Pop Music
January 13, 2023 11:58 AM Subscribe
Amazing how it goes from quality to....uh...less than...as the industry has changed over the decades. IMO.
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:12 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:12 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Respectfully disagree--that list starts with 'Sweet Home Alabama' and 'Hotel California,' two songs I would be happy to never hear again.
I'd rather listen to Beyonce or Taylor Swift any day.
posted by box at 12:17 PM on January 13, 2023 [25 favorites]
I'd rather listen to Beyonce or Taylor Swift any day.
posted by box at 12:17 PM on January 13, 2023 [25 favorites]
Interestingly, Taylor Swift is not on there (yet), I guess because her listens are more widely distributed over songs.
posted by grobstein at 12:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by grobstein at 12:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
There's a huge difference between something along the lines of Queen, AC/DC, Michael Jackson, Dr. Dre, and...The Weeknd, Post Malone, Ed Sheeran, Harry Styles. Musically. That's my only point. Music has taken SUCH a dive in uniqueness, it bums me out.
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:29 PM on January 13, 2023 [15 favorites]
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:29 PM on January 13, 2023 [15 favorites]
So a couple months back, I had to listen to about 90minutes of music on a "pop" radio station while on a road-trip.
I could not distinguish between 80-90% of the songs - the musical style, approach and vocals were... not unique.
But... I am also 50 and beginning to have some hearing problems, so... (insert 'old man yells at cloud/kids' meme) ... don't listen to me...
posted by rozcakj at 12:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I could not distinguish between 80-90% of the songs - the musical style, approach and vocals were... not unique.
But... I am also 50 and beginning to have some hearing problems, so... (insert 'old man yells at cloud/kids' meme) ... don't listen to me...
posted by rozcakj at 12:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I would LOVE to see how this maps to money made, because from what I can tell Ed Sheeran commands at least 1/3 of the entire music industry.
I do like that "Pumped Up Kicks" song tho. /lawn
posted by rhizome at 12:41 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
I do like that "Pumped Up Kicks" song tho. /lawn
posted by rhizome at 12:41 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
(Music is of course subjective - like whatever you like. Trends are measurable. The other sad thing is the complexity of lyrics has gone down as producers realized that simpler songs gain more popularity faster.)
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:43 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:43 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I'm genuinely surprised there aren't any songs or artists from before 1970 on the list.
posted by star gentle uterus at 12:46 PM on January 13, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by star gentle uterus at 12:46 PM on January 13, 2023 [8 favorites]
Anyway, here's Wonderwall.
posted by JHarris at 12:47 PM on January 13, 2023 [33 favorites]
posted by JHarris at 12:47 PM on January 13, 2023 [33 favorites]
Hey! XXXTentacion! That’s depressing.
posted by Going To Maine at 12:48 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Going To Maine at 12:48 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Nothing wrong with simple.
posted by maxwelton at 12:48 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by maxwelton at 12:48 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I am afraid it might reflect a lower vocabulary in the public at large. And it's a problem for me cause every song sounds the same - even in lyrical content.
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by tiny frying pan at 12:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
It's cool, but boy, would this be better if it was an actual interactive chart rather than a .jpg. Where you could mouseover all of the unnamed people and find out who the fuck they were (and what the unlabelled songs were) rather than trying to puzzle out who the three tiny faces in a circle might be from context. (I admit that I'm both worse on faces and worse at knowing what musicians look like than most, but still...) You could also use colour to have some actual meaning, rather than the gradient from green to purple meaning "how close to the top of the screen you are".
posted by Superilla at 12:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [23 favorites]
posted by Superilla at 12:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [23 favorites]
tiny frying pan: "Music is of course subjective - like whatever you like. "
Right? Last night I picked up my teen from soccer, and he informed me that pulling up at the curb blasting Rage Against the Machine was "cringe". I mean... really? Are the Kids These Days™ not into that?
(It got even better for me, because when I stopped playing Down Rodeo and flipped instead to our local radio station, they were in the middle of Renegades of Funk. I made him listen.)
posted by caution live frogs at 12:56 PM on January 13, 2023 [11 favorites]
Right? Last night I picked up my teen from soccer, and he informed me that pulling up at the curb blasting Rage Against the Machine was "cringe". I mean... really? Are the Kids These Days™ not into that?
(It got even better for me, because when I stopped playing Down Rodeo and flipped instead to our local radio station, they were in the middle of Renegades of Funk. I made him listen.)
posted by caution live frogs at 12:56 PM on January 13, 2023 [11 favorites]
Amazing how it goes from quality to....uh...less than...as the industry has changed over the decades. IMO.
I don't think this is wrong but it has less to do with "music sure used to be better, right?" and more to do with "Streaming is how new music is accessed now, and the stuff from prior decades that clears this hurdle for number of listens is going to be stuff that culture has already agreed upon."
Though obviously music peaked when I was fourteen.
posted by Navelgazer at 12:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [35 favorites]
I don't think this is wrong but it has less to do with "music sure used to be better, right?" and more to do with "Streaming is how new music is accessed now, and the stuff from prior decades that clears this hurdle for number of listens is going to be stuff that culture has already agreed upon."
Though obviously music peaked when I was fourteen.
posted by Navelgazer at 12:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [35 favorites]
Glass Animals is the surprise for me in the 2bn+ club.
posted by chaz at 12:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by chaz at 12:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
Also, XXXTentacion and JuiceWRLD, two artists who died very young and somehow reached almost unheard of levels of success before that.
posted by chaz at 12:59 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by chaz at 12:59 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
ladies and gentlemen, the weeknd
posted by schmod at 1:00 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by schmod at 1:00 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
Glass Animals is the surprise for me in the 2bn+ club.
There was an episode of Slate's Hit Parade podcast hung on this -- when the year's biggest song (Harry Styles' "As It Was") loses out on the Billboard end-of-year list to a long-running slow-boil (in this case, "Heat Waves"). Really great listen.
posted by uncleozzy at 1:01 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
There was an episode of Slate's Hit Parade podcast hung on this -- when the year's biggest song (Harry Styles' "As It Was") loses out on the Billboard end-of-year list to a long-running slow-boil (in this case, "Heat Waves"). Really great listen.
posted by uncleozzy at 1:01 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Ah, I see we're doing another post where people on Metafilter complain about the music the youths like.
I flat disagree that music has taken such a dive in uniqueness. If you don't believe me, perhaps spend some time exploring bandcamp dot com. There's MORE music, in far more diverse genres, right at your fingertips, than there ever has been. Sure, the industry that has established algorithmic playlists as the main funding mechanism is funneling ears toward lowest common denominator pop music, but I really don't think you can use that evidence to make any sweeping arguments about music as a whole.
posted by TheKaijuCommuter at 1:07 PM on January 13, 2023 [37 favorites]
I flat disagree that music has taken such a dive in uniqueness. If you don't believe me, perhaps spend some time exploring bandcamp dot com. There's MORE music, in far more diverse genres, right at your fingertips, than there ever has been. Sure, the industry that has established algorithmic playlists as the main funding mechanism is funneling ears toward lowest common denominator pop music, but I really don't think you can use that evidence to make any sweeping arguments about music as a whole.
posted by TheKaijuCommuter at 1:07 PM on January 13, 2023 [37 favorites]
I don't have any issue with streaming being the primary method therefore is mostly newer artists, but the older tracks make me scratch my head. And why only one track for each? You can't tell me Lynrd Skynrd or Fleetwood Mac (or Radiohead) has a digital streaming marketing team that pushes only one song? And September for Earth Wind & Fire, but not Thriller for Michael Jackson, taking advantage of Halloween plays? What's going on here?
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:09 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:09 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
music peaked when I was fourteen.
My taste in music sucked when I was fourteen. Music for me peaked yesterday, but that's more about me finding and liking more and better music than it is industry trends and Spotify stats.
(For one thing, all the music my peer group taught me to sneer at just happened to include almost everything that wasn't by straight-presenting male white guys. Amazing how much more good music there is when you're not worried about who else does or doesn't like it.)
(For another thing, I was fourteen.)
posted by straight at 1:10 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
My taste in music sucked when I was fourteen. Music for me peaked yesterday, but that's more about me finding and liking more and better music than it is industry trends and Spotify stats.
(For one thing, all the music my peer group taught me to sneer at just happened to include almost everything that wasn't by straight-presenting male white guys. Amazing how much more good music there is when you're not worried about who else does or doesn't like it.)
(For another thing, I was fourteen.)
posted by straight at 1:10 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
Wait, we’re going to complain about how music sucks these days, but we’re not going to complain about a graphic that uses color to indicate the release date while also arranging everything chronologically on a timeline? Where are our priorities and what are we even doing here?
posted by snofoam at 1:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [38 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 1:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [38 favorites]
I flat disagree that music has taken such a dive in uniqueness. If you don't believe me, perhaps spend some time exploring bandcamp dot com.
It has though - this is measurable. In pop music. We aren't talking about bandcamp, or the huge diversity in types of music now, which is indeed heartening. I'm in several bands and that part of the musical world is very cool.
posted by tiny frying pan at 1:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
It has though - this is measurable. In pop music. We aren't talking about bandcamp, or the huge diversity in types of music now, which is indeed heartening. I'm in several bands and that part of the musical world is very cool.
posted by tiny frying pan at 1:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
I'm actually happy that it is so heavily weighted towards newer songs. I was worried that us geezers would just be listening to songs from our youth. I'm sure that still happens but not to the extent that the songs are getting a billion streams. Or maybe more of us don't bother with streaming and are still listening to our CDs or downloaded MP3s. Although it does freak me out a bit that I couldn't see U2's picture anywhere even though they must be the biggest band of the last 40 years.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
All pop music today is produced by 3-4 different Norwegian men, that's why it sounds so similar.
