First word discovered in unopened Herculaneum scroll
October 12, 2023 2:26 PM Subscribe
The first word has been discovered from the Herculaneum papyri! The Vesuvius Challenge is a machine learning and computer vision competition to read the Herculaneum Papyri, which are a library of papyrus scrolls, preserved by the eruption of Mt. Vesuvius in 79 CE. While the scrolls have been preserved, they're too delicate to unfurl without destroying them. However, the scrolls can be virtually unwrapped using 3D scanning and ink detection.
Luke Farritor, a college student, developed a machine learning model that revealed one readable word in the papyri, for which he won the $40,000 First Letters Prize. Casey Handmer, who was the first person to find substantial, convincing evidence of ink within the unopened scrolls and whose insights led directly to Luke’s discovery, was awarded a $10,000 First Ink Prize. Youssef Nader built on Luke's findings, and also independently discovered the same word Luke did, and was awarded a second place $10,000 prize.
What's the word you ask? It's porphyras:
"One papyrologist noted: 'The sequence πορφυ̣ρ̣ας̣ may be πορφύ̣ρ̣ας̣ (noun, purple dye or cloths of purple) or πορφυ̣ρ̣ᾶς̣(adjective, purple). Due to the lack of context it is not possible to exclude πορφύ̣ρ̣α ς̣κ[ or πορφυ̣ρ̣ᾶ ς̣κ[.'"
A $700,000 prize remains for the following achievement: "Read at least 4 separate passages of continuous and plausible text from the scrolls, each at least 140 characters long." Approximately 80 days remain in the challenge!
(Previously.)
Luke Farritor, a college student, developed a machine learning model that revealed one readable word in the papyri, for which he won the $40,000 First Letters Prize. Casey Handmer, who was the first person to find substantial, convincing evidence of ink within the unopened scrolls and whose insights led directly to Luke’s discovery, was awarded a $10,000 First Ink Prize. Youssef Nader built on Luke's findings, and also independently discovered the same word Luke did, and was awarded a second place $10,000 prize.
What's the word you ask? It's porphyras:
"One papyrologist noted: 'The sequence πορφυ̣ρ̣ας̣ may be πορφύ̣ρ̣ας̣ (noun, purple dye or cloths of purple) or πορφυ̣ρ̣ᾶς̣(adjective, purple). Due to the lack of context it is not possible to exclude πορφύ̣ρ̣α ς̣κ[ or πορφυ̣ρ̣ᾶ ς̣κ[.'"
A $700,000 prize remains for the following achievement: "Read at least 4 separate passages of continuous and plausible text from the scrolls, each at least 140 characters long." Approximately 80 days remain in the challenge!
(Previously.)
Be...sure...
Be sure to - okay it's something really important!
Next word...drink. Be sure to drink...your...Ovaltine? God damn it!
posted by Naberius at 2:37 PM on October 12, 2023 [36 favorites]
Be sure to - okay it's something really important!
Next word...drink. Be sure to drink...your...Ovaltine? God damn it!
posted by Naberius at 2:37 PM on October 12, 2023 [36 favorites]
"Owah. Dafulay. Yam."
"And we're supposed to chant this?"
"That's what it says."
"For how long?"
"Says to just keep going."
posted by PlusDistance at 3:14 PM on October 12, 2023 [8 favorites]
"And we're supposed to chant this?"
"That's what it says."
"For how long?"
"Says to just keep going."
posted by PlusDistance at 3:14 PM on October 12, 2023 [8 favorites]
every time i see a story about this or anything like this comes up i can't stop myself from thinking "what if it's aristotle what if it's all the aristotle we lost what if it's the stuff they say was well-written instead of a pile of student notes." and then i'm like "holy shit, sappho! sappho could be in there! we could actually read sappho!"
whatever it is it's probably not the lost works of aristotle or sappho, but still the slim chance that it might be aristotle or sappho gives the whole thing this numinous glamour, right?
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 3:24 PM on October 12, 2023 [32 favorites]
whatever it is it's probably not the lost works of aristotle or sappho, but still the slim chance that it might be aristotle or sappho gives the whole thing this numinous glamour, right?
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 3:24 PM on October 12, 2023 [32 favorites]
What's the word you ask? It's porphyras:
Oooooh could it be porn???
I mean, it's probably a receipt or inventory or ledger
...but I hope it's porn.
posted by muddgirl at 3:25 PM on October 12, 2023 [9 favorites]
Oooooh could it be porn???
I mean, it's probably a receipt or inventory or ledger
...but I hope it's porn.
posted by muddgirl at 3:25 PM on October 12, 2023 [9 favorites]
"holy shit, sappho! sappho could be in there! we could actually read sappho!"
