It's raining cats and dogs
June 6, 2001 10:11 AM   Subscribe

It's raining cats and dogs this summer! GEEZ! Pearl Harbor, Shrek, and The Mummy Returns are already in the theaters. This weekend we get Swordfish, Evolution, and even Atlantis: The Lost Empire in limited release. What's next? Oh nuthin. Just stuff Angelina Jolie's been kicking around, Eddie Murphy's little pet project, something Jay & Silent Bob tossed off in the shower, Stephen Spielberg's thoughtful adult film coupled with his token bloodfest for the kiddies... Final Fantasy, Planet of the Apes, Kiss of the Dragon, a painfully predictable looking sequel to American Pie, a predictable but funny-lookin' sequel to Rush Hour, and a predictable sequel to Scary Movie, and the ever present SO MUCH MORE! I skipped half the movies coming out but those are the highlights. Is this gonna be the best summer blockbuster festival ever thrust upon the world's populous, or are we true fans of cinema about to once again take it up the ass? Whatcha think?
posted by ZachsMind (100 comments total)
i think i just broke something in my brain as i tried to decide exactly which link to click on.
posted by th3ph17 at 10:12 AM on June 6, 2001

i'd say your forecast of rain was correct, but you neglected to point out that what would be falling from the sky would be shit.
posted by maura at 10:16 AM on June 6, 2001

The number of links in the initial post is inversely proportional to the value of the post. 19 links. Is that a record? It sure seems the "So much more" link was all that was needed.
posted by fleener at 10:18 AM on June 6, 2001

The shit was implied. =)

And Fleener, I'm not interested in an argument of how different individuals view appropriateness of posts. Such argument belongs in Metatalk. This is movie talk. Don't wanna participate? Ignore the thread.

To those who want to actually enjoy this thread, which ones are you personally looking forward to and which ones do you think should have gone the way of Roger Corman's Fantastic Four? Personally I'm looking forward to Jay and Silent Bob Strikes Back, but that's just cuz I'm a sick f$#@. And I'll probably go see Lara Croft and Rush Hour 2 cuz they'll be good roller coaster rides. The rest can curl up and die. My two cents. Anything anyone's looking forward to?
posted by ZachsMind at 10:24 AM on June 6, 2001

I can't wait to see Rush Hour 2. The first is one of my guilty pleasure movies. Just so long as we get more of Jackie Chan trying to sing, I'll be happy. I'll also catch AI, but that's about it. Summer blockbuster season rarely appeals to me, and this year is no exception.

Oh, I'll also see Moulin Rouge, just to see how long it takes before Ewan and Nicole making cutesy with good songs as dialogue makes me ready to vomit. (I predict that I won't get beyond the cheesy scene where Ewan recites Your Song.)
posted by Dreama at 10:27 AM on June 6, 2001

Is it acceptable to *compliment* the linkage without going to MetaTalk? :-)

I wanna know what they padded Angie's boobs with. Lara's at least a 34DD.
posted by baylink at 10:28 AM on June 6, 2001

I've seen the extended trailer of Tim Burton's take on Planet of the Apes and I'll admit I'm gonna bite... Burton's vision is usually... ahem... "idiosyncratic"... and usually at worth seeing once, so I don't think I'm risking much (fortunately, P.o.t.A. looks more like Sleepy Hollow than Mars Attacks, which played a part in my personal ticket-buying decision).
posted by m.polo at 10:30 AM on June 6, 2001

I have no desire to see any of those films.
posted by corpse at 10:31 AM on June 6, 2001

Jay and Silent Bob tossed off in the shower? I didn't see that in the trailer.
posted by anildash at 10:32 AM on June 6, 2001

Cats & Dogs and Shrek I'll probably see for the novelty. I was very disappointed by Dogma, so unless I hear a lot of good things about the Jay & Silent Bob thing, I'm staying away. I am, however, breathlessly anticipating the FF movie, if for nothing else but the eye candy. The rest, like Zach said, can curl up and die.
posted by starvingartist at 10:33 AM on June 6, 2001

Ah, give it a rest, fleener... the initial post was just fine... clever, well thought out, and entertaining. And, rather than being the raison-d'etre, the "SO MUCH MORE" link was just icing on the cake.

I, for one, caught SHREK... great! and I'm looking forward to AI, JPIII, Atlantis and Planet of the Apes... if any of those are even half as good as they're being hyped to be I'll be happy. It's summer after all... fluff is in the air!

Of course, I've still got some older flix to catch up on: I still want to see Chocolat, and I'm also hoping to catch "Brigham City" before it leave theatres.
posted by silusGROK at 10:34 AM on June 6, 2001

Personally, I'm looking forward to Swordfish and Final Fantasy.
posted by crunchland at 10:35 AM on June 6, 2001

Oh yeah. Possibly Evolution. I like giant computer-generated monsters :)
posted by starvingartist at 10:38 AM on June 6, 2001

Drop your drawers and bend over please.
posted by Dick Paris at 10:40 AM on June 6, 2001

I wanna know what they padded Angie's boobs with. Lara's at least a 34DD.

