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Troopergate Update
November 3, 2008 8:26 PM   Subscribe

An independent investigator hired by the Alaska Personnel Board has cleared Governor Sarah Palin of wrongdoing in the Troopergate controversy. (Executive summary and recommendations of the report). As previously covered in MeFi, the Alaskan legislature had conducted its own investigation and had concluded that Governor Palin had indeed abused her power in dismissing Public Safety Commissioner Walt Monegan, but the independent investigator concluded that the Legislature's special counsel used the wrong state law as the basis for his conclusions and also misconstrued the evidence in the investigation.
posted by gyc (96 comments total)

 
How dare you post something about Palin that's not viciously negative? Don't you know this is MeFi you're posting to?

Personally, I don't find this surprising at all. If Palin wasn't involved in the presidential election I doubt this ever would have been any kind of a problem for her.
posted by Autarky at 8:28 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


Hopefully by this time tomorrow, none of this will matter.
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:29 PM on November 3, 2008 [4 favorites]


This is the same Alaska Personnel Board that reports to the Governor?
posted by mrnutty at 8:30 PM on November 3, 2008 [24 favorites]


Well, it was a problem for her before she was involved in the presidential election, so I have no idea what you are talking about.
posted by Freen at 8:30 PM on November 3, 2008 [5 favorites]


Some people just want to hang onto their jobs after *knock on wood* Palin returns to govern Alaska.
posted by drezdn at 8:32 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


Yes, that's the same Personnel Board with her three handpicked members.
posted by jalexei at 8:32 PM on November 3, 2008 [4 favorites]


I'm happy that she has friends.
posted by ob at 8:34 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


So, you're saying that you can cheat with a stacked deck, then?!

Do tell...
posted by markkraft at 8:36 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


An independent investigator hired by the Alaska Personnel Board has cleared Governor Sarah Palin of wrongdoing in the Troopergate controversy.

The Alaska Personnel Board is appointed, and fired, by the governor of Alaska.

In other news, O.J.'s search for the real killers continues.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:37 PM on November 3, 2008 [32 favorites]


You have two councils, both independent, giving conflicting stories.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 8:37 PM on November 3, 2008


You have two councils, both independent, giving conflicting stories.

Only a True Maverick can be both guilty AND innocent.
posted by brain cloud at 8:39 PM on November 3, 2008 [9 favorites]


She's a study in contradictions, that one.
posted by Astro Zombie at 8:51 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


Darn.
posted by Saxon Kane at 8:54 PM on November 3, 2008


Polls in Va. close in about 19 hours. That's the last time I plan to ever think about Sarah Palin.
posted by drjimmy11 at 8:55 PM on November 3, 2008 [5 favorites]


Hey! As Autarky notes, this is no place for balanced reporting on Palin :)

This new development is mildly interesting, although the phrase "handpicked members" lends a certain sickly pallor to the phrase "independent report".

This is from the Alaska Personnel Board Overview:
The Personnel Board, also created by the Personnel Act, is an independent agency composed of members appointed by the Governor.

And this is from the government factsheet about the Personnel Board:
Special facts: Regulatory. Board elects chair. Members may be removed by the Governor only for cause.

So....independent? You tell me. I realize I am accusing them of corruption (or at least inappropriate partisanship and misconduct) without any actual evidence, but it doesn't seem like much of a stretch.

I'm with The Card Cheat - I hope that tomorrow the great hand of the American people will reach up and smack Palin back into the Alaska newspapers and out of the NY times national section. Then they can iron out "Troopergate" (ugh) by themselves.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 8:56 PM on November 3, 2008


Oliver North??
posted by niles at 8:58 PM on November 3, 2008


Before America sends her back to Alaska, I have one last hope that we get to see Palin jump on stage and tell us we can't handle the truth.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 9:05 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


Only a True Maverick can be both guilty AND innocent.

Those two love to throw around the word 'Maverick.' I bet James Garner is a little irked.
posted by jonmc at 9:11 PM on November 3, 2008


I'd like to stop hearing about, seeing, thinking about, or having to hear speak, Sarah f'ing Palin. Enough already. I'm even starting to get annoyed at Tina Fey at this point.
posted by mmahaffie at 9:17 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


I always figured Palin wanted this to be referred to the Personnel Board only when she was guaranteed of its outcome there, but I'm pretty sure she has not picked the current three members of the Personnel Board...or at least not all of them. Maybe somebody has a source on that; it's been a while since I saw it.
posted by troybob at 9:18 PM on November 3, 2008


Hey Palin:

Fuck you. You make this country look bad. Get the fuck out of it.
posted by Mikey-San at 9:21 PM on November 3, 2008 [4 favorites]


So long, and thanks for all the fish.
posted by Eekacat at 9:24 PM on November 3, 2008 [3 favorites]


Report might be more believable had release not been timed hours before the polls open.

