duck, makes absolutely no geographic, social, cultural, or economic sense, and clearly just exists to overwhelm several potentially blue/purple large towns and small cities and suburbs with rural red voters.
posted by soundguy99 at 10:27 PM on January 12 [15 favorites]


Acting Attorney General Jeff Rosen takes to YouTube

My gut instinct is that I like this guy, and I am happy that he is getting this clear and unambiguous message out. But... the video is unlisted? And has only 2830 views? How is that going to make a difference? Am I missing something here?
posted by brambleboy at 10:29 PM on January 12


RE: Ayanna Pressley (Massachusetts) - I hope she and the rest of the Squad (Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York, Ilhan Omar of Minnesota, and Rashida Tlaib of Michigan) are having their offices independently inspected, my god.
posted by Iris Gambol at 10:31 PM on January 12 [31 favorites]


sorry soundguy99. thanks for the correction.
posted by 20 year lurk at 10:32 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


So what does the timeline look like now? Tomorrow they'll have the vote on impeachment which looks likely to go through and then it gets sent to the Senate at some point. And then...we wait for McConnell to say when the trial starts?
posted by NotTheRedBaron at 10:37 PM on January 12


I really fear for the Squad's lives. Do they have security?
posted by ichomp at 10:41 PM on January 12 [3 favorites]


As I understand it the House has control of the timeline in terms of when they choose to send the Articles of Impeachment to the Senate. Basically Trump will stand indicted but untried. You know like most folks awaiting a criminal trial.
posted by Ignorantsavage at 10:51 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


If Georgia certifies its Senate runoff votes sooner rather than later, will then power shift to the Democrats pretty immediately and maybe proceedings could begin before McConnell's Jan 19 date?
posted by hippybear at 10:55 PM on January 12 [1 favorite]


The argument has been twisted from one of actual defense into some kind of veto over the democratic process..

I know, right? Coming from Mo in '16 is ironically apt.

Second Amendment was never meant to be a protection against the government, it was meant to avoid having a standing Army. The Whiskey Rebellion

I avoid the hard liquor and powered fire arms discussion but the citizens have more guns, now. And we have one of the largest armies in history with presidential powers, consolidated in the 20th C. that allows a president to prevent states from using there guard if in the national interest. or in Trump's case not use it. The Whiskey Rebellion was the national army doing local authorities could not. Ya know, protect the fucking booze, forget the SLAVES. The right to carry arms was meant to protect the status quo from tryanny. See, everyone (white male of voting status) gets a gun.
posted by clavdivs at 10:55 PM on January 12


"Rep. Mikie Sherrill says that some members of Congress led groups of people through the Capitol Building on a "reconnaissance" tour one day before the riot that laid a deadly siege on the government's legislative branch." -- Kyle Griffin

Kyle Griffin is misrepresenting what Rep. Sherrill said. The quote: "I also intend to see that [...] those members of Congress who had groups coming through the Capitol that I saw on Jan. 5 – a reconnaissance for the next day; those members of Congress that incited this violent crowd; those members of Congress that attempted to help our president undermine our democracy; I'm going to see they are held accountable [...]"

It's very routine for staffers to give tours of the Capitol to visiting constituents. I've been on more than one myself and they're easy to arrange. It appears this is the kind of thing she's referencing -- she doesn't say the members themselves led tours, which would be unusual, just that they "had groups coming through" and that these groups must have been doing reconnaissance for the next day.

The extent to which members colluded with people planning a riot should be investigated fully of course. But the tweet is misleading.
posted by Emily's Fist at 11:09 PM on January 12 [18 favorites]


Unknown, Pouteria, but Sarah Groh says she had used them successfully before and had not changed offices since. So someone tore them out - she said the whole unit was gone, not just broken. It would be quite odd if some planned update happened to co-incide with this attack, and I would think that they would notify the office residents if they were pulled out for renovation. So at the very least it was extremely poor security communication and frankly given that it appears some USCP officers and MoC were accessories to the insurrection, I'm finding the worse interpretations much more likely.
posted by tavella at 11:10 PM on January 12 [29 favorites]


Seth Abramson has a new thread talking about the possible/likely conspiracy.
posted by wierdo at 11:26 PM on January 12 [7 favorites]


An official website of the United States government.

FBI
Most Wanted

U.S. Capitol Violence
https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/capitol-violence

The FBI is seeking information that will assist in identifying individuals who are actively instigating violence in Washington, D.C. The FBI is accepting tips and digital media depicting rioting and violence in the U.S. Capitol building and surrounding area in Washington, D.C., on January 6, 2021.

We have deployed our full investigative resources and are working closely with our federal, state, and local partners to aggressively pursue those involved in criminal activity during the events of January 6.

If you have witnessed unlawful violent actions, or have any information about the cases below, we urge you to submit any information, photos, or videos that could be relevant at fbi.gov/USCapitol.

You may also call ‪1-800-CALL-FBI (1-‪800-225-5324) to verbally report tips and/or information related to this investigation.

If you do not have an attachment but have information to provide, please submit it at tips.fbi.gov.

Seeking Information
Select tiles below to view all images and related Seeking Information posters...

[Filtered photos and descriptions follow on this FBI website.]
posted by cenoxo at 11:35 PM on January 12 [13 favorites]


I am trying (and succeeding) not getting ahead of the facts in my judgement. Things can be explained away, and almost always are. But this feels like a lot of drips, right?
posted by Brainy at 11:38 PM on January 12 [2 favorites]


Director Wray’s Statement on Violent Activity at the U.S. Capitol Building

January 7, 2021

The violence and destruction of property at the U.S. Capitol building yesterday showed a blatant and appalling disregard for our institutions of government and the orderly administration of the democratic process. As we’ve said consistently, we do not tolerate violent agitators and extremists who use the guise of First Amendment-protected activity to incite violence and wreak havoc. Such behavior betrays the values of our democracy. Make no mistake: With our partners, we will hold accountable those who participated in yesterday’s siege of the Capitol.

Let me assure the American people the FBI has deployed our full investigative resources and is working closely with our federal, state, and local partners to aggressively pursue those involved in criminal activity during the events of January 6. Our agents and analysts have been hard at work through the night gathering evidence, sharing intelligence, and working with federal prosecutors to bring charges. Members of the public can help by providing tips, information, and videos of illegal activity at fbi.gov/USCapitol. We are determined to find those responsible and ensure justice is served.
posted by cenoxo at 11:40 PM on January 12 [4 favorites]


Seth Abramson has a new thread talking about the possible/likely conspiracy.

Threadreader unrolled version.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 11:56 PM on January 12 [28 favorites]




So at the very least it was extremely poor security communication and frankly given that it appears some USCP officers and MoC were accessories to the insurrection, I'm finding the worse interpretations much more likely.
posted by tavella


I am trying (and succeeding) not getting ahead of the facts in my judgement. Things can be explained away, and almost always are. But this feels like a lot of drips, right?
posted by Brainy


Difficult to come up with an interpretation of all this that is benign.
posted by Pouteria at 12:11 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


From the BBC: Rioters are being urged to turn themselves into police.

Oops.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 12:13 AM on January 13 [29 favorites]


Pouteria I agree, the only reason I’m taking it slow is because I don’t want to get ahead of the evidence. But I had a lengthy list of all the things we’re seeing (plus others! Acting GA posting a video at midnight?? Liz Cheney saying more will come out??)

But it is feeling like there’s a lot of dots to connect and that maybe they’re being connected in classified settings?
posted by Brainy at 12:26 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


He is undoubtedly going to pardon himself, which then gives the Democrats open season to relitigate all the terrible shit he has done and utterly undermine the “law & order” party. With the now pariah status that he and his followers will have, you can turn the screws as hard as you want.

They are demoralized, splintered, and have no forum to communicate where they can scream the N word anymore.

Most of the people involved in this shit are small business tyrants, who are in no way capable of dealing with an actual insurgency and have everything to lose. The “insurrectionists” will dry up like a puddle in the sun and, with the capitol riot, managed to green light our massive security state to purge it’s ranks of white nationalists and punish other random psychos with all the tools at their disposal.

Also, Trump now has a RAPE TRIAL and any number of fraud cases as well as the families of the dead from Wednesday all drooling to sue him.

This is essentially a liberal wet dream. I fully understand why many think it was staged, but I frankly do not care and for the first time I a while I feel just the slightest bit of relief. Deride me as a pathetic lib (I totally am), but he was a very bad person in charge of thousands of nuclear weapons. I’m happy it’s ending like this.

Anyway, I’m gonna go get drunk
posted by lattiboy at 12:30 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


United States Capitol Police Arrests, Weekly Summary Reports, excerpted [R/O = Reporting Officer; Unlawful Entry is a misdemeanor charge]
"As of March 12, 2020, access to Capitol Complex buildings is limited to Members of Congress, staff, credentialed press and official business visitors (with appointments)."
Activity in the Capitol complex, Dec. 14 through Jan. 5:

12/14/2020 07:15 UNLAWFUL ENTRY - R/O was on post at the South Door of the U.S. Capitol Building when he observed an individual entering a restricted area. R/O advised the Suspect that entry was prohibited to the general public. The Suspect refused to leave and became combative. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to Headquarters for processing.

12/21/2020 09:57 UNLAWFUL ENTRY - R/O responded to the West Front of the U.S. Capitol Building where a Suspect was observed climbing the fence with marked "Area Closed" signs and walking inside the restricted perimeter adjacent to Peace Circle. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to Headquarters for processing.

12/22/2020 07:01 UNLAWFUL ENTRY - R/O responded to the West Front of the U.S. Capitol Building for a report of an individual who climbed over a fence marked with "Area Closed" signs, and was observed walking inside the restricted perimeter adjacent to Peace Circle. R/O located the Suspect in the restricted area. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to USCP Headquarters for processing.

12/24/2020 16:00 UNLAWFUL ENTRY - R/O responded to the 100 block of Independence Avenue, SW, for a report of an unauthorized individual attempting to gain access to the U.S. Botanic Garden. R/O observed the Suspect inside the loading dock area and conducted a stop. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to USCP Headquarters for processing.

12/28/2020 11:24 ASSAULT ON A POLICE/FIRE – FELONY DC CODE 22-405, ADDITIONAL CHARGES: THREATS TO DO BODILY HARM - FELONY - R/O was on post outside of the Northwest Door of the Dirksen Senate Office Building when he was approached by an individual. The Suspect spat at R/O and made threatening statements and stabbing gestures toward the Officer. The Suspect then threw a lit lighter at R/O and fled the scene. The Suspect was apprehended by responding units at the intersection of Fourth Street and Maryland Avenue, NE. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to USCP Headquarters for processing.

01/04/2021 12:45 UNLAWFUL ENTRY, ADDITIONAL CHARGE: RESISTING ARREST - R/O was on post at the Northwest Door of the Cannon House Office Building when an individual attempted to gain entry. R/O advised the Suspect that access to the building was prohibited to the general public due to the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic. The Suspect refused to leave. While attempting to handcuff the Suspect, they became limp and refused to place their hands behind their back. The Suspect was placed under arrest and transported to USCP Headquarters for processing.
posted by Iris Gambol at 12:34 AM on January 13 [13 favorites]


Don't forget they also need to swear in Kamala's replacement too before they can elect a new Senate Majority Leader
posted by mbo at 12:37 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


But it is feeling like there’s a lot of dots to connect and that maybe they’re being connected in classified settings?
posted by Brainy


The alphabet agencies may not be overly inclined to liberal views, but like the business sector they prefer order and predictability to violent incompetent chaos, which is all Trump is offering.
posted by Pouteria at 12:48 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


Also - if Trump can pardon himself can the Senate apply its conviction retroactively, say to after the Senate invasion but before the pardons were signed?
posted by mbo at 12:49 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


One thing the Boston Globe article linked further up makes clear is how close the mob came, and how Ashli Babbitt came to be shot. The video of the shooting shows the last of the Representatives being evacuated at the end of the hallway.
One of the last of roughly 50 members swept out of the House chamber, McGovern saw rioters had shattered windows in the adjacent lobby and were banging on the doors.

“It was like looking at evil,” the Worcester Democrat said.

In videos since released, McGovern is seen just moments before one of the rioters, Air Force veteran Ashli Babbitt, 35, attempts to jump in through a broken window and is fatally shot by police. McGovern said he probably heard those shots, but didn’t register them in the din of shouts from protesters and commands from officers as he escaped down a marble staircase.
posted by MattWPBS at 1:33 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]




I hope journalists dig into the transcripts that Iris Gambol reposted. Among others, at minimum, they seem to provide further evidence of reconnaissance in a larger conspiracy to overthrow the government.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 2:12 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


https://twitter.com/brianschatz/status/1348846469768351744

Brian Schatz @brianschatz·Jan 11

We were specifically instructed by those protecting us not to tell anyone, including our family, where exactly we were, for reasons that remain obvious.

Quote Tweet
Lauren Boebert @laurenboebert · Jan 6

The Speaker has been removed from the chambers.
posted by sebastienbailard at 2:57 AM on January 13 [32 favorites]


Evidenceofabsence, I concur, but I would also recommend watching the video clip of the interview. In all of the footage from the Capitol he looks very alone.

Mostofsky comes from an incredibly privileged background, and is being given the red carpet version of US Justice afforded by white privilege, the 'gold ticket of entitlement in settler-societies'. He will be getting the best possible council as regards court appearances (perhaps not in the sartorial department). Obviously, this doesn't garner sympathy from the impartial observer, never mind anyone who has experienced, or witnessed, the gross imbalance in the application of force by the police for those who are BIPOC (or BIPOC sympathetic), or perceived as anti establishment in some other way.

Judging by the media presence of the Mostofsky brothers, there seem to be a lot of toxic beliefs in that family. It is interesting to me that they would be involved in this white supremacist movement, which is explicitly anti-Jewish.

The catharsis that the arrest of these buffoons offers is delicious. What I am trying to communicate is that the buffoons are easy, media friendly, and most of all safe for the establisment, targets for righteous fury. These are flotsam pulled along by the current, not those making the waves. The sedition illustrates a few things, some noted in the thread from eyewitness Bouton, there is a problem with white supremacists permeating US society that needs to be addressed, systemic racism permeates many organisations and affords incredible privilege to white people, as is the way in settler societies. The establishment is incriminated in this and will seek to distract from this fact.

The people at the Capitol riot are likely to be some of the people who donated to the 'legal' defense/campaign fund post election, which has raised over $500m. People are far down the track to Jonestown with this, it is going to take a lot of work to reverse this trend. There are a lot of people who are emotionally, as well as financially invested in this delusion.

This is one of the reasons why I think the poo smearing should be associated with Trump supporters in the media, it gives a plausible route out for those cultists who are realising that they are 'the baddies'. They don't have to denounce their erstwhile confederates, but they can disentangle themselves from this mindset via their established conservative values. Polite society frowns on public defecation (in the Capitol, of all places), the poop chute is a safe exit route for the disenchanted Trump supporter. Once the initial inertia is overcome, the effects of pluralistic ignorance will be lessened.
posted by asok at 3:06 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


This is essentially a liberal wet dream. I fully understand why many think it was staged, but I frankly do not care and for the first time I a while I feel just the slightest bit of relief. Deride me as a pathetic lib (I totally am), but he was a very bad person in charge of thousands of nuclear weapons. I’m happy it’s ending like this.


I am not relieved. I remember thinking Sandy Hook was the beginning of the end for the gun lobby. A tragedy so awful, and clearly the result of Second Amendment absolutism, that it would have to be an inflection point.

It was, but in the worst way possible: confronted with an atrocity that confirmed what their opponents had been saying for years, with a reality that put the lie to their ideology....many chose to reject reality, to seek out sources that would call it a hoax, to double down.

We kept having mass shootings. It took massive internal corruption to put a dent in the NRA, and even that became a rallying cry when it got (justified) legal attention.

And the cry of "false flag" became part of the far-0right, and eventually just the right-wing repertoire. When reality confounds their expectations, it's merely proof of a conspiracy, a lie, a staged event to discredit them.

We are a week past an open, seditious attack visibly fomented by years of right-wing lies and denials of reality, an plenty of people -- up to and including the president, including a QAnon conspiracy contingent in Congress -- are still lying about it.

Attacks are being planned on nearly every state capitol. Additional attacks are being planned on D.C. And the "stolen election" life is still widely believed, a deeply entrenched denial of reality for literally millions.

I hope this is the beginning of the end for all of that. I hope it's not the beginning of a bad end.
posted by kewb at 3:10 AM on January 13 [61 favorites]


Boebert should be in an interrogation room, until we find out exactly what happened.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 3:28 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


To be clear, I think Mostofsky, and the rest of the Capitol invaders, should face the most severe consequences for their actions. The state has set a precedent for the treatment of non-violent protesters, so these people who where involved in violent sedition should be treated accordingly.
posted by asok at 3:40 AM on January 13


if Trump can pardon himself can the Senate apply its conviction retroactively, say to after the Senate invasion but before the pardons were signed?

I'm not sure if this is what you meant, but a pardon can't protect Trump from impeachment.
posted by ultraviolet catastrophe at 3:50 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I wish the Federal Bureau of Investigation could figure out how to present high-resolution images of seditionists, in an easy-to-view and easy-to-share manner, as well as the apps that we use to share photos of our lunches and our pets doing dumb things.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 3:54 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


ultraviolet catastrophe: I read it as "could it strike the pardons Trump has thrown up (or will still shit out) since the insurrection?".
posted by Stoneshop at 4:07 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


The Seth Abrams thread that wierdo linked to upthread is really terrifying (threadreader also posted here by TheophileEscargot) .

His point 34 really stood out to me: 34/ During a speech at a rally he'd set up with Alexander, Biggs, and Gosar—using Stone's tagline and Manafort's event-planning company—Brooks *explicitly* told the mob to go to the Capitol and "kick ass." His full speech is absolutely terrifying. It is seditious, and incitement.

Was that speech filmed or just transcribed? Is there an accessible copy out there?
posted by Mchelly at 4:15 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


As chilling as the events themselves were - armed, angry mob roaming the halls of the Capitol searching for members of congress to take hostage (presumably, but a reasonable presumption - they did kill a police officer) and pooping and peeing on everything... stirred to action by the President... The idea that some of the instigators of this attack might walk free is the real doozy.
posted by From Bklyn at 4:27 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Was that speech filmed or just transcribed? Is there an accessible copy out there?
This one?
posted by rongorongo at 4:29 AM on January 13


Mchelly:
C-Span has video of the entire rally here. Mo Brooks begins at about 37:45 and speaks for a bit over ten minutes.
posted by theory at 4:33 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


As chilling as the events themselves were - armed, angry mob roaming the halls of the Capitol searching for members of congress to take hostage (presumably, but a reasonable presumption - they did kill a police officer) and pooping and peeing on everything... stirred to action by the President... The idea that some of the instigators of this attack might walk free is the real doozy.

