Extremely Online, Extremely Anxious
October 4, 2022 11:11 AM Subscribe
Yep! Delete your social media and stop reading the 24/7 outrage news cycle and feel your mental health skyrocket over the next few weeks. If you can't do that, you should at least highly limit the time you spend consuming that stuff. There are plenty of ways to keep in touch with friends and communities that don't involve turning you into the failed result of a broken experiment on the viability of dopamine-driven data loops.
If you're not going to limit the time you spend ingesting data media, then please at least turn off push notifications and notification badges on your device for everything except the things that are undeniably and unmistakably important like phone calls from your mom. It's been said many times but in a few years we're going to think about the impact of push notifications on mental health the same way that we think about smoking in the 50s.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:27 AM on October 4, 2022 [10 favorites]
If you're not going to limit the time you spend ingesting data media, then please at least turn off push notifications and notification badges on your device for everything except the things that are undeniably and unmistakably important like phone calls from your mom. It's been said many times but in a few years we're going to think about the impact of push notifications on mental health the same way that we think about smoking in the 50s.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:27 AM on October 4, 2022 [10 favorites]
The information in the article on psychological effects is I suppose useful (though I think I've heard it plenty of times before), but it may ignore the fact that there is a generation that clearly already lives their lives online, period.
The last sentence really worries me: "We need guardrails for these digital products, especially for minors.”
Guardrails? This sounds like older people once again thinking we know what Gen Z should be doing, whether they like it or not. Clearly, we should just steer them all to Metafilter :)
posted by Flight Hardware, do not touch at 11:28 AM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
The last sentence really worries me: "We need guardrails for these digital products, especially for minors.”
Guardrails? This sounds like older people once again thinking we know what Gen Z should be doing, whether they like it or not. Clearly, we should just steer them all to Metafilter :)
posted by Flight Hardware, do not touch at 11:28 AM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
“When you post a picture, the only real data you get are people’s likes and comments. That’s not necessarily a true indication of what the world feels about your picture or your post,”Well, I know exactly what the world feels about my picture or post. The world doesn't give a shit. And that's fine by me. I'll post anyway.
posted by SansPoint at 11:35 AM on October 4, 2022 [16 favorites]
Well, I know exactly what the world feels about my picture or post. The world doesn't give a shit. And that's fine by me. I'll post anyway.
Basically my MetaFilter FPP policy.
posted by hippybear at 11:36 AM on October 4, 2022 [25 favorites]
Basically my MetaFilter FPP policy.
posted by hippybear at 11:36 AM on October 4, 2022 [25 favorites]
I'm curious what's worrying about the need for "guardrails for these digital products."
Social media companies are profiting off of people's attention, harvesting their behavioural habits to create revenue via ad and consumer profiles. I definitely don't trust Facebook or Tik Tok to know what's better for the brains of kids than, say, literally almost any parent (or non-parent!) in the world.
It's not an issue of young versus old, it's an issue of an almost entirely unregulated technology that has completely changed the way we live our lives that is now being introduced to kids and young people as an unchangeable and foundational part of the world. And these platforms and companies employ behavioural psychologists to work with UX designers to make sure that their products are as addictive as possible, because time spent on the platform equals money. This definitely isn't an issue like, "Dungeons & Dragons is Satanic!" where old people just fundamentally misunderstand something that young people spend their time doing.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:38 AM on October 4, 2022 [24 favorites]
Social media companies are profiting off of people's attention, harvesting their behavioural habits to create revenue via ad and consumer profiles. I definitely don't trust Facebook or Tik Tok to know what's better for the brains of kids than, say, literally almost any parent (or non-parent!) in the world.
It's not an issue of young versus old, it's an issue of an almost entirely unregulated technology that has completely changed the way we live our lives that is now being introduced to kids and young people as an unchangeable and foundational part of the world. And these platforms and companies employ behavioural psychologists to work with UX designers to make sure that their products are as addictive as possible, because time spent on the platform equals money. This definitely isn't an issue like, "Dungeons & Dragons is Satanic!" where old people just fundamentally misunderstand something that young people spend their time doing.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:38 AM on October 4, 2022 [24 favorites]
I’m suspicious when articles like this pop up just before elections.
This is the time to feel your outrage however painful it may be, and then go out and do something about it.
posted by jamjam at 11:39 AM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
This is the time to feel your outrage however painful it may be, and then go out and do something about it.
posted by jamjam at 11:39 AM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
I interpret "guardrails for the digital products" to mean the banning of attention seeking algorithms so everything goes back to being a timeline of people you follow and nothing else.
posted by hippybear at 11:40 AM on October 4, 2022 [10 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 11:40 AM on October 4, 2022 [10 favorites]
I'm curious what's worrying about the need for "guardrails for these digital products."
The tech industry hates being governed, and one of their favorite wells to go to is "free speech".
posted by NoxAeternum at 11:42 AM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
The tech industry hates being governed, and one of their favorite wells to go to is "free speech".
posted by NoxAeternum at 11:42 AM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
> The tech industry hates being governed, and one of their favorite wells to go to is "free speech".
Just because they hate being governed, does that mean we shouldn't try to govern them? I'm not sure I'm following the logic here.
> This is the time to feel your outrage however painful it may be, and then go out and do something about it.
I personally think it's problematic to conflate domestic political efficacy with the current state of social media platforms, because as we've seen who knows how many times in the last 6 or 7 years, they have absolutely no problem throwing their hands up and going "ohhh woahhh we didn't know people would use our tool to do that!" (see: Cambridge Analytica, the massacres in Myanmar, and so on, and so on, and so on). I think a group chat on Signal is just as effective as an organizing tool, and perhaps more so, because it requires that personal opt-in ("what's your number, want to join my group chat for tenant organizing in our neighbourhood?")
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:48 AM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
Just because they hate being governed, does that mean we shouldn't try to govern them? I'm not sure I'm following the logic here.
> This is the time to feel your outrage however painful it may be, and then go out and do something about it.
I personally think it's problematic to conflate domestic political efficacy with the current state of social media platforms, because as we've seen who knows how many times in the last 6 or 7 years, they have absolutely no problem throwing their hands up and going "ohhh woahhh we didn't know people would use our tool to do that!" (see: Cambridge Analytica, the massacres in Myanmar, and so on, and so on, and so on). I think a group chat on Signal is just as effective as an organizing tool, and perhaps more so, because it requires that personal opt-in ("what's your number, want to join my group chat for tenant organizing in our neighbourhood?")
