Life isn't fair; it's just fairer than death, that's all.
November 16, 2018 6:58 AM Subscribe
"I have been informed by friends of the family that William Goldman died last night. He was 87. Goldman, who twice won screenwriting Oscars for All The President’s Men and Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, passed away last night in his Manhattan home, surrounded by family and friends. His health had been failing for some time, and over the summer his condition deteriorated."
"[Goldman] also wrote several novels, along with what became arguably the most famous book about screenwriting in history: 1983’s Adventures in the Screen Trade, chronicling his ups and downs in the movie industry. That book is also where Goldman coined one of the most repeated lines about the world of Hollywood moviemaking: “Nobody knows anything,” summing up how everyone in the town thinks they’re brilliant, but actually knows squat.
"Although his best-known works are all outstanding, some of his lesser-known scripts are just as good. In 1972, he re-teamed with Sundance Kid Robert Redford for The Hot Rock, a sardonic heist film based on a novel by Donald Westlake. Dryly hilarious, it’s one of the all-time great crime movies (and a clear inspiration for Steven Soderbergh’s Ocean’s Eleven series). It’s not streaming online right now, but it’s worth tracking down a copy on DVD; it’s outstanding."
"[Goldman] also wrote several novels, along with what became arguably the most famous book about screenwriting in history: 1983’s Adventures in the Screen Trade, chronicling his ups and downs in the movie industry. That book is also where Goldman coined one of the most repeated lines about the world of Hollywood moviemaking: “Nobody knows anything,” summing up how everyone in the town thinks they’re brilliant, but actually knows squat.
"Although his best-known works are all outstanding, some of his lesser-known scripts are just as good. In 1972, he re-teamed with Sundance Kid Robert Redford for The Hot Rock, a sardonic heist film based on a novel by Donald Westlake. Dryly hilarious, it’s one of the all-time great crime movies (and a clear inspiration for Steven Soderbergh’s Ocean’s Eleven series). It’s not streaming online right now, but it’s worth tracking down a copy on DVD; it’s outstanding."
I hope he's just mostly dead and we can get him to Miracle Max.
posted by otherchaz at 7:04 AM on November 16, 2018 [43 favorites]
posted by otherchaz at 7:04 AM on November 16, 2018 [43 favorites]
And of course (as mentioned in the tags) the screenwriter of The Princess Bride.
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posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:05 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
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posted by Tell Me No Lies at 7:05 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
Inconceivable.
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He was also the author/screenwriter of Marathon Man, which is amazing.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 7:08 AM on November 16, 2018 [10 favorites]
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He was also the author/screenwriter of Marathon Man, which is amazing.
posted by Mr. Bad Example at 7:08 AM on November 16, 2018 [10 favorites]
Goldman also wrote the novel for The Princess Bride, which I highly recommend. It is different from the movie, but also really funny and brilliant, though significantly more cynical.
I get why reporters are leading with the screenplays that won Oscars, but I feel like The Princess Bride is the work that has the most hold on our current pop culture and I'm surprised there isn't more attention paid to it in the obituaries I'm reading. (Many don't even mention the novel.)
posted by JustKeepSwimming at 7:09 AM on November 16, 2018 [37 favorites]
I get why reporters are leading with the screenplays that won Oscars, but I feel like The Princess Bride is the work that has the most hold on our current pop culture and I'm surprised there isn't more attention paid to it in the obituaries I'm reading. (Many don't even mention the novel.)
posted by JustKeepSwimming at 7:09 AM on November 16, 2018 [37 favorites]
For decades, whenever I feed the animals I tell them, "Essen!" just as my own personal, Marathon Man inside joke. William Goldman will also have presence in my life.
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posted by Room 641-A at 7:10 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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posted by Room 641-A at 7:10 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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posted by mikelieman at 7:11 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by mikelieman at 7:11 AM on November 16, 2018
William Goldman will also have presence in my life.
Always. Always have a presence.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:13 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
Always. Always have a presence.
posted by Room 641-A at 7:13 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
And of course (as mentioned in the tags) the screenwriter of The Princess Bride.
When I figured out that that was by the same guy who wrote Marathon Man it explained.....something..... for me.
posted by thelonius at 7:17 AM on November 16, 2018
When I figured out that that was by the same guy who wrote Marathon Man it explained.....something..... for me.
posted by thelonius at 7:17 AM on November 16, 2018
Even before I saw any of the movies he worked on, Adventures In The Screen Trade was the first book I ever read about the movie industry.
posted by octobersurprise at 7:17 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by octobersurprise at 7:17 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
William Goldman will also have presence in my life.
Always. Always have a presence.
Always - we named our son Westley.