Fat lot of good it'll do her though.
posted by PeterMcDermott at 9:25 PM on November 3, 2008


my only consideration in voting was troopergate.
posted by b_thinky at 9:28 PM on November 3, 2008


This changes EVERYTHING.
posted by dirtdirt at 9:31 PM on November 3, 2008


Last Palin thread?
posted by hellojed at 9:31 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


Oh thank God. I was all nervous about voting for Obama because he's black, but felt I had to because Palin was guilty of using personal influence to push some mid-level manager out of his job. Now that I know she's innocent of that, I can vote for her with a clear conscience.

Full Disclosure: I own a company that manufactures rape kits.
posted by Joey Michaels at 9:33 PM on November 3, 2008 [9 favorites]


Meanwhile, it's a landslide for Obama as the first poll closes.

Sarah Who?
posted by maudlin at 9:34 PM on November 3, 2008


troybob: Here is the AK Personnel Board roster. One of the three was reappointed by Palin in January. But regardless, Palin can fire all of them (as long as she can come up with a cause).

I should also note that the Personnel Board themselves did not conduct the investigation, but the Board did hire the investigators.
posted by Salvor Hardin at 9:34 PM on November 3, 2008


Fuck you. You make this country look bad. Get the fuck out of it.

Hey Palin:

Fuck you. You are in Reno right now and the disturbance in the force is sending chills down my spine. Get the fuck out of here.
posted by clearly at 9:40 PM on November 3, 2008


Here's the question: Why would she decide to refuse to co-operate with the first investigation and have a second initiated, if she didn't expect a more favourable result from the latter?

Not that anything like this matters for the election. This election, anyway. 2012 awaits.
posted by topynate at 9:43 PM on November 3, 2008


> Last Palin thread?

Let's hope so, but...
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:45 PM on November 3, 2008


I should also note that the Personnel Board themselves did not conduct the investigation, but the Board did hire the investigators.

Timothy Petumenos, the independent investigator hired by the Personnel board that cleared Palin, donated $1000 to a Democratic Congressional candidate last year. So there's at least some evidence that he's not just a partisan Republican hack.
posted by gyc at 9:47 PM on November 3, 2008


From Washington Post:
...her attorneys attempted to take the investigation out of the hands of the legislative investigator by asking her handpicked three-person State Personnel Board to look into the matter.

She hand-picked 3 people who looked into this and said she's not guilty. And the other board had more than half republicans and they said she is guilty.

None of this really matters because the facts of the case that were reported make it obvious that even if the word of law wasn't broken, the spirit was shot, quartered, hanged and its ass was alltogether seriously kicked.
posted by rainy at 9:48 PM on November 3, 2008


and it looks like Petumenos donated another $1000 to the same Democratic Congressional candidate in late August.
posted by gyc at 9:50 PM on November 3, 2008


BTW I have an unfounded suspicion that S. Palin chose to run for governor at least partly to get back at the trooper. It'd be funny if she became VP when it all started with a grudge... and she still wouldn't be able to fire him.
posted by rainy at 9:50 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


I hate her proud-to-be-a-yokel shrill horrid voice.

Fuck McCain for choosing her, as not the best person for VP, but as a tactic. That shows what he really thinks of the country.
posted by mattoxic at 9:53 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


I hope she gets a reality show.



With Omarosa.
posted by Esoquo at 9:56 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


Autarky: If Palin wasn't involved in the presidential election I doubt this ever would have been any kind of a problem for her.

Presumably you didn't know that the original investigation was started months before Palin was selected for the VP nomination. The legislature, with a Republican majority, was very concerned about the unexplained and abrupt dismissal of a widely respected state police chief. They were particularly concerned since she replaced him with a Christian evangelical to her liking who lasted only two weeks before it was revealed that he had a record of reprimands for sexual harassment on his previous job.
posted by JackFlash at 9:56 PM on November 3, 2008 [4 favorites]


So there's at least some evidence that he's not just a partisan Republican hack.

