The Movie Star and Me
April 26, 2022 7:47 AM Subscribe
A sad and infuriating true story by Domenica Feraud about power dynamics in a relationship, show business, and bad behavior by men. (SL Medium)
I am surprised this piece didn't get more attention when it was originally published; I only just discovered it.
Related links (will hopefully become apparent why they are related upon review even if you are not a "Swiftie" which I myself am certainly NOT)
Taylor Swift performing her revised/expanded version of "All Too Well" on SNL last fall.
Like I said, I am not a Taylor Swift fan at all for numerous reasons, but I find this performance absolutely breathtaking and I must begrudgingly admit her talent as a lyricist. Also notable that SNL gave her a full ten minutes to do this when historically musical guests only get two smaller performance slots.
All Too Well" the short film, directed by Taylor Swift Surprisingly moving.
Taylor Swift’s ‘All Too Well’ and the Weaponization of Memory (SL NYT)
I am surprised this piece didn't get more attention when it was originally published; I only just discovered it.
Related links (will hopefully become apparent why they are related upon review even if you are not a "Swiftie" which I myself am certainly NOT)
Taylor Swift performing her revised/expanded version of "All Too Well" on SNL last fall.
Like I said, I am not a Taylor Swift fan at all for numerous reasons, but I find this performance absolutely breathtaking and I must begrudgingly admit her talent as a lyricist. Also notable that SNL gave her a full ten minutes to do this when historically musical guests only get two smaller performance slots.
All Too Well" the short film, directed by Taylor Swift Surprisingly moving.
Taylor Swift’s ‘All Too Well’ and the Weaponization of Memory (SL NYT)
For the sake of those of us not familiar with who the missing stairs are exactly, could names be named rather than hinted at please?
posted by bonehead at 8:23 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by bonehead at 8:23 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
No names are used in the article, but I gather the implication is that the Actor is Jake Gyllenhaal.
posted by suelac at 8:25 AM on April 26, 2022 [10 favorites]
posted by suelac at 8:25 AM on April 26, 2022 [10 favorites]
Just to throw this out there: if this article is about who many think it is, he's currently 41 years old in a relationship with a woman who is 25. I don't know if Taylor Swift wrote that lyric about getting older while his lovers stay her age when she originally wrote this song (in 2012, apparently a lot of the "newer" lyrics in the 10 minute version were written back then and scrapped to keep the song from ballooning to a length that wasn't going to fly on a record), but if she did, man, was she prescient. If she added it in recently, it makes me appreciate how this song has evolved from it's original incarnation as a breakup song to a very wise reflection about how she sees the power dynamic now and it has changed her understanding of her memories of the relationship.
For myself, both Feraud's article and Swift's song has made me re-evaluate a relationship I had in my 20s with a much older man and how it affected me. I'd already been working through my feelings about that ever since Monica Lewinsky wrote that article in VF a while back in the wake of #MeToo where she said she has never considered herself a victim, and still mostly doesn't - but her recognition of how young she was is what makes that "mostly" now.
It's hard to be a woman. It's really hard to be a 21 year old woman. I'm pushing 40 now and I wouldn't redo my 20s no matter how much you paid me.
posted by nayantara at 8:29 AM on April 26, 2022 [14 favorites]
For myself, both Feraud's article and Swift's song has made me re-evaluate a relationship I had in my 20s with a much older man and how it affected me. I'd already been working through my feelings about that ever since Monica Lewinsky wrote that article in VF a while back in the wake of #MeToo where she said she has never considered herself a victim, and still mostly doesn't - but her recognition of how young she was is what makes that "mostly" now.
It's hard to be a woman. It's really hard to be a 21 year old woman. I'm pushing 40 now and I wouldn't redo my 20s no matter how much you paid me.
posted by nayantara at 8:29 AM on April 26, 2022 [14 favorites]
Sorry, I wasn't trying to be coy or protect a missing stair - I've been down such a wormhole pertaining to the revised Swift song (there is a LOT of analysis out there at the moment) that I forgot his identity isn't necessarily obvious. I apologize.
Song confirmed to be about Jake Gyllenhaal, article timeline points to him being the movie star in question but not officially confirmed.
posted by nayantara at 8:36 AM on April 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
Song confirmed to be about Jake Gyllenhaal, article timeline points to him being the movie star in question but not officially confirmed.
posted by nayantara at 8:36 AM on April 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
A handsome man is strong, even if he is poor and single and jobless. He can take any woman he wants; he can make us weak. There will always be someone to fall under his spell. How much worse is it when he is charming, when he is rich and powerful?
Yes, and to take it a step further, I would say this is not so much about rich and powerful men, and not even so much about handsome men, as just men. And women, too, obviously. It's a tale as old as time. I was on the wrong end of this dynamic a dozen times before I reached adulthood.
posted by HotToddy at 8:47 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
Yes, and to take it a step further, I would say this is not so much about rich and powerful men, and not even so much about handsome men, as just men. And women, too, obviously. It's a tale as old as time. I was on the wrong end of this dynamic a dozen times before I reached adulthood.
posted by HotToddy at 8:47 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
I generally kinda hate age differences in relationships in general because of the power dynamics being frequently iffy (I know, Not All), but I really really really hate older men/younger women, especially when the woman is barely legal/early 20's. It's so easy for them to be all "I'm older and I have more experience" and snow the poor girl because she isn't experienced enough to know better. There's so many skeezy stories. I pretty much lucked out with the one older guy I dated--he didn't pull that crap, thank gawd.
