Why, fool, you shall never wake till Judgement-Day!
June 8, 2011 12:11 PM Subscribe
Terminator the Second is a project to stage Terminator 2: Judgement Day using only lines from Shakespeare (with some proper nouns and pronouns changed). A sample page from the script. A second page. A bit of background on Husky Jackal Theater.
(Many Kickstarter links, but they've already surpassed their funding goal so this isn't like a hidden solicitation)
(Many Kickstarter links, but they've already surpassed their funding goal so this isn't like a hidden solicitation)
GOD DAMN IT TO HELL.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:14 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:14 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
Describe Marsellus Wallace to me, pray.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011 [5 favorites]
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011 [5 favorites]
I love it when a random derail turns into its own thread.
posted by elizardbits at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011 [2 favorites]
posted by elizardbits at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011 [2 favorites]
Terminator > T2
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by roomthreeseventeen at 12:16 PM on June 8, 2011
Listen, we're never going to get anywhere arguing the relative merits of Terminator 2. Let us all just mutually agree that people who don't like the film are probably space aliens who don't fully understand human aesthetics.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:20 PM on June 8, 2011 [11 favorites]
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:20 PM on June 8, 2011 [11 favorites]
ALL FELLOW CENTAURIANS, ABORT PLAN ALPHA-THETA. WE HAVE BEEN COMPROMISED. RETURN TO HOMEWORLD AS SOON AS FEASIBLE.
posted by kmz at 12:22 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by kmz at 12:22 PM on June 8, 2011
The Terminator was pretty damn cool and I'm really disappointed I didn't end up seeing it until after the sequel. You appreciate Connor as a tough-as-nails character much less if you haven't first seen her as a friendly waitress with a blonde perm. The scene where she decides that her only option is to destroy what will eventually become Skynet and tells a crying soldier from the dystopian future to man the hell up is great (this may have been left out of the theatrical version).
posted by ODiV at 12:28 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
posted by ODiV at 12:28 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
TERMINATOR: I can... deliver a plain message bluntly [cocks shotgun].
OK, this made me laugh.
posted by Johnny Assay at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
OK, this made me laugh.
posted by Johnny Assay at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
Brilliant - any excuse to quote The Skinhead Hamlet (aka "The 'Fuck' Hamlet") by Richard "Blackadder/4 Weddings & A Funeral" Curtis:
ACT II SCENE I
(A corridor in the castle.)
(Enter HAMLET reading. Enter POLONIUS)
POLON: Oi! You!
HAMLET: Fuck off, grandad!
(Exit POLON. Enter ROSENCRANTZ AND GUILDENSTERN.)
RO & GUILD: Oi! Oi! Mucca!
HAMLET: Fuck off, the pair of you!
(Exit ROS and GUILD.)
HAMLET (Alone): To fuck or be fucked.
OPHELIA: My Lord!
HAMLET: Fuck off to a nunnery!
(They exit in different directions.)
(And on & fucking gloriously on it goes...!)
posted by Jody Tresidder at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011
ACT II SCENE I
(A corridor in the castle.)
(Enter HAMLET reading. Enter POLONIUS)
POLON: Oi! You!
HAMLET: Fuck off, grandad!
(Exit POLON. Enter ROSENCRANTZ AND GUILDENSTERN.)
RO & GUILD: Oi! Oi! Mucca!
HAMLET: Fuck off, the pair of you!
(Exit ROS and GUILD.)
HAMLET (Alone): To fuck or be fucked.
OPHELIA: My Lord!
HAMLET: Fuck off to a nunnery!
(They exit in different directions.)
(And on & fucking gloriously on it goes...!)
posted by Jody Tresidder at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011
I actually do like both the Terminator movies quite a bit. But I couldn't resist the callback.
At the end of the day though, Summer Glau makes TSCC the best Terminator franchise entry.
posted by kmz at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
At the end of the day though, Summer Glau makes TSCC the best Terminator franchise entry.
posted by kmz at 12:33 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
Whether it is better to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous Cyberdyne military infiltration units, or to take arms against a sea of Harvester robots, Aerial Hunter Killers, and Mototerminators.