Details coming out are making it sound like they won't get off easy. Multiple police officers were tased, one might lose an eye, one was shot with his own gun, several officers sustained head injuries from being struck by what they think were lead pipes. The attack is now sounding much worse, more premeditated and more consequential than initially portrayed. The Republican Party came within a few yards of pulling an U.S. Iranian embassy seizure ....on their own country!
posted by srboisvert at 4:54 AM on January 13 [29 favorites]


> Boebert should be in an interrogation room, until we find out exactly what happened.

Her colleagues agree:
Rep. Eric Swalwell @RepSwalwell · Jan 11
Replying to @brianschatz and @gtconway3dg

So were we in the House. @laurenboebert was told by the Sergeant of Arms in the chamber to not make any social media posts. It was said repeatedly. She defied it because she is more closely aligned with the terrorists than the patriots.
posted by sebastienbailard at 4:56 AM on January 13 [97 favorites]


Mostofsky comes from an incredibly privileged background, and is being given the red carpet version of US Justice afforded by white privilege, the 'gold ticket of entitlement in settler-societies'. He will be getting the best possible council as regards court appearances (perhaps not in the sartorial department). [...]

Judging by the media presence of the Mostofsky brothers, there seem to be a lot of toxic beliefs in that family. It is interesting to me that they would be involved in this white supremacist movement, which is explicitly anti-Jewish.


Mostowski absolutely should be prosecuted fully for his crimes (and I don’t care if he found his police vest and shield in a pile with a sign that says “take me!” - the second he put them on, his motives don’t matter - that’s an additional crime) But at the same time, as yet he wasn’t implicated in any of the violence, and he wasn’t implicated (as yet) in the planning. He stands out largely because of his ridiculous fur suit and the prominence of this photo in the early hours of the rampage. I think we really need to be careful about framing his story as more deserving of punishment or censure based on his family being well-connected Jews with high media presence. I know that’s not what you meant in your comment - I’m not calling you out - but I think it’s something we should be aware of.

Many Orthodox Jews are pro-Trump because his policies about Israel align with their own, and they share the right’s Islamophobia. I talk with Trumpist Jews all the time (there are some in my husband’s family) and I keep coming back to how they can possibly align themselves with white supremacists. They persist in believing that it’s just a few wackos who won’t do anything (I’m hoping the events of the 6th change some minds about this). But most of them believe that the left-wing anti-semitism they see is worse and more dangerous. A lot of Jewish-owned businesses were destroyed during the BLM protests, especially in California - in a couple of instances on blocks where other shops were left untouched. Synagogues were defaced. It got a lot of press at the time in Jewish publications, which were already heavily pro-Trump. This is not the time (and absolutely not the place) to go into criticizing Democratic leadership, but pretending that anti-semitism is only on the right is not true.

I often feel alone here, as a liberal Orthodox Jew, and I’d like to encourage people to be careful about inadvertently othering my community or singling them out for special attention. Fundamentalism loves authoritarianism across the board, and aligns perfectly with current GOP goals.
posted by Mchelly at 4:59 AM on January 13 [75 favorites]


There was nothing in it for Pence to invoke the 25th. He would be president for a few days, but he would be in mortal danger for years. I think his chat with Trump was in the style of the mob. Better to have someone else take responsibility.

It's hard to look at all the little hints coming up and not know anything. This is so much like 9-11, if you remember those first hours and days. Including seeing the whole thing play out on live TV, and still not know what the heck is going on. One thing we have learnt from that is, that even if we learnt what happened, that never stopped the conspiracy theories on both sides. Of course this time round we won't get the US waging wars against countries with no relation to the attack, but I can think of a lot of other terrible things that can happen globally (which I am not posting because no reason for speculative doomsaying). And of course within the US, this will have huge consequences, regardless of what is discovered and how it is dealt with. Consequences we can't know yet, but which are certainly on the scale of 9-11, or even the civil war.
posted by mumimor at 5:00 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president if he likes to literally run everything and everybody?

He already had the job where he got to run everything and everybody.
posted by atrazine at 5:01 AM on January 13 [20 favorites]


Juan Cole: The armed Accelerationists are Coming.
These groups are what social scientists call “accelerationists.” They believe that through direct action and spectacles of violence they can increase the speed of polarization in society.
Accelerationism was the tool that al-Qaeda in Mesopotamia and then ISIL used to take over 40 percent of Iraq. They have also had some success in pushing France to the far right and in damaging French traditions of civil liberties and tolerance.
There are about 940 distinct hate groups in the US, according to the Southern Poverty Law Center which has gathered information on 25,000 militiamen.
posted by adamvasco at 5:04 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]


Boebert should be in an interrogation room, until we find out exactly what happened.

Just imagine her surprise when she finds the real qanon was the seditions we made along the way.
posted by gusottertrout at 5:04 AM on January 13 [20 favorites]


Mo Brooks would like you to know that any attempt to link him to the failed insurrection is "vicious and scurrilous." Mo Brooks would like you to know that literally the worst thing he has ever done is "misjudge a traffic light." Mo Brooks doesn't know it, but Mo Brooks would further like you to know that he's not necessarily the best at writing - mendacious self-pity, yes, writing, not so much.
posted by deeker at 5:05 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


All the photos on the FBI website were taken by other rioters and the media who posted them online. I assume that there are security cameras throughout the building? maybe just the usual b/w low res kind but footage that would place people in specific corridors outside difficult-to-find offices?
posted by TWinbrook8 at 5:09 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I know it was posted earlier in this thread, and I'm honestly not trying to make the mega thread more mega, but I still can't get over this one thing:

The panic buttons were ripped out. When? By whom? That's such a damning detail of premeditation and planning that went into this attack. I'm thinking at minimum it was ripped out the night before. Staff would have noticed workers on the day of. And were the maintenance workers in on this plan? Or was it orders from someone corrupt in the management chain?

Also can't get over this part from Pressley in the article:
“Every panic button in my office had been torn out — the whole unit,” she said, though they could come up with no rationale as to why. She had used them before and hadn’t switched offices since then.
What happened when she used them before? I was a little surprised and disturbed that there was a "before". Is this something every congressperson & staff has to deal with at some point? Or was she targeted in her office before?
posted by Teegeeack AV Club Secretary at 5:21 AM on January 13 [52 favorites]


De Blasio on Morning Joe saying the City of New York, on the advice of their lawyers, is severing all contracts with the Trump Organization for their connection with "inciting an insurrection." Also, I missed it until this morning, but the NYT reported a couple of days ago that Deutsche bank, Trump's "lender of last resort," is ditching him as well.

Not sure if this is a sign that no capable lawyer will now be associated with Trump, or the big, scary thing is making the rounds in the legal community.
posted by nicoffeine at 5:34 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


I read it as "could it strike the pardons Trump has thrown up (or will still shit out) since the insurrection?".

That makes more sense, and I suspect the answer is no, unfortunately.
posted by ultraviolet catastrophe at 5:35 AM on January 13


He already had the job where he got to run everything and everybody.

And for longer (Senate R leader since 2007, after four years of senate R whip), with less unrelated duties than a president would.
posted by Stoneshop at 5:45 AM on January 13


To be clear, I think Mostofsky, and the rest of the Capitol invaders, should face the most severe consequences for their actions. The state has set a precedent for the treatment of non-violent protesters, so these people who where involved in violent sedition should be treated accordingly.

I agree in part but worry about the state turning around and producing legislation that will be used exclusively against the left and POC with 1,000 times more ferocity.

Some thread here or Twitter or elsewhere pointed out there are enough existing laws to charge what happened. Leaning on those laws, as you point out, makes sense. Just feel strongly we must be extremely wary of Democrats “looking strong” and enacting legislation that twists the knife into the far left and minority communities even further, as law enforcement who would be enforcing those laws is proven again and again to be extremely sympathetic to the Proud Boys and nazis.
posted by glaucon at 5:45 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


Calls for Lauren Boebert's Expulsion Go National, Westword, Michael Roberts, 1/11/2021 [brackets added]:
Only a few days into her term as U.S. Representative for Colorado's 3rd Congressional District [WP], Lauren Boebert [WP] is already being inundated with calls for her to resign the position or risk being expelled by her new colleagues for allegedly helping to incite the violence that took place in Washington, D.C., on January 6. And these efforts are getting national attention, with CNN putting a report [CNN Politics] about the controversial firebrand [The Independent] in heavy rotation over this past weekend.

For her part, Boebert has made it clear that she doesn't plan to go anywhere despite the furor created by Coloradans who voted against her and those who wish they could have.

Boebert's election was an indication that while Colorado may be a largely blue state at this point, it's hardly monochromatic. While the 3rd CD is not as conservative as it once was, it remains a GOP stronghold loaded with longtime residents who see Boebert — a fervent Second Amendment advocate [NRA] from Rifle [WP] who co-owns Shooter's Grill [Yelp], a restaurant at which the waitstaff packs heat — as a bold and charismatic figure....
More in the article. It’s the wild, Wild West, pardner.
posted by cenoxo at 5:48 AM on January 13 [19 favorites]


Charismatics Are At War With Each Other Over Failed Prophecies Of Trump Victory
“I’ve been called the servant of Satan and spawn of Baal because I caved and am not standing with the prophets,” Brown said. “I’ve been called Deep State and that I’m a Mossad agent.”

Certainly, the bulk of Pentecostal-charismatics who follow the prophets are in for a shock when Biden gets inaugurated Jan. 20. Rather than admit their error, Brown says some prophets have already concocted a scenario where Trump will be inaugurated “in heaven” and that God will replace Biden with Trump sometime this spring.
posted by clawsoon at 5:50 AM on January 13 [19 favorites]


Imagine believing Trump is aligned with heaven. White supremacy is a hell of a drug.
posted by supercrayon at 5:58 AM on January 13 [49 favorites]


A lot of Jewish-owned businesses were destroyed during the BLM protests, especially in California - in a couple of instances on blocks where other shops were left untouched. Synagogues were defaced. It got a lot of press at the time in Jewish publications, which were already heavily pro-Trump. This is not the time (and absolutely not the place) to go into criticizing Democratic leadership, but pretending that anti-semitism is only on the right is not true.

As a Jew myself, I have to push back here: I have yet to see any follow-up on the destruction of Jewish-owned businesses that was committed as an act of antisemitism instead of being destroyed alongside gentile-owned ones, at least not outside of the usual racist rags that think that BLM is being run by Louis Farrakhan. Now, this is an entire other FPP's worth of conversation, but Jewish leftists and liberals have been talking about the rise of white supremacy and nationalism in the community (and especially among the Orthodox) for years now. Up until basically the day of the coup, white nationalist Jews been had been involved a months-long harassment campaign against Jews of Color, LGBTQ+ Jews, patrilineal Jews, and Jewish converts, among other vulnerable Jewish groups. Many of us have been aghast that prominent Jewish publications have not only completely ignored this happening, but have repeatedly platformed many of these same bigots during the same time period, often times in the name of "balanced" reporting or opinion. Less than four months ago, several Jewish organizations, including large mainstream civil rights organizations like the American Jewish Committee and the Anti-Defamation League angrily lashed out at Jewish Democrats for making comparisons to 1933 Germany, an act that looks almost comically ignorant given the last week's events. The problem goes all the way up to the Conference of Presidents (an umbrella organization for most of the national and local Jewish orgs), who let an avowed white nationalist parroting the Poway Synagogue shooter's manifesto have say over the seating of their new leader. Not only is this organization (and ones like it) still attacking the Jewish left with language right out of Nazi playbooks, they are apparently under no threat of being expelled.

There is absolutely a need to confront antisemitism on the right, but that has already been going on for decades. It's beyond time for my community to start looking inwards and asking itself why white nationalism is ignored or embraced by Jewish community organizations, and begin the process of denying them access to the ears, eyes, and resources of the larger Jewish American population.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 5:59 AM on January 13 [70 favorites]


Interesting news from Minneapolis: noted white-supremacist/Trumper police union president Bob Kroll, after ignoring years of criticism and months of intense pressure to step down, has suddenly announced he's retiring at the end of January, two months before the trial of George Floyd's murderer.

Oh, and the city is also investigating two as-yet unidentified employees who were at the rally.

Really makes a person think, it does.
posted by Orange Dinosaur Slide at 6:03 AM on January 13 [25 favorites]


I am not arguing with you about any of this, and I suspect you miss my point. Right-wing anti-semitism is ubiquitous, it’s poisonous, and a lot of right-wing Jews are willing to ignore it in order to fight what they see as wider anti-semitism on the left. My point is that it’s on both sides, and if you think there aren’t liberal Jews who use anti-Semitic canards to attack Jews on the right, you’re mistaken. I’d love to see our community address that as well.

My point is that it exists on both sides of the political spectrum, it always has and it always will, and that there are religious Jews (in all Jewish denominations) on both sides as well.
posted by Mchelly at 6:07 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


There was nothing in it for Pence to invoke the 25th. He would be president for a few days, but he would be in mortal danger for years. I think his chat with Trump was in the style of the mob. Better to have someone else take responsibility.

I'm probably being simplistic, but I don't understand why Trump doesn't cut a deal with Pence where he resigns and then immediately gets pardoned. That pardon would stand up in court, unlike the self-pardon which might or might not. Pence is toast with the pro-Trump segment of the voters no matter what he does at this point; I'm not sure there is much difference in any of these outcomes in terms of his political future.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:07 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


"Good morning! Here's how Trump's SECOND impeachment trial SHOULD go today:

• U.S. House convenes at 9AM
• 1-hr of debate on rule setting debate time
• Vote on rule
• Another procedural vote
• 2-hrs of debate on impeachment resolution
• Vote on impeachment"

-- Democracy Docket
posted by valkane at 6:11 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


Trump has never honored an agreement in his life. Why would he think Pence would? For that matter why would Pence honor the deal?
posted by rdr at 6:12 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


These fuckers are the same ones that cheered on suspension of civil liberties with the Patriot Act, warrantless surveillance, etc.

They aren't pro-freedom, they're white supremacists.


Remember the concept that conservatives want society to be an in-group whom the laws protect but do not bind and an out-group whom the laws bind but do not protect. They'll pass the most Draconian laws, knowing -- or at least believing -- that they'll be exempt.

As such, they are not to be trusted with other people's lives, property, or freedom.
posted by Gelatin at 6:12 AM on January 13 [33 favorites]


My point is that it’s on both sides, and if you think there aren’t liberal Jews who use anti-Semitic canards to attack Jews on the right, you’re mistaken. I’d love to see our community address that as well.

My point is that it exists on both sides of the political spectrum, it always has and it always will, and that there are religious Jews (in all Jewish denominations) on both sides as well.


It's mind-boggling that, in the wake of an attempted coup by people wearing Auschwitz memorabalia, you are really trying to both-sides the conversation here. Right now, in this moment, the argument about fighting violent antisemitism and the physical threat to Jewish Americans should be and must be dominated with the discussion of the right. This is not a 50-50 or even a 75-25 moment here, this is a 99-1 moment on which our very survival may depend.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 6:15 AM on January 13 [37 favorites]


I think the chatter around Bob Kroll is that he's retiring early because that Parler hack is going to be very very bad for him, but that he was not in D.C. on 6 January. Regardless, that detestable man is not retiring early to "spend more time with his family". Something is afoot.
posted by mcstayinskool at 6:15 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Trump doesn't trust Pence. He knows the presidency is the only thing keeping him from being indicted. Once he resigns, he's vulnerable. I know Trump's got only 7 days left, but Trump's the sort of person who will cling to those 7 days like a life preserver.

I think that's a mistake of Trump. I don't know what Pence would do, but this is Trump's best (or least bad) option right now. Rolling the dice is better for him than just waiting for certain doom. It's times like these that I'm very glad Trump is a coward. Things are bad but they'd be so much worse if he had any courage.
posted by Teegeeack AV Club Secretary at 6:16 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


I'm probably being simplistic, but I don't understand why Trump doesn't cut a deal with Pence where he resigns and then immediately gets pardoned.
That is about Trump, not Pence. Trump doesn't want to resign and get pardoned by Pence, because he cannot admit failure. I'm not thinking about this as a psychological thing, though it might be, but as part of the Trump narrative. Trump is the Great White Victim as well as the Great White Saviour. Right now he and his ilk are constructing a modern American "Dolkstosslegende", where the Democrats along with establishment Republicans sold out the American Dream to Jewish cosmopolitans and Latin immigrants.
These guys are following the Nazi playbook very closely. And Pence is just a pawn in this game, they will have no scruples killing him. He knows that now.

I don't think Trump will be able to run for presidency in 2024, but the movement he is leading will, and how this attempted coup is handled now will have a great impact on their chances for success.
posted by mumimor at 6:19 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


A comment from the Charismatics at War... article:
Jeremiah 23: 25-30

“I have heard what the prophets say who prophesy lies in my name. They say, ‘I had a dream! I had a dream!’ 26 How long will this continue in the hearts of these lying prophets, who prophesy the delusions of their own minds? 27 They think the dreams they tell one another will make my people forget my name, just as their ancestors forgot my name through Baal worship. 28 Let the prophet who has a dream recount the dream, but let the one who has my word speak it faithfully. For what has straw to do with grain?” declares the Lord. 29 “Is not my word like fire,” declares the Lord, “and like a hammer that breaks a rock in pieces?

30 “Therefore,” declares the Lord, “I am against the prophets who steal from one another words supposedly from me. 31 Yes,” declares the Lord, “I am against the prophets who wag their own tongues and yet declare, ‘The Lord declares.’ 32 Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams,” declares the Lord. “They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least,” declares the Lord.
posted by cenoxo at 6:19 AM on January 13 [11 favorites]


I hope this is the beginning of the end for all of that. I hope it's not the beginning of a bad end.

I am sorry to say I think it's the beginning of a bad end (or really, a fully developed terminal case of the late-stage white supremacist colonialist-imperialist capitalism we constantly talk about, but evidently we didn't really believe ourselves?) and I think I've finally figured out why the reactions of almost everyone other than the Nazis, even here on MeFi, have seemed bizarrely divergent from reality to me in a “mime pretending to be stuck in a box” way. (←previous megathread link)

So the United States really actually was founded as a slave empire carved into land stolen from Indigenous people, by people like Thomas Jefferson who owned his own children as slaves despite some peripheral non-redeeming nerd qualities: specifically, an integral part of the United States was stable white supremacy in which white people enforcing the racial hierarchy was consistently rewarded, right up to almost the present—it was in 1966 that the last state Democratic party removed the phrase “white supremacy” from its logo.

Whites just barely beginning to wake from moral slumber in the 1960s realized the incongruousness of a “land of the free, home of the brave” former slave empire where Black people and other people of color could not vote. But, in the same way that post-Civil-War Reconstruction failed by giving Black American citizens and other PoC some things while not even remotely attempting anything like East and West Germany's post-WWII de-Nazification measures (which were far from adequate anyways) the oft-hyped changes of the 1960s were wholly inadequate and white Americans failed, collectively, to confront their own continued complicity and participation in white supremacy, despite achievements like the Civil Rights Acts and other things (it warms my shriveled heart in a despairing FML way, as a Gen Xer, to be root-cause-analysis blaming Baby Boomers here, but I would have done no better in their shoes: this is just what happened.) Also, I have to imagine that on some level it translates into, while intellectually recognizing some of the incongruousness, being simultaneously unwilling to actually give up most of the privileges delivered to them by white supremacy.

