“You just walk in like you belong.”
March 10, 2025 12:28 PM Subscribe
The first season of Andor is now streaming on Hulu and Disney has uploaded first three-episode arc to YouTube. This is done to build momentum for the April 22nd premiere of the second, and last, season. A day which happens to be, as Damien Walter notes in a recent video essay, Lenin’s birthday. This fits Walter’s argument that Andor is a Marxist story. Others, such as Sage Hyden and Phoebe Wagner, maintain it should be understood as anti-fascist. Either way, left-wing science fiction magazine Red Futures released a whole issue devoted to Andor analysis.
I'm old enough that I saw the original Star Wars in the theater. I am a casual Star Wars fan who hasn't even seen all the series and I think I've missed a couple of the more recent films. Not a huge fan, and not a hater.
I enjoyed Andor. It was essentially a WW2 movie made into a series set in a science fiction world. I liked that about it... no light sabers, no dead-boring Jedi mopes. I guess this is overthinking it, but: in Star Wars world, there's droids that can do work for free 24/7. Why did they need all these humans doing this labor?
They wanted to imprison and control them; I get that. But why make them do labor that could be sabotaged? Why not just force them to dig ditches, then fill the ditches back in?
posted by SoberHighland at 12:37 PM on March 10 [8 favorites]
I enjoyed Andor. It was essentially a WW2 movie made into a series set in a science fiction world. I liked that about it... no light sabers, no dead-boring Jedi mopes. I guess this is overthinking it, but: in Star Wars world, there's droids that can do work for free 24/7. Why did they need all these humans doing this labor?
They wanted to imprison and control them; I get that. But why make them do labor that could be sabotaged? Why not just force them to dig ditches, then fill the ditches back in?
posted by SoberHighland at 12:37 PM on March 10 [8 favorites]
What background do we need to make sense of Andor?
I've seen nearly all of the movies and the animated show(s?), but not the live action tv series.
posted by doctornemo at 12:43 PM on March 10
I've seen nearly all of the movies and the animated show(s?), but not the live action tv series.
posted by doctornemo at 12:43 PM on March 10
That’s plenty of background.
posted by Jon_Evil at 12:50 PM on March 10 [2 favorites]
posted by Jon_Evil at 12:50 PM on March 10 [2 favorites]
In the Star Wars univers, the empire ended slavery. Andor shows us, whether intentional or just a convenient by product of the bureaucracy of oppression, how easy it is to fill the prisons with laborers that are even cheaper than droids. Human life is worth very little to the empire.
Consider that in our own universe, if Tesla or whoever releases a $100khumanoid robot it will sell like hotcakes to the wealthy and be hailed as an incredible advance in elder care and hazardous jobs. And yet I think it would not even put a dent in the market for American prison laborers and undocumented agricultural workers.
posted by radagast at 12:53 PM on March 10 [22 favorites]
Consider that in our own universe, if Tesla or whoever releases a $100khumanoid robot it will sell like hotcakes to the wealthy and be hailed as an incredible advance in elder care and hazardous jobs. And yet I think it would not even put a dent in the market for American prison laborers and undocumented agricultural workers.
posted by radagast at 12:53 PM on March 10 [22 favorites]
I tried watching every other star wars TV show from Disney after watching Andor and was pretty disappointed.
The only thing in the Star Wars universe even close is the movie Rogue One, which Andor basically functions as a prequel for. You'll even notice a number of shared characters/actors.
posted by joyceanmachine at 12:56 PM on March 10 [7 favorites]
The only thing in the Star Wars universe even close is the movie Rogue One, which Andor basically functions as a prequel for. You'll even notice a number of shared characters/actors.
posted by joyceanmachine at 12:56 PM on March 10 [7 favorites]
In addition to Radagast's point, the Clone Wars (vs mass produced battle droids and boy is there a lot to unpack on both sides with that) in universe made a lot of people, if not droidphobic or droidhating, at least droidskeptical.
