UConn booster separates after unsuccessful coaching launch.
January 28, 2011 5:56 AM Subscribe
After football head coach Randy Edsall left the University of Connecticut for the head coaching position at Maryland, the athletic director began the search for a new head coach. On January 13, Paul Pasqualoni was named the new UConn football head coach. In an unprecedentedly public manner, the largest athletics department donor at UConn sent a scathing six page letter to the athletics director demanding his money back for not being consulted prior to the hiring, while also listing his grievances against the UConn athletics director.
This isn't the first time donors have been overly involved in the workings of big-time college football programs. Recently, Notre Dame boosters requested that head coach Brian Kelly resign. Florida State boosters donated money to buy out offensive coordinator (and head coach's son) Jeff Bowden's contract. Dennis Franchione involved Texas A&M in scandal when it was discovered that he was selling "insider information" in a $1200 newsletter to donors. Some boosters have even been convicted of crimes related to their involvement in the recruitment of potential student athletes.
This isn't the first time donors have been overly involved in the workings of big-time college football programs. Recently, Notre Dame boosters requested that head coach Brian Kelly resign. Florida State boosters donated money to buy out offensive coordinator (and head coach's son) Jeff Bowden's contract. Dennis Franchione involved Texas A&M in scandal when it was discovered that he was selling "insider information" in a $1200 newsletter to donors. Some boosters have even been convicted of crimes related to their involvement in the recruitment of potential student athletes.
He gave $7 million to a football program? He's small time, down in Texas their rich asshole football guy built a $1 billion stadium.
posted by zzazazz at 6:11 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
posted by zzazazz at 6:11 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
I think anyone who's run an online community based on donations is familiar with This Guy. "Hey, I've donated XX dollars over the years! Do exactly what I want!!!"
posted by muddgirl at 6:12 AM on January 28, 2011 [8 favorites]
posted by muddgirl at 6:12 AM on January 28, 2011 [8 favorites]
Can't we just have minor league football and basketball? Would that Destroy America in some way?
And to second sfts2, "Christ, what an asshole!"
posted by jtron at 6:19 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
And to second sfts2, "Christ, what an asshole!"
posted by jtron at 6:19 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Certainly possible that (a) he's a gigantic asshole and (b) the new coach ISN'T up to snuff.
That said, do you work for UConn? Does UConn pay you to manage their hiring decisions? No? Then go redirect your donations and go pound sand.
posted by delfin at 6:28 AM on January 28, 2011
That said, do you work for UConn? Does UConn pay you to manage their hiring decisions? No? Then go redirect your donations and go pound sand.
posted by delfin at 6:28 AM on January 28, 2011
Wow, what a whiny little baby.
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 6:30 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by The 10th Regiment of Foot at 6:30 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
He gave $7 million to a football program? He's small time, down in Texas their rich asshole football guy built a $1 billion stadium.
This isn't comparable. Jerry Jones constructed that stadium for profit, to hold games for the Cowboys, and other extremely high profile sporting events.
A better example would be T. Boone Pickens, who has donated over $400 million to Oklahoma State University, $265 million of which was dedicated to athletics.
posted by clearly at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
This isn't comparable. Jerry Jones constructed that stadium for profit, to hold games for the Cowboys, and other extremely high profile sporting events.
A better example would be T. Boone Pickens, who has donated over $400 million to Oklahoma State University, $265 million of which was dedicated to athletics.
posted by clearly at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
The best part was when he namedropped Billy Graham.
posted by Sternmeyer at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by Sternmeyer at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
I seriously can't fathom the mind that looks at a bank account containing an extra $7 million, then at the world, then decides that what we need is better funded football.
posted by DU at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [54 favorites]
posted by DU at 6:33 AM on January 28, 2011 [54 favorites]
"Money can't buy you class."
-my Mom (yours too, probably)
posted by Rangeboy at 6:34 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
-my Mom (yours too, probably)
posted by Rangeboy at 6:34 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
January 28, 2011
Dear Robert:
Attached is a letter we received on January 11, 2011. I feel that you should be aware that some asshole is signing your name to stupid letters.
Very truly yours,
Jeffrey A. Hathaway
encl.
(reference)
posted by fore at 6:36 AM on January 28, 2011 [42 favorites]
Dear Robert:
Attached is a letter we received on January 11, 2011. I feel that you should be aware that some asshole is signing your name to stupid letters.
Very truly yours,
Jeffrey A. Hathaway
encl.
(reference)
posted by fore at 6:36 AM on January 28, 2011 [42 favorites]
This makes for a nice contrast with the Scott Lang post from yesterday. Division I sports!
posted by jackflaps at 6:41 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by jackflaps at 6:41 AM on January 28, 2011
Where does this guy guy think he's from?
Greenwich or something?
Oh.
posted by chillmost at 6:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Greenwich or something?
Oh.
posted by chillmost at 6:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
I seriously can't fathom the mind that looks at a bank account containing an extra $7 million, then at the world, then decides that what we need is better funded football.
