Rockin' in the Minivan

May 5, 2023 1:42 AM

Billboard's list of the 50 Greatest Minivan Rock Songs

Think about popular music around the turn of the millennium, and what comes to mind? Maybe it’s the teen-pop that dominated TRL, or the rap-rock and nu-metal that rose up seemingly in response to it. Maybe it’s the crossover hip-hop and R&B jams that made household names out of Timbaland and The Neptunes, or the four-quadrant country that propelled Shania Twain and the Dixie Chicks to diamond-level sales. Maybe it’s Eminem. Maybe it’s “Who Let the Dogs Out?”

What probably doesn’t come immediately to mind, however, is the music that served as the glue for top 40 radio during this period: accessible, catchy, cleanly produced rock music built on sonic foundations of processed guitars and/or driving piano. This was the dependable, generation-spanning pop-rock that filled in the gaps between some of the meteoric musical moments and careers shooting off around it. We call it Minivan Rock.

Why Minivan Rock? Well, think of it as the Y2K-straddling equivalent to the smooth soft rock that was similarly ubiquitous on radio playlists of the mid-1970s to early ’80s — what’s since come to be known as Yacht Rock. While those Michael McDonald and Christopher Cross hits were ostensibly best enjoyed by the affluent while cruising in their personal vanity vessels on the high seas, by the late ’90s the vehicular status symbol for the suburban had become the minivan. And when the local top 40 or adult top 40 channel was blasting through the car radio, these were the songs most likely to be fun for the whole family. (BuzzFeed wrote about a similar idea in 2017.)

Ultimately, the only hard line we drew was that songs for this list had to be released as singles between the years of 1997 — when the final strains of Gen-X grunge had dissolved into something inherently top 40-friendlier — and 2004, after which alt-rock had a radio comeback and Grey’s Anatomy-type piano balladry turned pop-rock into something more dolorous and epic. Beyond that, we looked for a good deal of overlap with the previously mentioned sonic signifiers, but sometimes determining a song’s eligibility was as simple as asking: “Does this song sound like it would soundtrack a turn-of-the-century minivan commercial?”

posted by Pachylad (87 comments total)

The Fab Fifty:

50. Filter, “Take a Picture” (1999)
49. Dido, “White Flag” (2003)
48. Santana feat. Chad Kroeger, “Why Don’t You & I” (2003)
47. Josh Joplin Group, “Camera One” (2001)
46. Five For Fighting, “Superman (It’s Not Easy)” (2000)
45. Gavin DeGraw, “I Don’t Want to Be” (2004)
44. Hanson, “This Time Around” (2000)
43. Sugar Ray, “Falls Apart” (1999)
42. Stacie Orrico, “(There’s Gotta Be) More to Life” (2003)
41. Blessid Union of Souls, “Hey Leonardo (She Likes Me For Me)” (1999)
40. Clay Aiken, “Invisible” (2003)
39. New Radicals, “Someday We’ll Know” (1999)
38. Coldplay, “Clocks” (2003)
37. Evan and Jaron, “Crazy For This Girl” (2000)
36. 3 Doors Down, “Kryptonite” (2000)
35. Michelle Branch, “Breathe” (2003)
34. Wheatus, “Teenage Dirtbag” (2000)
33. Fuel, “Shimmer” (1998)
32. Barenaked Ladies, “Pinch Me” (2000)
31. John Mayer, “Clarity” (2004)
30. Goo Goo Dolls, “Iris” (1998)
29. Liz Phair, “Why Can’t I” (2004)
28. Fastball, “Out of My Head” (1999)
27. Jewel, “Standing Still” (2001)
26. Ashlee Simpson, “Pieces of Me” (2004)
25. Incubus, “Drive” (2000)
24. P!nk, “Just Like a Pill” (2002)
23. Train, “Drops of Jupiter” (2001)
22. Meredith Brooks, “Bitch” (1997)
21. Howie Day, “Collide” (2003)
20. Eagle-Eye Cherry, “Save Tonight” (1997)
19. Third Eye Blind, “Semi-Charmed Life” (1997)
18. Fountains of Wayne, “Stacy’s Mom” (2003)
17. Jason Mraz, “The Remedy (I Won’t Worry)” (2003)
16. Sheryl Crow, “Soak Up the Sun” (2002)
15. Maroon 5, “This Love” (2004)
14. The Calling, “Wherever You Will Go” (2001)
13. Semisonic, “Closing Time” (1998)
12. Tal Bachman, “She’s So High” (1999)
11. Sixpence None the Richer, “Kiss Me” (1999)
10. Matchbox Twenty, “3AM” (1997)
9. John Mayer, “No Such Thing” (2002)
8. Vanessa Carlton, “A Thousand Miles” (2002)
7. Vertical Horizon, “Everything You Want” (1999)
6. Third Eye Blind, “Never Let You Go” (2000)
5. Michelle Branch, “All You Wanted” (2001)
4. Goo Goo Dolls, “Slide” (1998)
3. Nine Days, “Absolutely (Story of a Girl)” (2000)
2. Avril Lavigne, “Complicated” (2002)
1. Lifehouse, “Hanging By a Moment” (2000)
posted by Pachylad at 1:45 AM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

What probably doesn’t come immediately to mind

As an Australian, I completely reject this premise. There wasn't as much of an audience for R&B as American would've had, and absolutely no audience for American country music. This is absolutely the sound of the new millennium to me.

