One of the most recognisable three-beat musical phrases in history

January 18, 2022 1:36 PM

Dun, Dun Duuun! Where did pop culture’s most dramatic sound come from? Yet though many of us are familiar with the sound, no one seems to know exactly where it came from. Try to Google it and … dun, dun, duuun! Its origins are a mystery.
posted by Cash4Lead (33 comments total)

Oh for god's sake. It's the opening of Richard Strauss's Elektra, OK? You know, Richard Strauss, the "Thus Spake Zarathustra" guy.
posted by Pallas Athena at 1:56 PM on January 18, 2022 [35 favorites]

Elektra. Dates to 1909. Several commenters on the Guardian article point this out, identifying it as "the Agamemnon motif". One commenter also notes "although the phrase can be found earlier" but doesn't provide examples.

Elektra is hardly obscure; speaks poorly for the Guardian author they didn't get to that when researching the article.
posted by Nelson at 2:01 PM on January 18, 2022 [13 favorites]

You'd think a Guardian columnist would have maybe watched one of the defining operas of the goddamn twentieth century. Or at least taken note of the amount that film and TV scores have quoted/cribbed from Strauss, and gone ferreting in his work just a little.

They don't even have to listen to the whole opera

It's the first three god damn chords

Baffling that they interview a bunch of film and TV composers and can't be arsed to phone up someone who works in classical music.

On preview, Nelson has it. Same link! Jinx, buy me a goblet of blood or something.
posted by Pallas Athena at 2:08 PM on January 18, 2022 [10 favorites]

I've heard some variants on it - most often with the three notes descending rather than with the higher note at the end. But I've certainly heard this and I didn't know that's where it came from. Cool! (Like finding out that the near-omnipresent "orchestra hit" "orch2" that was stock in some Fairlight synthesizers was the opening chord of Stravinsky's "Firebird Suite"
posted by rmd1023 at 2:11 PM on January 18, 2022 [7 favorites]

I could've sworn that there had been a FPP about the orchestra hit but I couldn't find it.
posted by rmd1023 at 2:12 PM on January 18, 2022 [1 favorite]

But this is a different dun dun duuuun than Dramatic Chipmunk, apparently?
posted by kaibutsu at 2:27 PM on January 18, 2022 [4 favorites]

rmd1023: Like finding out that the near-omnipresent "orchestra hit" "orch2" that was stock in some Fairlight synthesizers was the opening chord of Stravinsky's "Firebird Suite"

Here's a video about the connection.
posted by indexy at 2:29 PM on January 18, 2022 [6 favorites]

The article is about the use of the sting in popular media to denote dramatic tension. Its use in a significant opera seems like an important part of the story that the article missed, but saying that the answer is obviously Elektra, case closed, seems to be really missing the point. And borderline threadshitting I might add. I thought it was a good article and it provoked some interesting thoughts about the ways these sorts of cultural memes embed themselves without most people consciously thinking about it. The connection to early radio dramas and even earlier, less-well-documented vaudeville, is intriguing.
posted by biogeo at 2:30 PM on January 18, 2022 [8 favorites]

Now I'm curious about the origin of the comic snare drum/cymbal crash? Is there a known earliest example?
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 2:39 PM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]

But this is a different dun dun duuuun than Dramatic Chipmunk, apparently?

Yeah, that's the only one I've ever heard, of which the earliest use I'm personally aware of is in the Young Frankenstein movie (at 0:30).
posted by Greg_Ace at 2:44 PM on January 18, 2022 [5 favorites]

two drums and a cymbal fall off a cliff
posted by flabdablet at 2:53 PM on January 18, 2022 [7 favorites]

Now do ♩.♪♩♩
posted by acb at 2:56 PM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]

I never took “dun dun dunnnn” in text to represent a particular orchestral sting. I thought it was just a reference to the basic concept of a dramatic orchestral or organ sting as found in many, many pieces of media (radio dramas being the first to come to mind for me, as well).
posted by atoxyl at 3:06 PM on January 18, 2022

Now do ♩.♪♩♩

That is Dragnet.
posted by rpophessagr at 3:20 PM on January 18, 2022 [13 favorites]

The article is about the use of the sting in popular media to denote dramatic tension. Its use in a significant opera seems like an important part of the story that the article missed

The article seeks the origin of this common musical gesture, and the most likely candidate is the opening of the extremely famous and pervasively influential Strauss opera Elektra (1909). That the author missed that is a huge oversight, within the framing presented by the article itself. It's hardly threadshitting to point that out, and also causes the author to miss some interesting questions, i.e., how did a famously suspenseful musical gesture from an opera find its way into radio and cinema? Was Modernist opera influential on radio or early cinema in other notable ways? (spoiler: yes, it was)
posted by LooseFilter at 3:29 PM on January 18, 2022 [10 favorites]

Dun dun dun dah, dun dun dun dah, dun dun, (dun dah dahh.) Yup it is the very end of the Dragnet sound meme. This opening music, even has some Star Wars Evil Empire, overtones.
posted by Oyéah at 4:08 PM on January 18, 2022

You'd think a Guardian columnist would have maybe watched one of the defining operas of the goddamn twentieth century.