Sort of like the Brill Building days I suppose. The real diversity in pop music was in the 1980s, when almost any type of music could become a hit. The 90's started to segregate into pop genres, and now we're in the golden age of Scandinavian productions.
posted by chaz at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
Sort of like the Brill Building days I suppose. The real diversity in pop music was in the 1980s, when almost any type of music could become a hit. The 90's started to segregate into pop genres, and now we're in the golden age of Scandinavian productions.
posted by chaz at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
What's going on here?
An algorithm, that's what's going on, many of these streams are not things which anyone actively chose to listen to. On Spotify record company payola determines who gets the most streams.
posted by Lanark at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
An algorithm, that's what's going on, many of these streams are not things which anyone actively chose to listen to. On Spotify record company payola determines who gets the most streams.
posted by Lanark at 1:14 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
An algorithm, that's what's going on, many of these streams are not things which anyone actively chose to listen to. On Spotify record company payola determines who gets the most streams.
Maybe, but I would think it would mirror radio a bit closer, ie: several Fleetwood Mac, Prince, MJ, and so on tracks. Some amount of research has gone into determining a broad base of generic playlist. I would also assume an algorithm-based listing would have fewer new tracks, because even though young people are the primary consumers of new music, the fact that they sit in school for 8 hours a day means they are not the primary listeners of music in general.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Maybe, but I would think it would mirror radio a bit closer, ie: several Fleetwood Mac, Prince, MJ, and so on tracks. Some amount of research has gone into determining a broad base of generic playlist. I would also assume an algorithm-based listing would have fewer new tracks, because even though young people are the primary consumers of new music, the fact that they sit in school for 8 hours a day means they are not the primary listeners of music in general.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Man, this is the most humbug fuckin thread I’ve seen in a long time.
posted by uncleozzy at 1:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [29 favorites]
posted by uncleozzy at 1:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [29 favorites]
I guarantee young people are listening to music while they are at school!
posted by tiny frying pan at 1:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by tiny frying pan at 1:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I would imagine we would get a somewhat different list if we could see the all-time top played songs on Apple Music, or top songs ever played on a Zune player, or top songs ever sent to speakers via gold-plated audiophile cables.
It is interesting that despite the promise of access to a kajillion songs, Spotify has probably, by volume, basically replicated ultra playlisted, repetitive FM radio of the olden days.
Also, I don’t have Spotify, but can we work on getting a billion streams for Will to Power’s Baby, I Love Your Way/Free Bird medley? I feel like the good ol’ days are not represented adequately without it. Also, no Phil Collins?!?!
posted by snofoam at 1:24 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
It is interesting that despite the promise of access to a kajillion songs, Spotify has probably, by volume, basically replicated ultra playlisted, repetitive FM radio of the olden days.
Also, I don’t have Spotify, but can we work on getting a billion streams for Will to Power’s Baby, I Love Your Way/Free Bird medley? I feel like the good ol’ days are not represented adequately without it. Also, no Phil Collins?!?!
posted by snofoam at 1:24 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Spotify and YouTube changed how people listen to music. Post-millenial cohorts are far more into the weeds of microgenres and have more diverse/omnivorous tastes. This is also reflected in new music where you can hear influences colliding in ways that would have been impossible pre-internet because nobody could ever be exposed to hat much music, let alone afford the records.
The flipside of this is that mainstream pop music is even more lowest common denominator. Not to say that it's bad, but that it has to have broad appeal and a certain amount of blandness so that it can fit in many different playlists and mixes. I think you could even argue that popular music as we thought if it before 2010 or so doesn't exist as a category anymore.
There's more new music of more varieties and at higher production quality than ever before. Anyone that says they can't find good new music isn't trying.
posted by forbiddencabinet at 1:31 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
The flipside of this is that mainstream pop music is even more lowest common denominator. Not to say that it's bad, but that it has to have broad appeal and a certain amount of blandness so that it can fit in many different playlists and mixes. I think you could even argue that popular music as we thought if it before 2010 or so doesn't exist as a category anymore.
There's more new music of more varieties and at higher production quality than ever before. Anyone that says they can't find good new music isn't trying.
posted by forbiddencabinet at 1:31 PM on January 13, 2023 [9 favorites]
It has though - this is measurable. In pop music.
Yes, the very most popular music has become less diverse. This is what you would expect in a healthy, diverse music environment.
In the 60s, 70s and 80s, if you liked music from a less-common genre, there were probably only a few examples of it widely available. So everybody who liked that genre listened to those few artists, and they became popular. No classical-guitar solo will ever be as popular as "Classical Gas" was because there now are thousands of great guitar pieces available, and no single one of them is gonna capture the attention of everybody who likes that sort of thing.
This is like that video game company who had an extremely flexible character creator and was disappointed to see that the most common character was some minor variation on the default white guy. But this is because the creator was so flexible that there were dozens of variable traits with hundreds of choices. Even if everybody went wild, no single hair color or belt buckle would likely be more popular than the default.
posted by straight at 1:32 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
Yes, the very most popular music has become less diverse. This is what you would expect in a healthy, diverse music environment.
In the 60s, 70s and 80s, if you liked music from a less-common genre, there were probably only a few examples of it widely available. So everybody who liked that genre listened to those few artists, and they became popular. No classical-guitar solo will ever be as popular as "Classical Gas" was because there now are thousands of great guitar pieces available, and no single one of them is gonna capture the attention of everybody who likes that sort of thing.
This is like that video game company who had an extremely flexible character creator and was disappointed to see that the most common character was some minor variation on the default white guy. But this is because the creator was so flexible that there were dozens of variable traits with hundreds of choices. Even if everybody went wild, no single hair color or belt buckle would likely be more popular than the default.
posted by straight at 1:32 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
I'm blown away by that chart. What is that, like $250 in royalties?
posted by JoeZydeco at 1:34 PM on January 13, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by JoeZydeco at 1:34 PM on January 13, 2023 [12 favorites]
related: The Fake Artists Problem Is Much Worse Than You Realize - Ted Gioia
“Across all streaming services an increasing share of consumption is happening in areas of the product that is entirely controlled by the DSP [digital streaming platform], because as it turns out, most users prefer easy access to pre-curated experiences vs doing the work of actively finding what to listen to.”
“Even Sony and Universal Music created playlists for these types of use cases under their Digster and Filtr brands long before Spotify ever did.”
posted by Lanark at 1:38 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
“Across all streaming services an increasing share of consumption is happening in areas of the product that is entirely controlled by the DSP [digital streaming platform], because as it turns out, most users prefer easy access to pre-curated experiences vs doing the work of actively finding what to listen to.”
“Even Sony and Universal Music created playlists for these types of use cases under their Digster and Filtr brands long before Spotify ever did.”
posted by Lanark at 1:38 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
I want to see the list of the most played songs at dive bar karaoke nights in the suburban US. Or the most-played New Zealand 7” singles on midnight to 6am slots on Boston college radio in the 1990s. I know somewhere there are some lists that will make sense to me.
posted by snofoam at 1:44 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 1:44 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
Spotify and YouTube changed how people listen to music. Post-millenial cohorts are far more into the weeds of microgenres and have more diverse/omnivorous tastes.
Well that fact that the top 6 songs monthly listening count is more than the entire US population seems to disagree wit that assessment, at least among people who listen via Spotify. Seems like they listen to a short list of the same songs over and over and over.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:45 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Well that fact that the top 6 songs monthly listening count is more than the entire US population seems to disagree wit that assessment, at least among people who listen via Spotify. Seems like they listen to a short list of the same songs over and over and over.
posted by The_Vegetables at 1:45 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I don't know how many people actually listen to Spotify playlists dominated by these All-Time Greatest Streaming Hits. But even if everybody in the world had much, much more diverse playlists than they do now, the top of the charts would still be something like this because any single variation from the bland norm that becomes popular enough to make the charts just becomes the bland norm.
The only way the top of the charts can be diverse is if the whole world has a tiny selection of music to choose from so that everybody who likes something different can rally around the same different thing.
posted by straight at 1:45 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
The only way the top of the charts can be diverse is if the whole world has a tiny selection of music to choose from so that everybody who likes something different can rally around the same different thing.
posted by straight at 1:45 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
gonna get 'orinoco flow' on that chart even if i have to do it all on my own
posted by logicpunk at 1:50 PM on January 13, 2023 [43 favorites]
posted by logicpunk at 1:50 PM on January 13, 2023 [43 favorites]
. . .but we’re not going to complain about a graphic that uses color to indicate the release date while also arranging everything chronologically on a timeline? Where are our priorities and what are we even doing here?
