The First Casualty of War? Truth

May 12, 2007 1:01 PM

War vs. Democracy: Untold Stories from the Lynch / Tillman Hearing -- ...U.S. soldiers whose injuries or deaths remain mired in secrecy. Pat Tillman's brother and fellow Army Ranger Kevin Tillman advocated strongly for other families still waiting for answers. ... "The family was told, it was -- quote -- 'an ambush by insurgents.' Two years later, they found out that those -- quote -- 'insurgents' happened to be the same Iraqi troops that he was training. Before his death, he told his chain of command that these same troops that he was training were trying to kill him and his team. He was told to keep his mouth shut." ... Thorough and eye-opening examination of the many ways the military spun, lied, withheld information on soldier deaths and injuries for propaganda purposes (and even delayed action until cameras were present in the Jessica Lynch rescue).
posted by amberglow (29 comments total)

Uh this is old news. As thought provoking as it may be, this has been out for a long time.
posted by wheelieman at 1:06 PM on May 12, 2007

I always thought the idea of "embedding" U.S. troops in Iraqi units seemed a little, well, insane.
posted by delmoi at 1:07 PM on May 12, 2007

Uh this is old news.
This US House hearing (video there too) was the first time any Pentagon people have gone on the record about these incidents and stories, and the first time any oversight has been done in all this time.
posted by amberglow at 1:42 PM on May 12, 2007

Here's a link to the video stream (for non embedded browsing) I hadn't heard anything on this since a report became public on Tillman last month... thanks for posting this.
posted by acro at 1:49 PM on May 12, 2007

Why let a little thing like the lives of people's sons and daughters get in the way of your political reputation, right?
posted by yeloson at 1:50 PM on May 12, 2007

The Army's on Youtube.
Mission accomplished.
posted by phaedon at 2:01 PM on May 12, 2007

MissionFilter? phaedon's link

Multi-National Force - Iraq established this YouTube channel to give viewers around the world a "boots on the ground" perspective of Operation Iraqi Freedom from those who are fighting it.

Video clips document action as it appeared to personnel on the ground and in the air as it was shot. We will only edit video clips for time, security reasons, and/or overly disturbing or offensive images.

What you will see on this channel in the coming months:
- Combat action
- Interesting, eye-catching footage
- Interaction between Coalition troops and the Iraqi populace.
- Teamwork between Coalition and Iraqi troops in the fight against terror.

What we will NOT post on this channel:
- Profanity
- Sexual content
- Overly graphic, disturbing or offensive material
- Footage that mocks Coalition Forces, Iraqi Security Forces or the citizens of Iraq.

posted by acro at 2:12 PM on May 12, 2007

(phaedon's first link... That second link, you'll have to watch yourself.)
posted by acro at 2:19 PM on May 12, 2007

the bush admin has lied about so many things that it is no longer possible to untangle all the lies - they lie so well that they themselves believe their own lies to be true
posted by Flood at 2:20 PM on May 12, 2007

This US House hearing (video there too) was the first time any Pentagon people have gone on the record about these incidents and stories, and the first time any oversight has been done in all this time.

So? ESPN -- ESPN! -- did a four-parter with most of this material last year.

I don't see how this is any different from your single-link comments in political threads. Not that they're bad or anything, but this doesn't rise to the level of FPP for me.
posted by dw at 2:53 PM on May 12, 2007

I don't see how this is any different from your single-link comments in political threads. Not that they're bad or anything, but this doesn't rise to the level of FPP for me.

Flag. Move on.
posted by delmoi at 3:03 PM on May 12, 2007

they lie so well that they themselves believe their own lies to be true

Actually, they don't lie well at all, and they don't believe their own lies, either. They just don't care.
posted by dhartung at 5:03 PM on May 12, 2007 [1 favorite]

our government is scum.
posted by quarter waters and a bag of chips at 5:07 PM on May 12, 2007 [1 favorite]

Thanks for the update. The Tillman issue alone can not receive too much attention.
"Other Soldiers, Other Questions" is a good address of how Tillman received attention due to his fame, but many others are left with unanswered questions.
posted by buzzman at 7:26 PM on May 12, 2007