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 11:48 AM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
I've been quoting this so much that I feel like I should be paying royalties.
A deer in the forest has senses that let it monitor its environment out to a certain diameter. For the sake of the analogy let's say it's 250 meters, give or take depending on various factors (e.g. weather). That is all the deer needs. If a predator is further away then it doesn't really concern the deer. Now let's say we electronically augmented the deer's senses so that it could monitor the forest up to a kilometer around it. It would be aware of a lot more predators but that wouldn't actually be of any use to it because a predator further away than its unaugmented senses could detect shouldn't be of any concern. The only result of augmenting the deer's senses would be to stress the animal out, negatively impacting it. Almost every human being on the planet has senses that have been electronically augmented, through mass media and the internet and so on, resulting in the stresses of modern existence.posted by Mayor West at 11:51 AM on October 4, 2022 [88 favorites]
I interpret "guardrails for the digital products" to mean the banning of attention seeking algorithms so everything goes back to being a timeline of people you follow and nothing else.
Ha ha, joke's on me, my carefully curated non-algorithmic Twitter timeline is perfectly capable of absorbing too much of my attention. People have been terminally online since before "algorithms." I was burning by eyes out playing janky MUDs when I was 12. Sure, algo-feeds don't help, but I am abundantly capable of losing myself online all on my own.
posted by BungaDunga at 11:52 AM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
Ha ha, joke's on me, my carefully curated non-algorithmic Twitter timeline is perfectly capable of absorbing too much of my attention. People have been terminally online since before "algorithms." I was burning by eyes out playing janky MUDs when I was 12. Sure, algo-feeds don't help, but I am abundantly capable of losing myself online all on my own.
posted by BungaDunga at 11:52 AM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
Cpt. The Mango: I strongly suspect the anxiety and stress that people get from social media isn't as much a function of the algorithms and data mining (though that is absolutely a factor, and I try really hard to avoid obvious outrage bait on Twitter, et. al.) and more of the eyes of the people they know are following them: their peers and acquaintances. Now, there's always a risk of something going viral, and that's new, but your average teenager and 20-something on Instagram and TikTok is mostly going to have their posts seen by people they know, either directly or indirectly.
Frankly, I think the reason a lot of teenagers and 20-somethings are anxious and depressed has less to do with social media as a medium and more to do with *gestures wildly at the state of the goddamned real world over the past twenty years*. That state of the world gets filtered into bite-size doom nuggets on the timelines, outrage bait, and other nasty shit but that is a symptom of a larger problem, not its cause.
Now, none of this is to say the social media companies are without fault or blame here, but I'm less inclined to blame them for causing an epidemic of anxiety and more for creating an environment of uncontrolled conflict and abuse and prioritizing "engagement" above all other metrics including an enjoyable experience for people who aren't on there trying to antagonize other people.
posted by SansPoint at 11:54 AM on October 4, 2022 [16 favorites]
Frankly, I think the reason a lot of teenagers and 20-somethings are anxious and depressed has less to do with social media as a medium and more to do with *gestures wildly at the state of the goddamned real world over the past twenty years*. That state of the world gets filtered into bite-size doom nuggets on the timelines, outrage bait, and other nasty shit but that is a symptom of a larger problem, not its cause.
Now, none of this is to say the social media companies are without fault or blame here, but I'm less inclined to blame them for causing an epidemic of anxiety and more for creating an environment of uncontrolled conflict and abuse and prioritizing "engagement" above all other metrics including an enjoyable experience for people who aren't on there trying to antagonize other people.
posted by SansPoint at 11:54 AM on October 4, 2022 [16 favorites]
That’s a hypothesis, SansPoint, and testable by comparing the well-being of current teenagers who are more or less online.
posted by clew at 11:56 AM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by clew at 11:56 AM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
I think the era of social media actually being social/personal is slowly fading. In the beginning, we had Facebook friend requests, which were symmetrical - friends had to follow each other. Then Instagram and Twitter allowed asymmetrical relationships, where you followed someone but they didn't have to follow you. And TikTok just uses "the algorithm" to decide who/what you want to see. It's all degrading into entertainment, not connections.
posted by meowzilla at 12:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [7 favorites]
posted by meowzilla at 12:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [7 favorites]
Just because they hate being governed, does that mean we shouldn't try to govern them? I'm not sure I'm following the logic here.
My point is that the source of the "worry" here stems from tech hating to be governed. I absolutely think that they should.
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:08 PM on October 4, 2022 [5 favorites]
My point is that the source of the "worry" here stems from tech hating to be governed. I absolutely think that they should.
posted by NoxAeternum at 12:08 PM on October 4, 2022 [5 favorites]
Agreed, SansPoint. Social media definitely isn't uniquely responsible for all of the awfulness of the world! Just... a lot of it haha.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 12:11 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 12:11 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I distinctly remember the early days of the Net when people could hide behind anonymity and say the most vilest things. I genuinely thought that tying your real world identity to your online personae would make people nicer to each other online. I thought it would reinforce the social aspect of social media because your words could be tied back to you.
Oyyyy. I was so naive.
posted by zooropa at 12:20 PM on October 4, 2022 [9 favorites]
Oyyyy. I was so naive.
posted by zooropa at 12:20 PM on October 4, 2022 [9 favorites]
MetaFilter is my social media, so if I'm anxious or depressed ima just gonna blame all you guys.
posted by fimbulvetr at 12:24 PM on October 4, 2022 [21 favorites]
posted by fimbulvetr at 12:24 PM on October 4, 2022 [21 favorites]
This seems relevant to this thread's interest.
posted by jenfullmoon at 1:02 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
posted by jenfullmoon at 1:02 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
Thank you, Mayor West, I have been trying to track down that quote (paraphrase?) for the better part of a decade now.
posted by rustybullrake at 1:15 PM on October 4, 2022
posted by rustybullrake at 1:15 PM on October 4, 2022
Delete your social media
I stopped using FB a while ago now, and never really got into Instagram at all and the result is that I basically no longer exist socially — and apparently may be deemed a presumptively uninteresting or even unsafe person to date were I want to give that I shot again (out of caution I can understand, but yikes).
