The adventures of Novax Djacovid
January 15, 2022 5:36 PM Subscribe
"We’d stop writing about the guy if he stopped giving us fresh crap to write about." "Why on earth would Australia let in a reckless, twice-infected, antivaxxer who is clearly not interested in following rules, and quite possibly played fast-and-loose with the exemption protocols so that he could hit a yellow ball with a racket?"
Timeline here.
Once upon a time there was a Serbian tennis star named Novak Djokovic (or "Novax Djacovid" these days, or "Novax Jackass", which came up as an optional term when I was Googling for non-paywall links*) who (a) is very good at tennis, (b) refused to get vaccinated, (c) despite getting Covid twice so far, and (d) insisted on playing in the Australian Open, in a country with strict vaccination requirements and not all that much Covid compared to most other nations, anyway.
* Please excuse my Deadspin, I found the best articles on this on WaPo but I'm trying to not use a bunch of paywall links to recap it all, and the Deadspin snark was enjoyable.
Originally he was permitted to be in the Australian Open, despite rules saying he needs to be vaccinated, anyway. He got some kind of medical exemption for having Covid recently. Then the Australian government had some objections to this, as he applied for a type of visa that does not allow medical exemptions for vaccination, and he was denied upon arriving in Australia. Then this got challenged and he was allowed to stay after all.
THEN people started investigating his claims regarding his last bout with Covid and found out all kinds of fishy things. Notably: (a) he had a positive test on December 16, (b) he clearly was photographed around other people maskless and with no social distancing RIGHT after that, including children. He also claimed he hadn't been to any other countries of late, which was obviously not true according to his social media. Also, the deadline to announce your previous within-six-months Covid infection was December 10, not December 16. HMMMMMMMMMMMM.
After all of THAT, Novak's visa was canceled AGAIN on "health and good order" grounds, and he's currently waiting around on a hearing to see if he'll be allowed to stay in the country and play in the Open anyway on Monday. If he loses, he could be barred from Australia for three years.
Timeline here.
Once upon a time there was a Serbian tennis star named Novak Djokovic (or "Novax Djacovid" these days, or "Novax Jackass", which came up as an optional term when I was Googling for non-paywall links*) who (a) is very good at tennis, (b) refused to get vaccinated, (c) despite getting Covid twice so far, and (d) insisted on playing in the Australian Open, in a country with strict vaccination requirements and not all that much Covid compared to most other nations, anyway.
* Please excuse my Deadspin, I found the best articles on this on WaPo but I'm trying to not use a bunch of paywall links to recap it all, and the Deadspin snark was enjoyable.
Originally he was permitted to be in the Australian Open, despite rules saying he needs to be vaccinated, anyway. He got some kind of medical exemption for having Covid recently. Then the Australian government had some objections to this, as he applied for a type of visa that does not allow medical exemptions for vaccination, and he was denied upon arriving in Australia. Then this got challenged and he was allowed to stay after all.
THEN people started investigating his claims regarding his last bout with Covid and found out all kinds of fishy things. Notably: (a) he had a positive test on December 16, (b) he clearly was photographed around other people maskless and with no social distancing RIGHT after that, including children. He also claimed he hadn't been to any other countries of late, which was obviously not true according to his social media. Also, the deadline to announce your previous within-six-months Covid infection was December 10, not December 16. HMMMMMMMMMMMM.
After all of THAT, Novak's visa was canceled AGAIN on "health and good order" grounds, and he's currently waiting around on a hearing to see if he'll be allowed to stay in the country and play in the Open anyway on Monday. If he loses, he could be barred from Australia for three years.
Is it possible to throw flames on him? Just in case?
posted by GenjiandProust at 5:48 PM on January 15, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by GenjiandProust at 5:48 PM on January 15, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm confused how there could be any support for Djokovic's position now that it's been established he lied on his immigration forms. I mean the dude claims he had a positive Covid test and then did a photo op with a bunch of children. How much more awful can you be?
posted by Nelson at 5:52 PM on January 15, 2022 [55 favorites]
posted by Nelson at 5:52 PM on January 15, 2022 [55 favorites]
He better be fuckin' barred.
...just saying. From someone who doesn't even live there. Dude oughta be barred.
posted by aramaic at 6:08 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
...just saying. From someone who doesn't even live there. Dude oughta be barred.
posted by aramaic at 6:08 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
It's refreshing that, for once, the idiot at the center of the headlines is not an American.
posted by schmod at 6:09 PM on January 15, 2022 [45 favorites]
posted by schmod at 6:09 PM on January 15, 2022 [45 favorites]
Also, a number of refugees have been housed in the same hotel and kept detained for several years - Park Hotel detainees housed alongside Novak Djokovic describe 'disgusting' and 'cruel' conditions. And, as mentioned in the Deadspin article but not expanded upon Andy Murray trolls Nigel Farage over Djokovic visa row.
posted by phigmov at 6:11 PM on January 15, 2022 [12 favorites]
posted by phigmov at 6:11 PM on January 15, 2022 [12 favorites]
I tried to write this out neutrally, but if he doesn't get kicked out before the Open and banned for 3 years from re-entry, there shall be rage. And I don't even watch tennis. What a fucking goddamned liar doing whatever he wants and getting away with it because he's famous and a big shot. Lies upon lies upon lies that can be easily proved that he's lying by photos and social media. That guy could have spread it everywhere. And he goes to a country that's very specifically trying very hard not to have spread. The fucking nerve of this butthole.
As some of the WaPo articles I didn't link to pointed out, ALL OF THIS COULD HAVE EASILY AND CHEAPLY BEEN AVOIDED IF HE'D JUST GOTTEN HIS SHOTS LIKE EVERYONE ELSE. If you don't want to get vaccinated, then you get to suffer the consequences of not doing so, like not getting to win your title again.
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:30 PM on January 15, 2022 [60 favorites]
As some of the WaPo articles I didn't link to pointed out, ALL OF THIS COULD HAVE EASILY AND CHEAPLY BEEN AVOIDED IF HE'D JUST GOTTEN HIS SHOTS LIKE EVERYONE ELSE. If you don't want to get vaccinated, then you get to suffer the consequences of not doing so, like not getting to win your title again.
posted by jenfullmoon at 6:30 PM on January 15, 2022 [60 favorites]
Christ, what an asshole.
And I say that as an insult to the part of the body known familiarly by the word "asshole." It serves a purpose, after all, while Mr Djokovic does not.
posted by virago at 6:49 PM on January 15, 2022 [9 favorites]
And I say that as an insult to the part of the body known familiarly by the word "asshole." It serves a purpose, after all, while Mr Djokovic does not.
posted by virago at 6:49 PM on January 15, 2022 [9 favorites]
Start Rant/ As an Australian who has (shamefully admitting) watched the Border Force reality TV show a couple of times, the second a (its a commercial show so mostly Asian/pot smoker because ratings/racism) gets caught out on an entry lie, its home they go. Yet a Tennis player is allowed in! He is not even a cricket player. Its disgraceful. And I believe most of Australia wants him gone. /End Rant Just get vaccinated!
posted by Lesium at 6:54 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by Lesium at 6:54 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
→
That guy doesn't seem to have any awareness of other people as people. All he cares about is fuzzy yellow balls
posted by scruss at 7:00 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
That guy could have spread it everywhere
That guy doesn't seem to have any awareness of other people as people. All he cares about is fuzzy yellow balls
posted by scruss at 7:00 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
I'm a rank amateur, and even I know that lying on your immigration forms is a major no-no. I really hope he gets treated like a normal person and tossed out.
posted by Dip Flash at 7:14 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by Dip Flash at 7:14 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
I'm torn, between this asshole, and the great Australian shame of keeping foreign people out of the country as cruelly as possible.
Worth noting, that a court of law and a judge found that Djokovic's visa was valid. But this was overturned by His Grace the Immigration Minister using personal, unlimited powers to cancel visas and deport people whenever he feels like it.
posted by other barry at 7:27 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
Worth noting, that a court of law and a judge found that Djokovic's visa was valid. But this was overturned by His Grace the Immigration Minister using personal, unlimited powers to cancel visas and deport people whenever he feels like it.
posted by other barry at 7:27 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
Of course, if Novak wins, I hope there is a cavalcade of immigration lawyers arguing the case for all the refugees languishing in detention or on sad Visas, like the Biloela family.
posted by freethefeet at 7:47 PM on January 15, 2022 [13 favorites]
posted by freethefeet at 7:47 PM on January 15, 2022 [13 favorites]
How much more awful can you be?
Just wait. There's always more with these guys.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:50 PM on January 15, 2022 [17 favorites]
Just wait. There's always more with these guys.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 7:50 PM on January 15, 2022 [17 favorites]
Tourist: "Why on earth would Australia let in a reckless, twice-infected, antivaxxer who is clearly not interested in following rules, and quite possibly played fast-and-loose with the exemption protocols so that he could hit a yellow ball with a racket?"
