Clinton's Worldview
September 17, 2005 4:25 PM Subscribe
Bill Clinton kicks back, stretches his legs, sips on a diet coke and answers questions. He free to say whatever he wants now, so he chats on about everything from AIDS in China to global warming to Roswell (Yes, that Roswell) at the recent CPSA Investor's Forum in Hong Kong. Part 1, Part 2.
It's like we live in the 1970s looking back at JFK. Argh.
posted by The Jesse Helms at 4:54 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by The Jesse Helms at 4:54 PM on September 17, 2005
We have had this free speech Clinton you speak of in the United Kingdom for several years now. He has even joined forces with the guy who owns JJB Sports and together they are going to end poverty.
posted by fire&wings at 5:05 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by fire&wings at 5:05 PM on September 17, 2005
It's weird to come across someone in politics who will speak frankly about the things he's well versed in. No, wait, let me rephrase that.
It's weird to come across someone in politics to be well versed in something.
posted by Plinko at 5:14 PM on September 17, 2005
It's weird to come across someone in politics to be well versed in something.
posted by Plinko at 5:14 PM on September 17, 2005
Not sure why, but Clinton has been one low-profile past President these last 5+ years. Interesting how he surfaces as GW's approval rating hits record lows Almost as if he wants to remind the world what a real U.S. President looks like.
posted by spock at 5:35 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by spock at 5:35 PM on September 17, 2005
Spock, Gore asked Clinton to lay low while he was running in 2000 ("um yeah we're not with that guy") which didn't exactly work out for Gore and then Clinton had open-heart surgery and almost died. He's just now healthy enough to get back in the spotlight.
But thinking back, over the past few decades has any former president been high profile? Do you think we'd see George and Barbara on the news if W wasn't President. Because we sure didn't during the Clinton years. Reagan was obviously sequested away, Carter pops up to play statesman every once in a while, Ford keeps his head down. You have to go back to the eighties when Nixon was cranking out books to have a relatively high profile ex-president.
posted by thecjm at 6:02 PM on September 17, 2005
But thinking back, over the past few decades has any former president been high profile? Do you think we'd see George and Barbara on the news if W wasn't President. Because we sure didn't during the Clinton years. Reagan was obviously sequested away, Carter pops up to play statesman every once in a while, Ford keeps his head down. You have to go back to the eighties when Nixon was cranking out books to have a relatively high profile ex-president.
posted by thecjm at 6:02 PM on September 17, 2005
Clinton's a genius...its funny, you realize how clinton knows so much about economics, history, the environment, energy, everything...and then, you think, hmm, whats bush know about...and nothing comes to mind. our current president really doesn't know about much of anything...Clinton speaks about issue after issue, and he knows the backgrounds of so many countries and their leaders and issues...have we ever heard Bush really go into detail about much of anything? Bush speaks, but says nothing.
posted by rbf1138 at 6:32 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by rbf1138 at 6:32 PM on September 17, 2005
Jimmy Carter does this, too.
My imagination is too poor to construct even five seconds of "honest reflection" coming out of the present president's mouth a half a dozen years from now.
posted by gum at 6:44 PM on September 17, 2005
My imagination is too poor to construct even five seconds of "honest reflection" coming out of the present president's mouth a half a dozen years from now.
posted by gum at 6:44 PM on September 17, 2005
"Harrison Ford would make a kick-ass president!"
Letterman fan, are we?
posted by mr_crash_davis at 6:45 PM on September 17, 2005
Letterman fan, are we?
posted by mr_crash_davis at 6:45 PM on September 17, 2005
Why is it when Americans politicians get a chance to talk to a foreign (or at least not completely domestic) news source they just blab about everything? Stuff they should have been saying a long time ago
- skallas
We have had this free speech Clinton you speak of in the United Kingdom for several years now.
- fire&wings
I think the problem is that what he's saying wouldn't be that well received in the US thanks to Republican style campaigning. Don't forget that there are still hordes of average joe republicans who loath Clinton, and think he's an immoral, pussy-whipped, rich playboy. And it's a strike against him that he's so smart. What does he think he's better than everyone else? Give me George Regular-Slob Bush anyday. It's the sad state of current US politics.
posted by es_de_bah at 7:07 PM on September 17, 2005
- skallas
We have had this free speech Clinton you speak of in the United Kingdom for several years now.
