Look Back at Anger
July 16, 2023 1:45 AM Subscribe
I have both volumes of Hollywood Babylon on my bookshelf. I've not looked at them in a while, so it's probably time to revisit them. I see from Wikipedia "Anger finished writing Hollywood Babylon III but did not publish it, fearing severe legal repercussions if he did. Of this, he said: "The main reason I didn't bring it out was that I had a whole section on Tom Cruise and the Scientologists. I'm not a friend of the Scientologists." Damn.
I wrote a dissertation 40 years ago on the Manson Family, so I've been familiar with Anger's peripheral connection, but I'd not heard of the podcast, so thank you revmitcz for that.
TBH, I'd assumed Kenneth Anger had died years ago. I see his spent his latter years in a care facility. I hope he regaled residents and staff with his spicy stories. To me he was always a sort of anti-John Waters, both making films outside the mainstream, but Waters in the Light and Anger most definitely on the Dark Side.
There was a BBC Arena documentary about him some years ago, and sadly it's not on the iPlayer Arena archive, but I'll keep checking in case it gets added back.
posted by essexjan at 4:28 AM on July 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
I wrote a dissertation 40 years ago on the Manson Family, so I've been familiar with Anger's peripheral connection, but I'd not heard of the podcast, so thank you revmitcz for that.
TBH, I'd assumed Kenneth Anger had died years ago. I see his spent his latter years in a care facility. I hope he regaled residents and staff with his spicy stories. To me he was always a sort of anti-John Waters, both making films outside the mainstream, but Waters in the Light and Anger most definitely on the Dark Side.
There was a BBC Arena documentary about him some years ago, and sadly it's not on the iPlayer Arena archive, but I'll keep checking in case it gets added back.
posted by essexjan at 4:28 AM on July 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
I haven't read Hollywood Babylon, mainly because I heard the YMRT podcast debunking most of the whole thing.
I watched his Scorpio Rising recently - and was fascinated by it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:32 AM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
I watched his Scorpio Rising recently - and was fascinated by it.
posted by EmpressCallipygos at 4:32 AM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
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posted by Thorzdad at 4:37 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 4:37 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
essexjan: There was a BBC Arena documentary about him some years ago, and sadly it's not on the iPlayer Arena archive:
ftfy? KENNETH ANGER'S Hollywood Babylon (Arena 1991)
posted by BobTheScientist at 5:07 AM on July 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
ftfy? KENNETH ANGER'S Hollywood Babylon (Arena 1991)
posted by BobTheScientist at 5:07 AM on July 16, 2023 [5 favorites]
For an in-depth look at the absolute falsehoods that Anger popularized in Hollywood Babylon, the podcast You Must Remember This devoted an entire season to the topic.
posted by corey flood at 8:15 AM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by corey flood at 8:15 AM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
I remember going to see a screening of a number of his films at Film Forum? many years ago, and being captured by the images, especially Rabbit's Moon. I then read both Babylons, which I very much enjoyed back then (although I'm eager to hear YMRT , which I've just started listening to, dismantle the inaccuracies—thanks, corey flood). Very much in the spirit of "If you can't say something good about someone, sit right here by me."
I haven't watched his films in a long time, so his passing will be a good reason to revisit them.
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posted by the sobsister at 8:32 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
I haven't watched his films in a long time, so his passing will be a good reason to revisit them.
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posted by the sobsister at 8:32 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
I read the two Babylon books as a teenager and found them cruelly delightful.
Years later, when getting into the occult and into movies, I was surprised to find Anger again.
posted by doctornemo at 8:52 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
Years later, when getting into the occult and into movies, I was surprised to find Anger again.
posted by doctornemo at 8:52 AM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
KENNETH ANGER'S Hollywood Babylon (Arena 1991 yt )
I stumbled upon this recently, found it compelling, disturbing and yes, kind of cruel. Now reading here about the falsehoods etc, I'm not sure that diminishes things. In fact, it may go the other way. Because as they say, the only way to really tell the truth is via fiction. It may not be your stand-up-in-court sort of truth but rather a deeper, more revealing and darkly human one -- the kind that requires a mask.
