Into The Woods
September 25, 2021 5:09 AM Subscribe
Stephen Sondheim wanted to something funny. After the intensity of Sunday In The Park With George, he decided to turn, again with James Lapine, to classic art. In this case, fairy tales. The resulting show, Into The Woods, is one of those truly magical creations, running for over 750 performances across nearly 2 full years on the boards. It lost the 1987 Best Musical Tony Award to Phantom, but won Best Score and Best Book and Best Actress, so. there. Here is the American Playhouse filming of the original Broadway production of Into The Woods [2h31m].
Here are Sondheim and Lapine talking to Edwin H. Newman on PBS about the show. [23m] A lot of thoughts about the development of the show. Probably the best of this ancillary material to watch if you want a layman's overview from the creators of the show and not get too deep into the particulars.
If you want to get into the particulars, here is MTI's Conversation Piece about Into The Woods [52m30s], with Sondheim and Lapine. Steve talks about the songs, and Jim discusses characters, staging, and production/directing notes. Just for fun, here is the Piano Conductor Score [.pdf link].
This original cast got back together in 1997 for a 10th Anniversary Reunion Concert [2h36m], presented here in weirdly choppy audience-o-vision. It's not a bad bootleg, really. The whole affair is a hoot and full of celebration.
Another audience recording, this time of the 2002 Broadway Revival. It's not quite the same show as the original, with some songs and characters added. It's also not of the opened show, it's a preview performance. But it gives an idea...
Or maybe this sort of "around the back of heads" filming of the 2012 Shakespeare In The Park production is appealing. The setting and the set are really interesting. And the cast is insanely great, with Amy Adams, Donna Murphy, Denis O'Hare, and many more.
It continues to be a hot property: Encores! at City Center is talking about doing it this year [11m], the Old Vic is doing it next year (co-directed by Terry Gilliam and Leah Hausman). [Tickets]
Of course, we have a bit of ancillary reading material. Here's an examination of leitmotif in the score [From Score To Stage] which I found illuminating even after having memorized the whole thing 30-odd years ago. Reading Into The Woods as an AIDS parable is explored here on Talking Points Memo.
Oh! Oh! Oh! And this, this utter gem... I wonder if Sondheim and Lapine know about this... Here are four Financial Lessons From Into The Woods from Marotta Wealth Management: No One Is Alone, Children Will Listen, Do You Know What You Wish?, and Nice Is Different Than Good.
Oh yes, we must mention the Disney in the room. Michael Schulman writes in The New Yorker, the day before the movie's release, Why “Into the Woods” Matters [Archive.org link]. And I'm not 100% with Snugboy, but he sort of nails much of my own reaction to the film in Disney's Into The Woods - How NOT To Adapt a Movie [20m29s]
And to wrap this up, here's one of those delightful things that could never have happened outside of Pandemic Time... Into The Woods In Quarantine [13m12s]. Shout out to the piano player!
Here are Sondheim and Lapine talking to Edwin H. Newman on PBS about the show. [23m] A lot of thoughts about the development of the show. Probably the best of this ancillary material to watch if you want a layman's overview from the creators of the show and not get too deep into the particulars.
If you want to get into the particulars, here is MTI's Conversation Piece about Into The Woods [52m30s], with Sondheim and Lapine. Steve talks about the songs, and Jim discusses characters, staging, and production/directing notes. Just for fun, here is the Piano Conductor Score [.pdf link].
This original cast got back together in 1997 for a 10th Anniversary Reunion Concert [2h36m], presented here in weirdly choppy audience-o-vision. It's not a bad bootleg, really. The whole affair is a hoot and full of celebration.
Another audience recording, this time of the 2002 Broadway Revival. It's not quite the same show as the original, with some songs and characters added. It's also not of the opened show, it's a preview performance. But it gives an idea...
Or maybe this sort of "around the back of heads" filming of the 2012 Shakespeare In The Park production is appealing. The setting and the set are really interesting. And the cast is insanely great, with Amy Adams, Donna Murphy, Denis O'Hare, and many more.
It continues to be a hot property: Encores! at City Center is talking about doing it this year [11m], the Old Vic is doing it next year (co-directed by Terry Gilliam and Leah Hausman). [Tickets]
Of course, we have a bit of ancillary reading material. Here's an examination of leitmotif in the score [From Score To Stage] which I found illuminating even after having memorized the whole thing 30-odd years ago. Reading Into The Woods as an AIDS parable is explored here on Talking Points Memo.
Oh! Oh! Oh! And this, this utter gem... I wonder if Sondheim and Lapine know about this... Here are four Financial Lessons From Into The Woods from Marotta Wealth Management: No One Is Alone, Children Will Listen, Do You Know What You Wish?, and Nice Is Different Than Good.
Oh yes, we must mention the Disney in the room. Michael Schulman writes in The New Yorker, the day before the movie's release, Why “Into the Woods” Matters [Archive.org link]. And I'm not 100% with Snugboy, but he sort of nails much of my own reaction to the film in Disney's Into The Woods - How NOT To Adapt a Movie [20m29s]
And to wrap this up, here's one of those delightful things that could never have happened outside of Pandemic Time... Into The Woods In Quarantine [13m12s]. Shout out to the piano player!
