"Hand on heart...
June 15, 2023 2:41 AM Subscribe
...I did not lie to the House."
All the evidence on which the Committee has relied, including that from Mr Johnson, has been given on oath, that is, with a signed statement of truth where the evidence is in writing. The Committee has disclosed to Mr Johnson all documents that have been submitted to the inquiry, without any redaction. Mr Johnson knows the identities of all witnesses. At his request and as part of a fair procedure, Mr Johnson was given notice of all the issues that arose from the evidence submitted to the Committee so that he might provide his own written evidence. Mr Johnson availed himself of the opportunity to give written evidence, and in addition gave oral evidence at a hearing on 22 March 2023. Mr Johnson was subsequently given the opportunity to provide further written evidence which he did on 22 May 2023. The provisional conclusions of the Committee were delivered to Mr Johnson on 8 June 2023 so that he could respond. There is no matter upon which the Committee has reported that Mr Johnson has not had the opportunity to answer or comment upon.
The full report is 30,000 words long, coverage is ongoing.
All the evidence on which the Committee has relied, including that from Mr Johnson, has been given on oath, that is, with a signed statement of truth where the evidence is in writing. The Committee has disclosed to Mr Johnson all documents that have been submitted to the inquiry, without any redaction. Mr Johnson knows the identities of all witnesses. At his request and as part of a fair procedure, Mr Johnson was given notice of all the issues that arose from the evidence submitted to the Committee so that he might provide his own written evidence. Mr Johnson availed himself of the opportunity to give written evidence, and in addition gave oral evidence at a hearing on 22 March 2023. Mr Johnson was subsequently given the opportunity to provide further written evidence which he did on 22 May 2023. The provisional conclusions of the Committee were delivered to Mr Johnson on 8 June 2023 so that he could respond. There is no matter upon which the Committee has reported that Mr Johnson has not had the opportunity to answer or comment upon.
The full report is 30,000 words long, coverage is ongoing.
Context for those of us who like that sort of thing to help us decide whether or not to click? Is this US federal or a particular state? Who is Mr. Johnson?
posted by eviemath at 3:26 AM on June 15, 2023 [19 favorites]
posted by eviemath at 3:26 AM on June 15, 2023 [19 favorites]
From the coverage link, this statement does my head in:
“I think the committee was right to get rid of Boris completely. He shouldn’t even be allowed in Parliament any more”, says market stall holder and Conservative voter Mario Sergiou.
“He’s been a mockery ever since lockdown, a joke. As nice a person as he is - he’s got a great character - he’s not an MP. He should stick to playing around outside Parliament.”
How on earth can someone say two completely contradictory statements like that? Boris' behaviour clearly shows he's not a "nice person".
posted by awfurby at 3:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
“I think the committee was right to get rid of Boris completely. He shouldn’t even be allowed in Parliament any more”, says market stall holder and Conservative voter Mario Sergiou.
“He’s been a mockery ever since lockdown, a joke. As nice a person as he is - he’s got a great character - he’s not an MP. He should stick to playing around outside Parliament.”
How on earth can someone say two completely contradictory statements like that? Boris' behaviour clearly shows he's not a "nice person".
posted by awfurby at 3:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
"Context for those of us who like that sort of thing to help us decide whether or not to click? Is this US federal or a particular state? Who is Mr. Johnson?"
It's the 51st state - UK.
posted by awfurby at 3:28 AM on June 15, 2023 [27 favorites]
It's the 51st state - UK.
posted by awfurby at 3:28 AM on June 15, 2023 [27 favorites]
Boris. Mr. Boris Johnson.
posted by Senescence at 3:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by Senescence at 3:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
Ah, that’s why I was wracking my brain futilely! I was thinking of the wrong country-that-I-don’t-live-in. Thanks!
posted by eviemath at 3:33 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by eviemath at 3:33 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
You have to check the tags to get the context. I had no idea either before I saw them.
posted by octothorpe at 3:53 AM on June 15, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by octothorpe at 3:53 AM on June 15, 2023 [6 favorites]
It's a free vote on Monday. It will be very interesting to see how many Tories back the committee. I can't quite tell from the commentary so far which way people are expecting most of them to go. It does look clear that even if only say 20% of Tory MPs back the report then it'll pass.