Nothing, apparently. She's not wearing the Daisy Dukes either. I just checked out the site. That movie's going to suck suck suck. But, just like The Mummy Returns got a huge take because every rabid WWF fan went to see the Rock's 5 minutes of fame (only 5 more to go, Rock!), every drooling Lara Croft fanboy will go to see this movie. How depressing.
posted by starvingartist at 10:44 AM on June 6, 2001

I've got 3 words for you. Zhang Zi Yi.

posted by PWA_BadBoy at 10:44 AM on June 6, 2001

And I woulda sworn they said there'd be no sequel to Scary Movie... At least from the promotional poster, that's what I remembered seeing... hypocrites. :P
posted by PWA_BadBoy at 10:45 AM on June 6, 2001

does anyone know if enigma is coming out in the states this summer?
posted by kliuless at 10:48 AM on June 6, 2001

Dreama--you may be quite surprised at how well the "cutesy with good songs and dialogue" works in Moulin Rouge. The ones who won't get it, are those that are either too narrowminded or too elitist. The movie is simply spectacular as spectacle, and the use of modern pop songs to weave a fantastic tale is postmodern genius.

If you doesn't find yourself smiling upon hearing the penniless writer (Ewan McGregor) sing "And I Will Always Love You" (whether you think Whitney Houston's version is putrid or not)--then you have a cold, cold heart. ('You' plural, not 'you' Dreama :)

Oh yeah, and I'm also looking forward to Planet of the Apes, Final Fantasy and VA5: Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back. I'm not sure what to make of A.I. It was Stanley Kubrick's project before his death, and now it looks like it may be another E.T., rather than another 2001.
posted by brittney at 10:48 AM on June 6, 2001

I'm just patiently waiting for LOTR. Everything else until then is just Filler.
posted by th3ph17 at 10:48 AM on June 6, 2001

Pootie Tang - This is what you get when you leave Conan O'Brien. Farewell, Mr. Richter. We knew you well.
posted by starvingartist at 10:49 AM on June 6, 2001

whoa, zhang zi yi is going to be in 2046!
posted by kliuless at 10:50 AM on June 6, 2001

AI looks like DARYL meets Bicentennial Man to me. There's not an original bone in Hollywood's body, but Haley Joel Osment kicked some butt in Sixth Sense. Might be worth watching just to see him act again. Amazing talent for such a young age. Duchovny left X-Files to do Evolution? I'm still scratching my head over that. Final Fantasy scares me. In less than five years they won't need actors at all. About Scary Movie never having a sequel? Their new posters will probably say "so we lied. Get over it." I'll watch anything with Jackie Chan in it. If that makes me a sucker I don't care. He's cool. Rosie O'Donnell gave Moulin Rouge a supreme recommendation, but I'm still debating over whether or not that's a good thing. I think they padded Angie's boobs with CGI.

I know the previous paragraph sounded like a bunch of distorted thoughts squished together. I coulda done a couple paragraphs on each movie but people get mad when I ramble, so instead I squished it all together. I hope y'all don't mind. And you should probably take compliments to Metatalk too. No need to give critics more ammunition, but thank you for the kind words just the same. =)

Zhang Ziyi's got the same birthday as me! What're the odds of that?
posted by ZachsMind at 10:52 AM on June 6, 2001

posted by ZachsMind at 10:54 AM on June 6, 2001

Save your money, Dreama... Brittney's been listening to too much of his/her namesake's product if he/she thinks MOULIN ROUGE has anything to it that you can't see for free on MTV. Post-modern it may well be, but post-modern hasn't been interesting in about a decade and MOULIN ROUGE is all sound and fury, as a lot that was post-modern turned out to be once audiences figured out the joke was on THEM. Kidman, normally a decent enough actor, is forced to use her own decidedly sub-par singing voice and McGregor just stands about smirking, aware that it's all some elaborate joke even if he's not quite sure what the punchline is. It's a big, loud, unfunny, shriekingly sung mess.
posted by m.polo at 11:01 AM on June 6, 2001

If it wasn't for Kevin Smith, would Jason Mewes even get work?
posted by starvingartist at 11:02 AM on June 6, 2001

Oh, come on. Dogma wasn't THAT bad, was it? Certainly not the best Smith flick, but that's a pretty high standard to keep up with.

And, starvingartist, no. Jason Mewes would be homeless without Kevin Smith. He may actually be homeless now, having spent his movie salaries on pot and strippers. But that's a different thread.
posted by goto11 at 11:09 AM on June 6, 2001

So Brittney, is everyone who doesn't agree with you "too narrowminded or too elitist"? I didn't like Moulin Rouge because there was either too much story or not enough. If they wanted to go with visual spectacle, they should've gone all the way.
posted by binkin at 11:10 AM on June 6, 2001

About 1 in 365, I'd guess...
posted by hincandenza at 11:11 AM on June 6, 2001

I'd agree with m.polo that "Moulin Rouge" is a totally mess. I even liked Baz Luhrman's old movies ("Strictly Ballroom" and "Romeo And Juliet") but this new release was simply an over-the-top waste. The musical references didn't even fit part of the time (while the rest of the time they were so over the top it was like an aural ipecac), and everything was so painfully obvious that I (and my date) almost walked out after 20 minutes. We ended up staying and although it gets a little better in the second half, I totally wouldn't recommend it. I actually felt bad for Leguazamo playing Latrec, as his part was the worst of all. You can call me narrowminded or elitist, but it sucked, plain and simple.

