Truth in Advertising?

July 5, 2021 6:14 AM

The same word can mean different things in different cultures, "Thongs" in Australian English and British English for example. However seldom has such a difference in meaning had such a dramatic effect as in the launch of Nonce Finance's partnership with a crypto company. For the non-British,"nonce" is a colloquial term used for child sex abusers. This is a useful reminder that you should always check before using a word which may have multiple meanings. Fortunately, cryptocurrency and NFTs are classically famed for only being used for good things and not being at all associated with grift, money laundering and paying for illegal services...
posted by fallingbadgers (40 comments total)

I mean, these people aren't that stupid, right? This is a dog whistle, eh?
posted by Reasonably Everything Happens at 6:16 AM on July 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

This won't be an accident, sadly; it'll be techbros trying to be edgy.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 6:31 AM on July 5, 2021 [2 favorites]

This is a dog whistle, eh?

I don't even think it's a dog whistle, per se. These are the same folks who, when accused of pedophilia, correct you and say it's "ephebophilia", rather than denying it. They have no shame, and if anything, I think they get off on publicly being villains.

It's "owning the libs", except instead of rolling coal or loudly riding motorcycles past public parks, it's burning fossil fuels for NFTs and dating inappropriately young people under the thinnest veneer of "technically legal."
posted by explosion at 6:34 AM on July 5, 2021 [5 favorites]

'Steaming' means drunk in Belfast/Northern Ireland but horny in Liverpool, UK. Beware; such a difference in such a short distance!
posted by thisisarandomname07 at 6:40 AM on July 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

in the unlikely event that these people are not trolling, there is an NFT-adjacent reason why "Nonce" might work: Cryptographic nonce

And when I lived in the UK, which was 100 years ago now, nonce was used differently, like "for the nonce" being "for the time being."

but even still, any consultant worth their £1,000 an hour would have counselled hard against using that word as a company name today

In conclusion, trolls are a land of contrasts
posted by chavenet at 6:53 AM on July 5, 2021 [18 favorites]

I mean, these people aren't that stupid, right?

Nope. Everyone is now talking about their company. Free publicity.

Their target market won't care about the name and indeed will probably enjoy smugly telling everyone "well ACTUALLY it's a term from cryptography".
posted by automatronic at 7:07 AM on July 5, 2021 [10 favorites]

And when I lived in the UK, which was 100 years ago now, nonce was used differently, like "for the nonce" being "for the time being."

Nowadays, if that phrase came up, it would probably relate to an effigy-burning ritual, as in “penny for the guy”.
posted by acb at 7:27 AM on July 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

Anyway, if this is not, in fact, an incredibly stupid oversight, then it is also a sign that the NFT/crypto people have given up on the pretence of respectability and instead doubled back on edgelordism.
posted by acb at 7:29 AM on July 5, 2021 [5 favorites]

Is Jen still dating Peter File?
posted by fatbird at 7:32 AM on July 5, 2021 [10 favorites]

Brass Eye in paedogeddon had this down
posted by lalochezia at 7:44 AM on July 5, 2021 [7 favorites]

Brass Eye in paedogeddon had this down

“I'm talking paying nonce sense cents”
posted by acb at 7:49 AM on July 5, 2021 [3 favorites]

This is the one thing we didn't want to happen
posted by dis_integration at 7:52 AM on July 5, 2021 [4 favorites]

I was puzzled when someone from the UK whom I follow in Twitter posted something cryptic (to me) about it. I got two responses, one from someone referencing business, which puzzled me even more, and the second one with the colloquial etymology, which suddenly put a lot of other stuff into proper relief for me.

My initial understanding was of the crypto term, but the Twitter source, @scientits, clearly had something else in mind.
posted by hwestiii at 9:12 AM on July 5, 2021

It's doesn't come from "number once".

According to etymonline.com:
nonce (n.)
in phrase for the nonce (Middle English for þe naness, c. 1200) "for a special occasion, for a particular purpose," a misdivision (see N for other examples) of for þan anes "for the once," in reference to a particular occasion or purpose, the þan being an altered form of the Middle English dative definite article þam (see the). The phrase was used from early 14c. as an empty filler in metrical composition.

Also see, nonce-word
posted by thedward at 9:22 AM on July 5, 2021 [10 favorites]

It's doesn't come from "number once".

That's as may be, but it certainly serves as an effective mnemonic.
posted by hwestiii at 9:28 AM on July 5, 2021

They got spunk.
posted by Phanx at 9:45 AM on July 5, 2021 [2 favorites]

Yikes, had not been aware of this British usage, put "nonce word" away in the cupboard I guess.

Unfortunately "nonce" appears most likely derived from "nance", so we've got homophobia built into that.
posted by away for regrooving at 10:49 AM on July 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

If cryptogrifters say they are reclaiming the language, who are the rest of us to warn them?
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 11:56 AM on July 5, 2021

It is a common term in computer science and cryptography, and this is the first I've heard of the slang usage in Britain. Certainly a word I've used professionally often.
posted by thefoxgod at 12:22 PM on July 5, 2021 [14 favorites]

Knowing that "nonce" is a colloquial term used for child sex abusers somewhere is a piece of linguistic trivia. Someone who's primarily familiar with its cryptographic use has no less valid a claim to the word than someone who's familiar with it as a label for an abuser, and arguably a more credible claim to what *they* mean by it.