I don't think I've ever heard of Jake doing a musical--when did he do that?
"I went from crucial to expendable in less than 24 hours."
"Apparently, he falls in love with these young interns and PAs on sight, pursues them obsessively, and then has some sort of freak out a month in and disappears. "
This is something I will never understand about guys. How the hell does that happen? How do you go from hot to cold (and back again) like that? Why do they disappear and then return and yank you back and forth?
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:50 AM on April 26, 2022 [7 favorites]
I don't think I've ever heard of Jake doing a musical--when did he do that?
"I went from crucial to expendable in less than 24 hours."
"Apparently, he falls in love with these young interns and PAs on sight, pursues them obsessively, and then has some sort of freak out a month in and disappears. "
This is something I will never understand about guys. How the hell does that happen? How do you go from hot to cold (and back again) like that? Why do they disappear and then return and yank you back and forth?
posted by jenfullmoon at 8:50 AM on April 26, 2022 [7 favorites]
(It's also okay to be a fan of Taylor Swift.)
posted by kimberussell at 9:01 AM on April 26, 2022 [17 favorites]
posted by kimberussell at 9:01 AM on April 26, 2022 [17 favorites]
Jesus, the arrogance and entitlement over a stranger you just met. He was lying under her desk in day 1? Her mentor was fine with it? How almost everyone around her just let it happen, if not outright encouraged it, makes my blood boil, and not just as a father.
posted by gottabefunky at 9:12 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by gottabefunky at 9:12 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
I don't think I've ever heard of Jake doing a musical--when did he do that?
Jake has done Sunday in the Park with George and Little Shop of Horrors at the very least.
posted by BlahLaLa at 9:19 AM on April 26, 2022 [3 favorites]
Jake has done Sunday in the Park with George and Little Shop of Horrors at the very least.
posted by BlahLaLa at 9:19 AM on April 26, 2022 [3 favorites]
There’s this awful person (persona?) called DeliciousTacos who does advice columns sometimes, which I had the misfortune to read. I don’t know if he is writing as a terrible man for artistic purposes or if he really is one, but these days it is increasingly a distinction without a difference. Anyway, something he said stuck with me: “Pussy is a substance and women aren’t people.”
Taking this as a guiding people for some dudes, even good Democrats who would never say such a thing, allows their actions to make sense, whether or not they have such a plain crude goal. A guy like this wants a certain kind of sex, combined with a certain kind of emotional chase and consummation, and once it’s had (or is too much trouble to pursue) then the girl is done with. Where is the Diet Coke bottle you drank out of last month and tossed out? Do you know or care?
posted by Countess Elena at 9:23 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Taking this as a guiding people for some dudes, even good Democrats who would never say such a thing, allows their actions to make sense, whether or not they have such a plain crude goal. A guy like this wants a certain kind of sex, combined with a certain kind of emotional chase and consummation, and once it’s had (or is too much trouble to pursue) then the girl is done with. Where is the Diet Coke bottle you drank out of last month and tossed out? Do you know or care?
posted by Countess Elena at 9:23 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
I was thinking the other day of an expression, I can't remember where I read it: the strong do as they will, the weak bear what they must.
It's a line from the History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides, specifically Book 5, Chapters 84–116, often referred to as the "Melian Dialogue".
The island of Melos was a neutral party in the war between Athens and Sparta. Regardless, the Athenians come to Melos with an ultimatum: surrender and pay tribute to Athens, or be destroyed. The line is the Athenians' response when the Melians try to argue over the morality of the situation. It's a classic statement of the ethos of realpolitik.
posted by star gentle uterus at 9:25 AM on April 26, 2022 [23 favorites]
It's a line from the History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides, specifically Book 5, Chapters 84–116, often referred to as the "Melian Dialogue".
The island of Melos was a neutral party in the war between Athens and Sparta. Regardless, the Athenians come to Melos with an ultimatum: surrender and pay tribute to Athens, or be destroyed. The line is the Athenians' response when the Melians try to argue over the morality of the situation. It's a classic statement of the ethos of realpolitik.
posted by star gentle uterus at 9:25 AM on April 26, 2022 [23 favorites]
Ten years ago, I had an intern ten years younger than me to whom I was very attracted. We shared a common cultural background, many of the same hobbies, favorite novels, films, albums, artists… Sometimes, especially during work situations where I had to tersely issue orders to her and others without time to explain the why behind them, she… responded favorably, to my manner rather than what I was saying.
She was only my second intern. I was somewhat happily married at the time and did not want a reputation as That Guy (still don’t). So: I avoided even the appearance of impropriety; discussed workplace norms and suggestions as to what she may want to do should anyone, including me, act inappropriately with her; talked about my crush with my therapist and my partner; and when her internship was over, secretly beamed I’d cleared that particular hurdle of adulthood.
