Shane MacGowan: remember him THIS way.
November 30, 2023 6:36 AM Subscribe
Here he is at his peak, both as a songwriter and a performer. Here's another side to his songwriting. And here's today's Guardian obituary by Alex Petridis, which gets it about right.
There was so much more to this man than one over-exposed Christmas single and the undeniable sadness of his later years. Those of us who loved his music and his magnificent band should take every opportunity to remind people of that.
There was so much more to this man than one over-exposed Christmas single and the undeniable sadness of his later years. Those of us who loved his music and his magnificent band should take every opportunity to remind people of that.
he was a hell of a storyteller, with a flair for delicate and restrained detail.
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posted by entropone at 6:47 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
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posted by entropone at 6:47 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Let me just say, with a certain amount of affection, plus sadness regarding my own misadventures with alcohol: I'm surprised that he made it this far.
The Rake at the Gates of Hell
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:48 AM on November 30, 2023 [13 favorites]
The Rake at the Gates of Hell
posted by Halloween Jack at 6:48 AM on November 30, 2023 [13 favorites]
There was so much more to this man than one over-exposed Christmas single and the undeniable sadness of his later years.
I'm surprised he lasted as long as he did, but it still saddens me to think people might only know him from the worst song he was ever a party to. If Sally Maclennae, Bottle Of Smoke or The Broad Majestic Shannon don't speak to you, I don't know what to tell you.
posted by mhoye at 6:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [25 favorites]
I'm surprised he lasted as long as he did, but it still saddens me to think people might only know him from the worst song he was ever a party to. If Sally Maclennae, Bottle Of Smoke or The Broad Majestic Shannon don't speak to you, I don't know what to tell you.
posted by mhoye at 6:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [25 favorites]
A massive loss, although I feel like I've been dreading it for decades now. I never managed to see him with the Pogues, but I did see him with the Popes in Chicago in 1995 or so. The documentary is worth a watch, and it'll leave you with all the complex feelings his fans and admirers have had about him over the years.
posted by mykescipark at 6:51 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by mykescipark at 6:51 AM on November 30, 2023
That's gonna be an awkward ride down the escalator with Henry Kissinger.
posted by the bricabrac man at 6:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [32 favorites]
posted by the bricabrac man at 6:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [32 favorites]
♪
posted by Smart Dalek at 6:53 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by Smart Dalek at 6:53 AM on November 30, 2023
My father once owned a share in a racehorse, and there was much discussion among family and friends about what we should call it. I pitched for Bottle of Smoke in tribute to The Pogues' song, but not a single fucker supported the idea. Philistines.
posted by Paul Slade at 7:00 AM on November 30, 2023 [16 favorites]
posted by Paul Slade at 7:00 AM on November 30, 2023 [16 favorites]
We walked him to the station in the rain
We kissed him as we put him on the train
And we sang him a song of times long gone,
For we knew that we’d be seeing him again
Thanks, Shane.
posted by corey flood at 7:01 AM on November 30, 2023 [21 favorites]
We kissed him as we put him on the train
And we sang him a song of times long gone,
For we knew that we’d be seeing him again
Thanks, Shane.
posted by corey flood at 7:01 AM on November 30, 2023 [21 favorites]
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posted by MonsieurPEB at 7:06 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by MonsieurPEB at 7:06 AM on November 30, 2023
Not long ago I listened to the whole of If I Should Fall from Grace with God after not hearing it for years and was just stunned by the energy. He was fierce.
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posted by dlugoczaj at 7:08 AM on November 30, 2023 [14 favorites]
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posted by dlugoczaj at 7:08 AM on November 30, 2023 [14 favorites]
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posted by ducky l'orange at 7:09 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by ducky l'orange at 7:09 AM on November 30, 2023
If I should fall from grace with God
Where no doctor can relieve me
If I'm buried 'neath the sod
But the angels won't receive me
Let me go, boys
Let me go, boys
Let me go down in the mud
Where the rivers all run dry
I have always loved The Pogues, and was very glad to have seen them (NYC, Thanksgiving Week, 1987) in what was at least part of their heyday.
And while the music is important to me, Straight To Hell is even more important.
posted by chavenet at 7:09 AM on November 30, 2023 [7 favorites]
Where no doctor can relieve me
If I'm buried 'neath the sod
But the angels won't receive me
Let me go, boys
Let me go, boys
Let me go down in the mud
Where the rivers all run dry
I have always loved The Pogues, and was very glad to have seen them (NYC, Thanksgiving Week, 1987) in what was at least part of their heyday.
And while the music is important to me, Straight To Hell is even more important.
posted by chavenet at 7:09 AM on November 30, 2023 [7 favorites]
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But also thanks for whatever miracles kept him alive until he was 65.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 7:10 AM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
But also thanks for whatever miracles kept him alive until he was 65.
posted by GCU Sweet and Full of Grace at 7:10 AM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
Take my hand and dry your tears, babe
Take my hand, forget your fears, babe
There's no pain, there's no more sorrow
They're all gone, gone in the years, babe.
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 7:12 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
Take my hand, forget your fears, babe
There's no pain, there's no more sorrow
They're all gone, gone in the years, babe.
posted by Pickman's Next Top Model at 7:12 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
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posted by tychotesla at 7:20 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by tychotesla at 7:20 AM on November 30, 2023
With him they did in fact send a poet.
I got Peace and Love when it came out because I read a review in the Chicago Tribune. Not really MacGowen's finest hour but it made a big impression on me. At the time you really couldn't get Red Roses For Me or Rum Sodomy and the Lash in the US (unless, I assume, you had the assistance of the type of record store clerk you didn't find in the midwest).
I think it was my freshman year of college or maybe my sophomore year when I saw the CD version of Red Roses For Me at the short-lived indie record store in town. I was so thrilled, I could hardly believe it, just walked up to the register clutching the CD and paid with trembling hands, feeling of course like an absolute dork for that. Just as when I finally found copies of the Mekons' Honky-Tonkin' and So Good It Hurts, I was so overwhelmed by finally finding a longed for album that I could barely believe that someone wouldn't grab it from my hands and run out the door with it. And then it was absolutely as good as I had hoped and believed, if not better.
posted by Frowner at 7:24 AM on November 30, 2023 [19 favorites]
I got Peace and Love when it came out because I read a review in the Chicago Tribune. Not really MacGowen's finest hour but it made a big impression on me. At the time you really couldn't get Red Roses For Me or Rum Sodomy and the Lash in the US (unless, I assume, you had the assistance of the type of record store clerk you didn't find in the midwest).
I think it was my freshman year of college or maybe my sophomore year when I saw the CD version of Red Roses For Me at the short-lived indie record store in town. I was so thrilled, I could hardly believe it, just walked up to the register clutching the CD and paid with trembling hands, feeling of course like an absolute dork for that. Just as when I finally found copies of the Mekons' Honky-Tonkin' and So Good It Hurts, I was so overwhelmed by finally finding a longed for album that I could barely believe that someone wouldn't grab it from my hands and run out the door with it. And then it was absolutely as good as I had hoped and believed, if not better.
posted by Frowner at 7:24 AM on November 30, 2023 [19 favorites]
. ❤️.
posted by Silvery Fish at 7:32 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by Silvery Fish at 7:32 AM on November 30, 2023
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posted by Captain_Science at 7:35 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by Captain_Science at 7:35 AM on November 30, 2023
I once failed to secure tickets to a sold out Pogues concert in Edinburgh, retreated despondently into a nearby pub, as it was well past the start time with even the touts having nothing, and then of course ran into Shane at the bar. In terms of song writing and performance he was an absolute one of a kind.
Navigator: which I have sung to myself while valiantly digging a small garden pond.
posted by rongorongo at 7:37 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
Navigator: which I have sung to myself while valiantly digging a small garden pond.
posted by rongorongo at 7:37 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
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posted by theBigRedKittyPurrs at 7:42 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by theBigRedKittyPurrs at 7:42 AM on November 30, 2023
There was so much more to this man than one over-exposed Christmas single
While this is undeniably true, it is the one song about christmas I have never ever gotten tired of (and probably never will).