I saw the tech and dress rehearsal of a college production of Into The Woods as part of a high school drama field trip. I was a freshman. It blew me away - I had watched musicals before, but they were Oklahoma! and The King and I and West Side Story and so on. Good, but dated. But this had sex! Pathos! An unexpected twist to reveal that fairy tales are not happy endings!
This musical and Les Mis are why I went into theater.
posted by gwydapllew at 6:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [6 favorites]
This musical and Les Mis are why I went into theater.
posted by gwydapllew at 6:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [6 favorites]
I have been waiting for you to post about this yay!!!!
The words and lyrics and the way that the scenes and songs melt into and play off of each other makes this story one of my favorite stories ever. I love every single character so much.
I saw it performed live as a teenager and it was awesome but nothing can touch the version you linked to above the fold. The part I love best of all is Any Moment/Moments in the Woods. It makes me laugh "Any moment we could be crushed!.. Don't feel rushed." and "Have a child for warmth and a baker for bread.. and a prince for whatever" and it makes me remember to live in the moment.
posted by RobinofFrocksley at 6:24 AM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
The words and lyrics and the way that the scenes and songs melt into and play off of each other makes this story one of my favorite stories ever. I love every single character so much.
I saw it performed live as a teenager and it was awesome but nothing can touch the version you linked to above the fold. The part I love best of all is Any Moment/Moments in the Woods. It makes me laugh "Any moment we could be crushed!.. Don't feel rushed." and "Have a child for warmth and a baker for bread.. and a prince for whatever" and it makes me remember to live in the moment.
posted by RobinofFrocksley at 6:24 AM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
There used to be a supercut of various version of (the cow) Milky White in amateur productions, but I can't find it now. But here's a clip where Milky White didn't perform as expected.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:29 AM on September 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 7:29 AM on September 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
I worked as a costumer on an Into the Woods production and it was an incredibly fun experience for everyone on and backstage. I'm not really a fan of musicals, but I never got tired of hearing Into the Woods' music - and when you work on a musical you hear its songs almost every minute of every waking hour. There is no escape.
posted by Stoof at 8:57 AM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by Stoof at 8:57 AM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
There used to be a supercut of various version of (the cow) Milky White in amateur productions, but I can't find it now.
Low Budget Milky Whites tumblr
posted by one for the books at 9:14 AM on September 25, 2021 [12 favorites]
Low Budget Milky Whites tumblr
posted by one for the books at 9:14 AM on September 25, 2021 [12 favorites]
The way is clear
The light is good
I have no fear nor no one should
The woods are just trees
The trees are just wood
posted by kyrademon at 10:00 AM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
The light is good
I have no fear nor no one should
The woods are just trees
The trees are just wood
posted by kyrademon at 10:00 AM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
Into the Woods has two of my favorite lines from any artwork:
"I was raised to be charming not sincere."
"You're not good, you're not bad, you're just nice."
The timing from Jack on that Milky White clip above, "He'll be fine."
The female roles in this show are outstanding.
posted by gladly at 10:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
"I was raised to be charming not sincere."
"You're not good, you're not bad, you're just nice."
The timing from Jack on that Milky White clip above, "He'll be fine."
The female roles in this show are outstanding.
posted by gladly at 10:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
I've also always loved the Forbidden Broadway version:
Once upon a time... There was a great song writer called Stephen Sondheim. He had many, many hit shows.
(I wish...)
All the characters in all the shows were very happy to be in a prestigious Sondheim musical -- except for a few things...
(I wish... I wish this show were not so bloody, I wish)
(I wish... I wish this song was more melodic, I wish)
(I wish... I wish the lyrics weren't so wordy, I wish)
You see, with Sondheim's shows people sometimes miss the point. They're supposed to listen and go...
Into the words, the metaphors, the synonyms, the perfect scan
Into the words, the detail and tricky little phrases
Into the words, the what, the where, the when, the why, the plot began
Into the words, the work, the craft that garnishes the praises
Into the words, into the words
The music waits
Into the words, into the words
The lyric states that
Into the words, your content always comes before your form and style
Into the words, internal rhymes that even baffled Merman
Into the words, a quick exchange so very strange you'll cry and smile
Never repeat a verse or a bridge -- this isn't Jerry Herman
Into the words, into the words
They always teach
Into the words, into the words
So hear me preach:
The plot is clear
If understood
I have no peer 'cause I'm so good
The score is the star
The stars are just wood
I sort of hate to ask it,
But what's rhyme for basket?
Into the words that trip your lip then fry your brain and strain your tongue
Into the words, a cave so dark you better bring a torch in
Into the words that fly and try to choke the joke that you just sung
Into the words, more letters than they sell on "Wheel of Fortune"
Into the syllables
Into the antonyms
Into the metaphors
Into the synonyms
Into the words
Then out of the words
And home after dark
posted by kyrademon at 10:24 AM on September 25, 2021 [16 favorites]
Once upon a time... There was a great song writer called Stephen Sondheim. He had many, many hit shows.