Shepherd: "Because of the enormous commercial possibilities should he succeed"
With apologies to M Python and flying sheep everywhere.
posted by Zedcaster at 8:37 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
Shepherd: "Because of the enormous commercial possibilities should he succeed"
With apologies to M Python and flying sheep everywhere.
posted by Zedcaster at 8:37 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
He is likely the greatest tennis player ever to play the game. And if he takes a break from this competition, goes back home and trains for the next one, he'll probably still be the greatest tennis player alive. You fucked it Djokovic, go home with some dignity
posted by dis_integration at 9:22 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by dis_integration at 9:22 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
Such a shitbag
posted by bxvr at 9:41 PM on January 15, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by bxvr at 9:41 PM on January 15, 2022 [1 favorite]
He is likely the greatest tennis player ever to play the game
He might not be able to play in Australia for the next three years. Might hurt that record a bit.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 9:48 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
He might not be able to play in Australia for the next three years. Might hurt that record a bit.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 9:48 PM on January 15, 2022 [3 favorites]
I'm a kiwi and I'm used to there being just one government .... continually I've heard people in the media saying that he was given his visa by the Tennis federation (not the federal govt) how does this work?
posted by mbo at 10:06 PM on January 15, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by mbo at 10:06 PM on January 15, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm a kiwi and I'm used to there being just one government .... continually I've heard people in the media saying that he was given his visa by the Tennis federation (not the federal govt) how does this work?
Separation of powers, similar to the US. Australia was a collection of different colonies, and there was plans to unify them all in a single federation, even New Zealand was invited, and Fiji. Notably, New Zealand is not a federation of states like Australia and US is, so yes, you only have one layer of government. Though, on a micro level, the regional councils are delegated certain powers and responsibilities.
As part of the original agreement, the state governments would retain certain powers, while delegating others to the federal government.
For example, states are responsible for health, education, policing. While the federal government is responsible for international borders, defense, etc.
So in order for Djokovic to play in a public events venue in Victoria, he has to follow the rules set by the Victorian state government - as this falls under their health remit. There was a blind medical panel set up to assess applications, and he was allowed an exemption.
However, his ability to enter Australia is an entirely different matter, one that the Federal Government decides. The Federal Government decided that they didn't want to let him in.
posted by xdvesper at 10:12 PM on January 15, 2022 [10 favorites]
Separation of powers, similar to the US. Australia was a collection of different colonies, and there was plans to unify them all in a single federation, even New Zealand was invited, and Fiji. Notably, New Zealand is not a federation of states like Australia and US is, so yes, you only have one layer of government. Though, on a micro level, the regional councils are delegated certain powers and responsibilities.
As part of the original agreement, the state governments would retain certain powers, while delegating others to the federal government.
For example, states are responsible for health, education, policing. While the federal government is responsible for international borders, defense, etc.
So in order for Djokovic to play in a public events venue in Victoria, he has to follow the rules set by the Victorian state government - as this falls under their health remit. There was a blind medical panel set up to assess applications, and he was allowed an exemption.
However, his ability to enter Australia is an entirely different matter, one that the Federal Government decides. The Federal Government decided that they didn't want to let him in.
posted by xdvesper at 10:12 PM on January 15, 2022 [10 favorites]
I understand that stuff .... but how do sports organisations get the right to hand out visas? (which has been what all the media I've watched recently seem to imply)
posted by mbo at 11:00 PM on January 15, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by mbo at 11:00 PM on January 15, 2022 [1 favorite]
Tennis Australia didn’t give him a visa - that’s just incorrect. Only the federal government can issue a visa.
Anyway he just lost his case:
Bur Novak
posted by awfurby at 11:07 PM on January 15, 2022 [6 favorites]
Anyway he just lost his case:
Bur Novak
posted by awfurby at 11:07 PM on January 15, 2022 [6 favorites]
Worth noting, that a court of law and a judge found that Djokovic's visa was valid
This isn’t quite right. The judge found that Djokovic’s visa was cancelled without him being granted proper time to contact lawyers and establish a case. Not the same as saying his visa was valid.
posted by thebots at 11:26 PM on January 15, 2022 [16 favorites]
This isn’t quite right. The judge found that Djokovic’s visa was cancelled without him being granted proper time to contact lawyers and establish a case. Not the same as saying his visa was valid.
posted by thebots at 11:26 PM on January 15, 2022 [16 favorites]
Remember when Novak Djokovic called out Naomi Osaka for not following the rules?
posted by Halloween Jack at 11:52 PM on January 15, 2022 [18 favorites]
posted by Halloween Jack at 11:52 PM on January 15, 2022 [18 favorites]
He can get out and never come back - if he's not fash, he's fash-aligned
posted by prismatic7 at 11:55 PM on January 15, 2022 [10 favorites]
posted by prismatic7 at 11:55 PM on January 15, 2022 [10 favorites]
Ozzy Man Reviews: DJOKOVIC vs AUSTRALIA.
posted by Pendragon at 11:59 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by Pendragon at 11:59 PM on January 15, 2022 [4 favorites]
This long ago stopped being about Mr Djokovic - if you want my opinion there I can't fathom why people are acting like it was OK to grant him a visa in the first place, but apparently the initial grant is based on the assumption of honesty (if you're a white millionaire celebrity).
However, this is and always has been about politics - the PM didn't want to wear the trouble from right(er)-wing side of his base if the federal government denied ND a visa.
So he said, repeatedly and in public that it was an issue for the states in the hope that he could saddle Victoria and its Premier with the blame despite the fact that border control is very explicitly a constitutional responsibility of the federal government. Then, shock-horror, ND was granted exemption by both TA and the Victorian state government (technically consistent with their rules and blinded, but one has to be suspicious about the veracity of ND's medical evidence) - and, surprise, it was super-unpopular with the people who had just been told they couldn't shit unless they were vaccinated.
Soo, then our beloved federal leader saw a chance to play to polls and miraculously immi cancelled his visa on arrival - kind of a dick move, as was recognized by a judge who overturned the decision.
Sooo, then here they were with their dick in their hands looking like wankers, and in that situation they will _never_ back down but still waited until _Friday_evening_ to use ministerial discretion to cancel ND's visa a second time, presumably with the idea that since he had to play on Monday there would be little time for embarrassing court action before then.
Soooo, then the full bench of the Federal court sat on a Sunday (this is not a common occurrence) to decide the case, and unwilling to essentially neuter the immigration minister they upheld the cancellation in a judgement that all but said it was the wrong thing to do but (shrug) that's the law.
ND is unvaccinated and Australian immigration control does not currently allow unvaccinated people to enter Australia outside of some very specific circumstances, for which he did not qualify. As such he should never have been granted a visa, _however_ the blatant political posturing throughout has been beyond disgusting, as is so much of our politicized immigration system.
posted by memetoclast at 12:50 AM on January 16, 2022 [34 favorites]
However, this is and always has been about politics - the PM didn't want to wear the trouble from right(er)-wing side of his base if the federal government denied ND a visa.
So he said, repeatedly and in public that it was an issue for the states in the hope that he could saddle Victoria and its Premier with the blame despite the fact that border control is very explicitly a constitutional responsibility of the federal government. Then, shock-horror, ND was granted exemption by both TA and the Victorian state government (technically consistent with their rules and blinded, but one has to be suspicious about the veracity of ND's medical evidence) - and, surprise, it was super-unpopular with the people who had just been told they couldn't shit unless they were vaccinated.
Soo, then our beloved federal leader saw a chance to play to polls and miraculously immi cancelled his visa on arrival - kind of a dick move, as was recognized by a judge who overturned the decision.
Sooo, then here they were with their dick in their hands looking like wankers, and in that situation they will _never_ back down but still waited until _Friday_evening_ to use ministerial discretion to cancel ND's visa a second time, presumably with the idea that since he had to play on Monday there would be little time for embarrassing court action before then.
Soooo, then the full bench of the Federal court sat on a Sunday (this is not a common occurrence) to decide the case, and unwilling to essentially neuter the immigration minister they upheld the cancellation in a judgement that all but said it was the wrong thing to do but (shrug) that's the law.
ND is unvaccinated and Australian immigration control does not currently allow unvaccinated people to enter Australia outside of some very specific circumstances, for which he did not qualify. As such he should never have been granted a visa, _however_ the blatant political posturing throughout has been beyond disgusting, as is so much of our politicized immigration system.
posted by memetoclast at 12:50 AM on January 16, 2022 [34 favorites]
Thanks NSW, yes I'm still bitter.
As a resident of NSW, you and me both. The delta wave was arguably down to NSW losing control of it, and there's a reasonable debate to be had over whether NSW dropped the ball or we got unlucky. But this wave, it's pretty clear: the new premier decided to take a stand and preached "personal responsibility", expecting a collective problem to be solved by individuals. Hell of a way to introduce yourself to the electorate.
