CACODEMONS
August 5, 2004 2:03 AM Subscribe
That's where we disagree. Been to hell yet?
posted by Keyser Soze at 2:20 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by Keyser Soze at 2:20 AM on August 5, 2004
Yeah, its called 10 frames per second.
posted by Orange Goblin at 2:21 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by Orange Goblin at 2:21 AM on August 5, 2004
Yeah, it's definately got a higher minimum spec than the last Doom game. Shoddy.
posted by Pretty_Generic at 3:07 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by Pretty_Generic at 3:07 AM on August 5, 2004
This is what I get for making a post to see what mefites opinions are regarding the most public piracy issue in years, as far as games.
posted by Keyser Soze at 3:20 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by Keyser Soze at 3:20 AM on August 5, 2004
I downloaded it. Fuckin' A. It rocks. I will also pay money for a copy, so that id and their publishers get their revenue, as soon as I am able in the part of the world where I live.
In the case of Doom3, as it has been for Carmack's engines in their last 3 iterations as well -- Quake, Q2, and Q3 -- it's at least as much about the revenue from the licensing of the engine to other companies as it is about the game itself. This is the way games are going to look for the next 3 to 5 years. Which doesn't excuse those who download and never buy a 'real copy', but it does perhaps shine a slightly different light on it.
On the other hand I gotta admit that this time there's a heck of a lot more than a glorified tech demo there this time (see Q3A) -- the game is hella fun and immersive as as get out, even at lowish-res and lowish framerates on my work laptop (there being no way in hell my 5 year-old desktop would run it). At least until I got to the better-lighted parts and developed some strategies against the various nasties, it scared the living horripilating crap out of me. In a fun way.
I can't wait to replay it later this year (with all the mods and maps and TCs that inevitably spring up around id games) when (with luck and the permission of She Who Must Be Obeyed) I have a machine that can do it justice.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:39 AM on August 5, 2004
In the case of Doom3, as it has been for Carmack's engines in their last 3 iterations as well -- Quake, Q2, and Q3 -- it's at least as much about the revenue from the licensing of the engine to other companies as it is about the game itself. This is the way games are going to look for the next 3 to 5 years. Which doesn't excuse those who download and never buy a 'real copy', but it does perhaps shine a slightly different light on it.
On the other hand I gotta admit that this time there's a heck of a lot more than a glorified tech demo there this time (see Q3A) -- the game is hella fun and immersive as as get out, even at lowish-res and lowish framerates on my work laptop (there being no way in hell my 5 year-old desktop would run it). At least until I got to the better-lighted parts and developed some strategies against the various nasties, it scared the living horripilating crap out of me. In a fun way.
I can't wait to replay it later this year (with all the mods and maps and TCs that inevitably spring up around id games) when (with luck and the permission of She Who Must Be Obeyed) I have a machine that can do it justice.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:39 AM on August 5, 2004
Thank god this will be the only thread about doom3 here. All the other parts of the internet I frequent, even the ones with nothing to do about gaming, have been swamped in endless, repititive doom 3 discussion. God!
posted by kavasa at 3:42 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by kavasa at 3:42 AM on August 5, 2004
I've actually been seeking them out, the last few days, but I hear what you're saying. Found a few tweaks that have gotten me heaps more performance outta my very borderline laptop, though.
Takes me back to when I played Q2 all the damn time online, back in the laggy old dialup days of like 1998, and was a fiend for tweaking every little thing I could -- something that Carmack's engines are designed to allow, I think to satisfy that mad knob-twiddling obsessive tweaker that lies within so many of us geekly types -- a propeller-beanie feeling that this new game has taken me right back into. Hell, even some of the console command-line settings are the same. Wheee!
[/fanboy]
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:55 AM on August 5, 2004
Takes me back to when I played Q2 all the damn time online, back in the laggy old dialup days of like 1998, and was a fiend for tweaking every little thing I could -- something that Carmack's engines are designed to allow, I think to satisfy that mad knob-twiddling obsessive tweaker that lies within so many of us geekly types -- a propeller-beanie feeling that this new game has taken me right back into. Hell, even some of the console command-line settings are the same. Wheee!
[/fanboy]
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 3:55 AM on August 5, 2004
Oh, in re: piracy, I doubt it's costing iD all that much. Most people that can afford the game and want it right now will buy it, or downloaded the pirated version so they could start playing before their "real" copy arrived in stores. The percentage of the piraters that are pirating it when perfectly capable of purchasing it is, I suspect, quite small. And d3 apparently flips out if you've got daemon tools running, so even were I to purchase it, I'd be cracking it. Can't stand swapping CDs.
posted by kavasa at 4:07 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by kavasa at 4:07 AM on August 5, 2004
Just a quick little heads up:
From a particular website that I'm not certain it's kosher to mention here (and frankly I'd rather not mention even if it were), there were 3 torrents of Doom III going with 20,000 people each on them a day before the game was released.
This particular website now shows up on the right hand side of google whenever you google for "Doom III."
Yeah, when the bittorrent piracy on ONE SITE is 60,000 people, neglecting all other avenues of piracy such as copying the cds and giving them to a friend, hotline, irc, etc., I'd say the huge amounts of piracy thing is pretty accurate.
And frankly, Kavasa, just from my cursory experience with human nature, I seriously doubt that people are suddenly going to magically file into the store to buy a game that they've already "acquired." I could think of better uses for money than buying buying games that I already have on my hard drive, and people usually go to great lengths to try to dissociate "software piracy" from "actually stealing" (oh sorry, it's copyright infringement now, right?)
I bought my copy.
As for the game itself, surprisingly it's actually pretty playable at 25 fps - I've gotten it working fine on this laptop, and whether installing the 4.9 beta cats will get it working even better is yet to be seen. Having weak hardware really ruins the experience it seems - judging from the fact that all those damn game reviewers with their 3 ghz p4s and their geforce 6800s are raving about it.
As for the doom 3 console, ctrl-alt-~ shows it, and you can list all commands by typing listcmds, and all variables by typing listcvars. What really seems to bog the game down is the lighting, not surprisingly.
posted by Veritron at 4:14 AM on August 5, 2004
From a particular website that I'm not certain it's kosher to mention here (and frankly I'd rather not mention even if it were), there were 3 torrents of Doom III going with 20,000 people each on them a day before the game was released.
This particular website now shows up on the right hand side of google whenever you google for "Doom III."