Well, in all fairness, he does go to explain why he's given so much money to football in his letter.
posted by ob at 6:46 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Well, in all fairness, he does go to explain why he's given so much money to football in his letter.
posted by ob at 6:46 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
The consensus on the local radio station around here is that they should (of course) not give him his money back, but to show their gratitude for the money he donated rename the stadium after him; to whit: "Douchebag Fields."
posted by misha at 6:50 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by misha at 6:50 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
My alma mater lost a $12m donation after the college president (rightly) decided that it wasn't a good idea for a public school to display religious icons in its public spaces.
Somewhat shockingly, he actually did get his money back. Apparently lots of these large "donations" are actually just promises to name the university as a beneficiary in the donor's will.
Meanwhile, while said Alma Mater struggles to keep its buildings open, and avoid massive layoffs, the until-recently-quite-mediocre football team literally has more money specifically earmarked for it than it knows what to do with. They're having difficulty finding new ways to spend the interest on their portion of the endowment.
posted by schmod at 6:51 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Somewhat shockingly, he actually did get his money back. Apparently lots of these large "donations" are actually just promises to name the university as a beneficiary in the donor's will.
Meanwhile, while said Alma Mater struggles to keep its buildings open, and avoid massive layoffs, the until-recently-quite-mediocre football team literally has more money specifically earmarked for it than it knows what to do with. They're having difficulty finding new ways to spend the interest on their portion of the endowment.
posted by schmod at 6:51 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
My initial reaction was "who leaked the letter?". Having worked as a donor manager, I am really surprised the AD didn't consult his biggest donor about the football coach, since it is par for the course. $7 million for any team in the NCAA is a lot of money. You can forget about T. Boone Pickens, he's one in a billion. Any team would love to have a booster like this Burton guy, who gave over not only to the sport, but, to the success of young, disadvantaged people.
Fundraising offices get letters like this every day of the year, for infractions as small as getting someone's name wrong on an envelope. It's very sad when a donor decides to walk away from an organization after a longtime relationship but it is far worse the letter got out, because UConn now can never do enough to rebuild the relationship - even a losing season from this new head coach will probably not salve this booster's injury enough to get him involved again.
posted by parmanparman at 6:53 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
Fundraising offices get letters like this every day of the year, for infractions as small as getting someone's name wrong on an envelope. It's very sad when a donor decides to walk away from an organization after a longtime relationship but it is far worse the letter got out, because UConn now can never do enough to rebuild the relationship - even a losing season from this new head coach will probably not salve this booster's injury enough to get him involved again.
posted by parmanparman at 6:53 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
Can't we just have minor league football and basketball? Would that Destroy America in some way?
Yeah. Either we need to make college sports actually amateur, or we need to start paying student athletes over-the-table. Of course, why would the guys in power want to turn over any of their hard-earned loot?
posted by muddgirl at 6:54 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
Yeah. Either we need to make college sports actually amateur, or we need to start paying student athletes over-the-table. Of course, why would the guys in power want to turn over any of their hard-earned loot?
posted by muddgirl at 6:54 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
He's an asshole, all right. Does wealth cause assholishness, or do you have to be an asshole to be wealthy? Either way, somebody failed to communicate/understand the meaning of the word "donate," and its distinction from the word "buy."
posted by kinnakeet at 6:55 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by kinnakeet at 6:55 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Well, I know what I am doing this morning. Writing me some letters.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:06 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by cjorgensen at 7:06 AM on January 28, 2011
Writing me some letters.
No, you should write them to other people. Only obsessives write to themselves in order to test the effectiveness of the postal service.
posted by ob at 7:21 AM on January 28, 2011 [3 favorites]
No, you should write them to other people. Only obsessives write to themselves in order to test the effectiveness of the postal service.
posted by ob at 7:21 AM on January 28, 2011 [3 favorites]
I was shocked by how little I hated the guy by the end of the letter. Now I just feel funny.
posted by Shutter at 7:24 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by Shutter at 7:24 AM on January 28, 2011
My initial reaction was "who leaked the letter?".
The guy who wrote it did. He sent it to the press.
Certainly possible that (a) he's a gigantic asshole and (b) the new coach ISN'T up to snuff.
Biggest word on the street around here (in UConn country) is that the donor has a personal vendetta against the new coach because he didn't select the donor's son as football captain when he was playing at Syracuse.
I think that AD is in a bit of trouble though.
Maybe privately, but publicly he's got back from UConn's acting president and (I believe) the governor.
"Christ, what an asshole" has been pretty much the main reaction in these parts, all round. I think Jeff Jacobs has said it best.
posted by dlugoczaj at 7:26 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
The guy who wrote it did. He sent it to the press.
Certainly possible that (a) he's a gigantic asshole and (b) the new coach ISN'T up to snuff.
Biggest word on the street around here (in UConn country) is that the donor has a personal vendetta against the new coach because he didn't select the donor's son as football captain when he was playing at Syracuse.
I think that AD is in a bit of trouble though.