I think I'm expecting the proposed 90-day (nominal) suspension to be reduced back down to 20-ish in amendments. As long as it would have been high enough to trigger a recall petition. Not sure whether they'll end up giving him an ex-members pass or not.
posted by plonkee at 4:02 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
I think I'm expecting the proposed 90-day (nominal) suspension to be reduced back down to 20-ish in amendments. As long as it would have been high enough to trigger a recall petition. Not sure whether they'll end up giving him an ex-members pass or not.
posted by plonkee at 4:02 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
My sister used to work in the House of Commons so I’ve watched quite a bit of Parliament Live TV out of brotherly curiosity about her place of employment, so I’ve seen my share of performative anger. Seeing Labour MP Thangam Debbonaire this morning, who clearly had just read the report, seethe with anger, which she tried to keep in check, was striking in its genuineness. Conservative Leader of the House of Commons, Penny Mordaunt, didn’t even bother to defend Johnson. It’s clear that a lot of MPs are sincerely pissed off.
posted by Kattullus at 4:16 AM on June 15, 2023 [12 favorites]
posted by Kattullus at 4:16 AM on June 15, 2023 [12 favorites]
Ah, that’s why I was wracking my brain futilely! I was thinking of the wrong country-that-I-don’t-live-in. Thanks!
I was in the same situation as you but I had an inkling from the style: almost all US news outlets would write “Mr. Johnson” but many or most UK ones go for “Mr Johnson.”
At last, all those days spent reading style guides pays off.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 4:17 AM on June 15, 2023 [18 favorites]
I was in the same situation as you but I had an inkling from the style: almost all US news outlets would write “Mr. Johnson” but many or most UK ones go for “Mr Johnson.”
At last, all those days spent reading style guides pays off.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 4:17 AM on June 15, 2023 [18 favorites]
Sky News’ Tamara Cohen has just pointed out that the vote in the House of Commons to accept the privileges report has been scheduled for this Monday, which happens to be Boris Johnson’s birthday.
If this happened in a novel I’d honestly just toss it on the floor.
posted by Kattullus at 4:25 AM on June 15, 2023 [11 favorites]
If this happened in a novel I’d honestly just toss it on the floor.
posted by Kattullus at 4:25 AM on June 15, 2023 [11 favorites]
I’d honestly just toss it on the floor.
this is very tory-MP like behavior, but given the current political climate the rules committee recommends this activity not be conducted in committee meetings, but rather take place in the privacy of your home, or secretary's office.
posted by lalochezia at 4:28 AM on June 15, 2023 [15 favorites]
this is very tory-MP like behavior, but given the current political climate the rules committee recommends this activity not be conducted in committee meetings, but rather take place in the privacy of your home, or secretary's office.
posted by lalochezia at 4:28 AM on June 15, 2023 [15 favorites]
Semi-interested USian here, probably asking a silly question...How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
posted by Thorzdad at 4:49 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 4:49 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
> I think I'm expecting the proposed 90-day (nominal) suspension to be reduced back down to 20-ish in amendments.
For Boris I think maybe the more terrible punishment is the proposal to withdraw his parliament pass.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 4:59 AM on June 15, 2023
For Boris I think maybe the more terrible punishment is the proposal to withdraw his parliament pass.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 4:59 AM on June 15, 2023
New Statesman archive: Boris Johnson won’t be back
He has never been a man with a plan, rather an optimistic narcissist who believes something may turn up.Spectator archive: The plot against the PM
At first glance, it’s hard to understand why this war has broken out. Tories normally fight each other to advance an agenda or to supplant one leader with another. Johnson’s motivation seems to be more personal. He wants to undermine Sunak for the sake of it. His anger over the Prime Minister refusing to send Dorries into the House of Lords really does seem to be the casus belli.New Statesman archive: The delusions of the Johnsonian right
The strange thing about the right is that its prejudices and lack of willingness to engage with political realities is shared by much of the most powerful players in the Westminster media. There is a ready audience for these assumptions. Parts of the Conservative right have inherited much of the thinking and style of the most doctrinaire elements of the old Labour left – in their dogma and inability to harbour challenge. But the crucial difference is that the media environment is far more hospitable to the Johnsonian right than it ever was to the fanatical left; the right has a huge echo chamber that amplifies and reflects its members’ thinking...posted by TheophileEscargot at 5:13 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
This situation is both a blessing and a curse. Though it gives the right influence, it denies them perspective. There is none of the introspection that the left must endure, in which every idea is pitilessly ground through the press mill. The metropolitan liberal elite may be somewhat unrepresentative, but at least it usually knows it. The (sometimes) metropolitan illiberal elites labour under the illusion they represent nearly everybody.
Who could have foreseen that someone who had made a career out of lying as a journalist, with a personal life full of lying would then also turn out to be a liar in parliament?
How could anyone have known?
What does this change? What impact is there from this?