In Anger's case, I'm thinking it becomes an investigation of not the events he's purporting to be reporting on but himself. The kid who grew up in old, weird, corrupt-at-birth Hollywood ... and he couldn't help but dive into the shadows all those fabulously needy beautiful people couldn't help but cast. It may well be that Jayne Mansfield wasn't decapitated in the car crash that killed her, but in the nothing-left-to-the-imagination movie the public desperately secretly wanted to see about it, she most certainly did -- the proof being how easily we all bought into it.
The truth that Kenneth Anger cared about was, by definition, one that took the available facts and ran them through the funhouse mirrors of his uniquely distorted imagination. The truth about the lies about the truth about the world's great and hungry dream factory chewed up and spat back at it and us ...
Or something like that.
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posted by philip-random at 9:25 AM on July 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
I stumbled upon this recently, found it compelling, disturbing and yes, kind of cruel. Now reading here about the falsehoods etc, I'm not sure that diminishes things. In fact, it may go the other way. Because as they say, the only way to really tell the truth is via fiction. It may not be your stand-up-in-court sort of truth but rather a deeper, more revealing and darkly human one -- the kind that requires a mask.
In Anger's case, I'm thinking it becomes an investigation of not the events he's purporting to be reporting on but himself. The kid who grew up in old, weird, corrupt-at-birth Hollywood ... and he couldn't help but dive into the shadows all those fabulously needy beautiful people couldn't help but cast. It may well be that Jayne Mansfield wasn't decapitated in the car crash that killed her, but in the nothing-left-to-the-imagination movie the public desperately secretly wanted to see about it, she most certainly did -- the proof being how easily we all bought into it.
The truth that Kenneth Anger cared about was, by definition, one that took the available facts and ran them through the funhouse mirrors of his uniquely distorted imagination. The truth about the lies about the truth about the world's great and hungry dream factory chewed up and spat back at it and us ...
Or something like that.
.
posted by philip-random at 9:25 AM on July 16, 2023 [4 favorites]
I was always surprised that Anger didn’t mention Scotty Bowers.
posted by Ideefixe at 10:02 AM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by Ideefixe at 10:02 AM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
My college room mate was a fan and had all of his films on videotape. We watched them often, fun times. Pleasure Dome (with the ELO soundtrack version) was a party-pick.
posted by ovvl at 3:57 PM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by ovvl at 3:57 PM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
Anger was a provocative character. Here's a candid interview: "I am proud of the fact that I have no friends." (not recommended for the easily offended)
posted by ovvl at 4:16 PM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by ovvl at 4:16 PM on July 16, 2023 [3 favorites]
from that interview:
ALB: Did Walt Disney really use opium?
KA: Yes, Walt liked his opium. So it's been said and ne'er disputed.
posted by philip-random at 5:04 PM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
ALB: Did Walt Disney really use opium?
KA: Yes, Walt liked his opium. So it's been said and ne'er disputed.
posted by philip-random at 5:04 PM on July 16, 2023 [2 favorites]
I mostly remembered Anger from someone donating a copy of Hollywood Babylon II to the library that I worked at; IIRC, that was the one that had a photo of some dancer accidentally revealing that she'd gone commando that day, and so it went straight into the trash. Soon enough, we had rotten.com, gossip blogs, gossip sites, and the like to satisfy anyone's appetite for celebrity scandals and death photos, and in the fullness of time, #MeToo and the like to actually do something about celebrity bad behavior instead of just taking a cheap holiday in other people's misery.
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:12 PM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by Halloween Jack at 8:12 PM on July 16, 2023 [1 favorite]
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posted by Mutant Lobsters from Riverhead at 2:10 PM on July 20, 2023
posted by Mutant Lobsters from Riverhead at 2:10 PM on July 20, 2023
The truth that Kenneth Anger cared about was, by definition, one that took the available facts and ran them through the funhouse mirrors of his uniquely distorted imagination. The truth about the lies about the truth about the world's great and hungry dream factory chewed up and spat back at it and us ...
I get what you are saying. It’s just that Anger’s books were about real people whose lives were affected by the way he distorted information. When we treat celebrities as players in our own personal film about larger truths, we’re just part of the great and hungry dream factory that’s chewing them up and spitting them out.