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:49 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
I stopped using FB a while ago now, and never really got into Instagram at all and the result is that I basically no longer exist socially — and apparently may be deemed a presumptively uninteresting or even unsafe person to date were I want to give that I shot again (out of caution I can understand, but yikes).
posted by snuffleupagus at 1:49 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
“When you post a picture, the only real data you get are people’s likes and comments. That’s not necessarily a true indication of what the world feels about your picture or your post,”
As opposed to what? When you leave your house, the only real data you get are people's reactions as well. What is this 'real data' anyway? Like, most people have more exposure to public scrutiny at a mall than they do with their 74 Instagram followers.
And statistically speaking, it is an incontrovertible fact that what the 'world' thinks of anything you do is... they don't. A smidgen of a percentage even know you exist at all, let alone have an opinion on your
lunch-time selfie. Even the most famous among us does not have an 8 billion person reach.
posted by ananci at 2:05 PM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
As opposed to what? When you leave your house, the only real data you get are people's reactions as well. What is this 'real data' anyway? Like, most people have more exposure to public scrutiny at a mall than they do with their 74 Instagram followers.
And statistically speaking, it is an incontrovertible fact that what the 'world' thinks of anything you do is... they don't. A smidgen of a percentage even know you exist at all, let alone have an opinion on your
lunch-time selfie. Even the most famous among us does not have an 8 billion person reach.
posted by ananci at 2:05 PM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
I uninstalled Instagram from my phone a few weeks ago. Now, none of my friends talk to me.
I hated only seeing pictures of my friends' lives. Now I see nothing.
Are there people out there who have irl social circles not mediated by work, school, or religion?
I miss summer camp. Wait, no I don't... I was ostracized in summer camp for having adhd and weird religious rules.
I guess... Society is difficult.
posted by rebent at 2:11 PM on October 4, 2022 [11 favorites]
I hated only seeing pictures of my friends' lives. Now I see nothing.
Are there people out there who have irl social circles not mediated by work, school, or religion?
I miss summer camp. Wait, no I don't... I was ostracized in summer camp for having adhd and weird religious rules.
I guess... Society is difficult.
posted by rebent at 2:11 PM on October 4, 2022 [11 favorites]
Delete your social media and stop reading the 24/7 outrage news cycle and feel your mental health skyrocket over the next few weeks.
I haven't exactly done this, but I almost never check Twitter and use a browser plugin that hides my Facebook timeline. I only go to Facebook for a few groups I'm in, and even that is very rare.
I do have Instagram and spend probably too much time on it, but I'm mostly scrolling other people's reels and have managed to train the algorithm relatively well, such that it mostly just feeds me dumb jokes and very little outrage or political content. I don't actually post much any more, and most of what I *do* post is just re-shares of other people's content.
Despite all those caveats, my mental health vastly improved after getting off the outrage machine (which was hard -- all those pings and rage hits really get the dopamine firing, especially as someone with ADHD -- but not nearly as hard as I thought it might be).
posted by asnider at 2:21 PM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
I haven't exactly done this, but I almost never check Twitter and use a browser plugin that hides my Facebook timeline. I only go to Facebook for a few groups I'm in, and even that is very rare.
I do have Instagram and spend probably too much time on it, but I'm mostly scrolling other people's reels and have managed to train the algorithm relatively well, such that it mostly just feeds me dumb jokes and very little outrage or political content. I don't actually post much any more, and most of what I *do* post is just re-shares of other people's content.
Despite all those caveats, my mental health vastly improved after getting off the outrage machine (which was hard -- all those pings and rage hits really get the dopamine firing, especially as someone with ADHD -- but not nearly as hard as I thought it might be).
posted by asnider at 2:21 PM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
That Yann Martel / augmented deer quote is from 2010 or before and about the pernicious effects of ... television.
posted by chavenet at 2:40 PM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
posted by chavenet at 2:40 PM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
Once you get the antler rack working as an antenna, television deer are pretty easy.
posted by hippybear at 2:44 PM on October 4, 2022 [11 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 2:44 PM on October 4, 2022 [11 favorites]
>Are there people out there who have irl social circles not mediated by work, school, or religion?
Absolutely, my social life is mediated by none of these things. On the other hand, my partner's social life is mediated by a combination of the first two.
>Now, none of my friends talk to me.
Talk to them! They're friends with you, not your Instagram profile.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 2:44 PM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
Absolutely, my social life is mediated by none of these things. On the other hand, my partner's social life is mediated by a combination of the first two.
>Now, none of my friends talk to me.
Talk to them! They're friends with you, not your Instagram profile.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 2:44 PM on October 4, 2022 [4 favorites]
Coordinating a time to talk to a friend on the phone or discord or whatever (or share a meal if they're local) is one of the best things you can do for your brain. The biggest barrier is often just overcoming inertia.
I think there's another side to twitter and its ilk beyond social interaction, though. It's that it can be easily used to fill the numerous small gaps in your day. You can't call a friend and have a conversation during the thirty seconds you're waiting in line at the Wallgreen's. For me, that's the hard part to disconnect from. And it's bad for me! It's trained my brain to fill in all of the gaps, and I'm suffering from the lack of random moments of introspection and memory. So I'm trying to teach myself to be bored again. It's not easy, or fun, but once in a while I just leave my phone somewhere, and I feel so much better until I find it again.
posted by phooky at 3:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
I think there's another side to twitter and its ilk beyond social interaction, though. It's that it can be easily used to fill the numerous small gaps in your day. You can't call a friend and have a conversation during the thirty seconds you're waiting in line at the Wallgreen's. For me, that's the hard part to disconnect from. And it's bad for me! It's trained my brain to fill in all of the gaps, and I'm suffering from the lack of random moments of introspection and memory. So I'm trying to teach myself to be bored again. It's not easy, or fun, but once in a while I just leave my phone somewhere, and I feel so much better until I find it again.
posted by phooky at 3:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [6 favorites]
I am victim to the algorithms. A total addict, bouncing between FB, TikTok, and Reddit, it feels shameful to admit that I can literally spend hours a day doing this. Is it the ADHD that makes me uniquely vulnerable? A lack of willpower or persistence or passion for other areas of my life?