A lifetime without any real consequences continues floating along like the scum of the 'great stink' gathering more affluence along with the effluence as he goes.
posted by Leud at 5:18 AM on June 15, 2023 [13 favorites]
How could anyone have known?
What does this change? What impact is there from this?
A lifetime without any real consequences continues floating along like the scum of the 'great stink' gathering more affluence along with the effluence as he goes.
posted by Leud at 5:18 AM on June 15, 2023 [13 favorites]
The article is unclear on this. I'm assuming the Bible promptly burst into flame and was reduced in a matter of moments to a pile of smoking ash?
posted by Naberius at 5:21 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by Naberius at 5:21 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
> Spectator archive: The plot against the PM
That would be the same Spectator that Johnson himself edited for a number of years. They're not exactly what you'd call an objective independent voice here.
posted by parm at 5:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
That would be the same Spectator that Johnson himself edited for a number of years. They're not exactly what you'd call an objective independent voice here.
posted by parm at 5:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
As per Andy Zaltzman: Boris Johnson, the man putting the liar in 'national liability'.
posted by jaduncan at 5:37 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by jaduncan at 5:37 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
Who is Mr. Johnson?
Tangentially, I don’t think MetaFilter marked last month’s passing of Bill Saluga
posted by staggernation at 5:41 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
Tangentially, I don’t think MetaFilter marked last month’s passing of Bill Saluga
posted by staggernation at 5:41 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
UK magazine Private Eye on this historic resignation
posted by chavenet at 5:58 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by chavenet at 5:58 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
A letter in The Times a couple of days ago ( Twitter link):
Eton's failure
Sir,
Whatever wider strategy Eton adopts, the school itself will continue to educate the global elite or those who will become the global elite ("If we'd stayed the same since 1440, Eton would have closed years ago", Jun 10). Perhaps its most important mission will be to ensure that its pupils are saved from the sense of privilege, entitlement and omniscience that can produce alumni such as Boris Johnson, Jacob Rees-Mogg, Kwasi Kwarteng and Ben Elliot and thereby damage a country's very fabric.
Sadly, I failed in that purpose.
John Claughton
Master, Eton College, 1984-2001
posted by thatwhichfalls at 6:59 AM on June 15, 2023 [28 favorites]
Eton's failure
Sir,
Whatever wider strategy Eton adopts, the school itself will continue to educate the global elite or those who will become the global elite ("If we'd stayed the same since 1440, Eton would have closed years ago", Jun 10). Perhaps its most important mission will be to ensure that its pupils are saved from the sense of privilege, entitlement and omniscience that can produce alumni such as Boris Johnson, Jacob Rees-Mogg, Kwasi Kwarteng and Ben Elliot and thereby damage a country's very fabric.
Sadly, I failed in that purpose.
John Claughton
Master, Eton College, 1984-2001
posted by thatwhichfalls at 6:59 AM on June 15, 2023 [28 favorites]
I think it was obvious what Eton was turning out long before he stopped being a Master of the College in 2001. He was part of the problem, did he not realise? 17 years should have been more than enough time to work it out.
posted by IncognitoErgoSum at 7:07 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
posted by IncognitoErgoSum at 7:07 AM on June 15, 2023 [8 favorites]
Boris being pushed out is another part of the healing of the universe.
posted by hippybear at 7:10 AM on June 15, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by hippybear at 7:10 AM on June 15, 2023 [6 favorites]
I enjoy that he resigned to spare himself some dignity. Best of luck to him in holding onto his dignity as he goes down in history as a PM who resigned in disgrace the very same term he was elected.
How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
While I think Sunak is perfectly happy to let this play out to get the stink of Johnson out, it's also pretty clear that it's necessary for the Tories to get the stink of Johnson off them. He's highly associated with Brexit, and the idea that they all lined up behind him while he bullshitted the country is a difficult idea to take to an election. However, what did Johnson in wasn't lying to the British public, they were all absolutely happy to let him do that. It was the sense that he was just as willing to bullshit them as well: they'd go out, spin what they thought was the story to get the party out of their latest trouble, and then he'd change the story and hang them out to dry.
What ended his prime ministership was the relatively petty matter of appointing someone he knew was a serial sex pest, which compared to Partygate was not a very big deal at all. The problem was that he'd told them the man wasn't a sex pest and not to worry, and when they found all he knew all along when the man was forced to resign, they realised that he'd diddled them the way that they'd all diddled the UK by setting lockdown rules for everyone's health and safety, and then throwing a party for themselves.
posted by Merus at 7:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [4 favorites]
How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
While I think Sunak is perfectly happy to let this play out to get the stink of Johnson out, it's also pretty clear that it's necessary for the Tories to get the stink of Johnson off them. He's highly associated with Brexit, and the idea that they all lined up behind him while he bullshitted the country is a difficult idea to take to an election. However, what did Johnson in wasn't lying to the British public, they were all absolutely happy to let him do that. It was the sense that he was just as willing to bullshit them as well: they'd go out, spin what they thought was the story to get the party out of their latest trouble, and then he'd change the story and hang them out to dry.