Maybe privately, but publicly he's got back from UConn's acting president and (I believe) the governor.
"Christ, what an asshole" has been pretty much the main reaction in these parts, all round. I think Jeff Jacobs has said it best.
posted by dlugoczaj at 7:26 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Donation ≠ purchase.
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 7:41 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by L'Estrange Fruit at 7:41 AM on January 28, 2011
Loved the Jeff Jacobs piece. He's a pretty good sportswriter in general...
posted by rollbiz at 7:42 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by rollbiz at 7:42 AM on January 28, 2011
They should issue a letter to Alumni asking for the cash and saying that they will have to cancel the football program without it. They should make sure to mention his donation retraction as the reason they have to cancel football. Or they could just cancel the stupid football program.
posted by humanfont at 7:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by humanfont at 7:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
The guy who wrote it did. He sent it to the press.
Marked "Personal and Confidential" at the top? What a dumbass.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Marked "Personal and Confidential" at the top? What a dumbass.
posted by cjorgensen at 7:45 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Gee, yet another football scandal at a university. What a shocker.
Minor league football exists, I'm sure they'd enjoy being showered with cash from rich assholes, how about we just cancel college football for a few years, until the fuss dies down and the people who want to play it just for its own sake can do that without getting rich assholes involved.
Then all that money schools squander on coaches can be used for academics.
Or, alternatively, we could try acknowledging that university teams are effectively the junior branch of the NFL (while minor league football exists, no one cares about it), pay their players appropriately and openly, etc. And stop with the silly requirement that the football players pretend to be students. Some, I'm sure, are really students, and more power to them. But I'll bet that the majority don't care about academics and would be glad to be done with the pretense.
posted by sotonohito at 8:10 AM on January 28, 2011
Minor league football exists, I'm sure they'd enjoy being showered with cash from rich assholes, how about we just cancel college football for a few years, until the fuss dies down and the people who want to play it just for its own sake can do that without getting rich assholes involved.
Then all that money schools squander on coaches can be used for academics.
Or, alternatively, we could try acknowledging that university teams are effectively the junior branch of the NFL (while minor league football exists, no one cares about it), pay their players appropriately and openly, etc. And stop with the silly requirement that the football players pretend to be students. Some, I'm sure, are really students, and more power to them. But I'll bet that the majority don't care about academics and would be glad to be done with the pretense.
posted by sotonohito at 8:10 AM on January 28, 2011
The best part was when he namedropped Billy Graham.
Haa, totally. Just highlights how completely ridiculous his whole letter is, like Billy Graham would advocate acting this way or would want his name thrown into this whole mess.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:10 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Haa, totally. Just highlights how completely ridiculous his whole letter is, like Billy Graham would advocate acting this way or would want his name thrown into this whole mess.
posted by ThePinkSuperhero at 8:10 AM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
He (Burton) is an ass, of course. But a big part of any AD's job is fundraising, and if he doesn't know how to handle a $7M donor any better than this, perhaps he's not well-suited to be an AD at this level.
posted by tyllwin at 8:13 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by tyllwin at 8:13 AM on January 28, 2011
I seriously can't fathom the mind that looks at a bank account containing an extra $7 million, then at the world, then decides that what we need is better funded football.
You know what, DU..get over yourself. He also donates to the B-School and he explains himself at the end. He grew up poor in a coal mining town and got out through a college football scholarship. He gives back for others to have the same opportunity. Not everyone has the academic skills to get a free ride. They may have the athletic skills. So fathom that.
posted by spicynuts at 8:29 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
I always thought Pasqualoni was overmatched at Syracuse. I have no reason to think that he's become smarter in the interceding years. So, I'd have to question why the UConn AD thought that PP was the best choice. (Oh yeah, I know, because Brady Hoke already signed with Meeeeechigan!) That said, football boosters seem to be the among the most ridiculous about directing the way their funds are to be spent and in throwing their weight around.
The NYT article about the Auburn booster who had a pissing match with the chair of the Econ department, so he pressured AU to kill the department was the type of thing I hope to never hear about any school I've been associated with.
posted by beelzbubba at 8:34 AM on January 28, 2011
The NYT article about the Auburn booster who had a pissing match with the chair of the Econ department, so he pressured AU to kill the department was the type of thing I hope to never hear about any school I've been associated with.
posted by beelzbubba at 8:34 AM on January 28, 2011
I'll take back my slur on PP. I just remember his last couple of seasons with the Orange and how he looked so lost. His record is a lot better than that, and a lot better than many pretenders, plus he has Connecticut ties.
posted by beelzbubba at 8:38 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by beelzbubba at 8:38 AM on January 28, 2011
According to one of the articles, the letter was obtained by a FOIA request from the paper that published it. Also, I read via the Twitterz that Michael Burton, the donor's son, had a pretty rocky relationship with Paul Pasqualoni while playing at Syracuse. My attempts to find some better sourcing for this rumor has failed.
posted by norm at 9:02 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by norm at 9:02 AM on January 28, 2011
I think anyone who's run an online community based on donations is familiar with This Guy.