If I could be a decent person in that situation, so could unnamed movie star, and indeed any other person.
(I’m not looking for pats on the back with this comment—it’s more a workshop for a share at a twelve-step meeting later this week.)
posted by infinitewindow at 9:29 AM on April 26, 2022 [8 favorites]
She was only my second intern. I was somewhat happily married at the time and did not want a reputation as That Guy (still don’t). So: I avoided even the appearance of impropriety; discussed workplace norms and suggestions as to what she may want to do should anyone, including me, act inappropriately with her; talked about my crush with my therapist and my partner; and when her internship was over, secretly beamed I’d cleared that particular hurdle of adulthood.
If I could be a decent person in that situation, so could unnamed movie star, and indeed any other person.
(I’m not looking for pats on the back with this comment—it’s more a workshop for a share at a twelve-step meeting later this week.)
posted by infinitewindow at 9:29 AM on April 26, 2022 [8 favorites]
jenfullmoon, he was in a revival of a Sondheim show (I think Sunday in the Park?) and internet sleuths who know the timeline of that show's preproduction phase have narrowed in on him being the eponymous Movie Star as a result. Feraud hasn't confirmed or denied, but I don't blame her. It looks like this whole situation fucked with her career on top of everything else.
posted by nayantara at 9:33 AM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by nayantara at 9:33 AM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
"I went from crucial to expendable in less than 24 hours."
"Apparently, he falls in love with these young interns and PAs on sight, pursues them obsessively, and then has some sort of freak out a month in and disappears."
Apparently (and this is where I reveal how much of a rabbit hole I went down on this), those passages in particular were the tell for Taylor Swift's fans, as it seems that's what he did to her.
(Like, his feelings were so intense that he apparently brought her to his mom's house on their first date?!)
I have problems with Taylor Swift's history of White Woman Feminism and honestly I think I was just too old when she started to get famous to really "get" her. She struck me as so much younger than her age and very twee. (My stepkids love her.) I do recognize that people change and grow, and obviously this extended cut of "All Too Well" exemplifies that - as a musician myself I am really impressed by how well she tells a story in this song such that it's length goes unnoticed, at least for me. But as much as I enjoy this song (and the SNL performance in particular) I don't think I'm going to be digging through her back catalogue.
But that's neither here nor there, nor does it make how Gyllenhaal treated her ok at all, in the slightest.
posted by nayantara at 9:49 AM on April 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
"Apparently, he falls in love with these young interns and PAs on sight, pursues them obsessively, and then has some sort of freak out a month in and disappears."
Apparently (and this is where I reveal how much of a rabbit hole I went down on this), those passages in particular were the tell for Taylor Swift's fans, as it seems that's what he did to her.
(Like, his feelings were so intense that he apparently brought her to his mom's house on their first date?!)
I have problems with Taylor Swift's history of White Woman Feminism and honestly I think I was just too old when she started to get famous to really "get" her. She struck me as so much younger than her age and very twee. (My stepkids love her.) I do recognize that people change and grow, and obviously this extended cut of "All Too Well" exemplifies that - as a musician myself I am really impressed by how well she tells a story in this song such that it's length goes unnoticed, at least for me. But as much as I enjoy this song (and the SNL performance in particular) I don't think I'm going to be digging through her back catalogue.
But that's neither here nor there, nor does it make how Gyllenhaal treated her ok at all, in the slightest.
posted by nayantara at 9:49 AM on April 26, 2022 [2 favorites]
Part of the difficulty in recognizing the true character of an experience like this is that the uniqueness of it in any individual life initially obscures its universality.
posted by jocelmeow at 10:22 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by jocelmeow at 10:22 AM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
infinitewindow, it's ironic that an aspect of what made you be able to be a good person in that situation is precisely because you're not a famous movie star, with all of resources, history of being surrounded by yes-men, and gravity-defying personal charisma that implies. Your actions have consequences; for many famous and/or rich people, even in the wake of MeToo, this is simply not the case.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 10:28 AM on April 26, 2022 [9 favorites]
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 10:28 AM on April 26, 2022 [9 favorites]
There was something about him that mildly repulsed me, but here was this man every woman wanted: what was wrong with me if I wasn’t attracted to him?
Oof.
I loathe the minimal, trapdoored gestures towards checking that she consented.
posted by clew at 10:31 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Oof.
I loathe the minimal, trapdoored gestures towards checking that she consented.
posted by clew at 10:31 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Boy oh boy do I have so many complex feelings about this. This may be a little disjointed.
We teach young men that women are a reward, that when you are a real success, when you're a real man, when you're really good, the women will come, adoring, wide eyed, young, beautiful.
Then men get older, they keep getting older and they keep committing sins and women their age will call them on those sins, so they keep dating younger and younger. And they never want to consider their power in relationships; the illusion is that they are just so boyish and adorable and lovable that of course all the women love them for themselves.