I watched Andor and had a, "It could have been this the whole time!!?!" moment with Star Wars generally. Especially with Rogue One in the picture.
posted by Slackermagee at 1:11 PM on March 10 [10 favorites]
I watched Andor and had a, "It could have been this the whole time!!?!" moment with Star Wars generally. Especially with Rogue One in the picture.
posted by Slackermagee at 1:11 PM on March 10 [10 favorites]
What background do we need to make sense of Andor?
Andor is the prequel to Rogue One, and in that sense to Star Wars (the first one, aka A New Hope). It depicts the radicalization over time (apparently several planned seasons) of the character who eventually leads the group that steals the plans to the Death Star and delivers them to Leia and the rebellion--dying in the process.
It's aggressively anti-fascist and pro-union/worker. I'd agree that it's Marxist in the best possible sense, but others might disagree. Anyway it's extremely good TV. Nothing else in the Disney-era live action Star Wars universe comes anywhere close and you shouldn't bother with most of that stuff, but Andor is spectacular and life-affirming. Watch it!
posted by The Bellman at 1:15 PM on March 10 [26 favorites]
Andor is the prequel to Rogue One, and in that sense to Star Wars (the first one, aka A New Hope). It depicts the radicalization over time (apparently several planned seasons) of the character who eventually leads the group that steals the plans to the Death Star and delivers them to Leia and the rebellion--dying in the process.
It's aggressively anti-fascist and pro-union/worker. I'd agree that it's Marxist in the best possible sense, but others might disagree. Anyway it's extremely good TV. Nothing else in the Disney-era live action Star Wars universe comes anywhere close and you shouldn't bother with most of that stuff, but Andor is spectacular and life-affirming. Watch it!
posted by The Bellman at 1:15 PM on March 10 [26 favorites]
This fits Walter’s argument that Andor is a Marxist story. Others, such as Sage Hyden and Phoebe Wagner, maintain it should be understood as anti-fascist.
Uh … Marxism is anti-fascism? It's not the only strain of anti-fascism, but there is definitely no fundamental conflict between a Marxist reading and an anti-fascist reading.
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:26 PM on March 10 [6 favorites]
Uh … Marxism is anti-fascism? It's not the only strain of anti-fascism, but there is definitely no fundamental conflict between a Marxist reading and an anti-fascist reading.
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:26 PM on March 10 [6 favorites]
(I have no opinion on the particular text of Andor, however, because i loathe Star Wars and i think the worldbuilding of the larger universe is fundamentally fascist.)
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:27 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
posted by adrienneleigh at 1:27 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
Walter notes in the post I linked as Andor Is a Marxist Story:
posted by Kattullus at 1:33 PM on March 10 [6 favorites]
But it’s more interesting that the left and progressives were also generally unhappy with the idea of Andor as a Marxist text. There were a dozen or more essays from the well known left / progressive youtube critics that identified Andor as “anti-fascist”. And it’s from the audience for those channels that I got the most pushback.Which, interestingly, fits one of the running themes of the show, which dramatizes the tension between those who want a social revolution and revolutionaries who’re satisfied with political change.
posted by Kattullus at 1:33 PM on March 10 [6 favorites]
What background do we need to make sense of Andor?
I don’t think you need to have seen any Star Wars movies or TV shows before. None at all. The same story could be told with 20th century guns instead of blasters. The visual language of who has power and who lacks it is unambiguous. Maybe watch Casablanca?
Not my joke:
"Hey Tony Gilroy, we want you to make a Star Wars show."
"I want to make Army of Shadows"
"Is that a Sith thing?"
"...yes?"
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 2:36 PM on March 10 [12 favorites]
I don’t think you need to have seen any Star Wars movies or TV shows before. None at all. The same story could be told with 20th century guns instead of blasters. The visual language of who has power and who lacks it is unambiguous. Maybe watch Casablanca?
Not my joke:
"Hey Tony Gilroy, we want you to make a Star Wars show."
"I want to make Army of Shadows"
"Is that a Sith thing?"
"...yes?"
posted by justsomebodythatyouusedtoknow at 2:36 PM on March 10 [12 favorites]
right after the movie came out, the novel Splinter of the mind's eye was published.
essentially, like The Hobbit, the beginnings of a good Jewel Heist on Mimban. It encompasses the imperial presence/ mining interests and those who serve and those who rebel or may choose too.