On the other hand, since early September and until now, the GOP has repeatedly interfered with discovery and interrogation procedures, to the point that the results are nothing but poisoned.

There were also additional allegations of ethics violations, in addition to those violations she was found guilty of in October. If the investigation had proceeded on a normal timetable, it was unclear that results for these additional complaints would have been available for some months after the general election.

So if there's any sense that the results are tainted, that would be the fault of Republican hacks who kept guiding and rushing the investigation to the desired result, that needed to be released before November 4.
posted by Blazecock Pileon at 10:04 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


Just because a guy donates to a democrat doesn't mean they can't be corrupted. This "investigation" was a total sham from the get go, designed entirely to provide political cover. If Palin hadn't been selected as VP she probably would have cooperated with the first investigation (as she claimed she'd do before being selected)
posted by delmoi at 10:04 PM on November 3, 2008


heh- you people are a a collective piece of work....

Obama says his energy plan will bankrupt the coal companies and make electricity prices skyrocket.... and you people are bickering about some partisan hack job investigation...

Can't we discuss something more relevant to the state of the union like the color of her shoes?

(shakes head and walks away)
posted by Jfalways at 10:06 PM on November 3, 2008


Jesus, who the fuck are you? Go away, please.
posted by puke & cry at 10:09 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


Obama says his energy plan will bankrupt the coal companies and make electricity prices skyrocket.... and you people are bickering about some partisan hack job investigation...

Uh HUH. Cite please? A real one, not some maniacal froth site?

(shakes head and walks away)

Yeah. Didn't see that coming. Drop by any time, really.
posted by George_Spiggott at 10:11 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


Obama says his energy plan will bankrupt the coal companies and make electricity prices skyrocket

Is that what he said? Did he talk about how his stance on abortion will bankrupt hospitals around the country and make the price of health care skyrocket? Did he mention how his education plan will accidentally burn your house down and leave every child in this country with a 2nd grade reading level?
posted by Civil_Disobedient at 10:29 PM on November 3, 2008 [3 favorites]


That shows what he Republicans really thinks of the country.

fact is without the fundie vote going 80% (R) the Republican Party is officially fucked for the foreseeable future, until they become a saner version of the Democratic Party (an entirely possible evolution, but it would take decades flipping the 3%-97% rational/fundie powerbalance that currently exists in the party.

OH, MO, VA, CO, PA, . . . McCain needs those states and I for one thought adding Palin to the ticket made it more likely he'd get them.
posted by troy at 10:44 PM on November 3, 2008


leave every child in this country with a 2nd grade reading level?

We'll all be...freepers?
posted by maxwelton at 10:46 PM on November 3, 2008 [3 favorites]


Can't we discuss something more relevant to the state of the union like the color of her shoes?

Y-yes we can?
posted by Doublewhiskeycokenoice at 10:57 PM on November 3, 2008 [1 favorite]


NPR in the last week has been annoying me violently because every time I turn it on they're either a) talking about Tina Fey b) talking about Sarah Palin or c) talking about 30 Rock.

Today they hit the trifecta because Tina Fey was on Fresh Air talking about Sarah Palin and 30 Rock.

I am seriously thinking about telling them that I don't WANT a coffee mug when they run their next fundraiser.

Please, lords of sky and earth, let tomorrow be the last time I ever hear anything about Sarah Palin again ever. I will give you a sacrifice of an NPR coffee mug, which I shall shatter on the floor in honor of thine awesome might should you grant my request.
posted by winna at 10:59 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


Here's a little-known secret about Tina Fey: She ain't that funny.
posted by bardic at 11:09 PM on November 3, 2008


If this is the last Sara Palin thread (hope against hope!) then we might as well put on some Jefferson Starship.
posted by hellojed at 11:58 PM on November 3, 2008 [2 favorites]


winna: you're seriously setting yourself up for disappointment. Next 10-20-30 years, pick your poison, she'll be somewhere between white oprah, female bill o'reilly and (political angle) huckabee. If Obama is elected, there's still probably going to be more stories about her than him. I don't mind, she is mildly amusing.
posted by rainy at 12:26 AM on November 4, 2008


As much as I put one up, I would say nearly all Palin threads are the following (with many favourites and 500 comments):

LOLWHUT PALIN INSANITY
O RLY?/NO WAY
YA RLY/YES WAY
LOLPALIN
I LOVE SNARKING ON PALIN AS IF IT WERE MY PROFESSION!! TELL ME MORE ABOUT IT
YOU ENJOY THIS SNARKING YOU SNARKY SNARKING PERSON etc.