I see the things that Gyllenhaal did, putting his head on her, being under her desk, all of that, as gestures that would have been cute if they had ever both been 17 at the same time. That's how he wants to see himself, where he is arrested, these butterfly meet-cutes and make-out sessions where he is young and they are just innocently brushing against each other. What he loves is not love but adoration; it is not a coincidence that a month in is when these women start feeling comfortable asking things for themselves. (It reminds me a bit also of Johnny Depp's anger at Amber Heard, where I read a piece where in early days he was talking about how he thought she was this "sweet, giving" girl and then she WANTED things from him, and the power dynamics inherent there).
If she doesn't want things, then she can't be disappointed, then Gyllenhaal can't disappoint her, then he can't be a failure in his own eyes. If he can tell himself there's a reason, then he can exit, but there has to be a reason. It has to be her virginity, or a host of other reasons, but none of the reasons can be that Gyllenhaal is an insecure shell of a man and that makes consequently a bad boyfriend.
I think to the men I know who are in their late thirties and say women their age are too old for them, I think of how they try to mask their own failures. I cannot stop thinking.
I think of consent and power.
posted by corb at 10:42 AM on April 26, 2022 [58 favorites]
We teach young men that women are a reward, that when you are a real success, when you're a real man, when you're really good, the women will come, adoring, wide eyed, young, beautiful.
Then men get older, they keep getting older and they keep committing sins and women their age will call them on those sins, so they keep dating younger and younger. And they never want to consider their power in relationships; the illusion is that they are just so boyish and adorable and lovable that of course all the women love them for themselves.
I see the things that Gyllenhaal did, putting his head on her, being under her desk, all of that, as gestures that would have been cute if they had ever both been 17 at the same time. That's how he wants to see himself, where he is arrested, these butterfly meet-cutes and make-out sessions where he is young and they are just innocently brushing against each other. What he loves is not love but adoration; it is not a coincidence that a month in is when these women start feeling comfortable asking things for themselves. (It reminds me a bit also of Johnny Depp's anger at Amber Heard, where I read a piece where in early days he was talking about how he thought she was this "sweet, giving" girl and then she WANTED things from him, and the power dynamics inherent there).
If she doesn't want things, then she can't be disappointed, then Gyllenhaal can't disappoint her, then he can't be a failure in his own eyes. If he can tell himself there's a reason, then he can exit, but there has to be a reason. It has to be her virginity, or a host of other reasons, but none of the reasons can be that Gyllenhaal is an insecure shell of a man and that makes consequently a bad boyfriend.
I think to the men I know who are in their late thirties and say women their age are too old for them, I think of how they try to mask their own failures. I cannot stop thinking.
I think of consent and power.
posted by corb at 10:42 AM on April 26, 2022 [58 favorites]
Tangentially, I don't really know how far out SNL plans its bookings nor do I know if when Taylor Swift was booked last fall Lorne Michaels/the music directors knew that she wanted to eschew two performance slots for one mega-one specifically for this song, but surely they saw the conversation after the performance - and then Jake Gyllenhaal was the host a few weeks back and his last stint hosting was 15 years ago and he doesn't seem to be actively promoting a film or a project.
So they had Taylor singing about Jake, and then Jake hosting a few months later. I'm sure they knew he wasn't going to comment on the song (he's been pretty quiet about his relationship with Taylor in general as far as I can tell), but there is something deliciously diabolical about the way SNL did these bookings this season and I would love to know if it was intentional.
posted by nayantara at 10:59 AM on April 26, 2022
So they had Taylor singing about Jake, and then Jake hosting a few months later. I'm sure they knew he wasn't going to comment on the song (he's been pretty quiet about his relationship with Taylor in general as far as I can tell), but there is something deliciously diabolical about the way SNL did these bookings this season and I would love to know if it was intentional.
posted by nayantara at 10:59 AM on April 26, 2022
Obviously I'm angry at the Movie Star but I am incandescent with rage over her mother's actions and reactions. FFS.
posted by cooker girl at 11:00 AM on April 26, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by cooker girl at 11:00 AM on April 26, 2022 [6 favorites]
It's kind of staggering how repeatedly this author was failed by seemingly everyone around her. This line is telling:
"Everyone in my life was so excited by what was happening, demanding updates, wanting to hear every detail of this whirlwind romance. I couldn’t waste this opportunity, couldn’t risk messing up and disappointing everybody. I was living their fantasy."
Society's fantasy is for a famous person to pay any amount of attention to them, not for a young woman to feel happy and safe in her relationship.
She never wanted this relationship, everyone around both of them (except for his mother and sister) encouraged it, and then it ends by her being punished for listening to the advice of literally everyone she knows?
What I can't get out of my head is that obviously this guy is a problem, but equally obviously his status is a problem, and the ever-present permissiveness of everybody he works with and everybody who insists that a young woman should be grateful for his attention is a problem.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:03 AM on April 26, 2022 [16 favorites]
"Everyone in my life was so excited by what was happening, demanding updates, wanting to hear every detail of this whirlwind romance. I couldn’t waste this opportunity, couldn’t risk messing up and disappointing everybody. I was living their fantasy."
Society's fantasy is for a famous person to pay any amount of attention to them, not for a young woman to feel happy and safe in her relationship.