(I wish...)
All the characters in all the shows were very happy to be in a prestigious Sondheim musical -- except for a few things...
(I wish... I wish this show were not so bloody, I wish)
(I wish... I wish this song was more melodic, I wish)
(I wish... I wish the lyrics weren't so wordy, I wish)
You see, with Sondheim's shows people sometimes miss the point. They're supposed to listen and go...
Into the words, the metaphors, the synonyms, the perfect scan
Into the words, the detail and tricky little phrases
Into the words, the what, the where, the when, the why, the plot began
Into the words, the work, the craft that garnishes the praises
Into the words, into the words
The music waits
Into the words, into the words
The lyric states that
Into the words, your content always comes before your form and style
Into the words, internal rhymes that even baffled Merman
Into the words, a quick exchange so very strange you'll cry and smile
Never repeat a verse or a bridge -- this isn't Jerry Herman
Into the words, into the words
They always teach
Into the words, into the words
So hear me preach:
The plot is clear
If understood
I have no peer 'cause I'm so good
The score is the star
The stars are just wood
I sort of hate to ask it,
But what's rhyme for basket?
Into the words that trip your lip then fry your brain and strain your tongue
Into the words, a cave so dark you better bring a torch in
Into the words that fly and try to choke the joke that you just sung
Into the words, more letters than they sell on "Wheel of Fortune"
Into the syllables
Into the antonyms
Into the metaphors
Into the synonyms
Into the words
Then out of the words
And home after dark
posted by kyrademon at 10:24 AM on September 25, 2021 [16 favorites]
"Sometimes people leave you halfway through the woods."
That line and, oddly enough, the Stones "Paint It Black," have become lyrics that say so much about loss for me.
And the entirety of "Children will Listen" is stunning. That and "No One is Alone" are tied with "Sunday" as being Sondheim's big '80s anthem-hymns.
"Into the Woods" also feels connected to "A Little Night Music." The OBC publicity designs / album covers even seem similar.
posted by NorthernLite at 10:26 AM on September 25, 2021 [2 favorites]
That line and, oddly enough, the Stones "Paint It Black," have become lyrics that say so much about loss for me.
And the entirety of "Children will Listen" is stunning. That and "No One is Alone" are tied with "Sunday" as being Sondheim's big '80s anthem-hymns.
"Into the Woods" also feels connected to "A Little Night Music." The OBC publicity designs / album covers even seem similar.
posted by NorthernLite at 10:26 AM on September 25, 2021 [2 favorites]
I absolutely adored the Fiasco Theater production that was at the Ahmanson in LA a few years ago -- an extremely stripped down version with maybe 8 or 10 cast members but just a handful of props and almost no scenery. Having so little to set the scene on stage, I find, really forces me as an audience member to use my imagination and really, hugely focus in on the performers. It was utterly delightful.
posted by BlahLaLa at 10:38 AM on September 25, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by BlahLaLa at 10:38 AM on September 25, 2021 [2 favorites]
That American Playhouse version was one of a handful of things my parents recorded onto VHS when it aired on PBS, and I watched it over and over and over. (And then proceeded to be utterly disgusted with the musicals chosen by our high school's drama department, to the point that a friend had to set me straight that no, our high school did not have the depth of vocal talent to put on a good production of Into The Woods, Pippin was really about as much as they could pull off, and even there they had the advantage of a lead who went on to off Broadway for a few years.) Anyway, between its awesome female leads, its view on relationships, and the amazing lyrics and score, this show spoiled me for theater as a child, and probably substantially upped the quality of silly ditties I compose for my dogs to this day.
posted by deludingmyself at 11:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by deludingmyself at 11:01 AM on September 25, 2021 [3 favorites]
My wife and I used to love singing "TRAAAAGEDY! So much greater than yours!" when we catch ourselves being self-indulgently whiny about something that might not actually be that big a deal. (Or--privately, not to their faces--when our teenagers deserved it.)
posted by straight at 12:16 PM on September 25, 2021 [6 favorites]
posted by straight at 12:16 PM on September 25, 2021 [6 favorites]
Low Budget Milky Whites tumblr
Bless you, one for the books.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 12:19 PM on September 25, 2021
Bless you, one for the books.
posted by CheeseDigestsAll at 12:19 PM on September 25, 2021
I came to New York (from my hometown on the other side of the country) for *one day* to see Into the Woods the day after Christmas, about a month after it had opened.
I didn’t realize that so many Broadway theaters were so intimate, compared to the giant barn of a touring house where I lived. I felt like the actors were close enough to touch…
The theater — then called the Martin Beck— had some gothic-castle qualities in the entryway/box office area. Perfect.
Seeing a show when I had never before heard the music — incredible. When the cast album was released, the first time I listened sent me right back to that magical night.