Fun, but the comedy value is somewhat mined these days (even for Tina Fey).
posted by jaduncan at 12:27 AM on November 4, 2008 [2 favorites]


puke & cry writes "Jesus, who the fuck are you? Go away, please."

Spoken like a true lie-beral Demon-rat, rejecting Jesus Christ Our Lord and Savior, even as you admit you don't know Him in your heart! U-S-A!! U-S-A!!!
posted by orthogonality at 12:35 AM on November 4, 2008 [2 favorites]


(shakes head and walks away)

Well, you can maybe walk up to Dixville Notch -- a tiny town in New Hampshire that fits Palin's profile of "real America" perfectly. A tiny conservative town, they haven't voted for a Democrat since 1964, and cast their ballots according to an old tradition right at midnight.

Yes, Dixville Notch -- good Americans in an old-school town; "Live Free or Die" on their license plates, God, guns, & Jesus in their hearts.

Walk on up to Dixville Notch, New Hampshire and bask in the glow of small-town U.S.A., friend. Walk on up there and tell us what you see.
posted by Shepherd at 2:56 AM on November 4, 2008


Between the stories of abusing power, spending tax payer money on trips for her kids, and never complying with requests from the media, it's like Palin is determined to give us a potent reminder of the excesses of the Bush administration. If Alaska declared war on some country that wronged her mom, the circle would be complete.
posted by drezdn at 3:21 AM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


Obama says his energy plan will bankrupt the coal companies and make electricity prices skyrocket.... and you people are bickering about some partisan hack job investigation...

I think I got the license plate of that hit and run.
posted by nudar at 3:24 AM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


Here's a little-known secret about Tina Fey: She ain't that funny.

Whaaaaaat??? You clearly do not watch 30 Rock.
posted by mek at 3:30 AM on November 4, 2008


ROUGH. You lumped her in with all the other Sarahs.
posted by gman at 4:32 AM on November 4, 2008


Shit! And I just voted for Obama because I thought Palin couldn't be trusted. Can I re-vote?
posted by pmbuko at 5:07 AM on November 4, 2008


If this is the last Sara Palin thread (hope against hope!) then we might as well put on some Jefferson Starship.

Or how about some Jerry Jeff Walker?
posted by PeterMcDermott at 5:13 AM on November 4, 2008


I'm even starting to get annoyed at Tina Fey at this point.
posted by mmahaffie

I think Tina Fey is getting annoyed with Tina Fey at this point. There are multiple points in this where I feel like I can detect distinct tinges of disgust on her face.

I feel bad for Tina. Hopefully she won't have to do it much longer.
posted by six-or-six-thirty at 5:24 AM on November 4, 2008


Polls in Va. close in about 19 hours. That's the last time I plan to ever think about Sarah Palin.

Please, lords of sky and earth, let tomorrow be the last time I ever hear anything about Sarah Palin again ever.


Haven't you heard? Palin in 2012!
posted by brandman at 5:33 AM on November 4, 2008


Bad choice for VP? You betcha.

I still think Sarah's hawt, in a real-estate-lady, corporate clip-art sort of hawt. I like Tina Fey, too. Could just be the brunette thing (I married one)
posted by Artful Codger at 6:00 AM on November 4, 2008


Hey Palin: Fuck you. You make this country look bad. Get the fuck out of it.

This can probably be arranged. First, we give a lot of money to the AIP....
posted by the_bone at 6:13 AM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


Looking back, one of my happiest moments from this election season was a few months ago. I was standing in a Chinese restaurant in New Orleans with a friend of mine. "Did you hear John McCain picked a running mate?" he said "Sarah Palin, the governor of Alaska." And I was able to answer, with complete sincerity: "Who?"

It was a simpler time, which I long for, and yet to which I can never return.
posted by Who_Am_I at 6:42 AM on November 4, 2008 [2 favorites]


I'm not buying the 'white Oprah' thing....I'm guessing it will be more like 'female Pat Robertson'. Every three or four years she'll say something so batshit insane that the press will cover it. It's not like she has the authority to give running critique on the Obama administration--not using her own words, anyway.

And what better outro than her way creepy SNL appearance last night...
posted by troybob at 7:04 AM on November 4, 2008


NPR in the last week has been annoying me violently because every time I turn it on they're either a) talking about Tina Fey b) talking about Sarah Palin or c) talking about 30 Rock.