Yeah, when the bittorrent piracy on ONE SITE is 60,000 people, neglecting all other avenues of piracy such as copying the cds and giving them to a friend, hotline, irc, etc., I'd say the huge amounts of piracy thing is pretty accurate.
And frankly, Kavasa, just from my cursory experience with human nature, I seriously doubt that people are suddenly going to magically file into the store to buy a game that they've already "acquired." I could think of better uses for money than buying buying games that I already have on my hard drive, and people usually go to great lengths to try to dissociate "software piracy" from "actually stealing" (oh sorry, it's copyright infringement now, right?)
I bought my copy.
As for the game itself, surprisingly it's actually pretty playable at 25 fps - I've gotten it working fine on this laptop, and whether installing the 4.9 beta cats will get it working even better is yet to be seen. Having weak hardware really ruins the experience it seems - judging from the fact that all those damn game reviewers with their 3 ghz p4s and their geforce 6800s are raving about it.
As for the doom 3 console, ctrl-alt-~ shows it, and you can list all commands by typing listcmds, and all variables by typing listcvars. What really seems to bog the game down is the lighting, not surprisingly.
posted by Veritron at 4:14 AM on August 5, 2004
The minimum specs required for this hellish good time are astronomical. My system was bogged down until I ratcheted down the effects, and even then it wasn't perfect.
The fact that a Radeon 9800 128MB video card hacks on a game is simply rediculous, almost, but not quite as the fact that in order to play in the highest mode, you have to have a video card that hasn't even been released yet.
As for the piracy... every game out there is pirated to extremes. But the number of people actually buying the game (like myself) is high enough to off set this.
A sure fire way to slow piracy would be to realize that we live in a global economy, and an economy of scale. Release the game on the same day everywhere, and watch them fly off the shelves. Lower the price a little, and you'll sell more volumes, which will lead to increased profit and decreased piracy.
posted by benjh at 4:18 AM on August 5, 2004
The fact that a Radeon 9800 128MB video card hacks on a game is simply rediculous, almost, but not quite as the fact that in order to play in the highest mode, you have to have a video card that hasn't even been released yet.
As for the piracy... every game out there is pirated to extremes. But the number of people actually buying the game (like myself) is high enough to off set this.
A sure fire way to slow piracy would be to realize that we live in a global economy, and an economy of scale. Release the game on the same day everywhere, and watch them fly off the shelves. Lower the price a little, and you'll sell more volumes, which will lead to increased profit and decreased piracy.
posted by benjh at 4:18 AM on August 5, 2004
and frankly I'd rather not mention even if it were
Oh, bollocks. If you don't know about suprnova already, you should be forced to turn in your IntaRweb License.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:22 AM on August 5, 2004
Oh, bollocks. If you don't know about suprnova already, you should be forced to turn in your IntaRweb License.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 4:22 AM on August 5, 2004
How many people downloaded it just to see if it'd run on their machine? I did, and now I'm pricing up a new machine, just for Doom 3. I fully intend to buy it once I've built the new box. Why id didn't release a demo, I really can't understand.
posted by influx at 4:42 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by influx at 4:42 AM on August 5, 2004
I haven't downloaded it, but if I were considering buying it I would. They haven't released a demo and there's no way I'd buy it without knowing it'd run well enough on my system. It's not like you can return it to Best Buy (as far as I know), of course they'll happily sell you a new video card or better yet, system.
Piracy has always been a problem, in my wasted youth I was one of those nefarious people who cracked Commodore 64 software. I also purchased all of the software I actually used (and still do). Doom 3 seems to be a bigger problem because of it's own success. Id software and the press tried to make this the most hyped game of the year, and it worked. If they'd have released a demo it'd have been the most downloaded demo ever. Instead they decided not to do a demo (at least so far) and as a result they've the most widely pirated piece of software in history.
posted by substrate at 5:20 AM on August 5, 2004
Piracy has always been a problem, in my wasted youth I was one of those nefarious people who cracked Commodore 64 software. I also purchased all of the software I actually used (and still do). Doom 3 seems to be a bigger problem because of it's own success. Id software and the press tried to make this the most hyped game of the year, and it worked. If they'd have released a demo it'd have been the most downloaded demo ever. Instead they decided not to do a demo (at least so far) and as a result they've the most widely pirated piece of software in history.
posted by substrate at 5:20 AM on August 5, 2004
"The fact that a Radeon 9800 128MB video card hacks on a game is simply rediculous"
My 9800 is running it just fine with everything but AA on. And that's the OEM version. I had to crank the resolution up to 1600x1200 before it started to look really bad. Great frame rates at 1024x768.
As for pirating - Most people got the pirated version because they couldn't get it in stores yet. And most will go buy a real copy this weekend. You have a situation where the most anticipated game in years is available for download *right now*, or you can sit on your hands and wait.
I see this more like downloading a demo than pirating. Much like MP3 downloads, it will lead to more sales, not less. One of the reasons the Original Doom made so much money was that they gave away the first part for free. Once you tried it you knew it was worth the money. Same deal here.
posted by y6y6y6 at 5:36 AM on August 5, 2004
My 9800 is running it just fine with everything but AA on. And that's the OEM version. I had to crank the resolution up to 1600x1200 before it started to look really bad. Great frame rates at 1024x768.
As for pirating - Most people got the pirated version because they couldn't get it in stores yet. And most will go buy a real copy this weekend. You have a situation where the most anticipated game in years is available for download *right now*, or you can sit on your hands and wait.
I see this more like downloading a demo than pirating. Much like MP3 downloads, it will lead to more sales, not less. One of the reasons the Original Doom made so much money was that they gave away the first part for free. Once you tried it you knew it was worth the money. Same deal here.
posted by y6y6y6 at 5:36 AM on August 5, 2004
My download finished exactly when I got the box - so I just deleted the RARs. Would be interesting to find out whether that legally counts as pirating the game.
In any case - Athlon XP 2600+, 1GB PC2700 (333MHz) DDR, Radeon 9800XT 256MB RAM. Game runs smooth as silk using ATI's new 4.9 drivers at 1024x768 @ high quality with all options maxed. Looks fucking amazing, too, I might add.
As far as the game goes - the intro sequence is incredibly well done, the interface to the computers in the game - the way your targeting cursor turns into a mouse icon on a computer screen when you're close and facing it - is so smooth and utterly transparent I can't imagine we'll ever see it done any other way again.
The sound design, it's worth mentioning, is almost as good as the graphics.