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:46 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
posted by Astro Zombie at 12:46 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
This is pretty amazing, really.
I never thought of it in there terms before, but Terminator 2 is to Terminator like Aliens is to Alien. I know it's different in several ways, but I think the transition from creepy semi-realistic dread to Big Spectacle makes the comparison interesting.
Anyway, Terminator 2 hits many notes just so. My particular favorite is Sarah's escape sequence. The elevator opening and the look of terror on Sarah's face when she sees the Governator. Arnold echoing Kyle's "Come with me if you want to live". The doctor letting the (pen? syringe?) fall from his mouth when the T1000 walks through the bars. The pacing in that sequence is marvelous.
(I also love the scene behind the arcade. Arnie with the roses.)
There's somewhere (DVD commentary? I don't recall) where James Cameron talks about planning what information he needs to convey with a shot, specifically in regards to Arnold's walking into the bar in search of clothes. And I paid a lot of attention to that in Avatar, which I think someone also mentioned in discussion about that movie. Say what you want about Avatar, but the way information is transmitted to the audience from Jake's arrival on Pandora to his arrival in the lab is masterful.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:00 PM on June 8, 2011 [2 favorites]
I never thought of it in there terms before, but Terminator 2 is to Terminator like Aliens is to Alien. I know it's different in several ways, but I think the transition from creepy semi-realistic dread to Big Spectacle makes the comparison interesting.
Anyway, Terminator 2 hits many notes just so. My particular favorite is Sarah's escape sequence. The elevator opening and the look of terror on Sarah's face when she sees the Governator. Arnold echoing Kyle's "Come with me if you want to live". The doctor letting the (pen? syringe?) fall from his mouth when the T1000 walks through the bars. The pacing in that sequence is marvelous.
(I also love the scene behind the arcade. Arnie with the roses.)
There's somewhere (DVD commentary? I don't recall) where James Cameron talks about planning what information he needs to convey with a shot, specifically in regards to Arnold's walking into the bar in search of clothes. And I paid a lot of attention to that in Avatar, which I think someone also mentioned in discussion about that movie. Say what you want about Avatar, but the way information is transmitted to the audience from Jake's arrival on Pandora to his arrival in the lab is masterful.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:00 PM on June 8, 2011 [2 favorites]
At the end of the day though, Summer Glau makes TSCC the best Terminator franchise entry.
Okay, I've been giving this show a shot recently and I'm a bit into the second season. So, it's getting better, but I'm still kind of mystified at this point as to why people think a bunch of stuff from the first two Terminator films basically "reheated" is actually good. I mean they literally lifted dialogue, action sequences, even the clothes. My eyes get tired of rolling at all the un-originality they managed to pack into that show. Even setting aside the stuff they use as a crutch, there's still a lot of bad writing in there. Summer Glau's is alright I suppose, but hardly makes up for the deficit.
It's entertaining enough to pass the time though.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:01 PM on June 8, 2011
Okay, I've been giving this show a shot recently and I'm a bit into the second season. So, it's getting better, but I'm still kind of mystified at this point as to why people think a bunch of stuff from the first two Terminator films basically "reheated" is actually good. I mean they literally lifted dialogue, action sequences, even the clothes. My eyes get tired of rolling at all the un-originality they managed to pack into that show. Even setting aside the stuff they use as a crutch, there's still a lot of bad writing in there. Summer Glau's is alright I suppose, but hardly makes up for the deficit.