(For Americans - he backpedalled very quickly, but the damage was already done by that point.)
posted by Merus at 1:56 AM on January 16, 2022 [13 favorites]
As a resident of NSW, you and me both. The delta wave was arguably down to NSW losing control of it, and there's a reasonable debate to be had over whether NSW dropped the ball or we got unlucky. But this wave, it's pretty clear: the new premier decided to take a stand and preached "personal responsibility", expecting a collective problem to be solved by individuals. Hell of a way to introduce yourself to the electorate.
(For Americans - he backpedalled very quickly, but the damage was already done by that point.)
posted by Merus at 1:56 AM on January 16, 2022 [13 favorites]
Rohin Francis / Medlife Crisis last week on How Athletes Fall for Pseudoscience, and Wellness Leads to Conspiracy Theories [19 min]
posted by BobTheScientist at 2:04 AM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
posted by BobTheScientist at 2:04 AM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
ND should never have been allowed in, he’s an anti vaxxer twit. And now that he got in anyway, if he was allowed to stay there would have been an absolute out roar so at least the mistake was corrected. Good riddance. There’s bigger things to worry about than some guy who likes to hit yellow fuzzy balls around. I hope he’s not allowed back for another 3 years.
posted by Jubey at 3:25 AM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by Jubey at 3:25 AM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
"You can think #Djokovic is a tool & at same time be deeply troubled today that he lost because Immigration Ministers power is so vague, all encompassing & untouchable that he is allowed to argue anything is reasonable to cancel a visa as long as he’s ticked all the process boxes."
@ASRC1 - the excellent Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, on twitter
I needed to be reminded. 70 Asylum Seekers. Still in detention. 9 years. Two flavours of government in that time. (Just.)
posted by freethefeet at 3:32 AM on January 16, 2022 [16 favorites]
@ASRC1 - the excellent Asylum Seeker Resource Centre, on twitter
I needed to be reminded. 70 Asylum Seekers. Still in detention. 9 years. Two flavours of government in that time. (Just.)
posted by freethefeet at 3:32 AM on January 16, 2022 [16 favorites]
I've seen this discussed in a bunch of comment sections (WaPo, Spielgel, etc.) and it really looks like there's universal global outrage (not unlike this thread). And I feel it too, and no doubt it's justified. Clearly the guy is an entitled asshole.
Whatever. If he needs to get deported and miss the Australian Open, it still has to be for reasons other than "bad things should happen to unpleasant people." I don't know him, don't care about his character, will not invite him to my next barbecue.
Now, we could say yes, that's why the courts are making the decision... But exceptions are clearly made all the time if it's important enough. And we don't get to say "it's just sportsball shit" because this is actually important to millions of people, and that has to count.
Letting him participate safely is no doubt possible... build a bubble around him and his staff, discard any ball he touches, whatever. It would just be expensive, but not compared to the money already involved in this (which also kind of counts I guess).
So the question becomes, what damage would it do? Everybody who says "If he doesn't have to follow the rules, I don't have to either" would have a point. And the perception that rules don't apply if you're rich and famous would likely be unbelievably damaging to the effort to fight Covid. Hard to quantify, but how many extra deaths are we willing to tolerate to make a tennis tournament more fun? Not many, I hope.
So on balance, yeah, screw him, and put him on the next plane back to Marbella. But do it for reasons other than outrage. Even though this is clearly some outrageous shit.
posted by kleinsteradikaleminderheit at 4:00 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
Whatever. If he needs to get deported and miss the Australian Open, it still has to be for reasons other than "bad things should happen to unpleasant people." I don't know him, don't care about his character, will not invite him to my next barbecue.
Now, we could say yes, that's why the courts are making the decision... But exceptions are clearly made all the time if it's important enough. And we don't get to say "it's just sportsball shit" because this is actually important to millions of people, and that has to count.
Letting him participate safely is no doubt possible... build a bubble around him and his staff, discard any ball he touches, whatever. It would just be expensive, but not compared to the money already involved in this (which also kind of counts I guess).
So the question becomes, what damage would it do? Everybody who says "If he doesn't have to follow the rules, I don't have to either" would have a point. And the perception that rules don't apply if you're rich and famous would likely be unbelievably damaging to the effort to fight Covid. Hard to quantify, but how many extra deaths are we willing to tolerate to make a tennis tournament more fun? Not many, I hope.
So on balance, yeah, screw him, and put him on the next plane back to Marbella. But do it for reasons other than outrage. Even though this is clearly some outrageous shit.
posted by kleinsteradikaleminderheit at 4:00 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
He lied in response to a question on a legal form as part of entry to a country. Anyone should expect blowback if they do that. That seems like plenty of reason. Plus he showed he was irresponsible by admitting to meeting people when he knew he was infected. The whole thing is complicated by the exploitative reaction of Australian politicians but the basics are he's been a dick.
posted by biffa at 5:08 AM on January 16, 2022 [17 favorites]
posted by biffa at 5:08 AM on January 16, 2022 [17 favorites]
The delta wave was arguably down to NSW losing control of it
where by "arguably" you clearly mean "indisputably".
Luckily we have Jimmy Rees to keep it from all going down the memory hole: Meanwhile In Australia parts 18 (May 7), 19 and 19.1 (May 26-28), 20 (Jun 3), 21 (Jun 24 - Delta wave starts), 22 and 23 (Jun 28-30, Delta wave grows as NSW faffs about with the exact kind of piecewise lockdowns that Victoria has just finished showing don't work, and the Feds still haven't organized an adequate MRNA vaccine supply), 24 and 25 (Jul 12-16 - NSW now in lockdown, but far too late and not hard enough; Delta escapes into Victoria), 26 (Jul 20 - Victoria somewhere between burnout and complacency), 27 (Jul 27 - NSW still refusing to lock down any harder) and 28, 29 and 30 (Aug 4-13 - NSW Premier finally deigns to admit that her bullshit piecewise lockdown is a lockdown).
NSW wasted more than a month on a half-arsed non-response that would not have been adequate to contain an Alpha wave, let alone the much more infectious Delta, which then exploded into the rest of the nation (WA notably excepted). And after seeing those feeble attempts and total reliance on vaccinations fail to contain Delta, they went almost immediately to full let-her-rip with Omicron.
So now we're at the point where hospitalizations are at unprecedented and still growing levels and the new NSW Premier has nothing to offer but thoughts and prayers to the families of those his Party's policy failures have killed.
there's a reasonable debate to be had over whether NSW dropped the ball or we got unlucky
Clearly it was both.
posted by flabdablet at 5:09 AM on January 16, 2022 [7 favorites]
where by "arguably" you clearly mean "indisputably".
Luckily we have Jimmy Rees to keep it from all going down the memory hole: Meanwhile In Australia parts 18 (May 7), 19 and 19.1 (May 26-28), 20 (Jun 3), 21 (Jun 24 - Delta wave starts), 22 and 23 (Jun 28-30, Delta wave grows as NSW faffs about with the exact kind of piecewise lockdowns that Victoria has just finished showing don't work, and the Feds still haven't organized an adequate MRNA vaccine supply), 24 and 25 (Jul 12-16 - NSW now in lockdown, but far too late and not hard enough; Delta escapes into Victoria), 26 (Jul 20 - Victoria somewhere between burnout and complacency), 27 (Jul 27 - NSW still refusing to lock down any harder) and 28, 29 and 30 (Aug 4-13 - NSW Premier finally deigns to admit that her bullshit piecewise lockdown is a lockdown).
NSW wasted more than a month on a half-arsed non-response that would not have been adequate to contain an Alpha wave, let alone the much more infectious Delta, which then exploded into the rest of the nation (WA notably excepted). And after seeing those feeble attempts and total reliance on vaccinations fail to contain Delta, they went almost immediately to full let-her-rip with Omicron.
So now we're at the point where hospitalizations are at unprecedented and still growing levels and the new NSW Premier has nothing to offer but thoughts and prayers to the families of those his Party's policy failures have killed.
there's a reasonable debate to be had over whether NSW dropped the ball or we got unlucky
Clearly it was both.
posted by flabdablet at 5:09 AM on January 16, 2022 [7 favorites]
I can't fathom why people are acting like it was OK to grant him a visa in the first place
You and a former Deputy Secretary of the Immigration Department both. The whole thing has been a fiasco from the get-go.
posted by flabdablet at 5:25 AM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
You and a former Deputy Secretary of the Immigration Department both. The whole thing has been a fiasco from the get-go.
posted by flabdablet at 5:25 AM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
So on balance, yeah, screw him, and put him on the next plane back to Marbella. But do it for reasons other than outrage.
To be honest I was surprised that the government's only justification was the risk of "civil unrest", without any mention of him lying, or any mention of him not meeting the actual requirements for entry. Why rest everything just on that?