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posted by dry white toast at 7:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [32 favorites]
While this is undeniably true, it is the one song about christmas I have never ever gotten tired of (and probably never will).
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posted by dry white toast at 7:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [32 favorites]
That's gonna be an awkward ride down the escalator with Henry Kissinger.
Oh, I think you'll find they'll be going in opposite directions.
posted by Paul Slade at 7:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [56 favorites]
Oh, I think you'll find they'll be going in opposite directions.
posted by Paul Slade at 7:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [56 favorites]
I am gutted, although not totally surprised. What a songwriter, what a singer.
Even though this was a Eric Bogle song, I don't think many things can top the sheer raw power of Shane's delivery of "And The Band Played Waltzing Matilda" . The way he sings these two verses in particular just slays me:
And how well I remember that terrible day
How our blood stained the sand and the water
And of how in that hell that they called Suvla Bay
We were butchered like lambs at the slaughter
And then:
And as our ship pulled into Circular Quay
I looked at the place where me legs used to be
And thanked Christ there was nobody waiting for me
To grieve, to mourn, and to pity
But the band played Waltzing Matilda
As they carried us down the gangway
But nobody cheered, they just stood and stared
Then they turned all their faces away
I could go on and on about the Pogues, they gradually became such a big part of my life. I will be listening to them non stop the next few days.
posted by fortitude25 at 7:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
Even though this was a Eric Bogle song, I don't think many things can top the sheer raw power of Shane's delivery of "And The Band Played Waltzing Matilda" . The way he sings these two verses in particular just slays me:
And how well I remember that terrible day
How our blood stained the sand and the water
And of how in that hell that they called Suvla Bay
We were butchered like lambs at the slaughter
And then:
And as our ship pulled into Circular Quay
I looked at the place where me legs used to be
And thanked Christ there was nobody waiting for me
To grieve, to mourn, and to pity
But the band played Waltzing Matilda
As they carried us down the gangway
But nobody cheered, they just stood and stared
Then they turned all their faces away
I could go on and on about the Pogues, they gradually became such a big part of my life. I will be listening to them non stop the next few days.
posted by fortitude25 at 7:53 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
I wish I could write a song even half as good as "The Sick Bed of Cuchulainn"
What an absolute giant
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posted by SystematicAbuse at 8:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
What an absolute giant
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posted by SystematicAbuse at 8:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
the song that immediately comes to mind is Thousands Are Sailing which manages to break my heart pretty much every time I hear it. He didn't write but he sure owns it. One of those songs they really should teach in school, part of every North American's history curriculum.
Thousands are sailing
Across the western ocean
Where the hand of opportunity
Draws tickets in a lottery
Where e'er we go, we celebrate
The land that makes us refugees
From fear of priests with empty plates
From guilt and weeping effigies
Still we dance to the music
And we dance
Or if you wish something a little lighter and perhaps more appropriate for a wake, here's The Pogues singing 'Dirty Old Town' drunk in a pub
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posted by philip-random at 8:14 AM on November 30, 2023 [14 favorites]
Thousands are sailing
Across the western ocean
Where the hand of opportunity
Draws tickets in a lottery
Where e'er we go, we celebrate
The land that makes us refugees
From fear of priests with empty plates
From guilt and weeping effigies
Still we dance to the music
And we dance
Or if you wish something a little lighter and perhaps more appropriate for a wake, here's The Pogues singing 'Dirty Old Town' drunk in a pub
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posted by philip-random at 8:14 AM on November 30, 2023 [14 favorites]
God DAMN. I am gutted. They were my favorite of all favorites band in the 80s and I built probably too much of my identity around them. I came from one of those Irish-American families where being Irish is a Big Thing and a huge cultural signifier. When I first heard Rum Sodomy and the Lash in probably 1986 - as Frowner says, we didn’t get new music right away back then, particularly in Charleston, SC - it was just, everything to me. I still know every word of every song. It woke me up, it smashed all the old stupid Irish sentimental claptrap and made an angry noise to the world that was still so intrinsically Irish. Shane was my cohort’s Brendan Behan, our wavering drunken light to follow, we were so angry and so young and god DAMN god DAMN.
I saw the Pogues for the first time in 1989, outdoors at Riverstage in NYC with the Violent Femmes and Mojo Nixon and Skid Roper. It remains the pinnacle of my concert going life, just an incredible, amazing show. Saw them again in the early 2000s in Atlanta at the Fox Theater . . . Shane’s music is so inextricably wound through my life; I raised my kids with it; one of my oldest friends and I still to this day celebrate each others birthdays with snippets of Pogues songs as we have for nigh on forty years.
Fuck Kissinger, how did he manage another goddamn senseless act of evil on his way out, Shane deserves his own full wake with no noise from that asshole. Goodbye Shane, rest fully in peace, you changed countless lives including mine.
posted by mygothlaundry at 8:21 AM on November 30, 2023 [22 favorites]
I saw the Pogues for the first time in 1989, outdoors at Riverstage in NYC with the Violent Femmes and Mojo Nixon and Skid Roper. It remains the pinnacle of my concert going life, just an incredible, amazing show. Saw them again in the early 2000s in Atlanta at the Fox Theater . . . Shane’s music is so inextricably wound through my life; I raised my kids with it; one of my oldest friends and I still to this day celebrate each others birthdays with snippets of Pogues songs as we have for nigh on forty years.
Fuck Kissinger, how did he manage another goddamn senseless act of evil on his way out, Shane deserves his own full wake with no noise from that asshole. Goodbye Shane, rest fully in peace, you changed countless lives including mine.
posted by mygothlaundry at 8:21 AM on November 30, 2023 [22 favorites]
And some people left for heaven without warnin
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posted by peachfiber at 8:22 AM on November 30, 2023 [9 favorites]
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posted by peachfiber at 8:22 AM on November 30, 2023 [9 favorites]
I always loved the physicality of his singing: he sounded like he was putting his whole body into it.
That said, either effort or drink often made his lyrics kind of a mystery, keeping me from singing along as much as I would have liked to. :7)
. and 🎤 to the man.
posted by wenestvedt at 8:27 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
That said, either effort or drink often made his lyrics kind of a mystery, keeping me from singing along as much as I would have liked to. :7)
. and 🎤 to the man.
posted by wenestvedt at 8:27 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Good night Shane but in death if not life they’ll have peace where they sleep
posted by mygothlaundry at 8:28 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by mygothlaundry at 8:28 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
The Pogues singing 'Dirty Old Town' drunk in a pub
Somewhere round their 1980s peak, The Pogues got sick of the British music press always describing them as a bunch of drunks. There was one NME interview where they met the journalist in a pub as usual, but insisted all their drinks were removed from shot before the photographer took over. The result was a shot of the whole band gathered round what was clearly a pub table, but one where all the drinks seemed somehow to have turned invisible. The Pub With No Beer, you might say.
posted by Paul Slade at 8:33 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Somewhere round their 1980s peak, The Pogues got sick of the British music press always describing them as a bunch of drunks. There was one NME interview where they met the journalist in a pub as usual, but insisted all their drinks were removed from shot before the photographer took over. The result was a shot of the whole band gathered round what was clearly a pub table, but one where all the drinks seemed somehow to have turned invisible. The Pub With No Beer, you might say.
posted by Paul Slade at 8:33 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
While this is undeniably true, it is the one song about christmas I have never ever gotten tired of (and probably never will).
Same. Using a bit of digital jiggery-pokery, Shepherd scrubbed the offensive word out of the song, so that when it comes up on our Christmas playlist, no one has to hear a slur. (I mean, I'd rather the slur was never put in it, but so it goes.)
Shane MacGowan was a real one, and as a sober person, I can't drink in his honour, but I am sure you all have got me covered.
