Nike Blue
July 22, 2022 6:43 PM Subscribe
"Forget Niketown. To a certain extent we are all citizens of Nikeland now. [NYT]" The brand turns 50.
How ethical is Nike now? They still have some way to go.
How ethical is Nike now? They still have some way to go.
My only gripe with Nikes is they seem to run ridiculously narrow. I’ve never been able wear any of ‘em. I need a good, roomy toebox when running. Definitely some of the coolest looking shoes, though.
I’m old enough to remember when the choices for athletic shoes were basically variations on flat footbeds. Murder.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:25 PM on July 22, 2022 [1 favorite]
I’m old enough to remember when the choices for athletic shoes were basically variations on flat footbeds. Murder.
posted by Thorzdad at 7:25 PM on July 22, 2022 [1 favorite]
Clearly there's no better Nike movie than The Big Chill, it is about boomers who discover sneakers, can afford to buy houses and can still smoke. And yes The Big Chill is the only acceptable use for the derisive term "boomer." Vice even did a send up of it back before they somehow changed into a serious news organization.
posted by geoff. at 7:54 PM on July 22, 2022 [5 favorites]
posted by geoff. at 7:54 PM on July 22, 2022 [5 favorites]
dobbs: "Modern shoe design has basically weakened the feet of humanity by, to paraphrase one of the barefoot companies, making shoe-shaped shoes instead of foot-shaped shoes."
I dunno. I wear flatbottomed shoes with no support (not fancy "barefoot" shoes, just oldschool-style Vans). My wife wears Nikes/Reeboks/whatevers with soles that have all kinds of undulations and curves. When we got out for a long day, I'm the one complaining at the end of the day about how my feet hurt; she's fine. Maybe her shoes made her have shoe-shaped feet, but they're shoe-shaped feet that don't hurt after 8 hours of walking, which makes me feel kind of jealous as a person with feet-shaped feet that do hurt.
That said, 8-hour-walk days are rare, so I stick with the shoes I have because I prefer how they look.
posted by Bugbread at 10:27 PM on July 22, 2022 [8 favorites]
I dunno. I wear flatbottomed shoes with no support (not fancy "barefoot" shoes, just oldschool-style Vans). My wife wears Nikes/Reeboks/whatevers with soles that have all kinds of undulations and curves. When we got out for a long day, I'm the one complaining at the end of the day about how my feet hurt; she's fine. Maybe her shoes made her have shoe-shaped feet, but they're shoe-shaped feet that don't hurt after 8 hours of walking, which makes me feel kind of jealous as a person with feet-shaped feet that do hurt.
That said, 8-hour-walk days are rare, so I stick with the shoes I have because I prefer how they look.
posted by Bugbread at 10:27 PM on July 22, 2022 [8 favorites]
My only gripe with Nikes is they seem to run ridiculously narrow.
My son has very wide feet. Nike's online order-made fresh from the factory website was his savior. The shoes were shipped to us directly from their Vietnam factory.
posted by eye of newt at 10:52 PM on July 22, 2022
My son has very wide feet. Nike's online order-made fresh from the factory website was his savior. The shoes were shipped to us directly from their Vietnam factory.
posted by eye of newt at 10:52 PM on July 22, 2022
Getting those white leather Bruins in the 80s was one of my favorite lifestyle upgrades – I was Cool incarnate. Dollar has 3X down since then so they were ~$120 in today's money, yikes.
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 11:08 PM on July 22, 2022
posted by Heywood Mogroot III at 11:08 PM on July 22, 2022
Mod note: I have removed the archive.org link from the post, because the link was wrong (led back to the NYT article), and I couldn't find a backup of the story there to replace it with. If anyone does find it (or another source), let me know, and I'll add it back!
posted by taz (staff) at 11:39 PM on July 22, 2022
posted by taz (staff) at 11:39 PM on July 22, 2022
I also never owned any Nike trainers due to their narrowness. I think at some point in.my twenties I made a decision not to buy any Nike stuff, can't remember the reason but it's stuck - I'm now 51 and Nike free. (Also, my spellchecker keeps changing Nike to Bike so how ubiquitous can they be? (Now to Mike, which makes more sense I suppose)).
posted by biffa at 12:28 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by biffa at 12:28 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
The article didn't do much for me, because I don't connect much with the notion of Nike as some kind of pillar of modern culture.