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posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:25 AM on November 16, 2018 [10 favorites]
Always. Always have a presence.
Always - we named our son Westley.
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posted by robocop is bleeding at 7:25 AM on November 16, 2018 [10 favorites]
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posted by skycrashesdown at 7:25 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by skycrashesdown at 7:25 AM on November 16, 2018
god i read the princess bride when i was very very small, like maybe 5 years old? and i had absolutely no concept or understanding of like? idk what to call it? satirical fantasy? and i didn't want to ask bc i already had a sincerely deep horror of adults saying "isn't that adooooorable" while laughing at something i'd said or done in earnest. but anyway not being able to find the countries of guilder and florin in any encyclopedia was extremely frustrating. and then the movie came out a few years later and i was like oh shit good call tiny me, that would've been embarrassing.
posted by poffin boffin at 7:26 AM on November 16, 2018 [25 favorites]
posted by poffin boffin at 7:26 AM on November 16, 2018 [25 favorites]
♪
posted by Splunge at 7:30 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Splunge at 7:30 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
I was much older than you were -- 12? maybe? Old enough that I should have known better, but not old enough to be quite sure what was going on with the whole Morgenstern back-story (I knew Florin and Guilder weren't real, but somehow wasn't sure that Goldman wasn't excerpting from an actually existing longer version that was about fictional countries.) Loved that book so much, enough that while I'm sure the movie is great, I wasn't ever that blown away by it.
posted by LizardBreath at 7:31 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
posted by LizardBreath at 7:31 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
🦷
posted by GenjiandProust at 7:34 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by GenjiandProust at 7:34 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
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posted by zombieflanders at 7:36 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by zombieflanders at 7:36 AM on November 16, 2018
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posted by GrammarMoses at 7:42 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by GrammarMoses at 7:42 AM on November 16, 2018
I knew he was ill, and I was just wondering yesterday how he was holding up. Very much not the answer I was hoping for.
R.I.P., Sir. You were a giant.
posted by Optamystic at 7:47 AM on November 16, 2018
R.I.P., Sir. You were a giant.
posted by Optamystic at 7:47 AM on November 16, 2018
Do people still watch A Bridge Too Far? Because they should.
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posted by doubtfulpalace at 7:49 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
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posted by doubtfulpalace at 7:49 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
Florin and Guilder were the currencies my higher education finance prof used in examples. Quite the wide reach.
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posted by wellred at 8:03 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
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posted by wellred at 8:03 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
For a moment there I thought we were in trouble.
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posted by SonInLawOfSam at 8:25 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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posted by SonInLawOfSam at 8:25 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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He wrote "Magic"? That's a great but weirdly mostly forgotten horror/thriller with a great early performance from Anthony Hopkins.
Amazing how he could write in any genre.
posted by octothorpe at 8:33 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
He wrote "Magic"? That's a great but weirdly mostly forgotten horror/thriller with a great early performance from Anthony Hopkins.
Amazing how he could write in any genre.
posted by octothorpe at 8:33 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
In our house, whenever someone uses the word “possible”, someone else must say “pig”. This tradition originated, of course, with the scene in The Princess Bride where Westley is lying on the bed and Humperdinck guesses that he’s lying there because he lacks the strength to stand. “That’s possible, pig...”
Goddammit. I’m very sad. What a life.
posted by lizifer at 8:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
Goddammit. I’m very sad. What a life.
posted by lizifer at 8:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
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posted by chappell, ambrose at 8:42 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by chappell, ambrose at 8:42 AM on November 16, 2018
When I was a kid, Goldman fooled me completely with The Princess Bride novel's framing narrative about the author Morgenstern and the country Florin. It was only after trying to find out where in Europe that Florin had been that I figured it out.
Ariosto's Orlando Furioso really is like the unexpurgated Princess Bride is said to be in the novel. It contains page after page of flattery of Ariosto's patron's family, all of which you can skip, and the rest is a fine fantasy adventure.
posted by ckridge at 8:43 AM on November 16, 2018
Ariosto's Orlando Furioso really is like the unexpurgated Princess Bride is said to be in the novel. It contains page after page of flattery of Ariosto's patron's family, all of which you can skip, and the rest is a fine fantasy adventure.
posted by ckridge at 8:43 AM on November 16, 2018
From the "Princess Bride" IMDB page:
posted by Melismata at 8:43 AM on November 16, 2018 [25 favorites]
In a 2012 interview in New York Magazine, Mandy Patinkin said that his most famous line from The Princess Bride (1987) ("Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die.") gets quoted back to him by at least two or three strangers every day of his life. Patinkin told the interviewer that he loves hearing the line and he also loves the general fact that he got to be in the movie, stating, "I'm frankly thrilled about it. I can't believe that I got to be in The Wizard of Oz, you know what I mean?".
