Finally (9) virgins in space
January 19, 2021 10:27 AM Subscribe
On Sunday afternoon, Virgin Orbit joined the rare club of companies that have privately developed a rocket and successfully launched it into orbit.
Moreover, with its LauncherOne rocket dropped from a 747 aircraft, the California-based company has become the first to reach orbit with an air-launched, liquid-fueled rocket.
Video
The payloads onboard LauncherOne today were selected by NASA LSP as part of the agency’s CubeSat Launch Initiative (CSLI). Nearly all of the CubeSat missions were designed, built and tested by universities
Moreover, with its LauncherOne rocket dropped from a 747 aircraft, the California-based company has become the first to reach orbit with an air-launched, liquid-fueled rocket.
Video
The payloads onboard LauncherOne today were selected by NASA LSP as part of the agency’s CubeSat Launch Initiative (CSLI). Nearly all of the CubeSat missions were designed, built and tested by universities
They still can't drive.
posted by Jessica Savitch's Coke Spoon at 11:03 AM on January 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
posted by Jessica Savitch's Coke Spoon at 11:03 AM on January 19, 2021 [2 favorites]
Wankfests notwithstanding, this isn't the space tourism thing, that's Virgin Galactic, and they're still struggling with their flight testing. Maybe their rocketplane-cum-tyre-fire could learn some things from their, inexplicably buoyant, stock price.
Virgin Orbit OTOH are entering a tricky marketplace, slightly ahead of the pack, but years behind first place. With Rocket Lab looking like they'll be able to reuse first stages later this year, small launch is getting to be a tough market to compete in. I do hope VO manage to get one off from the UK though, partly for sentimental reasons, and partly for the comedy value of Spaceport Newquay!
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 11:11 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Virgin Orbit OTOH are entering a tricky marketplace, slightly ahead of the pack, but years behind first place. With Rocket Lab looking like they'll be able to reuse first stages later this year, small launch is getting to be a tough market to compete in. I do hope VO manage to get one off from the UK though, partly for sentimental reasons, and partly for the comedy value of Spaceport Newquay!
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 11:11 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
The air launch thing is interesting. What advantage does that confer aside from getting X amount of altitude for free?
posted by lazaruslong at 11:31 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by lazaruslong at 11:31 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
lazaruslong: You get more launch opportunities to specific orbits, since you don't have to wait for the target orbit to pass over your launch site. That could be useful if you want to be able to lob a spy satellite over a target at short notice, so the military has a whole responsive launch office contracting with a bunch of these little startups.
There are also some minor efficiency and operational improvements; launching from altitude means you don't have to optimise your first stage nozzle for sea-level, so you can get improved ISP. You get lower drag losses since the air is thinner. You can fly down to the equator if you want to get the extra boost from the Earth's rotation for low-inclination orbits. You can launch to lower inclinations than your launch site.
I think most of these benefits would be outweighed by the cost of developing an aircraft, but if you're owned by an airline that can give you a big plane with a handy spare engine hardpoint, then I guess it pencils out.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 11:44 AM on January 19, 2021 [11 favorites]
There are also some minor efficiency and operational improvements; launching from altitude means you don't have to optimise your first stage nozzle for sea-level, so you can get improved ISP. You get lower drag losses since the air is thinner. You can fly down to the equator if you want to get the extra boost from the Earth's rotation for low-inclination orbits. You can launch to lower inclinations than your launch site.
I think most of these benefits would be outweighed by the cost of developing an aircraft, but if you're owned by an airline that can give you a big plane with a handy spare engine hardpoint, then I guess it pencils out.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 11:44 AM on January 19, 2021 [11 favorites]
Far more importantly, it gets you Y amount of speed for free. Getting into space isn't about going up, it's about going sideways really fast.