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posted by Kitteh at 8:41 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Same. Using a bit of digital jiggery-pokery, Shepherd scrubbed the offensive word out of the song, so that when it comes up on our Christmas playlist, no one has to hear a slur. (I mean, I'd rather the slur was never put in it, but so it goes.)
Shane MacGowan was a real one, and as a sober person, I can't drink in his honour, but I am sure you all have got me covered.
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posted by Kitteh at 8:41 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
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posted by dannyboybell at 8:43 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by dannyboybell at 8:43 AM on November 30, 2023
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McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors gets name-dropped by Mikey Dread in this deepest of deep cuts by The Clash.
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:48 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors gets name-dropped by Mikey Dread in this deepest of deep cuts by The Clash.
posted by The Card Cheat at 8:48 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
When I was 25, I was scrambling for a roommate, and friends put me in touch with a French art student who was in town for a semester. Eric barely spoke English when he moved in, about as much as my high school French, but he loved his cassette of Rum, Sodomy and the Lash and it was great fun seeing him get more fluent and like the songs even more. I thought lyrics were the heart of McGowan's appeal, but clearly you could get tons from the delivery.
posted by bendybendy at 8:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by bendybendy at 8:50 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
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posted by dogstoevski at 8:55 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by dogstoevski at 8:55 AM on November 30, 2023
Somewhere round their 1980s peak, The Pogues got sick of the British music press always describing them as a bunch of drunks.
worth noting, the only contact of any kind I ever had with Shane MacGowan was the time I foolishly got between him and a bar that was offering free champagne (some London club's grand opening). I didn't hit the floor* but that man did have bulk. He was a big guy.
* that would happen later that evening when I mistakenly took a deep drag on a sloppily rolled cigarette thinking it was a joint. Nicotine's a hell of a drug, particularly when combined with jet lag and too much free champagne.
posted by philip-random at 8:58 AM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
worth noting, the only contact of any kind I ever had with Shane MacGowan was the time I foolishly got between him and a bar that was offering free champagne (some London club's grand opening). I didn't hit the floor* but that man did have bulk. He was a big guy.
* that would happen later that evening when I mistakenly took a deep drag on a sloppily rolled cigarette thinking it was a joint. Nicotine's a hell of a drug, particularly when combined with jet lag and too much free champagne.
posted by philip-random at 8:58 AM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
I did manage to see The Pogues in concert, after they had broken up and then gotten back together again (probably 2006). I'm glad I knew the words to all the songs, because I sure wasn't going to get them from his singing. I admired the band's ability to improvise around MacGowan randomly wandering offstage in the middle of songs.
Oh, I think you'll find they'll [MacGowan and Kissinger] be going in opposite directions.
Hell has all the good musicians. This is known.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 9:01 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Oh, I think you'll find they'll [MacGowan and Kissinger] be going in opposite directions.
Hell has all the good musicians. This is known.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 9:01 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
The Baltimore PD should throw his wake, Shane all laid out on the pool table.
posted by whuppy at 9:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [7 favorites]
posted by whuppy at 9:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [7 favorites]
And wherever he’s going, I hope our sacred sister Sinead is there to greet him.
posted by whuppy at 9:07 AM on November 30, 2023 [13 favorites]
posted by whuppy at 9:07 AM on November 30, 2023 [13 favorites]
He was fierce.
He certainly was. One of a kind, a great songwriter and a singular voice. I was never one for folk music really, but I listened to the Pogues albums heavily as a teen exploring music for the first time, largely I think now because of the fire he brought to their music. His streak of pure punk rock anger and passion elevated them to unique place.
Will be raising a glass shortly, cheers Shane.
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posted by tomsk at 9:12 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
He certainly was. One of a kind, a great songwriter and a singular voice. I was never one for folk music really, but I listened to the Pogues albums heavily as a teen exploring music for the first time, largely I think now because of the fire he brought to their music. His streak of pure punk rock anger and passion elevated them to unique place.
Will be raising a glass shortly, cheers Shane.
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posted by tomsk at 9:12 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Would have loved to catch him live in the day, regardless of his condition.
I saw the Pogues in 2011. The tickets were free, because a friend's coworker couldn't go and offered them up to him. Before that my wife and I had talked about buying tickets on multiple occasions, but a (different) friend had seen an absolute disaster of a show in NYC and it always seemed like too much of a risk for the ticket price.
I admired the band's ability to improvise around MacGowan randomly wandering offstage in the middle of songs.
What I saw in 2011 was a combination of frustration and relief. When they knew he wasn't going to be on stage at all they could just put on a show, and they were great. Every time he came out it was clear that there was tension about whether he'd make it all the way through a song. I don't recall him leaving in the middle of any songs, but I do recall that he was only on stage for around a third of the show. And I couldn't understand a word.
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posted by fedward at 9:15 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
I saw the Pogues in 2011. The tickets were free, because a friend's coworker couldn't go and offered them up to him. Before that my wife and I had talked about buying tickets on multiple occasions, but a (different) friend had seen an absolute disaster of a show in NYC and it always seemed like too much of a risk for the ticket price.
I admired the band's ability to improvise around MacGowan randomly wandering offstage in the middle of songs.
What I saw in 2011 was a combination of frustration and relief. When they knew he wasn't going to be on stage at all they could just put on a show, and they were great. Every time he came out it was clear that there was tension about whether he'd make it all the way through a song. I don't recall him leaving in the middle of any songs, but I do recall that he was only on stage for around a third of the show. And I couldn't understand a word.
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posted by fedward at 9:15 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
That's gonna be an awkward ride down the escalator with Henry Kissinger.
Count me out of any cosmology that puts those two in the same afterlife neighborhood!!
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posted by kensington314 at 9:15 AM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
Count me out of any cosmology that puts those two in the same afterlife neighborhood!!
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posted by kensington314 at 9:15 AM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
I haven't listened to them in a long time, but I remember the two Shane-less Pogues albums (Waiting For Herb and Pogue Mahone) being better than you might expect. They certainly weren't an embarrassing stain on their recorded legacy, anyway.
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:16 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by The Card Cheat at 9:16 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
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I'm not singing for the future
I'm not dreaming of the past
I'm not talking of the first times
I never think about the last
posted by thivaia at 9:46 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
I'm not singing for the future
I'm not dreaming of the past
I'm not talking of the first times
I never think about the last
posted by thivaia at 9:46 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
I came too late to his music.
Don't make that mistake with The Mary Wallopers (previously). If there's any band that embodies the spirit of The Pogues today, it's them.
I wish I could write a song even half as good as "The Sick Bed of Cuchulainn"
Safe to say we all do.
either effort or drink often made his lyrics kind of a mystery
That's certainly true for the later stuff, but he's pretty clear on the first three albums and any gigs up to about 1988. I do remember one reviewer of the first album asking what the hell an "Auld Main Drag" was supposed to be though.
McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors
I saw them live once, and the weren't bad - sort of ramshackle rockabilly/punk outfit. It was that period of UK punk where even good bands got gobbed on a lot and, boy, did they get gobbed on a lot.
in this deepest of deep cuts by The Clash.
Don't tell me: side 6 of Sandanista, right?
Finally, MacGowan's first appearance in the UK music press came in November 1976 under the unlikely headline "Cannibalism at Clash gig". Here's the details (SLTwitter).
posted by Paul Slade at 9:58 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
Don't make that mistake with The Mary Wallopers (previously). If there's any band that embodies the spirit of The Pogues today, it's them.
I wish I could write a song even half as good as "The Sick Bed of Cuchulainn"
Safe to say we all do.
either effort or drink often made his lyrics kind of a mystery
That's certainly true for the later stuff, but he's pretty clear on the first three albums and any gigs up to about 1988. I do remember one reviewer of the first album asking what the hell an "Auld Main Drag" was supposed to be though.
McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors
I saw them live once, and the weren't bad - sort of ramshackle rockabilly/punk outfit. It was that period of UK punk where even good bands got gobbed on a lot and, boy, did they get gobbed on a lot.
in this deepest of deep cuts by The Clash.