posted by Melismata at 8:43 AM on November 16, 2018 [25 favorites]
I want to put in a plug for The Color of Light, a 1984 novel of Goldman's. I'm not sure that I'd call it a good or a successful novel, but wow does a lot of colorful stuff happen. It sort of ricochets back and forth between being a psychological study of the career of a failed writer, and a lunatic thriller.
posted by LizardBreath at 8:49 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by LizardBreath at 8:49 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
Imagine having two Oscars, and no one in the entire goddamn world thinks either one is your best movie.
posted by Etrigan at 8:52 AM on November 16, 2018 [38 favorites]
posted by Etrigan at 8:52 AM on November 16, 2018 [38 favorites]
I remember getting the Princess Bride paperback from our mall's B. Dalton. I would often buy movie novelizations at the time, and they were usually schlock (but good enough to kill a few hours at the mall with, although the Goonies novelization was—is—surprisingly well-written). The Princess Bride, though... that framing device blew my junior high mind. It was one of the books from seventh grade, along with Watership Down, where I realized I needed to step up my book-choosing game because I was really missing out.
RIP Mr. Goldman.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 9:04 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
RIP Mr. Goldman.
posted by lefty lucky cat at 9:04 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
Goldman on film making:
It's hard. I don't mean hard like it was hard for Van Gogh to fill a canvas or Kant to deconstruct a universe. I mean hard like coal mining.posted by DirtyOldTown at 9:17 AM on November 16, 2018 [11 favorites]
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posted by homunculus at 9:18 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by homunculus at 9:18 AM on November 16, 2018
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I know I told the story about writing into the publisher for the edited text the Society for the Preservation of S. Morgenstern blocked the publication of, right?
posted by Samizdata at 9:20 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
I know I told the story about writing into the publisher for the edited text the Society for the Preservation of S. Morgenstern blocked the publication of, right?
posted by Samizdata at 9:20 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
In the fall of 1981 I was a terrified and extremely nerdy Freshman in High School in a very rural area where it was not ok for girls to be smart or nerdy (and of course there was no internet to tell me that there were other girls like me).
In the school library, on a dusty shelf that faced away from the rest of the room I found a novel called The Princess Bride that seemed untouched. I was not a big reader of fiction (and still am not) and in those pre-internet days my idea of what fantasy was pretty much started with The Hobbit/LOTR and ended with A Wrinkle in Time and I was not aware there was much else out there similar to that.
Reading The Princess Bride, reading it in chunks daily while sitting on the floor of the library in the space between the shelves, the book pages lit by the sun of the library window that was behind me, reading it as the dust motes drifted around me in the sunlight, hoping that nobody would find me back there, that is one of my most enduring and visceral memories of that time in my life. I read it seventeen times through before I graduated, and for some time I thought of it as my own secret novel - nobody else seemed to have heard of it, and although I loved the story of Buttercup and Wesley, what I loved more was hearing his voice as it drifted out of the pages ... the voice of a writer, speaking to me as himself ... something that I had not really encountered in that way before.
So, yeah, Mr. Goldman - thank you for inventing that world. Thank you for talking to me through the pages of that book. I hope you know how much joy your work brought to people.
and, yeah, if you've never read TPB novel and have just seen the movie -- READ THE BOOK. Your life will be so much richer for the experience.
posted by anastasiav at 9:33 AM on November 16, 2018 [32 favorites]
In the school library, on a dusty shelf that faced away from the rest of the room I found a novel called The Princess Bride that seemed untouched. I was not a big reader of fiction (and still am not) and in those pre-internet days my idea of what fantasy was pretty much started with The Hobbit/LOTR and ended with A Wrinkle in Time and I was not aware there was much else out there similar to that.
Reading The Princess Bride, reading it in chunks daily while sitting on the floor of the library in the space between the shelves, the book pages lit by the sun of the library window that was behind me, reading it as the dust motes drifted around me in the sunlight, hoping that nobody would find me back there, that is one of my most enduring and visceral memories of that time in my life. I read it seventeen times through before I graduated, and for some time I thought of it as my own secret novel - nobody else seemed to have heard of it, and although I loved the story of Buttercup and Wesley, what I loved more was hearing his voice as it drifted out of the pages ... the voice of a writer, speaking to me as himself ... something that I had not really encountered in that way before.
So, yeah, Mr. Goldman - thank you for inventing that world. Thank you for talking to me through the pages of that book. I hope you know how much joy your work brought to people.
and, yeah, if you've never read TPB novel and have just seen the movie -- READ THE BOOK. Your life will be so much richer for the experience.
posted by anastasiav at 9:33 AM on November 16, 2018 [32 favorites]
Is it safe?