- fire&wings
I think the problem is that what he's saying wouldn't be that well received in the US thanks to Republican style campaigning. Don't forget that there are still hordes of average joe republicans who loath Clinton, and think he's an immoral, pussy-whipped, rich playboy. And it's a strike against him that he's so smart. What does he think he's better than everyone else? Give me George Regular-Slob Bush anyday. It's the sad state of current US politics.
posted by es_de_bah at 7:07 PM on September 17, 2005
"Harrison Ford would make a kick-ass president!"
Letterman fan, are we?
Actually I was referring to "Air Force One" where Ford does display an impressive array of Air Force Fu.
Back on topic, can anyone here imagine Bush -- in or out of office -- doing this? Speaking unscripted and intelligently about a wide range of (unpredictable) topics?
posted by mazola at 7:12 PM on September 17, 2005
Letterman fan, are we?
Actually I was referring to "Air Force One" where Ford does display an impressive array of Air Force Fu.
Back on topic, can anyone here imagine Bush -- in or out of office -- doing this? Speaking unscripted and intelligently about a wide range of (unpredictable) topics?
posted by mazola at 7:12 PM on September 17, 2005
This was a refreshing read, thanks. His breadth if knowledge does not surprise me. I almost expect it of him. Same goes for Carter, thanks for that link too.
posted by rxreed at 7:18 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by rxreed at 7:18 PM on September 17, 2005
Time for GW to join him in retirement.
- "Mr. President, this job can't be fun for you any more. There's no more money to spend--you used up all of that. You can't start another war because you used up the army. And now, darn the luck, the rest of your term has become the Bush family nightmare: helping poor people. Listen to your Mom. The cupboard's bare, the credit cards maxed out. No one's speaking to you. Mission accomplished.
"Now it's time to do what you've always done best: lose interest and walk away. Like you did with your military service and the oil company and the baseball team. It's time. Time to move on and try the next fantasy job. How about cowboy or space man? Now I know what you're saying: there's so many other things that you as President could involve yourself in. Please don't. I know, I know. There's a lot left to do. There's a war with Venezuela. Eliminating the sales tax on yachts. Turning the space program over to the church. And Social Security to Fannie Mae. Giving embryos the vote.
...
Saw Bill on Larry King last night and had many of the same thoughts. He's...just smart. King asked him what he thought about Bush not meeting Cindy Sheehan, and he said "Well...he has to do what he thinks is right. ...I would have." and went on to elaborate about what the responsibility of president entails, and how he met with family members of the Black Hawk incident, and was raked over the coals by a heartbroken and angry father - and felt it was his duty to listen. It got me.
posted by Miko at 7:45 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by Miko at 7:45 PM on September 17, 2005
I was going to say GWB could possibly speak on mending barb-wire fences, but then again, it seems like he's been working on the same one in Crawford for years now.
posted by tetsuo at 8:03 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by tetsuo at 8:03 PM on September 17, 2005
GWB:
Mountain biking
Fishing
Running
...perhaps he could go to work as a spokesman for REI.
posted by Miko at 8:08 PM on September 17, 2005
Mountain biking
Fishing
Running
...perhaps he could go to work as a spokesman for REI.
posted by Miko at 8:08 PM on September 17, 2005
You know, I bet he'd make an awesome spokesman for REI and probably have a hell of a time doing it.
posted by ddf at 8:37 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by ddf at 8:37 PM on September 17, 2005
Unnecessary Bill Clinton-Harrison Ford convergence factoid:
"Air Force One": Factual errors (IMDB): None of the planes used as the real Air Force One have an escape pod. President Bill Clinton is said to have remarked on this detail after seeing the film at a White House screening.posted by mazola at 8:48 PM on September 17, 2005
There needs to be a flickr stream consisting of nothing but screen caps of bush mending that pernicious barbed wire fence in Crawford.
posted by craniac at 8:55 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by craniac at 8:55 PM on September 17, 2005
I had almost forgotten how freakin' verbose Clinton is. And then I remembered his autobiography. That man sure can ramble.
posted by grapefruitmoon at 8:58 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by grapefruitmoon at 8:58 PM on September 17, 2005
From president to president, do you pass along a list of secrets - you know like where's Jimmy Hoffa? What really happened at Roswell? Without giving away any state secrets, is there something that we can all look forward to in the future to read about that you know that we don't know that will make reading the National Enquirer required reading?
