"Stupiest thing EVA"
December 2, 2010 5:27 AM Subscribe
User reviews in app stores are notorious for their high percentage of uselessness. Users downrate when none of the windows of an Advent Calendar app open in mid-November and a dog to human translator doesn't actually translate their dog's barking.
Frustratingly app developers often can't respond to the complaint directly. There have been several efforts to improve the usefulness of user reviews. Marco Arment (Instapaper) has rated the most common words unique to 1-star and 5-star App Store reviews. And in Israel, scientists have worked out an algorithm to identify sarcasm in user reviews.
Frustratingly app developers often can't respond to the complaint directly. There have been several efforts to improve the usefulness of user reviews. Marco Arment (Instapaper) has rated the most common words unique to 1-star and 5-star App Store reviews. And in Israel, scientists have worked out an algorithm to identify sarcasm in user reviews.
Why not do what amazon does? Allow users to mark whether reviews are helpful or not, and just downgrade the impact of an unhelpful review? I mean, anyone who actually thinks that we've learned how to decipher dog speak shouldn't have the power to impact the sales of an item, let alone handle sharp implements.
posted by crunchland at 5:34 AM on December 2, 2010 [19 favorites]
posted by crunchland at 5:34 AM on December 2, 2010 [19 favorites]
More than any other adjective, reviewers condemn apps they don’t like as “useless”. Subjectively, I usually see this in contexts in which the app doesn’t have a minor feature that the reviewer wants, or where it doesn’t perform well in a rare use-case, so the reviewer unfairly declares the app “useless”.
"Minor" and "rare" for whom? If I download an app because I believe it will do X and it doesn't, then that app is useless (to me), regardless of how "minor" or "rare" X may be to anyone else.
But even if the case where I need X is rare, I might still want it. Does the infrequency of car crashes mean that seatbelts are a feature rarely used and therefore omittable? Less dramatically, there are plenty of things for which the "rare" use is exactly why I want the tool. Unrare things I can remember to do myself or have many tools that already cover, it's the rare ones I need help with.
posted by DU at 5:34 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
"Minor" and "rare" for whom? If I download an app because I believe it will do X and it doesn't, then that app is useless (to me), regardless of how "minor" or "rare" X may be to anyone else.
But even if the case where I need X is rare, I might still want it. Does the infrequency of car crashes mean that seatbelts are a feature rarely used and therefore omittable? Less dramatically, there are plenty of things for which the "rare" use is exactly why I want the tool. Unrare things I can remember to do myself or have many tools that already cover, it's the rare ones I need help with.
posted by DU at 5:34 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
The sarcastic phrases from the pool of Amazon reviews used for the research included "Great for insomniacs", "Are these iPods designed to die after two years?" and "Defective by design".
That's not sarcastic, just critical. Defective by Design.
posted by DU at 5:37 AM on December 2, 2010
That's not sarcastic, just critical. Defective by Design.
posted by DU at 5:37 AM on December 2, 2010
"I have soiled myself. How embarrassing."
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:49 AM on December 2, 2010 [13 favorites]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:49 AM on December 2, 2010 [13 favorites]
Yeah, just making a Simpsons reference. One that's apparently not far off.
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:53 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 5:53 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
This seems like a good thread to note that the official Google Voice app is terrible. Huge load times, constant freezing and crashing. The non-free GV Connect is much, much better.
posted by adamdschneider at 5:54 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by adamdschneider at 5:54 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Greg Nog: " "HA HA, POOP CAME OUT OF ME, HOW ABOUT THAT, DAMN""
And in my experience, it would be sometimes followed by "Hm, it still smells like food.."
posted by Plutor at 5:55 AM on December 2, 2010 [4 favorites]
And in my experience, it would be sometimes followed by "Hm, it still smells like food.."
posted by Plutor at 5:55 AM on December 2, 2010 [4 favorites]
I noticed this phenomenon when I was looking at getting the RedEye remote for my iPhone. For those not familiar with it the RedEye is an IR remote that you control via your iDevice. The software is free but the hardware costs about $180. I looked at reviews in the app store but they were full of complaints from people who downloaded the software and were angry that it didn't work without the actual IR emitter. I am not sure why they thought one would work without the other and why they got so angry about something they didn't pay for in the first place.
posted by TedW at 6:03 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by TedW at 6:03 AM on December 2, 2010
"HA HA, POOP CAME OUT OF ME, HOW ABOUT THAT, DAMN"
Or possibly: "I HAVE LEFT YOU A PRESENT IN YOUR SLIPPERS! IT WAS OH SO WARM FIVE HOURS AGO. I DO HOPE YOU LIKE IT."
Stupid dogs.
posted by Ghidorah at 6:06 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Or possibly: "I HAVE LEFT YOU A PRESENT IN YOUR SLIPPERS! IT WAS OH SO WARM FIVE HOURS AGO. I DO HOPE YOU LIKE IT."