What ended his prime ministership was the relatively petty matter of appointing someone he knew was a serial sex pest, which compared to Partygate was not a very big deal at all. The problem was that he'd told them the man wasn't a sex pest and not to worry, and when they found all he knew all along when the man was forced to resign, they realised that he'd diddled them the way that they'd all diddled the UK by setting lockdown rules for everyone's health and safety, and then throwing a party for themselves.
posted by Merus at 7:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [4 favorites]
Semi-interested USian here, probably asking a silly question...How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
So way way back in March there was a vote on something called the Windsor Framework. This was a Brexit protocol negotiated with the EU for Northern Ireland, who technically need to stay in the EU to ensure a no border with Ireland as per the Good Friday Agreement.
Now a faction can who doesn't like the government can throw a spanner in the works if they have a large enough contingent to make sure the government won't have a majority in a vote. Post-2019 the Tories have a majority of 80 seats. The vote on the Windsor Framework went 515-29. Even Labour didn't believe that Boris had the votes so were content to let it go through.
So that vote was effectively the end of BoJo's influence in the party at large. He may have control over a decent swath of the electorate (which is probably why he's resigning) and may attempt a comeback as an independent right wing party that exists just to be a thorn in the side of Tories a'la UKIP. If he's able to bring together enough candidates to split the vote in a few seats he can cost the right wing a majority. At that point you have indirect control over the Tory party because the threat of Tory MPs bolting to an even more right-wing party looms. That's how Nigel got his referendum in the first place, Tories kept bolting to UKIP and it needed to stop.
The honors listing is basically "I don't have to appoint the cronies of a disgraced dipshit to the House of Lords". Sunak isn't going to bat for Boris, a man who would gladly stab Sunak in the front with a giant, shit eating grin on his mop-topped face.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 7:42 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
So way way back in March there was a vote on something called the Windsor Framework. This was a Brexit protocol negotiated with the EU for Northern Ireland, who technically need to stay in the EU to ensure a no border with Ireland as per the Good Friday Agreement.
Now a faction can who doesn't like the government can throw a spanner in the works if they have a large enough contingent to make sure the government won't have a majority in a vote. Post-2019 the Tories have a majority of 80 seats. The vote on the Windsor Framework went 515-29. Even Labour didn't believe that Boris had the votes so were content to let it go through.
So that vote was effectively the end of BoJo's influence in the party at large. He may have control over a decent swath of the electorate (which is probably why he's resigning) and may attempt a comeback as an independent right wing party that exists just to be a thorn in the side of Tories a'la UKIP. If he's able to bring together enough candidates to split the vote in a few seats he can cost the right wing a majority. At that point you have indirect control over the Tory party because the threat of Tory MPs bolting to an even more right-wing party looms. That's how Nigel got his referendum in the first place, Tories kept bolting to UKIP and it needed to stop.
The honors listing is basically "I don't have to appoint the cronies of a disgraced dipshit to the House of Lords". Sunak isn't going to bat for Boris, a man who would gladly stab Sunak in the front with a giant, shit eating grin on his mop-topped face.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 7:42 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
"That shit is explosive: formal, thorough, closely argued, with a water-tight evidence base. They brought a sniper rifle to a knife fight."
Ian Dunt is enjoying himself going through the report on twitter.
posted by antiwiggle at 7:53 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
Ian Dunt is enjoying himself going through the report on twitter.
posted by antiwiggle at 7:53 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
Who is Mr. Johnson?
I’m too sleepy this morning to formulate a proper Shadowrun joke but I’m confident it’s out there somewhere.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
I’m too sleepy this morning to formulate a proper Shadowrun joke but I’m confident it’s out there somewhere.
posted by Parasite Unseen at 8:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
I generally find the use of "Boris" to refer to this person objectionable, as it feeds into his bumbling clown persona for which some people vote. When I used to receive a weekly news summary from the Local Govt Association at work, I complained to them about their use of "Boris". They apologised. Then they did it again so obvs I complained again. They responded that, although the article writers were on board with the correct name, this had not reached the headline writers, but that they would ensure those people were informed.