We became a bit like Pinocchio after only the slightest whiff of Tinkerbell's (racist fascist Disney, anyways) pixie dust: able to stand up and walk around and start working the torpor out of our creaky joints, but never a real boy, because we never prove our humanity to the Blue Fairy by actually acting like humans. Then the twenty-first century is some kind of mixed metaphor about playing with the fire of Nazism while being made of the wood of white supremacy, and/or shooting off our giant mile-long nose/dick/nuclear button while playing with improperly secured firearms on the way to Pleasure Island that were supposed to be for well-regulating militias anyways. And in the latter scenario Democrats and donkey ears fit in somehow.

The result overall tl;dr: we no longer had stable white supremacy, we just had white supremacy. All kinds of racist things still happened at all levels of society, BIPoC were still horrifyingly oppressed (and LGBTQIA+ and others, and intersectionality, our cup overfloweth), but some of the reward mechanisms for whites who supported all of that happening were broken.

I haven't thought it through yet, but I'll bet that upon closer look it's going to specifically be white supremacy reward mechanisms for lower class whites which were broken, while most things for the middle and upper classes of that era remained intact: hence the “working class voter” of the 2010s, implicitly white, and unlike their forebears no longer particularly lower class because of the rising tide of socialist reforms of the (yes still white supremacist) previous century's New Deal.

Despite their reprehensible values and cowardice and general incompetence and inability to deal with most facts (and what, I must say as an atheist, seems like an obsession with buying their immortal souls an express ticket to Hell on the part of Christofascists: helping the bunch who abetted Jamal Khashoggi being chopped up—on the explicit rationale that, sure, he was chopped up, but he was chopped up on the altar of Mammon—rush through American death row executions, because of their sterling Biblical authority and judgment on when governments should kill their citizens) this is the aspect of reality which Trump and the other Nazis are more in touch with than everyone else. They believe lots of bullshit, but that does not mean they do not themselves have bullshit detectors: they can see that a great deal of ostensible respect for BIPoC is superficial or entirely fake, because they themselves spend lots of time faking it (even more poorly), and their concomitant complaint is that they aren't being properly compensated any more for properly supporting the racial hierarchy. On this count, all the other white people of 2021 are out-doublethinking the Orwellians.

Consider this: remove all of the Nazi and twenty-first century context for a moment: the Trumpists are simply trying to steal everything for themselves. But this is hardly a new idea, one group stealing everything else for itself: conventional American historigraphy is to characterize much of our political system's history as repeated spoils and plunder. And it's kind of the American Way: stealing Indigenous land, stealing Black peoples' bodies, going through Monroe Doctrine^ “protected from European colonialism” Latin America and persuading everyone to shoot each other while we steal their guano and gold and oil and now Elon Musk steals their lithium, rounding up all American citizens of East Asian descent into concentration camps and stealing their homes and businesses and possessions while they can't fight back, and so on, and so forth...

What's the difference between that and 2021? In the past, the cosa nostra^ was that white American groups didn't steal all the stuff from other white American groups: the conventions of white supremacy ensured some measure of Magna Carta enforced sharing of wealth and fairness in dealings between those of the privileged class, with the English barony being replaced by the totality of those who qualified as white at any given point in time. These latest of the monsters the American system has created recognize that the previous privileged social contract to which they were a party is dead and gone, and they are expected to make due with the same crumbs and trickle-downs of late-stage capitalism everyone else gets, so they want it all now.

Hence the “mime in an invisible box” effect I'm personally experiencing watching other people react to the insurrection is that to me, the coup d'état finally happening after years of anticipation during which I'd almost immediately started reading up on things like the Insurrection Act (←brief comment in January 2017 megathread which probably isn't worth clicking on) should have been freeing and should have dramatically increased our range of possible responses to Nazism and white supremacist things like police killings of unarmed Black citizens, because it's basically the formal end to a bunch of American social contracts which, for the rest of us to participate in and hold up our end of the bargain, involved implicitly endorsing and abetting white supremacy. But everyone is acting like they're still bound by those white supremacist social contracts the Putschisten formally ended, but which were already long gone.

The reason why Trump and the GOP are blatantly lying to everyone's faces using immediately disprovable facile lies, obviously not even trying or intending to decieve any more but sort of putting placeholder or filler content into zombie processes^, and openly breaking laws, is because our obeisance to the social contracts no longer obligates them to reciprocate: the social contracts do not exist any more.

I think perhaps people of color figured all of this out back in 2016 on some level (though I don't want to promote any equivalent to “digital nativism” of Millenials—it's not like, merely by being BIPoC, someone is going to necessarily have a sophisticated current-events-understanding grasp of all facets of American racism and white supremacy) and (on top of other aspects of racism here at MeFi) maybe that's why I haven't been seeing many user names from peak #poctakeover #drowningoutwhitevoices days in among the megathreads and megathread favorites. (Though a few of you I have seen commenting and favoriting, and your presence and opinions and news links have been reassuring.)

Speaking of which, the phrase “liberal wet dream” is used above: to try to add some optimism to the “bad end” talk, the significance of what I say above is that I believe the end of the social contracts our white supremacist civilization was based upon really does present the potential to achieve great things if we carpe diem. Because of their sole connection to reality being having a better sense of what's going on with white supremacy, Trumpists are a sort of dowsing rod—their most terrifying pathological fears point to things that are actually good for the country.

Particularly, AOC becoming president or something like that; not because AOC has answers necessarily, but because AOC and Democrats like her have a better sense of what they don't know. And not to be ageist, but the leadership, while often being excellent politicians and superb at what they do, are basically maladapted to the current crisis: as top-shelf products of a machine designed to turn out finely-honed meritocratic late-twentieth-century politicians, they are so deeply embedded in and of the ancien régime that they can't see anything else.
posted by XMLicious at 6:21 AM on January 13 [101 favorites]


Trump doesn't want to resign and get pardoned by Pence, because he cannot admit failure.

I've been getting the impression that Trump's instinct is not to ask, "Does this harm my long-term interest", but rather, "Does this make me look weak?"
posted by clawsoon at 6:23 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Speaking of premeditation.. (Twitter video link)
posted by wierdo at 6:25 AM on January 13 [35 favorites]


Terrifying.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 6:32 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


"NEW: President Trump won't even be able to run a children's carousel anymore.

As backlash against Trump Org grows, NYC says it's terminating Trump's contracts to run a carousel, two ice rinks and a golf course in city parks." -- David Fahrenthold, Washington Post
posted by valkane at 6:32 AM on January 13 [13 favorites]


I don't think Trump will be able to run for presidency in 2024, but the movement he is leading will, and how this attempted coup is handled now will have a great impact on their chances for success.

It's this point that gives me chills. Ever since the Oklahoma City bombing (yeah, that long ago) there's been this pulse of white nationalist/supremacist/neo-nazi in the background that has, in the last four years, grown louder and louder. Somewhere in the last few days I read an opinion that what we were seeing was the result of economic insecurity and while I don't think that's the whole enchilada by a long shot - it's a point that only does everyone good to take a long hard look at. And by long hard look I mean a living minimum wage / health care / tighter inheritance laws. Poverty is an enormous stressor and under stress people make all kinds of bad decisions.
posted by From Bklyn at 6:36 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


I've been meaning to post this but :::waves arms around neighborhood:::

This is an excerpt from the House chaplain's opening prayer on January 6:
O God, our refuge and our strength, a very present help in times of discord and trouble. Mountains crumble, waters rage, nations roar, and yet we need not be afraid, for even now You abide with us in these times of great discord, uncertainty, and unrest.

We, who have pledged to defend our Constitution against all enemies, we pray Your hedge of protection around this Nation. Defend us from
those adversaries, both foreign and domestic, outside these walls and perhaps within these Chambers
, who sow seeds of acrimony to divide
colleagues and conspire to undermine trust in Your divine authority over all things. [...]
posted by jgirl at 6:38 AM on January 13 [26 favorites]


Ugh. I was listening to the NPR coverage of the hearing, and I had to turn it off at only the second speaker, some republican yammering on about "unity" and "moving on" and whatnot and castigating the Dems for rushing the impeachment without knowing all the facts. I just can't.
posted by Thorzdad at 6:40 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


This is just the debate on passing the rule. The actual impeachment vote won't be until around 3pm at the earliest, they'll have a 2-hour bloviating session debate before that.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 6:46 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Trump business backlash part of ‘cancel culture,’ son says

The story is exactly what you'd expect it to be ('cancel culture,' whining, everybody actually loves Trump), save for:

1) the son is Eric, not Don Jr.
2) the last paragraph:
Asked directly in his interview if he felt his father incited the crowd, Eric Trump paused and then the line went dead.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 6:47 AM on January 13 [46 favorites]


What happened when she used them before? I was a little surprised and disturbed that there was a "before".

From a USA Today interview with Pressley and Groh on Jan. 3:
“The reality is that these death threats, violent phone calls, the need for private security hires, coordination with Capitol Police and the FBI, this has become part of our daily negotiation of how to serve the people who sent us to Washington,” said Sarah Groh, Pressley’s chief of staff.

Groh said she used to print out mugshots sent by Capitol Police and post them on the office walls so that the team could memorize their faces. Now, she said, there are so many that she needs a binder to hold them.
posted by adamg at 6:55 AM on January 13 [19 favorites]


Eric Trump paused

His whole life is a great pause of goofy, out-of-place forced grins in the shadow of a monster
posted by glaucon at 6:55 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Edit to my above comment: not John Kasich, I think Steve Stivers. IDRK they're all aging white guys with side parts from where I'm standing
posted by erattacorrige at 6:57 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Speaking of which, the phrase “liberal wet dream” is used above: to try to add some optimism to the “bad end” talk, the significance of what I say above is that I believe the end of the social contracts our white supremacist civilization was based upon really does present the potential to achieve great things if we carpe diem.

I've flagged this whole comment as fantastic -- the idea of a stable white supremacy giving way to an unstable white supremacy, and that this takes the form of white supremacist rewards being removed from the bottom of the white hierarchy first is, I think, just...so fucking explanatory -- but I wanted to offer some more words of optimism.

Optimism isn't my usual bag, really -- my experience of the last four years has been as one of those people who keeps being like, "NO THERE IS A FUCKING NAZI VAMPIRE IN THE HOUSE," and everyone is like, oh stop being so hysterical, Klausferatu doesn't mean it-- but I do have this sense that an age of bullshit is coming to an end. I don't think this has anything to do with any one person, though some people will be the right person for the moment and will manifest this cultural change (thinking of John Fetterman, and to a lesser extent, entirely because of misogyny, AOC). I think it has to do with a cultural cycle where we are at first overrun by new modes of communication and then, slowly, develop an immune response to that new mode of communication. In this case, it's the internet, and in particular social media.

The historical Nazis used radio to rise to power; that they did this in the context of the Weimar devastation was probably helpful. I have been dreading what will happen as climate catastrophe accelerates, because holy shit, if this is what rich people, white people, and men are willing to do to to hold onto their power when things are comfortable for them, what the fuck are they going to do when things get scary? I mean, we know what they will do; it'll be tanks in the streets and fascist authoritarianism and social control. It'll be the same, but different, as it always is.

But if we develop an immune system to the newest iteration of bullshit before shit hits the fan, if we are able to organize using the same tools as the nazis and beat them back down to ash before the worst hits...

Well, we're not going to be "ok." The best case scenario still involves figuring out how to deal with a rapidly contracting inhabitable Earth and mass human migration and many, many disasters, and this might come after we have to fight a low-level civil war. But it might not be nazis figuring out how to deal with all that. And that would be a massive fucking improvement over what I've feared will happen the last four years.
posted by schadenfrau at 6:57 AM on January 13 [35 favorites]


'cancel culture'

He says that like it is a bad thing. But some aspects of culture should be cancelled.

Nazis, for example.
posted by Pouteria at 6:59 AM on January 13 [42 favorites]


Florida's Rep. Val Demings is in a quiet rage when asked if House members collaborated with the terrorists.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:00 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


cancel culture...

Trump isn't being cancelled. He is an asset which is being declared unprofitable by the system which put him in power, and is being sold off. This is the free market at work.
posted by JohnFromGR at 7:04 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


'cancel culture'

He says that like it is a bad thing. But some aspects of culture should be cancelled.

Nazis, for example.


I was thinking along the same lines. These guys love their Roman history and the nonsensical analogies they derive from it, so they should be all in for "Carthago (Trump) Delenda Est".
posted by Chitownfats at 7:05 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Speaking of premeditation..

I can't believe some fool filmed this.

I mean Stringer Bell's only been quoted once in these posts since last week but ... words fail me
posted by glasseyes at 7:10 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]




Is there anywhere liveblogging the proceedings today?
posted by BuddhaInABucket at 7:16 AM on January 13


NYT live blog
posted by gwint at 7:18 AM on January 13


The “FloorCast” on live.house.gov isn’t always up and running, but it at least documents what’s on the floor. There’s also a link to video.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:19 AM on January 13


Asked directly in his interview if he felt his father incited the crowd, Eric Trump paused and then the line went dead.

I'm genuinely curious what the various style guides / house practices have to say about when and where to include details like this because this seems unusually candid. I would have expected that question to have either been omitted entirely in deference to the interviewee or the sentence rephrased to something more neutral about technical difficulties.

I ask because we almost never see things like "Trump hesitated when asked which specific doctors had praised his coronavirus response and went on to ignore the question entirely and repeat the same unsubstantiated claims" in print.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 7:23 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


I was thinking along the same lines. These guys love their Roman history and the nonsensical analogies they derive from it, so they should be all in for "Carthago (Trump) Delenda Est".

Or go Athenian. A lot to be said for scratching "Trump" onto a shard of pottery.
posted by atrazine at 7:27 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


I ask because we almost never see things like "Trump hesitated when asked which specific doctors had praised his coronavirus response and went on to ignore the question entirely and repeat the same unsubstantiated claims" in print.

If we'd seen reporting like this, Trump wouldn't have become president.
posted by sebastienbailard at 7:30 AM on January 13 [22 favorites]


Better they carve the name into pottery than into an endangered manatee.
posted by peppermind at 7:31 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


Learning from the Failure of Reconstruction is an interview with Reconstruction historian Eric Foner.

Q: "There’s been a lot of talk about a kind of reconciliation and unity, especially from Republicans, in the past few days. And there’s been a lot of talk about punishment for this bad behavior, both for the people that did it and for President Trump. What does Reconstruction teach us about that?"

A: "I think the lesson of Reconstruction, sadly, is that it requires a lot of vigor, I suppose, to actually enforce a kind of a new regime. Reconstruction in our modern terminology was an attempt at regime change. Remember how we used to talk about regime change in Iraq and that kind of thing? Changing a regime based on slavery to one based on racial equality, that was a pretty big job to do. And it required force. President Grant was elected in 1868 with the slogan, “Let us have peace.” He wanted reconciliation. Three years later, he’s sending troops into South Carolina to crush the Ku Klux Klan. You can’t have peace when the other side is out there acting as a terrorist body, assassinating people if they try to vote and things like that. So the tragedy of Reconstruction is that the commitment to enforce it waned much too soon.

It was a national problem, not just a Southern one. And eventually, with the acquiescence of the North, with the acquiescence of the Supreme Court, you get the overthrow of this ideal of equality and the imposition of a new system of white supremacy. It’s not the same as slavery, it’s different, but it’s still a deeply unequal system in the South that then lasts well into the middle of the twentieth century. So, yeah, reconciliation is a wonderful idea, but it takes two to tango. And if Southern whites were irreconcilable, that made it very difficult."
posted by Groundhog Week at 7:34 AM on January 13 [52 favorites]


I'm pretty sure "carve the name into pottery in Athens" is a reference to voting for ostracism (exile for ten years). But yeah, that manatee thing is pretty awful, on top of the general early 2021 plague-coup shit sandwich.
posted by Alterscape at 7:34 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


The parade of cowardice by the GOP on the house floor this morning is unbelievable. They have appealed for the rule of law, quoted MLK arguing for unity, and brought up case law from the 19th Century arguing about process.

Rep. Tom Cole just closed with an appeal "not to rush to judgement."

The party of law and order, unable to muster the courage to stand up to an attempted coup. What a fucking disgrace to our country.
posted by nicoffeine at 7:34 AM on January 13 [35 favorites]


These guys love their Roman history and the nonsensical analogies they derive from it, so they should be all in for "Carthago (Trump) Delenda Est".
posted by Chitownfats


Not to mention Julius Caesar's fate.
posted by Pouteria at 7:35 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I can't believe some fool filmed this.

From their POV, this was going to be the equivalent of footage of the captures of Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden. They probably expected it to end up in the Smithsonian.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 7:36 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


Maybe the person filming was a mole with a concealed camera ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ? But then plenty of them are waving cameras about
posted by glasseyes at 7:39 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


They probably expected it to end up in the Smithsonian.

Which it may, just not for the reasons they were thinking.
posted by ZenMasterThis at 7:39 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Evidenceofabsence, I concur, but I would also recommend watching the video clip of the interview.
I had already watched the video. In general, I think it's kind of inappropriate to assess whether someone is vulnerable or has the capacity for violence from their speech patterns. I know your intent is to be considerate and compassionate, but to me, the speculation verges on armchair diagnosis and feels inherently kind of ableist.

I think we really need to be careful about framing his story as more deserving of punishment or censure based on his family being well-connected Jews with high media presence.
This is a good point and I think it's important to be careful in discussing this, since it's dangerous to play into anti-semetic tropes. My comments about Mostofsky's father weren't intended to suggest that he is any more deserving of punishment, just not any less either. He's one person among many and should only be held responsible to the extent of his engagement. That will hopefully become clear at trial, and, I think, shouldn't be inferred from mannerisms or appearance.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 7:40 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


"Once you block a vote on a Democratic Supreme Court Justice and then rush a vote on your own Supreme Court Justice, you don't get to talk about fairness and process.

And once you try to overturn a lawful election, you don't get to lecture anyone about unity and civility." -- Keith Boykin, CNN
posted by valkane at 7:41 AM on January 13 [90 favorites]


This is a photo that Member of Congress Lauren Boebert posted on her Instagram page on Jan 5. This is the group she then took on a guided tour of the Capitol after this photo was taken. These people participated in the insurrection the following day. At least one has been charged.
Several congressional Democrats claim the January 6 Capitol insurrection was aided by 'insiders'.
2 Capitol Police officers suspended and at least 10 more under investigation for alleged roles in riot.
posted by adamvasco at 7:41 AM on January 13 [87 favorites]


I ask because we almost never see things like "Trump hesitated when asked which specific doctors had praised his coronavirus response and went on to ignore the question entirely and repeat the same unsubstantiated claims" in print.

If we'd seen reporting like this, Trump wouldn't have become president.


