A nipple and some jockstraps

January 30, 2024 9:46 AM

This last weekend, Seattle's Joint Enforcement Team (JET), which is a coalition of Seattle Police, Fire, the state Liquor and Cannabis Board (LCB), and others, raided four gay bars, among other nightlife venues, over "lewd conduct". They found a bartender’s exposed nipple and a few people wearing jockstraps.

"Neither Cuff nor The Eagle had ever been cited for alcohol- or violence-related offenses. In this case, clothing was the sole issue. An open letter both owners signed calls for a thorough investigation into why the JET inspected two gay bars in as many nights."

These are both longstanding, safe gay bars beloved in the community. The owners report a pattern of harrassment by the Seattle Police Department over the years.

Meanwhile, the Seattle Police Department has claimed to be too understaffed to investigate sexual assaults.

posted by splitpeasoup (56 comments total)

And yet there are still people who, every June, will whine: "but why do we even need Pride parades? Don't we already have gay marriage?"

This. Shit like this is why. Because people like this will always hate us.
posted by fight or flight at 9:56 AM on January 30 [78 favorites]

Of the 15 places enforcement inspected over the weekend, four were gay clubs, two were hookah lounges, one was a college bar, one was a hot dog stand, one was a music venue, one was a dive bar, another one was a bowling alley, another was a bar & grill, one was a roller rink, another was some weird lounge that has no internet presence, and they strafed the people who sell clothes on Pine Street.

I’m really not sure what to make of all this. When I started that sentence, I really did not see it ending that way. The writer may also be able to say the same.
posted by ricochet biscuit at 10:05 AM on January 30 [11 favorites]

I read about this yesterday. Bullshit straight out of the Fifties. They obviously were targeting pretty specifically, and apparently all in the Cap Hill queer district, too. Community intimidation, pure and simple. I'm surprised the Seattle Police are willing to be this bold given the tendency of that part of the city to declare itself an autonomous zone.
posted by hippybear at 10:10 AM on January 30 [12 favorites]

And people claim there is any reason whatsoever to give public money to these dangerous assholes.
posted by Artw at 10:23 AM on January 30 [17 favorites]

Cops who end up joining ABC or other alcohol enforcement boards are typically zealots. In SF, they tried to shut down all-ages music venues by manufacturing a rule out of thin air that 50% of sales must come from food because, technically, these places operate under a restaurant license.
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 10:23 AM on January 30 [7 favorites]

Exposed Nipple would be a good name for the right kind of venue.
posted by philip-random at 10:39 AM on January 30 [11 favorites]

Meanwhile in SPD:

“Even crediting your explanation as true, that does not excuse the callousness of your comments,” the commanders wrote to Auderer in a memo The Seattle Times obtained from the Police Department. “Nor does it explain your full-bellied laughter” while discussing Kandula’s death in a South Lake Union crosswalk only hours earlier, the night of Jan. 23, 2023.

The leaders recommended Diaz punish Auderer with a minimum of 30 days off without pay — the most severe SPD discipline short of termination — or fire him.

Which sounds like actually taking action but let’s face it neither of those things is going to happen.
posted by Artw at 10:45 AM on January 30 [8 favorites]

I'm surprised the Seattle Police are willing to be this bold given the tendency of that part of the city to declare itself an autonomous zone.

Alternatively, that could be precisely why they chose to make trouble in that area specifically.
posted by AdamCSnider at 10:47 AM on January 30 [12 favorites]

between this and the ridiculousness in st. louis with the cop crashing into a gay bar and the shenanigans that followed, it definitely feels like there's a concerted effort to remove queer spaces.
posted by i used to be someone else at 11:07 AM on January 30 [16 favorites]

The two big things you need to know about SPD are that they are not from Seattle and they have absolute hatred and contempt for everyone in Seattle.

The third thing would be they operate under no civilian oversight as their actual leadership is SPOG, which is the police union and basically a fascist gang.
posted by Artw at 11:09 AM on January 30 [49 favorites]

Also the drag ban in Tennessee.
posted by joannemerriam at 11:09 AM on January 30 [2 favorites]

a bartender’s exposed nipple and a few people wearing jockstraps

Shoot, a fella could have a pretty good weekend in Vegas Seattle with all that stuff.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:12 AM on January 30 [9 favorites]

It was great to be queer from 2015-2016. I'll always be thankful for those 18 months
posted by rhymedirective at 11:15 AM on January 30 [14 favorites]

what's funny about that is the only time Kubrick accepted censorship was changing Dallas to Vegas.