Parish politics have the same.
posted by endless_forms at 9:15 AM on January 28, 2011
Parish politics have the same.
posted by endless_forms at 9:15 AM on January 28, 2011
Well, I think sports is pretty much the nadir of civilization, and to waste all that effort on throwing a ball around while people in the same schools struggle to afford books is disgraceful.
Plus I'm aware donors can be unreasonable from my volunteer work at a number of nonprofits. That said, I also have to say that when you read the whole letter it sounds far less petulant and douchebaggy than I expected it to.
IF he's sincere about just wanting input, not veto power, and IF the school is that inept at working with donors as it sounds, and IF the guy has as much legitimate information and first hand knowledge of the new hire through his son as he claims to have, and the AD didn't see what a smart resource (and smart politics) he should be utilizing...
... well, the truth is likely somewhere in the middle, and sports are still dumb, and he should have been giving the money for LEARNING all along.... but the guy's not as much of an asshole as I expected is all I'm saying.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:18 AM on January 28, 2011
Plus I'm aware donors can be unreasonable from my volunteer work at a number of nonprofits. That said, I also have to say that when you read the whole letter it sounds far less petulant and douchebaggy than I expected it to.
IF he's sincere about just wanting input, not veto power, and IF the school is that inept at working with donors as it sounds, and IF the guy has as much legitimate information and first hand knowledge of the new hire through his son as he claims to have, and the AD didn't see what a smart resource (and smart politics) he should be utilizing...
... well, the truth is likely somewhere in the middle, and sports are still dumb, and he should have been giving the money for LEARNING all along.... but the guy's not as much of an asshole as I expected is all I'm saying.
posted by John Kenneth Fisher at 9:18 AM on January 28, 2011
I guess my problem is this:
Why would a former college ball player from 10 years ago have better knowledge of a coach's current capabilities than all the people that the AD undeniably interviewed during the selection process?
I agree that the AD did a terrible job placating this donor, but in my ideal world such placation wouldn't be necessary. One of Div I college football's jobs is to blow smoke up this guy's ass to make him feel like a big man, and they failed. Boo hoo to both of them.
posted by muddgirl at 9:24 AM on January 28, 2011
Why would a former college ball player from 10 years ago have better knowledge of a coach's current capabilities than all the people that the AD undeniably interviewed during the selection process?
I agree that the AD did a terrible job placating this donor, but in my ideal world such placation wouldn't be necessary. One of Div I college football's jobs is to blow smoke up this guy's ass to make him feel like a big man, and they failed. Boo hoo to both of them.
posted by muddgirl at 9:24 AM on January 28, 2011
The University of Oregon simply does whatever Phil Knight says to do.
It is kept very simple, that way.
posted by Danf at 9:28 AM on January 28, 2011
It is kept very simple, that way.
posted by Danf at 9:28 AM on January 28, 2011
I read the letter.
Yes, it might have been very wise if they had consulted him on the hire. But I am tired to death of people thinking they have the right to control others thru donations of large sums of money.
That was a five page long temper tantrum and the fellow should be ashamed of it. No one is saying he is obligated to donate another dime if he wishes not to, but dang.
If anyone has embarrassed his family, it's him.
(ps -dude, if you want poor kids to have a chance at college, you don't have to just donate to FOOTBALL. Paying for those paintings didn't do a dang thing to get a kid in school. Just sayin.)
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 9:28 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Yes, it might have been very wise if they had consulted him on the hire. But I am tired to death of people thinking they have the right to control others thru donations of large sums of money.
That was a five page long temper tantrum and the fellow should be ashamed of it. No one is saying he is obligated to donate another dime if he wishes not to, but dang.
If anyone has embarrassed his family, it's him.
(ps -dude, if you want poor kids to have a chance at college, you don't have to just donate to FOOTBALL. Paying for those paintings didn't do a dang thing to get a kid in school. Just sayin.)
posted by St. Alia of the Bunnies at 9:28 AM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Yet another reason to ignore College sports...
And, although everyone wants to get all OMGain'titawful about this... let's face it folks, college football is all about the money...
posted by HuronBob at 9:38 AM on January 28, 2011
And, although everyone wants to get all OMGain'titawful about this... let's face it folks, college football is all about the money...
posted by HuronBob at 9:38 AM on January 28, 2011
Not everyone has the academic skills to get a free ride. They may have the athletic skills. So fathom that.
If they don't have the academic skills, they don't deserve a free ride through higher EDUCATION.
posted by Jeeb at 9:42 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
If they don't have the academic skills, they don't deserve a free ride through higher EDUCATION.
posted by Jeeb at 9:42 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
What's really interesting about UConn is that they have a football team because they had a successful basketball program to jump start it, financially. Usually, it's the other way around.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:50 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 9:50 AM on January 28, 2011
You know what, DU..get over yourself. He also donates to the B-School and he explains himself at the end. He grew up poor in a coal mining town and got out through a college football scholarship. He gives back for others to have the same opportunity. Not everyone has the academic skills to get a free ride. They may have the athletic skills. So fathom that.