The gameplay, unfortunately, gets old quickly - to make up for this there is, as Blue from Bluesnews mentioned, more story in the first level alone than every other id game ever combined. My beef with the gameplay is that every room proceeds as follows: enter, get attacked from behind (whether by monsters teleporting in behind you, or by some scripted event going off to your left while monsters attack a second later from the right), kill monsters, go and get powerups lying around the room, get attacked again from behind as picking up the items triggers another monster spawn, kill monster, proceed to next room.
Wash, rinse, repeat - the game consists of 999 variations on this same basic theme. It gets old, fast, and about halfway through the game I simply gave up, turned on god mode and fast-forwarded through to the ending, pausing only to turn it off for Hell because Hell was really freaking awesome and actually felt and looked like Hell ought to.
Everything about this game except the basic gameplay is perfect - the models, the plot, the sound, the textures, the content people did an awesome job. It's nice to see id actually put out an honest-to-God full product for the first time since Doom 2, I just wish the game was more fun with god mode off than it is with god mode on.
posted by Ryvar at 5:39 AM on August 5, 2004
In any case - Athlon XP 2600+, 1GB PC2700 (333MHz) DDR, Radeon 9800XT 256MB RAM. Game runs smooth as silk using ATI's new 4.9 drivers at 1024x768 @ high quality with all options maxed. Looks fucking amazing, too, I might add.
As far as the game goes - the intro sequence is incredibly well done, the interface to the computers in the game - the way your targeting cursor turns into a mouse icon on a computer screen when you're close and facing it - is so smooth and utterly transparent I can't imagine we'll ever see it done any other way again.
The sound design, it's worth mentioning, is almost as good as the graphics.
The gameplay, unfortunately, gets old quickly - to make up for this there is, as Blue from Bluesnews mentioned, more story in the first level alone than every other id game ever combined. My beef with the gameplay is that every room proceeds as follows: enter, get attacked from behind (whether by monsters teleporting in behind you, or by some scripted event going off to your left while monsters attack a second later from the right), kill monsters, go and get powerups lying around the room, get attacked again from behind as picking up the items triggers another monster spawn, kill monster, proceed to next room.
Wash, rinse, repeat - the game consists of 999 variations on this same basic theme. It gets old, fast, and about halfway through the game I simply gave up, turned on god mode and fast-forwarded through to the ending, pausing only to turn it off for Hell because Hell was really freaking awesome and actually felt and looked like Hell ought to.
Everything about this game except the basic gameplay is perfect - the models, the plot, the sound, the textures, the content people did an awesome job. It's nice to see id actually put out an honest-to-God full product for the first time since Doom 2, I just wish the game was more fun with god mode off than it is with god mode on.
posted by Ryvar at 5:39 AM on August 5, 2004
i downloaded it. it's boring and depressing and it never ends, but i realize the impact that the engine will have. i can't wait to see what other developers will do with it in the next few years.
posted by jimmy at 5:44 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by jimmy at 5:44 AM on August 5, 2004
also, i'm basically running on the minimum requirements -- 1.5 ghz p4, 512 mb sdram, radeon 9200 -- and it still runs. granted, it only runs at 640x480 with everything besides bump mapping turned off, but it still runs. kind of.
posted by jimmy at 5:46 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by jimmy at 5:46 AM on August 5, 2004
Everything about this game except the basic gameplay is perfect
I love it. "Everything...except for the basic gameplay." I watched my roommate play D3 last night and was immediately struck by the complete imbecility of the flashlight/weapon toggle. All the talk of realistic textures and lighting and such is a hoot, given that id couldn't be bothered to include a helmet-mounted light for users pretending to be Marines below the surface of Mars.
I can just imagine the meeting where it was decided to force users to constantly switch between a flashlight and a gun. A few designers left the room shaking their heads over the stupidity of that one, I'm sure.
posted by mediareport at 5:59 AM on August 5, 2004
I love it. "Everything...except for the basic gameplay." I watched my roommate play D3 last night and was immediately struck by the complete imbecility of the flashlight/weapon toggle. All the talk of realistic textures and lighting and such is a hoot, given that id couldn't be bothered to include a helmet-mounted light for users pretending to be Marines below the surface of Mars.
I can just imagine the meeting where it was decided to force users to constantly switch between a flashlight and a gun. A few designers left the room shaking their heads over the stupidity of that one, I'm sure.
posted by mediareport at 5:59 AM on August 5, 2004
I'm having trouble getting the damned thing to run on my Atari 2600...
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:08 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by The Card Cheat at 6:08 AM on August 5, 2004
I can just imagine the meeting where it was decided to force users to constantly switch between a flashlight and a gun.
You miss the point entirely, mediareport. Laughably so. Either you're not a gamer, or you're not a smart one.
It is the tension, the gameplay tension, that arises from the (artificial, of course) need to switch between gun and light, in the dark bits, that creates a huge whale-blubber slab of fun. Duh.
The fun, and the terror, early on in the game at least. Of course 22nd century marines would have night vision or head-mounted lights or something, dumbass, but that wouldn't be as much fun!
Everything about this game except the basic gameplay is perfect
The gameplay was described by the principals during dev as aiming to update the pants-poopingness of Doom itself, all those years ago, and for me, jaded as I am, it is the first game that I have played (and I play 'em all) that has done that. From that perspective, the basic gameplay is perfect.
Remember what DOOM was like on that 386XT all those years ago? Remember the bad dreams?
I remember.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:13 AM on August 5, 2004
You miss the point entirely, mediareport. Laughably so. Either you're not a gamer, or you're not a smart one.
It is the tension, the gameplay tension, that arises from the (artificial, of course) need to switch between gun and light, in the dark bits, that creates a huge whale-blubber slab of fun. Duh.
The fun, and the terror, early on in the game at least. Of course 22nd century marines would have night vision or head-mounted lights or something, dumbass, but that wouldn't be as much fun!
Everything about this game except the basic gameplay is perfect
The gameplay was described by the principals during dev as aiming to update the pants-poopingness of Doom itself, all those years ago, and for me, jaded as I am, it is the first game that I have played (and I play 'em all) that has done that. From that perspective, the basic gameplay is perfect.
Remember what DOOM was like on that 386XT all those years ago? Remember the bad dreams?
I remember.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:13 AM on August 5, 2004
[Sorry, the beer turned me into a videogame fanboy there for a second or two, and I'm now going to take myself out to the woodshed for a good healthy shutthefuckup beating.]