It's entertaining enough to pass the time though.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:01 PM on June 8, 2011
the way information is transmitted to the audience from Jake's arrival on Pandora to his arrival in the lab is masterful
You mean the ten minutes of narrated exposition? Yeah, even from people who I know really like the movie thought that was boring and unneeded. I've seen people pop the disc into the player and fast forward right past that part.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:07 PM on June 8, 2011
You mean the ten minutes of narrated exposition? Yeah, even from people who I know really like the movie thought that was boring and unneeded. I've seen people pop the disc into the player and fast forward right past that part.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:07 PM on June 8, 2011
Also, when T2 first came out, and we went to see it in the theatre, there was some guy laughing uproariously at the nuclear armageddon scene, which was delightfully out of place.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:07 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by neuromodulator at 1:07 PM on June 8, 2011
I'm talking about the camera movement and what's onscreen.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:08 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by neuromodulator at 1:08 PM on June 8, 2011
Sarah's escape sequence
And the pistol momentarily slowing the T-1000's progress through the bars. It's little touches like that sell the realness of it.
I was always fond of the T-1000 being slammed face first into the wall during the steel mill battle and instead of turning around, he simply morphs so he is facing forward. More efficient.
posted by entropicamericana at 1:10 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
And the pistol momentarily slowing the T-1000's progress through the bars. It's little touches like that sell the realness of it.
I was always fond of the T-1000 being slammed face first into the wall during the steel mill battle and instead of turning around, he simply morphs so he is facing forward. More efficient.
posted by entropicamericana at 1:10 PM on June 8, 2011 [3 favorites]
Fair enough. The movie pulled in billions of dollars for a reason.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:10 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by P.o.B. at 1:10 PM on June 8, 2011
I endorse this plan.
There is a great feature on the Monty Python and the Holy Grail DVD: alongside the English and French subtitles, there is an option called "Subtitles for those who don't like the movie" or words to that effect, which just subtitles all of the dialogue with dialogue from Henry VI, Part II. The effect is weirdly pleasing. Below, find a well-known scene with the dialogue as spoken and how the subtitles read.
The Dead Collector: Bring out yer dead.
[a man puts a body on the cart]
O, give me the spare men!
Large Man with Dead Body: Here's one.
Here I yield him.
The Dead Collector: That'll be ninepence.
Seven groats.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not dead.
Not that I am dead.
The Dead Collector: What?
What's this?
Large Man with Dead Body: Nothing. There's your ninepence.
Here's four harry ten shillings.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not dead.
Not that I am dead.
The Dead Collector: 'Ere, he says he's not dead.
Here, he is dead.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not.
No, my lord, not so.
The Dead Collector: He isn't.
Nay, not so.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, he will be soon, he's very ill.
He cannot long hold out.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm getting better.
Better than I was.
Large Man with Dead Body: No you're not, you'll be stone dead in a moment.
The apoplexy will certain be his end.
The Dead Collector: Well, I can't take him like that. It's against regulations.
Is this proceeding just and honourable?
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I don't want to go on the cart.
I'd as lief be hanged as go.
Large Man with Dead Body: Oh, don't be such a baby.
What a maidenly man-at-arms.
The Dead Collector: I can't take him.
I confess, I cannot help.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I feel fine.
I am well.
Large Man with Dead Body: Oh, do me a favor.
For my old dame's sake...
The Dead Collector: I can't.
I cannot.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, can you hang around for a couple of minutes? He won't be long.
You can do it, sir, he is retired.
The Dead Collector: I promised I'd be at the Robinsons'. They've lost nine today.
I must a dozen mile tonight.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, when's your next round?
When. I pray you sir?
The Dead Collector: Thursday.
O'Thursday.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I think I'll go for a walk.
Let me see, where is Mouldy?
Large Man with Dead Body: You're not fooling anyone, you know. Isn't there anything you could do?
By cock and pie, you shall not. Not able to invent anything?
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I feel happy. I feel happy.
Happy am I!
[the Dead Collector glances up and down the street furtively, then silences the Body with his a whack of his club]
Large Man with Dead Body: Ah, thank you very much.
I thank thee with all my heart.
The Dead Collector: Not at all. See you on Thursday.
O'Thursday.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:12 PM on June 8, 2011 [9 favorites]
There is a great feature on the Monty Python and the Holy Grail DVD: alongside the English and French subtitles, there is an option called "Subtitles for those who don't like the movie" or words to that effect, which just subtitles all of the dialogue with dialogue from Henry VI, Part II. The effect is weirdly pleasing. Below, find a well-known scene with the dialogue as spoken and how the subtitles read.