(Laughing and blushing) Well I don't know if you all heard this, but, there was actually, when I was president in my second term, there was an anniversary observance of Roswell. Remember that? People came to Roswell, New Mexico from all over the world. And there was also a site in Nevada where people were convinced that the government had buried a UFO and perhaps an alien deep underground because we wouldn't allow anybody to go there. And uhm… I can say now, 'cause it's now been released into the public domain. I had so many people in my own administration that were convinced that Roswell was a fraud but this place in Nevada was really serious, that there was an alien artefact there. So I actually sent somebody there to figure it out. And it was actually just a secret defence installation, alas, doing boring work that we didn't want anybody to else see.
posted by craniac at 9:05 PM on September 17, 2005
(Laughing and blushing) Well I don't know if you all heard this, but, there was actually, when I was president in my second term, there was an anniversary observance of Roswell. Remember that? People came to Roswell, New Mexico from all over the world. And there was also a site in Nevada where people were convinced that the government had buried a UFO and perhaps an alien deep underground because we wouldn't allow anybody to go there. And uhm… I can say now, 'cause it's now been released into the public domain. I had so many people in my own administration that were convinced that Roswell was a fraud but this place in Nevada was really serious, that there was an alien artefact there. So I actually sent somebody there to figure it out. And it was actually just a secret defence installation, alas, doing boring work that we didn't want anybody to else see.
posted by craniac at 9:05 PM on September 17, 2005
That man sure can ramble.
Surprizing, isn't it? Some people can actually complete entire sentences...
posted by c13 at 9:09 PM on September 17, 2005
Surprizing, isn't it? Some people can actually complete entire sentences...
posted by c13 at 9:09 PM on September 17, 2005
Bill Clinton is just a pimp for working people. Stop being so patronizing and wishing for yesterday. He speaks candidly, speaks our lingo and then screws us with the same sweet talk.
Clinton is a moderate conservative Republican and only looks liberal when the contrast is Bush.
Did you see that poverty in New Orleans? Did that really just start in 2000?
Do you see the apartheid in our school systems?
Do you notice how you are humping more for less money and time with your family?
Do you imagine that the fear in the back of your mid that you live in a bubble that could burst anytime started in 2000?
Clinton was the one who introduced you to looking over your shoulder at India and Asia to see where your job could go if you got impolite. He called it NAFTA and WTO.
Bush is an SOB, but he is clear as a bell working for oil and Halliburton. Clinton is their SOB, too. He just makes you feel good about it.
When does specator politics end?
When you can't afford your internet bill?
When metafilter starts talking about manufacturing jobs and the multiplier effects those jobs give us?
I'd like to know. Right now Bill Clinton and his Democratic Party are giving Bush cover.
Incredible that he has any credibility here.
posted by goodnature at 9:10 PM on September 17, 2005
Clinton is a moderate conservative Republican and only looks liberal when the contrast is Bush.
Did you see that poverty in New Orleans? Did that really just start in 2000?
Do you see the apartheid in our school systems?
Do you notice how you are humping more for less money and time with your family?
Do you imagine that the fear in the back of your mid that you live in a bubble that could burst anytime started in 2000?
Clinton was the one who introduced you to looking over your shoulder at India and Asia to see where your job could go if you got impolite. He called it NAFTA and WTO.
Bush is an SOB, but he is clear as a bell working for oil and Halliburton. Clinton is their SOB, too. He just makes you feel good about it.
When does specator politics end?
When you can't afford your internet bill?