Foster was given a task of serializing Star Wars and this was his endeavor and I believe there was a follow-up book that was going to be made until low budget movie that was scrapped for Empire.
essentially if there's an antecedent to the thesis of a Marxist style on Andor, the trade routes through the system appear to be quite valuable in the future Star Wars Canon. As the story takes place just after the death star's destruction, the story would have taken place not long after the events of rogue one rebellion organizes Jedi, rogue aristocrats, smugglers, farmers and the quasi-religious element of the force that is weak and that too, organizes. But as as the Grand story plays out, the Jedi will not win this alone.
posted by clavdivs at 4:25 PM on March 10 [2 favorites]
essentially, like The Hobbit, the beginnings of a good Jewel Heist on Mimban. It encompasses the imperial presence/ mining interests and those who serve and those who rebel or may choose too.
Foster was given a task of serializing Star Wars and this was his endeavor and I believe there was a follow-up book that was going to be made until low budget movie that was scrapped for Empire.
essentially if there's an antecedent to the thesis of a Marxist style on Andor, the trade routes through the system appear to be quite valuable in the future Star Wars Canon. As the story takes place just after the death star's destruction, the story would have taken place not long after the events of rogue one rebellion organizes Jedi, rogue aristocrats, smugglers, farmers and the quasi-religious element of the force that is weak and that too, organizes. But as as the Grand story plays out, the Jedi will not win this alone.
posted by clavdivs at 4:25 PM on March 10 [2 favorites]
It is written somewhere in Hegel that the history of a galaxy far far away repeats itself, so to speak, twice. First as taxation to outer trade routes being in dispute, then, as social realism about mining colonialism.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 4:36 PM on March 10 [11 favorites]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 4:36 PM on March 10 [11 favorites]
"I want to make Army of Shadows"
OMG, yes, exactly.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 4:56 PM on March 10
OMG, yes, exactly.
posted by Insert Clever Name Here at 4:56 PM on March 10
I do not care for Star Wars generally, do not pretend to know anything about it, and was immensely skeptical going in to this show, but it's really good. Some general political chit-chat and conniving escapes me because I simply don't care that much, but the main story is entirely watchable for its own sake. It's a beautifully immersive show as well, and there are lots of good actors. We re-watched it right around the election, and it really depressed me thinking of all the oppression to come/continue/intensify in the real world, but the people are also fighting the oppressors, and that part is good.
posted by oneirodynia at 4:59 PM on March 10 [3 favorites]
posted by oneirodynia at 4:59 PM on March 10 [3 favorites]
Dang, there's only going to be 2 seasons of Andor. It's the only Star Wars thing I've really liked since the original Trilogy, for the same reasons as described in the first post.
Better to keep it short and sweet I guess.
posted by Liquidwolf at 5:15 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
Better to keep it short and sweet I guess.
posted by Liquidwolf at 5:15 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
I tried watching every other star wars TV show from Disney after watching Andor and was pretty disappointed
Star Wars is sci-fi for children. While the first film blatantly stole the plot of The Hidden Fortress, it was inspired by the Flash Gordon Saturday matinee serials of 90 years ago.
Andor is the first flavor of Star Wars made for adults, because the political and financial machinations of a fledgling rebellion are not as interesting to kids as the zwumm zwumm pew pew. It's not really fair to compare the two. Both versions are enjoyable in their intended contexts.
posted by CynicalKnight at 5:20 PM on March 10 [9 favorites]
Star Wars is sci-fi for children. While the first film blatantly stole the plot of The Hidden Fortress, it was inspired by the Flash Gordon Saturday matinee serials of 90 years ago.