Also: The SHOCKING snubbing of "All Star". You gave Third Eye Blind two spots and no Smash Mouth?

_{Excellent listicle, draws an interesting circle around something. A+, would have outraged opinions again.}
posted by solarion at 1:52 AM on May 5, 2023 [18 favorites]

As an Australian, I completely reject this premise. There wasn't as much of an audience for R&B as American would've had, and absolutely no audience for American country music. This is absolutely the sound of the new millennium to me.

Heh, I was about to ask if Australia's embracing of Matchbox Twenty and later Rob Thomas was related to this. Here in Southeast Asia (for me specifically Singapore) there was a similar periphery demographic push for The Click Five (barely missing the 2004 cutoff point here) after their initial hometown success with "Just the Girl" and was remembered as a one-hit wonder while going onto enjoy regional overseas success here!
posted by Pachylad at 1:57 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I would have gone to my grave thinking "Bitch" was by Alanis Morisette if it hadn't been for this post. It would have been a fine life, but a lesser one than the life I get to live now. Thanks, Pachylad!
posted by sy at 2:26 AM on May 5, 2023 [6 favorites]

There’s a lot of frosted tips in that list. Also a lot of circa 2003 cover band trauma for yours truly. It certainly is very much the thing it claims to be though. Good list.
posted by threecheesetrees at 3:22 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

I checked, I know / have heard of just 8 of those songs. This confirms my suspicion that something kept me away from music from say 1995 to 2010. Time to have a listen. [Spotify Playlist]
posted by chavenet at 3:56 AM on May 5, 2023 [8 favorites]

Ur-conception for the subgenre's coining, Youtuber Todd in the Shadows first hightlighted it in this thread (snapshots to what could have been: "Dawson's Creek Rock", "Old Navy Rock", "American Pie Rock"). (He in fact wrote some of the entries in the list, under the pseudonym 'Todd Nathanson') Fast forward a bit to 2021, he does a One Hit Wonderland on Evan and Jaron's "Crazy for This Girl" ("a very mid song from this very most mid of genres") namedropping this list and his efforts to make it a thing. (Perhaps fittingly the song is at #37 on the list here lmao)
posted by Pachylad at 4:14 AM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

"The Top Fifty Lists of __________ Because We Have to Put Content Between the Ads"

(srsly... minivan rock?)
posted by SoberHighland at 4:22 AM on May 5, 2023 [10 favorites]

Sorry, not dumping on the post. It's a fun list, and I don't necessarily hate listicles. It just seems like an oddly arbitrary category from which to compile a list of 50 anything. (I shouldn't comment before coffee)

Friend of mine used to hang out with the Matchbox 20 guys before they became big... like six months before they exploded. I met them once before they were widely known and they were genuinely cool. Never liked any of their music, but they, they're millionaires now and I'm not!

I'm sure I've heard almost all of the tunes here, but I couldn't tell you what most of the songs are by name or artist.
posted by SoberHighland at 4:32 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

(srsly... minivan rock?)

It seems accurate to me. Isn’t this meant to be “Listicle of music you were stuck listening to while mom schlepped you and your friends to/from soccer practice?”
posted by Thorzdad at 4:35 AM on May 5, 2023 [11 favorites]

I think I disagree with the premise, here -- Yacht Rock is aspirational, the kind of music you'd listen to if you were living a life of leisure on the open sea. Minivan Rock ... even reading the description, I don't really get a sense that there's an overarching theme here, other than mostly-white-not-too-hard-music during the given time-span.

The name suggests something more like Dad Rock than anything else, and, sure, I guess a lot of this is Dad Rock. But I will take issue with Semi-Charmed Life. 1997 mom-and-dad weren't singing along with a song about getting head and using crystal meth.

And, having been in my late teens and early 20s during this time, I can tell you that teenagers absolutely were listening to Matchbox 20 and 3EB and the Goo Goo Dolls. That wasn't just Dad Music. It wasn't just the stuff you "were stuck listening to while mom schlepped you and your friends to/from soccer practice".

Although again, personal bias here, this list takes a huge nosedive in like 1999. There are maybe 3 songs from 2000 or later that I would ever listen to again (although those three are absolute bangers).
posted by uncleozzy at 4:43 AM on May 5, 2023 [6 favorites]

Also: The SHOCKING snubbing of "All Star". You gave Third Eye Blind two spots and no Smash Mouth?