Don't tell me: side 6 of Sandanista, right?
Finally, MacGowan's first appearance in the UK music press came in November 1976 under the unlikely headline "Cannibalism at Clash gig". Here's the details (SLTwitter).
posted by Paul Slade at 9:58 AM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
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posted by faceplantingcheetah at 10:03 AM on November 30, 2023
posted by faceplantingcheetah at 10:03 AM on November 30, 2023
I saw the Pogues twice in the summer of '91. Once was at a 3-day festival in Thurles, Tipperary, normally a town of ~7000 that was host for 3 days to 80,000 music fans. The festival also featured Van Morrison, Nanci Griffith, Elvis Costello, James, Black Crowes, Billy Bragg, and about 30 other bands. Me and Pete took the train down from Dublin and picked up a canvas tarp on the way, figuring we'd sleep under it if it rained and on top if it didn't. In the event, we were approached coming off the train by a kindly woman who had sent her kids to spend the weekend with her sister in the next town and rented us their bedrooms for something like 10 pounds, including breakfast. The walls were decorated with crayon drawings of Kid'n'Play.
The second show was at Brixton Academy, appearing for the first time on the same stage with The Chieftains, which was epic. We started the evening in Kilburn, an Irish ghetto then (and perhaps now), and took the tube down to Brixton. At many of the stops in between, police came onto the train to drag away brawling Irishmen. The scene in Brixton was barely contained chaos.
In any case, my point is that Shane was very much at the center of both these scenes. It was like he'd somehow come rocketing through a wormhole from the world of '77 punk into that of Irish folk music and there were still sparks flying from him. Memorable, even at this considerable distance.
posted by Harry Black Goat at 10:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [12 favorites]
The second show was at Brixton Academy, appearing for the first time on the same stage with The Chieftains, which was epic. We started the evening in Kilburn, an Irish ghetto then (and perhaps now), and took the tube down to Brixton. At many of the stops in between, police came onto the train to drag away brawling Irishmen. The scene in Brixton was barely contained chaos.
In any case, my point is that Shane was very much at the center of both these scenes. It was like he'd somehow come rocketing through a wormhole from the world of '77 punk into that of Irish folk music and there were still sparks flying from him. Memorable, even at this considerable distance.
posted by Harry Black Goat at 10:06 AM on November 30, 2023 [12 favorites]
Count me out of any cosmology that puts those two in the same afterlife neighborhood!!
Good news! They’re actually stashing Kissinger in heaven so that he spends eternity surrounded by people he can’t bomb, torture or kill
posted by thecaddy at 10:07 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Good news! They’re actually stashing Kissinger in heaven so that he spends eternity surrounded by people he can’t bomb, torture or kill
posted by thecaddy at 10:07 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Damn. He was spectacularly good at his best, and another dreat Irish writer. Especially for us Irish in England/
And no, he won't be gpomh anywhere with Kissinger. As W H Auden said; "Time that is intolerant Of the brave and innocent, And indifferent in a week To a beautiful physique, Worships language and forgives Everyone by whom it lives"
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posted by Fuchsoid at 10:09 AM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
And no, he won't be gpomh anywhere with Kissinger. As W H Auden said; "Time that is intolerant Of the brave and innocent, And indifferent in a week To a beautiful physique, Worships language and forgives Everyone by whom it lives"
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posted by Fuchsoid at 10:09 AM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
And wherever he’s going, I hope our sacred sister Sinead is there to greet him.
Kirsty MacColl's got first dibs.
posted by mykescipark at 10:16 AM on November 30, 2023 [16 favorites]
Kirsty MacColl's got first dibs.
posted by mykescipark at 10:16 AM on November 30, 2023 [16 favorites]
Finally, MacGowan's first appearance in the UK music press came in November 1976 under the unlikely headline "Cannibalism at Clash gig".
"You're the guy who had his ear bitten off, you're a great man!" lol
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:37 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
"You're the guy who had his ear bitten off, you're a great man!" lol
posted by The Card Cheat at 10:37 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
East LA-based band Ollin used to play Rum, Sodomy and The Lash live every St. Patrick's Day, and one year they did it as opening act for the Pogues in NYC. I wish I could have seen that.
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posted by queensissy at 10:46 AM on November 30, 2023
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posted by queensissy at 10:46 AM on November 30, 2023
R,S& t L is among my all time favorite road trip albums. singing along with Shane and co. at the top of my lungs was a highlight of several cross country adventures in the late 80's early 90's.
I have friends who, to this day, still thank me for introducing them to the Pogues.
May his eternal rest be filled with song.
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:13 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
I have friends who, to this day, still thank me for introducing them to the Pogues.
May his eternal rest be filled with song.
posted by OHenryPacey at 11:13 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
This news actually made me weep, perhaps because Rum Sodomy and The Lash and If I Should Fall From Grace With God were so important to me at a certain point in my life.
I was fortunate to see them in '87 and '88. The '87 gig was the one with Joe Strummer touring in place of Phil Chevron. Still one of the best shows I have ever seen and the audience responded in kind.
McGowan's songs on Rum are just amazing; they feel like they were organically generated by the culture they came out of like the great folk songs of yore. But, in songs likeThe Sick Bed of Cúchulainn there is also a punk energy that is as strong and fierce as the best punk music of the time. That's one of the crucial things that the pasty faced bands the sprung up imitating them never seemed to have. Those songs still sound punk as fuck to this day.
It's been a couple of years now since I raised a glass but I will toast Mr McGowan with something else today and be thankful for what he put into the world.
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posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 11:19 AM on November 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
I was fortunate to see them in '87 and '88. The '87 gig was the one with Joe Strummer touring in place of Phil Chevron. Still one of the best shows I have ever seen and the audience responded in kind.
McGowan's songs on Rum are just amazing; they feel like they were organically generated by the culture they came out of like the great folk songs of yore. But, in songs likeThe Sick Bed of Cúchulainn there is also a punk energy that is as strong and fierce as the best punk music of the time. That's one of the crucial things that the pasty faced bands the sprung up imitating them never seemed to have. Those songs still sound punk as fuck to this day.
It's been a couple of years now since I raised a glass but I will toast Mr McGowan with something else today and be thankful for what he put into the world.
.
posted by Phlegmco(tm) at 11:19 AM on November 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
Using a bit of digital jiggery-pokery, Shepherd scrubbed the offensive word out of the song, so that when it comes up on our Christmas playlist, no one has to hear a slur.
Guy I know sings it as "You scumbag you maggot, you taped over Taggart".
posted by GeorgeBickham at 11:20 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
Guy I know sings it as "You scumbag you maggot, you taped over Taggart".
posted by GeorgeBickham at 11:20 AM on November 30, 2023 [15 favorites]
I've taken the risk of playing my Pogues list in the car with my daughter, who likes to read the band and album names on the screen. Fortunately she never asked about Rum, Sodomy, and the Lash.
"Daddy, what's 'sodomy'?
"Well, it's when two people are in love..."
---
I'm listening to the Pogues albums on Spotify and I'm surprised bangers like "The Sickbed Of Cúchulainn" and "London Girl" aren't more popular.
I also like the version of "If I Should Fall From Grace With God" from Straight to Hell.
McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors
They changed their name to The Nips. The Pogues were originally named Pogue Mahone (from "póg mo thóin," Gaelic for "kiss my ass"). Two band names that were too upsetting!
posted by kirkaracha at 11:32 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
"Daddy, what's 'sodomy'?
"Well, it's when two people are in love..."
---
I'm listening to the Pogues albums on Spotify and I'm surprised bangers like "The Sickbed Of Cúchulainn" and "London Girl" aren't more popular.
I also like the version of "If I Should Fall From Grace With God" from Straight to Hell.