She never wanted this relationship, everyone around both of them (except for his mother and sister) encouraged it, and then it ends by her being punished for listening to the advice of literally everyone she knows?
What I can't get out of my head is that obviously this guy is a problem, but equally obviously his status is a problem, and the ever-present permissiveness of everybody he works with and everybody who insists that a young woman should be grateful for his attention is a problem.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:03 AM on April 26, 2022 [16 favorites]
The age does indeed match Gyllenhal's Sunday in the Park stint, and he certainly has a famous sister. And that production started as part of New York City Center's 2016 Gala, and a gala is in the story as well (and yes Maggie was there). Here's Ben Brantley's review of the show, also mentioned.
posted by timdiggerm at 11:10 AM on April 26, 2022
posted by timdiggerm at 11:10 AM on April 26, 2022
and he doesn't seem to be actively promoting a film or a project.
He has a new movie. And it looks awful.
Trailer for AmbuLAnce
posted by mochapickle at 11:11 AM on April 26, 2022
He has a new movie. And it looks awful.
Trailer for AmbuLAnce
posted by mochapickle at 11:11 AM on April 26, 2022
Feraud's mother infuriated me too - treating this like some sort of fairytale Meant To Be romance. Not to mention her mentor's behavior. Hell, everyone's behavior.
As Cpt. The Mango points out, it's sort of telling that Movie Star's mother and sister were not impressed or enthusiastic about the relationship and, again, if we are talking Jake, it's entirely possible that at this point Maggie and Mama Gyllenhaal have seen him do this So Many Times that they are just completely over it. Movie Star talks about the importance of big sisterly advice (with a really inappropriate oral sex story as an example) and I just imagine Maggie pulling Jake aside time and time again telling him he's being a shit and then finally just giving up and deciding the best course of action is to just give the New Pretty Young Thing the cold shoulder in hopes of maybe scaring her off from being another casualty of her awful younger brother.
Either that or Feraud wasn't as famous as Taylor Swift and so wasn't deserving of the kitchen table welcome with cute childhood stories and opportunities to accidentally leave scarves behind.
I hope it's the former and not the latter.
posted by nayantara at 11:14 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
As Cpt. The Mango points out, it's sort of telling that Movie Star's mother and sister were not impressed or enthusiastic about the relationship and, again, if we are talking Jake, it's entirely possible that at this point Maggie and Mama Gyllenhaal have seen him do this So Many Times that they are just completely over it. Movie Star talks about the importance of big sisterly advice (with a really inappropriate oral sex story as an example) and I just imagine Maggie pulling Jake aside time and time again telling him he's being a shit and then finally just giving up and deciding the best course of action is to just give the New Pretty Young Thing the cold shoulder in hopes of maybe scaring her off from being another casualty of her awful younger brother.
Either that or Feraud wasn't as famous as Taylor Swift and so wasn't deserving of the kitchen table welcome with cute childhood stories and opportunities to accidentally leave scarves behind.
I hope it's the former and not the latter.
posted by nayantara at 11:14 AM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Why get attached to the girl of the minute, if you're a relative of his?
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:34 AM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 11:34 AM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
I see the things that Gyllenhaal did, putting his head on her, being under her desk, all of that, as gestures that would have been cute if they had ever both been 17 at the same time.
Well, they are described as though even those relatively benign gestures weren't quite consensual, and it wouldn't be cute if a teenage boy initiated all of that without positive feedback. Back in my day some boys would "put the moves" on a girl and just keep trying even when she obviously wasn't into it. Hopefully kids know more about consent now?
posted by anhedonic at 12:38 PM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Well, they are described as though even those relatively benign gestures weren't quite consensual, and it wouldn't be cute if a teenage boy initiated all of that without positive feedback. Back in my day some boys would "put the moves" on a girl and just keep trying even when she obviously wasn't into it. Hopefully kids know more about consent now?
posted by anhedonic at 12:38 PM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Under her desk?!
I work as a consultant. I have viewed countless sexual harrassment training videos at my employers and clients. As such, I have no doubt at all that taking to a woman at work while lying under her desk is hideously inappropriate and would get me fired, fired, fired, were I ever inclined to do so. (I hope it goes without saying that I am not, not so much because it's a fireable offense but because it's hideously inappropriate behavior.) And I have no problem at all with this state of affairs ...
... except that some people openly flaunt the rules that the rest of us have to live by. I see no reason why they should, and have no sympathy at all when they get some minimal consequences of their terrible behavior. I hope lots of people read this article and, without her naming him, everyone -- especially his next future inamorata -- knows exactly who she's talking about.
posted by Gelatin at 12:40 PM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
I work as a consultant. I have viewed countless sexual harrassment training videos at my employers and clients. As such, I have no doubt at all that taking to a woman at work while lying under her desk is hideously inappropriate and would get me fired, fired, fired, were I ever inclined to do so. (I hope it goes without saying that I am not, not so much because it's a fireable offense but because it's hideously inappropriate behavior.) And I have no problem at all with this state of affairs ...