Andor is the first flavor of Star Wars made for adults, because the political and financial machinations of a fledgling rebellion are not as interesting to kids as the zwumm zwumm pew pew. It's not really fair to compare the two. Both versions are enjoyable in their intended contexts.
posted by CynicalKnight at 5:20 PM on March 10 [9 favorites]
honestly given the track record, "only going to be two seasons" means that it might go for a full season longer than usual for "good part of Disney+ Star Wars show"
I have heard that Andor is truly great, like someone lost a bet and was forced to greenlight a Star Wars thing meant for a grown-up audience, and keep meaning to check it out
posted by DoctorFedora at 6:04 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
I have heard that Andor is truly great, like someone lost a bet and was forced to greenlight a Star Wars thing meant for a grown-up audience, and keep meaning to check it out
posted by DoctorFedora at 6:04 PM on March 10 [1 favorite]
Also, all three of the top three monologues in Star Wars are in Andor. Kino Loy in episode 10, Luthen in episode 10, and Maarva in episode 12. Just astounding speeches.
An incredible turn on Yoda's "Do or do not" by Nemik in his manifesto. There's a show stopping religious festival that happens on screen except the show doesn't stop and it's treated as being precious, and special, and definitely on the chopping block for the Empire. Mon Mothma chiding a newly recruited conspirator, "Smile" in gentle but serious tones. The settings.
They should be giving Tony Gilroy mad money every year forever to just make more Star Wars. Let's see a Gilroy take on some side plot going on during the time of Exar Kun.
posted by Slackermagee at 6:08 PM on March 10 [10 favorites]
An incredible turn on Yoda's "Do or do not" by Nemik in his manifesto. There's a show stopping religious festival that happens on screen except the show doesn't stop and it's treated as being precious, and special, and definitely on the chopping block for the Empire. Mon Mothma chiding a newly recruited conspirator, "Smile" in gentle but serious tones. The settings.
They should be giving Tony Gilroy mad money every year forever to just make more Star Wars. Let's see a Gilroy take on some side plot going on during the time of Exar Kun.
posted by Slackermagee at 6:08 PM on March 10 [10 favorites]
Thank you for answering my background question, The Bellman and all.
Glad to hear the link to Rogue One. Back in the day I somehow wrote an Atlantic article about it.
posted by doctornemo at 6:18 PM on March 10 [8 favorites]
Glad to hear the link to Rogue One. Back in the day I somehow wrote an Atlantic article about it.
posted by doctornemo at 6:18 PM on March 10 [8 favorites]
I just remember in one of the episodes, some of the characters had to dive through a reservoir of some sort, and not only were they using drysuits, but the drysuits had dump valves in the shoulder just like real-world drysuits. The people doing the costumes did their research and designed something realistic!
posted by fnerg at 6:48 PM on March 10 [4 favorites]
posted by fnerg at 6:48 PM on March 10 [4 favorites]
The people doing the costumes did their research and designed something realistic!
In the heist sequence the conspirators all go marching off to do their job, leaving behind their campsite with the goats in the pens. And I said, "What about the goats?"
--the very next shot panned across the empty campsite, showing where the pens had been left open so the goats were safe.
I really knew, then, that I was in good hands.
posted by suelac at 9:40 PM on March 10 [17 favorites]
In the heist sequence the conspirators all go marching off to do their job, leaving behind their campsite with the goats in the pens. And I said, "What about the goats?"
--the very next shot panned across the empty campsite, showing where the pens had been left open so the goats were safe.
I really knew, then, that I was in good hands.
posted by suelac at 9:40 PM on March 10 [17 favorites]
Seconding everything said above, there's so much care and thought put into every detail of this show!
It's also the first Star Wars property where the laser blasts felt dangerous to me. I was actually worried for the characters. Can't quite put my finger on why. It's not just the plotting, but something about how they are filming the blaster scenes.
posted by ishmael at 1:25 AM on March 11 [3 favorites]
It's also the first Star Wars property where the laser blasts felt dangerous to me. I was actually worried for the characters. Can't quite put my finger on why. It's not just the plotting, but something about how they are filming the blaster scenes.
posted by ishmael at 1:25 AM on March 11 [3 favorites]
Dang, there's only going to be 2 seasons of Andor.