My sister pointed out to me after this that the LGA had probably come to the conclusion that I was a massive Tory who was deeply offended by the lack of respect shown to Johnson.
posted by paduasoy at 8:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
My sister pointed out to me after this that the LGA had probably come to the conclusion that I was a massive Tory who was deeply offended by the lack of respect shown to Johnson.
posted by paduasoy at 8:27 AM on June 15, 2023 [5 favorites]
Dunt: It's like a whole new specialist field of science. The quantum of contempt.
Indeed. But on this side of the pond, do we now need to work in advanced dimensions to quantify the vastly greater contempt and mendacity of #45?
posted by Artful Codger at 8:33 AM on June 15, 2023
Indeed. But on this side of the pond, do we now need to work in advanced dimensions to quantify the vastly greater contempt and mendacity of #45?
posted by Artful Codger at 8:33 AM on June 15, 2023
Boris' behaviour clearly shows he's not a "nice person".
"...As nice a person as he is - he’s got a great character..."
For those of you who only speak American, the word "nice" in this this context means "Repulsive, but I am not going to open myself to an action for libel." If you refer to the paintings in the National Gallery as "nice" you are not praising them, nor if you tell someone their seven course wedding banquet was "nice." People do not call Churchill and Nelson and Wellington and Raleigh and William the Bastard and King Arthur "nice." Johnson has fallen short of being an aspiring leader.
Continuing on, "great character" following a dash means "has no positive traits that I can come up with, so please don't misunderstand the word nice to mean I think he has any." They couldn't even say he was good at golf, or loves dogs. "He's a real character...." is not a positive statement.
Picture someone saying "Emperor Palpatine is a great character!" and you get some idea how enthusiastic the person quoted is to have Johnson in real life as a leader.
See also the British use of the terms "I'll bear it in mind," "I hear what you say," "That's very brave," and "very interesting," all of which mean they consider what you said to be a load of old tosh, but they are sparing you from hearing "Bollocks!" because they are respectful and kind like that.
posted by Jane the Brown at 8:35 AM on June 15, 2023 [20 favorites]
"...As nice a person as he is - he’s got a great character..."
For those of you who only speak American, the word "nice" in this this context means "Repulsive, but I am not going to open myself to an action for libel." If you refer to the paintings in the National Gallery as "nice" you are not praising them, nor if you tell someone their seven course wedding banquet was "nice." People do not call Churchill and Nelson and Wellington and Raleigh and William the Bastard and King Arthur "nice." Johnson has fallen short of being an aspiring leader.
Continuing on, "great character" following a dash means "has no positive traits that I can come up with, so please don't misunderstand the word nice to mean I think he has any." They couldn't even say he was good at golf, or loves dogs. "He's a real character...." is not a positive statement.
Picture someone saying "Emperor Palpatine is a great character!" and you get some idea how enthusiastic the person quoted is to have Johnson in real life as a leader.
See also the British use of the terms "I'll bear it in mind," "I hear what you say," "That's very brave," and "very interesting," all of which mean they consider what you said to be a load of old tosh, but they are sparing you from hearing "Bollocks!" because they are respectful and kind like that.
posted by Jane the Brown at 8:35 AM on June 15, 2023 [20 favorites]
I yearn for this level of political evisceration in the US and I can only hope that we will one day achieve it. Calling out the very hubris of lying to an investigative body. I can only imagine.
posted by Revvy at 8:45 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Revvy at 8:45 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
This is totally irrelevant, but thanks to John Entwhistle, whenever I hear the name “Boris”, I think of spiders.
posted by TedW at 8:45 AM on June 15, 2023 [9 favorites]
posted by TedW at 8:45 AM on June 15, 2023 [9 favorites]
This is totally irrelevant, but thanks to John Entwhistle, whenever I hear the name “Boris”, I think of spiders.
There he is wrapped in a ball
Doesn't seem to move at all
Perhaps he's dead, I'll just make sure
Pick this book up off the floor
posted by Omission at 8:58 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
There he is wrapped in a ball
Doesn't seem to move at all
Perhaps he's dead, I'll just make sure
Pick this book up off the floor
posted by Omission at 8:58 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
If this happened in a novel I’d honestly just toss it on the floor.
Real life's often like that. As someone once remarked: "God is bad novelist".
posted by Paul Slade at 9:05 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
Real life's often like that. As someone once remarked: "God is bad novelist".
posted by Paul Slade at 9:05 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
I generally find the use of "Boris" to refer to this person objectionable, as it feeds into his bumbling clown persona for which some people vote.