I'm trying a "no scroll October", limited to those three apps. In a moment of craving and weakness I let myself scroll Metafilter and came upon this post, grateful for the reinforcement.
posted by EarnestDeer at 3:09 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I'm trying a "no scroll October", limited to those three apps. In a moment of craving and weakness I let myself scroll Metafilter and came upon this post, grateful for the reinforcement.
posted by EarnestDeer at 3:09 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
So I'm trying to teach myself to be bored again.
boredom is fascinating.. CBC Ideas episode: The Tedium is the Message
posted by elkevelvet at 3:12 PM on October 4, 2022 [5 favorites]
boredom is fascinating.. CBC Ideas episode: The Tedium is the Message
posted by elkevelvet at 3:12 PM on October 4, 2022 [5 favorites]
Anyone who's interested in reading more about how to learn how to be bored again should check out How To Do Nothing by Jenny Odell, which I'm sure has been covered here before! EarnestDeer, that book definitely helps me to get a handle on my doomscrolling. I'm a lot better than before but I can also literally spend an entire work day checking between 4-5 different social media platforms without ever feeling like I've completed the task and I hate, hate, hate, hate it. But it's so freaking hard to stop! I've never been diagnosed with ADHD although it does run in the family and I know I'm capable of supreme focus when I want to be, or need to be, but I still wish my such a large portion of my life didn't revolve around mimicking a rat in an addictive behaviour study.
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 3:12 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by Cpt. The Mango at 3:12 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
Is it the ADHD that makes me uniquely vulnerable?
Yes, at least in part. Fucking Instagram Reels (and probably Tik Tok, but I don't use it) are basically designed to trap ADHDers for hours. I literally sat on the couch for a good 40 minutes after my wife went to bed last night, before snapping myself out of it and realizing I wasn't actually even entertaining myself...I was just scrolling Reels, when I had actually intended to watch something more deliberate.
posted by asnider at 3:15 PM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
Yes, at least in part. Fucking Instagram Reels (and probably Tik Tok, but I don't use it) are basically designed to trap ADHDers for hours. I literally sat on the couch for a good 40 minutes after my wife went to bed last night, before snapping myself out of it and realizing I wasn't actually even entertaining myself...I was just scrolling Reels, when I had actually intended to watch something more deliberate.
posted by asnider at 3:15 PM on October 4, 2022 [3 favorites]
I remember articles in the 60s about how to have hair (makeup?) so that your face wouldn't be to square or something. I think it was supposed to be oval.
My point is that the pull toward inhuman perfection was already there in the culture, and social media has simply amplified it.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 3:21 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
My point is that the pull toward inhuman perfection was already there in the culture, and social media has simply amplified it.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 3:21 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
hippybear: "I feel like I've read this article 4000 times. "
I feel like part of the cost of living your life online is reading articles about the cost of living your life online 4000 times.
posted by signal at 4:33 PM on October 4, 2022 [13 favorites]
I feel like part of the cost of living your life online is reading articles about the cost of living your life online 4000 times.
posted by signal at 4:33 PM on October 4, 2022 [13 favorites]
I had a real problem being bored before the internet. Maybe it's because I'm, let's say neurodiverse, but I don't know if cultivating an ability to be bored would be helpful.
I think there's significant harm in the way that social media optimises for engagement, but I've also come to the conclusion that a lot of maladaptive behaviour on Twitter is caused by the standard follow feed. I think basically anywhere where people feel like they have an audience rather than just people they know, they'll feel encouraged to "raise awareness" by posting about one of any number of tragedies currently taking place, which is of course bad, but I'm not really in a position to do anything about them. If your feed is entirely what your friends are seeing, you're going to get moments where everyone is talking about something that you may not have seen, and that means you have to seek it out too, and then you chip in to be included, and then it spreads further, and then you have Twitter's main character for the day.
posted by Merus at 4:34 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I think there's significant harm in the way that social media optimises for engagement, but I've also come to the conclusion that a lot of maladaptive behaviour on Twitter is caused by the standard follow feed. I think basically anywhere where people feel like they have an audience rather than just people they know, they'll feel encouraged to "raise awareness" by posting about one of any number of tragedies currently taking place, which is of course bad, but I'm not really in a position to do anything about them. If your feed is entirely what your friends are seeing, you're going to get moments where everyone is talking about something that you may not have seen, and that means you have to seek it out too, and then you chip in to be included, and then it spreads further, and then you have Twitter's main character for the day.
posted by Merus at 4:34 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I had a real problem being bored before the internet.
When you're a dog, no one knows you're bored.
posted by chavenet at 5:42 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
When you're a dog, no one knows you're bored.
posted by chavenet at 5:42 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I would like to point out that Wikipedia editors don't get points or upvotes or followers or any easily-seen credit for their contributions, and Wikipedia is one of the few websites that isn't a giant pile of garbage.
Social media websites want to be garbage, because that's what gets "engagement" and ad revenue.
posted by AlSweigart at 9:40 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
Social media websites want to be garbage, because that's what gets "engagement" and ad revenue.
posted by AlSweigart at 9:40 PM on October 4, 2022 [1 favorite]
You know, I avoided non-Mefi social media for a long time, but I joined Twitter this year and I have to say it's super fun? Nobody I know IRL knows who I am on there; I mostly just follow interesting people and make jokes and shitpost. If someone posts things that stress me out I unfollow them. If I get too many followers (or if someone figures out who I am) I'll delete my account and make a new one; I'm not trying to build a brand, just goofing around. I don't have the app, just use my browser, so my phone doesn't notify me about things happening on Twitter.
I completely understand that if you had to engage on social media for your job, or if you were trying to use the same account to communicate with friends, family, and work colleagues, it would be stressful. But I am having a jolly damn time on Twitter as an anonymous dumbass. I am much less informed about the news than I used to be but I somehow manage to avoid taking whatever controversies blow up on Twitter seriously at ALL. It's been great for my mental health. I really hope stupid Elon doesn't let Trump back on, it'll ruin everything.
posted by potrzebie at 11:02 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
I completely understand that if you had to engage on social media for your job, or if you were trying to use the same account to communicate with friends, family, and work colleagues, it would be stressful. But I am having a jolly damn time on Twitter as an anonymous dumbass. I am much less informed about the news than I used to be but I somehow manage to avoid taking whatever controversies blow up on Twitter seriously at ALL. It's been great for my mental health. I really hope stupid Elon doesn't let Trump back on, it'll ruin everything.
posted by potrzebie at 11:02 PM on October 4, 2022 [2 favorites]
We really do have to come up with a set of healthy engagement habits outside of forswearing everything like a religious hermit. I credit a lot of the positives in my worldview because of my interaction with social media and the internet at large. And as nostalgic as i am about pre-web 2.0 internet i can't escape the fact that my online socialization then was intensely anglo-western if not just white. There are niches that's much easier to find now and i have learned so much.