Joanna Gleason’s performance was the first example I had seen with my own eyes of an actor transcending the words of a script to bind everything together in a larger whole — she brought a quality of soul/spirit to it that was unmatchable. I was thrilled watching the Tony broadcast when she won. The actress who played the role in the revival was extremely talented of course— but it showed that what Ms Gleason had done was something really extraordinary. (In the revival, the standout was Laura Benanti as Cinderella, one of the only cast members in that production playing her role with complete honesty and true belief…)
I managed to see the show five times during its run, seeing cast replacements come and go (Phylicia Rashad replaced Bernadette Peters as the Witch early enough that she performed on the Tonys.) I also saw the show slowly decay as new cast members joined who didn’t have the same core spirit as the originals — pushing for laughs— recreating the surface but not the interior — the absolute belief in the reality of the piece. It was an excellent education. (One exception… a Rapunzel replacement who went on to become a Broadway star… Marin Mazzie.)
I later managed to see the first London production which, unusually, had a completely different design team than Broadway. The wolf was a man in a tuxedo… but with a fully functional animatronic wolf head… the stuff of nightmares. Imelda Staunton was the Baker’s Wife in that cast. And somehow the British actors managed to sing that score even faster…
So many emotional stories wrapped around that musical for me— a particular time in my life— growing up, moving to New York, finding my way through the woods myself… I will never tire of hearing those songs.
One song I often skipped was “No More”, when the Baker contemplates running away from the small band of surviving characters, late in the show. As a younger man, I didn’t really get it.
Then one time on a long road trip I was singing along to the Broadway recording and it hit me as it never had before. I wept, from that deep place of just-healed-over survivor’s pain. And I understood…
posted by profreader at 12:29 PM on September 25, 2021 [12 favorites]
I didn’t realize that so many Broadway theaters were so intimate, compared to the giant barn of a touring house where I lived. I felt like the actors were close enough to touch…
The theater — then called the Martin Beck— had some gothic-castle qualities in the entryway/box office area. Perfect.
Seeing a show when I had never before heard the music — incredible. When the cast album was released, the first time I listened sent me right back to that magical night.
Joanna Gleason’s performance was the first example I had seen with my own eyes of an actor transcending the words of a script to bind everything together in a larger whole — she brought a quality of soul/spirit to it that was unmatchable. I was thrilled watching the Tony broadcast when she won. The actress who played the role in the revival was extremely talented of course— but it showed that what Ms Gleason had done was something really extraordinary. (In the revival, the standout was Laura Benanti as Cinderella, one of the only cast members in that production playing her role with complete honesty and true belief…)
I managed to see the show five times during its run, seeing cast replacements come and go (Phylicia Rashad replaced Bernadette Peters as the Witch early enough that she performed on the Tonys.) I also saw the show slowly decay as new cast members joined who didn’t have the same core spirit as the originals — pushing for laughs— recreating the surface but not the interior — the absolute belief in the reality of the piece. It was an excellent education. (One exception… a Rapunzel replacement who went on to become a Broadway star… Marin Mazzie.)
I later managed to see the first London production which, unusually, had a completely different design team than Broadway. The wolf was a man in a tuxedo… but with a fully functional animatronic wolf head… the stuff of nightmares. Imelda Staunton was the Baker’s Wife in that cast. And somehow the British actors managed to sing that score even faster…
So many emotional stories wrapped around that musical for me— a particular time in my life— growing up, moving to New York, finding my way through the woods myself… I will never tire of hearing those songs.
One song I often skipped was “No More”, when the Baker contemplates running away from the small band of surviving characters, late in the show. As a younger man, I didn’t really get it.
Then one time on a long road trip I was singing along to the Broadway recording and it hit me as it never had before. I wept, from that deep place of just-healed-over survivor’s pain. And I understood…
posted by profreader at 12:29 PM on September 25, 2021 [12 favorites]
My favorite ever audition story concerns Into The Woods : A friend of mine wanted the role of The Narrator/Mysterious Man, which is a non-singing role, in a local production. However, the theater required him to sing the song of his choosing at the audition, and he wasn't entirely sure that he could sing. So, after much thought, he chose Woody Guthrie's Ladies Auxiliary (sung here by Arlo Guthrie, in its entirety). Reader, he got the part.
posted by dannyboybell at 12:29 PM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by dannyboybell at 12:29 PM on September 25, 2021 [4 favorites]
My favorite production of this is still the first one I ever saw, some touring show in the late 80s in New Jersey. The major characters were as good as in any version I've ever seen since (and I've seen ... a lot), and some of the more minor characters were INCREDIBLE. The narrator had a lot more personality than he's usually given, and it had the two most brilliant princes I've ever seen. It made a lot of moments in the show that often breeze past really pop.
I also knew nothing about the show going in, and remember just kind of blinking in awe after the first number, as it slowly dawned on me that we were now twenty minutes into the show and it had just gotten through the OPENING SONG.
posted by kyrademon at 1:47 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
I also knew nothing about the show going in, and remember just kind of blinking in awe after the first number, as it slowly dawned on me that we were now twenty minutes into the show and it had just gotten through the OPENING SONG.
posted by kyrademon at 1:47 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
Ahhh, I've been waiting for this post! Like several others, I first saw this when I was in my early teens, at a local college, and I think that's such a great age to see it, because it's built on all these fairy tales that you've outgrown at that point but still are very tangible to you, and it just has SUCH great lessons about growing up. The whole "nice is different than good" theme made a HUGE impression on me, as a very "nice" AFAB teenager. So did all the lessons about people leaving you, and when you leave vs. when you stay.