This is a point I made earlier: Trump, and his supporters, are allowed to get away with this. He's allowed to cite "people" or "doctors" who support his view, but he never says who, or invites them on stage with him. There are "rumors" of voter fraud in Georgia, but no evidence to suggest it goes beyond that.

Trump is never pressed on this. When his supporters are pressed, they become indigent: "everyone knows this," or they expect the person challenging the claim to go off and try to find who the original source is. Or, "the mainstream media doesn't want you to see it!"

Personally, I'm no longer tolerating this. Someone makes such a claim to me, I'm calling BS, and saying it's their responsibility to cite their source.
posted by MrGuilt at 7:42 AM on January 13 [15 favorites]


This is a photo that Member of Congress Lauren Boebert posted on her Instagram page on Jan 5. This is the group she then took on a guided tour of the Capitol after this photo was taken. These people participated in the insurrection the following day. At least one has been charged.

Every single one of the ones identified as participants is throwing up the "OK" white power signal.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 7:44 AM on January 13 [32 favorites]


"Lauren Boebert has been locked out of Twitter for 1 week." -- Parlertakes
posted by valkane at 7:44 AM on January 13 [34 favorites]


Better they carve the name into pottery than into an endangered manatee.

Huh?

Federal officials seek information on manatee harassment
The United States Fish and Wildlife Service is searching for information on the person or persons responsible for the harassment of a manatee discovered Sunday in the headwaters of the Homosassa River. The animal had the word “Trump” scraped into its back.

*nervous laughter* what the fuck
posted by adept256 at 7:46 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


Anyone know what exactly they are voting on now? (Text reads: "On ordering the previous question")
posted by piyushnz at 7:47 AM on January 13


The Internet is forever, Lauren.
posted by all about eevee at 7:47 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


They are voting on the rules of debate.
posted by all about eevee at 7:48 AM on January 13


One of the weirder sidebars on this past week is Pizza Inn's Twitter account.

On January 5, their PR department issued a press release (since retracted) and posted it to their Twitter account (archived). Using a bunch of hash tags including, for some difficult-to-ignore reason #January6 the tweetstorm begins: "Pizza Inn Takes Bold Stand For Election Reform Widespread concerns over fraud demand commonsense changes to rebuild unity and confidence."

And then across two dozen tweets proceeds to dig themselves a very, very deep hole before concluding with two final messages consisting only of atting Trump, the congresspeople opposing the election certification, plus a few extra namedrops for good measure such as @anncoulter, @tuckercarlson, and a sprinkling of hashtags like #electionfraud and, again, since for some reason since this went out on January 5, #january6.

Oh well, their pizza was okay, in that "this is bad pizza but it adequately fulfills my need for pizza" way. But now I'll have to do my part to ensure they never see money again.
posted by at by at 7:50 AM on January 13 [13 favorites]


Pizza Parler?
posted by ZenMasterThis at 7:52 AM on January 13 [53 favorites]


Incidentally, the intrepid journalists bringing this Pizza Inn expose to the masses is the McElroy Brothers on this week's MBMBAM podcast.
posted by at by at 7:52 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


The animal had the word “Trump” scraped into its back.

I read the manatee story. While it's illegal to harass manatee in any way, if it makes anyone feel better the word was just scraped into the algae that are always covering the manatee, not like carved into its flesh.
posted by jessamyn at 7:56 AM on January 13 [156 favorites]


ABC 7 News - WJLA (@ABC7News)

JUST IN: @Airbnb announces it will cancel reservations in the Washington, D.C. metro area during the Inauguration week, and will prevent any new reservations in the Washington, D.C. area from being booked during that time.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 7:57 AM on January 13 [46 favorites]


The “previous question” is a motion to end debate and proceed to a vote. In this case, proceed to a vote on H.Res. 41, which is the rule defining how they will consider H.Res. 24, which is the impeachment resolution.

Just about every bill or resolution that goes to the floor of the House is preceded by a “rule” (a resolution from the Rules Committee) that defines how long the debate will be, and any amendments that may be offered. This is a “closed rule”, meaning there aren’t any amendments coming up.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 7:58 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Thank you, Jessamyn, that actually does make me feel better. At least about that.
posted by probably not that Karen Blair at 7:58 AM on January 13 [45 favorites]


Somewhere in the last few days I read an opinion that what we were seeing was the result of economic insecurity and while I don't think that's the whole enchilada by a long shot - it's a point that only does everyone good to take a long hard look at.

"Economic insecurity" has become a joke at this point. I mean, if you think that no one has been paying attention to the "economic insecurity" of Trump supporters, you've missed a lot. It's been offered up as an excuse/explanation for Trumpism since the beginning of the campaign. It's been the theme of countless cowardly stories about Trump supporters - stories that were too afraid to tackle their racism.

And it doesn't really work because Trumpism is the result of white racial resentment*, not economic insecurity. Support for Trump is high among white people across economic lines, especially white men*. The mob that attacked the capitol was not working class. Some flew there on a private jet. These people are not hurting and lashing out at the wrong people. They're just racial bullies who are angry that the people they're bullying aren't giving up their lunch money without a fight.

Inequality is a huge issue in the US, but Trump's base is primarily white people, not primarily poor people. Trump campaigned mostly on racism. He made (and broke) promises to the working class too, but many of those promises were also couched in racist terms (e.g. fighting trade globalists and giving jobs to "real" Americans).

* I want to mention gender resentment too, especially backlash against feminism and toxic masculinity. I do think that's important when you figure in why support among white men is higher, but I don't want to excuse or ignore the women who support Trump. So it goes down here.
posted by Kutsuwamushi at 7:58 AM on January 13 [43 favorites]


Hold-up on that Boebert photo tweet!

"This viral photo is from a Colorado gun rights rally in December 2019, not from last week in Washington. (The tweeter deleted it after I messaged him; he said he’d been sent the inaccurate info by a Boebert constituent.)" -- Daniel Dale
posted by valkane at 8:01 AM on January 13 [25 favorites]


the word was just scraped into the algae
Clearly a false flag operation by Manatifa.
posted by neroli at 8:01 AM on January 13 [63 favorites]


This is a photo that Member of Congress Lauren Boebert posted on her Instagram page on Jan 5.

This was taken in 2019 (the original Tweet has been deleted).
posted by joethefob at 8:03 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


If our reps have time, I would love to see a vote on H.Res. 25, which forbids Republicans from ever mentioning MLK's name, ever again, in any context.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 8:03 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


From Georgia: The Jolt: Election deniers in state Senate stripped of chairmanships
The Republican rift in the state Senate came to a head Tuesday when Lt. Gov. Geoff Duncan demoted three Republican senators who have backed attempts to overturn the presidential vote in Georgia over baseless allegations of irregularities.

When the bloodletting was over, state Sens. Brandon Beach of Alpharetta, Matt Brass of Newnan and Burt Jones of Jackson were sapped of their political influence on the second day of the winter session.

As our AJC colleague Maya T. Prabhu reports, Duncan stripped Beach of his chairmanship of the Transportation Committee, while Jones will no longer lead the Insurance and Labor Committee. Neither will serve as even a rank-and-file member on the two panels they once led.

And though state Sen. Matt Brass of Newnan will still be a committee chairman this term, he was shelved to a lesser posting. Instead of serving as chairman of the committee that is set to redraw the political map later this year, he’ll oversee a banking committee.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 8:05 AM on January 13 [31 favorites]


Rep. Ilhan Omar: ‘We as a nation can no longer look away. The president not only incited an insurrection against our government, but has in word and deed led a rebellion. We cannot simply move past this or turn the page.’
posted by bluesky43 at 8:05 AM on January 13 [73 favorites]


We should address economic insecurity for the sake of addressing economic insecurity, not because of this.

Also, some of those people you're seeing on videos showed up on private jets, which we know because they bragged about it. There are business owners, lawyers, and other professionals in those crowds. Their engagement is often obscured by discussions about economic insecurity, but they are a huge part of this story.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 8:07 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


> JUST IN: @Airbnb announces it will cancel reservations in the Washington, D.C. metro area during the Inauguration week, and will prevent any new reservations in the Washington, D.C. area from being booked during that time.

What about freedom of sleep!?
posted by guiseroom at 8:07 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


I can't believe some fool filmed this

What's giving me the most clarity as we hear the Republicans whining about "healing" and "unity", and as we wring our hands over which of those murderous insurrectionists was too "vulnerable" to be held responsible, is the fact that these people expected everyone they hate to be dead or rounded up by now. They thought The Storm they'd been fantasizing about was starting. They did not expect to have to cope with us as equals again after January 6th. They don't know what happens next, because they were expecting to be celebrating all the lynchings by now. They did not expect laws they were breaking to exist by now. Keeping this in mind is helping me keep things in perspective.
posted by EatTheWeak at 8:08 AM on January 13 [96 favorites]


I've been avoiding clicking through to that manatee story this whole time because animal abuse is something I find viscerally upsetting, so I am also very relieved to hear that the word was just scraped into the algae on the surface of the manatee.
posted by confluency at 8:08 AM on January 13 [37 favorites]


Being a sociopath or an extreme narcissist *is* a mental disability. It is exactly what you might call "crazy" or "mentally debilitated" though it might be impolite to say "crazy". Being a narcissist screws up a person's thinking, same as any other mental illness, and that is precisely why the 25th was always appropriate, even though it was never invoked, and it will continue to be appropriate until Trump is no longer president.

Flagged as fantastic.
posted by Gelatin at 8:09 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


I said to my wife over the weekend that the more I read and learned, the more it felt like what happened on the 6th came closer to being a successful coup than we wanted to believe. So far this week, I feel like that’s only becoming more clear.

There can be no unity moving forward withoutPpl a full accounting of what happened, who was involved, and justice and accountability for those involved. I don’t know how you get there, given how hyper partisan everything is right now on the Republican side.
posted by nubs at 8:11 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


They did not expect to have to cope with us as equals again after January 6th.

Perfectly put. I think this was indeed the prevailing mindset of much of this treacherous mob.
posted by SoberHighland at 8:14 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Trump remains largely invisible after Kushner squashes attempts at building fringe social media presence -- CNN

"On the day he will be impeached for a history-making second time, President Donald Trump lacks a comprehensive legal strategy, has nothing on his public schedule and is without his preferred social media methods of responding -- in part because his son-in-law put a stop to efforts establishing his presence on fringe platforms after he was banned from Twitter.

It amounts to near-invisibility for the President at the most perilous moment of his presidency, which is ending in tumult and dramatic rebuke from members of his own party.

Aides expect Trump to mostly watch the proceedings on television throughout the day. But without Twitter, a campaign rally, a team of lawyers or Republicans willing to defend his actions, Trump is set to weather the historic shaming in subdued fashion."
posted by valkane at 8:14 AM on January 13 [11 favorites]


I said to my wife over the weekend that the more I read and learned, the more it felt like what happened on the 6th came closer to being a successful coup than we wanted to believe. So far this week, I feel like that’s only becoming more clear.

I don’t know about that. A successful ATTACK, sure. But an actually successful coup would require MILLIONS of people to just give up and go along with it.
posted by showbiz_liz at 8:15 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]


the word was just scraped into the algae

As always, quality investigative journalism by Algae Zeera
posted by oulipian at 8:15 AM on January 13 [89 favorites]




But an actually successful coup would require MILLIONS of people to just give up and go along with it.

Sadly, I think there's little doubt that millions would indeed.
posted by Ahmad Khani at 8:19 AM on January 13 [11 favorites]


I don't have the time/money to actually to this, but if I did, I would form a PAC called "Clowns for Trump." The point would be to organize rainbow themed miming clowns to attend every GOP function -- no talking, no slogans, no signs other than riffs on trump slogans (also rainbow themed). Just the honking of their noses and pretending to cry every time someone starts to yell.

I want the attachment of Trump to the GOP to be permanent until they officially expel him from the party.
posted by nicoffeine at 8:19 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


Re: Pizza Inn, I have a very faint connection. Back in the late 1970's and early 1980's my father was the manager for a Pizza Inn, and I still remember him talking about how the owners were missing the boat by refusing to do delivery.

He quit after his store was robbed and corporate was angry that their dinner buffet revenue for that day was down.

So apparently Pizza Inn has always been owned by jerks who make poor business decisions and the tweets are nothing new or out of character.
posted by sotonohito at 8:23 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


don’t know about that. A successful ATTACK, sure. But an actually successful coup would require MILLIONS of people to just give up and go along with it.

Fair enough; maybe coup is the wrong word. But the world would be a very different place today if those gallows had been used, and I think it came very close.
posted by nubs at 8:24 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Acting Washington, DC, US Attorney Michael Sherwin details how new federal task forces will go after the Capitol attackers for a range of crimes -- some of which Sherwin says the American people don't even know about yet.
(SL Youtube). If this is a double feel free to flag it.
posted by bluesky43 at 8:26 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


I want the attachment of Trump to the GOP to be permanent until they officially expel him from the party.

Until they stop espousing the same things as him in different language too. Basically until the GOP can do the equivalent of intentionally rebuking and giving up the votes of their most racist supporters like the passage of the Civil Rights Act did for the Dems, they're the party of Trump, long after Trump's gone.
posted by jason_steakums at 8:29 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]




The animal had the word “Trump” scraped into its back.

Oh the hewn manatee!

(Sorry. And I'm relieved to read further down that it was only in its surface algae. Still rather off, though.)
posted by Major Clanger at 8:31 AM on January 13 [49 favorites]


I don't think it's telling at all. It's simply a debate on the rules; the actual debate on impeachment will come later.
As usual, this first vote will be along party lines as it is a procedural vote. Even Rs in favor of impeachment will almost certainly vote 'Nay' in this first round.
posted by Ahmad Khani at 8:32 AM on January 13


@b_fung (CNN tech reporter):
Google bans all political advertising until "at least" Jan. 21, designating the Capitol riots, the impeachment, and inauguration as a "sensitive event" under its policies.

Google told advertisers in a letter obtained by CNN that it won't allow ads about "candidates, the election, its outcome, the upcoming presidential inauguration, the ongoing presidential impeachment process, violence at the US Capitol, or future planned protests on these topics."

The ban applies to multiple platforms, including YouTube, according to the letter.
posted by gwint at 8:37 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


They’re voting on the rule now. “15-minute” (minimum) votes already took way longer than 15 actual minutes, but the House has implemented proxy voting on the floor for COVID reasons. So these votes take even longer than normal. The guy on C-SPAN estimated about 45-50 minutes.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 8:37 AM on January 13


Judd Legum's Popular Information email list is covering some of the same stuff that Seth Abramson is tweeting about, including the director of the Republican Attorneys General Association's sudden resignation yesterday.
posted by box at 8:39 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


And it doesn't really work because Trumpism is the result of white racial resentment*

Yes. And no. As mentioned a few comments later - this should be addressed not just because of this... but to circle around... I could well have lost sight of the forest for the trees. That said, if people understand that (were it the case) and how "big G Gov." is taking care of them, less anger and less lashing out. It's not a perfect formulation, I know that, ...

no, fuckit. You're right. Racists gonna racist.
posted by From Bklyn at 8:39 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Why do I have a feeling that Ivanka is going to come out with a new perfume called "Insurrection."
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 8:40 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


All the photos on the FBI website were taken by other rioters and the media who posted them online. I assume that there are security cameras throughout the building? maybe just the usual b/w low res kind but footage that would place people in specific corridors outside difficult-to-find offices?

A few possibilities as to why those images aren't being distributed
  • As is so often the case with police equipment the cameras or recording equipment were mysteriously off or malfunctioning or the data was erased
  • The FBI is hiding the capabilities and/or location of internal security recording equipment
  • The crowd photos, being up close and at head level rather than far away and overhead are just better
posted by Mitheral at 8:41 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


For a deeper dive on the intersecting issues of gender, race and economic insecurity that Kutsuwamushi noted above, and how they play into Trumpism, Thomas Edsall has a very good (and characteristically in-depth) column today: "White Riot: How racism, grievance, resentment and the fear of diminished status came together to fuel violence and mayhem on Jan. 6."
posted by PhineasGage at 8:43 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Just out of curiosity, why hasn't Mitch run for president

does Mitch look like someone anyone would want to have a beer with?
posted by philip-random at 8:44 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Just an aside, but I wonder what geo-tags in the Parler leak data have to say about who was in the Capitol building on the 5th.
posted by Catblack at 8:46 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


does Mitch look like someone anyone would want to have a beer with?

He looks like someone you could lay eggs on a beach with.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 8:47 AM on January 13 [88 favorites]


JUST IN: @Airbnb announces it will cancel reservations in the Washington, D.C. metro area during the Inauguration week, and will prevent any new reservations in the Washington, D.C. area from being booked during that time.

All of a sudden Airbnb have a problem with people shitting all over other people's property?
posted by Cardinal Fang at 8:48 AM on January 13 [34 favorites]


Apologogies for posting something not factually correct.
However what the picture does show is that Boebert is quite happy to associate with and presumably therefore push the views of White Nationalists.
Like the man who bought a shotgun, an assault rifle, a crossbow, a stun gun, and Molotov cocktails to the Capitol. the Molotov cocktails were made of gasoline and melted Styrofoam, a combination designed to ensure they stuck to their targets as they burned.
Sorry America your country is crazed (you know that).
To put this into context:
I don't feel sorry for congress at all. Oh, I'm sorry, did you have to hide under your desk because of guns? Wah wah wah. I've only had to do that six times since kindergarten. School is terrifying. Maybe now they'll pass gun reform." - one of my 9th grade students, today.
Meanwhile; The Pro-Trump Riot Renews Concerns About Extremism in the Military which has a hate group problem.
posted by adamvasco at 8:48 AM on January 13 [18 favorites]


Apologogies for posting something not factually correct.

That's one of the worst apologies I've ever seen...
posted by Cardinal Fang at 8:50 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]


Jake Sherman: "NEW .. the right moves on ⁦@RepLizCheney. Just got my hands on this petition which is calling for a special conference to oust the no 3 Republican for supporting impeachment."
posted by cashman at 8:50 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


The host on CSPAN notes that military troops haven't been bivouacked in the Capitol building since the US Civil War.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 8:52 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


> the right moves on ⁦@RepLizCheney. Just got my hands on this petition which is calling for a special conference to oust the no 3 Republican for supporting impeachment.

Unity! Don't rush to judgement! There's not enough time for this process!

Is hypocrisy the only value left in the GOP?
posted by nicoffeine at 8:54 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


Klete Keller, a swimmer and two-time Olympic gold medal winner for the United States, was recognized by former teammates and coaches as one of the participants in the deadly pro-Trumb mob that overtook the Capitol last week

this thread is moving at lightspeed, but I can't believe we're not pausing to speculate on Mr. Keller's middle initial.
posted by martin q blank at 8:56 AM on January 13 [44 favorites]


"The guy behind Home Depot dumps Trump (side note: he already pocketed his super-rich folks tax cut so surely it's much easier to be outraged now...) but this does signal Trump's isolation will be profound after January 20th." -- Joy Reid
posted by valkane at 8:57 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Is hypocrisy the only value left in the GOP?