We find bits and pieces of Sappho with (in this context) some regularity.
posted by praemunire at 3:30 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
We find bits and pieces of Sappho with (in this context) some regularity.
posted by praemunire at 3:30 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
Anyway, my little history nerd-geek inner self absolutely loves it when tech is used in actually useful and clever ways to recover information to balance out...*waves hand*.
posted by praemunire at 3:32 PM on October 12, 2023 [13 favorites]
posted by praemunire at 3:32 PM on October 12, 2023 [13 favorites]
Feed the cat.
posted by Czjewel at 3:49 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by Czjewel at 3:49 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
It's going to be about copper, odds on.
posted by maxwelton at 4:02 PM on October 12, 2023 [17 favorites]
posted by maxwelton at 4:02 PM on October 12, 2023 [17 favorites]
"Pound pastrami, can kraut, six bagels--bring home for Emma."
posted by indexy at 4:34 PM on October 12, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by indexy at 4:34 PM on October 12, 2023 [8 favorites]
Jokes on all of you, it's also a complaint about copper to Ea-nāṣir.
posted by JHarris at 5:11 PM on October 12, 2023 [26 favorites]
posted by JHarris at 5:11 PM on October 12, 2023 [26 favorites]
"I herewith send to you 500 ( talents ) of copper. As my brother's greeting-gift, I send it to you. My brother, do not be concerned that the amount of copper is small."
posted by clavdivs at 5:37 PM on October 12, 2023
posted by clavdivs at 5:37 PM on October 12, 2023
One manuscript is titled Non Carborundum Illegitimi
posted by interogative mood at 6:58 PM on October 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by interogative mood at 6:58 PM on October 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
o
oh
ohs
ohsh
ohshi
ohshit
ohshitVesuv--
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:06 PM on October 12, 2023 [5 favorites]
oh
ohs
ohsh
ohshi
ohshit
ohshitVesuv--
posted by Halloween Jack at 7:06 PM on October 12, 2023 [5 favorites]
i have stained
the palla
that was in
the chest
and which
you were probably
wearing
to the convivium
forgive me
it's purple now
like wine
and like plums
posted by verbminx at 7:23 PM on October 12, 2023 [48 favorites]
the palla
that was in
the chest
and which
you were probably
wearing
to the convivium
forgive me
it's purple now
like wine
and like plums
posted by verbminx at 7:23 PM on October 12, 2023 [48 favorites]
(Metafilter: this thread could not pass without a "this is just to say" parody)
posted by verbminx at 7:24 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by verbminx at 7:24 PM on October 12, 2023 [3 favorites]
"Porphyras! It’s one word…I love it! I usually go for the whole sentence myself, but this is perfecto! Porphyras, you know… It’s so mysterious. "
posted by stevis23 at 7:40 PM on October 12, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by stevis23 at 7:40 PM on October 12, 2023 [4 favorites]
This is jaw-droppingly cool. The scrolls are misshapen lumps of charcoal. The fact that we can actually extract data from them is wonderful. It's ridiculous. Classicists must be salivating over this.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:04 PM on October 12, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:04 PM on October 12, 2023 [12 favorites]
This is so very exciting. I remember in highschool learning about this collection, and that we hoped one day to finally be able to read it.
I'm personally hoping there's Pytheas' account of his journeys to the far north somewhere in there.
posted by Audreynachrome at 11:27 PM on October 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
I'm personally hoping there's Pytheas' account of his journeys to the far north somewhere in there.
posted by Audreynachrome at 11:27 PM on October 12, 2023 [1 favorite]
Word.
posted by brundlefly at 11:47 PM on October 12, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by brundlefly at 11:47 PM on October 12, 2023 [5 favorites]
I'm reminded of the mosaic I saw in Pompeii... maybe 25 years ago? A dog snarling, with the legend "CAVE CANEM." Beware of Dog. Apparently it's pretty famous, and it cracked me the hell up.
Also, this is really really neat.
posted by brundlefly at 11:50 PM on October 12, 2023 [7 favorites]
Also, this is really really neat.
posted by brundlefly at 11:50 PM on October 12, 2023 [7 favorites]
Ceterum autem censeo Carthaginem esse delendam
posted by DreamerFi at 1:27 AM on October 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by DreamerFi at 1:27 AM on October 13, 2023 [3 favorites]
You know what's cool, is that the original excavators or whoever (archeologists I suppose) PRESERVED those misshapen lumps of charcoal in hopes that someone someday would find a way to read what's on them... somehow. May we learn a lesson about unreasonable hope and patience from this story.
posted by MiraK at 3:07 AM on October 13, 2023 [25 favorites]
posted by MiraK at 3:07 AM on October 13, 2023 [25 favorites]
🥐
posted by brachiopod at 3:48 AM on October 13, 2023
posted by brachiopod at 3:48 AM on October 13, 2023
You know what's cool, is that the original excavators or whoever (archeologists I suppose) PRESERVED those misshapen lumps of charcoal
Yes! But it makes me wonder what evidence we have been destroying in every dig because we had no idea that "time particle residue" or whatever was a thing. "Those maniacs just shoveled through all of those soul shadows as if the people who lived there didn't even matter!"
posted by pracowity at 4:05 AM on October 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
Yes! But it makes me wonder what evidence we have been destroying in every dig because we had no idea that "time particle residue" or whatever was a thing. "Those maniacs just shoveled through all of those soul shadows as if the people who lived there didn't even matter!"
posted by pracowity at 4:05 AM on October 13, 2023 [4 favorites]
I'm certain it was, "Actually...."