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:25 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:25 AM on August 5, 2004
Remember what DOOM was like on that 386XT all those years ago? Remember the bad dreams?
Just in case anyone needs a memory jog, Doom Legacy is still cranking along.
I broke out my old Doom 2 data files over the weekend and had a blast. It's still an excellent game, and still holds up great today.
And look at the bright side: The chances of your machine being under the system requirements are practically nil.
posted by Remy at 6:28 AM on August 5, 2004
Just in case anyone needs a memory jog, Doom Legacy is still cranking along.
I broke out my old Doom 2 data files over the weekend and had a blast. It's still an excellent game, and still holds up great today.
And look at the bright side: The chances of your machine being under the system requirements are practically nil.
posted by Remy at 6:28 AM on August 5, 2004
Ryvar nails it. The 1950s flashlight leads to plenty of terror. It will also make you hate the idiot who green-lighted it.
Doom 3 is not about incredible game play. But then FPSs rarely are. And Doom/Quake never are. For a creative FPS get Pankiller.
Doom is about eye candy and tension. And hating flashlights.
posted by y6y6y6 at 6:34 AM on August 5, 2004
Doom 3 is not about incredible game play. But then FPSs rarely are. And Doom/Quake never are. For a creative FPS get Pankiller.
Doom is about eye candy and tension. And hating flashlights.
posted by y6y6y6 at 6:34 AM on August 5, 2004
Duh.
Duh yourself, stavros. I played D2 nonstop until the RSI symptoms got scary enough that I swore off first-person shooters for good. I can't believe you're actually arguing in 2004 that switching between a gun and flashlight is necessary to create "gameplay tension."
Funny, we didn't need it before.
I can accept that D3 is just a rewrite of the original with better lighting and sound, but the toggle is just plain dumb interference that masks what looked to me like *extremely* simplistic gameplay. Oh, and the only thing "laughable" here is that you're trying to pass it off as a necessary feature of the game.
[On preview, thanks for the apology.]
posted by mediareport at 6:38 AM on August 5, 2004
Duh yourself, stavros. I played D2 nonstop until the RSI symptoms got scary enough that I swore off first-person shooters for good. I can't believe you're actually arguing in 2004 that switching between a gun and flashlight is necessary to create "gameplay tension."
Funny, we didn't need it before.
I can accept that D3 is just a rewrite of the original with better lighting and sound, but the toggle is just plain dumb interference that masks what looked to me like *extremely* simplistic gameplay. Oh, and the only thing "laughable" here is that you're trying to pass it off as a necessary feature of the game.
[On preview, thanks for the apology.]
posted by mediareport at 6:38 AM on August 5, 2004
I love it. "Everything...except for the basic gameplay."
That's just it, though - this time around id didn't just do the best engine, they ALSO did the best content. That's only 2/3rds of the equation, however, and the missing third tends to be the most important one in the long run.
Stavros: my problem with the gameplay is that 999 Variations On How To Stab The Player In The Back: A Complete & Unabridged Compendium (© Willits, et al), is NOT the particular book of game design theory I, as a player, prefer my games subscribe to.
posted by Ryvar at 6:42 AM on August 5, 2004
That's just it, though - this time around id didn't just do the best engine, they ALSO did the best content. That's only 2/3rds of the equation, however, and the missing third tends to be the most important one in the long run.
Stavros: my problem with the gameplay is that 999 Variations On How To Stab The Player In The Back: A Complete & Unabridged Compendium (© Willits, et al), is NOT the particular book of game design theory I, as a player, prefer my games subscribe to.
posted by Ryvar at 6:42 AM on August 5, 2004
You're a big doody-head, mediareport! Icky doodyhead!
I could not disagree with you more strongly, but that's life, and Metafilter. We'll see how many millions Carmack and co. make, and judge our auxiliary opinions accordingly, I guess.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:43 AM on August 5, 2004
I could not disagree with you more strongly, but that's life, and Metafilter. We'll see how many millions Carmack and co. make, and judge our auxiliary opinions accordingly, I guess.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:43 AM on August 5, 2004
Stavros: my problem with the gameplay is that 999 Variations On How To Stab The Player In The Back: A Complete & Unabridged Compendium (© Willits, et al), is NOT the particular book of game design theory I, as a player, prefer my games subscribe to.
Oh, hell, yeah, me too. But it's DOOM. And that kinda thing was, apparently, part of the design goal.
And if that was so, they did it good. That's all I'm sayin'.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:47 AM on August 5, 2004
Oh, hell, yeah, me too. But it's DOOM. And that kinda thing was, apparently, part of the design goal.
And if that was so, they did it good. That's all I'm sayin'.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 6:47 AM on August 5, 2004
Mediareport: Pistol flashlight mod.
Not a complete fix, but there you go.
posted by Ryvar at 6:49 AM on August 5, 2004
Not a complete fix, but there you go.
posted by Ryvar at 6:49 AM on August 5, 2004
I like the flashlight. Having to choose between seeing what's going to kill me, and wasting ammo on every little noise is part of the tension. For me.
Playing it with headphones at night, during a thunderstorm, is terrifying.
posted by aramaic at 7:14 AM on August 5, 2004
Playing it with headphones at night, during a thunderstorm, is terrifying.
posted by aramaic at 7:14 AM on August 5, 2004
Wow, I forgot this was coming out. I finally hit the sweet spot in FarCry, where you're introduced to most of the weapons, and figured out better approaches to different situations.
Doom3 is next, though it's sounding like I'll need to down my resolution to play it well.
But I agree completely with what Jimmy said about the engine's importance. Quake3 did more than I'd've ever guessed, and I like three games based on that engine more than quake 3.
As far as pirating goes, I find it problematic that people will upgrade to a $500 video card just to run the game, but not plunk down the $50 for the game itself.
posted by Busithoth at 7:25 AM on August 5, 2004
Doom3 is next, though it's sounding like I'll need to down my resolution to play it well.
But I agree completely with what Jimmy said about the engine's importance. Quake3 did more than I'd've ever guessed, and I like three games based on that engine more than quake 3.
As far as pirating goes, I find it problematic that people will upgrade to a $500 video card just to run the game, but not plunk down the $50 for the game itself.
posted by Busithoth at 7:25 AM on August 5, 2004
My longer Doom 3 review:
1) Runs smooth as butter on my system with everything but AA turned on at 1024x768. Runs "okay" until I push it up to 1600x1200. P4 3 GHz 800 MHz fsb 1 gig RAM Radeon 9800 OEM.