In terms of the rest of the year, I'm looking forward to "A.I." (hoping Spielberg can work the magic on the Kubrick idea) and "Planet Of The Apes," "Kiss Of The Dragon," and "Jurassic Park 3" for my good shlocky fun movies.

Of course, the winter will be owned by "Lord of the Rings!"
posted by almostcool at 11:13 AM on June 6, 2001

baylink: I wanna know what they padded Angie's boobs with. Lara's at least a 34DD.

in this GameSpy interview they asked:

Q We want to talk to you about the costume. You have a beautiful body, but there was some enhancement there, right?

A Yeah. I’m a 36C, in the movie she’s a 36D, and in the game she’s a 36DD, so yes, there was some padding.

A very poignant question indeed ;)
posted by pnevares at 11:18 AM on June 6, 2001

Let's see, I have the same birthday as:

Steve Ballmer... Willow from Buffy... Nope, no one good.
posted by SpecialK at 11:19 AM on June 6, 2001

I got King King Bundy, Dana Plato, and a porn star (Bianca Trump).
posted by starvingartist at 11:32 AM on June 6, 2001

Jason Mewes homeless? I don't know...he did have those Nike commercials.
posted by hootch at 11:37 AM on June 6, 2001

If you doesn't find yourself smiling upon hearing the penniless writer (Ewan McGregor) sing "And I Will Always Love You" (whether you think Whitney Houston's version is putrid or not)--then you have a cold, cold heart. ('You' plural, not 'you' Dreama :)
Hmmm...Well, that's it then. Looks like Santa lives in my chest cavity.
posted by bradth27 at 11:45 AM on June 6, 2001

Tomb Raider: will probably suck, but its got butt kickin' boobs. I'm there.
JP3: JP2 sucked, but dinosaurs rule
Final Fantasy/Atlantis: animation=good
AI: Spielberg=god
Scary Movie/AP2: laughed my ass off at part one, funny stuff
Rush Hour: ditto

Evolution looks like a poor man's Ghostbusters. Give it up Reitman...
Cats/Dogs: interesting premise, seemingly hokey execution...
posted by owillis at 11:46 AM on June 6, 2001

> Zhang Ziyi's got the same birthday as me! What're the
> odds of that?

One in 365, I think.
posted by dammitjim at 11:48 AM on June 6, 2001

Is it just me or does the website for this Atlantis thing look like a clunkier version of Myst? They've even nicked the sound effects...
posted by Grangousier at 11:52 AM on June 6, 2001

Great. I got Corey Feldman and Phoebe Cates. My day sucks.
posted by bradth27 at 11:52 AM on June 6, 2001

I have to admit that I got a sick pleasure out of American Pie, and Eugene Levy looks equally hilarious in the sequel.

I know, I know: DUMB movie, but everyone's gotta have their cinematic skeleton in the closet, right?
posted by arielmeadow at 11:59 AM on June 6, 2001

I apparently have the same birthday as Daryl Hall.
posted by kindall at 12:00 PM on June 6, 2001

Tomb Raider ... its got butt kickin' boobs.

Thank you for implanting that image in my brain.

I may need to go and have a nice lie down now.
posted by Grangousier at 12:03 PM on June 6, 2001

> Zhang Ziyi's got the same birthday as me! What're the
> odds of that?

One in 365, I think.

Actually, no. If you have 23 people in a room, the odds are about 50% that two will share a birthday.
posted by starvingartist at 12:05 PM on June 6, 2001

i want to see a movie about a fighter pilot who becomes president, saves the planet from aliens who attack the earth say, july 4. and i wanna see harvey firestone er fienstein or is it fireside... i wanna see him play...a disk jockey (sir they do not have those anymore) what, no fighter pilots...
posted by clavdivs at 12:05 PM on June 6, 2001

jason mewes wouldn't be completely homeless... he could live in his comic book store in new jersey.
posted by sugarfish at 12:06 PM on June 6, 2001

It's a perfect summer schedule for young (under 21) guys. (*Maybe* AI is an exception.) Aren't they the ones the Industry wants to drag in to its theaters anyway?
posted by caraig at 12:14 PM on June 6, 2001

a number of those movies look great . a number of those look so-so.

but i dont think any of them will be as impressive as memento
posted by Qambient at 12:20 PM on June 6, 2001

Methinks this summer is gonna be lacking, but I'm interested in the likes of A.I. (hopefully Spielberg won't ruin Kubrick's vision; we might even get a somewhat challenging film), Final Fantasy just looks gorgeous but I don't know about its plot, and Planet of the Apes might be good, but I have doubts... I still have to see Memento and Chopper though.

Dogma wasn't that bad, though not half as funny as I expected. I'm looking forward to the special edition DVD that's coming out for Dogma - all of Kevin Smith's other special editions are fantastic and fun and I can't imagine this one being any different:) Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back is definitely on my to-see list.
posted by tallman at 12:22 PM on June 6, 2001

Actually, no. If you have 23 people in a room, the odds are about 50% that two will share a birthday.

Well, except that in this case we're talking about two SPECIFIC individuals, not any two out of 23 - so it's still 1/365. (Or 1/366, depending....)
posted by binkin at 12:24 PM on June 6, 2001

If it wasn't for Kevin Smith, would Jason Mewes even get work?