Also, rocket engines work better if they aren't exposed to different outside air pressures - being able to start in the high atmosphere allows the engine to be designed for a lower outside pressure and not need to worry about operating at 1 atmosphere.
posted by Hatashran at 11:44 AM on January 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
Also, rocket engines work better if they aren't exposed to different outside air pressures - being able to start in the high atmosphere allows the engine to be designed for a lower outside pressure and not need to worry about operating at 1 atmosphere.
posted by Hatashran at 11:44 AM on January 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
Over on Metatalk I was reading the item about snark and criticism causing people to be less likely to create posts.
Tabbed back to this thread on an interesting topic, and what's the first comment?
I find Richard Branson's wankfest like that of Elon Musk and the others to be completely unpalatable
I will probably get shot down in flames here - I'm not interested in flaming you, but the coincidence was really striking.
posted by doctornemo at 11:52 AM on January 19, 2021 [15 favorites]
Tabbed back to this thread on an interesting topic, and what's the first comment?
I find Richard Branson's wankfest like that of Elon Musk and the others to be completely unpalatable
I will probably get shot down in flames here - I'm not interested in flaming you, but the coincidence was really striking.
posted by doctornemo at 11:52 AM on January 19, 2021 [15 favorites]
Those advantages make sense. Thank you, folks who are smart about this topic! :)
posted by lazaruslong at 11:59 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by lazaruslong at 11:59 AM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
The biggest advantage is really the ability to launch into any orbit and fewer weather worries since the aircraft can take off in weather that no commercial rocket would. The advantage of extra altitude and speed is diluted because the rocket has to be dropped and left to free fall for several seconds before ignition to avoid roasting the plane. It ends up with a velocity vector in the wrong direction and only getting an ~300mph boost in speed.
The flexibility, though, is a big enough advantage that I suspect Virgin Orbit will be around for a while.
posted by wierdo at 11:59 AM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
The flexibility, though, is a big enough advantage that I suspect Virgin Orbit will be around for a while.
posted by wierdo at 11:59 AM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
(thanks doctornemo)
What advantage does that confer aside from getting X amount of altitude for free?
There's a lot of discussion on forums if air launching is at all practical, technically and economically. A lot of space fans are quite doubtful. One point I have not read is that just demonstrating it's possible is a significant plus. A lot of amazing tech is not the result of huge new inventions but a long series of fine tunings. Look at solar/battery/cell phones. But folks don't get to do fine tuning until the first proof. The Wright Brothers could not take you to visit your sick aunt 'across the pond'. It may not be a viable technology, or could lead to results that improve the lives of billions.
posted by sammyo at 12:05 PM on January 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
What advantage does that confer aside from getting X amount of altitude for free?
There's a lot of discussion on forums if air launching is at all practical, technically and economically. A lot of space fans are quite doubtful. One point I have not read is that just demonstrating it's possible is a significant plus. A lot of amazing tech is not the result of huge new inventions but a long series of fine tunings. Look at solar/battery/cell phones. But folks don't get to do fine tuning until the first proof. The Wright Brothers could not take you to visit your sick aunt 'across the pond'. It may not be a viable technology, or could lead to results that improve the lives of billions.
posted by sammyo at 12:05 PM on January 19, 2021 [5 favorites]
It ends up with a velocity vector in the wrong direction
I'd be interested to see VO's data on how much they're able to blunt this effect by using their over-spec aircraft. That 747 makes a pretty serious looking pull-up right before release.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 12:26 PM on January 19, 2021
I'd be interested to see VO's data on how much they're able to blunt this effect by using their over-spec aircraft. That 747 makes a pretty serious looking pull-up right before release.
posted by rhamphorhynchus at 12:26 PM on January 19, 2021
I have no problem with the science.
rhamphorhynchus kindly points out that Virgin Orbit does not equal Virgin Galactic although it is part of beardy's group.
My problem is more with Branson and his ilk whose vast space investments always seem more geared toward fame and titillation for the 0.01% than any possible service to humanity, where in my very small opinion this investment could possibly be better spent.
posted by adamvasco at 12:35 PM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
rhamphorhynchus kindly points out that Virgin Orbit does not equal Virgin Galactic although it is part of beardy's group.