Jeez. I'm a huge college football fan and I find this a ridiculous overreaction.
College sports, and its ability to free the disadvantaged from their environs, does not hinge on this guy. Every kid who has definite D1 skills is going to be taken care of. Don't you worry about that.
Disadvantaged kids who do not have scholarship-level athletic ability, but are smart and would benefit from college, do indeed have something to worry about as financial aid gets slashed in many parts of the US, and no college is giving full scholarships to kids just to be another Joe Student.
So yeah, it's legit to opine that 7 million to give away could be donated in away that would better benefit society.
posted by mreleganza at 10:01 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
Jeez. I'm a huge college football fan and I find this a ridiculous overreaction.
College sports, and its ability to free the disadvantaged from their environs, does not hinge on this guy. Every kid who has definite D1 skills is going to be taken care of. Don't you worry about that.
Disadvantaged kids who do not have scholarship-level athletic ability, but are smart and would benefit from college, do indeed have something to worry about as financial aid gets slashed in many parts of the US, and no college is giving full scholarships to kids just to be another Joe Student.
So yeah, it's legit to opine that 7 million to give away could be donated in away that would better benefit society.
posted by mreleganza at 10:01 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
If they don't have the academic skills, they don't deserve a free ride through higher EDUCATION.
I went to college for a lot of years, through four degrees, and I can recall attending exactly two football games at my schools. I'm a long way away from deeply invested in college athletics. But colleges do a lot of different things: they have science geeks and artistic prodigies and musical geniuses and brilliant debaters and powerhouse athletes, and you can get scholarships for being any of those things. To act as though the athletic program doesn't exist, or doesn't provide value to the school or isn't integral to higher EDUCATION isn't accurate or helpful. Given the ridiculous costs of tuition and the extreme usefulness of a bachelor's degree for getting off the of bottom rung of society, I don't begrudge anyone offering or receiving any kind of scholarship they can think of.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 10:10 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
I went to college for a lot of years, through four degrees, and I can recall attending exactly two football games at my schools. I'm a long way away from deeply invested in college athletics. But colleges do a lot of different things: they have science geeks and artistic prodigies and musical geniuses and brilliant debaters and powerhouse athletes, and you can get scholarships for being any of those things. To act as though the athletic program doesn't exist, or doesn't provide value to the school or isn't integral to higher EDUCATION isn't accurate or helpful. Given the ridiculous costs of tuition and the extreme usefulness of a bachelor's degree for getting off the of bottom rung of society, I don't begrudge anyone offering or receiving any kind of scholarship they can think of.
posted by Pater Aletheias at 10:10 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
He also donates to the B-School and [...]
Strike two.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 10:29 AM on January 28, 2011 [3 favorites]
Strike two.
posted by Crabby Appleton at 10:29 AM on January 28, 2011 [3 favorites]
Why on earth would UConn return the $3 million Burton gave them? Does he think that this demand will actually go somewhere?
posted by grouse at 10:35 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by grouse at 10:35 AM on January 28, 2011
Or, alternatively, we could try acknowledging that university teams are effectively the junior branch of the NFL (while minor league football exists, no one cares about it), pay their players appropriately and openly, etc. And stop with the silly requirement that the football players pretend to be students. Some, I'm sure, are really students, and more power to them. But I'll bet that the majority don't care about academics and would be glad to be done with the pretense.Frank Deford is that you?
He also donates to the B-School and he explains himself at the end. He grew up poor in a coal mining town and got out through a college football scholarship. He gives back for others to have the same opportunity. Not everyone has the academic skills to get a free ride. They may have the athletic skills. So fathom that.He's still an asshole.
posted by cjorgensen at 10:43 AM on January 28, 2011
There's also a booster connection on the Maryland end, as well.
posted by Chrysostom at 10:56 AM on January 28, 2011
posted by Chrysostom at 10:56 AM on January 28, 2011
The University of Oregon simply does whatever Phil Knight says to do.
It is kept very simple, that way.
Well, he was nice enough to let the hoi polloi into the bottom floor of jock in a box, so that was nice of him.
posted by madajb at 11:00 AM on January 28, 2011
It is kept very simple, that way.
Well, he was nice enough to let the hoi polloi into the bottom floor of jock in a box, so that was nice of him.
posted by madajb at 11:00 AM on January 28, 2011
Jeeb wrote "If they don't have the academic skills, they don't deserve a free ride through higher EDUCATION."
Academic programs don't bring in money. Athletic programs do. Revenue sports make the school money through ticket sales, concessions, merchandising, payouts for playoff performance from TV contracts, and so on. When a team does well, alumni donations to the school go up. That money is not necessarily earmarked for the athletic program.