Today they hit the trifecta because Tina Fey was on Fresh Air talking about Sarah Palin and 30 Rock.

I am seriously thinking about telling them that I don't WANT a coffee mug when they run their next fundraiser.

Please, lords of sky and earth, let tomorrow be the last time I ever hear anything about Sarah Palin again ever. I will give you a sacrifice of an NPR coffee mug, which I shall shatter on the floor in honor of thine awesome might should you grant my request.
posted by winna at 10:59 PM on November 3 [2 favorites +] [!]


Here's a little-known secret about Tina Fey: She ain't that funny.
posted by bardic at 11:09 PM on November 3 [+] [!]


Man, theres some Gospel right there. Why Terry Gross is revered as some sort of public radio deity for her regular fawning over SNL hacks I'll never understand.
posted by Reverend John at 7:26 AM on November 4, 2008


I'm embarrassed to ask - but this is a serious question I'm sneaking in down here. I've lived in the US for 15 years as a Brit expat - but I'm suddenly overcome with a feeling I don't get the national sense of humor. Last night's prime time SNL Presidential Bash? Sarah Palin's cameos? (Not Tina Frey's!). I didn't get them!!!

Googling around simply reveals Palin was considered a good sport - by the partisan. And not a natural comic, to say the least - by the antis. Fair enough. But I thought they were completely surreal - far, far beyond - say, - Kinnock famously messing around with Tracey Ullman in a pop video - years ago back in the UK. I thought the timing of the candidates appearances was unbelievable - and the message a kind of deeply subversive truth, that politics is just a huge joke -perpetrated on the electorate? Obviously, I'm "misunderestimating" something? Right?

I don't know where else to ask this. Is there a write up I should read to lift my dazed fog?
posted by Jody Tresidder at 8:06 AM on November 4, 2008


On the eve of the election, Palin has also released a doctor's note saying she's healthy, and the McCain campaign is now claiming in press releases that Palin has "released her medical records." This would be correct if you were, say, retarded.

Let's make sure that's on the record on what will be the last significant day of Palin's political career: this is a person who wanted to be a heartbeat away from the presidency and refused to give a single press conference, refused to release her medical records to the public, refused to answer any questions about multiple concerns of both her intellectual and moral capability of elected leadership, and has now asked a couple of friends to say she was innocent after an earlier investigation found her guilty of abusing her office and pretend it has any merit, let alone an equal one.

Palin is running for the second-highest public office in America, and in the short two months of her national relevance she has done nothing but show utter contempt for the public on a daily basis. What amazes me the most about this FPP, and the people who support this most recent move, is how they seem to be so proud of her for that.
posted by XQUZYPHYR at 8:21 AM on November 4, 2008 [2 favorites]


Jody, the explanation is depressingly banal, and has nothing to do with the "national sense of humor". NBC and SNL are milking their fleeting return to the spotlight for everything they can get out of it. In all SNL's thirty-mumble seasons they've had maybe four or five -- at a generous estimate -- in which anyone paid very much attention to them: the first two or three, and maybe the Dana Carvey/Mike Myers era. That's it. Tina Fey's fortuitously cute Palin impression is to SNL what the WTC attacks were to Guiliani: "Wow! I don't know what this thing is, but suddenly people are liking me! I'm going to use this at every opportunity!"

That one guy's Obama impression is more par for SNL's course these days -- not even remotely well observed, just going through the comedy motions without a single idea of what might make it funny and hoping a laugh falls out somewhere.

They knew it'd be over today no matter what happened, so they quickly threw together something that touched all the buttons that seemed to be working. There isn't any evidence that any actual person thought last night was funny, it was just SNL trying to get the last few drops out of it.
posted by George_Spiggott at 8:36 AM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


George_Spiggott: No one paid attention to SNL except for the few seasons that you mention? Really? Then how do you explain the careers of Eddie Murphy, or Adam Sandler, or even Billy Crystal? (Hint: It wasn't Crystal's appearances on Soap.) I can understand getting tired of SNL; I haven't been a regular watcher for years. No need to overstate your case, though.
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:44 AM on November 4, 2008


Jody: It's not a national-sense-of-humor thing. Palin's thing last night was flat; I don't think there was really anything to get except that she'll show up wherever she's told and will say whatever she's told to say.