Mewes wasn't even interested in acting until Smith told him that he had been cast in Clerks. So the short answer is no... Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back should be funny, no sappy plot like Chasing Amy or Catholic bashing as in Dogma just a pointlessly funny Kevin Smith flick. I'm there! Gonna' see Evolution. my GF wants to see Tomb Raider (I don't know either..). sorry AI looks too cheesy for me. not sure about the rest...
posted by srw12 at 12:36 PM on June 6, 2001

Erm... I don't know. It seemed like a cool stat when I saw it for the first time. High-concept math is way over my head.
posted by starvingartist at 12:38 PM on June 6, 2001

I got nobody on my bitrthday. Unless you count Mark Wahlberg WHICH I DON"T!!. Mel Torme died on my birthday though and Ryan Phillipi and Greasy Reese Witherspoon were married on my birthday... Damn, still got nobody...
posted by srw12 at 12:46 PM on June 6, 2001

I've got Kate Winslet, Clive Barker, Guy Pearce, Michael Andretti, and the late Donald Pleasence. Anyone have Dec. 18th? DMX, Christina Aguilera, Katie Holmes and Steven Spielberg share that birthday.
posted by Cavatica at 1:00 PM on June 6, 2001

Just to clarify somewhat, Spielberg is tagged as Exec. Producer for JP3, but some fella named Joe Johnston is doing the actual "directing." But since it's all about the special effects....
posted by kphaley454 at 1:04 PM on June 6, 2001

For animation, Final Fantasy is the best looking of the bunch. After following the games, a movie was a natural progression.

Shrek characters still have about 800,000 a pop and with some advanced techniques incorporating muscles modeled under the skin and new fluid FX. But Shrek deliberately downed down the detail level for an overall artistic style.

Atlantis is showing the kinks in Disney's crown, but it's a hybrid of CGI and Ink. I am still a fan of the old way...

Not mentioned is the rerelease of Akira. It has been printed from the original negative with a remastered dolby digital soundtrack. They also redubbed the english to exactly match the original script. The sync with the voice animation is lost, but hell it's a dubbed Japanese film. Besides, it's rare to actually get a word for word translation. There is probably a web site devoted to this topic so I will make only one example. Since it is also being rereleased, In Monty Python's Holy Grail the line "Of course I'm French, can't you tell from my outrageous accent?" was changed by the French to "Of course I'm French, can't you tell from my distinguished face?"

Just a little factoid about the song "I Will Always Love You", it was originally written and performed by Dolly Parton.

Finally, I also read the gamespy interview and decided to have to fun with it. Too much free time I guess.
posted by john at 1:09 PM on June 6, 2001

Joe Johnston did Jumanji for Spielberg.
posted by Cavatica at 1:10 PM on June 6, 2001

I'm Dec 18th, cav. It's also got Keith Richards and Cy Young. Seven days before Christmas. It was a very good day.
posted by jpoulos at 1:12 PM on June 6, 2001

Francis Ford Coppola, Jack Black, Russell Crowe, and Jackie Chan!
posted by Mrmuhnrmuh at 1:13 PM on June 6, 2001

I am so glad someone else remembers the Dolly original. Whitney can't get off the pipe long enough to write her own songs....
posted by bradth27 at 1:19 PM on June 6, 2001

I got Krist Kristofferson and Meryl Streep. Seems like a wash.
posted by jennaratrix at 1:21 PM on June 6, 2001

Oops, that would be KRIS Kristofferson. Damn it.
posted by jennaratrix at 1:22 PM on June 6, 2001

you have to admit, though....Kristofferson wrote some great songs....although he should have stayed away from both the camera and the microphone...
posted by bradth27 at 1:27 PM on June 6, 2001

What can I say Brad? I'm a bastion of trivial facts. All this "light" information does keep me from sinking in the vast seas of information.
posted by john at 1:35 PM on June 6, 2001

Jesus God. All I've got are Al Molinaro, Kelly Wiglesworth, and Mick Fleetwood. I think I must have been hatched by a rooster atop a dungheap at midnight.
posted by Skot at 1:36 PM on June 6, 2001

Yeah, and Barbra Streisand. Yeesh, "A Star is Born" is unfortunately all I can think of. Agreed on the songwriting, tho.
posted by jennaratrix at 1:37 PM on June 6, 2001

Marky Mark...Tim Burton, and those "damn dirty apes": now that is a recipe for some good times.

I remember coming home after school in the late 1970's, and being treated to those marathon weeks of the Planet of the Apes series. I don't recall many media-consumption expreiences nearly as enjoyable.

I can't wait to see the 2001 version.
posted by mapalm at 1:54 PM on June 6, 2001

Sir Robin Day, Kevin Kline, Dervla Kirwan, F. Murray Abraham, Bill Wyman, Luciano Berio, Bob Kane, Tito Gobbi, Sybil Thorndike.