Yes, yes it is.
posted by deadaluspark at 8:57 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


I can't believe we're not pausing to speculate on Mr. Keller's middle initial.

It’s D! He’s a Democrat! Antifa was there!!! /s
posted by glaucon at 8:59 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Would it be possible to tone down the jokes and sarcasm in this particular discussion? I know that they're coping mechanisms and we all desperately need as much help coping with these events as we can get but it makes it difficult to follow the incredibly serious information that is being uncovered and analyzed on what appears to be a pivotal historical series of events that are still unfolding. Thanks!
posted by ElKevbo at 9:04 AM on January 13 [54 favorites]


Assuming the impeachment resolution is passed today, what's the timetable for the next steps? Last I heard, McConnell said they wouldn't even have them presented to the Senate until the 20th at the earliest (due to their current calendar), but I also saw references to a variety of procedural options to accelerate that. Is there some guide to the variety of scenarios?
posted by MrGuilt at 9:07 AM on January 13




I assume that there are security cameras throughout the building?

MSNBC, at least, was showing quality live video from the rotunda during the attack. One commentator joked that it was the Franklin (or whomever) cam. That is, from a particular statue's POV. At some point they lost the feed.
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 9:09 AM on January 13


Andy Biggs (AZ) drafted the petition and, naturally, Jim Jordan is first out the gate in support...
posted by deeker at 9:10 AM on January 13


If you want to joke or vent, please head over to the fuckity fuck fuck fuck this shit thread.
posted by tiny frying pan at 9:12 AM on January 13 [20 favorites]


The events of the past week have been destructive in a million different ways, but one of them is that the chaos has overshadowed all of the advocacy and planning aimed at implementing policy changes and fixing things from day one. For instance, a group of public defenders is presenting a plan for immigration justice right now, but many if not most of the people who would be listening have their attention elsewhere. We are very effectively being held hostage and prevented from getting to the staggering amount of work that needs to be done.
posted by evidenceofabsence at 9:17 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


Kate Bennett (@KateBennett_DC)

Massive barricade and fencing went up overnight at the @VP residence. The entire perimeter of the Naval Observatory is now behind the barricades. I am from here, never seen this before in my life.

-

Disney won't make political donations to lawmakers who voted to object to Electoral College certification. . . . for one whole non-election year (only 2021).

In the 2020 cycle, Disney donated $1000 to Rick Scott and $2000 to Josh Hawley's Leadership PAC. (Ref. 1, 2. Emphasis mine.)

-

Chris Stanton Georgia, a bank manager (confusingly from Georgia as well as named Georgia) who had been charged in the Capitol insurrection thing, has killed himself in his home. He had been charged with misdemeanor unlawful entry of public property, and had given a plea of not guilty. (Ref.)
posted by Spathe Cadet at 9:17 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


Hey mefites, I'm going to need that impeach cobbler recipe you were all talking about in the Georgia threads.
posted by adept256 at 9:19 AM on January 13 [20 favorites]


If You Don't Like These Principles, McConnell Has Others
McConnell's move will, however, probably persuade wealthy donors who are wary of the GOP after last week's riot that the party has nothing whatsoever to do with those awful MAGA types. It will also persuade the mainstream media that Republicans aren't the Trump party, even though they were until just a week ago.

So Democrats will do the heavy lifting, a few Republicans in the House and Senate will join them, Trump won't be convicted, but the GOP will get brownie points for distancing itself from Trump even as the majority of its members continue to back him, tacitly or overtly. I guess that's what McConnell wants.
I do hope this analysis is wrong, but I am not counting any votes until they're recorded.
posted by tonycpsu at 9:20 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]


Chris Stanton Georgia, a bank manager (confusingly from Georgia as well as named Georgia) who had been charged in the Capitol insurrection thing, has killed himself in his home. He had been charged with misdemeanor unlawful entry of public property, and had given a plea of not guilty. (Ref.)

This is blood on Trump's hands. He deluded the vulnerable into thinking they were soldiers on the side of the righteous, and they aren't able to handle it when their entire world crashes down. I expect there will be more like this.
posted by schoolgirl report at 9:24 AM on January 13 [24 favorites]


naturally, Jim Jordan is first out the gate in support

Jordan was given valuable time this morning by his party, which he used to again to allege election fraud, instead of dealing with the issue of last week's terrorist attack and why Trump is being impeached. His most recent act of treachery again reminds me that the GOP will never act in good faith, by putting up these people to speak for their party, but it is even more shocking to witness when America faces such a serious, existential crisis.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 9:26 AM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Earlier in thread in was asked about the Parler GPS data and the insurrection. Gizmodo has a piece about this that’s worth reading. The Parler hack was seriously brilliant.
posted by misterpatrick at 9:28 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


I expect there will be more like this.

Regarding this man's suicide, sure, this happens when a cult collapses. God help them.

He was lied to by people he should have been able to trust. Fucking liars.
posted by adept256 at 9:29 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Follow-up on the AirBnB news above:

Kaelyn Forde (@kaelynforde)

#AirBnB announced in a statement Wednesday it had also removed the accounts of "individuals who are either associated with known hate groups or otherwise involved in the criminal activity at the Capitol Building, and they have been banned from Airbnb’s platform."
posted by Spathe Cadet at 9:30 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


schoolgirl report: "This is blood on Trump's hands. He deluded the vulnerable into thinking they were soldiers on the side of the righteous, and they aren't able to handle it when their entire world crashes down. I expect there will be more like this."

The double quote at the end of that article is the most succint summary of white panic at losing status and privilege I think I've ever seen:

A neighbor told The Sun, “He was a loving father. I never heard him speak badly to anyone about anyone. Always had a smile and loved cutting his own grass.”

His ex-mother-in-law told the publication, “He wasn’t political at all then that I remember but that was not a political time, times have changed.”


For pretty much everyone else in the US, 'that was not a political time' has never been true.
posted by Happy Dave at 9:32 AM on January 13 [42 favorites]


The Parler hack was seriously brilliant.

The Hacker Who Archived Parler Explains How She Did It (and What Comes Next)
The hacker, donk_enby, explained that she only scraped what was publicly available: "I hope that it can be used to hold people accountable and to prevent more death."

Ironically, I hope we never find out who donk_enby is, for their own sake. We owe them a lot for a job well done.
posted by adept256 at 9:33 AM on January 13 [53 favorites]


I just wanted to note something about Seth Abramson, who was referred to way above several times thanks to a theory he has about the Capitol riots. He may be right. Still, people who take shortcuts or are sloppy make me uncomfortable.

Below I have highlighted the shortcut Abramson took in his long thread. Notice how he went from, essentially, "we don't know if that creepy dude was actually invited to the White House" to "dude was totally invited" in two sentences across the end of one tweet and the beginning of another.

That alone makes me suspicious of relying too heavily on anything he says. IMHO, we all need to be careful about trusting the sources of any seemingly important information, including this guy, unless we know they are good at their jobs/information gathering/whatevs. Because even the experienced folks screw up.

19/ On December 12, the leader of the Proud Boys went to the White House, saying in advance of his trip (on social media) he had been "invited" there. Team Trump claimed that he had merely been on a Christmas tour of the White House. The truth of the matter still remains unknown.

20/ 7 days after the Proud Boy leader visited the White House by invitation, a Trump rally scheduled by a pro-Trump dark money group was moved to January 6. Within minutes, Trump was promoting it, saying that it'd be "wild." It had Proud Boy ally Stone's "tagline" attached to it.

posted by Bella Donna at 9:33 AM on January 13 [40 favorites]


[Just letting people know there's a separate thread about the Parler hack.]
posted by LobsterMitten (staff) at 9:36 AM on January 13 [13 favorites]


A process/protocol question if anyone knows the answer: In today's debate both Steny Hoyer and Nancy Pelosi were yielded "one minute" to speak but spoke more than that, clearly with the approval of the entire House. Is that a way of giving the leaders extra time to speak while the clock is stopped, or what?
posted by mono blanco at 9:39 AM on January 13


Every single one of the ones identified as participants is throwing up the "OK" white power signal.

I know this is a nitpick -- and ultimately a distinction without a difference -- but the "III%-er" symbol, which predates the use of the "OK" white power symbol is the one they're throwing here. The distinction generally is the III%-er symbol is palm facing inward, and the "OK" symbol is typically palm facing outward. It's a fine distinction, especially since the III%-ers are part and parcel of the white supremacist movement, but probably worth noting. This is per JJ McNab on twitter (whose opinion on such things I generally trust).
posted by tclark at 9:40 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


They don’t ever cut off the Majority Leader, the Minority Leader, or the Speaker.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 9:43 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


“The House impeachment process seeks to legitimize a snap impeachment totally void of due process,” [Lindsey] Graham said in a statement Wednesday. “No hearings. No witnesses. It is a rushed process that, over time, will become a threat to future presidents. As to Senate leadership, I fear they are making the problem worse, not better.” He added: “The last thing the country needs is an impeachment trial of a president who is leaving office in one week.”

[snip]

Graham, meanwhile, cited the potential for even more violence as among the reasons why lawmakers should hold off on impeaching the president. “Supporting the impeachment of President Trump under these circumstances will do great damage to the institutions of government and could invite further violence at a time the President is calling for calm,” he said. “If there was a time for America’s political leaders to bend a knee and ask for God’s counsel and guidance, it is now.”

Graham also took aim at fellow Republicans who have thrown their support behind impeachment, arguing that they “are doing great damage not only to the country, the future of the presidency, but also to the party.”


YOU are a witness, Senator Graham, you addled centipede. You literally witnessed an insurrection that put your personal safety in grave danger.

The President is not calling for calm. God is not in charge of guiding the political leadership of this country. And WTF damage can impeachment do to the government that is worse than tolerating an armed mob attacking the Capitol? Goddamn, I know Lindsey Graham is the undisputed champion of talking out both sides of his mouth, but this cowardice is beyond the pale even for him.
posted by desuetude at 9:44 AM on January 13 [42 favorites]


Can't watch Jim Jordan speak because is honestly driving my blood pressure to unhealthy levels. If anyone can stomach it and he actually says something significant (although who are we kidding) please recap here.

Here is my plea to all the Democrats: please keep it simple. Repetition is important, and even though you all have the same general talking point, parsing it in different ways makes it harder for the message to be 100% crystal clear. No unnecessary tangents. Stick within the timeline that is presented: "The president voluntarily held an event and assembled a large crowd the same day the election was to be certified. He whipped that crowd into a frenzy and they became a violent mob. That mob stormed the Capitol while screaming 'Hang Mike Pence' and threatened the entire Congress. They murdered a police officer. They MURDERED a police officer."

Stick to the most salient, simplest points. Because every idiot in this country is going to both sides this the minute someone says something "slightly" different and oh my god what if this is just partisan and oh no? Stick to simplicity, repeat, repeat, repeat. Let's beat them at their own game with clear, vindictive soundbites.
posted by andruwjones26 at 9:44 AM on January 13 [31 favorites]


Oh man, why did it have to be Gymnasium Jordan? I had enough of him the last time we did this.
posted by Gray Duck at 9:44 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


While DC barricades itself after a coup attempt that breached the Capitol building, Jim Jordan is on the floor of that same building talking about the Wright Brothers and the dangers of "cancel culture".
posted by nicoffeine at 9:46 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


"This is blood on Trump's hands. He deluded the vulnerable into thinking they were soldiers on the side of the righteous, and they aren't able to handle it when their entire world crashes down. I expect there will be more like this."

Kool-Aid may have been involved.
posted by JackFlash at 9:47 AM on January 13


Wow, real touch of class with that mask of yours, McClintock. Death cult.
posted by wordless reply at 9:50 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


If cancel culture worked, Jim Jordan, aider and abettor of the sexual abuse of OSU athletes, would not hold a position in government.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 9:51 AM on January 13 [71 favorites]


Can't watch Jim Jordan speak because is honestly driving my blood pressure to unhealthy levels. If anyone can stomach it and he actually says something significant (although who are we kidding) please recap here.

I turned it off right at the beginning when he said something about how there was going to be a "peaceful transition" between administrations. That ship has sailed, dude. The transition has officially not been peaceful.
posted by damayanti at 9:51 AM on January 13 [34 favorites]


Lindsay Graham and Jim Jordan and all the rest sure use a lot of nonsense words to pretend not to say "we wish that the coup succeeded and we believe that we're the rightful rulers of America and the world at large."
posted by jason_steakums at 9:52 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


I just wanted to note something about Seth Abramson, who was referred to way above several times thanks to a theory he has about the Capitol riots. He may be right. Still, people who take shortcuts or are sloppy make me uncomfortable.

Below I have highlighted the shortcut Abramson took in his long thread. Notice how he went from, essentially, "we don't know if that creepy dude was actually invited to the White House" to "dude was totally invited" in two sentences across the end of one tweet and the beginning of another.


I read Seth Abramson's 'Proof of Collusion,' and he uses these kinds of shortcuts with... let's call it noticeable regularity. He's good about sourcing, but he has a tendency to draw solid lines where I'd probably use a dotted.

After compare-and-contrasting it with a few other Trump/Russia books, I declined to read Abramson's follow-ups, 'Proof of Conspiracy' and 'Proof of Corruption.' I still follow him on Twitter, though.

(If you must read a Trump/Russia book, I suggest either Craig Unger's 'House of Trump, House of Putin' or Isikoff/Corn's 'Russian Roulette.' Harding's 'Collusion' was overtaken by current events, 'The Apprentice' and 'Trump/Russia: A Definitive History' not as well-written, and, if in 2021, you feel like you must read a Trump /Russia book, 'Dirty Rubles' is too short.)
posted by box at 9:52 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


Jesus, Trump sat for 6 hours watching a house burn down and did nothing even as multiple people entreated him to do so. If that is not evidence of either culpability or malice I don't know what is.
posted by benzenedream at 9:53 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


“Every panic button in my office had been torn out — the whole unit,” she said, though they could come up with no rationale as to why. She had used them before and hadn’t switched offices since then.

Regarding the missing panic buttons, my experience with these devices in a professional corporate capacity (mostly conducting monthly checks and responding when they are activated) suggests a few thoughts to consider.

These panic buttons would certainly send a signal to a central law enforcement location, probably monitored by a dispatch staff. There are probably many other sensor inputs connected to this network, including glass-break sensors, door alarms, fire alarms, etc.

If these panic buttons function like the ones I have interacted with, then their removal would almost certainly show a "device offline" status in the security system, including date and time of the offline status.

If these panic buttons were offline for legitimate reasons, such as a furniture/office move or a device failure, then there would be a service case record, combined with a notification to the central office of the offline device.

In the absence of additional facts about this particular detail, I hope that more information is forthcoming, to more clearly depict what may have happened there. It's also possible that this may not get any more pubic discussion, since it would get into some pretty specific details about security infrastructure.
posted by JDC8 at 9:54 AM on January 13 [69 favorites]


"Surreal split-screen right now:

1. Rep. Jim Jordan blaming liberals for the end of free expression in America, because tech companies are removing social media accounts

2. Republican lawmakers saying they’re afraid of being killed if they vote their conscience to impeach" -- Derek Thompson, The Atlantic
posted by valkane at 9:57 AM on January 13 [34 favorites]


It's easy to resolve - Republican lawmakers are afraid of being killed by the free expression of Jim Jordan and Trump's ideas
posted by benzenedream at 10:01 AM on January 13 [15 favorites]


Someone in McConnell's office just leaked that he won't reconvene the Senate on Friday. If so, no trial until the inauguration.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 10:02 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Dems seem to be keeping it simple: There was insurrection. It was conducted by a mob. The mob was led by Trump. He violated his oath to the Constitution. He is a danger to the public and the country and needs to be impeached.

We may well need more impeachment trials, when this is all over, but this is a good start.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 10:02 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


“This is where we’ve come. The Legislative Branch has to thank the military for protecting it from The Executive Branch. Cromwell, anyone?” Reed Galen

Includes a photo of the NG getting thanked by Pelosi. Also liked this thread by Igor Bobic. Has more photos of the Guard in the Capitol Visitor Center.
posted by Teegeeack AV Club Secretary at 10:03 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


CNN:

DC Police Chief Robert Contee said on Wednesday that more than 20,000 National Guard members could be expected in the District for President-elect Joe Biden's inauguration, though he noted the final numbers will be provided by the United States Secret Service.

Multiple defense officials tell CNN that the total request for National Guard is close to 30,000 guardsmen to support US Capitol Police, Park Police and Washington Metropolitan Police Department but officials believe that the actual number needed is closer to 20,000.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 10:04 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Rep. Lesko from Arizona arguing that it's wrong to rush something through the house at the eleventh hour purely for political reasons. Amy Coney Barrett, anyone?
posted by essexjan at 10:06 AM on January 13 [24 favorites]


Mo Brooks would like you to know that any attempt to link him to the failed insurrection is "vicious and scurrilous."

This isn't his first rodeo. Remember back in October 2019, Brooks and Jordan and two dozen other House Republicans in a mob stormed the confidential hearing in a Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility (SCIF) where Republican and Democratic congressional members had been taking testimony from Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense Laura Cooper.

Brooks gave an incendiary speech before joining the non-committee Republicans forcing their way into the hearing in which he demanded, "By golly, if they are going to do it, do it in public. Don’t hide it from the American people" as the conservatives rammed into the top secret SCIF with prohibited cell phones taking selfies.

One committee member said, "It was the closest thing I've seen around here to mass civil unrest as a member of Congress."

The closest thing? Well things just got a hell of a lot closer. They keep moving the window for irresponsible behavior with no consequences and here we are.

Speech of incitement followed by angry mob attack. I think I see a pattern here.
posted by JackFlash at 10:07 AM on January 13 [54 favorites]


Someone in McConnell's office just leaked that he won't reconvene the Senate on Friday. If so, no trial until the inauguration.

McConnell is a coward (we knew this) who is trying to have it both ways. He can claim to hold Trump accountable by having the trial and even finding him guilty (but with what consequences), but he doesn't have to actively do it (he'll be minority leader by then). It also allows Trump supporters to say this is a "Biden Witch Hunt of the prior administration." They even can open the door to retroactive impeachment of Biden, just 'cause.
posted by MrGuilt at 10:11 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


> Rep. Lesko from Arizona arguing that it's wrong to rush something through the house at the eleventh hour purely for political reasons. Amy Coney Barrett, anyone?

Of course it's for political reasons. That's how...having a government...works. Do any of these Republicans remember what words mean?
posted by desuetude at 10:12 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


> Rep. Lesko from Arizona arguing that it's wrong to rush something through the house at the eleventh hour purely for political reasons. Amy Coney Barrett, anyone?

"If it wasn't for bad faith, I wouldn't have no faith at all."
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:14 AM on January 13 [23 favorites]


I am very interested in McConnell's attempts to salvage the GOP from the wreckage. I'm just pushing back on selective leaks that might be part of that effort. Hi, Ms. Haberman!