A lot of the things you like about the school you attended may very well have been paid for out of money originating from the sports programs. A lot of academic scholarships are funded by donations from alumni, and alumni like to brag about their school. Heck, my alma mater's football team went 11-2 last year, if I had a chunk of money burning a hole in my pocket I'd consider throwing it at my old (academic) department.
posted by caution live frogs at 11:12 AM on January 28, 2011
Academic programs don't bring in money. Athletic programs do. Revenue sports make the school money through ticket sales, concessions, merchandising, payouts for playoff performance from TV contracts, and so on. When a team does well, alumni donations to the school go up. That money is not necessarily earmarked for the athletic program.
A lot of the things you like about the school you attended may very well have been paid for out of money originating from the sports programs. A lot of academic scholarships are funded by donations from alumni, and alumni like to brag about their school. Heck, my alma mater's football team went 11-2 last year, if I had a chunk of money burning a hole in my pocket I'd consider throwing it at my old (academic) department.
posted by caution live frogs at 11:12 AM on January 28, 2011
Academic programs don't bring in money.
Students who pay tuition or receive external financial aid to take an academic program are a source of revenue for academic programs. Professors bring in external grants and fellowships. Benefactors endow chairs and fund labs and classrooms. All this happens in schools with a Div. III or unaffiliated sports program (talk about student athletes!), like my alma mater.
Athletic programs do.
Not really. Very few Div I programs operate in the black even when you factor in alumni donations.
posted by muddgirl at 11:47 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
Students who pay tuition or receive external financial aid to take an academic program are a source of revenue for academic programs. Professors bring in external grants and fellowships. Benefactors endow chairs and fund labs and classrooms. All this happens in schools with a Div. III or unaffiliated sports program (talk about student athletes!), like my alma mater.
Athletic programs do.
Not really. Very few Div I programs operate in the black even when you factor in alumni donations.
posted by muddgirl at 11:47 AM on January 28, 2011 [5 favorites]
Very few Div I programs operate in the black even when you factor in alumni donations.
You should be skeptical when you see a claim like that, because in essence, you're saying that every single university president running all 100+ D1 programs is mind-bogglingly foolish, and has been foolish, for decades and decades and decades.
Right? If they were losing money year over year, they'd stop doing it, right?
No. They're making money. Gobs of it. I'll give you another data point -- the football bowl system. The only reason it still exists is because it produces so many dollars, the football programs won't risk going to a playoff system, even in the face of an obvious success like the NCAA men's basketball tournament.
In fact, the problem with your linked study is that it's conflating the bigger name Florida programs (football and basketball) with the athletic department as a whole. ZOMG, the football team loses money! Well, actually, the revenue generated by D1 men's football and basketball programs very often fund the entirety of the non-revenue producing programs, like Florida's excellent tennis, soccer and swimming programs. And athletics are often viewed as giant marketing/advertising programs for generating student interest. Athletics are loss-leaders.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:27 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
You should be skeptical when you see a claim like that, because in essence, you're saying that every single university president running all 100+ D1 programs is mind-bogglingly foolish, and has been foolish, for decades and decades and decades.
Right? If they were losing money year over year, they'd stop doing it, right?
No. They're making money. Gobs of it. I'll give you another data point -- the football bowl system. The only reason it still exists is because it produces so many dollars, the football programs won't risk going to a playoff system, even in the face of an obvious success like the NCAA men's basketball tournament.
In fact, the problem with your linked study is that it's conflating the bigger name Florida programs (football and basketball) with the athletic department as a whole. ZOMG, the football team loses money! Well, actually, the revenue generated by D1 men's football and basketball programs very often fund the entirety of the non-revenue producing programs, like Florida's excellent tennis, soccer and swimming programs. And athletics are often viewed as giant marketing/advertising programs for generating student interest. Athletics are loss-leaders.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:27 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
isn't integral to higher EDUCATION isn't accurate or helpful.
Can you explain to me how a football program is integral to higher education? I earned a degree in chemistry. My school didn't have a football program so I'd like to know how they are related. The sports that received the most attention were the intramural sports.
posted by dibblda at 12:31 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Can you explain to me how a football program is integral to higher education? I earned a degree in chemistry. My school didn't have a football program so I'd like to know how they are related. The sports that received the most attention were the intramural sports.
posted by dibblda at 12:31 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Well, actually, the revenue generated by D1 men's football and basketball programs very often fund the entirety of the non-revenue producing programs, like Florida's excellent tennis, soccer and swimming programs. And athletics are often viewed as giant marketing/advertising programs for generating student interest. Athletics are loss-leaders.
You can't separate out Div. I football and basketball from the rest of the athletic department, because the department as a whole has to qualify for the division. If your Div I program is losing money, then it is losing money.
Marketing/advertising programs would be considered a "hidden benefit". If we are considering hidden benefits, then we have to consider hidden costs as well.
I have no problem with the ideals of a student athletic association - my alma mater was a nerd school with strong interest in our Div III sports program. I do have problems with the fact that corporations and elements within the NCAA exploit student athletes for their own financial gain, leaving school and state organizations to fund the programs with subsidies and student fees anyway.