This is fantastic. No ongoing story that eventually goes off the rails, no endless retreading of themes, or plot armor. Just get in, tell the story, and finish it. Plus we know how it ends (with the Star Wars movie Rogue One), so the story can really dig into the characters
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:33 AM on March 11 [7 favorites]
This is fantastic. No ongoing story that eventually goes off the rails, no endless retreading of themes, or plot armor. Just get in, tell the story, and finish it. Plus we know how it ends (with the Star Wars movie Rogue One), so the story can really dig into the characters
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:33 AM on March 11 [7 favorites]
To me, someone just old enough to remember seeing the first movie "Star Wars" in the theater, the only true Star Wars is Andor, Rogue One, and Star Wars (pre-Special-Edition). Empire is a good movie, but it took Star Wars in so many wrong directions I have abandoned it as part of the story. The less said about all the other stuff, the better (although The Mandalorian has some good bits, it's not essential in any way).
posted by rikschell at 5:43 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
posted by rikschell at 5:43 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
Star Wars is sci-fi for children.
This Christmas, The Andor play set by Mattel! Assemble part of the Death Star, while avoiding the electric floor. Oh no, Dad got shocked!
posted by funkaspuck at 6:16 AM on March 11 [7 favorites]
This Christmas, The Andor play set by Mattel! Assemble part of the Death Star, while avoiding the electric floor. Oh no, Dad got shocked!
posted by funkaspuck at 6:16 AM on March 11 [7 favorites]
I think it's a bit of a stretch to call Andor Marxist, elastic as the term is.
As I've said before, I think the core of Marx is his theory of history. That is that societies evolve by crisis through different stages: primitive communism, slave societies, feudalism, capitalism, communism. Part of the capitalist phase is the flattening of multi-level class structures into just two classes: the proletariat and the bourgeoisie.
The trouble with applying this to the Star Wars universe is that it doesn't seem to have any consistent political economy. It includes corporations, monarchs, slaves if we count droids and drones as such, feudal lords if we take the term "daimyo" used in Boba Fett as appropriate, and some elected officals.
The Rebellion seems to include monarchs and aristocrats rebelling against an emperor. It doesn't seem to be proletarians rebelling against a bourgeoisie. Marx considered the French Revolution to be part of the Feudal/Capitalist transition. But on the other hand the Trade Federation was a large corporation which was dissolved by the Empire, which would suggest that the transition to capitalism has already happened.
I don't think there's enough of a class basis for the revolution in Andor to be considered Marxist. I'm not sure there's enough coherence to the Star Wars universe for it to fit anywhere in his theory of history.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 6:33 AM on March 11 [12 favorites]
As I've said before, I think the core of Marx is his theory of history. That is that societies evolve by crisis through different stages: primitive communism, slave societies, feudalism, capitalism, communism. Part of the capitalist phase is the flattening of multi-level class structures into just two classes: the proletariat and the bourgeoisie.
The trouble with applying this to the Star Wars universe is that it doesn't seem to have any consistent political economy. It includes corporations, monarchs, slaves if we count droids and drones as such, feudal lords if we take the term "daimyo" used in Boba Fett as appropriate, and some elected officals.
The Rebellion seems to include monarchs and aristocrats rebelling against an emperor. It doesn't seem to be proletarians rebelling against a bourgeoisie. Marx considered the French Revolution to be part of the Feudal/Capitalist transition. But on the other hand the Trade Federation was a large corporation which was dissolved by the Empire, which would suggest that the transition to capitalism has already happened.
I don't think there's enough of a class basis for the revolution in Andor to be considered Marxist. I'm not sure there's enough coherence to the Star Wars universe for it to fit anywhere in his theory of history.
posted by TheophileEscargot at 6:33 AM on March 11 [12 favorites]
doctornemo: Back in the day I somehow wrote an Atlantic article about it.
That's a great piece!!
posted by wenestvedt at 6:42 AM on March 11 [3 favorites]
That's a great piece!!
posted by wenestvedt at 6:42 AM on March 11 [3 favorites]
The distinction someone made on this site that stuck with me was that all other Disney+ Star Wars is Jon Favreau and Dave Filoni smashing their Kenner toys together and making lightsaber noises, while Andor is Tony Gilroy DMing a Star Wars RPG campaign to a table full of adults.