He had a funny story about going to a new dentist, and, when word spread about who he was, everyone in the dental practice found an excuse to come in and meet him.
posted by thelonius at 9:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
He had a funny story about going to a new dentist, and, when word spread about who he was, everyone in the dental practice found an excuse to come in and meet him.
posted by thelonius at 9:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
When I was a kid, Goldman fooled me completely with The Princess Bride novel's framing narrative about the author Morgenstern and the country Florin. It was only after trying to find out where in Europe that Florin had been that I figured it out.
I knew the novel was fiction - but (at age 15) still thought that there was a longer novel out there somewhere that he'd edited the boring bits out of.
Took me several years to realize that it didn't exist.
(maybe)
posted by jb at 9:46 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
I knew the novel was fiction - but (at age 15) still thought that there was a longer novel out there somewhere that he'd edited the boring bits out of.
Took me several years to realize that it didn't exist.
(maybe)
posted by jb at 9:46 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
He wrote "Magic"?
If I ever knew Goldman wrote Magic, I'd forgotten it. I saw the movie on VHS some several years after it came out and it's still a creepy scary touchstone for me.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:50 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
If I ever knew Goldman wrote Magic, I'd forgotten it. I saw the movie on VHS some several years after it came out and it's still a creepy scary touchstone for me.
posted by octobersurprise at 9:50 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
Knew about some of his films, but the mentions above and elsewhere really make me want a retrospective series on his work. Possibly on FilmStruck after they save it (pleaseplease).
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posted by the sobsister at 10:08 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
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posted by the sobsister at 10:08 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
For a long time I regarded the novel of The Princess Bride with reserve and thought it inferior to the movie, because at the end of the novel the adult narrator of the framing narrative says that he no longer cares about love, or anything much at all. This wholly disavows the central narrative, which is wildly, madly, utterly romantic, and I thought doing this tawdry, cowardly, and likely the sort of thing that working for the movies did to you. I was a kid.
Lately I think that Goldman felt every word of that wild romanticism, but didn't feel able to live up to it - who can? - and wanted to avoid taking credit for being like Wesley. He may also have had qualms about showing romantic love as magically potent when it is no more than a leap into the unknown. He likely felt shy about showing something that mattered so much to him, too, and so tried to hide it at the same time as he showed it. I am no longer at all sure that is cowardice.
posted by ckridge at 10:11 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
Lately I think that Goldman felt every word of that wild romanticism, but didn't feel able to live up to it - who can? - and wanted to avoid taking credit for being like Wesley. He may also have had qualms about showing romantic love as magically potent when it is no more than a leap into the unknown. He likely felt shy about showing something that mattered so much to him, too, and so tried to hide it at the same time as he showed it. I am no longer at all sure that is cowardice.
posted by ckridge at 10:11 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
but anyway not being able to find the countries of guilder and florin in any encyclopedia was extremely frustrating
Oh god. I remember realizing that King Arthur and Camelot and all that was a story because I couldn’t find it in the encyclopedia. Seriously one of my saddest days as a child.
My William Goldman story: Back in college, my friends and I wanted to do our own theatre production, separate from the college’s department. We decided to do The Princess Bride, as it was beloved by all. I wrote the script, incorporating from both the movie and the book. (Dear lord, the amount of pausing the VIDEOTAPE I had to do.) I can hardly believe now that I did that. We held auditions, sold ads for the program to get money for the sets and costumes, booked the location, and all the while, one of our crew was working on getting the rights. About 2 months before the production, he finally got a hold of William Goldman himself, on the phone! And, of course, Goldman said “No.” That’s it. Just no. Our friend asked why. And he replied. “If I let you, I’d have to let everyone.” And hung up.
We were... disappointed. I think we used his name as a curse for a while. It makes sense now, but we were 20-yo idiots, then. We researched and found we could still do it as a “workshop” but we couldn’t charge money, so we had to return all we had raised.
We went on with it, and it was amazing. I wish we had a recording of it, because we did some truly remarkable things, considering we suddenly had zero budget. Poor Inigo broke her leg jumping off the stage during a sword-fight scene in the final production. And she continued on. And yet, she didn’t even seem upset after, that’s how much everyone loved the show.
That show, man. Nothing stopped us. Not lack of budget, legal woes, or broken bones.
Thanks, William Goldman. We couldn’t have done it without you.
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posted by greermahoney at 10:23 AM on November 16, 2018 [11 favorites]
Oh god. I remember realizing that King Arthur and Camelot and all that was a story because I couldn’t find it in the encyclopedia. Seriously one of my saddest days as a child.