Still I like their shoes well enough. I also like my bare foot shoes. Most people I know feel like they can only be comfortable in one type of shoe or or another. In general I think people should be careful about making blanket statements about what's good for everyone's feet, because I think this is definitely a case where one size does not fit all.
posted by Alex404 at 1:12 AM on July 23, 2022 [5 favorites]
Still I like their shoes well enough. I also like my bare foot shoes. Most people I know feel like they can only be comfortable in one type of shoe or or another. In general I think people should be careful about making blanket statements about what's good for everyone's feet, because I think this is definitely a case where one size does not fit all.
posted by Alex404 at 1:12 AM on July 23, 2022 [5 favorites]
I don’t understand how to buy the cool looking Nike shoes I see on blogs, and the Nike shoes on their website vary between “incredibly bland” and “this is a joke, right?!”.
posted by The River Ivel at 1:45 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
posted by The River Ivel at 1:45 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
and “this is a joke, right?!”.
what if cronenberg, but a shoe?
posted by logicpunk at 3:53 AM on July 23, 2022 [5 favorites]
what if cronenberg, but a shoe?
posted by logicpunk at 3:53 AM on July 23, 2022 [5 favorites]
I don't think I ever had any Nikes when I was growing up. When I was younger it was all Sonics or other low quality shoes from Bi-Way or Bargain Harold's that would get holes in them seemingly the moment you out them on and when I was old enough to have some say in the matter I was only wearing running shoes/trainers for actual sports activities, so didn't care too much about the brand, and wearing DMs for general use. I remember watching Seinfeld and wondering why this grown adult was wearing sneakers all the time instead of proper shoes.
When I was living in Japan the Nike store was the only place that I could reliably buy shoes from because other places didn't have much in size 12. Other places had much cheaper shoes with way more interesting designs but never in my size. I was quite active and never had complaints with my Nike shoes or sandals. Afterwards when I went back to university I stopped wearing proper shoes like DMs or Clark's for everyday use and went back to running shoes probably because there was less need to look put together in Winnipeg than Kyoto so comfort and budget took over.
Nowadays my shoe uses are much more specific and my shoes are from companies that are a bit more focused on just a couple of activities instead of just general running shoes, I've got a pair of Vans for skateboarding, Five Tens for cycling, Salomon trail runners, Scarpa hiking boots and New Balance trainers. For just general use I'll wear the trail runners in poor weather or days where I'll be doing a lot of walking and a different pair of Vans for casual use because they have suede uppers so look like real shoes. I think I may still have a pair of Nike Free runners but I don't go running very often so they don't see much use. It's kind of a ridiculous amount of activity shoes but I've got the space for them and they all last longer because it isn't just one pair of shoes that gets beat up in every which way possible and also a good gauge for how much I've been doing any particular activity.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 5:05 AM on July 23, 2022
When I was living in Japan the Nike store was the only place that I could reliably buy shoes from because other places didn't have much in size 12. Other places had much cheaper shoes with way more interesting designs but never in my size. I was quite active and never had complaints with my Nike shoes or sandals. Afterwards when I went back to university I stopped wearing proper shoes like DMs or Clark's for everyday use and went back to running shoes probably because there was less need to look put together in Winnipeg than Kyoto so comfort and budget took over.
Nowadays my shoe uses are much more specific and my shoes are from companies that are a bit more focused on just a couple of activities instead of just general running shoes, I've got a pair of Vans for skateboarding, Five Tens for cycling, Salomon trail runners, Scarpa hiking boots and New Balance trainers. For just general use I'll wear the trail runners in poor weather or days where I'll be doing a lot of walking and a different pair of Vans for casual use because they have suede uppers so look like real shoes. I think I may still have a pair of Nike Free runners but I don't go running very often so they don't see much use. It's kind of a ridiculous amount of activity shoes but I've got the space for them and they all last longer because it isn't just one pair of shoes that gets beat up in every which way possible and also a good gauge for how much I've been doing any particular activity.
posted by any portmanteau in a storm at 5:05 AM on July 23, 2022
I prefer New Balance, and I wear Vivobarefoots and Birkenstocks regularly, but I'm a bit of a sneakerhead, and so I'm a grown adult wearing sneakers (a lot of) the time instead of proper shoes. Sneakers are a very big business, and there might be more of us than you think.
I have probably six or seven pairs of Nikes, mostly either Jordans (I like the IVs) or Air Max 90s (aesthetically speaking one of my all-time favorite sneakers, but the toe box runs a little narrow).
