Is Cuba Next?
April 11, 2003 2:00 PM Subscribe
Is Cuba Next? As long as you're cleaning up for Poppy, why not clean up for the Democrat's martyred Sun King at the same time?
Ambassador's actual quote:
"I think what is happening in Iraq is going to send a very positive signal, and it is a very good example for Cuba, where we saw that last week the Fidel Castro regime ordered the arrest of more than 80 citizens ... simply for their ideas," Mr. Hertell told local reporters.
Quote paraphrased by the Washington Times:
And in the Dominican Republic yesterday, U.S. Ambassador Hans Hertell was quoted by Agence France-Presse as saying the war in Iraq was the beginning of a campaign aimed at all countries around the world with oppressive political systems.
So a low-profile diplomat's obscure statements to a French newspaper get extrapolated, incorrectly, by a right-wing mouthpiece. Translation: Invasion of Cuba imminent.
posted by PrinceValium at 2:15 PM on April 11, 2003
"I think what is happening in Iraq is going to send a very positive signal, and it is a very good example for Cuba, where we saw that last week the Fidel Castro regime ordered the arrest of more than 80 citizens ... simply for their ideas," Mr. Hertell told local reporters.
Quote paraphrased by the Washington Times:
And in the Dominican Republic yesterday, U.S. Ambassador Hans Hertell was quoted by Agence France-Presse as saying the war in Iraq was the beginning of a campaign aimed at all countries around the world with oppressive political systems.
So a low-profile diplomat's obscure statements to a French newspaper get extrapolated, incorrectly, by a right-wing mouthpiece. Translation: Invasion of Cuba imminent.
posted by PrinceValium at 2:15 PM on April 11, 2003
we saw that last week the Fidel Castro regime ordered the arrest of more than 80 citizens ... simply for their ideas
Insert requisite comment about the Patriot Act here.
posted by eustacescrubb at 2:17 PM on April 11, 2003
Insert requisite comment about the Patriot Act here.
posted by eustacescrubb at 2:17 PM on April 11, 2003
Yeah, um...Cuba was only mentioned once, very briefly, in that article. Nothing pointed to doing anything in Cuba at all.
But just for the sake of discussion, if anyone DID want to do something in Cuba, it probably wouldn't be too hard, and it probably *would* have a lot of support from Cuban-Americans. Many of whom are Republicans. From what I know of the Cuban expatriates, they would consider it a holy war.
But once again, this article wasn't about Cuba. At all.
posted by padraigin at 2:18 PM on April 11, 2003
But just for the sake of discussion, if anyone DID want to do something in Cuba, it probably wouldn't be too hard, and it probably *would* have a lot of support from Cuban-Americans. Many of whom are Republicans. From what I know of the Cuban expatriates, they would consider it a holy war.
But once again, this article wasn't about Cuba. At all.
posted by padraigin at 2:18 PM on April 11, 2003
Hasn't Fidel's regime *always* arrested a lot of citizens simply for their ideas?
posted by MrBaliHai at 2:25 PM on April 11, 2003
posted by MrBaliHai at 2:25 PM on April 11, 2003
zekinskia:
No, Syria is next.
Last I checked there's no oil in Syria. If George W. is smart he'll lasso the Neocons, now that we've secured the Iraqi oil fields for Haliburton, oops, I meant the Iraqi people.
posted by mark13 at 2:29 PM on April 11, 2003
No, Syria is next.
Last I checked there's no oil in Syria. If George W. is smart he'll lasso the Neocons, now that we've secured the Iraqi oil fields for Haliburton, oops, I meant the Iraqi people.
posted by mark13 at 2:29 PM on April 11, 2003
I reckon Syria will be next, Iran and North Korea are a *touch* too powerful. As for Cuba, if the neocons ever set their sights on that hoary old chestnut, it would be probably the most unpopular war EVER (in Europe anyway, and why should they care what we think?) because Cuba is salaamed as The Great Socialist Paradise here. Mainly because Castro was a mate of Che.
posted by Celery at 2:39 PM on April 11, 2003
posted by Celery at 2:39 PM on April 11, 2003
Many years ago, I learned a great lesson from the book "The Liberators", about the Russian invasion of Czechoslovakia in 1968. The author said that even the Russian military were puzzled, for they had assumed that they were going to be invading Yugoslavia, a hostile country actively snubbing and defying Russia, rather than Czechoslovakia, a close and friendly ally.