McGowan’s first band The Nipple Erectors
They changed their name to The Nips. The Pogues were originally named Pogue Mahone (from "póg mo thóin," Gaelic for "kiss my ass"). Two band names that were too upsetting!
posted by kirkaracha at 11:32 AM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Loving Rum, Sodomy, & the Lash and If I Should Fall from Grace with God were the most durable good music decisions I made as a young person. So many of those songs are still with me, and hearing just a few bars brings them right back. What a fucking band.
posted by that's candlepin at 11:35 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by that's candlepin at 11:35 AM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
Once upon a time I would have said The Pogues were my favourite band. I saw them twice but with Shane only once - London, Wembley Arena, December '88 - with guest appearances by Kirsty MacColl and (I think) Steve Earle. Wembley Arena was a big, soulless venue, and I was a fair old way back from the stage, but it was as joyous an evening's entertainment as I've ever had.
posted by misteraitch at 11:47 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by misteraitch at 11:47 AM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Loving Rum, Sodomy & the Lash and If I Should Fall From Grace With God were the most durable good music decisions I made as a young person
Co-signed. The friend who recorded these for me gave me the greatest of gifts. They fit on one tape, and I could and did drive for hours just flipping between the two sides.
posted by virago at 11:56 AM on November 30, 2023
Co-signed. The friend who recorded these for me gave me the greatest of gifts. They fit on one tape, and I could and did drive for hours just flipping between the two sides.
posted by virago at 11:56 AM on November 30, 2023
.
posted by the_dreamwriter at 12:01 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by the_dreamwriter at 12:01 PM on November 30, 2023
Here's a 50-minute TV studio gig from Ireland's RTE that I'd never seen before. First it's The Pogues, then it's The Dubliners, then it's The Pogues with Joe Strummer (for I Fought The Law and London Calling), then just The Pogues again, then absolutely everyone for The Irish Rover.
posted by Paul Slade at 12:06 PM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Paul Slade at 12:06 PM on November 30, 2023 [4 favorites]
.
posted by JoeXIII007 at 12:08 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by JoeXIII007 at 12:08 PM on November 30, 2023
(I think) Steve Earle
Probably so. He recorded Johnny Come Lately with them for Copperhead Road.
posted by Paul Slade at 12:14 PM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
Probably so. He recorded Johnny Come Lately with them for Copperhead Road.
posted by Paul Slade at 12:14 PM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
To a survivor and an artist of rare and strange power: easy rest and lasting inspiration.
posted by EvaDestruction at 12:38 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by EvaDestruction at 12:38 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
.
Saw the Pogues with him in NYC on St Pat's in the mid aughts. That was a lifetime bucket show even with him nowhere near the peak of his powers. I feel so fortunate to have seen him live at all.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 1:08 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Saw the Pogues with him in NYC on St Pat's in the mid aughts. That was a lifetime bucket show even with him nowhere near the peak of his powers. I feel so fortunate to have seen him live at all.
posted by gentlyepigrams at 1:08 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
The man was a genius.
The band were incredible.
.
I wish I had the brains and bravado to have pitched The Pogues’ jukebox musical. So many songs about leaving, surviving, wild times and declarations of love.
It starts, obviously, with The Body of the American, then Jimmy leaves the pub where he was born, there’s Streams of Whiskey, a Christmas Eve in NYC and it ends remembering A Rainy Night in Soho…
I mean, it’d be a travesty but, boy, would you coin it.
posted by stanf at 1:16 PM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
The band were incredible.
.
I wish I had the brains and bravado to have pitched The Pogues’ jukebox musical. So many songs about leaving, surviving, wild times and declarations of love.
It starts, obviously, with The Body of the American, then Jimmy leaves the pub where he was born, there’s Streams of Whiskey, a Christmas Eve in NYC and it ends remembering A Rainy Night in Soho…
I mean, it’d be a travesty but, boy, would you coin it.
posted by stanf at 1:16 PM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
You remember that foul evening when you heard the banshees howl
There was lousy drunken bastards singing Billy is in the bowl
They took you up to midnight mass and left you in the lurch
So you dropped a button in the plate and spewed up in the church
Now you'll sing a song of liberty for blacks and paks and jocks
And they'll take you from this dump you're in and stick you in a box
Then they'll take you to Cloughprior and shove you in the ground
But you'll stick your head back out and shout "we'll have another round"
At the graveside of Cuchulainn we'll kneel around and pray
And God is in His heaven, and Billy's down by the bay
posted by mike3k at 1:45 PM on November 30, 2023 [9 favorites]
There was lousy drunken bastards singing Billy is in the bowl
They took you up to midnight mass and left you in the lurch
So you dropped a button in the plate and spewed up in the church
Now you'll sing a song of liberty for blacks and paks and jocks
And they'll take you from this dump you're in and stick you in a box
Then they'll take you to Cloughprior and shove you in the ground
But you'll stick your head back out and shout "we'll have another round"
At the graveside of Cuchulainn we'll kneel around and pray
And God is in His heaven, and Billy's down by the bay
posted by mike3k at 1:45 PM on November 30, 2023 [9 favorites]
I saw the Pogues in Manchester in 1985. The support band finished about half past ten. The Pogues came on at one o'clock, by which time everyone in the place - including them - was roaring drunk. Absolutely brilliant night.
posted by Cardinal Fang at 1:53 PM on November 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
posted by Cardinal Fang at 1:53 PM on November 30, 2023 [6 favorites]
I'm not sure I'll survive next year's St. Paddy's Day, boys
posted by elkevelvet at 2:36 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by elkevelvet at 2:36 PM on November 30, 2023
James Fearnley's memoir is a close-up view of classic-era Shane-world;
TIL: "Black Zombie" was a vile cocktail he sometimes quaffed (gave me headache just reading about it);
also: Shane was for a time obsessed with traditional Greek folk music, especially from the Isle of Crete.
posted by ovvl at 2:44 PM on November 30, 2023
TIL: "Black Zombie" was a vile cocktail he sometimes quaffed (gave me headache just reading about it);
also: Shane was for a time obsessed with traditional Greek folk music, especially from the Isle of Crete.
posted by ovvl at 2:44 PM on November 30, 2023
The Dark Streets of London, live, 1985 This is how I saw them with Elvis Costello: who may have picked up a girlfriend from the band but who was at risk of getting upstaged by them.
posted by rongorongo at 3:03 PM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
posted by rongorongo at 3:03 PM on November 30, 2023 [3 favorites]
The Baltimore PD should throw his wake, Shane all laid out on the pool table.
Gross!
I liked the Wire and all, but shane was a dude with some pretty clear politics and philosophy, and no way does an organization like that get to claim a piece of him.
posted by St. Sorryass at 3:04 PM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
Gross!
I liked the Wire and all, but shane was a dude with some pretty clear politics and philosophy, and no way does an organization like that get to claim a piece of him.
posted by St. Sorryass at 3:04 PM on November 30, 2023 [8 favorites]
Shane!
The energetic 80s video for Streams of Whiskey:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPpGp_J3z2A
See also: Waxie's Dargle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NOsin1SPUw
12 years later...
The vulnerability of Shane MacGowan And The Popes' Danny Boy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdZkKDOXdgI
posted by Speculatist at 3:25 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
The energetic 80s video for Streams of Whiskey:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPpGp_J3z2A
See also: Waxie's Dargle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NOsin1SPUw
12 years later...
The vulnerability of Shane MacGowan And The Popes' Danny Boy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdZkKDOXdgI
posted by Speculatist at 3:25 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
My older brother would come home from university with all kinds of awesome new albums and 12” singles when I was in high school and in 1985 Rum Sodomy & the Lash was a bit like a window opening on the stagnant, post-new wave boring goth posturing that my 17 year-old musical tastes were stuck in at the time, into new possibilities of Fun! Drinking! Quality playing of real instruments! Many songs from that album went on mixed tapes that year and many years after.
I kind of went a bit too far in the paisley/neo-psychedelia direction after that, but that’s another story.
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posted by chococat at 3:38 PM on November 30, 2023
I kind of went a bit too far in the paisley/neo-psychedelia direction after that, but that’s another story.