I also like the Offline, a weird shoe that's basically a mule with an insole that's either yoga mat or massage beads.
posted by box at 5:35 AM on July 23, 2022
I have probably six or seven pairs of Nikes, mostly either Jordans (I like the IVs) or Air Max 90s (aesthetically speaking one of my all-time favorite sneakers, but the toe box runs a little narrow).
I also like the Offline, a weird shoe that's basically a mule with an insole that's either yoga mat or massage beads.
posted by box at 5:35 AM on July 23, 2022
I dunno. I wear flatbottomed shoes with no support (not fancy "barefoot" shoes, just oldschool-style Vans).
Vans are not foot-shaped. Neither are Chuck Taylors (another shoe people tell me are unadorned). They're narrow, have restrictive toe-boxes, and have very thick soles which make them somewhat inflexible. The thick soles are particularly unhelpful because they disconnect you from the ground. All the stimulation your foot would be getting from a truly barefoot shoe is gone so that the sensations that should be communicating with the soles of your feet, and through them the rest of your foot, are gone. Your feet hurt after wearing them because you've "shut them off" by disconnecting them from stimulation and removing the shoes is now introducing them to these sensations for the first time in 8 hours.
posted by dobbs at 5:51 AM on July 23, 2022
Vans are not foot-shaped. Neither are Chuck Taylors (another shoe people tell me are unadorned). They're narrow, have restrictive toe-boxes, and have very thick soles which make them somewhat inflexible. The thick soles are particularly unhelpful because they disconnect you from the ground. All the stimulation your foot would be getting from a truly barefoot shoe is gone so that the sensations that should be communicating with the soles of your feet, and through them the rest of your foot, are gone. Your feet hurt after wearing them because you've "shut them off" by disconnecting them from stimulation and removing the shoes is now introducing them to these sensations for the first time in 8 hours.
posted by dobbs at 5:51 AM on July 23, 2022
dobbs: "Your feet hurt after wearing them because you've "shut them off" by disconnecting them from stimulation and removing the shoes is now introducing them to these sensations for the first time in 8 hours."
That doesn't make sense. My feet don't hurt after wearing them, my feet hurt while wearing them.
posted by Bugbread at 5:59 AM on July 23, 2022 [6 favorites]
That doesn't make sense. My feet don't hurt after wearing them, my feet hurt while wearing them.
posted by Bugbread at 5:59 AM on July 23, 2022 [6 favorites]
I'm 51 and also have a short, very wide foot which restricts the brands I can wear comfortably. I had some Adidas and Reebok when growing up. New Balance was best for me when I was actually running distances (well, distances for me). Vans and Chuck Taylors are impossible for me to wear. I'm a size 9 wide, but I'd have to get those brands in a size 11 just to manage the width... then I'd have a long part of the front of the shoe sticking out past my toes!
Not sure I ever had a pair of Nikes. These days I wear Merrels for work, which is around 20,000-30,000+ steps per day (according to my phone) and mostly outdoors. I find Merrels to hold up really well for heavy duty use, and are pretty decent at repelling water, too. And they run wide!
posted by SoberHighland at 6:45 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Not sure I ever had a pair of Nikes. These days I wear Merrels for work, which is around 20,000-30,000+ steps per day (according to my phone) and mostly outdoors. I find Merrels to hold up really well for heavy duty use, and are pretty decent at repelling water, too. And they run wide!
posted by SoberHighland at 6:45 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Barefoot shoes are just marketing (8 year old vox link so this not come as a surprise). I’m pretty sure that “there is huge amounts of money in shoes” is one of the main articles takeaways.
posted by The River Ivel at 6:46 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by The River Ivel at 6:46 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
In my suburban Chicago high school in 1981, the hottest Nikes for girls were tan nylon with a brown swoosh. They were so incredible ugly. The following year, we all switched to the white Cortez with a red swoosh (school colors). In 1983, it was the white court shoe with a baby blue swoosh. Why do I remember this?!
posted by Sweetie Darling at 6:51 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Sweetie Darling at 6:51 AM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
The article itself is interesting--about how Nike is both the biggest apparel brand in the world and "part of the root system that underlies the culture. And not just sneaker culture."
"The only other brand to make the leap so effectively and completely from commodity to identity in the last half-century is Apple."