Stupid dogs.
posted by Ghidorah at 6:06 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
User reviews are one of those aspects of the Miracle of the Internet that haven't worked out as well in practice as, erm, whoever added them to everything might have hoped when first adding them.
Even when all of the reviews are by reasonable, non-moronic people, you can't always get much out of them. I was researching a new coffee maker a while back, and was initially confused when I was seeing crappy $30 Hamilton Beach coffee makers getting 5-star ratings, while $250 Technivorms for hardcore aficionados were getting 3-star ratings.
What I realized is that someone buying a cheapo coffee maker had much different expectations for it than a coffee connoisseur splashing out 8 times as much; if it meets their much lower expectations, yay, 5 stars.
The App Store was initially plagued by the fact that anybody could review an app—not just people who downloaded it; they fixed that, but then they asked for ratings when you deleted an app, which obviously skewed the ratings toward people who didn't like the app. They recently fixed that too. Still doesn't do anything to solve the rampant moron problem in our society.
posted by adamrice at 6:10 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
Even when all of the reviews are by reasonable, non-moronic people, you can't always get much out of them. I was researching a new coffee maker a while back, and was initially confused when I was seeing crappy $30 Hamilton Beach coffee makers getting 5-star ratings, while $250 Technivorms for hardcore aficionados were getting 3-star ratings.
What I realized is that someone buying a cheapo coffee maker had much different expectations for it than a coffee connoisseur splashing out 8 times as much; if it meets their much lower expectations, yay, 5 stars.
The App Store was initially plagued by the fact that anybody could review an app—not just people who downloaded it; they fixed that, but then they asked for ratings when you deleted an app, which obviously skewed the ratings toward people who didn't like the app. They recently fixed that too. Still doesn't do anything to solve the rampant moron problem in our society.
posted by adamrice at 6:10 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
rampant moron
"Lord Pickenflick, we at the College of Heralds have been meaning to speak with you regarding your family's coat of arms for some time..."
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [45 favorites]
"Lord Pickenflick, we at the College of Heralds have been meaning to speak with you regarding your family's coat of arms for some time..."
posted by robocop is bleeding at 6:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [45 favorites]
Oddly enough, user reviews seem to work really well on sites like TripAdvisor (yeah, there have been complaints about faked user comments and bad business practices, and of course you get the notorious complainers. But on the whole it's fairly easy to filter out what you need to know by reading the reviews.
App store reviews and Amazon reviews mostly just leave me more confused.
posted by Omnomnom at 6:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
App store reviews and Amazon reviews mostly just leave me more confused.
posted by Omnomnom at 6:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
...was initially confused when I was seeing crappy $30 Hamilton Beach coffee makers getting 5-star ratings, while $250 Technivorms for hardcore aficionados were getting 3-star ratings.
What I realized is that someone buying a cheapo coffee maker had much different expectations for it than a coffee connoisseur splashing out 8 times as much; if it meets their much lower expectations, yay, 5 stars.
This is not really an Internet Problem. If you asked your friends what they thought of their coffee maker and they told you "3 on a scale of 10" you still wouldn't really know how it would work for you. The problem here is the seeming objectivity of the numbers to represent the actual subjectivity of the rating.
You need to read the text (or in IRL, listen to the story). And from multiple sources to get a better feel what A Statistically Generic Person would think of it.
posted by DU at 6:21 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
What I realized is that someone buying a cheapo coffee maker had much different expectations for it than a coffee connoisseur splashing out 8 times as much; if it meets their much lower expectations, yay, 5 stars.
This is not really an Internet Problem. If you asked your friends what they thought of their coffee maker and they told you "3 on a scale of 10" you still wouldn't really know how it would work for you. The problem here is the seeming objectivity of the numbers to represent the actual subjectivity of the rating.
You need to read the text (or in IRL, listen to the story). And from multiple sources to get a better feel what A Statistically Generic Person would think of it.
posted by DU at 6:21 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Unfortunately the user review problem extends to where it really counts: Restaurants.
"The waitstaff looked foreign and my boyfriend's grown distant, D- don't ever eat here!"
posted by 2bucksplus at 6:22 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
"The waitstaff looked foreign and my boyfriend's grown distant, D- don't ever eat here!"
posted by 2bucksplus at 6:22 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
Everyone knows the default stance for a moron is trippant.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 6:24 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 6:24 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
My favorite one star reviews were for a now-unlocatable, enterprise level security camera product that cost around $500. People were absolutely furious that clicking the purchase button would, in fact, cause them to buy this app, apparently both Apple and the developer should've known they only clicked that "just to see what would happen."
posted by dantsea at 6:28 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
posted by dantsea at 6:28 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
I have found that if you take the time to read them, typically you can get the information you really want.