I've also been a little confused by the entry requirements part. Do you need to be vaccinated to get a visa -- or just to enter, meaning that a visa by itself is just a prerequisite for entry but not actually sufficient? The latter, right? In which case the arguments that "they gave him a visa, so they should have let him enter" aren't actually relevant? But the government page on travel requirements is ambiguous and I can't tell if you need both a visa and an exemption to travel restrictions, or if getting an individual-exemption visa counts as an exemption to those restrictions.
Anyway, Djokovic's family have been acting like assholes throughout ("They’re stomping all over him to stomp all over Serbia and the Serbian people [...] to bring Serbia to its knees", etc.), presumably with his blessing, and hopefully he doesn't decide to devote his post-tennis career to right-wing politics. I'd be surprised if he isn't being actively courted for that.
His supporters have also been taking the contradictory and obnoxious stance of "they shouldn't have treated someone so prominent that way" and "if Serbia were a more important country they wouldn't have done this". Australia's immigration system really is cruel, dehumanizing, unethical, and terrible to refugees and people without any power, but if you want to argue against that then you should argue against that, not against the fact that you personally weren't important enough to get the VIP treatment. The irony of embracing Nigel Farage is amazing.
posted by trig at 6:24 AM on January 16, 2022 [6 favorites]
To be honest I was surprised that the government's only justification was the risk of "civil unrest", without any mention of him lying, or any mention of him not meeting the actual requirements for entry. Why rest everything just on that?
I've also been a little confused by the entry requirements part. Do you need to be vaccinated to get a visa -- or just to enter, meaning that a visa by itself is just a prerequisite for entry but not actually sufficient? The latter, right? In which case the arguments that "they gave him a visa, so they should have let him enter" aren't actually relevant? But the government page on travel requirements is ambiguous and I can't tell if you need both a visa and an exemption to travel restrictions, or if getting an individual-exemption visa counts as an exemption to those restrictions.
Anyway, Djokovic's family have been acting like assholes throughout ("They’re stomping all over him to stomp all over Serbia and the Serbian people [...] to bring Serbia to its knees", etc.), presumably with his blessing, and hopefully he doesn't decide to devote his post-tennis career to right-wing politics. I'd be surprised if he isn't being actively courted for that.
His supporters have also been taking the contradictory and obnoxious stance of "they shouldn't have treated someone so prominent that way" and "if Serbia were a more important country they wouldn't have done this". Australia's immigration system really is cruel, dehumanizing, unethical, and terrible to refugees and people without any power, but if you want to argue against that then you should argue against that, not against the fact that you personally weren't important enough to get the VIP treatment. The irony of embracing Nigel Farage is amazing.
posted by trig at 6:24 AM on January 16, 2022 [6 favorites]
I think that it would be really difficult for a country to ask its citizens to make extraordinary sacrifices to prevent the spread of a disease and then to make huge, glaring exceptions to rules for a famous sportsballer because sportsball is important to people. I know someone whose Australian parents were not able to attend her wedding, and weddings are also important to people. My brother wasn't able to be at my mother's funeral because he lives in a country (not Australia) that had travel restrictions that would have made it impossible for him to return on a timeline that was acceptable to his job. Everyone is dealing with a shitty, interminable situation, and nothing kills morale more than the perception that some people don't have to follow the same rules as everyone else because they're perceived to be too powerful and important to have the rules apply to them.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:55 AM on January 16, 2022 [14 favorites]
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:55 AM on January 16, 2022 [14 favorites]
ND lied in order to enter Australia. He could have told a different lie, that he was vaccinated. There would have no way to lie to disprove the lie. He could have entered Australia, played in his stupid tournament, and continued to be the plague rat that he is. You know why he didn’t tell that lie? He didn’t because his antivax stand is entirely political. It’s not about concern for the fictional vaccine side effects. It’s not about his concern for the medical autonomy of others. It’s about drawing a line between his group and not his group and demanding that members of his group be willing to risk death to be part of his group.
posted by rdr at 7:15 AM on January 16, 2022 [20 favorites]
posted by rdr at 7:15 AM on January 16, 2022 [20 favorites]
I'm still surprised there are no diplomatic consequences after it was discovered his positive test was "manipulated".
source
source
Documents provided to court by Djokovic’s lawyers seeking to overturn his 11th-hour visa cancellation revealed that the 34-year-old took a PCR test at 1.05pm on December 16, and returned a positive result seven hours later.posted by DreamerFi at 7:20 AM on January 16, 2022 [10 favorites]
But according to an investigation by Der Spiegel, the digital timestamps on Djokovic’s test result – accessed via Serbia’s public central test registry – suggest the test was not from December 16 at all, but rather 2.21pm on December 26.
“Such timestamps are normally produced automatically by corona test systems, marking when individual tests are entered into the relevant database,” the newspaper claims.
“That usually happens just a few minutes after the test result becomes available.”
A second, negative test result was also provided to court by Djokovic’s lawyers.
“That test was apparently meant to prove that Djokovic had since recovered from his Covid-19 illness,” Der Spiegel writes. “According to the documentation presented, it is from the afternoon of December 22 – and the timing of that test is confirmed by the digital timestamp.”
[..]
In another twist, Der Spiegel reports that “things got strange” when it scanned the QR code linked to Djokovic’s positive December 16 test.
“At 1.19pm on Monday (CET), the result from the scan was ‘Test result Negative’,” the newspaper writes.
“Such a result would have destroyed Djokovic’s case for being allowed into the country. About an hour later, though, at 2.33pm on Monday, a second scan of the QR code returned a different result: ‘Test result Positive.’”
As for Novak and his family -- I worked with a Serbian who knew the family loosely and absolutely hated them all. The impression I got was that he thought they were thugs and bullies who got a lot of outrageous special treatment in Serbia because of Novak's status. The guy I worked with also was shocked a few years ago (pre-pandemic) to see anti-vax sentiment so strong in Serbia, he couldn't figure out what was going on.
As for Australia -- I've been reading for years about their cruel immigration policy and this whole case has been very confusing. Obviously the fact that he lied on his visa application should have disqualified him from entering, and yet that was not the reason given for not letting him in, and makes it seem legally dodgy.
posted by maggiemaggie at 7:22 AM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
As for Australia -- I've been reading for years about their cruel immigration policy and this whole case has been very confusing. Obviously the fact that he lied on his visa application should have disqualified him from entering, and yet that was not the reason given for not letting him in, and makes it seem legally dodgy.
posted by maggiemaggie at 7:22 AM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
I think that it would be really difficult for a country to ask its citizens to make extraordinary sacrifices to prevent the spread of a disease and then to make huge, glaring exceptions to rules for a famous sportsballer because sportsball is important to people.
worked for japan and the olympics!
posted by emmling at 7:31 AM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
worked for japan and the olympics!
posted by emmling at 7:31 AM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
TIL Djokovic has a collection of bizarre health ideas.
He says he has a gluten intolerance. In his book, he writes
posted by Nelson at 7:32 AM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
He says he has a gluten intolerance. In his book, he writes
he discovered his sensitivity to gluten when he held a piece of bread to his stomach with one hand and lost strength in his other arm.He's also got some magical beliefs about the power of the mind
I’ve seen people and I know some people that, through that energetical transformation, through the power of prayer, through the power of gratitude, they manage to turn the most toxic food or the most polluted water into the most healing water. Because water reacts and scientists have proven that, that molecules in the water react to our emotions, to what is being said.At least those beliefs only affect himself (and maybe a glass of water). Testing positive for Covid and then doing maskless photo-ops with kids is actively harmful.
posted by Nelson at 7:32 AM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
I'm getting that Dr. Fauci talking to Senator Rand Paul feeling...
posted by y2karl at 7:34 AM on January 16, 2022
posted by y2karl at 7:34 AM on January 16, 2022
NSW wasted more than a month on a half-arsed non-response that would not have been adequate to contain an Alpha wave
Luckily we have Jimmy Rees to keep it from all going down the memory hole
Yeh speaking of going down the memory hole, you might want to check NSW's "half-arsed non-response" at the tail end of 2020, which by the very next of ol' Jimmy's videos had basically blown over as everyone makes fun of QLD. Victorians in particular seem to be very fond of forgetting that NSW had a nasty outbreak on the Northern Beaches over Christmas, which it successfully contained with the same kind of light touch that it tried with the Delta outbreak; we could just as easily say that the Andrews government fucked up the first wave by circulating security guards around quarantine facilities. It would, I think, be more generous to say that state government responses involved a certain amount of fighting the last war, scrambling to adapt to failure, and blaming other states to distract from the suffering they were inflicting on their citizens.
This Omicron wave is absolutely Perrottet's fault, though. It was absolutely let-er-rip.
posted by Merus at 8:02 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
Luckily we have Jimmy Rees to keep it from all going down the memory hole
Yeh speaking of going down the memory hole, you might want to check NSW's "half-arsed non-response" at the tail end of 2020, which by the very next of ol' Jimmy's videos had basically blown over as everyone makes fun of QLD. Victorians in particular seem to be very fond of forgetting that NSW had a nasty outbreak on the Northern Beaches over Christmas, which it successfully contained with the same kind of light touch that it tried with the Delta outbreak; we could just as easily say that the Andrews government fucked up the first wave by circulating security guards around quarantine facilities. It would, I think, be more generous to say that state government responses involved a certain amount of fighting the last war, scrambling to adapt to failure, and blaming other states to distract from the suffering they were inflicting on their citizens.