It was also perfect timing for me because I had been a huge musical theater nerd for a few years at that time, but had started to get more into indie rock, etc (this would have been around 1992) and discovering Sondheim showed me that musical theater (really, any kind of art) could also be subversive and deep while also being really funny and entertaining at the same time.
My high school drama club tried to stage a production of this play. I was cast as Little Red Riding Hood, which I was super excited about, but the advisor/director realized a few weeks in that we didn't really have the chops for it, which was fair. We did a revue with songs from different shows instead, and I "got to" sing "On the Steps of the Palace." In quotes because it was probably the hardest song I've ever had to learn. Sondheim songs have SO MANY WORDS, and the accompaniment gives you no assistance at all. But it was a thrill to finally nail it.
The movie was an absolute disappointment, but fortunately there are all those stage recordings and it gets produced all the time.
posted by lunasol at 3:57 PM on September 25, 2021
It was also perfect timing for me because I had been a huge musical theater nerd for a few years at that time, but had started to get more into indie rock, etc (this would have been around 1992) and discovering Sondheim showed me that musical theater (really, any kind of art) could also be subversive and deep while also being really funny and entertaining at the same time.
My high school drama club tried to stage a production of this play. I was cast as Little Red Riding Hood, which I was super excited about, but the advisor/director realized a few weeks in that we didn't really have the chops for it, which was fair. We did a revue with songs from different shows instead, and I "got to" sing "On the Steps of the Palace." In quotes because it was probably the hardest song I've ever had to learn. Sondheim songs have SO MANY WORDS, and the accompaniment gives you no assistance at all. But it was a thrill to finally nail it.
The movie was an absolute disappointment, but fortunately there are all those stage recordings and it gets produced all the time.
posted by lunasol at 3:57 PM on September 25, 2021
I've been lucky enough to see at least three productions of Into the Woods - I think the original touring production was probably my introduction to Sondheim. Gosh.
profreader, I concur that Joanna Gleason's performance (captured on the DVD release) is revelatory, and Sondheim himself lauds her in probably my favorite bit of his Look, I Made a Hat:
Thank you so much for posting this, hippybear!
posted by kristi at 7:12 PM on September 25, 2021 [10 favorites]
profreader, I concur that Joanna Gleason's performance (captured on the DVD release) is revelatory, and Sondheim himself lauds her in probably my favorite bit of his Look, I Made a Hat:
One of the many reasons that I would make a had director is that I have a limited tolerance for actors who can't resist suggesting changes in the script. ... Only once in my experience has an actor said something that I immediately latched onto - not only a good notion for a lyric line, but also an insight into a character that hadn't occurred to me. It came from Joanna Gleason, who played the Baker's Wife and who, in a late-night conversation about the character, noted in passing that she felt like she was "in the wrong story."I love revisiting my memories of the productions I've seen, and thinking about everyone who's ever worked hard to mount this magical work, and reading other MeFites' thoughts and recollections. I'm looking forward to making the time to enjoy all the linked videos.
With a jolt, I suddenly saw the Baker and his Wife in a way I hadn't seen them before ... : They were not only in the wrong story, they were in the wrong play. They were a contemporary urban couple who had awakened one morning to find themselves in a medieval fantasia, surrounded not only by their own anxieties but by all the fairy-tale figures they had grown up with and probably loathed. The line in the song got a huge laugh, partly because it broke the fourth wall ... but, more trenchantly, encouraged them to identify with someone from their own era. In an instant, the Wife's problem became the contemporary soap-opera dilemma: adventure versus dependability, romance versus fidelity. It connected her with the traditional characters she found herself surrounded by: like Cinderella, Jack and Little Red Riding Hood, she was caught "in between." ... the song had to be about the present rather than the past - her decision of the moment. I took care of the past in the first twelve lines and then toyed with the dilemma, not merely with her conflicted emotions, but with the language she used: inadvertent puns and plays on words, semi-tongue twisters to mirror her confusion. Unlike the word-juggling in "Pretty Little Picture" (the song often cut from A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum), playfulness here serves a purpose. Puns are two-sided words - they are, in fact, verbal dilemmas.
Thank you so much for posting this, hippybear!
posted by kristi at 7:12 PM on September 25, 2021 [10 favorites]
I also saw the show slowly decay as new cast members joined who didn’t have the same core spirit as the originals — pushing for laughs— recreating the surface but not the interior — the absolute belief in the reality of the piece. It was an excellent education.
This is a fascinating ancedote/observation. Where I live might get a first-run touring company for two weeks, and then the show comes back and maybe it's the A company or the B company or C or D if it's really popular and doing long stays at every stop... but it's really rare that I've seen a Broadway touring company that was first class, first run touring... I saw the Sweeney Todd where they all played their own instruments and I think that was largely original cast members and it was astonishing! But I've seen really, sadly dull Les Miz professional companies who had just lost the spark.