Whenever Maggie starts to anthropomorphize Republicans, you know they're up to no good. They're like the toys in Toy Story.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 10:17 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


WaPo has been killin' it with the subtle sarcasm. From their post on Jim Jordan's comments:

"You can’t have a debate in this country,” he added as he opened Wednesday’s floor debate. He bemoaned “the cancel culture that only allows one side to talk."
posted by desuetude at 10:17 AM on January 13 [41 favorites]


woah, Jamie Raskin is a rising star!
posted by mumimor at 10:19 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Matt Gaetz is Trevor from "The Good Place", full-stop.
posted by riverlife at 10:23 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


My suspicion is that McConnell will not only stall the Senate trial until Biden's term begins, he'll make sure it goes slow so Biden can't accomplish anything for the first six to ten weeks.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:27 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


McConnell won't be Majority Leader shortly.
posted by PhineasGage at 10:27 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


McConnell is a coward (we knew this) who is trying to have it both ways. He can claim to hold Trump accountable by having the trial and even finding him guilty (but with what consequences), but he doesn't have to actively do it (he'll be minority leader by then).

Yeah, I can't believe I remotely got my hopes up that he was going to hold a trial before Jan 20. He was never going to do anything bold, at least not before the new boss gets in town.

The only hope I have for the timing of him saying it now, while the debate is underway and well before the voting, is perhaps this allows Rs in more purple districts to vote for impeachment. They can retroactively justify it like "I had to vote my conscience, but was assured there would not be a trial this week" or some other BS. At the end of the day, McConnell et al will never hand the Democrats anything close to a win. They'll both-sides this to death and continue to hold the football like Lucy setting up the kick, and treat us like Charley Brown the minute they can get away with it (and enough donors have been convinced). These people will never change.
posted by andruwjones26 at 10:27 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


I am very impressed by Raskin.
posted by all about eevee at 10:28 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I think Raskin has been named Lead Impeachment Manager.
posted by all about eevee at 10:31 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


McConnell's actions should be interpreted through the lens of what he wants to do -- punish Trump and scrape off the people who said the quiet part out loud with their signs and their fists. He wants the money and respectability back, and he will cooperate with the Democrats just as far and no farther.

The next few weeks will be full of unrest, I'm afraid, because either some powerful people will get arrested, enraging the mob, or they will not get arrested, allowing the infection to set in and destroy the country in as soon as two years.
posted by Countess Elena at 10:32 AM on January 13 [9 favorites]


I am not okay with all of these passive-voice references to "the loss" of officers in the insurrection who "died." For fuck's sake, Officer Sicknick was murdered by a mob; he was beaten to death.
posted by desuetude at 10:36 AM on January 13 [50 favorites]




Pro tip: If you want to know what Mitch McConnell is going to do, try to imagine whatever will give the greatest advantage to the Republican Party. I literally laughed out loud when reading speculation that McConnell was leaking word he might support impeachment because he had finally reached the end of his patience with Trump, or because Trump had 'insulted' him.

Just as Trump has no shame, McConnell has no feelings. He's the most disciplined cultivator and exerciser of political power in our lifetimes. The only reason he would turn on Trump is because he knows he has squeezed the last drop of political juice out of the desiccated orange.
posted by PhineasGage at 10:40 AM on January 13 [36 favorites]


Matt Gaetz is Trevor from "The Good Place", full-stop.

Strikes me as more of a Brent, personally. Trevor was at least devious and tricky.
posted by lazaruslong at 10:41 AM on January 13 [6 favorites]


Lauren Boebert is terrifying. Starting her 1 minute with "Glory To God!" and then saying that the Democrats are the ones requesting unity.
posted by austinetsu at 10:43 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Pro tip: If you want to know what Mitch McConnell is going to do, try to imagine whatever will give the greatest advantage to the Republican Party.

How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance? It seems like a decision that cost the GOP Georgia and the Senate majority. To be clear, I think McConnell is a craven operative who will do whatever most benefits himself and is only jumping on the impeachment train becasue he thinks it's useful, but I struggle to reconcile the COVID aid decision with the political mastermind described in this thread.
posted by Emily's Fist at 10:46 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Pro tip: If you want to know what Mitch McConnell is going to do, try to imagine whatever will give the greatest advantage to the Republican Party

Removing Trump from office and starting the clock on fading him from memory would be the greatest advantage to the Republican Party. So Mitch is fucking his team up by sitting on this.
posted by sideshow at 10:46 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Matt Gaetz looks like the new VP the company hires six days before layoffs start.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 10:46 AM on January 13 [29 favorites]


Matt Gaetz is Trevor from "The Good Place", full-stop.

I've always seen him as Jonah Ryan from Veep...
posted by sriracha at 10:46 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


From the House judiciary committee PDF linked by 20 year lurk (p. 36), with emphasis mine:
Simply put, President Trump has no free speech defense. President Trump is not a private citizen, free to say whatever he wants without accepting the consequences or recognizing the effects it might have on our system of government. As the head of the Executive Branch, his words can shake the nation — and so he is held to a higher standard than private citizens. Moreover, when it comes to the impeachment power, the question is not whether the President was free to say what he said. It is whether he has engaged in conduct that threatens the constitutional order.
posted by runcifex at 10:46 AM on January 13 [21 favorites]


Watching the impeachment conversation not long ago, a Repub from Oklahoma said something about 'sad loss of 6 lives' - is that including the erstwhile suicide of the above linked 53 yo man in his basement, do you think?

Speaking of suicide, I can't believe how tenacious Jamie Raskin is throughout all this, as his son Tommy recently completed suicide a week ago or so. Unbelievably sad. I can't image coping with that, meanwhile, your colleagues are attempting further gaslighting regarding "healing" etc.
posted by erattacorrige at 10:46 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]


Republican lawmakers saying they’re afraid of being killed if they vote their conscience to impeach

Any Representative who votes against impeachment needs to be asked, point blank: "Did you vote against impeachment because you believe Trump is innocent? Or did you vote against impeachment because you feared violence against you and your family?"
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 10:47 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Lauren Boebert bringing some real Sarah Palin energy.
posted by all about eevee at 10:48 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Whoa, Newhouse (my rep) voting against party. Way to go Dan!
posted by St. Oops at 10:48 AM on January 13 [15 favorites]


Massive barricade and fencing went up overnight at the @VP residence. The entire perimeter of the Naval Observatory is now behind the barricades. I am from here, never seen this before in my life.

It's bad enough that the Vice President should need this kind of protection from anyone.

It's utterly horrific that the Vice President should need this kind of protection from supporters of the President.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 10:49 AM on January 13 [19 favorites]


I was born and raised in Colorado's third district, which even all these 40+ years later still contains fewer humans than DC, where I live now. It's a great big messy place, full of some incredible people and some amazing territory. I am just so saddened that with the opportunity for significantly more meaningful and powerful representation in Congress than I currently have, these people chose Lauren Boebert.
posted by aspersioncast at 10:49 AM on January 13 [13 favorites]


Watching the impeachment conversation not long ago, a Repub from Oklahoma said something about 'sad loss of 6 lives' - is that including the erstwhile suicide of the above linked 53 yo man in his basement, do you think?

I think/hope he was referring to the cop who was on duty that day who later killed himself. Of course, the ambiguity might be intended...
posted by gtrwolf at 10:52 AM on January 13


[Graham] added: “The last thing the country needs is an impeachment trial of a president who is leaving office in one week.”

No. The last thing the country needed was an incitement to insurrection by a president who was leaving office in two weeks.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 10:56 AM on January 13 [81 favorites]


Upthread, I said I was curious about the Republican excuses for not voting for impeachment. Well, that curiosity is now stuffed to the point of nausea. I had to turn off the live stream for the sake of my health -- I didn't sleep last night and it can't happen again. I'm not religious, but when I see something like that, I really hope I am wrong and that there is a hell for them.
posted by mumimor at 10:59 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Matt Gaetz is Trevor from "The Good Place", full-stop.

I've always seen him as Jonah Ryan from Veep...


So a caricature of a caricature of Ted Cruz then.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 11:03 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance?

The GOP's message is that the government directly helping it's citizens doesn't benefit the nation. Any interference in the free market will make the potato famine worse only make the economy worse.

That message is bullshit and allowing the government to make $2k stimulus payments would show it for the lie that it is MUCH more clearly than $600 payments costing the GOP votes.
posted by VTX at 11:09 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


i enjoy demeaning jokes about these people too, but gaetz (and many others among those skin-suits filled with vermin) is a _real_ bad guy. he's charismatic, a fairly good speaker, a talented denier of erstwhile-consensual reality, and young. hopefully he'll burn out in corruption and absurdity without harming others (more than he has as a dedicated house rep attack dog), but dismiss him, now, as a caricature at risk.
posted by 20 year lurk at 11:13 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance? It seems like a decision that cost the GOP Georgia and the Senate majority. To be clear, I think McConnell is a craven operative who will do whatever most benefits himself and is only jumping on the impeachment train becasue he thinks it's useful, but I struggle to reconcile the COVID aid decision with the political mastermind described in this thread.

My guess is he thought Georgia would pull through and was queuing up for deficit hawking.
posted by leotrotsky at 11:13 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance?

I've been trying to figure that one out as well. McConnell is no idiot, and he is among the absolute tip-top of savvy political schemers in pursuit of his party and its agenda. The only explanation I have is he flubbed this one.
posted by tclark at 11:15 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


I feel like calls for "unity" translate into "shut up, bitches." It's kinda like when your ex wants to be "friends" and that really means "you're not mad at me, right?" except so much worse.
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:16 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


Because if you give people money they have choices. They don't want us to have choices.
posted by winna at 11:17 AM on January 13 [14 favorites]




dismiss him, now, as a caricature at risk.

Yeah, I have this horrible feeling that if we go with the "Healing/Unity/Forward Not Backward" thing, we're pretty much guaranteeing a President Gaetz or Hawley or Cotton in the very near future.
posted by lord_wolf at 11:17 AM on January 13 [8 favorites]




"Unity" is really disingenuous, yeah. Unity in...what...exactly? Unity in returning to their regularly-scheduled partisan fighting over legislation?
posted by desuetude at 11:20 AM on January 13


To me, unity 2021 is conceding that not all white people are evil. If anyone wants more than that, they can start putting in the effort to prove it.
posted by snofoam at 11:24 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


CrystalDave, I saw that too but it's from the day before the reports saying they now will screen after all. Lowell, whose tweet I linked, is a reporter, but I have no source yet from a publication or official source.

EDIT: a daily newspaper out of SLC has this as a story.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 11:24 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


"Unity", ie we tell people the election was a fraud and the government is illegitimate, meet us half-way here.
posted by adept256 at 11:25 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Lawmakers speak out about Capitol safety concerns following violent riot (CNN):
Democratic Rep. André Carson of Indiana also shared how law enforcement failed him because he had to learn through press reports of court proceedings that he was the target of a man accused of bringing bombs and an arsenal to the Capitol last week. Prosecutors found Carson's name on a handwritten note in the possession of Lonnie Leroy Coffman whose truck was parked near the Capitol for hours last Wednesday and contained guns and bombs. Next to Carson's name, the note read, "one of two Muslims in House of Reps." Carson is Muslim.

"It is extremely disturbing to learn from press reports that I was one of several individuals identified in a list of 'good guys' and 'bad guys' targeted for attacks," Carson said in a statement provided to CNN. "As a former law enforcement officer, it is especially disappointing to see the failure of law enforcement officials, including the US Capitol Police, to notify individuals like myself that we were targeted and at risk from the indicted terrorist and his co-conspirators."
I will be asking my reps to push for legislation and/or oversight to make sure that violent threats - against anyone, but especially public officials - are assumed to be serious and credible, and to give them the highest priority for investigation and prosecution.
posted by kristi at 11:25 AM on January 13 [23 favorites]


i enjoy demeaning jokes about these people too, but gaetz (and many others among those skin-suits filled with vermin) is a _real_ bad guy. he's charismatic, a fairly good speaker, a talented denier of erstwhile-consensual reality, and young. hopefully he'll burn out in corruption and absurdity without harming others (more than he has as a dedicated house rep attack dog), but dismiss him, now, as a caricature at risk.

Same reason I was all like "that's how you get Hawley" and was not impressed with getting a pat on the head. Hawley may have overreached, I dearly hope, but Cotton is also charismatic. When telegenic extremists run and win, I don't think you should shrug and say "oh well, keep your eyes on the median." The clever fascists may only need to get lucky once.
posted by Chef Flamboyardee at 11:25 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


[On threats against Republicans who vote in favor of impeachment] "I get it, but some of us just spent the last 2 years taking stances that have led to repeated attempts on our lives - for demanding guaranteed healthcare, immigrant justice, etc.

Sorry if this lacks empathy, but it’s a privilege if this is their first time. They can do one vote." — @AOC
posted by DevilsAdvocate at 11:25 AM on January 13 [100 favorites]


"Unity" is really disingenuous, yeah. Unity in...what...exactly? Unity in returning to their regularly-scheduled partisan fighting over legislation?

I am reminded in this moment by Daddy H.W. Bush's call for a 'kinder and gentler America' (a million years ago) and the unspoken question it seemed to beg: 'Kinder & gentler than what, exactly?' It still begs the question only we appear to now be less kind and less gentle.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 11:26 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


As someone put it upthread the GoP's idea of "unity" is "we just tried to overthrow the government, now we want you to meet us half way"
posted by mbo at 11:26 AM on January 13 [11 favorites]



Republican lawmakers saying they’re afraid of being killed if they vote their conscience to impeach


We could've been out of this mess a long time ago if they were able to vote anonymously.
posted by Liquidwolf at 11:27 AM on January 13


The irony of Marjorie Taylor-Greene wearing a mask that says "CENSORED" while she speaks to the nation.
posted by woodvine at 11:29 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]


"Meet me in the middle," says the unjust man.

You take one step forward.

He takes one step back.

"Meet me in the middle," says the unjust man.
posted by Faint of Butt at 11:29 AM on January 13 [141 favorites]


DirtyOldTown, the tweet you linked is dated 11 January; CrystalDave's is from 12 January.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 11:30 AM on January 13


DirtyOldTown, the tweet you linked is dated 11 January; CrystalDave's is from 12 January

Yes. But the follow-up link is from a newspaper article today.

Not much clarity on this, but I sure hope it's the case.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 11:32 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Trump has released a statement asking his supporters to refrain from a second attempted insurrection...
posted by deeker at 11:32 AM on January 13 [4 favorites]


We could've been out of this mess a long time ago if they were able to vote anonymously.

This doesn't seem like such a great idea to me, lawmakers are elected and therefore their constituents need to know how they vote in order to make an informed decision about whether to re-elect them.

It seems to me that the republican lawmakers complaining that they're receiving death threats could instead have avoided this situation by either (1) not throwing in with the psycho fringe in the first place or (2) displaying some leadership and steering the party away from sedition. The only way to make amends for not doing anything sooner is do the right thing later (i.e., now).
posted by axiom at 11:34 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


>We are very effectively being held hostage and prevented from getting to the staggering amount of work that needs to be done.

This is what narcissist abusers do, Trump will not let go until he is kicked off a metaphorical ledge, and when he catches the ledge, his fingers smashed until he falls; same for all who enable and support him. The whole country (world) is experiencing what abused women have known and experienced forever.

>McConnell is no idiot, and he is among the absolute tip-top of savvy political schemers in pursuit of his party and its agenda. The only explanation I have is he flubbed this one.

Or that even McConnell can't control reality and the actions of millions of people. He had to roll the dice at some point in this whole situation, and I think he took the (pretty good) bet that Georgia would stay red. I don't think he flubbed: I think he got beat.
posted by LooseFilter at 11:34 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


I'm really unimpressed with all these twitter hot takes. Every time I click through a source, if one exists, it shows that the twitter user is misrepresenting what has actually been reported. It's one thing to speculate or editorialize but pretty egregious to report speculation as if it's factual.
posted by Emily's Fist at 11:35 AM on January 13 [28 favorites]


We could've been out of this mess a long time ago if they were able to vote anonymously.

Pressed to imagine a worse idea if at all concerned about accountability to constituents.
posted by Ahmad Khani at 11:36 AM on January 13 [12 favorites]


Trump has released a statement asking his supporters to refrain from a second attempted insurrection...

A written statement, obviously authored by someone else. (He's definitely, like, tied down and/or drugged in the basement, right? I hope?)
posted by LooseFilter at 11:37 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


He's definitely, like, tied down and/or drugged in the basement, right? I hope?

Or, up in the residence trying to kick as many holes in the walls as he can before Biden moves in.
posted by Thorzdad at 11:38 AM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I wish I shared the confidence and optimism of the people who are stating that this is the beginning of the end of the Republican Party, or that their defense of Trump/the coup attempt is going to damage the GOP's electoral prospects.
posted by The Card Cheat at 11:39 AM on January 13 [27 favorites]


Ceterum autem censeo Titiatio esse delendam
posted by kirkaracha at 11:41 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


re: republicans not voting their conscience because of death threats / threats against their families.

So democrats aren't receiving death threats and/or threats against their families?! Isn't receiving threats kinda like their Thursday if they're men, and just Tuesday if they're women?
posted by nobeagle at 11:41 AM on January 13 [17 favorites]



We could've been out of this mess a long time ago if they were able to vote anonymously.

Pressed to imagine a worse idea if at all concerned about accountability to constituents.


his doesn't seem like such a great idea to me, lawmakers are elected and therefore their constituents need to know how they vote in order to make an informed decision about whether to re-elect them.


Yeah of course.. I wasn't completely serious.

But the reason many republicans haven't voted for impeachment before now is because they fear trump voters. Hypothetically If they were anonymous they'd have enough courage to do the right thing.
posted by Liquidwolf at 11:44 AM on January 13


rump has released a statement asking his supporters to refrain from a second attempted insurrection...

"I implore you not to be violent, not to bring two or three knives and gather at the North entrance of the Capitol building. Please don't break through that door and proceed to the third passageway on the right. I ask you not to make a left there and station yourselves at the top of the staircase next to the elevators. By no means should you go downstairs two floors and look for a door that says "Lounge" just to the left of the elevators there..."
posted by rhizome at 11:45 AM on January 13 [29 favorites]




Yeah of course.. I wasn't completely serious.

True—and in all fairness, I do recall this idea of an anonymous vote at the level of the senate being batted around prior to the previous impeachment trial.
posted by Ahmad Khani at 11:51 AM on January 13


How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance?

Maybe he's still stuck in the mindset where it's the "blue states" that are having the most trouble with COVID and so it's only the "blue state voters" who actually need the money so screw 'em.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 11:52 AM on January 13 [2 favorites]


bet their insurance doesn't cover the FBI/National Guard breaking down the door
posted by mbo at 11:52 AM on January 13


Trump has released a statement

271 characters; tweeting by press release.
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 11:53 AM on January 13 [16 favorites]


RE: The Turtle and Covid relief. See GOP governors rejecting medicare expansion. It's all drown the government in a bathtub virtue signalling.
posted by Mitheral at 11:54 AM on January 13 [5 favorites]


271 characters; tweeting by press release.