My William Goldman story: Back in college, my friends and I wanted to do our own theatre production, separate from the college’s department. We decided to do The Princess Bride, as it was beloved by all. I wrote the script, incorporating from both the movie and the book. (Dear lord, the amount of pausing the VIDEOTAPE I had to do.) I can hardly believe now that I did that. We held auditions, sold ads for the program to get money for the sets and costumes, booked the location, and all the while, one of our crew was working on getting the rights. About 2 months before the production, he finally got a hold of William Goldman himself, on the phone! And, of course, Goldman said “No.” That’s it. Just no. Our friend asked why. And he replied. “If I let you, I’d have to let everyone.” And hung up.
We were... disappointed. I think we used his name as a curse for a while. It makes sense now, but we were 20-yo idiots, then. We researched and found we could still do it as a “workshop” but we couldn’t charge money, so we had to return all we had raised.
We went on with it, and it was amazing. I wish we had a recording of it, because we did some truly remarkable things, considering we suddenly had zero budget. Poor Inigo broke her leg jumping off the stage during a sword-fight scene in the final production. And she continued on. And yet, she didn’t even seem upset after, that’s how much everyone loved the show.
That show, man. Nothing stopped us. Not lack of budget, legal woes, or broken bones.
Thanks, William Goldman. We couldn’t have done it without you.
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posted by greermahoney at 10:23 AM on November 16, 2018 [11 favorites]
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William Goldman was probably the first to drive home the point (to me) that in order to call yourself a writer, you must first write ... however you can, whenever you can. But he didn't just say it, he told a story (I think it was in Adventures in the Screen Trade). It concerned a friend who'd always wanted to be a novelist, but then he fell in love, got married, had kids, had to support a family. So he took to editing to pay the bills. But the dream of writing a novel just wouldn't go away. Except there was no time. Except maybe a few hours on Sunday, if he worked it right. Which is what he did. For maybe four hours every Sunday (while his wife took the kids to church and then off to visit grandma or whatever) he'd sit down and write his novel. It took years but he eventually finished it. I can't remember the rest of the story, whether it got published, whether it was a success and freed him up to write way more -- I just remember that the guy made the time, he wrote, and ultimately, he delivered. And that's helped me a lot. It's helping me right now.
So thanks, Mr. Goldman, thanks for everything. And here's hoping that you're remembered for way more than just the Princess Bride (the movie) ... because that's not even close to your best work.
posted by philip-random at 10:29 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
William Goldman was probably the first to drive home the point (to me) that in order to call yourself a writer, you must first write ... however you can, whenever you can. But he didn't just say it, he told a story (I think it was in Adventures in the Screen Trade). It concerned a friend who'd always wanted to be a novelist, but then he fell in love, got married, had kids, had to support a family. So he took to editing to pay the bills. But the dream of writing a novel just wouldn't go away. Except there was no time. Except maybe a few hours on Sunday, if he worked it right. Which is what he did. For maybe four hours every Sunday (while his wife took the kids to church and then off to visit grandma or whatever) he'd sit down and write his novel. It took years but he eventually finished it. I can't remember the rest of the story, whether it got published, whether it was a success and freed him up to write way more -- I just remember that the guy made the time, he wrote, and ultimately, he delivered. And that's helped me a lot. It's helping me right now.
So thanks, Mr. Goldman, thanks for everything. And here's hoping that you're remembered for way more than just the Princess Bride (the movie) ... because that's not even close to your best work.
posted by philip-random at 10:29 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
Adventures in the Screen Trade demystified the movie industry for me (and also screenwriting), and is still one of the best (or at least one of my favourite) books about learning to work in the creative industries - it's full of valuable insights into the ways creative decisions are quite properly dictated by logistics - either the need to explain what's going on without too much exposition, or the fact that the director always casts his wife even if she's not really appropriate for the role, or that reality is often unbelievable and what's dramatically valid can kill the audiences engagement or just ... y'know ... money. And this is just the landscape of creative endeavour, the stuff you have to deal with to get things done, and you just get on with it and don't start complaining about Your Art. Whenever I have to engage with any kind of creative industry, that book nudges the way I do it. Invaluable.
posted by Grangousier at 10:40 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
posted by Grangousier at 10:40 AM on November 16, 2018 [5 favorites]
Big appreciation to Goldman for adapting the Stephen King novel Misery for the screen, which turned out to be Kathy Bates' big breakout role. I liked the book a lot but it was a pretty difficult read in a lot of ways, and Goldman's adaptation added in some of the mordant wit that was in many of his other screenplays and books.
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posted by Halloween Jack at 10:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
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posted by Halloween Jack at 10:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [6 favorites]
Just the other day I commented to my wife that I would be mortally shocked if George R.R. Martin actually released the final book of the Song of Fire and Ice series, but I would only be pleasantly surprised if William Goldman suddenly released Buttercup's Baby. Sadly, I suppose I have one less pleasant surprise to idly dream about.