The Dead Collector: Bring out yer dead.
[a man puts a body on the cart]
O, give me the spare men!
Large Man with Dead Body: Here's one.
Here I yield him.
The Dead Collector: That'll be ninepence.
Seven groats.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not dead.
Not that I am dead.
The Dead Collector: What?
What's this?
Large Man with Dead Body: Nothing. There's your ninepence.
Here's four harry ten shillings.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not dead.
Not that I am dead.
The Dead Collector: 'Ere, he says he's not dead.
Here, he is dead.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm not.
No, my lord, not so.
The Dead Collector: He isn't.
Nay, not so.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, he will be soon, he's very ill.
He cannot long hold out.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I'm getting better.
Better than I was.
Large Man with Dead Body: No you're not, you'll be stone dead in a moment.
The apoplexy will certain be his end.
The Dead Collector: Well, I can't take him like that. It's against regulations.
Is this proceeding just and honourable?
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I don't want to go on the cart.
I'd as lief be hanged as go.
Large Man with Dead Body: Oh, don't be such a baby.
What a maidenly man-at-arms.
The Dead Collector: I can't take him.
I confess, I cannot help.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I feel fine.
I am well.
Large Man with Dead Body: Oh, do me a favor.
For my old dame's sake...
The Dead Collector: I can't.
I cannot.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, can you hang around for a couple of minutes? He won't be long.
You can do it, sir, he is retired.
The Dead Collector: I promised I'd be at the Robinsons'. They've lost nine today.
I must a dozen mile tonight.
Large Man with Dead Body: Well, when's your next round?
When. I pray you sir?
The Dead Collector: Thursday.
O'Thursday.
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I think I'll go for a walk.
Let me see, where is Mouldy?
Large Man with Dead Body: You're not fooling anyone, you know. Isn't there anything you could do?
By cock and pie, you shall not. Not able to invent anything?
The Dead Body That Claims It Isn't: I feel happy. I feel happy.
Happy am I!
[the Dead Collector glances up and down the street furtively, then silences the Body with his a whack of his club]
Large Man with Dead Body: Ah, thank you very much.
I thank thee with all my heart.
The Dead Collector: Not at all. See you on Thursday.
O'Thursday.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:12 PM on June 8, 2011 [9 favorites]
Describe Marsellus Wallace to me, pray.
Needs more "prithee."
posted by kirkaracha at 1:15 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
To describe more accurately what I meant, P.o.B., it's about how we have this narratively functional sequence ("Jake's arrival on Pandora"), and the way the camera pivots around him and edits are chosen during this sequence to set-up our reactions, and quickly convey a massive amount of information about setting in a way that's unconscious and the viewer takes for granted. There are, for example: close shots of the arrows in the tires establishing both the conflict and nature of the conflict, slow pans over the hi-tech screens establishing a lot of the technology of the world, and Jake nearly getting run over by vehicles (setting up the corporate vs. individual type stuff).
I think (if I were being critical) it would be easy to say those are, respectively, obvious, showing off the effects, and heavy-handed, but I think that's a too easy dismissal of the amount of care that went into the choices made. (And as to the effects thing, I think that's just not really true, since there's the thing I mentioned about James Cameron doing the same thing with the sequence of someone walking through a bar.)
And, yeah, I get that maybe this really sounds like filmmaking 101. That is, I think Spielberg probably does things like this too, and I don't think Spielberg is that interesting in a like "here's a director that really speaks to me" sense. (I don't know what I think of James Cameron, tbh). But I do think it would be easy for me (if you told me to direct something) to not be aware of this stuff. To just be like, "Okay, he's walking into a restaurant, let's pick a neat camera angle." And I think there are lots of directors who aren't good at this like Spielberg and Cameron are good at it. That's not to say other directors don't make better films - but that their films are very good at what they are, or something.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:29 PM on June 8, 2011 [4 favorites]
I think (if I were being critical) it would be easy to say those are, respectively, obvious, showing off the effects, and heavy-handed, but I think that's a too easy dismissal of the amount of care that went into the choices made. (And as to the effects thing, I think that's just not really true, since there's the thing I mentioned about James Cameron doing the same thing with the sequence of someone walking through a bar.)