This Omicron wave is absolutely Perrottet's fault, though. It was absolutely let-er-rip.
posted by Merus at 8:02 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
The guy I worked with also was shocked a few years ago (pre-pandemic) to see anti-vax sentiment so strong in Serbia, he couldn't figure out what was going on.
There's a ton of anti-vax sentiment in most (all?) of the former Soviet countries and areas in the Soviet sphere of control, because of (well-earned) public distrust of the government. (Some people argue it's because the USSR was corrupt, and others that it's because of all the corruption after it broke apart. Either way...)
He could have told a different lie, that he was vaccinated. There would have no way to lie to disprove the lie.
I am not sure about this. Many countries (unlike the US) keep actual centralized records of who's been vaccinated when and with what.
I've been curious about the silence about his sketchy test results too. My guess is that for the Australian government to imply that the Serbian government's centralized results registry has been doctored really would have been a declaration of war, so it wasn't worth it.
posted by trig at 8:09 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
There's a ton of anti-vax sentiment in most (all?) of the former Soviet countries and areas in the Soviet sphere of control, because of (well-earned) public distrust of the government. (Some people argue it's because the USSR was corrupt, and others that it's because of all the corruption after it broke apart. Either way...)
He could have told a different lie, that he was vaccinated. There would have no way to lie to disprove the lie.
I am not sure about this. Many countries (unlike the US) keep actual centralized records of who's been vaccinated when and with what.
I've been curious about the silence about his sketchy test results too. My guess is that for the Australian government to imply that the Serbian government's centralized results registry has been doctored really would have been a declaration of war, so it wasn't worth it.
posted by trig at 8:09 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm getting that Dr. Fauci talking to Senator Rand Paul feeling...
Ooops! I mean that Senator Moran feeling.
As in the common saying, Christ, what Moran!
posted by y2karl at 8:09 AM on January 16, 2022
Ooops! I mean that Senator Moran feeling.
As in the common saying, Christ, what Moran!
posted by y2karl at 8:09 AM on January 16, 2022
we could just as easily say that the Andrews government fucked up the first wave by circulating security guards around quarantine facilities
We can and should say that, because it is undoubtedly the case. The initial response to COVID was a total shitshow everywhere except WA; McGowan's go-hard, go-early doctrine is very easily mocked but it's also totally correct.
It's also worth bearing in mind that quarantine is a Commonwealth responsibility, not a State responsibility, and the only reason that any of the States were forced into the position of needing to use commercial accommodation facilities with ventilation systems blindingly obviously ill-suited to containing a respiratory epidemic to try to do exactly that is part and parcel of the present Commonwealth Government's failure to discharge any of its responsibilities with anything even vaguely resembling honest competence.
Djokovic getting the fuck-off treatment makes me happy. If only we could work out how to apply the same to Scotty from Announcements and his feckless crew of sycophants, enablers and fossil fuel industry shills.
posted by flabdablet at 8:27 AM on January 16, 2022 [10 favorites]
We can and should say that, because it is undoubtedly the case. The initial response to COVID was a total shitshow everywhere except WA; McGowan's go-hard, go-early doctrine is very easily mocked but it's also totally correct.
It's also worth bearing in mind that quarantine is a Commonwealth responsibility, not a State responsibility, and the only reason that any of the States were forced into the position of needing to use commercial accommodation facilities with ventilation systems blindingly obviously ill-suited to containing a respiratory epidemic to try to do exactly that is part and parcel of the present Commonwealth Government's failure to discharge any of its responsibilities with anything even vaguely resembling honest competence.
Djokovic getting the fuck-off treatment makes me happy. If only we could work out how to apply the same to Scotty from Announcements and his feckless crew of sycophants, enablers and fossil fuel industry shills.
posted by flabdablet at 8:27 AM on January 16, 2022 [10 favorites]
Well, he's gone. Boy, that must have been one of the more uncomfortable trips his fellow passengers ever took.
posted by y2karl at 8:56 AM on January 16, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by y2karl at 8:56 AM on January 16, 2022 [4 favorites]
i am disappointed at a stunning lack of tennis puns in this thread
posted by glonous keming at 11:27 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by glonous keming at 11:27 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
i am disappointed at a stunning lack of tennis puns in this thread
Yeah, that's totally not cricket.
posted by Pendragon at 11:47 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
Yeah, that's totally not cricket.
posted by Pendragon at 11:47 AM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
i am disappointed at a stunning lack of tennis puns in this thread
Well then get in on the racket and address the faults. That's the baseline expectation.
posted by stevis23 at 11:51 AM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
Well then get in on the racket and address the faults. That's the baseline expectation.
posted by stevis23 at 11:51 AM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
It's great he's been given this opportunity to work on his return.
posted by 7segment at 12:01 PM on January 16, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by 7segment at 12:01 PM on January 16, 2022 [7 favorites]
What are the chances he’ll be barred from entering the US for the US Open? He just got deported by a close ally for being a threat to public safety. That’s something that US immigration officials tend to take seriously. And US customs and immigration has a reputation of not giving a fuck whether someone’s famous.
posted by mr_roboto at 12:03 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by mr_roboto at 12:03 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
"They think that they humiliated Djokovic with this 10-day harassment, and they actually humiliated themselves. If you said that the one who was not vaccinated has no right to enter, Novak would not come or would be vaccinated," Vucic told reporters.
I'm not mad, you're mad.
What are the chances he’ll be barred from entering the US for the US Open?
It would seem his President is saying he would get vaccinated if he had to, "I mean duh, all you had to do was say something!" Eyerolls.
posted by rhizome at 12:16 PM on January 16, 2022
I'm not mad, you're mad.
What are the chances he’ll be barred from entering the US for the US Open?
It would seem his President is saying he would get vaccinated if he had to, "I mean duh, all you had to do was say something!" Eyerolls.
posted by rhizome at 12:16 PM on January 16, 2022
If Serbia (at whatever level) intervened to falsify PCR results, I expect it would not be past them to fake his vaccination records.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 12:31 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 12:31 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
It would seem his President is saying he would get vaccinated if he had to
This is total conjecture, but it seems more likely that he would be excluded from the US for having a deportation on his record than for not being vaccinated.
posted by mr_roboto at 1:09 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
This is total conjecture, but it seems more likely that he would be excluded from the US for having a deportation on his record than for not being vaccinated.
posted by mr_roboto at 1:09 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
If you’re Australian today is a good day to donate to the ASRC - refugees need lawyers too.
posted by awfurby at 1:41 PM on January 16, 2022 [9 favorites]
posted by awfurby at 1:41 PM on January 16, 2022 [9 favorites]
The delta wave was arguably down to NSW losing control of it
where by "arguably" you clearly mean "indisputably".
Yeah, NSW screwed the pooch, as they usually do. Queensland was doing so well, with a couple of hundred cases total for pretty much all of 2021. Yesterday we had nearly 18,000 new cases.
posted by turbid dahlia at 1:53 PM on January 16, 2022 [4 favorites]
where by "arguably" you clearly mean "indisputably".
Yeah, NSW screwed the pooch, as they usually do. Queensland was doing so well, with a couple of hundred cases total for pretty much all of 2021. Yesterday we had nearly 18,000 new cases.
posted by turbid dahlia at 1:53 PM on January 16, 2022 [4 favorites]
Man, I thought that dude would never leave.
posted by night_train at 2:21 PM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by night_train at 2:21 PM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
He got served.
posted by Melismata at 2:22 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by Melismata at 2:22 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
Return of Serb.
posted by metaplectic at 2:33 PM on January 16, 2022 [10 favorites]
posted by metaplectic at 2:33 PM on January 16, 2022 [10 favorites]
Reading this NYT article, um....for all the shit and lying he did, THAT wasn't the issue?!
posted by jenfullmoon at 2:36 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
The chief justice, James Allsop, announced the decision just before 6 p.m., after explaining that the court was not ruling on the merits of Mr. Djokovic’s stance, or on whether the government was correct in arguing that he might influence others to resist vaccination or defy public health orders. Rather, the court simply found that the immigration minister was within his rights to cancel the tennis star’s visa for a second time based on that possibility.Though then it gets into how the guy had reasons to suspect that this guy would be trouble, so.
posted by jenfullmoon at 2:36 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
He got served.
Becoming the first player to be knocked out of a Grand Slam tournament after missing only two shots.
posted by acb at 2:46 PM on January 16, 2022 [36 favorites]
Becoming the first player to be knocked out of a Grand Slam tournament after missing only two shots.
posted by acb at 2:46 PM on January 16, 2022 [36 favorites]
"Why on earth would Australia let in a reckless, twice-infected, antivaxxer who is clearly not interested in following rules, and quite possibly played fast-and-loose with the exemption protocols so that he could hit a yellow ball with a racket?"