I got to agree this shit s straight out of the twenties, the 30s, the 40s, the 50s, the '60s, the 70s, the 80s, the 90s, the 2000s, well 21st century.
posted by clavdivs at 11:16 AM on January 30 [10 favorites]

And yet there are still people who, every June, will whine: "but why do we even need Pride parades? Don't we already have gay marriage?"

This. Shit like this is why. Because people like this will always hate us.

In my city it's, "Why did you ban cops from your Pride parade?" and the right trying to make that of all things a civil rights issue.
posted by thecjm at 11:18 AM on January 30 [37 favorites]

How much does the state of Washington pay for police misconduct? In this article from 2022, the Seattle Times claims more than 100 million in the five years previous. "Police misconduct" is a broad term, of course. These costs are barely mentioned by states and muncipalities...but every taxpayer, no matter what race, creed, nationality or orientation pays for this. The way to stop police abuse is to keep adding up the numbers and making sure that the taxpayers realize the true cost of abusive policing.
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/law-justice/police-misconduct-is-costing-washington-taxpayers-millions-is-george-floyds-murder-one-of-the-reasons/
"The data shows that the number and size of settlements have grown precipitously over that time period — from $1.15 million in 2017 to the more than $34 million in 2021, a 2,990% increase. Nearly two-thirds of the total $100 million has been paid since the May 2020 murder of George Floyd by Minneapolis officers renewed outrage over unchecked police brutality and bolstered the Black Lives Matter movement."
This link goes to several stories from last fall that claims misconduct costs nationwide were 3.2 BILLION over the previous 10 years. And, this probably does not include the costs of increasing insurance policies for states/municipalities, the army of lawyers that municipalities need to "defend" themselves, etc.
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=how+much+does+police+misconduct+cost+taxpayers
posted by pthomas745 at 11:32 AM on January 30 [5 favorites]

As the owner of a nipple, should I be concerned?
posted by Keith Talent at 12:23 PM on January 30 [9 favorites]

Jesus, these fuckers. Every time there’s a notable crime in my area that’s covered by our micro news site, the comments section is drowning in whining about “this is what happens when you defund the poliiiiiice” despite the fact that there has never been any successful defunding. Not to mention our new city council member is the more conservative one who ran last year. I absolutely believe this is revenge for what happened on Cap Hill during the BLM protests.

Also I can’t believe they targeted the Eagle.
posted by kitten kaboodle at 12:26 PM on January 30 [19 favorites]

I'm sure some of the raid was just curiosity to see what the leather bars look like on the inside.
posted by hippybear at 12:30 PM on January 30 [5 favorites]

uh the easier way to do that is to just, like, go in
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 12:31 PM on January 30 [7 favorites]

In their off hours? In their own clothes? People might get ideas.
posted by hippybear at 12:33 PM on January 30 [5 favorites]

i assure you that no one who any spd cop knows is ever going to see them at a bar in seattle
posted by bombastic lowercase pronouncements at 12:42 PM on January 30 [9 favorites]

A nipple and some jockstraps, beer and a shot
Seattle threw a shot glass in a buffalo squeeze
posted by Reverend John at 1:11 PM on January 30 [3 favorites]

Reminiscent of this incident in Australia
posted by ThePlateThatHoldsTheBeans at 1:14 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

Was it a male-presenting nipple? I thought those were supposed to be fine :sip:
posted by I-Write-Essays at 1:20 PM on January 30 [5 favorites]

Nullagent on Mastodon has some updates
posted by Suedeltica at 2:38 PM on January 30 [5 favorites]

(Reminder that urls aren’t automatically turned into links, but can easily be made linkable (thus contributing to site accessibility) by using the “link” button in the quick-access edit buttons immediately below the comment input window. (The link button is the one on the far right of the row of buttons just under the comment box.) Linking urls properly ourselves saves mod time for actual site moderation, too!)
posted by eviemath at 2:42 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

Was it a male-presenting nipple? I thought those were supposed to be fine :sip:

gd it, you beat me to it!!!
posted by praemunire at 3:13 PM on January 30 [3 favorites]

Unmasked at last: All Seattle cops at fascist Jan. 6 rally have been identified
posted by Artw at 3:47 PM on January 30 [7 favorites]

Are jockstraps specifically called out or was the person only wearing the jockstrap exposing the, uh, intergluteal cleft?