And, yeah, I get that maybe this really sounds like filmmaking 101. That is, I think Spielberg probably does things like this too, and I don't think Spielberg is that interesting in a like "here's a director that really speaks to me" sense. (I don't know what I think of James Cameron, tbh). But I do think it would be easy for me (if you told me to direct something) to not be aware of this stuff. To just be like, "Okay, he's walking into a restaurant, let's pick a neat camera angle." And I think there are lots of directors who aren't good at this like Spielberg and Cameron are good at it. That's not to say other directors don't make better films - but that their films are very good at what they are, or something.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:29 PM on June 8, 2011 [4 favorites]
You mean the ten minutes of narrated exposition?
I think he means the little things like having arrows stuck in the tires. A) they use arrows and b) they're smart enough to shoot at tires.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:30 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
I think he means the little things like having arrows stuck in the tires. A) they use arrows and b) they're smart enough to shoot at tires.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 1:30 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
No, I get that. The film's cinematography and editing are the high points. Make of that what you will, but he definitely put together something that's weirdly hard to turn away from.
posted by P.o.B. at 1:35 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by P.o.B. at 1:35 PM on June 8, 2011
Oh, please. Gielgud played Claudius as a liquid-metal robot back in '65 at the Old Vic.
The scene where he morphed into Leo McKern's Polonius brought the audience to tears.
posted by PlusDistance at 1:39 PM on June 8, 2011 [4 favorites]
The scene where he morphed into Leo McKern's Polonius brought the audience to tears.
posted by PlusDistance at 1:39 PM on June 8, 2011 [4 favorites]
One of my favorite bits in the escape sequence is when Sarah tosses a bundle of keys, I think it was, to one of the guards who instinctively tries to catch them.
Oooh, oooh, one scene I've always wanted to stick into something is to refer to the coffee cup drop-kick scene in Kill Bill. I wanted to set up something identical, like shot for shot, except the protagonist is eating a muffin instead of having a coffee. So she drop kicks a muffin at the woman who just shot her and it hits her would-be assassin square in the face and there's like a split-second of "Did you just kick a muffin into my face?" before the fight starts. If you get the dumbfounded reaction shot just right it could be brilliant.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:40 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
Oooh, oooh, one scene I've always wanted to stick into something is to refer to the coffee cup drop-kick scene in Kill Bill. I wanted to set up something identical, like shot for shot, except the protagonist is eating a muffin instead of having a coffee. So she drop kicks a muffin at the woman who just shot her and it hits her would-be assassin square in the face and there's like a split-second of "Did you just kick a muffin into my face?" before the fight starts. If you get the dumbfounded reaction shot just right it could be brilliant.
posted by neuromodulator at 1:40 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
You mean the ten minutes of narrated exposition? Yeah, even from people who I know really like the movie thought that was boring and unneeded. I've seen people pop the disc into the player and fast forward right past that part.
Okay, so people who have heard it already do not need to hear it again. Got it. I fail to see the relevance.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:57 PM on June 8, 2011
Okay, so people who have heard it already do not need to hear it again. Got it. I fail to see the relevance.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 1:57 PM on June 8, 2011
One of my favorite bits in the escape sequence...
... is when the female guard belts Arnold with the cast on her arm*. Not a nightstick. A hard plaster cast on her arm.
It's another great example that the audience responds more to things they know. Show a guy getting shot, and the audience is like "meh." Show someone stubbing their toe, and everyone in the theater winces, because they know what that feels like.
Everyone who's seen a hard plaster cast can easily imagine what it would feel like to get hit with one of those things. It also shows a greater sense of the guard's emotional state that she would try to hit someone with their already injured arm.
Little scene-deepening techniques like this (Hans Gruber: "Shoot. The. Glass.") are golden, but they're unfortunately few and far between.