There are several reasons:
1. The Federal government is 100% pursuing a 'blood sacrifice for stonks' approach to COVID. They don't care how many people die as long as business (specifically their donors) benefit. And Tennis Australia wanted the world no. 1 guy.
2. They're shockingly incompetent. And so is Djokovic.
3. There are numerous anti-vaxxers in the Federal Government who are barracking for Djokovic.
4. The Federal Government, while not planning for this, are absolutely using it to distract from their numerous other failures in pandemic management, most recently the failure to make rapid tests available, refusing to provide tests to anyone, actively enabling price gouging by retailers, and then seizing tests ordered by pharmacies for themselves.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 2:57 PM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
There are several reasons:
1. The Federal government is 100% pursuing a 'blood sacrifice for stonks' approach to COVID. They don't care how many people die as long as business (specifically their donors) benefit. And Tennis Australia wanted the world no. 1 guy.
2. They're shockingly incompetent. And so is Djokovic.
3. There are numerous anti-vaxxers in the Federal Government who are barracking for Djokovic.
4. The Federal Government, while not planning for this, are absolutely using it to distract from their numerous other failures in pandemic management, most recently the failure to make rapid tests available, refusing to provide tests to anyone, actively enabling price gouging by retailers, and then seizing tests ordered by pharmacies for themselves.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 2:57 PM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
Reading this NYT article, um....for all the shit and lying he did, THAT wasn't the issue?!
Section 133C give the immigration minister the power to cancel a person's visa if he believes it is in the public interest. The law is written in such a way that gives the minister "godlike powers" - his decision would not be subject to the principles of common law natural justice, and is specifically written to allow the minister to even set aside court decisions.
In that case, you simply pick the reason that you think will gain you the most votes in the upcoming 2022 federal election...
posted by xdvesper at 3:00 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
Section 133C give the immigration minister the power to cancel a person's visa if he believes it is in the public interest. The law is written in such a way that gives the minister "godlike powers" - his decision would not be subject to the principles of common law natural justice, and is specifically written to allow the minister to even set aside court decisions.
In that case, you simply pick the reason that you think will gain you the most votes in the upcoming 2022 federal election...
posted by xdvesper at 3:00 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
In that case, you simply pick the reason that you think will gain you the most votes in the upcoming 2022 federal election...
By letting him in in the first place, they pissed off everyone who doesn't want to die from COVID.
By kicking him out, they've pissed off the anti-vaxxer loons, whose votes they desperately want and who they are likely to lose to Clive Palmer's political party for tax-avoiding proto-fascist libertarian rat-licking loons.
Hard to see how this kerfuffle gains them any votes. They've managed to upset literally everyone.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 3:17 PM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
By letting him in in the first place, they pissed off everyone who doesn't want to die from COVID.
By kicking him out, they've pissed off the anti-vaxxer loons, whose votes they desperately want and who they are likely to lose to Clive Palmer's political party for tax-avoiding proto-fascist libertarian rat-licking loons.
Hard to see how this kerfuffle gains them any votes. They've managed to upset literally everyone.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 3:17 PM on January 16, 2022 [2 favorites]
Hard to see how this kerfuffle gains them any votes. They've managed to upset literally everyone.
Well, like it or not, the Coalition DID win the majority of votes the last time. We'll have to see how this election turns out.
Sure, we think they might lose this time, but I did win a substantial amount of money (paid out at a ratio of 6:1) betting that the Coalition would win in 2019, when every poll and opinion piece in the media agreed they were going to lose to Labor in the election. I just found the comparisons with Trump too uncanny...
(Yes, I bet against the result I wanted, it's a hedging strategy...)
Anyway the payout now for a Coalition win is just 2.65 so the general opinion is they're much more likely to win this election than the last one, though it still favors Labor slightly.
On a somewhat serious note, I find betting sites a better indicator of who is going to win, because
1. They have an actual, real incentive for getting their forecasts right, because if they mis-price a bet they stand to lose millions of dollars. On the other hand, if the media get it wrong... just pretend you never wrote the article in the first place.
2. If I think the betting agency is hilariously, completely wrong, I can just take them up on that bet. If I think an editorial or opinion piece is wrong, I guess I could just write a comment and hope it doesn't get brigaded or deleted...
posted by xdvesper at 3:44 PM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
Well, like it or not, the Coalition DID win the majority of votes the last time. We'll have to see how this election turns out.
Sure, we think they might lose this time, but I did win a substantial amount of money (paid out at a ratio of 6:1) betting that the Coalition would win in 2019, when every poll and opinion piece in the media agreed they were going to lose to Labor in the election. I just found the comparisons with Trump too uncanny...
(Yes, I bet against the result I wanted, it's a hedging strategy...)
Anyway the payout now for a Coalition win is just 2.65 so the general opinion is they're much more likely to win this election than the last one, though it still favors Labor slightly.
On a somewhat serious note, I find betting sites a better indicator of who is going to win, because
1. They have an actual, real incentive for getting their forecasts right, because if they mis-price a bet they stand to lose millions of dollars. On the other hand, if the media get it wrong... just pretend you never wrote the article in the first place.
2. If I think the betting agency is hilariously, completely wrong, I can just take them up on that bet. If I think an editorial or opinion piece is wrong, I guess I could just write a comment and hope it doesn't get brigaded or deleted...
posted by xdvesper at 3:44 PM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
I'm tempted to bet on a Coalition win as well (not more than I can afford to lose, but enough to get drunk on the winnings), though am not aware of any betting sites serving customers in the EU that allow betting on Australian elections.
I've seen a lot of signs that the Tories are facing a once-in-a-generation landslide defeat, but none of them pass the “how the hell did Nixon win? I don't know one person who voted for him” test. Basically, almost everyone reasonably well-informed and not actively operating in bad faith seems to be contained in the Lefty Filter Bubble, voting in two-way Labor/Greens races, whereas the actual outcome will be decided by the electoral dark matter in the vast, sprawling suburbs, where nobody has heard of Crikey or The Guardian, and for all one knows, ScoMo may still be Australia's Favourite Daggy Dad, or at least less scary than that Labor guy who's going to ban meat pies and the V8 Commodore or something. So, until Anthony Green calls it for Labor on the night, I'm going to write off any evidence of an impending Tory wipeout as wishful thinking.
posted by acb at 3:53 PM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
I've seen a lot of signs that the Tories are facing a once-in-a-generation landslide defeat, but none of them pass the “how the hell did Nixon win? I don't know one person who voted for him” test. Basically, almost everyone reasonably well-informed and not actively operating in bad faith seems to be contained in the Lefty Filter Bubble, voting in two-way Labor/Greens races, whereas the actual outcome will be decided by the electoral dark matter in the vast, sprawling suburbs, where nobody has heard of Crikey or The Guardian, and for all one knows, ScoMo may still be Australia's Favourite Daggy Dad, or at least less scary than that Labor guy who's going to ban meat pies and the V8 Commodore or something. So, until Anthony Green calls it for Labor on the night, I'm going to write off any evidence of an impending Tory wipeout as wishful thinking.
posted by acb at 3:53 PM on January 16, 2022 [8 favorites]
Well, like it or not, the Coalition DID win the majority of votes the last time. We'll have to see how this election turns out.
They have a one seat majority. And with that razor thin majority, in the last term (and off the top of my head):
- One of their cabinet members (former Attorney General Christian Porter) was accused of rape, which they helped him avoid scruitiny over, attempted to sue an agency in his own portfolio for accurately reporting on the allegations, and then took a million dollar bribe, which they also helped him avoid scrutiny over.
- One of their cabinet members (Angus Taylor, Environment Minister) is implicated in numerous scandals in his own portfolio, including his company poisoning critically endangered grasslands that they found inconvenient..
- One of their cabinet members (Alan Tudge) had an affair with a staff member, whom he then abused.
- One of their backbenchers (Andrew Laming) has been caught harassing his own constituents and taking upskirt photos.
- Another (George Christiansen) is a vocal anti-vaxxer.
The government also sought to cover up a rape in Parliament House itself.
There are many more examples in this scandal-ridden government, but these are the most likely candidates to be under threat IMO. I'm hoping against hope that one or more of these assholes has generated enough disgust for their electorates to boot them.
Barnaby Joyce's (the Deputy PM) personal scandals could fill a book, but he's very popular in his own electorate.
Australian mefites know all this, of course. Details are provided for the benefit of our international brethren.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:11 PM on January 16, 2022 [16 favorites]
They have a one seat majority. And with that razor thin majority, in the last term (and off the top of my head):
- One of their cabinet members (former Attorney General Christian Porter) was accused of rape, which they helped him avoid scruitiny over, attempted to sue an agency in his own portfolio for accurately reporting on the allegations, and then took a million dollar bribe, which they also helped him avoid scrutiny over.