Mr. Goldman's writing was wonderful. I am proud that the officiant to my wedding worked it into the ceremony. I can only hope that wherever he is now there are mutton, lettuce, and tomato sandwiches, and the mutton is smooth and tender. Peace.
posted by 1f2frfbf at 10:42 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
Mr. Goldman's writing was wonderful. I am proud that the officiant to my wedding worked it into the ceremony. I can only hope that wherever he is now there are mutton, lettuce, and tomato sandwiches, and the mutton is smooth and tender. Peace.
posted by 1f2frfbf at 10:42 AM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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posted by songs_about_rainbows at 11:34 AM on November 16, 2018
posted by songs_about_rainbows at 11:34 AM on November 16, 2018
I quite enjoyed Boys and Girls Together, although it is definitely Of Its Time. And anyone looking for more S. Morgenstern should check out The Silent Gondoliers.
posted by doubtfulpalace at 11:35 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
posted by doubtfulpalace at 11:35 AM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
I got Goldman mixed up with Golding at one point in grade school.
posted by The otter lady at 11:38 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
posted by The otter lady at 11:38 AM on November 16, 2018 [7 favorites]
For a long time I regarded the novel of The Princess Bride with reserve and thought it inferior to the movie, because at the end of the novel the adult narrator of the framing narrative says that he no longer cares about love, or anything much at all. This wholly disavows the central narrative, which is wildly, madly, utterly romantic, and I thought doing this tawdry, cowardly, and likely the sort of thing that working for the movies did to you. I was a kid.
My take is that the primary subject of the book is “William Goldman”’s midlife crisis, and that the narrator’s statement here is meant to be taken as strongly felt, but ultimately wrong.
posted by doubtfulpalace at 11:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
My take is that the primary subject of the book is “William Goldman”’s midlife crisis, and that the narrator’s statement here is meant to be taken as strongly felt, but ultimately wrong.
posted by doubtfulpalace at 11:41 AM on November 16, 2018 [4 favorites]
Spoiler-that-there's-a-Spoiler Alert: There is no way to communicate this without at least some spoilage, but Marathon Man the book had the greatest twist I think I have ever encountered in any narrative, and as I recall, it's not in the movie at all. I'm older and more jaded now, so for all I know it may have just been an artifact of being a young and naive reader, but the moment of that twist, and the way the plot reveal was intertwined with the moment of description, is burned into my memory with even more concentrated intensity than the overall greater luminance of Princess Bride. What a writer.
posted by chortly at 11:57 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by chortly at 11:57 AM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
I get why reporters are leading with the screenplays that won Oscars
The CBC News headline: William Goldman, writer of The Princess Bride and All the President's Men, dead at 87.
posted by heatherlogan at 12:13 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
The CBC News headline: William Goldman, writer of The Princess Bride and All the President's Men, dead at 87.
posted by heatherlogan at 12:13 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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My mom claims to have known him, though isn't quite sure how. Given that Dad worked in Hollywood for years as a screenwriter, it's not entirely inconceivable.
posted by Alensin at 12:20 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
My mom claims to have known him, though isn't quite sure how. Given that Dad worked in Hollywood for years as a screenwriter, it's not entirely inconceivable.
posted by Alensin at 12:20 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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posted by grandiloquiet at 12:31 PM on November 16, 2018
posted by grandiloquiet at 12:31 PM on November 16, 2018
I used to work in a bookshop in Ann Arbor, Michigan. The owner was a series Princess Bride fan, and would read its opening page (most beautiful chocolate etc) to just about anybody, maybe once a day.
Now, when my wife wants to flatter me, she calls me her brute squad.
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posted by doctornemo at 1:21 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
Now, when my wife wants to flatter me, she calls me her brute squad.
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posted by doctornemo at 1:21 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
>My take is that the primary subject of the book is “William Goldman”’s midlife crisis<
It does seem likely that some such crisis is going on. I think he is like Colette's Cheri, who, having left his lover Lea, speaks slightingly of her in company so as to be able to speak of her. He thinks all that is over for him and that he doesn't care, but nothing else pleases.
"A littie more, and he would have sullied her name, while his heart was rejoicing in his own memories of her: sullied the soft sweet name which he had been unable to mention freely during the last six months, and the whole gracious vision he had of Lea, leaning over him with her two or three irreparable wrinkles, and her beauty, now lost to him, but — alas — ever present."
posted by ckridge at 1:30 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
It does seem likely that some such crisis is going on. I think he is like Colette's Cheri, who, having left his lover Lea, speaks slightingly of her in company so as to be able to speak of her. He thinks all that is over for him and that he doesn't care, but nothing else pleases.