I have a bluetooth head phones that I use with my PC (which you can experience in all their glory via the MeFight club's TF2 or L4D2 servers). When I was first looking at them, I spent a bit of time going through the reviews and ignoring all of the ones where the person didn't get that bluetooth didn't have the same range as WiFi, or that they were a bit less high fidelity than a similarly priced directly wired headphones. Ultimately everything I wanted to know about what they would (and wouldn't do) and what it would take to get them to work with my PC was in there, it just wasn't expressed as a number from one to five.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 6:33 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
I have a bluetooth head phones that I use with my PC (which you can experience in all their glory via the MeFight club's TF2 or L4D2 servers). When I was first looking at them, I spent a bit of time going through the reviews and ignoring all of the ones where the person didn't get that bluetooth didn't have the same range as WiFi, or that they were a bit less high fidelity than a similarly priced directly wired headphones. Ultimately everything I wanted to know about what they would (and wouldn't do) and what it would take to get them to work with my PC was in there, it just wasn't expressed as a number from one to five.
posted by Kid Charlemagne at 6:33 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
> "Minor" and "rare" for whom? If I download an app because I believe it will do X and it doesn't, then that app is useless (to me), regardless of how "minor" or "rare" X may be to anyone else.
The challenge in this case comes from trying to force people to preemptively RTFM; it's not the developer's fault that the user failed to understand, but the developer suffers the brunt of the user's misunderstanding.
Something that Amazon does right - it's subtle, but valuable - is allow other users to rank reviews. Amazon's system is still highly gameable, but it raises the bar significantly for products for which there's not enough emotional or financial value at stake to launch a coordinated effort. Reviews where the user demonstrates clear misunderstanding tend to not rank well.
I'm not an iOS developer, but as a customer I would definitely like something like that in the iTunes store, because user reviews tend not to be much of an improvement over YouTube comments.
posted by ardgedee at 6:41 AM on December 2, 2010
The challenge in this case comes from trying to force people to preemptively RTFM; it's not the developer's fault that the user failed to understand, but the developer suffers the brunt of the user's misunderstanding.
Something that Amazon does right - it's subtle, but valuable - is allow other users to rank reviews. Amazon's system is still highly gameable, but it raises the bar significantly for products for which there's not enough emotional or financial value at stake to launch a coordinated effort. Reviews where the user demonstrates clear misunderstanding tend to not rank well.
I'm not an iOS developer, but as a customer I would definitely like something like that in the iTunes store, because user reviews tend not to be much of an improvement over YouTube comments.
posted by ardgedee at 6:41 AM on December 2, 2010
Smart phones = Dumb people
posted by ReeMonster at 6:42 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by ReeMonster at 6:42 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I have found that if you take the time to read them, typically you can get the information you really want.
This has pretty much been my experience with online reviews everywhere. Especially movies. "If you're as big a fan of CGI animals singing today's pop hits, you'll love The Chipmunks movie!"
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 6:42 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
This has pretty much been my experience with online reviews everywhere. Especially movies. "If you're as big a fan of CGI animals singing today's pop hits, you'll love The Chipmunks movie!"
posted by Marisa Stole the Precious Thing at 6:42 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
The flipside is also true... if you like an app and get good use out of it, then leave a good review for it. It helps offset the idiot reviews, and the developer will really appreciate it. :)
posted by kira at 6:44 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
posted by kira at 6:44 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
It's rather easy to screw this up too. Before iOS 4, when you deleted an app, it invited you to rate it. There was no other prompt to rate an app in the OS. So that drives average ratings down, especially with a lot of 1 star ratings for "crashes on launch". Enough of a problem that apps themselves started prompting their users to rate them. Some of which prompts had bugs that caused them to prompt the users incessantly. Which then lead to lower ratings. Fun!
posted by smackfu at 6:45 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by smackfu at 6:45 AM on December 2, 2010
I have found that if you take the time to read them, typically you can get the information you really want.
When I look at the reviews, they always end up being stuff like "This app is brilliant and has everything I need!!! Well done!!!!" or "Utter crap crapped out on me the very first time. This suxx". I mean, they all seem to disagree.
posted by Omnomnom at 6:46 AM on December 2, 2010
When I look at the reviews, they always end up being stuff like "This app is brilliant and has everything I need!!! Well done!!!!" or "Utter crap crapped out on me the very first time. This suxx". I mean, they all seem to disagree.
posted by Omnomnom at 6:46 AM on December 2, 2010
Omnomnom, I came here to say the same thing.
I feel like there are just as many shill reviews saying "OMG I CANNOT LIVE W/O THIS APP" as there are people saying "This app crashes every time I open it."
And honestly, I tend to listen more to the naysayers than the hopeless goody-goodies.
Case in point. I recently downloaded the How Stuff Works app for my iPhone. I started listening to a podcast and couldn't finish it in one sitting so I paused it and even noted how far I had listened in case the pause didn't work. Well, I came back to it later in the day and found out I had to listen to the whole thing again. The "fast forward" function did not work. If you don't listen to a podcast in its entirety, you must listen to the whole thing again before continuing on.