"Nike wasn't 'an outfitter of equipment for athletes but a platform for constant personal progression,' which happened to coincide with an era when 'personal progression' became intertwined with physical activity on an every day level. And sports--or fitness/health/wellness, however you want to describe it--became a metaphor for independence and excellence."
"It has performed a balancing act that is almost unique in consumer culture: grow into a gigantic publicly listed brand with more than 73,000 employees and revenues of $44.6 billion for fiscal 2021 and maintain an aura of niche cool."
"Nike has become, Mr. Goldman said, “a consumer product that somehow appears to challenge the idea of consumerism.” That makes it awfully close, he said, to “the modern condition.”
posted by box at 6:53 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
"The only other brand to make the leap so effectively and completely from commodity to identity in the last half-century is Apple."
"Nike wasn't 'an outfitter of equipment for athletes but a platform for constant personal progression,' which happened to coincide with an era when 'personal progression' became intertwined with physical activity on an every day level. And sports--or fitness/health/wellness, however you want to describe it--became a metaphor for independence and excellence."
"It has performed a balancing act that is almost unique in consumer culture: grow into a gigantic publicly listed brand with more than 73,000 employees and revenues of $44.6 billion for fiscal 2021 and maintain an aura of niche cool."
"Nike has become, Mr. Goldman said, “a consumer product that somehow appears to challenge the idea of consumerism.” That makes it awfully close, he said, to “the modern condition.”
posted by box at 6:53 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
I am more concerned with fit and function and value than brand. I've tried Nike a couple times over the years, and I have never had shoes just completely fall apart on me, and so quickly, the way those Nikes did. :(
posted by xedrik at 7:01 AM on July 23, 2022
posted by xedrik at 7:01 AM on July 23, 2022
Barefoot shoes are just marketing
This is getting kind of far from Nike specifically, but that article is kind of terrible. Vibram failed to prove that there was enough evidence of reduced injury with "barefoot" shoes to support their claims, but it's clearly a hard thing to study. The crux of the article, "The reliable scientific evidence they require? For Vibram's barefoot shoes, it doesn't exist," falls into the trap that an absence of evidence for the Vibram premise is not the same as evidence that the premise is false. The article presents one case against, a study of a whopping 36 runners, but then concludes that there's just not enough data in either direction. The article fails to back up its incendiary "bullshit" headline, but that's "science journalism" for you.
(My own single data point is that personally I've gone from a couple sprained ankles a year to zero injuries in five years after switching to barefoot shoes. I don't actually wear Vibram shoes, and a single anecdote isn't data, but my experience is inconsistent with the "bullshit" claim.)
To bring it back around to Nike, I'd love it if they actually made a zero drop, low stack height shoe. If they did it would show up in a lot more brick and mortar stores than the shoes I have to hunt to try on or just order from the internet and hope.
posted by fedward at 7:40 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
This is getting kind of far from Nike specifically, but that article is kind of terrible. Vibram failed to prove that there was enough evidence of reduced injury with "barefoot" shoes to support their claims, but it's clearly a hard thing to study. The crux of the article, "The reliable scientific evidence they require? For Vibram's barefoot shoes, it doesn't exist," falls into the trap that an absence of evidence for the Vibram premise is not the same as evidence that the premise is false. The article presents one case against, a study of a whopping 36 runners, but then concludes that there's just not enough data in either direction. The article fails to back up its incendiary "bullshit" headline, but that's "science journalism" for you.
(My own single data point is that personally I've gone from a couple sprained ankles a year to zero injuries in five years after switching to barefoot shoes. I don't actually wear Vibram shoes, and a single anecdote isn't data, but my experience is inconsistent with the "bullshit" claim.)
To bring it back around to Nike, I'd love it if they actually made a zero drop, low stack height shoe. If they did it would show up in a lot more brick and mortar stores than the shoes I have to hunt to try on or just order from the internet and hope.
posted by fedward at 7:40 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
I bought my first pair of Nikes about a year or two ago when I finally found some wide fitting models (Pegasus) on the website.
Actually found them pretty good. I was half-expecting (hoping?) that after all these years they'd be terrible trainers because it's all about the marketing. But actually they were comfortable, well-balanced, and reasonably long lasting.
Barefoot/minimalist/cushioned running is a perennial debate. Here's a lay article summarizing it and a meta-study of 23 papers with the bombshell concusion: "Because of lack of high-quality evidence, no definitive conclusions can be drawn regarding specific risks or benefits to running barefoot, shod, or in minimalist shoes."
posted by TheophileEscargot at 8:09 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Actually found them pretty good. I was half-expecting (hoping?) that after all these years they'd be terrible trainers because it's all about the marketing. But actually they were comfortable, well-balanced, and reasonably long lasting.