My problem is more with Branson and his ilk whose vast space investments always seem more geared toward fame and titillation for the 0.01% than any possible service to humanity, where in my very small opinion this investment could possibly be better spent.
posted by adamvasco at 12:35 PM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
"My problem is more with Branson and his ilk whose vast space investments always seem more geared toward fame and titillation for the 0.01% than any possible service to humanity, where in my very small opinion this investment could possibly be better spent."
I mean, yeah? That's science in a capitalist society in a nutshell. All us ordinary people can do is hope that the system channels that greed into the occasional benefit to society.
posted by dazed_one at 1:16 PM on January 19, 2021
I mean, yeah? That's science in a capitalist society in a nutshell. All us ordinary people can do is hope that the system channels that greed into the occasional benefit to society.
posted by dazed_one at 1:16 PM on January 19, 2021
700 millions for the project, 12 million a pop for rocket. Not much but so much. The end result I see is a continuous reason to orbit. The thing is, one would lose money if the decision were made to liquidate the project/donate proceeds to those who need it, a space university, vaccines, etc.
Though I'll admit, showcasing your newly minted status as a orbital sub overlord should come with a better " here's what it wii do for you" PR handout.
posted by clavdivs at 1:35 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Though I'll admit, showcasing your newly minted status as a orbital sub overlord should come with a better " here's what it wii do for you" PR handout.
posted by clavdivs at 1:35 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Launching a space missile (though not into orbit) out of a plane was something that the US Air Force did in the 1970s, in that era of no-idea-to-weird-or-gruesome-to-fund; they put parachutes on a Minuteman ICBM and pushed it out the back of a C-5 Galaxy, flew quickly away, then set it off. It worked, as a test. It wasn't about height or velocity, it was about hiding the warheads: the idea was that to have nuclear missiles moving constantly in a shell-game inside a constantly travelling fleet of transport aircraft would make them more survivable in WWIII, since hitting a plane in the air is a lot more difficult than hitting a silo, and an attacker could never be sure which plane was empty and which held a warhead—which is absolutely feasible, to solve the 'preserve retaliation against a Soviet first-strike' problem, if an expensive solution. I imagine some USAF risk quantifier pointed out the number of aircraft accidents, then suggested what would happen if you added a solid-fuelled ICBM and a nuclear warhead, before the project was put quietly away. Submarines do the same deterrent job a lot more 'safely'.
The Minuteman is solid-fuelled, which removes a lot of handling risk. Liquid fuelling an orbital rocket to air-launch, though, makes me have risk opinions. I would not want to be that aircraft's pilot, crew, or insurer.
There's also the problem of discrimination and risk in doing anything involving rockets, a moving launch, and orbital trajectories:
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 3:22 PM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
The Minuteman is solid-fuelled, which removes a lot of handling risk. Liquid fuelling an orbital rocket to air-launch, though, makes me have risk opinions. I would not want to be that aircraft's pilot, crew, or insurer.
There's also the problem of discrimination and risk in doing anything involving rockets, a moving launch, and orbital trajectories:
lob a spy satellite over a target at short notice, so the military has a whole responsive launch office contracting with a bunch of these little startupsEvery nuclear power has to have a system to decide, in that 'Dmitri, what the fuck is that dot on the screen?' space of minutes, whether a rocket being launched across one's territory is going into orbit, going into space to attack a satellite, or descending ballistically onto a target. Man I would not want to pitch a startup whose business case involved the potential to be, at best, shot down, at worst, strategically pre-empted.