'Thank you very much' at the end would have been 280 characters exactly. There's how we know Trump didn't write it himself.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 11:58 AM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Trump has released a statement

Notably it does not tell his supporters to stay home. They will interpret it as "just something he has to say", if they pay any attention to it at all.
posted by jedicus at 11:59 AM on January 13 [7 favorites]


Whitehouse.gov link, filed under "Law and Justice":

Statement from the President
Issued on: January 13, 2021

In light of reports of more demonstrations, I urge that there must be NO violence, NO lawbreaking and NO vandalism of any kind. That is not what I stand for, and it is not what America stands for. I call on ALL Americans to help ease tensions and calm tempers. Thank You.

posted by Iris Gambol at 12:05 PM on January 13


The statement doesn’t even say “Donald Trump” anywhere.

This was 100% written as a statement to Congress that he’s playing nice now and they can trust him and to keep pretending his hands are clean and it was all a misunderstanding.
posted by Mchelly at 12:07 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Trump's statement is aimed specifically at reducing his liability. A real call to unity would have stated, at the very least, that the election was not stolen, and call for trials and accountability for anyone who was involved in the insurrection, including anyone who helped plan it.

Pathetic narcissism to the bitter end.
posted by nicoffeine at 12:07 PM on January 13 [35 favorites]


Real talk how would Trumpies even know about this since it wasn't rage-tweeted by the prez? It's not like they're following Jim Acosta, and you know Fox will mostly ignore it.
posted by aspersioncast at 12:09 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Trump supporters will interpret anything that contradicts them as “he had to say that.”

They are divorced from reality and reality will not bring them back.

It’s like how pointing out all the bad shit Trump does is ineffective against his supporters no matter how depraved he is. They like that he’s depraved, that’s the point.

This is why arguing with his supporters is the wrong tactic. If Trump supporters bring up one of their mendacious circular talking points the correct response is not a rebuttle using facts and figures. They will laugh at you and gleefully warp their own arguments into an incoherent tangle you cannot hope to keep up with.

The correct response to a Trump supporter who tries to bait you into arguing with them is: “Fuck you, nazi.”

These people need to be beat back not reasoned with.
posted by supercrayon at 12:10 PM on January 13 [30 favorites]


Why are these people incapable of keeping their masks over their little noses?
posted by all about eevee at 12:13 PM on January 13 [11 favorites]


There's some manic out there counting the letters or measuring the margins in the press release, and finding some hidden message about the STORM or something.
posted by meowzilla at 12:14 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Calls for Unity make my blood boil. Similar to how during the protests over the summer, the messaging from Biden's camp was how America was "crying out for leadership."

I'm really not interested in Unity, and I'm not crying out for leadership. I want JUSTICE.

The America United inauguration with High Profile Republicans on hand is a mistake. The inauguration should be held virtually in an undisclosed location. Republicans are actively circumventing the metal detectors when entering the Capitol and bragging about being armed, for fuck's sake. This is not the time for Unity. This is the time for Accountability and Justice.
posted by lazaruslong at 12:15 PM on January 13 [59 favorites]


If there was any seriousness behind the statement, it wouldn't be a short press release -- there would be a signed executive order with the full weight of the office behind it, then a press release about that order.
posted by Iris Gambol at 12:17 PM on January 13 [13 favorites]


I hear Presidents could easily get TV time to really hammer a message home.
posted by mazola at 12:18 PM on January 13 [7 favorites]


The Trumpist interpretation of that statement would surely be, “But he didn’t tell us not to come,” and heard as a dog whistle to do exactly that.
posted by blue suede stockings at 12:18 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


"It's been impossible to miss today that Republicans have been far more likely to jeer Black women who speak than anyone else." -- Aaron Rupar, Vox
posted by valkane at 12:19 PM on January 13 [62 favorites]


He didn't even say "leave the guns at home". Seven days is plenty for a change of heart.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 12:19 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


I'm really not interested in Unity, and I'm not crying out for leadership. I want JUSTICE.

I am mashing the favorite button so hard on this statement
posted by supercrayon at 12:22 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Capitol rioter pictured with Pelosi lectern promises not to return to DC as lawyer says only a ‘magician’ could get him off (The Independent, Jan. 13, 2021) Adam Christian Johnson, 36, who belongs to Florida, was released on Monday on a bond of $25,000. He was taken into custody last Friday on charges of knowingly entering or remaining in any restricted building or grounds without lawful authority and theft of government property, like other rioters. Mr Johnson is supposed to attend the next court hearing [in D.C.] on 19 January, a day before president-elect Joe Biden’s inauguration. However, his lawyer Dan Eckhart said that Mr Johnson will not try to attend the inauguration. [...]

More than 160 case files have been opened in relation to the Capitol riots and 70 people have been charged so far, said Michael Sherwin, US Attorney for the District of Columbia in a press conference on Tuesday.
posted by Iris Gambol at 12:23 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


I can think of no better way to bring the country to gather than punishing Donald Trump. If you disagree then you are not interested in unifying the country.
posted by interogative mood at 12:24 PM on January 13 [39 favorites]


If you disagree then you are not interested in unifying the country

The insurrection made it pretty clear that these folks think they _are_ the country.
posted by bfranklin at 12:26 PM on January 13 [6 favorites]


"What does it mean when they boo the Black congresswoman denouncing white supremacy?" -- Rep. Cori Bush
posted by valkane at 12:27 PM on January 13 [103 favorites]


Department of Defense says they will review troops deployed to Biden inauguration to ensure they don’t have sympathies to domestic terrorists — meaning the US govt is now trying to prevent a military coup.
if they have any brains they'll outsource this to the kpop fandom ecosystem
posted by Caxton1476 at 12:27 PM on January 13 [30 favorites]




Mr Johnson is supposed to attend the next court hearing [in D.C.] on 19 January, a day before president-elect Joe Biden’s inauguration.

They're scheduling hearings for these insurrectionists on the 19th? IN D.C.?!? What could possibly go wrong with that idea...
posted by mcstayinskool at 12:31 PM on January 13 [11 favorites]


To the Republican politicians who cite a fear of death threats and violence as a result of voting their conscience: What the fuck do you think your Democratic colleagues are dealing with for bringing it up in the first place? What the fuck do you think the entire event on January 6th was if not a gigantic threat of death?

What the fuck do you think so many less prominent people face on a daily basis for doing something so bold as visibly existing as a woman or person of color or marginalized group in this society?

Grow a conscience and join the fucking club. That's the god damn membership fee, apparently.
posted by Arson Lupine at 12:31 PM on January 13 [45 favorites]


Aaron Rupar on Twitter

Rep. Richmond's last floor speech: "In the first impeachment, Republicans said, 'we don't need to impeach him because he learned his lesson.' We said if we didn't remove him, he would do it again. Simply put, we told you so. Richmond out."
posted by ChurchHatesTucker at 12:32 PM on January 13 [116 favorites]


/"What does it mean when they boo the Black congresswoman denouncing white supremacy?"

That Republicans are still who they decided to become back in 1964 when they nominated Barry Goldwater on an anti-Civil Rights Act platform.
posted by Pseudonymous Cognomen at 12:34 PM on January 13 [21 favorites]




If you disagree then you are not interested in unifying the country

Quo usque tandem abutere, Catilina, patientia nostra? Quam diu etiam furor iste tuus nos eludet? Quem ad finem sese effrenata iactabit audacia?

-Cicero
posted by clavdivs at 12:36 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Two of Washington state's three Republicans say they'll vote to impeach. Dan Newhouse (noted above) of Yakima & central WA, and Herrera-Beutler of Vancouver (on the border just north of Portland, OR). I guess we haven't heard from McMorris-Rogers of Spokane, yet.

Analysis on KUOW in Seattle says this is probably a significant political risk for Newhouse as his district is deeply conservative. Herrera-Beutler less so, they think, but I'll note a whole lot of the Proud Boy garbage that hits Portland comes out of her district.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 12:36 PM on January 13 [12 favorites]




The insurrection made it pretty clear that these folks think they _are_ the country.
I think I've described it before, but I'm fairly convinced that conservatism in the US operates under an extension of Herrenvolk Democratic beliefs. (And the 'democratic' part is optional)

They are True/Real Americans. We are not.
What they enact politically is justified, because it's enacted by and for Real Americans. What Obama enacted was not, no matter how much he sought bipartisanship, because he can never be a Real American.
What they want is what's good for America, because they are True Americans. What we want is to be discarded, etc.

By this model, the idea of bipartisan unity only existed while it was helpful to them, and until they thought they could safely discard it. If we keep acting like they're behaving in good faith, it'll only be to our loss.
posted by CrystalDave at 12:43 PM on January 13 [27 favorites]


Democratic lawmakers warn Capitol rioters had ‘inside assistance’ as details emerge from insurrection (The Independent, Jan. 13, 2021) Probe underway to identify GOP members who gave tours details emerges from 6 January attack. Within the article:

New York Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez said that she avoided sheltering with "QAnon and white-supremacist sympathizers and, frankly, white supremacist members of Congress ... who I know and who I have felt would disclose my location” over fears that lawmakers could “create opportunities to allow me to be hurt, kidnapped, etc.” She said she “didn’t feel safe around other members of Congress.”

“I can tell you that I had a very close encounter where I thought I was going to die,” she said during an Instagram Live broadcast on Tuesday night. “I did not know if I was going to make it to the end of that day alive.”


For the last week, all of these traumatized people have had to be in rooms, on conference calls, and (right now, arguing) at the crime scene with these same bloodthirsty colleagues.
posted by Iris Gambol at 12:44 PM on January 13 [66 favorites]


And don't forget getting exposed to virus daily as well.
posted by jenfullmoon at 12:51 PM on January 13 [8 favorites]


For the last week, all of these traumatized people have had to be in rooms, on conference calls, and (right now, arguing) at the crime scene with these same bloodthirsty colleagues.

This. I am still stuck on how they have to see, hear, and be in the same room as the monsters who plotted their murder.

Medals of honor for every House Democrat.
posted by ichomp at 12:51 PM on January 13 [24 favorites]


non canadian guy: Josh Gerstein on Twitter: BREAKING: Acting Attorney General Jeff Rosen takes to YouTube just as president is removed from it. In 1st on camera appearance since Capitol riot, Rosen vows 'no tolerance whatsoever' for violence and other criminality at Biden inauguration.

This was posted yesterday. At the time, I watched Rosen's statement, which was a very strong condemnation of violence and warning, and I thought it was a message that ought to go out. I even thought I liked they guy -- until I looked into him more and saw that the expectation was that he would support Trump even where Barr wouldn't, and which point I was just glad that he had a line he wouldn't cross.

But it was odd that the video was unlisted and had fewer than 3000 views -- hardly the way to get out a warning about how seriously the Department of Justice is taking this issue. Commenters on the thread had a similar take, e.g.

“Why YouTube? He can’t go on TV where the majority of the population will see it? Something is up with this. It’s just utterly bizarre.”

“Because he wasn’t authorized to do it. Trump heads out of town and up goes YouTube, the only mass media his minders can’t physically keep him away from.”

Now, the video has been removed entirely. Perhaps Rosen recorded the video and sent the unlisted (but leaked) link for approval -- and approval was denied. I know that's Seth Abramson-esque reasoning and shouldn't be trusted, but I would like to know what went on there.
posted by brambleboy at 12:52 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]




But the reason many republicans haven't voted for impeachment before now is because they fear trump voters. Hypothetically If they were anonymous they'd have enough courage to do the right thing.

They just had their chance to vote anonymously during the voice vote. But Jim Jordan called for a roll call vote.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 12:56 PM on January 13 [15 favorites]


Biden's team would be smart to keep all the Trumps far away from the scene, in case he tries an inauguration day "wouldn't it be weird if i was actually still president" move rallying his mob.
posted by RobotVoodooPower at 12:57 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


I think I've described it before, but I'm fairly convinced that conservatism in the US operates under an extension of Herrenvolk Democratic beliefs.

I have come to basically this same understanding and it totally fits with US/UK history.

As the colonies grew, back in England society was basically organized into four groups:
1. Kings
2. "Men" (Read: White men who deserve to be in charge)
3. Those that support "Men"
4. Poor people, women, people of color, and everyone else who must be managed by "Men" for their own good

The founders just realized that kings weren't really any different from "Men". And those darn poors just had to come over and start surviving their indentured servitude contracts, striking out on their own, finding success and building wealth. Well damn, now we can't very well argue that the poors are poor because they're just lazy and dumb like we could back in England. So what to do?

1. Kings
1. "Men" and those that support "Men"
3. Those that support "Men" (now merged with 2)
2. Poor people, people of color and women (the latter two basically viewed as property)

And that's basically how it's been ever since and what we're STILL fighting against.
posted by VTX at 1:04 PM on January 13 [26 favorites]


When imps say "unity" they mean impunity.
posted by dances_with_sneetches at 1:07 PM on January 13 [35 favorites]


AP Exclusive: MLB suspends political donations after DC riot (Jan. 13, 2021) MLB is the first of the major professional sports leagues to say it would alter its lobbying strategy in the wake of the deadly Capitol riots.
posted by Iris Gambol at 1:07 PM on January 13 [8 favorites]


overheard on my Facebook:

"Just so we’re all clear, Trump committed impeachable offenses from the time he was sworn in. What changed is he became a mortal threat to figures of the white elite."
posted by philip-random at 1:09 PM on January 13 [60 favorites]


"We're suspending political donations" is some weaselly both-sides bullshit when the insurrectionists are all in one party.
posted by Pseudonymous Cognomen at 1:12 PM on January 13 [47 favorites]


"We're suspending political donations" is some weaselly both-sides bullshit when the insurrectionists are all in one party.

Absolutely. But money in politics is evil and needs to stop.
posted by mumimor at 1:14 PM on January 13 [18 favorites]


Corporate money in politics is always a corrosive force, so this type of broad campaign finance reform is a win-win.
posted by Glegrinof the Pig-Man at 1:17 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Ayanna Pressley's husband, who took shelter in that room with the Sedition Caucus members, has tested positive for Covid-19.
posted by adamg at 1:18 PM on January 13 [19 favorites]


Just so we’re all clear, Trump committed impeachable offenses from the time he was sworn in. What changed is he became a mortal threat to figures of the white elite.

Originally from Bree Newsome, I think.
posted by Spathe Cadet at 1:18 PM on January 13 [12 favorites]


(Which way to the fucking fuck thread again? I just went over to CNN, which gave me a choice of Covid Pandemic Live or House Impeachment Vote Live. I feel like one of those is much better than the other, so there's that. Off to bed, hang in there MeFites.)
posted by Bella Donna at 1:22 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Looks like it's official. Now what?
posted by Chaffinch at 1:23 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


What are the chances that today's announcement that US Space Command will move to Huntsville, AL is part of a quid pro quo reward for alleged seditious co-conspirator Mo Brooks?
posted by SpaceBass at 1:23 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Ayanna Pressley's husband, who took shelter in that room with the Sedition Caucus members, has tested positive for Covid-19.

We just have to assume for the rest of the pandemic that any given Republican has it and is spreading it. We must avoid them like the plague because they are very likely literally carrying it.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:24 PM on January 13 [11 favorites]


And, over the top. Donald Trump is responsible for 50% of all presidential impeachments.
posted by stevis23 at 1:25 PM on January 13 [50 favorites]


So despised they impeached him twice!
posted by oulipian at 1:27 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


> Looks like it's official. Now what?

Same thing as the last time Trump was impeached, probably. Bravo to everyone who voted to remove Trump from office, even if it's almost certainly not going to work.
posted by The Card Cheat at 1:27 PM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Donnie Two-scoops.
posted by valkane at 1:28 PM on January 13 [48 favorites]


Huntsville Al has been the lead area for rocket research going back to Verner Von Braun.

But yes, all those military bases and NASA being in the south are federally subsidized charity to keep the region afloat.
posted by Abehammerb Lincoln at 1:28 PM on January 13 [7 favorites]


The President so nice, they impeached him twice.
posted by Going To Maine at 1:28 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


> What are the chances that today's announcement that US Space Command will move to Huntsville, AL is part of a quid pro quo reward for alleged seditious co-conspirator Mo Brooks?

Not much because NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center is already there.
posted by at by at 1:29 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Ah dang it
posted by Going To Maine at 1:29 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Which Dem chose not to vote?
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 1:30 PM on January 13




q: do you remember where you were when president t[nope] was impeached?

a: can you be more specific?
posted by 20 year lurk at 1:30 PM on January 13 [33 favorites]


This is just a regular reminder that on top of his abhorrent politics, Matt Gaetz is the sort of person who received 16 speeding tickets in a 15 year period and was arrested for driving drunk but was able to use his political connections to get the charges dropped and his driver's license reinstated, despite having refused a breathalyzer test which under Florida law is supposed to result in an automatic one-year suspension. He is as perfect an example of the corrupt good-old-boy as exists, and an exemplar of why even small corruption needs to be taken seriously and rooted out whenever it's found, before it has a chance to fester.
posted by biogeo at 1:31 PM on January 13 [78 favorites]


Donnie Two-scoops.

Wow, it's been a long 4 years.

Thats_a_name_Ive_not_heard_in_a_long_time.gif
posted by Nonsteroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drug at 1:31 PM on January 13 [8 favorites]


Hope Hicks has resigned too. Good riddance! - Palmer Report (Twitter)
posted by rambling wanderlust at 1:32 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Which Dem chose not to vote?

I'm not sure they're done yet...are they?
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 1:32 PM on January 13


They itmfa x2
posted by supercrayon at 1:32 PM on January 13 [5 favorites]


It’s 231-197 so far, with 10 Republicans voting in favor. (There are 2 vacant seats, and we’re waiting on 5 members to vote.) (Final total 232-197.)

The rule for this resolution also included appointment of managers (H.Res. 40), so there won’t be a separate vote there. Now they have to wait for the Senate to come to work so they can “exhibit the article” and start the trial.
posted by Huffy Puffy at 1:32 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


They sucked his brains out!: "Which Dem chose not to vote?"

I think the livestream showing "1" under "no vote" just means "vote not recorded yet". The NV numbers are going down as yea or nay is announced.
posted by caution live frogs at 1:33 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Hope Hicks has resigned too.

Fitting that the day of the second impeachment was when this administration finally lost Hope.
posted by Joey Michaels at 1:33 PM on January 13 [62 favorites]


Jerk former Clinton impeachment manager on PBS immediately pivoting to claiming that, y’know, there really was something fishy in those ballots and we still need to investigate them and have hearings. Just awful.
posted by Going To Maine at 1:34 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


(PS: Please stop using small tags here so folks with vision problems can read the comments. Link to relevant MetaTalk here. Thanks again.)
posted by Bella Donna at 1:34 PM on January 13 [28 favorites]


O great! Other dude pushing back entirely, I am copacetic.
posted by Going To Maine at 1:35 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Massive barricade and fencing went up overnight at the @VP residence. The entire perimeter of the Naval Observatory is now behind the barricades. I am from here, never seen this before in my life.