I went to the app store to "report a bug" and to leave feedback for the app. A few people had mentioned the problem I came to report but the vast majority said they loved the app and were so happy for it...and some even went on to tell the "complainers" to shut up—it's a free app after all!
posted by morganannie at 7:11 AM on December 2, 2010
I feel like there are just as many shill reviews saying "OMG I CANNOT LIVE W/O THIS APP" as there are people saying "This app crashes every time I open it."
And honestly, I tend to listen more to the naysayers than the hopeless goody-goodies.
Case in point. I recently downloaded the How Stuff Works app for my iPhone. I started listening to a podcast and couldn't finish it in one sitting so I paused it and even noted how far I had listened in case the pause didn't work. Well, I came back to it later in the day and found out I had to listen to the whole thing again. The "fast forward" function did not work. If you don't listen to a podcast in its entirety, you must listen to the whole thing again before continuing on.
I went to the app store to "report a bug" and to leave feedback for the app. A few people had mentioned the problem I came to report but the vast majority said they loved the app and were so happy for it...and some even went on to tell the "complainers" to shut up—it's a free app after all!
posted by morganannie at 7:11 AM on December 2, 2010
Also, I got a good chuckle out of "Stupiest thing EVA". I'm sure you spelled that wrong on purpose but if you didn't, it's even more funny because that is just the kind of thing I see all the time in app store reviews.
posted by morganannie at 7:15 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by morganannie at 7:15 AM on December 2, 2010
Is there a name for the effect where people only leave reviews if things are really really lifechangingly good, or soulsuckingly bad? No one leaves a "good, but not great" review.
posted by 2bucksplus at 7:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by 2bucksplus at 7:15 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
2bucksplus, funny you mention "good not great". I think those were my exact words for the How Stuff Works app.
posted by morganannie at 7:20 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by morganannie at 7:20 AM on December 2, 2010
Pony request: can we install the sarcasm filter here?
They already have. It's doing a great job of making sure nothing else gets through.
posted by clarknova at 7:22 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
They already have. It's doing a great job of making sure nothing else gets through.
posted by clarknova at 7:22 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
I am now thinking on creating a dog translation app which actually does work.
Whenever your dog barks, it translates it as: HEY!
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 7:24 AM on December 2, 2010 [18 favorites]
Whenever your dog barks, it translates it as: HEY!
posted by FAMOUS MONSTER at 7:24 AM on December 2, 2010 [18 favorites]
The reviews that get me are the ones that say "where's my update for this two-week old app I paid $.99 for?" As with my freelance clients, it's the people with the smallest budgets who have the most demands.
posted by Trace McJoy at 7:28 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by Trace McJoy at 7:28 AM on December 2, 2010
Everything is amazing and no one is happy, Greg Nog.
posted by Scoo at 7:29 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
posted by Scoo at 7:29 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
As others have stated, the numerical/star rating doesn't yield much value, but the text of the reviews are revealing. No one handles this better than Amazon in my opinion. My strategy is to read the 2, 3 and 4 star reviews to weed out the excessively optimistic or pessimistic reviews. Even a low rating that fairly summarizes why the product was a bad fit is useful.
It is a little ironic that virtual commodities like software apps seem to have the least useful review process. I have an innate sense of the value and function of a coffee maker, but software purchases through app stores require a bit more trust concerning the nature of the deliverable.
posted by dgran at 7:40 AM on December 2, 2010
It is a little ironic that virtual commodities like software apps seem to have the least useful review process. I have an innate sense of the value and function of a coffee maker, but software purchases through app stores require a bit more trust concerning the nature of the deliverable.
posted by dgran at 7:40 AM on December 2, 2010
Why not do what amazon does? Allow users to mark whether reviews are helpful or not, and just downgrade the impact of an unhelpful review?
Yeah, but your opinion of what constitutes a good review versus a bad one might be suspect. If you're also an idiot, you might upvote the fools that complained about their dog translator not working. So then you need to build a "trusted reviewer" form of meta-moderation, to say I trust your opinion or You Crazy.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 7:46 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Yeah, but your opinion of what constitutes a good review versus a bad one might be suspect. If you're also an idiot, you might upvote the fools that complained about their dog translator not working. So then you need to build a "trusted reviewer" form of meta-moderation, to say I trust your opinion or You Crazy.
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 7:46 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I was going to download an app - the Gok Wan Style app, if you're wondering - in which you can input your measurements and it will suggest what you can wear. Sounded great for someone my shape who finds a lot of high street clothing won't fit me, and doesn't want to choose between gaping open and failed rapper. Until I read a review that told me that someone bought it, did just that, and none of the suggested outfits even came in her size. I could have wasted £1.49 to find that I have TOO MANY BOOB when I can do that in a changing room for free.