Anger’s books bother me for the same reason that The Hollywood Museum of Death did when they were displaying the car that Jayne Mansfield was killed in (excuse me, The Jayne Mansfield Death Car). A shocking celebrity story for the general public has to be, at best, a reminder of the worst day of her children’s life, two of whom still work in Hollywood. Some creep is charging admission to see the car where your mom died in front of you—should we sacrifice decency in the name of greater truths about the entertainment industry? I kind of feel like Mariska and Mickey Hargitay, Jr., Mansfield’s children who still live in the area, might have an opinion on that.
And what of Lupe Velez? She survived an enormous amount of bullshit in the studio system, only to be falsely remembered as that lady who drowned in her toilet, har har. Is that fair? Anger would have done better to tell larger truths through writing that was unequivocally fiction.
posted by corey flood at 8:53 AM on July 31, 2023
I get what you are saying. It’s just that Anger’s books were about real people whose lives were affected by the way he distorted information. When we treat celebrities as players in our own personal film about larger truths, we’re just part of the great and hungry dream factory that’s chewing them up and spitting them out.
Anger’s books bother me for the same reason that The Hollywood Museum of Death did when they were displaying the car that Jayne Mansfield was killed in (excuse me, The Jayne Mansfield Death Car). A shocking celebrity story for the general public has to be, at best, a reminder of the worst day of her children’s life, two of whom still work in Hollywood. Some creep is charging admission to see the car where your mom died in front of you—should we sacrifice decency in the name of greater truths about the entertainment industry? I kind of feel like Mariska and Mickey Hargitay, Jr., Mansfield’s children who still live in the area, might have an opinion on that.
And what of Lupe Velez? She survived an enormous amount of bullshit in the studio system, only to be falsely remembered as that lady who drowned in her toilet, har har. Is that fair? Anger would have done better to tell larger truths through writing that was unequivocally fiction.
posted by corey flood at 8:53 AM on July 31, 2023
A. I agree. There's nothing particularly good about how Mr. Anger etc have treated the memory of Jayne Mansfield, Lupe Velez etc. It's toxic. It feels sick.
B. I also think that the entire culture of celebrity is toxic, sick. And more to the point. The way the mass media works tends to shove it down our throats whether we want it or not. This was particularly true back in pre-internet times when there just weren't that many choices out there. Unless you were really committed to seeking out alternative sources, you tended to get what some mega-powerful TV network (or whatever) decided you were going to get, and that included vast amounts of celebrity bullshit. So at some point, deliberately poisoning it becomes a tactic I can at least understand. Consciously or not, I do think this is where Anger was coming from. He was no saint obviously and I think he'd be the first to agree.
posted by philip-random at 11:39 AM on July 31, 2023
B. I also think that the entire culture of celebrity is toxic, sick. And more to the point. The way the mass media works tends to shove it down our throats whether we want it or not. This was particularly true back in pre-internet times when there just weren't that many choices out there. Unless you were really committed to seeking out alternative sources, you tended to get what some mega-powerful TV network (or whatever) decided you were going to get, and that included vast amounts of celebrity bullshit. So at some point, deliberately poisoning it becomes a tactic I can at least understand. Consciously or not, I do think this is where Anger was coming from. He was no saint obviously and I think he'd be the first to agree.
posted by philip-random at 11:39 AM on July 31, 2023
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I have since bought copies of Magick Lantern for a few friends on special occasions. I have not, however, explained why or what it might mean. While I can't say I understand or agree with interpretations of it, I remain in love with insane art made by insane artists. Luckily, everyone I've gifted that set to has been enthralled and searches for their own meaning in it.
For that matter, having - weirdly - never heard of his book, I deeply look forward to the YMRT series diving into those stories and I now have those episodes queued up in my podcast app.
I wish I wasn't the first one commenting in this thread, because I'm so deeply curious what takes we'll see here.
That said ..
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*I will forever remain annoyed that the original title for the series "What we talk about when we talk about Charles Manson" - a far better title - is now "Charles Manson's Hollywood" - a shorter title that gives Manson way more agency than he ever deserves, and wish a shorter title like "Let's Talk About Manson" was used instead.
posted by revmitcz at 3:55 AM on July 16, 2023 [8 favorites]