Never been to Broadway, not yet. I had plans to see Spamalot's original cast and also The Gates In Central Park during a long weekend, but mr hippybear was grumpy about going and instead of going on my own I cancelled the trip. Foolish me.
I hear Sondheim has a new show opening next year. Maybe I need to keep my fingers on the pulse of that one.
posted by hippybear at 9:22 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
This is a fascinating ancedote/observation. Where I live might get a first-run touring company for two weeks, and then the show comes back and maybe it's the A company or the B company or C or D if it's really popular and doing long stays at every stop... but it's really rare that I've seen a Broadway touring company that was first class, first run touring... I saw the Sweeney Todd where they all played their own instruments and I think that was largely original cast members and it was astonishing! But I've seen really, sadly dull Les Miz professional companies who had just lost the spark.
Never been to Broadway, not yet. I had plans to see Spamalot's original cast and also The Gates In Central Park during a long weekend, but mr hippybear was grumpy about going and instead of going on my own I cancelled the trip. Foolish me.
I hear Sondheim has a new show opening next year. Maybe I need to keep my fingers on the pulse of that one.
posted by hippybear at 9:22 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
This work was my introduction to the full Sondheim. I knew individual songs of his (who doesn't know Send In The Clowns ?), but had never seen an entire work.
Happened completely at random. Turned on the telly one day, in the late 1980s, to see what was on offer, just as this was being introduced. Sat back, and loved it. Still do. :)
Just finished watching it, and pretty sure this was the very same production I saw in the late 80s. Which is a nice blast from the past. :)
Thanks, hippybear.
posted by Pouteria at 11:13 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
Happened completely at random. Turned on the telly one day, in the late 1980s, to see what was on offer, just as this was being introduced. Sat back, and loved it. Still do. :)
Just finished watching it, and pretty sure this was the very same production I saw in the late 80s. Which is a nice blast from the past. :)
Thanks, hippybear.
posted by Pouteria at 11:13 PM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]
Got to see the original cast on a low budget nyc trip. (I think this was the visit where an ultra low budget hotel let artists stay free if they designed the room, sounds like a good idea but.. artists. I was in the Elvis room, but Elvis as he was that day and he'd been dead for a couple years so creepy). Not a theater kid so all I remember about the anticipation of the show was looking forward to seeing Ms Peters up close. TKTS put me about four rows back, center, just amazing! But the first act she was no where to be found?? Was she off that night? Recall being perplexed and concerned, did I miss an announcement? So the second act reveal of the witch into this stunning broadway star just totally worked it's magic on me.
posted by sammyo at 5:20 AM on September 26, 2021 [5 favorites]
posted by sammyo at 5:20 AM on September 26, 2021 [5 favorites]
Never been to Broadway, not yet. I had plans to see Spamalot's original cast and also The Gates In Central Park during a long weekend, but mr hippybear was grumpy about going and instead of going on my own I cancelled the trip. Foolish me.
Our neighbor across the street, who loves musical theater so much he sees everything produced in a 90-mile radius, often including high school and community theater productions, tool himself to New York City for his 40th birthday, where he saw a matinee and an evening performance on Broadway every day for a week. It was his dream come true and I love that he took himself even though he didn't have anyone to go with him.
He recently attended his first live show since the start of the pandemic, and even though it was, like, a community college thing, he wore his tux to celebrate.
posted by Orlop at 7:49 AM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
Our neighbor across the street, who loves musical theater so much he sees everything produced in a 90-mile radius, often including high school and community theater productions, tool himself to New York City for his 40th birthday, where he saw a matinee and an evening performance on Broadway every day for a week. It was his dream come true and I love that he took himself even though he didn't have anyone to go with him.
He recently attended his first live show since the start of the pandemic, and even though it was, like, a community college thing, he wore his tux to celebrate.
posted by Orlop at 7:49 AM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
Which is to say, I am sure my neighbor would encourage you to go alone and have a blast, if it comes down to it.
posted by Orlop at 7:51 AM on September 26, 2021
posted by Orlop at 7:51 AM on September 26, 2021
Sooooooooo... the Baker's Wife's fate still bugs the crap out of me. Do I still like the show? Yeah. Lots in it to like. I, too, have adopted the witch's cri de coeur ("I'm not good, I'm not nice, I'M JUST RIGHT!") for my own.
But the philandering princes get off scot-free for exactly the same dereliction as she? Even though she plans to stick with her cinnamon-roll husband (and he is a precious cinnamon roll, I will hear no objections) henceforth, and they're as philandering as ever?
I don't like that, can't like that, will never like that. It's waaaaaaaay too Children-and-Artish for me, boxing women into boxes and punishing them for leaving those boxes. Which is what Sondheim does with women throughout his oeuvre and I wish he'd stop.
The death of the Giantess never sits right with me either. She is fully justified in her fury, but... that can't save a woman, in Sondheim. Little to nothing can.
posted by humbug at 10:28 AM on September 26, 2021 [6 favorites]
But the philandering princes get off scot-free for exactly the same dereliction as she? Even though she plans to stick with her cinnamon-roll husband (and he is a precious cinnamon roll, I will hear no objections) henceforth, and they're as philandering as ever?