Some clothing sites have reviews, which can be nearly as good as specific garment measurements for me - I can see whether something will be too tight or too short or whether I need to size up or down easily. And sites like MakeUpAlley and Temptalia are a hundred times more useful than fashion magazines. If I want to spend money on make-up, clothing, or equipment, I'll hit the review blogs.
posted by mippy at 8:00 AM on December 2, 2010
Some clothing sites have reviews, which can be nearly as good as specific garment measurements for me - I can see whether something will be too tight or too short or whether I need to size up or down easily. And sites like MakeUpAlley and Temptalia are a hundred times more useful than fashion magazines. If I want to spend money on make-up, clothing, or equipment, I'll hit the review blogs.
posted by mippy at 8:00 AM on December 2, 2010
"Minor" and "rare" for whom? If I download an app because I believe it will do X and it doesn't, then that app is useless (to me), regardless of how "minor" or "rare" X may be to anyone else.
This MetaFilter comment does not work as a calendar app at all!! UTTERLY USELESS!!!! WILL NEVER READ THIS MEFI USER'S COMMENTS AGAIN!!!!!!
I think the point is people don't pay attention to what an app is supposed to do and the rate it badly because it doesn't match their imagined specifications - so a percentage of the "useless" reviews will be meaningless.
Whenever your dog barks, it translates it as: HEY!
Someone got there before you :)
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:09 AM on December 2, 2010
This MetaFilter comment does not work as a calendar app at all!! UTTERLY USELESS!!!! WILL NEVER READ THIS MEFI USER'S COMMENTS AGAIN!!!!!!
I think the point is people don't pay attention to what an app is supposed to do and the rate it badly because it doesn't match their imagined specifications - so a percentage of the "useless" reviews will be meaningless.
Whenever your dog barks, it translates it as: HEY!
Someone got there before you :)
posted by EndsOfInvention at 8:09 AM on December 2, 2010
I look for complete sentences, correct punctuation, and capital letters when I'm looking at reviews. I find that the better written they are, the more useful they tend to be for me. I guess that means I have more in common with other uptight language snobs.
posted by goatdog at 8:16 AM on December 2, 2010 [6 favorites]
posted by goatdog at 8:16 AM on December 2, 2010 [6 favorites]
On this subject, let me just say how much I loathe 99% of the people who leave comments on apps in the Android Market Place. The lion's share of the reviews are either three words long ("I love it" / "I hate it" type stuff) conveying nothing that couldn't be conveyed through the star rating, spam, or malicious diatribes against the developer. Usually over free software.
We have this really weird sense of entitlement with technology now that we have easy access to high-quality free/cheap apps and services. It's like everyone wants to be the plucky blogger who cuts down the developers with just the right snarky turn of phrase. But it's absolutely bizarre to me why anyone thinks that snippy comments and haughty putdowns will somehow shame the developers into doing what they want. I can understand being displeased with a service and wanting it changed, but there's much more productive ways this could be done. And if they're not trying to be coercive with the snark... well, what are they trying to do at all then? Just being a general asshole? That makes even less sense.
Jolicloud (my current OS for my EeePC) announced on facebook that they were delaying the release of version 1.1 by a week to do some final tweaks/testing. Keep in mind that this software is totally free. One of the commenters basically implied that the Jolicloud team were maliciously lying to everyone, for reasons unknown, and threatened to switch back to Ubuntu if they didn't honor their new deadline TO THE LETTER. Shyeah, don't let your outrage hit you on the way out the door, Your Highness.
posted by kryptondog at 8:26 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
We have this really weird sense of entitlement with technology now that we have easy access to high-quality free/cheap apps and services. It's like everyone wants to be the plucky blogger who cuts down the developers with just the right snarky turn of phrase. But it's absolutely bizarre to me why anyone thinks that snippy comments and haughty putdowns will somehow shame the developers into doing what they want. I can understand being displeased with a service and wanting it changed, but there's much more productive ways this could be done. And if they're not trying to be coercive with the snark... well, what are they trying to do at all then? Just being a general asshole? That makes even less sense.
Jolicloud (my current OS for my EeePC) announced on facebook that they were delaying the release of version 1.1 by a week to do some final tweaks/testing. Keep in mind that this software is totally free. One of the commenters basically implied that the Jolicloud team were maliciously lying to everyone, for reasons unknown, and threatened to switch back to Ubuntu if they didn't honor their new deadline TO THE LETTER. Shyeah, don't let your outrage hit you on the way out the door, Your Highness.
posted by kryptondog at 8:26 AM on December 2, 2010 [3 favorites]
Whenever your dog barks, it translates it as: HEY!
This is a Far Side comic.
Speaking of which, I had almost this exact conversation with my roommate's dog last night.
posted by phunniemee at 8:37 AM on December 2, 2010
This is a Far Side comic.
Speaking of which, I had almost this exact conversation with my roommate's dog last night.
posted by phunniemee at 8:37 AM on December 2, 2010
Yeah, but your opinion of what constitutes a good review versus a bad one might be suspect. If you're also an idiot, you might upvote the fools that complained about their dog translator not working. So then you need to build a "trusted reviewer" form of meta-moderation, to say I trust your opinion or You Crazy.