THANK YOU. How about implying some sort of X-axis distribution in the overall shape without it actually representing anything! Kids these days and their supposed infographics, please.
posted by Think_Long at 1:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
THANK YOU. How about implying some sort of X-axis distribution in the overall shape without it actually representing anything! Kids these days and their supposed infographics, please.
posted by Think_Long at 1:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
gonna get 'orinoco flow' on that chart even if i have to do it all on my own
I'd bet a dollar it's on there as a backing sample at least twice.
posted by mhoye at 1:56 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
I'd bet a dollar it's on there as a backing sample at least twice.
posted by mhoye at 1:56 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
The most recent song on this list that I actually know I've heard, just from looking at the name, is "The Shape of You" from 2017. I am officially old and out of touch! Time to go find some young people and explain to them that their music sucks
posted by Gerald Bostock at 2:01 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Gerald Bostock at 2:01 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I feel like this chart tells us much more about this streaming company than it tells us about music
posted by eustatic at 2:05 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by eustatic at 2:05 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
For Apple Music, here's playlist updated daily showing the top 100 tracks played on that platform in the United States. There are similar playlists for other countries, too.
For the US playlist, I can honestly say I haven't heard of most of the artists on it, and don't own/stream any of the tracks on it. One song by SZA features Phoebe Bridgers, so I give myself a quarter of a point.
posted by emelenjr at 2:06 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
For the US playlist, I can honestly say I haven't heard of most of the artists on it, and don't own/stream any of the tracks on it. One song by SZA features Phoebe Bridgers, so I give myself a quarter of a point.
posted by emelenjr at 2:06 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
top songs ever sent to speakers via gold-plated audiophile cables.
Tom Sawyer by Rush, or maybe More Than A Feeling by Boston. On vinyl, obviously. Does it count if it was listened to via a comically large pair of headphones?
posted by dephlogisticated at 2:08 PM on January 13, 2023 [13 favorites]
Tom Sawyer by Rush, or maybe More Than A Feeling by Boston. On vinyl, obviously. Does it count if it was listened to via a comically large pair of headphones?
posted by dephlogisticated at 2:08 PM on January 13, 2023 [13 favorites]
This is also really interesting to look at though the lens of having been religiously reading Tom Breihan's "The Number Ones" column for almost five years now. He's going through every Billboard #1 song from the late '50s to, well, 2006 as of today's entry, but he's not stopping anytime soon as far as we know.
But one big takeaway from it (aside from excellent music history, criticism, and humor) is that, aside from a few big names (The Beatles, Michael Jackson, Madonna, Mariah Carey, etc.) the music we most identify with an era now isn't generally what was the most popular in its moment. Take the '70s, for instance. Some disco and hard rock topped the charts, but not most of the things we think of as the big, generation-defining tracks of that era. According the the charts the seventies were all about like, Ray Stevens, or The Captain & Tennille. Tony Orlando & Dawn.
I don't know what songs from nowadays will still have legs in 10-20 years, but it obviously won't be most of what we're seeing on the southern end of this infographic. Most of this will be in the Tony Orlando zone.
posted by Navelgazer at 2:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [20 favorites]
But one big takeaway from it (aside from excellent music history, criticism, and humor) is that, aside from a few big names (The Beatles, Michael Jackson, Madonna, Mariah Carey, etc.) the music we most identify with an era now isn't generally what was the most popular in its moment. Take the '70s, for instance. Some disco and hard rock topped the charts, but not most of the things we think of as the big, generation-defining tracks of that era. According the the charts the seventies were all about like, Ray Stevens, or The Captain & Tennille. Tony Orlando & Dawn.
I don't know what songs from nowadays will still have legs in 10-20 years, but it obviously won't be most of what we're seeing on the southern end of this infographic. Most of this will be in the Tony Orlando zone.
posted by Navelgazer at 2:11 PM on January 13, 2023 [20 favorites]
For the US playlist, I can honestly say I haven't heard of most of the artists on it, and don't own/stream any of the tracks on it. One song by SZA features Phoebe Bridgers, so I give myself a quarter of a point.
SZA's new album was pretty highly rated and likely would have made the top albums lists if it wasn't released in December. Think about it this way, if Phoebe Bridgers decided to make a track with her then there's gotta be something to her right? At the same time because it came out recently of course it'll be over represented in the top 100 songs played today, I mean that list is more about "these are the albums people are listening to right now" as opposed to what's great and will be listened to in a couple of years, but hey Belle and Sebastian just came out with a new album today so maybe that list will soon look a lot different (probably not).
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 2:20 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
SZA's new album was pretty highly rated and likely would have made the top albums lists if it wasn't released in December. Think about it this way, if Phoebe Bridgers decided to make a track with her then there's gotta be something to her right? At the same time because it came out recently of course it'll be over represented in the top 100 songs played today, I mean that list is more about "these are the albums people are listening to right now" as opposed to what's great and will be listened to in a couple of years, but hey Belle and Sebastian just came out with a new album today so maybe that list will soon look a lot different (probably not).
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 2:20 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Does it count if it was listened to via a comically large pair of headphones?
If you aren't listening to music via a comically large pair of headphones are you really listening to music or just playing it?
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 2:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
If you aren't listening to music via a comically large pair of headphones are you really listening to music or just playing it?
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 2:22 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
Right? Last night I picked up my teen from soccer, and he informed me that pulling up at the curb blasting Rage Against the Machine was "cringe". I mean... really? Are the Kids These Days™ not into that?
RATM has always been cringe. I don’t begrudge them making the choice to be on a major label and make a true career of music without having day jobs but revolutionary socialism doesn’t hit so hard coming from Sony Music on stadium tours.
“Fuck you I won’t do what you tell me”. Ok, Zack.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 2:25 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
RATM has always been cringe. I don’t begrudge them making the choice to be on a major label and make a true career of music without having day jobs but revolutionary socialism doesn’t hit so hard coming from Sony Music on stadium tours.
“Fuck you I won’t do what you tell me”. Ok, Zack.
posted by Special Agent Dale Cooper at 2:25 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Sincerely, although artists are actually not paid per stream (which, today I learned), using the low estimate calculated by USA Today, each song w/ 1 billion stream nets the artist $3.3 million.
@the_vegetables:
As for why only 1 song from a particular artist: I think it's a combination of factors, including that folks under say 30, were probably only familiar with them when a song had a cultural moment. and in the case of dreams by fleetwood mac; it was in the extremely viral tiktok video .
If you look at fleetwood mac's data on last.fm, dreams by far is the top (1.4 mil) (i crudely add the original and remaster song titles together); Go your own way at 1.2, the chain at 1.1, and everything else under 1million listeners.
Lastly, the Beatles weren't on spotify until 2016 so that may play a small factor why they aren't in the billion club yet.
Navelgazer, yes!! Totally agree! I'd add artists like Air Supply, bryan adams, and the carpenters that were extremely popular during when their music was first released and now has relatively little contemporary cultural presence nowadays
posted by fizzix at 2:29 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
@the_vegetables:
As for why only 1 song from a particular artist: I think it's a combination of factors, including that folks under say 30, were probably only familiar with them when a song had a cultural moment. and in the case of dreams by fleetwood mac; it was in the extremely viral tiktok video .
If you look at fleetwood mac's data on last.fm, dreams by far is the top (1.4 mil) (i crudely add the original and remaster song titles together); Go your own way at 1.2, the chain at 1.1, and everything else under 1million listeners.
Lastly, the Beatles weren't on spotify until 2016 so that may play a small factor why they aren't in the billion club yet.
Navelgazer, yes!! Totally agree! I'd add artists like Air Supply, bryan adams, and the carpenters that were extremely popular during when their music was first released and now has relatively little contemporary cultural presence nowadays
posted by fizzix at 2:29 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
The billion stream spotify songs of the last decade or whatever, are probably an approximation of the billboard hot 100 of previous eras, since they are including the streams of the songs when they were released. One thing that I notice is that the recent ones are dominated by young artists (as far as I can tell, aside from one Elton John remix?). By contrast, the billboard top 100 of 1988 (when I was young) had some Debbie Gibson/Tiffany/Rick Astley stuff, but it is also full of aging rockers who started their careers decades earlier, like George Harrison/Chicago/Aerosmith/Phil Collins. I guess that's because radio was still playing tons of stuff for baby boomers and Gen X was a relatively small cohort? As much as some pop music can be pretty silly and disposable, I can't really imagine any time being lamer than 80s Don Henley/Starship era. There were so many (in my opinion) artistic has-beens getting huge hits out of relatively lame songs. I feel like that's not as much of a thing anymore. The Cure is playing huge concerts, but they're not topping the charts.
posted by snofoam at 2:31 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 2:31 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
One thing that I notice is that the recent ones are dominated by young artists (as far as I can tell, aside from one Elton John remix?)
I think that's your age showing. Coldplay has many tracks on the 1b list, and one from 2000, meaning the gap between their first hit and their latest (Something Just Like This with The Chainsmokers) is almost 20 years. In other words, it's exactly like Aerosmith and RUN DMC, or Aerosmith and Desmond Child writing songs for them in the '80s.
Also, I'd argue that nearly every one of the past artists (Bon Jovi, Journey, Toto, Lynrd Skynrd) are pretty lame with the rest maybe being exceptions, so Spotify listeners of older music have pretty lame taste.
posted by The_Vegetables at 2:51 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I think that's your age showing. Coldplay has many tracks on the 1b list, and one from 2000, meaning the gap between their first hit and their latest (Something Just Like This with The Chainsmokers) is almost 20 years. In other words, it's exactly like Aerosmith and RUN DMC, or Aerosmith and Desmond Child writing songs for them in the '80s.