I can't work out if that's good or not...
posted by Grangousier at 2:09 PM on June 6, 2001

David Lee Roth, Tanya Tucker, Ben Vereen, Ed Wood and . . . Thelonius Monk. A wash or a killer, depending on your vantage point. Either Monk outweighs them all, that is, or Ed and Thelonius do, etc. Maybe very early Tanya, but on second thought, no.
posted by raysmj at 2:11 PM on June 6, 2001

Early Tanya. Thanks. Now, I will have that damn Delta Dawn song in my head all day.
posted by bradth27 at 2:16 PM on June 6, 2001

AND NOW SO DO I! Dammit, brad!
posted by jennaratrix at 2:37 PM on June 6, 2001

Sorry....... I didn't mean to...
Hey! What's that flower you've got on?
Could it be....
posted by bradth27 at 2:54 PM on June 6, 2001

Wow, what a stunner. I don't want to see any of those films Zach listed.

Wake me when the Coen brothers release a new one.

Oh, fine, I might see Moulin Rouge, because I'm a fan of huge ambitious messes (Apocalypse Now, Fight Club, Magnolia, etc.) and because Strictly Ballroom was sweet.

Gah. That list makes me want to gag. AI will be putrid, because Spielberg couldn't find his way around a story if he was given a map. Kevin Smith can't direct and writes exposition, not dialogue. The rest of them aren't "films" as much as they are "pan-global marketing campaigns with penetration into every medium the giant corporate behemoth that financed this $100 million piece of shit owns."

There needs to be a second strata. Somewhere below the abominable threshold of Paramount/WB/Universal et. al, but above the snarky cliquishiness of indie film.
posted by solistrato at 3:03 PM on June 6, 2001

Helena Christensen, Annie Lennox, Sissy Spacek, Barbara Mandrell, Jimmy Buffett, Rod Serling... And Jesus, although IMDB doesn't list him.
posted by fujikodunc at 3:42 PM on June 6, 2001

I have an icy heart, apparently, because I get faintly ill just thinking of Ewan McGregor warbling "I Will Always Love You." Oh well. I'll still see Moulin Rouge for the supreme joy of laughing at all of the supposedly poignant parts.

As for the birthday bingo, I get Jessica Alba, Penelope Cruz, Jay Leno, Marcia (Mrs. Kotter) Strassman, Ann-Margret, Harper Lee (my heroine) and two sides of the historical coin, Oskar Schindler and Saddam Hussein. I'm just trying to figure out why Saddam has an iMDb listing.
posted by Dreama at 3:57 PM on June 6, 2001

Dreama: It's not exactly a masterpiece, but the cheesy music is played for laughs, or at least the audience I watched it with thought so. The original music is another story entirely. Thank God there is precious little of it. Fun too look at, in any case -- the movie, that is. Like the concept, the aesthetics, just needed some meat. Oh well. Far lesser movies have been praised out the wazzo.
posted by raysmj at 4:14 PM on June 6, 2001

fujikodunc: we share a birthday! I'll console you if you'll console me.
posted by rodii at 4:26 PM on June 6, 2001

And by the way, they didn't list Bogie?

More importantly, Isaac Newton, Rickey Henderson, Carlos Castaneda, Little Richard or Gary Sandy?

Or, most importantly of all, Shane McGowan?
posted by rodii at 4:36 PM on June 6, 2001

I can't wait to see Planet of the Apes. Man, when I was a kid, I loved those apes!
posted by culberjo at 4:48 PM on June 6, 2001

Saddam might have been a mistake. Jerry Haleva does such a good job, it's scary.
posted by john at 4:54 PM on June 6, 2001

I'm just trying to figure out why Saddam has an iMDb listing.

Matt Stone played him in this.
posted by jpoulos at 5:19 PM on June 6, 2001

I was wondering about Bogie, too. Probably they just don't have a date for him.

If Saddam is in IMDB, where's Jesus? Certainly he's been a character in enough movies... More importantly, why am I obsessing over Jesus? It's not like it's his real birthday.
posted by fujikodunc at 6:32 PM on June 6, 2001

I LOVED Moulin Rouge. The first movie I actually enjoyed Nicole Kidman in. I thought Luhrman's use of music was brilliant - a tour de force. (I liked Strictly Ballroom & Dogma, too) Ewan McGregor finally got a romantic lead, & he took it and ran with it. He's my new fave male heartthrob. AI looks too Blair Witch-y with the internet promotion, & kind of weenyish, too. I'll see Lara Croft because I like edgy Angie & any movie based on a video game with a girl hero is ok in my book. Other than that, I'll wait for LOTR & Harry Potter. Oh, & I share my birthday with Christopher Walken, Al Gore, Richard Chamberlain, Shirley Jones, Gordy Howe, Herb Alpert, Cesar Chavez, Rene Descartes, Joseph Haydn and...Ewan McGregor! (swoon)
posted by Lynsey at 9:16 PM on June 6, 2001

Oddly enough, I not only have the same birthday as David Duchovny, I also have the same wedding anniversary. Oooooh.

The film I really want to see this summer is The Score. I'll nominate it right now, sight unseen, for best cinematography done by someone who used to be a Macworld Contributing Editor (not a very large category, btw) (yeah, Rob's a friend). But seriously, any film with Robert DeNiro, Marlon Brando, Edward Norton, and Angela Bassett will be worth watching.
posted by Dori at 1:13 AM on June 7, 2001

What was wrong with Dogma? Granted, it was the first Kevin Smith film with competitive financial backing and looked almost (gasp!) commercial. Of the four productions so far it looks the most "professional" and Hollywood-like. Big names were used in key places, instead of just whoever was hanging out with Smith at the time he was writing the script. Opportunity for product placement and merchandising, which is one area Smith has obviously embraced. However, after Chasing Amy I can forgive Kevin Smith for "selling out," because he manages to skirt a fine line with Dogma that impressed me greatly. He simultaneously sells out while not selling out at all. I just dig how the guy operates.