The reason for the invasion was that Russia could live with a hostile, but un-liberal Yugoslavia next door; but the Kremlin felt it could not tolerate a close friend who was too politically liberal, as that would threaten *their*, Russian, authoritarianism. An odd logic, but a fascinating one.
So what were the real reasons for the US invasion of Iraq? There seems to be disagreement that it was due to WMDs, or support for terrorism, or maybe some tangible threat against Israel.
And this is important as we consider what the US will do next. I noted in another article that, among others, the US may now be threatening our "friends" Saudi Arabia and Egypt(!).
posted by kablam at 2:58 PM on April 11, 2003
The reason for the invasion was that Russia could live with a hostile, but un-liberal Yugoslavia next door; but the Kremlin felt it could not tolerate a close friend who was too politically liberal, as that would threaten *their*, Russian, authoritarianism. An odd logic, but a fascinating one.
So what were the real reasons for the US invasion of Iraq? There seems to be disagreement that it was due to WMDs, or support for terrorism, or maybe some tangible threat against Israel.
And this is important as we consider what the US will do next. I noted in another article that, among others, the US may now be threatening our "friends" Saudi Arabia and Egypt(!).
posted by kablam at 2:58 PM on April 11, 2003
I reckon Syria will be next, Iran and North Korea are a *touch* too powerful. As for Cuba, if the neocons ever set their sights on that hoary old chestnut, it would be probably the most unpopular war EVER (in Europe anyway, and why should they care what we think?) because Cuba is salaamed as The Great Socialist Paradise here. Mainly because Castro was a mate of Che.
I realize Cuba isn't as succesful as a scandinavian socialist state, but for a Latin American socialist state (or a Latin American state of any kind), it really hasn't done half-badly (has it?), especially considering the U.S. has been trying to ruin it for fifty years.
OK, Costa Rica is clearly a better place.
posted by weston at 3:36 PM on April 11, 2003
I realize Cuba isn't as succesful as a scandinavian socialist state, but for a Latin American socialist state (or a Latin American state of any kind), it really hasn't done half-badly (has it?), especially considering the U.S. has been trying to ruin it for fifty years.
OK, Costa Rica is clearly a better place.
posted by weston at 3:36 PM on April 11, 2003
Anyone who'd actually *been* to Cuba, of course, would not tout it as a paradise of any sort for its citizens. It's gorgeous, and if you have dollars you can be quite comfy there as a tourist, but the fact of the matter is that for actual, average Cubans, it's become kind of a shithole in the last fifty or so years.
But anyway, neither here nor there. I'm just saying, Europeans should venture out of the resort hotels when they're in Cuba and check out the local color. It's easy to romanticize things from afar.
Cuba's shitholiness notwithstanding, I've adopted a new live-and-let-live policy which forces me to be against going in and slapping around any more despots for a while. If my policy changes, I'll be sure to advise.
posted by padraigin at 3:43 PM on April 11, 2003
But anyway, neither here nor there. I'm just saying, Europeans should venture out of the resort hotels when they're in Cuba and check out the local color. It's easy to romanticize things from afar.
Cuba's shitholiness notwithstanding, I've adopted a new live-and-let-live policy which forces me to be against going in and slapping around any more despots for a while. If my policy changes, I'll be sure to advise.
posted by padraigin at 3:43 PM on April 11, 2003
I vote for Burma. The junta is as brutal as they come, they have a destabilizing effect on the area, and liberating the country would relieve Cheney from his guilty conscience over Halliburton's contribution to the Yadana pipeline. On to Burma!