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posted by chococat at 3:38 PM on November 30, 2023
Back around 1990/91 the Pogues played a show in Vancouver and afterward Spider Steacy came to the bar I was in and asked me if he could sit at the table I was at. After some drinking, and him learning I knew who he was and was a fan of the Pogues, he asked me why I wasn't at the show and when I said, "No Shane," he got a little heated and said something along the lines of, "Shane would fuckin' punch yeh in the face for that." When I added that for the price of the ticket I could sit in this bar and drink all night long, he smiled, said something like, "Aye, I hear that," and we clinked pint mugs.
To Shane.
posted by house-goblin at 3:45 PM on November 30, 2023 [12 favorites]
To Shane.
posted by house-goblin at 3:45 PM on November 30, 2023 [12 favorites]
In 1984, a friend ran into the store I worked at and yelled at me “The Pogues, man the Pogues! You’ve got to fucking listen to this album!” then ran out. So what could I do? I bought Red Roses for Me, and I too lost my mind.
posted by GenjiandProust at 4:01 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by GenjiandProust at 4:01 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Been a fan since a roommate turned me on to the Pogues. Always sad that I never caught them live. Rest well Shane.
posted by Thrakburzug at 4:07 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by Thrakburzug at 4:07 PM on November 30, 2023
Hi wife Victoria May Clarke:
I don’t know how to say this so I am just going to say it. Shane who will always be the light that I hold before me and the measure of my dreams and the love ❤️ of my life and the most beautiful soul and beautiful angel and the sun and the moon and the start and end of everything that I hold dear has gone to be with Jesus and Mary and his beautiful mother Therese. I am blessed beyond words to have met him and to have loved him and to have been so endlessly and unconditionally loved by him and to have had so many years of life and love ❤️ and joy and fun and laughter and so many adventures. There’s no way to describe the loss that I am feeling and the longing for just one more of his smiles that lit up my world. Thank you thank you thank you thank you for your presence in this world you made it so very bright and you gave so much joy to so many people with your heart and soul and your music. You will live in my heart forever. Rave on in the garden all wet with rain that you loved so much ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️ You meant the world to me.posted by kensington314 at 4:29 PM on November 30, 2023 [9 favorites]
It's always funny as a Pogues fan because my absolute favorite Pogues song, "Tuesday Morning," comes from that period when they had kicked Shane out and most Pogues fans don't really like those albums. I think they're still a great band without him, but (like with Pink Floyd's first few post-Syd Barrett albums) you can tell that they're more of an actual pop band than a force of nature.
Maybe Shane was the Irish Syd Barrett in his own way? He came from a different folk tradition and had radically different substance preferences, but he was that same sort of scene-altering character.
posted by HunterFelt at 4:39 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Maybe Shane was the Irish Syd Barrett in his own way? He came from a different folk tradition and had radically different substance preferences, but he was that same sort of scene-altering character.
posted by HunterFelt at 4:39 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
. He was a poet. RIP.
posted by but no cigar at 4:49 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by but no cigar at 4:49 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
The AllMusic review of Hell's Ditch says, "...many of the songs are all but sunk by Shane's sloppy, mush-mouthed, and booze-addled delivery." And thought, "Do you even Pogue, mahone? That's kind of his thing."
my absolute favorite Pogues song, "Tuesday Morning,"
That's a great song, and the only post-Shane song I like.
that period when they had kicked Shane out
If you get kicked out of an Irish band for drinking too much and substance abuse, brother, you have a problem.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:06 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
my absolute favorite Pogues song, "Tuesday Morning,"
That's a great song, and the only post-Shane song I like.
that period when they had kicked Shane out
If you get kicked out of an Irish band for drinking too much and substance abuse, brother, you have a problem.
posted by kirkaracha at 5:06 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Great '60s retro video for "Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah"
posted by kirkaracha at 5:08 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by kirkaracha at 5:08 PM on November 30, 2023
The song that immediately comes to mind is Thousands Are Sailing, which manages to break my heart pretty much every time I hear it. He didn't write but he sure owns it.That was the one that came to mind for me, too, and the opening stanza seems bleakly fitting:
The island, it is silent nowposted by Nerd of the North at 5:36 PM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
But the ghosts still haunt the waves
And the torch lights up a famished man
Who fortune could not save
The Washington Post has a piece on MacGowan by a guy who I kinda-sorta knew at the Tufts Daily: https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/2023/11/30/shane-macgowan-fairytale-new-york-pogues-death/
posted by wenestvedt at 6:01 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by wenestvedt at 6:01 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
The two Pogues albums I had (on CD, so you can figure out how old I am) were If I Should Fall From Grace With God and Rum, Sodomy and the Lash. Both are excellent, but I remember having to buy the second specially from Sam the Record Man in Vancouver—it was expensive because it was an “export.” (Ah the 1990s.) It was so worth it—there are many good songs on there, but I agree with the person upthread who specifically mentioned “And the Band Played Waltzing Matilda;” it will rip out your heart and stomp on it with its raw poignancy. I’ve never heard a better version of that song; it sounds like it was made for Shane’s voice.
.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 6:41 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
.
posted by hurdy gurdy girl at 6:41 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
He was a really great songwriter. I even love Gabrielle by his early band the Nips, which is just straight-up melodic punk, without the Irish-y bits. I guess it's cool now to not like Fairytale of New York, but I consider myself a pretty true-blue Pogues fan, and I really love that song.
I guess this one doesn't hit me as hard as some other recent musicians' deaths, because it feels a bit inevitable. I knew he was sick, and there is nothing about his persona or oeuvre that would lead one to expect that he would live a long and healthy life. But it's still really sad.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:59 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
I guess this one doesn't hit me as hard as some other recent musicians' deaths, because it feels a bit inevitable. I knew he was sick, and there is nothing about his persona or oeuvre that would lead one to expect that he would live a long and healthy life. But it's still really sad.
posted by ArbitraryAndCapricious at 6:59 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Very sad.
Red Roses for Me in particular is one of those albums where every song is such a banger and you want to go back and play it again but the next one is just as good so you keep going until you've listened to the whole thing. Then you go back and play them all again.
Pretty sure Nick Cave praised Shane as the best lyricist going around and I have yet to be convinced otherwise.
posted by UbuRoivas at 7:09 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
Red Roses for Me in particular is one of those albums where every song is such a banger and you want to go back and play it again but the next one is just as good so you keep going until you've listened to the whole thing. Then you go back and play them all again.
Pretty sure Nick Cave praised Shane as the best lyricist going around and I have yet to be convinced otherwise.
posted by UbuRoivas at 7:09 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
First I drank the whiskey, then I drank the gin
I tried to make the toilet but I broke my fucking shin
The next thing that I knew I was in London in the rain
Staggering up the platform on the boat train
posted by oldnumberseven at 7:14 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
I tried to make the toilet but I broke my fucking shin
The next thing that I knew I was in London in the rain
Staggering up the platform on the boat train
posted by oldnumberseven at 7:14 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
The song that immediately comes to mind is Thousands Are Sailing, which manages to break my heart pretty much every time I hear it. He didn't write but he sure owns it.Third-ing this comment. I'm of Irish descent but felt almost no connection to my roots until I listened to that song and was struck by, I don't know, the sheer enormity of emigrating in the 19th century. My ancestors saw some shit and Shane's delivery made me feel it.
My favorite of late has been "The Body of an American. "
Some of my closest friends in college could not be persuaded to listen much to The Pogues, but they were my favorite of all favorites from Rum through Herb. I'm gutted.
Bonus - Shane and Sinead
posted by Joey Michaels at 7:40 PM on November 30, 2023 [5 favorites]
Bonus - Shane and Sinead yt
further to my little anecdote about almost getting trampled by Mr. MacGowan, I crossed paths with him again a few nights later at the taping of this TV performance which, I cannot tell a lie, wasn't really that impressive. Certainly nothing close to the times I saw both MacGowan and O'Connor in proper concert situations.