I dunno. If all a product's users are idiots, then the very best thing to upmoderate is a review that is Helpful To Idiots.
If a gazillion people upvoted the "THUMBS DOWN THIS DOES NOT ACTUALLY LET ME CONVERSE WITH MY DOG" review, that would be evidence that the system was working, by taking a review that corrected a widespread idiotic misconception and making it more prominent.
posted by nebulawindphone at 8:38 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I dunno. If all a product's users are idiots, then the very best thing to upmoderate is a review that is Helpful To Idiots.
If a gazillion people upvoted the "THUMBS DOWN THIS DOES NOT ACTUALLY LET ME CONVERSE WITH MY DOG" review, that would be evidence that the system was working, by taking a review that corrected a widespread idiotic misconception and making it more prominent.
posted by nebulawindphone at 8:38 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
This is certainly true on Yelp, where I tend to ignore about 80 percent of any given business's feedback as being obviously people that work there, crazed gripers and folks who are obviously talking about somewhere else.
I actually got burned by this the last time I went to RadioShack, because I ignored the myriad comments that talked about the incredibly poor customer service, then was amazed at how terrible the service was. I thought about going back to Yelp to post "No, this time it's actually true! The RadioShack on Vermont is entirely staffed by assholes and morons and they're not at all apologetic about it!"
posted by klangklangston at 8:47 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
I actually got burned by this the last time I went to RadioShack, because I ignored the myriad comments that talked about the incredibly poor customer service, then was amazed at how terrible the service was. I thought about going back to Yelp to post "No, this time it's actually true! The RadioShack on Vermont is entirely staffed by assholes and morons and they're not at all apologetic about it!"
posted by klangklangston at 8:47 AM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
"And in Israel, scientists have worked out an algorithm to identify sarcasm in user reviews."
And the name of the sarcasm detector is: The Cheney.
posted by rageagainsttherobots at 8:50 AM on December 2, 2010
And the name of the sarcasm detector is: The Cheney.
posted by rageagainsttherobots at 8:50 AM on December 2, 2010
★★★☆☆
I'd give this thread a better rating but there is too much whining for me to really like it. Also it needs more jokes about dogs, and there is no way to make the page switch to portrait mode when I put my laptop on its side so that is definitely a problem here.
posted by caution live frogs at 8:53 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
I'd give this thread a better rating but there is too much whining for me to really like it. Also it needs more jokes about dogs, and there is no way to make the page switch to portrait mode when I put my laptop on its side so that is definitely a problem here.
posted by caution live frogs at 8:53 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]
It also doesn't help when the developers themselves get accounts to say good things about their app to help bump it up on the ratings list. I've resigned to mostly look at actual reviews from 3rd party sites to get a good idea on an app before spending the money.
posted by samsara at 8:55 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by samsara at 8:55 AM on December 2, 2010
Yeah, but your opinion of what constitutes a good review versus a bad one might be suspect. --- That's where the aggregate of the masses comes in. On amazon, you get to see a review has gotten "3 out of 147 helpful votes" or some such. With a skew like that, it's reasonable to expect that the three who voted it up are idiots or friends of the reviewer, or perhaps sockpuppets. Likewise when you see "142 out of 147."
posted by crunchland at 9:23 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by crunchland at 9:23 AM on December 2, 2010
So many redundant phrases in this thread... "in app stores", "in our society", "on Vermont"...
posted by roystgnr at 9:28 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by roystgnr at 9:28 AM on December 2, 2010
An actual dog translator would be more like
"HA HA, POOP CAME OUT OF ME, HOW ABOUT THAT, DAMN"
This makes me think that we could use 3-year-olds to give us some insight into dog thoughts. My own 3yo sat on the potty the other day saying pretty much this, except the "damn" part, and then followed it up with: "I eat it?"
posted by not that girl at 9:56 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
"HA HA, POOP CAME OUT OF ME, HOW ABOUT THAT, DAMN"
This makes me think that we could use 3-year-olds to give us some insight into dog thoughts. My own 3yo sat on the potty the other day saying pretty much this, except the "damn" part, and then followed it up with: "I eat it?"
posted by not that girl at 9:56 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
My strategy is to read the 2, 3 and 4 star reviews to weed out the excessively optimistic or pessimistic reviews.
I always read the outliers. Sometimes it's a crank or an idiot ("This children's book about Darwin did not give equal time to Intelligent Design!") but sometimes the only 1-star review in a field of 4s and 5s is that one perceptive person who noticed a flaw that would drive me crazy, too.
posted by not that girl at 10:01 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I always read the outliers. Sometimes it's a crank or an idiot ("This children's book about Darwin did not give equal time to Intelligent Design!") but sometimes the only 1-star review in a field of 4s and 5s is that one perceptive person who noticed a flaw that would drive me crazy, too.
posted by not that girl at 10:01 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Also, amazon reviewers: I don't need a regurgitation of the plot (for movies or books) or for you to list what the product does from the bullet points on the box.
posted by maxwelton at 10:17 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
posted by maxwelton at 10:17 AM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I'm not saying there aren't flaws with Amazon's system. Have you noticed that negative reviews tend to garner more negative votes in terms of "helpfulness" than positive reviews? Not sure why that happens.
posted by crunchland at 10:26 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by crunchland at 10:26 AM on December 2, 2010
When what is being reviewed is useless, the review is useless. Yeah, we're getting plenty of entertaining schadenfreude from the technical foul-ups of the Spiderman Musical, but WHY SHOULD WE CARE?