... except that some people openly flaunt the rules that the rest of us have to live by. I see no reason why they should, and have no sympathy at all when they get some minimal consequences of their terrible behavior. I hope lots of people read this article and, without her naming him, everyone -- especially his next future inamorata -- knows exactly who she's talking about.
posted by Gelatin at 12:40 PM on April 26, 2022 [4 favorites]
Hopefully kids know more about consent now?
April 25th on The Current: High school students have staged walkouts around the country to push for change around consent education and sexual violence. Matt Galloway talks to Grade 12 student Fechi Onyegbule; Teralyn Phipps, a co-ordinating principal at the Peel District School Board in Ontario; and Farrah Khan, manager of Consent Comes First at Ryerson University in Toronto.
posted by elkevelvet at 12:46 PM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
April 25th on The Current: High school students have staged walkouts around the country to push for change around consent education and sexual violence. Matt Galloway talks to Grade 12 student Fechi Onyegbule; Teralyn Phipps, a co-ordinating principal at the Peel District School Board in Ontario; and Farrah Khan, manager of Consent Comes First at Ryerson University in Toronto.
posted by elkevelvet at 12:46 PM on April 26, 2022 [5 favorites]
gestures that would have been cute if they had ever both been 17 at the same time
For what it’s worth, I know someone who is the same age as him and hung out with him when they were both teenagers. She explicitly asked him not to smoke out her younger sister. He went ahead and did so anyway. I don’t think it amounted to anything more than that, but if his name came up the acquaintance’s immediate reaction was always, “man, fuck that guy.”
posted by evidenceofabsence at 12:51 PM on April 26, 2022 [3 favorites]
For what it’s worth, I know someone who is the same age as him and hung out with him when they were both teenagers. She explicitly asked him not to smoke out her younger sister. He went ahead and did so anyway. I don’t think it amounted to anything more than that, but if his name came up the acquaintance’s immediate reaction was always, “man, fuck that guy.”
posted by evidenceofabsence at 12:51 PM on April 26, 2022 [3 favorites]
Yeah anhedonic, I think the point is that if everything is totally fine in terms of consent and whatnot, then Gyllenhaal's behaviour would be cute if he was a 17-year-old boy, and it would in fact be the fairy tale romance that everyone around the author was insisting she was experiencing. However, because he's a 41-year-old-man pulling these moves on a 23-year-old woman , that removes the possibility of his behaviour being acceptable.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 1:04 PM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 1:04 PM on April 26, 2022 [1 favorite]
Gah, flashing back to being 17 and the mixed feelings about being flirted with by a teacher.
posted by The Underpants Monster at 6:28 PM on April 26, 2022 [6 favorites]
posted by The Underpants Monster at 6:28 PM on April 26, 2022 [6 favorites]
I started reading this article as my regular 5'8" self and paragraph-by-paragraph hunched deeper and deeper into my hoodie. I'm probably 3'1" now. And while I have not stopped clenching my teeth since November 2016 I think I ground off a few extra specks of molar dust.
posted by bendy at 12:05 AM on April 27, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by bendy at 12:05 AM on April 27, 2022 [7 favorites]
This was painful to read. It's not so much the age difference that I personally find iffy -- yeah ok a 36 yo man vs a 23 yo woman typically says something iffy about the man in question but you never know there are always exceptions to the rule -- but the imbalance of power between a movie star and an intern. That seems inappropriate on so many levels.
I never had encounters with movie stars but ah I could relate a lot to being very inexperienced and insecure as a teenager and young woman and letting guys take advantage and even realizing it while it was happening but being unable to stand up for yourself. It's something that can leave you with further insecurities and trust issues for years later too. I can imagine that's even worse when it was someone famous behaving like this with you. Ugh
posted by bitteschoen at 2:31 AM on April 27, 2022 [4 favorites]
I never had encounters with movie stars but ah I could relate a lot to being very inexperienced and insecure as a teenager and young woman and letting guys take advantage and even realizing it while it was happening but being unable to stand up for yourself. It's something that can leave you with further insecurities and trust issues for years later too. I can imagine that's even worse when it was someone famous behaving like this with you. Ugh
posted by bitteschoen at 2:31 AM on April 27, 2022 [4 favorites]
What I can't get out of my head is that obviously this guy is a problem, but equally obviously his status is a problem, and the ever-present permissiveness of everybody he works with and everybody who insists that a young woman should be grateful for his attention is a problem.
And that everyone involved recognized this pattern, knew exactly what was happening, and pushed her to accept his attention. Because that's what the movie star needed to perform this role. As if "very young intern he will find attractive and can latch onto temporarily" is a condition of his contract, like only having green m&m's in his dressing room or making sure his favorite brand of sparkling water is in good supply. It wasn't only permissiveness, it was helping to put the pressure on her in various ways to give him what he wanted. Active enabling.
posted by Well I never at 5:17 AM on April 27, 2022 [10 favorites]
And that everyone involved recognized this pattern, knew exactly what was happening, and pushed her to accept his attention. Because that's what the movie star needed to perform this role. As if "very young intern he will find attractive and can latch onto temporarily" is a condition of his contract, like only having green m&m's in his dressing room or making sure his favorite brand of sparkling water is in good supply. It wasn't only permissiveness, it was helping to put the pressure on her in various ways to give him what he wanted. Active enabling.
posted by Well I never at 5:17 AM on April 27, 2022 [10 favorites]
Lesson for the young: if you’re unsure what’s happening in a relationship, it’s never good. She wrote a lotta words trying to sort it all out afterwards, but I think the truth of it is worse than she imagines. Nervy stars - like nervy horses - don’t perform well. So they get a barn buddy.
posted by bookie at 5:25 AM on April 27, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by bookie at 5:25 AM on April 27, 2022 [5 favorites]
I read the comments here before I read her essay, so theoretically I knew what was coming, but it was even worse than I had imagined. Her mentor's transactive use of her was so gross, among the series of betrayals that she describes.