A serious omission. To make up for it, here's All Star, But They Don't Stop Coming For 10 Hours.
posted by mhoye at 4:49 AM on May 5, 2023 [9 favorites]

AKA the soundtrack of the gradual dissolution of my first marriage.

I think this is a pretty dumb list because there's some really good stuff on it and some real shite, which says to me, "the category is way too broad." Like, I don't know what the fuck P!nk has to do with Matchbox Twenty or John Mayer except the same five years of release.

And calling a timespan "minivan rock" and then building a list out of it is cringe. Nevermind that we had a minivan and schlepped our kids around in it in exactly this time period. Fuck you.

DUMB. Stop looking at me!
posted by seanmpuckett at 4:53 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

> This was the dependable, generation-spanning pop-rock

I dunno, I feel like I'm exactly the wrong age for this. Far too old to have listened to it with my parents, but too young to have listened to it with my own kids. I guess it's generation-spanning in that I don't think any of us have heard these songs out of our own free will.
posted by The corpse in the library at 5:08 AM on May 5, 2023 [5 favorites]

When I first saw this, I was expecting Sammy Johns' Chevy Van to be on it. I am grateful that it is not.

This was before I read that this list was exclusively of songs from 1997 to 2004.
posted by tallmiddleagedgeek at 5:12 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Hell yes I’m gonna belt out “Hanging by a Moment”
posted by BlunderingArtist at 5:19 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

I'm the wrong demographic for this. I recognize 1, maybe 2 of these from reading the list, although I'll know some of these from grocery shopping when I listen to the Spotify list.

But the irony is that these are almost precisely the only years we owned minivans.
posted by MtDewd at 5:24 AM on May 5, 2023 [5 favorites]

I like this list of songs as it takes a premise (there was a period when we had music in minivans) and fleshes it out with an exhaustive list of songs that fit the bill. The exclusion of rap, dance, and any other form of music is clearly signposted and mostly excusable as they’ve said “this is white American music between late 90s and early 2000s”. Way better than most lazy listicles. Hopefully the premise is expanded and we get music outside of the mainstream American experience of the late 90s

(Coincidentally the period talked about here is the period before the internet broke fashion for 30 years, as well as the period where music labels were living high on the hog from CD reissue income/not having to worry about MP3s. After this period a monolithic culture, especially in music, is incredibly hard to point out, which is why we don’t get a lot of listicles venturing into the 2010s)
posted by The River Ivel at 5:57 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

If this is minivan rock, I'm glad I was taking the subway.
posted by pxe2000 at 6:00 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I did listen to some of this in high school and college so I find it hard to generate the kind of disdain that "minivan rock" conjures. It definitely doesn't have the intensity or diversity of other periods but there's some music I still enjoy here.

The funniest cultural relic is Liz Phair's pop turn. That album was so fucking horny, including the overproduced pop "Why Can't I" which is very explicitly about fucking around. The songs are all ridiculously catchy but holy hell did she catch a lot of flak at the time for "selling out."
posted by graymouser at 6:08 AM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

I feel very much like "I am in this picture and I don't like it" reading this list. I mean, I was a white teenager in the DC area during the era, so I guess it's not surprising I heard/liked/owned the album for a bunch of stuff on this list. Even though I discovered punk and then a lot of other music around this time too, I'd probably still listen to most of this. Guess I'm still painfully uncool....
posted by Alterscape at 6:13 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

This is just a list of what alt-rock stations were playing in that time period. I think a subset of it is what I called at the time "sensitive guy rock" which seems to be more or less what they mean by "minivan rock" but that really doesn't include Pink or Dido or Sugar Ray, imo. That was well before I had any sort of MP3 capability in my car, so I heard all of these songs a lot and it's definitely representative of the time period, but this list isn't a convincing argument for a subgenre, I think. (I remain similiarly unconvinced by "yacht rock" but I haven't really dug into the argument.)
posted by restless_nomad at 6:30 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

But I will take issue with Semi-Charmed Life. 1997 mom-and-dad weren't singing along with a song about getting head and using crystal meth.

Don't you believe it. At least 95 percent of the people who sing along to that song don't know any of the words beyond "doo-doo-doo, doo-doo-DOO-doo".
posted by Daily Alice at 6:43 AM on May 5, 2023 [18 favorites]

I do love that song. I just wish they didn't play the radio edit with the extended bridge missing most of the time.
posted by restless_nomad at 6:44 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

The era where I rocked out in the minivan was a little more Roxette/Mike & the Mechanics. Because am old.

I can see the aesthetic they're looking to draw a lens on though, and it's a thing.

"Did we just sketch out the parameters of a hitherto unacknowledged cultural moment?" is a lot more interesting setup for a listicle than "We picked fifty songs you could argue about."
posted by DirtyOldTown at 6:49 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

This is basically my 20s. In 1997, I started my last year of grad school and then moved to New York in 1998. In 2003, we had our first kid and then moved out of New York in 2004.