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:31 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by oneswellfoop at 10:31 AM on December 2, 2010
blah blah blah GINGER, blah blah blah blah GINGER!
posted by not_on_display at 10:42 AM on December 2, 2010
posted by not_on_display at 10:42 AM on December 2, 2010
second goatdog... They should take that sarcasm filter and implement a "can construct proper english sentences" filter instead.
Let's not even talk about ebay ratings:
only A++++++++? oh hellz naw. I'm not buying shit unless it has
A++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ...
posted by stratastar at 10:47 AM on December 2, 2010
Let's not even talk about ebay ratings:
only A++++++++? oh hellz naw. I'm not buying shit unless it has
A++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ...
posted by stratastar at 10:47 AM on December 2, 2010
There's this weird thing that happens in online reviews (and I notice it especially in Amazon reviews) where the shipping/delivery/company specific stuff get reviewed in the same space as you would normally review the product and its content/merits/flaws etc.
It conflates two products (Amazon's service versus the item you're actually interested in purchasing) into one review system. Last time I looked something up on Amazon, there were three five-star reviews and all three were saying some variation on 'speedy delivery, product undamaged, great job!' Not a word about the utility of the product itself.
To some extent, this is the fault of the Amazons of the world; it would be very useful to have a dual reviewing system where you could rate the service of the site in a small section of your review of the product.
See, for an extreme example, the user reviews on Lady Gaga's Fame Monster. The three top rated reviews are all debating the (in-)explicit lyrics and this is because the initial reviews all complain about Amazon censoring the lyrics on the cds they shipped out. The reviews are pointing out something useful to know--the lyrics are censored--but it's turned into this cascading feedback loop where the entire group talks about the lyrics and not anything else about the cds.
posted by librarylis at 11:49 AM on December 2, 2010
It conflates two products (Amazon's service versus the item you're actually interested in purchasing) into one review system. Last time I looked something up on Amazon, there were three five-star reviews and all three were saying some variation on 'speedy delivery, product undamaged, great job!' Not a word about the utility of the product itself.
To some extent, this is the fault of the Amazons of the world; it would be very useful to have a dual reviewing system where you could rate the service of the site in a small section of your review of the product.
See, for an extreme example, the user reviews on Lady Gaga's Fame Monster. The three top rated reviews are all debating the (in-)explicit lyrics and this is because the initial reviews all complain about Amazon censoring the lyrics on the cds they shipped out. The reviews are pointing out something useful to know--the lyrics are censored--but it's turned into this cascading feedback loop where the entire group talks about the lyrics and not anything else about the cds.
posted by librarylis at 11:49 AM on December 2, 2010
The problem I have with most reviews is the same as it's been since I started reading film reviews: it matters who the reviewer is, which is why I like professional reviewers. I know that if Tor Thorsen likes a flick, I'll probably like it. If James Laube likes a wine, I probably will too.
The problem with app stores, Yelp!, ChowHound, Amazon, etc., are that the chances of finding anyone you trust reviewing an app, book, or restaurant are so low without significant research that you are probably better off emailing all of your friends with similar tastes, which makes them useless.
PS: The dog translation app works fine, it's just that your dog is a moron.
posted by Hylas at 12:00 PM on December 2, 2010
The problem with app stores, Yelp!, ChowHound, Amazon, etc., are that the chances of finding anyone you trust reviewing an app, book, or restaurant are so low without significant research that you are probably better off emailing all of your friends with similar tastes, which makes them useless.
PS: The dog translation app works fine, it's just that your dog is a moron.
posted by Hylas at 12:00 PM on December 2, 2010
Why not do what amazon does?
I've been wondering this as well. The argument seems to be, "You use the app on your phone, so you should be reviewing the app on your phone," which makes no sense. I used my new backpack while backpacking, but that's not when I wrote my review of it. Similarly, I wrote the review of my laptop while using my desktop.
At this point, I always google for long-form reviews before spending money on an app. The app store reviews are less than worthless.
posted by coolguymichael at 12:07 PM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
I've been wondering this as well. The argument seems to be, "You use the app on your phone, so you should be reviewing the app on your phone," which makes no sense. I used my new backpack while backpacking, but that's not when I wrote my review of it. Similarly, I wrote the review of my laptop while using my desktop.