When metafilter starts talking about manufacturing jobs and the multiplier effects those jobs give us?
I'd like to know. Right now Bill Clinton and his Democratic Party are giving Bush cover.
Incredible that he has any credibility here.
posted by goodnature at 9:10 PM on September 17, 2005
Wow, my troll meter just blew itself out. Was it anarchy you were pushing for, or just an end to the entire system with no replacement system at all ? (err, anarchy is still a system, kinda..)
posted by cavalier at 9:15 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by cavalier at 9:15 PM on September 17, 2005
yhbc:But he got a blowjob! And he lied about it!....
True, but nobody died.
posted by R. Mutt at 9:18 PM on September 17, 2005
True, but nobody died.
posted by R. Mutt at 9:18 PM on September 17, 2005
yhbc: But he got a blowjob! And he lied about it!....
True, but nobody died.
posted by R. Mutt at 9:18 PM on September 17, 2005
True, but nobody died.
posted by R. Mutt at 9:18 PM on September 17, 2005
Do you notice how you are humping more for less money and time with your family?
If I were humping more for less money I'd be a big supporter of Bush.
posted by mazola at 9:19 PM on September 17, 2005
If I were humping more for less money I'd be a big supporter of Bush.
posted by mazola at 9:19 PM on September 17, 2005
"Do you notice how you are humping more for less money and time with your family?"
Only since Bush Jr. took over.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 9:20 PM on September 17, 2005
Only since Bush Jr. took over.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 9:20 PM on September 17, 2005
Ok this is metatalk, but I used Opera to post and it doubleposted Wa the heck?
posted by R. Mutt at 9:25 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by R. Mutt at 9:25 PM on September 17, 2005
Clinton was the one who introduced you to looking over your shoulder at India and Asia to see where your job could go if you got impolite.
Impolite, or lazy, or incompetent. Or asking for more money than the job is worth. Isn't this what capitalism is all about? Republicans like capitalism, free markets, personal responsibilty and other such things, no?
posted by c13 at 9:27 PM on September 17, 2005
Impolite, or lazy, or incompetent. Or asking for more money than the job is worth. Isn't this what capitalism is all about? Republicans like capitalism, free markets, personal responsibilty and other such things, no?
posted by c13 at 9:27 PM on September 17, 2005
I miss Clinton. I get little pangs when I hear him talk now, and believe me, I wasn't too happy about a lot of his policies. (BTW, I just spent a restless, flu-y nap dreaming I was stuck on the Spinning Teacup ride at Disneyland with Bush. Horrible, and it seemed to go on forever....)
posted by maryh at 9:36 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by maryh at 9:36 PM on September 17, 2005
There's an old saying in Arkansas — I know it's in Texas, probably in Arkansas — that says, fool Bill Clinton once, shame on — shame on you. Fool George Bush — the american people can't get fooled again...
posted by blue_beetle at 9:50 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by blue_beetle at 9:50 PM on September 17, 2005
Sorry, that made no sense. Before or after the edits.
posted by blue_beetle at 9:50 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by blue_beetle at 9:50 PM on September 17, 2005
Bill was one of our most realistic presidents,and all presidents have to be obedient to power. The economic roots of the forum he spoke at, were cultivated by Bill's buddy, Bush senior, while he was ambassador, Bill and George Sr. are buddies and have been buddies since Bill as Gov.allowed (illegal) contra supply flights to use the national guard airbase at Mena. goodnature isn't far off the mark
(global bussiness wins)
posted by hortense at 9:57 PM on September 17, 2005
(global bussiness wins)
posted by hortense at 9:57 PM on September 17, 2005
I had a chance to see Clinton and Bob Dole perform all their old classics one time. He was a fun speaker, Bob Dole on the otherhand, well what you see is what you get. Clinton was speaking to a very liberal college audience and really threw them off by telling them that while Bush may be doing things they don't agree with, he's doing what he thinks is best for the country. He then played a great rendition of "Band on the Run."
posted by geoff. at 10:08 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by geoff. at 10:08 PM on September 17, 2005
yhbc for the win, the rest of ya'll be jealous, is all.
posted by joe lisboa at 10:29 PM on September 17, 2005
posted by joe lisboa at 10:29 PM on September 17, 2005
One of the extras on the middlin' documentary The Hunting of the President is footage of Clinton doing an impromptu lecture on history and politics at the film's debut. I was amazed at his intelliegence and eloquence, and I highly recommend his speech. (The movie itself is OK.)
