Take my money, please!
November 6, 2007 12:52 PM   Subscribe

 
I for one, salute our tax-paying pot distributing benefactors.
posted by psmealey at 12:58 PM on November 6, 2007


I'm pretty sure they can pay taxes if they want.
posted by found missing at 12:59 PM on November 6, 2007


shorter URL
posted by telstar at 1:05 PM on November 6, 2007


What a weird way to frame support for marijuana legalization. It's messed up if somehow the "as an autonomous moral agent I should be allowed to do drugs if I want" approach is less effective than this.
posted by tepidmonkey at 1:08 PM on November 6, 2007 [2 favorites]


So, to be more precise, they should say "make us pay taxes," not "let us pay taxes."
posted by found missing at 1:16 PM on November 6, 2007


I'm pretty sure they can pay taxes if they want.

I think what they want is some kind of agreement from the state that paying their taxes won't result in lengthy prison terms or being shot to death by paramilitary "police".
posted by [expletive deleted] at 1:29 PM on November 6, 2007 [2 favorites]


[expletive deleted] has it.
But under current law won't the Feds take over the imprisoning and shooting to death parts of the program? (There appears to be no mention of Federal Taxes.)
posted by speug at 1:39 PM on November 6, 2007


What a weird way to frame support for marijuana legalization.

Why?

It's messed up if somehow the "as an autonomous moral agent I should be allowed to do drugs if I want" approach is less effective than this.

Ah, perhaps you haven't been paying attention the last forty years or so. Allow me to enlighten you: no, the "as an autonomous moral agent I should be allowed to do drugs if I want" approach hasn't been effective at all, so they're trying the "hey, if you legalize it you can make $$$ in taxes!" approach. Makes sense to me.
posted by languagehat at 1:39 PM on November 6, 2007 [2 favorites]


I'm glad you offered the shorter URL "http://letuspaytaxes.com/" -- the original "http://druglibrary.org/taxes/" was simply far too unwieldly.

seriously, when I saw "shorter URL" I thought it was going to be a joke.
posted by davejay at 1:40 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


I'm pretty sure they can pay taxes if they want.

But after events like this, why would they want to?
posted by telstar at 1:49 PM on November 6, 2007


the "as an autonomous moral agent I should be allowed to do drugs if I want" approach hasn't been effective at all

I know that. And it "shouldn't" be that way, but, yeah, it is. That's all I was saying.
posted by tepidmonkey at 1:51 PM on November 6, 2007


A: Hey, are you a drug dealer?
B: Yep.
A: You want to sign my petition?
B: What's it for?
A: It's so you'll have to pay taxes.
B: Oh, okay. So I just sign here?
A: Uh-huh. And put your address and phone number right there.
B: Alrighty. There you go.
A: Thanks a bunch! So I guess I'll see you later at your place while we're arresting you.
B: Oh, right. So is eight o'clock okay?
A: Eight's perfect.
B: Well, I guess I'll see you then.
A: Right. Thanks for signing my petition!
B: You're really quite welcome.
A: Bye!
B: Eight o'clock!
posted by Reggie Digest at 1:54 PM on November 6, 2007


It's a novel idea, but I just don't see drug dealers clamouring to get on board. Nevermind the undesirability of taxes; the end result, legalization, would cut their profits.
posted by Reggie Digest at 1:58 PM on November 6, 2007


I'm pretty sure they can pay taxes if they want.

I'm pretty sure you're ignorant of history.

To get the tax stamps, you have to have the product in hand.

If you have the product in hand without the stamps, it is illegal and you are arrested and charged.

That is the status quo in the US and has been since Anslinger's dog and pony show. Hey, you got to catch up on a hundred years of history today, so not all is lost!

This is a great idea because it puts the position out there in a context that even non-drug abusers tend to pay attention to, getting hit in the face with enormous stacks of currency.
posted by prostyle at 2:00 PM on November 6, 2007


Sadly, when it comes to US cannabis laws, the fact of the matter is that the facts don't matter.
posted by Afroblanco at 2:02 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


This weirds me out on so many levels...
posted by Autarky at 2:08 PM on November 6, 2007


I've heard that IRS records are sealed and can't be used by the rest of the government. If that's true, then there is no reason they can't pay taxes. They don't need to say exactly how they made their money.

On the other hand, maybe the IRS does share records now under the new "Homeland Security" banner.

