Long time till spring
April 27, 2021 2:29 PM   Subscribe

A seedbank-testing experiment that started in 1879 has decades to run. It's a simple experiment, but the simple things are hard: neither losing the seeds nor digging them up too early. From the point of view of the *seeds* the simple thing -- don't germinate until you can grow -- is also getting pretty hard.

The article mentions two more long (but not *as* long) experiments, and the Pitch Drop is still dripping. The Pitch and the underground seeds are noticeable for being cheap to set up and fairly cheap to run, unlike free air CO2 enrichment, but having little chance of publication for the first researcher.
posted by clew (8 comments total) 14 users marked this as a favorite
 
having little chance of publication for the first researcher

There's an ethical question here: should deceased collaborators be listed as coauthors? Should Frank Telewski (21st century botanist) list William Beal (19th century botanist) as a coauthor in publications about Beal's ongoing experiment?

Current consensus seems to be no. Criteria for authorship:
1) Substantial contributions to the conception or design of the work; or the acquisition, analysis, or interpretation of data for the work; AND
2) Drafting the work or revising it critically for important intellectual content; AND
3) Final approval of the version to be published; AND
4) Agreement to be accountable for all aspects of the work in ensuring that questions related to the accuracy or integrity of any part of the work are appropriately investigated and resolved

Beal meets 1 but not 2-3-4. I grudgingly acknowledge that Beal's name should not be put on writing he did not see, writing with which he might not have agreed, however hilarious it might be to do so.
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 3:35 PM on April 27, 2021 [2 favorites]


Authorship no, acknowledgement yes
posted by The Power Nap at 4:10 PM on April 27, 2021 [3 favorites]


Current consensus seems to be no. Criteria for authorship:

That article is based on the most common case for a deceased author; that is, someone who was involved in work in a normal fashion but for whatever unfortunate reason died before the paper made it through to final publication. I'd note that the article does not describe a consensus -- it finds the Online Ethics Center suggesting that scientists who are involved in the development of a research project but who die before the paper is written might be appropriately included.

I'd argue that the specific case of an experiment explicitly designed to be multigenerational -- the original design of this study was for 100 years -- then it's appropriate. There's no way that anyone will blame Beal for the writing in the paper, and his contribution in part 1 is of such importance that without him there would be nothing to study at all.
posted by Superilla at 5:24 PM on April 27, 2021 [9 favorites]


As someone who has come to looooooathe stability studies, inheriting this would be my worst nightmare....

The long term nature of stability studies (and thus the utter impossibility of do-over in case of calamity) just gives me hives.
posted by Tandem Affinity at 7:25 PM on April 27, 2021


There's an ethical question here: should deceased collaborators be listed as coauthors?

On one hand, the dictum to publish or perish no longer applies...
posted by StarkRoads at 8:02 PM on April 27, 2021 [6 favorites]


Dear Mr. Beal,

I humbly submit for your consideration.

(32,000 y.o. seeds out of the permafrost)
posted by From Bklyn at 12:34 AM on April 28, 2021


And here I was reminded of this story about 2000-year-old seeds and thought that was a long time...

It's funny that the original impetus for the study was supposedly to see how long you'd have to deal with weeds popping up in your field if you kept weeding diligently.
posted by trig at 12:54 AM on April 28, 2021


having little chance of publication for the first researcher

Can a paper describing a multigenerational experiment be published? Could Beal have published a paper titled "An Experimental Method For Determining the Long-Term Viability of Seeds" describing his methodology and maybe including some initial results or even simulations of results so the experiment itself could be peer-reviewed for potential flaws? Then generations later subsequent papers with the actual results could cite Beal's initial paper.
posted by RonButNotStupid at 4:47 AM on April 28, 2021 [1 favorite]


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