2) The eye candy is everything you've heard it was. But....... well, the buildup was just too long. It certainly blows away anything I've seen before, but we've gotten used to things like that. You'll spend a lot of time wandering around just looking at things. Which is cool. If this was a tech demo. I guess I'm trying to say that it looks extremely cool, but after looking at the screenshots for the last year I'm a bit jaded.
3) The game play hasn't advanced much since Doom I. After games like Half-Life and painkiller, I don't think Id software can get away with this anymore. Not being able to interact with an environment as detailed as this one chops the sense of immersion off at the knees. Why can't I pick up soda cans? Why can't I read all the binders lying around? Why doesn't the vending machine work?
4) Yes, it will make you jump in your chair. But it's the cheap horror movie sort of jump. Not the Hitchcock sort of real fear. I actually found Painkiller much more frightening.
5) The flashlight is stupid. This is *the* single dumbest design decision of any game I've played in years. Id - Please allow me to duct tape the 1950s flashlight to my 2145 weapon when you send out the next patch. The flashlight sucks so much ass I'm having trouble not hating the game. Please send the dipspork who approved this over so I can show him a better place to put his flashlight.
Conclusion - Doom 3 is the best playable tech demo ever. Is it the best game ever? Not even close. Is it fun? You betcha. Will I get enough sleep in the next couple weeks. Not a chance. But it's still just a great tech demo.
I think the best part of Doom 3 will be the things other, more creative, companies do with the engine.
posted by y6y6y6 at 7:47 AM on August 5, 2004
1) Runs smooth as butter on my system with everything but AA turned on at 1024x768. Runs "okay" until I push it up to 1600x1200. P4 3 GHz 800 MHz fsb 1 gig RAM Radeon 9800 OEM.
2) The eye candy is everything you've heard it was. But....... well, the buildup was just too long. It certainly blows away anything I've seen before, but we've gotten used to things like that. You'll spend a lot of time wandering around just looking at things. Which is cool. If this was a tech demo. I guess I'm trying to say that it looks extremely cool, but after looking at the screenshots for the last year I'm a bit jaded.
3) The game play hasn't advanced much since Doom I. After games like Half-Life and painkiller, I don't think Id software can get away with this anymore. Not being able to interact with an environment as detailed as this one chops the sense of immersion off at the knees. Why can't I pick up soda cans? Why can't I read all the binders lying around? Why doesn't the vending machine work?
4) Yes, it will make you jump in your chair. But it's the cheap horror movie sort of jump. Not the Hitchcock sort of real fear. I actually found Painkiller much more frightening.
5) The flashlight is stupid. This is *the* single dumbest design decision of any game I've played in years. Id - Please allow me to duct tape the 1950s flashlight to my 2145 weapon when you send out the next patch. The flashlight sucks so much ass I'm having trouble not hating the game. Please send the dipspork who approved this over so I can show him a better place to put his flashlight.
Conclusion - Doom 3 is the best playable tech demo ever. Is it the best game ever? Not even close. Is it fun? You betcha. Will I get enough sleep in the next couple weeks. Not a chance. But it's still just a great tech demo.
I think the best part of Doom 3 will be the things other, more creative, companies do with the engine.
posted by y6y6y6 at 7:47 AM on August 5, 2004
Type in r_gamma 2 in the console to increase the gamma.
I absolutely hate how dark the game is, it might add to the tension but come on, even the lighted parts are dark at default settings. Apart from that the game is not that challenging, I've already completed about 50% of it without any real "Oh no I need a walktrhough to get me out of here" moment. Wait a minute, that's a good thing, I hate it when those moments come up, I don't like it when it's so hard that you need a walktrhough. Anyway the game play so far has no taxed my gaming skills, maybe the rest of the game will.
The game runs well on my ATI 9600 256MB card at 1024x768 and High settings, I just had to crank up the brightness to max and use r_gamma 2 in the console to make it playable.
I've had it crash on me while transferring from one level to another a few times, so I don't know if it's the game or my piddly lil card or the 512MB system memory. I've got an AMD 64 3200+ and a SATA HD, so those two are just fine.
posted by riffola at 7:59 AM on August 5, 2004
I absolutely hate how dark the game is, it might add to the tension but come on, even the lighted parts are dark at default settings. Apart from that the game is not that challenging, I've already completed about 50% of it without any real "Oh no I need a walktrhough to get me out of here" moment. Wait a minute, that's a good thing, I hate it when those moments come up, I don't like it when it's so hard that you need a walktrhough. Anyway the game play so far has no taxed my gaming skills, maybe the rest of the game will.
The game runs well on my ATI 9600 256MB card at 1024x768 and High settings, I just had to crank up the brightness to max and use r_gamma 2 in the console to make it playable.
I've had it crash on me while transferring from one level to another a few times, so I don't know if it's the game or my piddly lil card or the 512MB system memory. I've got an AMD 64 3200+ and a SATA HD, so those two are just fine.
posted by riffola at 7:59 AM on August 5, 2004
Frankly, I'm surprised there's enough beefy hardware out there to make pirating this game such a popular thing to do. I'm likely to sit out this entire engine cycle, myself, since I've been off the hardware upgrade train for about 3 years and don't relish the idea of spending somewhere in the neighborhood of $800 on enough hardware to run a game that shipped a little too early for the market.
I'd argue that Wing Commander I and Wolf3D were probably more pirated than Doom3 ever will be, though I've got no numbers to back that up. All I know is that there was a point during which it was difficult to find any machine anywhere on the planet, in offices, schools and homes, that didn't have at least one or the other installed, and they didn't face the same steep hardware requirements for adoption.
I wonder if the flashlight thing is Romero's rumored Doom3 "cameo." It sounds annoying.
posted by majick at 8:02 AM on August 5, 2004
I'd argue that Wing Commander I and Wolf3D were probably more pirated than Doom3 ever will be, though I've got no numbers to back that up. All I know is that there was a point during which it was difficult to find any machine anywhere on the planet, in offices, schools and homes, that didn't have at least one or the other installed, and they didn't face the same steep hardware requirements for adoption.
I wonder if the flashlight thing is Romero's rumored Doom3 "cameo." It sounds annoying.
posted by majick at 8:02 AM on August 5, 2004
riff if I had to guess I'd say doubling your RAM would clear up the stray crashes - otherwise that's a pretty decent system you've got there.
Majick: You can buy the core components of my system (videocard, motherboard, ram, CPU) for around $580.