posted by Molesome at 7:13 AM on March 11 [8 favorites]
posted by Molesome at 7:13 AM on March 11 [8 favorites]
Andor is really good and really the only thing in the Star Wars universe with good writing. Seriously, the scripts for all of the others are trash. Mandalorian: The Love Boat in Space is good but very silly. It’s also definitely a leftist story with a nuanced take on resistance. Something the U.S. needs right now are stories of resistance.
posted by misterpatrick at 8:14 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
posted by misterpatrick at 8:14 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
Leaving aside the Marxist/anti-fascist debate over the politics of Andor in season 1 - I think it's a great, wonderful examination of radicalization on both sides of the question. We see how Andor becomes part of the rebellion, and how others become drawn to the rewards of the power structure. For myself, at least, there's one character you spend a bit of time rooting for before being reminded very, very firmly that she's not one of the good guys. And how do you describe Syril Karn except as the saddest, most pathetic antagonist the SW universe has ever given us?
You don't need to know much Star Wars for it - all you need is a basic understanding of the idea that a large, centralized, repressive Empire is forming and that a variety of people and groups are working on how to resist it.
The show essentially works in contained arcs of episodes, written and directed by the same people. Episodes 1-3 basically introduce you to Andor, how he came to be where he is, and the people important to him, while a murder investigation unfolds. Treat it like a movie - watch all three episodes in one go if you can, I think its more satisfying.
Episodes 4-6 are a heist film, and utterly fantastic storytelling. At the same time, the universe of the show broadens out and we start learning what's happening elsewhere. Every detail matters.
Episodes 7 is a bit of a stand alone, catching everyone up on the fallout of the previous three episodes and setting everything in motion for the rest of the season.
Episodes 8-10 is the prison arc. Perhaps the best three episodes of the season. I will say no more.
Episodes 11-12 are the everyone's looking for Andor episodes. Meanwhile, the dead speak.
Anyways. It's not just good Star Wars TV, it's good TV period. I hope others try it, and find it enjoyable. A great companion podcast for it is A More Civilized Age. They start their Andor discussion in episode 43.
posted by nubs at 9:19 AM on March 11 [13 favorites]
You don't need to know much Star Wars for it - all you need is a basic understanding of the idea that a large, centralized, repressive Empire is forming and that a variety of people and groups are working on how to resist it.
The show essentially works in contained arcs of episodes, written and directed by the same people. Episodes 1-3 basically introduce you to Andor, how he came to be where he is, and the people important to him, while a murder investigation unfolds. Treat it like a movie - watch all three episodes in one go if you can, I think its more satisfying.
Episodes 4-6 are a heist film, and utterly fantastic storytelling. At the same time, the universe of the show broadens out and we start learning what's happening elsewhere. Every detail matters.
Episodes 7 is a bit of a stand alone, catching everyone up on the fallout of the previous three episodes and setting everything in motion for the rest of the season.
Episodes 8-10 is the prison arc. Perhaps the best three episodes of the season. I will say no more.
Episodes 11-12 are the everyone's looking for Andor episodes. Meanwhile, the dead speak.
Anyways. It's not just good Star Wars TV, it's good TV period. I hope others try it, and find it enjoyable. A great companion podcast for it is A More Civilized Age. They start their Andor discussion in episode 43.
posted by nubs at 9:19 AM on March 11 [13 favorites]
Heads up that Season 2 of Andor will be an unorthodox release schedule of three episodes a week for four weeks:
April 22 — E1, E2, E3
April 29 — E4, E5, E6
May 6 — E7, E8, E9
May 13 — E10, E11, E12
No reason given for this, but it sounds interesting.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:23 AM on March 11 [4 favorites]
April 22 — E1, E2, E3
April 29 — E4, E5, E6
May 6 — E7, E8, E9
May 13 — E10, E11, E12
No reason given for this, but it sounds interesting.
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 9:23 AM on March 11 [4 favorites]
misterpatrick: Andor is really good and really the only thing in the Star Wars universe with good writing.