The only reason it still exists is because it produces so many dollars
Dollars for whom?
posted by muddgirl at 12:47 PM on January 28, 2011
You can't separate out Div. I football and basketball from the rest of the athletic department, because the department as a whole has to qualify for the division. If your Div I program is losing money, then it is losing money.
Marketing/advertising programs would be considered a "hidden benefit". If we are considering hidden benefits, then we have to consider hidden costs as well.
I have no problem with the ideals of a student athletic association - my alma mater was a nerd school with strong interest in our Div III sports program. I do have problems with the fact that corporations and elements within the NCAA exploit student athletes for their own financial gain, leaving school and state organizations to fund the programs with subsidies and student fees anyway.
The only reason it still exists is because it produces so many dollars
Dollars for whom?
posted by muddgirl at 12:47 PM on January 28, 2011
You should be skeptical when you see a claim like that, because in essence, you're saying that every single university president running all 100+ D1 programs is mind-bogglingly foolish, and has been foolish, for decades and decades and decades.
First, I doubt most Division I university presidents have the authority to eliminate their athletics program without approval from the university's governing body. So more accurately you would have to say that all these boards of regents are mind-bogglingly foolish, which, if you have ever dealt with any, is far easier to believe. As Mark Twain wrote, "In the first place God made idiots. This was for practice. Then He made School Boards."
It is still possible for a decision to take a recurring loss to not be totally irrational, in the case of a loss leader. But that does not change the fact that the program is losing money. The claimed indirect benefits in the form of advertising to students are rarely examined carefully, and spending loads of money on marketing may not be an appropriate activity for an institution that is supposed to produce a public benefit rather than a profit. Even less so if the source of this money is a university general fund supported by taxpayer dollars or student loans.
As far as football and men's basketball making money but athletics losing money overall, one must consider that it is a legal requirement under Title IX to provide some amount of women's athletics as well, so the football program couldn't exist without some of these other sports. One should consider the cost and benefit of the tennis, soccer and swimming programs. I'm sure they are excellent, but could more students be better served academically by better chemistry labs, more English instructors, more library services? Probably, as the number of student-athletes is always going to be low and these programs will be expensive on a per-student basis when compared to other, more academic programs.
In reality, a careful and complete consideration of all the costs and benefits of Division I intercollegiate athletics is almost never completed because in most places, eliminating the Division I football program is an unthinkable third rail. The real reason university presidents don't propose eliminating their football programs is not because it is a financial winner for the university, but because they would be fired for even bringing up the idea.
posted by grouse at 1:03 PM on January 28, 2011
First, I doubt most Division I university presidents have the authority to eliminate their athletics program without approval from the university's governing body. So more accurately you would have to say that all these boards of regents are mind-bogglingly foolish, which, if you have ever dealt with any, is far easier to believe. As Mark Twain wrote, "In the first place God made idiots. This was for practice. Then He made School Boards."
It is still possible for a decision to take a recurring loss to not be totally irrational, in the case of a loss leader. But that does not change the fact that the program is losing money. The claimed indirect benefits in the form of advertising to students are rarely examined carefully, and spending loads of money on marketing may not be an appropriate activity for an institution that is supposed to produce a public benefit rather than a profit. Even less so if the source of this money is a university general fund supported by taxpayer dollars or student loans.
As far as football and men's basketball making money but athletics losing money overall, one must consider that it is a legal requirement under Title IX to provide some amount of women's athletics as well, so the football program couldn't exist without some of these other sports. One should consider the cost and benefit of the tennis, soccer and swimming programs. I'm sure they are excellent, but could more students be better served academically by better chemistry labs, more English instructors, more library services? Probably, as the number of student-athletes is always going to be low and these programs will be expensive on a per-student basis when compared to other, more academic programs.
In reality, a careful and complete consideration of all the costs and benefits of Division I intercollegiate athletics is almost never completed because in most places, eliminating the Division I football program is an unthinkable third rail. The real reason university presidents don't propose eliminating their football programs is not because it is a financial winner for the university, but because they would be fired for even bringing up the idea.
posted by grouse at 1:03 PM on January 28, 2011
You know what, DU..get over yourself.
Investors sue, threaten to sue, dump stock and badmouth those companies they invest in all the time, and even though they get a vote at the annual shareholders meeting, the fact remain that unless they control a sizable/majority portion of the outstanding stock, they do not get to run the company or choose who does, so I cannot expect a blowhard football fan, albeit a rich one, to be in the position to dictate the actions of a school's AD.
Should he want to be in the position of making AD or GM-level decisions, my suggestion is that he ring one Jon Bon Jovi and ask him how well that went, or apply for a job in person at a reputable program. Then we'll see just how much football Mr. Burton and his kids know.
posted by jsavimbi at 1:13 PM on January 28, 2011
Investors sue, threaten to sue, dump stock and badmouth those companies they invest in all the time, and even though they get a vote at the annual shareholders meeting, the fact remain that unless they control a sizable/majority portion of the outstanding stock, they do not get to run the company or choose who does, so I cannot expect a blowhard football fan, albeit a rich one, to be in the position to dictate the actions of a school's AD.