Pricewatch.com costs:
Motherboard: Asus A7N8X-E (Deluxe) w/ ship: $80
CPU: Athlon XP 2600+ w/ 333MHz FSB w/ship: $66
Video: Radeon 9800 Pro 256MB: $250
Crucial.com costs:
RAM: 2x 512MB PC2700 DDR DIMMs: $184
----------
Total: $580
Poof. All the core crap of a system good for Half-Life 2 and Doom 3 - and subsequent entries on those engines, which was my basic idea when specing it out for myself and my wife. Be aware that the motherboard there includes a 5.1 soundcard and 2 LAN adaptors onboard, as well as SATA RAID and a bunch of other things.
posted by Ryvar at 8:18 AM on August 5, 2004
Majick: You can buy the core components of my system (videocard, motherboard, ram, CPU) for around $580.
Pricewatch.com costs:
Motherboard: Asus A7N8X-E (Deluxe) w/ ship: $80
CPU: Athlon XP 2600+ w/ 333MHz FSB w/ship: $66
Video: Radeon 9800 Pro 256MB: $250
Crucial.com costs:
RAM: 2x 512MB PC2700 DDR DIMMs: $184
----------
Total: $580
Poof. All the core crap of a system good for Half-Life 2 and Doom 3 - and subsequent entries on those engines, which was my basic idea when specing it out for myself and my wife. Be aware that the motherboard there includes a 5.1 soundcard and 2 LAN adaptors onboard, as well as SATA RAID and a bunch of other things.
posted by Ryvar at 8:18 AM on August 5, 2004
More than a decade ago, I used to "courier" stolen software and pornography to commercial BBS's around the United States. For the most part this consisted of using shell scripts, ftp servers, and internet dial-outs to shuttle software around.
For me, it wasn't about stealing, it was about money. Each BBS would pay a relatively nominal fee to get a feed from me, and they'd then charge many of their users to porn and warez.
Later, when I actually met a few more users, I realized that for them it wasn't about making money, or even about saving money. It was about stealing because they had the ability to steal.
It seems that the scene today hasn't really changed. There's still a market for cheap/free software and porn, and there are still people providing it, despite laws to the contrary.
posted by mosch at 8:38 AM on August 5, 2004
For me, it wasn't about stealing, it was about money. Each BBS would pay a relatively nominal fee to get a feed from me, and they'd then charge many of their users to porn and warez.
Later, when I actually met a few more users, I realized that for them it wasn't about making money, or even about saving money. It was about stealing because they had the ability to steal.
It seems that the scene today hasn't really changed. There's still a market for cheap/free software and porn, and there are still people providing it, despite laws to the contrary.
posted by mosch at 8:38 AM on August 5, 2004
Not paying much attention there, are you [y6/mosch for entirely different reasons]?
Lordy lordy loo I hate the Stupid.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 8:53 AM on August 5, 2004
Lordy lordy loo I hate the Stupid.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 8:53 AM on August 5, 2004
I think one of the reasons you're seeing so much bittorrent activity is because the system requirements are so high. I downloaded the game just out of curiosity to see if I could play it. Result: I can! played it for about an hour, deleted it, and will be buying it this weekend.
posted by GeekAnimator at 9:25 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by GeekAnimator at 9:25 AM on August 5, 2004
If only I'd perservered, back in '76 and '77, in my crude attempts to program a tank battle game, via teletype interface to a huge mainframe that probably was about as fast as a 33mhz Pentium 1 chip.......
I'd be a pasty, pale, socially retarded and vastly rich geek now, living in a Santa Barbara castle or my own private Island somewhere, with a trophy wife and packs of snarling Dobermann's to chase off the Paparrazi.
But instead, I'm just me - and that's OK.
posted by troutfishing at 9:55 AM on August 5, 2004
I'd be a pasty, pale, socially retarded and vastly rich geek now, living in a Santa Barbara castle or my own private Island somewhere, with a trophy wife and packs of snarling Dobermann's to chase off the Paparrazi.
But instead, I'm just me - and that's OK.
posted by troutfishing at 9:55 AM on August 5, 2004
Doom 3 constantly tries to scare me, with little effect or appreciation from me. I'm sorry, but this lighting bullshit, monsters crawling out of every hole every time you turn your back on it, and cramped monotonous corridors do not a good FPS make.
The beginning was hopeful - I thought it would be something like Deus Ex. As if.
The poly count and lighting (IF YOU CAN SEE IT) are good, no contest here. It even runs faster than I expected it to (All you people complaining about minimal specs haven't played many new games lately. Doom 3 is not a pig.) But the gameplay? Daikatana.
No, sorry, I'm back to my UT2K4. Maybe I'll even try Thief 3 and Far Cry to see the real novelties in the FPS genre.
posted by azazello at 10:21 AM on August 5, 2004
The beginning was hopeful - I thought it would be something like Deus Ex. As if.
The poly count and lighting (IF YOU CAN SEE IT) are good, no contest here. It even runs faster than I expected it to (All you people complaining about minimal specs haven't played many new games lately. Doom 3 is not a pig.) But the gameplay? Daikatana.
No, sorry, I'm back to my UT2K4. Maybe I'll even try Thief 3 and Far Cry to see the real novelties in the FPS genre.
posted by azazello at 10:21 AM on August 5, 2004
Not to mention the prima donna way in which this game refuses to minimize, eliminating the ability to multitask while playing it.
posted by azazello at 10:47 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by azazello at 10:47 AM on August 5, 2004
The game isn't out for a week in the UK, which makes no sense at all. However, many downloaders = lots of beta-testers who can't whinge or return the game for a refund, but still generate lots of tips and tweaks to be incorporated into the 1.1 patch. The patch will be downloadable and installable only with a valid licence key, at least for a while, is my guess, and id software have recouped some of their losses on free R&D.
posted by punilux at 11:35 AM on August 5, 2004
posted by punilux at 11:35 AM on August 5, 2004
there is no such thing as a 33MHz Pentium. (Well, if you go by Intel's product info, anyway.)
And many games I've played have had a difficult time letting themselves be minimized. Many would crash, and many more would regularly act very strange after tabbing back into it.
posted by deadcowdan at 11:37 AM on August 5, 2004
And many games I've played have had a difficult time letting themselves be minimized. Many would crash, and many more would regularly act very strange after tabbing back into it.
posted by deadcowdan at 11:37 AM on August 5, 2004
Um, what kind of computer would it take to actually multitask with Doom 3? I mean, jeez, can't you guys turn off the IM and the bittorrent etc and just play a game for an hour or two?