- One of their cabinet members (Angus Taylor, Environment Minister) is implicated in numerous scandals in his own portfolio, including his company poisoning critically endangered grasslands that they found inconvenient..
- One of their cabinet members (Alan Tudge) had an affair with a staff member, whom he then abused.
- One of their backbenchers (Andrew Laming) has been caught harassing his own constituents and taking upskirt photos.
- Another (George Christiansen) is a vocal anti-vaxxer.
The government also sought to cover up a rape in Parliament House itself.
There are many more examples in this scandal-ridden government, but these are the most likely candidates to be under threat IMO. I'm hoping against hope that one or more of these assholes has generated enough disgust for their electorates to boot them.
Barnaby Joyce's (the Deputy PM) personal scandals could fill a book, but he's very popular in his own electorate.
Australian mefites know all this, of course. Details are provided for the benefit of our international brethren.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:11 PM on January 16, 2022 [16 favorites]
> Hard to see how this kerfuffle gains them any votes. They've managed to upset literally everyone.
But fewer people are dead.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 4:28 PM on January 16, 2022
But fewer people are dead.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 4:28 PM on January 16, 2022
i am disappointed at a stunning lack of tennis puns in this thread
If you've been keeping score, there's been little love.
posted by allium cepa at 4:36 PM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
If you've been keeping score, there's been little love.
posted by allium cepa at 4:36 PM on January 16, 2022 [5 favorites]
But fewer people are dead.
Novax probably wasn't going to murder anyone with his bare hands, and frankly the risk of introducing a specific single ratlicker to Melbourne, which currently has 30K new COVID cases a day (thanks Omicron!), is negligible.
Further, I am not hyperbolising when I say that the Federal Government doesn't care if people dies from COVID. They have done their level best to undermine all efforts from the states to keep people safe. If this was about public safety, the Federal Government would never have given him the visa in the first place. The deportation is about damage control following public outcry, nothing more.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:38 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
Novax probably wasn't going to murder anyone with his bare hands, and frankly the risk of introducing a specific single ratlicker to Melbourne, which currently has 30K new COVID cases a day (thanks Omicron!), is negligible.
Further, I am not hyperbolising when I say that the Federal Government doesn't care if people dies from COVID. They have done their level best to undermine all efforts from the states to keep people safe. If this was about public safety, the Federal Government would never have given him the visa in the first place. The deportation is about damage control following public outcry, nothing more.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:38 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
i am disappointed at a stunning lack of tennis puns in this thread
Whose fault is that? Be the comedy you wish to see in the world.
Oh, I see this joke has already been made. A double fault, if you will.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:40 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
Whose fault is that? Be the comedy you wish to see in the world.
Oh, I see this joke has already been made. A double fault, if you will.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 4:40 PM on January 16, 2022 [1 favorite]
Rather, the court simply found that the immigration minister was within his rights to cancel the tennis star’s visa for a second time based on that possibility.
In the one court case I've been involved in in my life, the judge asked our lawyer to re-draft a petition so that the judge could issue the narrowest ruling possible. Since then, I've noticed other courts in the news choosing to do the same thing.
posted by Well I never at 4:43 PM on January 16, 2022
In the one court case I've been involved in in my life, the judge asked our lawyer to re-draft a petition so that the judge could issue the narrowest ruling possible. Since then, I've noticed other courts in the news choosing to do the same thing.
posted by Well I never at 4:43 PM on January 16, 2022
I have no fondness at all for Novak, who appears to be an entitled right wing dickheaded idiot. Which is part of why it's hard to even begin to credit any outrage on the part of Scomo, as they have more in common than not.
Besides diverting attention from the very real flailing and bungling going on here with respect to the covid response, I'm mostly just furious how little reaction there seems to be at the highlighting of entrenched racist, classist, sexist foundations of society here.
Everyone here knows there are special classes of people. But the great lies of classless society and fair goes, and global leaders in lack of corruption keep getting trotted out.
There's rot to the core and kool-aid served daily in the Murdoch media.
posted by allium cepa at 4:46 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
Besides diverting attention from the very real flailing and bungling going on here with respect to the covid response, I'm mostly just furious how little reaction there seems to be at the highlighting of entrenched racist, classist, sexist foundations of society here.
Everyone here knows there are special classes of people. But the great lies of classless society and fair goes, and global leaders in lack of corruption keep getting trotted out.
There's rot to the core and kool-aid served daily in the Murdoch media.
posted by allium cepa at 4:46 PM on January 16, 2022 [3 favorites]
Novax probably wasn't going to murder anyone with his bare hands
He is unvaccinated and has already demonstrated that he'll go around unmasked while infected, let alone ignore self-quarantine protocols.
I don't know if some don't think of it as murder, because a virus particle is so small, or we're all weary of coronavirus news, but spreading disease and death is definitely murder, especially when the perp in question openly lies about being infected and acts in perhaps the most ignorant and abusive ways possible to those around him, when he already knows he is infected.
I have little knowledge about Australian politics and can't speak to that, but on the science and health policy, I can: This was the right decision in all ways. The pro athlete in question is a sociopath and shouldn't be out in public until he understands and can apply basic notions of right and wrong to his own conduct in the middle of a pandemic.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 6:57 PM on January 16, 2022 [14 favorites]
He is unvaccinated and has already demonstrated that he'll go around unmasked while infected, let alone ignore self-quarantine protocols.
I don't know if some don't think of it as murder, because a virus particle is so small, or we're all weary of coronavirus news, but spreading disease and death is definitely murder, especially when the perp in question openly lies about being infected and acts in perhaps the most ignorant and abusive ways possible to those around him, when he already knows he is infected.
I have little knowledge about Australian politics and can't speak to that, but on the science and health policy, I can: This was the right decision in all ways. The pro athlete in question is a sociopath and shouldn't be out in public until he understands and can apply basic notions of right and wrong to his own conduct in the middle of a pandemic.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 6:57 PM on January 16, 2022 [14 favorites]
I have little knowledge about Australian politics and can't speak to that, but on the science and health policy, I can: This was the right decision in all ways.
You might be missing some context. They didn't just deny him entry. The Australian Government:
1. gave him a visa when he applied for it, then
2. denied him entry when got off the plane in Australia, at 4am
3. lost the appeal
4. then cancelled his visa using Ministerial power
5. then won against Novax's second appeal.
If they were at all concerned about him spreading disease, they never would have granted a visa to a vocal anti-vaxxer in the first place. Is it the correct outcome from a public policy perspective? Sure. Was it the 'right decision in all ways'? Hah, no, this was the dumbest possible way to get there.
They didn't even deport him for being unvaccinated - they cancelled his visa on basis that it would be a risk to the "good order of the Australian public and may be counterproductive to efforts at vaccination by others in Australia”. The hubris, when there are current members of this same government that are vocal anti-vaxxers. The drama around this has inflamed the anti-vaxxers more than just letting him play would have.
The general consensus position is that Novax is an asshole and should fuck off, but that the government has behaved ridiculously and ineptly.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 7:40 PM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
You might be missing some context. They didn't just deny him entry. The Australian Government:
1. gave him a visa when he applied for it, then
2. denied him entry when got off the plane in Australia, at 4am
3. lost the appeal
4. then cancelled his visa using Ministerial power
5. then won against Novax's second appeal.
If they were at all concerned about him spreading disease, they never would have granted a visa to a vocal anti-vaxxer in the first place. Is it the correct outcome from a public policy perspective? Sure. Was it the 'right decision in all ways'? Hah, no, this was the dumbest possible way to get there.
They didn't even deport him for being unvaccinated - they cancelled his visa on basis that it would be a risk to the "good order of the Australian public and may be counterproductive to efforts at vaccination by others in Australia”. The hubris, when there are current members of this same government that are vocal anti-vaxxers. The drama around this has inflamed the anti-vaxxers more than just letting him play would have.
The general consensus position is that Novax is an asshole and should fuck off, but that the government has behaved ridiculously and ineptly.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 7:40 PM on January 16, 2022 [11 favorites]
The fact that he tried (and initially succeeded) to enter Australia well aware that he is violating the restrictions and apparently assumed that they don't apply to him is one thing. Then his family saying that his detention is basically incarcerating him. And now the Serbian president is saying that him being detained (for breaking the law) was torture. What a ride that was. Frankly, he should be happy he didn't end up in an actual prison. First time in a long time that I have felt that somewhat similar rules apply to rich and poor alike.