Should he want to be in the position of making AD or GM-level decisions, my suggestion is that he ring one Jon Bon Jovi and ask him how well that went, or apply for a job in person at a reputable program. Then we'll see just how much football Mr. Burton and his kids know.
posted by jsavimbi at 1:13 PM on January 28, 2011
High level team college sports distort the mission and practices of a university, and they cheapen the institution.
If you want to know with one of the core things that is wrong with modern life, look at the fact that supposedly 'educated' people continue to cheer for their 'teams', be it nation, party or religion, irrespective of the outcomes of the actions of their 'teams'.
Supporting a 'team' (rather than say, you know, the MORALITY or WORTH of an action) manages to suspend critical thinking quite nicely. Needless to say, this allows people in power to get away with gross crimes as long as it's draped in a 'team' flag.(see: my country right or wrong, love it or leave it, death to non believers, unAmericanism, etc etc).
Sports are meant to channel the tribal instinct into useful outlet, but all we see is the 'sportification' of every aspect of life.
The elevation of high-level team sports to the status of flagship enterpise of colleges is a symptom of a profoundly sick and anti-intellectual culture.
posted by lalochezia at 1:21 PM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
If you want to know with one of the core things that is wrong with modern life, look at the fact that supposedly 'educated' people continue to cheer for their 'teams', be it nation, party or religion, irrespective of the outcomes of the actions of their 'teams'.
Supporting a 'team' (rather than say, you know, the MORALITY or WORTH of an action) manages to suspend critical thinking quite nicely. Needless to say, this allows people in power to get away with gross crimes as long as it's draped in a 'team' flag.(see: my country right or wrong, love it or leave it, death to non believers, unAmericanism, etc etc).
Sports are meant to channel the tribal instinct into useful outlet, but all we see is the 'sportification' of every aspect of life.
The elevation of high-level team sports to the status of flagship enterpise of colleges is a symptom of a profoundly sick and anti-intellectual culture.
posted by lalochezia at 1:21 PM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]
Meanwhile, (relatively) tiny Vanderbilt University, perennial SEC cupcake, folded its athletic department into the Office of Student Life, elimating many of the gravy jobs so common in football factory schools and de-emphasizing varsity athletics. Strangely, their football team improved (well, they had nowhere to go but up). They're the only Division One school to make such a move.
Way to go, Vanderbilt!
posted by BitterOldPunk at 2:42 PM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
Way to go, Vanderbilt!
posted by BitterOldPunk at 2:42 PM on January 28, 2011 [2 favorites]
No. They're making money. Gobs of it. .
The NCAA disagrees with you apparently.
The school near me continually touts its financial self-sufficiency in athletics. While I think most of that is due to a very generous donor and some creative accounting, I'm not sure they'd put it in virtually every press release if it were common rather than the exception.
posted by madajb at 3:34 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
The NCAA disagrees with you apparently.
The school near me continually touts its financial self-sufficiency in athletics. While I think most of that is due to a very generous donor and some creative accounting, I'm not sure they'd put it in virtually every press release if it were common rather than the exception.
posted by madajb at 3:34 PM on January 28, 2011 [1 favorite]
Well, I wrote and sent a letter to Mr. Burton. Memail me if you want a copy.
posted by cjorgensen at 5:34 PM on January 28, 2011
posted by cjorgensen at 5:34 PM on January 28, 2011
Only if it's marked "Personal and Confidential," otherwise I'm not interested.
posted by grouse at 5:37 PM on January 28, 2011
posted by grouse at 5:37 PM on January 28, 2011
lalochezia: "High level team college sports distort the mission and practices of a university, and they cheapen the institution.
...
The elevation of high-level team sports to the status of flagship enterpise of colleges is a symptom of a profoundly sick and anti-intellectual culture."
Wow. I know you're trying really hard to be above the masses but way to be dismissive and downright rude to...pretty much anybody who enjoys sports. You know it's possible to be (using your words) "educated" and still enjoy cheering for a "team".
I hope you're enjoying cheering for your pro-intellectual, anti-sports "team".
posted by This Guy at 5:08 AM on January 31, 2011
...
The elevation of high-level team sports to the status of flagship enterpise of colleges is a symptom of a profoundly sick and anti-intellectual culture."
Wow. I know you're trying really hard to be above the masses but way to be dismissive and downright rude to...pretty much anybody who enjoys sports. You know it's possible to be (using your words) "educated" and still enjoy cheering for a "team".
I hope you're enjoying cheering for your pro-intellectual, anti-sports "team".
posted by This Guy at 5:08 AM on January 31, 2011
Booster has Second Thoughts; UConn Probably Doesn't NYT permalink
posted by beelzbubba at 1:03 PM on January 31, 2011
posted by beelzbubba at 1:03 PM on January 31, 2011
« Older radio k'bvh;b | SNOW DAY! Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by sfts2 at 6:08 AM on January 28, 2011 [4 favorites]