At this point, I always google for long-form reviews before spending money on an app. The app store reviews are less than worthless.
posted by coolguymichael at 12:07 PM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Morganannie:
Also, I got a good chuckle out of "Stupiest thing EVA".
It's from the second link. It made me laugh, too! I guess when something is the height of stupy, it is stupiest.
posted by Omnomnom at 1:38 PM on December 2, 2010
Also, I got a good chuckle out of "Stupiest thing EVA".
It's from the second link. It made me laugh, too! I guess when something is the height of stupy, it is stupiest.
posted by Omnomnom at 1:38 PM on December 2, 2010
This doesn't seem to be a new problem, but only one company seems to actually care about it: Netflix.
Make it really easy to review things yourself, match up your own reviews with similar reviews, and generate estimated reviews for other products.
posted by meowzilla at 1:51 PM on December 2, 2010
Make it really easy to review things yourself, match up your own reviews with similar reviews, and generate estimated reviews for other products.
posted by meowzilla at 1:51 PM on December 2, 2010
My own 3yo sat on the potty the other day saying pretty much this, except the "damn" part, and then followed it up with: "I eat it?"
You can't leave us in suspense like this; how did you respond?
Oh, some boring parenting thing about it tasting really bad and being full of germs. So now, every time she poops, she says, "I not eat it. it very yucky and full of worms."
posted by not that girl at 2:40 PM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
You can't leave us in suspense like this; how did you respond?
Oh, some boring parenting thing about it tasting really bad and being full of germs. So now, every time she poops, she says, "I not eat it. it very yucky and full of worms."
posted by not that girl at 2:40 PM on December 2, 2010 [2 favorites]
Make it really easy to review things yourself, match up your own reviews with similar reviews, and generate estimated reviews for other products.
If you're interested in that sort of stuff you should check out Programming Collective Intelligence which explains algorithms for things like 'find users with similar tastes.'
posted by robertc at 3:33 PM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
If you're interested in that sort of stuff you should check out Programming Collective Intelligence which explains algorithms for things like 'find users with similar tastes.'
posted by robertc at 3:33 PM on December 2, 2010 [1 favorite]
Last time I looked something up on Amazon, there were three five-star reviews and all three were saying some variation on 'speedy delivery, product undamaged, great job!' Not a word about the utility of the product itself.
I've noticed this recently too. I suspect they're people who got prompted to rate their Amazon Marketplace transaction -- Amazon sends an email to remind you a few weeks afterwards -- but went to the wrong place or got confused.
(The Amazon Marketplace seller ratings are reasonably useful in an "if it's not fairly-high-nineties I'm not going to buy from you" way. Amazon product reviews have always been a mixed bag anyway, because they're always biased towards loved-it/hated-it extremes. The "was this review helpful" thing does seem to have floated more detailed and thoughtful reviews towards the top, though.)
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 5:23 PM on December 2, 2010
I've noticed this recently too. I suspect they're people who got prompted to rate their Amazon Marketplace transaction -- Amazon sends an email to remind you a few weeks afterwards -- but went to the wrong place or got confused.
(The Amazon Marketplace seller ratings are reasonably useful in an "if it's not fairly-high-nineties I'm not going to buy from you" way. Amazon product reviews have always been a mixed bag anyway, because they're always biased towards loved-it/hated-it extremes. The "was this review helpful" thing does seem to have floated more detailed and thoughtful reviews towards the top, though.)
posted by We had a deal, Kyle at 5:23 PM on December 2, 2010
What's interesting to me as a consumer is that the bar is so high...or rather, the scale is so high it's meaningless. An ebay seller with a rating below 98%? Skank. Heck, I even baulk at 99.2%. Which, if you think about it...someone with 100% positive feedback and 7,000 transactions: every one went swimmingly? How would that even be possible?
I recently sold a few items for my dad on ebay and despite clear terms, quick packing, etc., I got a neutral review because someone thought they were getting something else due to their own self-admitted mistake. So how does a dude selling 20 items a day avoid stuff like that?
posted by maxwelton at 6:50 PM on December 2, 2010
I recently sold a few items for my dad on ebay and despite clear terms, quick packing, etc., I got a neutral review because someone thought they were getting something else due to their own self-admitted mistake. So how does a dude selling 20 items a day avoid stuff like that?
posted by maxwelton at 6:50 PM on December 2, 2010
Well listen, maybe an app should be able to translate a dog bark, but a few friends of mine made a joke "nerd detector" app that didn't cost any money and mostly sucked, and damned if they didn't get a comment from some stranger that "It didn't even try to detect nerds it just randomly detected whatever you pointed the phone at!"
I mean, seriously.
posted by ch1x0r at 7:38 PM on December 2, 2010
I mean, seriously.
posted by ch1x0r at 7:38 PM on December 2, 2010
This app demeans us both.
posted by stinkycheese at 9:38 AM on December 3, 2010
posted by stinkycheese at 9:38 AM on December 3, 2010
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posted by Nanukthedog at 5:30 AM on December 2, 2010 [5 favorites]