He'll never beat his first work, but in some ways Dogma gets close. It certainly beats Clerks in production value, and beats Mallrats in both comic timing and allowing the audience to like the characters. It's easier on the eyes than Clerks. It's not as funny as Clerks, but Dogma does have its moments. Dogma is true to itself: its laws of metaphysics, tho based upon admittedly questionable religious dogma, holds true to its own rules consistently, without sacrificing opportunities for humor or plot. In fact the exposition is the plot. Anyone who questions such writing could never truly appreciate Shakespeare, who did that all the time.

The liberties Smith takes are self-absorbed or in-jokey, like choosing Morrisette as God, but he lets the audience in on the joke and so as such can be forgiven. I'd've probably put Suzanne Vega there were I in his director's chair, simply because I've always wanted to meet her. Where's the harm? Smith doesn't claim to be making art. The best art comes from such pure playful experimentation. Anyone see the movie Timecode? Gimmicky and too coarsely staged, but what a romp! Unwitting art. Like a kid with a chemistry set who accidently invents a solution that ....uh, blows up the family dog or ..or something...
posted by ZachsMind at 1:45 AM on June 7, 2001

How nervous must Speilberg be. Taking over a Kubrick film. Will he pull a great film out of his hat? I have a sneaky feeling he will.

Final Fantasy looks like the only proper 'event' movie.

Moulin Rouge I'll go and see just because of Romeo and Juliet.

The rest are nothing new. Just usual summer films by numbers.

I wont to know if Human Nature will follow on the other two ex-music-video-genius-turned-feature-director smashes.
posted by fullerine at 2:18 AM on June 7, 2001

The Score is definitely my pick for the summer, though i still have yet to see Memento. I am also very excited for the Apocalypse Now Redux, and Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back. Everything else is just eye candy and stupid humor, but I'll probably see (and enjoy) most of it anyway (aren't I supposed to as a typical 19 year old male?) Oh, and I've got Jenny McCarthy, Anthony Kiedis, and Larry Flynt.
posted by rorycberger at 2:39 AM on June 7, 2001

The number of posts to this thread surprised me; it's pretty neat that movies provoke such intensity (good & bad). Maybe we need a MetaMovie site to discuss, review, and analyze movies? And for my money...PoTA is something I will have to see, but I'm going in with a healthy skepticism...Burton is a god-like creature (his movie-worlds inpsire awe), but tackling something as "mainstream" and well-known as PoTA has the potential to backfire. Got my fingers crossed.
posted by davidmsc at 3:05 AM on June 7, 2001

First, on Tim Burton as god: have you seen Stain Boy? I don't know if I'd call the guy a god...

Examining this thread again, one thing's for sure. Most of us see a couple of the movies as worth giving a chance, and the rest are flying under the radar. However, each of us have calibrated our "radar" for different things, and therefore we each choose different targets. So Hollywood, in its desperate need to attract crowds of individuals with a wide range of interests, have no choice but to design their product to appeal to a majority. One man's trash is another's treasure. I guess the logic is if they can market trash as treasure they'll turn more heads.

People argued last year that Gore was a liberal trying to appear more conservative and Bush was a conservative trying to appear more liberal. The result was two guys from opposite sides merging towards the middle, attempting to whitewash themselves in hopes of appeasing more voters. It felt like deciding whether the old Pepsi was better than the New Coke, which was a worthless argument. Either way you still get battery acid.

Looking at the news media, why do they focus on bad news more than good news? Because people generally tune into car wrecks and death counts more than 'human interest' stories. Is this the fault of politics, that we get a choice that isn't a choice? Is this the fault of our entertainment industry? Or are we telegraphing to them as a mob what is acceptable? Middle of the road vanilla?

More people tune into Jerry Springer than Charlie Rose. Whose fault is that? The masses won't flock to Memento because at a glance they don't know what it is, but put out something more familiar, like a sequel to something that worked well a couple years ago, or a remake of an old tv show, and you've recycled an old mousetrap. They'll beat a path to your door.

Are we, by our lemming-like actions, just telling them to send us crap? Does the fault not lie in our stars, but in ourselves?
posted by ZachsMind at 3:30 AM on June 7, 2001

What was wrong with Dogma?

Dogma just plain sucked.

Compared to all of his other movies, I cannot remember one funny scene. I sure as hell didn't laugh when I saw it. I can usually tolerate his dialogue (which sounds nothing like real speech), but in this movie it came across as extra forced and artifical.

I also found the movie's message to be overly preachy and way too pro-religion. It is the worst film Kevin Smith has done.

Timecode stunk too. Gimmicky and boring. After seeing it I have a new rule: "Just because it's digital doesn't mean its good".
posted by owillis at 5:54 AM on June 7, 2001

I don't know. I think the Buddy Christ alone made Dogma a cool movie.