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 3:22 PM on January 19, 2021 [4 favorites]
[it’s worth remembering scale here; the sums that private companies are putting into space seem large, and are; but compared to the money and energy the US and USSR (and others) spent on space tech for the purposes of nuclear war, they’re laughably trivial, just pocket change. The Cold War was a maldistribution of resources so colossal that humanity got the space programme as a thoughtful buy-one-get-one-free gift.]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 4:53 PM on January 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 4:53 PM on January 19, 2021 [8 favorites]
This isn't actually the first orbital air launch platform. Pegasus was doing that decades ago up to nearly the present. However, it's ridiculously expensive compared to Virgin Orbit's quoted price so it was very rarely used, which I'm sure contributed to the high cost.
The ability to use an only lightly modified 747 (it's mainly extra plumbing and a release mechanism because a stock 747 already has a hard point to ferry a fifth engine) and the higher launch cadence should help keep the price down.
posted by wierdo at 5:22 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
The ability to use an only lightly modified 747 (it's mainly extra plumbing and a release mechanism because a stock 747 already has a hard point to ferry a fifth engine) and the higher launch cadence should help keep the price down.
posted by wierdo at 5:22 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
Submarines do the same deterrent job a lot more 'safely'.
Maybe I'm biased because I spent quite a few months sleeping next to a Trident D5 SLBM, but given the track record for nuclear submarines, and SSBNs in particular, I don't really know what the scare quotes around safely are about. The US Navy has never, to the best of my knowledge, dropped a nuclear bomb on US soil.
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 6:14 PM on January 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
Maybe I'm biased because I spent quite a few months sleeping next to a Trident D5 SLBM, but given the track record for nuclear submarines, and SSBNs in particular, I don't really know what the scare quotes around safely are about. The US Navy has never, to the best of my knowledge, dropped a nuclear bomb on US soil.
posted by Mr.Encyclopedia at 6:14 PM on January 19, 2021 [3 favorites]
When it comes to a technology designed to destroy the habitable planet, there's no way 'safety' isn't a bit of a handwavey quantity. The least safe thing about them is their functional use as intended...
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 6:18 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
posted by Fiasco da Gama at 6:18 PM on January 19, 2021 [1 favorite]
The least safe thing about them is their functional use as intended...
Just ask the Air Force.
Interesting about the secret nuke shoot and scoot.
"Imagine a technology that could detect roadside bombs and landmines buried underground, pick out a nuclear warhead from a cloud of decoys miles away,..."
posted by clavdivs at 6:41 PM on January 19, 2021
Just ask the Air Force.
Interesting about the secret nuke shoot and scoot.
"Imagine a technology that could detect roadside bombs and landmines buried underground, pick out a nuclear warhead from a cloud of decoys miles away,..."
posted by clavdivs at 6:41 PM on January 19, 2021
Excellent Scott Manley video: Virgin Reaches Orbit With The Help of Cosmic Girl.
posted by Pendragon at 11:02 AM on January 20, 2021
posted by Pendragon at 11:02 AM on January 20, 2021
I'm kind of waiting for Rocketlab to announce a sea launch system for the Electron which would permit many of the same inclination selections as the Virgin Orbit system without the risk of a large bomb going off just below the wing of a 747. (Or even ground service operators having to disconnect the plumbing like a gas station attendant? Eeeecccch.)
Still, it'll be interesting to see how all the smallsat launchers shake out. Between Rocketlab's Electron and Virgin Orbit's LauncherOne and Astra's rocket (does it have a name?), there's a lot of options for rides smaller than a Falcon 9. I suspect Rocketlabs has a good first mover advantage, and if they do manage to get recovery nailed down, their prices ought to drop dramatically.
posted by Kyol at 2:37 PM on January 20, 2021
Still, it'll be interesting to see how all the smallsat launchers shake out. Between Rocketlab's Electron and Virgin Orbit's LauncherOne and Astra's rocket (does it have a name?), there's a lot of options for rides smaller than a Falcon 9. I suspect Rocketlabs has a good first mover advantage, and if they do manage to get recovery nailed down, their prices ought to drop dramatically.
posted by Kyol at 2:37 PM on January 20, 2021
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posted by adamvasco at 10:53 AM on January 19, 2021 [9 favorites]