So this list is basically "stuff I was too cool to listen to in my 20s" - the top 40 stuff that you couldn't avoid but didn't have to like.

That said, there are a couple bangers on this list that have stood the test of time ("Complicated", "A Thousand Miles", "Bitch"), but the rest, oof. My wife (a feminist, mind you) used to joke that Train, Goo Goo Dolls, and Matchbox 20 were headlining what she called the "P**** Rock Festival." Ah, those were the days. :)
posted by Ben Trismegistus at 6:53 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I took a job and stopped listening to 99X in the summer of 1999 and I can totally tell because I didn't know anything after that on this list except the mega-hits.
posted by ob1quixote at 7:06 AM on May 5, 2023

I actually like a lot of these songs.
posted by kevinbelt at 7:10 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

I am still eagerly awaiting the "Top 50 Rock Tunes While Eating Cheese".
posted by Meatbomb at 7:29 AM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

ut I will take issue with Semi-Charmed Life. 1997 mom-and-dad weren't singing along with a song about getting head and using crystal meth.

Man, the youths always thinking they invented sex and drugs and songs about sex and drugs.
posted by The_Vegetables at 7:37 AM on May 5, 2023 [6 favorites]

I agree that it felt like an oddly tortured way to create a genre.

That said - it's a decent enough list of songs.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 7:48 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

The explanation for the concept of “minivan rock” is nonsense, but at the same time these songs absolutely belong on a list together.
posted by sinfony at 7:52 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I feel extremely targeted by this list, as a white kid from a very white, very small rural Oregon town who graduated from high school in 2002. This stuff was all over the top 40 and adult alternative and “best of the 80s, 90s, and today!” stations throughout my adolescence. The summer after I graduated I drove my parents’ minivan off an embankment and into a wheat field while listening to Incubus’ “Drive.” I was o my way to a 12-hour night shift at a factory where the only allowed radio station was playing “Sk8ter Boy” twice per hour.

It has never occurred to me to wrap a genre around what I’ve always thought of as bad, lazy white person rock. My conception of the era was that it was the absolute nadir of major-label pop, a time when the record companies stopped pretending to find good music and gave us Papa Roach instead. So much of the culture of that time feels pointless, and for reasons I can’t articulate this music feels connected to Columbine and 9/11, not responsible for but maybe a symptom of the suburban white malaise that now runs congress. At least two of the bands mentioned here have played at the RNC. The stations that played this stuff also played Kid Rock.

I’ve heard many times that everyone thinks the best music is the music that came out when they were 12, and I’ve never been able to relate to that sentiment. “Load” and “Antichrist Superstar” came out when I was 12.
posted by Just the one swan, actually at 8:01 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Just chiming in to support the "minivan rock" designation; this is what was on the radio, on the "best hits of the 80s, 90s, and todayǃǃ" station (jinx, just the one swan, actually) when I was being driven around to various after school and summer activities in suburban NJ circa 2000; this was also playing over the loudspeakers at the orthodontists', and, nowadays, if my dental hygienist is the right age (i.e., also a millennial), I've got a 50/50 chance of hearing it at the dentist. And this is definitely very distinct from the top 40 station (Z100), as well as both the rock station (K-Rock), and classic rock (Q104.3), though there was some overlap.
posted by damayanti at 8:04 AM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

We have a hatchback, but this is the music I subject my kid to on the way to soccer practice today. (And I love "Crazy for this Girl." It might be the song I love most out of proportion for how good it actually is)/
posted by Bulgaroktonos at 8:09 AM on May 5, 2023

I am still eagerly awaiting the "Top 50 Rock Tunes While Eating Cheese".

It's all songs by Cracker.
posted by MrBadExample at 8:19 AM on May 5, 2023 [6 favorites]

This seems like the right place to link this robot puppet re-enacting the video for A Thousand Miles by Vanessa Carlton.
posted by mbrubeck at 8:23 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

All Star, But They Don't Stop Coming For 10 Hours.

Time to consult a physician!
posted by Greg_Ace at 8:27 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

Wow. This list is such a clear marker of when I stopped listening to Top 40 radio/watching MTV because I know maybe two songs on that list. Actually, really only "Bitch." Something about that stylistic turn into the new millennium really turned me off of popular music. Interesting.
posted by the sobsister at 8:27 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

“Save Tonight” does not deserve this. The “Doo-doo-doo, doo-doo-DOO-doo” song does.
posted by kerf at 8:28 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

One thing I found interesting about this period: songs like "Shimmer" that had a cello part in what would otherwise have just been a pretty straightforward rock tune. It's strange how often it happens, but I've always wondered about the process. It's not like Fuel had a regular cellist who they needed to work into the album. But it's kind of hard to imagine the song without it.
posted by graymouser at 8:30 AM on May 5, 2023

I am still eagerly awaiting the "Top 50 Rock Tunes While Eating Cheese".