What was strange about it was echoed in her appearance on the news today, when she had a kind-of press conference after she voted. You could see the defeat, even to the point where Todd (the first time I've heard him speak) said something about how it has been an interesting experience, with the sense that it is coming to an end. She also did this strange thing where she wouldn't say how she voted because people have a right to keep their votes private; I took this to be sort of comfort to those McCain-Palin voters who would feel embarrassed for voting for them. Or that she voted for Obama because she thinks it improves her career prospects. Also, maybe she's tired of playing grown-up; she looks tired.

I think that basically she is not someone who makes sense outside the limited context of election end-season; she makes little enough sense within it. The men she have supported her will pretty much just go back to their porn and/or administrative duties within the Lou Dobbs Fan Club, and the "empowered" women will return to Dr. Laura and Dancing with the Stars.
posted by troybob at 8:59 AM on November 4, 2008


George_Spiggott,

Thanks so much. So - the slightly awful truth - which I will readily accept - is that I am the one absurdly over-thinking last night's SNL show in a sarcastically liberal, slightly constipated, British ex-pat way? (I guess I'm a run-of-the-mill sarcastic liberal!) Because Palin has alarmed me so much - and I can't fathom the dozy affection some American Republicans maintain they have for her - there's an odd pocket of diehard - but oddly pleasant! -Republicans I know where I live - and because (yes, you're right) I do attach too much to SNL's now stale reputation for clever satire - I thought last night's show was intending to open people's eyes to her awful reality?

But the "proper" response is just an eye-roll?

SNL was just merrily exploiting Palin's happy greed for publicity and the "extra" wink I thought I was seeing behind Fey taking the piss out of Palin's now almost self-knowing wink was basically all in my head?
posted by Jody Tresidder at 9:10 AM on November 4, 2008


I think that basically she is not someone who makes sense outside the limited context of election end-season; she makes little enough sense within it.

Troybob,

That does make sense.
Maybe I'm just running behind all the rest of you, determined to make long term sense of who Palin is - and how she should be perceived -outside the sort of bad fever dream parts of this election - when that's not really the point at all...
posted by Jody Tresidder at 9:26 AM on November 4, 2008


My my my... such hostile retorts when a simple google search would tell you the facts....

Obama was caught on tape saying he would bankrupt the coal industry....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hdi4onAQBWQ

and that he would make the price of electricity skyrocket....
http://hotair.com/archives/2008/11/02/obama-ill-make-energy-prices-skyrocket/

But please... go on with your informed discussion and tell anyone who might bring pesky facts in to "Fuck off"

How sad for you.
posted by Jfalways at 9:39 AM on November 4, 2008


...the "extra" wink...

Actually, I think that is real. Fey is not part of SNL; she is a former writer there, then performer, and then went on to develop her own show. She has roots there, so she had a way to return as Palin. So I don't see the Palin thing as an SNL product as much as something they've benefited from.

My impression is that Fey was up for it because she doesn't like Palin or her politics; her performance is not a simple imitation but has some bite to it. (My favorite line is still Can I call you Joe?...'cause I practiced a couple of zingers where I call you Joe, because it captures the manipulation of Palin's faux folksy routine.) Also, Fey pretty quickly backed off the idea that she would do it long-term, no matter the election outcome. I'm curious to hear her take on it a bit more.

That's not to say I'm down on SNL. I don't put a lot of pressure on it to be a great show; I've always approached it as something more experimental, like a high-level comedy school. I think it benefits a lot from TIVO and online clips. Some things work and many things don't. What I get out of it is more the appreciation for the actors and the flashes of brilliance in how they build characters; even bad sketches can have really neat moments--sometimes as simple as a facial expression or how a particular line is delivered. They've had some really strong women on there for a few years, and these days I think Kristin Wiig is incredible.
posted by troybob at 9:40 AM on November 4, 2008


Uh HUH. Cite please? A real one, not some maniacal froth site?

posted by George_Spiggott at 10:11 PM on November 3 [1 favorite +] [!]

============================

Gave you links to audio of him saying it and if google a bit more there's even video.

You're welcome.

BTW is this "some maniacal froth site?"

Before you answer you might read some of the replies.
posted by Jfalways at 9:44 AM on November 4, 2008


Jfalways: You might take some time to look around this place for a while. It's not the kind of site you seem to think it is.
posted by troybob at 9:46 AM on November 4, 2008


Start at 6:00 or so.

Heck, the coal smear in itself shows how ineffectual the McCain campaign has been. It either took forever for them to find it (as it's been around since January) or they wait to the last minute to put it out, by which point they've cried wolf so many times it doesn't matter anymore.

