3 decade subprime mortgage timeline
September 16, 2008 9:14 PM Subscribe
Redlining led to the CRA
which led to attempted fixes to the CRA (via revamping Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae as reported in the New York Times)
which led to ABX tranches
which you can find the current value of here
which led to attempted fixes to the CRA (via revamping Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae as reported in the New York Times)
which led to ABX tranches
which you can find the current value of here
This post was deleted for the following reason: Hmm. not really a good post for metafilter. -- vacapinta
Well, if you are going to point fingers, I think you have an agenda that you are not being 100% honest about.
I don't have a horse in this race since I am a) British and b) living in Canada but when I saw this link being made elsewhere earlier today I did have to wonder who might have a vested interest in trying to link anti-racism legislation and the current financial crisis. It seems pretty despicable, if you want my $0.02.
posted by pascal at 10:11 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
I don't have a horse in this race since I am a) British and b) living in Canada but when I saw this link being made elsewhere earlier today I did have to wonder who might have a vested interest in trying to link anti-racism legislation and the current financial crisis. It seems pretty despicable, if you want my $0.02.
posted by pascal at 10:11 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
I love that you posted this late during a night when there are lots of other active threads on related subjects, then came back 45 minutes later and complained that no one was discussing your post.
posted by Science! at 10:14 PM on September 16, 2008
posted by Science! at 10:14 PM on September 16, 2008
"Defenders of CRA disagree, pointing out that half of all subprime loans were made by institutions that are not subject to CRA and another substantial share of subprime loans were made by subsidiaries of banks that do not fully come under CRA. They estimate that the substantial number of riskier loans banks were forced to accept by CRA were not enough to be a problem.[6]"
discuss?
posted by youthenrage at 10:17 PM on September 16, 2008
discuss?
posted by youthenrage at 10:17 PM on September 16, 2008
There's a very big difference between:
1) Not being allowed to exclude entire neighbourhoods from credit, and
2) Giving mortgages to people with nothing to their name.
It's as if, when forbidden from hiring only whites, a business hired the first black person they saw walking by and shouted "He's not qualified! Look what your policies made me do!!!1"
posted by Lemurrhea at 10:26 PM on September 16, 2008
1) Not being allowed to exclude entire neighbourhoods from credit, and
2) Giving mortgages to people with nothing to their name.
It's as if, when forbidden from hiring only whites, a business hired the first black person they saw walking by and shouted "He's not qualified! Look what your policies made me do!!!1"
posted by Lemurrhea at 10:26 PM on September 16, 2008
There's no discussion because no-one can tell what the fuck you're talking about. You wanted to post "If Carter and Clinton hadn't made banks loan money to niggers we wouldn't be in this pickle" but you knew that would get deleted, right? Anyway, independent mortgage lenders, who've made the bulk of the high-risk loans, aren't subject to the CRA, so your silly FreeRepublic "timeline" doesn't hold together. Please pick a hobby you're better at, you'll be happier and so will we.
posted by nicwolff at 10:39 PM on September 16, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by nicwolff at 10:39 PM on September 16, 2008 [2 favorites]
Dispute this:
Bill Clinton altered CRA, for whatever reason. I would say he did it to buy votes.
Bush tried to fix FRE and FNM years ago and was shot down by Democrats, Barney Frank's quote included above.
Here's the way I see it.
Democrats - won't blame this on Bush before the election because they don't want to be caught in a lie.
Republicans - won't blame this on anyone because the truth (Democrats fucked up) is so hard to explain that it *seems* like a lie. Also they're getting so much mileage from the current press(beating up a hockey mom), why turn the tide?
posted by Rafaelloello at 10:47 PM on September 16, 2008
Bill Clinton altered CRA, for whatever reason. I would say he did it to buy votes.
Bush tried to fix FRE and FNM years ago and was shot down by Democrats, Barney Frank's quote included above.
Here's the way I see it.
Democrats - won't blame this on Bush before the election because they don't want to be caught in a lie.
Republicans - won't blame this on anyone because the truth (Democrats fucked up) is so hard to explain that it *seems* like a lie. Also they're getting so much mileage from the current press(beating up a hockey mom), why turn the
posted by Rafaelloello at 10:47 PM on September 16, 2008
"Republicans - won't blame this on anyone because the truth (Democrats fucked up) is so hard to explain that it *seems* like a lie."
Are we talking about the same Republicans?
posted by youthenrage at 10:57 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
Are we talking about the same Republicans?
posted by youthenrage at 10:57 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
I love that you posted this late during a night when there are lots of other active threads on related subjects
Hell, I had to make my first two outside links appear to be anti-Bush just so Jessamyn didn't delete this in the first five minutes.
Whoops, countdown to this being a deleted thread. I would guess another 10 minutes.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:02 PM on September 16, 2008
Hell, I had to make my first two outside links appear to be anti-Bush just so Jessamyn didn't delete this in the first five minutes.