The movie wasn't listed on his IMDB page, but Kinky Friedman: Proud to Be an Asshole from El Paso is.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:08 AM on September 18, 2005
The movie wasn't listed on his IMDB page, but Kinky Friedman: Proud to Be an Asshole from El Paso is.
posted by kirkaracha at 1:08 AM on September 18, 2005
yhbc: But he got a blowjob! And he lied about it!....
True, but nobody died.
I believe the result of a good blowjob is referred to as the little death by the french. Who, you know, still let the leaders get them. In fact, I believe, they require them to.
posted by srboisvert at 3:25 AM on September 18, 2005
True, but nobody died.
I believe the result of a good blowjob is referred to as the little death by the french. Who, you know, still let the leaders get them. In fact, I believe, they require them to.
posted by srboisvert at 3:25 AM on September 18, 2005
Clinton is a moderate conservative Republican and only looks liberal when the contrast is Bush.
$$$$$$$$$$
posted by matteo at 4:48 AM on September 18, 2005
$$$$$$$$$$
posted by matteo at 4:48 AM on September 18, 2005
Dear God,
If you exist, please, please, please keep the Democrats from nominating Hillary Clinton in 2008.
And, goodnature's right: policy-wise, Clinton was pretty much a moderate Republican.
posted by eustacescrubb at 6:25 AM on September 18, 2005
If you exist, please, please, please keep the Democrats from nominating Hillary Clinton in 2008.
And, goodnature's right: policy-wise, Clinton was pretty much a moderate Republican.
posted by eustacescrubb at 6:25 AM on September 18, 2005
Clinton was far from perfect, but sadly, I think he's as good as anything we're going to get any time soon. The only way that will ever change is for a dramatic shift to take place in the very fabric of our society.
We're not compassionate people. Maybe some individuals are, but our culture, taken as a whole, is self-centered and mean. The strongly selective process of politics makes any potential president more self-centered and mean.
There is no "they" working in the shadows, responsible for the bad things in goodnature's post. It's us.
posted by Eamon at 11:49 AM on September 18, 2005
We're not compassionate people. Maybe some individuals are, but our culture, taken as a whole, is self-centered and mean. The strongly selective process of politics makes any potential president more self-centered and mean.
There is no "they" working in the shadows, responsible for the bad things in goodnature's post. It's us.
posted by Eamon at 11:49 AM on September 18, 2005
Agree with everyone about not being a big Clinton policy fan in the 90s. But that was during a time when you still just expected presidents to have intelligence and vision. My only complaint during the 90s was that he didn't have enough vision. But literally every time he says something now, I am reminded of how much trouble the U.S. is in currently.
My favorite quote:
I used to give speeches - in my second term I gave a lot of speeches, which almost no one in America paid any attention to, at least in the political press - in which I said, you know, we cannot forever be the only military, economic and political super power. This is an accident of the post-cold-war era. China is rising. India is rising. Europe, at that time, was still continuing to come together economically and politically, and all these places have more people than we do. And intelligence is evenly distributed throughout the world. And we shouldn't see that as a threat.
But what we should be doing is working as hard as we can to create a world that we would like to live in when we are a great and successful country but not the only military, political and economic superpower. That's what we should be doing. And that's what I tried to do.
So I never saw China's rising economic prosperity as a threat. I never saw India's rising prosperity as a threat. I thought it was a good thing. I don't think it's healthy for a country with 4% of the world's people to have 20% of the world's wealth. I don't think it's healthy to have a world where there are all these millionaires and billionaires and half the world's people live on less than $2 a day and a billion people live on less than a $1 a day and a billion people go to bed hungry every night. I think that's crazy. It's a misallocation of resources. It makes all of us poorer besides being immoral and inhuman.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 11:49 AM on September 18, 2005
My favorite quote:
I used to give speeches - in my second term I gave a lot of speeches, which almost no one in America paid any attention to, at least in the political press - in which I said, you know, we cannot forever be the only military, economic and political super power. This is an accident of the post-cold-war era. China is rising. India is rising. Europe, at that time, was still continuing to come together economically and politically, and all these places have more people than we do. And intelligence is evenly distributed throughout the world. And we shouldn't see that as a threat.