* Fun fact: She also breaks his sunglasses, which is a running gag in the entire franchise.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 2:18 PM on June 8, 2011
... is when the female guard belts Arnold with the cast on her arm*. Not a nightstick. A hard plaster cast on her arm.
It's another great example that the audience responds more to things they know. Show a guy getting shot, and the audience is like "meh." Show someone stubbing their toe, and everyone in the theater winces, because they know what that feels like.
Everyone who's seen a hard plaster cast can easily imagine what it would feel like to get hit with one of those things. It also shows a greater sense of the guard's emotional state that she would try to hit someone with their already injured arm.
Little scene-deepening techniques like this (Hans Gruber: "Shoot. The. Glass.") are golden, but they're unfortunately few and far between.
* Fun fact: She also breaks his sunglasses, which is a running gag in the entire franchise.
posted by Cool Papa Bell at 2:18 PM on June 8, 2011
I hated the way the advertisements ruined the surprise element of T2.
If you had seen Terminator, and went into T2 cold, you would think you had a total handle on the opening, "Ok, there's the terminator, ok, there's the human, and they're both trying to get to John." And then the scene in the mall, where Arny says "Get down" would blow your mind.
posted by fings at 3:04 PM on June 8, 2011
If you had seen Terminator, and went into T2 cold, you would think you had a total handle on the opening, "Ok, there's the terminator, ok, there's the human, and they're both trying to get to John." And then the scene in the mall, where Arny says "Get down" would blow your mind.
posted by fings at 3:04 PM on June 8, 2011
I hated the way the advertisements ruined the surprise element of T2.
If you had seen Terminator, and went into T2 cold, you would think you had a total handle on the opening, "Ok, there's the terminator, ok, there's the human, and they're both trying to get to John." And then the scene in the mall, where Arny says "Get down" would blow your mind.
This is so true - and it's very carefully constructed up to the roses scene to create that impression.
Terminator the Second is a project to stage Terminator 2: Judgement Day using only lines from Shakespeare (with some proper nouns and pronouns changed). A sample page from the script. A second page. A bit of background on Husky Jackal Theater.
posted by shakespeherian (38 comments total) [add to favorites] 8 users marked this as a favorite [!]
Eponyst- eh, too easy.
posted by Sebmojo at 3:49 PM on June 8, 2011
If you had seen Terminator, and went into T2 cold, you would think you had a total handle on the opening, "Ok, there's the terminator, ok, there's the human, and they're both trying to get to John." And then the scene in the mall, where Arny says "Get down" would blow your mind.
This is so true - and it's very carefully constructed up to the roses scene to create that impression.
Terminator the Second is a project to stage Terminator 2: Judgement Day using only lines from Shakespeare (with some proper nouns and pronouns changed). A sample page from the script. A second page. A bit of background on Husky Jackal Theater.
posted by shakespeherian (38 comments total) [add to favorites] 8 users marked this as a favorite [!]
Eponyst- eh, too easy.
posted by Sebmojo at 3:49 PM on June 8, 2011
Will there be black people in the production?
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:25 PM on June 8, 2011
posted by Brandon Blatcher at 4:25 PM on June 8, 2011
Okay, I've been giving this show a shot recently and I'm a bit into the second season. So, it's getting better, but I'm still kind of mystified at this point as to why people think a bunch of stuff from the first two Terminator films basically "reheated" is actually good.
Spoilers depending on where in the second season you are.
One of the things I really liked about it was that it was setting up a larger conflict that was more complex than EVIL COMPUTER KILLS HUMANITY!! They never got to settle this stuff, but stuff like having (maybe) John Henry as its own independent agent (but maybe it was going to merge with Skynet). Or having some of Skynet's terminators turning against it for their own reasons, like the ShirleyManson-1000. Which, of course, may have been a double-cross. And that they were setting up John Connor's fascination with the machines, and that he has some sort of relationship with one of them, etc.