Why would you think that?
posted by escape from the potato planet at 4:44 PM on January 18, 2022 [10 favorites]

Oh, but the theme music for Dragnet has its own controversies!
posted by queensissy at 4:44 PM on January 18, 2022

In my head, the song that always comes to mind is "The Pink Panther"
posted by thivaia at 5:05 PM on January 18, 2022 [1 favorite]

Good lord, when you know the actual origin of this trope, the article becomes a real comedy of errors with the author getting painfully close to the right answer.

Hand says the medium tended to adopt already popular tropes to entice listeners. “They imported that musical structure and musical language,” he says, pointing to Victorian stage melodramas.
...
"It seems stinger chords must have been entrenched enough in melodrama by 1912 to invite parody.”
...
But where did he find the inspiration? Walter’s mother, an amateur pianist, used to play Edwardian and Victorian melodrama in the house.

you're literally a single google away agghhhhh
posted by ZaphodB at 6:16 PM on January 18, 2022 [3 favorites]

Now do ♩.♪♩♩

okay
posted by flabdablet at 6:54 PM on January 18, 2022 [4 favorites]

[walk into thread expecting lighthearted pop-cultural amusement]
[come to the horrified realization that everyone's already shouting]
[DRAMATIC ORCHESTRAL STING]
posted by flexible-footwear figurine at 7:14 PM on January 18, 2022 [22 favorites]

flabdablet, that was extremely enjoyable. I especially liked the attention to detail of the fire flickering off the tree behind the perp.
posted by tllaya at 7:33 PM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]

My brain did the thing where I read, "One of the most recognisable..." and instantly said to itself, "MUST BE ABOUT THE LAW AND ORDER SOUND" and I was wrong but this was interesting, I did NOT know about the Strauss connection.

chun chun!
posted by missmobtown at 7:37 PM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]

Several years ago, I got so stoned that I became convinced it was possible to determine the origins of “Ta-daaaa!”, and that the original sacred or secular work it referenced was hiding in plain sight. I eventually got tangled up on the matter of whether the “chig-a-dunnnnng” of a strummed Spanish guitar was an approximation of a brass ta-da, or the other way around.

Actually, I can pinpoint the time exactly, because it started with reading this delightful FPP which mentions a backup dancer named Ta-da! The Shit Lady.
posted by Jon_Evil at 11:00 PM on January 18, 2022

I don't think the sting as used in Elektra fully fits in to the meme usage. Usually it's used after a dramatic reveal and is followed by a pause. Maybe someone familiar with the opera can provide context? And if the stereotypical use was already being parodied in 1912, then I also doubt Elektra was the first work that sting was used in.
posted by starfishprime at 12:58 AM on January 19, 2022 [2 favorites]

It's actually 500 kabuki feet stomping run through digital processors

oh wait, you mean the other sound
posted by klangklangston at 1:48 AM on January 19, 2022

The thing about the dun-dun-duuuuun, is that there are several variations. Sometimes it’s like the opening of Strauss’ Elektra, and sometimes like “dramatic chipmunk”, and I’ve heard other variations too. The article isn’t about any one of them, but the general phenomenon of the dramatic use of the dun-dun-duuuuun.
posted by Kattullus at 2:30 AM on January 19, 2022 [1 favorite]

Maybe I'm being daft or naive, but I did Google for a minute and couldn't find a citation for the dramatic "Dun-Dun-Duuuun"s origins in the Elektra opening - does anyone have a source? They are quite different, musically, Elektra melody being I V iii and DunDunDun being iii I iv (or vi).
posted by cogat at 2:31 AM on January 19, 2022 [7 favorites]

I don't know anything about music theory but the Elektra thing in the YouTube video sounds different to me except for being short-short-long. Is it actually the same notes or chords? Or is it just that it's short-short-long?
posted by TheophileEscargot at 3:18 AM on January 19, 2022

Related: I fell down a wikipedia rabbit hole on riffs:
Oriental riff
Arabian riff
Tarantella Napoletana

It's astonishing how old some of these are, and how much they've lived on.
posted by snerson at 7:11 AM on January 19, 2022 [5 favorites]

There's a place in France
Where the naked ladies dance

So, the Arabian riff then.
posted by Bee'sWing at 8:36 AM on January 19, 2022 [2 favorites]

When I read it written out, I always hear it as Rachmaninoff's Op. 3 #2 Prelude in C# minor.
posted by ctmf at 4:34 PM on January 19, 2022