Whoops, countdown to this being a deleted thread. I would guess another 10 minutes.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:02 PM on September 16, 2008
Rafaelloello: Are you an ornithopter?
posted by boo_radley at 11:13 PM on September 16, 2008 [2 favorites]
posted by boo_radley at 11:13 PM on September 16, 2008 [2 favorites]
Hell, I had to make my first two outside links appear to be anti-Bush just so Jessamyn didn't delete this in the first five minutes.
I've applied the same logic to many timelines.
posted by carsonb at 11:18 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
I've applied the same logic to many timelines.
posted by carsonb at 11:18 PM on September 16, 2008 [1 favorite]
Rafaelloello: Are you an ornithopter?
I *guess* you got me. Not being the sharpest tool in the shed, I don't know what that means. That might explain why I've been a registered Democrat since 1978 but I always seem to vote Republican in presidential elections. Guess I'm just an idiot. Good thing there aren't any others out there like me.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:19 PM on September 16, 2008
I *guess* you got me. Not being the sharpest tool in the shed, I don't know what that means. That might explain why I've been a registered Democrat since 1978 but I always seem to vote Republican in presidential elections. Guess I'm just an idiot. Good thing there aren't any others out there like me.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:19 PM on September 16, 2008
and honestly, why would you be so hostile about moderation before it happens?
posted by boo_radley at 11:19 PM on September 16, 2008
posted by boo_radley at 11:19 PM on September 16, 2008
Rafaelloello, you exhibit primary characteristics of the defensive Freeper. Please stop that.
Anyway, none of this explains the empty swaths of Irvine.
posted by dhartung at 11:29 PM on September 16, 2008
Anyway, none of this explains the empty swaths of Irvine.
posted by dhartung at 11:29 PM on September 16, 2008
Seriously. Whatever loosely documented point you're trying to make is being drowned out by this whole you-versus-the-mods thing. That and your loud, repeated assertions that you're "not the sharpest tool in the shed." (You said that already, and at least then you added an evil laugh.) Aggressive, faux-victimized perseveration does not engender friendly discussion.
posted by lumensimus at 11:34 PM on September 16, 2008
posted by lumensimus at 11:34 PM on September 16, 2008
Rafaelloello, you exhibit primary characteristics of the defensive Freeper. Please stop that.
Anyway, none of this explains the empty swaths of Irvine.
I have no idea what any of the above sentences mean. I admit to being very dim.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:37 PM on September 16, 2008
Anyway, none of this explains the empty swaths of Irvine.
I have no idea what any of the above sentences mean. I admit to being very dim.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:37 PM on September 16, 2008
That's closer to what I was trying to say: spoiling for a fight is pretty off-putting.
posted by boo_radley at 11:37 PM on September 16, 2008
posted by boo_radley at 11:37 PM on September 16, 2008
Seriously. Whatever loosely documented point you're trying to make is being drowned out by this whole you-versus-the-mods thing. That and your loud, repeated assertions that you're "not the sharpest tool in the shed." (You said that already, and at least then you added an evil laugh.) Aggressive, faux-victimized perseveration does not engender friendly discussion.
Sorry, really way over my head. Some of this is french, right?
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:40 PM on September 16, 2008
Sorry, really way over my head. Some of this is french, right?
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:40 PM on September 16, 2008
Actually I'm hoping the mods leave this post up. The vast indifference you're hearing speaks far louder than deleting this mess ever would.
Train harder.
posted by tkolar at 11:41 PM on September 16, 2008
Train harder.
posted by tkolar at 11:41 PM on September 16, 2008
Actually I'm hoping the mods leave this post up. The vast indifference you're hearing speaks far louder than deleting this mess ever would.
Train harder.
Thank you for the encouragement. I understood every word.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:45 PM on September 16, 2008
Train harder.
Thank you for the encouragement. I understood every word.
posted by Rafaelloello at 11:45 PM on September 16, 2008
Democrats market, they do nothing else.
Sort of like goggles?
I cannot parse that sentence. Can someone please tell me where the apostrophes, verbs, or paragraphs that are presumably missing from it are supposed to go?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:46 PM on September 16, 2008
Sort of like goggles?
I cannot parse that sentence. Can someone please tell me where the apostrophes, verbs, or paragraphs that are presumably missing from it are supposed to go?
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:46 PM on September 16, 2008
Oh wait, I get it now.
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:49 PM on September 16, 2008
posted by Alvy Ampersand at 11:49 PM on September 16, 2008
"Dispute this": Independent mortgage lenders, who've made the bulk of the high-risk loans, aren't subject to the CRA; therefore, the CRA and the fixes to it aren't responsible for the popularity of the subprime-default swaps and have little to do with the current cascading collapse of the risk dealers.
If you really think the Democrats aren't going to (quite accurately) blame Bush and McCain's deregulatory policies for this, you should revise your opinion of your intelligence: you may be dimmer than you think.
posted by nicwolff at 11:50 PM on September 16, 2008
If you really think the Democrats aren't going to (quite accurately) blame Bush and McCain's deregulatory policies for this, you should revise your opinion of your intelligence: you may be dimmer than you think.
posted by nicwolff at 11:50 PM on September 16, 2008
nicwolff:If Carter and Clinton hadn't made banks loan money to niggers we wouldn't be in this pickle
Sorry Nick, I may be severely lacking in my ability to express myself, but this is nowhere near what I was attempting to convey.