I don't like that, can't like that, will never like that. It's waaaaaaaay too Children-and-Artish for me, boxing women into boxes and punishing them for leaving those boxes. Which is what Sondheim does with women throughout his oeuvre and I wish he'd stop.
The death of the Giantess never sits right with me either. She is fully justified in her fury, but... that can't save a woman, in Sondheim. Little to nothing can.
posted by humbug at 10:28 AM on September 26, 2021 [6 favorites]
Can we just take a moment and look at how ridiculously difficult Your Fault is to execute? If I were being musical director for a production, I'd start work on this song on rehearsal day one.
posted by hippybear at 12:11 PM on September 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 12:11 PM on September 26, 2021 [3 favorites]
I am sure my neighbor would encourage you to go alone
mr hippybear is difficult to pry loose at times, and I do a lot of things on my own. :D Lessons learned, etc.
posted by hippybear at 12:14 PM on September 26, 2021
mr hippybear is difficult to pry loose at times, and I do a lot of things on my own. :D Lessons learned, etc.
posted by hippybear at 12:14 PM on September 26, 2021
I imprinted on this show in 3rd or 4th grade, when we got the VHS of the Broadway. Which really set up a huge divide between me and the other theatre kids, who were much more the Guys and Dolls/Sound of Music crew.
I latched onto the Baker's Wife for a long time, and abhored Cinderella, in the same way I was Team Eponine, rather than Cosette. Pretty grils to whom the plot just happens were not my jam. Still aren't, though I'm increasingly sold on a reading of Cinderella as Aro/Ace and that has opened the character up some.
I have many feelings about the movie. Few of them are good.
Complete OT, and I forgot to mention on the Sunday thread. I desperately want a production of that show where they double Dot with the Act 2 George's ex, and the old lady (George's mother) with Marie. I feel like it would help a little with the issues humbug raises.
posted by DebetEsse at 12:53 PM on September 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
I latched onto the Baker's Wife for a long time, and abhored Cinderella, in the same way I was Team Eponine, rather than Cosette. Pretty grils to whom the plot just happens were not my jam. Still aren't, though I'm increasingly sold on a reading of Cinderella as Aro/Ace and that has opened the character up some.
I have many feelings about the movie. Few of them are good.
Complete OT, and I forgot to mention on the Sunday thread. I desperately want a production of that show where they double Dot with the Act 2 George's ex, and the old lady (George's mother) with Marie. I feel like it would help a little with the issues humbug raises.
posted by DebetEsse at 12:53 PM on September 26, 2021 [2 favorites]
There hasn't been a Sunday thread. Yet.
posted by hippybear at 1:08 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by hippybear at 1:08 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Oh, cool. Will bring it up there, then , when it happens
posted by DebetEsse at 3:11 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by DebetEsse at 3:11 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
Yet another cool fact: the original Broadway Cinderella married her Prince Charming - and they're still together, happily ever after...
posted by cheshyre at 6:16 PM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
posted by cheshyre at 6:16 PM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
Thanks all for sharing. I saw the movie a while back and bounced so very hard, but after reading the comments I will will definitely try again with the American Playhouse version.
posted by Sparx at 8:10 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by Sparx at 8:10 PM on September 26, 2021 [1 favorite]
I will will definitely try again with the American Playhouse version.
Yes, please do. Not only is it so much better in tone and execution than the movie, it has more humor and depth.
Also, it is possibly the best filming of any stage show I have ever seen. It was obviously VERY carefully planned with cameras and I know it was restaged to fit more in a 4:3 aspect ratio and had the lights redone for the cameras to pick up better.
It's really a remarkable document. I repeat, it's possibly the best filming of any stage show I have ever seen.
posted by hippybear at 8:15 PM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
Yes, please do. Not only is it so much better in tone and execution than the movie, it has more humor and depth.
Also, it is possibly the best filming of any stage show I have ever seen. It was obviously VERY carefully planned with cameras and I know it was restaged to fit more in a 4:3 aspect ratio and had the lights redone for the cameras to pick up better.
It's really a remarkable document. I repeat, it's possibly the best filming of any stage show I have ever seen.
posted by hippybear at 8:15 PM on September 26, 2021 [4 favorites]
Sooooooooo... the Baker's Wife's fate still bugs the crap out of me. ..... But the philandering princes get off scot-free for exactly the same dereliction as she? Even though she plans to stick with her cinnamon-roll husband (and he is a precious cinnamon roll, I will hear no objections) henceforth, and they're as philandering as ever? ..... I don't like that, can't like that, will never like that.
The way I see it is this: Life is messy. It is not fair, or just, or sensible. As soon as they kill off the narrator, it stops being a story and starts just being life, where things aren't wrapped up in a way that is satisfying. Bad things happen to good people, and good things happen to bad people.
I first saw the DVD version in college in the early 90s, at the behest of a friend who played the Wolf in the first high school production in the country, and it remains one of my favorites to this day. I sang "Giants in the Sky" at my junior recital in college, and, nearly 25 years later, got to play the Baker opposite my wife in an abridged production at our local UU church.