But it's also true that the transition happened as I'm already an adult and crucially imo i learned computing in the 80s and picked up norms from earlier generations. I also grew up when it was necessary to learn the backend of a software or at least to not just be dependent on GUI. Nowadays apparently even learning how to file is a lost art. the point of that link is just to highlight how little acculturation we've actually provided to the young, under the assumption they're 'digital natives' or some nonsense. They're not. They are used to digital devices though.
But regardless the age of the person, my position is that there are absolutely healthy ways to live online and if you can get it going early enough you don't have to take the cold turkey option. But those ways will absolutely also counter much of what the tech companies would want us to engage (which to me is a good thing). So much is also in concert with your larger culture and customary norms i think.
So, some thoughts:
- Like, why the anxiety of having to reply to anything immediately? I like the idea of treating messaging apps as actual telegrams and calling cards: "hey, get this, something happened to me blablabla". Maybe it's because i liked reading epistolary fiction and just the idea of people leaving notes around to be charming. In any case, cultivating a time-lag might be helpful.
- why can't newsy content be treated like the evening news? Don't uninstall Twitter but check in only a couple of times. Use an alarm if needed.
- i genuinely wonder if the angst about being viewed is one's ego in action. This is of course bad if left unaddressed. But also there are more aspiring autobiographers and writers out there than they like to admit. And when you're in that mould of course you're performing. The question is, to what extent should you be aware of the audience and how much is the whole thing is your desire to creatively describe your life? There's no one solution to this, but people have got to be honest with themselves about this, even if one possible friction is the objective reality that you're "nobody". The angst about screens is connected to this. Maybe it would be more helpful to find parallels in artists' interviews and profiles and similar material.
- so, relating to guardrails around minors - i have no real interest in policing their pattern of consumption. That usually descends quickly into policing minorities and queer identities living their lives. What I want to take from TFA is establishing norms around their pattern of presentation. I think adults should habituate kids around the phone camera less. We all know toddlers who know how to pose already. That cultivation of their own panopticon to me is the thing we as grownups can do for them and for us.
- anyway for this article specifically i don't think the tangent is on cultivating the endurance for tedium (hence the doomscrolling etc). It's really about the ability to cultivate your own self-identity. And yeah, more people need to learn to be able to sit with themselves. In this, even bookworms are just as bad at this than someone watching the latest hot take about a marvel movie.
posted by cendawanita at 11:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [8 favorites]
But it's also true that the transition happened as I'm already an adult and crucially imo i learned computing in the 80s and picked up norms from earlier generations. I also grew up when it was necessary to learn the backend of a software or at least to not just be dependent on GUI. Nowadays apparently even learning how to file is a lost art. the point of that link is just to highlight how little acculturation we've actually provided to the young, under the assumption they're 'digital natives' or some nonsense. They're not. They are used to digital devices though.
But regardless the age of the person, my position is that there are absolutely healthy ways to live online and if you can get it going early enough you don't have to take the cold turkey option. But those ways will absolutely also counter much of what the tech companies would want us to engage (which to me is a good thing). So much is also in concert with your larger culture and customary norms i think.
So, some thoughts:
- Like, why the anxiety of having to reply to anything immediately? I like the idea of treating messaging apps as actual telegrams and calling cards: "hey, get this, something happened to me blablabla". Maybe it's because i liked reading epistolary fiction and just the idea of people leaving notes around to be charming. In any case, cultivating a time-lag might be helpful.
- why can't newsy content be treated like the evening news? Don't uninstall Twitter but check in only a couple of times. Use an alarm if needed.
- i genuinely wonder if the angst about being viewed is one's ego in action. This is of course bad if left unaddressed. But also there are more aspiring autobiographers and writers out there than they like to admit. And when you're in that mould of course you're performing. The question is, to what extent should you be aware of the audience and how much is the whole thing is your desire to creatively describe your life? There's no one solution to this, but people have got to be honest with themselves about this, even if one possible friction is the objective reality that you're "nobody". The angst about screens is connected to this. Maybe it would be more helpful to find parallels in artists' interviews and profiles and similar material.
- so, relating to guardrails around minors - i have no real interest in policing their pattern of consumption. That usually descends quickly into policing minorities and queer identities living their lives. What I want to take from TFA is establishing norms around their pattern of presentation. I think adults should habituate kids around the phone camera less. We all know toddlers who know how to pose already. That cultivation of their own panopticon to me is the thing we as grownups can do for them and for us.
- anyway for this article specifically i don't think the tangent is on cultivating the endurance for tedium (hence the doomscrolling etc). It's really about the ability to cultivate your own self-identity. And yeah, more people need to learn to be able to sit with themselves. In this, even bookworms are just as bad at this than someone watching the latest hot take about a marvel movie.
posted by cendawanita at 11:07 PM on October 4, 2022 [8 favorites]
The only result of augmenting the deer's senses would be to stress the animal out, negatively impacting it. Almost every human being on the planet has senses that have been electronically augmented, through mass media and the internet and so on, resulting in the stresses of modern existence.
Thing is, we're not deer, and we can understand that we can sense things that don't need to concern us. The deer is panicking because it thinks it needs to run away from every predator it can sense - that's what's kept it alive. We can 'sense threats' and at the same time understand that they are too far away to matter.
posted by Dysk at 2:19 AM on October 5, 2022 [4 favorites]
Thing is, we're not deer, and we can understand that we can sense things that don't need to concern us. The deer is panicking because it thinks it needs to run away from every predator it can sense - that's what's kept it alive. We can 'sense threats' and at the same time understand that they are too far away to matter.
posted by Dysk at 2:19 AM on October 5, 2022 [4 favorites]
I had a real problem being bored before the internet. Maybe it's because I'm, let's say neurodiverse, but I don't know if cultivating an ability to be bored would be helpful.