They were setting things up for the best ever way to wrap up the franchise: It's the end of the war, Skynet is smashed, they're at the time displacement facility preparing to go back in time and destroy Skynet before it exists. Except some of the [tech] there allows John to look into the alternate timelines surrounding the one he's in... and he learns that he started the war. In all of the timelines, there's always a John Connor and he always goes back at the end of the war to destroy Skynet -- and it's that attempt that panics Skynet into starting the war in the first place. So, in the end, he has to go back to defend Skynet against an attack from... himself, presumably from a nearby timeline, at least long enough for Cameron to find Skynet and merge with it so that it can learn too. Or maybe it's John that has to let Skynet destructively scan his brain and *he* merges with Skynet.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:36 PM on June 8, 2011
Spoilers depending on where in the second season you are.
One of the things I really liked about it was that it was setting up a larger conflict that was more complex than EVIL COMPUTER KILLS HUMANITY!! They never got to settle this stuff, but stuff like having (maybe) John Henry as its own independent agent (but maybe it was going to merge with Skynet). Or having some of Skynet's terminators turning against it for their own reasons, like the ShirleyManson-1000. Which, of course, may have been a double-cross. And that they were setting up John Connor's fascination with the machines, and that he has some sort of relationship with one of them, etc.
They were setting things up for the best ever way to wrap up the franchise: It's the end of the war, Skynet is smashed, they're at the time displacement facility preparing to go back in time and destroy Skynet before it exists. Except some of the [tech] there allows John to look into the alternate timelines surrounding the one he's in... and he learns that he started the war. In all of the timelines, there's always a John Connor and he always goes back at the end of the war to destroy Skynet -- and it's that attempt that panics Skynet into starting the war in the first place. So, in the end, he has to go back to defend Skynet against an attack from... himself, presumably from a nearby timeline, at least long enough for Cameron to find Skynet and merge with it so that it can learn too. Or maybe it's John that has to let Skynet destructively scan his brain and *he* merges with Skynet.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 4:36 PM on June 8, 2011
In all of the timelines, there's always a John Connor and he always goes back at the end of the war to destroy Skynet
Connor doesn't go back, his father does in Terminator:TOS. The only time traveling John Connor ever does himself is in the TV series, is probably not considered movie canon, and that's forward from the T:TOS milieu past the non-series-canon T3 into the then-contemporary early 00's.
posted by localroger at 7:10 PM on June 8, 2011
Connor doesn't go back, his father does in Terminator:TOS. The only time traveling John Connor ever does himself is in the TV series, is probably not considered movie canon, and that's forward from the T:TOS milieu past the non-series-canon T3 into the then-contemporary early 00's.
posted by localroger at 7:10 PM on June 8, 2011
Yeah, I know.
IN MY IDEA, in all the timelines there's always a John Connor who always sends a team back to terminate Skynet.
I mean, you're John Connor. You've just sent Kyle Reese back to die conceiving you, and you've sent a reprogrammed T800 back to protect you later. And there's this big, sexy time machine sitting there in front of you... of course you're going to try to stop Skynet before it starts.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:41 PM on June 8, 2011
IN MY IDEA, in all the timelines there's always a John Connor who always sends a team back to terminate Skynet.
I mean, you're John Connor. You've just sent Kyle Reese back to die conceiving you, and you've sent a reprogrammed T800 back to protect you later. And there's this big, sexy time machine sitting there in front of you... of course you're going to try to stop Skynet before it starts.
posted by ROU_Xenophobe at 7:41 PM on June 8, 2011
If you had seen Terminator, and went into T2 cold, you would think you had a total handle on the opening, "Ok, there's the terminator, ok, there's the human, and they're both trying to get to John." And then the scene in the mall, where Arny says "Get down" would blow your mind.
That's what happened to me! I didn't see Terminator or T2 until last summer when the newest film came out and the boyfriend insisted that I watch the first three before going to the theater.* I vaguely remembered ads for T2, but really, it was so long ago that I forgot everything. When I heard his say "Get down!" I was just giddy and my mind was blown.