What baffles me during the pandemic is the exemption of international sports events from regulation that applies to everyone else (at least in Europe that is often the case). The entire country can be close to locked down, curfew, mandatory work from home, many businesses not operating, kids not going to school, no more than 2 people are allowed to meet and then only outdoors, but sure, why not, say, have a freakin chess tournament there bringing hundreds of people from around the world. When on earth did these events and the sports celebrities became essential to survival.
posted by sharksmile at 6:13 AM on January 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
What baffles me during the pandemic is the exemption of international sports events from regulation that applies to everyone else (at least in Europe that is often the case). The entire country can be close to locked down, curfew, mandatory work from home, many businesses not operating, kids not going to school, no more than 2 people are allowed to meet and then only outdoors, but sure, why not, say, have a freakin chess tournament there bringing hundreds of people from around the world. When on earth did these events and the sports celebrities became essential to survival.
posted by sharksmile at 6:13 AM on January 17, 2022 [4 favorites]
What a shit head.
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 8:20 AM on January 17, 2022
posted by OnTheLastCastle at 8:20 AM on January 17, 2022
You'll have to be more specific.
posted by acb at 8:45 AM on January 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by acb at 8:45 AM on January 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
No Vaccine, No French Open for Novax.
Please let this trend continue.
posted by lock robster at 10:26 AM on January 17, 2022 [7 favorites]
Please let this trend continue.
posted by lock robster at 10:26 AM on January 17, 2022 [7 favorites]
If the Serbian government fakes his PCR results, they can fake his vaccination status. Still, good news all the same — more of this, please, everywhere.
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 11:09 AM on January 17, 2022
posted by They sucked his brains out! at 11:09 AM on January 17, 2022
I saw Mary Carillo on the news calling Djokovic's actions (hanging out unmasked with kids and an interviewer, the error on the immigration form) as "mistakes", just like there were "mistakes" on the government side. It seems like it was only a mistake in Djokovic's mind because he got caught.
posted by armacy at 12:14 PM on January 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by armacy at 12:14 PM on January 17, 2022 [2 favorites]
Remember when Novak Djokovic called out Naomi Osaka for not following the rules?
"Spiritual" Serbian who dabbles in right-wing anti-vaxx conspiracy theories scolding a woman of color for doing basic self-care? Sounds about white.
posted by jonp72 at 1:20 PM on January 17, 2022 [10 favorites]
"Spiritual" Serbian who dabbles in right-wing anti-vaxx conspiracy theories scolding a woman of color for doing basic self-care? Sounds about white.
posted by jonp72 at 1:20 PM on January 17, 2022 [10 favorites]
What baffles me during the pandemic is the exemption of international sports events from regulation that applies to everyone else (at least in Europe that is often the case). The entire country can be close to locked down, curfew, mandatory work from home, many businesses not operating, kids not going to school, no more than 2 people are allowed to meet and then only outdoors, but sure, why not, say, have a freakin chess tournament there bringing hundreds of people from around the world. When on earth did these events and the sports celebrities became essential to survival.
Whenever the correlation between sports fans and low-information, "could go either way" swing voters is high...
posted by jonp72 at 1:22 PM on January 17, 2022
Whenever the correlation between sports fans and low-information, "could go either way" swing voters is high...
posted by jonp72 at 1:22 PM on January 17, 2022
Just expressing my admiration for the coining of "Novax Djackass", will use it my email to my Aussie friends this evening.
posted by epo at 5:38 AM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by epo at 5:38 AM on January 18, 2022 [2 favorites]
NYT: After Australia, Djokovic is likely to run into problems in France and the U.S.
The French authorities said this week that players must be vaccinated to compete in the French Open — the next of the four Grand Slam tournaments, scheduled for May.
If Mr. Djokovic refuses to get vaccinated, he is likely to miss a second major tournament in a row, reflecting a major shift in how public officials approach Covid requirements and potential exemptions. As emblematic as Australia’s refusal to give Mr. Djokovic special treatment has been, it might just be the beginning.
The authorities in Spain, where Mr. Djokovic owns a house, have urged him to “lead by example” and get vaccinated. In Monte Carlo, where Mr. Djokovic also has a house, the organizers of a tournament that he has previously won said they were awaiting guidelines from the French government for the 2022 edition in April.
Mr. Djokovic might be able to compete in Wimbledon in June, but under current guidelines he could be barred from competing in the U.S. Open a few months later, since foreign travelers must be vaccinated to enter the United States, with very limited exceptions.
After France adopted a Covid pass law on Sunday requiring people to be vaccinated to enter restaurants, cinemas and sporting arenas, the country’s Sports Ministry said that no exemption would be made for athletes.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:07 AM on January 19, 2022
The French authorities said this week that players must be vaccinated to compete in the French Open — the next of the four Grand Slam tournaments, scheduled for May.
If Mr. Djokovic refuses to get vaccinated, he is likely to miss a second major tournament in a row, reflecting a major shift in how public officials approach Covid requirements and potential exemptions. As emblematic as Australia’s refusal to give Mr. Djokovic special treatment has been, it might just be the beginning.
The authorities in Spain, where Mr. Djokovic owns a house, have urged him to “lead by example” and get vaccinated. In Monte Carlo, where Mr. Djokovic also has a house, the organizers of a tournament that he has previously won said they were awaiting guidelines from the French government for the 2022 edition in April.
Mr. Djokovic might be able to compete in Wimbledon in June, but under current guidelines he could be barred from competing in the U.S. Open a few months later, since foreign travelers must be vaccinated to enter the United States, with very limited exceptions.
After France adopted a Covid pass law on Sunday requiring people to be vaccinated to enter restaurants, cinemas and sporting arenas, the country’s Sports Ministry said that no exemption would be made for athletes.
posted by jenfullmoon at 9:07 AM on January 19, 2022
ScoMo is out today demanding that children be allowed to drive forklifts to ease the labour shortage and supply line crisis, just in case anyone is wondering if he was playing 9th dimensional chess re Novax.
He's wasn't, he's just a moron. There's no strategy, he's just flailing around.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 6:44 PM on January 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
He's wasn't, he's just a moron. There's no strategy, he's just flailing around.
posted by His thoughts were red thoughts at 6:44 PM on January 19, 2022 [3 favorites]
Meanwhile Djokovic and his wife now control a new Danish biotech startup supposedly working on a cure for covid (they respectively have 40.8% and 39.2% stakes -- why that setup, I don't know).
posted by trig at 5:31 AM on January 20, 2022
posted by trig at 5:31 AM on January 20, 2022
So the description that I’ve found about QuantBioRes the startup that ND is investing in tells me that the company is headed by an entrepreneur and that they are “…developing a peptide, which inhibits the coronavirus from infecting the human cell.” I would bet money that ND got conned.
posted by rdr at 6:57 AM on January 20, 2022
posted by rdr at 6:57 AM on January 20, 2022
Yep it’s a scam:
At QuantBioRes, we work in utilising unique and novel Resonant Recognition Model … a biophysical model based on findings that certain periodicities/frequencies within the distribution of energies of free electrons along the protein are critical for protein biological function and interaction with protein receptors and other targets
posted by rdr at 7:28 AM on January 20, 2022 [2 favorites]
At QuantBioRes, we work in utilising unique and novel Resonant Recognition Model … a biophysical model based on findings that certain periodicities/frequencies within the distribution of energies of free electrons along the protein are critical for protein biological function and interaction with protein receptors and other targets
posted by rdr at 7:28 AM on January 20, 2022 [2 favorites]
Makes sense! I was wondering how he resolved the contradiction between "only the pure and the natural can enter my pure natural body" and lab-engineered medications.
(The CEO's "I'm an entrepreneur" quotes are also a great sign...)
posted by trig at 9:53 AM on January 20, 2022
(The CEO's "I'm an entrepreneur" quotes are also a great sign...)
posted by trig at 9:53 AM on January 20, 2022
Of course, if Novak wins, I hope there is a cavalcade of immigration lawyers arguing the case for all the refugees languishing in detention or on sad Visas, like the Biloela family.
The exact reason why he didn't win.
posted by turbid dahlia at 8:01 PM on January 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
The exact reason why he didn't win.
posted by turbid dahlia at 8:01 PM on January 20, 2022 [1 favorite]
ScoMo is out today demanding that children be allowed to drive forklifts
Perhaps it's time for an Australian remake of Staplerfahrer Klaus.
posted by acb at 4:49 AM on January 21, 2022
Perhaps it's time for an Australian remake of Staplerfahrer Klaus.
posted by acb at 4:49 AM on January 21, 2022
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Victoria (where Aus Open is played) has a pretty strict no jab, no work policy. Victoria has a labor government. There is no love lost between Victoria and the Federal Coalition government, who have blatantly played "favourite child" with NSW (same flavour government.)
So Scomo (Scott Morrison) was pretty quiet to begin with (let it be Victoria's problem) until it was clear what public sentiment was, then breathless Twitter from Scomo about strong borders blah blah blah.
Morrison government accused of using Novak Djokovic to 'distract' from COVID-19 issues [SBS news]
Honestly, we were doing fairly well (0 cases!) until NSW decided to let all hell break loose. (Arguably, AGAIN.) Thanks NSW, yes I'm still bitter.
posted by freethefeet at 5:46 PM on January 15, 2022 [23 favorites]