While I am an American, I used to refer to him as "The Dishonorable Alexander Boris DePfieffel Johnson" with as much disdain as possible. (As a descendent of the Cymru, I genetically can summon quite a bit of disdain for Their Majesty's Toff Collection.)
posted by mephron at 9:42 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
While I am an American, I used to refer to him as "The Dishonorable Alexander Boris DePfieffel Johnson" with as much disdain as possible. (As a descendent of the Cymru, I genetically can summon quite a bit of disdain for Their Majesty's Toff Collection.)
posted by mephron at 9:42 AM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
This is totally irrelevant, but thanks to John Entwhistle, whenever I hear the name “Boris”, I think of spiders.
Sorry, but there will only ever be one spider in UK politics for me...
posted by protorp at 10:10 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
Sorry, but there will only ever be one spider in UK politics for me...
posted by protorp at 10:10 AM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
the word "nice" in this this context means "Repulsive, but I am not going to open myself to an action for libel." If you refer to the paintings in the National Gallery as "nice" you are not praising them, nor if you tell someone their seven course wedding banquet was "nice." People do not call Churchill and Nelson and Wellington and Raleigh and William the Bastard and King Arthur "nice." Johnson has fallen short of being an aspiring leader.
Continuing on, "great character" following a dash means "has no positive traits that I can come up with, so please don't misunderstand the word nice to mean I think he has any."
I guess here we'd say "bless his heart," then?
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:11 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
Continuing on, "great character" following a dash means "has no positive traits that I can come up with, so please don't misunderstand the word nice to mean I think he has any."
I guess here we'd say "bless his heart," then?
posted by jenfullmoon at 10:11 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
The last line of the finding is the kind of bureaucratic kiss off that the British do so well:
“We recommend that he should not be entitled to a former Member’s pass.”
posted by minervous at 10:18 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
“We recommend that he should not be entitled to a former Member’s pass.”
posted by minervous at 10:18 AM on June 15, 2023 [7 favorites]
How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
I might be wrong, but I think at this point it's much more the case that Sunak is letting it play out and taking advantage of the opportunity it brings as best he can. He's not quite strong enough to completely turn against Johnson, but it is all to his benefit if most of the rest of the parliamentary party do. For example, he must have known that Nadine Dorries MP would be annoyed when her peerage was not approved, but it's not neither helpful nor catastrophic to him to have a by-election, the position he's ended up with (Dorries trying to inflict as much damage as possible by delaying the resigning) was probably not the intention, but again, not catastrophic yet.
posted by plonkee at 10:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
I might be wrong, but I think at this point it's much more the case that Sunak is letting it play out and taking advantage of the opportunity it brings as best he can. He's not quite strong enough to completely turn against Johnson, but it is all to his benefit if most of the rest of the parliamentary party do. For example, he must have known that Nadine Dorries MP would be annoyed when her peerage was not approved, but it's not neither helpful nor catastrophic to him to have a by-election, the position he's ended up with (Dorries trying to inflict as much damage as possible by delaying the resigning) was probably not the intention, but again, not catastrophic yet.
posted by plonkee at 10:29 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
Thanks for the link to Thangam Debbonaire's speech, Kattullus. Good righteous anger. It's at 11.04 if others want to see it.
posted by paduasoy at 11:24 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by paduasoy at 11:24 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
See also the British use of the terms "I'll bear it in mind," "I hear what you say," "That's very brave," and "very interesting," all of which mean they consider what you said to be a load of old tosh, but they are sparing you from hearing "Bollocks!" because they are respectful and kind like that.
You might well think that. I couldn’t possibly comment.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 11:49 AM on June 15, 2023 [11 favorites]
You might well think that. I couldn’t possibly comment.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 11:49 AM on June 15, 2023 [11 favorites]
Speaking of Eton, one of the more startling links I’ve ever clicked around here was in a comment by rednikki last January, under the words "Eton and all the murder".
posted by jamjam at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by jamjam at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]
> “We recommend that he should not be entitled to a former Member’s pass.”
It’s not just a weird bureaucratic thing, it’s basically recommending curtailing his future influence and access, which is a valuable thing both reputationally and financially. Former MPs are traditionally given a pass so they can hang out in the House, which basically means, drink with other current and former MPs and lobby them on behalf of either themselves or, more often, paying clients. By not giving him this pass (if they go through with it) they’re denying him that opportunity and it significantly reduces his value as someone with influence in UK politics.
Also, not getting one will really, really annoy him and that’s really funny.
posted by parm at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2023 [19 favorites]
It’s not just a weird bureaucratic thing, it’s basically recommending curtailing his future influence and access, which is a valuable thing both reputationally and financially. Former MPs are traditionally given a pass so they can hang out in the House, which basically means, drink with other current and former MPs and lobby them on behalf of either themselves or, more often, paying clients. By not giving him this pass (if they go through with it) they’re denying him that opportunity and it significantly reduces his value as someone with influence in UK politics.