But what we should be doing is working as hard as we can to create a world that we would like to live in when we are a great and successful country but not the only military, political and economic superpower. That's what we should be doing. And that's what I tried to do.
So I never saw China's rising economic prosperity as a threat. I never saw India's rising prosperity as a threat. I thought it was a good thing. I don't think it's healthy for a country with 4% of the world's people to have 20% of the world's wealth. I don't think it's healthy to have a world where there are all these millionaires and billionaires and half the world's people live on less than $2 a day and a billion people live on less than a $1 a day and a billion people go to bed hungry every night. I think that's crazy. It's a misallocation of resources. It makes all of us poorer besides being immoral and inhuman.
posted by Slarty Bartfast at 11:49 AM on September 18, 2005
Thanks for the nice read.
I was never a big Clinton fan during his presidency, and even less so after the sex scandal. But looking back, dang it, this guy really was a Jed Bartlett.
The point was emphasized recently when I watched an interview in which Clinton and Bush Sr. were popped the question about whether or not the government should place price caps on oil. My goodness, one stutters and waves the issue aside (“it's up to the government, it's up to the government”), while the other explains the concerns when considering a price cap, simply but thoroughly.
posted by slf at 12:23 PM on September 18, 2005
I was never a big Clinton fan during his presidency, and even less so after the sex scandal. But looking back, dang it, this guy really was a Jed Bartlett.
The point was emphasized recently when I watched an interview in which Clinton and Bush Sr. were popped the question about whether or not the government should place price caps on oil. My goodness, one stutters and waves the issue aside (“it's up to the government, it's up to the government”), while the other explains the concerns when considering a price cap, simply but thoroughly.
posted by slf at 12:23 PM on September 18, 2005
I've never been good at analyzing presidents' positions and then encapsulating them in a term like "moderate republican," which, for all I know, could be quite accurate. But reading this interview, and I don't care how prepared he was for it, shows that he is a far more intelligent, thoughtful, considerate, and generally a better man for the job than our current president. It's not like a revelation or anything but it just stresses the point to see Clinton's eloquent, considered, and honest answers when we can all imagine exactly what Bush would be saying were he there instead.
posted by BlackLeotardFront at 1:01 PM on September 18, 2005
posted by BlackLeotardFront at 1:01 PM on September 18, 2005
Yeah, but we all know the devil has a silver tongue. It's honest folk like George W. what sometimes just don' know what to say.
Clinton was pretty much a moderate Republican.
Moderate Republicans look pretty good to me these days, but while DLC folk like Clinton are different in a number of ways.
This isn't to say I was onboard with all of Clinton's policies. Just that it's not the same thing as having Bush Sr. in office, and certainly not as having Bush Jr.
posted by weston at 4:33 PM on September 18, 2005
Clinton was pretty much a moderate Republican.
Moderate Republicans look pretty good to me these days, but while DLC folk like Clinton are different in a number of ways.
This isn't to say I was onboard with all of Clinton's policies. Just that it's not the same thing as having Bush Sr. in office, and certainly not as having Bush Jr.