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 4:29 AM on October 13, 2023
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 4:29 AM on October 13, 2023
it's also a complaint about copper to Ea-nāṣir
Why didn't I learn about this document in my business law course???
posted by ZenMasterThis at 5:41 AM on October 13, 2023
Why didn't I learn about this document in my business law course???
posted by ZenMasterThis at 5:41 AM on October 13, 2023
"Per my scroll of 78 AD..."
posted by Naberius at 5:58 AM on October 13, 2023 [11 favorites]
posted by Naberius at 5:58 AM on October 13, 2023 [11 favorites]
"Klaatu..."
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 6:56 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 6:56 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
"Never gonna give you up, never gonna... dammit!"
posted by MrVisible at 7:24 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by MrVisible at 7:24 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
"We would like to speak with you about your extended chariot warranty"
posted by briank at 7:43 AM on October 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by briank at 7:43 AM on October 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
You know what's cool, is that the original excavators or whoever (archeologists I suppose) PRESERVED those misshapen lumps of charcoal in hopes that someone someday would find a way to read what's on them
Yes! That's what kind of blows my mind. Not that these scrolls were initially preserved by the eruption two thousand years ago, but that the people who found it during the 1700s didn't immediately screw the pooch and accidentally destroy them. Retroactive Nobels for all!
posted by brundlefly at 8:19 AM on October 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
Yes! That's what kind of blows my mind. Not that these scrolls were initially preserved by the eruption two thousand years ago, but that the people who found it during the 1700s didn't immediately screw the pooch and accidentally destroy them. Retroactive Nobels for all!
posted by brundlefly at 8:19 AM on October 13, 2023 [5 favorites]
this is really so incredibly cool. I love that despite all the yucky poo going on in our world there are pure nerds out there working so hard on this project. I will faint with utter delight if its Sappho (its not gonna be Sappho) but even if its just about the price of copper its wonderful!
posted by supermedusa at 9:24 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by supermedusa at 9:24 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
This is really cool. I was reflexively suspicious at the mention of machine learning but it seems like they're validating results and not just accepting the dreams of some neural net. (Maybe this is unfair of me but there's so much AI bullshit around right now.)
Aristotle and Sappho would be nice, but I want Heraclitus's book.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 9:35 AM on October 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
Aristotle and Sappho would be nice, but I want Heraclitus's book.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 9:35 AM on October 13, 2023 [6 favorites]
This is amazingly appropriate! We are visiting Herculaneum tomorrow. Might need to ask the guide about the latest info!
posted by TedW at 11:50 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by TedW at 11:50 AM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
> Aristotle and Sappho would be nice, but I want Heraclitus's book.
i hear it’s never the same book twice
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 2:00 PM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
i hear it’s never the same book twice
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 2:00 PM on October 13, 2023 [2 favorites]
This is amazingly appropriate! We are visiting Herculaneum tomorrow
picts!
posted by clavdivs at 2:40 PM on October 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
picts!
posted by clavdivs at 2:40 PM on October 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
I look forward to when they finally find the correspondence to the owner of the villa notifying the occupant that their chariot’s extended warranty is about to expire.
posted by interogative mood at 7:53 PM on October 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by interogative mood at 7:53 PM on October 13, 2023 [1 favorite]
i know it's just a joke and i should really just relax, and like i've been trying not to say this, but my attempts to not say it have failed and as such i find myself compelled to note that the amount of time that passed between ea-nasir selling bad copper and vesuvius exploding is nearly the same as the amount of time that passed between vesuvius exploding and this post appearing on metafilter.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 5:08 AM on October 14, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 5:08 AM on October 14, 2023 [9 favorites]
i hear it’s never the same book twice
My fear is that Heraclitus would turn out to be a sort of pre-Socratic Malcolm Gladwell if we got to see the full writings.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 7:36 AM on October 14, 2023
My fear is that Heraclitus would turn out to be a sort of pre-Socratic Malcolm Gladwell if we got to see the full writings.
posted by paper chromatographologist at 7:36 AM on October 14, 2023
> My fear is that Heraclitus would turn out to be a sort of pre-Socratic Malcolm Gladwell if we got to see the full writings.
see that's one reason i'm on parmenides's side. there's a lot of things you can say about his philosophy, but one thing you definitely can't do is accuse him of being the presocratic malcolm gladwell.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 8:13 AM on October 14, 2023
see that's one reason i'm on parmenides's side. there's a lot of things you can say about his philosophy, but one thing you definitely can't do is accuse him of being the presocratic malcolm gladwell.
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 8:13 AM on October 14, 2023
picts!
Grooving together in a cave with several small species of furry animals? I think that was Pompeii.
posted by TedW at 12:24 PM on October 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
Grooving together in a cave with several small species of furry animals? I think that was Pompeii.
posted by TedW at 12:24 PM on October 14, 2023 [2 favorites]
« Older That's how I got my call sign | Bwah ha ha ha ha Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by phooky at 2:33 PM on October 12, 2023 [60 favorites]