Also, I saw Shrek last night, it was cool.
posted by dagnyscott at 6:58 AM on June 7, 2001

I enjoyed Dogma a great deal. I didn't expect it to be an out-and-out comedy, and it wasn't. What it was, was a fantasy film based on mythological material, like many others. It just happened to be based on mythological material a lot of people still believe in, which pissed some of them off. The shit monster was utterly gratuitous, of course, but it was balanced out for me by the parking garage scene. "You sound like the Morningstar!" sent chills down my spine. That has to be the most dangerous accusation one angel can make to another.

Maybe if I'd seen other Smith movies first I would have had higher expectations and enjoyed it less. Guess I'm glad I hadn't.
posted by kindall at 7:58 AM on June 7, 2001

I can't not weigh in re: Dogma. I have a fabulously high tolerance even for movies I loathe, but Dogma was just worthless: it was the first movie I have rented in a long time that I bailed on halfway through. (I'm pretty sure the last rented movie I bailed on was the execrable Prospero's Books.) I mean, not one laugh. And it seems to me that you have to work REALLY, REALLY HARD to waste Linda Fiorentino in such a definitive way.

After being unforgivably kicked in the movie groin by Chasing Amy, Kevin Smith follows it up with this rabbit punch? I won't be seeing anything else of his.

(Not trying to pick a fight, of course, just giving my particular $.02.)
posted by Skot at 8:27 AM on June 7, 2001

I loved Prospero's Books. And liked Chasing Amy, actually. Why do people hate that movie so?
posted by rodii at 9:09 AM on June 7, 2001

I also found the movie's message to be overly preachy way too pro-religion.

Don't mean to make this a Kevin Smith debate but I read this and am still thinking "HUH??" the movie spent significant time making fun and picking on Catholicism. I guess I'm just curious how one comes to this conclusion. Overall, this thread proves that different people have different tastes (now there's a news flash). I also think it depends on why you are going to the movies. If you want intellectually stimulating artsy stuff, don't see "the Mummy Returns", "Jurasic Park", et cetera. If you want serious cinema, for god sakes don't go see "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back". and so on and so forth...different strokes I guess.
posted by srw12 at 9:52 AM on June 7, 2001

rodii: I think it has to do with the fact that the lovers totally stop using the f-word in every sentence when there is a serious scene, and then start using words such as "sated."
posted by raysmj at 9:55 AM on June 7, 2001

Oh, just remembered the other important-sounding word used in a serious "Chasing Amy" scene. It was "cathartic." Goodness. Was all frustrated, then it just came to me out of nowhere.
posted by raysmj at 10:19 AM on June 7, 2001

What was wrong with Dogma?

Dogma just plain sucked. Compared to all of his other movies, I cannot remember one funny scene. I sure as hell didn't laugh when I saw it...

Let me put it this way so that I'm not misundertood. I'm not saying Dogma's a perfect work of cinematic art. I'm saying it's a fantastic piece of shit. Follow:

I see it is necessary to educate some people on when Dogma is funny. This is unfortunate, but I must stand steadfast and defend this fine piece of shit. Admittedly it does help to have some vague connection to western religion mythology in your past, and preferably a rather sceptical and cynical attitude toward it now, in order to grok the film. I mean if you're an aetheist or you've never been a Christian, then chances are most of it will go right over your head, but if you see this film as pro religion or anti religion or pro or anti anything, you're taking it too seriously, and you obviously didn't read the disclaimer. It's got GEORGE CARLIN in it for Christ's sake! Not laughing at Carlin is like claiming Lenny Bruce deserved being incarcertated for saying "fuck." I mean really!

I really hate to do this but some of you simply leave me no choice. What follows is a scene by scene play by play of the first several minutes of the film. Feel free to print this out, and then go rent Dogma and watch it with this trusty list with you, so you know when it is alright to laugh. Think of it as a laugh track. And for those of you with a sense of humor, your mileage may vary of course. This is intended as a helpful guide for those having difficulty grasping the concept. Hopefully by the time Jay and Silent Bob actually show up in the film you'll have gotten the hang of it. If not, let me know where you're stuck and I'll try to help you out via email or something. Anyway, here we go.

The disclaimer - less than thirty seconds into the film it's funny. However it requires that you read it. If you're a platypus, you may take offense to it, and should leave the room.
EXT ASBURY PARK BOARDWALK - DAY Nothing funny about this scene unless you find it amusing that punk kids are beating up on a defenseless old man. It's okay not to laugh here. But if you want to laugh, go ahead. I won't judge you.
RED BANK, NEW JERSEY - The sight of George Carlin in a cardinal outfit should at least illicit a chuckle (please see George Carlin timeline and other historical data if you're unclear on just who George Carlin is.) Here are the punchlines in his speech. Notice the italicized words.

"People find the bible obtuse. Even hokey."
"Christ didn't come to Earth to give us the willies."
"I give you The Buddy Christ!"
VISUAL: the statue itself is pretty damn funny. Even JC himself would bust a gut here.
"..Just somethin' we've been kicking around the office.."