Also, I'd argue that nearly every one of the past artists (Bon Jovi, Journey, Toto, Lynrd Skynrd) are pretty lame with the rest maybe being exceptions, so Spotify listeners of older music have pretty lame taste.
posted by The_Vegetables at 2:51 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
The other day I happened to be reading The KLF’s The Manual (How To Have A Number 1 The Easy Way) and it struck me that apart from pop songs still being roughly 3 to 3’40” in length, everything else has altered so fundamentally about pop music that the document is very hard to understand history now. They are a different commodity, produced and listened to in a different arrangement, by different groups, by workers with different goals, and even like people pointing out bandcamp say, by atomised micro fanships rather than masses. It’s remarkable.
I would genuinely like to read some contemporary Cauty-Drummond make the same kind of observations about today’s political economy of music.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 2:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
I would genuinely like to read some contemporary Cauty-Drummond make the same kind of observations about today’s political economy of music.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 2:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
However that Post Malone sucks is a testable & objective fact
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 3:02 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 3:02 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
It is hard to know who exactly is in that graphic, but I'm not so sure that the Coldplay exception is anything but an exception. For context, the first 1 billion stream song on Spotify was "One Dance" by Drake in April 2016. On the graphic, it is in a band that corresponds to a huge increase in billion-stream songs. From shortly before this, to now, I think billon-stream is basically showing that a song was a huge hit.
The drizzle of billion-stream songs before that is basically some big hits, but also some weird viral things (like "Dreams") and some legacy songs that still get played unusual amounts ("All I Want for Christmas").
Of the songs from the 2016 or so cohort to now, I don't really see a lot of legacy artists. It is somewhat easier to see with this chart that actually lists artists. Sorted by release date, I don't really see what I recognize as older artists in the 2016-now list, except a couple cases where an older artist is featured with a new one.
posted by snofoam at 3:04 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
The drizzle of billion-stream songs before that is basically some big hits, but also some weird viral things (like "Dreams") and some legacy songs that still get played unusual amounts ("All I Want for Christmas").
Of the songs from the 2016 or so cohort to now, I don't really see a lot of legacy artists. It is somewhat easier to see with this chart that actually lists artists. Sorted by release date, I don't really see what I recognize as older artists in the 2016-now list, except a couple cases where an older artist is featured with a new one.
posted by snofoam at 3:04 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Something I find interesting about streaming numbers is fandom culture. Of course "fandoms" have always existed in some form, and competition between them (for me it was BSB vs Nsync), but there weren't a lot of ways to express that competition outside of just... saying who you like more or wearing merch or whatever.
Nowadays, streaming is a huge part of being a "good fan", particularly in kpop spaces where digital metrics count toward "wins" for weekly award shows. Part of BTS' meteoric rise was their fandom's incredible organizational abilities in terms of streaming because of how important these metrics are.
At this point it's pretty much standard for each fandom to have "streaming guides" letting fans know how to properly stream in order for the views/listens to count on the platform, streaming parties, even the term 'zombie hours' referring to people streaming when everyone else has gone to bed. At the same time, fans have also expressed an exhaustion with such expectations, some fandoms (especially ones with older fans) are known to be less streaming-obsessed, there's also a growing recognition of how ridiculous these metrics can be ("Congratulations to X for being the first group to get 1000 listens between the hours of 5-6pm on a Thursday night in February!"). Regardless it's still a huge thing and it'll be a while before people stop caring I think.
I don't spend a lot of time in Western fandom spaces but I think much of this has trickled over. People are truly obsessed with views, streams, numbers, awards - anything that can "objectively" point to your team being a winner. It fascinates me but it's also kind of sad.
posted by thebots at 3:13 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Nowadays, streaming is a huge part of being a "good fan", particularly in kpop spaces where digital metrics count toward "wins" for weekly award shows. Part of BTS' meteoric rise was their fandom's incredible organizational abilities in terms of streaming because of how important these metrics are.
At this point it's pretty much standard for each fandom to have "streaming guides" letting fans know how to properly stream in order for the views/listens to count on the platform, streaming parties, even the term 'zombie hours' referring to people streaming when everyone else has gone to bed. At the same time, fans have also expressed an exhaustion with such expectations, some fandoms (especially ones with older fans) are known to be less streaming-obsessed, there's also a growing recognition of how ridiculous these metrics can be ("Congratulations to X for being the first group to get 1000 listens between the hours of 5-6pm on a Thursday night in February!"). Regardless it's still a huge thing and it'll be a while before people stop caring I think.
I don't spend a lot of time in Western fandom spaces but I think much of this has trickled over. People are truly obsessed with views, streams, numbers, awards - anything that can "objectively" point to your team being a winner. It fascinates me but it's also kind of sad.
posted by thebots at 3:13 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Only one woman in the top 10. Wow...
posted by trillian at 3:18 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by trillian at 3:18 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
I would genuinely like to read some contemporary Cauty-Drummond make the same kind of observations about today’s political economy of music.
Especially if, or maybe only really if, they are able to pump out some chart topping (high-streaming? viral sensation?) songs to show they have mastered the new rules of the system.
posted by snofoam at 3:19 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Especially if, or maybe only really if, they are able to pump out some chart topping (high-streaming? viral sensation?) songs to show they have mastered the new rules of the system.
posted by snofoam at 3:19 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
There's a huge difference between something along the lines of Queen, AC/DC, Michael Jackson, Dr. Dre, and...The Weeknd, Post Malone, Ed Sheeran, Harry Styles
Post Malone, sure (though he has given indications of being more talented than he lets on) but The Weeknd? The Weeknd is already pretty well guaranteed a spot as a “great pop artist of the past” of the future.
posted by atoxyl at 3:21 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
Post Malone, sure (though he has given indications of being more talented than he lets on) but The Weeknd? The Weeknd is already pretty well guaranteed a spot as a “great pop artist of the past” of the future.
posted by atoxyl at 3:21 PM on January 13, 2023 [7 favorites]
A billion is a really freaking big number.
Spotify doesn't do play counts for songs that are less than thirty seconds long.
Playing a 30-second song a billion times would take over 900 years.
posted by box at 3:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
Spotify doesn't do play counts for songs that are less than thirty seconds long.
Playing a 30-second song a billion times would take over 900 years.
posted by box at 3:23 PM on January 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
Playing a 30-second song a billion times would take over 900 years.
But if you did it on a billion phones, it would only take 30 seconds. And there are 1.3 billion teenagers in the world.
posted by snofoam at 3:25 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
But if you did it on a billion phones, it would only take 30 seconds. And there are 1.3 billion teenagers in the world.
posted by snofoam at 3:25 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
From the “trends in pop music” link:
Most hit songs pull from the same small library (or libraries) of high-quality recorded samples. If a sound engineer or artist is able to record a sound effect, specific percussion hit, or other desirable sound, he or she is able to market it and charge high fees for its use. Because the pop market is controlled by a few large record labels and music companies, like Warner Music Group*, almost all of the songs pull from the same collections of samples. This results in us hearing the exact same effects over and over again which, in turn, contributes to pop music sounding “generic” or similar across the genre. For example, you can hear my personal nemesis in a ton of pop songs: a group of male voices repeatedly shouting “hey”, usually placed on the offbeat. Fancy uses this sample. Be advised that the song is explicit.
What a strangely, elaborately wrong explanation of a simple trend! There are tons of inexpensive, royalty-free libraries of percussion hits and sound effects, and something like that “hey” sample is almost certainly in the category of “sample that gets passed around forever without anybody getting paid, because nobody actually even knows who owns it.”
posted by atoxyl at 3:37 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
Most hit songs pull from the same small library (or libraries) of high-quality recorded samples. If a sound engineer or artist is able to record a sound effect, specific percussion hit, or other desirable sound, he or she is able to market it and charge high fees for its use. Because the pop market is controlled by a few large record labels and music companies, like Warner Music Group*, almost all of the songs pull from the same collections of samples. This results in us hearing the exact same effects over and over again which, in turn, contributes to pop music sounding “generic” or similar across the genre. For example, you can hear my personal nemesis in a ton of pop songs: a group of male voices repeatedly shouting “hey”, usually placed on the offbeat. Fancy uses this sample. Be advised that the song is explicit.
What a strangely, elaborately wrong explanation of a simple trend! There are tons of inexpensive, royalty-free libraries of percussion hits and sound effects, and something like that “hey” sample is almost certainly in the category of “sample that gets passed around forever without anybody getting paid, because nobody actually even knows who owns it.”
posted by atoxyl at 3:37 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
here's an easily disregardable anecdote: of the handful of 20-22 year old people i interact with in my workplace, none of them have a "favorite band" or have ever bought an "album" but they do like that song by so-and-so
posted by glonous keming at 3:43 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by glonous keming at 3:43 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I wonder if different music streaming services have different demographics so that if you made a list of billion stream songs using Apple Music or YouTube Music or Amazon Music data would there be some songs that show up on some lists but not others. Like fine any really popular song out right now will get 1 billion streams on a sufficiently large service but if Imagine Dragons makes it on the Spotify list but not on some other service then can we say that the users of that other service have better taste in music?