Who knows.
posted by delmoi at 2:10 PM on November 6, 2007


It's a novel idea, but I just don't see drug dealers clamouring to get on board. Nevermind the undesirability of taxes; the end result, legalization, would cut their profits.

From what little I know of drug cultivation and distribution, it seems like there are a lot of inefficiencies built into the system because of the number of middlemen between producer and end user. Legalization might reduce the distribution redundancy enough that it is still profitable for the producer. Plus, defense attorneys and lost income due to prison sentences should probably be factored in.
posted by BrotherCaine at 3:01 PM on November 6, 2007


prostyle: First of all, cites please on this:

To get the tax stamps, you have to have the product in hand.

Second, I wasn't talking about stamps. You can pay whatever the hell taxes you want.

Third, why you such an asshole, dog? You high?
posted by found missing at 3:09 PM on November 6, 2007


Well, I'm the dopeman, yeah boy wear corduroy;
Money up to here, but unemployed.
You keep smoking that dope and my pocket's getting bigger;

Yo, got to give Uncle Sam his action, double up n****!

Yeah, high rollin’, big money, I'm foldin;
IRS on my back, for the bank account, I'm holdin.
Strong Tax Man, jackin’ me so early;
G-man, ya wanna hit? Ya gotta get wait until April.
Well that's my life, that's how it's cut;
“Hey Dopeman!” HR Block, shut the f*** up!
Gotta make a run, it's a big money deal;
Govvies got the 15%, but you can get the real,
From the…

Dopeman! Dopeman!
Yeah, that’s me!
Dopeman! Dopeman!
Yo, can I get a 1099-G?
Dopeman! Dopeman!
Bank as much as he can.

[Void where prohibited by law]
posted by psmealey at 3:29 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


prostyle: First of all, cites please on this:

"Because of this widespread noncompliance, drug tax stamps – unlike so-called “sin taxes” on alcohol or tobacco – do not collect state tax revenue at the customer’s “point of purchase.” Rather, the legislative intent of drug tax laws is to impose an additional penalty – tax evasion – upon drug offenders after they are arrested and criminally charged with a drug violation."

1937 Marihuana Tax Act

"In 1969 in Leary v. United States, this act was found to be unconstitutional since it violated the Fifth Amendment, since a person seeking the tax stamp would have to incriminate him/herself"

Second, I wasn't talking about stamps. You can pay whatever the hell taxes you want.

Third, why you such an asshole, dog? You high?


Are you retarded?
posted by prostyle at 3:49 PM on November 6, 2007


Hemp for Victory becomes Buds for Bombs? Isn't that what our tax dollars really fund?
posted by augustweed at 4:11 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


It seems sort of silly to argue the ins and out of how (or whether) dealers could actually be paying taxes on an illegal substance when this is obviously just a novel way of illustrating the lunacy of maintaining the prohibition of a plant whose product is indisputably less dangerous than our two favorite legal drugs of abuse, has proven medical efficacies, and whose prohibition is insanely costly, does indeed deprive the public of a potentially gigantic source of revenue and is to boot completely ineffective... (checks to see if actual name is still listed in profile...) sorry, I meant to say legalize devil marihuana?! When a single "joint" the new bio-fungineered Super Skunk that all the kids are smoking these days has the carcinogenic potential of a carton of unfiltered menthol cigarettes and the mind-warping capacity to transform a dozen innocent grandmas into homicidal killing machines?

Sorry, was somebody making a stupid argument about the legalization of weed? Carry on.
posted by nanojath at 4:14 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


prostyle: You provided evidence that you *don't* need to incriminate yourself to pay the tax, b/c to do so is unconstitutional. Learn your history And, really, why the personal attacks?
posted by found missing at 4:16 PM on November 6, 2007


I posted this in an earlier thread, and it seems like it might be appropriate here as well. If the article is to be believed, we are currently spending about $42 billion dollars a year on keeping marijuana illegal.

This is not counting any additional money that would be brought in by taxing it.

Considering the financial pit our country is precariously standing on the edge of, I think that it should behoove our nation to rethink our stance on this issue.

Disclosure: I haven't touched the stuff in 15 years, I just hate that we criminalized a fucking weed (and a one with beneficial properties, at that.)
posted by quin at 4:26 PM on November 6, 2007


Good thing you put "US" in there, since all other countries have perfectly sensible drug laws.

in the general case the US has in fact driven more draconian prohibition in its trading partners / client states.
posted by Heywood Mogroot at 5:17 PM on November 6, 2007


I thought the real reason why they aren't taxing the hell out of marijuana is cuz they can't.