As I have aged, "No More" has become my favorite song in the show, and I can barely get through it without tears.
Can't we just pursue our lives, with our children and our wives,
'Til that happy day arrives, how do you ignore
All the witches, all the curses,
All the wolves, all the lies, the false hopes, the good-bye's,
The reverses,
All the wondering what even worse is still in store?
All the children.
All the giants..
No more.
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 7:56 AM on September 27, 2021 [4 favorites]
The way I see it is this: Life is messy. It is not fair, or just, or sensible. As soon as they kill off the narrator, it stops being a story and starts just being life, where things aren't wrapped up in a way that is satisfying. Bad things happen to good people, and good things happen to bad people.
I first saw the DVD version in college in the early 90s, at the behest of a friend who played the Wolf in the first high school production in the country, and it remains one of my favorites to this day. I sang "Giants in the Sky" at my junior recital in college, and, nearly 25 years later, got to play the Baker opposite my wife in an abridged production at our local UU church.
As I have aged, "No More" has become my favorite song in the show, and I can barely get through it without tears.
Can't we just pursue our lives, with our children and our wives,
'Til that happy day arrives, how do you ignore
All the witches, all the curses,
All the wolves, all the lies, the false hopes, the good-bye's,
The reverses,
All the wondering what even worse is still in store?
All the children.
All the giants..
No more.
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 7:56 AM on September 27, 2021 [4 favorites]
Like many other fiction writers, Ms Random and I adore this show. It has So Much to say about how stories work, and how to work stories, and how readers/audiences work. How to dig deeper into your characters and situations and themes. And that children will indeed listen.
All with such great songs to make the moments memorable.
posted by Quasirandom at 8:36 AM on September 27, 2021 [1 favorite]
All with such great songs to make the moments memorable.
posted by Quasirandom at 8:36 AM on September 27, 2021 [1 favorite]
The director of the vocal music program at my high school used to go to New York with his wife every spring break. My senior year somebody in the chorus got the idea in her head that she wanted not just to go to New York, but to take the same trip he did, so she wore him down and he opened the trip up. Bless his heart (and his wife's heart) I think at least a dozen kids came along. We saw the NYCO production of The Pajama Game (well, "saw" is generous, because it was warm in the upper tiers, we were tired, and most of us fell asleep); we saw Jerome Robbins' Broadway (too serious about itself and overlong); we saw Me and My Girl (utterly delightful); and I think every one of us had memorized every word of Into the Woods so that was the most anticipated ticket. It's probably still my favorite Sondheim.
Also since the Merrily thread has closed, I'll use this thread to say we finally watched "Best Worst Thing" last night instead of the Tony Awards. We paused right before it got to opening night and my wife (who is an actress, director, and acting teacher, and member of Actors Equity) said "I'm going to need a drink to get through the rest of this. You know what happens, right?" She said afterward she'd seen the Kennedy Center revival with Raul Esparza and Miriam Shor and they were great, but she couldn't remember who'd played Frank and she didn't think she ever needed to see the show again. The Post's critic called it "an attractively performed but hollow and illogical show." We then spent the better part of an hour looking up all the various revisions and wondering if it's a show that just can't be fixed.
posted by fedward at 9:11 AM on September 27, 2021
Also since the Merrily thread has closed, I'll use this thread to say we finally watched "Best Worst Thing" last night instead of the Tony Awards. We paused right before it got to opening night and my wife (who is an actress, director, and acting teacher, and member of Actors Equity) said "I'm going to need a drink to get through the rest of this. You know what happens, right?" She said afterward she'd seen the Kennedy Center revival with Raul Esparza and Miriam Shor and they were great, but she couldn't remember who'd played Frank and she didn't think she ever needed to see the show again. The Post's critic called it "an attractively performed but hollow and illogical show." We then spent the better part of an hour looking up all the various revisions and wondering if it's a show that just can't be fixed.
posted by fedward at 9:11 AM on September 27, 2021
Best Worst Thing seems, to me, to be a document of a production that could have been fixed early on but they tacked the wrong way and then corrected for that but on that same course. They might have backed up and taken a different direction but at some point the money- and time-sink become too much and you're going down THAT path regardless.
I do wonder if the Linklater film 1) will actually be completed (2030 opening date, I think?) and 2) if it will give better clarity to the entire thing and be a success or show that it's just flawed to begin with.
I have not seen or read the source play, so I don't know if that is also equally difficult. If it IS a difficult piece, it's interesting that Sondheim wanted to do it.
posted by hippybear at 5:51 PM on September 29, 2021
I do wonder if the Linklater film 1) will actually be completed (2030 opening date, I think?) and 2) if it will give better clarity to the entire thing and be a success or show that it's just flawed to begin with.
I have not seen or read the source play, so I don't know if that is also equally difficult. If it IS a difficult piece, it's interesting that Sondheim wanted to do it.
posted by hippybear at 5:51 PM on September 29, 2021
« Older I figured he knew what he was talking about. | Copying a mid-century stool….mid-14th century BCE Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by LionIndex at 5:42 AM on September 25, 2021 [1 favorite]