MILWAUKEE, WISCONSIN - The airport terminal scene.
Loki (to Nun): " it and I'll fuckin' spank you." Bonus points if you grok his reference to the Lewis Carroll work.
Loki (to Nun): "..go get yourself a nice dress. Fix yourself up."
Loki (to Bartleby): "I just like to fuck with the clergy, man.."
Bartleby: "..what that guy doesn't know, is the girl cheated on him when she was away. Loki: "She did?" Bartleby: (nods) "Twice."
Loki: "This why you brought me down here? This why you made me miss my fuckin' cartoons?"
Bartleby: "Quit leering at me man. People will think I just broke up with you."
Bartleby: " have to keep reading!"
Loki: "Let it never be said that your anal retentive attention to detail never yielded positive results!" Bartleby: "You can't be anal retentive if you don't have an anus."
Bartleby: "There hasn't been an angel of death since you quit. Doesn't that mean anything to you?"
Loki: "Last four days on Earth? Mmm! If I had a dick I'd go get laid. We can do the next best thing." Bartleby: "What's that?" Loki: (shrugs) "Let's kill people." (an extra overhears and spits out her coffee) "Oh, not you!"

McHENRY, ILLINOIS - The Church scene is largely exposition. What the priest is saying is integral to understanding the end of the movie, but most people don't listen to the priest because most people in society have conditioned themselves to not listen to priests, as is evident in the rest of the scene when most of the extras aren't listening either. Admittedly this is a flaw in Kevin Smith's otherwise excrutiatingly fantastic piece of shit. We also meet Bethany here, but it's generally an unfunny scene. Let's move on.
McHENRY, ILLINOIS - Abortion Clinic is the only scene in which we see Janeane Garofalo, who Kevin should have used more. She's a funny, intelligent, talented, and last but certainly not least drop dead gorgeous hunk a burning luv! But I digress. Let's continue.
Liz: "Holy shit it's the Pope!"
Liz: "...we already used that excuse when we killed Christ."
Bethany: "'re suggesting I need to get filled? Liz: "In more ways than one. You need to get laid, Bethany Sloane. You need a man. If only for ten minutes." Beth: "It's been my experience that the average male is never a man. Not even for ten minutes in his entire lifespan..." Actually this entire scene is well writ. Now everybody wave goodbye to Janeane.. *heavy sigh*

AZRAEL - His introductory scene where he has a woman killed for her air conditioning is largely uneventful humor-wise. The actual second where Mrs. Reynolds dies is good for a nervous shock giggle.

BETHANY'S BEDROOM INT. - When Beth puts out the Metatron, please laugh. When Alan Rickman drops his pants, feel free to laugh. This whole scene's deliciously funny. I won't recite the entire thing but here's a few punchline highlights. (Rickman gets the best ones. Linda's just playing 'straighman' here.)

"Sweet Jesus! D'you have t'use the whole can?"
"I'm as anatomically incorrect as a Ken doll."
" wonder you're single!"
"You people. If there isn't a movie about it, it's not worth knowing, is it?"
"Any documented occasion when some yahoo claims that God has spoken to them, they're speakin' t'me. Or they're talkin' to themselves."
"...we went through five Adams before we figured that one out."
"Noah was a drunk - look what he accomplished. And no one is askin' you to build an ark."
"They're called Watchers. Guess what they do?"
Beth: Sex is a joke in Heaven?" Metatron: "The way I understand it, it's mostly a joke down here too."

ABORTION CLINIC INT. - Actually there's a bit here that's funny from the point of view of an armchair director. Notice the terrible way Kevin Smith goes from Bethany's bedroom to the Abortion Clinic. You can't tell if she's leaving her apartment to go to work, or leaving an office inside the abortion clinic to head to the front door. In fact it looks like her apartment is IN the abortion clinic. If that were the case, why would she be heading towards her car? I got a giggle out of this bit. This movie's a great piece of shit.

ABORTION CLINIC EXT. - The big entrance of Jay & Silent Bob. Kevin's little tribute to the Batman sitcom of the sixties is fun, when they show up to save the day. Like the cavalry or something. *shrug* I laughed. I'm surprised he didn't throw in a couple BIFF POW ZOWIEs. Jay: "We're here to pick up chicks."

Okay I'm worn out and unfortunately have too much of a life to do the whole movie this way, although that would be fun, I feel I've made my point. There's on average a laugh a minute in this film. If you can't see it at this point I've done all I can.

Oh. One more great line: "I feel like I'm Han Solo, and you're Chewie, and she's Ben Kenobi, and we're in that fucked up bar."
posted by ZachsMind at 11:53 AM on June 7, 2001

Bzzt! Sorry. Wrong-o. It ain't funny. See: Chasing Amy, Mallrats, Clerks for real Kevin Smith funny. Dogma still blows (exceedingly long post and all).
posted by owillis at 12:22 PM on June 7, 2001

Yeah, but every knows that God is not Alanis. It may have been ironic that her song "Ironic" was more about bad luck (rain on your wedding day) then irony. Of course, she could have know this and therefore it was ironic. SNL did a skit once (with John Lithgow I think) called "ironic theater." It kept showing plays that were not ironic at all. It would cut back to John and he got more and more mad.

Which is all kind of weird because some people wished to God that they had never seen The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension that John Lithgow was in. Yet, I was pretty happy with the movie even though he didn't play God. Ironic, no?
posted by john at 12:40 PM on June 7, 2001

yeah but "the awesome power of God's voice explodes man's heart and mind" (paraphrase)... then for God to be Alanis was one of the best jokes of the movie. for me
posted by srw12 at 12:47 PM on June 7, 2001

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