Hard same - boredom was always a crushing torture. It's not good for me. It's also not the same as quiet moments for introspection, because those are not boring. They are interesting, and I will make sure to take time to do that. It seems bizarre to conflate the two things - all of yous who want to cultivate boredom or whatever, can you really not find it within yourself to take time to think without starving yourself of all other sources of engagement?
posted by Dysk at 2:24 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
Hard same - boredom was always a crushing torture. It's not good for me. It's also not the same as quiet moments for introspection, because those are not boring. They are interesting, and I will make sure to take time to do that. It seems bizarre to conflate the two things - all of yous who want to cultivate boredom or whatever, can you really not find it within yourself to take time to think without starving yourself of all other sources of engagement?
posted by Dysk at 2:24 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I'm dubious about adults having complete control of their children's access to the net. Not just dubious about whether it's feasible, but dubious whether it's a net win. There will be kids kept away from being pushed towards harming themselves and others, and other kids pushed away from legitimate knowledge and support.
I believe children and teenagers are marginalized, though maybe not a marginalized community. One example is how long it's taken to make progress on later start times for high schools.
I don't know how much can be done to raise children to have some sense about what's hurting them and what's good for them, and a feeling of having a right to make choices, but that's a direction I want to see. Yes, I'm not a parent.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 4:01 AM on October 5, 2022 [4 favorites]
I believe children and teenagers are marginalized, though maybe not a marginalized community. One example is how long it's taken to make progress on later start times for high schools.
I don't know how much can be done to raise children to have some sense about what's hurting them and what's good for them, and a feeling of having a right to make choices, but that's a direction I want to see. Yes, I'm not a parent.
posted by Nancy Lebovitz at 4:01 AM on October 5, 2022 [4 favorites]
For many of us, sensing threats is incredibly detrimental.
Now science has stepped forward with an explanation. The human brain thrives on novelty and is driven to constantly seek it. When novelty is available in effectively unlimited quantity, the brain becomes overworked as it tries to process this information while driving itself on to search for more. This leads to increased levels of the stress hormone cortisol, which can lead to confusion, memory loss and a state of restlessness.
posted by tiny frying pan at 5:11 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
Now science has stepped forward with an explanation. The human brain thrives on novelty and is driven to constantly seek it. When novelty is available in effectively unlimited quantity, the brain becomes overworked as it tries to process this information while driving itself on to search for more. This leads to increased levels of the stress hormone cortisol, which can lead to confusion, memory loss and a state of restlessness.
posted by tiny frying pan at 5:11 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
"Now science has stepped forward with an explanation....When novelty is available in effectively unlimited quantity, the brain becomes overworked as it tries to process this information while driving itself on to search for more...which can lead to confusion, memory loss and a state of restlessness."
"[Forbes Contributor] Bernard Marr is an internationally best-selling author, popular keynote speaker, futurist, and a strategic business & technology advisor to governments and companies. He helps organisations improve their business performance, use data more intelligently, and understand the implications of new technologies such as artificial intelligence, big data, blockchains, and the Internet of Things. Why don’t you connect with Bernard on Twitter (@bernardmarr), LinkedIn (https://uk.linkedin.com/in/bernardmarr) or instagram (bernard.marr)/ ?"
💩
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:59 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
"[Forbes Contributor] Bernard Marr is an internationally best-selling author, popular keynote speaker, futurist, and a strategic business & technology advisor to governments and companies. He helps organisations improve their business performance, use data more intelligently, and understand the implications of new technologies such as artificial intelligence, big data, blockchains, and the Internet of Things. Why don’t you connect with Bernard on Twitter (@bernardmarr), LinkedIn (https://uk.linkedin.com/in/bernardmarr) or instagram (bernard.marr)/ ?"
💩
posted by snuffleupagus at 6:59 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
I spent a couple of years working for Facebook, so I'll just drop in a few tidbits here:
I keep a Facebook account. I don't use it basically ever, but I keep it, because if you don't have Facebook, the algorithms create a shadow profile of you to attach connections to and gather data on. If you have an account, you can use what data controls they give you to limit data use. If you don't, they still attach that data, but you have no levers on it. However, the measure Facebook uses internally is daily or monthly active users. If you're never on, you don't count towards their "how are we doing?" numbers.
I do not believe that advertising funded social media can be anything but pernicious. At one point someone inside FB, for nostalgia, put up the oldest version of the FB site that they could for internal users. It was pre-newsfeed. You had to click through each of your friends to see their updates. *Everyone* commented how much better this was. Similarly, everyone commented on how crappy Facebook's comments system and newsfeed system are for actually having a discussion. But everything in FB has to be equivalent to an ad in newsfeed. It has to look roughly the same. It has to have roughly the same lifecycle with your attention. Otherwise advertising metrics drop and the experiment is rolled back.
The other reason it cannot be anything but pernicious is scale vs moderation. Ad revenue is small. It's like $12 per person per year. An ad funded site has to grow as large as possible with as much flowing content as possible. Conversely, every healthy community online I have ever encountered has had active, engaged, local moderation. The economics don't work out to ever have adequate moderation in an ad funded social media site.
On a non-FB note, I've been gathering material for what a socially useful social media would look like for years. What would a tool for mass collaboration actually look like? It would encourage working in batches, its newsfeed would show things to you based on whether you have previously engaged and are likely to want to engage again, how much stuff you have going, and whether you are likely to want to be involved (or, for expertise, need to be involved) with a discussion. There are all the interesting experiments like Polis for establishing direction from masses of people, Panelot for producing representative subsets to work through something, Condorcet ranking and lots of similar tools for group decision making... There's no reason we can't build something excellent.
Another thing I've been playing with is kind of the opposite of a social media tool. I have a list of people that I want to keep in touch with. I set a target interval between checking in with each of them. I write a program that brings up who to schedule a teatime with, and lets me track that I have scheduled it, that it has happened, and have that person's entry go back into the queue to be resurfaced after the interval again. The goal here is to produce engagement between people proportional to how much you value time spent with them as opposed to how much they post or can elicit responses.
posted by madhadron at 9:16 AM on October 5, 2022 [11 favorites]
I keep a Facebook account. I don't use it basically ever, but I keep it, because if you don't have Facebook, the algorithms create a shadow profile of you to attach connections to and gather data on. If you have an account, you can use what data controls they give you to limit data use. If you don't, they still attach that data, but you have no levers on it. However, the measure Facebook uses internally is daily or monthly active users. If you're never on, you don't count towards their "how are we doing?" numbers.