* Well, he really only insisted I see the first two. We watch the third just for kicks, knowing it was irrelevant to the 4th.
posted by piratebowling at 8:03 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
That's what happened to me! I didn't see Terminator or T2 until last summer when the newest film came out and the boyfriend insisted that I watch the first three before going to the theater.* I vaguely remembered ads for T2, but really, it was so long ago that I forgot everything. When I heard his say "Get down!" I was just giddy and my mind was blown.
* Well, he really only insisted I see the first two. We watch the third just for kicks, knowing it was irrelevant to the 4th.
posted by piratebowling at 8:03 PM on June 8, 2011 [1 favorite]
Pulp Fiction, The Big Lebowski, and now Terminator 2. Fascinating how there is this sort of cultural thread binding these three movies together. I can almost sense what it is.
I'll predict that The Shawshank Redemption will be the next to be Shakespeared.
Ellis the Red: Admit, must I, that Dufresne was naught to behold as my eyes first lay on him, a mere breeze might lay him flat. 'Twas my first impression of the man.
posted by jabberjaw at 9:40 PM on June 8, 2011
I'll predict that The Shawshank Redemption will be the next to be Shakespeared.
Ellis the Red: Admit, must I, that Dufresne was naught to behold as my eyes first lay on him, a mere breeze might lay him flat. 'Twas my first impression of the man.
posted by jabberjaw at 9:40 PM on June 8, 2011
it was setting up a larger conflict that was more complex than EVIL COMPUTER KILLS HUMANITY!!
Meh, you can tell all they did for the first season was bounce ideas around until they hit on that for the second season. For the most part the show is clunky(Machinas ex deus. Every. Single. Episode.), ridiculous(ohhh, that list is long and funny), and unoriginal("Hey, remember that 'one' scene from the movie? Yeah, they put it in the show"). It's not that the series doesn't have some good ideas in there but at best they kind of half-heartedly developed some and used them as throwaway episodes. At best there have been a few glimmers of some character development but I'm just going to hold out hope as I'm only a third of the way through the second season.
It's entertaining though, because who doesn't like killer robots from the future?
posted by P.o.B. at 10:09 PM on June 8, 2011
Meh, you can tell all they did for the first season was bounce ideas around until they hit on that for the second season. For the most part the show is clunky(Machinas ex deus. Every. Single. Episode.), ridiculous(ohhh, that list is long and funny), and unoriginal("Hey, remember that 'one' scene from the movie? Yeah, they put it in the show"). It's not that the series doesn't have some good ideas in there but at best they kind of half-heartedly developed some and used them as throwaway episodes. At best there have been a few glimmers of some character development but I'm just going to hold out hope as I'm only a third of the way through the second season.
It's entertaining though, because who doesn't like killer robots from the future?
posted by P.o.B. at 10:09 PM on June 8, 2011
For those who haven't seen it before: The MetaFilter Pulp Shakespeare
posted by SLC Mom at 7:37 AM on June 9, 2011
posted by SLC Mom at 7:37 AM on June 9, 2011
piratebowling: Unfortunately, the 4th film is irrelevant to everything.
posted by Saxon Kane at 12:01 PM on June 9, 2011
posted by Saxon Kane at 12:01 PM on June 9, 2011
I'd say the third was the least relevant. Besides, he hadn't seen the fourth yet, so he didn't know how much background I may out may not need to understand it.
posted by piratebowling at 8:01 AM on June 11, 2011
posted by piratebowling at 8:01 AM on June 11, 2011
Oh, the third is lame, no doubt about it. But the 4th just sucks, without even the occasionally amusing dumb comedy that makes parts of the 3rd somewhat watchable. "Salvation" takes itself sooooo seriously.
posted by Saxon Kane at 7:12 AM on June 14, 2011
posted by Saxon Kane at 7:12 AM on June 14, 2011
This, as with all things Shakespeare, is better in the original Klingon.
posted by ego at 2:05 PM on June 17, 2011
posted by ego at 2:05 PM on June 17, 2011
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posted by kmz at 12:13 PM on June 8, 2011 [5 favorites]