Her other essay on Medium ("The 26-Year-Old Virgin") is also very good and probably deserves an FPP of its own.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:31 AM on April 27, 2022 [1 favorite]
Her other essay on Medium ("The 26-Year-Old Virgin") is also very good and probably deserves an FPP of its own.
posted by Dip Flash at 6:31 AM on April 27, 2022 [1 favorite]
Feraud's mother infuriated me too - treating this like some sort of fairytale Meant To Be romance
And that everyone involved recognized this pattern, knew exactly what was happening, and pushed her to accept his attention. Because that's what the movie star needed to perform this role
I think these two things can't quite be separated - like, at no point did anyone sit her down and tell her, "This happens every time with a new person, here is the pattern, here is what happens, he is not going to build a relationship with you and then you will have a fairy tale ending, instead you will be uncertain of yourself and the instant you have needs of your own he will leave you", specifically because if they had told her that, she would have been like "ugh, no" and then Gyllenhaal would have had a crisis of faith or whatever and wouldn't have done the role as well. And so the mom had every reason to think this was a fairy tale situation because it must be unusual and striking and love-at-first sight because if it was a pattern someone surely would have said something. And because of access journalism, and the magic of film star mythos, nobody is going to publish about these open secrets, because if they do, they won't be allowed to the parties where everyone chit chats about things and they get stories, so no one will discover these problems until someone writes a veiled medium post.
posted by corb at 6:57 AM on April 27, 2022 [19 favorites]
And that everyone involved recognized this pattern, knew exactly what was happening, and pushed her to accept his attention. Because that's what the movie star needed to perform this role
I think these two things can't quite be separated - like, at no point did anyone sit her down and tell her, "This happens every time with a new person, here is the pattern, here is what happens, he is not going to build a relationship with you and then you will have a fairy tale ending, instead you will be uncertain of yourself and the instant you have needs of your own he will leave you", specifically because if they had told her that, she would have been like "ugh, no" and then Gyllenhaal would have had a crisis of faith or whatever and wouldn't have done the role as well. And so the mom had every reason to think this was a fairy tale situation because it must be unusual and striking and love-at-first sight because if it was a pattern someone surely would have said something. And because of access journalism, and the magic of film star mythos, nobody is going to publish about these open secrets, because if they do, they won't be allowed to the parties where everyone chit chats about things and they get stories, so no one will discover these problems until someone writes a veiled medium post.
posted by corb at 6:57 AM on April 27, 2022 [19 favorites]
And because of access journalism, and the magic of film star mythos, nobody is going to publish about these open secrets, because if they do, they won't be allowed to the parties where everyone chit chats about things and they get stories, so no one will discover these problems until someone writes a veiled medium post.
corb I just wanted to build on this point too - "All Too Well" was confirmed to be about Gyllenhaal back when Swift originally released it in it's original 5 minute version (in fact my understanding is that much of the album it's on is her processing this relationship). So there was some publication (in the form of fairly accurate speculation) that she was writing an older boyfriend who treated her terribly and the timeline of her relationship confirmed his identity and she also officially confirmed it at some point too. (See this rabbit hole I went down? For a musician I don't particularly care for?)
But I wonder if back then there was something else going on, which is that Swift has, up until recently, written many songs processing real life relationships of hers that ended badly, and got a lot of flak for that in the press. So, even if there is documented evidence in the form of Swift's work that this is how he operates, Feraud (and other women he's done this to) may not necessarily have been aware of his red flags because people have been mocking Swift for her breakup songs for years.
Idle speculation I suppose, but the 10 minute "All Too Well" ends up damning him in a way that the original didn't, and tracks with Feraud's experience with him. "I'll get older but your lovers stay my age" is his MO.
posted by nayantara at 7:35 AM on April 27, 2022 [2 favorites]
corb I just wanted to build on this point too - "All Too Well" was confirmed to be about Gyllenhaal back when Swift originally released it in it's original 5 minute version (in fact my understanding is that much of the album it's on is her processing this relationship). So there was some publication (in the form of fairly accurate speculation) that she was writing an older boyfriend who treated her terribly and the timeline of her relationship confirmed his identity and she also officially confirmed it at some point too. (See this rabbit hole I went down? For a musician I don't particularly care for?)
But I wonder if back then there was something else going on, which is that Swift has, up until recently, written many songs processing real life relationships of hers that ended badly, and got a lot of flak for that in the press. So, even if there is documented evidence in the form of Swift's work that this is how he operates, Feraud (and other women he's done this to) may not necessarily have been aware of his red flags because people have been mocking Swift for her breakup songs for years.