It's a weed. If they made it legal tomorrow, it would be growing EVERYWHERE! Hell, I'd start growing some in my backyard! And I don't even wanna smoke it! I'd let my friends come over and harvest it for me in return for Guinness!

Current economic systems would become irrelevant, and most of the time when someone's on pot, math ain't exactly their best subject y'know whut ah'm sayin'?

The powers that be can't police it now? You think they'd be able to control the buying and selling of it if they made it legal? It's not illegal cuz it's wrong. It's illegal cuz the people in power got no way to make money off it.

Tax a weed? You can't tax a weed! Figuring out how to convince us sheep to buy bottled water was easier! That took CENTURIES to implement!
posted by ZachsMind at 5:24 PM on November 6, 2007 [1 favorite]


Come to think of it, I haven't looked in my backyard in awhile. Afraid to. Lotsa weeds back there. And I ain't no botanist, for all I know there's weeds growing in my backyard right now!

Considering how often I can smell marijuana wafting to my porch from some unknown neighbor (or hell I'm downwind of the Dallas Zoo it could be the lowland gorillas for all I know) someone just has to nonchalantly throw away a roach that wasn't quite finished into someone's backyard and voila! Criminal behavior! Just add rain!

I mean how many times have you rolled a joint and there were still seeds in it? Admit it! Not me of course. Never touch the stuff... (in the past decade or two at any rate)
posted by ZachsMind at 5:30 PM on November 6, 2007


I agree with you, in theory, ZM, but consider that tobacco is a hearty, fairly easy to grow plant as well, and most people still buy their smokes from the shop.

Assuming that it became legal, sure, there will always be hobbyists that will go the hydroponic route, but for most people, I think the convince of store-bought would trump all else.
posted by quin at 5:34 PM on November 6, 2007


I had some of these tax stamps once, as a kid. Cop parents and all.
posted by Espoo2 at 5:58 PM on November 6, 2007


I have a one ounce stamp (state of Arizona) that came with a bag of pot bought in the parking lot during the super bowl a few years ago. client gave it to me said the cops were keeping people in line to buy the pot, NPR reported that the cops were arresting people,client reported the taxed substance was very skunky,all I got was the stamp.
posted by hortense at 6:30 PM on November 6, 2007


I've heard that IRS records are sealed and can't be used by the rest of the government.

Hi, meet USAPATRIOT.
posted by davelog at 6:45 PM on November 6, 2007


I know I have read legislation or proposed legislation that would have forced drug dealers to pay taxes. I just can't remember where at the moment, but basically it was setting up a damned if you, damned it you don't scenario. They knew none of them would pay taxes and then the IRS could go after them Al Capone style.
posted by whoaali at 8:20 PM on November 6, 2007


"The authorities in Arizona arrested a fellow who was selling marijuana, and he had a license and had put the tax stamps on his "product". A judge decided that if the state sold him a license, they shouldn't arrest him for selling the product so licensed. So he dismissed the charges against the fellow. The last I heard, the state had appealed and the case was still wending its way through court. Personally, I think the fellow is going to eventually end up in jail, but in the meantime, suddenly the license and the stamps are very popular. So popular, that they have sold out the original stamps and printed a new edition." (from my link above) the 'fellow' was selling pot at the Super Bowl news reports on NPR claimed people were being arrested for possession but that was not the case according to my client.
posted by hortense at 10:17 PM on November 6, 2007


I posted this mostly because I liked the uniqueness of the URL, "letuspaytaxes.com". I mean, how many other short, pithy phrases are there that are not too likely to be picked up by anyone for a domain name, yet are easy to remember in a "dog bites man" kinda way. davejay, thanks for noticing, I shoulda said "shorter, pithier, more contrarian" in my link.
posted by telstar at 8:58 PM on November 7, 2007


"...and then the IRS could go after them Al Capone style."

IF that was the case, y'know what that boils down to? Soon after Capone was put away for tax evasion, prohibition of alcohol was lifted. It means they're losing their little war on drugs, if they have to resort to tax evasion as a deterrent. It means there is no deterrent. Nothing is stopping it.

Of course, if Ron and Nancy Reagan had read history before launching into this War on Drugs, they woulda known how pointless it all was going to be. Twenty or thirty years of sound and fury signifying nothing. Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

I love America.
posted by ZachsMind at 8:59 PM on November 8, 2007




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