"A littie more, and he would have sullied her name, while his heart was rejoicing in his own memories of her: sullied the soft sweet name which he had been unable to mention freely during the last six months, and the whole gracious vision he had of Lea, leaning over him with her two or three irreparable wrinkles, and her beauty, now lost to him, but — alas — ever present."
posted by ckridge at 1:30 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
Worked in a copy shop in Manhattan in the early 1980s. One day, a guy came in with a pile of scripts and asked to have them all copied. Glancing over the pile, I noticed all the scripts were famous movies. All written by you-know-who.
"You writing a paper on William Goldman?" I joked.
"I am William Goldman," the customer said.
I looked at him closely. It was.
posted by Modest House at 2:31 PM on November 16, 2018 [23 favorites]
"You writing a paper on William Goldman?" I joked.
"I am William Goldman," the customer said.
I looked at him closely. It was.
posted by Modest House at 2:31 PM on November 16, 2018 [23 favorites]
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Adventures in the Screen Trade is a better book, but Goldman’s writing about The Princess Bride – which most people here are remembering fondly – comes in its sequel, Which Lie Did I Tell?
Another interesting Goldman book that rarely gets mentioned is his 1964 novel No Way to Treat a Lady, which features a Boston Strangler-like character who has to deal with a copy-cat strangler who starts working in the same area. His editor didn’t want the book to detract from what was supposed to be Goldman’s career as an ‘serious’ literary figure, so he published it under the pseudonym Harry Longbaugh – aka ‘the Sundance Kid’ – five years before that movie appeared.
The importance of No Way, in the end, turned out to be that its publication led to Goldman being hired to write his first screenplay – for Cliff Robertson’s movie Charly. It wasn’t used, but subsequent screenplays, as we all know, pretty much derailed Goldman’s life as a 'serious' literary novelist.
posted by LeLiLo at 3:02 PM on November 16, 2018
Adventures in the Screen Trade is a better book, but Goldman’s writing about The Princess Bride – which most people here are remembering fondly – comes in its sequel, Which Lie Did I Tell?
Another interesting Goldman book that rarely gets mentioned is his 1964 novel No Way to Treat a Lady, which features a Boston Strangler-like character who has to deal with a copy-cat strangler who starts working in the same area. His editor didn’t want the book to detract from what was supposed to be Goldman’s career as an ‘serious’ literary figure, so he published it under the pseudonym Harry Longbaugh – aka ‘the Sundance Kid’ – five years before that movie appeared.
The importance of No Way, in the end, turned out to be that its publication led to Goldman being hired to write his first screenplay – for Cliff Robertson’s movie Charly. It wasn’t used, but subsequent screenplays, as we all know, pretty much derailed Goldman’s life as a 'serious' literary novelist.
posted by LeLiLo at 3:02 PM on November 16, 2018
•
I had read all his early novels before The Princess Bride came out. As mentioned, they were of their time but the writing was spare and witty. He had the touch in both genres.
posted by MovableBookLady at 3:05 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
I had read all his early novels before The Princess Bride came out. As mentioned, they were of their time but the writing was spare and witty. He had the touch in both genres.
posted by MovableBookLady at 3:05 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
I will watch Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid any time it comes on.
Can't turn it off.
posted by bongo_x at 3:38 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
Can't turn it off.
posted by bongo_x at 3:38 PM on November 16, 2018 [3 favorites]
> anastasiav:
"and, yeah, if you've never read TPB novel and have just seen the movie -- READ THE BOOK. Your life will be so much richer for the experience."
Inna gadda da vita, YES!
posted by Samizdata at 3:44 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
"and, yeah, if you've never read TPB novel and have just seen the movie -- READ THE BOOK. Your life will be so much richer for the experience."
Inna gadda da vita, YES!
posted by Samizdata at 3:44 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
Adventures in the Screen Trade is not just a great book about screenwriting and Hollywood, it's just simply a great book.