Lou Reed and Bjork were also on the bill that evening and neither of them were particularly memorable either. Made for TV rock usually sucks.
posted by philip-random at 8:15 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
further to my little anecdote about almost getting trampled by Mr. MacGowan, I crossed paths with him again a few nights later at the taping of this TV performance which, I cannot tell a lie, wasn't really that impressive. Certainly nothing close to the times I saw both MacGowan and O'Connor in proper concert situations.
Lou Reed and Bjork were also on the bill that evening and neither of them were particularly memorable either. Made for TV rock usually sucks.
posted by philip-random at 8:15 PM on November 30, 2023 [1 favorite]
and oh yeah, a Neil Diamond cover, because who better to sing an ode to a cheap (thus popular) sparkling wine from my home province of British Columbia. In fact it's maybe the first booze I ever got sick on.
posted by philip-random at 8:23 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
posted by philip-random at 8:23 PM on November 30, 2023 [2 favorites]
Is this the guy what wrote that one Christmas song?
posted by DeepSeaHaggis at 11:50 PM on November 30, 2023
posted by DeepSeaHaggis at 11:50 PM on November 30, 2023
I am blessed beyond words to have met him and to have loved him
And he you, Victoria. And he you.
posted by Paul Slade at 12:16 AM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
And he you, Victoria. And he you.
posted by Paul Slade at 12:16 AM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
An amazing songwriter. If I Should Fall From Grace With God is a touchstone album for me. There are few I've come across that can place standards alongside originals and you can't tell the difference. Robert Fisher, Shane McGowan, Nick Cave.
.
posted by analoghotdog at 1:04 AM on December 1, 2023
.
posted by analoghotdog at 1:04 AM on December 1, 2023
Anecdote: Somebody approaches Shane and asks what he thought of "The Turkey Song - by the Damned" - Shane mishears the question and writes The Turkish Song of the Damned. His songs make so many mentions of other songs: When The Roses Bloom Again in Dark Streets of London, The Rare Old Mountain Dew or Galway Bay in Fairy Tale of New York for example. - his Guardian Obit (linked in the FPP) mentioned that "he learnt a song a day" to perform them from the age of 3. Its an usual experience to be exposed to that many songs being performed around you and by you as you grow up - and a rare skill to use all that groundwork to fashion something absolutely new but with old sounding roots.
posted by rongorongo at 1:51 AM on December 1, 2023 [5 favorites]
posted by rongorongo at 1:51 AM on December 1, 2023 [5 favorites]
Its an usual experience to be exposed to that many songs being performed around you and by you as you grow up - and a rare skill to use all that groundwork to fashion something absolutely new but with old sounding roots.
See also: Bob Dylan.
posted by Paul Slade at 2:10 AM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
See also: Bob Dylan.
posted by Paul Slade at 2:10 AM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
.
posted by inexorably_forward at 2:46 AM on December 1, 2023
posted by inexorably_forward at 2:46 AM on December 1, 2023
If you should stumble across a copy of his autobiography, pick it up.
posted by aspersioncast at 4:55 AM on December 1, 2023
posted by aspersioncast at 4:55 AM on December 1, 2023
I spoke to a friend of mine last night, who first gave me some Pogues (which blew me away), and she opined this:
“Shane knew, like an Irishman, he was going to Hell for his sins, and so his soul reached up for something to give to Satan to pay his way to a better level, and there was Kissinger. He got there, handed over Kissinger’s soul, and walked into Heaven smiling and asking where the whiskey was kept.”
I like the image of St. Peter staring in horror at Shane walking in and saying, “ay, Pete ya fuckface, where can I get me some half-decent shite to drink?”
posted by mephron at 6:11 AM on December 1, 2023 [9 favorites]
“Shane knew, like an Irishman, he was going to Hell for his sins, and so his soul reached up for something to give to Satan to pay his way to a better level, and there was Kissinger. He got there, handed over Kissinger’s soul, and walked into Heaven smiling and asking where the whiskey was kept.”
I like the image of St. Peter staring in horror at Shane walking in and saying, “ay, Pete ya fuckface, where can I get me some half-decent shite to drink?”
posted by mephron at 6:11 AM on December 1, 2023 [9 favorites]
Guy I know sings it as "You scumbag you maggot, you taped over Taggart".
FWIW, I sing that as "You scumbag, you maggot, you cheap, lousy braggart", which I flatter myself works just as well.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:55 AM on December 1, 2023 [5 favorites]
FWIW, I sing that as "You scumbag, you maggot, you cheap, lousy braggart", which I flatter myself works just as well.
posted by It's Never Lurgi at 8:55 AM on December 1, 2023 [5 favorites]
David Simon & friends are working on the book for a Pogues jukebox musical (Simon's own Twitter thread).
Let's hope it's more Conor McPherson's Girl From The North Country and less Ben Elton's We Will Rock You.
I suppose if anyone can make this work, it's Simon & Co. I'm still nervous, though ...
posted by Paul Slade at 8:56 AM on December 1, 2023
Let's hope it's more Conor McPherson's Girl From The North Country and less Ben Elton's We Will Rock You.
I suppose if anyone can make this work, it's Simon & Co. I'm still nervous, though ...
posted by Paul Slade at 8:56 AM on December 1, 2023
Edna St. Vincent Millay's poem could have been written for him.
My candle burns at both ends;
It will not last the night:
But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends—
It gives a lovely light!
posted by night_train at 9:10 AM on December 1, 2023 [2 favorites]
My candle burns at both ends;
It will not last the night:
But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends—
It gives a lovely light!
posted by night_train at 9:10 AM on December 1, 2023 [2 favorites]
Eric barely spoke English when he moved in, about as much as my high school French, but he loved his cassette of Rum, Sodomy and the Lash and it was great fun seeing him get more fluent and like the songs even more.
This reminded me of the guy in Better Off Dead.
This reminded me of the guy in Better Off Dead.
Two brothers...one speaks no English, the other learned English from watching "The Wide World of Sports." So you tell me...which is better, speaking no English at all, or speaking Howard Cosell?posted by kirkaracha at 9:57 AM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
May the wind that blows65 is young. But he seemed to live his whole life building to exactly this end. The promise of being doomed was in his voice, in his eyes, in every lyric he wrote and every note he sang. He lit the candle at both ends with a fucking flamethrower. He was born raging against the dying of the light.
from haunted graves
never bring you misery;
may the angels bright
watch you tonight
and keep you while you sleep.
For those who prefer a more upbeat sendoff:
I have cursed, bled and sworn,posted by Pallas Athena at 11:30 AM on December 1, 2023 [3 favorites]
jumped bail and landed up in jail
Life has often tried to stretch me but the rope always went slack
And now that I've a pile,
I'll go down to the Chelsea
I'll walk in on my feet, but I'll leave there on my back
I'm going, I am going
Any which way the wind may be blowing
I am going, I am going
Where streams of whiskey are flowing
Steve Earle, in the liner notes of some release or another of "If I Should Fall from Grace with God."
By Steve Earleposted by kensington314 at 11:38 AM on December 1, 2023 [14 favorites]
I met the Pogues in London, in EMI Abbey Road studios in 1986 while they were recording demos for what would become "If I Should Fall from Grace with God". They were trying to get out of their publishing deal at the time and had booked themselves into the third floor "penthouse" studio under the pseudo-pseudonym "The Terry Woods Quartet". . . . .
It was late, well after midnight and the journey out to St. John's Wood through an impossibly proverbial London fog took on the air of a secret mission in a B&W spy movie, all very hush-hush and deliciously clandestine. I presented myself to the uniformed security guard and I actually caught myself whispering as I announced "Steve Earle to see the Terry Woods Quarter in the penthouse." The elderly uniformed guard looked at me like I was a fucking idiot. "Oh, the Pogues? Top of the stairs turn right. You can't miss it. Half of fuckin' London's up there."