'Cause I'm thinking the cod piece was recently on the rise and maybe the black Russian should be the response.
posted by Mitheral at 3:54 PM on January 30 [2 favorites]

I don't know that the actual charges have yet been posted to any public portal, but the article talking about the charges is right there in the FPP. Maybe you can find more information if you search deeper?
posted by hippybear at 3:56 PM on January 30

Something that sticks out to me about this is that it happened in a "blue" city on the coast which is where many (often kind, thoughtful, well-meaning, generally liberal!) people say queer people should go to be safe, but it isn't safe. In this case violent agents of the state showed up to repress people who were being queer in public . Nowhere is safe for queer people until everywhere is safe for queer people and the police make everyone, especially marginalized people, a lot less safe.
posted by an octopus IRL at 4:39 PM on January 30 [15 favorites]

The thing is even the bluest city is bound by some kind of evil universal law to have a shitass corporate dem major, a nakedly fascist and corrupt police force that he or she is terrified off and a highly influential business lobby who’s main function is ensuring no public money ever be spent on anything other than the fashy police ever.
posted by Artw at 4:58 PM on January 30 [8 favorites]

See also: Seattle NIMBY tried to close a nude, primarily gay beach on Lake Washington last year.
posted by sbutler at 5:37 PM on January 30 [9 favorites]

I've read the linked article again and these are the only mentions of jockstraps:

He’s waiting on a call from them about the jockstraps and a potential citation.

Cuff staff have hall-monitored fashion choices, banning jockstraps and asking patrons to pull up their pants to hide exposed cracks.

People can play kickball in their jockstraps at nearby Cal Anderson Park, but they could risk a citation for walking into a Capitol Hill bar.

Maybe I just can't parse it properly but I can't figure out whether people were just wearing jock straps or they had other clothing. It's not a scene I'm familiar with so maybe a better question is "Is it common in these spaces to see people only wearing jock straps over their groin and buttocks? Or are jockstraps worn over/under other clothing?"
posted by Mitheral at 6:23 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

It's a leather bar. There will be men there wearing attire that might be just a leather vest, a jock strap, and leather boots. Variations upon this. Substitute tiny briefs, possibly made of leather...

Guys go into spaces like this wearing fetish gear of various sorts and hang out. Depending on the space, there might be areas in which sex is taking place, but most of it will be wearing the correct costume and how much cruising for sexual contact in or out of the space varies with the individual.
posted by hippybear at 6:35 PM on January 30 [5 favorites]

Is it common in these spaces to see people only wearing jock straps over their groin and buttocks? Or are jockstraps worn over/under other clothing?

I have the same question about the people playing kickball in their jockstraps at Cal Anderson Park.
posted by kirkaracha at 6:42 PM on January 30 [2 favorites]

A nipple and some jockstraps

No home should be out one or two...
posted by y2karl at 6:43 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

"Is it common in these spaces to see people only wearing jock straps over their groin and buttocks?

Yes. Jockstraps don’t cover the butt, though. Kind of their whole raison d’etre in gay spaces, generally.

Or are jockstraps worn over/under other clothing?"

Under? Sure, I guess, but usually if guys are going out wearing a jockstrap, it’s to show off. Over? I have never seen that in my life and cannot imagine a single reason why anyone ever would.
posted by rhymedirective at 7:39 PM on January 30

The "jockstrap over the clothes" turns into a codpiece, which is a different sort of social public sexual display entirely.
posted by hippybear at 7:46 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

Over? I have never seen that in my life and cannot imagine a single reason why anyone ever would.

Yet superheroes do it all the time.
posted by kirkaracha at 8:18 PM on January 30 [1 favorite]

What is going on with the SPD? City of Seattle settles BLM protesters’ lawsuit for $10 million. They shot flash grenades at a ton of people who just happened to be reporting on, photographing or watching the protests, not even protestors. For some the injuries were horrific.
posted by caddis at 9:16 PM on January 30 [8 favorites]

People, people--codpieces are not jockstraps. Superheroes do not wear jockstraps--some of them wear codpieces.