Simply put, banks were put under pressure to "fairly" accomodate their service areas. This led to two new markets, one in front of them (brokers), one behind them (buyers of CDOs).
Banks bought up "nasty" mortgages from brokers to accomodate regulators(and stay in business) and accumulate "CRA points" and quickly sold these loans packaged with good loans on up the line to the new upstream market that suddenly arose.
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:10 AM on September 17, 2008
Sorry Nick, I may be severely lacking in my ability to express myself, but this is nowhere near what I was attempting to convey.
Simply put, banks were put under pressure to "fairly" accomodate their service areas. This led to two new markets, one in front of them (brokers), one behind them (buyers of CDOs).
Banks bought up "nasty" mortgages from brokers to accomodate regulators(and stay in business) and accumulate "CRA points" and quickly sold these loans packaged with good loans on up the line to the new upstream market that suddenly arose.
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:10 AM on September 17, 2008
If you really think the Democrats aren't going to (quite accurately) blame Bush and McCain's deregulatory policies for this, you should revise your opinion of your intelligence: you may be dimmer than you think.
Perhaps you missed the link in my original post from FIVE YEARS AGO AS REPORTED IN THE NEW YORK TIMES (maybe you've heard of it?):
READ THIS
To quote DEMOCRAT Barney Frank from this article:
'These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''
Five years ago, dickweed.
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:18 AM on September 17, 2008
Perhaps you missed the link in my original post from FIVE YEARS AGO AS REPORTED IN THE NEW YORK TIMES (maybe you've heard of it?):
READ THIS
To quote DEMOCRAT Barney Frank from this article:
'These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''
Five years ago, dickweed.
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:18 AM on September 17, 2008
dickweed
French?
"Ze weed, it is like ze penis!"
posted by humannaire at 12:28 AM on September 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
French?
"Ze weed, it is like ze penis!"
posted by humannaire at 12:28 AM on September 17, 2008 [1 favorite]
"Ze weed, it is like ze penis!"
End scene.
Great work guys.
That's a wrap;-)
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:35 AM on September 17, 2008
End scene.
Great work guys.
That's a wrap;-)
posted by Rafaelloello at 12:35 AM on September 17, 2008
Discussion is cool; name-calling on either side ("you may be dimmer than you think" and "dickweed") is not.
Not that fighty behavior didn't doom this post from the beginning -- the poster essentially walked into a pub at midnight, sat at an empty table, blurted out something about subprime mortgages, scorned the pub management and clientele because people didn't immediately abandon their conversations at other tables to sit and chat with him, and then dared management to kick him out -- but name-calling never helps.
posted by pracowity at 12:52 AM on September 17, 2008
Not that fighty behavior didn't doom this post from the beginning -- the poster essentially walked into a pub at midnight, sat at an empty table, blurted out something about subprime mortgages, scorned the pub management and clientele because people didn't immediately abandon their conversations at other tables to sit and chat with him, and then dared management to kick him out -- but name-calling never helps.
posted by pracowity at 12:52 AM on September 17, 2008
I knew those nigger-loving New Deal Democrats had to be responsible for this mess. I just knew.
posted by [expletive deleted] at 1:27 AM on September 17, 2008
posted by [expletive deleted] at 1:27 AM on September 17, 2008
Right, five years ago, just before Bush relaxed enforcement of regulation on subprime lenders, and just before high-risk lending went though the roof. Thanks for proving my point... dickweed.
In 1980, Reagan and the Republican Congress enacted the DIDMCA and abolished the limits on interest rates that had made high-risk loans unfeasible. In 1982 they enacted the AMTPA and made adjustable-rate and interest-only mortgages legal. In 1986 they enacted the Tax Reform Act which made consumer debt taxable while leaving home-equity loans deductible. In 2000 McCain's pal Phil Gramm snuck through the Commodity Futures Modernization Act, which deregulated derivative trading. In 2005 the Republican Congress enacted the "Responsible Lending Act" (quotes for irony), which actually rolled back protections for homeowners from predatory high-fee loans.
There's your timeline.
posted by nicwolff at 1:29 AM on September 17, 2008 [4 favorites]
In 1980, Reagan and the Republican Congress enacted the DIDMCA and abolished the limits on interest rates that had made high-risk loans unfeasible. In 1982 they enacted the AMTPA and made adjustable-rate and interest-only mortgages legal. In 1986 they enacted the Tax Reform Act which made consumer debt taxable while leaving home-equity loans deductible. In 2000 McCain's pal Phil Gramm snuck through the Commodity Futures Modernization Act, which deregulated derivative trading. In 2005 the Republican Congress enacted the "Responsible Lending Act" (quotes for irony), which actually rolled back protections for homeowners from predatory high-fee loans.
There's your timeline.
posted by nicwolff at 1:29 AM on September 17, 2008 [4 favorites]
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No discussion == huge agenda
Democrats market, they do nothing else.
posted by Rafaelloello at 9:57 PM on September 16, 2008