Also, not getting one will really, really annoy him and that’s really funny.
posted by parm at 11:51 AM on June 15, 2023 [19 favorites]
Here is a bit more direct link to the speech which Thangam Debbonaire gave to which Katullus was so kind to alert us.
On a sidenote, I have note what a lovely name she has. Another example of two great nations separated by a common language I presume.
posted by y2karl at 12:13 PM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
On a sidenote, I have note what a lovely name she has. Another example of two great nations separated by a common language I presume.
posted by y2karl at 12:13 PM on June 15, 2023 [1 favorite]
He must be so happy at the unexpected support for him on UK media today which is mainly coming from Lord Johnson (no relation), a not particularly notable failed MP who Johnson made a Lord, Lord Goldsmith, failed London Mayor candidate who Johnson made a Lord, Sir James Duddridge, who Johnson gave a knighthood to, Sir Jacob Rees Mogg, haunted pencil to whom Johnson gave a knighthood, Nadine Dorries to whom Johnson attempted to grant a peerage, Simon Clarke, to whom Johnson gave a knighthood, Michael Fabricant, a small woodland creature to whom Johnson gave a knighthood, Jake Berry, to whom Johnson gave a knighthood, and Andrea Jenkyns who Boris made a dame.
posted by reynir at 12:20 PM on June 15, 2023 [17 favorites]
posted by reynir at 12:20 PM on June 15, 2023 [17 favorites]
→
This is especially delightful as he had the rest of his career set on lobbying and schmoozing with govt types. He thrived on access (and the money it brought him) but without it he's a wormy little twerp.
posted by scruss at 12:42 PM on June 15, 2023 [4 favorites]
it significantly reduces his value as someone with influence in UK politics
This is especially delightful as he had the rest of his career set on lobbying and schmoozing with govt types. He thrived on access (and the money it brought him) but without it he's a wormy little twerp.
posted by scruss at 12:42 PM on June 15, 2023 [4 favorites]
Now, I come to find that Thangam is, according to my desultory searches of sometimes dubious sources, listed as a boys name in Hindi and Urdu and a Tamil girls name in India and Pakistan and means Golden. So, that maybe makes three great nations separated by more than two or three common languages. Or, alternatively, one island and one subcontinent at the very least.
posted by y2karl at 4:31 PM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by y2karl at 4:31 PM on June 15, 2023 [2 favorites]
How much of this is being orchestrated (in whatever manner) behind the scenes by Sunak, in order to excise Johnson (and his influence) from the party? To basically make perfectly clear who is in charge now?
As others have noted, Sunak is largely content to let things play out. It would have been difficult to meaningfully interfere- and such interference would almost certainly have leaked. The Committee that investigated Johnson is (genuinely) independent and independent-minded. Its a standing Committee so, although the Chair had to recuse himself because he had made some intemperate remarks on Johnson before the case was called, its not like it was created for this purpose and stuffed with anti-Johnson activists. It afforded Johnson more leeway than others who have appeared before it and, had Johnson accepted fault and expressed genuinecontrition, I tend to think they would either have let it pass or gone lightly. Johnson is, however, constitutionally incapable of responsibility or contrition so he instead tried his usual shtick with Committee of Actually Serious People. It didn't work. Sunak didn't force Johnson to trade the Committee, either, nor flounce off in a spectacular toy-throwing episode.
Some of the honours thing might be a little different in terms of Sunak meddling to some small degree - but ultimately it came down to Johnson's lack of focus and attention to detail. Dorries was never going to get past HOLAC and I bet Johnson was informed of this and either didn't notice, didn't care or thought he could get around it. I don't doubt that Johnson's recollection of his conversation with Sunak is also typical of him: not only does he tell people what they want to hear, he hears people say what he wants to hear. Sunak's recollection is definitely to be preferred.
In short, I don't think there's all that much Sunak could have done to orchestrate this mess. Much more likely, he's just following Napoleon's maxim about interruptions...
posted by deeker at 4:02 AM on June 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
As others have noted, Sunak is largely content to let things play out. It would have been difficult to meaningfully interfere- and such interference would almost certainly have leaked. The Committee that investigated Johnson is (genuinely) independent and independent-minded. Its a standing Committee so, although the Chair had to recuse himself because he had made some intemperate remarks on Johnson before the case was called, its not like it was created for this purpose and stuffed with anti-Johnson activists. It afforded Johnson more leeway than others who have appeared before it and, had Johnson accepted fault and expressed genuinecontrition, I tend to think they would either have let it pass or gone lightly. Johnson is, however, constitutionally incapable of responsibility or contrition so he instead tried his usual shtick with Committee of Actually Serious People. It didn't work. Sunak didn't force Johnson to trade the Committee, either, nor flounce off in a spectacular toy-throwing episode.