Barefoot/minimalist/cushioned running is a perennial debate. Here's a lay article summarizing it and a meta-study of 23 papers with the bombshell concusion: "Because of lack of high-quality evidence, no definitive conclusions can be drawn regarding specific risks or benefits to running barefoot, shod, or in minimalist shoes."
posted by TheophileEscargot at 8:09 AM on July 23, 2022 [3 favorites]
Personally I wear big, wide shoes tied tight on the ankle. This leaves my foot a lot of movement, effectively I'm walking barefoot onto the surface of the soles. Most shoes are too narrow for me though, and I swear they've gotten narrower, I'm also a half size and find buying shoes to be a nightmare.
I have one pair of shoes with relatively thing, flexible soles and I can feel the pavement and everything through them, they actually suck anywhere you might tread on, you know, gravel or things with pointy bits. Also running on pavement really fucks with my knees. Proper barefoot shoes aren't gonna work for me.
posted by stillnocturnal at 8:25 AM on July 23, 2022
I have one pair of shoes with relatively thing, flexible soles and I can feel the pavement and everything through them, they actually suck anywhere you might tread on, you know, gravel or things with pointy bits. Also running on pavement really fucks with my knees. Proper barefoot shoes aren't gonna work for me.
posted by stillnocturnal at 8:25 AM on July 23, 2022
Never owned anything Nike. Nor any Adidas. And being a Yank, I wear running shoes rather than trainers, specifically Saucony and Asics. Please don't tell me these companies are actually owned by the swoosh.
posted by Rash at 8:43 AM on July 23, 2022
posted by Rash at 8:43 AM on July 23, 2022
The article also mentions the NikeCraft General Purpose Shoe, which was (maybe) intended to be a non-buzzy general purpose sneaker and instead sold out as quickly as any of the limited-release shoes that drop on SNKRS before moving to StockX.
posted by box at 8:55 AM on July 23, 2022
posted by box at 8:55 AM on July 23, 2022
Here's a lay article summarizing it
Which, amusingly, links to a MetaFilter FPP described as "a nice little summary of this issue."
The summary of the summary: running shoes are a land of contrasts and there's not really any good evidence to support any shoe design. I especially liked the bit about the relationship between calf muscle shape and heel bone length, since it points to the basic impossibility of designing a good enough study to prove anything about shoes. We just don't know enough about biomechanics.
Relatedly, everything I've ever been told at a running shoe store about pronation and supination seems to have been entirely wrong. Trying to control or correct for the way my foot rolls through a strike has only ever made my problems worse. After wearing barefoot shoes for the past six years I've seen the wear pattern on my soles evolve in such a way that it's clear in retrospect the "control," "stability," and even "neutral" shoes offered by brands like Nike were causing my gait problems, not fixing them. Sample size of one, though. Lots of people seem to love their big ol' Hokas or whatever cushy Nikes are in these days
posted by fedward at 9:54 AM on July 23, 2022 [1 favorite]
Which, amusingly, links to a MetaFilter FPP described as "a nice little summary of this issue."
The summary of the summary: running shoes are a land of contrasts and there's not really any good evidence to support any shoe design. I especially liked the bit about the relationship between calf muscle shape and heel bone length, since it points to the basic impossibility of designing a good enough study to prove anything about shoes. We just don't know enough about biomechanics.
Relatedly, everything I've ever been told at a running shoe store about pronation and supination seems to have been entirely wrong. Trying to control or correct for the way my foot rolls through a strike has only ever made my problems worse. After wearing barefoot shoes for the past six years I've seen the wear pattern on my soles evolve in such a way that it's clear in retrospect the "control," "stability," and even "neutral" shoes offered by brands like Nike were causing my gait problems, not fixing them. Sample size of one, though. Lots of people seem to love their big ol' Hokas or whatever cushy Nikes are in these days
posted by fedward at 9:54 AM on July 23, 2022 [1 favorite]
I stopped buying Nikes during the sweatshop boycott and never went back. Things are only marginally better, now, and it's hard to make a choice that is ethical (or even to take seriously the ethics of my individual choices vs. those of international corporations, but still....)
Nike is killing kangaroos? shit. And they own Vans... when did that happen?