Is that part of a love spell you can cast to "win" a woman's love?
posted by cirhosis at 8:31 AM on May 5, 2023

“Save Tonight” does not deserve this. The “Doo-doo-doo, doo-doo-DOO-doo” song does.

I feel like I agree with this, but with the opposite meaning of "deserve." (I will go to the mat for Semi-Charmed life every day, and twice on Sunday.)

It's not like Fuel had a regular cellist who they needed to work into the album. But it's kind of hard to imagine the song without it.

Fun story about the Goo Goo Dolls' "Iris," which is also on this list. Session guitarist Tim Pierce was brought in to play mandolin on that track and decided to have all his gear brought to the studio, because ... you never know. After he tracked the (also iconic) mandolin part, he was tapped to add something to the bridge, and wound up playing the absolutely iconic slide guitar solo in that song. Kismet? Or making one's own kismet?
posted by uncleozzy at 8:35 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

In the better timeline we don’t mock minivans and they fill the niche now held in the US by SUVs and we’re a bit quieter and safer and not implicitly killing Japans kei-car industry.

Cool non threatening minivans could have been… hm… not carpeted sex pits like 70s vans; over and not kid-friendly. How about media platforms a bit early? Better speakers, set up so Parent has a pleasant hang while Kid is at practice, somehow set up for having a guest. Tiny RVs. Aftermarket fins and lights and chilled cup holders and what-all.
posted by clew at 8:38 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

When I see this lawyer sign, I always sing "I'm not listening when you say, gooodbyyyyyeee."
posted by DirtyOldTown at 8:41 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

One thing I found interesting about this period: songs like "Shimmer" that had a cello part in what would otherwise have just been a pretty straightforward rock tune. It's strange how often it happens, but I've always wondered about the process. It's not like Fuel had a regular cellist who they needed to work into the album.

Label: Nirvana had a cello on "All Apologies". You should put a cello on your record.

Band: ...

Producer: I could probably fit something in on that one section of "Shimmer".

Band: ...

Producer: I'll call that cellist we got to play on Bush's second record.

Band: ...

Producer: (overdubs cello part)

Label: Yes! #1 record on the way!

Band: Yay, we still have a record contract.
posted by kevinbelt at 8:48 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I'll just be here listening to my tunes.
posted by credulous at 8:51 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Whether or not the category is strained or has the right songs in it, I enjoyed the article, the writing, the descriptions of the songs. Thumbs up for the post, Pachylad!
posted by straight at 8:59 AM on May 5, 2023

"Music that caused potrzebie to quit listening to the radio". A number of these songs were truly inescapable if you were a teen at the time, but god, if anyone tried it was me.
posted by potrzebie at 9:08 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Lol before I even clicked into the post and saw the list of songs, my millennial brain immediately thought of Lighthouse when I saw the description of "minivan rock."

I'm also adding in any music that was featured on Smallville.
posted by paisley sheep at 9:28 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

On the one hand, I've heard probably all of the more-or-less-canonical yacht rock songs, whereas the only songs in this list that I'm sure that I've heard are "Complicated" and "Stacy's Mom" (and the latter only because of, you know, er, the video). On the other hand, I have been in a minivan more than once, but never in an actual yacht. In conclusion, listicles are a land of contrasts.
posted by Halloween Jack at 9:31 AM on May 5, 2023

Next up for discussion/debate/nostalgia: Billboard's The 100 Greatest Choruses of the 21st Century.
posted by gottabefunky at 9:33 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

Why is Jimmie Eat World not on this list? The Middle was definitely one of the better entries to this "genre."

Hanging by a Moment/Lifehouse do belong on this list, but the list it/they should be number 1 on is "songs that you assume are love songs but then you find out the band is explicitly Christian and you have to wonder if you got tricked into singing about your love for Jesus." For the record, I believe the songwriter says it was written as a love song but thinks it can work as a spiritual song as well. So only ambiguously Jesusy.
posted by the primroses were over at 10:07 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

Next up for discussion/debate/nostalgia: Billboard's The 100 Greatest Choruses of the 21st Century.

It's really hard to argue with most of those choruses. I'm on the record as not being interested in ranking, but as a group, those are some strong fucking hooks. I had to go all the way down to 5SOS at 45 to find one I couldn't instantly sing, and even below there, I think there are only 10 or so that aren't instantly in my head.
posted by uncleozzy at 10:07 AM on May 5, 2023

I checked, I know / have heard of just 8 of those songs. This confirms my suspicion that something kept me away from music from say 1995 to 2010.