It believe Pence really is terrified of Trump and his gangs. Ex-VPs only get six months of Secret Service protection. Those guy who whisked him and his family to safety when the mob attacked are gone in six months. Might explain why he doesn't want to do to much to piss him off.
posted by JackFlash at 1:37 PM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Pelosi just hit the gavel. 5 Reps didn't vote.
posted by ceejaytee at 1:37 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


I can't believe it. It happened a second time!

James Harden has been traded!
posted by Groundhog Week at 1:37 PM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Looked like four republicans didn't vote.
posted by valkane at 1:37 PM on January 13


Better to not vote than vote no under duress.
posted by benzenedream at 1:42 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


The House did their duty.
posted by mazola at 1:44 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


I can't believe that I was the first person to update the list of presidential impeachments on Wikipedia. Adding "and again in 2021" kinda made my day.
posted by caution live frogs at 1:44 PM on January 13 [143 favorites]


Massive barricade and fencing went up overnight at the @VP residence. The entire perimeter of the Naval Observatory is now behind the barricades. I am from here, never seen this before in my life.

-It's awful, but new VP Harris is going to need this more than friggin' Pence.
posted by Iris Gambol at 1:47 PM on January 13 [31 favorites]


First in popular vote losses
First in impeachments
Last in the hearts of his countrymen
posted by kirkaracha at 1:50 PM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Two impeachments is going to look really awkward on Donnie's C.V.

Or loan application.

Or application for day parole.
posted by Capt. Renault at 1:51 PM on January 13 [6 favorites]


>How do you account for him blocking the $2k COVID assistance?
I've been trying to figure that one out as well. McConnell is no idiot, and he is among the absolute tip-top of savvy political schemers in pursuit of his party and its agenda. The only explanation I have is he flubbed this one.


My guesses are:
1) He doesn't personally know anyone for whom $2000 is substantial. He doesn't personally know anyone for whom $2000 is the difference between a roof over their head or homelessness, much less the difference between life and death.

2) He doesn't personally know anyone who's been hard-hit by the shutdowns. Doesn't know anyone who's been trying to find a job for seven months and is increasingly frantic as the six-month unemployment checks have dried up; doesn't know anyone who's trying to work from home with an 8-year-old trying to attend school on a 13" laptop; doesn't know anyone who couldn't visit dying loved ones in the hospital.

In short: he's out of touch with the country at large, in a way that normally doesn't matter for him politically--but became obvious at just the right moment to spur voters in a state he doesn't normally pay much attention to.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 1:56 PM on January 13 [11 favorites]


In the United States' 243 years, Half of all Presidential Impeachments have been given to Donald John Trump.
posted by Twain Device at 1:57 PM on January 13 [49 favorites]


Does he get two asterisks after his name now?
posted by May Kasahara at 1:59 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Winning!
posted by Windopaene at 2:00 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


History.com: How Many US Presidents Have Faced Impeachment?
Only three U.S. presidents have been formally impeached by Congress—Andrew Johnson, Bill Clinton and Donald Trump. One of those presidents, Donald Trump, was impeached twice during his single term.
UPDATED: JAN 13, 2021 ORIGINAL: OCT 21, 2019
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:03 PM on January 13 [22 favorites]


He's going down in history alright!
posted by symbioid at 2:03 PM on January 13


Make America Impeach Again
posted by Ahmad Khani at 2:05 PM on January 13 [7 favorites]


Also re: McConnell and the $2k checks, his talents are smoke-filled-room politics and parliamentary tactics, not so much electoral politics and legislation. He basically runs on being an incumbent Republican in Kentucky using stock Republican talking points so he doesn't need to understand voters any deeper, and his usual trick is just letting Republicans avoid going on the record entirely by just not voting on things, but that wasn't an option with COVID relief legislation.

Like, he's good at his awful work, but like gerrymandering he's good at getting results within the typical parameters and quickly overwhelmed if things get outside of that comfort zone. The man filibustered his own bill when Reid called his bluff.
posted by jason_steakums at 2:06 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


I'm taking some real comfort in the fact that if he just could have kept his fucking face shut for two more weeks, he could have retired into the right-wing grift machine and managed to prop up his flailing empire somehow. But now he's doomed his brand and doomed Ivanka's brand and rendered everything called "Trump" so incredibly toxic that he won't be able to do business again (except with dictators and terrorists, and I somehow doubt the US is going to continue to let that shit slide from him like they did the time he laundered money for the Iranian Revolutionary Guards).
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 2:07 PM on January 13 [46 favorites]


Pseudonymous Cognomen: ""We're suspending political donations" is some weaselly both-sides bullshit when the insurrectionists are all in one party."

Glegrinof the Pig-Man: "Corporate money in politics is always a corrosive force, so this type of broad campaign finance reform is a win-win."

During the ACA fight I said this, that the difference is not in what was paid but what was being sold:
The republicans are selling their devotion to the health care status quo. They sell fearmongering about wait times and people leeching off your hard-earned tax dollars.

Democrats are simply offering their apathy. No one gives them lobbying money expecting them to cry out about the socialist boogeyman; it will suffice to just stay out of the spotlight and let the republicans own the discourse.
Suspending political donations can make republicans less powerful and democrats more progressive.

But it doesn't necessarily do that, which is why we have to impress upon democratic politicans that they can compensate for being defunded by being active advocates for policies that help people.
posted by Riki tiki at 2:07 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


This is now the most bipartisan presidential impeachment in American history.

I just looked this up and it's true. Not nearly enough, but I'll fucking take it.
posted by widdershins at 2:08 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Aaaaaand the Honey Drippers are on repeat tonight, baybeeee!
posted by sucre at 2:08 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Something I hadn't seen before - 34 House Democrats call for investigation into Jan. 5 tours by fellow members ahead of attack:
“The tours being conducted on Tuesday, January 5, were a noticeable and concerning departure from the procedures in place as of March 2020 that limited the number of visitors to the Capitol. These tours were so concerning that they were reported to the Sergeant at Arms on January 5,” Sherrill and others wrote.
The tour groups on Jan. 5 were unusual enough that members of Congress noticed and reported them.

Also mentions how no one can find Majority Whip James Clyburn's office ... but the terrorists knew right where it was.
posted by kristi at 2:09 PM on January 13 [55 favorites]


Twinpeached!
posted by murphy slaw at 2:10 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Meanwhile, Trump is giving a medal to Toby Keith. Words fail me.
posted by TheCoug at 2:10 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


"This is STILL all part of the plan."

QAnon, probably
posted by vverse23 at 2:10 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


Same thing as the last time Trump was impeached, probably. Bravo to everyone who voted to remove Trump from office, even if it's almost certainly not going to work.

Forgive the no doubt stupid question from an overseas viewer: Won't it be different this time because the trial will be held in a senate where the Dems hold the balance of power?
posted by penguin pie at 2:12 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Surprised that McConnell won't bring this to a quick vote; it seems the last grift that Trump has is to get the GOP to help him out, or he tears that operation down, as well. Not a good situation for McConnell, when Trump is allowed to keep reminding everyone that the Republican Party is the party of sedition and treason, just as it gets minority status.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 2:12 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


Oh, sorry, my brain answered that the minute I posted it. They need 2/3 of the senate, right?
posted by penguin pie at 2:12 PM on January 13 [8 favorites]


And that Boebert and all those other reps need to be voted the fuck out for both endangering their cohorts by locking themselves in without a mask and frankly, if I were there, i would have forcibly pushed them out the chamber to meet their wonderful friendly smiling happy constituents who just love them so much.

These fuckers are shady and a fifth column and very rightly so need to be watched constantly.
posted by symbioid at 2:13 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Speaking of telegenics, I literally couldn't hear the Democratic speakers on tv unless I made an effort. The Republican speakers were LOUD and their voices cut through everything else I'm doing (at work), and their message got across. At first I thought it was just Pelosi being old, but even Schiff was quieter and I really wanted to hear him. I have no idea how that happens and I don't feel good about this at all.
posted by Rainbo Vagrant at 2:13 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


Jesus, did he hand out any arts medals before this? This is a deliberate finger in the eye to the concept of good music. (Before you argue, I am part from Tennessee, a bluegrass fan, and like old country songs.)
posted by Countess Elena at 2:14 PM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Forgive the no doubt stupid question from an overseas viewer: Won't it be different this time because the trial will be held in a senate where the Dems hold the balance of power?

The trial in the Senate won't begin until after Trump is out of office.
Also it requires a 2/3rds majority to convict, which may be too much. But it may likely be more than one Republican voting to convict this time, anyway.
posted by scaryblackdeath at 2:14 PM on January 13 [4 favorites]


So, if Trump had led Putin into the Capitol in a failed coup attempt, would the number of Republicans to vote yes on impeachment have grown to, say, 11?

How is it that in the face of this outrageous, planned attack on our governnment by its president less than ten percent of his party's representatives could bring themselves to vote for his impeachment?!? What the actual fuck?!?
posted by riverlife at 2:14 PM on January 13 [22 favorites]


Hey...if you think you're sharing news here....please double check the thread before posting. It's like deja vu watching people post the same links and news every 20 comments. You are likely not going to be first to post it. That's okay.
posted by tiny frying pan at 2:14 PM on January 13 [23 favorites]


Penguin Pie no. It takes a 2/3 majority in the Senate to actually punish someone who is impeached.

More important, right now McConnell will have a majority until the two Democrats from Georgia are seated AND whoever is appointed to replace Sen Harris is appointed.

So Mitch and the Republicans will be firmly in control of the Senate of they take up the impeachment quickly. And even if they weren't there still aren't the 66 votes it takes to punish Trump.
posted by sotonohito at 2:15 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


He must be totally pumped to have finally beaten a Clinton in something for reals.
posted by Thorzdad at 2:15 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


he's doomed his brand and doomed Ivanka's brand

I don't count on that latter. Unless someone brings charges against her, I really am worried about Ivanka running in 2024. She is spot-on for Republican brand of "pretty blonde woman who exists to be someone else's mouthpiece," and they might be able to sell her as "look, her name will be on the paperwork, but you all know who'll really be running the show."

And they'd leave that person unnamed, but vaguely described so's to fit the preferences of each target audience differently.
posted by ErisLordFreedom at 2:17 PM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Speaking of telegenics, I literally couldn't hear the Democratic speakers on tv unless I made an effort. The Republican speakers were LOUD and their voices cut through everything else I'm doing (at work), and their message got across.

Then it is a problem with the audio at your end.

Was perfectly fine—and indeed very audible—on both the NY Times and C-Span stream.
posted by Ahmad Khani at 2:20 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


Ivanka could be imprisoned by 2024.
posted by kiwi-epitome at 2:21 PM on January 13 [10 favorites]


Now what about all those appointed enablers being held to account?
Amidst all of the Chaos of the past week, one voice inside the White House has remained silent.
Arguably the President's most loyal advisor and one of his longest-tenured employees, Stephen Miller has been in hiding since the aftermath of the January 6th siege on the Capitol. According to a senior White House Official who wished to remain anonymous, Miller entered the private elevator inside the Presidential residence following the day's events, pressed the 'down' button and has not been seen or heard from since. The 'down button' remains illuminated.
posted by adamvasco at 2:22 PM on January 13 [36 favorites]


this is probably a significant political risk for Newhouse

Yeah, he'll probably get a challenge from the right, but my district's ceiling for dems is maybe 30% and with Washington's primary system, with only two candidates qualifying for final ballot regardless of party he may figure he can squeak by. I gritted my teeth and voted for him when he was up against a nutso Tea-partier a few years ago.

Or maybe he's gunning for Murray's senate seat in 2022.
posted by St. Oops at 2:22 PM on January 13


And even if they weren't there still aren't the 66 votes it takes to punish Trump.

Keep in mind the last Senate impeachment trial was a farce. If/when the Democrats execute the trial there is going to be all sorts of bad for the GOP evidence presented.
posted by Mitheral at 2:23 PM on January 13 [8 favorites]


That tracks, Miller has to sleep in his home soil
posted by Countess Elena at 2:24 PM on January 13 [13 favorites]


None of this in any way "ends" with impeachment or even Trump leaving, except the immediate danger of Trump and a serious deflation of his critical monied support.

There will be violent tragedies which we will all go through. There are millions of fully activated fascists, hundreds of millions of guns, and an empires worth of military equipment just floating about. The only thing that gives me hope is that the large bulk of the security apparatus appears to be quite against this and is publicly outing and reprimanding/arresting their members who took part. Also, if you read between the lines I feel there seems to be some kind of a real purge happening behind the scenes. This interregnum between Trump and Biden is a kind of perfect time to do some other politically difficult house cleaning under the banner of NATIONAL SECURITY. Press out the craziest, internally chastise and/or punish the sympathetic. Again, this is amateur tea leaf reading, but the silence kind of speaks volumes. I'm sure there will be massive volumes written about the last few days, but the juicy shit probably won't come out for a while.

However, the situation Jan 5th was untenable. Just muddling through and pretending that people would abandon Trump and fascism because reasons was shattered into a million pieces in the Senate gallery. The lines aren't so blurry anymore, and the Georgia wins (which we barley had time to talk about) showed the power players in the DNC how you win. Now, whether or not current leadership will fully embrace this is to be seen, but the things Biden is saying about MMT and child bonds, and the people who will chair committees leads me to believe a kind of built-up damn has broken with the Dems.

Additionally, I think "Trumpism without Trump" doesn't have the purchase people think. Hawley, Cruz, et al are just plain unlikeable. Same with the more loon-ish House members. As a figure from a certain podcast about a kind of house said recently, "It all started with these people just liking him", which is such an obviously true and completely underappreciated part of all of this. The man had charisma! Quite obviously I don't fully understand it, but when you watched him talk, especially during the 2016 primaries, he was so very different. I'll never actually get it, but I can kind of see why a lot of people did.

The thing that I still can hardly believe (I say it out loud a few times a day) is "Chairman of the Budget Committee Bernard Sanders". That is some leftist Sorkin shit.
posted by lattiboy at 2:24 PM on January 13 [29 favorites]


Or maybe he's gunning for Murray's senate seat in 2022.

I’m VERY skeptical that there’s any chance of that happening given WA’s demographics.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 2:24 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


until the two Democrats from Georgia are seated AND whoever is appointed to replace Sen Harris is appointed

For the record, that is going to be Alex Padilla, the current CA secretary of state.
posted by albion moonlight at 2:28 PM on January 13 [3 favorites]


I’m VERY skeptical that there’s any chance of that happening given WA’s demographics.

I agree with you but then again the 2000 senate race was within about 2000 votes, maybe he figures...?
posted by St. Oops at 2:31 PM on January 13


And even if they weren't there still aren't the 66 votes it takes to punish Trump.

I believe it was pointed out earlier that conviction on impeachment requires 2/3 of the members present. They only need 51 present for a quorum.
posted by Thorzdad at 2:33 PM on January 13 [5 favorites]


Hawley, Cruz, et al are just plain unlikeable.

At Scalia's funeral Cruz--who was a clerk for Rehnquist--asked to sit with the Scalia clerks and they said no. You know no one likes you if you get shunned at a funeral.
posted by kirkaracha at 2:33 PM on January 13 [49 favorites]


I'll never actually get it, but I can kind of see why a lot of people did.

Not just a certain confrontational charisma, he had literally over a decade of straight-up propaganda on prime time television that sold the fiction that he was competent, principled (in his own way), a talented executive, and good at business.
posted by tclark at 2:34 PM on January 13 [22 favorites]


I didn't actually mean Ivanka's political brand, I meant her actual brand-brand that she sells things with. One of the most delightful parts of the past week is how thoroughly and quickly businesses that do business with the Trumps are dumping them and running away as fast as they can.
posted by Eyebrows McGee at 2:37 PM on January 13 [9 favorites]


Not going to link, but here's the chaff Fox is throwing up right now:
PBS lawyer suggested sending children of Trump voters to 'reeducation camps' where 'they watch PBS all day' by our good friends at Project Veritas. Guess they were keeping this headline in the cupboard for an emergency.
posted by benzenedream at 2:39 PM on January 13 [2 favorites]


How is it that in the face of this outrageous, planned attack on our governnment by its president less than ten percent of his party's representatives could bring themselves to vote for his impeachment?!?

Don't give them too much credit. It's actually less than 5% of Republicans voted for impeachment. Just a week ago 66% voted for the coup -- after the insurrection.
posted by JackFlash at 2:41 PM on January 13 [15 favorites]


Only takes 50% in each house for a joint resolution declaring that he engaged in insurrection or rebellion and invoking section 3 of the 14th amendment on his ass - on its own that would do nothing concrete, but it would provide a basis for state level court challenges against his candidature in future elections.

This would be a great backstop after a failure in the Senate
posted by mbo at 2:44 PM on January 13 [15 favorites]


PBS lawyer suggested sending children of Trump voters to 'reeducation camps' where 'they watch PBS all day'

I hadn't thought of that, but there's a pretty damn good idea in there. More Muppets teaching love, understanding, and the letter D!
posted by Countess Elena at 2:47 PM on January 13 [21 favorites]


“ After a deeply divisive struggle, there can be no durable unity if one side continues to propagate myths, if those who have ripped a nation apart refuse to acknowledge their role in deepening its schisms, if crimes committed are swept under a rug woven from the threads of politically convenient forgetfulness.

The effort to create a new order of racial justice in the South after our Civil War was thwarted for nearly a century because of myths spun by Confederates who cast a war for slavery as a noble lost cause and Reconstruction, an effort to democratize an unjust society, as oppressive. The Weimar Republic, Germany’s noble democratic experiment, failed because large parts of the country’s political elite refused to acknowledge its own failures in World War I and never accepted the new regime.
In our time, the United States will move forward only if Trump’s radical attacks on democracy itself are recognized and condemned, only if his false claims are repudiated by his own party, only if every form of false equivalence aimed at diminishing or relativizing Trump’s shameful behavior is thoroughly and completely discredited.“

Want unity? Impeaching Trump was the first step.
posted by supercrayon at 2:55 PM on January 13 [23 favorites]


"It was like a Dukakis-on-the-tank moment," one Republican strategist said about the viral photo of Josh Hawley raising his fist toward the gathered pro-Trump crowd, "in that he just looked phony and out of place and like a doofus."

Sen. Josh Hawley becomes a pariah on Capitol Hill -- NBC

"The Missouri freshman is under fire from Democrats and members of his own party after the riot at the Capitol."
posted by valkane at 2:55 PM on January 13 [28 favorites]


against his candidature in future elections.

Speaking of, if (I know, I know) the Senate bars him from holding office in the future, how is that enforced? We all know that he would just declare candidacy again anyway. I think they need signatures to get on the ballot, and so what if he gets that? Or what if 70 million people write him in? In either situation do we end up right back where we are now, with 70 million people believing he won the 2024 election fair and square and they start marching and rioting and committing insurrection again? Honest procedural questions.
posted by Snowishberlin at 2:56 PM on January 13 [1 favorite]


This is not the first coup to happen in America. The first successful coup in America was the 1898 Wilmington insurrection... - TikTok calling out the white supremacy.
posted by Lanark at