I downloaded it, and I'm going to test it this weekend...but I highly doubt that it'll run well. Poor poor pitiful (and free!) Athlon 1800. *sob*
Keyser, I was just saying that it was your fault for all the pirating. Not that the thread sucked or anything. You've always been forward with your...you know... arr!
posted by graventy at 11:54 AM on August 5, 2004
I downloaded it, and I'm going to test it this weekend...but I highly doubt that it'll run well. Poor poor pitiful (and free!) Athlon 1800. *sob*
Keyser, I was just saying that it was your fault for all the pirating. Not that the thread sucked or anything. You've always been forward with your...you know... arr!
posted by graventy at 11:54 AM on August 5, 2004
Multi tasking? Hell, you can't even change the graphics settings without having to quit and restart the game.
posted by Orange Goblin at 12:05 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by Orange Goblin at 12:05 PM on August 5, 2004
I'm tired of the "monsters coming out of every dark corner/access panel" bit. I know the game is a FPS, but that's just too much shooting. I sort of like how Deus Ex and Max Payne gave the player a short breathing room from all the carnage.
As for the most pirated game, I think that might be Quake 1 or 2 or maybe even Doom 1. Those games were out in the Windows 95/98 loaded computer buying sprees.
posted by riffola at 12:53 PM on August 5, 2004
As for the most pirated game, I think that might be Quake 1 or 2 or maybe even Doom 1. Those games were out in the Windows 95/98 loaded computer buying sprees.
posted by riffola at 12:53 PM on August 5, 2004
Veritron - as my post says, my (correct) contention was that the vast majority of the pirates were pirate or nothing; I also supposed (correctly) that a few of the pirates just didn't want to wait a day or two for their physical copy of the game. The number of people that are capable of paying $55 for the game and elected to pirate it instead is going to be pretty small. Further, there is a real and important distinction between theft and copyright infringement. For a lengthy discussion of what, exactly copyright really is, read this post at ArsTechnica. If the theft/copyright distinction itself is giving you trouble, here's a simple, concrete image:
1. Imagine a man walking into a book store, picking up a book, and leaving without paying. This is theft.
2. Imagine a man walking into a book store with a miniature xerox machine, copying a book, and leaving with the copy but not the original. This is copyright infringement.
To paraphrase the post I linked to above, copyrights are utilitarian, they are implemented in such a way as to make the most people in society the most happy. Draconian enforcement might make the authors the happiest (for a while anyways, until people stop buying their stuff), but makes society as a whole quite unhappy. The current system works fine.
posted by kavasa at 1:25 PM on August 5, 2004
1. Imagine a man walking into a book store, picking up a book, and leaving without paying. This is theft.
2. Imagine a man walking into a book store with a miniature xerox machine, copying a book, and leaving with the copy but not the original. This is copyright infringement.
To paraphrase the post I linked to above, copyrights are utilitarian, they are implemented in such a way as to make the most people in society the most happy. Draconian enforcement might make the authors the happiest (for a while anyways, until people stop buying their stuff), but makes society as a whole quite unhappy. The current system works fine.
posted by kavasa at 1:25 PM on August 5, 2004
Orange Goblin: Are you serious? id software still hasn't dropped the "must restart the universe if you sneeze" engine design? Jeez, that's almost as bad as 3dfx trying to release a chip that still couldn't mix 3d and 2d on the same screen in 2000.
Also, I have to echo the zillions of other people who have said piracy might have been reduced if a downloadable, playable demo had been released before the full game had hit store shelves. Maybe.
posted by Potsy at 1:46 PM on August 5, 2004
Also, I have to echo the zillions of other people who have said piracy might have been reduced if a downloadable, playable demo had been released before the full game had hit store shelves. Maybe.
posted by Potsy at 1:46 PM on August 5, 2004
If I had money to buy the game, I would. For what it's worth, I want to buy the game. Unfortunately, even if I didn't pirate it Id would still not see any of my money.
I will wait until the patch comes out, find the cracked version, and patch my illegal copy.
posted by Keyser Soze at 1:55 PM on August 5, 2004
I will wait until the patch comes out, find the cracked version, and patch my illegal copy.
posted by Keyser Soze at 1:55 PM on August 5, 2004
Potsy - I swear the Quake engines don't make you restart? Games based off Quake 3 don't.
As for releasing a demo, Doom 3 has been expected so long, pretty much everyone who might buy it plans to. A pre-release demo (with a possibly unfinished product) might look bad, and turn people off from buying the actual game. What they should have released is some kind of tech demo to show off the engine and see if your system can handle it.
posted by Orange Goblin at 1:58 PM on August 5, 2004
As for releasing a demo, Doom 3 has been expected so long, pretty much everyone who might buy it plans to. A pre-release demo (with a possibly unfinished product) might look bad, and turn people off from buying the actual game. What they should have released is some kind of tech demo to show off the engine and see if your system can handle it.
posted by Orange Goblin at 1:58 PM on August 5, 2004
I have to echo the zillions of other people who have said piracy might have been reduced if a downloadable, playable demo had been released before the full game had hit store shelves.
but then the full game wouldn't have been released for another 4-6 weeks. it's not that easy to make a quality demo.
on preview: yes, a tech demo would have been smart. but when you've got a sure best-seller, why spoil it?
posted by mrgrimm at 2:03 PM on August 5, 2004
but then the full game wouldn't have been released for another 4-6 weeks. it's not that easy to make a quality demo.
on preview: yes, a tech demo would have been smart. but when you've got a sure best-seller, why spoil it?
posted by mrgrimm at 2:03 PM on August 5, 2004
i pirated it only because it came late to canada. Then i bought it - yesterday - then i bought a second copy today so that i can play with roomies or friends who come over on the net.
there are a lot of filthy pirates who won't buy it - but.. they are filthy.... some who download, do buy.
in fact, i preorderd weeks ago - so i felt almost just ified dling it knowing it was already paid for on this end.
posted by re_verse at 2:50 PM on August 5, 2004
there are a lot of filthy pirates who won't buy it - but.. they are filthy.... some who download, do buy.
in fact, i preorderd weeks ago - so i felt almost just ified dling it knowing it was already paid for on this end.
posted by re_verse at 2:50 PM on August 5, 2004
Orange Goblin: The Quake series of engines do a "silent" restart, but you can clearly tell from the screen blanking and huge, painful pause that goes on after you click "accept" in the change settings screen.
posted by Potsy at 2:58 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by Potsy at 2:58 PM on August 5, 2004
"a ... demo would have been smart. but when you've got a sure best-seller, why spoil it?"