The Pentagon has placed unprecedented restrictions on who can testify before Congress, reserving the right to bar lower-ranking officers, enlisted soldiers and career bureaucrats from appearing before oversight committees or having their remarks transcribed, according to Defense Department documents.
An assistant secretary of defense for legislative affairs, Robert Wilkie, has outlined a half-dozen guidelines that prohibit most officers below the rank of colonel from appearing in hearings, restricting testimony to high-ranking officers and civilians appointed by the president.
The guidelines, described in an April 19 memo to the staff director of the House Armed Services Committee, adds that all field-level officers and enlisted personnel must be deemed appropriate by the Department of Defense before they can participate in personal briefings for members of Congress or their staffs; in addition, according to the memo, the proceedings must not be recorded. ...
posted by amberglow at 8:05 PM on May 12, 2007 [1 favorite]

Uh this is old news.

Yeah. It will be old news when we as a country actually do something and Iraqi stop dying. Sorry if the reality of our mistakes isn't enteraining.
posted by gesamtkunstwerk at 8:20 PM on May 12, 2007

How can the Pentagon, or anyone else, put restrictions on who can appear before congress?
Isn't the Congress the Pentagon's boss?
posted by Balisong at 8:24 PM on May 12, 2007

yup, Bali--they're ignoring the law and acting like the administration is--Congress will have to always issue subpoenas to get Pentagon people from now on (and for the WH people too--they're refusing to come.)
posted by amberglow at 8:29 PM on May 12, 2007

OK, let me add them to my list...
posted by Balisong at 8:31 PM on May 12, 2007

Your "header" for this story makes it sound like Pat Tillman was killed by Iraqis.

Pat Tillman was never in Iraq; he was killed by friendly fire in Afghanistan
posted by wxsnoozle at 10:31 PM on May 12, 2007

Former Powell Aide: Bush, Cheney Guilty Of “High Crimes”

More on Wilkerson’s Impeachment Call
posted by homunculus at 10:41 PM on May 12, 2007

Actually, Pat Tillman served both in Iraq and Afghanistan. He was killed in Afghanistan. GIYF.
posted by nevercalm at 7:13 AM on May 13, 2007

Amberglow's summary is a little bit unclear. Tillman, as probably everybody knows, was killed in Afghanistan, and by men in his own unit. The guy who was killed in Iraq by men he'd trained was Sergeant Patrick McCafferty. Amberglow probably realized this, but the summary sort of implies that this was Tillman.
posted by jackbrown at 11:05 AM on May 13, 2007

i did the quote that way with "other families still waiting for answers" right before another family's experience and the lies they were told--i guess i foolishly assumed everyone knew the Tillman story by now. I see that's not so, which makes me think this post was even more worth doing.
posted by amberglow at 1:30 PM on May 13, 2007

I'm definitely glad you posted it....I was very familiar with Tillman and Lynch, but knew nothing of the others (though nothing surprises me anymore).

I think that as far as the US's current geopolitical situation is concerned, there really isn't any such thing as too much information.
posted by nevercalm at 1:57 PM on May 13, 2007

I didn't know about the others either.

Today: Defense Dept. Blocking MySpace, YouTube--... The Defense Department will begin blocking access "worldwide" to YouTube, MySpace and 11 other popular Web sites on its computers and networks, according to a memo sent Friday by Gen. B.B. Bell, the U.S. Forces Korea commander.
...
The sites covered by the ban are the video-sharing sites YouTube, Metacafe, IFilm, StupidVideos and FileCabi; social networking sites MySpace, BlackPlanet and Hi5; music sites Pandora, MTV, 1.fm and live365; and the photo-sharing site Photobucket. ...
posted by amberglow at 6:54 AM on May 14, 2007

Yup. So what? They also block Something Awful, too. Anything considered a social site is blocked, which is pretty much anything with a comments section. So, they can't look at the stuff from DoD computers, which are only used when at work. The soldiers, sailors and airmen will have to get a private ISP, if they want access to that stuff, just like they did before. DoD computers are not intended to be used for personel purposes.
posted by Snyder at 11:26 AM on May 14, 2007

Today: Defense Dept. Blocking MySpace, YouTube

Maybe they're just celebrating Wiretap the Internet Day.
posted by homunculus at 11:49 AM on May 14, 2007

Shadowboxing
posted by Smedleyman at 3:42 PM on May 14, 2007