I do not believe that advertising funded social media can be anything but pernicious. At one point someone inside FB, for nostalgia, put up the oldest version of the FB site that they could for internal users. It was pre-newsfeed. You had to click through each of your friends to see their updates. *Everyone* commented how much better this was. Similarly, everyone commented on how crappy Facebook's comments system and newsfeed system are for actually having a discussion. But everything in FB has to be equivalent to an ad in newsfeed. It has to look roughly the same. It has to have roughly the same lifecycle with your attention. Otherwise advertising metrics drop and the experiment is rolled back.
The other reason it cannot be anything but pernicious is scale vs moderation. Ad revenue is small. It's like $12 per person per year. An ad funded site has to grow as large as possible with as much flowing content as possible. Conversely, every healthy community online I have ever encountered has had active, engaged, local moderation. The economics don't work out to ever have adequate moderation in an ad funded social media site.
On a non-FB note, I've been gathering material for what a socially useful social media would look like for years. What would a tool for mass collaboration actually look like? It would encourage working in batches, its newsfeed would show things to you based on whether you have previously engaged and are likely to want to engage again, how much stuff you have going, and whether you are likely to want to be involved (or, for expertise, need to be involved) with a discussion. There are all the interesting experiments like Polis for establishing direction from masses of people, Panelot for producing representative subsets to work through something, Condorcet ranking and lots of similar tools for group decision making... There's no reason we can't build something excellent.
Another thing I've been playing with is kind of the opposite of a social media tool. I have a list of people that I want to keep in touch with. I set a target interval between checking in with each of them. I write a program that brings up who to schedule a teatime with, and lets me track that I have scheduled it, that it has happened, and have that person's entry go back into the queue to be resurfaced after the interval again. The goal here is to produce engagement between people proportional to how much you value time spent with them as opposed to how much they post or can elicit responses.
posted by madhadron at 9:16 AM on October 5, 2022 [11 favorites]
I would like to point out that Wikipedia editors don't get points or upvotes or followers or any easily-seen credit for their contributions, and Wikipedia is one of the few websites that isn't a giant pile of garbage.
Wikipedia is a website that was notoriously rolled by Gamergate, continues to have endemic issues with all sorts of bigotry in its editorial voice, and has shown itself incapable of dealing with evidence that there are editorial groups are comfortable with fascist apologia.
In short, I'm going to have to call [citation needed] on your claim that it's not a giant pile of garbage.
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:43 AM on October 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
Wikipedia is a website that was notoriously rolled by Gamergate, continues to have endemic issues with all sorts of bigotry in its editorial voice, and has shown itself incapable of dealing with evidence that there are editorial groups are comfortable with fascist apologia.
In short, I'm going to have to call [citation needed] on your claim that it's not a giant pile of garbage.
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:43 AM on October 5, 2022 [5 favorites]
can you really not find it within yourself to take time to think without starving yourself of all other sources of engagement?
I mean, all of yous who say you want colorblindness correcting glasses, can you really not find it within yourself to just see red and green like I can?
"Brains are different and other peoples' don't work like yours" is like a core tenet of this site.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:47 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
I mean, all of yous who say you want colorblindness correcting glasses, can you really not find it within yourself to just see red and green like I can?
"Brains are different and other peoples' don't work like yours" is like a core tenet of this site.
posted by We put our faith in Blast Hardcheese at 9:47 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
Are there people out there who have irl social circles not mediated by work, school, or religion?
Yes.
Re the deer metaphor, it's a fun analogy but shouldn't remotely be confused with how deer actually work.
posted by aspersioncast at 10:39 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
Yes.
Re the deer metaphor, it's a fun analogy but shouldn't remotely be confused with how deer actually work.
posted by aspersioncast at 10:39 AM on October 5, 2022 [3 favorites]
I recently set my phone to only allow me 20 minutes of instagram each day, after I got annoyed at their new push towards reels and things. It's been great! The most striking thing about it is that when I hit the limit and it's shut off for the day, I never feel like "oh man, I was enjoying that!"
posted by Ragged Richard at 10:54 AM on October 5, 2022
posted by Ragged Richard at 10:54 AM on October 5, 2022
I will say that nothing improved my experience of Twitter like using an unofficial client (Fritter) that, crucially, doesn't support posting. Can't get into pointless, angry arguments with people who are Wrong On The Internet if I can't actually tweet. Vastly less stressful to be physically prevented from tossing off an angry response to something and accidentally getting into a shouting match.
My Facebook feed has become a ghost town over the last year. It seems like a huge number of my peers have just... quit, or stopped posting. I enjoyed being able to passively check in on people who I knew from college, or high school- there was something comforting to know that they are still out there having lives even if I don't have any particular reason to be properly in touch with them. I think Facebook-the-product is probably doomed in the medium term, Meta might keep stumbling on indefinitely.
posted by BungaDunga at 10:57 AM on October 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
My Facebook feed has become a ghost town over the last year. It seems like a huge number of my peers have just... quit, or stopped posting. I enjoyed being able to passively check in on people who I knew from college, or high school- there was something comforting to know that they are still out there having lives even if I don't have any particular reason to be properly in touch with them. I think Facebook-the-product is probably doomed in the medium term, Meta might keep stumbling on indefinitely.
posted by BungaDunga at 10:57 AM on October 5, 2022 [2 favorites]
When we’re using social media, there are often a lot of strangers viewing our content, liking it, commenting on it, and sharing it with their own communities. Any time we post something online, thus exposing a part of who we are, we don’t fully know how we’re being received in the virtual world. Fallon Goodman, an assistant professor of psychology at George Washington University, says not knowing what kind of impression you’re making online can cause stress and anxiety.
“When you post a picture, the only real data you get are people’s likes and comments. That’s not necessarily a true indication of what the world feels about your picture or your post,” Goodman says. “Now you’ve put yourself out there—in a semi-permanent way—and you have limited information about how that was received, so you have limited information about the evaluations people are making about you.”
Some of us find that we get MORE information about how people feel about things online than in person. I only know people like my photo because someone clicked like. But if I had nowhere to post my photo it's not like anyone would be welcome to me shoving my phone in their face to make them look at it IRL. It's not like they'd honestly tell me they liked it even if they did like it.