posted by weston at 4:33 PM on September 18, 2005
this guy really was a Jed Bartlett
WW really started feeling disconnected for me in recent years (and for many others, I think) even though they obviously tried to move the show in directions that mirrored the "real" America as time went on. One of the interesting things that they dealt with early on was Jed's tendency to dumb down his speeches, to try to appear folksy, and of course the staffers' response was to say: "No, of course people won't hold education against you. That's ridiculous!" (Barlett at one point comes out and says that if you're going to try to be the education president, you shouldn't be hiding your own education)
In the meantime (in the real world), it seems like it's gone from "you can't have an educated ivy-league liberal in office" to "you can't have a generally knowledgable and intellectually curious individual in office" and I don't think the slope is getting less slippery. I mean, really, why shouldn't you have a president with a PhD in economics? It isn't necessary but neither would the loathing that would accompany such a candidate. And forget about candidates who don't embrace some concept of god. Atheists -- intelligent, qualified, compassionate or otherwise, are out. Maybe it's just me, but I'd like to see the person with the world's largest nuclear stockpile be at least agnostic when it comes to having the afterlife as a backup plan.
posted by dreamsign at 8:17 PM on September 18, 2005
WW really started feeling disconnected for me in recent years (and for many others, I think) even though they obviously tried to move the show in directions that mirrored the "real" America as time went on. One of the interesting things that they dealt with early on was Jed's tendency to dumb down his speeches, to try to appear folksy, and of course the staffers' response was to say: "No, of course people won't hold education against you. That's ridiculous!" (Barlett at one point comes out and says that if you're going to try to be the education president, you shouldn't be hiding your own education)
In the meantime (in the real world), it seems like it's gone from "you can't have an educated ivy-league liberal in office" to "you can't have a generally knowledgable and intellectually curious individual in office" and I don't think the slope is getting less slippery. I mean, really, why shouldn't you have a president with a PhD in economics? It isn't necessary but neither would the loathing that would accompany such a candidate. And forget about candidates who don't embrace some concept of god. Atheists -- intelligent, qualified, compassionate or otherwise, are out. Maybe it's just me, but I'd like to see the person with the world's largest nuclear stockpile be at least agnostic when it comes to having the afterlife as a backup plan.
posted by dreamsign at 8:17 PM on September 18, 2005
why shouldn't you have a president with a PhD in economics?
How about somebody who is actually trained to do something instead of provide political policy rationalizations dressed up as science?
posted by srboisvert at 4:22 AM on September 19, 2005
How about somebody who is actually trained to do something instead of provide political policy rationalizations dressed up as science?
posted by srboisvert at 4:22 AM on September 19, 2005
srboisvert is right, economics is not a science. Political economists are usually a mixture of harmful idealism and corruption. OTOH, I know enough scientific people who believe in some silly Marxist notions of global social justice, which would be equally harmful to the world. One day our science will give correct economic answers, but it won't ceome from current methods in economics, it'll probably come from psychology.
For now, Clinton's current idea of social and economic progress seems like the right one to me (see his suggestion of doing a national cost benifit analysis for each trade deal, as well as the shirt lady). No overriding idealism (either left or right).
posted by jeffburdges at 7:36 AM on September 19, 2005
For now, Clinton's current idea of social and economic progress seems like the right one to me (see his suggestion of doing a national cost benifit analysis for each trade deal, as well as the shirt lady). No overriding idealism (either left or right).
posted by jeffburdges at 7:36 AM on September 19, 2005
Economics is the science of common sense.
[at least according to Elbert Bowden]
posted by caddis at 7:48 AM on September 19, 2005
[at least according to Elbert Bowden]
posted by caddis at 7:48 AM on September 19, 2005
dreamsign, thanks for pointing that out. I should have qualified by WW reference with a Sorkin-only tag (i.e. Seasons 1 to 4). Anything beyond that, I refuse to acknowledge. :p
posted by slf at 8:02 AM on September 19, 2005
posted by slf at 8:02 AM on September 19, 2005
Wow:
"The other big problem is the legitimate concern in America, or a genuine concern, over the Chinese military build up - and whether China is basically being nice now but some day, once they get the most modern military equipment in the world, is going to provoke some sort of a showdown with Japan, which will draw us in, and throw the world into a turmoil. And there are people in the Pentagon who push that line every single day. Just like there are people in the military in China who, every single day say that someday we're going to have to confront the Americans. They're too aggressive, They're too over-reaching. The Japanese are becoming militant again.