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:47 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:47 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Repeat repeat repeat repeat the lyrics for
Rhythm if you want to
Repeat again repeat again repeat again repeat
the same word over and over because
lyrics are dead
Put on a looped drum kit. Add a looped synth sound. Flatten it all and voila! Instant hit pop song.
posted by Chuffy at 3:58 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Rhythm if you want to
Repeat again repeat again repeat again repeat
the same word over and over because
lyrics are dead
Put on a looped drum kit. Add a looped synth sound. Flatten it all and voila! Instant hit pop song.
posted by Chuffy at 3:58 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I think it is fascinating that the things in this discussion that are more relevant than actual music in the world include such diversity: economics, demographics, technology, payola, Nordic pop-writers, kids these days, sampling, virality, etc.
posted by snofoam at 4:07 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by snofoam at 4:07 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Repeat repeat repeat repeat the lyrics for
Rhythm if you want to
Repeat again repeat again repeat again repeat
the same word over and over because
lyrics are dead
Put on a looped drum kit. Add a looped synth sound. Flatten it all and voila! Instant hit pop song.
I read this and instantly Softly by Arlo Parks came to mind. Catchy song but still. Here's the chorus:
Oh, won't you
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Or I'll forget myself, I don't want no one else
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 4:15 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
Rhythm if you want to
Repeat again repeat again repeat again repeat
the same word over and over because
lyrics are dead
Put on a looped drum kit. Add a looped synth sound. Flatten it all and voila! Instant hit pop song.
I read this and instantly Softly by Arlo Parks came to mind. Catchy song but still. Here's the chorus:
Oh, won't you
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Break it to me softly, I don't want no one else
Break it to me, break it to me, break it to me
Or I'll forget myself, I don't want no one else
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 4:15 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
See, I like Ed Sheeran and Bruno Mars, but I have maybe two songs by each in any of my Spotify playlists. And though I'm 71, when I get with people who swear the only good music was made in (name of decade), I get really impatient. There's always good music. And there's always a whole lot of terrible stuff, and that was true in the 50s, 60s, and 70s.
posted by Peach at 5:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by Peach at 5:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [12 favorites]
Rick Beato focuses on last century hits: Why Do These 16 Classic Songs Have Over 1,000,000,000 Spotify Plays?
posted by fairmettle at 6:30 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by fairmettle at 6:30 PM on January 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
There's always good music. And there's always a whole lot of terrible stuff, and that was true in the 50s, 60s, and 70s.
That's true, but you won't hear good music on regular radio anymore. You really have to look for it. There's more objectively terrible and unoriginal stuff now in mainstream pop culture today. Nobody who knows music history would debate this.
posted by Liquidwolf at 6:32 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
That's true, but you won't hear good music on regular radio anymore. You really have to look for it. There's more objectively terrible and unoriginal stuff now in mainstream pop culture today. Nobody who knows music history would debate this.
posted by Liquidwolf at 6:32 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
The Weeknd is already pretty well guaranteed a spot as a “great pop artist of the past” of the future.
There isn't anything unique or special about The Weeknd.
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
There isn't anything unique or special about The Weeknd.
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:53 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
Regular radio was awful except for a few good stations, each for a little while until it was sold or until the DJ was fired. A lot of the music was manufactured tripe and a lot of it showed up on radio because of payola. I don’t listen to radio any more anyway.
I’ve lived the last six-seven decades of music history so I’d argue that there’s more music now, a lot more, and it’s easier to make, so of course there’s more bad stuff. But I don’t think it’s a larger percentage.
posted by Peach at 6:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I’ve lived the last six-seven decades of music history so I’d argue that there’s more music now, a lot more, and it’s easier to make, so of course there’s more bad stuff. But I don’t think it’s a larger percentage.
posted by Peach at 6:57 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
"Everyone knows rock attained perfection in 1974. It’s a scientific fact." - Homer J. Simpson
posted by neuron at 7:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by neuron at 7:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
Wow, Spotify must have paid some of these artists hundreds of dollars!
posted by whir at 8:05 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by whir at 8:05 PM on January 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
I'm scrolling through the playlist and clicking on songs whose names/artists I don't recognize. And I have heard a bunch of these! (Milky Chance? who? oh yeah, I've heard this song...) Some on the radio, some from commercials and (more recent songs) from tik-tok/instagram/facebook videos.
posted by vespabelle at 8:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by vespabelle at 8:39 PM on January 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
I’m glad the data is sortable by song length because I’m impressed that you can release a song that’s nearly seven minutes long and still get to the Billion listen club. And then I listened and realized oh yeah I definitely have danced to that.
posted by meinvt at 8:42 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by meinvt at 8:42 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Does anyone happen to know the origin of the dataset?
Spotify has some public data sets for their challenges, but I haven't see where this one comes from.
Edit: Ah, I see there's a Billions Club playlist. My bad.
posted by SunSnork at 9:02 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
Spotify has some public data sets for their challenges, but I haven't see where this one comes from.
Edit: Ah, I see there's a Billions Club playlist. My bad.
posted by SunSnork at 9:02 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
There isn't anything unique or special about The Weeknd.
His first few tapes were a huge influence on the next decade of pop (broad definition) - every sad druggy R&B/rap singer owes him big time - and still have cred with the record nerds, too. Then he became a retro-ish mainstream pop star (with occasional throwbacks to his darker material) but made a lot of well-crafted pop songs within those bound. That’s already more tricks than AC/DC had. I like AC/DC, but come on.
posted by atoxyl at 9:08 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
His first few tapes were a huge influence on the next decade of pop (broad definition) - every sad druggy R&B/rap singer owes him big time - and still have cred with the record nerds, too. Then he became a retro-ish mainstream pop star (with occasional throwbacks to his darker material) but made a lot of well-crafted pop songs within those bound. That’s already more tricks than AC/DC had. I like AC/DC, but come on.
posted by atoxyl at 9:08 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
Holy shut the get off my lawn vibes are unbelievable in this thread
posted by thedaniel at 9:54 PM on January 13, 2023 [16 favorites]
posted by thedaniel at 9:54 PM on January 13, 2023 [16 favorites]
Why did the big band hits of the 40's get so few plays on the FM rock radio of the 70's?
posted by fairmettle at 11:03 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by fairmettle at 11:03 PM on January 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
@paulisci A Brief History of Music These Days Isn't Any Good
posted by Gary at 12:13 AM on January 14, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by Gary at 12:13 AM on January 14, 2023 [5 favorites]
His first few tapes were a huge influence on the next decade of pop (broad definition) - every sad druggy R&B/rap singer owes him big time - and still have cred with the record nerds, too. Then he became a retro-ish mainstream pop star (with occasional throwbacks to his darker material) but made a lot of well-crafted pop songs within those bound. That’s already more tricks than AC/DC had. I like AC/DC, but come on.
Musically, I hear nothing unique. I really, really, don't. If someone can explain what the unique elements are, please MeMail me.
Also, it's pretty weird people keep complaining this is old people or get off my lawn energy. It's not, at least from me. I explained, with links, my points about pop music becoming less creative and more similar to itself. I do believe this is a valid point that isn't being engaged with when people say there's a dour mood here. (Also, not much to engage with on this link and music is a hot point for people - it's subjective! I'm not mad if you like The Weeknd! Enjoy! No need to be offended that someone else doesn't!)
posted by tiny frying pan at 5:49 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
Musically, I hear nothing unique. I really, really, don't. If someone can explain what the unique elements are, please MeMail me.
Also, it's pretty weird people keep complaining this is old people or get off my lawn energy. It's not, at least from me. I explained, with links, my points about pop music becoming less creative and more similar to itself. I do believe this is a valid point that isn't being engaged with when people say there's a dour mood here. (Also, not much to engage with on this link and music is a hot point for people - it's subjective! I'm not mad if you like The Weeknd! Enjoy! No need to be offended that someone else doesn't!)
posted by tiny frying pan at 5:49 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
(Also....it's just...people should be able to have an opinion without being accused of being "old" and out of touch.)
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:01 AM on January 14, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by tiny frying pan at 6:01 AM on January 14, 2023 [6 favorites]
Musically, I hear nothing unique. I really, really, don't. If someone can explain what the unique elements are, please MeMail me.
You’re asking for other people to give you the list of unique, by which you mean “new-to-you”, sounds on a list of songs that have been preselected entirely on the basis of their mass market appeal to a relatively inexperienced audience.
That’s where the get off my lawn energy is coming from; it’s not age so much as it is of a kind with demands you might hear from somebody of an advanced age.
posted by mhoye at 6:46 AM on January 14, 2023 [6 favorites]
You’re asking for other people to give you the list of unique, by which you mean “new-to-you”, sounds on a list of songs that have been preselected entirely on the basis of their mass market appeal to a relatively inexperienced audience.
That’s where the get off my lawn energy is coming from; it’s not age so much as it is of a kind with demands you might hear from somebody of an advanced age.
posted by mhoye at 6:46 AM on January 14, 2023 [6 favorites]
While I understand your points, I do not agree that pop music is less creative or more self-similar now than it was at some point in the past.
Take a look at e.g. the Coachella lineup. The headliners are Frank Ocean, an alt-R&B singer, Bad Bunny, a mostly-Spanish-language reggaeton rapper, and BLACKPINK, a k-pop girl group. Further down the list you'll find people like Gorillaz, Bjork, Weyes Blood (folk-leaning singer-songwriter), Hiatus Kayote (jazz/funk band), The Linda Lindas (teen girl-punk), Pusha T (top-shelf cocaine rap), Sudan Archives (Africa-inspired singer/songwriter/violinist), and Wet Leg (post-punk indie duo).
If it all sounds the same to you, I'm not sure how to respond to that.