I maintain that there’s enough of Leigh Brackett left in the script of Empire Strikes Back to elevate that above the rest of the movie scripts. That aside, I agree with you, in so far as we’re talking about the live action stuff. Some arcs of the Clone Wars are really masterful, and Rebels hits those heights sometimes too. I’ve been watching both with my son, and while there has been some absolute garbage along the way, when it hits, it hits. I’ve been listening to A More Civilized Age while watching, and it’s a fun companion.
posted by Kattullus at 9:55 AM on March 11 [6 favorites]
I maintain that there’s enough of Leigh Brackett left in the script of Empire Strikes Back to elevate that above the rest of the movie scripts. That aside, I agree with you, in so far as we’re talking about the live action stuff. Some arcs of the Clone Wars are really masterful, and Rebels hits those heights sometimes too. I’ve been watching both with my son, and while there has been some absolute garbage along the way, when it hits, it hits. I’ve been listening to A More Civilized Age while watching, and it’s a fun companion.
posted by Kattullus at 9:55 AM on March 11 [6 favorites]
I concur with nubs that A More Civilized Age is an excellent companion to Andor and they go deep into what the actual philosphy of the rebellion is following episode 12 of Andor.
posted by invisible_al at 10:01 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
posted by invisible_al at 10:01 AM on March 11 [2 favorites]
Your search site:www.redfuturesmag.com "battle of algiers" - did not match any documentsFor real? I know there's references to other movies about rebellions but the kasbah just is Ferrix. And the flute theme is lifted almost note for note.
If you haven't seen it and you like Andor you're in for an incredible treat.
Full movie at the Internet Archive.
posted by Space Coyote at 10:49 AM on March 11 [5 favorites]
Incidentally, the conclusion that Austin Walker of A More Civilized Age came to, regarding the real world roots of Nemik’s political ideas (who’s the character with the most developed revolutionary thought) is that they most closely resemble anarchist manifestos of the turn of the millennium, e.g. that of the Zapatistas. But it’s worth listening to the whole discussion.
I’m intrigued by Walter’s claim that it’s cribbed from Trotsky, which I haven’t seen elsewhere. Though I’ll note that Gilroy refers to him as “a Trotsky” in this recent interview. But I feel he’s talking about his role in the story, rather than his ideas. Anyway, here’s the relevant excerpt:
I’m intrigued by Walter’s claim that it’s cribbed from Trotsky, which I haven’t seen elsewhere. Though I’ll note that Gilroy refers to him as “a Trotsky” in this recent interview. But I feel he’s talking about his role in the story, rather than his ideas. Anyway, here’s the relevant excerpt:
But Gilroy’s ability to completely turn conviction in the opposite direction comes to the forefront when discussing Syril’s ideological antithesis in season one: Karis Nemik, a young member of the cell Cassian is parachuted into by Luthen to conduct a raid on an Imperial payroll facility in season one’s second arc. “This will violate everything that I just said in the previous answer,” Gilroy laughed. “I know I need to take a guy who’s going to be like a total cockroach at the beginning and turn him into a butterfly. I know that part of the way, I have to get him after 12 hours, to the point where he’s going to say ‘Take me to the revolution or kill me.’ I want to make that trip as exciting and adventurous and dramatic, and as wild as I possibly can, but I also have to make it plausible on an emotional level for him.”posted by Kattullus at 10:55 AM on March 11 [8 favorites]
Enter Nemik, the manifesto-writing insurgent. “I want to have as many different exposures to the power of rebellion as I possibly can—I do that through Maarva, I do that through the people [Cassian] meets along the way who’ve joined the Aldhani band. Everyone has their own story about how they’re there… and I went ‘I should really have a Trotsky. I should really have a young Russian,'” Gilroy continued. “I should have a dialectic character who introduces another note to the chorus of his education. That culminates in the prison arc, where he finally has his own little microcosm and his own little revolution. The prison is the final radicalizing experience for him, but I’ve given him what, eight, 10, 12 different really big bangs on the head along the way to say ‘Hey, this is where you should be going.'”
(Thank you, wenestvedt)
posted by doctornemo at 11:13 AM on March 11 [1 favorite]
posted by doctornemo at 11:13 AM on March 11 [1 favorite]
Mod note: One deleted, poster’s request.
posted by travelingthyme (staff) at 11:50 AM on March 11 [1 favorite]
posted by travelingthyme (staff) at 11:50 AM on March 11 [1 favorite]
flagged post as fantastic.