posted by homunculus at 3:45 PM on April 11, 2003
posted by homunculus at 3:45 PM on April 11, 2003
Cuba? Whatever in the world for? They have no product or natural resource the US believes it requires (apologies to you cigar aficianados), they represent no great untapped market... Hell, they don't even have any of the "smokescreen justifications" like WMDs or active support for terrorists. It's a totalitarian regime, to be sure, so there's "oppression of the native peoples" going on but not even Bush would be so foolhardy as attempt to justify an invasion of Cuba based on social conditions that have existed for the most part unchanged and unchallenged for over 40 years... would he?!
posted by JollyWanker at 3:50 PM on April 11, 2003
posted by JollyWanker at 3:50 PM on April 11, 2003
I'd think the neo-cons would feel a special urgency to put the smackdown on Castro before he dies of old age...
The problem with taking Cuba next is all those Cuban ex-pats in Miami would go home and there'd be no way Bush'd be able to carry Florida in 2004...
Oh, wait a minute. I forgot about the GOP's ultimate weapon in the battle for voter-fraud superiority: the absentee ballot.
posted by wendell at 3:51 PM on April 11, 2003
The problem with taking Cuba next is all those Cuban ex-pats in Miami would go home and there'd be no way Bush'd be able to carry Florida in 2004...
Oh, wait a minute. I forgot about the GOP's ultimate weapon in the battle for voter-fraud superiority: the absentee ballot.
posted by wendell at 3:51 PM on April 11, 2003
Jesus. I think I vote for this as the single most bitter and cynical FPP I've ever seen. And that's saying alot, recently.
posted by jammer at 4:30 PM on April 11, 2003
posted by jammer at 4:30 PM on April 11, 2003
Indian defence minister joins Pakistan pre-emptive strike chorus
All the coolkids countries are doing it!
posted by homunculus at 5:03 PM on April 11, 2003
All the cool
posted by homunculus at 5:03 PM on April 11, 2003
padraign,
Since 1989 the military authorities in Burma have promoted the name Myanmar as a conventional name for their state; this decision was not approved by any sitting legislature in Burma, and the US Government did not adopt the name
-from CIA world factbook
posted by entropy at 6:00 PM on April 11, 2003
Since 1989 the military authorities in Burma have promoted the name Myanmar as a conventional name for their state; this decision was not approved by any sitting legislature in Burma, and the US Government did not adopt the name
-from CIA world factbook
posted by entropy at 6:00 PM on April 11, 2003
Is Israel Next?
via Matthew Yglesias
*memo to those who are still buying the roadmap thing:
Jews settle in Palestinian Jerusalem
Sharon tests Bush, Blair and the road map by letting families occupy contested district *
posted by matteo at 6:42 PM on April 11, 2003
via Matthew Yglesias
*memo to those who are still buying the roadmap thing:
Jews settle in Palestinian Jerusalem
Sharon tests Bush, Blair and the road map by letting families occupy contested district *
posted by matteo at 6:42 PM on April 11, 2003
I hope not Cuba, I'm planning a vacation there in few months.
posted by CrazyJub at 6:21 AM on April 12, 2003
posted by CrazyJub at 6:21 AM on April 12, 2003
I hope not Cuba, I'm planning a vacation there in few months.
God forbid the liberation of an entire island of oppressed people would interfere with your vacation plans.
posted by Mick at 9:17 AM on April 12, 2003
God forbid the liberation of an entire island of oppressed people would interfere with your vacation plans.
posted by Mick at 9:17 AM on April 12, 2003
Mick: God forbid the liberation of an entire island of oppressed people would interfere with your vacation plans.
Hell, that's as valid as any explanation the American people have been given for the recent "liberation" of Iraq and at least 1000% more honest...
posted by JollyWanker at 9:32 AM on April 12, 2003
Hell, that's as valid as any explanation the American people have been given for the recent "liberation" of Iraq and at least 1000% more honest...
posted by JollyWanker at 9:32 AM on April 12, 2003
CrazyJub - And I'm going there on my Honeymoon in October...
posted by twine42 at 9:06 AM on April 13, 2003
posted by twine42 at 9:06 AM on April 13, 2003
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posted by zekinskia at 2:11 PM on April 11, 2003