None of these artists are especially obscure--you might hear about them on NPR or in the New York Times, and they have been picked because people think they will appeal to thousands of festival-goers.
By contrast, take a look at the many, many people in the '60s that tried to bite the early Beatles' success. Herman's Hermits, Gerry and the Pacemakers, Manfred Mann...
Or the people trying to make a hit disco record after Donna Summer and Chic, or the major labels releasing things like Candlebox, Nickelback, and Silverchair after Nirvana and Pearl Jam broke out.
There have always been people trying to do their own thing and people wanting to do the popular thing. The tension between those is a big part of why I think pop music, from almost any era, is interesting.
posted by box at 7:09 AM on January 14, 2023 [16 favorites]
Take a look at e.g. the Coachella lineup. The headliners are Frank Ocean, an alt-R&B singer, Bad Bunny, a mostly-Spanish-language reggaeton rapper, and BLACKPINK, a k-pop girl group. Further down the list you'll find people like Gorillaz, Bjork, Weyes Blood (folk-leaning singer-songwriter), Hiatus Kayote (jazz/funk band), The Linda Lindas (teen girl-punk), Pusha T (top-shelf cocaine rap), Sudan Archives (Africa-inspired singer/songwriter/violinist), and Wet Leg (post-punk indie duo).
If it all sounds the same to you, I'm not sure how to respond to that.
None of these artists are especially obscure--you might hear about them on NPR or in the New York Times, and they have been picked because people think they will appeal to thousands of festival-goers.
By contrast, take a look at the many, many people in the '60s that tried to bite the early Beatles' success. Herman's Hermits, Gerry and the Pacemakers, Manfred Mann...
Or the people trying to make a hit disco record after Donna Summer and Chic, or the major labels releasing things like Candlebox, Nickelback, and Silverchair after Nirvana and Pearl Jam broke out.
There have always been people trying to do their own thing and people wanting to do the popular thing. The tension between those is a big part of why I think pop music, from almost any era, is interesting.
posted by box at 7:09 AM on January 14, 2023 [16 favorites]
I think even if you were able to scientifically prove today’s pop music has less variety than it did in previous generations, it has already been scientifically proven that “can you believe what the kids call ‘music’ these days?” is the ultimate old man complaint, so I think there is an inevitable impasse. And I say that having commented that I think there is a demographic difference between contemporary chart toppers and those of my youth (80s had lots of mega hits by aging artists). I think it is an interesting topic, but I don’t think it’s possible to get anywhere with “unique” without defining it in a very technical way.
posted by snofoam at 7:36 AM on January 14, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by snofoam at 7:36 AM on January 14, 2023 [4 favorites]
That's true, but you won't hear good music on regular radio anymore. You really have to look for it. There's more objectively terrible and unoriginal stuff now in mainstream pop culture today. Nobody who knows music history would debate this.
What even is 'regular radio'? I wouldn't know where to find that if I tried. I teach university music history, so I'm pretty sure I know music history, and will strongly refute any assertions that music is "more objectively terrible and unoriginal" now than it ever has been. First of all, that assertion is objectively not true, since all music appreciation is ultimately subjective (Duke Ellington hit it precisely: 'if you like it, it's good'); and second, once you really know music history, you realize that it's mostly all crap, all the time, and that time is the filter that typically separates wheat from chaff. At the end of last semester we just covered the early 20th c. in the US and the emergence of popular music as a thing, and holy shit nearly all popular music from the first few decades of the 1900s is so stupid and bad and banal and basic. So much stupider than anything we're subjected to these days, truly. Any look at any "contemporary" body of musical work (by genre, etc.) is going to be looking at mostly crap, that's just how it goes in creative media. What we remember and keep is the tiny minority of stuff produced in any given era that survives the filter of time and evolving culture. Good stuff tends to stick (though not always).
I explained, with links, my points about pop music becoming less creative and more similar to itself. I do believe this is a valid point that isn't being engaged with when people say there's a dour mood here.
The recent, trendy, bullshit analyses about pop music being less creative and more similar to itself (i.e., because of no key changes, the horror) have been thoroughly debunked and mocked by musicians (theorists, musicologists) in social media, so I do recommend availing yourself of those conversations among experts before making claims about objective proof. I also, as a music professor, caution against any 'objective, verifiable' claims about musical taste, because there simply is no actual objective fact in a creative medium--it's all quite literally made up. (Very very short explanation of the key change thing being dumb: in music, you only find what you look for, and when your metrics for quality are pitch-based, and further based in a tonal pitch-set system, you will be deaf to other aspects of musical texture that are being developed and in fact are more primary to particular tracks than the notes themselves. If a track doesn't preoccupy itself with key--or pitch generally--as one of its primary expressive components, then it won't have any complexity of pitch at all, most likely; but it is not a failing to miss a target at which you are not aiming, and all creative work is best evaluated on its terms, i.e., review a horror movie as a horror movie, not for its failings as a serious period drama. If a track isn't really interested in pitch, it will not be pitch-interesting.)
Anyone who comes into a conversation about music and tries to assert any version of 'correct,' 'objective,' or otherwise 'provable' ideas about personal preference and taste will come off as dour, because that's not how music works. I've made, studied and taught music for most of my life, and two of the (very few) things I know for sure are that you won't convince someone to love music that they hate, and you won't convince someone that music that they love is not worth loving. That used to bother me, but now I realize that it's all subjective and it's all made up, and the only thing the really ends up being real and lasting with music is the experience you have with it, and how that affects and changes you in your life. And I'm not going to tell anyone that something meaningful to them is actually bullshit. Instead, I'm just glad that they love any music, and build up from there.
posted by LooseFilter at 7:44 AM on January 14, 2023 [39 favorites]
What even is 'regular radio'? I wouldn't know where to find that if I tried. I teach university music history, so I'm pretty sure I know music history, and will strongly refute any assertions that music is "more objectively terrible and unoriginal" now than it ever has been. First of all, that assertion is objectively not true, since all music appreciation is ultimately subjective (Duke Ellington hit it precisely: 'if you like it, it's good'); and second, once you really know music history, you realize that it's mostly all crap, all the time, and that time is the filter that typically separates wheat from chaff. At the end of last semester we just covered the early 20th c. in the US and the emergence of popular music as a thing, and holy shit nearly all popular music from the first few decades of the 1900s is so stupid and bad and banal and basic. So much stupider than anything we're subjected to these days, truly. Any look at any "contemporary" body of musical work (by genre, etc.) is going to be looking at mostly crap, that's just how it goes in creative media. What we remember and keep is the tiny minority of stuff produced in any given era that survives the filter of time and evolving culture. Good stuff tends to stick (though not always).
I explained, with links, my points about pop music becoming less creative and more similar to itself. I do believe this is a valid point that isn't being engaged with when people say there's a dour mood here.
The recent, trendy, bullshit analyses about pop music being less creative and more similar to itself (i.e., because of no key changes, the horror) have been thoroughly debunked and mocked by musicians (theorists, musicologists) in social media, so I do recommend availing yourself of those conversations among experts before making claims about objective proof. I also, as a music professor, caution against any 'objective, verifiable' claims about musical taste, because there simply is no actual objective fact in a creative medium--it's all quite literally made up. (Very very short explanation of the key change thing being dumb: in music, you only find what you look for, and when your metrics for quality are pitch-based, and further based in a tonal pitch-set system, you will be deaf to other aspects of musical texture that are being developed and in fact are more primary to particular tracks than the notes themselves. If a track doesn't preoccupy itself with key--or pitch generally--as one of its primary expressive components, then it won't have any complexity of pitch at all, most likely; but it is not a failing to miss a target at which you are not aiming, and all creative work is best evaluated on its terms, i.e., review a horror movie as a horror movie, not for its failings as a serious period drama. If a track isn't really interested in pitch, it will not be pitch-interesting.)
Anyone who comes into a conversation about music and tries to assert any version of 'correct,' 'objective,' or otherwise 'provable' ideas about personal preference and taste will come off as dour, because that's not how music works. I've made, studied and taught music for most of my life, and two of the (very few) things I know for sure are that you won't convince someone to love music that they hate, and you won't convince someone that music that they love is not worth loving. That used to bother me, but now I realize that it's all subjective and it's all made up, and the only thing the really ends up being real and lasting with music is the experience you have with it, and how that affects and changes you in your life. And I'm not going to tell anyone that something meaningful to them is actually bullshit. Instead, I'm just glad that they love any music, and build up from there.
posted by LooseFilter at 7:44 AM on January 14, 2023 [39 favorites]
For what it's worth, I'm nearly 50 years old and I think "As It Was" by Harry Styles is genuinely one of the most poignant songs of the last few years, and its success warms my cold, dead heart. It sounds so happy and glossy, but scratch the surface and it's overwhelmingly bittersweet and melancholic. The sound of a pandemic when you try to hold on and on and on. And that moment when it shifts into a crescendo with tubular bells? It's over too soon and you go back to scratch that itch of oh, nothing is as it was, but maybe just maybe we'll get through this.