I will die on this hill.
posted by rhymedirective at 6:45 AM on January 31 [1 favorite]

the thing going on with the spd is the same thing going on with every single gang of blue-wearing thugs bearing cheap metal shields across the country

those fuckers shouldn't be at pride.
posted by i used to be someone else at 8:51 AM on January 31 [4 favorites]

The Liquor Control Board has always been a bunch of hardasses about making sure that nudity and alcohol aren't within a quarter mile of each other. The best solution is to legalize shrooms so that they're distracted by three years of unnecessary committee meetings and infighting, only to eventually decide that they could be sold through the weed shops.
posted by Blue Jello Elf at 1:36 PM on January 31 [3 favorites]

The classic superhero outfit is a variation on the circus strongman/ bodybuilder outfit. The "underwear" is shorts or a onesie, typically worn on the outside of tights, and in non drawn form usually a looser fit than underwear would be.

I assume that if you wanted to have a 1920s strongman perform in your bar, that would not be allowed due to the dangerous nipples potentially on display, and notwithstanding the cruel absurdity of a policy that would ban such a thing in the 20 fucking 20s.
posted by surlyben at 1:54 PM on January 31 [2 favorites]

The best solution is to legalize shrooms so that they're distracted by three years of unnecessary committee meetings and infighting, only to eventually decide that they could be sold through the weed shops.

Yadda yadda yadda… mandatory shrooms therapy for all cops.
posted by Artw at 4:05 PM on January 31 [1 favorite]

the, uh, intergluteal cleft

I'd be up for drinks at the Intergluteal Cleft.
posted by Dip Flash at 5:08 PM on January 31 [1 favorite]

I'd get to the show early if Intergluteal Cleft was opening.
posted by inexorably_forward at 5:15 PM on January 31 [3 favorites]

Seattle’s Queer Community Demands Swift Change After Raids of Gay Bars -- A follow up article from The Stranger about the immediate backlash from the community and possible actions.
posted by Laura Palmer's Cold Dead Kiss at 6:52 AM on February 1

I'm glad to see actions being taken so quickly. This really need to be addressed so it can't happen again.
posted by hippybear at 7:24 AM on February 1

i work in queer nightlife in seattle. i have for a really long time.

there’s actually more to this that makes it even worse.

First, they visited more bars/clubs than are listed in a lot of the posts about this, they just only issued citations at some.

Second, they took fucking photos of a lot of people during this which is unsettling for a lot of reasons. this is discussed in this video. There’s legitimate concerns about these photos being used to put people and as part of public record etc. right wing harassment all that. Seattle is NOT better than firing a teacher for wearing a jock strap at a gay bar. the suburbs around it especially are not.

I had a job for years here where i wasn’t out, and 100% would have lost my job if i had been publicly outed. this isn’t san francisco as much as people want to pretend it is.

Third, this was all based on anonymous tips which they openly admit could be harassment but they “have to follow up on” sort of response.

Here is kind of the original post we all sent each other about this. i woke up sunday and monday to explosions of texts about this from everyone i know in the industry and community.

i kinda hate that i don’t share a lot of peoples confidence that even with a strong, unified response this kind of thing isn’t coming. Washington is actually super right wing, just in a bernie sanders shirt with some smarmy canned responses. it’s the land of the DINOs, and the city government has swung heavily right over the past few years in seattle.

I’ll probably be back later with more. i just wanted to add some ~on the ground~ commentary. everyone i know is really upset over this, but im old enough to remember when they’d try and shut down gay bars for playing gay porn. Again, this is the only state in the country that’s so puritanical you can’t even serve booze at strip clubs. You can’t even get most trans surgeries in seattle because the hospitals are too jesusified lmao.
posted by emptythought at 10:25 AM on February 1 [10 favorites]

The Stranger: Liquor and Cannabis Board Pauses Enforcement of Lewd Conduct Regulations

The Board also paused participation in Seattle’s Joint Enforcement Team, a coalition of police, fire, and other city departments, and will reopen rulemaking to amend or repeal the lewd conduct violation regulations.
...
and it will review its past practices and policies, including the use of photographs as evidence.

posted by away for regrooving at 8:42 PM on February 1 [3 favorites]

I'm really pleased with how quickly this has all moved forward toward maybe not happening again.

Sounds like bar patrons in the Seattle area need to start carrying a lot of pennies with them to the bars.
posted by hippybear at 11:25 AM on February 2 [1 favorite]

State Senate makes quick work, repeals ‘lewd laws’ governing bars, clubs
posted by Artw at 10:10 PM on February 7

[T]he 20 fucking 20s has a piquant ring to it.
posted by y2karl at 2:43 PM on February 18