Great article doctornemo.
posted by clavdivs at 1:21 PM on March 11 [2 favorites]
Great article doctornemo.
posted by clavdivs at 1:21 PM on March 11 [2 favorites]
I can’t believe I didn’t make the Che Guevara / Saw Gerrera connection before!
posted by Ishbadiddle at 1:57 PM on March 11 [7 favorites]
posted by Ishbadiddle at 1:57 PM on March 11 [7 favorites]
Saw Gerrera used to say, "One fighter with a sharp stick and nothing left to lose can take the day."
He neglected to add, "And we don't just have sharp sticks. We have blasters."
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 4:31 PM on March 11
He neglected to add, "And we don't just have sharp sticks. We have blasters."
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 4:31 PM on March 11
Also, during a recent re-watch of Rogue One, I noticed that Melshi from Cassian's work unit on Narkina 5 is also with him for the Raid on Scarif, which is some pretty impressive series continuity, actually.
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 5:26 PM on March 11 [1 favorite]
posted by TheWhiteSkull at 5:26 PM on March 11 [1 favorite]
Heads up that Season 2 of Andor will be an unorthodox release schedule of three episodes a week for four weeks
I would have preferred one episode a week. Gives the fanbase more time to talk about the episodes.
posted by Pendragon at 1:26 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
I would have preferred one episode a week. Gives the fanbase more time to talk about the episodes.
posted by Pendragon at 1:26 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
Incidentally, if you're feeling like you just need a Star War right now, Skeleton Crew is surprisingly decent. It's not at the level of Andor, but it's my second favorite of the live action series.
posted by Kattullus at 2:50 AM on March 12 [5 favorites]
posted by Kattullus at 2:50 AM on March 12 [5 favorites]
Heads up that Season 2 of Andor will be an unorthodox release schedule of three episodes a week for four weeks // No reason given for this, but it sounds interesting.
It actually worked really well for Arcane.
Drip feeding one episode a week leaves them unable to resolve plot points properly, so you either leave the viewer hanging for 2 weeks without resolution, or you resort to writing single episode filler arcs like traditional TV.
Dumping the whole season at once leaves viewers unable to discuss the shows in progress with the community - you're extremely unlikely to bump into someone who has stopped at exactly the same point you did. You basically need to finish the whole thing first, which stops a lot of the interesting speculative discussion of "what happens next".
Dropping 3 episodes on a Friday allows people to consume a longer, more complex arc all at once over the weekend, then discuss it with their friends over the following week before the next content drop. Essentially getting the best of both worlds.
posted by xdvesper at 3:52 AM on March 12 [2 favorites]
It actually worked really well for Arcane.
Drip feeding one episode a week leaves them unable to resolve plot points properly, so you either leave the viewer hanging for 2 weeks without resolution, or you resort to writing single episode filler arcs like traditional TV.
Dumping the whole season at once leaves viewers unable to discuss the shows in progress with the community - you're extremely unlikely to bump into someone who has stopped at exactly the same point you did. You basically need to finish the whole thing first, which stops a lot of the interesting speculative discussion of "what happens next".
Dropping 3 episodes on a Friday allows people to consume a longer, more complex arc all at once over the weekend, then discuss it with their friends over the following week before the next content drop. Essentially getting the best of both worlds.
posted by xdvesper at 3:52 AM on March 12 [2 favorites]
I’m an outlier here. I like Star Wars. Like, all of it. Give me more fun adventures. Give me mystery. Give me political thrillers. It’s a playground of imagination seeing all the different takes.
posted by ckoerner at 11:03 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
posted by ckoerner at 11:03 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
(Thank you,clavdivs)
posted by doctornemo at 11:12 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
posted by doctornemo at 11:12 AM on March 12 [1 favorite]
Andor is NOT a rebellion against the Empire - "Andor [and/or] shows us the stark class divides in the Star Wars universe to show us that long before the tyrant emperor the Republic was already a corrupt oligarchy."
posted by kliuless at 2:56 AM on March 18
posted by kliuless at 2:56 AM on March 18
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posted by constraint at 12:35 PM on March 10 [6 favorites]