Doom II was pretty much guaranteed to be an ultraplatinum hit (even though, really, it sucked quite a bit more than the first, being mostly a bunch of new wads and not much new game), but there was still a shareware demo.
And Quake.
And Quake2.
And Quake3.
And RTCW.
id doesn't seem to have been "spoiled" by releasing demos in the past.
posted by majick at 3:05 PM on August 5, 2004
Doom II was pretty much guaranteed to be an ultraplatinum hit (even though, really, it sucked quite a bit more than the first, being mostly a bunch of new wads and not much new game), but there was still a shareware demo.
And Quake.
And Quake2.
And Quake3.
And RTCW.
id doesn't seem to have been "spoiled" by releasing demos in the past.
posted by majick at 3:05 PM on August 5, 2004
Maybe they felt they had something to worry about. My first 15 minuites of the game gave me the impression it was complete crap, (crap music, crappy cutscenes that take you out of your body, etc), if they had released a demo of the first level I might have thought the same thing.
posted by Orange Goblin at 3:15 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by Orange Goblin at 3:15 PM on August 5, 2004
I downloaded it, and I'm going to test it this weekend...but I highly doubt that it'll run well. Poor poor pitiful (and free!) Athlon 1800. *sob*
i tried on my 1800 and quickly decided that was a futile excercise. i have been wanting to get a new system (not for this game), but i am totally out of the loop. no clue what the "godly" vid card of the moment is, nor what processor/motherboard/memory to go with.
posted by bargle at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2004
i tried on my 1800 and quickly decided that was a futile excercise. i have been wanting to get a new system (not for this game), but i am totally out of the loop. no clue what the "godly" vid card of the moment is, nor what processor/motherboard/memory to go with.
posted by bargle at 4:00 PM on August 5, 2004
I've done some surveys of download activity on popular movie torrents. The efficiency is pretty amazing.
posted by Nelson at 4:51 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by Nelson at 4:51 PM on August 5, 2004
I'm thinking of buying it just as an interactive benchmarking program. I think it's cheaper than the pro version of 3Dmark.
posted by krisjohn at 6:51 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by krisjohn at 6:51 PM on August 5, 2004
In my experience the number of people who "try before they buy" is fairly small. I am aware of a fair number of people who have pirated D3 and they have no intention of paying for it - they will run it and the cracks forever.
Whether they would have paid for it if a cracked/downloadable version was NOT available is open to question, but it really isn't the point.
It's flat out theft, and on some level for all the justifications they seem to know it.
posted by soulhuntre at 7:47 PM on August 5, 2004
Whether they would have paid for it if a cracked/downloadable version was NOT available is open to question, but it really isn't the point.
It's flat out theft, and on some level for all the justifications they seem to know it.
posted by soulhuntre at 7:47 PM on August 5, 2004
I hate the Stupid.
Sorry, that was unnecessarily insulting.
Hell, you can't even change the graphics settings without having to quit and restart the game.
Drop the console (ctrl-alt-~) and type vid_restart.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 7:56 PM on August 5, 2004
Sorry, that was unnecessarily insulting.
Hell, you can't even change the graphics settings without having to quit and restart the game.
Drop the console (ctrl-alt-~) and type vid_restart.
posted by stavrosthewonderchicken at 7:56 PM on August 5, 2004
"that was unnecessarily insulting."
No worries. You were unnecessarily drunk. We're used to it.
posted by y6y6y6 at 8:34 PM on August 5, 2004
No worries. You were unnecessarily drunk. We're used to it.
posted by y6y6y6 at 8:34 PM on August 5, 2004
Ok, I just finished the game, and all I got to say is the BFG is handy :)
posted by riffola at 10:04 PM on August 5, 2004
posted by riffola at 10:04 PM on August 5, 2004
But the gameplay? Daikatana.
Them be fighting words.
Where Doom 3 went astray: Daikatana proved that in the real hell, one would be using a pea-shooter to fight frogs.
posted by DaShiv at 11:40 PM on August 5, 2004
Them be fighting words.
Where Doom 3 went astray: Daikatana proved that in the real hell, one would be using a pea-shooter to fight frogs.
posted by DaShiv at 11:40 PM on August 5, 2004
I beat the game, don't knock it till you've played it to the hell portion. Dorks.
posted by Keyser Soze at 12:11 PM on August 6, 2004
posted by Keyser Soze at 12:11 PM on August 6, 2004
I do plan on getting a new system, not just for this game.
In response to Ryvar's pricewatch quote, if you are lucky enough to have a Fry's in your area you can get a better deal. They regularly have Motherboard/CPU combo deals and I saw an Athlon XP 2600+ with mother board for $87.
The last time I was heavily into 1st person games was during Quake 2. I went nuts over the Weapons Factory mod and even was ranked 2 for a week on the now defunct CLQ.
As far as pirating games goes...shit, like they'd lower the price of software if piracy were nonexistent. I used to try before I buy, but now I just wait until the price goes down to $20-30 and I rent PS2 games. (BTW that DRIV3R game is a POS!)
posted by john at 3:01 PM on August 6, 2004
In response to Ryvar's pricewatch quote, if you are lucky enough to have a Fry's in your area you can get a better deal. They regularly have Motherboard/CPU combo deals and I saw an Athlon XP 2600+ with mother board for $87.
The last time I was heavily into 1st person games was during Quake 2. I went nuts over the Weapons Factory mod and even was ranked 2 for a week on the now defunct CLQ.
As far as pirating games goes...shit, like they'd lower the price of software if piracy were nonexistent. I used to try before I buy, but now I just wait until the price goes down to $20-30 and I rent PS2 games. (BTW that DRIV3R game is a POS!)
posted by john at 3:01 PM on August 6, 2004
I just got to hell, and I'm incredibly pissed off they used the old "take away all your weapons" plot twist. Like that hasn't been done a million times. I'm not seeing anything innovative, and I'm expecting the end to be a rip off of System Shock 2. And those fucking cutscenes are still pissing the hell out of me.
posted by Orange Goblin at 6:03 PM on August 6, 2004
posted by Orange Goblin at 6:03 PM on August 6, 2004
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posted by Orange Goblin at 2:18 AM on August 5, 2004