For the next couple of years we bumped into each other now and again in the middle of the night on one side of the pond or the other. Well, okay, sometimes it was a little harder than a bump. By the time we recorded "Johnny Come Lately" together (for my "Copperhead Road" Album), "If I Should Fall from Grace with God" was out and the boys were playing six nights during the week of St. Patricks Day at the old Town and Country club in Kentish Town. It was a magical week. Kirsty MacColl was there to sing "Fairytale of New York" with Shane every night and the encores included "Message to Rudy" featuring the Specials horn section and "I Fought the Law" with Joe Strummer himself fronting the band. I went out and sang "Johnny" with the band on each of the first three shows and then, on the morning of the fourth day, having worked out most of the kinks in front of 6000 people we recorded the track at Livingstone studios. We stayed up all night that night (like every other night) and the next morning Spider poured me into a cab for Heathrow and I only just made my flight home to the States. That night was the big St. Paddy's finale at the Town and Country. Somehow, in the confusion, no one bothered to inform Terry Woods, who had insisted on introducing me every night, that I was no longer in the country.
"Please Welcome" he rasped, "a good friend of ours from the great State of Texas -- STEVE EARLE!
And fuckin' nothin' happened because I was already halfway across the Atlantic nursing a hangover that registered about a 7.4 on the Richter scale. It took me about a week to recover and I'm sure some of the damage that I sustained that week was structural and permanent. But it was worth it. For four minutes on four consecutive nights in the Spring of 1987 I had been a Pogue.
Steve Earle
Fairview, Tn. May 2004
I didn't get the memo that it wasn't cool to love "Fairytale." Don't come at Kirsty.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 4:06 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 4:06 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
(I think it’s finally cool to like it again, as long as you respect other people’s reasons for not liking it).
posted by ducky l'orange at 4:36 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by ducky l'orange at 4:36 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
If other people don't like it, that's their business, but the comments in the Kissinger post stating that nobody liked it got my hackles up.
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 4:51 PM on December 1, 2023
posted by computech_apolloniajames at 4:51 PM on December 1, 2023
I deeply love a lot of Pogues songs and 99% of Fairytale but the slur in it does make it a bit like somebody made you an amazing, beautiful cake and then dropped a dead rat on it, and throwing "slut" in for good measure doesn't help.
I fully get that it's in character for the dysfunctional couple depicted in the song but it still unnecessarily takes you out of it, you know?
posted by jason_steakums at 7:33 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
I fully get that it's in character for the dysfunctional couple depicted in the song but it still unnecessarily takes you out of it, you know?
posted by jason_steakums at 7:33 PM on December 1, 2023 [1 favorite]
There are few I've come across that can place standards alongside originals and you can't tell the difference. Robert Fisher, Shane McGowan, Nick Cave.
On that note, the single of What a Wonderful World is one of my favourites.
The duet they did to cover the song is amazing in itself, but on the b-side Shane & Nick cover one of each other's songs, and it sounds like one of their own. Shane does Lucy, and Nick does Rainy Night in Soho.
posted by UbuRoivas at 8:30 PM on December 1, 2023 [2 favorites]
On that note, the single of What a Wonderful World is one of my favourites.
The duet they did to cover the song is amazing in itself, but on the b-side Shane & Nick cover one of each other's songs, and it sounds like one of their own. Shane does Lucy, and Nick does Rainy Night in Soho.
posted by UbuRoivas at 8:30 PM on December 1, 2023 [2 favorites]
I fully get that it's in character for the dysfunctional couple depicted in the song but it still unnecessarily takes you out of it, you know?
See, for me, it's the awkward substitutions that people make for the song's offending word that take me out of it. It's not just a question of finding a word that (more or less) rhymes with "maggot" in the previous line - it needs to be one which those particular people in that particular time would plausibly reach for in anger. "Braggart" fails all these tests.
[I do like the "Taggart" suggestion some made above, though. At least there's smidgeon of wit about that.]
posted by Paul Slade at 12:15 AM on December 2, 2023 [2 favorites]
See, for me, it's the awkward substitutions that people make for the song's offending word that take me out of it. It's not just a question of finding a word that (more or less) rhymes with "maggot" in the previous line - it needs to be one which those particular people in that particular time would plausibly reach for in anger. "Braggart" fails all these tests.
[I do like the "Taggart" suggestion some made above, though. At least there's smidgeon of wit about that.]
posted by Paul Slade at 12:15 AM on December 2, 2023 [2 favorites]
Nick Cave's added a post about MacGowan to his Red Hand Files.
posted by Paul Slade at 4:51 AM on December 2, 2023 [4 favorites]
posted by Paul Slade at 4:51 AM on December 2, 2023 [4 favorites]
See, for me, it's the awkward substitutions that people make for the song's offending word that take me out of it. It's not just a question of finding a word that (more or less) rhymes with "maggot" in the previous line - it needs to be one which those particular people in that particular time would plausibly reach for in anger.
Oh yeah I definitely get that too! I don't think there really is a great solution for it. Even if someone recorded a great version of it with a perfect substitution that worked it still wouldn't be the definitive version with the specific iconic performances of the original so it just sort of comes to an unsatisfying non-answer. It's not even like an old movie or book for me where it's easier to roll with some not great things that were of the time, because I just connect with music in a different way than that.
Honestly The Pogues do very well for the time to only have one song I can think of that has this issue, the thing that sucks is that Fairytale is probably the best song by far that gives me pause like that, so it's too bad that it will always have that asterisk on it for me.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:14 AM on December 2, 2023
Oh yeah I definitely get that too! I don't think there really is a great solution for it. Even if someone recorded a great version of it with a perfect substitution that worked it still wouldn't be the definitive version with the specific iconic performances of the original so it just sort of comes to an unsatisfying non-answer. It's not even like an old movie or book for me where it's easier to roll with some not great things that were of the time, because I just connect with music in a different way than that.
Honestly The Pogues do very well for the time to only have one song I can think of that has this issue, the thing that sucks is that Fairytale is probably the best song by far that gives me pause like that, so it's too bad that it will always have that asterisk on it for me.
posted by jason_steakums at 6:14 AM on December 2, 2023
Some may find this 99-comment thread from 2017, mostly discussing the f-slur in the lyrics of Fairytale, of interest.
What I said then:
What makes the f-slur hard to replace in that particular line is that the the rhyme is perfect and, just in physical terms, the consonants make it feel weirdly satisfying to sing. So we have to find a substitute line that preserves those characteristics and also provides the kick of using a swearword in a Christmas song.
"You scumbag, you sucker,
you cheap motherfucker"
"You scumbag, you canker,
you filthy old wanker"
etc. etc. etc. But more than ever, now, it's vital to make a substitution that would please the departed spirits of both Kristy and Shane. So nothing too clever, and for god's sake nothing clean.
posted by Pallas Athena at 4:25 PM on December 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
What I said then:
What makes the f-slur hard to replace in that particular line is that the the rhyme is perfect and, just in physical terms, the consonants make it feel weirdly satisfying to sing. So we have to find a substitute line that preserves those characteristics and also provides the kick of using a swearword in a Christmas song.
"You scumbag, you sucker,
you cheap motherfucker"
"You scumbag, you canker,
you filthy old wanker"
etc. etc. etc. But more than ever, now, it's vital to make a substitution that would please the departed spirits of both Kristy and Shane. So nothing too clever, and for god's sake nothing clean.
posted by Pallas Athena at 4:25 PM on December 2, 2023 [3 favorites]
Nick Cave performing A Rainy Night in Soho at the funeral of Shane MacGowan
posted by rollick at 11:20 AM on December 9, 2023 [1 favorite]
posted by rollick at 11:20 AM on December 9, 2023 [1 favorite]
Shane MacGowan urged Johnny Depp to "forgive" Amber Heard (link)
posted by Saxon Kane at 6:41 AM on December 10, 2023
posted by Saxon Kane at 6:41 AM on December 10, 2023
Shane wrote about a dozen songs which would have been perfect to play at his funeral - here he is getting sent off by a cover of Fairy-tale of New York.
posted by rongorongo at 5:10 AM on December 21, 2023
posted by rongorongo at 5:10 AM on December 21, 2023
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