In short, consumer culture is sick, and not in a good way. Alternatives? few.
Have a Nice Day!
posted by allthinky at 10:03 AM on July 23, 2022
Nike is killing kangaroos? shit. And they own Vans... when did that happen?
In short, consumer culture is sick, and not in a good way. Alternatives? few.
Have a Nice Day!
posted by allthinky at 10:03 AM on July 23, 2022
Living in Portland for most of my life, Nike has been impossible to ignore. A significant portion of my social group does or has worked for Nike in various capacities (they employ somewhere around 10,000 people in the area). This article talks about the style and sport impact so its really strange reading about it from an 'outsider' perspective. Nike is literally part of the fabric of the community out here. Nike sponsors the bikeshare system. Nike pays for high school tracks and local basketball courts.
Their shoes don't fit my feet either, but luckily Adidas' US headquarters is here too so the employee store is just a few short miles away...
posted by tmt at 10:03 AM on July 23, 2022
Their shoes don't fit my feet either, but luckily Adidas' US headquarters is here too so the employee store is just a few short miles away...
posted by tmt at 10:03 AM on July 23, 2022
Ever since I read
Letter of Recommendation: New Balance 990s
in the New York Times seven years ago, I have worn them ever since. A bit pricey, yes, but man, are they a dream in which to walk.* Plus they come in all black if you hate wearing clothing bearing logos, which I do.
*Pro tip: if you buy a pair, choose a half size larger than your usual for a perfect fit.
posted by y2karl at 10:12 AM on July 23, 2022 [1 favorite]
Letter of Recommendation: New Balance 990s
in the New York Times seven years ago, I have worn them ever since. A bit pricey, yes, but man, are they a dream in which to walk.* Plus they come in all black if you hate wearing clothing bearing logos, which I do.
*Pro tip: if you buy a pair, choose a half size larger than your usual for a perfect fit.
posted by y2karl at 10:12 AM on July 23, 2022 [1 favorite]
I have always had problems getting shoes with room to spread my toes, so the minimalist/barefoot shoes that tout a wide toebox tend to be the way I lean for shoes, and the thin soles letting me feel the ground is a nice bonus.
Adjusting from blocky generic workshoes to Lems or Vivobarefoots etc. for work (security in a pretty big building) took a few months of sore feet or knees from learning how to walk differently, but after that breaking-in period of gait change, I have no interest in going back to regular thick narrow sneakers, or anything with much of a heel. My littlest toes aren’t pinched, my feet never hurt now, and the thin soles are pretty nice for driving, too.
I bought a pair of Vibram Fivefingers, but because my feet are short and wide (I practically have duck feet), they don’t really fit the way they should.
Also, lazy person tip: I laced all my shoes with shock cord and tied knots in the ends of the laces, so all my shoes are slipons now.
posted by Mister Moofoo at 11:02 AM on July 23, 2022
Adjusting from blocky generic workshoes to Lems or Vivobarefoots etc. for work (security in a pretty big building) took a few months of sore feet or knees from learning how to walk differently, but after that breaking-in period of gait change, I have no interest in going back to regular thick narrow sneakers, or anything with much of a heel. My littlest toes aren’t pinched, my feet never hurt now, and the thin soles are pretty nice for driving, too.
I bought a pair of Vibram Fivefingers, but because my feet are short and wide (I practically have duck feet), they don’t really fit the way they should.
Also, lazy person tip: I laced all my shoes with shock cord and tied knots in the ends of the laces, so all my shoes are slipons now.
posted by Mister Moofoo at 11:02 AM on July 23, 2022
i abhor the nike brand and i figure it's primarily due to the bullying in public schools i witnessed and occasionally endured for not owning or not being able to own them. fuck those kids and fuck nike. there's plenty of other fine kicks that don't have a toxic cult attached to them.
posted by glonous keming at 1:09 PM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by glonous keming at 1:09 PM on July 23, 2022 [2 favorites]
I have no real opinion on streetwear or sneakers, but I blame Nike for the current running-shoe-technology inflation caused by their support of the sub-two-hour marathon (previously on Metafilter), which convinced people that racing shoes, that used to be cheaper than trainers, are now $250 elaborately engineered plates of carbon fiber riding atop huge slabs of magical high-tech foam that degrade in 100 miles. Of course, they don't come in wide either.
posted by meowzilla at 1:47 PM on July 23, 2022
posted by meowzilla at 1:47 PM on July 23, 2022
Barefoot shoes are just marketing
I've never worn those Vibram shoes but my own data point is having to wear custom-made orthotics for 7 years and still waking up and hobbling around every morning before switching to barefoot shoes (mostly Vivobarefoot and Feelgrounds), tossing the orthotics in the trash, and being able to walk 12+ miles every single day without any pain whatsoever.