I'm the wrong demographic for this. I recognize 1, maybe 2 of these from reading the list, although

I can immediately say I know two of the listed tracks:

18. Fountains of Wayne, “Stacy’s Mom” (2003)
12. Tal Bachman, “She’s So High” (1999)

Otherwise, nada. Lots of artist names I recognize. And I'm sure if I actually heard some of these tracks, they'd trigger some level of recognition. But in general, I guess I just wasn't there 1997-2004, mini-vanning it, caring what the fuck pop was up to. I guess I'd given up. Not on music but on what the pop world (and those who were manipulating it, usually for mercenary ends) was deeming relevant.

Isn’t this meant to be “Listicle of music you were stuck listening to while mom schlepped you and your friends to/from soccer practice?”

full reveal. I turned thirty-six in 1995 and I wasn't a mom, or a dad. Though I was an uncle sometimes. But generally I had mixtapes on hand with which to educate the youngers ...
posted by philip-random at 10:08 AM on May 5, 2023

Why is Jimmie Eat World not on this list? The Middle was definitely one of the better entries to this "genre."

They explicitly excluded emo. Plus I'd argue that Jimmy Eat World is a lot "harder" than most of this material, despite writing poppy hooks.
posted by uncleozzy at 10:11 AM on May 5, 2023 [3 favorites]

The funniest cultural relic is Liz Phair's pop turn. That album was so fucking horny, including the overproduced pop "Why Can't I" which is very explicitly about fucking around. The songs are all ridiculously catchy but holy hell did she catch a lot of flak at the time for "selling out."

I know that this is the second time Todd In The Shadows has been mentioned here, but Liz Phair's "Freestyle" record was also a subject for one of his videos.

The Calling, “Wherever You Will Go” (2001)

I remember that this song caused a bit of controversy in the online Star Trek community; it was featured in the teaser commercial for Enterprise. Some fans were appalled that pop music was being used to promote Star Trek. I'll admit that I enjoyed the commercial music more than the music that played over the Enterprise opening credits.
posted by JDC8 at 10:11 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

They explicitly excluded emo

Thanks, I did read the exclusions but missed that.

I still think The Middle specifically fits this list, it's closer to Kryptonite or Teenage Dirtbag than say Dashboard Confessional in my opinion. But I only heard about minivan rock now, so I don't claim to be expert. (Also I am quite distracted if I'm spelling Jimmy Eat World with an "ie" so there you go.)
posted by the primroses were over at 10:36 AM on May 5, 2023

I know that this is the second time Todd In The Shadows has been mentioned here, but Liz Phair's "Freestyle" record was also a subject for one of his videos .

The Calling, “Wherever You Will Go” (2001)

And now a third time! ONE HIT WONDERLAND: "Wherever You Will Go" by The Calling
posted by Pachylad at 10:41 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

Todd in the Shadows' analysis of "The Macarena" also had an FPP.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 10:50 AM on May 5, 2023

I recognize more than half of these, and don’t care enough to really debate. But I am making This comment so the list did its job.

I agree that Smashmouth should be on this list. Their first album was really pop-punk except for “Walking on the sun” but then they really settled into the Minivan thing with All-Star, et Al. Jimmy Eat World is clearly emo to me even if the middle got lots of airplay.

I do wonder why Dave Mathews Band isn’t on here.
For whoever brought up the Click Five, Adam from Fountains of Wayne actually wrote a lot of their stuff. FOW is probably my favorite Pop-Rock band of all time and has such an amazing deep catalog beyond Stacey’s Mom. I wonder about some of the other one-hit wonders like Wheatus and if some of them have deep catalogs.
posted by CostcoCultist at 11:11 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

On review DMBs Crash came out in 1996 so just outside this window, but I swear is was still all over the radio untill 2003.

I might also nominate Switchfoot’s “dare you to move” but maybe that was just a SoCal thing
posted by CostcoCultist at 11:22 AM on May 5, 2023

1997 to 2004 was kind of a blur of 80 hour work weeks and I had little time for new music. Only two songs on that list do I recognize by name.
Though I did see Howie Day perform in 2002 when he opened for Tori Amos at Key Arena.
posted by Tenuki at 11:31 AM on May 5, 2023

How did Fastball's non-hit make the list but their hit didn't?

Also not nearly enough Daughtry if this is supposed to be minivan mom music.
posted by The_Vegetables at 11:35 AM on May 5, 2023

Though I did see Howie Day perform in 2002 when he opened for Tori Amos at Key Arena.

Howie Day played in Austin regularly before his big break and his solo loop-machine shows were fantastic. I really think the standard band arrangements did his music no favors, although I certainly don't begrudge him his success. Still like both of the albums of his I have.
posted by restless_nomad at 11:38 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

I do wonder why Dave Mathews Band isn’t on here

If we're using the minivan framework, people didn't listen to Dave in the minivan. People listened to Dave once they got out of the minivan and either got their own car or went to college.