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posted by Joey Michaels at 4:43 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
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posted by Joey Michaels at 4:43 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
"And that's what's wrong with publishing today." It's from the Intro to TPB, and is in the lexicon of my wife and myself. I guess in the way others use "And that's why we can't have nice things," but the flavor is different.
posted by aurelian at 5:22 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
posted by aurelian at 5:22 PM on November 16, 2018 [2 favorites]
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Count me also as one of the gullible people who read The Princess Bride a bit younger than I should have (10?) and furiously searched atlases for Florin and Guilder. I felt pretty foolish a few years later when I could Search The Internet and figured it out.
posted by permiechickie at 6:21 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
Count me also as one of the gullible people who read The Princess Bride a bit younger than I should have (10?) and furiously searched atlases for Florin and Guilder. I felt pretty foolish a few years later when I could Search The Internet and figured it out.
posted by permiechickie at 6:21 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
I found Brothers, the sequel to Marathon Man, in a used bookstore, bought it and read it. It was kind of insane.
posted by thelonius at 7:11 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by thelonius at 7:11 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
Oh. I've only ever written two fan letters in my 40 years of life. One to Michael Ende (The Neverending Story) and one to William Goldman after reading The Princess Bride. A master storyteller.
posted by Brocktoon at 9:58 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
posted by Brocktoon at 9:58 PM on November 16, 2018 [1 favorite]
The officiant at my marriage started off with "Mwarridge. Marriage is what brings us together today." It pleasantly surprised me, as we had joked about it with the officiant when we meet with her. My wife had forgotten about that part of the conversation and was slightly stunned.
I finally read the novel of TPB in college and despite knowing better, part of me believed Morgenstern for a little while.
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posted by Hactar at 3:22 AM on November 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
I finally read the novel of TPB in college and despite knowing better, part of me believed Morgenstern for a little while.
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posted by Hactar at 3:22 AM on November 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
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Our wedding was lightly Princess Bride themed. We were at the San Diego Central Library, so it was already swinging pretty bookish anyway. The officiant opened the ceremony with the "mawwaige" bit, and our cake was an open book with two pages from TPB printed on it. Pics. (For the curious -- one page was the Man In Black is Westley/"As you wish" reveal, and the other page was when they reach the Fire Swamp. Buttercup finds her courage to enter it in Westley's eyes, and the walk in hand in hand. It seemed a pretty apt metaphor to put on a wedding cake.)
We're expecting our first child in a week. One of our friends made us a onesie that says "I am the brute squad!"
The movie and the book are both going to be staples in our expanding family.
posted by natabat at 10:01 AM on November 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
Our wedding was lightly Princess Bride themed. We were at the San Diego Central Library, so it was already swinging pretty bookish anyway. The officiant opened the ceremony with the "mawwaige" bit, and our cake was an open book with two pages from TPB printed on it. Pics. (For the curious -- one page was the Man In Black is Westley/"As you wish" reveal, and the other page was when they reach the Fire Swamp. Buttercup finds her courage to enter it in Westley's eyes, and the walk in hand in hand. It seemed a pretty apt metaphor to put on a wedding cake.)
We're expecting our first child in a week. One of our friends made us a onesie that says "I am the brute squad!"
The movie and the book are both going to be staples in our expanding family.
posted by natabat at 10:01 AM on November 17, 2018 [1 favorite]
After seeing The Princess Bride as a kid, I naturally sought out the book. The library didn't have it -- though I did eventually get my hands on it -- but they had a little book called The Silent Gondoliers. I read it over a day or so; it's short. I cried, and cried, and cried.
Every word of it I carried with me for a long time after that.
So many years later my not-yet-wife was recovering from a medical procedure. She asked me to read her a book. I said Wait a second, I've got just the thing. I cried, and cried, and cried.
It is very beautiful. Maybe it won't hit you dead center, so to speak, like it hit me. I dunno, people are weird.
RIP Goldman.
posted by waxbanks at 5:55 AM on November 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
Every word of it I carried with me for a long time after that.
So many years later my not-yet-wife was recovering from a medical procedure. She asked me to read her a book. I said Wait a second, I've got just the thing. I cried, and cried, and cried.
It is very beautiful. Maybe it won't hit you dead center, so to speak, like it hit me. I dunno, people are weird.
RIP Goldman.
posted by waxbanks at 5:55 AM on November 18, 2018 [1 favorite]
I haven't read anything by Goldman yet, but that will change soon.
We are having a Goldman movie memorial weekend. Last night, Butch and Sundance. Later today, The Princess Bride.
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posted by lhauser at 12:28 PM on November 18, 2018
We are having a Goldman movie memorial weekend. Last night, Butch and Sundance. Later today, The Princess Bride.
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posted by lhauser at 12:28 PM on November 18, 2018
"Mwarridge. Marriage is what brings us together today."Our wedding program included that as an epigram. Only about 20% of the guests got it.
I don't see it mentioned here yet, and sadly I can't seem to find it online, but years ago Goldman wrote a bit (in, I think, Esquire) about going to the dentist. There was small talk. As I recall, it went something like:
"What do you do?", asked the dentist.
"I'm a writer."
"What do you write?"
"Mostly screenplays."
"Anything I might have seen?"
Um.
posted by uberchet at 9:30 AM on November 19, 2018
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posted by Etrigan at 7:02 AM on November 16, 2018