Some of the honours thing might be a little different in terms of Sunak meddling to some small degree - but ultimately it came down to Johnson's lack of focus and attention to detail. Dorries was never going to get past HOLAC and I bet Johnson was informed of this and either didn't notice, didn't care or thought he could get around it. I don't doubt that Johnson's recollection of his conversation with Sunak is also typical of him: not only does he tell people what they want to hear, he hears people say what he wants to hear. Sunak's recollection is definitely to be preferred.
In short, I don't think there's all that much Sunak could have done to orchestrate this mess. Much more likely, he's just following Napoleon's maxim about interruptions...
posted by deeker at 4:02 AM on June 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
The motherfucker is actually getting rewarded with a Daily Mail column.
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 8:08 AM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Your Childhood Pet Rock at 8:08 AM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Is that a reward?
posted by plonkee at 8:10 AM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by plonkee at 8:10 AM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
The six-figure salary is I guess.
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 1:20 PM on June 16, 2023
posted by urbanwhaleshark at 1:20 PM on June 16, 2023
Is there any chance that Sunak (who, by now, has to also hate Johnson back) could use the pretext of Johnson quitting his position to pull the entire departing honours list?
That'd tarnish Johnson's relationships with people right now; the lack of former member's pass would limit his ability to schmooze in the future.
posted by The Outsider at 1:41 PM on June 16, 2023
That'd tarnish Johnson's relationships with people right now; the lack of former member's pass would limit his ability to schmooze in the future.
posted by The Outsider at 1:41 PM on June 16, 2023
Is there any chance that Sunak (who, by now, has to also hate Johnson back) could use the pretext of Johnson quitting his position to pull the entire departing honours list?
My understanding is that Big Chuck has already used one of those bloody pens to sign off on it (that is, the list has been royally approved) so it's not possible according to convention and precedent. It might be publicly popular but would be seen as an embarrassment to the monarch and that is the trump card...
posted by deeker at 1:54 PM on June 16, 2023
My understanding is that Big Chuck has already used one of those bloody pens to sign off on it (that is, the list has been royally approved) so it's not possible according to convention and precedent. It might be publicly popular but would be seen as an embarrassment to the monarch and that is the trump card...
posted by deeker at 1:54 PM on June 16, 2023
BoJo lied to the Queen to get it to prorogue; maybe Charles would appreciate the chance to provide Johnson with a "teachable moment."
posted by The Outsider at 3:09 PM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by The Outsider at 3:09 PM on June 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
The video is not going to help matters. For the Tories. Must be a story behind why it has come out now.
posted by paduasoy at 1:30 PM on June 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by paduasoy at 1:30 PM on June 18, 2023 [2 favorites]
How MPs voted on the report. Keep an eye on this poll tracker in late June: Is Rishi Sunak strong or weak?
On social media, Boris backers have been trying to distract from the central issue of his lying to the House by focussing on the party aspect and again minimizing it as "a bit of cake", but the video has blown up that defence; now it's "they were just letting off a bit of steam". But there were formal invitations for this "Jingle and Mingle" party that actually call it a party. The fury from people who lost loved ones on or around 14 December 2020 or had gruelling shifts on Covid wards at that time isn't going away. This heartbreaking clip from a BBC Radio 4 call-in last week (TW: suicide) should be played to every last one of the minimizers.
posted by rory at 1:48 AM on June 20, 2023 [1 favorite]
On social media, Boris backers have been trying to distract from the central issue of his lying to the House by focussing on the party aspect and again minimizing it as "a bit of cake", but the video has blown up that defence; now it's "they were just letting off a bit of steam". But there were formal invitations for this "Jingle and Mingle" party that actually call it a party. The fury from people who lost loved ones on or around 14 December 2020 or had gruelling shifts on Covid wards at that time isn't going away. This heartbreaking clip from a BBC Radio 4 call-in last week (TW: suicide) should be played to every last one of the minimizers.
posted by rory at 1:48 AM on June 20, 2023 [1 favorite]
« Older Wanting more than "a bit of rainbow window... | I always thought "I've arrived" every step of the... Newer »
This thread has been archived and is closed to new comments
posted by biffa at 3:12 AM on June 15, 2023 [3 favorites]