You can keep your "Wonderwall" and "Don't Stop Believin'" - a song like "As It Was" feels far more meaningful to me at this stage in life.
posted by peacesign at 8:42 AM on January 14, 2023 [7 favorites]
You can keep your "Wonderwall" and "Don't Stop Believin'" - a song like "As It Was" feels far more meaningful to me at this stage in life.
posted by peacesign at 8:42 AM on January 14, 2023 [7 favorites]
It grosses me out that Shape of You is ranked this high. I wanted to take out a restraining order against Ed Sheeran on the strength of that line about bedsheets. Creepy guys aiming for sexy and ending up on Ed Gein are an eternal presence on the pop charts, I guess…
posted by pxe2000 at 9:39 AM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by pxe2000 at 9:39 AM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
here's an easily disregardable anecdote: of the handful of 20-22 year old people i interact with in my workplace, none of them have a "favorite band" or have ever bought an "album" but they do like that song by so-and-so
And my counter-anecdote: all the 20-22 year olds I know (and I know quite a few, having one child in that demographic and knowing her friends, plus working with several, and nieces/nephews, etc.) have favorite bands and buy albums. Several of them have impressive vinyl collections and they also go to local and national shows. Now, having said that, I will admit that a good majority of those 20-22 year olds I know come from musical families; parents in local bands, for instance. But a lot of them don't and they still have an impressive knowledge of music.
posted by cooker girl at 10:13 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
And my counter-anecdote: all the 20-22 year olds I know (and I know quite a few, having one child in that demographic and knowing her friends, plus working with several, and nieces/nephews, etc.) have favorite bands and buy albums. Several of them have impressive vinyl collections and they also go to local and national shows. Now, having said that, I will admit that a good majority of those 20-22 year olds I know come from musical families; parents in local bands, for instance. But a lot of them don't and they still have an impressive knowledge of music.
posted by cooker girl at 10:13 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
> you won't hear good music on regular radio anymore.
I invite you to listen to KEXP. You might like John in the Morning -- he's a good blend of older stuff for us older people who like familiar songs, and recent releases to keep things interesting. I also like Gabriel Teodros, who plays mostly music that I, an out-of-touch person, have never heard.
posted by The corpse in the library at 10:28 AM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
I invite you to listen to KEXP. You might like John in the Morning -- he's a good blend of older stuff for us older people who like familiar songs, and recent releases to keep things interesting. I also like Gabriel Teodros, who plays mostly music that I, an out-of-touch person, have never heard.
posted by The corpse in the library at 10:28 AM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
Not gonna get into the weeds of how innovative he is but I definitely listen to more of The Weeknd than any of the post-Weeknd artists on that chart, with the exception of Dua Lipa. I've never even heard a Post Malone song, and whenever his name comes up in conversation, I have to mentally remind myself he's not some benchwarmer ball player.
I do think there's no shortage of truly creative contemporary musicians, but just like in the before times, the most creative ones aren't the ones you normally find at the top of the singles charts.
posted by xigxag at 11:09 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
I do think there's no shortage of truly creative contemporary musicians, but just like in the before times, the most creative ones aren't the ones you normally find at the top of the singles charts.
posted by xigxag at 11:09 AM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
Interestingly, Taylor Swift is not on there (yet), I guess because her listens are more widely distributed over songs.
She did boycott Spotify from 2014 to 2017.
posted by Pendragon at 12:20 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
She did boycott Spotify from 2014 to 2017.
posted by Pendragon at 12:20 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
This has been a fascinating thread to read through.
I just want to add: I started listening to music via Spotify about 8 or so years ago after a friend suggested that for the cost of a used CD (approx $10 at the time) I could have access to a HUGE library of music. I trialed the first month then hooked it to my bank account and I have never looked back. My musical horizons have been. vastened in ways I could never have imagined, even to the point of developing a taste for pop-adjacent female vocals. And I love being able to endlessly genre hop.
If someone told me there was no good music out there now to listen to, I’m not sure what I’d say. Maybe you need to listen to more music? It feels like a pretty golden time, tbh.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 3:48 PM on January 14, 2023 [4 favorites]
I just want to add: I started listening to music via Spotify about 8 or so years ago after a friend suggested that for the cost of a used CD (approx $10 at the time) I could have access to a HUGE library of music. I trialed the first month then hooked it to my bank account and I have never looked back. My musical horizons have been. vastened in ways I could never have imagined, even to the point of developing a taste for pop-adjacent female vocals. And I love being able to endlessly genre hop.
If someone told me there was no good music out there now to listen to, I’m not sure what I’d say. Maybe you need to listen to more music? It feels like a pretty golden time, tbh.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 3:48 PM on January 14, 2023 [4 favorites]
I liked the "expect something great from Taylor Swift" meme from the previously about her most recent (maybe, like hell I've checked) record release, but recognise it as "pop music isn't serious art" nonsense. Then she's hampered this race to billion-plus streams by recreating recordings she's famous for with ones what she owns the copyright of, so you want "Taylor's Version" in your playlist.
posted by k3ninho at 3:49 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by k3ninho at 3:49 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
. I've never even heard a Post Malone song, and whenever his name comes up in conversation, I have to mentally remind myself he's not some benchwarmer ball player.
I've not like a big fan or anything, but he's more creative than you might think. I'd actually describe him as being agnostic about pop/rock/rap genres, and being able to work (well enough) in each one. Maybe like a Gorrillaz if I had to pick a comparable artist. I'd say if you listen to pop radio, you probably have heard his songs, but probably just didn't recognize as him.
Sunflower from Spiderverse, though this one cribs heavily from MIA's Paper Planes at the beginning.
Congratulations straight hiphop.
Circles indie, or indie chillwave or not that different from like Future Islands or Boy and Bear.
posted by The_Vegetables at 3:55 PM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
I've not like a big fan or anything, but he's more creative than you might think. I'd actually describe him as being agnostic about pop/rock/rap genres, and being able to work (well enough) in each one. Maybe like a Gorrillaz if I had to pick a comparable artist. I'd say if you listen to pop radio, you probably have heard his songs, but probably just didn't recognize as him.
Sunflower from Spiderverse, though this one cribs heavily from MIA's Paper Planes at the beginning.
Congratulations straight hiphop.
Circles indie, or indie chillwave or not that different from like Future Islands or Boy and Bear.
posted by The_Vegetables at 3:55 PM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
First of all, that assertion is objectively not true, since all music appreciation is ultimately subjective (Duke Ellington hit it precisely: 'if you like it, it's good'); and second, once you really know music history, you realize that it's mostly all crap, all the time, and that time is the filter that typically separates wheat from chaff.
If music is so subjective, then how can most of it 'be crap'? Does that just mean you personally don't like it? I mean, we currently measure music based on sales and streams, so it's very possible that the tracks designed for mass consumption are worse than average, because smoothing averages reduces variance, and variance is interesting.
And if music I like is subjective, then time doesn't do anything in particular, other than increase your musical knowledge vs those younger. I absolutely reject the idea that time does separate the wheat from the chaff, because (from above) Herman's Hermit's "Mrs Brown You've Got a Lovely Daughter" is super fun to play on guitar, extremely well made, and can stand comfortably beside the Beatles tracks from the same period, as can "There's a Kind of Hush" and "I'm Into Something Good". OK Henry VIII I Am is kind of cheesy. Also, another thread mentioned The Sonics, who were The Beatles contemporaries, and they've been lost to history even as the music they made is still easy to find on the airwaves, while copying The Beatles' sound is relegated to a small corner of indie music.
posted by The_Vegetables at 4:07 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
If music is so subjective, then how can most of it 'be crap'? Does that just mean you personally don't like it? I mean, we currently measure music based on sales and streams, so it's very possible that the tracks designed for mass consumption are worse than average, because smoothing averages reduces variance, and variance is interesting.
And if music I like is subjective, then time doesn't do anything in particular, other than increase your musical knowledge vs those younger. I absolutely reject the idea that time does separate the wheat from the chaff, because (from above) Herman's Hermit's "Mrs Brown You've Got a Lovely Daughter" is super fun to play on guitar, extremely well made, and can stand comfortably beside the Beatles tracks from the same period, as can "There's a Kind of Hush" and "I'm Into Something Good". OK Henry VIII I Am is kind of cheesy. Also, another thread mentioned The Sonics, who were The Beatles contemporaries, and they've been lost to history even as the music they made is still easy to find on the airwaves, while copying The Beatles' sound is relegated to a small corner of indie music.
posted by The_Vegetables at 4:07 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
As I wrote above, 'Good stuff tends to stick (though not always).'
posted by LooseFilter at 4:11 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by LooseFilter at 4:11 PM on January 14, 2023 [1 favorite]
If music is so subjective, then how can most of it 'be crap'?
I think that whole framing is not very useful, actually, but was trying to respond in terms of this particular thread conversation. In my own classes, we discuss music in terms of widespread praxis and/or demonstrable influence (as in, these are basic things that make any given musical work/person/style/practice/etc. important or notable in some way), and we talk about craft, as in, if a thing is considered well-made by wide consensus, what makes it well-made? if it is especially influential, why is it more influential than other music like it? how is it crafted more deftly and effectively than other music like it? etc. So discussions about musical structures, processes, compositional method and craft and relative effectiveness as opposed to personal opinion and whether one "likes" listening to something or not. (Also, philosophically, I generally approach music as a verb, a human activity, rather than as repertoires or bodies of musical works, if that helps. So [e.g.] awareness of social and political contexts, power structures matters a great deal, too.)
posted by LooseFilter at 4:31 PM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
I think that whole framing is not very useful, actually, but was trying to respond in terms of this particular thread conversation. In my own classes, we discuss music in terms of widespread praxis and/or demonstrable influence (as in, these are basic things that make any given musical work/person/style/practice/etc. important or notable in some way), and we talk about craft, as in, if a thing is considered well-made by wide consensus, what makes it well-made? if it is especially influential, why is it more influential than other music like it? how is it crafted more deftly and effectively than other music like it? etc. So discussions about musical structures, processes, compositional method and craft and relative effectiveness as opposed to personal opinion and whether one "likes" listening to something or not. (Also, philosophically, I generally approach music as a verb, a human activity, rather than as repertoires or bodies of musical works, if that helps. So [e.g.] awareness of social and political contexts, power structures matters a great deal, too.)
posted by LooseFilter at 4:31 PM on January 14, 2023 [3 favorites]
This whole "the kids listen to music differently than WE listened to music and it's WORSE" appears to come from people who didn't grow up around entire communities of folks who basically just played "Country Roads" and "Wagon Wheel" back and forth any time there was a gathering. Or, hell, I still can't listen to Jeff Buckley's "Hallelujah" because I went to college, ever.