I kind of hate "Stacey's Mom" because Fountains of Wayne is such a good band and people only know them for a joke song.
posted by kevinbelt at 11:42 AM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

If you look at it from a certain angle, just about all of the Fountains of Wayne catalog is joke songs, though. Pastiches, wry points-of-view, sometimes outright parody. That all of it was done with such astonishing aplomb is almost part of the joke. Sure, yes, the gag of Stacy's Mom is broad to the point of absurdity, but it's not really so different from anything else.
posted by uncleozzy at 11:49 AM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I don't recognize most of these song but I just remembered that my company car at the time was a Ford Windstar.
posted by Tenuki at 11:50 AM on May 5, 2023

Scanning the list, I either really, really like it or I've never heard of it.

I think a lot of this didn't make it to the UK and I accept that I have no taste.
posted by plonkee at 12:20 PM on May 5, 2023

I wonder about some of the other one-hit wonders like Wheatus and if some of them have deep catalogs.

Okay so I haven't followed Wheatus, but I did love "Teenage Dirtbag" back in the day which was good because in the heart of the Minivan Rock years I was living in Eastern Europe with intermittent access to pirated German MTV, where it was on pretty heavy rotation. It was one of the few contemporary American rock songs I heard at all for a couple years, and one of the only ones I did hear that I liked. It is possible their debut album is buried in the depths of my CD collection? I recall the rest of it as competent, although not as catchy as "Teenage Dirtbag."

And nearly 20 years later, as the result of still vaguely keeping track of Mike Doughty's post-Soul Coughing career, I was surprised to learn Wheatus was still a going concern, after he announced a tour with them.

So, since my curiosity is now piqued - going by Wikipedia, it looks like popularity in the UK may have been a driver keeping the band working? They have a North American festival tour and a solo UK tour on their website for later this year.
posted by EvaDestruction at 12:30 PM on May 5, 2023

Vice did a "story of Teenage Dirtbag" video a couple of years ago, and yeah, it does seem like they were much bigger outside the US than at home. Great video, highly worth watching if you love Teenage Dirtbag as much as I do.

(I bought their first CD in the cutout bin at Newbury Comics for like $5 in 2001, and yeah, it's got a couple of songs I enjoy, but they're not obvious hits like Teenage Dirtbag.)
posted by uncleozzy at 12:39 PM on May 5, 2023

Like many here I lived through this time phase, and while I didn't listen closely to generic radio, I heard some vague bits on TV, etc. So out of all 50 songs listed here, I can only recognize exactly one title enough to hum a few bars: Kiss Me by Sixpence-blahblah. Which is actually a pretty decent pop ballad. (Yeah okay I recognize the names of many of the bands but not exactly the song titles.)
posted by ovvl at 1:05 PM on May 5, 2023

This must have been my peak radio era because I recognize most of the songs on the list. If you made a list like this for the present though I would be completely lost. My 70 year old dad knows more modern pop than I do.
posted by downtohisturtles at 1:42 PM on May 5, 2023

uncleozzy you comment may have just inspired me to do a FPP on FOW (assuming there hasn’t been one) especially as we just passed the 3rd anniversary of Adam’s Covid death. So many great songs from so many perspectives, although more folks may be aware of all the explicitly joke/parody songs from Crazy Ex-Girlfriend.

On the separate DMB discussion I’d argue that Crash into Me is absolutely a minivan rock song, although getting Dave’s songwriting certainly support a a deep and varied catalog
posted by CostcoCultist at 2:36 PM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

I get that Billboard is attempting to conjure up a very particular image. But after folks rebounded from the economic down turn in 07 & 08 this period marked the rise of the SUV and the decline of the minivan in suburbia.

SUV are boring, bland and the safe choice for anyone just looking for keep up with their neighbors. SUV's are less safe, consume more resources and are worse than most other transportation options. They exist primarily as a method for large corporations to extract as much capital out of the economy as possible.

So if I was putting together a list of bland radio hits in the service of selling white suburbanites the feeling of being safe in SUVs this Billboard list would be a good start.
posted by zenon at 2:55 PM on May 5, 2023

I would pay $25 to never hear Drops of Jupiter again.
posted by dephlogisticated at 4:28 PM on May 5, 2023 [4 favorites]

Man this is like a list of songs I really hate.

It's interesting though, I've never had a minivan, never listened to any of this music by choice, spent most of this era doing exotic drugs and listening to jungle and techno, and yet I immediately knew exactly what they meant by this genre description and the minivan tie-in. And I know at least 2/3 of the songs.
posted by chaz at 4:36 PM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

They added Hanson but not “Mmmmmmbop?” What the heck????
posted by yes I said yes I will Yes at 4:49 PM on May 5, 2023

I drive a Dodge minivan, and have since 95' (on my second one, and the ability to haul damn near anything anywhere rocks), but I'll be dammed if any of those are in my playlist. Sorry folks, but 2000's music sucks.
posted by Old'n'Busted at 5:03 PM on May 5, 2023

I am perhaps over thinking the specifics of the genre?