To hell with cryptogrifts for half a dozen reasons but it might work out better if we can use the better ones.
posted by wildblueyonder at 12:26 PM on July 5, 2021 [9 favorites]

nonce - Google Book Search is interesting.

Seems you better get in touch with the French as well. It's like a papal ambassador or something.
posted by zengargoyle at 12:33 PM on July 5, 2021

Cognate with "papal nuncio".
posted by away for regrooving at 12:48 PM on July 5, 2021

I'm passingly familiar with the term "nonce" in the cryptographic sense (among others).

Not being from the UK, I was wholly unfamiliar with the slang sense.

I've no particular love for crypto entrepreneurs, and this company probably should've done a bit more branding research - but it seems unreasonable to charge that this was a deliberate "all publicity is good publicity" move, or that they are in fact defenders of pedophilia.
posted by escape from the potato planet at 12:54 PM on July 5, 2021 [7 favorites]

I always thought "Paper Nuncios" would be a great band name...
posted by Windopaene at 1:00 PM on July 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

Another point, perhaps, is that something you now know is also something you can't claim ignorance about, going forwards. It is a positive choice, either way, and one colored by recent news about non-British people in power potentially (and their associates definitely) using cryptoscrip to avoid legal scrutiny over buying sex from those under the age of consent.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 1:39 PM on July 5, 2021

"Hello? Is this his royal highness's secretary? Yes, we're establishing an exciting new commercial venture and we were wondering whether Prince Andrew might be interested in joining the board. The name? Nonce Finance. What? Hello? Hello?"
posted by Joe in Australia at 1:40 PM on July 5, 2021 [4 favorites]

Mod note: One comment deleted. No need to bring an ableist slur to make a comparison
posted by loup (staff) at 1:49 PM on July 5, 2021 [2 favorites]

but it seems unreasonable to charge ... that they are in fact defenders of pedophilia.

In fact I charged that they were Libertarians. Crypto-currency is the Libertarian dream, and it's not at all unreasonable to suspect that these folks are Libertarians.

If you're saying it's unreasonable to charge Libertarians as "defenders of pedophilia," well, that's their own reputation that they've earned as readily as the Vatican or BSA.
posted by explosion at 4:23 PM on July 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

Who wants that tech swag?
posted by srboisvert at 4:58 PM on July 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

Unfortunately "nonce" appears most likely derived from "nance", so we've got homophobia built into that.

I thought it was rhyming slang for ponce.
posted by srboisvert at 5:01 PM on July 5, 2021

Add me as another person who didn't know that "nonce" was slang and only knew it from its well known cryptographic sense. Keep in mind that "nonce" and "nancy" don't Rhyme in American English dialect so drawing that entomology isn't really obvious. Is there a word for words that are the same yet have two separate etymologies?
posted by geoff. at 6:34 PM on July 5, 2021 [2 favorites]

Fortunately, cryptocurrency and NFTs are classically famed for only being used for good things and not being at all associated with grift, money laundering and paying for illegal services...

Or Once-ler-level environmental destruction...
posted by BiggerJ at 7:43 PM on July 5, 2021

I can’t remember the last time anybody thought of crypto as being used to buy anything. It’s been an investment vehicle for half a decade or more by this point.
posted by gucci mane at 11:44 PM on July 5, 2021 [1 favorite]

I (Brit) always thought 'nonce' was a relatively obscure underworld, especially prison, slang word. I thought that it was limited to the south of England. Regardless, it was not a term of affection. Its use in my Masters crypto classes always used to amuse me greatly.
posted by epo at 1:04 AM on July 6, 2021

Coming soon: a new Australian cryptocurrency investment company, Rock Spider Finance.
posted by acb at 1:05 AM on July 6, 2021 [4 favorites]

Yeah I know it from speaking to English people as a uniquely negative and ominous term. All the similar UK terms for gay men (Nancy/ponce) can carry in-joke or self-deprecatory meaning; after all this is the culture of Carry On movies and It Ain’t Half Hot Here and drag and endless levels of knowing winking.

At ‘nonce’ the winking stops. It’s just hostile.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 5:45 AM on July 6, 2021 [2 favorites]

Well, the salient features of “nancy’ and “ponce” are unconventional gender expression/exaggerated mannerisms and such. (One has to do some work to get from there to being disgusted about hot man-on-man action if one is that way inclined, and these days, that reflects more on the person getting worked up about it and their obsessions.) The salient feature of “nonce”, however, is preying on the vulnerable for sexual gratification. So, possible etymology notwithstanding, there's a huge qualitative gap there.
posted by acb at 6:01 AM on July 6, 2021

At ‘nonce’ the winking stops. It’s just hostile.

I only heard 'ponce' as a synonym for pimp and then as a jokey insult rather than in the literal sense. But yes, if someone calls you a nonce to your face it's quite likely to be followed by a fist.
posted by epo at 9:39 AM on July 6, 2021

Back in the seventies - in the UK - a Nonce was an informer, especially in prisons. For example it was used that way in the prison sitcom 'Porridge'
posted by communicator at 12:07 PM on July 6, 2021

At some point, a whole marketing discipline was made out of concocting brand names that avoided unfortunate connotations. Is that still a thing? I'm inclined to think that such considerations have slipped a good distance down the list of priorities.
posted by Flexagon at 1:52 PM on July 6, 2021