Most people do not care strongly about music. Of the people who do care strongly about music, the vast majority are fixated on either specific genres or specific bands. The "connoisseur" variety of music enthusiast has always been the exception, not the rule. Spotify and its content algorithm give me the heebie-jeebs, but so did classmates of mine in 1996 who didn't know a band other than the Backstreet Boys existed. This is just how people work, y'all.
(And there is flat-out no way to pan contemporary pop music compared to "how it was back then" if the thing you're comparing it to is Max Martin. I say this as a huge retroactive fan of Max Martin: just try saying that Ed Sheeran is less inventive or less musically sophisticated than Max Martin. Go on, try.)
Anyway, modern music is not only fine, it's great. My favorite music blogger releases a monthly playlist of songs he's liked recently, and I still haven't made it through the June 2022 playlist linked here, because I have a giant list of albums I should get around to buying based on how good these songs were. Even if you want to cheat and limit yourself to just pop music—and good God, why would you?—the increasing influence of PC Music alone gives you Caroline Polacek, Charli XCX, and 100 gecs, along with my fave, Hannah Diamond. Limit yourself to the narrowest possible slice of "what modern music is," and you still wind up with an insane spectrum of interesting stuff going on.
Unless you're literally Billie Eilish, you probably don't have to care about what goes into a song getting a billion streams on Spotify. You're free! The kids will be fine, really, The Weeknd is the least of their problems rn
posted by Tom Hanks Cannot Be Trusted at 6:49 PM on January 14, 2023 [7 favorites]
Most people do not care strongly about music. Of the people who do care strongly about music, the vast majority are fixated on either specific genres or specific bands. The "connoisseur" variety of music enthusiast has always been the exception, not the rule. Spotify and its content algorithm give me the heebie-jeebs, but so did classmates of mine in 1996 who didn't know a band other than the Backstreet Boys existed. This is just how people work, y'all.
(And there is flat-out no way to pan contemporary pop music compared to "how it was back then" if the thing you're comparing it to is Max Martin. I say this as a huge retroactive fan of Max Martin: just try saying that Ed Sheeran is less inventive or less musically sophisticated than Max Martin. Go on, try.)
Anyway, modern music is not only fine, it's great. My favorite music blogger releases a monthly playlist of songs he's liked recently, and I still haven't made it through the June 2022 playlist linked here, because I have a giant list of albums I should get around to buying based on how good these songs were. Even if you want to cheat and limit yourself to just pop music—and good God, why would you?—the increasing influence of PC Music alone gives you Caroline Polacek, Charli XCX, and 100 gecs, along with my fave, Hannah Diamond. Limit yourself to the narrowest possible slice of "what modern music is," and you still wind up with an insane spectrum of interesting stuff going on.
Unless you're literally Billie Eilish, you probably don't have to care about what goes into a song getting a billion streams on Spotify. You're free! The kids will be fine, really, The Weeknd is the least of their problems rn
posted by Tom Hanks Cannot Be Trusted at 6:49 PM on January 14, 2023 [7 favorites]
My musical horizons have been. vastened in ways I could never have imagined
Vastening is a most worthy aspiration.
posted by fairmettle at 9:13 PM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
Vastening is a most worthy aspiration.
posted by fairmettle at 9:13 PM on January 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
If music is so subjective, then how can most of it 'be crap'?
Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap.
It's just that nobody can agree which 10% is good.
posted by rhizome at 2:29 AM on January 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is crap.
It's just that nobody can agree which 10% is good.
posted by rhizome at 2:29 AM on January 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
MetaFilter: The Tony Orlando Zone 2: The Vastening
posted by mhoye at 9:54 AM on January 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by mhoye at 9:54 AM on January 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
I really don’t think you can compare Pre-Malone with Post-Malone.
(Spotify/mp3/home taping is killing music)
posted by Devils Rancher at 1:20 PM on January 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
(Spotify/mp3/home taping is killing music)
posted by Devils Rancher at 1:20 PM on January 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
Where is the METAL? Thousands of great metal tracks, many from this very century. Isn't anyone into ferocious pissed off love and compassion!!1!
posted by a humble nudibranch at 3:49 PM on January 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by a humble nudibranch at 3:49 PM on January 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
a humble nudibranch, I submit that Scarcity's 2022 microtonal black metal reflection Aveilut is both unique and super catchy!
posted by TheKaijuCommuter at 4:17 PM on January 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by TheKaijuCommuter at 4:17 PM on January 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
Thanks. This confirms what I've long suspected: 2000 marked the end, for me, of listening to pop, i.e., top 40, music. With the exception of a few ubiquitous, inescapable tunes, e.g., "Happy," I haven't heard anything on this chart past the turn of the millennium. And I listen to and collect a lot of music.
Not exactly sure why the disconnect from chart music (although I'd posit that the singles of 2010, say, don't hold a candle to those of 1975, to pick a pre-millennial high point at random), but this is a clear illustration of its reality.
posted by the sobsister at 8:34 AM on January 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
Not exactly sure why the disconnect from chart music (although I'd posit that the singles of 2010, say, don't hold a candle to those of 1975, to pick a pre-millennial high point at random), but this is a clear illustration of its reality.
posted by the sobsister at 8:34 AM on January 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
2010: ‘Bad Romance,’ ‘Party in the USA,’ ‘Empire State of Mind.’
1975: ‘Love Will Keep Us Together,’ ‘Kung Fu Fighting,’ ‘Chevy Van.’
posted by box at 5:12 PM on January 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
1975: ‘Love Will Keep Us Together,’ ‘Kung Fu Fighting,’ ‘Chevy Van.’
posted by box at 5:12 PM on January 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
@box, you made my point. So, thanks, I guess.
posted by the sobsister at 1:31 PM on January 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by the sobsister at 1:31 PM on January 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
(jk) But seriously, your three against, let's see...EW&F, "Shining Star"; Bowie, "Fame"'; Sweet, "The Ballroom Blitz." Or Ohio Players, "Fire." Or Stevie Wonder, "Boogie On Reggae Woman." Or Bee Gees, "Jive Talkin'." Or Labelle, "Lady Marmalade."
The ref is stopping the fight.
posted by the sobsister at 1:36 PM on January 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
The ref is stopping the fight.
posted by the sobsister at 1:36 PM on January 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
The list of Billboard top singles for 2010 is a pretty depressing read. I'd wager it has more to do with the top 100 charting songs being something very different from the top 100 best songs for a given year than music in 2010 being rubbish though. There were a lot of great songs from 1975 that didn't make the Billboard list for that year either.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:31 PM on January 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 3:31 PM on January 18, 2023 [1 favorite]
I sometimes think about the South Park episode where, when old people listen to the music of young people, they just hear fart noises.
posted by Going To Maine at 5:30 PM on January 18, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by Going To Maine at 5:30 PM on January 18, 2023 [3 favorites]
2010: ‘Bad Romance,’ ‘Party in the USA,’ ‘Empire State of Mind.’
1975: ‘Love Will Keep Us Together,’ ‘Kung Fu Fighting,’ ‘Chevy Van.’
The difference is that in 1975, the charts were made by polling record store owners about what they thought were the top songs. By 2010, the switch to Soundscan meant the charts reflected actual record sales (which is why metal, rap, and country suddenly sprang into existence in 1991).
So, 1975 counted what gatekeepers thought was #1, 2010 was what people were actually buying, and then this Billion Spotify list counts what people were actually playing on their music apps. I suppose in another decade years we'll have a list of songs that had the most people actually listening to them, and maybe 10 years after that, songs that had the most people actually paying attention when they were played.
posted by straight at 10:07 AM on January 19, 2023 [4 favorites]
1975: ‘Love Will Keep Us Together,’ ‘Kung Fu Fighting,’ ‘Chevy Van.’
The difference is that in 1975, the charts were made by polling record store owners about what they thought were the top songs. By 2010, the switch to Soundscan meant the charts reflected actual record sales (which is why metal, rap, and country suddenly sprang into existence in 1991).
So, 1975 counted what gatekeepers thought was #1, 2010 was what people were actually buying, and then this Billion Spotify list counts what people were actually playing on their music apps. I suppose in another decade years we'll have a list of songs that had the most people actually listening to them, and maybe 10 years after that, songs that had the most people actually paying attention when they were played.
posted by straight at 10:07 AM on January 19, 2023 [4 favorites]
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posted by box at 12:03 PM on January 13, 2023 [1 favorite]