I went from having plantar fasciitis so bad that I was considering cortisone injections into my heels to zero pain and it not being uncommon to do 30K steps a day.
That doesn't make sense. My feet don't hurt after wearing them, my feet hurt while wearing them.
Fair enough, obviously I misunderstood what you meant by your statement that, "I'm the one complaining at the end of the day about how my feet hurt." I have no advice for someone who deliberately wears shoes that hurt their feet while they're wearing them and am a little baffled that anyone would do such a thing. I will restate that Vans are zero drop shoes, which is good, but they're not barefoot shoes.
My own experience is that shitty shoes, weak feet, or, most often, a combination of those two things are what make feet hurt. Both elements are within one's control. I've convinced many friends and acquaintances with "bad feet" to switch to barefoot shoes and none have switched back (I recommend this book). Luckily all of those people put their foot health ahead of fashion. Of course, many others I've recommended it to have called me crazy and insisted they need arch support or that their shoes are wide enough, thank you very much. None of the latter have actually tried it, though — and none have had their foot pain go away.
As far as fashion goes, for looks I'd take these or these or these over anything Nike makes, but I generally prefer subtle or non-existent branding.
posted by dobbs at 4:38 PM on July 23, 2022
I've never worn those Vibram shoes but my own data point is having to wear custom-made orthotics for 7 years and still waking up and hobbling around every morning before switching to barefoot shoes (mostly Vivobarefoot and Feelgrounds), tossing the orthotics in the trash, and being able to walk 12+ miles every single day without any pain whatsoever.
I went from having plantar fasciitis so bad that I was considering cortisone injections into my heels to zero pain and it not being uncommon to do 30K steps a day.
That doesn't make sense. My feet don't hurt after wearing them, my feet hurt while wearing them.
Fair enough, obviously I misunderstood what you meant by your statement that, "I'm the one complaining at the end of the day about how my feet hurt." I have no advice for someone who deliberately wears shoes that hurt their feet while they're wearing them and am a little baffled that anyone would do such a thing. I will restate that Vans are zero drop shoes, which is good, but they're not barefoot shoes.
My own experience is that shitty shoes, weak feet, or, most often, a combination of those two things are what make feet hurt. Both elements are within one's control. I've convinced many friends and acquaintances with "bad feet" to switch to barefoot shoes and none have switched back (I recommend this book). Luckily all of those people put their foot health ahead of fashion. Of course, many others I've recommended it to have called me crazy and insisted they need arch support or that their shoes are wide enough, thank you very much. None of the latter have actually tried it, though — and none have had their foot pain go away.
As far as fashion goes, for looks I'd take these or these or these over anything Nike makes, but I generally prefer subtle or non-existent branding.
posted by dobbs at 4:38 PM on July 23, 2022
Love me some Monarchs, I buy a fresh pair around April and wear them out by October. I'd like to buy some dunks but those have left the realm of mortals like me.
posted by monkeymike at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2022
posted by monkeymike at 7:36 PM on July 23, 2022
dobbs: "I have no advice for someone who deliberately wears shoes that hurt their feet while they're wearing them and am a little baffled that anyone would do such a thing."
Sorry, rereading my initial comment it definitely comes across as a much bigger issue than it really is. It's not me saying "oh god my feet hurt so bad" but just "my feet are sore from walking all day," and it only happens like twice a year or so. If this was sharp pain, or if it was something that lasted a long time and not just at the very end of a long day, or if it was something that happened on a monthly basis, yeah, I'd get new shoes, but it's not really worth it for something that affects me for maybe two hours out of every year, and pretty mildly at that.
posted by Bugbread at 10:15 PM on July 23, 2022
Sorry, rereading my initial comment it definitely comes across as a much bigger issue than it really is. It's not me saying "oh god my feet hurt so bad" but just "my feet are sore from walking all day," and it only happens like twice a year or so. If this was sharp pain, or if it was something that lasted a long time and not just at the very end of a long day, or if it was something that happened on a monthly basis, yeah, I'd get new shoes, but it's not really worth it for something that affects me for maybe two hours out of every year, and pretty mildly at that.
posted by Bugbread at 10:15 PM on July 23, 2022
"we are all citizens of Nikeland now"
I... guess? I never gave a shit about sneaker brands when I was presenting male in the eighties and nineties; now that I've transitioned, I basically never wear sneakers. It's boots when it's cold, sandals when it's warm. When I got some running shoes they were from the "as close to barefoot as possible" world, though not those weird toe shoes as I have some extra webbing between a couple of my toes.