They key is: Where are the people? And where are the leaders? There will always be people who will have an institutional interest in finding an enemy - and finding division. And I don't think we've answered that question yet. So yeah, I'm concerned about it."
posted by thisisdrew at 8:04 AM on September 19, 2005
"The other big problem is the legitimate concern in America, or a genuine concern, over the Chinese military build up - and whether China is basically being nice now but some day, once they get the most modern military equipment in the world, is going to provoke some sort of a showdown with Japan, which will draw us in, and throw the world into a turmoil. And there are people in the Pentagon who push that line every single day. Just like there are people in the military in China who, every single day say that someday we're going to have to confront the Americans. They're too aggressive, They're too over-reaching. The Japanese are becoming militant again.
They key is: Where are the people? And where are the leaders? There will always be people who will have an institutional interest in finding an enemy - and finding division. And I don't think we've answered that question yet. So yeah, I'm concerned about it."
posted by thisisdrew at 8:04 AM on September 19, 2005
Q: If you had 24 hours in office again, what would you do? Is there something that really is nagging you since you left?
A: "Oh yeah. (Drawn out, and followed by a long pause - which prompted giggles from the audience). If I had 24 hours, I would at least lay down where I think we ought to go in the Middle East to finish the business between the Israelis and the Palestinians ....
"I would put a healthcare plan before the Congress that would end this insane system we have that's bankrupting the American economy and is leaving huge numbers of people out. And I would do my dead-level best to change the energy and environmental direction that the current government has.
"And of course, now I would have to give them a budget plan to get rid of the deficit I got rid of once, and now - (chuckle) - he's brought it back.
"Those would be the things I would do in my day as president."
posted by hank at 8:15 AM on September 19, 2005
A: "Oh yeah. (Drawn out, and followed by a long pause - which prompted giggles from the audience). If I had 24 hours, I would at least lay down where I think we ought to go in the Middle East to finish the business between the Israelis and the Palestinians ....
"I would put a healthcare plan before the Congress that would end this insane system we have that's bankrupting the American economy and is leaving huge numbers of people out. And I would do my dead-level best to change the energy and environmental direction that the current government has.
"And of course, now I would have to give them a budget plan to get rid of the deficit I got rid of once, and now - (chuckle) - he's brought it back.
"Those would be the things I would do in my day as president."
posted by hank at 8:15 AM on September 19, 2005
As I say to my Pinko-Communist-Liberal trivia buddies, Gawd, do I miss good ole Billy-C.
Re: Preznits should not be smart(-y pantses): Sarah Vowell says in Partly Cloudy Patriot that Al Gore's problem is that he's a geek, and he didn't play the geek part correctly. Looking, back, I can totally see that. Le sigh.
posted by Medieval Maven at 9:28 AM on September 19, 2005
Re: Preznits should not be smart(-y pantses): Sarah Vowell says in Partly Cloudy Patriot that Al Gore's problem is that he's a geek, and he didn't play the geek part correctly. Looking, back, I can totally see that. Le sigh.
posted by Medieval Maven at 9:28 AM on September 19, 2005
Does anybody have a mirror of this article? It requires a subscription to view now, and bugmenot doesn't have any entries for this site.
posted by dvdgee at 10:15 AM on September 19, 2005
posted by dvdgee at 10:15 AM on September 19, 2005
grapefruitmoon: I had almost forgotten how freakin' verbose Clinton is. And then I remembered his autobiography. That man sure can ramble.
At least he could probably define "verbose" if prompted...which is not something I could say for Ten Gallon Asshat.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 10:52 AM on September 19, 2005
At least he could probably define "verbose" if prompted...which is not something I could say for Ten Gallon Asshat.
posted by bitter-girl.com at 10:52 AM on September 19, 2005
Economics is the science of common sense.
And yet economists assume everyone has it.
posted by weston at 11:58 AM on September 19, 2005
And yet economists assume everyone has it.
posted by weston at 11:58 AM on September 19, 2005
That was classic, weston!
posted by sonofsamiam at 12:05 PM on September 19, 2005
posted by sonofsamiam at 12:05 PM on September 19, 2005
« Older Terry Fox | Burma-shave signs Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by mazola at 4:30 PM on September 17, 2005