On top of that, it's taking something out of a larger context, that Obama wants higher standards for coal use in the future.
posted by drezdn at 9:59 AM on November 4, 2008


Gave you links to audio of him saying it and if google a bit more there's even video.
Yes, I found it afterward.

Obama was caught on tape saying he would bankrupt the coal industry....

Except -- whoops! -- he doesn't say that. He says that once proposed regulation is in place someone who builds a new coal-fired power plant -- and it's clear from other parts of the interview that he means one using old technology and old pre-regulation models -- will go bankrupt. The only way you get from that to "will bankrupt the coal industry" is if you very badly want to. Which you obviously do.
posted by George_Spiggott at 10:20 AM on November 4, 2008 [3 favorites]


“But please... go on with your informed discussion and tell anyone who might bring pesky facts in to "Fuck off"”

You’re being told to fuck off because A. you’re mischaracterizing what he said. You want to beef about whether it’s worth the trade off to switch to alternative energy sources or not, swell. Maybe Obama’s right, maybe he’s wrong.
But B. this is a thread on Palin and troopergate, so it’s a derail. And, I’ll add, in a thread with plenty o’ noise on top of it.

On topic - I myself am curious what this actually means. Can she still be prosecuted?
Just as a point of process. I don’t really particularly care.
But what was all this for?
If we’ve got an issue with spending taxpayer money - why have another investigation clearing her, if she’s not going to be prosecuted whether she broke the law or not?

And who would run the prosecuton’s investigation?
Out here (in Illinois) when we prosecuted Ryan it was an asst. U.S. Attorney (Zach Fardon). But that was a federal beef because it involved racketeering and mail fraud, fun stuff like that.

This, I understand, is a state ethics law. So it’d be internal. Probably a moot point all around.

“The Palins have argued that Wooten was a loose cannon...”

Maybe he’s a lone renegade, on the edge. But Mike Wooten’s a good cop! (sorry, obligatory)
posted by Smedleyman at 10:38 AM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


Maybe he was a maverick cop.
posted by Man-Thing at 11:05 AM on November 4, 2008


I see what you did there.
posted by Smedleyman at 12:22 PM on November 4, 2008


Obama was caught on tape saying he would bankrupt the coal industry....

and that he would make the price of electricity skyrocket....


Yeah. Your case might look better if McCain weren't for the exact same emissions caps.

http://wonkroom.thinkprogress.org/2008/11/02/obama-coal-plants/

/derail
posted by Amanojaku at 12:37 PM on November 4, 2008 [3 favorites]


>Jfalways: You might take some time to look around this place for a while. It's not the kind of site you seem to think it is.

Still looking, not finding.

I guess I'm the silly one. I think it's more important that Obama says his energy plan will make the price of electricity skyrocket than most of the other nonsense people discuss... but then I kinda am from the old school where I don't meet new people with the greeting "fuck off" so what do I know?
posted by Jfalways at 3:12 PM on November 4, 2008


Still looking, not finding.

Here's a start: You came into a topic on Palin and Troopergate and announced that the topic was not relevant, and then you decided to try to change the topic to Obama's energy plan, and then got upset that it didn't sidetrack the conversation.

If you did that kind of a thing to a group in person--my friends, at least--you would consider the reaction you got here a flirtation.
posted by troybob at 4:41 PM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


“so what do I know?”

Not enough to read with any comprehension apparently Jfalways.
You, personally, no, don’t fuck off.
Your desire to argue this energy plan thing in a thread about the Palin controversy - that should fuck off.
It’s a derail. You’re derailing. You are a deraileur, Jfalways.
People are arguing Obama’s energy plan. They shouldn’t be. You are one of those people.
You’ve made your point that you think it’s more important to discuss that topic than this one. Fine. Do it in an Obama thread. Do it in a general political thread. Make a front page post about it.
Don’t do it here.

Now, if you want me to do you the courtesy of taking you seriously I would say you’re being purposefully and willfully disruptive. Trolling. Because, given that I take your position and intellect with more seriousness, it would appear to me that you’re purposefully making this argument in the wrong place either to assert your own position and view with little opposition or you’re merely doing it to irritate people.

As it is, I’m doing you the courtesy of assuming your ignorance - that’s not meant as a perjorative, I am ignorant of, for example, the procedures involved in brain surgery - and attempting to clarify.
As you can see, I’ve spent some time and effort to do this instead of merely hurling invectives - as is perfectly reasonable to do given the wealth of instruction available on this site.
Courtesy is the correct word here, Jfalways .