At one point I think I bought a couple of Nike sports bras because they were the only thing that halfway fit on the store's rack, that's about it for things I can actually remember buying from them. I don't really think this qualifies me for residence in Nikeland. Especially since the brand of sandals I prefer doesn't seem to have been acquired by Nike.
posted by egypturnash at 10:35 AM on July 24, 2022
I... guess? I never gave a shit about sneaker brands when I was presenting male in the eighties and nineties; now that I've transitioned, I basically never wear sneakers. It's boots when it's cold, sandals when it's warm. When I got some running shoes they were from the "as close to barefoot as possible" world, though not those weird toe shoes as I have some extra webbing between a couple of my toes.
At one point I think I bought a couple of Nike sports bras because they were the only thing that halfway fit on the store's rack, that's about it for things I can actually remember buying from them. I don't really think this qualifies me for residence in Nikeland. Especially since the brand of sandals I prefer doesn't seem to have been acquired by Nike.
posted by egypturnash at 10:35 AM on July 24, 2022
To bring it back around to Nike, I'd love it if they actually made a zero drop, low stack height shoe. If they did it would show up in a lot more brick and mortar stores than the shoes I have to hunt to try on or just order from the internet and hope.
That was the Nike Free 1.0, which was unceremoniously killed off just like every other good entry in the Free line.
posted by a box and a stick and a string and a bear at 1:27 PM on July 24, 2022 [1 favorite]
That was the Nike Free 1.0, which was unceremoniously killed off just like every other good entry in the Free line.
posted by a box and a stick and a string and a bear at 1:27 PM on July 24, 2022 [1 favorite]
Nike’s Metcon series is made for CrossFit, weightlifting, and other gym-rat (not in a pejorative sense) kinds of activities, and I think the drop is 4mm. Outside of, like, slides and the aforementioned Offline, I think that’s as close to zero-drop as the swoosh gets.
(Nike owns Converse (but not Vans, which is owned by VF), so maybe some All-Stars or Jack Purcells or something have a place on that list too.)
posted by box at 4:47 PM on July 24, 2022
(Nike owns Converse (but not Vans, which is owned by VF), so maybe some All-Stars or Jack Purcells or something have a place on that list too.)
posted by box at 4:47 PM on July 24, 2022
To add a datapoint converse to dobbs' I had a couple of pairs of Vivobarefoot and loved being able to feel the floor beneath my feet, but eventually my hip gave out from wearing them and it all got much better when I went back to more cushioned shoes. My assumption is that I'm slightly lopsided/have one leg longer than the other, and having a little cushioning beneath my feet allows my body to even that out a little.
Which, as others have said, just goes to show that everyone's needs are different and there's no need to be sniffy or superior about others' shoe choices.
posted by penguin pie at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2022 [1 favorite]
Which, as others have said, just goes to show that everyone's needs are different and there's no need to be sniffy or superior about others' shoe choices.
posted by penguin pie at 12:25 PM on July 25, 2022 [1 favorite]
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I've probably had a dozen pairs in my life and... they're just not very good shoes. The last ones I had, Nike Free, probably 10 years ago now, didn't even accomplish what the model's mission was: to bring you as close to barefoot as possible. They still have a heel. They still have arch support. They still have narrow toe boxes. So many small brands these days do "barefoot" so much better, and it's great for your feet! I'm 54 and my feet are probably stronger now than they were in the previous 45 years because I used to buy the hype: "air" cushions, padding, etc. It's all nonsense. If you want your feet to be as strong as they can be, you want to basically have the opposite of Nike (or Adidas or Asics, etc.). You want as little on your feet as possible while living in a world of concrete and debris.
Modern shoe design has basically weakened the feet of humanity by, to paraphrase one of the barefoot companies, making shoe-shaped shoes instead of foot-shaped shoes. It's very bizarre how long it's been going on and Nike is one of the guiltier parties.
posted by dobbs at 7:06 PM on July 22, 2022 [7 favorites]