I think it's interesting that the source of the stress is identified as the technology or the volume of information and not just...the way people act towards each other. People are really freaking mean to each other online. I really only feel stress when people interact with me, or I have to see some of the ridiculous & cruel kinds of things other people say to each other. The rest of the time it's fine.
posted by bleep at 11:59 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
“When you post a picture, the only real data you get are people’s likes and comments. That’s not necessarily a true indication of what the world feels about your picture or your post,” Goodman says. “Now you’ve put yourself out there—in a semi-permanent way—and you have limited information about how that was received, so you have limited information about the evaluations people are making about you.”
Some of us find that we get MORE information about how people feel about things online than in person. I only know people like my photo because someone clicked like. But if I had nowhere to post my photo it's not like anyone would be welcome to me shoving my phone in their face to make them look at it IRL. It's not like they'd honestly tell me they liked it even if they did like it.
I think it's interesting that the source of the stress is identified as the technology or the volume of information and not just...the way people act towards each other. People are really freaking mean to each other online. I really only feel stress when people interact with me, or I have to see some of the ridiculous & cruel kinds of things other people say to each other. The rest of the time it's fine.
posted by bleep at 11:59 AM on October 5, 2022 [1 favorite]
MeFi, yesterday: Not sure what we will do without Twitter.
MeFi, today: We'd all be better off without Twitter.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:11 PM on October 5, 2022
MeFi, today: We'd all be better off without Twitter.
posted by DirtyOldTown at 12:11 PM on October 5, 2022
I'm always slightly suspicious of people telling me to turn off my connection to a larger outside world that is responsible for connecting me to people who are some of my best friends and showing me a world that was larger than my tiny home town.
Like, yeah, I get the deer analogy, but what if the superDeer could hear or sense hunters coming in from miles away. What if they got schedule updates and maps of where state and national parks were so on day one of hunting season they could all be sitting on non-huntable public land and safe.
Yeah, we'd be overrun with deer in a few short years but it'd be better for the individual deer that die from unknowable threats.
Same goes for the internet and social media. I'd never have a community of people that care about me if I hadn't gone online and started talking about Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I wouldn't have learned that therapy would be a great help to me if it weren't for Ask and countless conversations on Twitter. I've learned tons and gained tons of joy from my online interactions that are no less real than my in person ones and while you do have to filter through the bullshit, I'm also happy to try it.
It doesn't have to be all or nothing. The people who get suckered in by an algorithm and janky Facebook posts would get suckered in by a snake oil salesman back in the day. Those methods work because people want to believe the easy solutions are true and they are special. The only way to deal with it is not to limit exposure but to teach critical thinking and analytical skills so people don't believe the first or the fifteenth diet pill ad but understand that a vaccine is good for you.
posted by teleri025 at 12:33 PM on October 5, 2022 [11 favorites]
Like, yeah, I get the deer analogy, but what if the superDeer could hear or sense hunters coming in from miles away. What if they got schedule updates and maps of where state and national parks were so on day one of hunting season they could all be sitting on non-huntable public land and safe.
Yeah, we'd be overrun with deer in a few short years but it'd be better for the individual deer that die from unknowable threats.
Same goes for the internet and social media. I'd never have a community of people that care about me if I hadn't gone online and started talking about Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I wouldn't have learned that therapy would be a great help to me if it weren't for Ask and countless conversations on Twitter. I've learned tons and gained tons of joy from my online interactions that are no less real than my in person ones and while you do have to filter through the bullshit, I'm also happy to try it.
It doesn't have to be all or nothing. The people who get suckered in by an algorithm and janky Facebook posts would get suckered in by a snake oil salesman back in the day. Those methods work because people want to believe the easy solutions are true and they are special. The only way to deal with it is not to limit exposure but to teach critical thinking and analytical skills so people don't believe the first or the fifteenth diet pill ad but understand that a vaccine is good for you.
posted by teleri025 at 12:33 PM on October 5, 2022 [11 favorites]
The only good thing I got from social media is reconnecting with my high school friends and also reminding me of the reason I fell out of touch with them in the first place.
I do use FB for buying and selling guitar pedals, so I guess two good things.
I'm currently in a limited-access SF&F writers group which is quite interesting, not sure if that counts as social media as it's not public.
posted by signal at 6:49 PM on October 5, 2022
I do use FB for buying and selling guitar pedals, so I guess two good things.
I'm currently in a limited-access SF&F writers group which is quite interesting, not sure if that counts as social media as it's not public.
posted by signal at 6:49 PM on October 5, 2022
Well, I know exactly what the world feels about my picture or post. The world doesn't give a shit. And that's fine by me. I'll post anyway.
That's okay -- I'll still keep drinking that garbage.
posted by grobstein at 8:11 PM on October 5, 2022
That's okay -- I'll still keep drinking that garbage.
posted by grobstein at 8:11 PM on October 5, 2022
The only way to deal with it is not to limit exposure but to teach critical thinking and analytical skills so people don't believe the first or the fifteenth diet pill ad but understand that a vaccine is good for you.
Well no, the answer is the same way we dealt with snake oil salesmen - regulation. The problem is that we've created a culture that views this sort of regulation as a greater evil than the existing system that is harming people (and in many cases either denies that harm occurs or engages in victim blaming.)
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:27 AM on October 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
Well no, the answer is the same way we dealt with snake oil salesmen - regulation. The problem is that we've created a culture that views this sort of regulation as a greater evil than the existing system that is harming people (and in many cases either denies that harm occurs or engages in victim blaming.)
posted by NoxAeternum at 9:27 AM on October 6, 2022 [1 favorite]
It's trained my brain to fill in all of the gaps
Instead of teaching myself to be bored, I have taught myself to do what I used to do before I had a smartphone: read a book. Except then it was a paperback in my knapsack and now it's an app on my phone.
posted by joannemerriam at 10:19 AM on October 6, 2022
Instead of teaching myself to be bored, I have taught myself to do what I used to do before I had a smartphone: read a book. Except then it was a paperback in my knapsack and now it's an app on my phone.
posted by joannemerriam at 10:19 AM on October 6, 2022
Actually the more I think about it I think the deer analogy is confusing deer with sentient radar.
posted by aspersioncast at 4:02 PM on October 6, 2022 [2 favorites]
posted by aspersioncast at 4:02 PM on October 6, 2022 [2 favorites]
Sentient radar, cursed to know every approaching danger but be unable to flee their approach.
posted by Dysk at 11:10 PM on October 6, 2022
posted by Dysk at 11:10 PM on October 6, 2022
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