So, the fact that you feel (apparently) that it is of dire importance to discuss Obama’s energy policy instead of the topic at hand is of no real interest to anyone here. You will therefore indeed recieve some abuse as a matter of course.
This should have put you off in some respect.
I grant it is puzzling that some folks addressed your topic and engaged your points on Obama’s energy policy.

That is not an endorsement or validation of your meta-point that arguing Obama’s energy policy is more important than, by your implication, any other discussion that might be going on.

Their refutation (and mine) was/is also an attempt to put you off, whether they are genuinely interested in the topic or not.

Now there are tangents within threads on occasion, but even these are lamented and sometimes threads go awry.
If they go truly awry people go to metatalk and all sorts of invective from highbrow to low is hurled all sorts of ways.
There’s no need for this here since it’s a relatively minor deviation - but it is not only tangential, but a complete departure from the topic.

Additionally, it is repetative.
In this way it is, by the norms of this weblog, more than merely presumptive, it’s rude.

It’s as if one stepped into a conversation about Kyle Orton injuring his ankle Sunday and Rex Grossman’s comeback over the Detroit Lions and said “*I* want to talk about something else. Let’s talk about baseball. Forget this football nonsense.”
Well, ok, it’s still sports, but you don’t get to set the terms of the conversation simply because *you* want to talk about something you think is more interesting or important or whatever.

It shows disrespect to gyc and his post and people participating in it. And willful disregard for the dialogue others are attempting to establish.
Your characterization of it as ‘nonsense’ makes it all the more egregious.

Put more plainly, in your front page post on the inferiorities and flaws in Obama’s energy policy (which I anticipate with great interest) you wouldn’t want someone saying how the discussion there was nonsense and why aren’t we talking about Palin and Troopergate which is far more important?

So you’re new, great, welcome. Read the FAQ’s and About’s and get a sense of how discourse is conducted and cavalierly derogate people’s conversations as nonsense.
posted by Smedleyman at 4:52 PM on November 4, 2008 [3 favorites]


'not' derogate other's conversations, that is.
posted by Smedleyman at 5:13 PM on November 4, 2008


Tina Fey in 2012!
posted by five fresh fish at 5:56 PM on November 4, 2008


Now that Palin believes she's been totally cleared of any ethical transgressions, she's talking about her future in American politics:
For the first time, she expressed what she will be focused on if John McCain is not victorious this evening.

"You know if there is a role in national politics it wont be so much partisan. My efforts have always been here in the state of Alaska to get everybody to unite and work together to progress this state," Palin said, "It certainly would be a uniter type of role."
Presumably she intends to unite what she called "pro-America areas of this great nation" with, you know, the rest.
posted by Doktor Zed at 6:56 PM on November 4, 2008


Now, if you want me to do you the courtesy of taking you seriously I would say you’re being purposefully and willfully disruptive. Trolling.

You say that like it's a bad thing.
posted by Balisong at 6:58 PM on November 4, 2008


Why is there a post about some random governor from such a small state? Flagged? You betcha!
posted by drezdn at 8:05 PM on November 4, 2008 [1 favorite]


WELP, SO MUCH FOR THIS SHIT

may I never hear about that woman again
posted by furiousthought at 9:05 PM on November 4, 2008 [2 favorites]


How you like community organizers now?
posted by kirkaracha at 12:23 AM on November 5, 2008 [1 favorite]


Second only to the delight of seeing Obama elected POTUS is the pleasure in sending this woman's butt back to the frozen north.

Poor Sarah, Alaska isn't going to seem all that great after her experience campaigning in the lower 48. She has been living like a rock star these last two months: flying around from state to state; speaking to tens of thousands of adoring, cheering fans; having professionals on hand every day to do her make-up and hair; swanning around in designer duds; having the media begging for interviews-- it is going to feel very flat to return to normal life. The celebrity life is like a drug for some people and I have a feeling Sarah will be one of those who will do anything to get a little bit of the limelight. The first thing will be to try and make her governorship seem a whole lot more important nationally. I expect to see her popping up on talk shows discussing oil, global warming, native Americans, sexism in politics, reproductive rights, and much, much more. Think of her like a cold sore-- while it may disappear for a time, once you have the virus it is with you forever, rearing its ugly head during times of stress.
posted by Secret Life of Gravy at 5:58 AM on November 5, 2008 [1 favorite]


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