Like, there is a period of several years near the turn of the century that we'll call the Golden Age of Minivans. Granted. Agreed. Understood.

But is this just music that happened to be concurrent with that era?
Is it the passive, Music that was on The Radio, during the minivan years?

Or is it supposed to reflect the active choices in music made by the minivan set? Those years spanned the age of an armrest full of loose cassettes to a binder full of CDs to an armrest full of loose CD-Rs full of pirated MP3s, Sharpie-labeled 'Summer Jamz '97' and such.
So is this Songs that They played in minivans On Purpose? Ha ha?

And who's the They making the choices in this minivan?
Is this 'stuff your Mom put on while she drove you to soccer practice'? Or is this piling your friends in the AstroVan for the road trip to Spring Break Y2K? Or am I 'Mom' and it's my minivan?
Who's supposed to nostalgic here?

I don't know what else to say, except...

IT'S BEEN
posted by bartleby at 5:12 PM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Man this is like a list of songs I really hate.

It's interesting though, I've never had a minivan, never listened to any of this music by choice, spent most of this era doing exotic drugs and listening to jungle and techno, and yet I immediately knew exactly what they meant by this genre description and the minivan tie-in. And I know at least 2/3 of the songs.

This is pretty much me, though I am not sure I know 2/3rds of these songs- and I don't want to listen to them to find out. If I do know them it's because I used to snowboard and I would have categorized these tunes as Ski Area Music.
posted by oneirodynia at 5:29 PM on May 5, 2023

I had one of exactly three reactions to every item in this list:

1.) What the fuck? I've never even heard of that.
2.) Oh hey, now, maybe you had to be there but I love that one.
3.) Oh fuck that song right into a dying star. No no no.

So yeah, seems like a good list.
posted by Navelgazer at 7:04 PM on May 5, 2023 [1 favorite]

I've long been an occasional radio listener just to keep up with what the squares are up to, and my reaction is that I bet I know a whole bunch of these, I just don't know the titles, or the band. Just the doo-doo-doos. I could really use a YouTube playlist! This is not a request. I will say that this music, music that was catchy but I was not into, fed my sense of pop music as a craft at least as much as exploitation and co-option (co-opting?). It became interesting to muse, "why is this one popular?"

I'd have to do a bunch of digging that I will never feel like doing in order to confirm that maybe these were all The Last MTV Videos before a) hip-hop (really) exploded, and b) they stopped playing videos. I don't know the years of all these, but if they go up to 2007 then that would be when the iPhone came out and YouTube ate MTV's lunch.

Overall, since streaming hadn't individualized the music listening experience in the way that it does yet, people still were able to like A Radio Station. It might have just been the music that was on, but the thing that it was on was the result of a preference. I remember going to Kings Island amusement park in Cincinnati the summer of 97 and noticing that every long line had TVs above showing some music video service. Because I was almost 30, I was a little gobsmacked that teens were standing in line with their friends, singing "Mmm Bop" and Britney Spears out loud. Not like a whole crowd or even loud enough for a lot of people to hear, just that kind of toe-tapping sing along you do sometimes. The experience of listening to music (and knowing band names and song titles) has changed so much in the past 25 years, but that 10 years across the turn of the millenium is a foreign country now.
posted by rhizome at 8:40 PM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

“The Middle” is a good shout, and if Filter (an industrial band through and through, check out “Welcome to the Fold,” the first single from the record with “Take a Picture” if you don’t believe me) can be on this list then so can Jimmy Eat World.

And props to all the incredibly brave people stopping in note that they’re too cool, takes real courage to admit you’re not into Avril Lavigne and Lifehouse.
posted by sinfony at 11:39 PM on May 5, 2023 [2 favorites]

Addendum: I am not into Avril Lavigne and Lifehouse.
posted by Meatbomb at 12:30 AM on May 6, 2023

OK I have officially listened to the whole list (except from "She's So High" because fuck that song) and I have come to the conclusion that what they have defined is a marketing category, not a genre in any artistic sense. These are all songs with a particular level of edge (not much), a pretty small range of tempo and intensity, and came out in a particular time period aimed at a particular market. It's just... what was successful on Adult Alternative radio during that time period.

I have a poorly-defined theory that part of the reason it kinda feels cohesive is that this is the last gasp of rock that is still pretty alienated from rap/hip-hop. The latter part of the 00s and onward, it seems to me like hip-hop went much more mainstream and it changed the average sound quite a bit. But I'm not willing to do that kind of research, I may be off-base.
posted by restless_nomad at 1:32 PM on May 6, 2023 [2 favorites]

takes real courage to admit you’re not into Avril Lavigne and Lifehouse.

They’re… whatever, they exist, but can we strap John Mayer and Jason Mraz on a rocket and launch into the sun

I am serious
posted by pxe2000 at 3:14 AM on May 7, 2023 [1 favorite]