Idle speculation I suppose, but the 10 minute "All Too Well" ends up damning him in a way that the original didn't, and tracks with Feraud's experience with him. "I'll get older but your lovers stay my age" is his MO.
posted by nayantara at 7:35 AM on April 27, 2022 [2 favorites]
Oh and also: "You said if we were closer in age maybe it would have been fine and it made me want to die" along with Gyllenhaal only pointing out the age difference between him and Feraud mere minutes AFTER she gave him a blow job, even though he knew very well from the start that there was an age difference from the start. In both cases. Though I think the age difference lyric might be a new addition in the revised song.
I also want to say - and I said this before, briefly - that it makes me so angry that Feraud's relationship with him - THAT HER MENTOR and everyone else on the production encouraged - ended up, in the end, fucking up her career. She wasn't a part of the production once it moved to Broadway, likely because Gyllenhaal made it a condition of his continued participation. And again, everyone played along. She was an INTERN and he fucked up her career. I just... I can't. I can't.
Shades of Monica Lewinsky there too...
posted by nayantara at 7:44 AM on April 27, 2022 [6 favorites]
I also want to say - and I said this before, briefly - that it makes me so angry that Feraud's relationship with him - THAT HER MENTOR and everyone else on the production encouraged - ended up, in the end, fucking up her career. She wasn't a part of the production once it moved to Broadway, likely because Gyllenhaal made it a condition of his continued participation. And again, everyone played along. She was an INTERN and he fucked up her career. I just... I can't. I can't.
Shades of Monica Lewinsky there too...
posted by nayantara at 7:44 AM on April 27, 2022 [6 favorites]
This piece's treatment of attraction and consent and love and power and harm is like a very condensed My Dark Vanessa.
posted by jocelmeow at 11:40 AM on April 27, 2022
posted by jocelmeow at 11:40 AM on April 27, 2022
bookie I actually think that she does believe she was offered up as a barn buddy explicitly. What a horrifyingly accurate metaphor.
posted by macrael at 2:51 PM on April 27, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by macrael at 2:51 PM on April 27, 2022 [4 favorites]
My sister works in the film industry and JG is number one on her “worst of the worst” list.. My sister is gay, married, and his age (aka too old for him) so, while she was not subjected to his sexual predation, she still had to put up with him being a completely narcissistic childish asshole.
I’m also infuriated about how many other people (women!) were complicit in using/objectifying and then dismissing/vilifying Feraud. Gross.
posted by sleepingwithcats at 9:31 PM on April 27, 2022 [10 favorites]
I’m also infuriated about how many other people (women!) were complicit in using/objectifying and then dismissing/vilifying Feraud. Gross.
posted by sleepingwithcats at 9:31 PM on April 27, 2022 [10 favorites]
Swift's short film is lovely, and I hope it was cathartic for her to re-frame the experience for herself. I say that because- her choice to show the Jake stand-in express any yearning or regret that even remotely approached her own (he has seemingly sought her out 13 years later, wearing the old scarf, etc.??), is, and I say this gently, a giant crock.
Predatory types like Jake G. can't regret or miss anyone in the way Taylor dreams of. To project that onto him is amusing at best. She'd like to THINK he misses her and regrets his actions; but- no. Not happening. He's got his own long list of ex-lovers and to him, they are all the same; just another new one in the same old role. She was to him what she needed to be until he was done with her. Just like Feraud.
But it hurts like hell to think you're overlooked and essentially don't matter beyond that brief 3-month lovebombing period. I am glad Taylor has the resources and ability to do whatever she needs to do in order to reclaim her peace of mind. I hope Domenica finds something similar.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 9:47 AM on April 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
Predatory types like Jake G. can't regret or miss anyone in the way Taylor dreams of. To project that onto him is amusing at best. She'd like to THINK he misses her and regrets his actions; but- no. Not happening. He's got his own long list of ex-lovers and to him, they are all the same; just another new one in the same old role. She was to him what she needed to be until he was done with her. Just like Feraud.
But it hurts like hell to think you're overlooked and essentially don't matter beyond that brief 3-month lovebombing period. I am glad Taylor has the resources and ability to do whatever she needs to do in order to reclaim her peace of mind. I hope Domenica finds something similar.
posted by I_Love_Bananas at 9:47 AM on April 28, 2022 [4 favorites]
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This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
I was thinking the other day of an expression, I can't remember where I read it: the strong do as they will, the weak bear what they must. A handsome man is strong, even if he is poor and single and jobless. He can take any woman he wants; he can make us weak. There will always be someone to fall under his spell. How much worse is it when he is charming, when he is rich and powerful?
It's a bleak business. I see that her epigraph is bet you rue the day you kissed a writer in the dark. But does he? I don't think he even remembers. Men like him don't, as a rule. If he has regrets about treating a woman badly, it's because she's powerful herself. A bleak business, finding a man to love when you are a woman. Let's be careful out there.
posted by Countess Elena at 8:07 AM on April 26, 2022 [12 favorites]